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\"我想以就是說在野黨這樣子提案這種濫用國家公帑的這個行為我覺得這些經濟狀況優渥的長者有可能得到補助之後甚至搞不好他們不會去感謝這些提案的委員反而會認為說為什麼不把這些錢用在更需要幫助的人身上\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 522.616, \"end\": 522.737, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 522.737, \"end\": 523.377, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 523.377, \"end\": 524.058, \"score\": 0.971}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 524.058, \"end\": 524.178, \"score\": 0.834}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 524.178, \"end\": 524.418, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 524.418, \"end\": 524.578, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"野\", \"start\": 524.578, \"end\": 525.179, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"黨\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"子\", \"start\": 525.179, \"end\": 525.399, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 525.399, \"end\": 525.559, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 525.559, \"end\": 526.4, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"種\"}, {\"word\": \"濫\"}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 526.4, \"end\": 526.921, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"家\", \"start\": 526.921, \"end\": 527.161, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"公\", \"start\": 527.161, \"end\": 527.601, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"帑\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 527.601, \"end\": 528.002, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 528.002, \"end\": 529.343, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 529.343, \"end\": 529.663, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"覺\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 529.663, \"end\": 530.124, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 530.124, \"end\": 531.745, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"濟\"}, {\"word\": \"狀\"}, {\"word\": \"況\"}, {\"word\": \"優\"}, {\"word\": \"渥\", \"start\": 531.745, \"end\": 531.925, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 531.925, \"end\": 532.506, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"者\", \"start\": 532.506, \"end\": 533.007, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 533.007, \"end\": 533.187, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 533.187, \"end\": 533.327, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 533.327, \"end\": 533.507, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 533.507, \"end\": 533.647, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 533.647, \"end\": 534.088, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"補\"}, {\"word\": \"助\", \"start\": 534.088, \"end\": 534.348, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 534.348, \"end\": 534.548, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 534.548, \"end\": 535.569, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"甚\", \"start\": 535.569, \"end\": 535.869, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"至\", \"start\": 535.869, \"end\": 536.45, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"搞\", \"start\": 536.45, \"end\": 536.59, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 536.59, \"end\": 536.73, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 536.73, \"end\": 537.171, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 537.171, \"end\": 537.471, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 537.471, \"end\": 537.771, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 