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Tahovecahe委員：部長好。當我們在談居住正義的時候，往往都是很關注在房價、打房，但實際上我們來看一下，根據內政部不動產資訊平臺所提供的資料，估算全國的租屋戶大概是93萬戶，如果再去對比報稅的資料來粗估，一般來講，我們全臺有七分之一的租屋戶，這個比例其實是非常可觀的，所以我們在關注居住正義的時候，往往居住最不正義的應該是這一些租屋族，因為他們會面臨到租不到、租不起，還有租的品質不好的問題。我們看這些年的租金其實是一路成長，不太可能下降，特別是看到六都的部分，那六都的話，因為土地的關係，我們可以看到租金占他的整個所得大概可以到18%到35%，特別是在臺北市，幾乎他的所得都拿去負擔他的租金。","我們也曾經看到資料，就是問年輕人認為買房比租屋好的好處是什麼，我們可以看到排名第一的原因叫做長期居住，也就是說他不用怕被房東趕，那反過來說，我們這些租屋族其實心中最大的隱憂也就是不能夠久居。如果問到這些房客，就是租屋的時候，他最在乎的面向是什麼，那可以看到其實他最在意的面向是關於租金能不能負擔，至於住的品質好不好，那個都在其次。所以我們的召委郭國文委員，他曾經在3月份有請財政部研議「免追溯租金所得稅之租稅特赦可行性」，我們也看到財政部你們的回復，你們是特別提到說，現在已經有提供很多的租稅誘因，像是社宅、租金補貼免納綜所稅，又例如像包租代管免納綜所稅，或者是說關於誠實申報的房東，出租的時候可以降他的房屋稅率，又或者說這一些我們即將明年再上路的，就是由列舉扣除額改列到特別扣除額，讓這一些房客可以減他的所得稅又不影響房東，當然這個部分我們是希望說，因為明年要上路，希望財政部要加強宣導。另外一方面，你們也提到加強查緝這些囤房大戶，我看到資料提到2021年8月跟2022年1月起一整年，針對這一些10戶以上跟5戶以上的大戶，兩波共查獲到6,053件，合計補稅可以補到3.2億元。那先請教一下部長，關於所謂的持有10戶或5戶以上的這些，他們是有跨縣市嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：有，有跨縣市。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：所以有查緝他們是跨縣市？"],["莊部長翠雲：是。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：這個部分我是想要請教，因為立法院的預算中心曾經提過，你們所謂的加強查緝大戶，他就是不含法人，像很多的物業公司，它其實非不動產……他們其實才是真正的持有大戶，請教一下部長，就這方面你們的態度是怎麼樣？"],["莊部長翠雲：委員，實務執行我是不是可以請署長回答？"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：好，請署長。"],["宋署長秀玲：報告委員，當時我們對於租賃所得的查核專案，主要是針對個人間租，因為他沒有扣繳資料，也沒有開發票的資料，完全仰賴個人房東自己誠實申報，所以我們才會鎖定個人房東的部分，如果他是租給個人，因為都沒有相關的資料可以掌握，我們特別專案查核。至於預算中心研究裡面，他講不含法人中的非不動產及營建工程業者持有多戶，因為這些都叫營利事業，營利事業基本上出租是要開立發票的，然後因為它有資產負債表，如果它資產裡面有這麼多棟的房屋，基本上如果有所謂非不對稱的那種收入列報，也會變成我們的查核對象，所以它就沒有列在這個專案計畫裡面。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：我們很關心，因為我們認為我們一直在講打房或者是房價的抑制，這個部分其實他們往往才是根源，因為他們持有房屋，現在做這個行業的非常多，我想這個部分還是要請財政部要注意。另外就是有提到你們加強查緝囤房大戶，今年各地區國稅局強化個人，應該就是5戶以下，這個查核專案作業目前應該也推動半年了，想要知道一下成效怎麼樣？"],["宋署長秀玲：報告委員，因為我們這個計畫是按季回報的，所以目前我們還在……而且它不是年初就開始，它是在後面才開始，所以目前還沒有查核成效，但按季回報之後，一定會跟……委員如果有關心這個問題，我們再回報給您。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：好，謝謝。總之，你們的回復講了這麼多，就是棒子也有，蘿蔔也有，所以認為租稅特赦是違反租稅的公平，那我是要特別去提到說，當我們用盡了所有的棒子跟蘿蔔，我們會看到問題還是存在，表示我們還有問題沒有解決，還是有原因。我在這裡就特別舉個例子，像土地稅法的第三十四條有一個所謂的「一生一次」、「一生一屋」的土增稅，它的稅率是10%，比一般買賣的20%到40%優惠很多。為什麼我特別提？因為我如果賣了一個房子，我可以賺500萬，可是如果我是非自用，可能就是要課100萬以上；如果我是自用，我只要課大概50萬左右。這個差很多，所以其實這也是一個隱憂啊！因為將心比心，很多的屋主會擔心，他未來準備要賣房子，他可能會因為這樣子而不報出租。因此我想這個部分就是要特別提醒，財政部可不可以去參考比照像房東地價稅優惠的一個作法，讓這些誠實的報稅者也能夠適用自用的稅率。為什麼我這樣說？因為我們都很清楚看到，在COVID-19疫情期間，很多人以前都不保勞保，可是因為我們祭出了一個勞工紓困補貼，所以釣出了很多人，他們就趕快去投勞保，提高未投保勞工的投保意願，所以像這樣子的狀況其實都可以提供財政部參考。","其實我在這邊特別要講，還是要回到居住正義，我們要關心的，希望財政部放更多的關心、更多的感情在這一些租屋族，我們很期待臺灣未來不要執著在我們的一個民族的價值觀，好像一定要有土有房，其實一生一輩子很短，我們不見得每一個人一定要買房子，但是重點在於，在我這一生能夠用很低的租金住到很好的房子，所以我很希望你們給一些賦稅的誘因，像那一些鼓勵房東要修繕這些老舊的房屋，我們很希望租屋者住得安全、住得舒適，很宜居，住得很健康。