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10:05:46","影片長度":"00:07:24","會議時間":"2024-06-26T09:10:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境、外交及國防委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：審查勞動部函送「駐印度台北經濟文化中心與印度台北協會促進僱用印度勞工瞭解備忘錄」之中、英及印地文文本影本案。\n【6月26日及27日二天一次會】）","type":"Clip","date":"2024-06-26","start_time":"2024-06-26T09:58:22+08:00","end_time":"2024-06-26T10:05:46+08:00","duration":444,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境、外交及國防委員會第1次聯席會議","type":"聯席會議","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":1,"committees":[26,35],"id":"聯席會議-11-1-26,35-1"},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"gazette":{"lineno":301,"blocks":[["邱委員鎮軍：（9時58分）主席好，我們請部長。"],["主席：好，請何部長。"],["邱委員鎮軍：部長好。一樣是印度移工的問題。"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["邱委員鎮軍：勞動部113年人力需求調查結果，概括說，我們預估4月底比1月的人力需求增加5.3萬人，7月又比4月增加了6萬人，所以目前我們臺灣缺工人數是多少？"],["何部長佩珊：有分行業嗎？還是整體缺工？"],["邱委員鎮軍：沒有，就是整體。"],["何部長佩珊：整體缺工是24萬左右，如果主計總處的估計是這樣的，我們是按主計總處的估計來看。"],["邱委員鎮軍：我覺得那個數字好像不對啦！待會我們回去再查。"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["邱委員鎮軍：因為我剛剛看到是一百多萬。"],["何部長佩珊：應該沒有到這樣喔……"],["邱委員鎮軍：缺工人數當中可以用移工聘用來補的這個部分有多少？"],["何部長佩珊：您說以移工來補嗎？"],["邱委員鎮軍：對。"],["何部長佩珊：我們現在移工已經有76萬人，您是指未來在缺工裡面有多少要用移工來補是嗎？"],["邱委員鎮軍：對。"],["何部長佩珊：當然我們現在是儘量看產業的需求，還有包括家庭看護這邊的需求，儘量來滿足啦！"],["邱委員鎮軍：那有多少是要用印度移工來補？"],["何部長佩珊：委員，其實印度移工還不在我們補足所謂缺工這樣的討論，因為印度移工是剛開始而已，它只是增加一個來源。"],["邱委員鎮軍：現在是這樣，因為我們缺工的問題實在是非常嚴重。"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["邱委員鎮軍：剛剛我也聽到部長在其他委員質詢的時候有提到，就是我們第一步從1,000人開始，我們也希望這個部分能夠儘快，來彌補我們國內人工不足的部分。"],["何部長佩珊：是，謝謝委員。"],["邱委員鎮軍：我剛剛也聽到部長講了很多問題，也有可能是印度勞工適應的問題等等，當然這些都是考慮的因素。"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["邱委員鎮軍：我們也是要求，剛剛有提到臺灣自己本地的勞工，看看有沒有什麼可以轉職來補足這個部分？"],["何部長佩珊：當然，委員，我上任以後很重要的一個工作就是推動婦女跟中高齡就業，這個部分我們預估有56萬的勞動力可以開發出來，所以我們一定是優先處理這邊，移工還是一個補充。"],["邱委員鎮軍：有關我們臺灣勞工，其實也有很多家庭是需要工作，好讓他們維持生計。"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["邱委員鎮軍：剛剛我聽到你們當初突襲式的簽約，我稱之為突襲式，你說這個叫善意的謊言……"],["何部長佩珊：不是謊言啦！