537.771, \"end\": 538.031, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"感\", \"start\": 538.031, \"end\": 538.952, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 538.952, \"end\": 539.253, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 539.253, \"end\": 539.393, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 539.393, \"end\": 539.633, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 539.633, \"end\": 539.793, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 539.793, \"end\": 540.614, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"反\", \"start\": 540.614, \"end\": 540.774, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"而\", \"start\": 540.774, \"end\": 542.516, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"認\"}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 542.516, \"end\": 542.816, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 542.816, \"end\": 542.956, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"把\", \"start\": 542.956, \"end\": 543.317, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 543.317, \"end\": 544.257, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"錢\"}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 544.257, \"end\": 544.498, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 544.498, \"end\": 544.718, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"更\", \"start\": 544.718, \"end\": 544.878, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"需\", \"start\": 544.878, \"end\": 544.998, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 544.998, \"end\": 545.419, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"幫\"}, {\"word\": \"助\", \"start\": 545.419, \"end\": 545.599, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 545.599, \"end\": 545.719, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 545.719, \"end\": 545.939, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"身\", \"start\": 545.939, \"end\": 546.219, \"score\": 0.97}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 546.219, \"end\": 546.239, \"score\": 0.001}]}, {\"start\": 547.52, \"end\": 574.69, \"text\": \"那我想這些數據我希望說部長你們可以在一週內去跟相關部會整理出來那在院長協商的時候在院長主持協商的時候你們可以提出這些有力的證據作為佐證那我不希望說因為這件事情去要數據這個事情我其實在更早之前我已經有提醒你們了\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 547.52, \"end\": 547.9, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 547.9, \"end\": 548.02, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 548.02, \"end\": 548.28, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 548.28, \"end\": 549.421, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"數\"}, {\"word\": \"據\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 549.421, \"end\": 549.561, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"希\", \"start\": 549.561, \"end\": 549.701, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"望\", \"start\": 549.701, \"end\": 550.521, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 550.521, \"end\": 550.881, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 550.881, \"end\": 551.222, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 551.222, \"end\": 551.442, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 551.442, \"end\": 551.722, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 551.722, \"end\": 552.242, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 552.242, \"end\": 553.402, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"週\"}, {\"word\": \"內\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 553.402, \"end\": 553.582, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 