{"id":154583,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/154583","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/21d04b5a781cb6187893cd26113a55e2a09fb1100d58f4be9d3d28c55f1f245b4db96ec05ca036185ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"李昆澤","委員發言時間":"14:46:54 - 15:02:38","影片長度":"00:15:44","會議時間":"2024-07-09T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第11屆第1會期第21次會議（事由：一、對行政院院長報告施政方針繼續質詢。\n二、7月5日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。\n三、7月9日下午1時50分至2時30分為處理臨時提案時間。）","type":"Clip","date":"2024-07-09","start_time":"2024-07-09T14:46:54+08:00","end_time":"2024-07-09T15:02:38+08:00","duration":944,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期第21次會議","id":"院會-11-1-21","type":"院會","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":21},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"gazette":{"lineno":42,"blocks":[["李委員昆澤：（14時46分）主席，請卓院長，還有勞動部何部長。"],["主席：請卓院長、何部長備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：李委員好。"],["李委員昆澤：院長好、部長好。臺灣勞工為臺灣發展打下很重要的基礎，也付出最多，所以對於勞工權益的保障是政府最重要的基本責任。大家都談到勞保，記得在馬英九擔任總統，陳冲擔任行政院長的時候，我是第一個針對勞保財務精算報告提出質詢的，而且有兩項重要建議，好讓勞工安心，讓勞工老年之後，在生活上有勞保的基本保障。所以我當時要求：第一，政府撥補；第二，政府、國家負最終支付責任。經過多年努力，謝謝蘇貞昌院長在2020年踏出重要的第一步，撥補了200億；2021年撥補220億；2022年300億；2023年450億，再加300億的特別預算，到今年已經撥補到1,200億。我首先要請教院長，針對政府的撥補，明年所編的預算是不是還會再增加？會維持到1,200億以上嗎？請說明。"],["卓院長榮泰：政府負最終支付責任，這是政府已經持續下來對勞工的承諾，也是對臺灣社會安定的承諾。現在明年度的總預算已經進到最後的整理階段，一定會在這個項目上衡量政府的財政，根據實際需要來做……"],["李委員昆澤：會不會維持在1,200億以上？會不會增加？"],["卓院長榮泰：目前至少維持跟過去一樣的水準。"],["李委員昆澤：謝謝院長的承諾。第二，對於最終支付責任或政府撥補，當然政府已經連續五年撥補，而勞工對於政府的相關作為認為，對於勞保的撥補以及國家負最終支付責任有實質做到，但勞工也希望政府對於勞保的撥補以及國家負最終支付責任要明文入法，所以勞保條例第六十九條必須明文加入政府撥補以及國家負最終支付責任。","我們看到國民年金法第四十九條以及公務人員退休撫卹管理條例第八條，對於相關的政府撥補或者是國家最終支付責任都有明文入法，這個是我們接下來要推動的，這是第二階段，要明文入法。第三階段，最重要的，就是針對勞保年金的改革必須更進一步地推出長期的規劃。","過去對於勞保年金的改革討論不出一個版本，或者是勞工無法接受，主要有三大原因，第一是過去政府沒有撥補；第二是國家沒有最終支付的責任；第三是過去所討論出來的版本可能都是多繳、少領，而且要晚一點領，這種版本勞工是無法接受的。所以我在這邊要提醒何部長，第一步的實質政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任，做到了；第二步就是相關的明文入法，勞保條例要將政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任明文入法；第三步就是針對相關的勞保改革必須長期的跟產官學進行更進一步的討論，提出共識的版本，這是很重要的工作。","另外，針對相關的職災部分，院長，我們2023年職災加上職業病、職場染疫，加起來總共有9萬多件，院長，這很嚴重耶，職業災害占了4萬7,000件，職業病跟職場染疫現在也納入職業災害裡面，所以它也有4萬3,000件，加起來就9萬件。2022年是7萬件，2023相較於2022增加了2萬件，多了2萬件！我們來看2023年的部分，因為職業災害失能的勞工朋友達到1,382人，不幸死亡的人數達到625人，部長，我要提醒你，在這625人中，單純職業災害（扣除職業病以及職場染疫）的就有599人。我再提醒部長，如果我們針對2023跟2022再來做個比較，2023比2022在職業傷害方面多出了1,351人，死亡人數增加了83人，對於有效地降低職災保護我們勞工，部長有什麼具體作為？我們職業災害的受傷人數增加、職業災害的死亡人數增加，這對勞工權益的保障是一個嚴重的警訊。請說明。"],["何部長佩珊：是，謝謝委員。剛剛您提到職災給付件數會增加，基本上是有COVID-19的因素啦，因為這部分增加了2萬多……"],["李委員昆澤：所以我說加上職業病跟職場染疫。"],["何部長佩珊：對，可是我要跟您報告，現在因應這個，確實我們職災發生率並沒有有效的降低，這是個嚴重的問題，針對這個，我們也準備要修正職業安全衛生法，為什麼呢？因為第一個，在您看到的工安意外內，很多的業主跟施作，譬如施工廠之間並沒有負連帶責任，他們彼此間常常會以承攬關係來規避，這是一個嚴重的問題，也造成業主常常把責任轉嫁給下游的發包商，我們必須在這部分把責任讓它能夠統一起來。"],["李委員昆澤：部長！部長，重點在於如何有效地降低職災啦！"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["李委員昆澤：我們一年有1,382位勞工失能，這很嚴重耶！我們有625位勞工失去生命，這很嚴重耶！"],["何部長佩珊：是，這個……"],["李委員昆澤：每一位勞工都像是我們家人一般，他們為臺灣的經濟發展付出最大的心力，勞工的權益必須要具體的保障。我們看看相關的勞工職業災害統計，有50%都是營造業啦！"],["何部長佩珊：對，沒錯。"],["李委員昆澤：然後有43%左右都是墜落，那都是非常嚴重的。"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["李委員昆澤：勞動部也提出了營造業墜落打擊年。"],["何部長佩珊：今年。"],["李委員昆澤：你們有什麼具體的作法，請講一下。"],["何部長佩珊：我們今年就是……最近我們甚至要找營造同業公會，還有包括這些業主，我們必須跟他們面對面嚴肅地談這個問題，像今年這個月下旬……"],["李委員昆澤：具體的作法呢？會不會提高相關的工安裁罰金額？"],["何部長佩珊：是，會，我剛剛提到的職業安全衛生法也會提高相關的裁罰金額，現在只有3萬到30萬，而且裁罰金額都沒有公布，這是要檢討的，我們準備要把它大幅提高，因為這個部分也不能讓業主心存僥倖，尤其我們在營造業趕工的過程裡面，大家常常輕忽了工地安全本身這樣一個連帶責任的問題，這部分我們必須確實檢討。"],["李委員昆澤：他們違反的大部分都是職業安全衛生法第六條，更應該具體的提出一些督促、管理這樣的作為，所以我一直要請教何部長，你剛就任，我們對於降低職業災害到底有什麼具體的作法？