{"id":154482,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/154482","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5ad2054f9b7cf4bda9f223124bd7c51abbafa62845183024e8e3eb0bf88d021c2ed63b081278be015ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"洪申翰","委員發言時間":"10:49:15 - 10:58:35","影片長度":"00:09:20","會議時間":"2024-07-03T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防、經濟委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：一、審查行政院函請審議「馬拉喀什世界貿易組織協定修正議定書」及其附件「漁業補貼協定」案。\n二、審查行政院函請審議「中華民國（臺灣）政府部分停止中華民國（臺灣）與薩爾瓦多共和國暨宏都拉斯共和國自由貿易協定施行文書」案。\n三、審查行政院函請審議我國與宏都拉斯共和國間自112年12月6日終止「中華民國（臺灣）與薩爾瓦多共和國暨宏都拉斯共和國自由貿易協定」案。）","type":"Clip","date":"2024-07-03","start_time":"2024-07-03T10:49:15+08:00","end_time":"2024-07-03T10:58:35+08:00","duration":560,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期外交及國防、經濟委員會第1次聯席會議","type":"聯席會議","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":1,"committees":[35,19],"id":"聯席會議-11-1-35,19-1"},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"gazette":{"lineno":535,"blocks":[["洪委員申翰：（10時49分）請外交部陳次長跟農業部黃次長。"],["主席：請兩位次長。"],["陳次長立國：洪委員好。"],["黃次長昭欽：洪委員好。"],["洪委員申翰：外交部跟農業部，我們今天要審查這兩個協定跟議定書，當然，這是一個很好的機會，之前其實有幾個在臺的外籍漁工組織有來拜訪我，跟我講到很多關於外籍漁工現在面對到的問題，尤其他們最常面對到的問題當然就是薪資的拖欠，有時候長達3個月、6個月都拿不到薪水，所以我的辦公室其實也常常接到很多NGO請我們幫忙，去協助這些外籍漁工薪水被拖欠的問題，要求漁業署給予協助、處理。也有很多雇主沒有幫外籍漁工保保險，所以當有船員死亡的時候，船員沒有拿到賠償，這都是我自己的辦公室遇到的真實案例。","次長，我們這幾年在遠洋漁業上面，受到國際上面的壓力大不大？"],["黃次長昭欽：報告委員，持續有受到國際上的壓力。"],["洪委員申翰：是，所以不論是2015年被歐盟列入打擊IUU漁業不合作國家的黃牌，或者是2020年、2022年又被美國列入「童工及強迫勞動製品清單」，這次在臺美21世紀貿易協定談判上面，其實我們的遠洋漁業也一直是被關注的對象。我想問次長，知不知道在今年5月的時候，歐盟其實有通過了一個企業永續盡職調查指令，也就是所謂的DD法，你知道嗎？"],["黃次長昭欽：是，瞭解。"],["洪委員申翰：目前這個法已經生效了，歐盟這個法其實有很多的專家都提醒，它很可能會衝擊到臺灣的遠洋漁業，我們之前拿掉了歐盟這個IUU的黃牌，但很多人擔心，不用多久，接下來又要面對這個DD法的制裁，這部分我想知道，目前漁業署或外交部有沒有做什麼相關的準備？"],["黃次長昭欽：報告委員，事實上我們現在針對漁業勞動以及人權的這個問題，持續在改善、改進當中，所以基本上像剛剛委員所說的薪資這個部分，我們已經立法，強制要求必須要直接匯入漁工的戶頭，還有相關的這些……"],["洪委員申翰：次長，我就直接問，好不好？"],["黃次長昭欽：是。"],["洪委員申翰：因為我們今天在外交及國防委員會，現在歐盟新立、新通過的這個企業永續盡職調查指令，它已經上路了，農業部有沒有對這個法規進行評估或影響的盤點？"],["黃次長昭欽：我們未來會持續關注這個議題。"],["洪委員申翰：所以還沒做嗎？"],["黃次長昭欽：是。"],["洪委員申翰：還沒做嗎？人家5月就通過，現在7月囉！"],["張署長致盛：跟委員報告，有幾個地方要澄清、說明一下。第一個，那個Due Diligence本來就是在我們整個漁業管理的部分，包括漁工的權利保障，本來就要做這些，這是第一個部分……"],["洪委員申翰：對。"],["張署長致盛：第二個部分，歐盟初步通過的法案其實是針對大企業的部分……"],["洪委員申翰：對，沒錯。"],["張署長致盛：我們遠洋漁船都是小的漁船，或者是其他，暫時不會受到影響。"],["洪委員申翰：但是你的遠洋漁船接下來如果要把貨賣給大的水產企業的時候，就會面對這些相對應的問題啊！"],["張署長致盛：所以我們現在從幾個面向，Due Diligence去查的幾個部分，包括勞權的部分、漁業管理的部分，我們必須把前端整個做好，才能夠因應後端這些整個的調查……"],["洪委員申翰：是，但是我現在要問的是，現在歐盟剛通過的這個法規，我們有沒有去做相關法規的影響評估或盤點？弄清楚我們現在遠洋漁業的運作方式裡面或模式裡面，哪些部分可能未來會受到影響，這部分農業部有沒有做了？我的問題是這個。"],["張署長致盛：目前評估會委託相關學者專家來做，但是我們內部初步檢視，目前法規會受到影響的部分，我們必須要去強化，或者是管理面的部分，不夠完善的地方、要去強化的地方，這部分我們內部已經做過評估。"],["洪委員申翰：哪些地方會受到影響？"],["張署長致盛：包括比如工時的登記，人家看你到底每天的工作是不是符合那個，我們在這些工時的登記必須更完善。另外，就是整個在保育或者是相關的部分，我們這些法規及文件部分必須更完善，這個以後在……"],["洪委員申翰：署長，你剛才說得沒錯，它可能會針對比較大的這些水產企業，對不對？"],["張署長致盛：是。"],["洪委員申翰：可是我們的這些遠洋漁船是供貨給他們啊！所以還是在一個供應鏈的關係上啊！"],["張署長致盛：沒有錯。"],["洪委員申翰：所以如果它去要求這些大的水產企業的時候，間接還是會影響到我們的遠洋漁業啊！"],["張署長致盛：跟委員報告，所以我們在漁業與人權裡面有強調一個部分，就是企業也要一起來做，包括FIP的部分，也就是把前端的管理面做好，日後我們再因應盡職調查的部分就不會受到影響。"],["洪委員申翰：那我直接問次長，好不好？次長……"],["黃次長昭欽：是。"],["洪委員申翰：因為去年羅秉成政委其實有講到，針對歐盟的企業永續盡職調查指令上路，政府會先研究跟提供相關的指引跟輔導。我想請問，現在農業部或漁業署，目前這個指引跟輔導已經出來了嗎？