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\"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"何\", \"start\": 400.525, \"end\": 400.605, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 400.605, \"end\": 400.625, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:01,015 --> 00:00:04,177\n謝謝主席蘇委員我們是不是請彭部長部長好第一次來質詢剛剛有武立法委員提到我台中離山部分的這個垃圾的問題那請部長這邊是不是可以要求地方政府是不是大家中央地方一起合作來看看我們台中市的這個垃圾的問題\n\n2\n00:00:26,332 --> 00:00:49,291\n因為確實在這幾年來我聽說尤其臺中市議會的議員曾經也質詢過臺中市的垃圾未來是一個很大很大的一個令人擔憂的地方其實在上一任環保署署長的時候大概兩三年前在疫情時間我就有曾經就就交與這個署長有過於各縣市之間地方的這個垃圾的一個處理\n\n3\n00:00:51,132 --> 00:01:04,878\n真的在這幾年來是一個我們必須要中央要能夠掌握而且要提出有效的解方這部長這第一個提醒也希望我台中的部分請你多多關心第二個剛剛在經濟委員會我聽到這個國發會主委有說要來找你討論商量\n\n4\n00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:34,183\n商量什麼你知道嗎今天經濟委員會在討論的是有關呢中小企業的一個創新以及未來面對的這個ESG淨零碳排那未來我們政府可以如何扶植如何幫助那國發會主委呢有講了一句話他說呢他要找環境部來商量因為呢我們呢要結合部會資源要成立綠色科技等\n\n5\n00:01:34,563 --> 00:01:57,857\n白益大基金部長你知道這個綠色科技白益大基金是什麼報告委員這個是其實我也跟委員說總統跟院長都很關心他們關心醫療了之後其實我後來他們提醒我之後我就積極的去找國發會金管會還有保險公司所以國發會很支持我們要成立一個100億的綠色成長基金\n\n6\n00:02:20,447 --> 00:02:42,803\n大大小那希望是用產業鏈的關係來看整個推動那當然你們現在相關碳費的執法規正在公告那我只是提醒部長中小企業尤其是在產業鏈的中下游的其他這種協力的微型廠商非常的焦慮第一個焦慮是什麼對政府的政策其實他不是那麼的瞭解\n\n7\n00:02:43,604 --> 00:02:59,055\n不是那麼的了解第二個所謂的這個碳費的前端可能要的所謂的碳盤查什麼碳計算什麼有的沒有的他們也不懂那這中間呢我們也產生了很多在基層上看到民間的所謂的顧問公司來\n\n8\n00:03:00,937 --> 00:03:25,659\n來跟各個中小企業說來來我來跟你說明聽我的就對了你知道嗎在上個禮拜的經濟委員會公平會主委到我們立法院來備詢的時候很多位我們地方選區的區域立委都講到一件事情就是因為呢中小企業還有微型企業對於政府的政策跟未來的這個所謂的綠色科技啦我如何可以被認證啊如何可以減碳啊如何怎樣怎樣\n\n9\n00:03:27,165 --> 00:03:43,012\n沒啥了解所以一大堆的這個所謂的這個顧問公司呢如竹筍般的生出來了那到處吹噓到處招攬然後到處收取顧問費中小企業因為不賣所以他想說這可能比較賺錢\n\n10\n00:03:45,613 --> 00:04:07,580\n聽信了顧問費付了到底能不能達到政府要的這個減碳他們的這個努力投資的這個綠色的成本到底能不能被認可被認證都沒有人知道所以上個禮拜在經濟委員會就要求公平會主委針對如果有廣告不實或者是呢有這個說的比做的還好做的\n\n11\n00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:19,747\n很少說了很多的是不是也應該政府要拿出公權力來而這個其實不是只有公平會主委的事我覺得跟環境部有關係這個其實我已經有接獲一些檢舉的案例那我們也在調查當中那我希望我會可以積極來處理的確委員說的是對的因為很多人在販賣這種恐慌焦慮來謀利這的確是不好的\n\n12\n00:04:31,795 --> 00:04:56,432\n那中小企業也不必過於擔心因為我們有一系列的輔導措施我們是針對大企業要影響到中小企業其實那個量很低很低啦但是我覺得部長這個你要說清楚因為很多真的不懂真的不曉得那大家因為資訊的不透明或是接觸不到接收的不完整所以這樣子的恐慌事實上到處在蔓延我參加了很多的工協會的會員大會\n\n13\n00:04:58,894 --> 00:05:00,456\n我希望在產業面能夠真的能夠知道說環境部未來對於近林碳排的\n\n14\n00:05:14,814 --> 00:05:35,714\n建建式的一個程序時程推動還有輔導的措施還有政府可以怎麼協助的我希望有一個人說了算啊不然我們現在在七點看到的這些顧問公司說了不算那誰說了算尤其呢包括我相信今天有其他委員有問到在近年探牌裡面的探盤查來\n\n15\n00:05:37,795 --> 00:06:02,853\n誰算是對的對的話又誰來認證認證跟驗證的單位又有哪些你知道我上網去看喔環境部公告的跟經濟部公告的是不一樣的加數不一樣的數字那請問一下你們怎麼分工那你們又怎麼去認定那我中小企業或是微型企業我如果有相關的問題我自己上網去查了很多都是二代\n\n16\n00:06:03,493 --> 00:06:22,590\n二代年輕人他們會上網查可是查的時候他告訴我什麼不好意思啦我去環境部這裡看看我去經濟部這裡看看看來看過去我還是不懂到底誰是權責單位誰說了算那我又該去找誰有沒有可能成立你跟經濟部可以有一個單一窗口\n\n17\n00:06:22,930 --> 00:06:40,625\n好可以我們現在會研議拜託你們研議好不好我覺得這個很重要很重要好那多久的時間可以成立我們現在在深度節能針對整個大戶的正在進行當中我希望我把這個東西帶帶進去可能兩個月內給委員一個答覆好不好好謝謝謝謝何委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1015\t4177\t謝謝主席 蘇委員我們是不是請彭部長部長好第一次來質詢剛剛有武立法委員提到我台中離山部分的這個垃圾的問題那請部長這邊是不是可以要求地方政府是不是大家中央地方一起合作來看看我們台中市的這個垃圾的問題\n26332\t49291\t因為確實在這幾年來我聽說尤其臺中市議會的議員曾經也質詢過臺中市的垃圾未來是一個很大很大的一個令人擔憂的地方其實在上一任環保署署長的時候大概兩三年前在疫情時間我就有曾經就就交與這個署長有過於各縣市之間地方的這個垃圾的一個處理\n51132\t64878\t真的在這幾年來是一個我們必須要中央要能夠掌握而且要提出有效的解方這部長這第一個提醒也希望我台中的部分請你多多關心第二個剛剛在經濟委員會我聽到這個國發會主委有說要來找你討論商量\n69680\t94183\t商量什麼你知道嗎今天經濟委員會在討論的是有關呢中小企業的一個創新以及未來面對的這個ESG淨零碳排那未來我們政府可以如何扶植如何幫助那國發會主委呢有講了一句話他說呢他要找環境部來商量因為呢我們呢要結合部會資源要成立綠色科技等\n94563\t117857\t白益大基金部長你知道這個綠色科技白益大基金是什麼報告委員這個是其實我也跟委員說總統跟院長都很關心他們關心醫療了之後其實我後來他們提醒我之後我就積極的去找國發會金管會還有保險公司所以國發會很支持我們要成立一個100億的綠色成長基金\n119718\t140367\t獲獲獲獲獲獲\n140447\t162803\t大大小那希望是用產業鏈的關係來看整個推動那當然你們現在相關碳費的執法規正在公告那我只是提醒部長中小企業尤其是在產業鏈的中下游的其他這種協力的微型廠商非常的焦慮第一個焦慮是什麼對政府的政策其實他不是那麼的瞭解\n163604\t179055\t不是那麼的了解第二個所謂的這個碳費的前端可能要的所謂的碳盤查什麼碳計算什麼有的沒有的他們也不懂那這中間呢我們也產生了很多在基層上看到民間的所謂的顧問公司來\n180937\t205659\t來跟各個中小企業說來來我來跟你說明聽我的就對了你知道嗎在上個禮拜的經濟委員會公平會主委到我們立法院來備詢的時候很多位我們