{"id":153782,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153782","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/065bcaf30f002e2bcd0a91878369495deab218bf194c20658bc56c59a2000a06518ee6f291af3d525ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"葛如鈞","委員發言時間":"09:16:56 - 09:47:51","影片長度":"00:30:55","會議時間":"2024-06-11T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第11屆第1會期第17次會議（事由：一、對行政院院長報告施政方針繼續質詢。 \n二、6月7日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。\n三、6月11日下午1時50分至2時30分為處理臨時提案時間。）","type":"Clip","date":"2024-06-11","start_time":"2024-06-11T09:16:56+08:00","end_time":"2024-06-11T09:47:51+08:00","duration":1855,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"立法院第11屆第1會期第17次會議","id":"院會-11-1-17","type":"院會","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":17},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"gazette":{"lineno":74,"blocks":[["葛委員如鈞：（9時17分）謝謝主席，有請行政院卓榮泰院長。"],["主席：請卓院長備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：葛委員好。"],["葛委員如鈞：院長好，初次和您見面。首先，我要單獨請您看一段影片，大概1分鐘，暫時先請其他閣員不要就備詢臺。","（播放影片）"],["葛委員如鈞：我想院長可以看到，這隻AI人形機器人（humanoid）有23到43個關節模組，不只肢體靈活，高難度的動作也難不倒它，還可以做精細的動作，甚至會使用工具。如果有一台的話，您今天休息慶功就可以讓它幫你開飲料了，它還可以幫我們做一些工作。院長，影片看完了，您覺得這一隻AI人形機器人做得怎麼樣？是不是還不錯？"],["卓院長榮泰：科技的進步會改變人類的生活，真是嘆為觀止，我曾經喝過機器人泡的咖啡。"],["葛委員如鈞：很好，機器人泡的咖啡只是手而已，這是整個模擬人形的人形機器人，完全不同。我想要告訴院長，現在這一隻人形機器人在網路平台就可以買得到，每一隻售價45萬臺幣。您看到的機器人泡咖啡，沒有辦法走路、沒有辦法跑步，這一隻是秒數2公尺，未來隨著大量生產，價格還可能更低，您認為這個產品未來有沒有機會在臺灣，甚至全球普及？"],["卓院長榮泰：我現在也在我們的飯店看到很多機器人在送餐、引路，但還沒有做到人形，我覺得它會一步一步的進化、進步到這樣的程度。"],["葛委員如鈞：很好，在臺灣、在全球有機會普及嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：如果過去我們在電影中看到的都會實現的話，我覺得這個在相當的時日應該可以跟人類生活在一起。"],["葛委員如鈞：非常好，關於影片最後還有一個問題讓您猜猜看，這一隻AI人形機器人的產地是哪裡？"],["卓院長榮泰：產地喔？對不起，這個請委員明示。"],["葛委員如鈞：很好喔！院長不願意猜猜嗎？再給您一次機會。"],["卓院長榮泰：我猜就是那些科技大國。"],["葛委員如鈞：好啦！院長，好奇心是人類進步的動力，沒想到您對於科技的進步，感覺是不願意猜一猜，這樣的政府是否能夠引領科技的進步呢？我覺得有點危險。其實你也算猜對一半，但你也許不願意承認，這一隻AI人形機器人也許真的如您所說是科技大國，但是我們認為臺灣才是科技大國，剛剛影片的這一隻AI人形機器人是由中國大陸的科技公司所研發的，相較於其他人形機器人動輒數十萬、上百萬，這一隻售價相對的低廉，甚至現在、今天就已經可以從網路商店購買，大概3到5年以後，可能從工廠到家庭都可以看到它的身影，一個機器人做各種協助，AI的下一步就是人形機器人，人形機器人包含內部的AI晶片、視覺語言系統以及行動技術，是AI落地的實體應用。","我們看到這樣的未來還會突飛猛進，特斯拉的執行長馬斯克在今年4月宣布，8月8日要推出Robotaxi，到時候院長可能在路邊攔車攔到的都是機器人開的計程車；輝達的執行長也在前幾天的大會發表演說的時候，邀請一打機器人在臺上助陣，當然是用影像的方式。我們現在擁有創建人形機器人所需的所有技術，根據機器人聯盟（IFR）的數據，其中73%會安裝在亞太地區，2023年到2028年的複合年增長率百分之五十，目前還剛起步。","講了這麼多，回過頭來看看臺灣，想請教一下院長，我國目前進行AI人形機器人研發的主責單位是哪一個部會？"],["吳主任委員誠文：報告委員，目前國科會在資助全國的學研單位，的確是有發展人形機器人這樣的計畫。"],["葛委員如鈞：我問的是政府由哪一個部會主責研發？"],["吳主任委員誠文：國科會。"],["葛委員如鈞：國科會有沒有機器人研發的相關計畫？不要講大專院校喔！國科會還有很多的中心喔！"],["吳主任委員誠文：國科會的……"],["葛委員如鈞：好，沒有關係，謝謝，我直接告訴院長，我們問過一輪了，答案是沒有。主管科技發展的國科會直接告訴我們，目前沒有針對AI人形機器人推動特定的專案，一切全憑各大學自主研究，兄弟登山，自行努力。我還不死心，還上網找找看其他部會有沒有進行相關的研究，好不容易找到經濟部工研院有一個小小的、在做機器人可拆式關節模組的研究。想要在此很沉重地來問一下院長，難道臺灣已經直接放棄AI人形機器人的研發了嗎？主導臺灣科研的國科會，無論是在AI行動2.0計畫裡或者在晶創計畫裡，居然都沒有提到有關「人形機器人」的半個字！國科會主委要不要確認這件事情？是不是沒有提到？"],["吳主任委員誠文：報告委員……"],["葛委員如鈞：我們現在在這裡要講話要很明確喔！相關文件上網都找得到喔！有沒有提到？你只要回答有或沒有就好了。"],["吳主任委員誠文：人形機器人並不是……"],["葛委員如鈞：有沒有在文件裡提到？我可以告訴你，就是沒有！院長，我們是不是要放棄了？"],["卓院長榮泰：跟委員報告，機器人的研究、研發當然是有……"],["葛委員如鈞：人形機器人。"],["卓院長榮泰：但是或許在名稱上沒有把它冠上「人形」兩個字，但是它的內容、它的研發方向應該絕對是有的。"],["葛委員如鈞：車子兩輪也是車啦！好，沒有關係，相對於臺灣對AI發展，真的是雜亂無章、一盤散沙。我們最喜歡的經濟學人指出，中國大陸預測到未來勞動力缺乏的問題，因此正在力爭成為機器人以及人形機器人的超級大國。現在路上跑的車子很多都進口車，大家手機裡下載的遊戲app都是國外的遊戲，大家可能習以為常，但是很快地，3到5年內，很可能在路上走的、家家戶戶用的都是網路上買來的、由您剛剛所提到的「科技大國」所製造的人形機器人，甚至有可能他們裡面所採用的語言模型是「ChatCPT」，我們一直在講開放語料，但是沒有人給我們回應啊！到時候臺灣要如何抵禦中國大陸的科技統戰、文化統戰？","最近人稱AI教父的NVIDIA創始人黃仁勳來臺、緊急來臺，和許多業界人士會晤，一口氣和16%的GDP老闆大吃大談未來AI產業的發展，但是不知道怎麼樣、到底是不是錯覺，我們的政府官員像神隱少女一樣，在AI產業的交流裡頭完全缺席，別人邊吃邊談，難道在座的官員都只有羨慕的份嗎？我想在此詢問卓院長以及在場所有的內閣官員，這一次黃仁勳先生訪臺的過程當中，有沒有人受邀與他共餐，暢談政府對AI政策的規劃？有的話可不可以舉手讓我們知道一下？"],["卓院長榮泰：跟委員報告，產業界的合作有各種方式……"],["葛委員如鈞：對不起，我們不要問……"],["卓院長榮泰：政府跟產業界當然有接觸。"],["葛委員如鈞：我剛剛問的是有沒有，但沒有人舉手啊！沒有人舉手啊！"],["卓院長榮泰：再跟委員報告，現場舉手沒有留下紀錄，我們還是用口頭回答比較有誠意。"],["葛委員如鈞：那有沒有邀你共餐？"],["卓院長榮泰：我們有見過面，但沒有共餐。"],["葛委員如鈞：有沒有暢談政府AI……看起來，所謂AI內閣，我們真的不希望政府內部是把AI束之高閣的地方，扮演神隱少女！人家沒有邀你們吃飯，你們難道也沒有主動邀他嗎？"],["吳主任委員誠文：報告委員，吃飯不重要，我們是做事的。"],["葛委員如鈞：那你有沒有跟黃仁勳聊過國家科研發展、AI科研發展？剛剛我還想說你沒有舉手，我就不要點你了，有嗎？"],["吳主任委員誠文：我們跟NVIDIA、AMD都有詳細……"],["葛委員如鈞：黃仁勳來跟……好，沒有關係，我不管了！政府的AI政策多頭馬車、一團散沙，真的是要導致我國AI產業的發展連基本戰略方針都沒有嗎？我之前已經朗讀過很多，我們待會還有例子。國科會主委兼任政委，擔任國家AI推動小組召集人，上任至今一個月，有沒有召開會議？今天是卓內閣上任第22天，根據行政院智慧國家推動小組設置要點，行政院智慧國家推動小組理應由行政院副院長擔任總召集人，但是行政院的官網上，現在的小組召集人竟然還掛著鄭文燦前副院長的名字！院長，你可以看投影片，你可以不用看我，因為這真的是有點太誇張了！"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員，這個很抱歉，我們立即更正。"],["葛委員如鈞：真的不知道是不是時光被凍結了？鄭前副院長現在是海基會董事長，我們難道要期待他作為海基會董事長，來和對岸談人工智慧的合作，推動智慧國家小組嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員提醒，我們立即更正，跟委員抱歉。"],["葛委員如鈞：沒有，不用道歉，我們要的不是道歉，我們要的是active and innovative，要主動、積極、創新。黃仁勳先生說未來機器人會像汽車一樣的普及，假設過去政府沒有注意到，我今天在這裡特別提醒院長及相關閣員，跨部會要有高度，真的要有前瞻性的思維，趕緊整合各部會，針對AI人形機器人調整相關計畫方案，包含軟體、硬體，當然也包含晶片、視覺系統等等，以此為基礎，才能夠擘劃臺灣的AI戰略總體方針，好不好？","最近兩週，也不只是NVIDIA，我們的護國神山台積電在6月5號董事會中通過了一個決議，要投資最多40億臺幣長期研究半導體教學及人才培育，足見產業對於人才短缺的憂心已經到了不得不自己跳下來自救的程度！院長，產業已經跳下來自救了，我們政府相應的……人家都搭飛機來臺灣了，台積電也要投錢了，政府相應的措施是什麼？我幫你先列出三種可能，第一個，錦上添花。產業砸錢，我們跟著砸。第二個，弭平落差。針對產業沒有投入的面向，政府盤點資源，扶助弱勢。第三個，政府覺得已經很完美的，兩手一攤、躺平看戲。請問院長是哪一種？"],["卓院長榮泰：跟委員報告，我們應該還要有戰略地位的考量，因為我們看到COMPUTEX國際大廠都來到臺灣，造成一股熱潮，他們要在臺灣投資，我們當然歡迎，投資到哪裡去？政府要做好更多的投資環境，這是政府該做的，可以引領他們到需要的地方。"],["葛委員如鈞：現在已經有新的行動、新的作為，我們不是active、innovative嗎？我們要有新的動作，就應該要有新的行動來因應，為什麼台積電忍不住跳進來？因為全球AI人才大大的缺乏，而且還發生一個狀況，這個我真的要跟院長分享，紐約時報3月報導，全球頂尖AI研究人員已經有近半數出自中國，遠高於美國的18%。3年前中國人才只占三分之一，3年後已經成長到五成，中國大陸顯然成為AI人才的最大搖籃，我們的AI人才呢？要從哪裡來呢？上週我質詢國科會，吳主委備詢的時候說，AI需求永無止境，人力缺口永遠無法滿足，只能盡力做；還強調事實就是如此。難道這就是我們行政院的態度嗎？如果是的話，政府真的可以洗洗睡了！我直接幫你整理好資料了，AI行動計畫2.0說，每年可以培育600名AI研究人才、8,000個AI應用人才、3,500名相關人才，AI資通領域擴充招生名額500名，我國每年可以新增1萬2,000名AI人才，但是我們人力銀行業者在1月說，AI人才缺口可能超過2.4萬，顯然還有非常大的差距。臺灣雖然也有吸引國外人才的優質機制，但是條件僵化，去年一整年，我們的就業金卡在科技類領域只網羅到372人，相較於臺灣外流勞動人口微不足道。我直接唸幾個數字來看，這是300位企業家共同做的2024臺灣人才白皮書，臺灣一年有1.2萬人赴日工作，十年暴增八倍，美國光是臺灣籍過去的技術人才簽證數量超過3,000人，世界排名第七，我們真的要成為出超大國。我們再來看，英國牛津經濟學公司用數學模型推估，臺灣有最嚴重的全球人才荒，人才赤字達-1.5%，根本沒有辦法吸引高階的人才過來。半導體、AI產業，包含我們剛剛講的人形機器人，對外人才需才孔急，我們挖角卻受限於金卡的條件僵化，我們想問院長，除了就業金卡以外，我們還有沒有研議其他方式，網羅人才成為入超大國，甚至新增所謂AI就業銀卡的機制，擴大對外攬才？"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員，我們看到世界各國對臺灣的科技地位如此重視，我們當然知道人才的培育是非常重要的一節，也謝謝委員剛剛提醒的那些部分，我認為每個部會都要自己去培訓很多的AI人才，而不僅是靠學校，在部會當中要培訓，所以這樣的比例看下來，數字應該還可以往上增加。"],["葛委員如鈞：院長，您的高度是絕對重要的，請您帶頭，除了擴大攬才以外，您剛剛已經承諾了，我們要努力，那你也要努力啊！政府要帶頭，美國4月的時候宣布所有聯邦政府機關都要聘用一個首席AI專家，負責監督AI的使用，目標預計在今年夏天以前招聘100名相關人才，每位人才年薪突破450萬臺幣。請問院長，我們的行政院目前有沒有類似的規劃，由政府機關帶頭聘用AI人才？"],["卓院長榮泰：跟委員報告，包括國科會、數發部、經濟部，他們常常在……"],["葛委員如鈞：行政院長有沒有帶頭？"],["卓院長榮泰：我都跟他們一起談論過，他們在交換意見的過程當中火花四射，意見很好。"],["葛委員如鈞：政府機關有沒有要聘用AI人才？"],["卓院長榮泰：有。"],["葛委員如鈞：有沒有預計多少人數？何時完成招募和聘任？你覺得你有，但是想聘就聘得到嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：當然要經過很多的努力。"],["葛委員如鈞：拜託院長努力，這一點真的非常重要。"],["卓院長榮泰：一定會的，謝謝委員。"],["葛委員如鈞：台積電大規模投入人才的培育，產業跳進來自救，就是一大警訊。","接下來，當然我們有好消息，輝達、超微都要在臺灣設置研發中心，人才需求只會多、不會少，我們現在內部供應已經不足，我們還要向外攬才，中央的人才政策一定要做好準備。","再來，我們不僅缺人才，院長，您記得2023年臺灣的代表字第一名是什麼嗎？我剛剛其實已經洩題，我現在告訴您答案，就是「缺」！缺水、缺電、缺雞蛋、缺藥，而且還缺什麼？缺土地、缺供水、缺供電、缺人才、缺勞動力。行政院的政策如果有好好落實，應該要滿足產業的需求，但是我們卻面臨了五缺。過去我們受惠於China+1，我們有機會得到很多紅利，成為世界科技中心，但是現在物換星移，全球都在喊Taiwan+1，要尋找下一個取代臺灣的地點，台積電在日本、美國、德國設廠就是很明顯的案例。對政府來講，根留臺灣說的容易，但五缺問題沒有解決的話，這恐怕非常非常危險，我給你市調機構的數字，這個數字真的很重要，TrendForce 2023年年底的報告，相關的半導體廠商，尤其先進製程的產能占比將從2023年的29%成長到33%，同期未來臺灣成熟製程的占比會從49%下降到42%。另外，接下來以美國為首，很可能會從2023年到2027年，從12%成長到17%。本席真的非常擔心未來會不會從現在的Taiwan+1變成Everyone–Taiwan？以前的China+1，我們賺到了，結果現在Taiwan+1，執政黨不僅讓大家缺水、缺電，甚至國防部還亂發飛彈簡訊、製造恐慌。我們來看中華經濟研究院曹添旺董事長、陳信宏副院長投書，我們應該由行政院領頭，形成盟國+Taiwan，我真的希望院長今天之後緊急思考，讓Taiwan+1翻轉成Everyone+Taiwan，不要讓Taiwan被取代。","我剛剛講這麼長，其實我要問你一個具體的問題，黃仁勳說臺灣是世界的支柱，我相信您認同這一點。"],["卓院長榮泰：是。"],["葛委員如鈞：但是黃仁勳同時也說了「缺」這個字。他說臺灣電力的局限會是一個挑戰，請問您認同嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：剛剛委員有說過一句話，說執政黨造成臺灣的缺水、缺電，我更正一下，執政黨努力不造成臺灣的缺水、缺電。"],["葛委員如鈞：我沒有要究責，我現在是說我們未來嘛！active、innovative，我們往前看嘛！他就說缺嘛！"],["卓院長榮泰：我們當然知道電力穩定供應……"],["葛委員如鈞：你認同臺灣電力的局限是個挑戰嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：我們勇敢面對這個問題。"],["葛委員如鈞：我們不要回去講什麼馬政府啦。經濟部郭部長曾經講，今年兩個用電高峰，以目前的電力，沒有擔心缺電；但是台積電董事長劉德音在股東會上無奈地說，政府認為電是夠的，我們只能相信它。短短幾個字，道盡產業心聲。","再來，我們看美國商會，我們最重視盟友的想法。6月6日美國商會發布臺灣白皮書，強調臺灣官方應保持穩定電價，同時也表示商會成員關心穩定能源供應，有七成成員在調查當中表達對綠色能源供應的擔憂。","我們可以看下一個投影片，我們政府部會相關態度反覆，我就不多說了，包括以核養綠、非核家園，以核養綠、非核家園，以核養綠、非核家園，態度反反覆覆，就在短短1個月左右的時間。非核家園的神主牌拿起來、放下去，拿起來、放下去。我表演一下，拿起來、放下去，拿起來、放下去，搞得民眾和產業霧裡看花。","我在這裡再問一次院長，產業界大聲疾呼，民進黨的好朋友童子賢、民進黨大老許信良、許多的閣員看似都比您理性務實，您還是獨排眾議，堅守核電不延役的非核家園神主牌的立場嗎？在您回答以前，我先提醒您，本席也是立法院臺美國會聯誼會的副會長，所以我們今天的互動代表臺灣國會及行政院正式對美國商會的回復。您在媒體上反覆無常沒有關係，您的閣員反覆無常沒有關係，但您在這裡的說法就是給他們一個真實回應，請院長回答！"],["卓院長榮泰：政府對於產業界所有的擔心，我們一定會重視，這是最大的原則，所以穩定供電是政府對人民及產業的責任，我們也一定要達到，但是非核家園不是神主牌啊。"],["葛委員如鈞：蛤？"],["卓院長榮泰：它是我們現在依照環境基本法裡面依法要朝向的目標。"],["葛委員如鈞：沒有關係，院長，我今天問您一個問題，我當時問國科會主委、經濟部、核安會有沒有要把非核家園神主牌接過去。我今天問您相同的問題，您願不願意接受非核家園的神主牌？"],["卓院長榮泰：你把它定位為神主牌的話，無人可以接受得起，它只是我們現在依照環境基本法所訂定的非核家園目標。"],["葛委員如鈞：我quote您講的話，您說非核家園是您的價值，還說如果失去價值，生命會失去意義。