553.582, \"end\": 553.802, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 553.802, \"end\": 554.263, \"score\": 0.955}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 554.263, \"end\": 554.663, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"整\", \"start\": 554.663, \"end\": 554.863, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"理\", \"start\": 554.863, \"end\": 555.103, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 555.103, \"end\": 555.963, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 555.963, \"end\": 557.304, \"score\": 0.97}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 557.304, \"end\": 557.504, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 557.504, \"end\": 558.144, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"商\", \"start\": 558.144, \"end\": 558.384, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 558.384, \"end\": 558.724, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 558.724, \"end\": 559.705, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 559.705, \"end\": 559.985, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 559.985, \"end\": 560.345, \"score\": 0.906}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 560.345, \"end\": 560.505, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"持\", \"start\": 560.505, \"end\": 560.845, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"商\", \"start\": 560.845, \"end\": 561.045, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 561.045, \"end\": 561.365, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 561.365, \"end\": 561.505, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 561.505, \"end\": 561.785, \"score\": 0.861}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 561.785, \"end\": 561.965, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 561.965, \"end\": 562.445, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 562.445, \"end\": 562.666, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 562.666, \"end\": 563.086, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 563.086, \"end\": 563.286, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 563.286, \"end\": 563.466, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 563.466, \"end\": 563.606, \"score\": 0.859}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 563.606, \"end\": 564.286, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"證\"}, {\"word\": \"據\"}, {\"word\": \"作\", \"start\": 564.286, \"end\": 564.586, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"佐\", \"start\": 564.586, \"end\": 565.507, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"證\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 565.507, \"end\": 565.647, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 565.647, \"end\": 565.787, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 565.787, \"end\": 565.907, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"希\", \"start\": 565.907, \"end\": 566.047, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"望\", \"start\": 566.047, \"end\": 567.527, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 567.527, \"end\": 568.188, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"件\", \"start\": 568.188, \"end\": 568.428, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 568.428, \"end\": 568.628, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 568.628, \"end\": 569.508, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 569.508, \"end\": 570.088, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 570.088, \"end\": 