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{\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 273.781, \"end\": 274.041, \"score\": 0.955}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 274.041, \"end\": 274.182, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 274.182, \"end\": 274.602, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 274.602, \"end\": 274.982, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 274.982, \"end\": 275.163, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 275.163, \"end\": 275.323, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 275.323, \"end\": 275.483, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 275.483, \"end\": 275.643, \"score\": 0.85}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 275.643, \"end\": 275.763, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 275.763, \"end\": 275.944, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"半\", \"start\": 275.944, \"end\": 276.124, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 276.124, \"end\": 277.225, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"間\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 277.225, \"end\": 277.465, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"加\", \"start\": 277.465, \"end\": 277.766, \"score\": 0.865}, {\"word\": \"快\", \"start\": 277.766, \"end\": 277.786, \"score\": 0.497}]}, {\"start\": 278.967, \"end\": 293.678, \"text\": \"第一個時間要加快不要拖在明年中了好不好讓業者趕快能夠應對好不好這第一個第二個碳費開徵你的碳費藍圖你什麼時候要公佈要明確化來請教你看了這個圖第5次的會議審議會議當中你2026年到2030年你在這邊有說那你什麼時候要公佈你的碳費藍圖\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 278.967, \"end\": 280.748, \"score\": 0.863}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 280.748, \"end\": 282.069, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"間\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 282.069, \"end\": 282.229, \"score\": 0.864}, {\"word\": \"加\", \"start\": 282.229, \"end\": 