{"id":154222,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/154222","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/0ea7781078621bd1ae891ffba60ed4cba22d6087941f42bcee23585586e40b3a91973a31aecd7fbc5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"范雲","委員發言時間":"09:59:02 - 10:06:59","影片長度":"00:07:57","會議時間":"2024-06-26T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第17次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查委員范雲等17人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n二、審查委員林宜瑾等22人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n三、審查委員張雅琳等19人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n四、審查委員李柏毅等18人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n五、審查委員黃秀芳等18人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n六、審查委員許智傑等25人擬具「學生輔導法第四條及第七條條文修正草案」案。\n七、審查委員許智傑等26人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n八、審查委員柯志恩等18人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n九、審查委員陳培瑜等18人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n十、審查委員陳培瑜等18人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n十一、審查委員洪孟楷等22人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n十二、審查委員陳秀寳等20人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n十三、審查委員郭昱晴等19人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n十四、審查委員葛如鈞等16人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n十五、審查委員郭國文等19人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n十六、審查委員郭國文等19人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n十七、審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n十八、審查委員吳沛憶等16人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n十九、審查委員王育敏等20人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n二十、審查委員萬美玲等19人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n二十一、審查委員羅智強等16人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n二十二、審查委員陳亭妃等19人擬具「學生輔導法第五條及第七條條文修正草案」案。\n二十三、審查委員馬文君等24人擬具「學生輔導法第五條條文修正草案」案。\n二十四、審查委員陳菁徽等20人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n二十五、審查委員莊瑞雄等16人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案。