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0.701}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 526.13, \"end\": 526.311, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"希\", \"start\": 526.311, \"end\": 526.471, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"望\", \"start\": 526.471, \"end\": 526.771, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 526.771, \"end\": 527.512, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"從\"}, {\"word\": \"語\"}, {\"word\": \"言\", \"start\": 527.512, \"end\": 527.932, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"開\"}, {\"word\": \"始\", \"start\": 527.932, \"end\": 528.613, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 528.613, \"end\": 528.893, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"感\", \"start\": 528.893, \"end\": 529.093, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"美\", \"start\": 529.093, \"end\": 529.794, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"燕\", \"start\": 529.794, \"end\": 530.334, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 530.334, \"end\": 530.474, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 530.474, \"end\": 530.654, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"意\", \"start\": 530.654, \"end\": 530.795, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 530.795, \"end\": 531.075, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"勸\"}, {\"word\": \"發\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"三\", \"start\": 531.075, \"end\": 531.315, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"點\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"客\", \"start\": 531.315, \"end\": 531.455, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 531.455, \"end\": 531.475, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"參\"}, {\"word\": \"考\", \"start\": 531.475, \"end\": 531.595, \"score\": 0.832}, {\"word\": \"非\", \"start\": 531.595, \"end\": 531.856, \"score\": 0.866}, {\"word\": \"常\", \"start\": 531.856, \"end\": 531.976, \"score\": 0.814}, {\"word\": \"清\", \"start\": 531.976, \"end\": 532.256, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"楚\", \"start\": 532.256, \"end\": 532.436, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"易\", \"start\": 532.436, \"end\": 532.516, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"懂\", \"start\": 532.516, \"end\": 532.536, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,694 --> 00:00:04,509\n好謝謝主席我們請客委員會谷主委好請谷主委\n\n2\n00:00:08,849 --> 00:00:13,130\n主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好\n\n3\n00:00:38,854 --> 00:01:03,362\n再來我們再輸用華語,這樣不知道主委覺得可以嗎?