282.449, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"快\", \"start\": 282.449, \"end\": 282.75, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 282.75, \"end\": 282.83, \"score\": 0.752}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 282.83, \"end\": 282.99, \"score\": 0.809}, {\"word\": \"拖\", \"start\": 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\"圖\"}]}, {\"start\": 307.057, \"end\": 322.139, \"text\": \"這個是每兩年有碳費審議委員會會討論一次你告訴我你什麼時候要公佈這個事實上每兩年就要檢討一次它的成效你告訴我你近期什麼時候要公佈你連公佈都沒有你還講兩年之後的事情\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 307.057, \"end\": 307.237, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"每\", \"start\": 307.237, \"end\": 307.598, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"兩\"}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 307.598, \"end\": 307.758, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 307.758, \"end\": 307.898, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"碳\", \"start\": 307.898, \"end\": 308.459, \"score\": 0.86}, {\"word\": \"費\"}, {\"word\": \"審\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 308.459, \"end\": 309.3, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"討\"}, {\"word\": \"論\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 309.3, \"end\": 309.5, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"次\", \"start\": 309.5, \"end\": 309.661, \"score\": 0.867}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 309.661, 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--> 00:01:20,328\n這個其實我們是相互尊重他們的意見啦相互尊重,當他申表遺憾,你的看法呢?但是這個是碳費審議委員會共同的決議啦共同的決議,碳費審議會定的這個價錢請教,針對本席的提問當碳費開徵經濟部表遺憾,你環境部部長你的看法呢?\n\n4\n00:01:21,607 --> 00:01:36,027\n當然我們會希望說未來也多聽他們的意見,共同來聽產業的意見,其實我也聽了很多產業的意見。那經濟部,陳表宜和他繼續跟你溝通你現在的看法呢?\n\n5\n00:01:37,128 --> 00:01:39,550\n你現在的心態呢?你要不要再給環境部建議?\n\n6\n00:01:58,423 --> 00:02:01,466\n收費的對象是直接跟使用電力間接溫室氣體排放要達到多少以上的電力業\n\n7\n00:02:23,467 --> 00:02:32,212\n這個燃氣供應業以及製造業要課呢?2.5萬噸那你現在一般費率是1公噸多少錢?300塊是以300塊那你提出也就是符合減量指定目標的自主減量計畫者可以適用優惠嗎?是嗎?對對對可以適用優惠有兩個階段A、B兩岸嗎?A、B兩岸對不對?