或者什麼時候會出來？"],["黃次長昭欽：目前指引的草案已經出來了，而且已經經過了幾次會議的溝通，在6月底的時候還會再召開一次……"],["洪委員申翰：6月底過了。"],["黃次長昭欽：在6月底的時候已經有召開過一次，因為相關部分還沒有達到共識，所以我們後續還會再邀集產業界及勞權方面的NGO團體來進行相關的……"],["洪委員申翰：預計什麼時候會出來？"],["張署長致盛：跟委員報告……"],["洪委員申翰：有沒有時間表？"],["張署長致盛：我們次長剛剛所解釋的，就是針對漁船上的管理指引跟Wi-Fi的指引部分，我們在資料蒐集完整以後，近期就會再召開一次會議，我們希望越早越好，因為這事對臺灣來講很重要。另外，我們針對Due Diligence，大概就是不同面向地去盤點法規的完備，這個部分我們會儘速來做。"],["洪委員申翰：剛剛次長講的應該是針對Wi-Fi部分的指引嘛！但我現在講的是針對DD的部分，這部分還沒有開始盤點，對不對？"],["張署長致盛：內部做盤點，還沒有請外部來協助，這部分我們後續會加快腳步。"],["洪委員申翰：署長，什麼時候？給一個時間點吧！我現在講的是針對DD法的部分，什麼時候能夠盤點結束？什麼時候指引跟輔導的措施可以推出？"],["張署長致盛：我們希望做一個務實而且也前瞻的……"],["洪委員申翰：當然、當然，我們都希望務實嘛！"],["張署長致盛：我們希望在年底以前能夠有初步的草案出來。"],["洪委員申翰：年底嗎？年底會不會太久？現在幾月？還有半年，年底？3個月內可不可以？"],["張署長致盛：好，我們盡力。"],["洪委員申翰：3個月內，好，這部分麻煩。主席，我還要再講一個事情。我知道現在在農業部的漁業與人權行動裡面，有講到說要做國際合作部分的深化，裡面有包括跟漁工的來源國要進行相關的合作，我有聽說你們要跟印尼簽署遠洋漁工保護的MOU，這個MOU目前的進展到什麼地方？"],["張署長致盛：目前已經把我們的草案提供給印尼，因為印尼有相關部會在負責勞工的部分，包括駐印尼的代表處也在協助、協商，目前在等印尼方面回饋相關的意見。另外，我要說明……"],["洪委員申翰：署長，這個MOU有沒有邀請我們自己國內的NGO或者是漁工團體一起進來討論？"],["張署長致盛：因為目前我們提出來的部分……"],["洪委員申翰：我聽說印尼給了一個冷屁股啊！"],["張署長致盛：我想不同國家的作業方式不一樣啦！但其實我們產業界，像鮪魚公會，也跟印尼的SPPI這些相關公協會在討論，民間跟政府都會來努力。"],["洪委員申翰：署長，我這邊做一個具體的要求，關於遠洋漁工保護的MOU，是不是可以找我們民間的團體，包括NGO、包括漁工的團體，一起拉進來再重新檢視一遍？到底它的內容符不符合第一線實質的需求，這件事情可不可以？我們就把這部分要再加強的工作給補上，可以嗎？"],["張署長致盛：謝謝委員的建議，不過我要說明，MOU是一個概念性的，而且重點是要雙方同意，而不是我們單方面的……"],["洪委員申翰：當然，可是重點要有效嘛！要能夠處理問題嘛！對不對？重點是這個嘛！"],["張署長致盛：是。"],["洪委員申翰：所以這可以嗎？"],["張署長致盛：可以，沒有問題。"],["洪委員申翰：好，剛才說到3個月的時間把DD法的相關評估，也包括指引跟輔導的措施要推出，好不好？這沒有問題。"],["主席：好，謝謝……"],["洪委員申翰：到時候推出請送外交及國防委員會，也包括經濟委員會，謝謝。"],["張署長致盛：這部分我們會努力，因為還有很多協商細節的部分，我們會來努力。"],["洪委員申翰：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝洪申翰委員，各位請回。印尼那個MOU是因為地緣政治問題，還是因為我們的法令不齊全？不用回答，我只提醒你，那個東西要寫清楚，謝謝。","接下來進行詢答的委員，張嘉郡委員、張嘉郡委員，張嘉郡委員不在。","請陳冠廷委員進行詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":66,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-1-35,19-1","speakers":["王定宇","陳亭妃","鄭正鈐","羅美玲","沈伯洋","鄭天財Sra 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\"報告委員事實上我們現在針對這個漁業勞動以及人權的這個問題的話那持續在做改善改進當中所以基本上像剛剛委員所說的薪資的這個部分我們已經立法強制要求這個必須要直接匯入到這個漁工的這個這個戶頭那還有相關的這些市長我就直接問好不好因為我們今天在外交國防委員會現在歐盟新立的新通過的這個企業永續禁止調查指令\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 143.75, \"end\": 143.99, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 143.99, \"end\": 144.57, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 144.57, \"end\": 144.73, \"score\": 0.884}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 144.73, \"end\": 144.89, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 144.89, \"end\": 145.11, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 145.11, \"end\": 147.432, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"針\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"漁\"}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"勞\"}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 147.432, \"end\": 147.492, \"score\": 0.723}, {\"word\": \"及\", \"start\": 147.492, \"end\": 147.612, \"score\": 0.889}, 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\"個\"}, {\"word\": \"M\", \"start\": 447.333, \"end\": 447.573, \"score\": 0.797}, {\"word\": \"O\", \"start\": 447.573, \"end\": 447.713, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"U\", \"start\": 