你有什麼目標？"],["何部長佩珊：剛剛提到修法是一個方向，我們現在也新成立了……"],["李委員昆澤：在修法之前，你有什麼具體的措施嗎？相關的行政作為嗎？"],["何部長佩珊：今年我們其實就是把勞檢的場次都提高，包括對各種工地，包括營造業的，包括各種製造業的，他們有在施工的，其實這個場次都有提高。"],["李委員昆澤：我們提到勞檢，部長你也提到勞檢，我們1年勞檢的場次大概是28萬場次，如果以初檢來說，就有11萬場次，11萬場次的初檢，它的違規是達到12萬次以上，所以去初檢大概都有問題，幾乎是百分之百以上，當然我們在相關的複檢這些違規的場次裡面，勞動部所提供的資料，號稱它的改善率達到92%，有這麼厲害嗎？請你說明一下。"],["何部長佩珊：我想這個確實該檢討，因為如果對照委員所感受到的、我們大家所感受到的，確實這個不盡符合事實，因為我剛上任，我準備我也要求我們職安署對這個問題要進行全面的檢討，因為包含初檢跟複檢之間，它會有一個時間差，初檢跟複檢之間還有包括我們對停工範圍的定義，其實那個有很多檢討的空間。"],["李委員昆澤：這個部分我倒是要肯定一下勞動部，我們對於勞檢的場次，這樣的增加是更能夠具體的來保障勞工的職場安全，但是相關這些對於業者的督促以及相關的改善，必須有更進一步的作為來提升，請說明一下。"],["何部長佩珊：是，就是另一方面，除了我們增加勞檢、修職業安全衛生法，委員，就是說勞檢要確實化跟修職業安全衛生法也很有關係，因為我們目前職業安全衛生法的某些規範並沒有那麼的明確化，所以導致我們在勞檢進行裁罰的時候其實也不夠具體，這個是有互相連帶關係，所以希望我們能在最快的時間內提出職安衛的修法，也能夠獲得委員的支持。"],["李委員昆澤：這個必須要有更具體的作為。"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["李委員昆澤：部長，我再請教你關於熱危害的議題，院長、部長，這幾天都非常熱，我們好像住在蒸籠裡面，這就是因為極端氣候這樣的一個肆虐跟趨勢，勞工朋友在這麼炎熱的天氣下工作，相關的熱危害以及對身體所造成的衝擊，它的傷害性非常的大。在6月26號郵局的勞工、辛苦的郵差，就有一位在送信的過程裡面中暑昏倒，我們對於熱危害，部長，你有什麼具體的想法？部長請說明。"],["何部長佩珊：跟委員報告，熱危害確實也是當前大家都在注意的一個大問題，我們現在有進行夏季高溫勞檢，也是一樣有勞檢，可是一樣的，就是說這個在職安衛這個法的規定裡面也是不夠明確，所以我們必須把它進行法規的修正，這部分是行政命令，就是說業主他必須要提供避難，就是防高溫的設備跟設施給勞工，目前這個部分沒有明確化的規定，所以導致我們……"],["李委員昆澤：接下來要做明確化的規定嗎？來，說明一下。"],["何部長佩珊：對，我們8月底要把相關法規的明確字眼入法，我們現在只有要求進行避難這樣子的規定，可是沒有要求他提供設備、設施，會變成在勞檢的時候沒有辦法很明確地去罰他，所以這又會是一個執行上的問題。雖然我們夏季高溫勞檢好幾萬場次，可是罰的都很少，所以這會變成一個無效率的狀態，很快這個月我們就要進行法規修正。"],["李委員昆澤：部長，我們之前通過了勞工職業災害保險及保護法，針對勞工職場安全以及發生職業災害之後，他們相關的津貼、保障以及保護等等有更進一步的提升，而且對於他們職災之後的重建有更進一步具體的保障。但是我要請教，我看我們今年1至4月職業災害預防補助申請只有20件，而且職業災害重建1至4月只有7件，這個部分必須更加強做相關處理。來，說明一下。"],["何部長佩珊：好，謝謝委員。職災預防重建中心是一個職災保護法之後新成立的單位，運作到現在大概2、3年左右而已，事實上它也在摸索中，因為它是一個前端跟後端──前端預防跟後端重建，在臺灣這樣子一個職業安全衛生醫學環境裡面，目前運作的狀況，因為它是針對一般民間的，所以它還要去找個案，然後對它進行一些示範的輔導，它現在都還在嘗試建立model的工作而已，所以可能還不夠全面推廣，這是事實，我想我們必須強化這個效率，還有包括它的範圍，我會朝這個方向來進行全面的……"],["李委員昆澤：院長，因為時間的關係，請院長全力督促，針對勞保對勞工的相關保障，以及降低職災的部分，請督促勞動部拿出具體的成績，以上。"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝李委員的關心，謝謝指教。"],["主席：謝謝李委員。下一位我們請羅廷瑋委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":182,"meet_id":"院會-11-1-21","speakers":["江啟臣","王定宇","黃國昌","羅明才","吳琪銘","葉元之","邱若華","楊曜","羅智強","黃健豪","盧縣一","蘇清泉","林國成","李昆澤","羅廷瑋","陳培瑜","林月琴","游顥","王正旭","林淑芬","涂權吉"],"page_start":93,"meetingDate":["2024-07-09"],"gazette_id":"1136601","agenda_lci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\"end\": 939.704, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"羅\"}, {\"word\": \"廷\", \"start\": 939.704, \"end\": 939.984, \"score\": 0.959}, {\"word\": \"偉\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 939.984, \"end\": 940.004, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:08,686 --> 00:00:14,889\n好,謝謝主席。請一下卓院長還有勞動部何部長。好,請卓院長何部長備詢。好,議員好。好,院長好、部長好。臺灣的勞工對著臺灣的發電,派出最重要的基礎,付出最多。所以我們對於勞工的權利的保障,是政府最重要的一個基本責任。\n\n2\n00:00:38,134 --> 00:00:54,480\n大家都談到勞保那我記得在馬英九擔任總統陳沖擔任行政院長的時候我是第一個針對相關的財務精算報告提出質詢而且有兩項重要的建議\n\n3\n00:00:55,540 --> 00:01:22,185\n就是要讓勞工安心讓勞工在老年之後對於他們的生活有勞保的這樣的一個基本的保障所以當初要求第一個政府撥補第二是政府的國家最終支付責任經過多年的努力謝謝蘇貞昌院長在2020年我們踏出了重要的第一步就是撥補了200億2021年\n\n4\n00:01:25,796 --> 00:01:33,619\n剝補220億。2022年300億。2023年450億再加300億的特別預算。到今年已經剝補到了1200億。我首先要請教院長我們針對政府的剝補明年我們編的預算是不是還會再增加?會維持到1200億以上嗎?來請部長說明。\n\n5\n00:01:54,218 --> 00:01:54,658\n會不會維持1200億以上?會不會增加?\n\n6\n00:02:18,407 --> 00:02:41,984\n目前還是至少維持跟過去一樣的水準是有的。好,謝謝院長的承諾。第二我們對於最終支付責任或是政府撥補當然已經連續5年的撥補那勞工對於政府的相關的作為認為對於勞保的撥補以及國家最終支付責任是有實質的做到。