我想這個部分都希望財政部能夠來幫個忙，讓我們每一個人一生都能夠住得起、住得好，我想這個才是真正的居住正義。部長您的看法如何？"],["莊部長翠雲：認同委員，居住是人基本生活的一個需求，然後每一個人有適宜的居住環境是很重要的，這也就是要達到居住正義的一個目的。委員剛剛所提的這三項，我想這個部分，我們是不是以書面來做回復好嗎？"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：一定要有對策啊！你們要再多想一想，因為問題始終沒有解決，我希望能夠朝向更好的方式，我們來解決居住正義的問題。"],["莊部長翠雲：那是不是第二項不要限定我們在一個月內提出書面，我們等有成效出來以後，我們就回報給委員？這樣好嗎？"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：好，謝謝部長、謝謝署長、謝謝主席。"],["莊部長翠雲：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝伍麗華委員的質詢。","我們休息10分鐘。","休息（11時12分）","繼續開會（11時23分）"],["主席：我們繼續開會。接著我們請李坤城委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":252,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-20-19","speakers":["郭國文","顏寬恒","林德福","吳秉叡","賴士葆","賴惠員","李彥秀","羅明才","黃珊珊","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","李坤城","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","邱志偉","王世堅"],"page_start":169,"meetingDate":["2024-06-26"],"gazette_id":"1136501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1136501_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第19次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"審查行政院函請審議、本院委員鄭天財 Sra Kacaw 等17人、委員顏寬恒等20人分別擬具「所得稅\n法部分條文修正草案」等3案","agenda_id":"1136501_00004"}},"transcript":{"id":"154266","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/154266","tool":"pyannote","id":"154266-pyannote"},"job_id":"9PyAmrHA8tx9OVlc","queued_at":"2024-06-26 11:35:23","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2024-06-26 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\"因為都沒有相關資料可以掌握嘛那我們特別專案查核至於研究預算中心研究裡面它講不函法人中的非不動產及營界工程業者持有多戶因為這些都叫盈利事業盈利事業基本上出租是要開利發票的然後因為它有資產負債表如果它資產裡面有這麼多棟的房屋基本上如果有所謂的不對稱的那種收入劣報也會變成規矩查核的對象\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 304.036, \"end\": 304.276, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 304.276, \"end\": 304.416, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 304.416, \"end\": 304.496, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 304.496, \"end\": 304.616, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 304.616, \"end\": 305.076, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"資\"}, {\"word\": \"料\", \"start\": 305.076, \"end\": 305.237, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 305.237, \"end\": 305.317, \"score\": 0.838}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 305.317, \"end\": 305.417, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"掌\", \"start\": 