447.713, \"end\": 447.853, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"目\", \"start\": 447.853, \"end\": 447.993, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"前\", \"start\": 447.993, \"end\": 448.093, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 448.093, \"end\": 448.373, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"展\", \"start\": 448.373, \"end\": 448.533, \"score\": 0.97}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 448.533, \"end\": 448.673, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 448.673, \"end\": 448.874, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 448.874, \"end\": 449.014, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 449.014, \"end\": 449.034, \"score\": 0.999}]}, {\"start\": 450.645, \"end\": 477.728, \"text\": 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\"text\": \"是所以這可以嗎?可以啊沒有問題那這個剛才說到兩個月的三個月的時間把滴滴法的相關的評估也包括指引輔導的措施要推出好不好這沒有問題那到時候推出的請送外交國防委員會也包括經濟委員會因為還有很多協商細節的部分我們會來努力好謝謝紅三二委員來各位請回\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 530.612, \"end\": 531.533, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 531.533, \"end\": 531.653, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 531.653, \"end\": 531.973, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 531.973, \"end\": 532.093, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 532.093, \"end\": 532.574, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}, {\"word\": \"?\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 532.574, \"end\": 532.674, \"score\": 0.827}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 532.674, \"end\": 532.714, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 532.714, \"end\": 532.854, \"score\": 0.821}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 532.854, \"end\": 532.994, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 532.994, \"end\": 534.075, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, 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\"start\": 547.846, \"end\": 548.006, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"各\", \"start\": 548.006, \"end\": 548.066, \"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 548.066, \"end\": 548.106, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"回\", \"start\": 548.106, \"end\": 548.126, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 557.076, \"end\": 557.298, \"score\": 0.84}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"印\", \"start\": 557.298, \"end\": 557.439, \"score\": 0.866}, {\"word\": \"尼\", \"start\": 557.439, \"end\": 557.601, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 557.601, \"end\": 557.742, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"M\", \"start\": 557.742, \"end\": 557.964, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"O\", \"start\": 557.964, \"end\": 558.145, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"U\", \"start\": 558.145, \"end\": 558.811, \"score\": 0.97}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 558.811, \"end\": 558.992, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 