報告委員還有主席,我們接下去因為委員的要求,我們用法語看主席采詩喔,可以,當然可以我是這樣想啦,確實這是因為歷史的關係啦你看我現在全程使用台語,我也是可以啦只是我們剛剛在討論另外一條,一時間有點羞怕感啦\n\n4\n00:01:06,883 --> 00:01:30,068\n我覺得語言最重要的就是要能夠使用並且活用所以其實今天我還是想跟主委來討論一下的其實是我們對客語的政府如何、狀況如何首先我想請問主委像您能夠這麼流利的使用客家話必定是從小就有學習嘛那如果你認為現在的孩子現在的孩子\n\n5\n00:01:32,068 --> 00:01:43,807\n那到底是在非客家莊長大的客家人有客家血統的客家人比較會說客語還是在客莊長大的非客莊人比較會使用台語這是客語\n\n6\n00:01:45,565 --> 00:01:48,949\n目前我又講客語了沒關係啦其實我剛剛發現我都聽得懂還蠻妙的我試試看用客語啦好啊好啊在客庄裡面\n\n7\n00:02:04,465 --> 00:02:09,408\n事實上是這樣為什麼因為就是語言的關係我認為我自己本身主委剛剛您的客語發言將近八成以上是能夠理解的狀況其實也是因為我有屏東這樣生長環境的過程我們在屏東有使用客語的習慣我的父母我的父親因為工作的關係客語非常流利所以\n\n8\n00:02:27,276 --> 00:02:29,740\n我們在家裡也會這樣使用所以環境對一個人的學習語言其實才是最重要的所以我也看到其實是客委會在這段時間以來其實多年以來我們國家的政策就是一直在塑造家庭以外的客語環境\n\n9\n00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:49,125\n所以不管是課與生根服務計劃、課與沉浸式教學計劃、課與生活學校計劃等等,都是在塑造環境,沒有錯吧?對不對?主委。是。那我想請問一下,這個課與生根服務計劃,你們現在的重點會是在你們的誘因啊,或者是成效,你自己的評價如何?我想這樣齁,就是課與生根服務計劃是我們跟縣市政府跟新船師一起合作。\n\n10\n00:03:11,303 --> 00:03:19,307\n是跟縣市政府嘛對不對是所以說縣市政府舉辦起來會不太一樣好那您再說簡要的說一下簡要的說就是透過新傳師跟孩子孩子的課與生跟服務計畫對對要新傳師開課\n\n11\n00:03:29,212 --> 00:03:51,266\n開課要有孩子來學所以這個其實是有基礎長期以來在培養孩子的對,所以其實你們做了很多但我剛剛給你看就是您在說的這個課語班的部分我發現這幾年以三年為例就好了課語班的開設學員是增加的表示有興趣的人是多的可是我們要怎麼檢核他們到底會不會講呢\n\n12\n00:03:52,947 --> 00:04:01,914\n需不需要來看看說這個班到底有沒有效呢那我想來想去能夠通過的一個方法是什麼就是有沒有去參加課語認證並且有沒有通過嘛所以我們再來看參加班學習班的人數增加可是去報考課語認證的人呢其實是下降的而且是今年是參加的課語考證的人數是近三年來一個新低這樣的狀況所以你對這樣的現象有什麼樣的看法\n\n13\n00:04:23,041 --> 00:04:41,606\n學習的人數成長但考照的人數下降因為考試還是有難度我覺得最重要的其實還是誘因你要不要原民會主委在旁邊問一下我們原民會的學生、原住民族的學生學生去考族語認證的有多少?幾成?\n\n14\n00:04:44,970 --> 00:04:51,734\n將近九成吧九成嘛因為如果沒有去考他還會一直寄通知單來問你要不要考啊因為我孩子就是這樣啊對啊那客家孩子有這樣要求要通過課語認證嗎沒有沒有嘛那為什麼要這樣子呢因為主委可以原民會主委謝謝\n\n15\n00:05:00,919 --> 00:05:21,428\n所以為什麼會這樣就是考到這個證照到底有沒有作用這個證照之後到底可以帶來什麼效益會決定了這一張證照到底有沒有人想去考講白了就是這樣因為事實上準備考試是一件很重要的事情如果我們今天在這裡跟大家說客委會的所有的這個服務同仁要通過客語認證\n\n16\n00:05:22,728 --> 00:05:37,325\n而且要是中高級才能夠來客委會服務我相信這個考照的人數一定大幅增加所以剛剛我看到客委會同仁其實站起來的時候都是用客語回答非常感謝都以身作則都是會使用母語的\n\n17\n00:05:37,805 --> 00:05:58,664\n那再講更實際一點啦因為剛剛的這種法規一定不會通過因為大家一定會說這會影響到工作權等等好那我如果這樣講我剛剛在跟李柏毅委員開玩笑啊那你如果立法委員要代表你的選區裡面有客家中的立法委員要求要會客語才能夠有參選資格這個大家一定去考啊\n\n18\n00:05:59,304 --> 00:06:12,922\n那也不要說這麼嚴重啦那如果我們用鼓勵性質我們不要用懲罰性質我們用鼓勵性質的啦所有要參選立法委員的候選人如果會講客語初選加10%要不要?要客嗎?\n\n19\n00:06:14,824 --> 00:06:15,465\n這就是有用需要用\n\n20\n00:06:30,868 --> 00:06:54,387\n所以我檢視了您今天的業務報告裡面其實在有用的部分我希望能夠再加強因為我的時間只有一部分所以我是提升第一個它的有用的程度不管是在考照、證照之後的有用或者是客語的有用是最重要的這樣非客家人也一定會去學第二個我也想跟主委分享主委你有問過年輕人為什麼他們現在都在學泰語、韓語\n\n21\n00:06:56,653 --> 00:07:12,091\n一個潮流對啊潮流嘛就追星嘛我小時候也要學日文啊我還用波波夢在拼日文啊我也不知道我在唱什麼但是我就會想學啊所以是追星所以你能不能夠創造客家的民心你現在在影視圈有你說打造客劇\n\n22\n00:07:13,112 --> 00:07:29,169\n好,可是我覺得啦,我支持有客具但我認為這個歌曲的影響力更是無遠弗屆當年有羅時鋒,所以現在所有的人都會生那眼睛那,前幾年有羅文玉,所以大家又都抓了一句有寒來溜,是保了嗎?