這比神主牌還嚴重啊！"],["卓院長榮泰：那是在講一種……"],["葛委員如鈞：你如果沒有拿過去，你很可能就沒有生命了，我們是要拯救你……"],["卓院長榮泰：委員，你也有信仰……"],["葛委員如鈞：堅守非核家園啊！"],["卓院長榮泰：委員，你也有信仰，也有價值……"],["葛委員如鈞：既然如此，你要不要大方接下來？"],["卓院長榮泰：也有信仰，也有價值……"],["葛委員如鈞：要不要接受？"],["卓院長榮泰：委員，你也有信仰，也有價值，但這絕對不是一個神主牌、要掛在牆壁上的，不是如此，是放在心上的。"],["葛委員如鈞：沒有關係，我把它放遠一點，我把它放遠一點。"],["卓院長榮泰：這是委員的自由。"],["葛委員如鈞：如果拒絕接下來，我想您的非核家園也是口號，喊喊而已，我們所有的美國盟友都看得到。每年AI需要的能源增加3%，我們核電廠7月1日1號機停機，將少3%的電力，明年2號機停機，再少3%，一來一往，需要補足的電力不只是核電廠的6.2%，很可能我們要增加用肺發電、火力發電的比例，讓我們的健康受到長期的影響。這一次內閣有很多的亮點是來自於產業，我們真的誠懇呼籲行政院，能源政策要中立、務實、客觀，不要被意識形態綁架，不要擔心被非核家園的支持者討厭就不敢改變，不要打腫臉充胖子，最後造成政府、產業和民眾三輸的局面。"],["卓院長榮泰：核三廠的問題，我們有新的電廠可以接得上來，經濟部郭部長已經算得很清楚……"],["葛委員如鈞：我待會會有數據告訴您別國都在怎麼做……"],["卓院長榮泰：我們知道，過去的評估……"],["葛委員如鈞：人家微軟已經開始在購買核電囉！已經在購買核電囉！我們待會會聊這個部分。雖然說科學本於事實，但是有時候事實難以判斷，一樣會造成三輸的局面。","接下來要請問一下院長，請您看看螢幕上顯示的這幾張圖片，哪一封是真正的台水公司催繳簡訊？分辨得出來嗎？假如錯誤，院長官邸可能會被斷水、斷電喔。哪一個是真的？"],["卓院長榮泰：我知道委員想提的就是詐騙的行為，這個我們深惡痛絕，我們跟委員一樣地重視。"],["葛委員如鈞：這是台水公司喔！這幾個月來，我數度接獲民眾陳情收到假冒的國營事業台水、台電的催繳簡訊，這裡面有一半是假的，民眾不疑有他，刷卡以後發現受到詐騙。政府一再強調電子簽章法施行以後，刊登相關的廣告要有數位簽章，可以有效地減少，但是詐騙集團的技術日新月異，要仰賴民間跟政府的互動才能防範。想請問一下，剛好經濟部郭部長也上來了，據你所知，經濟部所屬的國營事業台水及台電是否需要提出資通安全維護計畫？假如發生資安事件，需不需要資安通報？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，我們支持您的看法。"],["葛委員如鈞：是，很好，非常、非常重要，因為依據資通安全管理法，台水、台電是屬於關鍵基礎設施，必須要向經濟部提出資通安全維護計畫，假如發生資安事件，要依法通報。我先回復您，我也支持您關於核電的很多看法；但是再問郭部長，近半年台水、台電是否曾經發生過資安事件？是幾級的資安事件？"],["郭部長智輝：我沒有收到這個報告。"],["葛委員如鈞：好。數發部的黃部長能不能回應一下？因為資安院在數發部嘛，我已經提到資安很久了，黃部長，您可以回答一下，近半年來，數發部是否曾接獲台水及台電的資安通報？"],["黃部長彥男：報告委員，我們現在1個月大概收到……"],["葛委員如鈞：這是關鍵基礎設施喔！"],["黃部長彥男：我知道，每個月收到大概一百多件的……"],["葛委員如鈞：台水跟台電，關鍵基礎設施。"],["黃部長彥男：目前沒有這個資料。"],["葛委員如鈞：我幫您問好了，這半年來台電做過一次資安通報，台水的通報次數為零，你們上網隨便搜尋一下台水詐騙，全部都是！幾乎半個臺灣都收到了。請問一下郭部長，兩家國營事業有沒有確認客戶資料是否遭到外洩？我們應該盤查一下，對不對？我們來盤查一下。院長，您能不能責成有關單位，包含經濟部、數發部、內政部立即成立專案小組，調查台水、台電的詐騙簡訊有沒有個資外洩，讓民眾安心，願不願意承諾？"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員，政府部門、國營事業，甚至包括民間的產業、事業都不應該將個資外洩出去……"],["葛委員如鈞：台水、台電的部分，成立專案小組，調查資安，可不可以承諾？"],["卓院長榮泰：誠如委員所說，關鍵基礎設施跟民生相關，所有臺灣人民在這樣的環境底下，我們應該保障他的資訊安全。"],["葛委員如鈞：我想要提醒院長，在國內，這還都只是舊方法，接下來還有AI深偽技術，講話5秒鐘就可以模仿你的聲音，美國、歐盟都集中資源嚴防AI詐騙，我們現在上網一查，結果呢？內政部刑事警察局鼓勵民眾要建立通關密語，要發通關密語才能夠通話，不僅把防詐的責任完全推給民眾，還要求民眾用落後的方式來防詐，彷彿退回漢朝，跟比對虎符一樣啦！院長，我們的AI戰略方針可能還不明確，但是國科會積極推動AI行動計畫3.0，您能不能承諾AI防詐可以列為AI政策的重要一環？科技的事，用科技處理，漢朝的事，我們把它放在歷史裡面，院長可以承諾嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員，您當然知道我們現在全力推動，希望大院通過打詐四法，就是讓我們有先進的法律可以握在手上……"],["葛委員如鈞：您回去看一下裡面有沒有用到科技、有沒有用到AI啦！沒有關係，我們開放問題，真的是提醒大家。","最後，我想講一下，虛擬世界也不全然都是洪水猛獸，有一個產業正在被全世界擁抱，卻唯獨被臺灣當成洪水猛獸，這個議題就是虛擬貨幣的ETF。今年1月10號美國證交會即證券交易委會（SEC）批准比特幣ETF交易，3月4號我上任以後馬上去質詢，為什麼我們的金管會禁止我們的民眾透過複委託、政府鼓勵的方式去購買比特幣的現貨ETF呢？5月22號，我再就此議題詢問金管會彭主委，我們當然很感謝彭主委有表示法人有機會先行，開放程度雖未達預期，但起碼表示政府對虛擬貨幣的態度不再保守僵化，我想要請院長給我們一個勉勵，好不好？政府目前對於虛擬貨幣ETF的態度有沒有正由保守轉向開放？我們目前預估的期程，何時可以開放複委託購買比特幣ETF？"],["卓院長榮泰：這是一個新興的事業、新興的行業，我們願意在安全更有保障的情況底下，能夠朝向跟國際接軌的方式做，但是注重安全，保障人民的安全，因為我始終主張AI的創新也要民主AI的創新，保障人類的自主跟人格……"],["葛委員如鈞：現在才6月，我們已經問了半年了，有什麼理由還要再拖延6個月呢？院長，能不能責成金管會加速研議開放？我們不要一直把安全、安全掛在嘴巴上，我們長期、長期，我們要加速，我們每天睡一覺，AI都在變聰明，全世界的競爭都在增加，能不能加速研議開放法人以及一般民眾複委託購買國際上已經允許的比特幣現貨ETF，滿足社會大眾對多元投資商品的期待，可不可以？"],["彭主任委員金隆：報告委員，這部分我們已經在進行中。"],["葛委員如鈞：時間希望可以加快，範圍希望可以增加，如果有教育民眾、保障安全的需求，我們朝野一起來努力，可以嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員。"],["葛委員如鈞：最後，我要用我最喜歡的電影「一一」來總結，院長，不曉得你有沒有看過這部楊德昌導演最棒的電影之一？當中的主角小男孩「洋洋」有一句名句，他說：我要去告訴別人他們不知道的事，給別人看他們看不到的東西。這正是我進入國會擔任立法委員的原因，我希望利用每一次質詢的機會，告訴院長和所有的內閣官員，我們都沒有看見的事。我看見黃仁勳說未來數位經濟會是實體經濟的一百倍，我quote他的原話「The economy in the metaverse, the economy of Omniverse, will be larger than the economy in the physical world. Digital currency, cryptocurrency, could be used in the world of metaverse.」我看見數位經濟即將爆炸性的成長，我看見臺灣是AI產業鏈的重要角色，我感到驕傲；但是同時我也看見臺灣淪為詐騙手法的創新基地，我對此感到羞愧，我看見臺灣對人型機器人研發的闕如，對政府的無知感到驚訝，我也看到臺灣在非核神主牌與核電廠，我再給……我放到比較遠，我把它撿回來，你們要不要接回去？要不要接回去？看起來還是沒有。我為政府的反覆拉扯感到難過，我們正在失去科技之島的地位和優勢，我們置外於數位經濟下崇尚多元，卻自我設限、自我封閉。今天的質詢像電影一樣，我希望能夠讓你們看到看不見的東西，跟多數民意站在一起，共同推動福國利民的政策，為未來努力，謝謝院長。"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員的提醒，我們一同來推動第二次能源轉型。"],["主席：謝謝葛委員，謝謝卓院長。","下一位請黃委員建賓質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":173,"meet_id":"院會-11-1-17","speakers":["江啟臣","陳秀寳","葛如鈞","黃建賓","劉建國","柯志恩","沈伯洋","萬美玲","吳沛憶","王鴻薇","范雲","王育敏","李坤城","林憶君","王美惠","邱志偉"],"page_start":89,"meetingDate":["2024-06-11"],"gazette_id":"1135401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1135401_00003","1135401_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期第17次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長報告施政方針繼續質詢─ 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{\"word\": \"羨\"}, {\"word\": \"慕\", \"start\": 468.492, \"end\": 468.632, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 468.632, \"end\": 468.772, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"份\", \"start\": 468.772, \"end\": 469.393, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}, {\"word\": \"?\"}]}, {\"start\": 469.393, \"end\": 481.081, \"text\": \"我想在此詢問卓院長以及在場所有的內閣官員這一次黃仁勛先生訪台的過程當中有沒有人受邀與他共餐暢談政府AI政策規劃的?\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 469.393, \"end\": 469.533, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 469.533, \"end\": 469.773, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 469.773, \"end\": 470.033, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"此\", \"start\": 470.033, \"end\": 470.614, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"卓\", \"start\": 470.614, \"end\": 470.754, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 470.754, \"end\": 470.894, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 470.894, \"end\": 471.074, \"score\": 0.887}, {\"word\": 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1814.948, \"end\": 1815.008, \"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"技\", \"start\": 1815.008, \"end\": 1815.108, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 1815.108, \"end\": 1815.128, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"島\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 1815.128, \"end\": 1815.168, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 1815.168, \"end\": 1815.248, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 1815.248, \"end\": 1815.308, \"score\": 0.667}, {\"word\": \"和\", \"start\": 1815.308, \"end\": 1815.328, \"score\": 0.198}, {\"word\": \"優\"}, {\"word\": \"勢\"}, {\"word\": \"﹖\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"各\", \"start\": 1832.301, \"end\": 1832.421, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 1832.421, \"end\": 1832.441, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 1832.441, \"end\": 1832.461, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:25,082 --> 00:00:30,867\n好,謝謝主席。有請行政院卓榮泰院長。請卓院長備詢。各位好。院長好,初次和你見面。首先我要單獨請您看一段影片。大概一分鐘,暫時先請其他閣員不要就備詢台。\n\n2\n00:01:07,250 --> 00:01:34,896\n我想院長你可以看到這一支AI人型機器人Humanoid它有23到43個關節模組不只肢體靈活高難度的動作也難不倒他還可以做精細的動作甚至會使用工具如果有一台的話您今天這個休息慶功就可以讓他幫你開飲料了\n\n3\n00:01:36,598 --> 00:01:41,920\n我曾經喝過機器人泡的咖啡。很好,機器人泡的咖啡只是手而已,這是整個模擬人形的人形機器人,完全不同。\n\n4\n00:01:58,445 --> 00:02:19,805\n我想要告訴院長現在這支人型機器人在網路平台就可以買得到每一支售價45萬台幣您看到的泡咖啡沒有辦法走路沒有辦法跑步這支是秒數兩公尺未來隨著大量生產價格還可能更低您認為這個產品未來有沒有機會在臺灣甚至全球普及\n\n5\n00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:47,108\n我現在也到我們的飯店啊,看到很多機器人在送餐啊,引路,但還沒有做到人形。我覺得它會一步一步的進化到,進步到這樣的程度。好,有機會普及嗎?在台灣?在全球?如果過去我們在電影中看到的都會實現的話,我覺得這個在相當的時日應該是跟人類可以生活在一起。非常好,關於影片最後還有一個問題讓您猜猜看,這一支AI人形機器人的產地是哪裡?\n\n6\n00:02:49,387 --> 00:03:17,461\n產地喔,對不起這個委員請委員明示。好,很好喔,院長不願意猜猜嗎?再給您一次機會。那猜就是那些科技的大國。科技大國。好啦,院長好奇心是人類進步的動力啦。是。沒想到您對於科技的進步不願意感覺猜猜。這樣的政府我覺得能夠引領科技的進步我覺得有點危險。但您也算猜對一半,但您也許不願意承認這一支AI人型機器人\n\n7\n00:03:17,981 --> 00:03:36,546\n也許真的如您所說是科技大國但是我們認為臺灣才是科技大國AI人型機器人是由中國大陸的科技公司剛剛影片這一支中國大陸的科技公司有研發的相較於其他人型機器人動雜數十萬上百萬這一支售價相對的低廉\n\n8\n00:03:37,026 --> 00:03:58,314\n甚至現在今天就已經可以從網路商店購買大概3到5年以後可能從工廠到家庭都可以看到他的身影一個機器人做各種的協助AI的下一步就是人型機器人人型機器人包含內部的AI晶片、視覺語言系統以及行動技術是AI落地的實體應用\n\n9\n00:04:00,075 --> 00:04:26,681\n我們看到這樣子的一個未來還會突飛猛進。特斯拉的執行長馬斯克今年4月宣布8月8日要推出Robotaxi。到時候院長可能在路邊攔車攔到了可能都是機器人開的計程車。灰達的執行長也在前幾天的大會發表演說的時候邀請一打機器人在台上助陣當然是用影像的方式。我們現在擁有創建人型機器人所需的所有技術。\n\n10\n00:04:27,521 --> 00:04:46,586\n根據機器人聯盟IFR的數據,其中73%會安裝在亞太地區,2023年到2028年的複合年增長率50%,目前還剛起步。講了這麼多,回過頭來看看臺灣,想請教一下院長,我國目前進行AI人型機器人研發的組織單位,請問是哪一個部會?\n\n11\n00:04:50,989 --> 00:05:13,624\n報告委員,我們目前國科會在資助全國的學院單位的確是有發展人型機器人的這樣的計畫。我問的是政府部會有哪一個部會主責研發?國科會。國科會有沒有機器人研發的相關計畫?不要講大專院校喔,我們國科會還有很多的中心喔。\n\n12\n00:05:14,431 --> 00:05:17,535\n主管科技發展的國科會直接告訴我們目前沒有針對AI人型機器人的推動特定的專案\n\n13\n00:05:29,791 --> 00:05:47,796\n一切全憑各大學自主研究兄弟登山自行努力我還不死心喔上網找找看啊看看其他部會有沒有進行相關的研究好不容易找到經濟部工研院有一個小小的在做機器人可猜是關節模組的研究想要在此很沉重的來問一下院長\n\n14\n00:05:48,696 --> 00:06:17,750\n難道臺灣已經直接放棄AI人型機器人的研發了嗎?主導臺灣科研的國科會,無論是在AI行動2.0計畫裡,或者在精創計畫裡,居然都沒有提到有關人型機器人的半個字!國科會主委要不要確認這件事情?是不是沒有提到?我們現在在這裡要講話要很明確的喔!相關文件都上網找得到喔!有沒有提到?你只要提有或沒有就好!有沒有在文件裡提到?\n\n15\n00:06:19,773 --> 00:06:20,354\n我們最喜歡的經濟學人指出中國大陸\n\n16\n00:06:45,175 --> 00:07:05,436\n預測到未來勞動力缺乏的問題因此正在力爭成為機器人以及人型機器人的超級大國我們現在路上跑的車子很多都是進口車大家手機裡下載的遊戲app都是國外的遊戲大家可能習以為常但是很快的三到五年內很可能在路上走的家家戶戶用的都是網路上買來的\n\n17\n00:07:06,337 --> 00:07:34,864\n由您剛剛所提到的科技大國所製造的人型機器人甚至有可能他們裡面所採用的語言模型是ChatCPT我們一直在講開放語料但是沒有人給我們回應到時候臺灣要如何抵禦中國大陸的科技統戰、文化統戰最近人稱AI教父的NVIDIA創始人黃恩勛來臺緊急來臺和許多業界人士揮霧一口氣和16%的GDP老闆大吃大談未來AI產業的發展\n\n18\n00:07:36,124 --> 00:07:37,165\n但是不知道怎麼樣?