{"id":154003,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/154003","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/cf02c7fc60cc7ba08021ae0ced6dceaec65fab1c545da5d01d141634ad16f55fdcbf91617bdae11f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"羅智強","委員發言時間":"12:19:14 - 12:25:19","影片長度":"00:06:05","會議時間":"2024-06-13T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第16次全體委員會議（事由：邀請教育部政務次長葉丙成列席就「少子化趨勢下高教應如何經營、創新及提升競爭力」進行專題報告，並備質詢。【6月12日及13日二天一次會】）","type":"Clip","date":"2024-06-13","start_time":"2024-06-13T12:19:14+08:00","end_time":"2024-06-13T12:25:19+08:00","duration":365,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第16次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":16,"committees":[22],"id":"委員會-11-1-22-16"},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"gazette":{"lineno":843,"blocks":[["羅委員智強：（12時19分）主席，有請次長。"],["主席：好，次長。"],["葉次長丙成：委員好。"],["羅委員智強：次長好。賴清德總統多次宣示要將臺灣打造成AI智慧島，他有提三個要點，第一個是要穩定供電、多元綠電；第二個是要建置超級電腦；第三個，你知道是什麼嗎？"],["葉次長丙成：AI人才。"],["羅委員智強：對，培養人才。培養人才方面，總統說，不管是ICT產業、晶圓製造、半導體或人工智慧的人才，政府都會持續培養，讓臺灣成為人工智慧島的目標可以實現。","可是我們看到108課綱實施之後，事實上大砍自然領域的學分數。過去物理、化學、生物跟地球科學必修學分有16個學分，到108課綱只剩下8個學分，等於上述這四個科目都只剩2個學分。這就產生一些連鎖效應，基本學分跟上課時數不足，教師只能夠拼命趕課，學生在短時間內難以吸收。授課時數減少後，也相對的影響計算練習，也影響後續，尤其特別是學習理工進階課程的基礎，這樣一個循環減損了學生的學習信心跟興趣。","有很多的大學發現108課綱大學新生的數理能力弱化，微積分跟普通化學弱化尤其明顯。有些學者就擔心，學生數理能力不足，會削弱我們科技、科學、工程、數學人才實力，也同時會動搖我們國家半導體人才的根基。","次長，你是電機工程專家，也在臺大任教，你有注意到學生數理能力的問題嗎？"],["葉次長丙成：跟委員報告，我在臺大電機系至少看到沒有很深、明顯的感覺。"],["羅委員智強：也許臺大不錯啦，沒有明顯感受到。那你覺得其他大學教授擔憂是有其根據，還是沒有根據？"],["葉次長丙成：跟委員報告，剛剛提到學分數減少這件事情，如果把加深、加廣的部分納進去，其實臺灣學生如果是走理工這條路線，他該修習的數理學分數是沒有減少的。"],["羅委員智強：所以相反的，你看起來是非常的圓滿，對不對？