558.992, \"end\": 559.759, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 559.759, \"end\": 560.082, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"緣\"}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 560.082, \"end\": 560.263, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"治\", \"start\": 560.263, \"end\": 560.283, \"score\": 0.102}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,349 --> 00:00:02,753\n請這個外交部陳次長跟農業部的黃次長來兩位次長\n\n2\n00:00:11,923 --> 00:00:15,125\n委員會長、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席\n\n3\n00:00:33,063 --> 00:00:33,083\n二、審\n\n4\n00:01:00,305 --> 00:01:11,511\n那也很多這些僱主他沒有幫外籍公務來做保險所以當有船員死亡的時候才沒有拿到賠償那這都是我們自己辦公室遇到很真實的案例\n\n5\n00:01:13,546 --> 00:01:42,049\n市長,我們這幾年在遠洋漁業上面受到國際上面的壓力大不大?報告委員,持續一直都有受到國際上的壓力。是,所以不論是2015年被歐盟列入這個打擊IUU漁業不合作國家的黃牌,或者是2020年、2022年又被美國列入同工及強迫勞動製品清單,那這次在臺美21世紀貿易協定談判上面,其實我們的遠洋漁業也一直是受到被關注的對象。\n\n6\n00:01:43,010 --> 00:02:03,188\n那我想問次長知不知道我們在今年的今年五月的時候歐盟其實通過了一個竊永續禁職調查指令所謂的滴滴法知不知道知道嗎是那目前這個法其實生效了那歐盟這個法其實很多專家都提醒他很可能會衝擊到臺灣的原糧漁業\n\n7\n00:02:05,846 --> 00:02:20,124\n我們之前拿掉了歐盟IUU的黃牌但很多人擔心不用多久接下來又要面對滴滴法的制裁這部分我想知道目前漁業署或外交部我們有沒有做什麼相關的準備\n\n8\n00:02:23,750 --> 00:02:49,988\n報告委員事實上我們現在針對這個漁業勞動以及人權的這個問題的話那持續在做改善改進當中所以基本上像剛剛委員所說的薪資的這個部分我們已經立法強制要求這個必須要直接匯入到這個漁工的這個這個戶頭那還有相關的這些市長我就直接問好不好因為我們今天在外交國防委員會現在歐盟新立的新通過的這個企業永續禁止調查指令\n\n9\n00:02:51,189 --> 00:03:00,562\n那他已經上路了。我們農業部有沒有對這個法規進行評估或影響的方面?我們未來會持續關注這件事情。所以還沒做?是。還沒做嗎?\n\n10\n00:03:04,281 --> 00:03:30,373\n五月,人家五月就通過,現在七月囉。各位委員報告齁,大概有幾個地方要澄清啦齁,要說明一下。第一個那個DutyDiligence本來就是我們在整個做漁業管理的部分,包括漁工權利保重的部分,本來就要做這些部分。對。這大概第一個部分。那第二個部分,歐盟先初步通過的法案其實是針對大企業的部分。對,沒錯。那我們遠洋漁船都是小的那個漁船或者是比較那個。但是你的遠洋漁船,\n\n11\n00:03:31,013 --> 00:03:54,909\n接下來如果他把貨賣給大的水產企業的時候就會面對這個相對應的問題啊所以我們現在從幾個面向Duty你僅是他去查的幾個部分包括勞犬的部分包括這個漁業管理的部分我們必須把這個前端整個做好我們才能夠因應後端這些整個的調查是但是我現在要問的是說現在歐盟剛通過的這個法規我們有沒有去做相關的法規的影響評估或盤點\n\n12\n00:03:57,210 --> 00:04:24,002\n弄清楚我們可能現在我們的遠洋漁業的運作的方式裡面或模式裡面哪些部分可能未來會受到影響這部分農業部有沒有做了嗎?我的問題是這個嘛目前評估正在會委託相關學者專家來做但是我們內部初步檢視我們目前的法規會受到影響的部分我們必須要去強化或者是管理面的部分不過完善的地方要去強化的地方這個我們內部已經做過評估\n\n13\n00:04:24,642 --> 00:04:52,434\n那哪些地方會受到影響?包括我們比如說公使的登記啊公使的登記人家看你說你到底每天的工作是不是符合那個我們必須在這些公使的登記必須更完善那另外就是整個在保育啊或者是相關的部分我們這些法規的部分文件的部分必須更完善蘇洋你剛才說的沒錯他可能會針對比較是大的這些水產企業對不對可是我們的這些遠洋漁船是供貨給他們啊\n\n14\n00:04:53,695 --> 00:05:02,802\n所以你還是在一個供應鏈的關係上啊沒有錯所以如果他去要求這大的水產企業的時候間接的還是會影響到我們的遠洋漁業啊\n\n15\n00:05:05,169 --> 00:05:22,468\n所以我們在漁業與人權裏面有強調一個就是企業也要一起來做包括FIP的部分就是把前端這個管理面做好日後我們再因應這個禁止調查的部分就不會受到影響我直接問次長好不好次長我想問因為之前去年羅振偉有講到羅秉成政委其實有講到\n\n16\n00:05:25,070 --> 00:05:51,526\n針對歐盟的這個切永續禁止調查指令的上路那政府會先研究跟提供相關的指引跟輔導那我想問現在農業部或漁業署那目前這個指引跟輔導已經出來了嗎或什麼時候會出來目前指引的草案已經出來了而且已經經過了幾次會議的這樣的一個溝通那在六月底的時候還會再召開一次六月底過了\n\n17\n00:05:53,027 --> 00:05:53,467\n那預計什麼時候會出來?\n\n18\n00:06:08,840 --> 00:06:36,149\n跟委員報告有沒有時間表我們次長剛剛所解釋的就是針對漁船上的管理指引跟Wi-Fi的指引這部分我們大概近期資料收集完整以後近期就會再召開一次會議我們希望越早越好因為這是大概對臺灣來講很重要那另外我們針對duediligence大概就是不同面向的去盤點法規的完備那這個部分我們希望剛剛次長講的應該是針對Wi-Fi的部分的指引嘛但我現在講的是針對DD的部分的話那這部分還沒有開始盤點嘛對不對\n\n19\n00:06:38,389 --> 00:07:03,354\n內部做盤點還沒有請外部來協助。那這個我們後期再加快調某。需要什麼時候給一個時間點吧。什麼時候,我現在講的是針對滴滴法的部分。什麼時候能夠盤點結束?什麼時候指引跟輔導的措施可以推出?我們希望做一個務實而且也前瞻的。當然當然,我們都希望務實嘛。年底以前能夠有初步的查案能夠出來。年底嗎?年底會不會太久?現在幾月了?現在還有半年了,年底。三個月內可不可以?