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00:02:22,912\n這幾年我們陸陸續續做機關組織的調整增加這麼多的部會或是改變部會的從部改成會或從會改成提升成為部那這部分您的看法是什麼您認為這個跟我們這個政府接下來的人事的緣額會不會產生重大的影響我們經費的支出就想聽聽看您的意見\n\n7\n00:02:27,654 --> 00:02:40,920\n謝謝委員這個議題事實上我們整個組織在調整事實上是因應整個社會還有國際歧視在調整像各自成立委員會就大概七八年前\n\n8\n00:02:41,880 --> 00:02:58,176\n歐盟那裡有成立GDPR然後我們為了以他們接軌所以我們也成立了各支籌備委員會現在是成立籌備處的一個階段它本身是一個獨立機關大概介於有一點類似研能會的這一種組織的結構\n\n9\n00:03:00,638 --> 00:03:29,881\n那體育發展部大概這幾年大概也知道臺灣在運動賽事方面對在整個表現都非常好那我們也希望說從另外一個角度如何提供全民更好的一個運動的環境還有健康的體魄從這個角度來會成立一個部那至於新住民的這個部分是大院才是要求要成立一個專者機關的部分\n\n10\n00:03:31,402 --> 00:03:55,983\n其實我的問題在於說依照現在行政院的組織法裡面行政院組織法裡面有明定我們就是有14個部應該是14個部8個會是不是14個部9個會那麼未來要怎麼樣去做調整呢是又要再把某個部又拉下來改成會嗎\n\n11\n00:03:57,529 --> 00:04:07,579\n如果說按照你們現在講的整個人力的管理是要以當增則增因減則減的原則那麼當你的人力增加了之後你哪些要減呢我覺得委員這個問題非常好現在目前的一個規劃會成立一個\n\n12\n00:04:17,332 --> 00:04:17,352\n委員會議員\n\n13\n00:04:47,792 --> 00:05:09,024\n我們會在這個範圍內去做移動的概念它不是競爭家因為這一個新的部會它有競爭家一樣我們也會定期透過兩年一次的延合評鑑去減少有些業務一定會有消有漲嘛是的我了解這個情況但是就是說以我們看到之前速發部的成立\n\n14\n00:05:09,824 --> 00:05:20,074\n其實他基本上已經也占用了我們目前就是之前的不少的員額那現在要再成立一個體育部當然本人是支持成立體育部但是就說在整個的整體國家的總員額\n\n15\n00:05:24,147 --> 00:05:24,167\n委員會議員\n\n16\n00:05:43,419 --> 00:05:43,599\n李慧琼議員\n\n17\n00:06:04,271 --> 00:06:04,331\n公職律師\n\n18\n00:06:29,584 --> 00:06:35,906\n本席在上禮拜五的總諮詢裏面其實我有特別提到有關於NCC編列的訴訟費用過高因為業者不滿NCC所做的處分所以紛紛提起行政訴訟那它的訴訟費用夏年度還編了800多萬前兩年還有超過上千萬的訴訟費用\n\n19\n00:06:53,712 --> 00:07:19,277\n所以由這個角度來看似乎NCC譬如說它內部就真的要去聘請聘請的公職律師可能會比這個編列預算去付一個訴訟付這麼高的訴訟費用都要來的經濟那我想請教就是就我們律師法修正通過增加公職律師那麼人事總處這邊有去了解目前到底有哪些機關有設置公職律師嗎\n\n20\n00:07:21,847 --> 00:07:27,293\n目前健保署有提出來偵測兩名公職律師其他都沒有目前還沒有提出來因為他們可能要評估然後要修編制表\n\n21\n00:07:37,748 --> 00:07:42,930\n其實我認為說這個部分的話其實人事總處這裡其實也可以去了解一下各機關的需求然後而且呢要特別將這個一些機關他們浪費人民的納稅錢編了很高的這個編了很多的公帑去支應訴訟費用的這件事情這些機關都要去考慮他們未來是不是要增設公職律師那這部分的話可能希望人事長這邊也要去了解目前公職律師的經用狀況還有為什麼\n\n22\n00:08:07,222 --> 00:08:07,382\n國安部\n\n23\n00:08:24,192 --> 00:08:52,253\n好沒關係那接下來我還有另外一個問題這也是跟公務人員的福利有關的我們知道其實現在台灣已經進入到高齡化的時代根據最新的統計就是2025年之後台灣每五個人就有一個人是65歲的老年人口已經進入到超高齡社會那進入到這樣超高齡社會的時代裡面我們就必須考慮到就是公務人員他可能這個也必須要奉養父母親\n\n24\n00:08:53,914 --> 00:09:06,182\n現在我們有釋清假但是我們釋清假是留職停薪就不像是育嬰假育嬰假的話還可以照顧小孩請申請育嬰假有留職給薪還可以有八成薪\n\n25\n00:09:11,525 --> 00:09:30,419\n那麼所以在這樣的一個情況之下我本席是認為說也要考慮到我們時代在改變我們整個的社會的狀況然後照顧年老的父母親其實也是公務員的作為子女的一個很重要的責任所以是不是有可能可以要修法將這個釋清價\n\n26\n00:09:33,882 --> 00:09:37,283\n沒有留職停薪的補助,這個涉及到勞工跟軍工教育的一點\n\n27\n00:09:49,223 --> 00:10:08,683\n我想委員的建議會長因為這一個適性假如果是要留職給薪的話必須要考慮到我們跟勞工的很平性的問題那我們現在有做一個大概有不少機關的同仁都有去使用就是說我們上下班有彈性上班\n\n28\n00:10:09,464 --> 00:10:33,519\n那個是不一樣的概念啦我知道當然是不一樣的概念可是當這個制度要做比較大的變革的時候我們要考量的因素就比較多可是我這裡答應委員我們會跟程序部在協調所以希望人事長是不是可以也是大概一個月可以給我提一個報告出來就是針對就是市清價如何改善然後要比照育嬰價\n\n29\n00:10:35,956 --> 00:10:36,636\n主席主席\n\n30\n00:11:05,114 --> 00:11:06,963\n好謝謝翁委員謝謝蘇人事長兩個月提一個書面報告\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n9979\t12083\t主席好謝謝委員長人事長請人事長\n18015\t43142\t好 人事長我今天我雖然沒有來現場聆聽您的口頭報告但是我有認真的讀了您所提出來的業務報告那麼在這次的業務報告裡面其實我有關心幾個議題然後正好您在報告裡面有提所以我現在就想要來就教有關於就是您在業務報告裡面提到的涉及到像是組織精簡\n45503\t45823\t公職律師\n66617\t66777\t那我想請問就是說\n98437\t118131\t當現在政府或是有其他的這個民間的呼籲說要成立這些新部會在這個新部會成立他勢必會影響到我們政府機關的整個組織架構人員的增加員額增加經費也會增加那請問人事長您對於像\n119960\t142912\t這幾年我們陸陸續續做機關組織的調整增加這麼多的部會或是改變部會的從部改成會或從會改成提升成為部那這部分您的看法是什麼您認為這個跟我們這個政府接下來的人事的緣額會不會產生重大的影響我們經費的支出就想聽聽看您的意見\n147654\t160920\t謝謝委員這個議題事實上我們整個組織在調整事實上是因應整個社會還有國際歧視在調整像各自成立委員會就大概七八年前\n161880\t178176\t歐盟那裡有成立GDPR然後我們為了以他們接軌所以我們也成立了各支籌備委員會現在是成立籌備處的一個階段它本身是一個獨立機關大概介於有一點類似研能會的這一種組織的結構\n180638\t209881\t那體育發展部大概這幾年大概也知道臺灣在運動賽事方面對在整個表現都非常好那我們也希望說從另外一個角度如何提供全民更好的一個運動的環境還有健康的體魄從這個角度來會成立一個部那至於新住民的這個部分是大院才是要求要成立一個專者機關的部分\n211402\t235983\t其實我的問題在於說依照現在行政院的組織法裡面行政院組織法裡面有明定我們就是有14個部應該是14個部8個會是不是14個部9個會那麼未來要怎麼樣去做調整呢是又要再把某個部又拉下來改成會嗎\n237529\t247579\t如果說按照你們現在講的整個人力的管理是要以當增則增因減則減的原則那麼當你的人力增加了之後你哪些要減呢我覺得委員這個問題非常好現在目前的一個規劃會成立一個\n257332\t257352\t委員會議員\n287792\t309024\t我們會在這個範圍內去做移動的概念它不是競爭家因為這一個新的部會它有競爭家一樣我們也會定期透過兩年一次的延合評鑑去減少有些業務一定會有消有漲嘛是的我了解這個情況但是就是說以我們看到之前速發部的成立\n309824\t320074\t其實他基本上已經也占用了我們目前就是之前的不少的員額那現在要再成立一個體育部當然本人是支持成立體育部但是就說在整個的整體國家的總員額\n324147\t324167\t委員會議員\n343419\t343599\t李慧琼議員\n364271\t364331\t公職律師\n389584\t395906\t本席在上禮拜五的總諮詢裏面其實我有特別提到有關於NCC編列的訴訟費用過高因為業者不滿NCC所做的處分所以紛紛提起行政訴訟那它的訴訟費用夏年度還編了800多萬前兩年還有超過上千萬的訴訟費用\n413712\t439277\t所以由這個角度來看似乎NCC 