\n\n23\n00:07:31,825 --> 00:07:45,000\n因為這個就是歌曲的魅力所以一個明星可以帶動的是更多尤其是歌曲類的所以我認為你在預算的分配上面其實可以是打造客語明星的部分可以再加強最後我還是覺得是從小親近是最好的\n\n24\n00:07:48,483 --> 00:08:02,233\n親近的意思是就算我這一時間一時片刻沒有把它學起來但我就是有這個基礎我就是有這個根底我其實再重新拾回來這個母語的技能其實是很容易的所以我再次我已經在這裡多次的強調我認為客委會在補助客家社團的時候如果這些社團是有辦親子活動的應該要大力給予補助讓孩子從小能夠親近我認為\n\n25\n00:08:14,722 --> 00:08:32,378\n這是比你在學校開更多的班或者是你在這邊做任何的計畫你寫了這篇通篇我認為就只有三件三個點是讓我們的母語能夠重新活在這個社會上最好的三個原則就是有用、夠潮\n\n26\n00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:52,536\n從小清淨就是這三點所以未來我也會秉持這三個原則再跟客委會做更多的討論我想客委會存在的目的就是維繫傳承客家文化所以我希望能夠從語言開始好感謝美燕再同意要勸發這三點請客委會參考非常清楚易懂謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n694\t4509\t好 謝謝主席 我們請客委員會谷主委好 請谷主委\n8849\t13130\t主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好\n38854\t63362\t再來我們再輸用華語,這樣不知道主委覺得可以嗎?報告委員還有主席,我們接下去因為委員的要求,我們用法語看主席采詩喔,可以,當然可以我是這樣想啦,確實這是因為歷史的關係啦你看我現在全程使用台語,我也是可以啦只是我們剛剛在討論另外一條,一時間有點羞怕感啦\n66883\t90068\t我覺得語言最重要的就是要能夠使用並且活用所以其實今天我還是想跟主委來討論一下的其實是我們對客語的政府如何、狀況如何首先我想請問主委像您能夠這麼流利的使用客家話必定是從小就有學習嘛那如果你認為現在的孩子現在的孩子\n92068\t103807\t那到底是在非客家莊長大的客家人有客家血統的客家人比較會說客語還是在客莊長大的非客莊人比較會使用台語這是客語\n105565\t108949\t目前我又講客語了沒關係啦其實我剛剛發現我都聽得懂還蠻妙的我試試看用客語啦好啊好啊在客庄裡面\n124465\t129408\t事實上是這樣 為什麼 因為就是語言的關係我認為我自己本身 主委剛剛您的客語發言將近八成以上是能夠理解的狀況其實也是因為我有屏東這樣生長環境的過程我們在屏東有使用客語的習慣我的父母 我的父親因為工作的關係 客語非常流利 所以\n147276\t149740\t我們在家裡也會這樣使用所以環境對一個人的學習語言其實才是最重要的所以我也看到其實是客委會在這段時間以來其實多年以來我們國家的政策就是一直在塑造家庭以外的客語環境\n163760\t169125\t所以不管是課與生根服務計劃、課與沉浸式教學計劃、課與生活學校計劃等等,都是在塑造環境,沒有錯吧?對不對?主委。是。那我想請問一下,這個課與生根服務計劃,你們現在的重點會是在你們的誘因啊,或者是成效,你自己的評價如何?我想這樣齁,就是課與生根服務計劃是我們跟縣市政府跟新船師一起合作。\n191303\t199307\t是跟縣市政府嘛對不對是所以說縣市政府舉辦起來會不太一樣好那您再說簡要的說一下簡要的說就是透過新傳師跟孩子孩子的課與生跟服務計畫對對要新傳師開課\n209212\t231266\t開課要有孩子來學所以這個其實是有基礎長期以來在培養孩子的對,所以其實你們做了很多但我剛剛給你看就是您在說的這個課語班的部分我發現這幾年以三年為例就好了課語班的開設學員是增加的表示有興趣的人是多的可是我們要怎麼檢核他們到底會不會講呢\n232947\t241914\t需不需要來看看說這個班到底有沒有效呢那我想來想去能夠通過的一個方法是什麼就是有沒有去參加課語認證並且有沒有通過嘛所以我們再來看參加班學習班的人數增加可是去報考課語認證的人呢其實是下降的而且是今年是參加的課語考證的人數是近三年來一個新低這樣的狀況所以你對這樣的現象有什麼樣的看法\n263041\t281606\t學習的人數成長但考照的人數下降因為考試還是有難度我覺得最重要的其實還是誘因你要不要原民會主委在旁邊問一下我們原民會的學生、原住民族的學生學生去考族語認證的有多少?幾成?\n284970\t291734\t將近九成吧九成嘛 因為如果沒有去考他還會一直寄通知單來問你要不要考啊因為我孩子就是這樣啊對啊 那客家孩子有這樣要求要通過課語認證嗎沒有 沒有嘛那為什麼要這樣子呢因為 主委可以 原民會主委謝謝\n300919\t321428\t所以為什麼會這樣就是考到這個證照到底有沒有作用這個證照之後到底可以帶來什麼效益會決定了這一張證照到底有沒有人想去考講白了就是這樣因為事實上準備考試是一件很重要的事情如果我們今天在這裡跟大家說客委會的所有的這個服務同仁要通過客語認證\n322728\t337325\t而且要是中高級才能夠來客委會服務我相信這個考照的人數一定大幅增加所以剛剛我看到客委會同仁其實站起來的時候都是用客語回答非常感謝都以身作則都是會使用母語的\n337805\t358664\t那再講更實際一點啦因為剛剛的這種法規一定不會通過因為大家一定會說這會影響到工作權等等好 那我如果這樣講我剛剛在跟李柏毅委員開玩笑啊那你如果立法委員要代表你的選區裡面有客家中的立法委員要求要會客語才能夠有參選資格這個大家一定去考啊\n359304\t372922\t那也不要說這麼嚴重啦那如果我們用鼓勵性質我們不要用懲罰性質我們用鼓勵性質的啦所有要參選立法委員的候選人如果會講客語初選加10%要不要?要客嗎?\n374824\t375465\t這就是有用需要用\n390868\t414387\t所以我檢視了您今天的業務報告裡面其實在有用的部分我希望能夠再加強因為我的時間只有一部分所以我是提升第一個它的有用的程度不管是在考照、證照之後的有用或者是客語的有用是最重要的這樣非客家人也一定會去學第二個我也想跟主委分享主委你有問過年輕人為什麼他們現在都在學泰語、韓語\n416653\t432091\t一個潮流對啊 潮流嘛就追星嘛我小時候也要學日文啊我還用波波夢在拼日文啊我也不知道我在唱什麼但是我就會想學啊所以是追星所以你能不能夠創造客家的民心你現在在影視圈有你說打造客劇\n433112\t449169\t好,可是我覺得啦,我支持有客具但我認為這個歌曲的影響力更是無遠弗屆當年有羅時鋒,所以現在所有的人都會生那眼睛那,前幾年有羅文玉,所以大家又都抓了一句有寒來溜,是保了嗎?