一切沒問題？"],["葉次長丙成：跟委員報告，現在問題是出在，因為我們招生一直以來都是兩階段的招生，很多學生在甄試上了學校之後，他高三下學期就請假，這是一個還蠻普遍的現象。"],["羅委員智強：對。"],["葉次長丙成：現在的狀況就是因為大學……"],["羅委員智強：所以這個有沒有影響？"],["葉次長丙成：這就有影響，因為有的學生高三下的微積分就沒有好好學起來。"],["羅委員智強：對呀。"],["葉次長丙成：但是問題是大學又希望多收學生，現在是你就算高中沒有畢業，還是可以錄取。"],["羅委員智強：可是剛剛次長你跟我講，你覺得在教學過程當中沒有看到影響，可見這個問題也沒有影響，是這個意思嗎？"],["葉次長丙成：沒有，這個問題應該是說為什麼進來大學之後，學生的落差很大。"],["羅委員智強：對。"],["葉次長丙成：一樣高中3年，走分發指考這個路線的學生，他就有完整的學習。"],["羅委員智強：我這樣講好啦，其實課綱實施以來真的問題叢生，有很多人有很多意見，相信次長也都有看到。有些親身體驗的高中生提出了「108課綱觀察報告」，首屆的觀察報告說有學生批評是一群住在象牙塔的學者們高談闊論，以自身觀點，構想一個無法落實的教育規劃，讓同學們毫無方向感。當然這些東西，我想請次長也要相當的關切注意。","另外，我想問次長另一個問題，因為最近是畢業熱季嘛，對不對？所以很多人都會應邀到畢業典禮致詞。"],["葉次長丙成：是。"],["羅委員智強：我自己也會應邀到我的選區的學校畢業典禮致詞。如果我到我的選區的高中致詞的時候，跟大家講，國會改革非常重要，今天執政黨反國會改革，就是反民主，我們年輕同學們要站出來反對執政黨，要力抗執政黨這種所謂為了維護政府黑箱，阻止今天國會改革，希望同學們勇敢站出來。你覺得我如果在高中畢業典禮講這段話，合適嗎？"],["葉次長丙成：如果就委員剛剛講的內容，……"],["羅委員智強：我告訴你啦……"],["葉次長丙成：我覺得我可能必須要知道這個演講的上下脈絡。"],["羅委員智強：就高中生畢業典禮啊，我就是說假設我到畢業典禮，當然我不會講，我直接跟你講，我怎麼會講這些話。我說如果我在高中畢業典禮講這段話，你覺得合適嗎？"],["葉次長丙成：沒有，我剛嚇到了，不知道委員會這樣……"],["羅委員智強：那當然啦。"],["葉次長丙成：跟你蠻不一樣的。"],["羅委員智強：剛還好，就是你的反應，你會嚇到。"],["葉次長丙成：我是嚇到你講這些話，我會嚇到。"],["羅委員智強：對、對、對，我跟你講就不會講，我不會講這些話嘛。可是問題這些話就有人講啊，對不對？教育基本法第六條規定：教育本於中立原則，學校不得為特定政治團體從事宣傳或活動。這個教育基本法，你應該認同吧，對不對？第六條的規定。"],["葉次長丙成：是。"],["羅委員智強：可是抱歉，我看到民進黨委員在成大南工的畢業典禮上，就號召大家站出來對抗立法院，對抗立法院黑箱、擴權。對抗立法院是一個正確的方向，鼓勵學生站出來。","我要講的是，剛剛那個例子很簡單，我當然知道教育部也為難，可是真的也呼籲政治人物還是尊重一下教育基本法，不要造成學校的困擾！畢業典禮就是好好地勉勵同學認真向學，不要講一些政治語言。以上，謝謝。"],["葉次長丙成：謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝兩位。","接下來是邱志偉委員，4分鐘，謝謝。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":334,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-16","speakers":["柯志恩","萬美玲","林倩綺","葛如鈞","葉元之","陳秀寳","吳沛憶","林宜瑾","羅廷瑋","郭昱晴","洪孟楷","陳培瑜","張雅琳","賴士葆","林思銘","陳亭妃","翁曉玲","范雲","羅智強","邱志偉","楊瓊瓔","黃國昌","吳春城"],"page_start":273,"meetingDate":["2024-06-13"],"gazette_id":"1136201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