譬如說它內部就真的要去聘請聘請的公職律師可能會比這個編列預算去付一個訴訟付這麼高的訴訟費用都要來的經濟那我想請教就是就我們律師法修正通過增加公職律師那麼人事總處這邊有去了解目前到底有哪些機關有設置公職律師嗎\n441847\t447293\t目前健保署有提出來偵測兩名公職律師其他都沒有目前還沒有提出來因為他們可能要評估然後要修編制表\n457748\t462930\t其實我認為說這個部分的話其實人事總處這裡其實也可以去了解一下各機關的需求然後而且呢要特別將這個一些機關他們浪費人民的納稅錢編了很高的這個編了很多的公帑去支應訴訟費用的這件事情這些機關都要去考慮他們未來是不是要增設公職律師那這部分的話可能希望人事長這邊也要去了解目前公職律師的經用狀況還有為什麼\n487222\t487382\t國安部\n504192\t532253\t好沒關係那接下來我還有另外一個問題這也是跟公務人員的福利有關的我們知道其實現在台灣已經進入到高齡化的時代根據最新的統計就是2025年之後台灣每五個人就有一個人是65歲的老年人口已經進入到超高齡社會那進入到這樣超高齡社會的時代裡面我們就必須考慮到就是公務人員他可能這個也必須要奉養父母親\n533914\t546182\t現在我們有釋清假但是我們釋清假是留職停薪就不像是育嬰假育嬰假的話還可以照顧小孩請申請育嬰假有留職給薪還可以有八成薪\n551525\t570419\t那麼所以在這樣的一個情況之下我本席是認為說也要考慮到我們時代在改變我們整個的社會的狀況然後照顧年老的父母親其實也是公務員的作為子女的一個很重要的責任所以是不是有可能可以要修法將這個釋清價\n573882\t577283\t沒有留職停薪的補助,這個涉及到勞工跟軍工教育的一點\n589223\t608683\t我想委員的建議會長因為這一個適性假如果是要留職給薪的話必須要考慮到我們跟勞工的很平性的問題那我們現在有做一個大概有不少機關的同仁都有去使用就是說我們上下班有彈性上班\n609464\t633519\t那個是不一樣的概念啦我知道當然是不一樣的概念可是當這個制度要做比較大的變革的時候我們要考量的因素就比較多可是我這裡答應委員我們會跟程序部在協調所以希望人事長是不是可以也是大概一個月可以給我提一個報告出來就是針對就是市清價如何改善然後要比照育嬰價\n635956\t636636\t主席主席\n665114\t666963\t好 謝謝翁委員 謝謝蘇人事長 兩個月提一個書面報告\n","txt":"主席好謝謝委員長人事長請人事長\n好 人事長我今天我雖然沒有來現場聆聽您的口頭報告但是我有認真的讀了您所提出來的業務報告那麼在這次的業務報告裡面其實我有關心幾個議題然後正好您在報告裡面有提所以我現在就想要來就教有關於就是您在業務報告裡面提到的涉及到像是組織精簡\n公職律師\n那我想請問就是說\n當現在政府或是有其他的這個民間的呼籲說要成立這些新部會在這個新部會成立他勢必會影響到我們政府機關的整個組織架構人員的增加員額增加經費也會增加那請問人事長您對於像\n這幾年我們陸陸續續做機關組織的調整增加這麼多的部會或是改變部會的從部改成會或從會改成提升成為部那這部分您的看法是什麼您認為這個跟我們這個政府接下來的人事的緣額會不會產生重大的影響我們經費的支出就想聽聽看您的意見\n謝謝委員這個議題事實上我們整個組織在調整事實上是因應整個社會還有國際歧視在調整像各自成立委員會就大概七八年前\n歐盟那裡有成立GDPR然後我們為了以他們接軌所以我們也成立了各支籌備委員會現在是成立籌備處的一個階段它本身是一個獨立機關大概介於有一點類似研能會的這一種組織的結構\n那體育發展部大概這幾年大概也知道臺灣在運動賽事方面對在整個表現都非常好那我們也希望說從另外一個角度如何提供全民更好的一個運動的環境還有健康的體魄從這個角度來會成立一個部那至於新住民的這個部分是大院才是要求要成立一個專者機關的部分\n其實我的問題在於說依照現在行政院的組織法裡面行政院組織法裡面有明定我們就是有14個部應該是14個部8個會是不是14個部9個會那麼未來要怎麼樣去做調整呢是又要再把某個部又拉下來改成會嗎\n如果說按照你們現在講的整個人力的管理是要以當增則增因減則減的原則那麼當你的人力增加了之後你哪些要減呢我覺得委員這個問題非常好現在目前的一個規劃會成立一個\n委員會議員\n我們會在這個範圍內去做移動的概念它不是競爭家因為這一個新的部會它有競爭家一樣我們也會定期透過兩年一次的延合評鑑去減少有些業務一定會有消有漲嘛是的我了解這個情況但是就是說以我們看到之前速發部的成立\n其實他基本上已經也占用了我們目前就是之前的不少的員額那現在要再成立一個體育部當然本人是支持成立體育部但是就說在整個的整體國家的總員額\n委員會議員\n李慧琼議員\n公職律師\n本席在上禮拜五的總諮詢裏面其實我有特別提到有關於NCC編列的訴訟費用過高因為業者不滿NCC所做的處分所以紛紛提起行政訴訟那它的訴訟費用夏年度還編了800多萬前兩年還有超過上千萬的訴訟費用\n所以由這個角度來看似乎NCC 