{"id":154129,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/154129","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3ceaf6abec8b4a6dca059aed7da7aca79dd1cafa7fa6f271ed9074248c5ffe99cd1a1fb20885ccf05ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"吳宗憲","委員發言時間":"14:52:34 - 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0.0}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 600.331, \"end\": 600.351, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:05,590 --> 00:00:09,995\n麻煩我們請院長請卓院長備詢其實這幾天我在全院的審查會看下來昨天看到今天\n\n2\n00:00:24,003 --> 00:00:52,750\n其實我發現兩個現象就是說溝通這兩個字齁目前用在執政黨身上好像越溝通就有這個溝越大就更不同我現在看到的是這樣完全無法溝通大家講的東西完全南轅北轍所以從上個禮拜我對院長的質詢我有提到說我蠻期望院長將來是成為全民大師兄一起來照顧照顧全民就現在變成是好像是浩克一樣碰到一些關鍵字就有一點\n\n3\n00:00:53,663 --> 00:00:53,683\n吳宗憲\n\n4\n00:01:15,421 --> 00:01:42,395\n他好像是像是那個辯論比賽一樣2016年以前他是抽到正方所以2016年以前他認為國會就是要改革需要有這些權利要聽證調查都要有結果呢2016到2024這8年又完全靜悄悄國會多數他也不管這件事2024之後呢又好像辯論比賽抽到反方一樣完全又開始否定所有的東西\n\n5\n00:01:43,075 --> 00:01:57,963\n所以這個讓我去思考一下到底這個政黨他是有一個核心理念想要為國為民想要讓立法權能夠好好的監督權還是他今天他的所謂的理念只因為是否執政而改變\n\n6\n00:01:59,083 --> 00:02:18,377\n時空環境不同或者是什麼政策的轉彎其實我覺得這個都不是真正的原因啦很單純就是一個有沒有執政執政了之後想法就全都變好那不要講我的想法啦這段時間呢我們看到吉林卓水在民進黨的大前輩其實他有提到了\n\n7\n00:02:19,705 --> 00:02:42,964\n這個修法已經好幾十年等了好幾十年了結果呢現在卻是他以前的同志們帶頭出來反對甚至我自己提出來的提案也都是很多都是參考前輩顧立雄前輩林佳龍的一些草案結果呢現在卻被喊成是毀憲亂政然後講一些奇怪怪的扣我一堆的帽子然後講我是什麼中共同路人其實我不太能夠接受這樣\n\n8\n00:02:43,953 --> 00:03:00,078\n我覺得一個還權於民的這個概念到最後變成扣上迴憲亂政這就是把政治當作辯論比賽這我沒有辦法去接受而且我覺得最離譜的是今天在座的法務部正部長我覺得他不只選手要當他裁判也要當\n\n9\n00:03:00,984 --> 00:03:24,282\n不能部長把自己...不用不用...不用...那個...我沒有要問部長部長不要把自己演成是側翼啦因為部長來其實我對他很...蠻...蠻期待而且他其實做了很多事我是...我也跟他說過他做了好幾個政策我覺得是非常稱讚的齁但是我認為啦齁部長不應該把自己演成側翼為什麼?因為第一個藐視國會他說違背法律明確性昨天講的\n\n10\n00:03:26,090 --> 00:03:53,785\n這怎麼違背法律明確性呢?你說虛偽陳述四個字不明確好,刑法168條偽證罪就是虛偽陳述阿我不相信政部長一輩子沒有起訴過一件偽證罪我自己起訴過很多件偽證罪從來也沒有一個法官用違憲來把判無罪或認定他違憲所以你跟我講說這個違反法律明確性原則部長不能講這種話再來,部長昨天又講說什麼國會調查權違反四字五八五號\n\n11\n00:03:55,083 --> 00:04:21,837\n部長什麼時候變大法官了?這也不能這樣幹嘛?515號請部長回去自己再看清楚啦至少我看的不是這樣啦所以我認為不能這樣所以藐視國會這個定義不明到底是真的定義不明還是你這覆議的理由寫不明這是我一直以來我自己的問題啦唉呦我覺得啦你要說迴憲亂政你不如去提總統所要成立的三個委員會\n\n12\n00:04:23,639 --> 00:04:52,864\n這三個委員會其實他的預算跟能源編制這個都很奇怪而且是由總統來去成立之前蔡政府時代還不敢這麼做結果現在賴政府時代變成說他要搞三個委員會那這樣子是不是說賴總統有侵害到行政權他說他有跟你仔細討論過還是說你覺得今天侵害到行政權乾脆你做個手板我們請外面的青鳥幫你一起去維護你的權利所以我真的覺得制度越走越奇怪而且\n\n13\n00:04:53,855 --> 00:05:05,204\n這不就是跟那個習近平一樣嗎?