\n二十六、審查委員林月琴等19人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(6月26日僅進行詢答)\n【6月24日及26日二天一次會】）","type":"Clip","date":"2024-06-26","start_time":"2024-06-26T09:59:02+08:00","end_time":"2024-06-26T10:06:59+08:00","duration":477,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第17次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":17,"committees":[22],"id":"委員會-11-1-22-17"},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"gazette":{"lineno":198,"blocks":[["范委員雲：（9時59分）謝謝召委，有請部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["鄭部長英耀：委員好。"],["范委員雲：部長早安。這邊要給部長看一下，這個照片就是我剛剛講的，在2020年的時候，我跟賴品妤委員率先共同召開公聽會，然後啟動學輔法修法，當時的po文現在看起來差不多都已經是三、四年前的事情了，所以教育部的動作真的可以更快一點。","現在我們就直接來對話，關於這一次教育部版本及院版跟大家的期待，想請問部長，我們的第一個訴求剛剛有講到，就是覺得應該要優先任用輔導的專業主管，這邊是社工師全聯會的建議版本，我想請問部長，部長知不知道目前輔諮中心的主管是專輔人員的比例是多少？"],["鄭部長英耀：目前有9個縣市，全國22個縣市裡面有9個縣市是由專輔人員來擔任輔諮中心的主任。"],["范委員雲：所以這樣算起來的比例是多少？二十二分之九，其實還是滿低的啦，當然我不知道為什麼這個數字跟我去索資來的不大一樣，也許有一些進展，我們事後再比對。重點是我拿到的數字只有27%，您剛剛講的好像又調整了，多了一點，可是這個部分我也跟教育部對話過，你們提到了人力不足的部分，然後還有專業人員不一定有行政長才，但是我想這個部分，因為他畢竟是要統籌這麼重要的單位，還是應該要由專業人力擔任主管，不知道部長覺得我們在這一次修法是不是就可以達到這件事？"],["鄭部長英耀：非常謝謝委員的關心，確實我們這一次的修法也是朝著這個方向在努力。"],["范委員雲：好，謝謝，那我就期待到時候可以參考我的版本，讓我們能夠確實達到輔諮中心應由專業人力擔任的目標。","再來，關於輔導處室的部分，專業團體也主張，這是輔諮學會的修訂條文，他們覺得應採「宜由」，「宜由」跟「應由」已經不大一樣了，表示他們知道有時候是無法的，但是原則上優先由專業人員來任用，而且是不是能夠有配套，也就是說，他如果來做主任的話，應該還要補足員額，因為他事實上能夠做的輔導工作就會降低了嘛，部長對於這一條的看法呢？這一條我之前沒有跟你們溝通過，您覺得這一條是不是有可能也往這個方向來邁進？"],["鄭部長英耀：是的，有關輔導室主任由專業人員來擔任、專業老師來擔任，我想我們都是朝那一個方向努力……"],["范委員雲：好，太好了！"],["鄭部長英耀：但確實小學有一些規模比較小，他的主任的候用不一定有這個專業……"],["范委員雲：那個部分可能是例外……"],["鄭部長英耀：但是那個目標是我們努力的。"],["范委員雲：好，關於行政職如果由專業人員擔任的話，能不能夠補足員額的部分呢？要不然就變得工作量更大了，因為本來是他有他原本的工作。"],["鄭部長英耀：我想這一個是分離的啦……"],["范委員雲：分離的？教育部可不可以去考慮一下，能不能夠補足員額？"],["鄭部長英耀：就是說輔導主任的編制是輔導主任，輔導老師是屬於輔導老師，這裡邊應該是不衝突的。"],["范委員雲：這個部分你們去瞭解一下，好不好？"],["鄭部長英耀：理論上應該要補足啦！"],["范委員雲：對，理論上要補足，我們就朝這個方向努力，好不好？"],["鄭部長英耀：是。"],["范委員雲：如果遇到什麼困難，也希望能夠跟我辦公室溝通，好不好？希望往這個方向，謝謝部長，真的是非常的用心啦。","再來，剛剛大家都提到高中以下專輔人力的部分，我們知道大專的部分，肯定教育部已經率先達標了，我們就來講高中以下的部分。我對照了現行條文跟教育部112年報院的條文，有幾個部分大家還是有不同的意見，第一個，你們原來112年報院版本刪除了大校駐校人力，因為原本是有一定班數就要設的規定，我有問了一下原因，你們說這樣會有輔諮中心能不能統籌的問題，可是事實上，我們的條文第四條已經規定輔諮中心有統籌權啊！第二個就是地方的比例20比1沒有提升，專業團體用這樣來估算，如果是112年報院版的話，算起來還是1比4,400耶，現狀，就是你們的增訂版是1比4,500到1比5,000，就變得不進反退喔！新法如果是112年報院版的話，只有保下限，部長，這個部分如果只有保下限的話，那不就是不升反減嗎？沒有規劃提升，部長對於這個部分的回應是什麼？因為這個是您還沒來當部長的時候所提出來的，我們看的是上一次送院的版本，您當部長之後是不是有修改呢？您也是心理方面的專業，大家的期待更高，部長是不是可以改善一下？"],["鄭部長英耀：我想這個我們來努力。"],["范委員雲：努力，好不好？好，我就要聽您說努力啦，因為我們對您的期待很高，就是不一定要跟上一屆一樣。","另外，我的版本要請你們參考的就是原本的55班降為40班，原本的20校降為15校，這個部分，我想因為時間有限，我就請部長納入參考，然後去努力，好嗎？","另外還有一個很重要的是專輔人員的待遇要提升，我聽到後也很驚訝，有關輔導年資的部分，他如果去當督導卸任回來後，居然年資不被採計，還被降職，這樣誰要去當督導？所以是不是能夠解決這個問題？就是輔導年資在卸任後不被採計的問題，這個表有點複雜，部長可以請學特司去研究一下，是不是應該透過職務加給的方式支持接任主任、督導之專輔人員？