不是謊言……"],["邱委員鎮軍：我想這是出自什麼樣的善意？"],["何部長佩珊：委員，我要更正喔，我不是說謊言。"],["邱委員鎮軍：那是善意的欺騙？"],["何部長佩珊：善意的隱瞞。因為外交工作真的很難，許部長當時很辛苦。"],["邱委員鎮軍：我比較不懂，其實這個問題並不在我今天要問的問題裡面，我是剛剛在臺下聽到的，這個為什麼要有善意的……"],["何部長佩珊：隱瞞。"],["邱委員鎮軍：就講善意的隱瞞好了，為什麼要隱瞞呢？"],["何部長佩珊：我就說，因為外交工作真的很辛苦。"],["邱委員鎮軍：外交跟移工好像沒有很大的影響。"],["何部長佩珊：會喔！會喔！委員，我要跟您報告……"],["邱委員鎮軍：有誰會阻擋嗎？難道又是共產黨搞的？"],["何部長佩珊：有地緣政治的因素啊！"],["邱委員鎮軍：他會管到我們移工嗎？又是習近平的問題？"],["何部長佩珊：因為很多來源國他們會考慮中國的態度，會喔！"],["邱委員鎮軍：我覺得應該是想太多，其實只要不牽扯政治，我想這個部分應該不會像你們想的有這麼多考量的因素。"],["何部長佩珊：委員，跟您報告，主要這都是政府對政府的談判，MOU是政府對政府。"],["邱委員鎮軍：我再請問你，當時我們有聽你們說到跟社會的對話，就是3月1號跟5月2號兩次，看起來都是跟我們的協會、公會在討論。"],["何部長佩珊：對。"],["邱委員鎮軍：在諮詢專家意見的時候，我們跟社會的溝通是什麼？"],["何部長佩珊：這就是我們跟社會溝通的平臺，經過這個溝通其實也很有效地瞭解到社會的需求，跟委員報告，其實所有雇主團體或者是公協會，或者是產業界等等各方面，他們都認為一定要雙軌。"],["邱委員鎮軍：好，現在移工是預計要採直聘跟仲介嘛！在直聘的部分我看到有很大的問題，因為申請的流程非常繁瑣，我看到我們要建置直聘印度勞工的資訊系統，這是要另外開發一個系統，還是在原來的直聘系統、直聘網頁裡面？"],["何部長佩珊：跟委員報告，所謂台印MOU裡面的直聘，它是一個新的制度。"],["邱委員鎮軍：所以要重新開發嘛，對不對？"],["何部長佩珊：對。"],["邱委員鎮軍：那要花多少錢？"],["何部長佩珊：這個恐怕都還要再估算，因為也得等MOU通過以後，我們再來嘗試。"],["邱委員鎮軍：所以你們現在就是只有想法，目前只是想到這樣，還沒有開始準備實施就對了？"],["何部長佩珊：對，因為這個必須要往下走的時候，跟印度有工作層級會議的時候，我們還要考慮印方的配合度，印方其實對這個MOU非常的支持，而且非常積極，可是……"],["邱委員鎮軍：我知道你們很積極，但我現在是擔心直聘的流程非常繁瑣。"],["何部長佩珊：沒錯。"],["邱委員鎮軍：我有看到你們在年底之前要辦三場，6月29日的高雄、7月13日的臺北和7月27日的苗栗。"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["邱委員鎮軍：我看到你們的網頁點閱次數非常少，到昨天為止，高雄場是634，臺北場是844，苗栗比較熱鬧一點，苗栗是1,313，我的意思是說現在……"],["何部長佩珊：委員的選區比較關心這件事情。"],["邱委員鎮軍：對，很多人還不曉得啦！我希望這部分部裡面能夠對外再擴大宣傳，讓大家能多瞭解一下。"],["何部長佩珊：好，沒問題。"],["邱委員鎮軍：直聘是很好的，讓大家不要被仲介另外剝削掉了。"],["何部長佩珊：委員，我們也會挑選優質的仲介來做評選。"],["邱委員鎮軍：你現在講到優質仲介，你的客觀條件是什麼？所謂的優質仲介條件是什麼？"],["何部長佩珊：這個一定是我們A級評鑑單位。"],["邱委員鎮軍：你的標準是什麼？"],["何部長佩珊：我們本來就有對仲介評鑑的既定標準，委員，我會後給你提供資料好嗎？"],["邱委員鎮軍：好，時間到了，我本來還有很多問題，但今天質詢的委員非常多，謝謝。"],["何部長佩珊：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝邱鎮軍委員。","待黃秀芳委員質詢結束後，休息5分鐘。","接下來請蘇清泉委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":114,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-1-26,35-1","speakers":["王育敏","林月琴","蘇清泉","陳昭姿","陳菁徽","廖偉翔","王正旭","邱鎮