搞了一堆工作小組來架空國務院我覺得這個賴政府如果一直嘴巴罵共產黨身體又一直學共產黨\n\n14\n00:05:06,496 --> 00:05:08,318\n總統府三個委員會他是一個任務的編組他沒有組織、沒有預算、沒有人事\n\n15\n00:05:24,379 --> 00:05:52,084\n單就一個特定的議題選定之後,召集各界來討論這個是很常有的事情,所有的執行工作,行政院會執行我們今天是在討論那個國會改革案之後那另外齁,我覺得我們這個互相的質詢就是一個很好的典範啦那今天我立委他造謠功力也是滿分啦,真的是很厲害譬如說我昨天剛好有聽到有一位立委說,欸這個為什麼沒有可以行使緘默權,為什麼不能請律師,我想請問\n\n16\n00:05:53,257 --> 00:06:16,907\n院長你也是法律人嘛,什麼時候我國的訴訟制度正能請律師可以行使緘默權?我想請教你。但是在這裡不一樣,你面對的不是一個司法上面的被告或是...今天不是司法調查喔,院長你不能這樣子亂扯喔。所以今天國會的調查不實,你不能任何一個人來到這裡。緘默權是不自證舉罪的時候對於當事人的保障,並不是你今天講這個樣子。\n\n17\n00:06:18,097 --> 00:06:20,820\n我國的法律制度是不是本來就是依據條文以及判決判例來做判決?\n\n18\n00:06:40,933 --> 00:07:07,111\n如果有名文條文當然是如果有形成判例那當然就是一個對沒錯所以林益錦這種法律嘗試的不足那我也不想再譴責就好像說民主國家立法委員跑去人家高中的畢業典禮在那邊做政治宣傳一樣其實這都不是民主國家該有的樣子就吼有關吼這個國會的這個改革的這個法案吼我想我還是跟院長報告一下啦我常跟人家講啦\n\n19\n00:07:08,257 --> 00:07:11,121\n一二三四我們這段時間舉辦過一場專報兩場審查會三場公聽會四場協商\n\n20\n00:07:16,294 --> 00:07:39,279\n民進黨發言的時間是1068分鐘光是4月21號民進黨發言時間就81分鐘27秒每一個委員都發言兩次以上結果你們最習慣的就是把所有的事情切成一個非常小的縫隙然後在這個縫隙裡面去談對錯你們從來不去把整個東西從頭到尾看清楚是誰在搗亂整個議程\n\n21\n00:07:40,339 --> 00:07:43,363\n報告委員不僅審查的過程不夠嚴謹在投票的當天提出一個從來沒有看過的版本這個也是大家詬病之所在\n\n22\n00:08:00,105 --> 00:08:14,356\n您當過立法委員嗎?曾經我想說修正動議是什麼時候提你也很清楚啦我覺得不用在一邊這樣子說了啦我想請問一下院長到底我們依據議事規則我們有幾種投票方式在立法院\n\n23\n00:08:15,506 --> 00:08:38,661\n可以記名不記名表決器等等都可以簡單說吳宗結果現在大家在攻擊說當天為什麼是舉手表決那我在這邊跟院長報告一件事情當天國民黨也提案希望我們簽一個竊決書大家不要攻占主席台所有人回到位置上面去按表決器就好大家都輕鬆結果是柯建民總召說什麼都不願意他就講了一句這不可能啦\n\n24\n00:08:39,465 --> 00:08:53,864\n所以沒有辦法到最後大家為了讓議事順利就只能在主席台上面狀況是這樣並不是我們這麼願意說站在那裡沒有椅子坐沒有插座可以充手機充電然後在那裡傻傻的在那邊舉手表決\n\n25\n00:08:54,685 --> 00:09:10,697\n更何況你說舉手表決什麼跟中共人大一樣那你為什麼不說跟聯合國一樣既然它是議事規則裡面一種投票方式你們卻可以來這樣子去攻擊我沒有辦法理解這樣啦吼報告委員我認為舉手表決有一個條件他必須清點人數\n\n26\n00:09:12,398 --> 00:09:12,838\n最後齁我是覺得啦齁\n\n27\n00:09:43,326 --> 00:09:59,311\n民進黨齁我們是一個五權體制的國家不要把五權完成一權剩下行政權就變成獨裁那湯德忠大法官齁在去年在東吳的時候提到四字五八五號他在解釋這個的時候他有講到\n\n28\n00:10:00,331 --> 