571.009, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"數\"}, {\"word\": \"據\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 571.009, \"end\": 571.169, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 571.169, \"end\": 571.689, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 571.689, \"end\": 571.829, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 571.829, \"end\": 572.089, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 572.089, \"end\": 572.329, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"更\", \"start\": 572.329, \"end\": 572.509, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"早\", \"start\": 572.509, \"end\": 572.709, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 572.709, \"end\": 572.869, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"前\", \"start\": 572.869, \"end\": 573.389, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 573.389, \"end\": 573.489, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"已\", \"start\": 573.489, \"end\": 573.709, \"score\": 0.834}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 573.709, \"end\": 573.87, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 573.87, \"end\": 574.05, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"醒\", \"start\": 574.05, \"end\": 574.31, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 574.31, \"end\": 574.67, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 574.67, \"end\": 574.69, \"score\": 0.984}]}, {\"start\": 575.37, \"end\": 584.097, \"text\": \"那我不曉得你們有遇到什麼樣的困難還是就是說這是沒有問題我們可以盡快來拿到這些數據來作證?\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 575.37, \"end\": 575.51, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 575.51, \"end\": 575.63, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 575.63, \"end\": 575.971, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"曉\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 575.971, \"end\": 578.052, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 578.052, \"end\": 578.373, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 578.373, \"end\": 578.673, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"遇\", \"start\": 578.673, \"end\": 578.813, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 578.813, 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{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"數\"}, {\"word\": \"據\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 647.867, \"end\": 648.407, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"拜\", \"start\": 648.407, \"end\": 648.747, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"託\"}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 648.747, \"end\": 649.387, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 649.387, \"end\": 649.627, \"score\": 0.839}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 649.627, \"end\": 649.687, \"score\": 0.696}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 649.687, \"end\": 649.947, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 649.947, \"end\": 650.127, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 650.127, \"end\": 650.247, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 650.247, \"end\": 650.527, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"趕\"}, {\"word\": \"快\", \"start\": 650.527, \"end\": 650.627, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 650.627, \"end\": 650.708, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"周\", \"start\": 650.708, \"end\": 651.268, \"score\": 0.867}, {\"word\": \"內\"}, {\"word\": \"趕\"}, {\"word\": \"快\", \"start\": 