譬如說它內部就真的要去聘請聘請的公職律師可能會比這個編列預算去付一個訴訟付這麼高的訴訟費用都要來的經濟那我想請教就是就我們律師法修正通過增加公職律師那麼人事總處這邊有去了解目前到底有哪些機關有設置公職律師嗎\n目前健保署有提出來偵測兩名公職律師其他都沒有目前還沒有提出來因為他們可能要評估然後要修編制表\n其實我認為說這個部分的話其實人事總處這裡其實也可以去了解一下各機關的需求然後而且呢要特別將這個一些機關他們浪費人民的納稅錢編了很高的這個編了很多的公帑去支應訴訟費用的這件事情這些機關都要去考慮他們未來是不是要增設公職律師那這部分的話可能希望人事長這邊也要去了解目前公職律師的經用狀況還有為什麼\n國安部\n好沒關係那接下來我還有另外一個問題這也是跟公務人員的福利有關的我們知道其實現在台灣已經進入到高齡化的時代根據最新的統計就是2025年之後台灣每五個人就有一個人是65歲的老年人口已經進入到超高齡社會那進入到這樣超高齡社會的時代裡面我們就必須考慮到就是公務人員他可能這個也必須要奉養父母親\n現在我們有釋清假但是我們釋清假是留職停薪就不像是育嬰假育嬰假的話還可以照顧小孩請申請育嬰假有留職給薪還可以有八成薪\n那麼所以在這樣的一個情況之下我本席是認為說也要考慮到我們時代在改變我們整個的社會的狀況然後照顧年老的父母親其實也是公務員的作為子女的一個很重要的責任所以是不是有可能可以要修法將這個釋清價\n沒有留職停薪的補助,這個涉及到勞工跟軍工教育的一點\n我想委員的建議會長因為這一個適性假如果是要留職給薪的話必須要考慮到我們跟勞工的很平性的問題那我們現在有做一個大概有不少機關的同仁都有去使用就是說我們上下班有彈性上班\n那個是不一樣的概念啦我知道當然是不一樣的概念可是當這個制度要做比較大的變革的時候我們要考量的因素就比較多可是我這裡答應委員我們會跟程序部在協調所以希望人事長是不是可以也是大概一個月可以給我提一個報告出來就是針對就是市清價如何改善然後要比照育嬰價\n主席主席\n好 謝謝翁委員 謝謝蘇人事長 兩個月提一個書面報告\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:09.979 --> 00:12.083\n主席好謝謝委員長人事長請人事長\n\n00:18.015 --> 00:43.142\n好人事長我今天我雖然沒有來現場聆聽您的口頭報告但是我有認真的讀了您所提出來的業務報告那麼在這次的業務報告裡面其實我有關心幾個議題然後正好您在報告裡面有提所以我現在就想要來就教有關於就是您在業務報告裡面提到的涉及到像是組織精簡\n\n00:45.503 --> 00:45.823\n公職律師\n\n01:06.617 --> 01:06.777\n那我想請問就是說\n\n01:38.437 --> 01:58.131\n當現在政府或是有其他的這個民間的呼籲說要成立這些新部會在這個新部會成立他勢必會影響到我們政府機關的整個組織架構人員的增加員額增加經費也會增加那請問人事長您對於像\n\n01:59.960 --> 02:22.912\n這幾年我們陸陸續續做機關組織的調整增加這麼多的部會或是改變部會的從部改成會或從會改成提升成為部那這部分您的看法是什麼您認為這個跟我們這個政府接下來的人事的緣額會不會產生重大的影響我們經費的支出就想聽聽看您的意見\n\n02:27.654 --> 02:40.920\n謝謝委員這個議題事實上我們整個組織在調整事實上是因應整個社會還有國際歧視在調整像各自成立委員會就大概七八年前\n\n02:41.880 --> 02:58.176\n歐盟那裡有成立GDPR然後我們為了以他們接軌所以我們也成立了各支籌備委員會現在是成立籌備處的一個階段它本身是一個獨立機關大概介於有一點類似研能會的這一種組織的結構\n\n03:00.638 --> 03:29.881\n那體育發展部大概這幾年大概也知道臺灣在運動賽事方面對在整個表現都非常好那我們也希望說從另外一個角度如何提供全民更好的一個運動的環境還有健康的體魄從這個角度來會成立一個部那至於新住民的這個部分是大院才是要求要成立一個專者機關的部分\n\n03:31.402 --> 03:55.983\n其實我的問題在於說依照現在行政院的組織法裡面行政院組織法裡面有明定我們就是有14個部應該是14個部8個會是不是14個部9個會那麼未來要怎麼樣去做調整呢是又要再把某個部又拉下來改成會嗎\n\n03:57.529 --> 04:07.579\n如果說按照你們現在講的整個人力的管理是要以當增則增因減則減的原則那麼當你的人力增加了之後你哪些要減呢我覺得委員這個問題非常好現在目前的一個規劃會成立一個\n\n04:17.332 --> 04:17.352\n委員會議員\n\n04:47.792 --> 05:09.024\n我們會在這個範圍內去做移動的概念它不是競爭家因為這一個新的部會它有競爭家一樣我們也會定期透過兩年一次的延合評鑑去減少有些業務一定會有消有漲嘛是的我了解這個情況但是就是說以我們看到之前速發部的成立\n\n05:09.824 --> 05:20.074\n其實他基本上已經也占用了我們目前就是之前的不少的員額那現在要再成立一個體育部當然本人是支持成立體育部但是就說在整個的整體國家的總員額\n\n05:24.147 --> 05:24.167\n委員會議員\n\n05:43.419 --> 05:43.599\n李慧琼議員\n\n06:04.271 --> 06:04.331\n公職律師\n\n06:29.584 --> 06:35.906\n本席在上禮拜五的總諮詢裏面其實我有特別提到有關於NCC編列的訴訟費用過高因為業者不滿NCC所做的處分所以紛紛提起行政訴訟那它的訴訟費用夏年度還編了800多萬前兩年還有超過上千萬的訴訟費用\n\n06:53.712 --> 07:19.277\n所以由這個角度來看似乎NCC譬如說它內部就真的要去聘請聘請的公職律師可能會比這個編列預算去付一個訴訟付這麼高的訴訟費用都要來的經濟那我想請教就是就我們律師法修正通過增加公職律師那麼人事總處這邊有去了解目前到底有哪些機關有設置公職律師嗎\n\n07:21.847 --> 07:27.293\n目前健保署有提出來偵測兩名公職律師其他都沒有目前還沒有提出來因為他們可能要評估然後要修編制表\n\n07:37.748 --> 07:42.930\n其實我認為說這個部分的話其實人事總處這裡其實也可以去了解一下各機關的需求然後而且呢要特別將這個一些機關他們浪費人民的納稅錢編了很高的這個編了很多的公帑去支應訴訟費用的這件事情這些機關都要去考慮他們未來是不是要增設公職律師那這部分的話可能希望人事長這邊也要去了解目前公職律師的經用狀況還有為什麼\n\n08:07.222 --> 08:07.382\n國安部\n\n08:24.192 --> 08:52.253\n好沒關係那接下來我還有另外一個問題這也是跟公務人員的福利有關的我們知道其實現在台灣已經進入到高齡化的時代根據最新的統計就是2025年之後台灣每五個人就有一個人是65歲的老年人口已經進入到超高齡社會那進入到這樣超高齡社會的時代裡面我們就必須考慮到就是公務人員他可能這個也必須要奉養父母親\n\n08:53.914 --> 09:06.182\n現在我們有釋清假但是我們釋清假是留職停薪就不像是育嬰假育嬰假的話還可以照顧小孩請申請育嬰假有留職給薪還可以有八成薪\n\n09:11.525 --> 09:30.419\n那麼所以在這樣的一個情況之下我本席是認為說也要考慮到我們時代在改變我們整個的社會的狀況然後照顧年老的父母親其實也是公務員的作為子女的一個很重要的責任所以是不是有可能可以要修法將這個釋清價\n\n09:33.882 --> 09:37.283\n沒有留職停薪的補助,這個涉及到勞工跟軍工教育的一點\n\n09:49.223 --> 10:08.683\n我想委員的建議會長因為這一個適性假如果是要留職給薪的話必須要考慮到我們跟勞工的很平性的問題那我們現在有做一個大概有不少機關的同仁都有去使用就是說我們上下班有彈性上班\n\n10:09.464 --> 10:33.519\n那個是不一樣的概念啦我知道當然是不一樣的概念可是當這個制度要做比較大的變革的時候我們要考量的因素就比較多可是我這裡答應委員我們會跟程序部在協調所以希望人事長是不是可以也是大概一個月可以給我提一個報告出來就是針對就是市清價如何改善然後要比照育嬰價\n\n10:35.956 --> 10:36.636\n主席主席\n\n11:05.114 --> 11:06.963\n好謝謝翁委員謝謝蘇人事長兩個月提一個書面報告\n\n","segments":[{"start":9.979,"end":12.083,"text":"主席好謝謝委員長人事長請人事長"},{"start":18.015,"end":43.142,"text":"好 人事長我今天我雖然沒有來現場聆聽您的口頭報告但是我有認真的讀了您所提出來的業務報告那麼在這次的業務報告裡面其實我有關心幾個議題然後正好您在報告裡面有提所以我現在就想要來就教有關於就是您在業務報告裡面提到的涉及到像是組織精簡"},{"start":45.503,"end":45.823,"text":"公職律師"},{"start":66.617,"end":66.777,"text":"那我想請問就是說"},{"start":98.437,"end":118.131,"text":"當現在政府或是有其他的這個民間的呼籲說要成立這些新部會在這個新部會成立他勢必會影響到我們政府機關的整個組織架構人員的增加員額增加經費也會增加那請問人事長您對於像"},{"start":119.96,"end":142.912,"text":"這幾年我們陸陸續續做機關組織的調整增加這麼多的部會或是改變部會的從部改成會或從會改成提升成為部那這部分您的看法是什麼您認為這個跟我們這個政府接下來的人事的緣額會不會產生重大的影響我們經費的支出就想聽聽看您的意見"},{"start":147.654,"end":160.92,"text":"謝謝委員這個議題事實上我們整個組織在調整事實上是因應整個社會還有國際歧視在調整像各自成立委員會就大概七八年前"},{"start":161.88,"end":178.176,"text":"歐盟那裡有成立GDPR然後我們為了以他們接軌所以我們也成立了各支籌備委員會現在是成立籌備處的一個階段它本身是一個獨立機關大概介於有一點類似研能會的這一種組織的結構"},{"start":180.638,"end":209.881,"text":"那體育發展部大概這幾年大概也知道臺灣在運動賽事方面對在整個表現都非常好那我們也希望說從另外一個角度如何提供全民更好的一個運動的環境還有健康的體魄從這個角度來會成立一個部那至於新住民的這個部分是大院才是要求要成立一個專者機關的部分"},{"start