\n451825\t465000\t因為這個就是歌曲的魅力所以一個明星可以帶動的是更多尤其是歌曲類的所以我認為你在預算的分配上面其實可以是打造客語明星的部分可以再加強最後我還是覺得是從小親近是最好的\n468483\t482233\t親近的意思是就算我這一時間一時片刻沒有把它學起來但我就是有這個基礎我就是有這個根底我其實再重新拾回來這個母語的技能其實是很容易的所以我再次我已經在這裡多次的強調我認為客委會在補助客家社團的時候如果這些社團是有辦親子活動的應該要大力給予補助讓孩子從小能夠親近我認為\n494722\t512378\t這是比你在學校開更多的班或者是你在這邊做任何的計畫你寫了這篇通篇我認為就只有三件三個點是讓我們的母語能夠重新活在這個社會上最好的三個原則就是有用、夠潮\n514920\t532536\t從小清淨就是這三點所以未來我也會秉持這三個原則再跟客委會做更多的討論我想客委會存在的目的就是維繫傳承客家文化所以我希望能夠從語言開始好 感謝美燕再同意要勸發這三點請客委會參考非常清楚易懂謝謝\n","txt":"好 謝謝主席 我們請客委員會谷主委好 請谷主委\n主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好\n再來我們再輸用華語,這樣不知道主委覺得可以嗎?報告委員還有主席,我們接下去因為委員的要求,我們用法語看主席采詩喔,可以,當然可以我是這樣想啦,確實這是因為歷史的關係啦你看我現在全程使用台語,我也是可以啦只是我們剛剛在討論另外一條,一時間有點羞怕感啦\n我覺得語言最重要的就是要能夠使用並且活用所以其實今天我還是想跟主委來討論一下的其實是我們對客語的政府如何、狀況如何首先我想請問主委像您能夠這麼流利的使用客家話必定是從小就有學習嘛那如果你認為現在的孩子現在的孩子\n那到底是在非客家莊長大的客家人有客家血統的客家人比較會說客語還是在客莊長大的非客莊人比較會使用台語這是客語\n目前我又講客語了沒關係啦其實我剛剛發現我都聽得懂還蠻妙的我試試看用客語啦好啊好啊在客庄裡面\n事實上是這樣 為什麼 因為就是語言的關係我認為我自己本身 主委剛剛您的客語發言將近八成以上是能夠理解的狀況其實也是因為我有屏東這樣生長環境的過程我們在屏東有使用客語的習慣我的父母 我的父親因為工作的關係 客語非常流利 所以\n我們在家裡也會這樣使用所以環境對一個人的學習語言其實才是最重要的所以我也看到其實是客委會在這段時間以來其實多年以來我們國家的政策就是一直在塑造家庭以外的客語環境\n所以不管是課與生根服務計劃、課與沉浸式教學計劃、課與生活學校計劃等等,都是在塑造環境,沒有錯吧?對不對?主委。是。那我想請問一下,這個課與生根服務計劃,你們現在的重點會是在你們的誘因啊,或者是成效,你自己的評價如何?我想這樣齁,就是課與生根服務計劃是我們跟縣市政府跟新船師一起合作。\n是跟縣市政府嘛對不對是所以說縣市政府舉辦起來會不太一樣好那您再說簡要的說一下簡要的說就是透過新傳師跟孩子孩子的課與生跟服務計畫對對要新傳師開課\n開課要有孩子來學所以這個其實是有基礎長期以來在培養孩子的對,所以其實你們做了很多但我剛剛給你看就是您在說的這個課語班的部分我發現這幾年以三年為例就好了課語班的開設學員是增加的表示有興趣的人是多的可是我們要怎麼檢核他們到底會不會講呢\n需不需要來看看說這個班到底有沒有效呢那我想來想去能夠通過的一個方法是什麼就是有沒有去參加課語認證並且有沒有通過嘛所以我們再來看參加班學習班的人數增加可是去報考課語認證的人呢其實是下降的而且是今年是參加的課語考證的人數是近三年來一個新低這樣的狀況所以你對這樣的現象有什麼樣的看法\n學習的人數成長但考照的人數下降因為考試還是有難度我覺得最重要的其實還是誘因你要不要原民會主委在旁邊問一下我們原民會的學生、原住民族的學生學生去考族語認證的有多少?幾成?\n將近九成吧九成嘛 因為如果沒有去考他還會一直寄通知單來問你要不要考啊因為我孩子就是這樣啊對啊 那客家孩子有這樣要求要通過課語認證嗎沒有 沒有嘛那為什麼要這樣子呢因為 主委可以 原民會主委謝謝\n所以為什麼會這樣就是考到這個證照到底有沒有作用這個證照之後到底可以帶來什麼效益會決定了這一張證照到底有沒有人想去考講白了就是這樣因為事實上準備考試是一件很重要的事情如果我們今天在這裡跟大家說客委會的所有的這個服務同仁要通過客語認證\n而且要是中高級才能夠來客委會服務我相信這個考照的人數一定大幅增加所以剛剛我看到客委會同仁其實站起來的時候都是用客語回答非常感謝都以身作則都是會使用母語的\n那再講更實際一點啦因為剛剛的這種法規一定不會通過因為大家一定會說這會影響到工作權等等好 那我如果這樣講我剛剛在跟李柏毅委員開玩笑啊那你如果立法委員要代表你的選區裡面有客家中的立法委員要求要會客語才能夠有參選資格這個大家一定去考啊\n那也不要說這麼嚴重啦那如果我們用鼓勵性質我們不要用懲罰性質我們用鼓勵性質的啦所有要參選立法委員的候選人如果會講客語初選加10%要不要?要客嗎?\n這就是有用需要用\n所以我檢視了您今天的業務報告裡面其實在有用的部分我希望能夠再加強因為我的時間只有一部分所以我是提升第一個它的有用的程度不管是在考照、證照之後的有用或者是客語的有用是最重要的這樣非客家人也一定會去學第二個我也想跟主委分享主委你有問過年輕人為什麼他們現在都在學泰語、韓語\n一個潮流對啊 潮流嘛就追星嘛我小時候也要學日文啊我還用波波夢在拼日文啊我也不知道我在唱什麼但是我就會想學啊所以是追星所以你能不能夠創造客家的民心你現在在影視圈有你說打造客劇\n好,可是我覺得啦,我支持有客具但我認為這個歌曲的影響力更是無遠弗屆當年有羅時鋒,所以現在所有的人都會生那眼睛那,前幾年有羅文玉,所以大家又都抓了一句有寒來溜,是保了嗎?\n因為這個就是歌曲的魅力所以一個明星可以帶動的是更多尤其是歌曲類的所以我認為你在預算的分配上面其實可以是打造客語明星的部分可以再加強最後我還是覺得是從小親近是最好的\n親近的意思是就算我這一時間一時片刻沒有把它學起來但我就是有這個基礎我就是有這個根底我其實再重新拾回來這個母語的技能其實是很容易的所以我再次我已經在這裡多次的強調我認為客委會在補助客家社團的時候如果這些社團是有辦親子活動的應該要大力給予補助讓孩子從小能夠親近我認為\n這是比你在學校開更多的班或者是你在這邊做任何的計畫你寫了這篇通篇我認為就只有三件三個點是讓我們的母語能夠重新活在這個社會上最好的三個原則就是有用、夠潮\n從小清淨就是這三點所以未來我也會秉持這三個原則再跟客委會做更多的討論我想客委會存在的目的就是維繫傳承客家文化所以我希望能夠從語言開始好 感謝美燕再同意要勸發這三點請客委會參考非常清楚易懂謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.694 --> 00:04.509\n好謝謝主席我們請客委員會谷主委好請谷主委\n\n00:08.849 --> 00:13.130\n主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好\n\n00:38.854 --> 01:03.362\n再來我們再輸用華語,這樣不知道主委覺得可以嗎?