地方選區的區域立委都講到一件事情就是因為呢中小企業還有微型企業對於政府的政策跟未來的這個所謂的綠色科技啦我如何可以被認證啊如何可以減碳啊如何怎樣怎樣\n207165\t223012\t沒啥了解所以一大堆的這個所謂的這個顧問公司呢如竹筍般的生出來了那到處吹噓到處招攬然後到處收取顧問費中小企業因為不賣所以他想說這可能比較賺錢\n225613\t247580\t聽信了顧問費付了到底能不能達到政府要的這個減碳他們的這個努力投資的這個綠色的成本到底能不能被認可被認證都沒有人知道所以上個禮拜在經濟委員會就要求公平會主委針對如果有廣告不實或者是呢有這個說的比做的還好做的\n248480\t259747\t很少說了很多的是不是也應該政府要拿出公權力來而這個其實不是只有公平會主委的事我覺得跟環境部有關係這個其實我已經有接獲一些檢舉的案例那我們也在調查當中那我希望我會可以積極來處理的確委員說的是對的因為很多人在販賣這種恐慌焦慮來謀利這的確是不好的\n271795\t296432\t那中小企業也不必過於擔心因為我們有一系列的輔導措施我們是針對大企業要影響到中小企業其實那個量很低很低啦但是我覺得部長這個你要說清楚因為很多真的不懂真的不曉得那大家因為資訊的不透明或是接觸不到接收的不完整所以這樣子的恐慌事實上到處在蔓延我參加了很多的工協會的會員大會\n298894\t300456\t我希望在產業面能夠真的能夠知道說環境部未來對於近林碳排的\n314814\t335714\t建建式的一個程序時程推動還有輔導的措施還有政府可以怎麼協助的我希望有一個人說了算啊不然我們現在在七點看到的這些顧問公司說了不算那誰說了算尤其呢包括我相信今天有其他委員有問到在近年探牌裡面的探盤查來\n337795\t362853\t誰算是對的對的話又誰來認證認證跟驗證的單位又有哪些你知道我上網去看喔環境部公告的跟經濟部公告的是不一樣的加數不一樣的數字那請問一下你們怎麼分工那你們又怎麼去認定那我中小企業或是微型企業我如果有相關的問題我自己上網去查了很多都是二代\n363493\t382590\t二代年輕人他們會上網查可是查的時候他告訴我什麼不好意思啦我去環境部這裡看看我去經濟部這裡看看看來看過去我還是不懂到底誰是權責單位誰說了算那我又該去找誰有沒有可能成立你跟經濟部可以有一個單一窗口\n382930\t400625\t好 可以 我們現在會研議拜託你們研議好不好我覺得這個很重要很重要好 那多久的時間可以成立我們現在在深度節能針對整個大戶的正在進行當中我希望我把這個東西帶帶進去可能兩個月內給委員一個答覆好不好好 謝謝謝謝何委員\n","txt":"謝謝主席 蘇委員我們是不是請彭部長部長好第一次來質詢剛剛有武立法委員提到我台中離山部分的這個垃圾的問題那請部長這邊是不是可以要求地方政府是不是大家中央地方一起合作來看看我們台中市的這個垃圾的問題\n因為確實在這幾年來我聽說尤其臺中市議會的議員曾經也質詢過臺中市的垃圾未來是一個很大很大的一個令人擔憂的地方其實在上一任環保署署長的時候大概兩三年前在疫情時間我就有曾經就就交與這個署長有過於各縣市之間地方的這個垃圾的一個處理\n真的在這幾年來是一個我們必須要中央要能夠掌握而且要提出有效的解方這部長這第一個提醒也希望我台中的部分請你多多關心第二個剛剛在經濟委員會我聽到這個國發會主委有說要來找你討論商量\n商量什麼你知道嗎今天經濟委員會在討論的是有關呢中小企業的一個創新以及未來面對的這個ESG淨零碳排那未來我們政府可以如何扶植如何幫助那國發會主委呢有講了一句話他說呢他要找環境部來商量因為呢我們呢要結合部會資源要成立綠色科技等\n白益大基金部長你知道這個綠色科技白益大基金是什麼報告委員這個是其實我也跟委員說總統跟院長都很關心他們關心醫療了之後其實我後來他們提醒我之後我就積極的去找國發會金管會還有保險公司所以國發會很支持我們要成立一個100億的綠色成長基金\n獲獲獲獲獲獲\n大大小那希望是用產業鏈的關係來看整個推動那當然你們現在相關碳費的執法規正在公告那我只是提醒部長中小企業尤其是在產業鏈的中下游的其他這種協力的微型廠商非常的焦慮第一個焦慮是什麼對政府的政策其實他不是那麼的瞭解\n不是那麼的了解第二個所謂的這個碳費的前端可能要的所謂的碳盤查什麼碳計算什麼有的沒有的他們也不懂那這中間呢我們也產生了很多在基層上看到民間的所謂的