\n\n7\n00:02:43,001 --> 00:03:07,775\n但是我們的論壇也說我們對於勞保的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任是要明文入法所以相關的勞保條例第69條必須要明文的加入相關的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任我們看國民年金法的第49條以及公務人員退休撫恤管理條例第8條\n\n8\n00:03:09,035 --> 00:03:34,707\n對於他們相關的政府撥補或者是國家最終支付責任都有明文入法這個是我們接下來要推動的這是第二階段明文入法第三階段最重要的就是我們針對老保年金的改革必須更進一步的來推出長期的一個規劃過去對於老保年金的改革\n\n9\n00:03:49,602 --> 00:04:08,835\n第三、過去所討論出來的版本可能都是要多繳少領而且要晚點領這種勞工是無法接受的所以說我在這邊要提醒何部長我們第一步實質的政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任做到了\n\n10\n00:04:09,485 --> 00:04:35,285\n第二部就是相關的我們的民穩入法勞保條例要將政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任民穩入法。第三就是要針對我們相關的勞保的改革必須做長期的跟長官學來進行更進一步的討論提出共識的版本這是很重要的工作。\n\n11\n00:04:36,190 --> 00:04:40,652\n另外,我們針對相關的職災的部分,我們2023年職災加上我們的職業病,就是職場染疫加起來總共有9萬多件,這很嚴重。職業災害佔了4萬7千件,\n\n12\n00:05:01,136 --> 00:05:25,707\n然後職業病跟職場染疫現在也納入這個職業災害裡面,所以他也有4萬3千件,加起來就9萬件。那我們2022年多少件?7萬件。2023年比2022年增加了2萬件,給你們慢驚啦。那我們2023年我們來看,因為職業災害失能的我們的勞工朋友啊,是達到1382人。\n\n13\n00:05:28,729 --> 00:05:51,479\n死亡的人數不幸死亡的人數達到625人部長我要提醒你這625人單純的職業災害扣除職業病以及職場燃益的就有599人如果我再提醒部長我們針對2023跟2022再來做一個比較2023比2022\n\n14\n00:05:57,472 --> 00:06:25,571\n我們的職業傷害多出了1351人。死亡的人數增加了83人。要有效的降低職災保護我們的勞工啊來保證你有什麼具體的作為我們的職業傷害的職業災害的受傷的人數增加以及職業災害死亡的人數增加這對勞工權益的保障是一個嚴重的警訊來請說明\n\n15\n00:06:27,769 --> 00:06:43,303\n謝謝委員。剛剛您提到的那個職災給付件數會增加,那個是基本上是有COVID-19的因素啦。是因為...所以我說加上職業病跟職場染疫。對,可是我要跟您報告,現在因應這一個確實我們職災發生率並沒有有效的降低,這是一個嚴重的問題。\n\n16\n00:06:48,928 --> 00:07:00,628\n那麼我們也針對這個我們要準備修正職業安全衛生法。這是為什麼呢?因為第一個在我們的這一個您看到的公安意外裡面很多數的業主\n\n17\n00:07:01,271 --> 00:07:03,012\n部長,重點在於如何有效的降低職債。我們一年\n\n18\n00:07:31,348 --> 00:07:55,308\n有1382位勞工失能這很嚴重的我們有625人勞工失去生命這很嚴重的每一位勞工都是我們的家人一般他們為臺灣的經濟發展付出最大的心力勞工的權利必須要具體的保障那我們看看相關的勞工職業災害有50%都營造業了\n\n19\n00:07:58,666 --> 00:08:10,759\n對。然後有43%左右都是墜落。是。那都是非常嚴重的。是。那勞動部委員提出說營造業墜落打幾年?\n\n20\n00:08:11,618 --> 00:08:15,501\n那你們有什麼具體的做法來講一下?具體的做法會不會提高相關的公安裁罰的金額?\n\n21\n00:08:33,596 --> 00:08:36,779\n我剛剛提到職業安全衛生法也會提高相關的裁罰金額,現在只有3萬到30萬,而且裁罰金額都沒有公佈,這是要檢討的。那麼我們準備要把它大幅提高,因為這個部分也不能讓業主心存僥倖,\n\n22\n00:08:52,771 --> 00:09:16,299\n那麼尤其我們在這個營造業的這個趕工的過程裡面,常常大家輕忽的工地安全本身的這樣子的一個連帶的責任的問題,這是部分我們必須確實檢討的。那違反了大部分都是職業安全衛生法的第6條,那更應該具體的提出一些督促管理的這樣的作為,所以說我\n\n23\n00:09:18,663 --> 00:09:26,837\n一直要請教何部長,你剛就任。我們對於要降低職業災害到底有什麼具體的做法?你有什麼目標?\n\n24\n00:09:29,516 --> 00:09:33,558\n那修法之前你有什麼具體的措施嗎?相關的行政作為嗎?我們也提到勞檢,部長你也提到勞檢。我們一年勞檢的場次大概是28萬的場次。\n\n25\n00:09:57,449 --> 00:10:16,596\n如果以初檢來說就有11萬場次那11萬場次的初檢它的違規是達到12萬次以上所以去初檢大概都有問題都幾乎百分之百以上那當然我們在相關的復檢這些違規的這些場次裡面\n\n26\n00:10:21,657 --> 00:10:46,205\n勞動部所提供的資料號稱它的改善率達到92%,有證據嗎?來請你說明一下。我想這個確實該檢討,因為如果跟對照我們委員所感受到的或我們大家所感受到的,確實這個不盡符合事實。那麼因為我剛上任,我也要求我們職安署對這個問題要進行全面的檢討。\n\n27\n00:10:47,225 --> 00:11:09,917\n因為包含初檢跟復檢之間,它會有一個時間差嘛。那麼初檢跟復檢之間還有包括我們對停工範圍的定義,其實那個有很多檢討的空間。這個部分我倒是要肯定一下勞動部,我們對於勞檢的場次啊,這樣的增加是更能夠具體的來保障勞工的職場的安全。\n\n28\n00:11:10,475 --> 00:11:19,195\n但是相關的這一些對於業者的督促以及相關的改善必須更進一步的來作為提升。來說明一下。\n\n29\n00:11:20,009 --> 00:11:40,822\n是,就是另一方面這個除了我們這個增加勞檢修職業安全衛生委員就是說這個勞檢要確實化跟修職業安全衛生法也很有關係因為我們目前的職業安全衛生法某些規範並沒有那麼的明確化所以導致這個我們在勞檢進行裁罰的時候其實也不夠具體\n\n30\n00:11:42,103 --> 00:12:03,432\n這個是有互相連帶關係,所以希望我們能在最快的時間內提出執行委的修法,也能獲得委員的支持。這個必須要更具體的作為。部長我都簽稿了,熱危害的議題。院長、部長,這幾天都灰色的熱,我們好像住在人生裡面。這就是因為極端氣候的這樣的一個肆虐跟趨勢。\n\n31\n00:12:05,076 --> 00:12:21,804\n那勞工朋友在這麼炎熱的天氣工作,相關的熱危害以及對身體所造成的衝擊啊,他的傷害性非常的大。在6月26號,郵局的勞工啊,郵差,辛苦的郵差啊,就一位眾署分導。\n\n32\n00:12:22,634 --> 00:12:38,576\n在送信的過程裡面那我們對於熱危害部長你有什麼具體的想法來部長請說明對要跟委員報告這熱危害確實也是當前大家都在注意的一個大問題我們現在也進行夏季高溫勞檢\n\n33\n00:12:39,938 --> 00:12:57,804\n也是一樣有勞檢,可是呢,這個一樣就是說,這個在食安委的這個法的規定裡面也是不夠明確,所以我們必須要把它進行法規的修正,這部分是行政命令。就是說業主他必須要提供避難,就是這一個防高溫的設備跟設施給勞工。\n\n34\n00:13:00,385 --> 00:13:29,494\n目前這個部分沒有明確化的規定。接下來要做明確化的規定嗎?來說明一下。我們8月底要來做這個相關法規的明確字眼入法。我們現在只有要求他進行避難的這個規定,避難這樣子的一個規定,可是沒有要求他提供設備設施。所以會變成你在勞檢的時候,你又沒有辦法很明確的去罰他。所以這個又是一個執行上的問題。