也就是說，沒有這種當督導然後年資不被採計的道理，回去之後還停在第三年，他其實已經去當別的了，部長可以瞭解一下嗎？"],["鄭部長英耀：是，我想……"],["范委員雲：這個部分應該不是在法條中，但是你們會有相關的辦法，也去瞭解一下，我這邊一起反映出來。"],["鄭部長英耀：好，謝謝。"],["范委員雲：最後一個也是曾跟教育部溝通過的，就是自我傷害要納主動輔導，不要放在「等其他事項」當中，因為大家都關心自殺、自傷的問題，是不是就應該明確保障，讓他能夠優先被面對、被照顧，好不好？"],["鄭部長英耀：謝謝委員，我想有很多委員跟委員的看法是一致的，怎麼樣把自我傷害能夠納入到法條裡邊，我想我們也會認真來考量。"],["范委員雲：謝謝部長的肯定，因為還沒有看到你們通過的院版，希望在這之前，據說明天才要通過嘛，還有時間，是不是能夠符合我們這一次的修法，您又是相關專業來擔任部長，過去沒做好的部分，要資源的話，我們委員雖然不宜增加預算，所以應該是你們的版本就要符合大家的期待，好不好？"],["鄭部長英耀：謝謝委員提醒。"],["范委員雲：好，謝謝部長，我們一起加油，謝謝。"],["鄭部長英耀：謝謝委員。"],["主席（陳委員培瑜代）：謝謝范雲委員、謝謝部長、謝謝署長、謝謝司長。","接下來有請柯志恩委員，謝謝。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":332,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-17","speakers":["柯志恩","陳秀寳","洪孟楷","陳培瑜","張雅琳","羅智強","陳菁徽","葛如鈞","范雲","萬美玲","羅廷瑋","林宜瑾","郭昱晴","吳沛憶","陳亭妃","葉元之","楊瓊瓔","邱志偉","吳宗憲","徐欣瑩","林憶君","王育敏","吳春城","林月琴"],"page_start":275,"meetingDate":["2024-06-26"],"gazette_id":"1136601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1136601_00012"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第17次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查委員范雲等17人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案；二、審查委員林宜瑾等22人\n擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案；三、審查委員張雅琳等19人擬具「學生輔導法部分條\n文修正草案」案；四、審查委員李柏毅等 18 人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案；\n五、審查委員黃秀芳等18人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案；六、審查委員許智傑等25\n人擬具「學生輔導法第四條及第七條條文修正草案」案；七、審查委員許智傑等26人擬具「學生\n輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案；八、審查委員柯志恩等18人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正\n草案」案；九、審查委員陳培瑜等18人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案；十、審查\n委員陳培瑜等18人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案；十一、審查委員洪孟楷等22人擬具\n「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案；十二、審查委員陳秀寳等20人擬具「學生輔導法部分\n條文修正草案」案；十三、審查委員郭昱晴等 19 人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」\n案；十四、審查委員葛如鈞等16人擬具「學生輔導法部分條文修正草案」案；十五、審查委員郭\n國文等 19 人擬具「學生輔導法第十一條條文修正草案」案；十六、審查委員郭國文等 19 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\"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"毅\", \"start\": 450.446, \"end\": 450.566, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"等\", \"start\": 450.566, \"end\": 450.586, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"9\"}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 