00:10:00,351\n好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5590\t9995\t麻煩我們請院長請卓院長備詢其實這幾天我在全院的審查會看下來昨天看到今天\n24003\t52750\t其實我發現兩個現象就是說溝通這兩個字齁目前用在執政黨身上好像越溝通就有這個溝越大就更不同我現在看到的是這樣完全無法溝通大家講的東西完全南轅北轍所以從上個禮拜我對院長的質詢我有提到說我蠻期望院長將來是成為全民大師兄一起來照顧照顧全民就現在變成是好像是浩克一樣碰到一些關鍵字就有一點\n53663\t53683\t吳宗憲\n75421\t102395\t他好像是像是那個辯論比賽一樣2016年以前他是抽到正方所以2016年以前他認為國會就是要改革需要有這些權利要聽證調查都要有結果呢2016到2024這8年又完全靜悄悄國會多數他也不管這件事2024之後呢又好像辯論比賽抽到反方一樣完全又開始否定所有的東西\n103075\t117963\t所以這個讓我去思考一下到底這個政黨他是有一個核心理念想要為國為民想要讓立法權能夠好好的監督權還是他今天他的所謂的理念只因為是否執政而改變\n119083\t138377\t時空環境不同或者是什麼政策的轉彎其實我覺得這個都不是真正的原因啦很單純就是一個有沒有執政執政了之後想法就全都變好那不要講我的想法啦這段時間呢我們看到吉林卓水在民進黨的大前輩其實他有提到了\n139705\t162964\t這個修法已經好幾十年等了好幾十年了結果呢現在卻是他以前的同志們帶頭出來反對甚至我自己提出來的提案也都是很多都是參考前輩顧立雄前輩林佳龍的一些草案結果呢現在卻被喊成是毀憲亂政然後講一些奇怪怪的扣我一堆的帽子然後講我是什麼中共同路人其實我不太能夠接受這樣\n163953\t180078\t我覺得一個還權於民的這個概念到最後變成扣上迴憲亂政這就是把政治當作辯論比賽這我沒有辦法去接受而且我覺得最離譜的是今天在座的法務部正部長我覺得他不只選手要當他裁判也要當\n180984\t204282\t不能部長把自己...不用不用...不用...那個...我沒有要問部長部長不要把自己演成是側翼啦因為部長來其實我對他很...蠻...蠻期待而且他其實做了很多事我是...我也跟他說過他做了好幾個政策我覺得是非常稱讚的齁但是我認為啦齁部長不應該把自己演成側翼為什麼?因為第一個藐視國會他說違背法律明確性昨天講的\n206090\t233785\t這怎麼違背法律明確性呢?你說虛偽陳述四個字不明確好,刑法168條偽證罪就是虛偽陳述阿我不相信政部長一輩子沒有起訴過一件偽證罪我自己起訴過很多件偽證罪從來也沒有一個法官用違憲來把判無罪或認定他違憲所以你跟我講說這個違反法律明確性原則部長不能講這種話再來,部長昨天又講說什麼國會調查權違反四字五八五號\n235083\t261837\t部長什麼時候變大法官了?這也不能這樣幹嘛?515號請部長回去自己再看清楚啦至少我看的不是這樣啦所以我認為不能這樣所以藐視國會這個定義不明到底是真的定義不明還是你這覆議的理由寫不明這是我一直以來我自己的問題啦唉呦我覺得啦你要說迴憲亂政你不如去提總統所要成立的三個委員會\n263639\t292864\t這三個委員會其實他的預算跟能源編制這個都很奇怪而且是由總統來去成立之前蔡政府時代還不敢這麼做結果現在賴政府時代變成說他要搞三個委員會那這樣子是不是說賴總統有侵害到行政權他說他有跟你仔細討論過還是說你覺得今天侵害到行政權乾脆你做個手板我們請外面的青鳥幫你一起去維護你的權利所以我真的覺得制度越走越奇怪而且\n293855\t305204\t這不就是跟那個習近平一樣嗎?搞了一堆工作小組來架空國務院我覺得這個賴政府如果一直嘴巴罵共產黨身體又一直學共產黨\n306496\t308318\t總統府三個委員會他是一個任務的編組他沒有組織、沒有預算、沒有人事\n324379\t352084\t單就一個特定的議題選定之後,召集各界來討論這個是很常有的事情,所有的執行工作,行政院會執行我們今天是在討論那個國會改革案之後那另外齁,我覺得我們這個互相的質詢就是一個很好的典範啦那今天我立委他造謠功力也是滿分啦,真的是很厲害譬如說我昨天剛好有聽到有一位立委說,欸這個為什麼沒有可以行使緘默權,為什麼不能請律師,我想請問\n353257\t376907\t院長你也是法律人嘛,什麼時候我國的訴訟制度正能請律師可以行使緘默權?我想請教你。但是在這裡不一樣,你面對的不是一個司法上面的被告或是...今天不是司法調查喔,院長你不能這樣子亂扯喔。所以今天國會的調查不實,你不能任何一個人來到這裡。緘默權是不自證舉罪的時候對於當事人的保障,並不是你今天講這個樣子。\n378097\t380820\t我國的法律制度是不是本來就是依據條文以及判決判例來做判決?