\n\n19\n00:07:37,165 --> 00:07:38,446\n到底是不是錯覺?\n\n20\n00:07:38,446 --> 00:07:49,393\n我們的政府官員好像神隱少女一樣在AI產業的交流裡頭完全缺席。別人邊吃邊抬。難道在座的官員都只有羨慕的份嗎?\n\n21\n00:07:49,393 --> 00:08:01,081\n我想在此詢問卓院長以及在場所有的內閣官員這一次黃仁勛先生訪台的過程當中有沒有人受邀與他共餐暢談政府AI政策規劃的?\n\n22\n00:08:01,081 --> 00:08:02,541\n有的可不可以舉手讓我們知道一下?\n\n23\n00:08:03,442 --> 00:08:20,165\n跟委員報告,產業界他們合作各種方式,政府跟產業界當然有接觸。我剛剛問的是有沒有人舉手啊?沒有人舉手啊?再跟委員報告,我們現場舉手沒有留下紀錄,我們還是用口頭回答,比較誠意。看來,那有沒有,有沒有邀您共參嘛?\n\n24\n00:08:20,816 --> 00:08:44,126\n我們有見過面沒有共餐有沒有暢談政府AI我想啦看起來所謂AI內閣我們真的不希望是在政府內部裡樹枝高閣把AI樹枝高閣的一個地方扮演神隱造你的潮人家沒有邀你們吃飯你們難道也沒有主動邀他嗎報告委員吃飯不重要我們是做事的那您有沒有跟黃文勳聊過國家科研發展AI科研發展\n\n25\n00:08:45,254 --> 00:08:55,703\n趕快還想說你沒有舉手我就不要點你了,有嗎?我們跟NVIDIA跟AMD都有詳情。王仁勳來跟,沒有關係,我不管了,政府AI政策多頭馬車一團閃殺。\n\n26\n00:08:58,035 --> 00:09:27,092\n真的是要導致我國AI產業的發展,連基本的戰略方針都沒有。我之前已經攏圖過很多,我們待會還有例子。國科會主委兼任政委,擔任國家AI推動小組的召集人,上任至今一個月。有沒有召開會議?今天是卓內閣上任第22天。根據行政院智慧國家推動小組的設置要點,我們行政院智慧國家推動小組的理由,理應由行政院副院長擔任總召集人。\n\n27\n00:09:27,352 --> 00:09:53,585\n但是,行政院的官網上,我們現在小組的召集人竟然還掛著鄭文燦前院長的名字。院長您可以看頭影片,這真的,你可以不用看我,因為這真的是有點太誇張了。真的是不知道是不是時光被凍結了。鄭前院長現在是海基會的董事長,我們難道要期待他作為海基會的董事長來和多萬台人工智慧的合作推動智慧國家小組嗎?\n\n28\n00:09:55,045 --> 00:10:15,065\n謝謝委員提醒,我們立即跟委員抱歉。很好,沒有不用道歉,我們要的不是道歉,我們要的是ActiveandInnovative,要主動積極創新啊。我們看到黃仁興先生有說,吸氣人會像未來汽車一樣的普及。假設過去政府沒有注意到,我今天在這裡是來提醒院長,\n\n29\n00:10:15,746 --> 00:10:40,049\n以及相關的閣員﹚跨部會要有高度真的要有前瞻性的思維趕緊整合各部會針對AI人型機器人調整相關計劃方案包含軟體硬體當然也包含晶片視覺系統等等以此為基礎才能夠破壞臺灣的AI戰略總體方針好不好那最近兩週也不只是NVIDIA我們的護國神山台積電\n\n30\n00:10:41,030 --> 00:10:56,241\n在6月5號董事會當中通過了一個決議,要投資最多40億台幣長期研究半導體教學及人才培育,逐漸產業對於人才短缺的優勢已經到了不得不自己跳下來自救的程度。院長\n\n31\n00:10:57,762 --> 00:11:21,575\n產業已經跳下來自救了,我們政府相應的,人家搭飛機來台灣了,我們這個台積電要投錢了,我們政府相應的措施是什麼?我幫您先列三種可能,第一個錦上添花,產業查錢我們跟著查。第二個米平落差,針對產業沒有投入的面向,政府盤點資源輔助弱勢。第三個,政府覺得已經很完美了,兩手一攤,躺平看戲,請問院長是哪一種?\n\n32\n00:11:22,695 --> 00:11:41,846\n各位委員報告,我們應該還要有戰略第一位的考量,因為我們看到Computex這樣的國際的大廠都來到台灣,造成一股熱潮,那他們要在台灣的投資我們當然歡迎,投資到哪裡去,政府要做好更多的投資的環境,這個是政府該做的。現在已經有新的行動。\n\n33\n00:11:42,646 --> 00:12:07,179\n新的作為我們不是ActiveInnovative嗎?請問我們要有新的動作我們就應該要有新的行動來因應為什麼台積電忍不住跳進來?因為全球AI人才大大的缺乏而且還發生一個狀況紐約時報這個我真的是要跟院長分享紐約時報3月說全球頂尖AI研究人員已經有近半數出自中國\n\n34\n00:12:08,219 --> 00:12:34,822\n遠高於美國的18%,三年前中國人才只佔三分之一,三年後已經成長到五成。中國大陸顯然成為以AI人才的最大搖籃。那我們的AI人才呢?要從哪裡來看呢?我們來看齁,上週我質詢國會國務組委備詢的時候,他說AI需求永無止盡,人類缺口,人力缺口永遠無法滿足,只能盡力做。還強調事實就是如此。\n\n35\n00:12:35,422 --> 00:12:37,423\n難道這就是我們行政院的態度嗎?\n\n36\n00:12:37,423 --> 00:12:55,251\n如果是的話政府真的可以洗洗睡了齁。我直接幫您整理好資料了齁。AI行動計畫2.0說每年可以培育600個AI研究人才、8000個AI應用人才、3500名這個相關的人才、AI自動領域500名。每年可能可以新增12000名。但是!\n\n37\n00:12:55,831 --> 00:13:11,459\n我們人力行業者1月說AI人口人才缺口可能超過2.4萬顯然還有非常大的差距臺灣雖然也有吸引國外人才優質的機制但是條件僵化去年一整年我們的就業金卡科技類領域只網羅到372人\n\n38\n00:13:16,841 --> 00:13:44,587\n相較於臺灣外流的勞動人口我還不足道我直接念幾個數字來看這是300位企業家共同做的2024臺灣人才白皮書臺灣一年1.2萬人復日工作10年暴增8倍美國我們光是臺灣籍過去的技術人才簽證的數量超過3000人世界排名第7我們真的要成為粗糙大國我們再來看英國牛津經濟學公司用數學模型推估\n\n39\n00:13:45,827 --> 00:14:13,090\n臺灣是最嚴重的全球人才荒,人才次數負1.5%,根本沒有辦法吸引高階的人才過來,半導體AI產業,包含我們剛剛講的人型機器人,對外人才需有恐懼,我們挖角卻受限於金卡的條件僵化。我們想問院長,除了就業金卡以外,我們還有沒有研議其他的方式,網羅成為入超大國,新增甚至所謂的AI就業銀卡的機制,擴大對外攬財。\n\n40\n00:14:14,492 --> 00:14:30,700\n謝謝委員我們看到世界各國對台灣的科技地位如此的重視我們當然知道人才的培育是一個非常重要的一節也謝謝委員剛剛提醒的那些個部會但是我認為在每個部會都要自己去培訓很多的AI人才而不僅是靠學校\n\n41\n00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:52,040\n在部會當中要培訓所以我們這樣的比例現在看下來數字應該還可以往上增加。院長您的高度是絕對重要的請您帶頭除了擴大攬財以外您剛剛也已經承諾了我們要努力那你也要努力政府要帶頭美國4月的時候宣布所有聯邦政府機關都要聘用一個\n\n42\n00:14:52,620 --> 00:15:11,935\n首席AI專家負責監督AI的使用性目標預計在今年夏天以前招聘100名相關人才每位人才年薪突破450萬台幣請問院長我們的行政院目前有沒有類似的規劃由政府機關帶頭聘用AI人才\n\n43\n00:15:13,092 --> 00:15:26,164\n各位委員報告,包括我們的國科會、速發部、經濟部,他們常常在...行政院長有沒有帶頭...我都跟他們一起談論過,他們在交談...有沒有要政府機關應用AI人才?\n\n44\n00:15:26,164 --> 00:15:27,906\n有。有嗎?\n\n45\n00:15:27,906 --> 00:15:30,248\n有沒有預計多少人數?\n\n46\n00:15:30,248 --> 00:15:31,950\n何時完成招募案聘任?\n\n47\n00:15:31,950 --> 00:15:33,731\n你覺得你有想聘就聘得到嗎?\n\n48\n00:15:34,876 --> 00:16:03,539\n當然要經過很多的努力啊。好,拜託院長努力喔,這一點真的非常重要。一定會的,謝謝委員。台積電大規模要投入人才的培育,產業跳進來自救,就是一大警訊啦齁。接下來當然我們有好消息啦,輝達超維都要在臺灣設置研發中心,人才需求只會多不會少。我們現在內部供應已經不足,我們還要向外攬財,中央的人才政策一定要做好準備齁。再來我們不僅缺人才齁,院長您記得2023年臺灣的代表制第一名是什麼嗎?\n\n49\n00:16:05,199 --> 00:16:15,769\n我剛剛其實已經洩題了我現在告訴您答案就是缺啦缺水缺電缺雞蛋缺藥而且還缺什麼缺土地缺供水缺供電缺人才缺勞動力\n\n50\n00:16:17,651 --> 00:16:39,646\n行政院的政策如果好好落實應該要滿足產業的需求但是我們卻面臨了五缺啦過去我們受惠於ChinaPlusOne我們有機會得到了很多的紅利成為世界科技中心但是現在勿換心意全球都在喊台灣PlusOne要尋找下一個取代台灣的地點\n\n51\n00:16:40,908 --> 00:16:55,290\n臺積電在日本、美國、德國設廠就是很明顯的案例。對政府來講,跟牛臺灣說的容易,但五缺問題沒有解決的話,這恐怕非常非常危險。市調機構,給您看數字,這個數字真的很重要。ChainForce2023年年底的報告,\n\n52\n00:16:56,451 --> 00:17:05,698\n相關的半導體廠商由其先進製程的產能占比將從2023年的29%成長到33%同期未來臺灣成熟製程的占比會從49%下降到42%另外接下來美國為首很可能會從2023到2027年從12%成長到17%本席真的非常擔心\n\n53\n00:17:22,091 --> 00:17:47,529\n未來會不會從現在的TaiwanPlusOne變成EveryoneMinusTaiwan以前的ChinaPlusOne我們賺到了結果呢現在TaiwanPlusOne執政黨不僅讓大家缺水缺電甚至國防部還亂發飛彈簡訊製造恐慌我們還看中華經濟研究院的曹天旺董事長陳信宏副院長投書我們應該由行政院領頭形成某國PlusTaiwan\n\n54\n00:17:48,149 --> 00:18:11,052\n我真的希望院長今天之後緊急思考讓台灣plusone翻轉成everyoneplusTaiwan不要讓台灣被取代我們剛剛講那麼長我其實要問您一個具體的問題黃仁勳說台灣是世界的支柱我相信您認同這一點但是黃仁勳同時也說了缺這個字他說台灣電力的局限會是一個挑戰請問您認同嗎\n\n55\n00:18:13,286 --> 00:18:30,892\n剛剛委員有說過一句話說執政黨造成臺灣的缺水缺電,我更認一下,執政黨努力不造成臺灣的缺水缺電。我現在是說我們未來嘛,activeinnovative我們往前看嘛,他就說缺嘛。當然知道電力穩定。你認同臺灣電力的局限是個挑戰嗎?\n\n56\n00:18:32,172 --> 00:18:32,892\n短短幾個字倒進產業心聲\n\n57\n00:18:54,298 --> 00:19:13,679\n再來我們看美國商會我們最重視盟友的想法6月6日發布2024年臺灣白皮書強調臺灣官方應保持穩定電價同時也表示商會成員關心穩定能源供應有7成成員在調查中表達對綠色能源供應的擔憂我們可以看下一個這是我們政府部會\n\n58\n00:19:14,940 --> 00:19:38,933\n的這個相關態度的反覆﹖我就不多說了﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖反反覆覆短短1個月左右的時間﹖非核家園的神主牌﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖我表演一下﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖搞得民眾和產業物理看法﹖我在這裡再問一次院長﹖\n\n59\n00:19:40,730 --> 00:19:59,029\n產業界大聲疾呼,民進黨好朋友童子賢,民進黨大寶許信良,許多的閣員看似都比您理性物質。您還是圖牌綜藝堅守,核電不研議的非核家園省主牌的立場嗎?在您回答以前,我先提醒您,本席也是立法院臺美國會聯誼會的副會長。\n\n60\n00:20:00,951 --> 00:20:05,853\n政府對於產業界所有的擔心我們一定會重視這是最大的原則所以穩定供電是政府對人民跟產業的責任我們也一定要達到但是非核家園它不是神主牌\n\n61\n00:20:27,927 --> 00:20:53,422\n他是我們現在依照環境基本法裡面依法要朝向的目標沒有關係院長我今天問您一個問題啦我當時問這個這個國會主委啦經濟部啦和安會啦有沒有要把非核家園省主牌接過去我今天問您相同的問題您願不願意接受非核家園的省主牌你把它定義為省主牌的話無人可以接受得起他只是我們現在依照環境基本法所定定的非核家園目標\n\n62\n00:20:54,315 --> 00:21:14,492\n我quote您講的話您說非核家園是您的價值還說如果失去價值生命會失去意義這裡神主牌還嚴重阿你如果沒有拿過去你很可能就沒有生命阿我們是要拯救你阿接受非核家園阿既然如此要不要大方接受下來要不要接受要不要接受沒有關係我把他放遠一點\n\n63\n00:21:21,821 --> 00:21:35,987\n這是委員的自由如果拒絕接下來我想您的非核家園是口號喊喊而已我們所有的美國盟友都看得到每年AI需要的能源增加3%我們核電廠7月1號機停機少3%明年2號機停機再少3%\n\n64\n00:21:39,449 --> 00:22:08,531\n一來一往補足的電力不只是核電廠的6.2%很可能我們要增加用費發電火力發電的比例讓我們的健康受到長期的影響這一次內閣有很多的亮點是來自於產業我們真的誠懇呼籲行政院能源政策要中立務實客觀不要被意識形態綁架不要擔心被非核家園的支持者討厭就不敢改變不要打中臉充棒子最後造成政府產業和民眾三輸的局面\n\n65\n00:22:09,231 --> 00:22:36,343\n三場的問題我們有新的電廠可以接的上來這個經濟部郭部長已經算的很清楚我待會會有數據告訴您啦我們知道過去的評估人家微軟已經開始在購買核電囉已經在購買核電囉我們待會會聊這個部分雖然說科學本於事實但是有時候事實難以判斷一樣會造成三輸的局面接下來要請問一下院長看看螢幕上顯示的這幾張圖片\n\n66\n00:22:40,650 --> 00:22:45,581\n請問院長,哪一封是真正的臺水公司吹角簡訊,分辨得出來嗎?\n\n67\n00:22:45,581 --> 00:22:47,866\n繳錯了院長官邸可能會被斷水斷電喔。\n\n68\n00:22:49,226 --> 00:23:17,759\n哪一個是真的?我知道委員想提的就是詐騙的行為這個我們深惡痛絕我們跟我一樣的重視這是臺水公司喔這幾個月來我速度接獲民眾的陳情收到假冒的國營事業臺水臺電的吹角簡訊這裡面有一半是假的不疑有他刷卡以後發現受到詐騙政府一再強調電子簽章法施行以後刊登相關的廣告數位簽章可以有效的減少\n\n69\n00:23:18,499 --> 00:23:19,199\n報告委員我們支持您的看法。\n\n70\n00:23:40,456 --> 00:24:07,086\n是很好非常非常重要因為依據資通安全管理法臺水臺電關於是屬於關鍵基礎設施必須要向經濟部提出資通安全維護的計畫假如發生資安事件要依法通報再問郭部長我先回覆您我也支持您關於核電的很多看法但是再問郭部長近半年臺水臺電是否曾經發生過資安事件是幾級的資安事件\n\n71\n00:24:09,161 --> 00:24:38,411\n我是沒有收到這個報告好,速發部的黃部長我們能不能回應一下近半年來速發部因為資安院在速發部嘛這個我已經提到資安很久了這個黃部長您可以回答一下近半年來速發部是否曾接獲台水及台電的資安通報我們報告委員我們現在一個月大概收到這是關鍵基礎設施喔對我知道大概每個月收到大概100多件的台水跟台電\n\n72\n00:24:40,580 --> 00:25:01,206\n關鍵基礎設施目前沒有這個資料目前沒有我幫您問好了這半年來臺電做過一次資安通報臺水的通報次數為零啦齁你們上網隨便搜尋一下臺水詐騙全部都是幾乎半個臺灣都被都收到了請問一下郭部長兩家國營事業是否有沒有確認客戶資料有沒有遭到外洩\n\n73\n00:25:05,356 --> 00:25:07,478\n謝謝委員政府部門、國營事業甚至包括民間的產業事業都不應該\n\n74\n00:25:27,786 --> 00:25:32,309\n當將各自海水、海電、潭南市、公立專案小組、調查治安、軍人治安、委員承諾。我想要提醒院長,國內這還都只是舊方法。\n\n75\n00:25:43,337 --> 00:26:05,533\n接下來還有AI聲尾技術,5秒鐘講話就可以模仿你的聲音。美國歐盟都集中支援嚴防AI詐騙,我們現在上網一查,結果內政部、刑事警察局鼓勵民眾要建立通關密語,要發通關密語才能夠通話,不僅防詐的責任完全推給民眾,還要求民眾用落後的方式來防詐,彷彿推回漢朝,比對虎符一樣。\n\n76\n00:26:09,176 --> 00:26:23,691\n院長,既然我們的AI戰略方針可能還不明確,但是我們國科會積極推動AI行動計畫3.0,您能不能承諾AI防詐可以列為AI政策的重要一環,科技的事用科技處理,漢朝的事我們把它放在歷史裡面,院長可以承諾嗎?\n\n77\n00:26:24,930 --> 00:26:47,800\n謝謝委員您當然知道我們現在全力推動希望大院通過打詐釋法就是讓我們有先進的法律可以握在手上您回去看一下裡面有沒有用到科技有沒有用到AI這個沒有關係我們開放問題真的是提醒大家最後我想講一下虛擬世界也不是全然都洪水猛獸有一個產業正在被全世界擁抱卻唯獨被台灣當成洪水猛獸\n\n78\n00:26:49,821 --> 00:27:04,474\n這個議題就是虛擬貨幣的ETF。今年1月10日美國證券交易委員會批准比特幣ETF交易。3月4日我上任以後馬上去質詢為什麼我們的金管會禁止\n\n79\n00:27:05,094 --> 00:27:28,036\n我們的民眾通過互委託我們政府鼓勵的方式去購買比特幣的現貨ETF5月22號我再就此一提詢問金管會彭主委我們當然很感謝彭主委有表示法人有機會先行開放程度雖未達預期但起碼表示政府對虛擬貨幣的態度不再保守僵化我想要請院長給我們一個勉勵好不好政府\n\n80\n00:27:28,556 --> 00:27:38,906\n目前對於虛擬貨幣ETF的態度有沒有正由保守轉向開放?我們目前預估的期程何時可以開放付委託購買比特幣ETF?\n\n81\n00:27:40,387 --> 00:28:00,663\n這是一個新興的事業齁,新興的行業,那我們願意在安全更有保障的情況底下,能夠朝向跟國際接軌的方式做,但是注重安全,保障人民的安全,因為我始終主張AI的創新,也要民主AI的創新,保障人類的自主跟人格自治。我們已經問了半年了,有什麼理由還要再拖延6個月勒?