450.586, \"end\": 450.606, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"擬\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:03,575 --> 00:00:04,202\n一人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具\n\n2\n00:00:10,732 --> 00:00:33,206\n部長早安,這邊是要給部長看一下這個照片就是我剛剛講2020年我跟賴平委員我們率先共同召開這個公聽會然後啟動學服法修法那當時這個PO文都已經現在看起來都是已經差不多已經三、四年前的事情了那所以呢教育部的動作那真的可以更快一點\n\n3\n00:00:33,766 --> 00:01:01,281\n那我們就直接回來對話這一次的那個DRIVE的版本跟院版那跟大家的期待那想請問部長因為我們第一個訴求剛有講到就是覺得應該要優先任用輔導的專業主管那這邊是社工師群聯會的建議版本我想問部長目前輔資中心他的主管是專輔人員的比例部長知不知道比例是多少\n\n4\n00:01:02,842 --> 00:01:16,477\n目前有9個縣市,全國有22個縣市裡面有9個縣市是這一個由專輔人員來擔任這一個輔資中心的一個所以這樣算起來比例是多少?\n\n5\n00:01:18,066 --> 00:01:19,347\n二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬\n\n6\n00:01:48,424 --> 00:02:07,021\n應該還是因為他畢竟是要統籌這麼重要的單位還是應該要由專業人力擔任主管那不知道部長覺得這是不是我們這一次就可以達到這件事我想非常謝謝委員的關心確實我們這一次的一個修法也是朝著這個方向在努力\n\n7\n00:02:07,481 --> 00:02:09,563\n二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具«學生輔導法部分條文修正草案案案案》案。\n\n8\n00:02:30,378 --> 00:02:56,147\n議由跟應由已經不大一樣了表示他們知道有時候無法但是原則上優先由專業人員任用而且是不是能夠有配套他如果來做主任的話那其實就應該要補足員工因為他事實上能夠做的輔導工作就會降低了嘛那部長對這一條呢那這一條之前沒有跟你們溝通過那您覺得這一條是不是有可能也往這個方向來邁進\n\n9\n00:02:58,007 --> 00:03:18,334\n是的,我想輔導是主任由這個專業人員來擔任,專業的這個老師來擔任,我想那是我們都是朝那個方向努力。但是確實小學有一些規模比較小,它的主任的一個後用不一定有這個專業,但是那個目標是我們努力的。\n\n10\n00:03:18,914 --> 00:03:47,363\n那關於行政職他如果擔任的話行政職由專業人擔任的話能不能夠補足援額這個部分呢要不然他就變得工作量更大了因為本來是他有他原本的工作我想這一個裡面他是分離的啦分離的那教育部可不可以去考慮一下能不能夠補足援額呢那輔導老師是屬於輔導老師這裡邊應該是不衝突的那這部分你們去了解一下好不好因為這部分我們理論上應該要補足啦\n\n11\n00:03:47,683 --> 00:03:48,323\n李柏毅等19人擬李柏毅等19人擬\n\n12\n00:04:10,673 --> 00:04:31,080\n現行條文及教育部1、1、2年抱怨版的條文有幾個部分大家還是有不同的意見第一個你們原來1、2年抱怨版本刪除了大校助校的人力因為原本是有一定的班數要設我有問一下原因你們是說這樣會有一個\n\n13\n00:04:32,921 --> 00:04:36,685\n議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬\n\n14\n00:04:56,502 --> 00:05:25,203\n就是你們的增訂版是1比4500到1比5000就變得不進反退新法如果是以112年報院版的話只有保下限欸所以部長不知道這個部分就是如果只有保下限的話那不是就不升反減嗎沒有規劃提升那部長對於這個部分的回應是什麼因為這個是您還沒來當部長的時候我們看的是上一次的那個送院版\n\n15\n00:05:26,463 --> 00:05:45,830\n您當部長之後是不是您也是心理方面的大家的期待更高部長是不是可以改善一下我想這個我們來努力努力好不好就要聽您的努力因為我們對您期待很高就是不一定要跟上一屆一樣那另外就是我的版本是這樣你們請參考\n\n16\n00:05:47,150 --> 00:05:47,611\n最後一個,專府人員的待遇\n\n17\n00:06:04,730 --> 00:06:05,391\n兩、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬\n\n18\n00:06:28,334 --> 00:06:43,177\n是不是應該透過職務加解的方式支持接任主任督導之專輔人員啊就是說沒有這種當督導然後年資不被採集回去之後還停在就是第三年他其實已經去當別的了\n\n19\n00:06:44,492 --> 00:07:06,458\n部長可以了解一下嗎?