651.268, \"end\": 651.488, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 651.488, \"end\": 652.428, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 652.428, \"end\": 652.448, \"score\": 0.765}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:16,031 --> 00:00:43,334\n謝謝主席,麻煩請部長請邱部長委員好部長好,我們先來看一下這個TVBS的這個新聞的專題報告不過為此也估算了一下這一項修正草案恐怕還要多加300多億元的預算雖然美青年稍讓有長輩需要照顧的家庭可以減輕負擔但如果未來保費入不敷出是不是又要調漲年輕世代的健保費\n\n2\n00:00:44,535 --> 00:00:51,159\n其實在特別預算的支持再加上補充保費讓健保連續5年的赤字終於在2022年由戶轉好那個我想這樣\n\n3\n00:01:21,587 --> 00:01:49,680\n立委提出《老人福利法修正草案》增訂綜合所得稅20%以下的65歲長者免繳交健保費估算要花到359億元衛福部憂心法案通過後保費短收節於誘變負數醫改會認為恐怕會加速健保破產我們的醫療資源的分布包含就醫的需求困境其實都不一樣所以你現在在談其一補助其實可能會衍生其他公平性的問題\n\n4\n00:01:50,620 --> 00:02:14,360\n再來就是政策的這個正當性那倘若這個提案真的通過了那它將會併入現在的政府負擔36%裡面對於政府端而言它本來就要負擔一定的比例那所以它在政府端它其實首當其衝其實是保費的這樣的一個短收但是對於民眾端而言的話它所帶來也是疊加的負擔的這樣的一個架軸\n\n5\n00:02:15,741 --> 00:02:42,408\n開辦以來主要來源都是壽星階級但漸漸的得要正視高齡社會還有少子化健保保費繳交到人變少就得進行改革只是這個要補助那個也要增加預算影響到政府負擔的36%再加上法案沒有指定用途財源供不應求未來都是一大問題再加上長輩們大多是慢性疾病每一年健保費用在\n\n6\n00:02:42,728 --> 00:02:51,972\n當初在總統大選老人健保補助確實是候選人們的政見草案說要排富但銀髮族們或許才是最有能力消費的保費又要找年輕世代要\n\n7\n00:03:08,178 --> 00:03:33,559\n專家也說,把多的稅收增加就醫知識、健保長照的未來投資才是長遠之計。Q&A新聞好,我想這一則新聞的內容他也恰恰地點出了在野黨提案補助老人健保費所帶來的一些問題那麼這個減輕經濟弱勢的負擔我覺得是大力支持的\n\n8\n00:03:34,640 --> 00:03:56,058\n本席在衛環委員會也質詢了很多次也要求衛福部應該要擴大對經濟弱勢長者的照顧可是在這個專題報導裡面講得非常清楚就是在野黨現在的提案幾乎完全是一種齊頭式的補助這對年輕人來講是一個世代正義的問題同時也是對這個年輕世代再扒一層皮\n\n9\n00:04:02,583 --> 00:04:17,665\n所以我們現在對於這個低收入戶中低收入戶的認定標準依照各縣市公佈的這個最低生活費的基準家庭平均收入低於最低生活費是低收入戶那麼家庭\n\n10\n00:04:36,429 --> 00:04:54,262\n其實我主要還是要強調的就是說由經濟弱勢的底層往上去檢討然後擴大補助的這個可能性才是真正這個照顧弱勢而且符合公平正義的一個正確模式不知道部長對於我剛剛的講法認不認同\n\n11\n00:04:57,216 --> 00:04:58,017\n有關健保合理支付．\n\n12\n00:05:16,104 --> 00:05:35,318\n他是只有去掉這個金字塔頂端的這些長者其他是無差別式的全部列入補助的對象這將會發生非常大的問題那長者在退休之後大部分他們的健保費有可能都是依附在子女上的這個頭包\n\n13\n00:05:37,239 --> 00:05:47,632\n所以探討經濟的狀況可能也是我們必須要去檢視整個家庭的情形那依照這個主計總署公布的資料\n\n14\n00:05:49,073 --> 00:06:13,722\n台灣家庭財富的中位數是894萬元那麼在在野黨的這個提案裡面呢有83%的長者是全部補助的那麼在這83%的長者的家庭當中如果家庭財富超過2000萬的我們補助他健保費部長你覺得這樣子合理嗎\n\n15\n00:06:20,572 --> 00:06:35,059\n這83%的長者當中呢假設他的存款是有超過200萬元甚至有更多好幾百萬甚至破千萬的那他可能不只是生活無憂這樣子的長者\n\n16\n00:06:35,479 --> 00:06:35,619\n應該不用\n\n17\n00:07:03,479 --> 00:07:30,428\n好那再來我想這個健保的概念是一個互助的一個制度那麼我們要擴大對弱勢長者的照顧這絕對是一個正確的方向但是在以目前這個在野黨的提案裡面不論它是不是會直接影響到健保的財政那它絕對絕對是增加未來年輕人的負擔\n\n18\n00:07:31,628 --> 00:07:51,071\n所以我必須要在這裡強調那在野黨提案的內容有很多可能是政府編列預算但是拿這個有限的資源去補助到經濟優渥的家庭所以部長你認不認為說這樣是一個很大的問題\n\n19\n00:07:52,281 --> 00:07:58,624\n我提到這些都是有所本這些數據也都是可以被統計出來的數據甚至還有其他經濟狀況的數據我很早就也跟衛福部說了\n\n20\n00:08:14,791 --> 00:08:41,516\n衛福部應該要把這些統計數據全部拿出來讓在野黨讓所有的民眾知道在他們的提案當中呢有多少金分是去補助到這些經濟優渥的家庭那他們的提案要補助的對象有多少是擁有這個兩棟三棟房子的家庭那有多少的存款有多少的長者的存款是有好幾百萬的那這些呢\n\n21\n00:08:42,616 --> 00:09:06,239\n我想以就是說在野黨這樣子提案這種濫用國家公帑的這個行為我覺得這些經濟狀況優渥的長者有可能得到補助之後甚至搞不好他們不會去感謝這些提案的委員反而會認為說為什麼不把這些錢用在更需要幫助的人身上\n\n22\n00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:34,690\n那我想這些數據我希望說部長你們可以在一週內去跟相關部會整理出來那在院長協商的時候在院長主持協商的時候你們可以提出這些有力的證據作為佐證那我不希望說因為這件事情去要數據這個事情我其實在更早之前我已經有提醒你們了\n\n23\n00:09:35,370 --> 00:09:44,097\n那我不曉得你們有遇到什麼樣的困難還是就是說這是沒有問題我們可以盡快來拿到這些數據來作證?\n\n24\n00:09:47,236 --> 00:09:59,940\n我們相關的部門其實一直在蒐集相關的數據那是不是會牽涉到個人隱私的這個我再確認一下能拿多少我們就拿多少那第二個其實我們簡單的一個數據他如果說要求要淨稅20%以上的\n\n25\n00:10:05,407 --> 00:10:22,216\n那這個我們統計起來他大概他的收入的中位數可能是每個月15萬可是現在的年輕人你挑中位數差不多3萬7千5的中來3萬7千5的要去互保會月入15萬的要去補助單其實這對世代正義是不好的\n\n26\n00:10:30,901 --> 