軍","羅美玲","洪申翰","黃秀芳","林楚茵","王定宇","陳冠廷","羅廷瑋","涂權吉","沈伯洋","陳培瑜","黃珊珊","林淑芬","陳瑩","劉建國","林憶君","楊曜","盧縣一","楊瓊瓔"],"page_start":49,"meetingDate":["2024-06-26"],"gazette_id":"1136701","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1136701_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境、外交及國防委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄","content":"審查勞動部函送「駐印度台北經濟文化中心與印度台北協會促進僱用印度勞工瞭解備忘錄」之\n中、英及印地文文本影本案","agenda_id":"1136701_00002"}},"transcript":{"id":"154227","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/154227","tool":"pyannote","id":"154227-pyannote"},"job_id":"BUhmduKUws5mNvHa","queued_at":"2024-06-26 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00:00:32,632\n主席好我們請部長好請何部長好部長好我們一樣是印度移工的問題是那我想勞動部113年人力需求調查的結果概括說我們預估4月底比1月的人力需求增加5.3萬人那7月又比4月增加了6萬人所以目前呢我們臺灣的缺工人數是多少\n\n2\n00:00:34,501 --> 00:00:36,245\n您是指哪個?\n\n3\n00:00:36,245 --> 00:00:37,747\n有分行業嗎?還是總體缺工?這個總體缺工喔委員這個因為\n\n4\n00:00:46,840 --> 00:01:08,450\n二十四萬左右啦。如果主計總署的估計是這樣的。我們是按主計總署這樣來看。我覺得那個數字好像不對啦。待會我們回去再查。因為我剛剛看到是一百多萬。應該沒有到這樣喔。缺工人數當中有多少可以用移工聘用的來補的?這個部分有多少?您說以移工來補嗎?\n\n5\n00:01:10,834 --> 00:01:31,080\n我們現在移工已經有76萬人那您是指未來在缺工裡面有多少要用移工來補?那當然我們現在是盡量看產業的需求還有包括我們家庭看護這邊的需求盡量來滿足那有多少是要用印度移工來補?\n\n6\n00:01:32,630 --> 00:01:54,426\n委員其實印度移工還不在我們補足這個所謂缺工的這樣的因為印度移工這個是剛開始而已它只是增加一個來源因為我們現在是這樣就是說我們的這個缺工的問題實在是非常嚴重剛剛我也聽到部長在其他委員諮詢的時候有提到就是說我們第一步是從一千人開始\n\n7\n00:01:55,767 --> 00:02:16,824\n我們也希望這個部分能夠盡快來彌補我們國內人工不足的部分我剛剛也聽到部長講了很多的問題也有可能說印度勞工適應的問題等等當然這些都是考慮的因素我們也是要求就是說也希望說我們剛剛也提到我們臺灣本地的我們自己臺灣的勞工看看有沒有什麼可以轉職來補足這個部分\n\n8\n00:02:25,910 --> 00:02:51,705\n當然我很重要的上完以後最重要的一個就是推動婦女跟中高齡的就業啦那麼這個部分我們預估有56萬的勞動力可以開發出來所以其實如果我們一定是優先處理這邊的那麼移工還是一個補充對因為我們本其實我們臺灣的勞工也其實有很多很多家庭啦是需要工作讓他們來維持生計是是是那剛剛\n\n9\n00:02:52,665 --> 00:03:01,684\n我聽到就是說你們當初突襲式的簽約我稱為突襲式那您說是有這個叫善意的謊言\n\n10\n00:03:02,574 --> 00:03:28,686\n不是謊言啦不是謊言我要更正喔我不是說謊言那是善意的欺騙善意的隱瞞因為外交工作真的很難許部長當時很辛苦我比較不懂因為剛剛這個問題是不在我今天的問題裡面我是剛剛在台下聽到的就是說這個為什麼要有善意的欺騙不要講了善意的隱瞞好了善意的隱瞞好了那為什麼要隱瞞\n\n11\n00:03:33,278 --> 00:03:50,594\n因為外交工作真的很辛苦我覺得外交跟移工好像沒有很大的影響會喔會喔委員其實我要跟您報告難道又是共產黨搞的有地緣政治的因素啊他會管到我們移工嗎因為\n\n12\n00:03:54,707 --> 00:03:56,348\n主要委員跟您報告主要這都是政府對政府的談判\n\n13\n00:04:21,499 --> 00:04:28,223\n我再請問您就是說我們現在就是說我們當時我們有聽你們講說跟社會的對話就是3月1號跟5月2號兩次嘛看起來都是跟我們的協會、工會在討論那我們在諮詢專家意見的時候我們跟社會的溝通是什麼?