\n\n20\n00:07:04,638 --> 00:07:29,034\n好,我們盡力三個月內,好,那這部分麻煩,那我後面那個主席我再講一個事情喔我知道現在在農業部的業與人權行動裡面有講到說要做國際合作的部分的深化那你們有包括跟漁工的來源國要進行相關的合作我有聽說你們在這個要跟印尼簽署遠洋漁工保護的MOU那這個MOU目前的進展到什麼地方\n\n21\n00:07:30,645 --> 00:07:57,728\n目前我們已經把我們的草案提供給印尼那因為印尼他有相關部位在負責這個勞工的部分那目前包括駐印尼的代表處也在協助、協商那目前在等印尼方面的回饋相關的意見我想這個MOU有沒有邀請我們自己國內的NGO或者是漁工團體一起進來討論因為目前我們提出來的部分我聽說印尼\n\n22\n00:07:59,261 --> 00:07:59,281\n二、審\n\n23\n00:08:20,742 --> 00:08:20,762\n二、審\n\n24\n00:08:50,612 --> 00:09:08,126\n是所以這可以嗎?可以啊沒有問題那這個剛才說到兩個月的三個月的時間把滴滴法的相關的評估也包括指引輔導的措施要推出好不好這沒有問題那到時候推出的請送外交國防委員會也包括經濟委員會因為還有很多協商細節的部分我們會來努力好謝謝紅三二委員來各位請回\n\n25\n00:09:17,076 --> 00:09:20,283\n那個印尼那個MOU是因為地緣政治問題\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n349\t2753\t請這個外交部陳次長跟農業部的黃次長來兩位次長\n11923\t15125\t委員會長、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席\n33063\t33083\t二、審\n60305\t71511\t那也很多這些僱主他沒有幫外籍公務來做保險所以當有船員死亡的時候才沒有拿到賠償那這都是我們自己辦公室遇到很真實的案例\n73546\t102049\t市長,我們這幾年在遠洋漁業上面受到國際上面的壓力大不大?報告委員,持續一直都有受到國際上的壓力。是,所以不論是2015年被歐盟列入這個打擊IUU漁業不合作國家的黃牌,或者是2020年、2022年又被美國列入同工及強迫勞動製品清單,那這次在臺美21世紀貿易協定談判上面,其實我們的遠洋漁業也一直是受到被關注的對象。\n103010\t123188\t那我想問次長知不知道我們在今年的今年五月的時候歐盟其實通過了一個竊永續禁職調查指令所謂的滴滴法知不知道知道嗎是那目前這個法其實生效了那歐盟這個法其實很多專家都提醒他很可能會衝擊到臺灣的原糧漁業\n125846\t140124\t我們之前拿掉了歐盟IUU的黃牌但很多人擔心不用多久接下來又要面對滴滴法的制裁這部分我想知道目前漁業署或外交部我們有沒有做什麼相關的準備\n143750\t169988\t報告委員事實上我們現在針對這個漁業勞動以及人權的這個問題的話那持續在做改善改進當中所以基本上像剛剛委員所說的薪資的這個部分我們已經立法強制要求這個必須要直接匯入到這個漁工的這個這個戶頭那還有相關的這些市長我就直接問好不好因為我們今天在外交國防委員會現在歐盟新立的新通過的這個企業永續禁止調查指令\n171189\t180562\t那他已經上路了。我們農業部有沒有對這個法規進行評估或影響的方面?我們未來會持續關注這件事情。所以還沒做?是。還沒做嗎?\n184281\t210373\t五月,人家五月就通過,現在七月囉。各位委員報告齁,大概有幾個地方要澄清啦齁,要說明一下。第一個那個Duty Diligence本來就是我們在整個做漁業管理的部分,包括漁工權利保重的部分,本來就要做這些部分。對。這大概第一個部分。那第二個部分,歐盟先初步通過的法案其實是針對大企業的部分。對,沒錯。那我們遠洋漁船都是小的那個漁船或者是比較那個。但是你的遠洋漁船,\n211013\t234909\t接下來如果他把貨賣給大的水產企業的時候就會面對這個相對應的問題啊所以我們現在從幾個面向Duty你僅是他去查的幾個部分包括勞犬的部分包括這個漁業管理的部分我們必須把這個前端整個做好我們才能夠因應後端這些整個的調查是但是我現在要問的是說現在歐盟剛通過的這個法規我們有沒有去做相關的法規的影響評估或盤點\n237210\t264002\t弄清楚我們可能現在我們的遠洋漁業的運作的方式裡面或模式裡面哪些部分可能未來會受到影響這部分農業部有沒有做了嗎?我的問題是這個嘛目前評估正在會委託相關學者專家來做但是我們內部初步檢視我們目前的法規會受到影響的部分我們必須要去強化或者是管理面的部分不過完善的地方要去強化的地方這個我們內部已經做過評估\n264642\t292434\t那哪些地方會受到影響?包括我們比如說公使的登記啊公使的登記人家看你說你到底每天的工作是不是符合那個我們必須在這些公使的登記必須更完善那另外就是整個在保育啊或者是相關的部分我們這些法規的部分文件的部分必須更完善蘇洋你剛才說的沒錯他可能會針對比較是大的這些水產企業對不對可是我們的這些遠洋漁船是供貨給他們啊\n293695\t302802\t所以你還是在一個供應鏈的關係上啊沒有錯所以如果他去要求這大的水產企業的時候間接的還是會影響到我們的遠洋漁業啊\n305169\t322468\t所以我們在漁業與人權裏面有強調一個就是企業也要一起來做包括FIP的部分就是把前端這個管理面做好日後我們再因應這個禁止調查的部分就不會受到影響我直接問次長好不好次長我想問因為之前去年羅振偉有講到羅秉成政委其實有講到\n325070\t351526\t針對歐盟的這個切永續禁止調查指令的上路那政府會先研究跟提供相關的指引跟輔導那我想問現在農業部或漁業署那目前這個指引跟輔導已經出來了嗎或什麼時候會出來目前指引的草案已經出來了而且已經經過了幾次會議的這樣的一個溝通那在六月底的時候還會再召開一次六月底過了\n353027\t353467\t那預計什麼時候會出來?\n368840\t396149\t跟委員報告有沒有時間表我們次長剛剛所解釋的就是針對漁船上的管理指引跟Wi-Fi的指引這部分我們大概近期資料收集完整以後近期就會再召開一次會議我們希望越早越好因為這是大概對臺灣來講很重要那另外我們針對due diligence大概就是不同面向的去盤點法規的完備那這個部分我們希望剛剛次長講的應該是針對Wi-Fi的部分的指引嘛但我現在講的是針對DD的部分的話那這部分還沒有開始盤點嘛對不對\n398389\t423354\t內部做盤點還沒有請外部來協助。那這個我們後期再加快調某。需要什麼時候給一個時間點吧。什麼時候,我現在講的是針對滴滴法的部分。什麼時候能夠盤點結束?什麼時候指引跟輔導的措施可以推出?我們希望做一個務實而且也前瞻的。當然當然,我們都希望務實嘛。年底以前能夠有初步的查案能夠出來。年底嗎?年底會不會太久?現在幾月了?現在還有半年了,年底。三個月內可不可以?