\n\n82\n00:28:02,284 --> 00:28:27,470\n我想這個院長能不能責任金管會加速研議開放,我們不要一直把安全安全掛在嘴巴上,我們長期長期我們要加速,我們每天睡覺AI都在變聰明,全世界的競爭都在增加,能不能加速研議開放法人以及一般民眾,互委託購買國際上已經允許的比特幣現貨ETF,滿足社會大眾對多元投資商品的期待,可不可以?\n\n83\n00:28:29,178 --> 00:28:46,769\n報告委員,我們這部分已經在進行中。那時間希望可以加快,範圍希望可以增加,如果有教育民眾保障安全的需求,我們朝野一起來努力,可以嗎?謝謝委員,謝謝委員。最後啦,我要用我最喜歡的電影一一來做總結。\n\n84\n00:28:48,735 --> 00:29:18,267\n院長,不曉得你有沒有看過這部楊德昌導演最棒的電影之一。當中的主角小男孩楊洋他有一句名句他說我要去告訴別人他們不知道的事給別人看他們看不到的東西這正是我進入國會擔任立法委員的原因我希望利用每一次質詢的機會告訴院長和所有的內閣官員我們都沒有看見的事\n\n85\n00:29:19,414 --> 00:29:38,729\n我看見黃恩勳說的,未來數位經濟會是實體經濟的一百倍。我括他的原話,theeconomyintheMetaverse,theeconomyofOmniversewillbelargerthantheeconomyinthephysicalworld.\n\n86\n00:29:38,729 --> 00:29:45,714\nDigitalcurrency,CryptocurrencycouldbeusedintheworldofMetaverse.\n\n87\n00:29:46,581 --> 00:30:02,737\n我看見數位經濟即將爆炸性的成長。我看見台灣是AI產業鏈的重要角色。我感到驕傲。但是同時我也看見台灣淪為詐騙手法的創新基地。我對此感到羞愧。\n\n88\n00:30:03,678 --> 00:30:15,328\n我看見臺灣對人型機器人研發的缺乳﹖對政府的無知感到驚訝﹖我也看到臺灣在非核神主牌與核電廠為政府的反覆拉扯感到難過﹖正在失去科技之島的地位和優勢﹖\n\n89\n00:30:32,301 --> 00:30:32,461\n謝謝各位委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n25082\t30867\t好,謝謝主席。有請行政院卓榮泰院長。請卓院長備詢。各位好。院長好,初次和你見面。首先我要單獨請您看一段影片。大概一分鐘,暫時先請其他閣員不要就備詢台。\n67250\t94896\t我想院長你可以看到這一支AI人型機器人Humanoid它有23到43個關節模組不只肢體靈活高難度的動作也難不倒他還可以做精細的動作甚至會使用工具如果有一台的話您今天這個休息慶功就可以讓他幫你開飲料了\n96598\t101920\t我曾經喝過機器人泡的咖啡。很好,機器人泡的咖啡只是手而已,這是整個模擬人形的人形機器人,完全不同。\n118445\t139805\t我想要告訴院長現在這支人型機器人在網路平台就可以買得到每一支售價45萬台幣您看到的泡咖啡沒有辦法走路沒有辦法跑步這支是秒數兩公尺未來隨著大量生產價格還可能更低您認為這個產品未來有沒有機會在臺灣甚至全球普及\n140800\t167108\t我現在也到我們的飯店啊,看到很多機器人在送餐啊,引路,但還沒有做到人形。我覺得它會一步一步的進化到,進步到這樣的程度。好,有機會普及嗎?在台灣?在全球?如果過去我們在電影中看到的都會實現的話,我覺得這個在相當的時日應該是跟人類可以生活在一起。非常好,關於影片最後還有一個問題讓您猜猜看,這一支AI人形機器人的產地是哪裡?\n169387\t197461\t產地喔,對不起這個委員請委員明示。好,很好喔,院長不願意猜猜嗎?再給您一次機會。那猜就是那些科技的大國。科技大國。好啦,院長好奇心是人類進步的動力啦。是。沒想到您對於科技的進步不願意感覺猜猜。這樣的政府我覺得能夠引領科技的進步我覺得有點危險。但您也算猜對一半,但您也許不願意承認這一支AI人型機器人\n197981\t216546\t也許真的如您所說是科技大國但是我們認為臺灣才是科技大國AI人型機器人是由中國大陸的科技公司剛剛影片這一支中國大陸的科技公司有研發的相較於其他人型機器人動雜數十萬上百萬這一支售價相對的低廉\n217026\t238314\t甚至現在今天就已經可以從網路商店購買大概3到5年以後可能從工廠到家庭都可以看到他的身影一個機器人做各種的協助AI的下一步就是人型機器人人型機器人包含內部的AI晶片、視覺語言系統以及行動技術是AI落地的實體應用\n240075\t266681\t我們看到這樣子的一個未來還會突飛猛進。特斯拉的執行長馬斯克今年4月宣布8月8日要推出Robotaxi。到時候院長可能在路邊攔車攔到了可能都是機器人開的計程車。灰達的執行長也在前幾天的大會發表演說的時候邀請一打機器人在台上助陣當然是用影像的方式。我們現在擁有創建人型機器人所需的所有技術。\n267521\t286586\t根據機器人聯盟IFR的數據,其中73%會安裝在亞太地區,2023年到2028年的複合年增長率50%,目前還剛起步。講了這麼多,回過頭來看看臺灣,想請教一下院長,我國目前進行AI人型機器人研發的組織單位,請問是哪一個部會?\n290989\t313624\t報告委員,我們目前國科會在資助全國的學院單位的確是有發展人型機器人的這樣的計畫。我問的是政府部會有哪一個部會主責研發?國科會。國科會有沒有機器人研發的相關計畫?不要講大專院校喔,我們國科會還有很多的中心喔。\n314431\t317535\t主管科技發展的國科會直接告訴我們目前沒有針對AI人型機器人的推動特定的專案\n329791\t347796\t一切全憑各大學自主研究兄弟登山自行努力我還不死心喔上網找找看啊看看其他部會有沒有進行相關的研究好不容易找到經濟部工研院有一個小小的在做機器人可猜是關節模組的研究想要在此很沉重的來問一下院長\n348696\t377750\t難道臺灣已經直接放棄AI人型機器人的研發了嗎?主導臺灣科研的國科會,無論是在AI行動2.0計畫裡,或者在精創計畫裡,居然都沒有提到有關人型機器人的半個字!國科會主委要不要確認這件事情?是不是沒有提到?我們現在在這裡要講話要很明確的喔!相關文件都上網找得到喔!有沒有提到?你只要提有或沒有就好!有沒有在文件裡提到?\n379773\t380354\t我們最喜歡的經濟學人指出中國大陸\n405175\t425436\t預測到未來勞動力缺乏的問題因此正在力爭成為機器人以及人型機器人的超級大國我們現在路上跑的車子很多都是進口車大家手機裡下載的遊戲app都是國外的遊戲大家可能習以為常但是很快的三到五年內很可能在路上走的家家戶戶用的都是網路上買來的\n426337\t454864\t由您剛剛所提到的科技大國所製造的人型機器人甚至有可能他們裡面所採用的語言模型是Chat CPT我們一直在講開放語料但是沒有人給我們回應到時候臺灣要如何抵禦中國大陸的科技統戰、文化統戰最近人稱AI教父的NVIDIA創始人黃恩勛來臺緊急來臺和許多業界人士揮霧一口氣和16%的GDP老闆大吃大談未來AI產業的發展\n456124\t457165\t但是不知道怎麼樣?\n457165\t458446\t到底是不是錯覺?\n458446\t469393\t我們的政府官員好像神隱少女一樣在AI產業的交流裡頭完全缺席。 別人邊吃邊抬。 難道在座的官員都只有羨慕的份嗎?\n469393\t481081\t我想在此詢問卓院長以及在場所有的內閣官員這一次黃仁勛先生訪台的過程當中有沒有人受邀與他共餐暢談政府AI政策規劃的?\n481081\t482541\t有的可不可以舉手讓我們知道一下?\n483442\t500165\t跟委員報告,產業界他們合作各種方式,政府跟產業界當然有接觸。我剛剛問的是有沒有人舉手啊?沒有人舉手啊?再跟委員報告,我們現場舉手沒有留下紀錄,我們還是用口頭回答,比較誠意。看來,那有沒有,有沒有邀您共參嘛?\n500816\t524126\t我們有見過面沒有共餐有沒有暢談政府AI我想啦看起來所謂AI內閣我們真的不希望是在政府內部裡樹枝高閣把AI樹枝高閣的一個地方扮演神隱造你的潮人家沒有邀你們吃飯你們難道也沒有主動邀他嗎報告委員吃飯不重要我們是做事的那您有沒有跟黃文勳聊過國家科研發展AI科研發展\n525254\t535703\t趕快還想說你沒有舉手我就不要點你了,有嗎?我們跟NVIDIA跟AMD都有詳情。 王仁勳來跟,沒有關係,我不管了,政府AI政策多頭馬車一團閃殺。\n538035\t567092\t真的是要導致我國AI產業的發展,連基本的戰略方針都沒有。我之前已經攏圖過很多,我們待會還有例子。國科會主委兼任政委,擔任國家AI推動小組的召集人,上任至今一個月。有沒有召開會議?今天是卓內閣上任第22天。根據行政院智慧國家推動小組的設置要點,我們行政院智慧國家推動小組的理由,理應由行政院副院長擔任總召集人。\n567352\t593585\t但是,行政院的官網上,我們現在小組的召集人竟然還掛著鄭文燦前院長的名字。院長您可以看頭影片,這真的,你可以不用看我,因為這真的是有點太誇張了。真的是不知道是不是時光被凍結了。鄭前院長現在是海基會的董事長,我們難道要期待他作為海基會的董事長來和多萬台人工智慧的合作推動智慧國家小組嗎?\n595045\t615065\t謝謝委員提醒,我們立即跟委員抱歉。很好,沒有不用道歉,我們要的不是道歉,我們要的是Active and Innovative,要主動積極創新啊。我們看到黃仁興先生有說,吸氣人會像未來汽車一樣的普及。假設過去政府沒有注意到,我今天在這裡是來提醒院長,\n615746\t640049\t以及相關的閣員﹚跨部會要有高度真的要有前瞻性的思維趕緊整合各部會針對AI人型機器人調整相關計劃方案包含軟體硬體當然也包含晶片視覺系統等等以此為基礎才能夠破壞臺灣的AI戰略總體方針好不好那最近兩週也不只是NVIDIA我們的護國神山台積電\n641030\t656241\t在6月5號董事會當中通過了一個決議,要投資最多40億台幣長期研究半導體教學及人才培育,逐漸產業對於人才短缺的優勢已經到了不得不自己跳下來自救的程度。 院長\n657762\t681575\t產業已經跳下來自救了,我們政府相應的,人家搭飛機來台灣了,我們這個台積電要投錢了,我們政府相應的措施是什麼?我幫您先列三種可能,第一個錦上添花,產業查錢我們跟著查。第二個米平落差,針對產業沒有投入的面向,政府盤點資源輔助弱勢。第三個,政府覺得已經很完美了,兩手一攤,躺平看戲,請問院長是哪一種?\n682695\t701846\t各位委員報告,我們應該還要有戰略第一位的考量,因為我們看到Computex這樣的國際的大廠都來到台灣,造成一股熱潮,那他們要在台灣的投資我們當然歡迎,投資到哪裡去,政府要做好更多的投資的環境,這個是政府該做的。現在已經有新的行動。\n702646\t727179\t新的作為我們不是Active Innovative嗎?請問我們要有新的動作我們就應該要有新的行動來因應為什麼台積電忍不住跳進來?因為全球AI人才大大的缺乏而且還發生一個狀況紐約時報這個我真的是要跟院長分享紐約時報3月說全球頂尖AI研究人員已經有近半數出自中國\n728219\t754822\t遠高於美國的18%,三年前中國人才只佔三分之一,三年後已經成長到五成。中國大陸顯然成為以AI人才的最大搖籃。那我們的AI人才呢?要從哪裡來看呢?我們來看齁,上週我質詢國會國務組委備詢的時候,他說AI需求永無止盡,人類缺口,人力缺口永遠無法滿足,只能盡力做。還強調事實就是如此。\n755422\t757423\t難道這就是我們行政院的態度嗎?\n757423\t775251\t如果是的話政府真的可以洗洗睡了齁。 我直接幫您整理好資料了齁。 AI行動計畫2.0說每年可以培育600個AI研究人才、8000個AI應用人才、3500名這個相關的人才、AI自動領域500名。 每年可能可以新增12000名。 但是!\n775831\t791459\t我們人力行業者1月說AI人口人才缺口可能超過2.4萬顯然還有非常大的差距臺灣雖然也有吸引國外人才優質的機制但是條件僵化去年一整年我們的就業金卡科技類領域只網羅到372人\n796841\t824587\t相較於臺灣外流的勞動人口我還不足道我直接念幾個數字來看這是300位企業家共同做的2024臺灣人才白皮書臺灣一年1.2萬人復日工作10年暴增8倍美國我們光是臺灣籍過去的技術人才簽證的數量超過3000人世界排名第7我們真的要成為粗糙大國我們再來看英國牛津經濟學公司用數學模型推估\n825827\t853090\t臺灣是最嚴重的全球人才荒,人才次數負1.5%,根本沒有辦法吸引高階的人才過來,半導體AI產業,包含我們剛剛講的人型機器人,對外人才需有恐懼,我們挖角卻受限於金卡的條件僵化。我們想問院長,除了就業金卡以外,我們還有沒有研議其他的方式,網羅成為入超大國,新增甚至所謂的AI就業銀卡的機制,擴大對外攬財。\n854492\t870700\t謝謝委員我們看到世界各國對台灣的科技地位如此的重視我們當然知道人才的培育是一個非常重要的一節也謝謝委員剛剛提醒的那些個部會但是我認為在每個部會都要自己去培訓很多的AI人才而不僅是靠學校\n871320\t892040\t在部會當中要培訓所以我們這樣的比例現在看下來數字應該還可以往上增加。院長您的高度是絕對重要的請您帶頭除了擴大攬財以外您剛剛也已經承諾了我們要努力那你也要努力政府要帶頭美國4月的時候宣布所有聯邦政府機關都要聘用一個\n892620\t911935\t首席AI專家負責監督AI的使用性目標預計在今年夏天以前招聘100名相關人才每位人才年薪突破450萬台幣請問院長我們的行政院目前有沒有類似的規劃由政府機關帶頭聘用AI人才\n913092\t926164\t各位委員報告,包括我們的國科會、速發部、經濟部,他們常常在... 行政院長有沒有帶頭... 我都跟他們一起談論過,他們在交談... 有沒有要政府機關應用AI人才?\n926164\t927906\t有。 有嗎?\n927906\t930248\t有沒有預計多少人數?\n930248\t931950\t何時完成招募案聘任?\n931950\t933731\t你覺得你有想聘就聘得到嗎?\n934876\t963539\t當然要經過很多的努力啊。好,拜託院長努力喔,這一點真的非常重要。一定會的,謝謝委員。台積電大規模要投入人才的培育,產業跳進來自救,就是一大警訊啦齁。接下來當然我們有好消息啦,輝達超維都要在臺灣設置研發中心,人才需求只會多不會少。我們現在內部供應已經不足,我們還要向外攬財,中央的人才政策一定要做好準備齁。再來我們不僅缺人才齁,院長您記得2023年臺灣的代表制第一名是什麼嗎?\n965199\t975769\t我剛剛其實已經洩題了我現在告訴您答案就是缺啦缺水缺電缺雞蛋缺藥而且還缺什麼缺土地缺供水缺供電缺人才缺勞動力\n977651\t999646\t行政院的政策如果好好落實應該要滿足產業的需求但是我們卻面臨了五缺啦過去我們受惠於China Plus One我們有機會得到了很多的紅利成為世界科技中心但是現在勿換心意全球都在喊台灣Plus One要尋找下一個取代台灣的地點\n1000908\t1015290\t臺積電在日本、美國、德國設廠就是很明顯的案例。對政府來講,跟牛臺灣說的容易,但五缺問題沒有解決的話,這恐怕非常非常危險。市調機構,給您看數字,這個數字真的很重要。Chain Force2023年年底的報告,\n1016451\t1025698\t相關的半導體廠商由其先進製程的產能占比將從2023年的29%成長到33%同期未來臺灣成熟製程的占比會從49%下降到42%另外接下來美國為首很可能會從2023到2027年從12%成長到17%本席真的非常擔心\n1042091\t1067529\t未來會不會從現在的Taiwan Plus One變成Everyone Minus Taiwan以前的China Plus One我們賺到了結果呢現在Taiwan Plus One執政黨不僅讓大家缺水缺電甚至國防部還亂發飛彈簡訊製造恐慌我們還看中華經濟研究院的曹天旺董事長陳信宏副院長投書我們應該由行政院領頭形成某國Plus Taiwan\n1068149\t1091052\t我真的希望院長今天之後緊急思考讓台灣plusone翻轉成everyone plus Taiwan不要讓台灣被取代我們剛剛講那麼長我其實要問您一個具體的問題黃仁勳說台灣是世界的支柱我相信您認同這一點但是黃仁勳同時也說了缺這個字他說台灣電力的局限會是一個挑戰請問您認同嗎\n1093286\t1110892\t剛剛委員有說過一句話說執政黨造成臺灣的缺水缺電,我更認一下,執政黨努力不造成臺灣的缺水缺電。我現在是說我們未來嘛,active innovative我們往前看嘛,他就說缺嘛。當然知道電力穩定。你認同臺灣電力的局限是個挑戰嗎?\n1112172\t1112892\t短短幾個字倒進產業心聲\n1134298\t1153679\t再來我們看美國商會我們最重視盟友的想法6月6日發布2024年臺灣白皮書強調臺灣官方應保持穩定電價同時也表示商會成員關心穩定能源供應有7成成員在調查中表達對綠色能源供應的擔憂我們可以看下一個這是我們政府部會\n1154940\t1178933\t的這個相關態度的反覆﹖我就不多說了﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖反反覆覆短短1個月左右的時間﹖非核家園的神主牌﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖我表演一下﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖搞得民眾和產業物理看法﹖我在這裡再問一次院長﹖\n1180730\t1199029\t產業界大聲疾呼,民進黨好朋友童子賢,民進黨大寶許信良,許多的閣員看似都比您理性物質。您還是圖牌綜藝堅守,核電不研議的非核家園省主牌的立場嗎?在您回答以前,我先提醒您,本席也是立法院臺美國會聯誼會的副會長。\n1200951\t1205853\t政府對於產業界所有的擔心我們一定會重視這是最大的原則所以穩定供電是政府對人民跟產業的責任我們也一定要達到但是非核家園它不是神主牌\n1227927\t1253422\t他是我們現在依照環境基本法裡面依法要朝向的目標沒有關係 院長我今天問您一個問題啦我當時問這個這個國會主委啦經濟部啦 和安會啦有沒有要把非核家園省主牌接過去我今天問您相同的問題您願不願意接受非核家園的省主牌你把它定義為省主牌的話無人可以接受得起他只是我們現在依照環境基本法所定定的非核家園目標\n1254315\t1274492\t我quote您講的話您說非核家園是您的價值還說如果失去價值生命會失去意義這裡神主牌還嚴重阿你如果沒有拿過去你很可能就沒有生命阿我們是要拯救你阿接受非核家園阿既然如此要不要大方接受下來要不要接受要不要接受沒有關係我把他放遠一點\n1281821\t1295987\t這是委員的自由如果拒絕接下來我想您的非核家園是口號喊喊而已我們所有的美國盟友都看得到每年AI需要的能源增加3%我們核電廠7月1號機停機少3%明年2號機停機再少3%\n1299449\t1328531\t一來一往補足的電力不只是核電廠的6.2%很可能我們要增加用費發電火力發電的比例讓我們的健康受到長期的影響這一次內閣有很多的亮點是來自於產業我們真的誠懇呼籲行政院能源政策要中立務實客觀不要被意識形態綁架不要擔心被非核家園的支持者討厭就不敢改變不要打中臉充棒子最後造成政府產業和民眾三輸的局面\n1329231\t1356343\t三場的問題我們有新的電廠可以接的上來這個經濟部郭部長已經算的很清楚我待會會有數據告訴您啦我們知道過去的評估人家微軟已經開始在購買核電囉已經在購買核電囉我們待會會聊這個部分雖然說科學本於事實但是有時候事實難以判斷一樣會造成三輸的局面接下來要請問一下院長看看螢幕上顯示的這幾張圖片\n1360650\t1365581\t請問院長,哪一封是真正的臺水公司吹角簡訊,分辨得出來嗎?