":211.402,"end":235.983,"text":"其實我的問題在於說依照現在行政院的組織法裡面行政院組織法裡面有明定我們就是有14個部應該是14個部8個會是不是14個部9個會那麼未來要怎麼樣去做調整呢是又要再把某個部又拉下來改成會嗎"},{"start":237.529,"end":247.579,"text":"如果說按照你們現在講的整個人力的管理是要以當增則增因減則減的原則那麼當你的人力增加了之後你哪些要減呢我覺得委員這個問題非常好現在目前的一個規劃會成立一個"},{"start":257.332,"end":257.352,"text":"委員會議員"},{"start":287.792,"end":309.024,"text":"我們會在這個範圍內去做移動的概念它不是競爭家因為這一個新的部會它有競爭家一樣我們也會定期透過兩年一次的延合評鑑去減少有些業務一定會有消有漲嘛是的我了解這個情況但是就是說以我們看到之前速發部的成立"},{"start":309.824,"end":320.074,"text":"其實他基本上已經也占用了我們目前就是之前的不少的員額那現在要再成立一個體育部當然本人是支持成立體育部但是就說在整個的整體國家的總員額"},{"start":324.147,"end":324.167,"text":"委員會議員"},{"start":343.419,"end":343.599,"text":"李慧琼議員"},{"start":364.271,"end":364.331,"text":"公職律師"},{"start":389.584,"end":395.906,"text":"本席在上禮拜五的總諮詢裏面其實我有特別提到有關於NCC編列的訴訟費用過高因為業者不滿NCC所做的處分所以紛紛提起行政訴訟那它的訴訟費用夏年度還編了800多萬前兩年還有超過上千萬的訴訟費用"},{"start":413.712,"end":439.277,"text":"所以由這個角度來看似乎NCC 譬如說它內部就真的要去聘請聘請的公職律師可能會比這個編列預算去付一個訴訟付這麼高的訴訟費用都要來的經濟那我想請教就是就我們律師法修正通過增加公職律師那麼人事總處這邊有去了解目前到底有哪些機關有設置公職律師嗎"},{"start":441.847,"end":447.293,"text":"目前健保署有提出來偵測兩名公職律師其他都沒有目前還沒有提出來因為他們可能要評估然後要修編制表"},{"start":457.748,"end":462.93,"text":"其實我認為說這個部分的話其實人事總處這裡其實也可以去了解一下各機關的需求然後而且呢要特別將這個一些機關他們浪費人民的納稅錢編了很高的這個編了很多的公帑去支應訴訟費用的這件事情這些機關都要去考慮他們未來是不是要增設公職律師那這部分的話可能希望人事長這邊也要去了解目前公職律師的經用狀況還有為什麼"},{"start":487.222,"end":487.382,"text":"國安部"},{"start":504.192,"end":532.253,"text":"好沒關係那接下來我還有另外一個問題這也是跟公務人員的福利有關的我們知道其實現在台灣已經進入到高齡化的時代根據最新的統計就是2025年之後台灣每五個人就有一個人是65歲的老年人口已經進入到超高齡社會那進入到這樣超高齡社會的時代裡面我們就必須考慮到就是公務人員他可能這個也必須要奉養父母親"},{"start":533.914,"end":546.182,"text":"現在我們有釋清假但是我們釋清假是留職停薪就不像是育嬰假育嬰假的話還可以照顧小孩請申請育嬰假有留職給薪還可以有八成薪"},{"start":551.525,"end":570.419,"text":"那麼所以在這樣的一個情況之下我本席是認為說也要考慮到我們時代在改變我們整個的社會的狀況然後照顧年老的父母親其實也是公務員的作為子女的一個很重要的責任所以是不是有可能可以要修法將這個釋清價"},{"start":573.882,"end":577.283,"text":"沒有留職停薪的補助,這個涉及到勞工跟軍工教育的一點"},{"start":589.223,"end":608.683,"text":"我想委員的建議會長因為這一個適性假如果是要留職給薪的話必須要考慮到我們跟勞工的很平性的問題那我們現在有做一個大概有不少機關的同仁都有去使用就是說我們上下班有彈性上班"},{"start":609.464,"end":633.519,"text":"那個是不一樣的概念啦我知道當然是不一樣的概念可是當這個制度要做比較大的變革的時候我們要考量的因素就比較多可是我這裡答應委員我們會跟程序部在協調所以希望人事長是不是可以也是大概一個月可以給我提一個報告出來就是針對就是市清價如何改善然後要比照育嬰價"},{"start":635.956,"end":636.636,"text":"主席主席"},{"start":665.114,"end":666.963,"text":"好 謝謝翁委員 