305.417, \"end\": 305.617, \"score\": 0.879}, {\"word\": \"握\", \"start\": 305.617, \"end\": 305.797, \"score\": 0.821}, {\"word\": \"嘛\", \"start\": 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\"start\": 613.217, \"end\": 613.397, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"休\", \"start\": 613.397, \"end\": 613.598, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"息\", \"start\": 613.598, \"end\": 613.758, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 613.758, \"end\": 613.778, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"鐘\"}, {\"word\": \"。\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:02,279 --> 00:00:25,473\n委員好部長好當我們在談居住正義的時候往往都是很關注在房價打房但實際上我們來看一下根據內政部不動產資訊平台他所提供的資料估算全國的租屋戶大概是93萬戶\n\n2\n00:00:57,774 --> 00:01:25,705\n那我們看這些年租金其實是一路成長不太可能下降特別是看到六都的部分那六都的話呢因為他的土地的關係我們可以看到他的租金佔他的整個所得大概可以到18%到35%特別是在台北市那幾乎呢他的所得都拿去負擔他的租金\n\n3\n00:01:26,665 --> 00:01:44,898\n我們也曾經看到資料就是問年輕人那如果問說你認為買房比租屋好的好處是什麼我們可以看到這個排名第一的一個原因叫做長期居住\n\n4\n00:01:45,899 --> 00:02:05,218\n也就是說他不用怕被房東趕那反過來說我們這些租屋族其實他心中最大的隱憂也就是不能夠久居那如果說問到這些房客就是你租屋的時候你最在乎的面向是什麼\n\n5\n00:02:05,919 --> 00:02:06,560\n他曾經在3月份有請財政部你們來研議\n\n6\n00:02:25,322 --> 00:02:44,170\n免追溯租金所得稅這個租稅特色的可行性那我們也看到財政部你們的回覆你們是特別提到說現在已經有提供很多的租稅誘因例如像是社宅租金補貼免納眾所稅\n\n7\n00:02:47,071 --> 00:03:03,053\n那又例如像包租代管免納眾所稅那或者是說關於誠實申報的房東呢他可以出租的時候他可以降他的房屋稅率又或者說\n\n8\n00:03:04,555 --> 00:03:25,895\n這些我們現在即將明年再上路的就是由列舉扣除額改列到特別扣除額讓這一些房客他可以減他的所得稅又不影響房東那當然這個部分我們是希望說因為明年要上路希望財政部要加強宣導\n\n9\n00:03:27,196 --> 00:03:47,021\n那另外一方面你們也提到就是加強查緝這些屯房大戶那我看到資料提到2021年的8月一整年跟2022年1月起這個一整年針對這一些10戶以上跟5戶以上的大戶說兩撥\n\n10\n00:03:49,282 --> 00:04:06,214\n共查獲到6053件合計補稅可以補到3.2億元先請教一下部長關於所謂的持有者10戶或5戶以上的這些他們是有跨縣市嗎?\n\n11\n00:04:09,314 --> 00:04:35,895\n有跨縣市的所以有茶企他們是跨縣市那這個部分我是想要請教因為立法院的預算中心曾經提過就是你們這個所謂的加強茶企大戶他就是不含法人像很多的物業公司他其實非不動產這些他們其實才是真正的持有大戶\n\n12\n00:04:36,736 --> 00:05:02,635\n那請教一下部長,就是這方面你們的態度是怎麼樣?委員在實務執行我是不是可以請署長回答?好,謝謝,署長。報告委員,當時我們對於租賃所的查專案主要是針對個人建築,因為它沒有扣繳資料,也沒有開發票的資料,完全仰賴個人房東自己誠實申報,所以我們才會鎖定個人房東的部分,如果他是租給個人,\n\n13\n00:05:04,036 --> 00:05:33,568\n因為都沒有相關資料可以掌握嘛那我們特別專案查核至於研究預算中心研究裡面它講不函法人中的非不動產及營界工程業者持有多戶因為這些都叫盈利事業盈利事業基本上出租是要開利發票的然後因為它有資產負債表如果它資產裡面有這麼多棟的房屋基本上如果有所謂的不對稱的那種收入劣報也會變成規矩查核的對象\n\n14\n00:05:34,048 --> 00:05:50,703\n所以他就沒有列在這個專案計畫裡面那我們很關心因為我們認為我們一直在講打房或者是房價的意志這個部分其實他們往往才是根源因為他們持有的房屋\n\n15\n00:05:51,904 --> 00:06:16,479\n現在做這個行業的非常多我想這個部分還是要請財政部要注意那另外就是有提到你們加強查緝囤房大戶今年各地區國稅局強化個人應該就是5戶以下那這個查核專案作業目前應該也推動半年了想要知道一下成效怎麼樣\n\n16\n00:06:17,299 --> 