\n400933\t427111\t如果有名文條文當然是 如果有形成判例那當然就是一個對沒錯所以林益錦這種法律嘗試的不足那我也不想再譴責就好像說民主國家立法委員跑去人家高中的畢業典禮在那邊做政治宣傳一樣其實這都不是民主國家該有的樣子就吼有關吼這個國會的這個改革的這個法案吼我想我還是跟院長報告一下啦我常跟人家講啦\n428257\t431121\t一二三四我們這段時間舉辦過一場專報兩場審查會三場公聽會四場協商\n436294\t459279\t民進黨發言的時間是1068分鐘光是4月21號民進黨發言時間就81分鐘27秒每一個委員都發言兩次以上結果你們最習慣的就是把所有的事情切成一個非常小的縫隙然後在這個縫隙裡面去談對錯你們從來不去把整個東西從頭到尾看清楚是誰在搗亂整個議程\n460339\t463363\t報告委員不僅審查的過程不夠嚴謹在投票的當天提出一個從來沒有看過的版本這個也是大家詬病之所在\n480105\t494356\t您當過立法委員嗎?曾經我想說修正動議是什麼時候提你也很清楚啦我覺得不用在一邊這樣子說了啦我想請問一下院長到底我們依據議事規則我們有幾種投票方式在立法院\n495506\t518661\t可以記名不記名表決器等等都可以簡單說吳宗結果現在大家在攻擊說當天為什麼是舉手表決那我在這邊跟院長報告一件事情當天國民黨也提案希望我們簽一個竊決書大家不要攻占主席台所有人回到位置上面去按表決器就好大家都輕鬆結果是柯建民總召說什麼都不願意他就講了一句這不可能啦\n519465\t533864\t所以沒有辦法到最後大家為了讓議事順利就只能在主席台上面狀況是這樣並不是我們這麼願意說站在那裡沒有椅子坐沒有插座可以充手機充電然後在那裡傻傻的在那邊舉手表決\n534685\t550697\t更何況你說舉手表決什麼跟中共人大一樣那你為什麼不說跟聯合國一樣既然它是議事規則裡面一種投票方式你們卻可以來這樣子去攻擊我沒有辦法理解這樣啦吼報告委員我認為舉手表決有一個條件他必須清點人數\n552398\t552838\t最後齁 我是覺得啦齁\n583326\t599311\t民進黨齁我們是一個五權體制的國家不要把五權完成一權剩下行政權就變成獨裁那湯德忠大法官齁在去年在東吳的時候提到四字五八五號他在解釋這個的時候他有講到\n600331\t600351\t好 謝謝\n","txt":"麻煩我們請院長請卓院長備詢其實這幾天我在全院的審查會看下來昨天看到今天\n其實我發現兩個現象就是說溝通這兩個字齁目前用在執政黨身上好像越溝通就有這個溝越大就更不同我現在看到的是這樣完全無法溝通大家講的東西完全南轅北轍所以從上個禮拜我對院長的質詢我有提到說我蠻期望院長將來是成為全民大師兄一起來照顧照顧全民就現在變成是好像是浩克一樣碰到一些關鍵字就有一點\n吳宗憲\n他好像是像是那個辯論比賽一樣2016年以前他是抽到正方所以2016年以前他認為國會就是要改革需要有這些權利要聽證調查都要有結果呢2016到2024這8年又完全靜悄悄國會多數他也不管這件事2024之後呢又好像辯論比賽抽到反方一樣完全又開始否定所有的東西\n所以這個讓我去思考一下到底這個政黨他是有一個核心理念想要為國為民想要讓立法權能夠好好的監督權還是他今天他的所謂的理念只因為是否執政而改變\n時空環境不同或者是什麼政策的轉彎其實我覺得這個都不是真正的原因啦很單純就是一個有沒有執政執政了之後想法就全都變好那不要講我的想法啦這段時間呢我們看到吉林卓水在民進黨的大前輩其實他有提到了\n這個修法已經好幾十年等了好幾十年了結果呢現在卻是他以前的同志們帶頭出來反對甚至我自己提出來的提案也都是很多都是參考前輩顧立雄前輩林佳龍的一些草案結果呢現在卻被喊成是毀憲亂政然後講一些奇怪怪的扣我一堆的帽子然後講我是什麼中共同路人其實我不太能夠接受這樣\n我覺得一個還權於民的這個概念到最後變成扣上迴憲亂政這就是把政治當作辯論比賽這我沒有辦法去接受而且我覺得最離譜的是今天在座的法務部正部長我覺得他不只選手要當他裁判也要當\n不能部長把自己...不用不用...不用...那個...我沒有要問部長部長不要把自己演成是側翼啦因為部長來其實我對他很...蠻...蠻期待而且他其實做了很多事我是...我也跟他說過他做了好幾個政策我覺得是非常稱讚的齁但是我認為啦齁部長不應該把自己演成側翼為什麼?因為第一個藐視國會他說違背法律明確性昨天講的\n這怎麼違背法律明確性呢?你說虛偽陳述四個字不明確好,刑法168條偽證罪就是虛偽陳述阿我不相信政部長一輩子沒有起訴過一件偽證罪我自己起訴過很多件偽證罪從來也沒有一個法官用違憲來把判無罪或認定他違憲所以你跟我講說這個違反法律明確性原則部長不能講這種話再來,部長昨天又講說什麼國會調查權違反四字五八五號\n部長什麼時候變大法官了?這也不能這樣幹嘛?515號請部長回去自己再看清楚啦至少我看的不是這樣啦所以我認為不能這樣所以藐視國會這個定義不明到底是真的定義不明還是你這覆議的理由寫不明這是我一直以來我自己的問題啦唉呦我覺得啦你要說迴憲亂政你不如去提總統所要成立的三個委員會\n這三個委員會其實他的預算跟能源編制這個都很奇怪而且是由總統來去成立之前蔡政府時代還不敢這麼做結果現在賴政府時代變成說他要搞三個委員會那這樣子是不是說賴總統有侵害到行政權他說他有跟你仔細討論過還是說你覺得今天侵害到行政權乾脆你做個手板我們請外面的青鳥幫你一起去維護你的權利所以我真的覺得制度越走越奇怪而且\n這不就是跟那個習近平一樣嗎?