謝謝蘇人事長 兩個月提一個書面報告"}]}}},"meet":{"sessionPeriod":2,"sessionTimes":2,"tmpMeeting":null,"committees":[36],"term":11,"id":"委員會-11-2-36-2","title":"第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第2次全體委員會議","type":"委員會"},"會議時間":"2024-09-30T09:00:00+08:00","委員發言時間":"10:33:18 - 10:44:27","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第2次全體委員會議（事由：邀請行政院人事行政總處人事長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。）","id":154965,"gazette":{"lineno":575,"blocks":[["翁委員曉玲：（10時33分）主席好，請人事長。"],["主席：請人事長。"],["翁委員曉玲：人事長，我今天雖然沒有來現場聆聽您的口頭報告，但是我有認真的讀了您所提出來的業務報告，在這次的業務報告裡面，我關心的幾個議題，正好你在報告裡面也有提，所以我現在就想要來就教，有關於您在業務報告裡面提到的，像涉及組織精簡、公職律師等等問題。","首先，我想要講的就是，您這次業務報告的第一個重點就提到，未來我們的政府機關可能會要再多增加幾個部或是專責機關，像是有可能成立體育部，還有個資保護委員會籌備處其實已經在進行，未來可能會成立個資保護委員會，還有現在政府也可能會提出要成立新住民的專責機構，以及國家語言研究發展中心這個行政法人。那我想請問的就是，當政府或是民間呼籲要成立新部會時，新部會的成立勢必會影響到整個政府機關的組織架構、人員的增加，員額增加，經費也會增加，請問人事長，您對於這幾年我們陸陸續續做機關組織調整，增加這麼多的部會，或從部改成會，或從會提升為部，您的看法是什麼？您認為這對政府的員額、經費的支出會不會產生重大的影響？我就想聽聽看您的意見。"],["蘇人事長俊榮：謝謝委員提出這個議題，我們整個組織在調整，事實上是為了因應整個社會還有國際趨勢，像個資成立委員會，就是因為七、八年前歐盟成立GDPR，我們為了與他們接軌，所以也成立了個資籌備委員會，現在是成立籌備處的階段，它本身是一個獨立機關，大概有一點類似原能會這一種組織結構。至於體育發展部，大家也知道這幾年臺灣在運動賽事方面的表現都非常好，我們也希望從另外一個角度，提供全民更好的一個運動環境，培養國民健康的體魄，從這個角度來成立一個部。"],["翁委員曉玲：是，瞭解。"],["蘇人事長俊榮：至於新住民的部分，是大院裁示要求要成立一個專責機關。"],["翁委員曉玲：好的，其實我的問題在於，現在的行政院組織法明定有14個部、8個會，是不是？"],["蘇人事長俊榮：9個會。"],["翁委員曉玲：未來要怎麼樣去做調整？是又要再把某一個部拉下來改成會嗎？如果按照你們現在講的，整個人力的管理要依照「當增則增，應減則減」的原則，那麼當人力增加了之後，哪些要減呢？你們有沒有一些整體的規劃？"],["蘇人事長俊榮：我覺得委員這個問題非常好，目前的規劃會成立一個……"],["翁委員曉玲：成立體育部之後呢？"],["蘇人事長俊榮：成立體育部之後，我們要修中央機關組織基準法還有行政院組織法，還有一個新的組織法規，目前規劃的方式是朝14增加到15，一個是組織變革的問題，一個是員額的問題，我坦白講，員額在我們的業務報告裡面就有提，當增則增，當減則減，因為我們會有一個總員額的上限，就是16萬900人，我們會在這個範圍內去移動，它不是淨增加，因為這一個新的部會會有淨增加，一樣，我們也會定期透過兩年一次的員額評鑑去減少，有些業務一定會有消有長。"],["翁委員曉玲：是，我瞭解這個情況，但是就是以我們看到之前數發部的成立，基本上已經占用了我們不少的員額，現在又要再成立一個體育部，當然本人支持成立體育部，但是就是在整體國家總員額的調整，員額到底要增加，還是在維持現狀的情況之下，在其他機關做人力的刪減？我覺得這都是涉及到國家的整體發展。我們知道其實現在很多公務員叫苦連連，覺得他們的工作負擔都很大了，那麼如果未來因應好幾個部會要新成立，然後因此必須讓別的機關不能夠再進用人員，這我覺得會是個大問題。所以，我希望人事長可能要提出一個整個國家未來員額的調整方案、報告書之類的，畢竟我們已經很多年沒有調整，到底16萬900人是不是一個合理的數字？還是因應科技的發展、AI化之後，員額還應該要更往下降？這個部分應該要再做一個通盤檢討了。","接下來再進入另外一個問題，就是有關於公職律師的問題，本席在上禮拜五的總質詢有特別提到NCC編列的訴訟費用過高，因為業者不滿NCC所作的處分，所以紛紛提起行政訴訟，它的訴訟費用下年度還編了八百多萬，前兩年還有超過上千萬的訴訟費用。所以由這個角度來看，似乎NCC內部就真的要去聘請個公職律師，可能會比編列預算去付這麼高的訴訟費用都要來得經濟。