報告委員還有主席,我們接下去因為委員的要求,我們用法語看主席采詩喔,可以,當然可以我是這樣想啦,確實這是因為歷史的關係啦你看我現在全程使用台語,我也是可以啦只是我們剛剛在討論另外一條,一時間有點羞怕感啦\n\n01:06.883 --> 01:30.068\n我覺得語言最重要的就是要能夠使用並且活用所以其實今天我還是想跟主委來討論一下的其實是我們對客語的政府如何、狀況如何首先我想請問主委像您能夠這麼流利的使用客家話必定是從小就有學習嘛那如果你認為現在的孩子現在的孩子\n\n01:32.068 --> 01:43.807\n那到底是在非客家莊長大的客家人有客家血統的客家人比較會說客語還是在客莊長大的非客莊人比較會使用台語這是客語\n\n01:45.565 --> 01:48.949\n目前我又講客語了沒關係啦其實我剛剛發現我都聽得懂還蠻妙的我試試看用客語啦好啊好啊在客庄裡面\n\n02:04.465 --> 02:09.408\n事實上是這樣為什麼因為就是語言的關係我認為我自己本身主委剛剛您的客語發言將近八成以上是能夠理解的狀況其實也是因為我有屏東這樣生長環境的過程我們在屏東有使用客語的習慣我的父母我的父親因為工作的關係客語非常流利所以\n\n02:27.276 --> 02:29.740\n我們在家裡也會這樣使用所以環境對一個人的學習語言其實才是最重要的所以我也看到其實是客委會在這段時間以來其實多年以來我們國家的政策就是一直在塑造家庭以外的客語環境\n\n02:43.760 --> 02:49.125\n所以不管是課與生根服務計劃、課與沉浸式教學計劃、課與生活學校計劃等等,都是在塑造環境,沒有錯吧?對不對?主委。是。那我想請問一下,這個課與生根服務計劃,你們現在的重點會是在你們的誘因啊,或者是成效,你自己的評價如何?我想這樣齁,就是課與生根服務計劃是我們跟縣市政府跟新船師一起合作。\n\n03:11.303 --> 03:19.307\n是跟縣市政府嘛對不對是所以說縣市政府舉辦起來會不太一樣好那您再說簡要的說一下簡要的說就是透過新傳師跟孩子孩子的課與生跟服務計畫對對要新傳師開課\n\n03:29.212 --> 03:51.266\n開課要有孩子來學所以這個其實是有基礎長期以來在培養孩子的對,所以其實你們做了很多但我剛剛給你看就是您在說的這個課語班的部分我發現這幾年以三年為例就好了課語班的開設學員是增加的表示有興趣的人是多的可是我們要怎麼檢核他們到底會不會講呢\n\n03:52.947 --> 04:01.914\n需不需要來看看說這個班到底有沒有效呢那我想來想去能夠通過的一個方法是什麼就是有沒有去參加課語認證並且有沒有通過嘛所以我們再來看參加班學習班的人數增加可是去報考課語認證的人呢其實是下降的而且是今年是參加的課語考證的人數是近三年來一個新低這樣的狀況所以你對這樣的現象有什麼樣的看法\n\n04:23.041 --> 04:41.606\n學習的人數成長但考照的人數下降因為考試還是有難度我覺得最重要的其實還是誘因你要不要原民會主委在旁邊問一下我們原民會的學生、原住民族的學生學生去考族語認證的有多少?幾成?\n\n04:44.970 --> 04:51.734\n將近九成吧九成嘛因為如果沒有去考他還會一直寄通知單來問你要不要考啊因為我孩子就是這樣啊對啊那客家孩子有這樣要求要通過課語認證嗎沒有沒有嘛那為什麼要這樣子呢因為主委可以原民會主委謝謝\n\n05:00.919 --> 05:21.428\n所以為什麼會這樣就是考到這個證照到底有沒有作用這個證照之後到底可以帶來什麼效益會決定了這一張證照到底有沒有人想去考講白了就是這樣因為事實上準備考試是一件很重要的事情如果我們今天在這裡跟大家說客委會的所有的這個服務同仁要通過客語認證\n\n05:22.728 --> 05:37.325\n而且要是中高級才能夠來客委會服務我相信這個考照的人數一定大幅增加所以剛剛我看到客委會同仁其實站起來的時候都是用客語回答非常感謝都以身作則都是會使用母語的\n\n05:37.805 --> 05:58.664\n那再講更實際一點啦因為剛剛的這種法規一定不會通過因為大家一定會說這會影響到工作權等等好那我如果這樣講我剛剛在跟李柏毅委員開玩笑啊那你如果立法委員要代表你的選區裡面有客家中的立法委員要求要會客語才能夠有參選資格這個大家一定去考啊\n\n05:59.304 --> 06:12.922\n那也不要說這麼嚴重啦那如果我們用鼓勵性質我們不要用懲罰性質我們用鼓勵性質的啦所有要參選立法委員的候選人如果會講客語初選加10%要不要?要客嗎?\n\n06:14.824 --> 06:15.465\n這就是有用需要用\n\n06:30.868 --> 06:54.387\n所以我檢視了您今天的業務報告裡面其實在有用的部分我希望能夠再加強因為我的時間只有一部分所以我是提升第一個它的有用的程度不管是在考照、證照之後的有用或者是客語的有用是最重要的這樣非客家人也一定會去學第二個我也想跟主委分享主委你有問過年輕人為什麼他們現在都在學泰語、韓語\n\n06:56.653 --> 07:12.091\n一個潮流對啊潮流嘛就追星嘛我小時候也要學日文啊我還用波波夢在拼日文啊我也不知道我在唱什麼但是我就會想學啊所以是追星所以你能不能夠創造客家的民心你現在在影視圈有你說打造客劇\n\n07:13.112 --> 07:29.169\n好,可是我覺得啦,我支持有客具但我認為這個歌曲的影響力更是無遠弗屆當年有羅時鋒,所以現在所有的人都會生那眼睛那,前幾年有羅文玉,所以大家又都抓了一句有寒來溜,是保了嗎?