搞了一堆工作小組來架空國務院我覺得這個賴政府如果一直嘴巴罵共產黨身體又一直學共產黨\n總統府三個委員會他是一個任務的編組他沒有組織、沒有預算、沒有人事\n單就一個特定的議題選定之後,召集各界來討論這個是很常有的事情,所有的執行工作,行政院會執行我們今天是在討論那個國會改革案之後那另外齁,我覺得我們這個互相的質詢就是一個很好的典範啦那今天我立委他造謠功力也是滿分啦,真的是很厲害譬如說我昨天剛好有聽到有一位立委說,欸這個為什麼沒有可以行使緘默權,為什麼不能請律師,我想請問\n院長你也是法律人嘛,什麼時候我國的訴訟制度正能請律師可以行使緘默權?我想請教你。但是在這裡不一樣,你面對的不是一個司法上面的被告或是...今天不是司法調查喔,院長你不能這樣子亂扯喔。所以今天國會的調查不實,你不能任何一個人來到這裡。緘默權是不自證舉罪的時候對於當事人的保障,並不是你今天講這個樣子。\n我國的法律制度是不是本來就是依據條文以及判決判例來做判決?\n如果有名文條文當然是 如果有形成判例那當然就是一個對沒錯所以林益錦這種法律嘗試的不足那我也不想再譴責就好像說民主國家立法委員跑去人家高中的畢業典禮在那邊做政治宣傳一樣其實這都不是民主國家該有的樣子就吼有關吼這個國會的這個改革的這個法案吼我想我還是跟院長報告一下啦我常跟人家講啦\n一二三四我們這段時間舉辦過一場專報兩場審查會三場公聽會四場協商\n民進黨發言的時間是1068分鐘光是4月21號民進黨發言時間就81分鐘27秒每一個委員都發言兩次以上結果你們最習慣的就是把所有的事情切成一個非常小的縫隙然後在這個縫隙裡面去談對錯你們從來不去把整個東西從頭到尾看清楚是誰在搗亂整個議程\n報告委員不僅審查的過程不夠嚴謹在投票的當天提出一個從來沒有看過的版本這個也是大家詬病之所在\n您當過立法委員嗎?曾經我想說修正動議是什麼時候提你也很清楚啦我覺得不用在一邊這樣子說了啦我想請問一下院長到底我們依據議事規則我們有幾種投票方式在立法院\n可以記名不記名表決器等等都可以簡單說吳宗結果現在大家在攻擊說當天為什麼是舉手表決那我在這邊跟院長報告一件事情當天國民黨也提案希望我們簽一個竊決書大家不要攻占主席台所有人回到位置上面去按表決器就好大家都輕鬆結果是柯建民總召說什麼都不願意他就講了一句這不可能啦\n所以沒有辦法到最後大家為了讓議事順利就只能在主席台上面狀況是這樣並不是我們這麼願意說站在那裡沒有椅子坐沒有插座可以充手機充電然後在那裡傻傻的在那邊舉手表決\n更何況你說舉手表決什麼跟中共人大一樣那你為什麼不說跟聯合國一樣既然它是議事規則裡面一種投票方式你們卻可以來這樣子去攻擊我沒有辦法理解這樣啦吼報告委員我認為舉手表決有一個條件他必須清點人數\n最後齁 我是覺得啦齁\n民進黨齁我們是一個五權體制的國家不要把五權完成一權剩下行政權就變成獨裁那湯德忠大法官齁在去年在東吳的時候提到四字五八五號他在解釋這個的時候他有講到\n好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.590 --> 00:09.995\n麻煩我們請院長請卓院長備詢其實這幾天我在全院的審查會看下來昨天看到今天\n\n00:24.003 --> 00:52.750\n其實我發現兩個現象就是說溝通這兩個字齁目前用在執政黨身上好像越溝通就有這個溝越大就更不同我現在看到的是這樣完全無法溝通大家講的東西完全南轅北轍所以從上個禮拜我對院長的質詢我有提到說我蠻期望院長將來是成為全民大師兄一起來照顧照顧全民就現在變成是好像是浩克一樣碰到一些關鍵字就有一點\n\n00:53.663 --> 00:53.683\n吳宗憲\n\n01:15.421 --> 01:42.395\n他好像是像是那個辯論比賽一樣2016年以前他是抽到正方所以2016年以前他認為國會就是要改革需要有這些權利要聽證調查都要有結果呢2016到2024這8年又完全靜悄悄國會多數他也不管這件事2024之後呢又好像辯論比賽抽到反方一樣完全又開始否定所有的東西\n\n01:43.075 --> 01:57.963\n所以這個讓我去思考一下到底這個政黨他是有一個核心理念想要為國為民想要讓立法權能夠好好的監督權還是他今天他的所謂的理念只因為是否執政而改變\n\n01:59.083 --> 02:18.377\n時空環境不同或者是什麼政策的轉彎其實我覺得這個都不是真正的原因啦很單純就是一個有沒有執政執政了之後想法就全都變好那不要講我的想法啦這段時間呢我們看到吉林卓水在民進黨的大前輩其實他有提到了\n\n02:19.705 --> 02:42.964\n這個修法已經好幾十年等了好幾十年了結果呢現在卻是他以前的同志們帶頭出來反對甚至我自己提出來的提案也都是很多都是參考前輩顧立雄前輩林佳龍的一些草案結果呢現在卻被喊成是毀憲亂政然後講一些奇怪怪的扣我一堆的帽子然後講我是什麼中共同路人其實我不太能夠接受這樣\n\n02:43.953 --> 03:00.078\n我覺得一個還權於民的這個概念到最後變成扣上迴憲亂政這就是把政治當作辯論比賽這我沒有辦法去接受而且我覺得最離譜的是今天在座的法務部正部長我覺得他不只選手要當他裁判也要當\n\n03:00.984 --> 03:24.282\n不能部長把自己...