00:06:34,938\n報告委員因為我們這計畫它是按記回報的所以目前我們還在那個就整個從而且它是不是年初就開始它是在後面才開始所以目前還沒有查的成效但按記回報之後一定會跟委員如果有關心這個問題我們再回報給你好謝謝齁\n\n17\n00:06:38,862 --> 00:07:07,778\n總之你們的回覆講了這麼多就是棒子也有蘿蔔也有所以呢認為租稅特色是違反租稅的公平那我是要特別去提到說當我們用盡了所有的棒子跟蘿蔔我們會看到問題還是存在表示我們還有問題沒有解決還是有原因那我在這裡就是特別提到我舉個例子\n\n18\n00:07:08,658 --> 00:07:29,671\n土地稅法的第34條有一個所謂的一生一次一生一屋的土增稅那它的自用稅的匯率是10%比一般買賣的20到40%優惠很多那為什麼我特別提因為我們如果我賣了一個房子我可以賺500萬\n\n19\n00:07:31,232 --> 00:07:55,891\n可是如果說我非自用我可能就是要繳課一百萬以上那如果我是自用我只要課大概五十萬左右這個差很多所以其實這也是一個隱憂啊因為將心比心很多的屋主他擔心他未來他準備要賣房子他可能會因為這樣子而不報出租\n\n20\n00:07:56,871 --> 00:08:22,557\n所以我想這個部分就是要特別提醒就是我們可能財政部可不可以去參考比照像房東地價稅優惠的一個做法那讓這些誠實的報稅者他也能夠適用這個自用的稅率那為什麼我這樣說因為我們都很清楚看到在COVID-19疫情期間很多人以前都是不報勞保啊\n\n21\n00:08:23,777 --> 00:08:43,839\n可是因為我們寄出了一個勞工紓困補貼所以呢調出了很多的人他就趕快去投勞保提高投保勞工的投保意願所以像這樣子的一個狀況其實都可以提供財政部來參考那其實我在這邊就是特別要講\n\n22\n00:08:44,780 --> 00:09:07,766\n還是要回到居住正義我們要關心的希望財政部放更多的關心更多的感情在這一些租屋族我們很期待我們台灣未來不要執著在我們的一個民族的價值觀好像一定要有土有房其實一生一輩子很短\n\n23\n00:09:09,146 --> 00:09:24,898\n我們不見得每一個人一定要買房子但是重點我可以在我這一生我能夠用很低的租金然後住到很好的房子所以我很希望你們給一些付稅的誘因像那一些鼓勵房東要修繕這些老舊的房屋\n\n24\n00:09:28,300 --> 00:09:48,881\n我們很希望我們的住屋者住得安全、住得舒適很宜居、住得很健康我想這個部分都希望財政部能夠來幫個忙讓我們每一個人一生都能夠住得起、住得好我想這個才是真正的居住正義那部長您的看法如何?\n\n25\n00:09:49,682 --> 00:10:11,957\n任同委員,居住是一個人的一個基本生活的一個需求然後每一個人有適宜的一個居住環境是很重要的這也就是要達到居住正義的一個目的那委員剛剛所提的這3項我想這個部分我們是不是以書面來做回覆好嗎那一定要有對策啊你們要再多想一想\n\n26\n00:10:12,957 --> 00:10:13,778\n謝謝吳立法委員的質詢,我們休息10分鐘。\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n2279\t25473\t委員好部長好當我們在談居住正義的時候往往都是很關注在房價打房但實際上我們來看一下根據內政部不動產資訊平台他所提供的資料估算全國的租屋戶大概是93萬戶\n27534\t57534\t﹏﹏\n57774\t85705\t那我們看這些年租金其實是一路成長不太可能下降特別是看到六都的部分那六都的話呢因為他的土地的關係我們可以看到他的租金佔他的整個所得大概可以到18%到35%特別是在台北市那幾乎呢他的所得都拿去負擔他的租金\n86665\t104898\t我們也曾經看到資料就是問年輕人那如果問說你認為買房比租屋好的好處是什麼我們可以看到這個排名第一的一個原因叫做長期居住\n105899\t125218\t也就是說他不用怕被房東趕那反過來說我們這些租屋族其實他心中最大的隱憂也就是不能夠久居那如果說問到這些房客就是你租屋的時候你最在乎的面向是什麼\n125919\t126560\t他曾經在3月份有請財政部你們來研議\n145322\t164170\t免追溯租金所得稅這個租稅特色的可行性那我們也看到財政部你們的回覆你們是特別提到說現在已經有提供很多的租稅誘因例如像是社宅租金補貼免納眾所稅\n167071\t183053\t那又例如像包租代管免納眾所稅那或者是說關於誠實申報的房東呢他可以出租的時候他可以降他的房屋稅率又或者說\n184555\t205895\t這些我們現在即將明年再上路的就是由列舉扣除額改列到特別扣除額讓這一些房客他可以減他的所得稅又不影響房東那當然這個部分我們是希望說因為明年要上路希望財政部要加強宣導\n207196\t227021\t那另外一方面你們也提到就是加強查緝這些屯房大戶那我看到資料提到2021年的8月一整年跟2022年1月起這個一整年針對這一些10戶以上跟5戶以上的大戶說兩撥\n229282\t246214\t共查獲到6053件合計補稅可以補到3.2億元先請教一下部長關於所謂的持有者10戶或5戶以上的這些他們是有跨縣市嗎?\n249314\t275895\t有跨縣市的所以有茶企他們是跨縣市那這個部分我是想要請教因為立法院的預算中心曾經提過就是你們這個所謂的加強茶企大戶他就是不含法人像很多的物業公司他其實非不動產這些他們其實才是真正的持有大戶\n276736\t302635\t那請教一下部長,就是這方面你們的態度是怎麼樣?委員在實務執行我是不是可以請署長回答?好,謝謝,署長。