\n\n35\n00:13:30,314 --> 00:13:48,432\n雖然我們下季勞工勞檢好幾萬場次可是罰的都很少所以這是會變成一個無效率的一個狀態這樣子所以我很很快的這個月就要進行這個法規的修正我們之前有通過勞工的職業災害保險以及保護法那針對勞工的職場的安全以及相關發生職業災害之後\n\n36\n00:13:54,478 --> 00:13:54,518\n﹚李昆澤﹚\n\n37\n00:14:22,407 --> 00:14:42,913\n那這個部分必須要更加強的來做相關的處理,來說明一下。好,謝謝委員。那個植栽預防重建中心是一個植栽保護法之後新成立的單位。它運作大概現在三年左右,兩三年左右而已。那麼它事實上也在摸索中。\n\n38\n00:14:43,773 --> 00:14:43,813\n﹚李昆澤\n\n39\n00:15:01,483 --> 00:15:02,543\n院長因為時間的關係請院長全力督促針對相關的勞保對勞工的保障。\n\n40\n00:15:35,260 --> 00:15:40,004\n好,謝謝李委員下一位我們請羅廷偉委員質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n8686\t14889\t好,謝謝主席。請一下卓院長還有勞動部何部長。好,請卓院長何部長備詢。好,議員好。好,院長好、部長好。臺灣的勞工對著臺灣的發電,派出最重要的基礎,付出最多。所以我們對於勞工的權利的保障,是政府最重要的一個基本責任。\n38134\t54480\t大家都談到勞保那我記得在馬英九擔任總統陳沖擔任行政院長的時候我是第一個針對相關的財務精算報告提出質詢而且有兩項重要的建議\n55540\t82185\t就是要讓勞工安心讓勞工在老年之後對於他們的生活有勞保的這樣的一個基本的保障所以當初要求第一個政府撥補第二是政府的國家最終支付責任經過多年的努力謝謝蘇貞昌院長在2020年我們踏出了重要的第一步就是撥補了200億2021年\n85796\t93619\t剝補220億。2022年300億。2023年450億再加300億的特別預算。到今年已經剝補到了1200億。我首先要請教院長我們針對政府的剝補明年我們編的預算是不是還會再增加?會維持到1200億以上嗎?來請部長說明。\n114218\t114658\t會不會維持1200億以上?會不會增加?\n138407\t161984\t目前還是至少維持跟過去一樣的水準是有的。好,謝謝院長的承諾。第二我們對於最終支付責任或是政府撥補當然已經連續5年的撥補那勞工對於政府的相關的作為認為對於勞保的撥補以及國家最終支付責任是有實質的做到。\n163001\t187775\t但是我們的論壇也說我們對於勞保的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任是要明文入法所以相關的勞保條例第69條必須要明文的加入相關的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任我們看國民年金法的第49條以及公務人員退休撫恤管理條例第8條\n189035\t214707\t對於他們相關的政府撥補或者是國家最終支付責任都有明文入法這個是我們接下來要推動的這是第二階段明文入法第三階段最重要的就是我們針對老保年金的改革必須更進一步的來推出長期的一個規劃過去對於老保年金的改革\n215879\t229326\t﹚議員\n229602\t248835\t第三、過去所討論出來的版本可能都是要多繳少領而且要晚點領這種勞工是無法接受的所以說我在這邊要提醒何部長我們第一步實質的政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任做到了\n249485\t275285\t第二部就是相關的我們的民穩入法勞保條例要將政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任民穩入法。第三就是要針對我們相關的勞保的改革必須做長期的跟長官學來進行更進一步的討論提出共識的版本這是很重要的工作。\n276190\t280652\t另外,我們針對相關的職災的部分,我們2023年職災加上我們的職業病,就是職場染疫加起來總共有9萬多件,這很嚴重。職業災害佔了4萬7千件,\n301136\t325707\t然後職業病跟職場染疫現在也納入這個職業災害裡面,所以他也有4萬3千件,加起來就9萬件。那我們2022年多少件?7萬件。2023年比2022年增加了2萬件,給你們慢驚啦。那我們2023年我們來看,因為職業災害失能的我們的勞工朋友啊,是達到1382人。\n328729\t351479\t死亡的人數不幸死亡的人數達到625人部長我要提醒你這625人單純的職業災害扣除職業病以及職場燃益的就有599人如果我再提醒部長我們針對2023跟2022再來做一個比較2023比2022\n357472\t385571\t我們的職業傷害多出了1351人。死亡的人數增加了83人。要有效的降低職災保護我們的勞工啊來保證你有什麼具體的作為我們的職業傷害的職業災害的受傷的人數增加以及職業災害死亡的人數增加這對勞工權益的保障是一個嚴重的警訊來請說明\n387769\t403303\t謝謝委員。剛剛您提到的那個職災給付件數會增加,那個是基本上是有COVID-19的因素啦。是因為...所以我說加上職業病跟職場染疫。對,可是我要跟您報告,現在因應這一個確實我們職災發生率並沒有有效的降低,這是一個嚴重的問題。\n408928\t420628\t那麼我們也針對這個我們要準備修正職業安全衛生法。這是為什麼呢?因為第一個在我們的這一個您看到的公安意外裡面很多數的業主\n421271\t423012\t部長,重點在於如何有效的降低職債。我們一年\n451348\t475308\t有1382位勞工失能 這很嚴重的我們有625人勞工失去生命 這很嚴重的每一位勞工都是我們的家人一般他們為臺灣的經濟發展付出最大的心力勞工的權利必須要具體的保障那我們看看相關的勞工職業災害有50%都營造業了\n478666\t490759\t對。然後有43%左右都是墜落。是。那都是非常嚴重的。是。那勞動部委員提出說營造業墜落打幾年?\n491618\t495501\t那你們有什麼具體的做法來講一下?具體的做法會不會提高相關的公安裁罰的金額?\n513596\t516779\t我剛剛提到職業安全衛生法也會提高相關的裁罰金額,現在只有3萬到30萬,而且裁罰金額都沒有公佈,這是要檢討的。那麼我們準備要把它大幅提高,因為這個部分也不能讓業主心存僥倖,\n532771\t556299\t那麼尤其我們在這個營造業的這個趕工的過程裡面,常常大家輕忽的工地安全本身的這樣子的一個連帶的責任的問題,這是部分我們必須確實檢討的。那違反了大部分都是職業安全衛生法的第6條,那更應該具體的提出一些督促管理的這樣的作為,所以說我\n558663\t566837\t一直要請教何部長,你剛就任。我們對於要降低職業災害到底有什麼具體的做法?你有什麼目標?\n569516\t573558\t那修法之前你有什麼具體的措施嗎?相關的行政作為嗎?我們也提到勞檢,部長你也提到勞檢。我們一年勞檢的場次大概是28萬的場次。\n597449\t616596\t如果以初檢來說就有11萬場次那11萬場次的初檢它的違規是達到12萬次以上所以去初檢大概都有問題都幾乎百分之百以上那當然我們在相關的復檢這些違規的這些場次裡面\n621657\t646205\t勞動部所提供的資料號稱它的改善率達到92%,有證據嗎?來請你說明一下。我想這個確實該檢討,因為如果跟對照我們委員所感受到的或我們大家所感受到的,確實這個不盡符合事實。那麼因為我剛上任,我也要求我們職安署對這個問題要進行全面的檢討。\n647225\t669917\t因為包含初檢跟復檢之間,它會有一個時間差嘛。那麼初檢跟復檢之間還有包括我們對停工範圍的定義,其實那個有很多檢討的空間。這個部分我倒是要肯定一下勞動部,我們對於勞檢的場次啊,這樣的增加是更能夠具體的來保障勞工的職場的安全。\n670475\t679195\t但是相關的這一些對於業者的督促以及相關的改善必須更進一步的來作為提升。來說明一下。