1136201_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第16次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請教育部政務次長葉丙成列席就「少子化趨勢下高教應如何經營、創新及提升競爭力」進行專\n題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1136201_00005"}},"transcript":{"id":"154003","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/154003","tool":"pyannote","id":"154003-pyannote"},"job_id":"RH3e8k1jRPjdM72l","queued_at":"2024-06-13 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\"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:08,365 --> 00:00:30,060\n主席有請次長次長好賴清德總統多次宣誓要將台灣打造成AI智慧島他有提三個要點第一個是要穩定供電、多元預電第二個是要建制超級電腦第三個你知道是什麼嗎?\n\n2\n00:00:37,785 --> 00:00:46,995\n總統說不管ICT產業、晶圓製造、半導體或人工智慧的人才政府都會持續培養讓台灣成為人工智慧島的目標可以實現\n\n3\n00:00:48,436 --> 00:01:11,576\n可是我們看到108課綱實施之後事實上大砍自然領域的學分數那過去物理化學生物跟地球科學必修學分有16個學分到108課綱只剩下8個學分等於上述這4個科目都只剩2個學分那這產生一些連鎖效應就基本學分跟上課時數不足\n\n4\n00:01:12,176 --> 00:01:12,196\n﹚羅智強﹚\n\n5\n00:01:29,216 --> 00:01:55,151\n這樣的一個循環減損了學生的學習信心跟興趣那有很多的大學發現108課綱大學新生的數理能力弱化那微積分跟普通化學弱化尤其明顯那有些學者就擔心學生數理能力不足會削弱我們科技科學工程數學人才實力也同時會動搖我們國家半導體人才的根基\n\n6\n00:01:56,031 --> 00:02:21,920\n次長你是電機工程專家也在台大任教你有注意到學生數與能力的一個問題嗎跟委員報告我在台大電機系至少看到沒有很明顯的感覺到也許台大不錯沒有明顯感受到那你覺得這些大學其他大學教授擔憂是有崎嶇還是沒有根據\n\n7\n00:02:24,426 --> 00:02:26,307\n所以相反的看起來是非常的圓滿嘛對不對一切沒問題了\n\n8\n00:02:43,419 --> 00:03:07,051\n但是現在的問題是出在說跟委員報告就是說因為我們現在招生一直以來都是這個兩階段的招生很多學生在這個正式上了學校之後他下學期就請假這是個還蠻普遍的現象對那現在的狀況又是因為所以這個也沒有影響那這就有影響因為就有的學生他就高三下就沒有好好這些微積分這些高三下他就沒辦法學起來對\n\n9\n00:03:07,911 --> 00:03:21,458\n可是問題是又在處在於說大學又希望多收學生大學現在是你今天就算高中沒有畢業可是剛剛次長跟我講你覺得你在教學過程當中你沒有看到影響啊可見這個問題也沒有影響是這個意思嗎\n\n10\n00:03:23,319 --> 00:03:25,140\n我這樣講好了,其實課綱實施以來真的問題重生了,有很多人有很多意見,相信次長也都有看到\n\n11\n00:03:39,184 --> 00:03:54,470\n那有些親身體驗的高中生說新課綱提出了108課綱觀察報告那首屆的觀察報告說有學生是批評是一群住在象牙塔的學者們高團擴論以資深觀點構想一個無法落實的教育規劃那這個是讓同學們\n\n12\n00:03:57,751 --> 00:03:59,914\n我會邀請選區學校的畢業典禮支持。