報告委員,當時我們對於租賃所的查專案主要是針對個人建築,因為它沒有扣繳資料,也沒有開發票的資料,完全仰賴個人房東自己誠實申報,所以我們才會鎖定個人房東的部分,如果他是租給個人,\n304036\t333568\t因為都沒有相關資料可以掌握嘛那我們特別專案查核至於研究預算中心研究裡面它講不函法人中的非不動產及營界工程業者持有多戶因為這些都叫盈利事業盈利事業基本上出租是要開利發票的然後因為它有資產負債表如果它資產裡面有這麼多棟的房屋基本上如果有所謂的不對稱的那種收入劣報也會變成規矩查核的對象\n334048\t350703\t所以他就沒有列在這個專案計畫裡面那我們很關心因為我們認為我們一直在講打房或者是房價的意志這個部分其實他們往往才是根源因為他們持有的房屋\n351904\t376479\t現在做這個行業的非常多我想這個部分還是要請財政部要注意那另外就是有提到你們加強查緝囤房大戶今年各地區國稅局強化個人應該就是5戶以下那這個查核專案作業目前應該也推動半年了想要知道一下成效怎麼樣\n377299\t394938\t報告委員因為我們這計畫它是按記回報的所以目前我們還在那個就整個從而且它是不是年初就開始它是在後面才開始所以目前還沒有查的成效但按記回報之後一定會跟委員如果有關心這個問題我們再回報給你好謝謝齁\n398862\t427778\t總之你們的回覆講了這麼多就是棒子也有蘿蔔也有所以呢認為租稅特色是違反租稅的公平那我是要特別去提到說當我們用盡了所有的棒子跟蘿蔔我們會看到問題還是存在表示我們還有問題沒有解決還是有原因那我在這裡就是特別提到我舉個例子\n428658\t449671\t土地稅法的第34條有一個所謂的一生一次一生一屋的土增稅那它的自用稅的匯率是10%比一般買賣的20到40%優惠很多那為什麼我特別提因為我們如果我賣了一個房子我可以賺500萬\n451232\t475891\t可是如果說我非自用我可能就是要繳課一百萬以上那如果我是自用我只要課大概五十萬左右這個差很多所以其實這也是一個隱憂啊因為將心比心很多的屋主他擔心他未來他準備要賣房子他可能會因為這樣子而不報出租\n476871\t502557\t所以我想這個部分就是要特別提醒就是我們可能財政部可不可以去參考比照像房東地價稅優惠的一個做法那讓這些誠實的報稅者他也能夠適用這個自用的稅率那為什麼我這樣說因為我們都很清楚看到在COVID-19疫情期間很多人以前都是不報勞保啊\n503777\t523839\t可是因為我們寄出了一個勞工紓困補貼所以呢調出了很多的人他就趕快去投勞保提高投保勞工的投保意願所以像這樣子的一個狀況其實都可以提供財政部來參考那其實我在這邊就是特別要講\n524780\t547766\t還是要回到居住正義我們要關心的希望財政部放更多的關心更多的感情在這一些租屋族我們很期待我們台灣未來不要執著在我們的一個民族的價值觀好像一定要有土有房其實一生一輩子很短\n549146\t564898\t我們不見得每一個人一定要買房子但是重點我可以在我這一生我能夠用很低的租金然後住到很好的房子所以我很希望你們給一些付稅的誘因像那一些鼓勵房東要修繕這些老舊的房屋\n568300\t588881\t我們很希望我們的住屋者住得安全、住得舒適很宜居、住得很健康我想這個部分都希望財政部能夠來幫個忙讓我們每一個人一生都能夠住得起、住得好我想這個才是真正的居住正義那部長您的看法如何?\n589682\t611957\t任同委員,居住是一個人的一個基本生活的一個需求然後每一個人有適宜的一個居住環境是很重要的這也就是要達到居住正義的一個目的那委員剛剛所提的這3項我想這個部分我們是不是以書面來做回覆好嗎那一定要有對策啊你們要再多想一想\n612957\t613778\t謝謝吳立法委員的質詢,我們休息10分鐘。\n","txt":"委員好部長好當我們在談居住正義的時候往往都是很關注在房價打房但實際上我們來看一下根據內政部不動產資訊平台他所提供的資料估算全國的租屋戶大概是93萬戶\n﹏﹏\n那我們看這些年租金其實是一路成長不太可能下降特別是看到六都的部分那六都的話呢因為他的土地的關係我們可以看到他的租金佔他的整個所得大概可以到18%到35%特別是在台北市那幾乎呢他的所得都拿去負擔他的租金\n我們也曾經看到資料就是問年輕人那如果問說你認為買房比租屋好的好處是什麼我們可以看到這個排名第一的一個原因叫做長期居住\n也就是說他不用怕被房東趕那反過來說我們這些租屋族其實他心中最大的隱憂也就是不能夠久居那如果說問到這些房客就是你租屋的時候你最在乎的面向是什麼\n他曾經在3月份有請財政部你們來研議\n免追溯租金所得稅這個租稅特色的可行性那我們也看到財政部你們的回覆你們是特別提到說現在已經有提供很多的租稅誘因例如像是社宅租金補貼免納眾所稅\n那又例如像包租代管免納眾所稅那或者是說關於誠實申報的房東呢他可以出租的時候他可以降他的房屋稅率又或者說\n這些我們現在即將明年再上路的就是由列舉扣除額改列到特別扣除額讓這一些房客他可以減他的所得稅又不影響房東那當然這個部分我們是希望說因為明年要上路希望財政部要加強宣導\n那另外一方面你們也提到就是加強查緝這些屯房大戶那我看到資料提到2021年的8月一整年跟2022年1月起這個一整年針對這一些10戶以上跟5戶以上的大戶說兩撥\n共查獲到6053件合計補稅可以補到3.2億元先請教一下部長關於所謂的持有者10戶或5戶以上的這些他們是有跨縣市嗎?\n有跨縣市的所以有茶企他們是跨縣市那這個部分我是想要請教因為立法院的預算中心曾經提過就是你們這個所謂的加強茶企大戶他就是不含法人像很多的物業公司他其實非不動產這些他們其實才是真正的持有大戶\n那請教一下部長,就是這方面你們的態度是怎麼樣?委員在實務執行我是不是可以請署長回答?好,謝謝,署長。