\n1365581\t1367866\t繳錯了院長官邸可能會被斷水斷電喔。\n1369226\t1397759\t哪一個是真的?我知道委員想提的就是詐騙的行為這個我們深惡痛絕我們跟我一樣的重視這是臺水公司喔這幾個月來我速度接獲民眾的陳情收到假冒的國營事業臺水臺電的吹角簡訊這裡面有一半是假的不疑有他刷卡以後發現受到詐騙政府一再強調電子簽章法施行以後刊登相關的廣告數位簽章可以有效的減少\n1398499\t1399199\t報告委員我們支持您的看法。\n1420456\t1447086\t是很好非常非常重要因為依據資通安全管理法臺水臺電關於是屬於關鍵基礎設施必須要向經濟部提出資通安全維護的計畫假如發生資安事件要依法通報再問郭部長我先回覆您我也支持您關於核電的很多看法但是再問郭部長近半年臺水臺電是否曾經發生過資安事件是幾級的資安事件\n1449161\t1478411\t我是沒有收到這個報告好,速發部的黃部長我們能不能回應一下近半年來速發部因為資安院在速發部嘛這個我已經提到資安很久了這個黃部長您可以回答一下近半年來速發部是否曾接獲台水及台電的資安通報我們報告委員我們現在一個月大概收到這是關鍵基礎設施喔對我知道大概每個月收到大概100多件的台水跟台電\n1480580\t1501206\t關鍵基礎設施目前沒有這個資料目前沒有我幫您問好了這半年來臺電做過一次資安通報臺水的通報次數為零啦齁你們上網隨便搜尋一下臺水詐騙全部都是幾乎半個臺灣都被都收到了請問一下郭部長兩家國營事業是否有沒有確認客戶資料有沒有遭到外洩\n1505356\t1507478\t謝謝委員政府部門、國營事業甚至包括民間的產業事業都不應該\n1527786\t1532309\t當將各自海水、海電、潭南市、公立專案小組、調查治安、軍人治安、委員承諾。我想要提醒院長,國內這還都只是舊方法。\n1543337\t1565533\t接下來還有AI聲尾技術,5秒鐘講話就可以模仿你的聲音。美國歐盟都集中支援嚴防AI詐騙,我們現在上網一查,結果內政部、刑事警察局鼓勵民眾要建立通關密語,要發通關密語才能夠通話,不僅防詐的責任完全推給民眾,還要求民眾用落後的方式來防詐,彷彿推回漢朝,比對虎符一樣。\n1569176\t1583691\t院長,既然我們的AI戰略方針可能還不明確,但是我們國科會積極推動AI行動計畫3.0,您能不能承諾AI防詐可以列為AI政策的重要一環,科技的事用科技處理,漢朝的事我們把它放在歷史裡面,院長可以承諾嗎?\n1584930\t1607800\t謝謝委員 您當然知道我們現在全力推動希望大院通過打詐釋法就是讓我們有先進的法律可以握在手上您回去看一下裡面有沒有用到科技有沒有用到AI這個沒有關係我們開放問題真的是提醒大家最後我想講一下虛擬世界也不是全然都洪水猛獸有一個產業正在被全世界擁抱卻唯獨被台灣當成洪水猛獸\n1609821\t1624474\t這個議題就是虛擬貨幣的ETF。今年1月10日美國證券交易委員會批准比特幣ETF交易。3月4日我上任以後馬上去質詢為什麼我們的金管會禁止\n1625094\t1648036\t我們的民眾通過互委託我們政府鼓勵的方式去購買比特幣的現貨ETF5月22號我再就此一提詢問金管會彭主委我們當然很感謝彭主委有表示法人有機會先行開放程度雖未達預期但起碼表示政府對虛擬貨幣的態度不再保守僵化我想要請院長給我們一個勉勵好不好政府\n1648556\t1658906\t目前對於虛擬貨幣ETF的態度有沒有正由保守轉向開放?我們目前預估的期程何時可以開放付委託購買比特幣ETF?\n1660387\t1680663\t這是一個新興的事業齁,新興的行業,那我們願意在安全更有保障的情況底下,能夠朝向跟國際接軌的方式做,但是注重安全,保障人民的安全,因為我始終主張AI的創新,也要民主AI的創新,保障人類的自主跟人格自治。我們已經問了半年了,有什麼理由還要再拖延6個月勒?\n1682284\t1707470\t我想這個院長能不能責任金管會加速研議開放,我們不要一直把安全安全掛在嘴巴上,我們長期長期我們要加速,我們每天睡覺AI都在變聰明,全世界的競爭都在增加,能不能加速研議開放法人以及一般民眾,互委託購買國際上已經允許的比特幣現貨ETF,滿足社會大眾對多元投資商品的期待,可不可以?\n1709178\t1726769\t報告委員,我們這部分已經在進行中。那時間希望可以加快,範圍希望可以增加,如果有教育民眾保障安全的需求,我們朝野一起來努力,可以嗎?謝謝委員,謝謝委員。最後啦,我要用我最喜歡的電影一一來做總結。\n1728735\t1758267\t院長,不曉得你有沒有看過這部楊德昌導演最棒的電影之一。當中的主角小男孩楊洋他有一句名句他說我要去告訴別人他們不知道的事給別人看他們看不到的東西這正是我進入國會擔任立法委員的原因我希望利用每一次質詢的機會告訴院長和所有的內閣官員我們都沒有看見的事\n1759414\t1778729\t我看見黃恩勳說的,未來數位經濟會是實體經濟的一百倍。我括他的原話,the economy in the Metaverse, the economy of Omniverse will be larger than the economy in the physical world.\n1778729\t1785714\tDigital currency, Cryptocurrency could be used in the world of Metaverse.\n1786581\t1802737\t我看見數位經濟即將爆炸性的成長。 我看見台灣是AI產業鏈的重要角色。 我感到驕傲。 但是同時我也看見台灣淪為詐騙手法的創新基地。 我對此感到羞愧。\n1803678\t1815328\t我看見臺灣對人型機器人研發的缺乳﹖對政府的無知感到驚訝﹖我也看到臺灣在非核神主牌與核電廠為政府的反覆拉扯感到難過﹖正在失去科技之島的地位和優勢﹖\n1832301\t1832461\t謝謝各位委員\n","txt":"好,謝謝主席。有請行政院卓榮泰院長。請卓院長備詢。各位好。院長好,初次和你見面。首先我要單獨請您看一段影片。大概一分鐘,暫時先請其他閣員不要就備詢台。\n我想院長你可以看到這一支AI人型機器人Humanoid它有23到43個關節模組不只肢體靈活高難度的動作也難不倒他還可以做精細的動作甚至會使用工具如果有一台的話您今天這個休息慶功就可以讓他幫你開飲料了\n我曾經喝過機器人泡的咖啡。很好,機器人泡的咖啡只是手而已,這是整個模擬人形的人形機器人,完全不同。\n我想要告訴院長現在這支人型機器人在網路平台就可以買得到每一支售價45萬台幣您看到的泡咖啡沒有辦法走路沒有辦法跑步這支是秒數兩公尺未來隨著大量生產價格還可能更低您認為這個產品未來有沒有機會在臺灣甚至全球普及\n我現在也到我們的飯店啊,看到很多機器人在送餐啊,引路,但還沒有做到人形。我覺得它會一步一步的進化到,進步到這樣的程度。好,有機會普及嗎?在台灣?在全球?如果過去我們在電影中看到的都會實現的話,我覺得這個在相當的時日應該是跟人類可以生活在一起。非常好,關於影片最後還有一個問題讓您猜猜看,這一支AI人形機器人的產地是哪裡?\n產地喔,對不起這個委員請委員明示。好,很好喔,院長不願意猜猜嗎?再給您一次機會。那猜就是那些科技的大國。科技大國。好啦,院長好奇心是人類進步的動力啦。是。沒想到您對於科技的進步不願意感覺猜猜。這樣的政府我覺得能夠引領科技的進步我覺得有點危險。但您也算猜對一半,但您也許不願意承認這一支AI人型機器人\n也許真的如您所說是科技大國但是我們認為臺灣才是科技大國AI人型機器人是由中國大陸的科技公司剛剛影片這一支中國大陸的科技公司有研發的相較於其他人型機器人動雜數十萬上百萬這一支售價相對的低廉\n甚至現在今天就已經可以從網路商店購買大概3到5年以後可能從工廠到家庭都可以看到他的身影一個機器人做各種的協助AI的下一步就是人型機器人人型機器人包含內部的AI晶片、視覺語言系統以及行動技術是AI落地的實體應用\n我們看到這樣子的一個未來還會突飛猛進。特斯拉的執行長馬斯克今年4月宣布8月8日要推出Robotaxi。到時候院長可能在路邊攔車攔到了可能都是機器人開的計程車。灰達的執行長也在前幾天的大會發表演說的時候邀請一打機器人在台上助陣當然是用影像的方式。我們現在擁有創建人型機器人所需的所有技術。\n根據機器人聯盟IFR的數據,其中73%會安裝在亞太地區,2023年到2028年的複合年增長率50%,目前還剛起步。講了這麼多,回過頭來看看臺灣,想請教一下院長,我國目前進行AI人型機器人研發的組織單位,請問是哪一個部會?\n報告委員,我們目前國科會在資助全國的學院單位的確是有發展人型機器人的這樣的計畫。我問的是政府部會有哪一個部會主責研發?國科會。國科會有沒有機器人研發的相關計畫?不要講大專院校喔,我們國科會還有很多的中心喔。\n主管科技發展的國科會直接告訴我們目前沒有針對AI人型機器人的推動特定的專案\n一切全憑各大學自主研究兄弟登山自行努力我還不死心喔上網找找看啊看看其他部會有沒有進行相關的研究好不容易找到經濟部工研院有一個小小的在做機器人可猜是關節模組的研究想要在此很沉重的來問一下院長\n難道臺灣已經直接放棄AI人型機器人的研發了嗎?主導臺灣科研的國科會,無論是在AI行動2.0計畫裡,或者在精創計畫裡,居然都沒有提到有關人型機器人的半個字!國科會主委要不要確認這件事情?是不是沒有提到?我們現在在這裡要講話要很明確的喔!相關文件都上網找得到喔!有沒有提到?你只要提有或沒有就好!有沒有在文件裡提到?\n我們最喜歡的經濟學人指出中國大陸\n預測到未來勞動力缺乏的問題因此正在力爭成為機器人以及人型機器人的超級大國我們現在路上跑的車子很多都是進口車大家手機裡下載的遊戲app都是國外的遊戲大家可能習以為常但是很快的三到五年內很可能在路上走的家家戶戶用的都是網路上買來的\n由您剛剛所提到的科技大國所製造的人型機器人甚至有可能他們裡面所採用的語言模型是Chat CPT我們一直在講開放語料但是沒有人給我們回應到時候臺灣要如何抵禦中國大陸的科技統戰、文化統戰最近人稱AI教父的NVIDIA創始人黃恩勛來臺緊急來臺和許多業界人士揮霧一口氣和16%的GDP老闆大吃大談未來AI產業的發展\n但是不知道怎麼樣?\n到底是不是錯覺?\n我們的政府官員好像神隱少女一樣在AI產業的交流裡頭完全缺席。 別人邊吃邊抬。 難道在座的官員都只有羨慕的份嗎?\n我想在此詢問卓院長以及在場所有的內閣官員這一次黃仁勛先生訪台的過程當中有沒有人受邀與他共餐暢談政府AI政策規劃的?\n有的可不可以舉手讓我們知道一下?\n跟委員報告,產業界他們合作各種方式,政府跟產業界當然有接觸。我剛剛問的是有沒有人舉手啊?沒有人舉手啊?再跟委員報告,我們現場舉手沒有留下紀錄,我們還是用口頭回答,比較誠意。看來,那有沒有,有沒有邀您共參嘛?\n我們有見過面沒有共餐有沒有暢談政府AI我想啦看起來所謂AI內閣我們真的不希望是在政府內部裡樹枝高閣把AI樹枝高閣的一個地方扮演神隱造你的潮人家沒有邀你們吃飯你們難道也沒有主動邀他嗎報告委員吃飯不重要我們是做事的那您有沒有跟黃文勳聊過國家科研發展AI科研發展\n趕快還想說你沒有舉手我就不要點你了,有嗎?我們跟NVIDIA跟AMD都有詳情。 王仁勳來跟,沒有關係,我不管了,政府AI政策多頭馬車一團閃殺。\n真的是要導致我國AI產業的發展,連基本的戰略方針都沒有。我之前已經攏圖過很多,我們待會還有例子。國科會主委兼任政委,擔任國家AI推動小組的召集人,上任至今一個月。有沒有召開會議?今天是卓內閣上任第22天。根據行政院智慧國家推動小組的設置要點,我們行政院智慧國家推動小組的理由,理應由行政院副院長擔任總召集人。\n但是,行政院的官網上,我們現在小組的召集人竟然還掛著鄭文燦前院長的名字。院長您可以看頭影片,這真的,你可以不用看我,因為這真的是有點太誇張了。真的是不知道是不是時光被凍結了。鄭前院長現在是海基會的董事長,我們難道要期待他作為海基會的董事長來和多萬台人工智慧的合作推動智慧國家小組嗎?\n謝謝委員提醒,我們立即跟委員抱歉。很好,沒有不用道歉,我們要的不是道歉,我們要的是Active and Innovative,要主動積極創新啊。我們看到黃仁興先生有說,吸氣人會像未來汽車一樣的普及。假設過去政府沒有注意到,我今天在這裡是來提醒院長,\n以及相關的閣員﹚跨部會要有高度真的要有前瞻性的思維趕緊整合各部會針對AI人型機器人調整相關計劃方案包含軟體硬體當然也包含晶片視覺系統等等以此為基礎才能夠破壞臺灣的AI戰略總體方針好不好那最近兩週也不只是NVIDIA我們的護國神山台積電\n在6月5號董事會當中通過了一個決議,要投資最多40億台幣長期研究半導體教學及人才培育,逐漸產業對於人才短缺的優勢已經到了不得不自己跳下來自救的程度。 院長\n產業已經跳下來自救了,我們政府相應的,人家搭飛機來台灣了,我們這個台積電要投錢了,我們政府相應的措施是什麼?我幫您先列三種可能,第一個錦上添花,產業查錢我們跟著查。第二個米平落差,針對產業沒有投入的面向,政府盤點資源輔助弱勢。第三個,政府覺得已經很完美了,兩手一攤,躺平看戲,請問院長是哪一種?\n各位委員報告,我們應該還要有戰略第一位的考量,因為我們看到Computex這樣的國際的大廠都來到台灣,造成一股熱潮,那他們要在台灣的投資我們當然歡迎,投資到哪裡去,政府要做好更多的投資的環境,這個是政府該做的。現在已經有新的行動。\n新的作為我們不是Active Innovative嗎?請問我們要有新的動作我們就應該要有新的行動來因應為什麼台積電忍不住跳進來?因為全球AI人才大大的缺乏而且還發生一個狀況紐約時報這個我真的是要跟院長分享紐約時報3月說全球頂尖AI研究人員已經有近半數出自中國\n遠高於美國的18%,三年前中國人才只佔三分之一,三年後已經成長到五成。中國大陸顯然成為以AI人才的最大搖籃。那我們的AI人才呢?要從哪裡來看呢?我們來看齁,上週我質詢國會國務組委備詢的時候,他說AI需求永無止盡,人類缺口,人力缺口永遠無法滿足,只能盡力做。還強調事實就是如此。\n難道這就是我們行政院的態度嗎?\n如果是的話政府真的可以洗洗睡了齁。 我直接幫您整理好資料了齁。 AI行動計畫2.0說每年可以培育600個AI研究人才、8000個AI應用人才、3500名這個相關的人才、AI自動領域500名。 每年可能可以新增12000名。 但是!\n我們人力行業者1月說AI人口人才缺口可能超過2.4萬顯然還有非常大的差距臺灣雖然也有吸引國外人才優質的機制但是條件僵化去年一整年我們的就業金卡科技類領域只網羅到372人\n相較於臺灣外流的勞動人口我還不足道我直接念幾個數字來看這是300位企業家共同做的2024臺灣人才白皮書臺灣一年1.2萬人復日工作10年暴增8倍美國我們光是臺灣籍過去的技術人才簽證的數量超過3000人世界排名第7我們真的要成為粗糙大國我們再來看英國牛津經濟學公司用數學模型推估\n臺灣是最嚴重的全球人才荒,人才次數負1.5%,根本沒有辦法吸引高階的人才過來,半導體AI產業,包含我們剛剛講的人型機器人,對外人才需有恐懼,我們挖角卻受限於金卡的條件僵化。我們想問院長,除了就業金卡以外,我們還有沒有研議其他的方式,網羅成為入超大國,新增甚至所謂的AI就業銀卡的機制,擴大對外攬財。\n謝謝委員我們看到世界各國對台灣的科技地位如此的重視我們當然知道人才的培育是一個非常重要的一節也謝謝委員剛剛提醒的那些個部會但是我認為在每個部會都要自己去培訓很多的AI人才而不僅是靠學校\n在部會當中要培訓所以我們這樣的比例現在看下來數字應該還可以往上增加。院長您的高度是絕對重要的請您帶頭除了擴大攬財以外您剛剛也已經承諾了我們要努力那你也要努力政府要帶頭美國4月的時候宣布所有聯邦政府機關都要聘用一個\n首席AI專家負責監督AI的使用性目標預計在今年夏天以前招聘100名相關人才每位人才年薪突破450萬台幣請問院長我們的行政院目前有沒有類似的規劃由政府機關帶頭聘用AI人才\n各位委員報告,包括我們的國科會、速發部、經濟部,他們常常在... 行政院長有沒有帶頭... 我都跟他們一起談論過,他們在交談... 有沒有要政府機關應用AI人才?\n有。 有嗎?\n有沒有預計多少人數?\n何時完成招募案聘任?\n你覺得你有想聘就聘得到嗎?\n當然要經過很多的努力啊。好,拜託院長努力喔,這一點真的非常重要。一定會的,謝謝委員。台積電大規模要投入人才的培育,產業跳進來自救,就是一大警訊啦齁。接下來當然我們有好消息啦,輝達超維都要在臺灣設置研發中心,人才需求只會多不會少。我們現在內部供應已經不足,我們還要向外攬財,中央的人才政策一定要做好準備齁。再來我們不僅缺人才齁,院長您記得2023年臺灣的代表制第一名是什麼嗎?\n我剛剛其實已經洩題了我現在告訴您答案就是缺啦缺水缺電缺雞蛋缺藥而且還缺什麼缺土地缺供水缺供電缺人才缺勞動力\n行政院的政策如果好好落實應該要滿足產業的需求但是我們卻面臨了五缺啦過去我們受惠於China Plus One我們有機會得到了很多的紅利成為世界科技中心但是現在勿換心意全球都在喊台灣Plus One要尋找下一個取代台灣的地點\n臺積電在日本、美國、德國設廠就是很明顯的案例。對政府來講,跟牛臺灣說的容易,但五缺問題沒有解決的話,這恐怕非常非常危險。市調機構,給您看數字,這個數字真的很重要。Chain Force2023年年底的報告,\n相關的半導體廠商由其先進製程的產能占比將從2023年的29%成長到33%同期未來臺灣成熟製程的占比會從49%下降到42%另外接下來美國為首很可能會從2023到2027年從12%成長到17%本席真的非常擔心\n未來會不會從現在的Taiwan Plus One變成Everyone Minus Taiwan以前的China Plus One我們賺到了結果呢現在Taiwan Plus One執政黨不僅讓大家缺水缺電甚至國防部還亂發飛彈簡訊製造恐慌我們還看中華經濟研究院的曹天旺董事長陳信宏副院長投書我們應該由行政院領頭形成某國Plus Taiwan\n我真的希望院長今天之後緊急思考讓台灣plusone翻轉成everyone plus Taiwan不要讓台灣被取代我們剛剛講那麼長我其實要問您一個具體的問題黃仁勳說台灣是世界的支柱我相信您認同這一點但是黃仁勳同時也說了缺這個字他說台灣電力的局限會是一個挑戰請問您認同嗎\n剛剛委員有說過一句話說執政黨造成臺灣的缺水缺電,我更認一下,執政黨努力不造成臺灣的缺水缺電。我現在是說我們未來嘛,active innovative我們往前看嘛,他就說缺嘛。當然知道電力穩定。你認同臺灣電力的局限是個挑戰嗎?\n短短幾個字倒進產業心聲\n再來我們看美國商會我們最重視盟友的想法6月6日發布2024年臺灣白皮書強調臺灣官方應保持穩定電價同時也表示商會成員關心穩定能源供應有7成成員在調查中表達對綠色能源供應的擔憂我們可以看下一個這是我們政府部會\n的這個相關態度的反覆﹖我就不多說了﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖反反覆覆短短1個月左右的時間﹖非核家園的神主牌﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖我表演一下﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖搞得民眾和產業物理看法﹖我在這裡再問一次院長﹖\n產業界大聲疾呼,民進黨好朋友童子賢,民進黨大寶許信良,許多的閣員看似都比您理性物質。您還是圖牌綜藝堅守,核電不研議的非核家園省主牌的立場嗎?在您回答以前,我先提醒您,本席也是立法院臺美國會聯誼會的副會長。