\n\n8\n00:02:49,102 --> 00:03:18,112\n在這樣的情況之下目前經濟部仍就認為是有困難的那政府是一體的必須要好好的去檢討那在這樣的一個情況之下本席要告訴你也就是高碳洩漏事業的單位在碳費公司當中最初可以想排放係數的一個折扣對不對這是全球各個國家都朝這個方向那請問你何時可以拍板\n\n9\n00:03:18,812 --> 00:03:22,194\n高碳洩漏的這個項目,何時可以排版?\n\n10\n00:03:40,366 --> 00:03:53,474\n我們現在在等那個主計處把產業關聯表11月要公告那因為它會是我們計算高碳洩漏風險的一個很重要的資料11月下個月主計處會出來那你們預計什麼時候會我們會跟經濟部就這個資料再去做溝通那預計什麼時候會公告因為你們一定有一個指標啊譬如說\n\n11\n00:04:05,190 --> 00:04:16,482\n這個鋼鐵製電業有沒有報告在裡面?有沒有?國際上現在高碳洩漏風險經濟部有點頭鋼鐵跟水泥是各國都普遍認定是有高碳洩漏所以換句話說11月主計單會出來你們預計什麼時候可以宣布?\n\n12\n00:04:22,148 --> 00:04:37,786\n我們應該希望明年的上半年可以有把那個認定的準則做一個公告時間要加快你們經濟部跟環境部在這裡因為產業很緊張明年你現在說的是明年的上半年時間要加快\n\n13\n00:04:38,967 --> 00:04:53,678\n第一個時間要加快不要拖在明年中了好不好讓業者趕快能夠應對好不好這第一個第二個碳費開徵你的碳費藍圖你什麼時候要公佈要明確化來請教你看了這個圖第5次的會議審議會議當中你2026年到2030年你在這邊有說那你什麼時候要公佈你的碳費藍圖\n\n14\n00:05:07,057 --> 00:05:22,139\n這個是每兩年有碳費審議委員會會討論一次你告訴我你什麼時候要公佈這個事實上每兩年就要檢討一次它的成效你告訴我你近期什麼時候要公佈你連公佈都沒有你還講兩年之後的事情\n\n15\n00:05:23,444 --> 00:05:27,828\n報告委員其實這個委員都討論到最後一個階段2030年可能是1200到1800這個當中是不是一個協力的路徑協力的路徑到底你是不是承載你的2026年到2030年從300漲到1800噸這個是跟國際接軌的一個數字我請問\n\n16\n00:05:44,881 --> 00:06:00,635\n我們政府是不是如此你要明確地告訴民眾因為我們必須要以價自量這個概念從根源以價自量這個非常的重要如果你沒有給人家公佈我現在300我可以吸收\n\n17\n00:06:01,756 --> 00:06:23,028\n但是我如果到...我就不減碳我如果到1800我吸收不了我做價給消費者這怎麼辦這不是政府應該要做的所以我具體說明具體說明第一個也就是說你什麼時候可以讓碳費的藍圖明確化請你告訴我這一點非常的重要請告訴我\n\n18\n00:06:23,448 --> 00:06:42,857\n關委員這個其實這種制度不見得是一個國際上最好的制度所以我們承諾在4年內會推動總量管制的排放交易所以我給你功課因為時間的關係我給你功課請你要儘快你現在沒有要公佈碳費藍圖你沒有我請你要公佈我請你要公佈\n\n19\n00:06:44,718 --> 00:07:05,376\n上路不公布人家怎麼預定怎麼應對呢所以這個就是民間非常的憂心那拜託拜託碳費藍圖你一定要去公布我這個功課給你好不好這個功課一定要給你不是先上路再講沒有那回事的那未來產業要怎麼應對很重要所以最後一個功課給你\n\n20\n00:07:07,718 --> 00:07:33,293\n也就是我們台中中火市世界最高的碳排這個電廠而且我們台中也是製造業精密業發展最重要的重鎮也是都市企業排碳屬全國第三名我們的碳費是專款專用我要拜託部長在這邊你們在分配的時候一定要對台中一個公平的分配我們是全世界曾經剛剛我說過的這樣的一個背景\n\n21\n00:07:34,053 --> 00:07:41,448\n我們付出那麼多一定要好好的讓我們有更多的補助額專案的來作為我們檢探可以嗎\n\n22\n00:07:44,416 --> 00:08:04,514\n這個我們碳費審議會會來考量這個事情你一定要考量喔我一定會追蹤好不好那以上剛剛所說的拜託尤其是我們的碳費藍圖一定要公佈全世界沒有一個國家說上了再講這個是不負責任的一個態度嘛好不好一定要去將碳費藍圖要公佈給社會大眾瞭解好不好謝謝好謝謝楊瓊瓔委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n3490\t6651\t謝謝主席 楊瓊瓔發言 邀請部長請彭部長楊委員好部長好 今天我們討論這個碳費開徵碳費開徵你們跟經濟部你們跟經濟部兩個 那請經濟部也上來你們兩個當說碳費開徵經濟部稱\n30190\t50003\t這一個遺憾那現在你們協商的進度到底怎麼回 怎麼呢來 部長你先說吧委員我們跟經濟部我說說很好大家可能又不滿意阿說不好大家又見縫插針不見縫插針你就講實質的問題實質的面向因為經濟部遺憾怎麼會很好呢你們兩個是風馬牛不相對的阿在這個議題上面你們怎麼樣去把它融合在一起\n60393\t80328\t這個其實我們是相互尊重他們的意見啦相互尊重,當他申表遺憾,你的看法呢?