報告委員,當時我們對於租賃所的查專案主要是針對個人建築,因為它沒有扣繳資料,也沒有開發票的資料,完全仰賴個人房東自己誠實申報,所以我們才會鎖定個人房東的部分,如果他是租給個人,\n因為都沒有相關資料可以掌握嘛那我們特別專案查核至於研究預算中心研究裡面它講不函法人中的非不動產及營界工程業者持有多戶因為這些都叫盈利事業盈利事業基本上出租是要開利發票的然後因為它有資產負債表如果它資產裡面有這麼多棟的房屋基本上如果有所謂的不對稱的那種收入劣報也會變成規矩查核的對象\n所以他就沒有列在這個專案計畫裡面那我們很關心因為我們認為我們一直在講打房或者是房價的意志這個部分其實他們往往才是根源因為他們持有的房屋\n現在做這個行業的非常多我想這個部分還是要請財政部要注意那另外就是有提到你們加強查緝囤房大戶今年各地區國稅局強化個人應該就是5戶以下那這個查核專案作業目前應該也推動半年了想要知道一下成效怎麼樣\n報告委員因為我們這計畫它是按記回報的所以目前我們還在那個就整個從而且它是不是年初就開始它是在後面才開始所以目前還沒有查的成效但按記回報之後一定會跟委員如果有關心這個問題我們再回報給你好謝謝齁\n總之你們的回覆講了這麼多就是棒子也有蘿蔔也有所以呢認為租稅特色是違反租稅的公平那我是要特別去提到說當我們用盡了所有的棒子跟蘿蔔我們會看到問題還是存在表示我們還有問題沒有解決還是有原因那我在這裡就是特別提到我舉個例子\n土地稅法的第34條有一個所謂的一生一次一生一屋的土增稅那它的自用稅的匯率是10%比一般買賣的20到40%優惠很多那為什麼我特別提因為我們如果我賣了一個房子我可以賺500萬\n可是如果說我非自用我可能就是要繳課一百萬以上那如果我是自用我只要課大概五十萬左右這個差很多所以其實這也是一個隱憂啊因為將心比心很多的屋主他擔心他未來他準備要賣房子他可能會因為這樣子而不報出租\n所以我想這個部分就是要特別提醒就是我們可能財政部可不可以去參考比照像房東地價稅優惠的一個做法那讓這些誠實的報稅者他也能夠適用這個自用的稅率那為什麼我這樣說因為我們都很清楚看到在COVID-19疫情期間很多人以前都是不報勞保啊\n可是因為我們寄出了一個勞工紓困補貼所以呢調出了很多的人他就趕快去投勞保提高投保勞工的投保意願所以像這樣子的一個狀況其實都可以提供財政部來參考那其實我在這邊就是特別要講\n還是要回到居住正義我們要關心的希望財政部放更多的關心更多的感情在這一些租屋族我們很期待我們台灣未來不要執著在我們的一個民族的價值觀好像一定要有土有房其實一生一輩子很短\n我們不見得每一個人一定要買房子但是重點我可以在我這一生我能夠用很低的租金然後住到很好的房子所以我很希望你們給一些付稅的誘因像那一些鼓勵房東要修繕這些老舊的房屋\n我們很希望我們的住屋者住得安全、住得舒適很宜居、住得很健康我想這個部分都希望財政部能夠來幫個忙讓我們每一個人一生都能夠住得起、住得好我想這個才是真正的居住正義那部長您的看法如何?\n任同委員,居住是一個人的一個基本生活的一個需求然後每一個人有適宜的一個居住環境是很重要的這也就是要達到居住正義的一個目的那委員剛剛所提的這3項我想這個部分我們是不是以書面來做回覆好嗎那一定要有對策啊你們要再多想一想\n謝謝吳立法委員的質詢,我們休息10分鐘。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:02.279 --> 00:25.473\n委員好部長好當我們在談居住正義的時候往往都是很關注在房價打房但實際上我們來看一下根據內政部不動產資訊平台他所提供的資料估算全國的租屋戶大概是93萬戶\n\n00:57.774 --> 01:25.705\n那我們看這些年租金其實是一路成長不太可能下降特別是看到六都的部分那六都的話呢因為他的土地的關係我們可以看到他的租金佔他的整個所得大概可以到18%到35%特別是在台北市那幾乎呢他的所得都拿去負擔他的租金\n\n01:26.665 --> 01:44.898\n我們也曾經看到資料就是問年輕人那如果問說你認為買房比租屋好的好處是什麼我們可以看到這個排名第一的一個原因叫做長期居住\n\n01:45.899 --> 02:05.218\n也就是說他不用怕被房東趕那反過來說我們這些租屋族其實他心中最大的隱憂也就是不能夠久居那如果說問到這些房客就是你租屋的時候你最在乎的面向是什麼\n\n02:05.919 --> 02:06.560\n他曾經在3月份有請財政部你們來研議\n\n02:25.322 --> 02:44.170\n免追溯租金所得稅這個租稅特色的可行性那我們也看到財政部你們的回覆你們是特別提到說現在已經有提供很多的租稅誘因例如像是社宅租金補貼免納眾所稅\n\n02:47.071 --> 03:03.053\n那又例如像包租代管免納眾所稅那或者是說關於誠實申報的房東呢他可以出租的時候他可以降他的房屋稅率又或者說\n\n03:04.555 --> 03:25.895\n這些我們現在即將明年再上路的就是由列舉扣除額改列到特別扣除額讓這一些房客他可以減他的所得稅又不影響房東那當然這個部分我們是希望說因為明年要上路希望財政部要加強宣導\n\n03:27.196 --> 03:47.021\n那另外一方面你們也提到就是加強查緝這些屯房大戶那我看到資料提到2021年的8月一整年跟2022年1月起這個一整年針對這一些10戶以上跟5戶以上的大戶說兩撥\n\n03:49.282 --> 04:06.214\n共查獲到6053件合計補稅可以補到3.2億元先請教一下部長關於所謂的持有者10戶或5戶以上的這些他們是有跨縣市嗎?\n\n04:09.314 --> 04:35.895\n有跨縣市的所以有茶企他們是跨縣市那這個部分我是想要請教因為立法院的預算中心曾經提過就是你們這個所謂的加強茶企大戶他就是不含法人像很多的物業公司他其實非不動產這些他們其實才是真正的持有大戶\n\n04:36.736 --> 05:02.635\n那請教一下部長,就是這方面你們的態度是怎麼樣?委員在實務執行我是不是可以請署長回答?好,謝謝,署長。