\n680009\t700822\t是,就是另一方面這個除了我們這個增加勞檢修職業安全衛生委員就是說這個勞檢要確實化跟修職業安全衛生法也很有關係因為我們目前的職業安全衛生法某些規範並沒有那麼的明確化所以導致這個我們在勞檢進行裁罰的時候其實也不夠具體\n702103\t723432\t這個是有互相連帶關係,所以希望我們能在最快的時間內提出執行委的修法,也能獲得委員的支持。這個必須要更具體的作為。部長我都簽稿了,熱危害的議題。院長、部長,這幾天都灰色的熱,我們好像住在人生裡面。這就是因為極端氣候的這樣的一個肆虐跟趨勢。\n725076\t741804\t那勞工朋友在這麼炎熱的天氣工作,相關的熱危害以及對身體所造成的衝擊啊,他的傷害性非常的大。在6月26號,郵局的勞工啊,郵差,辛苦的郵差啊,就一位眾署分導。\n742634\t758576\t在送信的過程裡面那我們對於熱危害部長你有什麼具體的想法來部長請說明對要跟委員報告這熱危害確實也是當前大家都在注意的一個大問題我們現在也進行夏季高溫勞檢\n759938\t777804\t也是一樣有勞檢,可是呢,這個一樣就是說,這個在食安委的這個法的規定裡面也是不夠明確,所以我們必須要把它進行法規的修正,這部分是行政命令。就是說業主他必須要提供避難,就是這一個防高溫的設備跟設施給勞工。\n780385\t809494\t目前這個部分沒有明確化的規定。接下來要做明確化的規定嗎?來說明一下。我們8月底要來做這個相關法規的明確字眼入法。我們現在只有要求他進行避難的這個規定,避難這樣子的一個規定,可是沒有要求他提供設備設施。所以會變成你在勞檢的時候,你又沒有辦法很明確的去罰他。所以這個又是一個執行上的問題。\n810314\t828432\t雖然我們下季勞工勞檢好幾萬場次可是罰的都很少所以這是會變成一個無效率的一個狀態這樣子所以我很很快的這個月就要進行這個法規的修正我們之前有通過勞工的職業災害保險以及保護法那針對勞工的職場的安全以及相關發生職業災害之後\n834478\t834518\t﹚李昆澤﹚\n862407\t882913\t那這個部分必須要更加強的來做相關的處理,來說明一下。好,謝謝委員。那個植栽預防重建中心是一個植栽保護法之後新成立的單位。它運作大概現在三年左右,兩三年左右而已。那麼它事實上也在摸索中。\n883773\t883813\t﹚李昆澤\n901483\t902543\t院長因為時間的關係請院長全力督促針對相關的勞保對勞工的保障。\n935260\t940004\t好,謝謝李委員下一位我們請羅廷偉委員質詢\n","txt":"好,謝謝主席。請一下卓院長還有勞動部何部長。好,請卓院長何部長備詢。好,議員好。好,院長好、部長好。臺灣的勞工對著臺灣的發電,派出最重要的基礎,付出最多。所以我們對於勞工的權利的保障,是政府最重要的一個基本責任。\n大家都談到勞保那我記得在馬英九擔任總統陳沖擔任行政院長的時候我是第一個針對相關的財務精算報告提出質詢而且有兩項重要的建議\n就是要讓勞工安心讓勞工在老年之後對於他們的生活有勞保的這樣的一個基本的保障所以當初要求第一個政府撥補第二是政府的國家最終支付責任經過多年的努力謝謝蘇貞昌院長在2020年我們踏出了重要的第一步就是撥補了200億2021年\n剝補220億。2022年300億。2023年450億再加300億的特別預算。到今年已經剝補到了1200億。我首先要請教院長我們針對政府的剝補明年我們編的預算是不是還會再增加?會維持到1200億以上嗎?來請部長說明。\n會不會維持1200億以上?會不會增加?\n目前還是至少維持跟過去一樣的水準是有的。好,謝謝院長的承諾。第二我們對於最終支付責任或是政府撥補當然已經連續5年的撥補那勞工對於政府的相關的作為認為對於勞保的撥補以及國家最終支付責任是有實質的做到。\n但是我們的論壇也說我們對於勞保的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任是要明文入法所以相關的勞保條例第69條必須要明文的加入相關的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任我們看國民年金法的第49條以及公務人員退休撫恤管理條例第8條\n對於他們相關的政府撥補或者是國家最終支付責任都有明文入法這個是我們接下來要推動的這是第二階段明文入法第三階段最重要的就是我們針對老保年金的改革必須更進一步的來推出長期的一個規劃過去對於老保年金的改革\n﹚議員\n第三、過去所討論出來的版本可能都是要多繳少領而且要晚點領這種勞工是無法接受的所以說我在這邊要提醒何部長我們第一步實質的政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任做到了\n第二部就是相關的我們的民穩入法勞保條例要將政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任民穩入法。第三就是要針對我們相關的勞保的改革必須做長期的跟長官學來進行更進一步的討論提出共識的版本這是很重要的工作。\n另外,我們針對相關的職災的部分,我們2023年職災加上我們的職業病,就是職場染疫加起來總共有9萬多件,這很嚴重。職業災害佔了4萬7千件,\n然後職業病跟職場染疫現在也納入這個職業災害裡面,所以他也有4萬3千件,加起來就9萬件。那我們2022年多少件?7萬件。2023年比2022年增加了2萬件,給你們慢驚啦。那我們2023年我們來看,因為職業災害失能的我們的勞工朋友啊,是達到1382人。\n死亡的人數不幸死亡的人數達到625人部長我要提醒你這625人單純的職業災害扣除職業病以及職場燃益的就有599人如果我再提醒部長我們針對2023跟2022再來做一個比較2023比2022\n我們的職業傷害多出了1351人。死亡的人數增加了83人。要有效的降低職災保護我們的勞工啊來保證你有什麼具體的作為我們的職業傷害的職業災害的受傷的人數增加以及職業災害死亡的人數增加這對勞工權益的保障是一個嚴重的警訊來請說明\n謝謝委員。剛剛您提到的那個職災給付件數會增加,那個是基本上是有COVID-19的因素啦。是因為...所以我說加上職業病跟職場染疫。對,可是我要跟您報告,現在因應這一個確實我們職災發生率並沒有有效的降低,這是一個嚴重的問題。\n那麼我們也針對這個我們要準備修正職業安全衛生法。這是為什麼呢?因為第一個在我們的這一個您看到的公安意外裡面很多數的業主\n部長,重點在於如何有效的降低職債。我們一年\n有1382位勞工失能 這很嚴重的我們有625人勞工失去生命 這很嚴重的每一位勞工都是我們的家人一般他們為臺灣的經濟發展付出最大的心力勞工的權利必須要具體的保障那我們看看相關的勞工職業災害有50%都營造業了\n對。然後有43%左右都是墜落。是。那都是非常嚴重的。是。那勞動部委員提出說營造業墜落打幾年?\n那你們有什麼具體的做法來講一下?具體的做法會不會提高相關的公安裁罰的金額?\n我剛剛提到職業安全衛生法也會提高相關的裁罰金額,現在只有3萬到30萬,而且裁罰金額都沒有公佈,這是要檢討的。那麼我們準備要把它大幅提高,因為這個部分也不能讓業主心存僥倖,\n那麼尤其我們在這個營造業的這個趕工的過程裡面,常常大家輕忽的工地安全本身的這樣子的一個連帶的責任的問題,這是部分我們必須確實檢討的。那違反了大部分都是職業安全衛生法的第6條,那更應該具體的提出一些督促管理的這樣的作為,所以說我\n一直要請教何部長,你剛就任。我們對於要降低職業災害到底有什麼具體的做法?你有什麼目標?\n那修法之前你有什麼具體的措施嗎?相關的行政作為嗎?我們也提到勞檢,部長你也提到勞檢。我們一年勞檢的場次大概是28萬的場次。\n如果以初檢來說就有11萬場次那11萬場次的初檢它的違規是達到12萬次以上所以去初檢大概都有問題都幾乎百分之百以上那當然我們在相關的復檢這些違規的這些場次裡面\n勞動部所提供的資料號稱它的改善率達到92%,有證據嗎?來請你說明一下。我想這個確實該檢討,因為如果跟對照我們委員所感受到的或我們大家所感受到的,確實這個不盡符合事實。那麼因為我剛上任,我也要求我們職安署對這個問題要進行全面的檢討。\n因為包含初檢跟復檢之間,它會有一個時間差嘛。那麼初檢跟復檢之間還有包括我們對停工範圍的定義,其實那個有很多檢討的空間。這個部分我倒是要肯定一下勞動部,我們對於勞檢的場次啊,這樣的增加是更能夠具體的來保障勞工的職場的安全。