我想請教的是，我們律師法修正通過，要增加公職律師，人事總處這邊有去瞭解目前到底有哪些機關有設置公職律師嗎？"],["蘇人事長俊榮：目前健保署有提出增設兩名公職律師。"],["翁委員曉玲：只有健保署？"],["蘇人事長俊榮：其他沒有。"],["翁委員曉玲：那其他的機關呢？"],["蘇人事長俊榮：都沒有。"],["翁委員曉玲：其他機關都沒有這個需求？"],["蘇人事長俊榮：目前還沒有提出來。"],["翁委員曉玲：所以對於公職律師……"],["蘇人事長俊榮：他們可能要評估，然後可能要修編制表。"],["翁委員曉玲：我認為這個部分，人事總處這裡其實也可以去瞭解一下各機關的需求，而且要特別針對一些機關，他們浪費人民的納稅錢，編了很多的公帑去支應訴訟費用的這件事情，這些機關都要去考慮他們未來是不是要增設公職律師，這部分希望人事長這邊也要去瞭解目前公職律師的進用狀況，還有為什麼沒有人願意來當公職律師，這個部分可能需要一併考量。"],["蘇人事長俊榮：這個我跟委員補充一下，另外一個有在評估增設公職律師的就是國防部，因為它有很多的那個……"],["翁委員曉玲：不過法務部自己本身的法律專業的人才就很多了，這個我倒是認為不需要。"],["蘇人事長俊榮：是國防部。"],["翁委員曉玲：好、沒關係，接下來我還有另外一個問題，這也是跟公務人員的福利有關的。我們知道其實現在臺灣已經進入到高齡化的時代，根據最新的統計，2025年之後，臺灣每5個人就有一個人是65歲的老年人口，已經進入到超高齡社會。進入到這樣超高齡社會的時代裡面，我們就必須考慮到公務人員可能也必須要奉養父母親，我知道現在我們有侍親假，但是我們的侍親假是留職停薪，就不像是育嬰假，育嬰假的話，還可以照顧小孩，申請育嬰假有留職給薪，還可以有八成薪。所以在這樣一個情況之下，本席是認為說，也要考慮到我們時代在改變，我們整個的社會的狀況，要照顧年老的父母親其實也是公務員作為子女的一個很重要的責任。所以是不是有可能可以修法，將侍親假的留職停薪改為比照育嬰假去辦理？就是同樣地，也是可以留職給薪，不曉得人事總處過去有沒有考慮過這個議題？"],["蘇人事長俊榮：我想委員的建議非常好，因為這個侍親假如果是要留職給薪的話，必須要考慮到我們跟勞工衡平性的問題。我們現在有做一個措施，大概不少機關的同仁都有去使用，就是我們上下班方面有彈性上班嘛……"],["翁委員曉玲：那個是不一樣的概念啦！這跟育嬰假……"],["蘇人事長俊榮：我當然知道這是不一樣的概念，可是當這個制度要做比較大的變革的時候，我們要考量的因素就比較多，可是我這裡答應委員，我們會跟銓敘部再來協調……"],["翁委員曉玲：所以希望人事長是不是也是大概一個月可以給我提一個報告出來，就是針對侍親假如何改善，然後要比照育嬰假留職給薪的方式來處理？至於說給多少薪，我覺得這都是可以談，也要考慮到整個國家的經費預算，但是我認為這是一個好的方向，同時……"],["蘇人事長俊榮：是不是委員給我們兩個月？因為我們還要協調國防部、勞動部，還有銓敘部。"],["翁委員曉玲：我覺得軍公教就跟勞工分開處理，那就給你們兩個月的時間，希望在年底之前，提出一份規劃報告書給我。"],["蘇人事長俊榮：好，謝謝。"],["翁委員曉玲：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝翁委員、謝謝蘇人事長，兩個月提一個書面報告給翁委員。","接下來有請吳思瑤委員質詢，並在陳俊宇委員質詢後，我們休息。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":334,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-36-2","speakers":["鍾佳濱","黃國昌","羅智強","林思銘","莊瑞雄","沈發惠","傅崐萁","翁曉玲","吳思瑤","陳俊宇","吳宗憲","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","賴士葆","楊瓊瓔","黃健豪","陳培瑜","洪孟楷","謝龍介","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe"],"page_start":277,"meetingDate":["2024-09-30"],"gazette_id":"1137801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1137801_00010"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第2次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請行政院人事行政總處人事長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1137801_00011"}}}