但是這個是碳費審議委員會共同的決議啦共同的決議,碳費審議會定的這個價錢請教,針對本席的提問當碳費開徵經濟部表遺憾,你環境部部長你的看法呢?\n81607\t96027\t當然我們會希望說未來也多聽他們的意見,共同來聽產業的意見,其實我也聽了很多產業的意見。那經濟部,陳表宜和他繼續跟你溝通你現在的看法呢?\n97128\t99550\t你現在的心態呢?你要不要再給環境部建議?\n118423\t121466\t收費的對象是直接跟使用電力間接溫室氣體排放要達到多少以上的電力業\n143467\t152212\t這個燃氣供應業以及製造業要課呢?2.5萬噸那你現在一般費率是1公噸多少錢?300塊是以300塊那你提出也就是符合減量指定目標的自主減量計畫者可以適用優惠嗎?是嗎?對對對可以適用優惠有兩個階段A、B兩岸嗎?A、B兩岸對不對?\n169102\t198112\t在這樣的情況之下目前經濟部仍就認為是有困難的那政府是一體的必須要好好的去檢討那在這樣的一個情況之下本席要告訴你也就是高碳洩漏事業的單位在碳費公司當中最初可以想排放係數的一個折扣對不對這是全球各個國家都朝這個方向那請問你何時可以拍板\n198812\t202194\t高碳洩漏的這個項目,何時可以排版?\n220366\t233474\t我們現在在等那個主計處把產業關聯表11月要公告那因為它會是我們計算高碳洩漏風險的一個很重要的資料11月下個月主計處會出來那你們預計什麼時候會我們會跟經濟部就這個資料再去做溝通那預計什麼時候會公告因為你們一定有一個指標啊譬如說\n245190\t256482\t這個鋼鐵製電業有沒有報告在裡面?有沒有?國際上現在高碳洩漏風險 經濟部有點頭鋼鐵跟水泥是各國都普遍認定是有高碳洩漏所以換句話說11月主計單會出來你們預計什麼時候可以宣布?\n262148\t277786\t我們應該希望明年的上半年可以有把那個認定的準則做一個公告時間要加快你們經濟部跟環境部在這裡因為產業很緊張明年你現在說的是明年的上半年時間要加快\n278967\t293678\t第一個時間要加快不要拖在明年中了好不好讓業者趕快能夠應對好不好這第一個第二個碳費開徵你的碳費藍圖你什麼時候要公佈要明確化來請教你看了這個圖第5次的會議審議會議當中你2026年到2030年你在這邊有說那你什麼時候要公佈你的碳費藍圖\n307057\t322139\t這個是每兩年有碳費審議委員會會討論一次你告訴我你什麼時候要公佈這個事實上每兩年就要檢討一次它的成效你告訴我你近期什麼時候要公佈你連公佈都沒有你還講兩年之後的事情\n323444\t327828\t報告委員其實這個委員都討論到最後一個階段2030年可能是1200到1800這個當中是不是一個協力的路徑協力的路徑到底你是不是承載你的2026年到2030年從300漲到1800噸這個是跟國際接軌的一個數字我請問\n344881\t360635\t我們政府是不是如此你要明確地告訴民眾因為我們必須要以價自量這個概念從根源以價自量這個非常的重要如果你沒有給人家公佈我現在300我可以吸收\n361756\t383028\t但是我如果到...我就不減碳我如果到1800我吸收不了我做價給消費者這怎麼辦這不是政府應該要做的所以我具體說明具體說明第一個也就是說你什麼時候可以讓碳費的藍圖明確化請你告訴我這一點非常的重要請告訴我\n383448\t402857\t關委員這個其實這種制度不見得是一個國際上最好的制度所以我們承諾在4年內會推動總量管制的排放交易所以我給你功課因為時間的關係我給你功課請你要儘快你現在沒有要公佈碳費藍圖你沒有我請你要公佈我請你要公佈\n404718\t425376\t上路不公布人家怎麼預定怎麼應對呢所以這個就是民間非常的憂心那拜託拜託碳費藍圖你一定要去公布我這個功課給你好不好這個功課一定要給你不是先上路再講沒有那回事的那未來產業要怎麼應對很重要所以最後一個功課給你\n427718\t453293\t也就是我們台中中火市世界最高的碳排這個電廠而且我