00:10:52,448\n對阿這個確實我想在我們再提一個案子的時候也需要面面俱到阿那現在其實年輕人在少子化之後壓力也是越來越重所以這個部分還是要請各位委員要三思阿那這個數據要拜託你們可以很用力的趕快一周內趕快調出來好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n16031\t43334\t謝謝主席,麻煩請部長請邱部長委員好部長好,我們先來看一下這個TVBS的這個新聞的專題報告不過為此也估算了一下這一項修正草案恐怕還要多加300多億元的預算雖然美青年稍讓有長輩需要照顧的家庭可以減輕負擔但如果未來保費入不敷出是不是又要調漲年輕世代的健保費\n44535\t51159\t其實在特別預算的支持再加上補充保費讓健保連續5年的赤字終於在2022年由戶轉好那個我想這樣\n64087\t81527\t﹗\n81587\t109680\t立委提出《老人福利法修正草案》增訂綜合所得稅20%以下的65歲長者免繳交健保費估算要花到359億元衛福部憂心法案通過後保費短收節於誘變負數醫改會認為恐怕會加速健保破產我們的醫療資源的分布包含就醫的需求困境其實都不一樣所以你現在在談其一補助其實可能會衍生其他公平性的問題\n110620\t134360\t再來就是政策的這個正當性那倘若這個提案真的通過了那它將會併入現在的政府負擔36%裡面對於政府端而言它本來就要負擔一定的比例那所以它在政府端它其實首當其衝其實是保費的這樣的一個短收但是對於民眾端而言的話它所帶來也是疊加的負擔的這樣的一個架軸\n135741\t162408\t開辦以來主要來源都是壽星階級但漸漸的得要正視高齡社會還有少子化健保保費繳交到人變少就得進行改革只是這個要補助那個也要增加預算影響到政府負擔的36%再加上法案沒有指定用途財源供不應求未來都是一大問題再加上長輩們大多是慢性疾病每一年健保費用在\n162728\t171972\t當初在總統大選老人健保補助確實是候選人們的政見草案說要排富但銀髮族們或許才是最有能力消費的保費又要找年輕世代要\n188178\t213559\t專家也說,把多的稅收增加就醫知識、健保長照的未來投資才是長遠之計。Q&A新聞好,我想這一則新聞的內容他也恰恰地點出了在野黨提案補助老人健保費所帶來的一些問題那麼這個減輕經濟弱勢的負擔我覺得是大力支持的\n214640\t236058\t本席在衛環委員會也質詢了很多次也要求衛福部應該要擴大對經濟弱勢長者的照顧可是在這個專題報導裡面講得非常清楚就是在野黨現在的提案幾乎完全是一種齊頭式的補助這對年輕人來講是一個世代正義的問題同時也是對這個年輕世代再扒一層皮\n242583\t257665\t所以我們現在對於這個低收入戶中低收入戶的認定標準依照各縣市公佈的這個最低生活費的基準家庭平均收入低於最低生活費是低收入戶那麼家庭\n258166\t275128\t陳瑩議員：陳瑩\n276429\t294262\t其實我主要還是要強調的就是說由經濟弱勢的底層往上去檢討然後擴大補助的這個可能性才是真正這個照顧弱勢而且符合公平正義的一個正確模式不知道部長對於我剛剛的講法認不認同\n297216\t298017\t有關健保合理支付．\n316104\t335318\t他是只有去掉這個金字塔頂端的這些長者其他是無差別式的全部列入補助的對象這將會發生非常大的問題那長者在退休之後大部分他們的健保費有可能都是依附在子女上的這個頭包\n337239\t347632\t所以探討經濟的狀況可能也是我們必須要去檢視整個家庭的情形那依照這個主計總署公布的資料\n349073\t373722\t台灣家庭財富的中位數是894萬元那麼在在野黨的這個提案裡面呢有83%的長者是全部補助的那麼在這83%的長者的家庭當中如果家庭財富超過2000萬的我們補助他健保費部長你覺得這樣子合理嗎\n380572\t395059\t這83%的長者當中呢假設他的存款是有超過200萬元甚至有更多好幾百萬甚至破千萬的那他可能不只是生活無憂這樣子的長者\n395479\t395619\t應該不用\n423479\t450428\t好 那再來我想這個健保的概念是一個互助的一個制度那麼我們要擴大對弱勢長者的照顧這絕對是一個正確的方向但是在以目前這個在野黨的提案裡面不論它是不是會直接影響到健保的財政那它絕對絕對是增加未來年輕人的負擔\n451628\t471071\t所以我必須要在這裡強調那在野黨提案的內容有很多可能是政府編列預算但是拿這個有限的資源去補助到經濟優渥的家庭所以部長你認不認為說這樣是一個很大的問題\n472281\t478624\t我提到這些都是有所本這些數據也都是可以被統計出來的數據甚至還有其他經濟狀況的數據我很早就也跟衛福部說了\n494791\t521516\t衛福部應該要把這些統計數據全部拿出來讓在野黨讓所有的民眾知道在他們的提案當中呢有多少金分是去補助到這些經濟優渥的家庭那他們的提案要補助的對象有多少是擁有這個兩棟三棟房子的家庭那有多少的存款有多少的長者的存款是有好幾百萬的那這些呢\n522616\t546239\t我想以就是說在野黨這樣子提案這種濫用國家公帑的這個行為我覺得這些經濟狀況優渥的長者有可能得到補助之後甚至搞不好他們不會去感謝這些提案的委員反而會認為說為什麼不把這些錢用在更需要幫助的人身上\n547520\t574690\t那我想這些數據我希望說部長你們可以在一週內去跟相關部會整理出來那在院長協商的時候在院長主持協商的時候你們可以提出這些有力的證據作為佐證那我不希望說因為這件事情去要數據這個事情我其實在更早之前我已經有提醒你們了\n575370\t584097\t那我不曉得你們有遇到什麼樣的困難還是就是說這是沒有問題我們可以盡快來拿到這些數據來作證?\n587236\t599940\t我們相關的部門其實一直在蒐集相關的數據那是不是會牽涉到個人隱私的這個我再確認一下能拿多少我們就拿多少那第二個其實我們簡單的一個數據他如果說要求要淨稅20%以上的\n605407\t622216\t那這個我們統計起來他大概他的收入的中位數可能是每個月15萬可是現在的年輕人你挑中位數差不多3萬7千5的中來3萬7千5的要去互保會月入15萬的要去補助單其實這對世代正義是不好的\n630901\t652448\t對阿 這個確實我想在我們再提一個案子的時候也需要面面俱到阿那現在其實年輕人在少子化之後壓力也是越來越重所以這個部分還是要請各位委員要三思阿那這個數據要拜託你們可以很用力的趕快一周內趕快調出來好 謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席,麻煩請部長請邱部長委員好部長好,我們先來看一下這個TVBS的這個新聞的專題報告不過為此也估算了一下這一項修正草案恐怕還要多加300多億元的預算雖然美青年稍讓有長輩需要照顧的家庭可以減輕負擔但如果未來保費入不敷出是不是又要調漲年輕世代的健保費\n其實在特別預算的支持再加上補充保費讓健保連續5年的赤字終於在2022年由戶轉好那個我想這樣\n﹗\n立委提出《老人福利法修正草案》增訂綜合所得稅20%以下的65歲長者免繳交健保費估算要花到359億元衛福部憂心法案通過後保費短收節於誘變負數醫改會認為恐怕會加速健保破產我們的醫療資源的分布包含就醫的需求困境其實都不一樣所以你現在在談其一補助其實可能會衍生其他公平性的問題\n再來就是政策的這個正當性那倘若這個提案真的通過了那它將會併入現在的政府負擔36%裡面對於政府端而言它本來就要負擔一定的比例那所以它在政府端它其實首當其衝其實是保費的這樣的一個短收但是對於民眾端而言的話它所帶來也是疊加的負擔的這樣的一個架軸\n開辦以來主要來源都是壽星階級但漸漸的得要正視高齡社會還有少子化健保保費繳交到人變少就得進行改革只是這個要補助那個也要增加預算影響到政府負擔的36%再加上法案沒有指定用途財源供不應求未來都是一大問題再加上長輩們大多是慢性疾病每一年健保費用在\n當初在總統大選老人健保補助確實是候選人們的政見草案說要排富但銀髮族們或許才是最有能力消費的保費又要找年輕世代要\n專家也說,把多的稅收增加就醫知識、健保長照的未來投資才是長遠之計。Q&A新聞好,我想這一則新聞的內容他也恰恰地點出了在野黨提案補助老人健保費所帶來的一些問題那麼這個減輕經濟弱勢的負擔我覺得是大力支持的\n本席在衛環委員會也質詢了很多次也要求衛福部應該要擴大對經濟弱勢長者的照顧可是在這個專題報導裡面講得非常清楚就是在野黨現在的提案幾乎完全是一種齊頭式的補助這對年輕人來講是一個世代正義的問題同時也是對這個年輕世代再扒一層皮\n所以我們現在對於這個低收入戶中低收入戶的認定標準依照各縣市公佈的這個最低生活費的基準家庭平均收入低於最低生活費是低收入戶那麼家庭\n陳瑩議員：陳瑩\n其實我主要還是要強調的就是說由經濟弱勢的底層往上去檢討然後擴大補助的這個可能性才是真正這個照顧弱勢而且符合公平正義的一個正確模式不知道部長對於我剛剛的講法認不認同\n有關健保合理支付．