不用不用...不用...那個...我沒有要問部長部長不要把自己演成是側翼啦因為部長來其實我對他很...蠻...蠻期待而且他其實做了很多事我是...我也跟他說過他做了好幾個政策我覺得是非常稱讚的齁但是我認為啦齁部長不應該把自己演成側翼為什麼?因為第一個藐視國會他說違背法律明確性昨天講的\n\n03:26.090 --> 03:53.785\n這怎麼違背法律明確性呢?你說虛偽陳述四個字不明確好,刑法168條偽證罪就是虛偽陳述阿我不相信政部長一輩子沒有起訴過一件偽證罪我自己起訴過很多件偽證罪從來也沒有一個法官用違憲來把判無罪或認定他違憲所以你跟我講說這個違反法律明確性原則部長不能講這種話再來,部長昨天又講說什麼國會調查權違反四字五八五號\n\n03:55.083 --> 04:21.837\n部長什麼時候變大法官了?這也不能這樣幹嘛?515號請部長回去自己再看清楚啦至少我看的不是這樣啦所以我認為不能這樣所以藐視國會這個定義不明到底是真的定義不明還是你這覆議的理由寫不明這是我一直以來我自己的問題啦唉呦我覺得啦你要說迴憲亂政你不如去提總統所要成立的三個委員會\n\n04:23.639 --> 04:52.864\n這三個委員會其實他的預算跟能源編制這個都很奇怪而且是由總統來去成立之前蔡政府時代還不敢這麼做結果現在賴政府時代變成說他要搞三個委員會那這樣子是不是說賴總統有侵害到行政權他說他有跟你仔細討論過還是說你覺得今天侵害到行政權乾脆你做個手板我們請外面的青鳥幫你一起去維護你的權利所以我真的覺得制度越走越奇怪而且\n\n04:53.855 --> 05:05.204\n這不就是跟那個習近平一樣嗎?搞了一堆工作小組來架空國務院我覺得這個賴政府如果一直嘴巴罵共產黨身體又一直學共產黨\n\n05:06.496 --> 05:08.318\n總統府三個委員會他是一個任務的編組他沒有組織、沒有預算、沒有人事\n\n05:24.379 --> 05:52.084\n單就一個特定的議題選定之後,召集各界來討論這個是很常有的事情,所有的執行工作,行政院會執行我們今天是在討論那個國會改革案之後那另外齁,我覺得我們這個互相的質詢就是一個很好的典範啦那今天我立委他造謠功力也是滿分啦,真的是很厲害譬如說我昨天剛好有聽到有一位立委說,欸這個為什麼沒有可以行使緘默權,為什麼不能請律師,我想請問\n\n05:53.257 --> 06:16.907\n院長你也是法律人嘛,什麼時候我國的訴訟制度正能請律師可以行使緘默權?我想請教你。但是在這裡不一樣,你面對的不是一個司法上面的被告或是...今天不是司法調查喔,院長你不能這樣子亂扯喔。所以今天國會的調查不實,你不能任何一個人來到這裡。緘默權是不自證舉罪的時候對於當事人的保障,並不是你今天講這個樣子。\n\n06:18.097 --> 06:20.820\n我國的法律制度是不是本來就是依據條文以及判決判例來做判決?\n\n06:40.933 --> 07:07.111\n如果有名文條文當然是如果有形成判例那當然就是一個對沒錯所以林益錦這種法律嘗試的不足那我也不想再譴責就好像說民主國家立法委員跑去人家高中的畢業典禮在那邊做政治宣傳一樣其實這都不是民主國家該有的樣子就吼有關吼這個國會的這個改革的這個法案吼我想我還是跟院長報告一下啦我常跟人家講啦\n\n07:08.257 --> 07:11.121\n一二三四我們這段時間舉辦過一場專報兩場審查會三場公聽會四場協商\n\n07:16.294 --> 07:39.279\n民進黨發言的時間是1068分鐘光是4月21號民進黨發言時間就81分鐘27秒每一個委員都發言兩次以上結果你們最習慣的就是把所有的事情切成一個非常小的縫隙然後在這個縫隙裡面去談對錯你們從來不去把整個東西從頭到尾看清楚是誰在搗亂整個議程\n\n07:40.339 --> 07:43.363\n報告委員不僅審查的過程不夠嚴謹在投票的當天提出一個從來沒有看過的版本這個也是大家詬病之所在\n\n08:00.105 --> 08:14.356\n您當過立法委員嗎?