是。這個部分應該不是在法條中,但是你們會有相關的辦法,好不好?也去了解一下,我們一起反映。最後一個就是也跟Joy部溝通過,就是自我傷害要納主動輔導,不要放在本其他事項當中啦,因為這個事情大家都關心,這個自殺自傷的問題,那是不是就應該明確保障,讓他能夠優先被面對、被照顧,好不好?\n\n20\n00:07:14,020 --> 00:07:21,043\n謝謝委員我想有很多的委員跟委員的看法是一致的那麼怎麼樣把這個自我傷害能夠納入到這一個法條裡邊我想我們也會認真來考量謝謝部長的肯定喔那因為我還沒看到你們通過的願板喔\n\n21\n00:07:30,026 --> 00:07:30,606\n等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n3575\t4202\t一人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具\n10732\t33206\t部長早安,這邊是要給部長看一下這個照片就是我剛剛講2020年我跟賴平委員我們率先共同召開這個公聽會然後啟動學服法修法那當時這個PO文都已經現在看起來都是已經差不多已經三、四年前的事情了那所以呢教育部的動作那真的可以更快一點\n33766\t61281\t那我們就直接回來對話這一次的那個DRIVE的版本跟院版那跟大家的期待那想請問部長因為我們第一個訴求剛有講到就是覺得應該要優先任用輔導的專業主管那這邊是社工師群聯會的建議版本我想問部長目前輔資中心他的主管是專輔人員的比例部長知不知道比例是多少\n62842\t76477\t目前有9個縣市,全國有22個縣市裡面有9個縣市是這一個由專輔人員來擔任這一個輔資中心的一個所以這樣算起來比例是多少?\n78066\t79347\t二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬\n108424\t127021\t應該還是因為他畢竟是要統籌這麼重要的單位還是應該要由專業人力擔任主管那不知道部長覺得這是不是我們這一次就可以達到這件事我想非常謝謝委員的關心確實我們這一次的一個修法也是朝著這個方向在努力\n127481\t129563\t二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具 «學生輔導法部分條文修正草案案案案》案。\n150378\t176147\t議由跟應由已經不大一樣了表示他們知道有時候無法但是原則上優先由專業人員任用而且是不是能夠有配套他如果來做主任的話那其實就應該要補足員工因為他事實上能夠做的輔導工作就會降低了嘛那部長對這一條呢那這一條之前沒有跟你們溝通過那您覺得這一條是不是有可能也往這個方向來邁進\n178007\t198334\t是的,我想輔導是主任由這個專業人員來擔任,專業的這個老師來擔任,我想那是我們都是朝那個方向努力。但是確實小學有一些規模比較小,它的主任的一個後用不一定有這個專業,但是那個目標是我們努力的。\n198914\t227363\t那關於行政職他如果擔任的話行政職由專業人擔任的話能不能夠補足援額這個部分呢要不然他就變得工作量更大了因為本來是他有他原本的工作我想這一個裡面他是分離的啦分離的那教育部可不可以去考慮一下能不能夠補足援額呢那輔導老師是屬於輔導老師這裡邊應該是不衝突的那這部分你們去了解一下好不好因為這部分我們理論上應該要補足啦\n227683\t228323\t李柏毅等19人擬李柏毅等19人擬\n250673\t271080\t現行條文及教育部1、1、2年抱怨版的條文有幾個部分大家還是有不同的意見第一個你們原來1、2年抱怨版本刪除了大校助校的人力因為原本是有一定的班數要設我有問一下原因你們是說這樣會有一個\n272921\t276685\t議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬\n296502\t325203\t就是你們的增訂版是1比4500到1比5000就變得不進反退新法如果是以112年報院版的話只有保下限欸所以部長不知道這個部分就是如果只有保下限的話那不是就不升反減嗎沒有規劃提升那部長對於這個部分的回應是什麼因為這個是您還沒來當部長的時候我們看的是上一次的那個送院版\n326463\t345830\t您當部長之後是不是您也是心理方面的大家的期待更高部長是不是可以改善一下我想這個我們來努力努力好不好就要聽您的努力因為我們對您期待很高就是不一定要跟上一屆一樣那另外就是我的版本是這樣你們請參考\n347150\t347611\t最後一個,專府人員的待遇\n364730\t365391\t兩、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬\n388334\t403177\t是不是應該透過職務加解的方式支持接任主任督導之專輔人員啊就是說沒有這種當督導然後年資不被採集回去之後還停在就是第三年他其實已經去當別的了\n404492\t426458\t部長可以了解一下嗎?是。這個部分應該不是在法條中,但是你們會有相關的辦法,好不好?也去了解一下,我們一起反映。