顧問公司來\n來跟各個中小企業說來來我來跟你說明聽我的就對了你知道嗎在上個禮拜的經濟委員會公平會主委到我們立法院來備詢的時候很多位我們地方選區的區域立委都講到一件事情就是因為呢中小企業還有微型企業對於政府的政策跟未來的這個所謂的綠色科技啦我如何可以被認證啊如何可以減碳啊如何怎樣怎樣\n沒啥了解所以一大堆的這個所謂的這個顧問公司呢如竹筍般的生出來了那到處吹噓到處招攬然後到處收取顧問費中小企業因為不賣所以他想說這可能比較賺錢\n聽信了顧問費付了到底能不能達到政府要的這個減碳他們的這個努力投資的這個綠色的成本到底能不能被認可被認證都沒有人知道所以上個禮拜在經濟委員會就要求公平會主委針對如果有廣告不實或者是呢有這個說的比做的還好做的\n很少說了很多的是不是也應該政府要拿出公權力來而這個其實不是只有公平會主委的事我覺得跟環境部有關係這個其實我已經有接獲一些檢舉的案例那我們也在調查當中那我希望我會可以積極來處理的確委員說的是對的因為很多人在販賣這種恐慌焦慮來謀利這的確是不好的\n那中小企業也不必過於擔心因為我們有一系列的輔導措施我們是針對大企業要影響到中小企業其實那個量很低很低啦但是我覺得部長這個你要說清楚因為很多真的不懂真的不曉得那大家因為資訊的不透明或是接觸不到接收的不完整所以這樣子的恐慌事實上到處在蔓延我參加了很多的工協會的會員大會\n我希望在產業面能夠真的能夠知道說環境部未來對於近林碳排的\n建建式的一個程序時程推動還有輔導的措施還有政府可以怎麼協助的我希望有一個人說了算啊不然我們現在在七點看到的這些顧問公司說了不算那誰說了算尤其呢包括我相信今天有其他委員有問到在近年探牌裡面的探盤查來\n誰算是對的對的話又誰來認證認證跟驗證的單位又有哪些你知道我上網去看喔環境部公告的跟經濟部公告的是不一樣的加數不一樣的數字那請問一下你們怎麼分工那你們又怎麼去認定那我中小企業或是微型企業我如果有相關的問題我自己上網去查了很多都是二代\n二代年輕人他們會上網查可是查的時候他告訴我什麼不好意思啦我去環境部這裡看看我去經濟部這裡看看看來看過去我還是不懂到底誰是權責單位誰說了算那我又該去找誰有沒有可能成立你跟經濟部可以有一個單一窗口\n好 可以 我們現在會研議拜託你們研議好不好我覺得這個很重要很重要好 那多久的時間可以成立我們現在在深度節能針對整個大戶的正在進行當中我希望我把這個東西帶帶進去可能兩個月內給委員一個答覆好不好好 謝謝謝謝何委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.015 --> 00:04.177\n謝謝主席蘇委員我們是不是請彭部長部長好第一次來質詢剛剛有武立法委員提到我台中離山部分的這個垃圾的問題那請部長這邊是不是可以要求地方政府是不是大家中央地方一起合作來看看我們台中市的這個垃圾的問題\n\n00:26.332 --> 00:49.291\n因為確實在這幾年來我聽說尤其臺中市議會的議員曾經也質詢過臺中市的垃圾未來是一個很大很大的一個令人擔憂的地方其實在上一任環保署署長的時候大概兩三年前在疫情時間我就有曾經就就交與這個署長有過於各縣市之間地方的這個垃圾的一個處理\n\n00:51.132 --> 01:04.878\n真的在這幾年來是一個我們必須要中央要能夠掌握而且要提出有效的解方這部長這第一個提醒也希望我台中的部分請你多多關心第二個剛剛在經濟委員會我聽到這個國發會主委有說要來找你討論商量\n\n01:09.680 --> 01:34.183\n商量什麼你知道嗎今天經濟委員會在討論的是有關呢中小企業的一個創新以及未來面對的這個ESG淨零碳排那未來我們政府可以如何扶植如何幫助那國發會主委呢有講了一句話他說呢他要找環境部來商量因為呢我們呢要結合部會資源要成立綠色科技等\n\n01:34.563 --> 01:57.857\n白益大基金部長你知道這個綠色科技白益大基金是什麼報告委員這個是其實我也跟委員說總統跟院長都很關心他們關心醫療了之後其實我後來他們提醒我之後我就積極的去找國發會金管會還有保險公司所以國發會很支持我們要成立一個100億的綠色成長基金\n\n02:20.447 --> 02:42.803\n大大小那希望是用產業鏈的關係來看整個推動那當然你們現在相關碳費的執法規正在公告那我只是提醒部長中小企業尤其是在產業鏈的中下游的其他這種協力的微型廠商非常的焦慮第一個焦慮是什麼對政府的政策其實他不是那麼的瞭解\n\n02:43.604 --> 02:59.055\n不是那麼的了解第二個所謂的這個碳費的前端可能要的所謂的碳盤查什麼碳計算什麼有的沒有的他們也不懂那這中間呢我們也產生了很多在基層上看到民間的所謂的顧問公司來\n\n03:00.937 --> 03:25.659\n來跟各個中小企業說來來我來跟你說明聽我的就對了你知道嗎在上個禮拜的經濟委員會公平會主委到我們立法院來備詢的時候很多位我們地方選區的區域立委都講到一件事情就是因為呢中小企業還有微型企業對於政府的政策跟未來的這個所謂的綠色科技啦我如何可以被認證啊如何可以減碳啊如何怎樣怎樣\n\n03:27.165 --> 03:43.012\n沒啥了解所以一大堆的這個所謂的這個顧問公司呢如竹筍般的生出來了那到處吹噓到處招攬然後到處收取顧問費中小企業因為不賣所以他想說這可能比較賺錢\n\n03:45.613 --> 04:07.580\n聽信了顧問費付了到底能不能達到政府要的這個減碳他們的這個努力投資的這個綠色的成本到底能不能被認可被認證都沒有人知道所以上個禮拜在經濟委員會就要求公平會主委針對如果有廣告不實或者是呢有這個說的比做的還好做的\n\n04:08.480 --> 04:19.747\n很少說了很多的是不是也應該政府要拿出公權力來而這個其實不是只有公平會主委的事我覺得跟環境部有關係這個其實我已經有接獲一些檢舉的案例那我們也在調查當中那我希望我會可以積極來處理的確委員說的是對的因為很多人在販賣這種恐慌焦慮來謀利這的確是不好的\n\n04:31.795 --> 04:56.432\n那中小企業也不必過於擔心因為我們有一系列的輔導措施我們是針對大企業要影響到中小企業其實那個量很低很低啦但是我覺得部長這個你要說清楚因為很多真的不懂真的不曉得那大家因為資訊的不透明或是接觸不到接收的不完整所以這樣子的恐慌事實上到處在蔓延我參加了很多的工協會的會員大會\n\n04:58.894 --> 05:00.456\n我希望在產業面能夠真的能夠知道說環境部未來對於近林碳排的\n\n05:14.814 --> 05:35.714\n建建式的一個程序時程推動還有輔導的措施還有政府可以怎麼協助的我希望有一個人說了算啊不然我們現在在七點看到的這些顧問公司說了不算那誰說了算尤其呢包括我相信今天有其他委員有問到在近年探牌裡面的探盤查來\n\n05:37.795 --> 06:02.853\n誰算是對的對的話又誰來認證認證跟驗證的單位又有哪些你知道我上網去看喔環境部公告的跟經濟部公告的是不一樣的加數不一樣的數字那請問一下你們怎麼分工那你們又怎麼去認定那我中小企業或是微型企業我如果有相關的問題我自己上網去查了很多都是二代\n\n06:03.493 --> 06:22.590\n二代年輕人他們會上網查可是查的時候他告訴我什麼不好意思啦我去環境部這裡看看我去經濟部這裡看看看來看過去我還是不懂到底誰是權責單位誰說了算那我又該去找誰有沒有可能成立你跟經濟部可以有一個單一窗口\n\n06:22.930 --> 06:40.625\n好可以我們現在會研議拜託你們研議好不好我覺得這個很重要很重要好那多久的時間可以成立我們現在在深度節能針對整個大戶的正在進行當中我希望我把這個東西帶帶進去可能兩個月內給委員一個答覆好不好好謝謝謝謝何委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.015,"end":4.177,"text":"謝謝主席 蘇委員我們是不是請彭部長部長好第一次來質詢剛剛有武立法委員提到我台中離山部分的這個垃圾的問題那請部長這邊是不是可以要求地方政府是不是大家中央地方一起合作來看看我們台中市的這個垃圾的問題"},{"start":26.332,"end":49.291,"text":"因為確實在這幾年來我聽說尤其臺中市議會的議員曾經也質詢過臺中市的垃圾未來是一個很大很大的一個令人擔憂的地方其實在上一任環保署署長的時候大概兩三年前在疫情時間我就有曾經就就交與這個署長有過於各縣市之間地方的這個垃圾的一個處理"},{"start":51.132,"end":64.878,"text":"真的在這幾年來是一個我們必須要中央要能夠掌握而且要提出有效的解方這部長