\n但是相關的這一些對於業者的督促以及相關的改善必須更進一步的來作為提升。來說明一下。\n是,就是另一方面這個除了我們這個增加勞檢修職業安全衛生委員就是說這個勞檢要確實化跟修職業安全衛生法也很有關係因為我們目前的職業安全衛生法某些規範並沒有那麼的明確化所以導致這個我們在勞檢進行裁罰的時候其實也不夠具體\n這個是有互相連帶關係,所以希望我們能在最快的時間內提出執行委的修法,也能獲得委員的支持。這個必須要更具體的作為。部長我都簽稿了,熱危害的議題。院長、部長,這幾天都灰色的熱,我們好像住在人生裡面。這就是因為極端氣候的這樣的一個肆虐跟趨勢。\n那勞工朋友在這麼炎熱的天氣工作,相關的熱危害以及對身體所造成的衝擊啊,他的傷害性非常的大。在6月26號,郵局的勞工啊,郵差,辛苦的郵差啊,就一位眾署分導。\n在送信的過程裡面那我們對於熱危害部長你有什麼具體的想法來部長請說明對要跟委員報告這熱危害確實也是當前大家都在注意的一個大問題我們現在也進行夏季高溫勞檢\n也是一樣有勞檢,可是呢,這個一樣就是說,這個在食安委的這個法的規定裡面也是不夠明確,所以我們必須要把它進行法規的修正,這部分是行政命令。就是說業主他必須要提供避難,就是這一個防高溫的設備跟設施給勞工。\n目前這個部分沒有明確化的規定。接下來要做明確化的規定嗎?來說明一下。我們8月底要來做這個相關法規的明確字眼入法。我們現在只有要求他進行避難的這個規定,避難這樣子的一個規定,可是沒有要求他提供設備設施。所以會變成你在勞檢的時候,你又沒有辦法很明確的去罰他。所以這個又是一個執行上的問題。\n雖然我們下季勞工勞檢好幾萬場次可是罰的都很少所以這是會變成一個無效率的一個狀態這樣子所以我很很快的這個月就要進行這個法規的修正我們之前有通過勞工的職業災害保險以及保護法那針對勞工的職場的安全以及相關發生職業災害之後\n﹚李昆澤﹚\n那這個部分必須要更加強的來做相關的處理,來說明一下。好,謝謝委員。那個植栽預防重建中心是一個植栽保護法之後新成立的單位。它運作大概現在三年左右,兩三年左右而已。那麼它事實上也在摸索中。\n﹚李昆澤\n院長因為時間的關係請院長全力督促針對相關的勞保對勞工的保障。\n好,謝謝李委員下一位我們請羅廷偉委員質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:08.686 --> 00:14.889\n好,謝謝主席。請一下卓院長還有勞動部何部長。好,請卓院長何部長備詢。好,議員好。好,院長好、部長好。臺灣的勞工對著臺灣的發電,派出最重要的基礎,付出最多。所以我們對於勞工的權利的保障,是政府最重要的一個基本責任。\n\n00:38.134 --> 00:54.480\n大家都談到勞保那我記得在馬英九擔任總統陳沖擔任行政院長的時候我是第一個針對相關的財務精算報告提出質詢而且有兩項重要的建議\n\n00:55.540 --> 01:22.185\n就是要讓勞工安心讓勞工在老年之後對於他們的生活有勞保的這樣的一個基本的保障所以當初要求第一個政府撥補第二是政府的國家最終支付責任經過多年的努力謝謝蘇貞昌院長在2020年我們踏出了重要的第一步就是撥補了200億2021年\n\n01:25.796 --> 01:33.619\n剝補220億。2022年300億。2023年450億再加300億的特別預算。到今年已經剝補到了1200億。我首先要請教院長我們針對政府的剝補明年我們編的預算是不是還會再增加?會維持到1200億以上嗎?來請部長說明。\n\n01:54.218 --> 01:54.658\n會不會維持1200億以上?會不會增加?\n\n02:18.407 --> 02:41.984\n目前還是至少維持跟過去一樣的水準是有的。好,謝謝院長的承諾。第二我們對於最終支付責任或是政府撥補當然已經連續5年的撥補那勞工對於政府的相關的作為認為對於勞保的撥補以及國家最終支付責任是有實質的做到。\n\n02:43.001 --> 03:07.775\n但是我們的論壇也說我們對於勞保的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任是要明文入法所以相關的勞保條例第69條必須要明文的加入相關的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任我們看國民年金法的第49條以及公務人員退休撫恤管理條例第8條\n\n03:09.035 --> 03:34.707\n對於他們相關的政府撥補或者是國家最終支付責任都有明文入法這個是我們接下來要推動的這是第二階段明文入法第三階段最重要的就是我們針對老保年金的改革必須更進一步的來推出長期的一個規劃過去對於老保年金的改革\n\n03:49.602 --> 04:08.835\n第三、過去所討論出來的版本可能都是要多繳少領而且要晚點領這種勞工是無法接受的所以說我在這邊要提醒何部長我們第一步實質的政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任做到了\n\n04:09.485 --> 04:35.285\n第二部就是相關的我們的民穩入法勞保條例要將政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任民穩入法。第三就是要針對我們相關的勞保的改革必須做長期的跟長官學來進行更進一步的討論提出共識的版本這是很重要的工作。\n\n04:36.190 --> 04:40.652\n另外,我們針對相關的職災的部分,我們2023年職災加上我們的職業病,就是職場染疫加起來總共有9萬多件,這很嚴重。職業災害佔了4萬7千件,\n\n05:01.136 --> 05:25.707\n然後職業病跟職場染疫現在也納入這個職業災害裡面,所以他也有4萬3千件,加起來就9萬件。那我們2022年多少件?7萬件。2023年比2022年增加了2萬件,給你們慢驚啦。那我們2023年我們來看,因為職業災害失能的我們的勞工朋友啊,是達到1382人。\n\n05:28.729 --> 05:51.479\n死亡的人數不幸死亡的人數達到625人部長我要提醒你這625人單純的職業災害扣除職業病以及職場燃益的就有599人如果我再提醒部長我們針對2023跟2022再來做一個比較2023比2022\n\n05:57.472 --> 06:25.571\n我們的職業傷害多出了1351人。死亡的人數增加了83人。要有效的降低職災保護我們的勞工啊來保證你有什麼具體的作為我們的職業傷害的職業災害的受傷的人數增加以及職業災害死亡的人數增加這對勞工權益的保障是一個嚴重的警訊來請說明\n\n06:27.769 --> 06:43.303\n謝謝委員。剛剛您提到的那個職災給付件數會增加,那個是基本上是有COVID-19的因素啦。是因為...所以我說加上職業病跟職場染疫。對,可是我要跟您報告,現在因應這一個確實我們職災發生率並沒有有效的降低,這是一個嚴重的問題。\n\n06:48.928 --> 07:00.628\n那麼我們也針對這個我們要準備修正職業安全衛生法。這是為什麼呢?因為第一個在我們的這一個您看到的公安意外裡面很多數的業主\n\n07:01.271 --> 07:03.012\n部長,重點在於如何有效的降低職債。我們一年\n\n07:31.348 --> 07:55.308\n有1382位勞工失能這很嚴重的我們有625人勞工失去生命這很嚴重的每一位勞工都是我們的家人一般他們為臺灣的經濟發展付出最大的心力勞工的權利必須要具體的保障那我們看看相關的勞工職業災害有50%都營造業了\n\n07:58.666 --> 08:10.759\n對。然後有43%左右都是墜落。是。那都是非常嚴重的。是。那勞動部委員提出說營造業墜落打幾年?\n\n08:11.618 --> 08:15.501\n那你們有什麼具體的做法來講一下?具體的做法會不會提高相關的公安裁罰的金額?\n\n08:33.596 --> 08:36.779\n我剛剛提到職業安全衛生法也會提高相關的裁罰金額,現在只有3萬到30萬,而且裁罰金額都沒有公佈,這是要檢討的。