\n\n13\n00:04:16,244 --> 00:04:40,485\n如果我到我的選區的高中致詞的時候跟大家講說我跟你講國會改革非常重要今天執政黨反國會改革就是反民主我們年輕同學們要站出來反對執政黨要力抗執政黨這種所謂的為了維護政府黑箱然後阻止今天國會改革希望同學們勇敢站出來你覺得我在高中畢業典禮講這段話合適嗎\n\n14\n00:04:44,055 --> 00:05:08,229\n如果就委員剛才講的內容我覺得這個演講我必須要知道這個可能他的上下脈絡我就說假設我到畢業生當然我不會講啦我直接跟你講我怎麼會講這些話我說如果我在高中畢業典禮講這段話你覺得合適嗎因為我剛才嚇到我不知道委員當然啦跟你蠻不一樣\n\n15\n00:05:08,829 --> 00:05:15,612\n非常好就是你的反應你會嚇到我是嚇到說你講這些話對對對我跟你講就不會講嘛我不會講這些話嘛可是問題是這些話就有人講啊對不對我們教育基本法第6條規定教育本於中立原則學校不得為特定政治團體從事宣傳或活動這教育基本法你應該認同吧對不對第6條的規定對不對可是抱歉我看到民進黨委員在成大南宮的畢業典禮上\n\n16\n00:05:35,842 --> 00:05:35,882\n以上,謝謝。\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n8365\t30060\t主席有請次長次長好賴清德總統多次宣誓要將台灣打造成AI智慧島他有提三個要點第一個是要穩定供電、多元預電第二個是要建制超級電腦第三個你知道是什麼嗎?\n37785\t46995\t總統說不管ICT產業、晶圓製造、半導體或人工智慧的人才政府都會持續培養讓台灣成為人工智慧島的目標可以實現\n48436\t71576\t可是我們看到108課綱實施之後事實上大砍自然領域的學分數那過去物理化學生物跟地球科學必修學分有16個學分到108課綱只剩下8個學分等於上述這4個科目都只剩2個學分那這產生一些連鎖效應就基本學分跟上課時數不足\n72176\t72196\t﹚羅智強﹚\n89216\t115151\t這樣的一個循環減損了學生的學習信心跟興趣那有很多的大學發現108課綱大學新生的數理能力弱化那微積分跟普通化學弱化尤其明顯那有些學者就擔心學生數理能力不足會削弱我們科技科學工程數學人才實力也同時會動搖我們國家半導體人才的根基\n116031\t141920\t次長你是電機工程專家也在台大任教你有注意到學生數與能力的一個問題嗎跟委員報告我在台大電機系至少看到沒有很明顯的感覺到也許台大不錯沒有明顯感受到那你覺得這些大學其他大學教授擔憂是有崎嶇還是沒有根據\n144426\t146307\t所以相反的看起來是非常的圓滿嘛對不對一切沒問題了\n163419\t187051\t但是現在的問題是出在說跟委員報告就是說因為我們現在招生一直以來都是這個兩階段的招生很多學生在這個正式上了學校之後他下學期就請假這是個還蠻普遍的現象對那現在的狀況又是因為所以這個也沒有影響那這就有影響因為就有的學生他就高三下就沒有好好這些微積分這些高三下他就沒辦法學起來對\n187911\t201458\t可是問題是又在處在於說大學又希望多收學生大學現在是你今天就算高中沒有畢業可是剛剛次長跟我講你覺得你在教學過程當中你沒有看到影響啊可見這個問題也沒有影響是這個意思嗎\n203319\t205140\t我這樣講好了,其實課綱實施以來真的問題重生了,有很多人有很多意見,相信次長也都有看到\n219184\t234470\t那有些親身體驗的高中生說新課綱提出了108課綱觀察報告那首屆的觀察報告說有學生是批評是一群住在象牙塔的學者們高團擴論以資深觀點構想一個無法落實的教育規劃那這個是讓同學們\n237751\t239914\t我會邀請選區學校的畢業典禮支持。