曾經我想說修正動議是什麼時候提你也很清楚啦我覺得不用在一邊這樣子說了啦我想請問一下院長到底我們依據議事規則我們有幾種投票方式在立法院\n\n08:15.506 --> 08:38.661\n可以記名不記名表決器等等都可以簡單說吳宗結果現在大家在攻擊說當天為什麼是舉手表決那我在這邊跟院長報告一件事情當天國民黨也提案希望我們簽一個竊決書大家不要攻占主席台所有人回到位置上面去按表決器就好大家都輕鬆結果是柯建民總召說什麼都不願意他就講了一句這不可能啦\n\n08:39.465 --> 08:53.864\n所以沒有辦法到最後大家為了讓議事順利就只能在主席台上面狀況是這樣並不是我們這麼願意說站在那裡沒有椅子坐沒有插座可以充手機充電然後在那裡傻傻的在那邊舉手表決\n\n08:54.685 --> 09:10.697\n更何況你說舉手表決什麼跟中共人大一樣那你為什麼不說跟聯合國一樣既然它是議事規則裡面一種投票方式你們卻可以來這樣子去攻擊我沒有辦法理解這樣啦吼報告委員我認為舉手表決有一個條件他必須清點人數\n\n09:12.398 --> 09:12.838\n最後齁我是覺得啦齁\n\n09:43.326 --> 09:59.311\n民進黨齁我們是一個五權體制的國家不要把五權完成一權剩下行政權就變成獨裁那湯德忠大法官齁在去年在東吳的時候提到四字五八五號他在解釋這個的時候他有講到\n\n10:00.331 --> 10:00.351\n好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.59,"end":9.995,"text":"麻煩我們請院長請卓院長備詢其實這幾天我在全院的審查會看下來昨天看到今天"},{"start":24.003,"end":52.75,"text":"其實我發現兩個現象就是說溝通這兩個字齁目前用在執政黨身上好像越溝通就有這個溝越大就更不同我現在看到的是這樣完全無法溝通大家講的東西完全南轅北轍所以從上個禮拜我對院長的質詢我有提到說我蠻期望院長將來是成為全民大師兄一起來照顧照顧全民就現在變成是好像是浩克一樣碰到一些關鍵字就有一點"},{"start":53.663,"end":53.683,"text":"吳宗憲"},{"start":75.421,"end":102.395,"text":"他好像是像是那個辯論比賽一樣2016年以前他是抽到正方所以2016年以前他認為國會就是要改革需要有這些權利要聽證調查都要有結果呢2016到2024這8年又完全靜悄悄國會多數他也不管這件事2024之後呢又好像辯論比賽抽到反方一樣完全又開始否定所有的東西"},{"start":103.075,"end":117.963,"text":"所以這個讓我去思考一下到底這個政黨他是有一個核心理念想要為國為民想要讓立法權能夠好好的監督權還是他今天他的所謂的理念只因為是否執政而改變"},{"start":119.083,"end":138.377,"text":"時空環境不同或者是什麼政策的轉彎其實我覺得這個都不是真正的原因啦很單純就是一個有沒有執政執政了之後想法就全都變好那不要講我的想法啦這段時間呢我們看到吉林卓水在民進黨的大前輩其實他有提到了"},{"start":139.705,"end":162.964,"text":"這個修法已經好幾十年等了好幾十年了結果呢現在卻是他以前的同志們帶頭出來反對甚至我自己提出來的提案也都是很多都是參考前輩顧立雄前輩林佳龍的一些草案結果呢現在卻被喊成是毀憲亂政然後講一些奇怪怪的扣我一堆的帽子然後講我是什麼中共同路人其實我不太能夠接受這樣"},{"start":163.953,"end":180.078,"text":"我覺得一個還權於民的這個概念到最後變成扣上迴憲亂政這就是把政治當作辯論比賽這我沒有辦法去接受而且我覺得最離譜的是今天在座的法務部正部長我覺得他不只選手要當他裁判也要當"},{"start":180.984,"end":204.282,"text":"不能部長把自己...不用不用...不用...那個...我沒有要問部長部長不要把自己演成是側翼啦因為部長來其實我對他很...蠻...蠻期待而且他其實做了很多事我是...我也跟他說過他做了好幾個政策我覺得是非常稱讚的齁但是我認為啦齁部長不應該把自己演成側翼為什麼?因為第一個藐視國會他說違背法律明確性昨天講的"},{"start":206.09,"end":233.785,"text":"這怎麼違背法律明確性呢?你說虛偽陳述四個字不明確好,刑法168條偽證罪就是虛偽陳述阿我不相信政部長一輩子沒有起訴過一件偽證罪我自己起訴過很多件偽證罪從來也沒有一個法官用違憲來把判無罪或認定他違憲所以你跟我講說這個違反法律明確性原則部長不能講這種話再來,部長昨天又講說什麼國會調查權違反四字五八五號"},{"start":235.083,"end":261.837,"text":"部長什麼時候變大法官了?