那麼我們準備要把它大幅提高,因為這個部分也不能讓業主心存僥倖,\n\n08:52.771 --> 09:16.299\n那麼尤其我們在這個營造業的這個趕工的過程裡面,常常大家輕忽的工地安全本身的這樣子的一個連帶的責任的問題,這是部分我們必須確實檢討的。那違反了大部分都是職業安全衛生法的第6條,那更應該具體的提出一些督促管理的這樣的作為,所以說我\n\n09:18.663 --> 09:26.837\n一直要請教何部長,你剛就任。我們對於要降低職業災害到底有什麼具體的做法?你有什麼目標?\n\n09:29.516 --> 09:33.558\n那修法之前你有什麼具體的措施嗎?相關的行政作為嗎?我們也提到勞檢,部長你也提到勞檢。我們一年勞檢的場次大概是28萬的場次。\n\n09:57.449 --> 10:16.596\n如果以初檢來說就有11萬場次那11萬場次的初檢它的違規是達到12萬次以上所以去初檢大概都有問題都幾乎百分之百以上那當然我們在相關的復檢這些違規的這些場次裡面\n\n10:21.657 --> 10:46.205\n勞動部所提供的資料號稱它的改善率達到92%,有證據嗎?來請你說明一下。我想這個確實該檢討,因為如果跟對照我們委員所感受到的或我們大家所感受到的,確實這個不盡符合事實。那麼因為我剛上任,我也要求我們職安署對這個問題要進行全面的檢討。\n\n10:47.225 --> 11:09.917\n因為包含初檢跟復檢之間,它會有一個時間差嘛。那麼初檢跟復檢之間還有包括我們對停工範圍的定義,其實那個有很多檢討的空間。這個部分我倒是要肯定一下勞動部,我們對於勞檢的場次啊,這樣的增加是更能夠具體的來保障勞工的職場的安全。\n\n11:10.475 --> 11:19.195\n但是相關的這一些對於業者的督促以及相關的改善必須更進一步的來作為提升。來說明一下。\n\n11:20.009 --> 11:40.822\n是,就是另一方面這個除了我們這個增加勞檢修職業安全衛生委員就是說這個勞檢要確實化跟修職業安全衛生法也很有關係因為我們目前的職業安全衛生法某些規範並沒有那麼的明確化所以導致這個我們在勞檢進行裁罰的時候其實也不夠具體\n\n11:42.103 --> 12:03.432\n這個是有互相連帶關係,所以希望我們能在最快的時間內提出執行委的修法,也能獲得委員的支持。這個必須要更具體的作為。部長我都簽稿了,熱危害的議題。院長、部長,這幾天都灰色的熱,我們好像住在人生裡面。這就是因為極端氣候的這樣的一個肆虐跟趨勢。\n\n12:05.076 --> 12:21.804\n那勞工朋友在這麼炎熱的天氣工作,相關的熱危害以及對身體所造成的衝擊啊,他的傷害性非常的大。在6月26號,郵局的勞工啊,郵差,辛苦的郵差啊,就一位眾署分導。\n\n12:22.634 --> 12:38.576\n在送信的過程裡面那我們對於熱危害部長你有什麼具體的想法來部長請說明對要跟委員報告這熱危害確實也是當前大家都在注意的一個大問題我們現在也進行夏季高溫勞檢\n\n12:39.938 --> 12:57.804\n也是一樣有勞檢,可是呢,這個一樣就是說,這個在食安委的這個法的規定裡面也是不夠明確,所以我們必須要把它進行法規的修正,這部分是行政命令。就是說業主他必須要提供避難,就是這一個防高溫的設備跟設施給勞工。\n\n13:00.385 --> 13:29.494\n目前這個部分沒有明確化的規定。接下來要做明確化的規定嗎?來說明一下。我們8月底要來做這個相關法規的明確字眼入法。我們現在只有要求他進行避難的這個規定,避難這樣子的一個規定,可是沒有要求他提供設備設施。所以會變成你在勞檢的時候,你又沒有辦法很明確的去罰他。所以這個又是一個執行上的問題。\n\n13:30.314 --> 13:48.432\n雖然我們下季勞工勞檢好幾萬場次可是罰的都很少所以這是會變成一個無效率的一個狀態這樣子所以我很很快的這個月就要進行這個法規的修正我們之前有通過勞工的職業災害保險以及保護法那針對勞工的職場的安全以及相關發生職業災害之後\n\n13:54.478 --> 13:54.518\n﹚李昆澤﹚\n\n14:22.407 --> 14:42.913\n那這個部分必須要更加強的來做相關的處理,來說明一下。好,謝謝委員。那個植栽預防重建中心是一個植栽保護法之後新成立的單位。它運作大概現在三年左右,兩三年左右而已。那麼它事實上也在摸索中。\n\n14:43.773 --> 14:43.813\n﹚李昆澤\n\n15:01.483 --> 15:02.543\n院長因為時間的關係請院長全力督促針對相關的勞保對勞工的保障。\n\n15:35.260 --> 15:40.004\n好,謝謝李委員下一位我們請羅廷偉委員質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":8.686,"end":14.889,"text":"好,謝謝主席。請一下卓院長還有勞動部何部長。好,請卓院長何部長備詢。好,議員好。好,院長好、部長好。臺灣的勞工對著臺灣的發電,派出最重要的基礎,付出最多。所以我們對於勞工的權利的保障,是政府最重要的一個基本責任。"},{"start":38.134,"end":54.48,"text":"大家都談到勞保那我記得在馬英九擔任總統陳沖擔任行政院長的時候我是第一個針對相關的財務精算報告提出質詢而且有兩項重要的建議"},{"start":55.54,"end":82.185,"text":"就是要讓勞工安心讓勞工在老年之後對於他們的生活有勞保的這樣的一個基本的保障所以當初要求第一個政府撥補第二是政府的國家最終支付責任經過多年的努力謝謝蘇貞昌院長在2020年我們踏出了重要的第一步就是撥補了200億2021年"},{"start":85.796,"end":93.619,"text":"剝補220億。2022年300億。2023年450億再加300億的特別預算。到今年已經剝補到了1200億。我首先要請教院長我們針對政府的剝補明年我們編的預算是不是還會再增加?會維持到1200億以上嗎?來請部長說明。"},{"start":114.218,"end":114.658,"text":"會不會維持1200億以上?會不會增加?"},{"start":138.407,"end":161.984,"text":"目前還是至少維持跟過去一樣的水準是有的。好,謝謝院長的承諾。第二我們對於最終支付責任或是政府撥補當然已經連續5年的撥補那勞工對於政府的相關的作為認為對於勞保的撥補以及國家最終支付責任是有實質的做到。"},{"start":163.001,"end":187.775,"text":"但是我們的論壇也說我們對於勞保的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任是要明文入法所以相關的勞保條例第69條必須要明文的加入相關的政府撥補以及國家最終支付責任我們看國民年金法的第49條以及公務人員退休撫恤管理條例第8條"},{"start":189.035,"end":214.707,"text":"對於他們相關的政府撥補或者是國家最終支付責任都有明文入法這個是我們接下來要推動的這是第二階段明文入法第三階段最重要的就是我們針對老保年金的改革必須更進一步的來推出長期的一個規劃過去對於老保年金的改革"},{"start":215.879,"end":229.326,"text":"﹚議員"},{"start":229.602,"end":248.835,"text":"第三、過去所討論出來的版本可能都是要多繳少領而且要晚點領這種勞工是無法接受的所以說我在這邊要提醒何部長我們第一步實質的政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任做到了"},{"start":249.485,"end":275.285,"text":"第二部就是相關的我們的民穩入法勞保條例要將政府撥補跟國家最終支付責任民穩入法。第三就是要針對我們相關的勞保的改革必須做長期的跟長官學來進行更進一步的討論提出共識的版本這是很重要的工作。"},{"start":276.19,"end":280.652,"text":"另外,我們針對相關的職災的部分,我們2023年職災加上我們的職業病,就是職場染疫加起來總共有9萬多件,這很嚴重。