們台中也是製造業精密業發展最重要的重鎮也是都市企業排碳屬全國第三名我們的碳費是專款專用我要拜託部長在這邊你們在分配的時候一定要對台中一個公平的分配我們是全世界曾經剛剛我說過的這樣的一個背景\n454053\t461448\t我們付出那麼多一定要好好的讓我們有更多的補助額專案的來作為我們檢探可以嗎\n464416\t484514\t這個我們碳費審議會會來考量這個事情你一定要考量喔我一定會追蹤好不好那以上剛剛所說的拜託尤其是我們的碳費藍圖一定要公佈全世界沒有一個國家說上了再講這個是不負責任的一個態度嘛好不好一定要去將碳費藍圖要公佈給社會大眾瞭解好不好謝謝好謝謝楊瓊瓔委員\n","txt":"謝謝主席 楊瓊瓔發言 邀請部長請彭部長楊委員好部長好 今天我們討論這個碳費開徵碳費開徵你們跟經濟部你們跟經濟部兩個 那請經濟部也上來你們兩個當說碳費開徵經濟部稱\n這一個遺憾那現在你們協商的進度到底怎麼回 怎麼呢來 部長你先說吧委員我們跟經濟部我說說很好大家可能又不滿意阿說不好大家又見縫插針不見縫插針你就講實質的問題實質的面向因為經濟部遺憾怎麼會很好呢你們兩個是風馬牛不相對的阿在這個議題上面你們怎麼樣去把它融合在一起\n這個其實我們是相互尊重他們的意見啦相互尊重,當他申表遺憾,你的看法呢?但是這個是碳費審議委員會共同的決議啦共同的決議,碳費審議會定的這個價錢請教,針對本席的提問當碳費開徵經濟部表遺憾,你環境部部長你的看法呢?\n當然我們會希望說未來也多聽他們的意見,共同來聽產業的意見,其實我也聽了很多產業的意見。那經濟部,陳表宜和他繼續跟你溝通你現在的看法呢?\n你現在的心態呢?你要不要再給環境部建議?\n收費的對象是直接跟使用電力間接溫室氣體排放要達到多少以上的電力業\n這個燃氣供應業以及製造業要課呢?2.5萬噸那你現在一般費率是1公噸多少錢?300塊是以300塊那你提出也就是符合減量指定目標的自主減量計畫者可以適用優惠嗎?是嗎?對對對可以適用優惠有兩個階段A、B兩岸嗎?A、B兩岸對不對?\n在這樣的情況之下目前經濟部仍就認為是有困難的那政府是一體的必須要好好的去檢討那在這樣的一個情況之下本席要告訴你也就是高碳洩漏事業的單位在碳費公司當中最初可以想排放係數的一個折扣對不對這是全球各個國家都朝這個方向那請問你何時可以拍板\n高碳洩漏的這個項目,何時可以排版?\n我們現在在等那個主計處把產業關聯表11月要公告那因為它會是我們計算高碳洩漏風險的一個很重要的資料11月下個月主計處會出來那你們預計什麼時候會我們會跟經濟部就這個資料再去做溝通那預計什麼時候會公告因為你們一定有一個指標啊譬如說\n這個鋼鐵製電業有沒有報告在裡面?有沒有?國際上現在高碳洩漏風險 經濟部有點頭鋼鐵跟水泥是各國都普遍認定是有高碳洩漏所以換句話說11月主計單會出來你們預計什麼時候可以宣布?\n我們應該希望明年的上半年可以有把那個認定的準則做一個公告時間要加快你們經濟部跟環境部在這裡因為產業很緊張明年你現在說的是明年的上半年時間要加快\n第一個時間要加快不要拖在明年中了好不好讓業者趕快能夠應對好不好這第一個第二個碳費開徵你的碳費藍圖你什麼時候要公佈要明確化來請教你看了這個圖第5次的會議審議會議當中你2026年到2030年你在這邊有說那你什麼時候要公佈你的碳費藍圖\n這個是每兩年有碳費審議委員會會討論一次你告訴我你什麼時候要公佈這個事實上每兩年就要檢討一次它的成效你告訴我你近期什麼時候要公佈你連公佈都沒有你還講兩年之後的事情\n報告委員其實這個委員都討論到最後一個階段2030年可能是1200到1800這個當中是不是一個協力的路徑協力的路徑到底你是不是承載你的2026年到2030年從300漲到1800噸這個是跟國際接軌的一個數字我請問\n我們政府是不是如此你要明確地告訴民眾因為我們必須要以價自量這個概念從根源以價自量這個非常的重要如果你沒有給人家公佈我現在300我可以吸收\n但是我如果到...我就不減碳我如果到1800我吸收不了我做價給消費者這怎麼辦這不是政府應該要做的所以我具體說明具體說明第一個也就是說你什麼時候可以讓碳費的藍圖明確化請你告訴我這一點非常的重要請告訴我\n關委員這個其實這種制度不見得是一個國際上最好的制度所以我們承諾在4年內會推動總量管制的排放交易所以我給你功課因為時間的關係我給你功課請你要儘快你現在沒有要公佈碳費藍圖你沒有我請你要公佈我請你要公佈\n上路不公布人家怎麼預定怎麼應對呢所以這個就是民間非常的憂心那拜託拜託碳費藍圖你一定要去公布我這個功課給你好不好這個功課一定要給你不是先上路再講沒有那回事的那未來產業要怎麼應對很重要所以最後一個功課給你\n也就是我們台中中火市世界最高的碳排這個電廠而且我們台中也是製造業精密業發展最重