\n\n07:31.825 --> 07:45.000\n因為這個就是歌曲的魅力所以一個明星可以帶動的是更多尤其是歌曲類的所以我認為你在預算的分配上面其實可以是打造客語明星的部分可以再加強最後我還是覺得是從小親近是最好的\n\n07:48.483 --> 08:02.233\n親近的意思是就算我這一時間一時片刻沒有把它學起來但我就是有這個基礎我就是有這個根底我其實再重新拾回來這個母語的技能其實是很容易的所以我再次我已經在這裡多次的強調我認為客委會在補助客家社團的時候如果這些社團是有辦親子活動的應該要大力給予補助讓孩子從小能夠親近我認為\n\n08:14.722 --> 08:32.378\n這是比你在學校開更多的班或者是你在這邊做任何的計畫你寫了這篇通篇我認為就只有三件三個點是讓我們的母語能夠重新活在這個社會上最好的三個原則就是有用、夠潮\n\n08:34.920 --> 08:52.536\n從小清淨就是這三點所以未來我也會秉持這三個原則再跟客委會做更多的討論我想客委會存在的目的就是維繫傳承客家文化所以我希望能夠從語言開始好感謝美燕再同意要勸發這三點請客委會參考非常清楚易懂謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.694,"end":4.509,"text":"好 謝謝主席 我們請客委員會谷主委好 請谷主委"},{"start":8.849,"end":13.13,"text":"主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好主委,你好"},{"start":38.854,"end":63.362,"text":"再來我們再輸用華語,這樣不知道主委覺得可以嗎?報告委員還有主席,我們接下去因為委員的要求,我們用法語看主席采詩喔,可以,當然可以我是這樣想啦,確實這是因為歷史的關係啦你看我現在全程使用台語,我也是可以啦只是我們剛剛在討論另外一條,一時間有點羞怕感啦"},{"start":66.883,"end":90.068,"text":"我覺得語言最重要的就是要能夠使用並且活用所以其實今天我還是想跟主委來討論一下的其實是我們對客語的政府如何、狀況如何首先我想請問主委像您能夠這麼流利的使用客家話必定是從小就有學習嘛那如果你認為現在的孩子現在的孩子"},{"start":92.068,"end":103.807,"text":"那到底是在非客家莊長大的客家人有客家血統的客家人比較會說客語還是在客莊長大的非客莊人比較會使用台語這是客語"},{"start":105.565,"end":108.949,"text":"目前我又講客語了沒關係啦其實我剛剛發現我都聽得懂還蠻妙的我試試看用客語啦好啊好啊在客庄裡面"},{"start":124.465,"end":129.408,"text":"事實上是這樣 為什麼 因為就是語言的關係我認為我自己本身 主委剛剛您的客語發言將近八成以上是能夠理解的狀況其實也是因為我有屏東這樣生長環境的過程我們在屏東有使用客語的習慣我的父母 我的父親因為工作的關係 客語非常流利 所以"},{"start":147.276,"end":149.74,"text":"我們在家裡也會這樣使用所以環境對一個人的學習語言其實才是最重要的所以我也看到其實是客委會在這段時間以來其實多年以來我們國家的政策就是一直在塑造家庭以外的客語環境"},{"start":163.76,"end":169.125,"text":"所以不管是課與生根服務計劃、課與沉浸式教學計劃、課與生活學校計劃等等,都是在塑造環境,沒有錯吧?對不對?主委。是。那我想請問一下,這個課與生根服務計劃,你們現在的重點會是在你們的誘因啊,或者是成效,你自己的評價如何?我想這樣齁,就是課與生根服務計劃是我們跟縣市政府跟新船師一起合作。"},{"start":191.303,"end":199.307,"text":"是跟縣市政府嘛對不對是所以說縣市政府舉辦起來會不太一樣好那您再說簡要的說一下簡要的說就是透過新傳師跟孩子孩子的課與生跟服務計畫對對要新傳師開課"},{"start":209.212,"end":231.266,"text":"開課要有孩子來學所以這個其實是有基礎長期以來在培養孩子的對,所以其實你們做了很多但我剛剛給你看就是您在說的這個課語班的部分我發現這幾年以三年為例就好了課語班的開設學員是增加的表示有興趣的人是多的可是我們要怎麼檢核他們到底會不會講呢"},{"start":232.947,"end":241.914,"text":"需不需要來看看說這個班到底有沒有效呢那我想來想去能夠通過的一個方法是什麼就是有沒有去參加課語認證並且有沒有通過嘛所以我們再來看參加班學習班的人數增加可是去報考課語認證的人呢其實是下降的而且是今年是參加的課語考證的人數是近三年來一個新低這樣的狀況所以你對這樣的現象有什麼樣的看法"},{"start":263.041,"end":281.606,"text":"學習的人數成長但考照的人數下降因為考試還是有難度我覺得最重要的其實還是誘因你要不要原民會主委在旁邊問一下我們原民會的學生、原住民族的學生學生去考族語認證的有多少?幾成?"},{"start":284.97,"end":291.734,"text":"將近九成吧九成嘛 因為如果沒有去考他還會一直寄通知單來問你要不要考啊因為我孩子就是這樣啊對啊 那客家孩子有這樣要求要通過課語認證嗎沒有 沒有嘛那為什麼要這樣子呢因為 主委可以 原民會主委謝謝"},{"start":300.919,"end":321.428,"text":"所以為什麼會這樣就是考到這個證照到底有沒有作用這個證照之後到底可以帶來什麼效益會決定了這一張證照到底有沒有人想去考講白了就是這樣因為事實上準備考試是一件很重要的事情如果我們今天在這裡跟大家說客委會的所有的這個服務同仁要通過客語認證"},{"start":322.728,"end":337.325,"text":"而且要是中高級才能夠來客委會服務我相信這個考照的人數一定大幅增加所以剛剛我看到客委會同仁其實站起來的時候都是用客語回答非常感謝都以身作則都是會使用母語的"},{"start":337.805,"end":358.664,"text":"那再講更實際一點啦因為剛剛的這種法規一定不會通過因為大家一定會說這會影響到工作權等等好 那我如果這樣講我剛剛在跟李柏毅委員開玩笑啊那你如果立法委員要代表你的選區裡面有客家中的立法委員要求要會客語才能夠有參選資格這個大家一定去考啊"},{"start":359.304,"end":372.922,"text":"那也不要說這麼嚴重啦那如果我們用鼓勵性質我們不要用懲罰性質我們用鼓勵性質的啦所有要參選立法委員的候選人如果會講客語初選加10%要不要?