最後一個就是也跟Joy部溝通過,就是自我傷害要納主動輔導,不要放在本其他事項當中啦,因為這個事情大家都關心,這個自殺自傷的問題,那是不是就應該明確保障,讓他能夠優先被面對、被照顧,好不好?\n434020\t441043\t謝謝委員我想有很多的委員跟委員的看法是一致的那麼怎麼樣把這個自我傷害能夠納入到這一個法條裡邊我想我們也會認真來考量謝謝部長的肯定喔那因為我還沒看到你們通過的願板喔\n450026\t450606\t等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬\n","txt":"一人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具\n部長早安,這邊是要給部長看一下這個照片就是我剛剛講2020年我跟賴平委員我們率先共同召開這個公聽會然後啟動學服法修法那當時這個PO文都已經現在看起來都是已經差不多已經三、四年前的事情了那所以呢教育部的動作那真的可以更快一點\n那我們就直接回來對話這一次的那個DRIVE的版本跟院版那跟大家的期待那想請問部長因為我們第一個訴求剛有講到就是覺得應該要優先任用輔導的專業主管那這邊是社工師群聯會的建議版本我想問部長目前輔資中心他的主管是專輔人員的比例部長知不知道比例是多少\n目前有9個縣市,全國有22個縣市裡面有9個縣市是這一個由專輔人員來擔任這一個輔資中心的一個所以這樣算起來比例是多少?\n二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬\n應該還是因為他畢竟是要統籌這麼重要的單位還是應該要由專業人力擔任主管那不知道部長覺得這是不是我們這一次就可以達到這件事我想非常謝謝委員的關心確實我們這一次的一個修法也是朝著這個方向在努力\n二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具 «學生輔導法部分條文修正草案案案案》案。\n議由跟應由已經不大一樣了表示他們知道有時候無法但是原則上優先由專業人員任用而且是不是能夠有配套他如果來做主任的話那其實就應該要補足員工因為他事實上能夠做的輔導工作就會降低了嘛那部長對這一條呢那這一條之前沒有跟你們溝通過那您覺得這一條是不是有可能也往這個方向來邁進\n是的,我想輔導是主任由這個專業人員來擔任,專業的這個老師來擔任,我想那是我們都是朝那個方向努力。但是確實小學有一些規模比較小,它的主任的一個後用不一定有這個專業,但是那個目標是我們努力的。\n那關於行政職他如果擔任的話行政職由專業人擔任的話能不能夠補足援額這個部分呢要不然他就變得工作量更大了因為本來是他有他原本的工作我想這一個裡面他是分離的啦分離的那教育部可不可以去考慮一下能不能夠補足援額呢那輔導老師是屬於輔導老師這裡邊應該是不衝突的那這部分你們去了解一下好不好因為這部分我們理論上應該要補足啦\n李柏毅等19人擬李柏毅等19人擬\n現行條文及教育部1、1、2年抱怨版的條文有幾個部分大家還是有不同的意見第一個你們原來1、2年抱怨版本刪除了大校助校的人力因為原本是有一定的班數要設我有問一下原因你們是說這樣會有一個\n議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬\n就是你們的增訂版是1比4500到1比5000就變得不進反退新法如果是以112年報院版的話只有保下限欸所以部長不知道這個部分就是如果只有保下限的話那不是就不升反減嗎沒有規劃提升那部長對於這個部分的回應是什麼因為這個是您還沒來當部長的時候我們看的是上一次的那個送院版\n您當部長之後是不是您也是心理方面的大家的期待更高部長是不是可以改善一下我想這個我們來努力努力好不好就要聽您的努力因為我們對您期待很高就是不一定要跟上一屆一樣那另外就是我的版本是這樣你們請參考\n最後一個,專府人員的待遇\n兩、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬\n是不是應該透過職務加解的方式支持接任主任督導之專輔人員啊就是說沒有這種當督導然後年資不被採集回去之後還停在就是第三年他其實已經去當別的了\n部長可以了解一下嗎?是。這個部分應該不是在法條中,但是你們會有相關的辦法,好不好?也去了解一下,我們一起反映。最後一個就是也跟Joy部溝通過,就是自我傷害要納主動輔導,不要放在本其他事項當中啦,因為這個事情大家都關心,這個自殺自傷的問題,那是不是就應該明確保障,讓他能夠優先被面對、被照顧,好不好?\n謝謝委員我想有很多的委員跟委員的看法是一致的那麼怎麼樣把這個自我傷害能夠納入到這一個法條裡邊我想我們也會認真來考量謝謝部長的肯定喔那因為我還沒看到你們通過的願板喔\n等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:03.575 --> 00:04.202\n一人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具\n\n00:10.732 --> 00:33.206\n部長早安,這邊是要給部長看一下這個照片就是我剛剛講2020年我跟賴平委員我們率先共同召開這個公聽會然後啟動學服法修法那當時這個PO文都已經現在看起來都是已經差不多已經三、四年前的事情了那所以呢教育部的動作那真的可以更快一點\n\n00:33.766 --> 01:01.281\n那我們就直接回來對話這一次的那個DRIVE的版本跟院版那跟大家的期待那想請問部長因為我們第一個訴求剛有講到就是覺得應該要優先任用輔導的專業主管那這邊是社工師群聯會的建議版本我想問部長目前輔資中心他的主管是專輔人員的比例部長知不知道比例是多少\n\n01:02.842 --> 01:16.477\n目前有9個縣市,全國有22個縣市裡面有9個縣市是這一個由專輔人員來擔任這一個輔資中心的一個所以這樣算起來比例是多少?