這第一個提醒也希望我台中的部分請你多多關心第二個剛剛在經濟委員會我聽到這個國發會主委有說要來找你討論商量"},{"start":69.68,"end":94.183,"text":"商量什麼你知道嗎今天經濟委員會在討論的是有關呢中小企業的一個創新以及未來面對的這個ESG淨零碳排那未來我們政府可以如何扶植如何幫助那國發會主委呢有講了一句話他說呢他要找環境部來商量因為呢我們呢要結合部會資源要成立綠色科技等"},{"start":94.563,"end":117.857,"text":"白益大基金部長你知道這個綠色科技白益大基金是什麼報告委員這個是其實我也跟委員說總統跟院長都很關心他們關心醫療了之後其實我後來他們提醒我之後我就積極的去找國發會金管會還有保險公司所以國發會很支持我們要成立一個100億的綠色成長基金"},{"start":119.718,"end":140.367,"text":"獲獲獲獲獲獲"},{"start":140.447,"end":162.803,"text":"大大小那希望是用產業鏈的關係來看整個推動那當然你們現在相關碳費的執法規正在公告那我只是提醒部長中小企業尤其是在產業鏈的中下游的其他這種協力的微型廠商非常的焦慮第一個焦慮是什麼對政府的政策其實他不是那麼的瞭解"},{"start":163.604,"end":179.055,"text":"不是那麼的了解第二個所謂的這個碳費的前端可能要的所謂的碳盤查什麼碳計算什麼有的沒有的他們也不懂那這中間呢我們也產生了很多在基層上看到民間的所謂的顧問公司來"},{"start":180.937,"end":205.659,"text":"來跟各個中小企業說來來我來跟你說明聽我的就對了你知道嗎在上個禮拜的經濟委員會公平會主委到我們立法院來備詢的時候很多位我們地方選區的區域立委都講到一件事情就是因為呢中小企業還有微型企業對於政府的政策跟未來的這個所謂的綠色科技啦我如何可以被認證啊如何可以減碳啊如何怎樣怎樣"},{"start":207.165,"end":223.012,"text":"沒啥了解所以一大堆的這個所謂的這個顧問公司呢如竹筍般的生出來了那到處吹噓到處招攬然後到處收取顧問費中小企業因為不賣所以他想說這可能比較賺錢"},{"start":225.613,"end":247.58,"text":"聽信了顧問費付了到底能不能達到政府要的這個減碳他們的這個努力投資的這個綠色的成本到底能不能被認可被認證都沒有人知道所以上個禮拜在經濟委員會就要求公平會主委針對如果有廣告不實或者是呢有這個說的比做的還好做的"},{"start":248.48,"end":259.747,"text":"很少說了很多的是不是也應該政府要拿出公權力來而這個其實不是只有公平會主委的事我覺得跟環境部有關係這個其實我已經有接獲一些檢舉的案例那我們也在調查當中那我希望我會可以積極來處理的確委員說的是對的因為很多人在販賣這種恐慌焦慮來謀利這的確是不好的"},{"start":271.795,"end":296.432,"text":"那中小企業也不必過於擔心因為我們有一系列的輔導措施我們是針對大企業要影響到中小企業其實那個量很低很低啦但是我覺得部長這個你要說清楚因為很多真的不懂真的不曉得那大家因為資訊的不透明或是接觸不到接收的不完整所以這樣子的恐慌事實上到處在蔓延我參加了很多的工協會的會員大會"},{"start":298.894,"end":300.456,"text":"我希望在產業面能夠真的能夠知道說環境部未來對於近林碳排的"},{"start":314.814,"end":335.714,"text":"建建式的一個程序時程推動還有輔導的措施還有政府可以怎麼協助的我希望有一個人說了算啊不然我們現在在七點看到的這些顧問公司說了不算那誰說了算尤其呢包括我相信今天有其他委員有問到在近年探牌裡面的探盤查來"},{"start":337.795,"end":362.853,"text":"誰算是對的對的話又誰來認證認證跟驗證的單位又有哪些你知道我上網去看喔環境部公告的跟經濟部公告的是不一樣的加數不一樣的數字那請問一下你們怎麼分工那你們又怎麼去認定那我中小企業或是微型企業我如果有相關的問題我自己上網去查了很多都是二代"},{"start":363.493,"end":382.59,"text":"二代年輕人他們會上網查可是查的時候他告訴我什麼不好意思啦我去環境部這裡看看我去經濟部這裡看看看來看過去我還是不懂到底誰是權責單位誰說了算那我又該去找誰有沒有可能成立你跟經濟部可以有一個單一窗口"},{"start":382.93,"end":400.625,"text":"好 