\n政府對於產業界所有的擔心我們一定會重視這是最大的原則所以穩定供電是政府對人民跟產業的責任我們也一定要達到但是非核家園它不是神主牌\n他是我們現在依照環境基本法裡面依法要朝向的目標沒有關係 院長我今天問您一個問題啦我當時問這個這個國會主委啦經濟部啦 和安會啦有沒有要把非核家園省主牌接過去我今天問您相同的問題您願不願意接受非核家園的省主牌你把它定義為省主牌的話無人可以接受得起他只是我們現在依照環境基本法所定定的非核家園目標\n我quote您講的話您說非核家園是您的價值還說如果失去價值生命會失去意義這裡神主牌還嚴重阿你如果沒有拿過去你很可能就沒有生命阿我們是要拯救你阿接受非核家園阿既然如此要不要大方接受下來要不要接受要不要接受沒有關係我把他放遠一點\n這是委員的自由如果拒絕接下來我想您的非核家園是口號喊喊而已我們所有的美國盟友都看得到每年AI需要的能源增加3%我們核電廠7月1號機停機少3%明年2號機停機再少3%\n一來一往補足的電力不只是核電廠的6.2%很可能我們要增加用費發電火力發電的比例讓我們的健康受到長期的影響這一次內閣有很多的亮點是來自於產業我們真的誠懇呼籲行政院能源政策要中立務實客觀不要被意識形態綁架不要擔心被非核家園的支持者討厭就不敢改變不要打中臉充棒子最後造成政府產業和民眾三輸的局面\n三場的問題我們有新的電廠可以接的上來這個經濟部郭部長已經算的很清楚我待會會有數據告訴您啦我們知道過去的評估人家微軟已經開始在購買核電囉已經在購買核電囉我們待會會聊這個部分雖然說科學本於事實但是有時候事實難以判斷一樣會造成三輸的局面接下來要請問一下院長看看螢幕上顯示的這幾張圖片\n請問院長,哪一封是真正的臺水公司吹角簡訊,分辨得出來嗎?\n繳錯了院長官邸可能會被斷水斷電喔。\n哪一個是真的?我知道委員想提的就是詐騙的行為這個我們深惡痛絕我們跟我一樣的重視這是臺水公司喔這幾個月來我速度接獲民眾的陳情收到假冒的國營事業臺水臺電的吹角簡訊這裡面有一半是假的不疑有他刷卡以後發現受到詐騙政府一再強調電子簽章法施行以後刊登相關的廣告數位簽章可以有效的減少\n報告委員我們支持您的看法。\n是很好非常非常重要因為依據資通安全管理法臺水臺電關於是屬於關鍵基礎設施必須要向經濟部提出資通安全維護的計畫假如發生資安事件要依法通報再問郭部長我先回覆您我也支持您關於核電的很多看法但是再問郭部長近半年臺水臺電是否曾經發生過資安事件是幾級的資安事件\n我是沒有收到這個報告好,速發部的黃部長我們能不能回應一下近半年來速發部因為資安院在速發部嘛這個我已經提到資安很久了這個黃部長您可以回答一下近半年來速發部是否曾接獲台水及台電的資安通報我們報告委員我們現在一個月大概收到這是關鍵基礎設施喔對我知道大概每個月收到大概100多件的台水跟台電\n關鍵基礎設施目前沒有這個資料目前沒有我幫您問好了這半年來臺電做過一次資安通報臺水的通報次數為零啦齁你們上網隨便搜尋一下臺水詐騙全部都是幾乎半個臺灣都被都收到了請問一下郭部長兩家國營事業是否有沒有確認客戶資料有沒有遭到外洩\n謝謝委員政府部門、國營事業甚至包括民間的產業事業都不應該\n當將各自海水、海電、潭南市、公立專案小組、調查治安、軍人治安、委員承諾。我想要提醒院長,國內這還都只是舊方法。\n接下來還有AI聲尾技術,5秒鐘講話就可以模仿你的聲音。美國歐盟都集中支援嚴防AI詐騙,我們現在上網一查,結果內政部、刑事警察局鼓勵民眾要建立通關密語,要發通關密語才能夠通話,不僅防詐的責任完全推給民眾,還要求民眾用落後的方式來防詐,彷彿推回漢朝,比對虎符一樣。\n院長,既然我們的AI戰略方針可能還不明確,但是我們國科會積極推動AI行動計畫3.0,您能不能承諾AI防詐可以列為AI政策的重要一環,科技的事用科技處理,漢朝的事我們把它放在歷史裡面,院長可以承諾嗎?\n謝謝委員 您當然知道我們現在全力推動希望大院通過打詐釋法就是讓我們有先進的法律可以握在手上您回去看一下裡面有沒有用到科技有沒有用到AI這個沒有關係我們開放問題真的是提醒大家最後我想講一下虛擬世界也不是全然都洪水猛獸有一個產業正在被全世界擁抱卻唯獨被台灣當成洪水猛獸\n這個議題就是虛擬貨幣的ETF。今年1月10日美國證券交易委員會批准比特幣ETF交易。3月4日我上任以後馬上去質詢為什麼我們的金管會禁止\n我們的民眾通過互委託我們政府鼓勵的方式去購買比特幣的現貨ETF5月22號我再就此一提詢問金管會彭主委我們當然很感謝彭主委有表示法人有機會先行開放程度雖未達預期但起碼表示政府對虛擬貨幣的態度不再保守僵化我想要請院長給我們一個勉勵好不好政府\n目前對於虛擬貨幣ETF的態度有沒有正由保守轉向開放?我們目前預估的期程何時可以開放付委託購買比特幣ETF?\n這是一個新興的事業齁,新興的行業,那我們願意在安全更有保障的情況底下,能夠朝向跟國際接軌的方式做,但是注重安全,保障人民的安全,因為我始終主張AI的創新,也要民主AI的創新,保障人類的自主跟人格自治。我們已經問了半年了,有什麼理由還要再拖延6個月勒?\n我想這個院長能不能責任金管會加速研議開放,我們不要一直把安全安全掛在嘴巴上,我們長期長期我們要加速,我們每天睡覺AI都在變聰明,全世界的競爭都在增加,能不能加速研議開放法人以及一般民眾,互委託購買國際上已經允許的比特幣現貨ETF,滿足社會大眾對多元投資商品的期待,可不可以?\n報告委員,我們這部分已經在進行中。那時間希望可以加快,範圍希望可以增加,如果有教育民眾保障安全的需求,我們朝野一起來努力,可以嗎?謝謝委員,謝謝委員。最後啦,我要用我最喜歡的電影一一來做總結。\n院長,不曉得你有沒有看過這部楊德昌導演最棒的電影之一。當中的主角小男孩楊洋他有一句名句他說我要去告訴別人他們不知道的事給別人看他們看不到的東西這正是我進入國會擔任立法委員的原因我希望利用每一次質詢的機會告訴院長和所有的內閣官員我們都沒有看見的事\n我看見黃恩勳說的,未來數位經濟會是實體經濟的一百倍。我括他的原話,the economy in the Metaverse, the economy of Omniverse will be larger than the economy in the physical world.\nDigital currency, Cryptocurrency could be used in the world of Metaverse.\n我看見數位經濟即將爆炸性的成長。 我看見台灣是AI產業鏈的重要角色。 我感到驕傲。 但是同時我也看見台灣淪為詐騙手法的創新基地。 我對此感到羞愧。\n我看見臺灣對人型機器人研發的缺乳﹖對政府的無知感到驚訝﹖我也看到臺灣在非核神主牌與核電廠為政府的反覆拉扯感到難過﹖正在失去科技之島的地位和優勢﹖\n謝謝各位委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:25.082 --> 00:30.867\n好,謝謝主席。有請行政院卓榮泰院長。請卓院長備詢。各位好。院長好,初次和你見面。首先我要單獨請您看一段影片。大概一分鐘,暫時先請其他閣員不要就備詢台。\n\n01:07.250 --> 01:34.896\n我想院長你可以看到這一支AI人型機器人Humanoid它有23到43個關節模組不只肢體靈活高難度的動作也難不倒他還可以做精細的動作甚至會使用工具如果有一台的話您今天這個休息慶功就可以讓他幫你開飲料了\n\n01:36.598 --> 01:41.920\n我曾經喝過機器人泡的咖啡。很好,機器人泡的咖啡只是手而已,這是整個模擬人形的人形機器人,完全不同。\n\n01:58.445 --> 02:19.805\n我想要告訴院長現在這支人型機器人在網路平台就可以買得到每一支售價45萬台幣您看到的泡咖啡沒有辦法走路沒有辦法跑步這支是秒數兩公尺未來隨著大量生產價格還可能更低您認為這個產品未來有沒有機會在臺灣甚至全球普及\n\n02:20.800 --> 02:47.108\n我現在也到我們的飯店啊,看到很多機器人在送餐啊,引路,但還沒有做到人形。我覺得它會一步一步的進化到,進步到這樣的程度。好,有機會普及嗎?在台灣?在全球?如果過去我們在電影中看到的都會實現的話,我覺得這個在相當的時日應該是跟人類可以生活在一起。非常好,關於影片最後還有一個問題讓您猜猜看,這一支AI人形機器人的產地是哪裡?\n\n02:49.387 --> 03:17.461\n產地喔,對不起這個委員請委員明示。好,很好喔,院長不願意猜猜嗎?再給您一次機會。那猜就是那些科技的大國。科技大國。好啦,院長好奇心是人類進步的動力啦。是。沒想到您對於科技的進步不願意感覺猜猜。這樣的政府我覺得能夠引領科技的進步我覺得有點危險。但您也算猜對一半,但您也許不願意承認這一支AI人型機器人\n\n03:17.981 --> 03:36.546\n也許真的如您所說是科技大國但是我們認為臺灣才是科技大國AI人型機器人是由中國大陸的科技公司剛剛影片這一支中國大陸的科技公司有研發的相較於其他人型機器人動雜數十萬上百萬這一支售價相對的低廉\n\n03:37.026 --> 03:58.314\n甚至現在今天就已經可以從網路商店購買大概3到5年以後可能從工廠到家庭都可以看到他的身影一個機器人做各種的協助AI的下一步就是人型機器人人型機器人包含內部的AI晶片、視覺語言系統以及行動技術是AI落地的實體應用\n\n04:00.075 --> 04:26.681\n我們看到這樣子的一個未來還會突飛猛進。特斯拉的執行長馬斯克今年4月宣布8月8日要推出Robotaxi。到時候院長可能在路邊攔車攔到了可能都是機器人開的計程車。灰達的執行長也在前幾天的大會發表演說的時候邀請一打機器人在台上助陣當然是用影像的方式。我們現在擁有創建人型機器人所需的所有技術。\n\n04:27.521 --> 04:46.586\n根據機器人聯盟IFR的數據,其中73%會安裝在亞太地區,2023年到2028年的複合年增長率50%,目前還剛起步。講了這麼多,回過頭來看看臺灣,想請教一下院長,我國目前進行AI人型機器人研發的組織單位,請問是哪一個部會?\n\n04:50.989 --> 05:13.624\n報告委員,我們目前國科會在資助全國的學院單位的確是有發展人型機器人的這樣的計畫。我問的是政府部會有哪一個部會主責研發?國科會。國科會有沒有機器人研發的相關計畫?不要講大專院校喔,我們國科會還有很多的中心喔。\n\n05:14.431 --> 05:17.535\n主管科技發展的國科會直接告訴我們目前沒有針對AI人型機器人的推動特定的專案\n\n05:29.791 --> 05:47.796\n一切全憑各大學自主研究兄弟登山自行努力我還不死心喔上網找找看啊看看其他部會有沒有進行相關的研究好不容易找到經濟部工研院有一個小小的在做機器人可猜是關節模組的研究想要在此很沉重的來問一下院長\n\n05:48.696 --> 06:17.750\n難道臺灣已經直接放棄AI人型機器人的研發了嗎?主導臺灣科研的國科會,無論是在AI行動2.0計畫裡,或者在精創計畫裡,居然都沒有提到有關人型機器人的半個字!國科會主委要不要確認這件事情?是不是沒有提到?我們現在在這裡要講話要很明確的喔!相關文件都上網找得到喔!有沒有提到?你只要提有或沒有就好!有沒有在文件裡提到?\n\n06:19.773 --> 06:20.354\n我們最喜歡的經濟學人指出中國大陸\n\n06:45.175 --> 07:05.436\n預測到未來勞動力缺乏的問題因此正在力爭成為機器人以及人型機器人的超級大國我們現在路上跑的車子很多都是進口車大家手機裡下載的遊戲app都是國外的遊戲大家可能習以為常但是很快的三到五年內很可能在路上走的家家戶戶用的都是網路上買來的\n\n07:06.337 --> 07:34.864\n由您剛剛所提到的科技大國所製造的人型機器人甚至有可能他們裡面所採用的語言模型是ChatCPT我們一直在講開放語料但是沒有人給我們回應到時候臺灣要如何抵禦中國大陸的科技統戰、文化統戰最近人稱AI教父的NVIDIA創始人黃恩勛來臺緊急來臺和許多業界人士揮霧一口氣和16%的GDP老闆大吃大談未來AI產業的發展\n\n07:36.124 --> 07:37.165\n但是不知道怎麼樣?\n\n07:37.165 --> 07:38.446\n到底是不是錯覺?\n\n07:38.446 --> 07:49.393\n我們的政府官員好像神隱少女一樣在AI產業的交流裡頭完全缺席。別人邊吃邊抬。難道在座的官員都只有羨慕的份嗎?\n\n07:49.393 --> 08:01.081\n我想在此詢問卓院長以及在場所有的內閣官員這一次黃仁勛先生訪台的過程當中有沒有人受邀與他共餐暢談政府AI政策規劃的?\n\n08:01.081 --> 08:02.541\n有的可不可以舉手讓我們知道一下?\n\n08:03.442 --> 08:20.165\n跟委員報告,產業界他們合作各種方式,政府跟產業界當然有接觸。我剛剛問的是有沒有人舉手啊?沒有人舉手啊?再跟委員報告,我們現場舉手沒有留下紀錄,我們還是用口頭回答,比較誠意。看來,那有沒有,有沒有邀您共參嘛?\n\n08:20.816 --> 08:44.126\n我們有見過面沒有共餐有沒有暢談政府AI我想啦看起來所謂AI內閣我們真的不希望是在政府內部裡樹枝高閣把AI樹枝高閣的一個地方扮演神隱造你的潮人家沒有邀你們吃飯你們難道也沒有主動邀他嗎報告委員吃飯不重要我們是做事的那您有沒有跟黃文勳聊過國家科研發展AI科研發展\n\n08:45.254 --> 08:55.703\n趕快還想說你沒有舉手我就不要點你了,有嗎?我們跟NVIDIA跟AMD都有詳情。王仁勳來跟,沒有關係,我不管了,政府AI政策多頭馬車一團閃殺。\n\n08:58.035 --> 09:27.092\n真的是要導致我國AI產業的發展,連基本的戰略方針都沒有。我之前已經攏圖過很多,我們待會還有例子。國科會主委兼任政委,擔任國家AI推動小組的召集人,上任至今一個月。有沒有召開會議?今天是卓內閣上任第22天。根據行政院智慧國家推動小組的設置要點,我們行政院智慧國家推動小組的理由,理應由行政院副院長擔任總召集人。\n\n09:27.352 --> 09:53.585\n但是,行政院的官網上,我們現在小組的召集人竟然還掛著鄭文燦前院長的名字。院長您可以看頭影片,這真的,你可以不用看我,因為這真的是有點太誇張了。真的是不知道是不是時光被凍結了。鄭前院長現在是海基會的董事長,我們難道要期待他作為海基會的董事長來和多萬台人工智慧的合作推動智慧國家小組嗎?\n\n09:55.045 --> 10:15.065\n謝謝委員提醒,我們立即跟委員抱歉。很好,沒有不用道歉,我們要的不是道歉,我們要的是ActiveandInnovative,要主動積極創新啊。我們看到黃仁興先生有說,吸氣人會像未來汽車一樣的普及。假設過去政府沒有注意到,我今天在這裡是來提醒院長,\n\n10:15.746 --> 10:40.049\n以及相關的閣員﹚跨部會要有高度真的要有前瞻性的思維趕緊整合各部會針對AI人型機器人調整相關計劃方案包含軟體硬體當然也包含晶片視覺系統等等以此為基礎才能夠破壞臺灣的AI戰略總體方針好不好那最近兩週也不只是NVIDIA我們的護國神山台積電\n\n10:41.030 --> 10:56.241\n在6月5號董事會當中通過了一個決議,要投資最多40億台幣長期研究半導體教學及人才培育,逐漸產業對於人才短缺的優勢已經到了不得不自己跳下來自救的程度。院長\n\n10:57.762 --> 11:21.575\n產業已經跳下來自救了,我們政府相應的,人家搭飛機來台灣了,我們這個台積電要投錢了,我們政府相應的措施是什麼?我幫您先列三種可能,第一個錦上添花,產業查錢我們跟著查。第二個米平落差,針對產業沒有投入的面向,政府盤點資源輔助弱勢。第三個,政府覺得已經很完美了,兩手一攤,躺平看戲,請問院長是哪一種?\n\n11:22.695 --> 11:41.846\n各位委員報告,我們應該還要有戰略第一位的考量,因為我們看到Computex這樣的國際的大廠都來到台灣,造成一股熱潮,那他們要在台灣的投資我們當然歡迎,投資到哪裡去,政府要做好更多的投資的環境,這個是政府該做的。現在已經有新的行動。\n\n11:42.646 --> 12:07.179\n新的作為我們不是ActiveInnovative嗎?請問我們要有新的動作我們就應該要有新的行動來因應為什麼台積電忍不住跳進來?因為全球AI人才大大的缺乏而且還發生一個狀況紐約時報這個我真的是要跟院長分享紐約時報3月說全球頂尖AI研究人員已經有近半數出自中國\n\n12:08.219 --> 12:34.822\n遠高於美國的18%,三年前中國人才只佔三分之一,三年後已經成長到五成。中國大陸顯然成為以AI人才的最大搖籃。那我們的AI人才呢?要從哪裡來看呢?我們來看齁,上週我質詢國會國務組委備詢的時候,他說AI需求永無止盡,人類缺口,人力缺口永遠無法滿足,只能盡力做。還強調事實就是如此。\n\n12:35.422 --> 12:37.423\n難道這就是我們行政院的態度嗎?\n\n12:37.423 --> 12:55.251\n如果是的話政府真的可以洗洗睡了齁。我直接幫您整理好資料了齁。AI行動計畫2.0說每年可以培育600個AI研究人才、8000個AI應用人才、3500名這個相關的人才、AI自動領域500名。每年可能可以新增12000名。但是!\n\n12:55.831 --> 13:11.459\n我們人力行業者1月說AI人口人才缺口可能超過2.4萬顯然還有非常大的差距臺灣雖然也有吸引國外人才優質的機制但是條件僵化去年一整年我們的就業金卡科技類領域只網羅到372人\n\n13:16.841 --> 13:44.587\n相較於臺灣外流的勞動人口我還不足道我直接念幾個數字來看這是300位企業家共同做的2024臺灣人才白皮書臺灣一年1.2萬人復日工作10年暴增8倍美國我們光是臺灣籍過去的技術人才簽證的數量超過3000人世界排名第7我們真的要成為粗糙大國我們再來看英國牛津經濟學公司用數學模型推估\n\n13:45.827 --> 14:13.090\n臺灣是最嚴重的全球人才荒,人才次數負1.5%,根本沒有辦法吸引高階的人才過來,半導體AI產業,包含我們剛剛講的人型機器人,對外人才需有恐懼,我們挖角卻受限於金卡的條件僵化。我們想問院長,除了就業金卡以外,我們還有沒有研議其他的方式,網羅成為入超大國,新增甚至所謂的AI就業銀卡的機制,擴大對外攬財。\n\n14:14.492 --> 14:30.700\n謝謝委員我們看到世界各國對台灣的科技地位如此的重視我們當然知道人才的培育是一個非常重要的一節也謝謝委員剛剛提醒的那些個部會但是我認為在每個部會都要自己去培訓很多的AI人才而不僅是靠學校\n\n14:31.320 --> 14:52.040\n在部會當中要培訓所以我們這樣的比例現在看下來數字應該還可以往上增加。院長您的高度是絕對重要的請您帶頭除了擴大攬財以外您剛剛也已經承諾了我們要努力那你也要努力政府要帶頭美國4月的時候宣布所有聯邦政府機關都要聘用一個\n\n14:52.620 --> 15:11.935\n首席AI專家負責監督AI的使用性目標預計在今年夏天以前招聘100名相關人才每位人才年薪突破450萬台幣請問院長我們的行政院目前有沒有類似的規劃由政府機關帶頭聘用AI人才\n\n15:13.092 --> 15:26.164\n各位委員報告,包括我們的國科會、速發部、經濟部,他們常常在...行政院長有沒有帶頭...我都跟他們一起談論過,他們在交談...有沒有要政府機關應用AI人才?\n\n15:26.164 --> 15:27.906\n有。有嗎?\n\n15:27.906 --> 15:30.248\n有沒有預計多少人數?\n\n15:30.248 --> 15:31.950\n何時完成招募案聘任?\n\n15:31.950 --> 15:33.731\n你覺得你有想聘就聘得到嗎?\n\n15:34.876 --> 16:03.539\n當然要經過很多的努力啊。好,拜託院長努力喔,這一點真的非常重要。一定會的,謝謝委員。台積電大規模要投入人才的培育,產業跳進來自救,就是一大警訊啦齁。接下來當然我們有好消息啦,輝達超維都要在臺灣設置研發中心,人才需求只會多不會少。我們現在內部供應已經不足,我們還要向外攬財,中央的人才政策一定要做好準備齁。再來我們不僅缺人才齁,院長您記得2023年臺灣的代表制第一名是什麼嗎?\n\n16:05.199 --> 16:15.769\n我剛剛其實已經洩題了我現在告訴您答案就是缺啦缺水缺電缺雞蛋缺藥而且還缺什麼缺土地缺供水缺供電缺人才缺勞動力\n\n16:17.651 --> 16:39.646\n行政院的政策如果好好落實應該要滿足產業的需求但是我們卻面臨了五缺啦過去我們受惠於ChinaPlusOne我們有機會得到了很多的紅利成為世界科技中心但是現在勿換心意全球都在喊台灣PlusOne要尋找下一個取代台灣的地點\n\n16:40.908 --> 16:55.290\n臺積電在日本、美國、德國設廠就是很明顯的案例。