\n他是只有去掉這個金字塔頂端的這些長者其他是無差別式的全部列入補助的對象這將會發生非常大的問題那長者在退休之後大部分他們的健保費有可能都是依附在子女上的這個頭包\n所以探討經濟的狀況可能也是我們必須要去檢視整個家庭的情形那依照這個主計總署公布的資料\n台灣家庭財富的中位數是894萬元那麼在在野黨的這個提案裡面呢有83%的長者是全部補助的那麼在這83%的長者的家庭當中如果家庭財富超過2000萬的我們補助他健保費部長你覺得這樣子合理嗎\n這83%的長者當中呢假設他的存款是有超過200萬元甚至有更多好幾百萬甚至破千萬的那他可能不只是生活無憂這樣子的長者\n應該不用\n好 那再來我想這個健保的概念是一個互助的一個制度那麼我們要擴大對弱勢長者的照顧這絕對是一個正確的方向但是在以目前這個在野黨的提案裡面不論它是不是會直接影響到健保的財政那它絕對絕對是增加未來年輕人的負擔\n所以我必須要在這裡強調那在野黨提案的內容有很多可能是政府編列預算但是拿這個有限的資源去補助到經濟優渥的家庭所以部長你認不認為說這樣是一個很大的問題\n我提到這些都是有所本這些數據也都是可以被統計出來的數據甚至還有其他經濟狀況的數據我很早就也跟衛福部說了\n衛福部應該要把這些統計數據全部拿出來讓在野黨讓所有的民眾知道在他們的提案當中呢有多少金分是去補助到這些經濟優渥的家庭那他們的提案要補助的對象有多少是擁有這個兩棟三棟房子的家庭那有多少的存款有多少的長者的存款是有好幾百萬的那這些呢\n我想以就是說在野黨這樣子提案這種濫用國家公帑的這個行為我覺得這些經濟狀況優渥的長者有可能得到補助之後甚至搞不好他們不會去感謝這些提案的委員反而會認為說為什麼不把這些錢用在更需要幫助的人身上\n那我想這些數據我希望說部長你們可以在一週內去跟相關部會整理出來那在院長協商的時候在院長主持協商的時候你們可以提出這些有力的證據作為佐證那我不希望說因為這件事情去要數據這個事情我其實在更早之前我已經有提醒你們了\n那我不曉得你們有遇到什麼樣的困難還是就是說這是沒有問題我們可以盡快來拿到這些數據來作證?\n我們相關的部門其實一直在蒐集相關的數據那是不是會牽涉到個人隱私的這個我再確認一下能拿多少我們就拿多少那第二個其實我們簡單的一個數據他如果說要求要淨稅20%以上的\n那這個我們統計起來他大概他的收入的中位數可能是每個月15萬可是現在的年輕人你挑中位數差不多3萬7千5的中來3萬7千5的要去互保會月入15萬的要去補助單其實這對世代正義是不好的\n對阿 這個確實我想在我們再提一個案子的時候也需要面面俱到阿那現在其實年輕人在少子化之後壓力也是越來越重所以這個部分還是要請各位委員要三思阿那這個數據要拜託你們可以很用力的趕快一周內趕快調出來好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:16.031 --> 00:43.334\n謝謝主席,麻煩請部長請邱部長委員好部長好,我們先來看一下這個TVBS的這個新聞的專題報告不過為此也估算了一下這一項修正草案恐怕還要多加300多億元的預算雖然美青年稍讓有長輩需要照顧的家庭可以減輕負擔但如果未來保費入不敷出是不是又要調漲年輕世代的健保費\n\n00:44.535 --> 00:51.159\n其實在特別預算的支持再加上補充保費讓健保連續5年的赤字終於在2022年由戶轉好那個我想這樣\n\n01:21.587 --> 01:49.680\n立委提出《老人福利法修正草案》增訂綜合所得稅20%以下的65歲長者免繳交健保費估算要花到359億元衛福部憂心法案通過後保費短收節於誘變負數醫改會認為恐怕會加速健保破產我們的醫療資源的分布包含就醫的需求困境其實都不一樣所以你現在在談其一補助其實可能會衍生其他公平性的問題\n\n01:50.620 --> 02:14.360\n再來就是政策的這個正當性那倘若這個提案真的通過了那它將會併入現在的政府負擔36%裡面對於政府端而言它本來就要負擔一定的比例那所以它在政府端它其實首當其衝其實是保費的這樣的一個短收但是對於民眾端而言的話它所帶來也是疊加的負擔的這樣的一個架軸\n\n02:15.741 --> 02:42.408\n開辦以來主要來源都是壽星階級但漸漸的得要正視高齡社會還有少子化健保保費繳交到人變少就得進行改革只是這個要補助那個也要增加預算影響到政府負擔的36%再加上法案沒有指定用途財源供不應求未來都是一大問題再加上長輩們大多是慢性疾病每一年健保費用在\n\n02:42.728 --> 02:51.972\n當初在總統大選老人健保補助確實是候選人們的政見草案說要排富但銀髮族們或許才是最有能力消費的保費又要找年輕世代要\n\n03:08.178 --> 03:33.559\n專家也說,把多的稅收增加就醫知識、健保長照的未來投資才是長遠之計。Q&A新聞好,我想這一則新聞的內容他也恰恰地點出了在野黨提案補助老人健保費所帶來的一些問題那麼這個減輕經濟弱勢的負擔我覺得是大力支持的\n\n03:34.640 --> 03:56.058\n本席在衛環委員會也質詢了很多次也要求衛福部應該要擴大對經濟弱勢長者的照顧可是在這個專題報導裡面講得非常清楚就是在野黨現在的提案幾乎完全是一種齊頭式的補助這對年輕人來講是一個世代正義的問題同時也是對這個年輕世代再扒一層皮\n\n04:02.583 --> 04:17.665\n所以我們現在對於這個低收入戶中低收入戶的認定標準依照各縣市公佈的這個最低生活費的基準家庭平均收入低於最低生活費是低收入戶那麼家庭\n\n04:36.429 --> 04:54.262\n其實我主要還是要強調的就是說由經濟弱勢的底層往上去檢討然後擴大補助的這個可能性才是真正這個照顧弱勢而且符合公平正義的一個正確模式不知道部長對於我剛剛的講法認不認同\n\n04:57.216 --> 04:58.017\n有關健保合理支付．\n\n05:16.104 --> 05:35.318\n他是只有去掉這個金字塔頂端的這些長者其他是無差別式的全部列入補助的對象這將會發生非常大的問題那長者在退休之後大部分他們的健保費有可能都是依附在子女上的這個頭包\n\n05:37.239 --> 05:47.632\n所以探討經濟的狀況可能也是我們必須要去檢視整個家庭的情形那依照這個主計總署公布的資料\n\n05:49.073 --> 06:13.722\n台灣家庭財富的中位數是894萬元那麼在在野黨的這個提案裡面呢有83%的長者是全部補助的那麼在這83%的長者的家庭當中如果家庭財富超過2000萬的我們補助他健保費部長你覺得這樣子合理嗎\n\n06:20.572 --> 06:35.059\n這83%的長者當中呢假設他的存款是有超過200萬元甚至有更多好幾百萬甚至破千萬的那他可能不只是生活無憂這樣子的長者\n\n06:35.479 --> 06:35.619\n應該不用\n\n07:03.479 --> 07:30.428\n好那再來我想這個健保的概念是一個互助的一個制度那麼我們要擴大對弱勢長者的照顧這絕對是一個正確的方向但是在以目前這個在野黨的提案裡面不論它是不是會直接影響到健保的財政那它絕對絕對是增加未來年輕人的負擔\n\n07:31.628 --> 07:51.071\n所以我必須要在這裡強調那在野黨提案的內容有很多可能是政府編列預算但是拿這個有限的資源去補助到經濟優渥的家庭所以部長你認不認為說這樣是一個很大的問題\n\n07:52.281 --> 07:58.624\n我提到這些都是有所本這些數據也都是可以被統計出來的數據甚至還有其他經濟狀況的數據我很早就也跟衛福部說了\n\n08:14.791 --> 08:41.516\n衛福部應該要把這些統計數據全部拿出來讓在野黨讓所有的民眾知道在他們的提案當中呢有多少金分是去補助到這些經濟優渥的家庭那他們的提案要補助的對象有多少是擁有這個兩棟三棟房子的家庭那有多少的存款有多少的長者的存款是有好幾百萬的那這些呢\n\n08:42.616 --> 09:06.239\n我想以就是說在野黨這樣子提案這種濫用國家公帑的這個行為我覺得這些經濟狀況優渥的長者有可能得到補助之後甚至搞不好他們不會去感謝這些提案的委員反而會認為說為什麼不把這些錢用在更需要幫助的人身上\n\n09:07.520 --> 09:34.690\n那我想這些數據我希望說部長你們可以在一週內去跟相關部會整理出來那在院長協商的時候在院長主持協商的時候你們可以提出這些有力的證據作為佐證那我不希望說因為這件事情去要數據這個事情我其實在更早之前我已經有提醒你們了\n\n09:35.370 --> 09:44.097\n那我不曉得你們有遇到什麼樣的困難還是就是說這是沒有問題我們可以盡快來拿到這些數據來作證?