\n424638\t449034\t好,我們盡力三個月內,好,那這部分麻煩,那我後面那個主席我再講一個事情喔我知道現在在農業部的業與人權行動裡面有講到說要做國際合作的部分的深化那你們有包括跟漁工的來源國要進行相關的合作我有聽說你們在這個要跟印尼簽署遠洋漁工保護的MOU那這個MOU目前的進展到什麼地方\n450645\t477728\t目前我們已經把我們的草案提供給印尼那因為印尼他有相關部位在負責這個勞工的部分那目前包括駐印尼的代表處也在協助、協商那目前在等印尼方面的回饋相關的意見我想這個MOU有沒有邀請我們自己國內的NGO或者是漁工團體一起進來討論因為目前我們提出來的部分我聽說印尼\n479261\t479281\t二、審\n500742\t500762\t二、審\n530612\t548126\t是所以這可以嗎?可以啊沒有問題那這個剛才說到兩個月的三個月的時間把滴滴法的相關的評估也包括指引輔導的措施要推出好不好這沒有問題那到時候推出的請送外交國防委員會也包括經濟委員會因為還有很多協商細節的部分我們會來努力好謝謝紅三二委員來各位請回\n557076\t560283\t那個印尼那個MOU是因為地緣政治問題\n","txt":"請這個外交部陳次長跟農業部的黃次長來兩位次長\n委員會長、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席\n二、審\n那也很多這些僱主他沒有幫外籍公務來做保險所以當有船員死亡的時候才沒有拿到賠償那這都是我們自己辦公室遇到很真實的案例\n市長,我們這幾年在遠洋漁業上面受到國際上面的壓力大不大?報告委員,持續一直都有受到國際上的壓力。是,所以不論是2015年被歐盟列入這個打擊IUU漁業不合作國家的黃牌,或者是2020年、2022年又被美國列入同工及強迫勞動製品清單,那這次在臺美21世紀貿易協定談判上面,其實我們的遠洋漁業也一直是受到被關注的對象。\n那我想問次長知不知道我們在今年的今年五月的時候歐盟其實通過了一個竊永續禁職調查指令所謂的滴滴法知不知道知道嗎是那目前這個法其實生效了那歐盟這個法其實很多專家都提醒他很可能會衝擊到臺灣的原糧漁業\n我們之前拿掉了歐盟IUU的黃牌但很多人擔心不用多久接下來又要面對滴滴法的制裁這部分我想知道目前漁業署或外交部我們有沒有做什麼相關的準備\n報告委員事實上我們現在針對這個漁業勞動以及人權的這個問題的話那持續在做改善改進當中所以基本上像剛剛委員所說的薪資的這個部分我們已經立法強制要求這個必須要直接匯入到這個漁工的這個這個戶頭那還有相關的這些市長我就直接問好不好因為我們今天在外交國防委員會現在歐盟新立的新通過的這個企業永續禁止調查指令\n那他已經上路了。我們農業部有沒有對這個法規進行評估或影響的方面?我們未來會持續關注這件事情。所以還沒做?是。還沒做嗎?\n五月,人家五月就通過,現在七月囉。各位委員報告齁,大概有幾個地方要澄清啦齁,要說明一下。第一個那個Duty Diligence本來就是我們在整個做漁業管理的部分,包括漁工權利保重的部分,本來就要做這些部分。對。這大概第一個部分。那第二個部分,歐盟先初步通過的法案其實是針對大企業的部分。對,沒錯。那我們遠洋漁船都是小的那個漁船或者是比較那個。但是你的遠洋漁船,\n接下來如果他把貨賣給大的水產企業的時候就會面對這個相對應的問題啊所以我們現在從幾個面向Duty你僅是他去查的幾個部分包括勞犬的部分包括這個漁業管理的部分我們必須把這個前端整個做好我們才能夠因應後端這些整個的調查是但是我現在要問的是說現在歐盟剛通過的這個法規我們有沒有去做相關的法規的影響評估或盤點\n弄清楚我們可能現在我們的遠洋漁業的運作的方式裡面或模式裡面哪些部分可能未來會受到影響這部分農業部有沒有做了嗎?我的問題是這個嘛目前評估正在會委託相關學者專家來做但是我們內部初步檢視我們目前的法規會受到影響的部分我們必須要去強化或者是管理面的部分不過完善的地方要去強化的地方這個我們內部已經做過評估\n那哪些地方會受到影響?包括我們比如說公使的登記啊公使的登記人家看你說你到底每天的工作是不是符合那個我們必須在這些公使的登記必須更完善那另外就是整個在保育啊或者是相關的部分我們這些法規的部分文件的部分必須更完善蘇洋你剛才說的沒錯他可能會針對比較是大的這些水產企業對不對可是我們的這些遠洋漁船是供貨給他們啊\n所以你還是在一個供應鏈的關係上啊沒有錯所以如果他去要求這大的水產企業的時候間接的還是會影響到我們的遠洋漁業啊\n所以我們在漁業與人權裏面有強調一個就是企業也要一起來做包括FIP的部分就是把前端這個管理面做好日後我們再因應這個禁止調查的部分就不會受到影響我直接問次長好不好次長我想問因為之前去年羅振偉有講到羅秉成政委其實有講到\n針對歐盟的這個切永續禁止調查指令的上路那政府會先研究跟提供相關的指引跟輔導那我想問現在農業部或漁業署那目前這個指引跟輔導已經出來了嗎或什麼時候會出來目前指引的草案已經出來了而且已經經過了幾次會議的這樣的一個溝通那在六月底的時候還會再召開一次六月底過了\n那預計什麼時候會出來?\n跟委員報告有沒有時間表我們次長剛剛所解釋的就是針對漁船上的管理指引跟Wi-Fi的指引這部分我們大概近期資料收集完整以後近期就會再召開一次會議我們希望越早越好因為這是大概對臺灣來講很重要那另外我們針對due diligence大概就是不同面向的去盤點法規的完備那這個部分我們希望剛剛次長講的應該是針對Wi-Fi的部分的指引嘛但我現在講的是針對DD的部分的話那這部分還沒有開始盤點嘛對不對\n內部做盤點還沒有請外部來協助。那這個我們後期再加快調某。需要什麼時候給一個時間點吧。什麼時候,我現在講的是針對滴滴法的部分。什麼時候能夠盤點結束?什麼時候指引跟輔導的措施可以推出?我們希望做一個務實而且也前瞻的。當然當然,我們都希望務實嘛。年底以前能夠有初步的查案能夠出來。年底嗎?年底會不會太久?現在幾月了?現在還有半年了,年底。三個月內可不可以?\n好,我們盡力三個月內,好,那這部分麻煩,那我後面那個主席我再講一個事情喔我知道現在在農業部的業與人權行動裡面有講到說要做國際合作的部分的深化那你們有包括跟漁工的來源國要進行相關的合作我有聽說你們在這個要跟印尼簽署遠洋漁工保護的MOU那這個MOU目前的進展到什麼地方\n目前我們已經把我們的草案提供給印尼那因為印尼他有相關部位在負責這個勞工的部分那目前包括駐印尼的代表處也在協助、協商那目前在等印尼方面的回饋相關的意見我想這個MOU有沒有邀請我們自己國內的NGO或者是漁工團體一起進來討論因為目前我們提出來的部分我聽說印尼\n二、審\n二、審\n是所以這可以嗎?可以啊沒有問題那這個剛才說到兩個月的三個月的時間把滴滴法的相關的評估也包括指引輔導的措施要推出好不好這沒有問題那到時候推出的請送外交國防委員會也包括經濟委員會因為還有很多協商細節的部分我們會來努力好謝謝紅三二委員來各位請回\n那個印尼那個MOU是因為地緣政治問題\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.349 --> 00:02.753\n請這個外交部陳次長跟農業部的黃次長來兩位次長\n\n00:11.923 --> 00:15.125\n委員會長、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席\n\n00:33.063 --> 00:33.083\n二、審\n\n01:00.305 --> 01:11.511\n那也很多這些僱主他沒有幫外籍公務來做保險所以當有船員死亡的時候才沒有拿到賠償那這都是我們自己辦公室遇到很真實的案例\n\n01:13.546 --> 01:42.049\n市長,我們這幾年在遠洋漁業上面受到國際上面的壓力大不大?