可以 我們現在會研議拜託你們研議好不好我覺得這個很重要很重要好 那多久的時間可以成立我們現在在深度節能針對整個大戶的正在進行當中我希望我把這個東西帶帶進去可能兩個月內給委員一個答覆好不好好 謝謝謝謝何委員"}]}}},"meet":{"sessionPeriod":2,"sessionTimes":2,"tmpMeeting":null,"committees":[26],"term":11,"id":"委員會-11-2-26-2","title":"第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第2次全體委員會議","type":"委員會"},"會議時間":"2024-10-07T09:00:00+08:00","委員發言時間":"12:39:11 - 12:45:55","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第2次全體委員會議（事由：邀請環境部部長針對「垃圾裸露堆置及災後垃圾妥善處理對策」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n【10月7日及9日二天一次會】）","id":155188,"gazette":{"lineno":1171,"blocks":[["何委員欣純：（12時39分）謝謝主席蘇委員。我們是不是請彭部長？"],["主席：好，請彭部長。"],["彭部長啓明：何委員好。"],["何委員欣純：部長好。第一次來質詢，剛剛伍麗華委員有提到臺中梨山這部分的垃圾問題，部長這邊是不是可以要求地方政府，中央、地方大家一起合作，來看看我們臺中市這個垃圾的問題？因為確實這幾年來，我聽說啦！尤其臺中市議會的議員也曾經質詢過，臺中市的垃圾未來是一個很大、令人擔憂的地方。其實在上一任環保署署長的時候，大概兩、三年前在疫情期間，我曾經就教於署長，有關於各縣市之間地方垃圾的處理，中央真的必須要能夠掌握，而且要提出有效的解方。這是對部長的第一個提醒，也希望我臺中的部分請你多多關心。"],["彭部長啓明：好。"],["何委員欣純：第二個，剛剛在經濟委員會，我聽到國發會主委有說要來找你討論、商量，商量什麼你知道嗎？今天經濟委員會在討論的是有關中小企業創新以及未來面對的ESG、淨零碳排，未來我們政府可以如何扶植、如何幫助？國發會主委講了一句話，他說要找環境部來商量，因為我們要結合部會資源，要成立綠色科技等百億大基金。部長，你知道這個綠色科技百億大基金是什麼嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：報告委員，這個是……其實我要跟委員說，總統跟院長都很關心，他們關心完醫療，他們提醒我之後，我就積極地去找國發會、金管會還有保險公司，所以國發會很支持我們，要成立一個100億的綠色成長基金，就是針對淨零、循環經濟，整個政府可以來投資、鼓勵，讓這個產業能夠起來。"],["何委員欣純：是，我現在就要跟部長分享，在基層我的選區有很多中小企業，臺中也是傳統產業的重鎮，現在我們針對碳費以及推動減碳的政策是以大帶小，希望是用產業鏈的關係來看整個推動。當然現在相關碳費的子法規你們正在公告，我只是提醒部長，中小企業尤其是在產業鏈中下游其他這種協力的微型廠商非常地焦慮。第一個焦慮是什麼？他們對於政府的政策不是那麼地瞭解；第二個，所謂碳費的前端可能要碳盤查、碳計算等什麼有的沒有的，他們也不懂。這中間也產生了很多問題，我們在基層看到民間所謂的顧問公司會跟各個中小企業說「來、來、來，我跟你們說明，聽我的就對了」。你知道嗎？上個禮拜在經濟委員會，公平會主委到立法院備詢的時候，很多位地方選區的區域立委都講到一件事情，因為中小企業還有微型企業對於政府的政策跟未來所謂的綠色科技、如何可以被認證、如何可以減碳、如何怎樣怎樣不怎麼瞭解，所以就有一大堆所謂的顧問公司如竹筍般地生出來了，到處吹噓、到處招攬、到處收取顧問費。