\n\n09:47.236 --> 09:59.940\n我們相關的部門其實一直在蒐集相關的數據那是不是會牽涉到個人隱私的這個我再確認一下能拿多少我們就拿多少那第二個其實我們簡單的一個數據他如果說要求要淨稅20%以上的\n\n10:05.407 --> 10:22.216\n那這個我們統計起來他大概他的收入的中位數可能是每個月15萬可是現在的年輕人你挑中位數差不多3萬7千5的中來3萬7千5的要去互保會月入15萬的要去補助單其實這對世代正義是不好的\n\n10:30.901 --> 10:52.448\n對阿這個確實我想在我們再提一個案子的時候也需要面面俱到阿那現在其實年輕人在少子化之後壓力也是越來越重所以這個部分還是要請各位委員要三思阿那這個數據要拜託你們可以很用力的趕快一周內趕快調出來好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":16.031,"end":43.334,"text":"謝謝主席,麻煩請部長請邱部長委員好部長好,我們先來看一下這個TVBS的這個新聞的專題報告不過為此也估算了一下這一項修正草案恐怕還要多加300多億元的預算雖然美青年稍讓有長輩需要照顧的家庭可以減輕負擔但如果未來保費入不敷出是不是又要調漲年輕世代的健保費"},{"start":44.535,"end":51.159,"text":"其實在特別預算的支持再加上補充保費讓健保連續5年的赤字終於在2022年由戶轉好那個我想這樣"},{"start":64.087,"end":81.527,"text":"﹗"},{"start":81.587,"end":109.68,"text":"立委提出《老人福利法修正草案》增訂綜合所得稅20%以下的65歲長者免繳交健保費估算要花到359億元衛福部憂心法案通過後保費短收節於誘變負數醫改會認為恐怕會加速健保破產我們的醫療資源的分布包含就醫的需求困境其實都不一樣所以你現在在談其一補助其實可能會衍生其他公平性的問題"},{"start":110.62,"end":134.36,"text":"再來就是政策的這個正當性那倘若這個提案真的通過了那它將會併入現在的政府負擔36%裡面對於政府端而言它本來就要負擔一定的比例那所以它在政府端它其實首當其衝其實是保費的這樣的一個短收但是對於民眾端而言的話它所帶來也是疊加的負擔的這樣的一個架軸"},{"start":135.741,"end":162.408,"text":"開辦以來主要來源都是壽星階級但漸漸的得要正視高齡社會還有少子化健保保費繳交到人變少就得進行改革只是這個要補助那個也要增加預算影響到政府負擔的36%再加上法案沒有指定用途財源供不應求未來都是一大問題再加上長輩們大多是慢性疾病每一年健保費用在"},{"start":162.728,"end":171.972,"text":"當初在總統大選老人健保補助確實是候選人們的政見草案說要排富但銀髮族們或許才是最有能力消費的保費又要找年輕世代要"},{"start":188.178,"end":213.559,"text":"專家也說,把多的稅收增加就醫知識、健保長照的未來投資才是長遠之計。Q&A新聞好,我想這一則新聞的內容他也恰恰地點出了在野黨提案補助老人健保費所帶來的一些問題那麼這個減輕經濟弱勢的負擔我覺得是大力支持的"},{"start":214.64,"end":236.058,"text":"本席在衛環委員會也質詢了很多次也要求衛福部應該要擴大對經濟弱勢長者的照顧可是在這個專題報導裡面講得非常清楚就是在野黨現在的提案幾乎完全是一種齊頭式的補助這對年輕人來講是一個世代正義的問題同時也是對這個年輕世代再扒一層皮"},{"start":242.583,"end":257.665,"text":"所以我們現在對於這個低收入戶中低收入戶的認定標準依照各縣市公佈的這個最低生活費的基準家庭平均收入低於最低生活費是低收入戶那麼家庭"},{"start":258.166,"end":275.128,"text":"陳瑩議員：陳瑩"},{"start":276.429,"end":294.262,"text":"其實我主要還是要強調的就是說由經濟弱勢的底層往上去檢討然後擴大補助的這個可能性才是真正這個照顧弱勢而且符合公平正義的一個正確模式不知道部長對於我剛剛的講法認不認同"},{"start":297.216,"end":298.017,"text":"有關健保合理支付．"},{"start":316.104,"end":335.318,"text":"他是只有去掉這個金字塔頂端的這些長者其他是無差別式的全部列入補助的對象這將會發生非常大的問題那長者在退休之後大部分他們的健保費有可能都是依附在子女上的這個頭包"},{"start":337.239,"end":347.632,"text":"所以探討經濟的狀況可能也是我們必須要去檢視整個家庭的情形那依照這個主計總署公布的資料"},{"start":349.073,"end":373.722,"text":"台灣家庭財富的中位數是894萬元那麼在在野黨的這個提案裡面呢有83%的長者是全部補助的那麼在這83%的長者的家庭當中如果家庭財富超過2000萬的我們補助他健保費部長你覺得這樣子合理嗎"},{"start":380.572,"end":395.059,"text":"這83%的長者當中呢假設他的存款是有超過200萬元甚至有更多好幾百萬甚至破千萬的那他可能不只是生活無憂這樣子的長者"},{"start":395.479,"end":395.619,"text":"應該不用"},{"start":423.479,"end":450.428,"text":"好 那再來我想這個健保的概念是一個互助的一個制度那麼我們要擴大對弱勢長者的照顧這絕對是一個正確的方向但是在以目前這個在野黨的提案裡面不論它是不是會直接影響到健保的財政那它絕對絕對是增加未來年輕人的負擔"},{"start":451.628,"end":471.071,"text":"所以我必須要在這裡強調那在野黨提案的內容有很多可能是政府編列預算但是拿這個有限的資源去補助到經濟優渥的家庭所以部長你認不認為說這樣是一個很大的問題"},{"start":472.281,"end":478.624,"text":"我提到這些都是有所本這些數據也都是可以被統計出來的數據甚至還有其他經濟狀況的數據我很早就也跟衛福部說了"},{"start":494.791,"end":521.516,"text":"衛福部應該要把這些統計數據全部拿出來讓在野黨讓所有的民眾知道在他們的提案當中呢有多少金分是去補助到這些經濟優渥的家庭那他們的提案要補助的對象有多少是擁有這個兩棟三棟房子的家庭那有多少的存款有多少的長者的存款是有好幾百萬的那這些呢"},{"start":522.616,"end":546.239,"text":"我想以就是說在野黨這樣子提案這種濫用國家公帑的這個行為我覺得這些經濟狀況優渥的長者有可能得到補助之後甚至搞不好他們不會去感謝這些提案的委員反而會認為說為什麼不把這些錢用在更需要幫助的人身上"},{"start":547.52,"end":574.69,"text":"那我想這些數據我希望說部長你們可以在一週內去跟相關部會整理出來那在院長協商的時候在院長主持協商的時候你們可以提出這些有力的證據作為佐證那我不希望說因為這件事情去要數據這個事情我其實在更早之前我已經有提醒你們了"},{"start":575.37,"end":584.097,"text":"那我不曉得你們有遇到什麼樣的困難還是就是說這是沒有問題我們可以盡快來拿到這些數據來作證?"},{"start":587.236,"end":599.94,"text":"我們相關的部門其實一直在蒐集相關的數據那是不是會牽涉到個人隱私的這個我再確認一下能拿多少我們就拿多少那第二個其實我們簡單的一個數據他如果說要求要淨稅20%以上的"},{"start":605.407,"end":622.216,"text":"那這個我們統計起來他大概他的收入的中位數可能是每個月15萬可是現在的年輕人你挑中位數差不多3萬7千5的中來3萬7千5的要去互保會月入15萬的要去補助單其實這對世代正義是不好的"},{"start":630.901,"end":652.448,"text":"對阿 這個確實我想在我們再提一個案子的時候也需要面面俱到阿那現在其實年輕人在少子化之後壓力也是越來越重所以這個部分還是要請各位委員要三思阿那這個數據要拜託你們可以很用力的趕快一周內趕快調出來好 謝謝"}]}}}}