要的重鎮也是都市企業排碳屬全國第三名我們的碳費是專款專用我要拜託部長在這邊你們在分配的時候一定要對台中一個公平的分配我們是全世界曾經剛剛我說過的這樣的一個背景\n我們付出那麼多一定要好好的讓我們有更多的補助額專案的來作為我們檢探可以嗎\n這個我們碳費審議會會來考量這個事情你一定要考量喔我一定會追蹤好不好那以上剛剛所說的拜託尤其是我們的碳費藍圖一定要公佈全世界沒有一個國家說上了再講這個是不負責任的一個態度嘛好不好一定要去將碳費藍圖要公佈給社會大眾瞭解好不好謝謝好謝謝楊瓊瓔委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:03.490 --> 00:06.651\n謝謝主席楊瓊瓔發言邀請部長請彭部長楊委員好部長好今天我們討論這個碳費開徵碳費開徵你們跟經濟部你們跟經濟部兩個那請經濟部也上來你們兩個當說碳費開徵經濟部稱\n\n00:30.190 --> 00:50.003\n這一個遺憾那現在你們協商的進度到底怎麼回怎麼呢來部長你先說吧委員我們跟經濟部我說說很好大家可能又不滿意阿說不好大家又見縫插針不見縫插針你就講實質的問題實質的面向因為經濟部遺憾怎麼會很好呢你們兩個是風馬牛不相對的阿在這個議題上面你們怎麼樣去把它融合在一起\n\n01:00.393 --> 01:20.328\n這個其實我們是相互尊重他們的意見啦相互尊重,當他申表遺憾,你的看法呢?但是這個是碳費審議委員會共同的決議啦共同的決議,碳費審議會定的這個價錢請教,針對本席的提問當碳費開徵經濟部表遺憾,你環境部部長你的看法呢?\n\n01:21.607 --> 01:36.027\n當然我們會希望說未來也多聽他們的意見,共同來聽產業的意見,其實我也聽了很多產業的意見。那經濟部,陳表宜和他繼續跟你溝通你現在的看法呢?\n\n01:37.128 --> 01:39.550\n你現在的心態呢?你要不要再給環境部建議?\n\n01:58.423 --> 02:01.466\n收費的對象是直接跟使用電力間接溫室氣體排放要達到多少以上的電力業\n\n02:23.467 --> 02:32.212\n這個燃氣供應業以及製造業要課呢?2.5萬噸那你現在一般費率是1公噸多少錢?300塊是以300塊那你提出也就是符合減量指定目標的自主減量計畫者可以適用優惠嗎?是嗎?對對對可以適用優惠有兩個階段A、B兩岸嗎?A、B兩岸對不對?\n\n02:49.102 --> 03:18.112\n在這樣的情況之下目前經濟部仍就認為是有困難的那政府是一體的必須要好好的去檢討那在這樣的一個情況之下本席要告訴你也就是高碳洩漏事業的單位在碳費公司當中最初可以想排放係數的一個折扣對不對這是全球各個國家都朝這個方向那請問你何時可以拍板\n\n03:18.812 --> 03:22.194\n高碳洩漏的這個項目,何時可以排版?\n\n03:40.366 --> 03:53.474\n我們現在在等那個主計處把產業關聯表11月要公告那因為它會是我們計算高碳洩漏風險的一個很重要的資料11月下個月主計處會出來那你們預計什麼時候會我們會跟經濟部就這個資料再去做溝通那預計什麼時候會公告因為你們一定有一個指標啊譬如說\n\n04:05.190 --> 04:16.482\n這個鋼鐵製電業有沒有報告在裡面?有沒有?國際上現在高碳洩漏風險經濟部有點頭鋼鐵跟水泥是各國都普遍認定是有高碳洩漏所以換句話說11月主計單會出來你們預計什麼時候可以宣布?\n\n04:22.148 --> 04:37.786\n我們應該希望明年的上半年可以有把那個認定的準則做一個公告時間要加快你們經濟部跟環境部在這裡因為產業很緊張明年你現在說的是明年的上半年時間要加快\n\n04:38.967 --> 04:53.678\n第一個時間要加快不要拖在明年中了好不好讓業者趕快能夠應對好不好這第一個第二個碳費開徵你的碳費藍圖你什麼時候要公佈要明確化來請教你看了這個圖第5次的會議審議會議當中你2026年到2030年你在這邊有說那你什麼時候要公佈你的碳費藍圖\n\n05:07.057 --> 05:22.139\n這個是每兩年有碳費審議委員會會討論一次你告訴我你什麼時候要公佈這個事實上每兩年就要檢討一次它的成效你告訴我你近期什麼時候要公佈你連公佈都沒有你還講兩年之後的事情\n\n05:23.444 --> 05:27.828\n報告委員其實這個委員都討論到最後一個階段2030年可能是1200到1800這個當中是不是一個協力的路徑協力的路徑到底你是不是承載你的2026年到2030年從300漲到1800噸這個是跟國際接軌的一個數字我請問\n\n05:44.881 --> 06:00.635\n我們政府是不是如此你要明確地告訴民眾因為我們必須要以價自量這個概念從根源以價自量這個非常的重要如果你沒有給人家公佈我現在300我可以吸收\n\n06:01.756 --> 06:23.028\n但是我如果到...