要客嗎?"},{"start":374.824,"end":375.465,"text":"這就是有用需要用"},{"start":390.868,"end":414.387,"text":"所以我檢視了您今天的業務報告裡面其實在有用的部分我希望能夠再加強因為我的時間只有一部分所以我是提升第一個它的有用的程度不管是在考照、證照之後的有用或者是客語的有用是最重要的這樣非客家人也一定會去學第二個我也想跟主委分享主委你有問過年輕人為什麼他們現在都在學泰語、韓語"},{"start":416.653,"end":432.091,"text":"一個潮流對啊 潮流嘛就追星嘛我小時候也要學日文啊我還用波波夢在拼日文啊我也不知道我在唱什麼但是我就會想學啊所以是追星所以你能不能夠創造客家的民心你現在在影視圈有你說打造客劇"},{"start":433.112,"end":449.169,"text":"好,可是我覺得啦,我支持有客具但我認為這個歌曲的影響力更是無遠弗屆當年有羅時鋒,所以現在所有的人都會生那眼睛那,前幾年有羅文玉,所以大家又都抓了一句有寒來溜,是保了嗎?"},{"start":451.825,"end":465,"text":"因為這個就是歌曲的魅力所以一個明星可以帶動的是更多尤其是歌曲類的所以我認為你在預算的分配上面其實可以是打造客語明星的部分可以再加強最後我還是覺得是從小親近是最好的"},{"start":468.483,"end":482.233,"text":"親近的意思是就算我這一時間一時片刻沒有把它學起來但我就是有這個基礎我就是有這個根底我其實再重新拾回來這個母語的技能其實是很容易的所以我再次我已經在這裡多次的強調我認為客委會在補助客家社團的時候如果這些社團是有辦親子活動的應該要大力給予補助讓孩子從小能夠親近我認為"},{"start":494.722,"end":512.378,"text":"這是比你在學校開更多的班或者是你在這邊做任何的計畫你寫了這篇通篇我認為就只有三件三個點是讓我們的母語能夠重新活在這個社會上最好的三個原則就是有用、夠潮"},{"start":514.92,"end":532.536,"text":"從小清淨就是這三點所以未來我也會秉持這三個原則再跟客委會做更多的討論我想客委會存在的目的就是維繫傳承客家文化所以我希望能夠從語言開始好 感謝美燕再同意要勸發這三點請客委會參考非常清楚易懂謝謝"}]}}},"meet":{"sessionPeriod":2,"sessionTimes":4,"tmpMeeting":null,"committees":[15],"term":11,"id":"委員會-11-2-15-4","title":"第11屆第2會期內政委員會第4次全體委員會議","type":"委員會"},"會議時間":"2024-10-09T09:00:00+08:00","委員發言時間":"09:44:42 - 09:53:39","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期內政委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請客家委員會主任委員率同所屬及財團法人客家公共傳播基金會董事長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。二、邀請客家委員會主任委員、原住民族委員會主任委員、文化部次長、教育部，就「臺灣台語 」名詞是否符合「國家語言」定義？ 是否侵犯台灣其他語言併存地位？及修正「臺灣台語」政策進行專題報告，並備質詢。）","id":155288,"gazette":{"lineno":429,"blocks":[["蘇委員巧慧：（9時44分）謝謝主席，請客委會古主委。"],["主席：請古主委。"],["古主任委員秀妃：蘇委員你好。"],["蘇委員巧慧：主委你好。上次在你做總質詢的時候看到你全程使用客家話回答，我實在是非常敬佩，所以今天在這裡，第一段我要先向你恭喜，也向你表達敬意，但是因為歷史的關係，你說客家話，我說台語，如果我們兩個在這裡要吵架或聊天都說得通的話，我們就要使用華語，接下來我們使用華語，主委覺得可以嗎？"],["古主任委員秀妃：報告委員還有主席，接下來因為委員的要求，所以我就用華語回答，請主席裁示。"],["主席：好，可以。"],["蘇委員巧慧：我是這樣想，確實這是因為歷史的關係，你要我現在全程使用台語，我也是可以，只是我們剛剛在討論另外一部分，所以一時間似乎說話有點打結了，但我覺得語言最重要的就是要能夠使用並且活用，其實今天我還是想跟主委來討論一下我們對客語的復振狀況如何。","首先，我想請問主委，像您能夠這麼流利的使用客家話，必定是從小就有學習，你認為現在的孩子，到底是在非客家庄長大有客家血統的客家人比較會說客語，還是在客庄長大的非客庄人比較會使用客語？"],["古主任委員秀妃：目前……我又講客語了……"],["蘇委員巧慧：沒關係，其實我剛剛發現，我都聽得懂！"],["古主任委員秀妃：真的嗎？"],["蘇委員巧慧：還滿妙的。"],["古主任委員秀妃：我試試看用客語來回答，我想在客庄裡面長大的人比較會說客語。"],["蘇委員巧慧：事實上就是這樣，為什麼？因為就是環境的關係，主委剛剛的客語發言有將近八成以上，我認為我自己本身是處於能夠理解的狀況，其實也是因為我有屏東這樣生長環境的過程，我們在屏東有使用客語的習慣，我的父親因為工作的關係，客語非常流利，所以我們在家裡也會這樣來使用。所以環境對一個人的學習語言其實才是最重要的，而我也看到客委會在這段時間以來，其實也是多年以來，我們國家的政策就是一直在塑造家庭以外的客語環境，所以不管是客語深根服務計畫、客語沉浸式教學計畫、客語生活學校計畫等等，都是在塑造環境，主委，對不對？"],["古主任委員秀妃：是。"],["蘇委員巧慧：主委，我想請問一下，關於客語深根服務計畫，你們現在的重點，包括你們的誘因或者是成效，你自己的評價是如何？"],["古主任委員秀妃：客語深根服務計畫是我們跟縣市政府、跟薪傳師一起合作……"],["蘇委員巧慧：跟縣市政府，對不對？"],["古主任委員秀妃：是。"],["蘇委員巧慧：縣市政府舉辦起來會不太一樣。