\n256244\t280485\t如果我到我的選區的高中致詞的時候跟大家講說我跟你講國會改革非常重要今天執政黨反國會改革就是反民主我們年輕同學們要站出來反對執政黨要力抗執政黨這種所謂的為了維護政府黑箱然後阻止今天國會改革希望同學們勇敢站出來你覺得我在高中畢業典禮講這段話合適嗎\n284055\t308229\t如果就委員剛才講的內容我覺得這個演講我必須要知道這個可能他的上下脈絡我就說假設我到畢業生當然我不會講啦我直接跟你講我怎麼會講這些話我說如果我在高中畢業典禮講這段話你覺得合適嗎因為我剛才嚇到我不知道委員當然啦跟你蠻不一樣\n308829\t315612\t非常好就是你的反應你會嚇到我是嚇到說你講這些話對對對我跟你講就不會講嘛我不會講這些話嘛可是問題是這些話就有人講啊對不對我們教育基本法第6條規定教育本於中立原則學校不得為特定政治團體從事宣傳或活動這教育基本法你應該認同吧對不對第6條的規定對不對可是抱歉我看到民進黨委員在成大南宮的畢業典禮上\n335842\t335882\t以上,謝謝。\n","txt":"主席有請次長次長好賴清德總統多次宣誓要將台灣打造成AI智慧島他有提三個要點第一個是要穩定供電、多元預電第二個是要建制超級電腦第三個你知道是什麼嗎?\n總統說不管ICT產業、晶圓製造、半導體或人工智慧的人才政府都會持續培養讓台灣成為人工智慧島的目標可以實現\n可是我們看到108課綱實施之後事實上大砍自然領域的學分數那過去物理化學生物跟地球科學必修學分有16個學分到108課綱只剩下8個學分等於上述這4個科目都只剩2個學分那這產生一些連鎖效應就基本學分跟上課時數不足\n﹚羅智強﹚\n這樣的一個循環減損了學生的學習信心跟興趣那有很多的大學發現108課綱大學新生的數理能力弱化那微積分跟普通化學弱化尤其明顯那有些學者就擔心學生數理能力不足會削弱我們科技科學工程數學人才實力也同時會動搖我們國家半導體人才的根基\n次長你是電機工程專家也在台大任教你有注意到學生數與能力的一個問題嗎跟委員報告我在台大電機系至少看到沒有很明顯的感覺到也許台大不錯沒有明顯感受到那你覺得這些大學其他大學教授擔憂是有崎嶇還是沒有根據\n所以相反的看起來是非常的圓滿嘛對不對一切沒問題了\n但是現在的問題是出在說跟委員報告就是說因為我們現在招生一直以來都是這個兩階段的招生很多學生在這個正式上了學校之後他下學期就請假這是個還蠻普遍的現象對那現在的狀況又是因為所以這個也沒有影響那這就有影響因為就有的學生他就高三下就沒有好好這些微積分這些高三下他就沒辦法學起來對\n可是問題是又在處在於說大學又希望多收學生大學現在是你今天就算高中沒有畢業可是剛剛次長跟我講你覺得你在教學過程當中你沒有看到影響啊可見這個問題也沒有影響是這個意思嗎\n我這樣講好了,其實課綱實施以來真的問題重生了,有很多人有很多意見,相信次長也都有看到\n那有些親身體驗的高中生說新課綱提出了108課綱觀察報告那首屆的觀察報告說有學生是批評是一群住在象牙塔的學者們高團擴論以資深觀點構想一個無法落實的教育規劃那這個是讓同學們\n我會邀請選區學校的畢業典禮支持。\n如果我到我的選區的高中致詞的時候跟大家講說我跟你講國會改革非常重要今天執政黨反國會改革就是反民主我們年輕同學們要站出來反對執政黨要力抗執政黨這種所謂的為了維護政府黑箱然後阻止今天國會改革希望同學們勇敢站出來你覺得我在高中畢業典禮講這段話合適嗎\n如果就委員剛才講的內容我覺得這個演講我必須要知道這個可能他的上下脈絡我就說假設我到畢業生當然我不會講啦我直接跟你講我怎麼會講這些話我說如果我在高中畢業典禮講這段話你覺得合適嗎因為我剛才嚇到我不知道委員當然啦跟你蠻不一樣\n非常好就是你的反應你會嚇到我是嚇到說你講這些話對對對我跟你講就不會講嘛我不會講這些話嘛可是問題是這些話就有人講啊對不對我們教育基本法第6條規定教育本於中立原則學校不得為特定政治團體從事宣傳或活動這教育基本法你應該認同吧對不對第6條的規定對不對可是抱歉我看到民進黨委員在成大南宮的畢業典禮上\n以上,謝謝。