我就不減碳我如果到1800我吸收不了我做價給消費者這怎麼辦這不是政府應該要做的所以我具體說明具體說明第一個也就是說你什麼時候可以讓碳費的藍圖明確化請你告訴我這一點非常的重要請告訴我\n\n06:23.448 --> 06:42.857\n關委員這個其實這種制度不見得是一個國際上最好的制度所以我們承諾在4年內會推動總量管制的排放交易所以我給你功課因為時間的關係我給你功課請你要儘快你現在沒有要公佈碳費藍圖你沒有我請你要公佈我請你要公佈\n\n06:44.718 --> 07:05.376\n上路不公布人家怎麼預定怎麼應對呢所以這個就是民間非常的憂心那拜託拜託碳費藍圖你一定要去公布我這個功課給你好不好這個功課一定要給你不是先上路再講沒有那回事的那未來產業要怎麼應對很重要所以最後一個功課給你\n\n07:07.718 --> 07:33.293\n也就是我們台中中火市世界最高的碳排這個電廠而且我們台中也是製造業精密業發展最重要的重鎮也是都市企業排碳屬全國第三名我們的碳費是專款專用我要拜託部長在這邊你們在分配的時候一定要對台中一個公平的分配我們是全世界曾經剛剛我說過的這樣的一個背景\n\n07:34.053 --> 07:41.448\n我們付出那麼多一定要好好的讓我們有更多的補助額專案的來作為我們檢探可以嗎\n\n07:44.416 --> 08:04.514\n這個我們碳費審議會會來考量這個事情你一定要考量喔我一定會追蹤好不好那以上剛剛所說的拜託尤其是我們的碳費藍圖一定要公佈全世界沒有一個國家說上了再講這個是不負責任的一個態度嘛好不好一定要去將碳費藍圖要公佈給社會大眾瞭解好不好謝謝好謝謝楊瓊瓔委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":3.49,"end":6.651,"text":"謝謝主席 楊瓊瓔發言 邀請部長請彭部長楊委員好部長好 今天我們討論這個碳費開徵碳費開徵你們跟經濟部你們跟經濟部兩個 那請經濟部也上來你們兩個當說碳費開徵經濟部稱"},{"start":30.19,"end":50.003,"text":"這一個遺憾那現在你們協商的進度到底怎麼回 怎麼呢來 部長你先說吧委員我們跟經濟部我說說很好大家可能又不滿意阿說不好大家又見縫插針不見縫插針你就講實質的問題實質的面向因為經濟部遺憾怎麼會很好呢你們兩個是風馬牛不相對的阿在這個議題上面你們怎麼樣去把它融合在一起"},{"start":60.393,"end":80.328,"text":"這個其實我們是相互尊重他們的意見啦相互尊重,當他申表遺憾,你的看法呢?但是這個是碳費審議委員會共同的決議啦共同的決議,碳費審議會定的這個價錢請教,針對本席的提問當碳費開徵經濟部表遺憾,你環境部部長你的看法呢?"},{"start":81.607,"end":96.027,"text":"當然我們會希望說未來也多聽他們的意見,共同來聽產業的意見,其實我也聽了很多產業的意見。那經濟部,陳表宜和他繼續跟你溝通你現在的看法呢?"},{"start":97.128,"end":99.55,"text":"你現在的心態呢?你要不要再給環境部建議?"},{"start":118.423,"end":121.466,"text":"收費的對象是直接跟使用電力間接溫室氣體排放要達到多少以上的電力業"},{"start":143.467,"end":152.212,"text":"這個燃氣供應業以及製造業要課呢?2.5萬噸那你現在一般費率是1公噸多少錢?300塊是以300塊那你提出也就是符合減量指定目標的自主減量計畫者可以適用優惠嗎?是嗎?對對對可以適用優惠有兩個階段A、B兩岸嗎?A、B兩岸對不對?"},{"start":169.102,"end":198.112,"text":"在這樣的情況之下目前經濟部仍就認為是有困難的那政府是一體的必須要好好的去檢討那在這樣的一個情況之下本席要告訴你也就是高碳洩漏事業的單位在碳費公司當中最初可以想排放係數的一個折扣對不對這是全球各個國家都朝這個方向那請問你何時可以拍板"},{"start":198.812,"end":202.194,"text":"高碳洩漏的這個項目,何時可以排版?"