好，請您再簡要的說一下。"],["古主任委員秀妃：簡要來說，就是透過薪傳師跟孩子的……"],["蘇委員巧慧：客語深根服務計畫喔！"],["古主任委員秀妃：對，要薪傳師開課，然後開課後要有孩子來學，所以這個其實是有基礎的，就是長期的來培養孩子的語言能力。"],["蘇委員巧慧：對，所以其實你們做了很多，但我剛剛給你看的，就是您在說的客語班，以3年為例就好了，我們發現這幾年客語班的開設上，學員是增加的，表示有興趣的人是多的，可是我們要怎麼檢核他們到底會不會講呢？需不需要來看看開這個班到底有沒有效呢？我想來想去，能夠透過什麼方法呢？就是有沒有去參加客語認證並且有沒有通過嘛！所以我們再來看看，參加客語學習班的人數增加，可是報考客語認證的人數，其實是下降的，而且今年參加客語考證的人數是近3年來新低，對於這樣的現象，你有什麼樣的看法？就是學習的人數成長但考照的人數下降。"],["古主任委員秀妃：因為考試還是有它的難度，所以……"],["蘇委員巧慧：我覺得最重要的其實還是誘因，原民會主委在旁邊，你要不要問一下，我們原住民族學生去考族語認證的有幾成？將近九成吧？"],["曾主任委員智勇：對。"],["蘇委員巧慧：九成嘛！因為如果沒有去考，它還會一直寄通知單來問你要不要考，我的孩子就是這樣。但客家孩子有這樣要求他們要通過客語認證嗎？沒有！"],["古主任委員秀妃：沒有。"],["蘇委員巧慧：沒有。為什麼會這樣子呢？考到這個證照到底有沒有作用；考到這個證照之後，到底可以帶來什麼效益，就會決定這一張證照到底有沒有人想去考，講白了就是這樣。","事實上，準備考試是一件很重要的事情，如果我們今天在這裡跟大家說，客委會所有的服務同仁要通過客語認證，而且要通過中高級的才能夠來客委會服務，我相信考照的人數一定會大幅增加，剛剛我看到客委會同仁站起來的時候都是用客語回答，非常感謝，都是以身作則、都是會使用母語的。","再講更實際一點，其實這種法規一定不會通過，因為大家一定會說，這會影響到工作權等等，我剛剛在跟李柏毅委員開玩笑，如果要求選區裡面有客家庄的立法委員要會客語，才能夠有參選資格，這樣大家一定會去考；或許也不要說得這麼嚴重，如果我們用鼓勵性質，不要用懲罰性質，所有要參選立法委員的候選人，如果會講客語，初選加10%，要不要？要考嗎？一定會去考的啊！絕對會去考的！大家可以看到，我們每個人都一定會講「各位叔婆伯母隔壁鄰舍好朋友，我是立法委員蘇巧慧，謝謝大家，拜託大家」，大家超級會的！每一個人都會啊！對不對？所以這就是有用、需要用嘛！","而我檢視了您今天的業務報告，其實在有用的部分，我希望能夠再加強，因為我的時間只有一些，所以我希望，第一個，能夠提升它有用的程度，不管是在考證照之後的有用或者是客語的有用是最重要的，然後非客家人也一定會去學；第二個，我也想跟主委分享，主委，你有問過年輕人為什麼他們現在都在學泰語、韓語嗎？"],["古主任委員秀妃：這是一個潮流。"],["蘇委員巧慧：對啊！潮流嘛！就追星嘛！我小時候為了追星也在學日文，我還用ㄅㄆㄇ在拼日文，我也不知道自己在唱什麼，但我就是想學啊！所以你能不能夠創造客家的明星？現在在影視圈，你說有在打造客劇，我支持有客劇，但我認為歌曲的影響力更是無遠弗屆，當年有羅時豐，所以現在所有的人都會「細妹按靚」；前幾年有羅文裕，所以大家又會了一句「有閒來尞，食飽了無？」這個就是歌曲的魅力，一個明星可以帶動的會更多，尤其是歌曲類的。所以我認為你在預算的分配上面，在打造客語明星的部分可以再加強。","最後，我還是覺得，從小親近是最好的，親近的意思是就算我一時片刻沒有把它學起來，但我就是有這個基礎，我就是有這個根底，若要再重新拾回這個母語的技能，其實是很容易的，我已經在這裡多次的強調，我認為客委會在補助客家社團的時候，如果這些社團是有辦親子活動的，應該要大力給予補助，讓孩子從小能夠親近，我認為這比你在學校開更多的班或者是你做了任何的計畫還好。你寫了這整個通篇，我認為就只有三個點，這是讓我們的母語能夠重新活在這個社會上最好的三個原則，就是有用、夠潮、從小親近，就是這三點，未來我也會秉持這三個原則再跟客委會做更多的討論，我想客委會存在的目的就是維繫、傳承客家文化，所以我希望能夠從語言開始。"],["古主任委員秀妃：好，感謝委員，很同意您的看法，我們會努力來做。"],["蘇委員巧慧：這三點請客委會參考，非常清楚易懂，謝謝。"],["古主任委員秀妃：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝蘇巧慧委員。","接下來請張智倫委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":278,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-15-4","speakers":["徐欣瑩","蘇巧慧","張智倫","李柏毅","麥玉珍","黃建賓","張宏陸","許宇甄","王美惠","黃捷","徐巧芯","牛煦庭","林倩綺","吳琪銘","高金素梅","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","楊瓊瓔","張雅琳","葉元之","吳沛憶","陳培瑜","羅智強","涂權吉","徐富癸","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","洪孟楷","黃國昌","呂玉玲","蘇清泉","丁學忠","邱鎮軍"],"page_start":187,"meetingDate":["2024-10-09"],"gazette_id":"1138001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1138001_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期內政委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請客家委員會主任委員率同所屬及財團法人客家公共傳播基金會董事長列席報告業務概\n況，並備質詢；二、邀請客家委員會主任委員、原住民族委員會主任委員、文化部次長、教育\n部，就「臺灣台語」名詞是否符合「國家語言」定義？是否侵犯台灣其他語言併存地位？及修正\n「臺灣台語」政策進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1138001_00004"}}}