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:08.365 --> 00:30.060\n主席有請次長次長好賴清德總統多次宣誓要將台灣打造成AI智慧島他有提三個要點第一個是要穩定供電、多元預電第二個是要建制超級電腦第三個你知道是什麼嗎?\n\n00:37.785 --> 00:46.995\n總統說不管ICT產業、晶圓製造、半導體或人工智慧的人才政府都會持續培養讓台灣成為人工智慧島的目標可以實現\n\n00:48.436 --> 01:11.576\n可是我們看到108課綱實施之後事實上大砍自然領域的學分數那過去物理化學生物跟地球科學必修學分有16個學分到108課綱只剩下8個學分等於上述這4個科目都只剩2個學分那這產生一些連鎖效應就基本學分跟上課時數不足\n\n01:12.176 --> 01:12.196\n﹚羅智強﹚\n\n01:29.216 --> 01:55.151\n這樣的一個循環減損了學生的學習信心跟興趣那有很多的大學發現108課綱大學新生的數理能力弱化那微積分跟普通化學弱化尤其明顯那有些學者就擔心學生數理能力不足會削弱我們科技科學工程數學人才實力也同時會動搖我們國家半導體人才的根基\n\n01:56.031 --> 02:21.920\n次長你是電機工程專家也在台大任教你有注意到學生數與能力的一個問題嗎跟委員報告我在台大電機系至少看到沒有很明顯的感覺到也許台大不錯沒有明顯感受到那你覺得這些大學其他大學教授擔憂是有崎嶇還是沒有根據\n\n02:24.426 --> 02:26.307\n所以相反的看起來是非常的圓滿嘛對不對一切沒問題了\n\n02:43.419 --> 03:07.051\n但是現在的問題是出在說跟委員報告就是說因為我們現在招生一直以來都是這個兩階段的招生很多學生在這個正式上了學校之後他下學期就請假這是個還蠻普遍的現象對那現在的狀況又是因為所以這個也沒有影響那這就有影響因為就有的學生他就高三下就沒有好好這些微積分這些高三下他就沒辦法學起來對\n\n03:07.911 --> 03:21.458\n可是問題是又在處在於說大學又希望多收學生大學現在是你今天就算高中沒有畢業可是剛剛次長跟我講你覺得你在教學過程當中你沒有看到影響啊可見這個問題也沒有影響是這個意思嗎\n\n03:23.319 --> 03:25.140\n我這樣講好了,其實課綱實施以來真的問題重生了,有很多人有很多意見,相信次長也都有看到\n\n03:39.184 --> 03:54.470\n那有些親身體驗的高中生說新課綱提出了108課綱觀察報告那首屆的觀察報告說有學生是批評是一群住在象牙塔的學者們高團擴論以資深觀點構想一個無法落實的教育規劃那這個是讓同學們\n\n03:57.751 --> 03:59.914\n我會邀請選區學校的畢業典禮支持。\n\n04:16.244 --> 04:40.485\n如果我到我的選區的高中致詞的時候跟大家講說我跟你講國會改革非常重要今天執政黨反國會改革就是反民主我們年輕同學們要站出來反對執政黨要力抗執政黨這種所謂的為了維護政府黑箱然後阻止今天國會改革希望同學們勇敢站出來你覺得我在高中畢業典禮講這段話合適嗎\n\n04:44.055 --> 05:08.229\n如果就委員剛才講的內容我覺得這個演講我必須要知道這個可能他的上下脈絡我就說假設我到畢業生當然我不會講啦我直接跟你講我怎麼會講這些話我說如果我在高中畢業典禮講這段話你覺得合適嗎因為我剛才嚇到我不知道委員當然啦跟你蠻不一樣\n\n05:08.829 --> 05:15.612\n非常好就是你的反應你會嚇到我是嚇到說你講這些話對對對我跟你講就不會講嘛我不會講這些話嘛可是問題是這些話就有人講啊對不對我們教育基本法第6條規定教育本於中立原則學校不得為特定政治團體從事宣傳或活動這教育基本法你應該認同吧對不對第6條的規定對不對可是抱歉我看到民進黨委員在成大南宮的畢業典禮上\n\n05:35.842 --> 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