報告委員,當時我們對於租賃所的查專案主要是針對個人建築,因為它沒有扣繳資料,也沒有開發票的資料,完全仰賴個人房東自己誠實申報,所以我們才會鎖定個人房東的部分,如果他是租給個人,\n\n05:04.036 --> 05:33.568\n因為都沒有相關資料可以掌握嘛那我們特別專案查核至於研究預算中心研究裡面它講不函法人中的非不動產及營界工程業者持有多戶因為這些都叫盈利事業盈利事業基本上出租是要開利發票的然後因為它有資產負債表如果它資產裡面有這麼多棟的房屋基本上如果有所謂的不對稱的那種收入劣報也會變成規矩查核的對象\n\n05:34.048 --> 05:50.703\n所以他就沒有列在這個專案計畫裡面那我們很關心因為我們認為我們一直在講打房或者是房價的意志這個部分其實他們往往才是根源因為他們持有的房屋\n\n05:51.904 --> 06:16.479\n現在做這個行業的非常多我想這個部分還是要請財政部要注意那另外就是有提到你們加強查緝囤房大戶今年各地區國稅局強化個人應該就是5戶以下那這個查核專案作業目前應該也推動半年了想要知道一下成效怎麼樣\n\n06:17.299 --> 06:34.938\n報告委員因為我們這計畫它是按記回報的所以目前我們還在那個就整個從而且它是不是年初就開始它是在後面才開始所以目前還沒有查的成效但按記回報之後一定會跟委員如果有關心這個問題我們再回報給你好謝謝齁\n\n06:38.862 --> 07:07.778\n總之你們的回覆講了這麼多就是棒子也有蘿蔔也有所以呢認為租稅特色是違反租稅的公平那我是要特別去提到說當我們用盡了所有的棒子跟蘿蔔我們會看到問題還是存在表示我們還有問題沒有解決還是有原因那我在這裡就是特別提到我舉個例子\n\n07:08.658 --> 07:29.671\n土地稅法的第34條有一個所謂的一生一次一生一屋的土增稅那它的自用稅的匯率是10%比一般買賣的20到40%優惠很多那為什麼我特別提因為我們如果我賣了一個房子我可以賺500萬\n\n07:31.232 --> 07:55.891\n可是如果說我非自用我可能就是要繳課一百萬以上那如果我是自用我只要課大概五十萬左右這個差很多所以其實這也是一個隱憂啊因為將心比心很多的屋主他擔心他未來他準備要賣房子他可能會因為這樣子而不報出租\n\n07:56.871 --> 08:22.557\n所以我想這個部分就是要特別提醒就是我們可能財政部可不可以去參考比照像房東地價稅優惠的一個做法那讓這些誠實的報稅者他也能夠適用這個自用的稅率那為什麼我這樣說因為我們都很清楚看到在COVID-19疫情期間很多人以前都是不報勞保啊\n\n08:23.777 --> 08:43.839\n可是因為我們寄出了一個勞工紓困補貼所以呢調出了很多的人他就趕快去投勞保提高投保勞工的投保意願所以像這樣子的一個狀況其實都可以提供財政部來參考那其實我在這邊就是特別要講\n\n08:44.780 --> 09:07.766\n還是要回到居住正義我們要關心的希望財政部放更多的關心更多的感情在這一些租屋族我們很期待我們台灣未來不要執著在我們的一個民族的價值觀好像一定要有土有房其實一生一輩子很短\n\n09:09.146 --> 09:24.898\n我們不見得每一個人一定要買房子但是重點我可以在我這一生我能夠用很低的租金然後住到很好的房子所以我很希望你們給一些付稅的誘因像那一些鼓勵房東要修繕這些老舊的房屋\n\n09:28.300 --> 09:48.881\n我們很希望我們的住屋者住得安全、住得舒適很宜居、住得很健康我想這個部分都希望財政部能夠來幫個忙讓我們每一個人一生都能夠住得起、住得好我想這個才是真正的居住正義那部長您的看法如何?\n\n09:49.682 --> 10:11.957\n任同委員,居住是一個人的一個基本生活的一個需求然後每一個人有適宜的一個居住環境是很重要的這也就是要達到居住正義的一個目的那委員剛剛所提的這3項我想這個部分我們是不是以書面來做回覆好嗎那一定要有對策啊你們要再多想一想\n\n10:12.957 --> 10:13.778\n謝謝吳立法委員的質詢,我們休息10分鐘。\n\n","segments":[{"start":2.279,"end":25.473,"text":"委員好部長好當我們在談居住正義的時候往往都是很關注在房價打房但實際上我們來看一下根據內政部不動產資訊平台他所提供的資料估算全國的租屋戶大概是93萬戶"},{"start":27.534,"end":57.534,"text":"﹏﹏"},{"start":57.774,"end":85.705,"text":"那我們看這些年租金其實是一路成長不太可能下降特別是看到六都的部分那六都的話呢因為他的土地的關係我們可以看到他的租金佔他的整個所得大概可以到18%到35%特別是在台北市那幾乎呢他的所得都拿去負擔他的租金"},{"start":86.665,"end":104.898,"text":"我們也曾經看到資料就是問年輕人那如果問說你認為買房比租屋好的好處是什麼我們可以看到這個排名第一的一個原因叫做長期居住"},{"start":105.899,"end":125.218,"text":"也就是說他不用怕被房東趕那反過來說我們這些租屋族其實他心中最大的隱憂也就是不能夠久居那如果說問到這些房客就是你租屋的時候你最在乎的面向是什麼"},{"start":125.919,"end":126.56,"text":"他曾經在3月份有請財政部你們來研議"},{"start":145.322,"end":164.17,"text":"免追溯租金所得稅這個租稅特色的可行性那我們也看到財政部你們的回覆你們是特別提到說現在已經有提供很多的租稅誘因例如像是社宅租金補貼免納眾所稅"},{"start":167.071,"end":183.053,"text":"那又例如像包租代管免納眾所稅那或者是說關於誠實申報的房東呢他可以出租的時候他可以降他的房屋稅率又或者說"},{"start":184.555,"end":205.895,"text":"這些我們現在即將明年再上路的就是由列舉扣除額改列到特別扣除額讓這一些房客他可以減他的所得稅又不影響房東那當然這個部分我們是希望說因為明年要上路希望財政部要加強宣導"},{"start":207.196,"end":227.021,"text":"那另外一方面你們也提到就是加強查緝這些屯房大戶那我看到資料提到2021年的8月一整年跟2022年1月起這個一整年針對這一些10戶以上跟5戶以上的大戶說兩撥"},{"start":229.282,"end":246.214,"text":"共查獲到6053件合計補稅可以補到3.2億元先請教一下部長關於所謂的持有者10戶或5戶以上的這些他們是有跨縣市嗎?"