報告委員,持續一直都有受到國際上的壓力。是,所以不論是2015年被歐盟列入這個打擊IUU漁業不合作國家的黃牌,或者是2020年、2022年又被美國列入同工及強迫勞動製品清單,那這次在臺美21世紀貿易協定談判上面,其實我們的遠洋漁業也一直是受到被關注的對象。\n\n01:43.010 --> 02:03.188\n那我想問次長知不知道我們在今年的今年五月的時候歐盟其實通過了一個竊永續禁職調查指令所謂的滴滴法知不知道知道嗎是那目前這個法其實生效了那歐盟這個法其實很多專家都提醒他很可能會衝擊到臺灣的原糧漁業\n\n02:05.846 --> 02:20.124\n我們之前拿掉了歐盟IUU的黃牌但很多人擔心不用多久接下來又要面對滴滴法的制裁這部分我想知道目前漁業署或外交部我們有沒有做什麼相關的準備\n\n02:23.750 --> 02:49.988\n報告委員事實上我們現在針對這個漁業勞動以及人權的這個問題的話那持續在做改善改進當中所以基本上像剛剛委員所說的薪資的這個部分我們已經立法強制要求這個必須要直接匯入到這個漁工的這個這個戶頭那還有相關的這些市長我就直接問好不好因為我們今天在外交國防委員會現在歐盟新立的新通過的這個企業永續禁止調查指令\n\n02:51.189 --> 03:00.562\n那他已經上路了。我們農業部有沒有對這個法規進行評估或影響的方面?我們未來會持續關注這件事情。所以還沒做?是。還沒做嗎?\n\n03:04.281 --> 03:30.373\n五月,人家五月就通過,現在七月囉。各位委員報告齁,大概有幾個地方要澄清啦齁,要說明一下。第一個那個DutyDiligence本來就是我們在整個做漁業管理的部分,包括漁工權利保重的部分,本來就要做這些部分。對。這大概第一個部分。那第二個部分,歐盟先初步通過的法案其實是針對大企業的部分。對,沒錯。那我們遠洋漁船都是小的那個漁船或者是比較那個。但是你的遠洋漁船,\n\n03:31.013 --> 03:54.909\n接下來如果他把貨賣給大的水產企業的時候就會面對這個相對應的問題啊所以我們現在從幾個面向Duty你僅是他去查的幾個部分包括勞犬的部分包括這個漁業管理的部分我們必須把這個前端整個做好我們才能夠因應後端這些整個的調查是但是我現在要問的是說現在歐盟剛通過的這個法規我們有沒有去做相關的法規的影響評估或盤點\n\n03:57.210 --> 04:24.002\n弄清楚我們可能現在我們的遠洋漁業的運作的方式裡面或模式裡面哪些部分可能未來會受到影響這部分農業部有沒有做了嗎?我的問題是這個嘛目前評估正在會委託相關學者專家來做但是我們內部初步檢視我們目前的法規會受到影響的部分我們必須要去強化或者是管理面的部分不過完善的地方要去強化的地方這個我們內部已經做過評估\n\n04:24.642 --> 04:52.434\n那哪些地方會受到影響?包括我們比如說公使的登記啊公使的登記人家看你說你到底每天的工作是不是符合那個我們必須在這些公使的登記必須更完善那另外就是整個在保育啊或者是相關的部分我們這些法規的部分文件的部分必須更完善蘇洋你剛才說的沒錯他可能會針對比較是大的這些水產企業對不對可是我們的這些遠洋漁船是供貨給他們啊\n\n04:53.695 --> 05:02.802\n所以你還是在一個供應鏈的關係上啊沒有錯所以如果他去要求這大的水產企業的時候間接的還是會影響到我們的遠洋漁業啊\n\n05:05.169 --> 05:22.468\n所以我們在漁業與人權裏面有強調一個就是企業也要一起來做包括FIP的部分就是把前端這個管理面做好日後我們再因應這個禁止調查的部分就不會受到影響我直接問次長好不好次長我想問因為之前去年羅振偉有講到羅秉成政委其實有講到\n\n05:25.070 --> 05:51.526\n針對歐盟的這個切永續禁止調查指令的上路那政府會先研究跟提供相關的指引跟輔導那我想問現在農業部或漁業署那目前這個指引跟輔導已經出來了嗎或什麼時候會出來目前指引的草案已經出來了而且已經經過了幾次會議的這樣的一個溝通那在六月底的時候還會再召開一次六月底過了\n\n05:53.027 --> 05:53.467\n那預計什麼時候會出來?\n\n06:08.840 --> 06:36.149\n跟委員報告有沒有時間表我們次長剛剛所解釋的就是針對漁船上的管理指引跟Wi-Fi的指引這部分我們大概近期資料收集完整以後近期就會再召開一次會議我們希望越早越好因為這是大概對臺灣來講很重要那另外我們針對duediligence大概就是不同面向的去盤點法規的完備那這個部分我們希望剛剛次長講的應該是針對Wi-Fi的部分的指引嘛但我現在講的是針對DD的部分的話那這部分還沒有開始盤點嘛對不對\n\n06:38.389 --> 07:03.354\n內部做盤點還沒有請外部來協助。那這個我們後期再加快調某。需要什麼時候給一個時間點吧。什麼時候,我現在講的是針對滴滴法的部分。什麼時候能夠盤點結束?什麼時候指引跟輔導的措施可以推出?我們希望做一個務實而且也前瞻的。當然當然,我們都希望務實嘛。年底以前能夠有初步的查案能夠出來。年底嗎?年底會不會太久?現在幾月了?現在還有半年了,年底。三個月內可不可以?\n\n07:04.638 --> 07:29.034\n好,我們盡力三個月內,好,那這部分麻煩,那我後面那個主席我再講一個事情喔我知道現在在農業部的業與人權行動裡面有講到說要做國際合作的部分的深化那你們有包括跟漁工的來源國要進行相關的合作我有聽說你們在這個要跟印尼簽署遠洋漁工保護的MOU那這個MOU目前的進展到什麼地方\n\n07:30.645 --> 07:57.728\n目前我們已經把我們的草案提供給印尼那因為印尼他有相關部位在負責這個勞工的部分那目前包括駐印尼的代表處也在協助、協商那目前在等印尼方面的回饋相關的意見我想這個MOU有沒有邀請我們自己國內的NGO或者是漁工團體一起進來討論因為目前我們提出來的部分我聽說印尼\n\n07:59.261 --> 07:59.281\n二、審\n\n08:20.742 --> 08:20.762\n二、審\n\n08:50.612 --> 09:08.126\n是所以這可以嗎?可以啊沒有問題那這個剛才說到兩個月的三個月的時間把滴滴法的相關的評估也包括指引輔導的措施要推出好不好這沒有問題那到時候推出的請送外交國防委員會也包括經濟委員會因為還有很多協商細節的部分我們會來努力好謝謝紅三二委員來各位請回\n\n09:17.076 --> 09:20.283\n那個印尼那個MOU是因為地緣政治問題\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.349,"end":2.753,"text":"請這個外交部陳次長跟農業部的黃次長來兩位次長"},{"start":11.923,"end":15.125,"text":"委員會長、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席、委員會主席"},{"start":33.063,"end":33.083,"text":"二、審"},{"start":60.305,"end":71.511,"text":"那也很多這些僱主他沒有幫外籍公務來做保險所以當有船員死亡的時候才沒有拿到賠償那這都是我們自己辦公室遇到很真實的案例"},{"start":73.546,"end":102.049,"text":"市長,我們這幾年在遠洋漁業上面受到國際上面的壓力大不大?