職業災害佔了4萬7千件,"},{"start":301.136,"end":325.707,"text":"然後職業病跟職場染疫現在也納入這個職業災害裡面,所以他也有4萬3千件,加起來就9萬件。那我們2022年多少件?7萬件。2023年比2022年增加了2萬件,給你們慢驚啦。那我們2023年我們來看,因為職業災害失能的我們的勞工朋友啊,是達到1382人。"},{"start":328.729,"end":351.479,"text":"死亡的人數不幸死亡的人數達到625人部長我要提醒你這625人單純的職業災害扣除職業病以及職場燃益的就有599人如果我再提醒部長我們針對2023跟2022再來做一個比較2023比2022"},{"start":357.472,"end":385.571,"text":"我們的職業傷害多出了1351人。死亡的人數增加了83人。要有效的降低職災保護我們的勞工啊來保證你有什麼具體的作為我們的職業傷害的職業災害的受傷的人數增加以及職業災害死亡的人數增加這對勞工權益的保障是一個嚴重的警訊來請說明"},{"start":387.769,"end":403.303,"text":"謝謝委員。剛剛您提到的那個職災給付件數會增加,那個是基本上是有COVID-19的因素啦。是因為...所以我說加上職業病跟職場染疫。對,可是我要跟您報告,現在因應這一個確實我們職災發生率並沒有有效的降低,這是一個嚴重的問題。"},{"start":408.928,"end":420.628,"text":"那麼我們也針對這個我們要準備修正職業安全衛生法。這是為什麼呢?因為第一個在我們的這一個您看到的公安意外裡面很多數的業主"},{"start":421.271,"end":423.012,"text":"部長,重點在於如何有效的降低職債。我們一年"},{"start":451.348,"end":475.308,"text":"有1382位勞工失能 這很嚴重的我們有625人勞工失去生命 這很嚴重的每一位勞工都是我們的家人一般他們為臺灣的經濟發展付出最大的心力勞工的權利必須要具體的保障那我們看看相關的勞工職業災害有50%都營造業了"},{"start":478.666,"end":490.759,"text":"對。然後有43%左右都是墜落。是。那都是非常嚴重的。是。那勞動部委員提出說營造業墜落打幾年?"},{"start":491.618,"end":495.501,"text":"那你們有什麼具體的做法來講一下?具體的做法會不會提高相關的公安裁罰的金額?"},{"start":513.596,"end":516.779,"text":"我剛剛提到職業安全衛生法也會提高相關的裁罰金額,現在只有3萬到30萬,而且裁罰金額都沒有公佈,這是要檢討的。那麼我們準備要把它大幅提高,因為這個部分也不能讓業主心存僥倖,"},{"start":532.771,"end":556.299,"text":"那麼尤其我們在這個營造業的這個趕工的過程裡面,常常大家輕忽的工地安全本身的這樣子的一個連帶的責任的問題,這是部分我們必須確實檢討的。那違反了大部分都是職業安全衛生法的第6條,那更應該具體的提出一些督促管理的這樣的作為,所以說我"},{"start":558.663,"end":566.837,"text":"一直要請教何部長,你剛就任。我們對於要降低職業災害到底有什麼具體的做法?你有什麼目標?"},{"start":569.516,"end":573.558,"text":"那修法之前你有什麼具體的措施嗎?相關的行政作為嗎?我們也提到勞檢,部長你也提到勞檢。我們一年勞檢的場次大概是28萬的場次。"},{"start":597.449,"end":616.596,"text":"如果以初檢來說就有11萬場次那11萬場次的初檢它的違規是達到12萬次以上所以去初檢大概都有問題都幾乎百分之百以上那當然我們在相關的復檢這些違規的這些場次裡面"},{"start":621.657,"end":646.205,"text":"勞動部所提供的資料號稱它的改善率達到92%,有證據嗎?來請你說明一下。我想這個確實該檢討,因為如果跟對照我們委員所感受到的或我們大家所感受到的,確實這個不盡符合事實。那麼因為我剛上任,我也要求我們職安署對這個問題要進行全面的檢討。"},{"start":647.225,"end":669.917,"text":"因為包含初檢跟復檢之間,它會有一個時間差嘛。那麼初檢跟復檢之間還有包括我們對停工範圍的定義,其實那個有很多檢討的空間。這個部分我倒是要肯定一下勞動部,我們對於勞檢的場次啊,這樣的增加是更能夠具體的來保障勞工的職場的安全。"},{"start":670.475,"end":679.195,"text":"但是相關的這一些對於業者的督促以及相關的改善必須更進一步的來作為提升。來說明一下。"},{"start":680.009,"end":700.822,"text":"是,就是另一方面這個除了我們這個增加勞檢修職業安全衛生委員就是說這個勞檢要確實化跟修職業安全衛生法也很有關係因為我們目前的職業安全衛生法某些規範並沒有那麼的明確化所以導致這個我們在勞檢進行裁罰的時候其實也不夠具體"},{"start":702.103,"end":723.432,"text":"這個是有互相連帶關係,所以希望我們能在最快的時間內提出執行委的修法,也能獲得委員的支持。這個必須要更具體的作為。部長我都簽稿了,熱危害的議題。院長、部長,這幾天都灰色的熱,我們好像住在人生裡面。這就是因為極端氣候的這樣的一個肆虐跟趨勢。"},{"start":725.076,"end":741.804,"text":"那勞工朋友在這麼炎熱的天氣工作,相關的熱危害以及對身體所造成的衝擊啊,他的傷害性非常的大。在6月26號,郵局的勞工啊,郵差,辛苦的郵差啊,就一位眾署分導。"},{"start":742.634,"end":758.576,"text":"在送信的過程裡面那我們對於熱危害部長你有什麼具體的想法來部長請說明對要跟委員報告這熱危害確實也是當前大家都在注意的一個大問題我們現在也進行夏季高溫勞檢"},{"start":759.938,"end":777.804,"text":"也是一樣有勞檢,可是呢,這個一樣就是說,這個在食安委的這個法的規定裡面也是不夠明確,所以我們必須要把它進行法規的修正,這部分是行政命令。就是說業主他必須要提供避難,就是這一個防高溫的設備跟設施給勞工。"},{"start":780.385,"end":809.494,"text":"目前這個部分沒有明確化的規定。接下來要做明確化的規定嗎?來說明一下。我們8月底要來做這個相關法規的明確字眼入法。我們現在只有要求他進行避難的這個規定,避難這樣子的一個規定,可是沒有要求他提供設備設施。所以會變成你在勞檢的時候,你又沒有辦法很明確的去罰他。所以這個又是一個執行上的問題。"},{"start":810.314,"end":828.432,"text":"雖然我們下季勞工勞檢好幾萬場次可是罰的都很少所以這是會變成一個無效率的一個狀態這樣子所以我很很快的這個月就要進行這個法規的修正我們之前有通過勞工的職業災害保險以及保護法那針對勞工的職場的安全以及相關發生職業災害之後"},{"start":834.478,"end":834.518,"text":"﹚李昆澤﹚"},{"start":862.407,"end":882.913,"text":"那這個部分必須要更加強的來做相關的處理,來說明一下。好,謝謝委員。那個植栽預防重建中心是一個植栽保護法之後新成立的單位。它運作大概現在三年左右,兩三年左右而已。那麼它事實上也在摸索中。"},{"start":883.773,"end":883.813,"text":"﹚李昆澤"},{"start":901.483,"end":902.543,"text":"院長因為時間的關係請院長全力督促針對相關的勞保對勞工的保障。"},{"start":935.26,"end":940.004,"text":"好,謝謝李委員下一位我們請羅廷偉委員質詢"}]}}}}