},{"start":249.314,"end":275.895,"text":"有跨縣市的所以有茶企他們是跨縣市那這個部分我是想要請教因為立法院的預算中心曾經提過就是你們這個所謂的加強茶企大戶他就是不含法人像很多的物業公司他其實非不動產這些他們其實才是真正的持有大戶"},{"start":276.736,"end":302.635,"text":"那請教一下部長,就是這方面你們的態度是怎麼樣?委員在實務執行我是不是可以請署長回答?好,謝謝,署長。報告委員,當時我們對於租賃所的查專案主要是針對個人建築,因為它沒有扣繳資料,也沒有開發票的資料,完全仰賴個人房東自己誠實申報,所以我們才會鎖定個人房東的部分,如果他是租給個人,"},{"start":304.036,"end":333.568,"text":"因為都沒有相關資料可以掌握嘛那我們特別專案查核至於研究預算中心研究裡面它講不函法人中的非不動產及營界工程業者持有多戶因為這些都叫盈利事業盈利事業基本上出租是要開利發票的然後因為它有資產負債表如果它資產裡面有這麼多棟的房屋基本上如果有所謂的不對稱的那種收入劣報也會變成規矩查核的對象"},{"start":334.048,"end":350.703,"text":"所以他就沒有列在這個專案計畫裡面那我們很關心因為我們認為我們一直在講打房或者是房價的意志這個部分其實他們往往才是根源因為他們持有的房屋"},{"start":351.904,"end":376.479,"text":"現在做這個行業的非常多我想這個部分還是要請財政部要注意那另外就是有提到你們加強查緝囤房大戶今年各地區國稅局強化個人應該就是5戶以下那這個查核專案作業目前應該也推動半年了想要知道一下成效怎麼樣"},{"start":377.299,"end":394.938,"text":"報告委員因為我們這計畫它是按記回報的所以目前我們還在那個就整個從而且它是不是年初就開始它是在後面才開始所以目前還沒有查的成效但按記回報之後一定會跟委員如果有關心這個問題我們再回報給你好謝謝齁"},{"start":398.862,"end":427.778,"text":"總之你們的回覆講了這麼多就是棒子也有蘿蔔也有所以呢認為租稅特色是違反租稅的公平那我是要特別去提到說當我們用盡了所有的棒子跟蘿蔔我們會看到問題還是存在表示我們還有問題沒有解決還是有原因那我在這裡就是特別提到我舉個例子"},{"start":428.658,"end":449.671,"text":"土地稅法的第34條有一個所謂的一生一次一生一屋的土增稅那它的自用稅的匯率是10%比一般買賣的20到40%優惠很多那為什麼我特別提因為我們如果我賣了一個房子我可以賺500萬"},{"start":451.232,"end":475.891,"text":"可是如果說我非自用我可能就是要繳課一百萬以上那如果我是自用我只要課大概五十萬左右這個差很多所以其實這也是一個隱憂啊因為將心比心很多的屋主他擔心他未來他準備要賣房子他可能會因為這樣子而不報出租"},{"start":476.871,"end":502.557,"text":"所以我想這個部分就是要特別提醒就是我們可能財政部可不可以去參考比照像房東地價稅優惠的一個做法那讓這些誠實的報稅者他也能夠適用這個自用的稅率那為什麼我這樣說因為我們都很清楚看到在COVID-19疫情期間很多人以前都是不報勞保啊"},{"start":503.777,"end":523.839,"text":"可是因為我們寄出了一個勞工紓困補貼所以呢調出了很多的人他就趕快去投勞保提高投保勞工的投保意願所以像這樣子的一個狀況其實都可以提供財政部來參考那其實我在這邊就是特別要講"},{"start":524.78,"end":547.766,"text":"還是要回到居住正義我們要關心的希望財政部放更多的關心更多的感情在這一些租屋族我們很期待我們台灣未來不要執著在我們的一個民族的價值觀好像一定要有土有房其實一生一輩子很短"},{"start":549.146,"end":564.898,"text":"我們不見得每一個人一定要買房子但是重點我可以在我這一生我能夠用很低的租金然後住到很好的房子所以我很希望你們給一些付稅的誘因像那一些鼓勵房東要修繕這些老舊的房屋"},{"start":568.3,"end":588.881,"text":"我們很希望我們的住屋者住得安全、住得舒適很宜居、住得很健康我想這個部分都希望財政部能夠來幫個忙讓我們每一個人一生都能夠住得起、住得好我想這個才是真正的居住正義那部長您的看法如何?"},{"start":589.682,"end":611.957,"text":"任同委員,居住是一個人的一個基本生活的一個需求然後每一個人有適宜的一個居住環境是很重要的這也就是要達到居住正義的一個目的那委員剛剛所提的這3項我想這個部分我們是不是以書面來做回覆好嗎那一定要有對策啊你們要再多想一想"},{"start":612.957,"end":613.778,"text":"謝謝吳立法委員的質詢,我們休息10分鐘。"}]}}}}