\n\n14\n00:04:45,373 --> 00:05:02,634\n這就是我們跟社會溝通的平台。那麼經過這個溝通其實也很有效的瞭解說社會的需求啦那跟委員報告其實所有的僱主團體或者是工協會或者是產業界各方面他們都認為一定要雙軌啦\n\n15\n00:05:05,816 --> 00:05:26,046\n我們現在移工的這個是預計要職聘跟仲介嘛那職聘的部分我看到有很大的問題因為這個申請的流程非常繁瑣我看到我們說要建置職聘印度勞工的資訊的系統那這是要另外開發一個系統還是在原來的職聘系統裡面職聘的網頁裡面\n\n16\n00:05:28,052 --> 00:05:50,063\n就跟委員報告,這個所謂我們台藝MOU裡面這一個職聘喔,它是一個新的啦,它是一個新的制度。所以說要普及開發嘛對不對?對,那是從,那都,這個恐怕都還要再估算,因為也得等這個MOU通過以後我們再來嘗試。所以你們現在就是只有想法,目前只是想到這樣還沒有開始要準備實施就對了?沒有。\n\n17\n00:05:51,412 --> 00:06:19,202\n對,因為我們這個必須要往下走的時候跟印度有工作層級會議的時候我們還要考慮印方的配合度印方其實對這個MOU非常的支持而且非常積極我知道你們很積極就是我們看到我現在是擔心執聘的這個流程非常繁瑣沒錯我們也看到您在年底之前要辦三場6月29的高雄7月13的台北7月27的苗栗\n\n18\n00:06:20,343 --> 00:06:36,178\n我看到你們的網頁點閱次數非常的少到昨天為止到臺北高雄場的是634臺北場的是844那苗栗的比較熱鬧一點因為苗栗1313就是我的意思是說現在很多人還不曉得我希望說這部分我們部裡面能夠\n\n19\n00:06:44,145 --> 00:07:00,532\n對外再擴大宣傳可以嗎?讓大家能多瞭解一下,因為職品是很好,又讓大家不要被仲介都另外的剝削掉了委員我們也會挑選優質的仲介來做評選你的客觀條件是什麼?\n\n20\n00:07:03,725 --> 00:07:03,746\n謝謝委員謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n3840\t32632\t主席好我們請部長好請何部長好部長好我們一樣是印度移工的問題是那我想勞動部113年人力需求調查的結果概括說我們預估4月底比1月的人力需求增加5.3萬人那7月又比4月增加了6萬人所以目前呢我們臺灣的缺工人數是多少\n34501\t36245\t您是指哪個?\n36245\t37747\t有分行業嗎?還是總體缺工?這個總體缺工喔委員 這個因為\n46840\t68450\t二十四萬左右啦。如果主計總署的估計是這樣的。我們是按主計總署這樣來看。我覺得那個數字好像不對啦。待會我們回去再查。因為我剛剛看到是一百多萬。應該沒有到這樣喔。缺工人數當中有多少可以用移工聘用的來補的?這個部分有多少?您說以移工來補嗎?\n70834\t91080\t我們現在移工已經有76萬人那您是指未來在缺工裡面有多少要用移工來補?那當然我們現在是盡量看產業的需求還有包括我們家庭看護這邊的需求盡量來滿足那有多少是要用印度移工來補?\n92630\t114426\t委員其實印度移工還不在我們補足這個所謂缺工的這樣的因為印度移工這個是剛開始而已它只是增加一個來源因為我們現在是這樣就是說我們的這個缺工的問題實在是非常嚴重剛剛我也聽到部長在其他委員諮詢的時候有提到就是說我們第一步是從一千人開始\n115767\t136824\t我們也希望這個部分能夠盡快來彌補我們國內人工不足的部分我剛剛也聽到部長講了很多的問題也有可能說印度勞工適應的問題等等當然這些都是考慮的因素我們也是要求就是說也希望說我們剛剛也提到我們臺灣本地的我們自己臺灣的勞工看看有沒有什麼可以轉職來補足這個部分\n145910\t171705\t當然 我很重要的 上完以後最重要的一個就是推動婦女跟中高齡的就業啦 那麼 這個部分我們預估有56萬的勞動力可以開發出來 