這也不能這樣幹嘛?515號請部長回去自己再看清楚啦至少我看的不是這樣啦所以我認為不能這樣所以藐視國會這個定義不明到底是真的定義不明還是你這覆議的理由寫不明這是我一直以來我自己的問題啦唉呦我覺得啦你要說迴憲亂政你不如去提總統所要成立的三個委員會"},{"start":263.639,"end":292.864,"text":"這三個委員會其實他的預算跟能源編制這個都很奇怪而且是由總統來去成立之前蔡政府時代還不敢這麼做結果現在賴政府時代變成說他要搞三個委員會那這樣子是不是說賴總統有侵害到行政權他說他有跟你仔細討論過還是說你覺得今天侵害到行政權乾脆你做個手板我們請外面的青鳥幫你一起去維護你的權利所以我真的覺得制度越走越奇怪而且"},{"start":293.855,"end":305.204,"text":"這不就是跟那個習近平一樣嗎?搞了一堆工作小組來架空國務院我覺得這個賴政府如果一直嘴巴罵共產黨身體又一直學共產黨"},{"start":306.496,"end":308.318,"text":"總統府三個委員會他是一個任務的編組他沒有組織、沒有預算、沒有人事"},{"start":324.379,"end":352.084,"text":"單就一個特定的議題選定之後,召集各界來討論這個是很常有的事情,所有的執行工作,行政院會執行我們今天是在討論那個國會改革案之後那另外齁,我覺得我們這個互相的質詢就是一個很好的典範啦那今天我立委他造謠功力也是滿分啦,真的是很厲害譬如說我昨天剛好有聽到有一位立委說,欸這個為什麼沒有可以行使緘默權,為什麼不能請律師,我想請問"},{"start":353.257,"end":376.907,"text":"院長你也是法律人嘛,什麼時候我國的訴訟制度正能請律師可以行使緘默權?我想請教你。但是在這裡不一樣,你面對的不是一個司法上面的被告或是...今天不是司法調查喔,院長你不能這樣子亂扯喔。所以今天國會的調查不實,你不能任何一個人來到這裡。緘默權是不自證舉罪的時候對於當事人的保障,並不是你今天講這個樣子。"},{"start":378.097,"end":380.82,"text":"我國的法律制度是不是本來就是依據條文以及判決判例來做判決?"},{"start":400.933,"end":427.111,"text":"如果有名文條文當然是 如果有形成判例那當然就是一個對沒錯所以林益錦這種法律嘗試的不足那我也不想再譴責就好像說民主國家立法委員跑去人家高中的畢業典禮在那邊做政治宣傳一樣其實這都不是民主國家該有的樣子就吼有關吼這個國會的這個改革的這個法案吼我想我還是跟院長報告一下啦我常跟人家講啦"},{"start":428.257,"end":431.121,"text":"一二三四我們這段時間舉辦過一場專報兩場審查會三場公聽會四場協商"},{"start":436.294,"end":459.279,"text":"民進黨發言的時間是1068分鐘光是4月21號民進黨發言時間就81分鐘27秒每一個委員都發言兩次以上結果你們最習慣的就是把所有的事情切成一個非常小的縫隙然後在這個縫隙裡面去談對錯你們從來不去把整個東西從頭到尾看清楚是誰在搗亂整個議程"},{"start":460.339,"end":463.363,"text":"報告委員不僅審查的過程不夠嚴謹在投票的當天提出一個從來沒有看過的版本這個也是大家詬病之所在"},{"start":480.105,"end":494.356,"text":"您當過立法委員嗎?曾經我想說修正動議是什麼時候提你也很清楚啦我覺得不用在一邊這樣子說了啦我想請問一下院長到底我們依據議事規則我們有幾種投票方式在立法院"},{"start":495.506,"end":518.661,"text":"可以記名不記名表決器等等都可以簡單說吳宗結果現在大家在攻擊說當天為什麼是舉手表決那我在這邊跟院長報告一件事情當天國民黨也提案希望我們簽一個竊決書大家不要攻占主席台所有人回到位置上面去按表決器就好大家都輕鬆結果是柯建民總召說什麼都不願意他就講了一句這不可能啦"},{"start":519.465,"end":533.864,"text":"所以沒有辦法到最後大家為了讓議事順利就只能在主席台上面狀況是這樣並不是我們這麼願意說站在那裡沒有椅子坐沒有插座可以充手機充電然後在那裡傻傻的在那邊舉手表決"},{"start":534.685,"end":550.697,"text":"更何況你說舉手表決什麼跟中共人大一樣那你為什麼不說跟聯合國一樣既然它是議事規則裡面一種投票方式你們卻可以來這樣子去攻擊我沒有辦法理解這樣啦吼報告委員我認為舉手表決有一個條件他必須清點人數"},{"start":552.398,"end":552.838,"text":"最後齁 我是覺得啦齁"},{"start":583.326,"end":599.311,"text":"民進黨齁我們是一個五權體制的國家不要把五權完成一權剩下行政權就變成獨裁那湯德忠大法官齁在去年在東吳的時候提到四字五八五號他在解釋這個的時候他有講到"},{"start":600.331,"end":600.351,"text":"好 謝謝"}]}}}}