對政府來講,跟牛臺灣說的容易,但五缺問題沒有解決的話,這恐怕非常非常危險。市調機構,給您看數字,這個數字真的很重要。ChainForce2023年年底的報告,\n\n16:56.451 --> 17:05.698\n相關的半導體廠商由其先進製程的產能占比將從2023年的29%成長到33%同期未來臺灣成熟製程的占比會從49%下降到42%另外接下來美國為首很可能會從2023到2027年從12%成長到17%本席真的非常擔心\n\n17:22.091 --> 17:47.529\n未來會不會從現在的TaiwanPlusOne變成EveryoneMinusTaiwan以前的ChinaPlusOne我們賺到了結果呢現在TaiwanPlusOne執政黨不僅讓大家缺水缺電甚至國防部還亂發飛彈簡訊製造恐慌我們還看中華經濟研究院的曹天旺董事長陳信宏副院長投書我們應該由行政院領頭形成某國PlusTaiwan\n\n17:48.149 --> 18:11.052\n我真的希望院長今天之後緊急思考讓台灣plusone翻轉成everyoneplusTaiwan不要讓台灣被取代我們剛剛講那麼長我其實要問您一個具體的問題黃仁勳說台灣是世界的支柱我相信您認同這一點但是黃仁勳同時也說了缺這個字他說台灣電力的局限會是一個挑戰請問您認同嗎\n\n18:13.286 --> 18:30.892\n剛剛委員有說過一句話說執政黨造成臺灣的缺水缺電,我更認一下,執政黨努力不造成臺灣的缺水缺電。我現在是說我們未來嘛,activeinnovative我們往前看嘛,他就說缺嘛。當然知道電力穩定。你認同臺灣電力的局限是個挑戰嗎?\n\n18:32.172 --> 18:32.892\n短短幾個字倒進產業心聲\n\n18:54.298 --> 19:13.679\n再來我們看美國商會我們最重視盟友的想法6月6日發布2024年臺灣白皮書強調臺灣官方應保持穩定電價同時也表示商會成員關心穩定能源供應有7成成員在調查中表達對綠色能源供應的擔憂我們可以看下一個這是我們政府部會\n\n19:14.940 --> 19:38.933\n的這個相關態度的反覆﹖我就不多說了﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖反反覆覆短短1個月左右的時間﹖非核家園的神主牌﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖我表演一下﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖搞得民眾和產業物理看法﹖我在這裡再問一次院長﹖\n\n19:40.730 --> 19:59.029\n產業界大聲疾呼,民進黨好朋友童子賢,民進黨大寶許信良,許多的閣員看似都比您理性物質。您還是圖牌綜藝堅守,核電不研議的非核家園省主牌的立場嗎?在您回答以前,我先提醒您,本席也是立法院臺美國會聯誼會的副會長。\n\n20:00.951 --> 20:05.853\n政府對於產業界所有的擔心我們一定會重視這是最大的原則所以穩定供電是政府對人民跟產業的責任我們也一定要達到但是非核家園它不是神主牌\n\n20:27.927 --> 20:53.422\n他是我們現在依照環境基本法裡面依法要朝向的目標沒有關係院長我今天問您一個問題啦我當時問這個這個國會主委啦經濟部啦和安會啦有沒有要把非核家園省主牌接過去我今天問您相同的問題您願不願意接受非核家園的省主牌你把它定義為省主牌的話無人可以接受得起他只是我們現在依照環境基本法所定定的非核家園目標\n\n20:54.315 --> 21:14.492\n我quote您講的話您說非核家園是您的價值還說如果失去價值生命會失去意義這裡神主牌還嚴重阿你如果沒有拿過去你很可能就沒有生命阿我們是要拯救你阿接受非核家園阿既然如此要不要大方接受下來要不要接受要不要接受沒有關係我把他放遠一點\n\n21:21.821 --> 21:35.987\n這是委員的自由如果拒絕接下來我想您的非核家園是口號喊喊而已我們所有的美國盟友都看得到每年AI需要的能源增加3%我們核電廠7月1號機停機少3%明年2號機停機再少3%\n\n21:39.449 --> 22:08.531\n一來一往補足的電力不只是核電廠的6.2%很可能我們要增加用費發電火力發電的比例讓我們的健康受到長期的影響這一次內閣有很多的亮點是來自於產業我們真的誠懇呼籲行政院能源政策要中立務實客觀不要被意識形態綁架不要擔心被非核家園的支持者討厭就不敢改變不要打中臉充棒子最後造成政府產業和民眾三輸的局面\n\n22:09.231 --> 22:36.343\n三場的問題我們有新的電廠可以接的上來這個經濟部郭部長已經算的很清楚我待會會有數據告訴您啦我們知道過去的評估人家微軟已經開始在購買核電囉已經在購買核電囉我們待會會聊這個部分雖然說科學本於事實但是有時候事實難以判斷一樣會造成三輸的局面接下來要請問一下院長看看螢幕上顯示的這幾張圖片\n\n22:40.650 --> 22:45.581\n請問院長,哪一封是真正的臺水公司吹角簡訊,分辨得出來嗎?\n\n22:45.581 --> 22:47.866\n繳錯了院長官邸可能會被斷水斷電喔。\n\n22:49.226 --> 23:17.759\n哪一個是真的?我知道委員想提的就是詐騙的行為這個我們深惡痛絕我們跟我一樣的重視這是臺水公司喔這幾個月來我速度接獲民眾的陳情收到假冒的國營事業臺水臺電的吹角簡訊這裡面有一半是假的不疑有他刷卡以後發現受到詐騙政府一再強調電子簽章法施行以後刊登相關的廣告數位簽章可以有效的減少\n\n23:18.499 --> 23:19.199\n報告委員我們支持您的看法。\n\n23:40.456 --> 24:07.086\n是很好非常非常重要因為依據資通安全管理法臺水臺電關於是屬於關鍵基礎設施必須要向經濟部提出資通安全維護的計畫假如發生資安事件要依法通報再問郭部長我先回覆您我也支持您關於核電的很多看法但是再問郭部長近半年臺水臺電是否曾經發生過資安事件是幾級的資安事件\n\n24:09.161 --> 24:38.411\n我是沒有收到這個報告好,速發部的黃部長我們能不能回應一下近半年來速發部因為資安院在速發部嘛這個我已經提到資安很久了這個黃部長您可以回答一下近半年來速發部是否曾接獲台水及台電的資安通報我們報告委員我們現在一個月大概收到這是關鍵基礎設施喔對我知道大概每個月收到大概100多件的台水跟台電\n\n24:40.580 --> 25:01.206\n關鍵基礎設施目前沒有這個資料目前沒有我幫您問好了這半年來臺電做過一次資安通報臺水的通報次數為零啦齁你們上網隨便搜尋一下臺水詐騙全部都是幾乎半個臺灣都被都收到了請問一下郭部長兩家國營事業是否有沒有確認客戶資料有沒有遭到外洩\n\n25:05.356 --> 25:07.478\n謝謝委員政府部門、國營事業甚至包括民間的產業事業都不應該\n\n25:27.786 --> 25:32.309\n當將各自海水、海電、潭南市、公立專案小組、調查治安、軍人治安、委員承諾。我想要提醒院長,國內這還都只是舊方法。\n\n25:43.337 --> 26:05.533\n接下來還有AI聲尾技術,5秒鐘講話就可以模仿你的聲音。美國歐盟都集中支援嚴防AI詐騙,我們現在上網一查,結果內政部、刑事警察局鼓勵民眾要建立通關密語,要發通關密語才能夠通話,不僅防詐的責任完全推給民眾,還要求民眾用落後的方式來防詐,彷彿推回漢朝,比對虎符一樣。\n\n26:09.176 --> 26:23.691\n院長,既然我們的AI戰略方針可能還不明確,但是我們國科會積極推動AI行動計畫3.0,您能不能承諾AI防詐可以列為AI政策的重要一環,科技的事用科技處理,漢朝的事我們把它放在歷史裡面,院長可以承諾嗎?\n\n26:24.930 --> 26:47.800\n謝謝委員您當然知道我們現在全力推動希望大院通過打詐釋法就是讓我們有先進的法律可以握在手上您回去看一下裡面有沒有用到科技有沒有用到AI這個沒有關係我們開放問題真的是提醒大家最後我想講一下虛擬世界也不是全然都洪水猛獸有一個產業正在被全世界擁抱卻唯獨被台灣當成洪水猛獸\n\n26:49.821 --> 27:04.474\n這個議題就是虛擬貨幣的ETF。今年1月10日美國證券交易委員會批准比特幣ETF交易。3月4日我上任以後馬上去質詢為什麼我們的金管會禁止\n\n27:05.094 --> 27:28.036\n我們的民眾通過互委託我們政府鼓勵的方式去購買比特幣的現貨ETF5月22號我再就此一提詢問金管會彭主委我們當然很感謝彭主委有表示法人有機會先行開放程度雖未達預期但起碼表示政府對虛擬貨幣的態度不再保守僵化我想要請院長給我們一個勉勵好不好政府\n\n27:28.556 --> 27:38.906\n目前對於虛擬貨幣ETF的態度有沒有正由保守轉向開放?我們目前預估的期程何時可以開放付委託購買比特幣ETF?\n\n27:40.387 --> 28:00.663\n這是一個新興的事業齁,新興的行業,那我們願意在安全更有保障的情況底下,能夠朝向跟國際接軌的方式做,但是注重安全,保障人民的安全,因為我始終主張AI的創新,也要民主AI的創新,保障人類的自主跟人格自治。我們已經問了半年了,有什麼理由還要再拖延6個月勒?\n\n28:02.284 --> 28:27.470\n我想這個院長能不能責任金管會加速研議開放,我們不要一直把安全安全掛在嘴巴上,我們長期長期我們要加速,我們每天睡覺AI都在變聰明,全世界的競爭都在增加,能不能加速研議開放法人以及一般民眾,互委託購買國際上已經允許的比特幣現貨ETF,滿足社會大眾對多元投資商品的期待,可不可以?\n\n28:29.178 --> 28:46.769\n報告委員,我們這部分已經在進行中。那時間希望可以加快,範圍希望可以增加,如果有教育民眾保障安全的需求,我們朝野一起來努力,可以嗎?謝謝委員,謝謝委員。最後啦,我要用我最喜歡的電影一一來做總結。\n\n28:48.735 --> 29:18.267\n院長,不曉得你有沒有看過這部楊德昌導演最棒的電影之一。當中的主角小男孩楊洋他有一句名句他說我要去告訴別人他們不知道的事給別人看他們看不到的東西這正是我進入國會擔任立法委員的原因我希望利用每一次質詢的機會告訴院長和所有的內閣官員我們都沒有看見的事\n\n29:19.414 --> 29:38.729\n我看見黃恩勳說的,未來數位經濟會是實體經濟的一百倍。我括他的原話,theeconomyintheMetaverse,theeconomyofOmniversewillbelargerthantheeconomyinthephysicalworld.\n\n29:38.729 --> 29:45.714\nDigitalcurrency,CryptocurrencycouldbeusedintheworldofMetaverse.\n\n29:46.581 --> 30:02.737\n我看見數位經濟即將爆炸性的成長。我看見台灣是AI產業鏈的重要角色。我感到驕傲。但是同時我也看見台灣淪為詐騙手法的創新基地。我對此感到羞愧。\n\n30:03.678 --> 30:15.328\n我看見臺灣對人型機器人研發的缺乳﹖對政府的無知感到驚訝﹖我也看到臺灣在非核神主牌與核電廠為政府的反覆拉扯感到難過﹖正在失去科技之島的地位和優勢﹖\n\n30:32.301 --> 30:32.461\n謝謝各位委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":25.082,"end":30.867,"text":"好,謝謝主席。有請行政院卓榮泰院長。請卓院長備詢。各位好。院長好,初次和你見面。首先我要單獨請您看一段影片。大概一分鐘,暫時先請其他閣員不要就備詢台。"},{"start":67.25,"end":94.896,"text":"我想院長你可以看到這一支AI人型機器人Humanoid它有23到43個關節模組不只肢體靈活高難度的動作也難不倒他還可以做精細的動作甚至會使用工具如果有一台的話您今天這個休息慶功就可以讓他幫你開飲料了"},{"start":96.598,"end":101.92,"text":"我曾經喝過機器人泡的咖啡。很好,機器人泡的咖啡只是手而已,這是整個模擬人形的人形機器人,完全不同。"},{"start":118.445,"end":139.805,"text":"我想要告訴院長現在這支人型機器人在網路平台就可以買得到每一支售價45萬台幣您看到的泡咖啡沒有辦法走路沒有辦法跑步這支是秒數兩公尺未來隨著大量生產價格還可能更低您認為這個產品未來有沒有機會在臺灣甚至全球普及"},{"start":140.8,"end":167.108,"text":"我現在也到我們的飯店啊,看到很多機器人在送餐啊,引路,但還沒有做到人形。我覺得它會一步一步的進化到,進步到這樣的程度。好,有機會普及嗎?在台灣?在全球?如果過去我們在電影中看到的都會實現的話,我覺得這個在相當的時日應該是跟人類可以生活在一起。非常好,關於影片最後還有一個問題讓您猜猜看,這一支AI人形機器人的產地是哪裡?"},{"start":169.387,"end":197.461,"text":"產地喔,對不起這個委員請委員明示。好,很好喔,院長不願意猜猜嗎?再給您一次機會。那猜就是那些科技的大國。科技大國。好啦,院長好奇心是人類進步的動力啦。是。沒想到您對於科技的進步不願意感覺猜猜。這樣的政府我覺得能夠引領科技的進步我覺得有點危險。但您也算猜對一半,但您也許不願意承認這一支AI人型機器人"},{"start":197.981,"end":216.546,"text":"也許真的如您所說是科技大國但是我們認為臺灣才是科技大國AI人型機器人是由中國大陸的科技公司剛剛影片這一支中國大陸的科技公司有研發的相較於其他人型機器人動雜數十萬上百萬這一支售價相對的低廉"},{"start":217.026,"end":238.314,"text":"甚至現在今天就已經可以從網路商店購買大概3到5年以後可能從工廠到家庭都可以看到他的身影一個機器人做各種的協助AI的下一步就是人型機器人人型機器人包含內部的AI晶片、視覺語言系統以及行動技術是AI落地的實體應用"},{"start":240.075,"end":266.681,"text":"我們看到這樣子的一個未來還會突飛猛進。特斯拉的執行長馬斯克今年4月宣布8月8日要推出Robotaxi。到時候院長可能在路邊攔車攔到了可能都是機器人開的計程車。灰達的執行長也在前幾天的大會發表演說的時候邀請一打機器人在台上助陣當然是用影像的方式。我們現在擁有創建人型機器人所需的所有技術。"},{"start":267.521,"end":286.586,"text":"根據機器人聯盟IFR的數據,其中73%會安裝在亞太地區,2023年到2028年的複合年增長率50%,目前還剛起步。講了這麼多,回過頭來看看臺灣,想請教一下院長,我國目前進行AI人型機器人研發的組織單位,請問是哪一個部會?"},{"start":290.989,"end":313.624,"text":"報告委員,我們目前國科會在資助全國的學院單位的確是有發展人型機器人的這樣的計畫。我問的是政府部會有哪一個部會主責研發?國科會。國科會有沒有機器人研發的相關計畫?不要講大專院校喔,我們國科會還有很多的中心喔。"},{"start":314.431,"end":317.535,"text":"主管科技發展的國科會直接告訴我們目前沒有針對AI人型機器人的推動特定的專案"},{"start":329.791,"end":347.796,"text":"一切全憑各大學自主研究兄弟登山自行努力我還不死心喔上網找找看啊看看其他部會有沒有進行相關的研究好不容易找到經濟部工研院有一個小小的在做機器人可猜是關節模組的研究想要在此很沉重的來問一下院長"},{"start":348.696,"end":377.75,"text":"難道臺灣已經直接放棄AI人型機器人的研發了嗎?主導臺灣科研的國科會,無論是在AI行動2.0計畫裡,或者在精創計畫裡,居然都沒有提到有關人型機器人的半個字!國科會主委要不要確認這件事情?是不是沒有提到?我們現在在這裡要講話要很明確的喔!相關文件都上網找得到喔!有沒有提到?你只要提有或沒有就好!有沒有在文件裡提到?"},{"start":379.773,"end":380.354,"text":"我們最喜歡的經濟學人指出中國大陸"},{"start":405.175,"end":425.436,"text":"預測到未來勞動力缺乏的問題因此正在力爭成為機器人以及人型機器人的超級大國我們現在路上跑的車子很多都是進口車大家手機裡下載的遊戲app都是國外的遊戲大家可能習以為常但是很快的三到五年內很可能在路上走的家家戶戶用的都是網路上買來的"},{"start":426.337,"end":454.864,"text":"由您剛剛所提到的科技大國所製造的人型機器人甚至有可能他們裡面所採用的語言模型是Chat CPT我們一直在講開放語料但是沒有人給我們回應到時候臺灣要如何抵禦中國大陸的科技統戰、文化統戰最近人稱AI教父的NVIDIA創始人黃恩勛來臺緊急來臺和許多業界人士揮霧一口氣和16%的GDP老闆大吃大談未來AI產業的發展"},{"start":456.124,"end":457.165,"text":"但是不知道怎麼樣?"},{"start":457.165,"end":458.446,"text":"到底是不是錯覺?"},{"start":458.446,"end":469.393,"text":"我們的政府官員好像神隱少女一樣在AI產業的交流裡頭完全缺席。 別人邊吃邊抬。 難道在座的官員都只有羨慕的份嗎?"},{"start":469.393,"end":481.081,"text":"我想在此詢問卓院長以及在場所有的內閣官員這一次黃仁勛先生訪台的過程當中有沒有人受邀與他共餐暢談政府AI政策規劃的?"},{"start":481.081,"end":482.541,"text":"有的可不可以舉手讓我們知道一下?"},{"start":483.442,"end":500.165,"text":"跟委員報告,產業界他們合作各種方式,政府跟產業界當然有接觸。我剛剛問的是有沒有人舉手啊?沒有人舉手啊?再跟委員報告,我們現場舉手沒有留下紀錄,我們還是用口頭回答,比較誠意。看來,那有沒有,有沒有邀您共參嘛?"},{"start":500.816,"end":524.126,"text":"我們有見過面沒有共餐有沒有暢談政府AI我想啦看起來所謂AI內閣我們真的不希望是在政府內部裡樹枝高閣把AI樹枝高閣的一個地方扮演神隱造你的潮人家沒有邀你們吃飯你們難道也沒有主動邀他嗎報告委員吃飯不重要我們是做事的那您有沒有跟黃文勳聊過國家科研發展AI科研發展"},{"start":525.254,"end":535.703,"text":"趕快還想說你沒有舉手我就不要點你了,有嗎?我們跟NVIDIA跟AMD都有詳情。 王仁勳來跟,沒有關係,我不管了,政府AI政策多頭馬車一團閃殺。"},{"start":538.035,"end":567.092,"text":"真的是要導致我國AI產業的發展,連基本的戰略方針都沒有。我之前已經攏圖過很多,我們待會還有例子。國科會主委兼任政委,擔任國家AI推動小組的召集人,上任至今一個月。有沒有召開會議?今天是卓內閣上任第22天。根據行政院智慧國家推動小組的設置要點,我們行政院智慧國家推動小組的理由,理應由行政院副院長擔任總召集人。"},{"start":567.352,"end":593.585,"text":"但是,行政院的官網上,我們現在小組的召集人竟然還掛著鄭文燦前院長的名字。院長您可以看頭影片,這真的,你可以不用看我,因為這真的是有點太誇張了。真的是不知道是不是時光被凍結了。鄭前院長現在是海基會的董事長,我們難道要期待他作為海基會的董事長來和多萬台人工智慧的合作推動智慧國家小組嗎?"