報告委員,持續一直都有受到國際上的壓力。是,所以不論是2015年被歐盟列入這個打擊IUU漁業不合作國家的黃牌,或者是2020年、2022年又被美國列入同工及強迫勞動製品清單,那這次在臺美21世紀貿易協定談判上面,其實我們的遠洋漁業也一直是受到被關注的對象。"},{"start":103.01,"end":123.188,"text":"那我想問次長知不知道我們在今年的今年五月的時候歐盟其實通過了一個竊永續禁職調查指令所謂的滴滴法知不知道知道嗎是那目前這個法其實生效了那歐盟這個法其實很多專家都提醒他很可能會衝擊到臺灣的原糧漁業"},{"start":125.846,"end":140.124,"text":"我們之前拿掉了歐盟IUU的黃牌但很多人擔心不用多久接下來又要面對滴滴法的制裁這部分我想知道目前漁業署或外交部我們有沒有做什麼相關的準備"},{"start":143.75,"end":169.988,"text":"報告委員事實上我們現在針對這個漁業勞動以及人權的這個問題的話那持續在做改善改進當中所以基本上像剛剛委員所說的薪資的這個部分我們已經立法強制要求這個必須要直接匯入到這個漁工的這個這個戶頭那還有相關的這些市長我就直接問好不好因為我們今天在外交國防委員會現在歐盟新立的新通過的這個企業永續禁止調查指令"},{"start":171.189,"end":180.562,"text":"那他已經上路了。我們農業部有沒有對這個法規進行評估或影響的方面?我們未來會持續關注這件事情。所以還沒做?是。還沒做嗎?"},{"start":184.281,"end":210.373,"text":"五月,人家五月就通過,現在七月囉。各位委員報告齁,大概有幾個地方要澄清啦齁,要說明一下。第一個那個Duty Diligence本來就是我們在整個做漁業管理的部分,包括漁工權利保重的部分,本來就要做這些部分。對。這大概第一個部分。那第二個部分,歐盟先初步通過的法案其實是針對大企業的部分。對,沒錯。那我們遠洋漁船都是小的那個漁船或者是比較那個。但是你的遠洋漁船,"},{"start":211.013,"end":234.909,"text":"接下來如果他把貨賣給大的水產企業的時候就會面對這個相對應的問題啊所以我們現在從幾個面向Duty你僅是他去查的幾個部分包括勞犬的部分包括這個漁業管理的部分我們必須把這個前端整個做好我們才能夠因應後端這些整個的調查是但是我現在要問的是說現在歐盟剛通過的這個法規我們有沒有去做相關的法規的影響評估或盤點"},{"start":237.21,"end":264.002,"text":"弄清楚我們可能現在我們的遠洋漁業的運作的方式裡面或模式裡面哪些部分可能未來會受到影響這部分農業部有沒有做了嗎?我的問題是這個嘛目前評估正在會委託相關學者專家來做但是我們內部初步檢視我們目前的法規會受到影響的部分我們必須要去強化或者是管理面的部分不過完善的地方要去強化的地方這個我們內部已經做過評估"},{"start":264.642,"end":292.434,"text":"那哪些地方會受到影響?包括我們比如說公使的登記啊公使的登記人家看你說你到底每天的工作是不是符合那個我們必須在這些公使的登記必須更完善那另外就是整個在保育啊或者是相關的部分我們這些法規的部分文件的部分必須更完善蘇洋你剛才說的沒錯他可能會針對比較是大的這些水產企業對不對可是我們的這些遠洋漁船是供貨給他們啊"},{"start":293.695,"end":302.802,"text":"所以你還是在一個供應鏈的關係上啊沒有錯所以如果他去要求這大的水產企業的時候間接的還是會影響到我們的遠洋漁業啊"},{"start":305.169,"end":322.468,"text":"所以我們在漁業與人權裏面有強調一個就是企業也要一起來做包括FIP的部分就是把前端這個管理面做好日後我們再因應這個禁止調查的部分就不會受到影響我直接問次長好不好次長我想問因為之前去年羅振偉有講到羅秉成政委其實有講到"},{"start":325.07,"end":351.526,"text":"針對歐盟的這個切永續禁止調查指令的上路那政府會先研究跟提供相關的指引跟輔導那我想問現在農業部或漁業署那目前這個指引跟輔導已經出來了嗎或什麼時候會出來目前指引的草案已經出來了而且已經經過了幾次會議的這樣的一個溝通那在六月底的時候還會再召開一次六月底過了"},{"start":353.027,"end":353.467,"text":"那預計什麼時候會出來?"},{"start":368.84,"end":396.149,"text":"跟委員報告有沒有時間表我們次長剛剛所解釋的就是針對漁船上的管理指引跟Wi-Fi的指引這部分我們大概近期資料收集完整以後近期就會再召開一次會議我們希望越早越好因為這是大概對臺灣來講很重要那另外我們針對due diligence大概就是不同面向的去盤點法規的完備那這個部分我們希望剛剛次長講的應該是針對Wi-Fi的部分的指引嘛但我現在講的是針對DD的部分的話那這部分還沒有開始盤點嘛對不對"},{"start":398.389,"end":423.354,"text":"內部做盤點還沒有請外部來協助。那這個我們後期再加快調某。需要什麼時候給一個時間點吧。什麼時候,我現在講的是針對滴滴法的部分。什麼時候能夠盤點結束?什麼時候指引跟輔導的措施可以推出?我們希望做一個務實而且也前瞻的。當然當然,我們都希望務實嘛。年底以前能夠有初步的查案能夠出來。年底嗎?年底會不會太久?現在幾月了?現在還有半年了,年底。三個月內可不可以?"},{"start":424.638,"end":449.034,"text":"好,我們盡力三個月內,好,那這部分麻煩,那我後面那個主席我再講一個事情喔我知道現在在農業部的業與人權行動裡面有講到說要做國際合作的部分的深化那你們有包括跟漁工的來源國要進行相關的合作我有聽說你們在這個要跟印尼簽署遠洋漁工保護的MOU那這個MOU目前的進展到什麼地方"},{"start":450.645,"end":477.728,"text":"目前我們已經把我們的草案提供給印尼那因為印尼他有相關部位在負責這個勞工的部分那目前包括駐印尼的代表處也在協助、協商那目前在等印尼方面的回饋相關的意見我想這個MOU有沒有邀請我們自己國內的NGO或者是漁工團體一起進來討論因為目前我們提出來的部分我聽說印尼"},{"start":479.261,"end":479.281,"text":"二、審"},{"start":500.742,"end":500.762,"text":"二、審"},{"start":530.612,"end":548.126,"text":"是所以這可以嗎?可以啊沒有問題那這個剛才說到兩個月的三個月的時間把滴滴法的相關的評估也包括指引輔導的措施要推出好不好這沒有問題那到時候推出的請送外交國防委員會也包括經濟委員會因為還有很多協商細節的部分我們會來努力好謝謝紅三二委員來各位請回"},{"start":557.076,"end":560.283,"text":"那個印尼那個MOU是因為地緣政治問題"}]}}}}