\n\n01:18.066 --> 01:19.347\n二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬\n\n01:48.424 --> 02:07.021\n應該還是因為他畢竟是要統籌這麼重要的單位還是應該要由專業人力擔任主管那不知道部長覺得這是不是我們這一次就可以達到這件事我想非常謝謝委員的關心確實我們這一次的一個修法也是朝著這個方向在努力\n\n02:07.481 --> 02:09.563\n二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具«學生輔導法部分條文修正草案案案案》案。\n\n02:30.378 --> 02:56.147\n議由跟應由已經不大一樣了表示他們知道有時候無法但是原則上優先由專業人員任用而且是不是能夠有配套他如果來做主任的話那其實就應該要補足員工因為他事實上能夠做的輔導工作就會降低了嘛那部長對這一條呢那這一條之前沒有跟你們溝通過那您覺得這一條是不是有可能也往這個方向來邁進\n\n02:58.007 --> 03:18.334\n是的,我想輔導是主任由這個專業人員來擔任,專業的這個老師來擔任,我想那是我們都是朝那個方向努力。但是確實小學有一些規模比較小,它的主任的一個後用不一定有這個專業,但是那個目標是我們努力的。\n\n03:18.914 --> 03:47.363\n那關於行政職他如果擔任的話行政職由專業人擔任的話能不能夠補足援額這個部分呢要不然他就變得工作量更大了因為本來是他有他原本的工作我想這一個裡面他是分離的啦分離的那教育部可不可以去考慮一下能不能夠補足援額呢那輔導老師是屬於輔導老師這裡邊應該是不衝突的那這部分你們去了解一下好不好因為這部分我們理論上應該要補足啦\n\n03:47.683 --> 03:48.323\n李柏毅等19人擬李柏毅等19人擬\n\n04:10.673 --> 04:31.080\n現行條文及教育部1、1、2年抱怨版的條文有幾個部分大家還是有不同的意見第一個你們原來1、2年抱怨版本刪除了大校助校的人力因為原本是有一定的班數要設我有問一下原因你們是說這樣會有一個\n\n04:32.921 --> 04:36.685\n議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬\n\n04:56.502 --> 05:25.203\n就是你們的增訂版是1比4500到1比5000就變得不進反退新法如果是以112年報院版的話只有保下限欸所以部長不知道這個部分就是如果只有保下限的話那不是就不升反減嗎沒有規劃提升那部長對於這個部分的回應是什麼因為這個是您還沒來當部長的時候我們看的是上一次的那個送院版\n\n05:26.463 --> 05:45.830\n您當部長之後是不是您也是心理方面的大家的期待更高部長是不是可以改善一下我想這個我們來努力努力好不好就要聽您的努力因為我們對您期待很高就是不一定要跟上一屆一樣那另外就是我的版本是這樣你們請參考\n\n05:47.150 --> 05:47.611\n最後一個,專府人員的待遇\n\n06:04.730 --> 06:05.391\n兩、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬\n\n06:28.334 --> 06:43.177\n是不是應該透過職務加解的方式支持接任主任督導之專輔人員啊就是說沒有這種當督導然後年資不被採集回去之後還停在就是第三年他其實已經去當別的了\n\n06:44.492 --> 07:06.458\n部長可以了解一下嗎?是。這個部分應該不是在法條中,但是你們會有相關的辦法,好不好?也去了解一下,我們一起反映。最後一個就是也跟Joy部溝通過,就是自我傷害要納主動輔導,不要放在本其他事項當中啦,因為這個事情大家都關心,這個自殺自傷的問題,那是不是就應該明確保障,讓他能夠優先被面對、被照顧,好不好?\n\n07:14.020 --> 07:21.043\n謝謝委員我想有很多的委員跟委員的看法是一致的那麼怎麼樣把這個自我傷害能夠納入到這一個法條裡邊我想我們也會認真來考量謝謝部長的肯定喔那因為我還沒看到你們通過的願板喔\n\n07:30.026 --> 07:30.606\n等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬\n\n","segments":[{"start":3.575,"end":4.202,"text":"一人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具"},{"start":10.732,"end":33.206,"text":"部長早安,這邊是要給部長看一下這個照片就是我剛剛講2020年我跟賴平委員我們率先共同召開這個公聽會然後啟動學服法修法那當時這個PO文都已經現在看起來都是已經差不多已經三、四年前的事情了那所以呢教育部的動作那真的可以更快一點"},{"start":33.766,"end":61.281,"text":"那我們就直接回來對話這一次的那個DRIVE的版本跟院版那跟大家的期待那想請問部長因為我們第一個訴求剛有講到就是覺得應該要優先任用輔導的專業主管那這邊是社工師群聯會的建議版本我想問部長目前輔資中心他的主管是專輔人員的比例部長知不知道比例是多少"},{"start":62.842,"end":76.477,"text":"目前有9個縣市,全國有22個縣市裡面有9個縣市是這一個由專輔人員來擔任這一個輔資中心的一個所以這樣算起來比例是多少?"