中小企業因為不懂，所以就想說這個可能比較專業而聽信了，顧問費也付了，但到底能不能達到政府要的減碳、他們努力投資的綠色成本到底能不能被認可、被認證卻沒人知道。所以上個禮拜在經濟委員會就要求公平會主委，針對廣告不實或是說得比做得還好聽，做得很少說得很多的，政府是不是也應該拿出公權力來？這個其實不是只有公平會主委的事，我覺得跟環境部也有關係耶！"],["彭部長啓明：報告委員，其實我已接獲一些檢舉的案例，我們也在調查當中，我希望我可以積極來處理。的確委員說的是對的，因為很多人在販賣這種恐慌、焦慮來牟利，這的確是不好的。中小企業也不必過於擔心，因為我們有一系列的輔導措施，我們是針對大企業，要影響到中小企業，其實那個量很低、很低啦！所以也……"],["何委員欣純：但是我覺得部長，這個你要說清楚，因為很多人真的不懂，真的不曉得，大家因為資訊不透明，或是接觸不到，接收得不完整，所以這樣子的恐慌事實上到處在蔓延。我參加了很多公協會的會員大會，很多都還在跟我反映這件事情。"],["彭部長啓明：報告委員，你就請我去參加，我可以公開說。"],["何委員欣純：好，這是你說的，那我就邀請你。"],["彭部長啓明：可以。"],["何委員欣純：中部有好多公協會，我希望在產業面能夠真的知道環境部未來對於淨零碳排漸進式的程序、時程推動、輔導的措施，還有政府可以怎麼協助等，我希望有一個人說了算。不然我們現在在基層看到的這些顧問公司說的不算，那誰說的算？尤其我相信包括今天其他委員也有問到，在淨零碳排裡面的碳盤查，誰說的是對的？對不對是由誰來認證？認證跟驗證的單位有哪些？你知道嗎，我上網去，環境部公告的跟經濟部公告的是不一樣的家數、不一樣的數字，請問你們怎麼分工又怎麼去認定？中小企業或微型企業如果有相關的問題就自己上網去查了，很多都是二代，二代的年輕人會上網查，可是查了之後他告訴什麼？歹勢啦！我去環境部這邊看一看，去經濟部那邊看一看，看來看去我還是不懂，到底誰是權責單位？誰說了算？我又該去找誰？有沒有可能你跟經濟部成立一個單一窗口？"],["彭部長啓明：可以，我們現在會研議。"],["何委員欣純：拜託你們研議好不好？"],["彭部長啓明：好，可以。"],["何委員欣純：我覺得這個很重要。"],["彭部長啓明：知道。"],["何委員欣純：多久的時間可以成立？你給我一個時間。"],["彭部長啓明：我們現在在針對整個大戶進行深度節能當中，我把這個東西帶進去，可能兩個月內給委員一個答復好不好？"],["何委員欣純：好，謝謝。"],["彭部長啓明：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝何委員。","接續我們請林淑芬委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":256,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-26-2","speakers":["蘇清泉","陳昭姿","林月琴","涂權吉","盧縣一","陳菁徽","邱鎮軍","王育敏","廖偉翔","王正旭","楊曜","洪申翰","羅廷瑋","洪孟楷","羅智強","黃秀芳","劉建國","陳瑩","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","邱若華","何欣純","林淑芬","牛煦庭","蘇巧慧","林倩綺","謝衣鳯"],"page_start":173,"meetingDate":["2024-10-07"],"gazette_id":"1138201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1138201_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第2次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請環境部部長針對「垃圾裸露堆置及災後垃圾妥善處理對策」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1138201_00004"}}}