所以其實如果 我們一定是優先處理這邊的 那麼移工還是一個補充對 因為我們本 其實我們臺灣的勞工也其實有很多 很多家庭啦 是需要工作讓他們來維持生計 是是是 那剛剛\n172665\t181684\t我聽到就是說你們當初突襲式的簽約我稱為突襲式那您說是有這個叫善意的謊言\n182574\t208686\t不是謊言啦不是謊言我要更正喔我不是說謊言那是善意的欺騙善意的隱瞞因為外交工作真的很難許部長當時很辛苦我比較不懂因為剛剛這個問題是不在我今天的問題裡面我是剛剛在台下聽到的就是說這個為什麼要有善意的欺騙不要講了善意的隱瞞好了善意的隱瞞好了那為什麼要隱瞞\n213278\t230594\t因為外交工作真的很辛苦我覺得外交跟移工好像沒有很大的影響會喔會喔委員其實我要跟您報告難道又是共產黨搞的有地緣政治的因素啊他會管到我們移工嗎因為\n234707\t236348\t主要委員跟您報告主要這都是政府對政府的談判\n261499\t268223\t我再請問您就是說我們現在就是說我們當時我們有聽你們講說跟社會的對話就是3月1號跟5月2號兩次嘛看起來都是跟我們的協會、工會在討論那我們在諮詢專家意見的時候我們跟社會的溝通是什麼?\n285373\t302634\t這就是我們跟社會溝通的平台。那麼經過這個溝通其實也很有效的瞭解說社會的需求啦那跟委員報告其實所有的僱主團體或者是工協會或者是產業界各方面他們都認為一定要雙軌啦\n305816\t326046\t我們現在移工的這個是預計要職聘跟仲介嘛那職聘的部分我看到有很大的問題因為這個申請的流程非常繁瑣我看到我們說要建置職聘印度勞工的資訊的系統那這是要另外開發一個系統還是在原來的職聘系統裡面職聘的網頁裡面\n328052\t350063\t就跟委員報告,這個所謂我們台藝MOU裡面這一個職聘喔,它是一個新的啦,它是一個新的制度。所以說要普及開發嘛對不對?對,那是從,那都,這個恐怕都還要再估算,因為也得等這個MOU通過以後我們再來嘗試。所以你們現在就是只有想法,目前只是想到這樣還沒有開始要準備實施就對了?沒有。\n351412\t379202\t對,因為我們這個必須要往下走的時候跟印度有工作層級會議的時候我們還要考慮印方的配合度印方其實對這個MOU非常的支持而且非常積極我知道你們很積極就是我們看到我現在是擔心執聘的這個流程非常繁瑣沒錯我們也看到您在年底之前要辦三場6月29的高雄7月13的台北7月27的苗栗\n380343\t396178\t我看到你們的網頁點閱次數非常的少到昨天為止到臺北高雄場的是634臺北場的是844那苗栗的比較熱鬧一點因為苗栗1313就是我的意思是說現在很多人還不曉得我希望說這部分我們部裡面能夠\n404145\t420532\t對外再擴大宣傳可以嗎?讓大家能多瞭解一下,因為職品是很好,又讓大家不要被仲介都另外的剝削掉了委員我們也會挑選優質的仲介來做評選你的客觀條件是什麼?\n423725\t423746\t謝謝委員 謝謝\n","txt":"主席好我們請部長好請何部長好部長好我們一樣是印度移工的問題是那我想勞動部113年人力需求調查的結果概括說我們預估4月底比1月的人力需求增加5.3萬人那7月又比4月增加了6萬人所以目前呢我們臺灣的缺工人數是多少\n您是指哪個?\n有分行業嗎?還是總體缺工?這個總體缺工喔委員 這個因為\n二十四萬左右啦。如果主計總署的估計是這樣的。我們是按主計總署這樣來看。我覺得那個數字好像不對啦。待會我們回去再查。因為我剛剛看到是一百多萬。應該沒有到這樣喔。缺工人數當中有多少可以用移工聘用的來補的?這個部分有多少?您說以移工來補嗎?\n我們現在移工已經有76萬人那您是指未來在缺工裡面有多少要用移工來補?那當然我們現在是盡量看產業的需求還有包括我們家庭看護這邊的需求盡量來滿足那有多少是要用印度移工來補?\n委員其實印度移工還不在我們補足這個所謂缺工的這樣的因為印度移工這個是剛開始而已它只是增加一個來源因為我們現在是這樣就是說我們的這個缺工的問題實在是非常嚴重剛剛我也聽到部長在其他委員諮詢的時候有提到就是說我們第一步是從一千人開始\n我們也希望這個部分能夠盡快來彌補我們國內人工不足的部分我剛剛也聽到部長講了很多的問題也有可能說印度勞工適應的問題等等當然這些都是考慮的因素我們也是要求就是說也希望說我們剛剛也提到我們臺灣本地的我們自己臺灣的勞工看看有沒有什麼可以轉職來補足這個部分\n當然 我很重要的 上完以後最重要的一個就是推動婦女跟中高齡的就業啦 那麼 這個部分我們預估有56萬的勞動力可以開發出來 所以其實如果 我們一定是優先處理這邊的 那麼移工還是一個補充對 