},{"start":78.066,"end":79.347,"text":"二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬"},{"start":108.424,"end":127.021,"text":"應該還是因為他畢竟是要統籌這麼重要的單位還是應該要由專業人力擔任主管那不知道部長覺得這是不是我們這一次就可以達到這件事我想非常謝謝委員的關心確實我們這一次的一個修法也是朝著這個方向在努力"},{"start":127.481,"end":129.563,"text":"二、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬具 «學生輔導法部分條文修正草案案案案》案。"},{"start":150.378,"end":176.147,"text":"議由跟應由已經不大一樣了表示他們知道有時候無法但是原則上優先由專業人員任用而且是不是能夠有配套他如果來做主任的話那其實就應該要補足員工因為他事實上能夠做的輔導工作就會降低了嘛那部長對這一條呢那這一條之前沒有跟你們溝通過那您覺得這一條是不是有可能也往這個方向來邁進"},{"start":178.007,"end":198.334,"text":"是的,我想輔導是主任由這個專業人員來擔任,專業的這個老師來擔任,我想那是我們都是朝那個方向努力。但是確實小學有一些規模比較小,它的主任的一個後用不一定有這個專業,但是那個目標是我們努力的。"},{"start":198.914,"end":227.363,"text":"那關於行政職他如果擔任的話行政職由專業人擔任的話能不能夠補足援額這個部分呢要不然他就變得工作量更大了因為本來是他有他原本的工作我想這一個裡面他是分離的啦分離的那教育部可不可以去考慮一下能不能夠補足援額呢那輔導老師是屬於輔導老師這裡邊應該是不衝突的那這部分你們去了解一下好不好因為這部分我們理論上應該要補足啦"},{"start":227.683,"end":228.323,"text":"李柏毅等19人擬李柏毅等19人擬"},{"start":250.673,"end":271.08,"text":"現行條文及教育部1、1、2年抱怨版的條文有幾個部分大家還是有不同的意見第一個你們原來1、2年抱怨版本刪除了大校助校的人力因為原本是有一定的班數要設我有問一下原因你們是說這樣會有一個"},{"start":272.921,"end":276.685,"text":"議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬議員林宜瑾等19人擬"},{"start":296.502,"end":325.203,"text":"就是你們的增訂版是1比4500到1比5000就變得不進反退新法如果是以112年報院版的話只有保下限欸所以部長不知道這個部分就是如果只有保下限的話那不是就不升反減嗎沒有規劃提升那部長對於這個部分的回應是什麼因為這個是您還沒來當部長的時候我們看的是上一次的那個送院版"},{"start":326.463,"end":345.83,"text":"您當部長之後是不是您也是心理方面的大家的期待更高部長是不是可以改善一下我想這個我們來努力努力好不好就要聽您的努力因為我們對您期待很高就是不一定要跟上一屆一樣那另外就是我的版本是這樣你們請參考"},{"start":347.15,"end":347.611,"text":"最後一個,專府人員的待遇"},{"start":364.73,"end":365.391,"text":"兩、審查委員林宜瑾等19人擬"},{"start":388.334,"end":403.177,"text":"是不是應該透過職務加解的方式支持接任主任督導之專輔人員啊就是說沒有這種當督導然後年資不被採集回去之後還停在就是第三年他其實已經去當別的了"},{"start":404.492,"end":426.458,"text":"部長可以了解一下嗎?是。這個部分應該不是在法條中,但是你們會有相關的辦法,好不好?也去了解一下,我們一起反映。最後一個就是也跟Joy部溝通過,就是自我傷害要納主動輔導,不要放在本其他事項當中啦,因為這個事情大家都關心,這個自殺自傷的問題,那是不是就應該明確保障,讓他能夠優先被面對、被照顧,好不好?"},{"start":434.02,"end":441.043,"text":"謝謝委員我想有很多的委員跟委員的看法是一致的那麼怎麼樣把這個自我傷害能夠納入到這一個法條裡邊我想我們也會認真來考量謝謝部長的肯定喔那因為我還沒看到你們通過的願板喔"},{"start":450.026,"end":450.606,"text":"等19人擬具李柏毅等19人擬"}]}}}}