},{"start":595.045,"end":615.065,"text":"謝謝委員提醒,我們立即跟委員抱歉。很好,沒有不用道歉,我們要的不是道歉,我們要的是Active and Innovative,要主動積極創新啊。我們看到黃仁興先生有說,吸氣人會像未來汽車一樣的普及。假設過去政府沒有注意到,我今天在這裡是來提醒院長,"},{"start":615.746,"end":640.049,"text":"以及相關的閣員﹚跨部會要有高度真的要有前瞻性的思維趕緊整合各部會針對AI人型機器人調整相關計劃方案包含軟體硬體當然也包含晶片視覺系統等等以此為基礎才能夠破壞臺灣的AI戰略總體方針好不好那最近兩週也不只是NVIDIA我們的護國神山台積電"},{"start":641.03,"end":656.241,"text":"在6月5號董事會當中通過了一個決議,要投資最多40億台幣長期研究半導體教學及人才培育,逐漸產業對於人才短缺的優勢已經到了不得不自己跳下來自救的程度。 院長"},{"start":657.762,"end":681.575,"text":"產業已經跳下來自救了,我們政府相應的,人家搭飛機來台灣了,我們這個台積電要投錢了,我們政府相應的措施是什麼?我幫您先列三種可能,第一個錦上添花,產業查錢我們跟著查。第二個米平落差,針對產業沒有投入的面向,政府盤點資源輔助弱勢。第三個,政府覺得已經很完美了,兩手一攤,躺平看戲,請問院長是哪一種?"},{"start":682.695,"end":701.846,"text":"各位委員報告,我們應該還要有戰略第一位的考量,因為我們看到Computex這樣的國際的大廠都來到台灣,造成一股熱潮,那他們要在台灣的投資我們當然歡迎,投資到哪裡去,政府要做好更多的投資的環境,這個是政府該做的。現在已經有新的行動。"},{"start":702.646,"end":727.179,"text":"新的作為我們不是Active Innovative嗎?請問我們要有新的動作我們就應該要有新的行動來因應為什麼台積電忍不住跳進來?因為全球AI人才大大的缺乏而且還發生一個狀況紐約時報這個我真的是要跟院長分享紐約時報3月說全球頂尖AI研究人員已經有近半數出自中國"},{"start":728.219,"end":754.822,"text":"遠高於美國的18%,三年前中國人才只佔三分之一,三年後已經成長到五成。中國大陸顯然成為以AI人才的最大搖籃。那我們的AI人才呢?要從哪裡來看呢?我們來看齁,上週我質詢國會國務組委備詢的時候,他說AI需求永無止盡,人類缺口,人力缺口永遠無法滿足,只能盡力做。還強調事實就是如此。"},{"start":755.422,"end":757.423,"text":"難道這就是我們行政院的態度嗎?"},{"start":757.423,"end":775.251,"text":"如果是的話政府真的可以洗洗睡了齁。 我直接幫您整理好資料了齁。 AI行動計畫2.0說每年可以培育600個AI研究人才、8000個AI應用人才、3500名這個相關的人才、AI自動領域500名。 每年可能可以新增12000名。 但是!"},{"start":775.831,"end":791.459,"text":"我們人力行業者1月說AI人口人才缺口可能超過2.4萬顯然還有非常大的差距臺灣雖然也有吸引國外人才優質的機制但是條件僵化去年一整年我們的就業金卡科技類領域只網羅到372人"},{"start":796.841,"end":824.587,"text":"相較於臺灣外流的勞動人口我還不足道我直接念幾個數字來看這是300位企業家共同做的2024臺灣人才白皮書臺灣一年1.2萬人復日工作10年暴增8倍美國我們光是臺灣籍過去的技術人才簽證的數量超過3000人世界排名第7我們真的要成為粗糙大國我們再來看英國牛津經濟學公司用數學模型推估"},{"start":825.827,"end":853.09,"text":"臺灣是最嚴重的全球人才荒,人才次數負1.5%,根本沒有辦法吸引高階的人才過來,半導體AI產業,包含我們剛剛講的人型機器人,對外人才需有恐懼,我們挖角卻受限於金卡的條件僵化。我們想問院長,除了就業金卡以外,我們還有沒有研議其他的方式,網羅成為入超大國,新增甚至所謂的AI就業銀卡的機制,擴大對外攬財。"},{"start":854.492,"end":870.7,"text":"謝謝委員我們看到世界各國對台灣的科技地位如此的重視我們當然知道人才的培育是一個非常重要的一節也謝謝委員剛剛提醒的那些個部會但是我認為在每個部會都要自己去培訓很多的AI人才而不僅是靠學校"},{"start":871.32,"end":892.04,"text":"在部會當中要培訓所以我們這樣的比例現在看下來數字應該還可以往上增加。院長您的高度是絕對重要的請您帶頭除了擴大攬財以外您剛剛也已經承諾了我們要努力那你也要努力政府要帶頭美國4月的時候宣布所有聯邦政府機關都要聘用一個"},{"start":892.62,"end":911.935,"text":"首席AI專家負責監督AI的使用性目標預計在今年夏天以前招聘100名相關人才每位人才年薪突破450萬台幣請問院長我們的行政院目前有沒有類似的規劃由政府機關帶頭聘用AI人才"},{"start":913.092,"end":926.164,"text":"各位委員報告,包括我們的國科會、速發部、經濟部,他們常常在... 行政院長有沒有帶頭... 我都跟他們一起談論過,他們在交談... 有沒有要政府機關應用AI人才?"},{"start":926.164,"end":927.906,"text":"有。 有嗎?"},{"start":927.906,"end":930.248,"text":"有沒有預計多少人數?"},{"start":930.248,"end":931.95,"text":"何時完成招募案聘任?"},{"start":931.95,"end":933.731,"text":"你覺得你有想聘就聘得到嗎?"},{"start":934.876,"end":963.539,"text":"當然要經過很多的努力啊。好,拜託院長努力喔,這一點真的非常重要。一定會的,謝謝委員。台積電大規模要投入人才的培育,產業跳進來自救,就是一大警訊啦齁。接下來當然我們有好消息啦,輝達超維都要在臺灣設置研發中心,人才需求只會多不會少。我們現在內部供應已經不足,我們還要向外攬財,中央的人才政策一定要做好準備齁。再來我們不僅缺人才齁,院長您記得2023年臺灣的代表制第一名是什麼嗎?"},{"start":965.199,"end":975.769,"text":"我剛剛其實已經洩題了我現在告訴您答案就是缺啦缺水缺電缺雞蛋缺藥而且還缺什麼缺土地缺供水缺供電缺人才缺勞動力"},{"start":977.651,"end":999.646,"text":"行政院的政策如果好好落實應該要滿足產業的需求但是我們卻面臨了五缺啦過去我們受惠於China Plus One我們有機會得到了很多的紅利成為世界科技中心但是現在勿換心意全球都在喊台灣Plus One要尋找下一個取代台灣的地點"},{"start":1000.908,"end":1015.29,"text":"臺積電在日本、美國、德國設廠就是很明顯的案例。對政府來講,跟牛臺灣說的容易,但五缺問題沒有解決的話,這恐怕非常非常危險。市調機構,給您看數字,這個數字真的很重要。Chain Force2023年年底的報告,"},{"start":1016.451,"end":1025.698,"text":"相關的半導體廠商由其先進製程的產能占比將從2023年的29%成長到33%同期未來臺灣成熟製程的占比會從49%下降到42%另外接下來美國為首很可能會從2023到2027年從12%成長到17%本席真的非常擔心"},{"start":1042.091,"end":1067.529,"text":"未來會不會從現在的Taiwan Plus One變成Everyone Minus Taiwan以前的China Plus One我們賺到了結果呢現在Taiwan Plus One執政黨不僅讓大家缺水缺電甚至國防部還亂發飛彈簡訊製造恐慌我們還看中華經濟研究院的曹天旺董事長陳信宏副院長投書我們應該由行政院領頭形成某國Plus Taiwan"},{"start":1068.149,"end":1091.052,"text":"我真的希望院長今天之後緊急思考讓台灣plusone翻轉成everyone plus Taiwan不要讓台灣被取代我們剛剛講那麼長我其實要問您一個具體的問題黃仁勳說台灣是世界的支柱我相信您認同這一點但是黃仁勳同時也說了缺這個字他說台灣電力的局限會是一個挑戰請問您認同嗎"},{"start":1093.286,"end":1110.892,"text":"剛剛委員有說過一句話說執政黨造成臺灣的缺水缺電,我更認一下,執政黨努力不造成臺灣的缺水缺電。我現在是說我們未來嘛,active innovative我們往前看嘛,他就說缺嘛。當然知道電力穩定。你認同臺灣電力的局限是個挑戰嗎?"},{"start":1112.172,"end":1112.892,"text":"短短幾個字倒進產業心聲"},{"start":1134.298,"end":1153.679,"text":"再來我們看美國商會我們最重視盟友的想法6月6日發布2024年臺灣白皮書強調臺灣官方應保持穩定電價同時也表示商會成員關心穩定能源供應有7成成員在調查中表達對綠色能源供應的擔憂我們可以看下一個這是我們政府部會"},{"start":1154.94,"end":1178.933,"text":"的這個相關態度的反覆﹖我就不多說了﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖以和養綠﹖非核家園﹖反反覆覆短短1個月左右的時間﹖非核家園的神主牌﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖我表演一下﹖拿起來放下去﹖拿起來放下去﹖搞得民眾和產業物理看法﹖我在這裡再問一次院長﹖"},{"start":1180.73,"end":1199.029,"text":"產業界大聲疾呼,民進黨好朋友童子賢,民進黨大寶許信良,許多的閣員看似都比您理性物質。您還是圖牌綜藝堅守,核電不研議的非核家園省主牌的立場嗎?在您回答以前,我先提醒您,本席也是立法院臺美國會聯誼會的副會長。"},{"start":1200.951,"end":1205.853,"text":"政府對於產業界所有的擔心我們一定會重視這是最大的原則所以穩定供電是政府對人民跟產業的責任我們也一定要達到但是非核家園它不是神主牌"},{"start":1227.927,"end":1253.422,"text":"他是我們現在依照環境基本法裡面依法要朝向的目標沒有關係 院長我今天問您一個問題啦我當時問這個這個國會主委啦經濟部啦 和安會啦有沒有要把非核家園省主牌接過去我今天問您相同的問題您願不願意接受非核家園的省主牌你把它定義為省主牌的話無人可以接受得起他只是我們現在依照環境基本法所定定的非核家園目標"},{"start":1254.315,"end":1274.492,"text":"我quote您講的話您說非核家園是您的價值還說如果失去價值生命會失去意義這裡神主牌還嚴重阿你如果沒有拿過去你很可能就沒有生命阿我們是要拯救你阿接受非核家園阿既然如此要不要大方接受下來要不要接受要不要接受沒有關係我把他放遠一點"},{"start":1281.821,"end":1295.987,"text":"這是委員的自由如果拒絕接下來我想您的非核家園是口號喊喊而已我們所有的美國盟友都看得到每年AI需要的能源增加3%我們核電廠7月1號機停機少3%明年2號機停機再少3%"},{"start":1299.449,"end":1328.531,"text":"一來一往補足的電力不只是核電廠的6.2%很可能我們要增加用費發電火力發電的比例讓我們的健康受到長期的影響這一次內閣有很多的亮點是來自於產業我們真的誠懇呼籲行政院能源政策要中立務實客觀不要被意識形態綁架不要擔心被非核家園的支持者討厭就不敢改變不要打中臉充棒子最後造成政府產業和民眾三輸的局面"},{"start":1329.231,"end":1356.343,"text":"三場的問題我們有新的電廠可以接的上來這個經濟部郭部長已經算的很清楚我待會會有數據告訴您啦我們知道過去的評估人家微軟已經開始在購買核電囉已經在購買核電囉我們待會會聊這個部分雖然說科學本於事實但是有時候事實難以判斷一樣會造成三輸的局面接下來要請問一下院長看看螢幕上顯示的這幾張圖片"},{"start":1360.65,"end":1365.581,"text":"請問院長,哪一封是真正的臺水公司吹角簡訊,分辨得出來嗎?"},{"start":1365.581,"end":1367.866,"text":"繳錯了院長官邸可能會被斷水斷電喔。"},{"start":1369.226,"end":1397.759,"text":"哪一個是真的?我知道委員想提的就是詐騙的行為這個我們深惡痛絕我們跟我一樣的重視這是臺水公司喔這幾個月來我速度接獲民眾的陳情收到假冒的國營事業臺水臺電的吹角簡訊這裡面有一半是假的不疑有他刷卡以後發現受到詐騙政府一再強調電子簽章法施行以後刊登相關的廣告數位簽章可以有效的減少"},{"start":1398.499,"end":1399.199,"text":"報告委員我們支持您的看法。"},{"start":1420.456,"end":1447.086,"text":"是很好非常非常重要因為依據資通安全管理法臺水臺電關於是屬於關鍵基礎設施必須要向經濟部提出資通安全維護的計畫假如發生資安事件要依法通報再問郭部長我先回覆您我也支持您關於核電的很多看法但是再問郭部長近半年臺水臺電是否曾經發生過資安事件是幾級的資安事件"},{"start":1449.161,"end":1478.411,"text":"我是沒有收到這個報告好,速發部的黃部長我們能不能回應一下近半年來速發部因為資安院在速發部嘛這個我已經提到資安很久了這個黃部長您可以回答一下近半年來速發部是否曾接獲台水及台電的資安通報我們報告委員我們現在一個月大概收到這是關鍵基礎設施喔對我知道大概每個月收到大概100多件的台水跟台電"},{"start":1480.58,"end":1501.206,"text":"關鍵基礎設施目前沒有這個資料目前沒有我幫您問好了這半年來臺電做過一次資安通報臺水的通報次數為零啦齁你們上網隨便搜尋一下臺水詐騙全部都是幾乎半個臺灣都被都收到了請問一下郭部長兩家國營事業是否有沒有確認客戶資料有沒有遭到外洩"},{"start":1505.356,"end":1507.478,"text":"謝謝委員政府部門、國營事業甚至包括民間的產業事業都不應該"},{"start":1527.786,"end":1532.309,"text":"當將各自海水、海電、潭南市、公立專案小組、調查治安、軍人治安、委員承諾。我想要提醒院長,國內這還都只是舊方法。"},{"start":1543.337,"end":1565.533,"text":"接下來還有AI聲尾技術,5秒鐘講話就可以模仿你的聲音。美國歐盟都集中支援嚴防AI詐騙,我們現在上網一查,結果內政部、刑事警察局鼓勵民眾要建立通關密語,要發通關密語才能夠通話,不僅防詐的責任完全推給民眾,還要求民眾用落後的方式來防詐,彷彿推回漢朝,比對虎符一樣。"},{"start":1569.176,"end":1583.691,"text":"院長,既然我們的AI戰略方針可能還不明確,但是我們國科會積極推動AI行動計畫3.0,您能不能承諾AI防詐可以列為AI政策的重要一環,科技的事用科技處理,漢朝的事我們把它放在歷史裡面,院長可以承諾嗎?"},{"start":1584.93,"end":1607.8,"text":"謝謝委員 您當然知道我們現在全力推動希望大院通過打詐釋法就是讓我們有先進的法律可以握在手上您回去看一下裡面有沒有用到科技有沒有用到AI這個沒有關係我們開放問題真的是提醒大家最後我想講一下虛擬世界也不是全然都洪水猛獸有一個產業正在被全世界擁抱卻唯獨被台灣當成洪水猛獸"},{"start":1609.821,"end":1624.474,"text":"這個議題就是虛擬貨幣的ETF。今年1月10日美國證券交易委員會批准比特幣ETF交易。3月4日我上任以後馬上去質詢為什麼我們的金管會禁止"},{"start":1625.094,"end":1648.036,"text":"我們的民眾通過互委託我們政府鼓勵的方式去購買比特幣的現貨ETF5月22號我再就此一提詢問金管會彭主委我們當然很感謝彭主委有表示法人有機會先行開放程度雖未達預期但起碼表示政府對虛擬貨幣的態度不再保守僵化我想要請院長給我們一個勉勵好不好政府"},{"start":1648.556,"end":1658.906,"text":"目前對於虛擬貨幣ETF的態度有沒有正由保守轉向開放?我們目前預估的期程何時可以開放付委託購買比特幣ETF?"},{"start":1660.387,"end":1680.663,"text":"這是一個新興的事業齁,新興的行業,那我們願意在安全更有保障的情況底下,能夠朝向跟國際接軌的方式做,但是注重安全,保障人民的安全,因為我始終主張AI的創新,也要民主AI的創新,保障人類的自主跟人格自治。我們已經問了半年了,有什麼理由還要再拖延6個月勒?"},{"start":1682.284,"end":1707.47,"text":"我想這個院長能不能責任金管會加速研議開放,我們不要一直把安全安全掛在嘴巴上,我們長期長期我們要加速,我們每天睡覺AI都在變聰明,全世界的競爭都在增加,能不能加速研議開放法人以及一般民眾,互委託購買國際上已經允許的比特幣現貨ETF,滿足社會大眾對多元投資商品的期待,可不可以?"},{"start":1709.178,"end":1726.769,"text":"報告委員,我們這部分已經在進行中。那時間希望可以加快,範圍希望可以增加,如果有教育民眾保障安全的需求,我們朝野一起來努力,可以嗎?謝謝委員,謝謝委員。最後啦,我要用我最喜歡的電影一一來做總結。"},{"start":1728.735,"end":1758.267,"text":"院長,不曉得你有沒有看過這部楊德昌導演最棒的電影之一。當中的主角小男孩楊洋他有一句名句他說我要去告訴別人他們不知道的事給別人看他們看不到的東西這正是我進入國會擔任立法委員的原因我希望利用每一次質詢的機會告訴院長和所有的內閣官員我們都沒有看見的事"},{"start":1759.414,"end":1778.729,"text":"我看見黃恩勳說的,未來數位經濟會是實體經濟的一百倍。我括他的原話,the economy in the Metaverse, the economy of Omniverse will be larger than the economy in the physical world."},{"start":1778.729,"end":1785.714,"text":"Digital currency, Cryptocurrency could be used in the world of Metaverse."},{"start":1786.581,"end":1802.737,"text":"我看見數位經濟即將爆炸性的成長。 我看見台灣是AI產業鏈的重要角色。 我感到驕傲。 但是同時我也看見台灣淪為詐騙手法的創新基地。 我對此感到羞愧。"},{"start":1803.678,"end":1815.328,"text":"我看見臺灣對人型機器人研發的缺乳﹖對政府的無知感到驚訝﹖我也看到臺灣在非核神主牌與核電廠為政府的反覆拉扯感到難過﹖正在失去科技之島的地位和優勢﹖"},{"start":1832.301,"end":1832.461,"text":"謝謝各位委員"}]}}}}