},{"start":220.366,"end":233.474,"text":"我們現在在等那個主計處把產業關聯表11月要公告那因為它會是我們計算高碳洩漏風險的一個很重要的資料11月下個月主計處會出來那你們預計什麼時候會我們會跟經濟部就這個資料再去做溝通那預計什麼時候會公告因為你們一定有一個指標啊譬如說"},{"start":245.19,"end":256.482,"text":"這個鋼鐵製電業有沒有報告在裡面?有沒有?國際上現在高碳洩漏風險 經濟部有點頭鋼鐵跟水泥是各國都普遍認定是有高碳洩漏所以換句話說11月主計單會出來你們預計什麼時候可以宣布?"},{"start":262.148,"end":277.786,"text":"我們應該希望明年的上半年可以有把那個認定的準則做一個公告時間要加快你們經濟部跟環境部在這裡因為產業很緊張明年你現在說的是明年的上半年時間要加快"},{"start":278.967,"end":293.678,"text":"第一個時間要加快不要拖在明年中了好不好讓業者趕快能夠應對好不好這第一個第二個碳費開徵你的碳費藍圖你什麼時候要公佈要明確化來請教你看了這個圖第5次的會議審議會議當中你2026年到2030年你在這邊有說那你什麼時候要公佈你的碳費藍圖"},{"start":307.057,"end":322.139,"text":"這個是每兩年有碳費審議委員會會討論一次你告訴我你什麼時候要公佈這個事實上每兩年就要檢討一次它的成效你告訴我你近期什麼時候要公佈你連公佈都沒有你還講兩年之後的事情"},{"start":323.444,"end":327.828,"text":"報告委員其實這個委員都討論到最後一個階段2030年可能是1200到1800這個當中是不是一個協力的路徑協力的路徑到底你是不是承載你的2026年到2030年從300漲到1800噸這個是跟國際接軌的一個數字我請問"},{"start":344.881,"end":360.635,"text":"我們政府是不是如此你要明確地告訴民眾因為我們必須要以價自量這個概念從根源以價自量這個非常的重要如果你沒有給人家公佈我現在300我可以吸收"},{"start":361.756,"end":383.028,"text":"但是我如果到...我就不減碳我如果到1800我吸收不了我做價給消費者這怎麼辦這不是政府應該要做的所以我具體說明具體說明第一個也就是說你什麼時候可以讓碳費的藍圖明確化請你告訴我這一點非常的重要請告訴我"},{"start":383.448,"end":402.857,"text":"關委員這個其實這種制度不見得是一個國際上最好的制度所以我們承諾在4年內會推動總量管制的排放交易所以我給你功課因為時間的關係我給你功課請你要儘快你現在沒有要公佈碳費藍圖你沒有我請你要公佈我請你要公佈"},{"start":404.718,"end":425.376,"text":"上路不公布人家怎麼預定怎麼應對呢所以這個就是民間非常的憂心那拜託拜託碳費藍圖你一定要去公布我這個功課給你好不好這個功課一定要給你不是先上路再講沒有那回事的那未來產業要怎麼應對很重要所以最後一個功課給你"},{"start":427.718,"end":453.293,"text":"也就是我們台中中火市世界最高的碳排這個電廠而且我們台中也是製造業精密業發展最重要的重鎮也是都市企業排碳屬全國第三名我們的碳費是專款專用我要拜託部長在這邊你們在分配的時候一定要對台中一個公平的分配我們是全世界曾經剛剛我說過的這樣的一個背景"},{"start":454.053,"end":461.448,"text":"我們付出那麼多一定要好好的讓我們有更多的補助額專案的來作為我們檢探可以嗎"},{"start":464.416,"end":484.514,"text":"這個我們碳費審議會會來考量這個事情你一定要考量喔我一定會追蹤好不好那以上剛剛所說的拜託尤其是我們的碳費藍圖一定要公佈全世界沒有一個國家說上了再講這個是不負責任的一個態度嘛好不好一定要去將碳費藍圖要公佈給社會大眾瞭解好不好謝謝好謝謝楊瓊瓔委員"}]}}},"meet":{"sessionPeriod":2,"sessionTimes":3,"tmpMeeting":null,"committees":[26],"term":11,"id":"委員會-11-2-26-3","title":"第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第3次全體委員會議","type":"委員會"},"會議時間":"2024-10-14T09:00:00+08:00","委員發言時間":"12:19:09 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