因為我們本 其實我們臺灣的勞工也其實有很多 很多家庭啦 是需要工作讓他們來維持生計 是是是 那剛剛\n我聽到就是說你們當初突襲式的簽約我稱為突襲式那您說是有這個叫善意的謊言\n不是謊言啦不是謊言我要更正喔我不是說謊言那是善意的欺騙善意的隱瞞因為外交工作真的很難許部長當時很辛苦我比較不懂因為剛剛這個問題是不在我今天的問題裡面我是剛剛在台下聽到的就是說這個為什麼要有善意的欺騙不要講了善意的隱瞞好了善意的隱瞞好了那為什麼要隱瞞\n因為外交工作真的很辛苦我覺得外交跟移工好像沒有很大的影響會喔會喔委員其實我要跟您報告難道又是共產黨搞的有地緣政治的因素啊他會管到我們移工嗎因為\n主要委員跟您報告主要這都是政府對政府的談判\n我再請問您就是說我們現在就是說我們當時我們有聽你們講說跟社會的對話就是3月1號跟5月2號兩次嘛看起來都是跟我們的協會、工會在討論那我們在諮詢專家意見的時候我們跟社會的溝通是什麼?\n這就是我們跟社會溝通的平台。那麼經過這個溝通其實也很有效的瞭解說社會的需求啦那跟委員報告其實所有的僱主團體或者是工協會或者是產業界各方面他們都認為一定要雙軌啦\n我們現在移工的這個是預計要職聘跟仲介嘛那職聘的部分我看到有很大的問題因為這個申請的流程非常繁瑣我看到我們說要建置職聘印度勞工的資訊的系統那這是要另外開發一個系統還是在原來的職聘系統裡面職聘的網頁裡面\n就跟委員報告,這個所謂我們台藝MOU裡面這一個職聘喔,它是一個新的啦,它是一個新的制度。所以說要普及開發嘛對不對?對,那是從,那都,這個恐怕都還要再估算,因為也得等這個MOU通過以後我們再來嘗試。所以你們現在就是只有想法,目前只是想到這樣還沒有開始要準備實施就對了?沒有。\n對,因為我們這個必須要往下走的時候跟印度有工作層級會議的時候我們還要考慮印方的配合度印方其實對這個MOU非常的支持而且非常積極我知道你們很積極就是我們看到我現在是擔心執聘的這個流程非常繁瑣沒錯我們也看到您在年底之前要辦三場6月29的高雄7月13的台北7月27的苗栗\n我看到你們的網頁點閱次數非常的少到昨天為止到臺北高雄場的是634臺北場的是844那苗栗的比較熱鬧一點因為苗栗1313就是我的意思是說現在很多人還不曉得我希望說這部分我們部裡面能夠\n對外再擴大宣傳可以嗎?讓大家能多瞭解一下,因為職品是很好,又讓大家不要被仲介都另外的剝削掉了委員我們也會挑選優質的仲介來做評選你的客觀條件是什麼?\n謝謝委員 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:03.840 --> 00:32.632\n主席好我們請部長好請何部長好部長好我們一樣是印度移工的問題是那我想勞動部113年人力需求調查的結果概括說我們預估4月底比1月的人力需求增加5.3萬人那7月又比4月增加了6萬人所以目前呢我們臺灣的缺工人數是多少\n\n00:34.501 --> 00:36.245\n您是指哪個?\n\n00:36.245 --> 00:37.747\n有分行業嗎?還是總體缺工?這個總體缺工喔委員這個因為\n\n00:46.840 --> 01:08.450\n二十四萬左右啦。如果主計總署的估計是這樣的。我們是按主計總署這樣來看。我覺得那個數字好像不對啦。待會我們回去再查。因為我剛剛看到是一百多萬。應該沒有到這樣喔。缺工人數當中有多少可以用移工聘用的來補的?這個部分有多少?您說以移工來補嗎?\n\n01:10.834 --> 01:31.080\n我們現在移工已經有76萬人那您是指未來在缺工裡面有多少要用移工來補?那當然我們現在是盡量看產業的需求還有包括我們家庭看護這邊的需求盡量來滿足那有多少是要用印度移工來補?\n\n01:32.630 --> 01:54.426\n委員其實印度移工還不在我們補足這個所謂缺工的這樣的因為印度移工這個是剛開始而已它只是增加一個來源因為我們現在是這樣就是說我們的這個缺工的問題實在是非常嚴重剛剛我也聽到部長在其他委員諮詢的時候有提到就是說我們第一步是從一千人開始\n\n01:55.767 --> 02:16.824\n我們也希望這個部分能夠盡快來彌補我們國內人工不足的部分我剛剛也聽到部長講了很多的問題也有可能說印度勞工適應的問題等等當然這些都是考慮的因素我們也是要求就是說也希望說我們剛剛也提到我們臺灣本地的我們自己臺灣的勞工看看有沒有什麼可以轉職來補足這個部分\n\n02:25.910 --> 02:51.705\n當然我很重要的上完以後最重要的一個就是推動婦女跟中高齡的就業啦那麼這個部分我們預估有56萬的勞動力可以開發出來所以其實如果我們一定是優先處理這邊的那麼移工還是一個補充對因為我們本其實我們臺灣的勞工也其實有很多很多家庭啦是需要工作讓他們來維持生計是是是那剛剛\n\n02:52.665 --> 03:01.684\n我聽到就是說你們當初突襲式的簽約我稱為突襲式那您說是有這個叫善意的謊言\n\n03:02.574 --> 03:28.686\n不是謊言啦不是謊言我要更正喔我不是說謊言那是善意的欺騙善意的隱瞞因為外交工作真的很難許部長當時很辛苦我比較不懂因為剛剛這個問題是不在我今天的問題裡面我是剛剛在台下聽到的就是說這個為什麼要有善意的欺騙不要講了善意的隱瞞好了善意的隱瞞好了那為什麼要隱瞞\n\n03:33.278 --> 03:50.594\n因為外交工作真的很辛苦我覺得外交跟移工好像沒有很大的影響會喔會喔委員其實我要跟您報告難道又是共產黨搞的有地緣政治的因素啊他會管到我們移工嗎因為\n\n03:54.707 --> 03:56.348\n主要委員跟您報告主要這都是政府對政府的談判\n\n04:21.499 --> 04:28.223\n我再請問您就是說我們現在就是說我們當時我們有聽你們講說跟社會的對話就是3月1號跟5月2號兩次嘛看起來都是跟我們的協會、工會在討論那我們在諮詢專家意見的時候我們跟社會的溝通是什麼?\n\n04:45.373 --> 05:02.634\n這就是我們跟社會溝通的平台。那麼經過這個溝通其實也很有效的瞭解說社會的需求啦那跟委員報告其實所有的僱主團體或者是工協會或者是產業界各方面他們都認為一定要雙軌啦\n\n05:05.816 --> 05:26.046\n我們現在移工的這個是預計要職聘跟仲介嘛那職聘的部分我看到有很大的問題因為這個申請的流程非常繁瑣我看到我們說要建置職聘印度勞工的資訊的系統那這是要另外開發一個系統還是在原來的職聘系統裡面職聘的網頁裡面\n\n05:28.052 --> 05:50.063\n就跟委員報告,這個所謂我們台藝MOU裡面這一個職聘喔,它是一個新的啦,它是一個新的制度。所以說要普及開發嘛對不對?對,那是從,那都,這個恐怕都還要再估算,因為也得等這個MOU通過以後我們再來嘗試。所以你們現在就是只有想法,目前只是想到這樣還沒有開始要準備實施就對了?沒有。\n\n05:51.412 --> 06:19.202\n對,因為我們這個必須要往下走的時候跟印度有工作層級會議的時候我們還要考慮印方的配合度印方其實對這個MOU非常的支持而且非常積極我知道你們很積極就是我們看到我現在是擔心執聘的這個流程非常繁瑣沒錯我們也看到您在年底之前要辦三場6月29的高雄7月13的台北7月27的苗栗\n\n06:20.343 --> 06:36.178\n我看到你們的網頁點閱次數非常的少到昨天為止到臺北高雄場的是634臺北場的是844那苗栗的比較熱鬧一點因為苗栗1313就是我的意思是說現在很多人還不曉得我希望說這部分我們部裡面能夠\n\n06:44.145 --> 07:00.532\n對外再擴大宣傳可以嗎?讓大家能多瞭解一下,因為職品是很好,又讓大家不要被仲介都另外的剝削掉了委員我們也會挑選優質的仲介來做評選你的客觀條件是什麼?\n\n07:03.725 --> 07:03.746\n謝謝委員謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":3.84,"end":32.632,"text":"主席好我們請部長好請何部長好部長好我們一樣是印度移工的問題是那我想勞動部113年人力需求調查的結果概括說我們預估4月底比1月的人力需求增加5.3萬人那7月又比4月增加了6萬人所以目前呢我們臺灣的缺工人數是多少"},{"start":34.501,"end":36.245,"text":"您是指哪個?"},{"start":36.245,"end":37.747,"text":"有分行業嗎?還是總體缺工?這個總體缺工喔委員 這個因為"},{"start":46.84,"end":68.45,"text":"二十四萬左右啦。如果主計總署的估計是這樣的。我們是按主計總署這樣來看。我覺得那個數字好像不對啦。待會我們回去再查。因為我剛剛看到是一百多萬。應該沒有到這樣喔。缺工人數當中有多少可以用移工聘用的來補的?這個部分有多少?您說以移工來補嗎?"},{"start":70.834,"end":91.08,"text":"我們現在移工已經有76萬人那您是指未來在缺工裡面有多少要用移工來補?那當然我們現在是盡量看產業的需求還有包括我們家庭看護這邊的需求盡量來滿足那有多少是要用印度移工來補?"},{"start":92.63,"end":114.426,"text":"委員其實印度移工還不在我們補足這個所謂缺工的這樣的因為印度移工這個是剛開始而已它只是增加一個來源因為我們現在是這樣就是說我們的這個缺工的問題實在是非常嚴重剛剛我也聽到部長在其他委員諮詢的時候有提到就是說我們第一步是從一千人開始"},{"start":115.767,"end":136.824,"text":"我們也希望這個部分能夠盡快來彌補我們國內人工不足的部分我剛剛也聽到部長講了很多的問題也有可能說印度勞工適應的問題等等當然這些都是考慮的因素我們也是要求就是說也希望說我們剛剛也提到我們臺灣本地的我們自己臺灣的勞工看看有沒有什麼可以轉職來補足這個部分"},{"start":145.91,"end":171.705,"text":"當然 我很重要的 上完以後最重要的一個就是推動婦女跟中高齡的就業啦 那麼 這個部分我們預估有56萬的勞動力可以開發出來 所以其實如果 我們一定是優先處理這邊的 那麼移工還是一個補充對 因為我們本 其實我們臺灣的勞工也其實有很多 很多家庭啦 是需要工作讓他們來維持生計 是是是 那剛剛"},{"start":172.665,"end":181.684,"text":"我聽到就是說你們當初突襲式的簽約我稱為突襲式那您說是有這個叫善意的謊言"},{"start":182.574,"end":208.686,"text":"不是謊言啦不是謊言我要更正喔我不是說謊言那是善意的欺騙善意的隱瞞因為外交工作真的很難許部長當時很辛苦我比較不懂因為剛剛這個問題是不在我今天的問題裡面我是剛剛在台下聽到的就是說這個為什麼要有善意的欺騙不要講了善意的隱瞞好了善意的隱瞞好了那為什麼要隱瞞"},{"start":213.278,"end":230.594,"text":"因為外交工作真的很辛苦我覺得外交跟移工好像沒有很大的影響會喔會喔委員其實我要跟您報告難道又是共產黨搞的有地緣政治的因素啊他會管到我們移工嗎因為"},{"start":234.707,"end":236.348,"text":"主要委員跟您報告主要這都是政府對政府的談判"},{"start":261.499,"end":268.223,"text":"我再請問您就是說我們現在就是說我們當時我們有聽你們講說跟社會的對話就是3月1號跟5月2號兩次嘛看起來都是跟我們的協會、工會在討論那我們在諮詢專家意見的時候我們跟社會的溝通是什麼?"},{"start":285.373,"end":302.634,"text":"這就是我們跟社會溝通的平台。那麼經過這個溝通其實也很有效的瞭解說社會的需求啦那跟委員報告其實所有的僱主團體或者是工協會或者是產業界各方面他們都認為一定要雙軌啦"},{"start":305.816,"end":326.046,"text":"我們現在移工的這個是預計要職聘跟仲介嘛那職聘的部分我看到有很大的問題因為這個申請的流程非常繁瑣我看到我們說要建置職聘印度勞工的資訊的系統那這是要另外開發一個系統還是在原來的職聘系統裡面職聘的網頁裡面"},{"start":328.052,"end":350.063,"text":"就跟委員報告,這個所謂我們台藝MOU裡面這一個職聘喔,它是一個新的啦,它是一個新的制度。所以說要普及開發嘛對不對?對,那是從,那都,這個恐怕都還要再估算,因為也得等這個MOU通過以後我們再來嘗試。所以你們現在就是只有想法,目前只是想到這樣還沒有開始要準備實施就對了?沒有。"},{"start":351.412,"end":379.202,"text":"對,因為我們這個必須要往下走的時候跟印度有工作層級會議的時候我們還要考慮印方的配合度印方其實對這個MOU非常的支持而且非常積極我知道你們很積極就是我們看到我現在是擔心執聘的這個流程非常繁瑣沒錯我們也看到您在年底之前要辦三場6月29的高雄7月13的台北7月27的苗栗"},{"start":380.343,"end":396.178,"text":"我看到你們的網頁點閱次數非常的少到昨天為止到臺北高雄場的是634臺北場的是844那苗栗的比較熱鬧一點因為苗栗1313就是我的意思是說現在很多人還不曉得我希望說這部分我們部裡面能夠"},{"start":404.145,"end":420.532,"text":"對外再擴大宣傳可以嗎?讓大家能多瞭解一下,因為職品是很好,又讓大家不要被仲介都另外的剝削掉了委員我們也會挑選優質的仲介來做評選你的客觀條件是什麼?"},{"start":423.725,"end":423.746,"text":"謝謝委員 謝謝"}]}}}}