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00:02:03,060\n你說6個月的空窗嗎?就表示他竟然已經使用半年以上就表示他有照顧需求那家屬要怎麼來他本來就有啊他本來就有我是指他就是有這個需求他們就是需要巴士量表我是說他如果我們把他來放寬的話那比如那如果這些當事人他們去醫院定期都要回診那眼前的空窗期在家屬發現他們有異眾的時候又需要上班的話那這些家人怎麼\n\n6\n00:02:03,900 --> 00:02:25,565\n是,所以我們也推了擴大喘息還有包括我們現在我就是要推那個多元陪伴服務方案就是希望能夠cover這種有短期照顧需求的就是我們跟NGO合作然後讓NGO跟六職仲介合作那麼我們聘移工\n\n7\n00:02:28,826 --> 00:02:28,866\n邱若華\n\n8\n00:02:47,478 --> 00:03:15,645\n不明確的裁員那第二是高齡者超過90%都跟子女同住那所以高齡者的狀況他們的情形他們的子女最知道那當高齡者他們出現退化的問題的時候那子女只能先在他們申請政府的支援之前他們優先想到的就是來申請看護那子女他們才能夠順利出門上班可是那這邊請問部長一個問題喔薪水跟台籍的看護他們的落差大概是多大台籍的看護跟外籍\n\n9\n00:03:17,207 --> 00:03:22,399\n當然是差距是相當大了。多大?差距相當大?大概是多大?部長瞭解嗎?\n\n10\n00:03:25,049 --> 00:03:46,183\n你現在當然可能有到一半的差距就本席的了解外籍的看護是兩萬多塊一個月那我們台籍的看護一個月可能要五六萬塊所以這差距非常大那部長那台籍看護一天的薪水行情是臺幣2800多元那是很多上班族都是不搬不起的金額\n\n11\n00:03:47,823 --> 00:04:14,616\n護士長者他們要去上班那長者在家的時候可能會有一些狀況比如說他們忘記服藥或是跌倒還是煮飯忘記關火或是出門的時候因為認知的問題還是他們肌力退化那導致出車禍或在路上跌倒然後沒有旁邊沒有人照顧那部長你有看到他們這些家庭的問題嗎是是是所以我才要推那個多元陪伴服務方案是那是不是放寬巴士量表我們來修法的話會比較快一點\n\n12\n00:04:15,416 --> 00:04:35,763\n我們也會擴大多元免貧就是我們比較擔心用這個年齡限來劃會變成有需要跟沒需要的全部都會申請那會造成現在的缺工抗護工的缺工的狀態會更嚴峻主要是有這個負率\n\n13\n00:04:36,984 --> 00:04:49,804\n會造成他們會挑工作那麼你會更難照顧對就是說你那個照顧會更緊繃啦那個照顧的所以這個恐怕沒有辦法真的解決這個照顧的問題\n\n14\n00:04:51,687 --> 00:04:55,312\n市場勞動力不足,除了勞動力不足之外,人口高齡化對於看護的需求是增加的。我們必須要對這件事解決人力的問題。\n\n15\n00:05:07,949 --> 00:05:35,159\n對所以我們現在也在對這一個我就說為什麼要推多元陪伴服務方案就是這樣子希望能夠把移工也進度照顧領域這個部分能夠來把它用國家的力量把它建置起來這樣子那部長那本席還是希望您回去可以和就是我們勞動部再討論一套就是巴士表演表的政策那根據本席今天向您提出的目前很多家庭的需求是是是當然謝謝主席\n\n16\n00:05:37,667 --> 00:05:37,848\n邱若華議員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n9326\t18569\t謝謝主席主席有請我們勞動部部長有請何部長委員好部長好先請教部長一個問題請問我國和社會邁入超高齡社會就2022\n24369\t24649\t目前進度為何?\n38375\t53380\t委員我們當然80歲以上免巴氏量表這是一個修這是我們在黨委員的修法案然後我們比較不贊成用一個80歲這樣的線來劃分免巴氏量表我們現在用擴大多元免貧\n55541\t67991\t來這樣的措施來處理所以我們現在其實所謂的擴大多元免貧已經有包括第一個使用長照服務6個月以上是長照服務2.0半年以上對就可以免貧了要針對這個2.0長照2.0這邊提到方官看護申請只要連續使用長照2.0半年以上嗎\n79360\t95230\t對﹗對﹗\n95860\t123060\t你說6個月的空窗嗎?就表示他竟然已經使用半年以上就表示他有照顧需求那家屬要怎麼來他本來就有啊他本來就有我是指他就是有這個需求他們就是需要巴士量表我是說他如果我們把他來放寬的話那比如那如果這些當事人他們去醫院定期都要回診那眼前的空窗期在家屬發現他們有異眾的時候又需要上班的話那這些家人怎麼\n123900\t145565\t是,所以我們也推了擴大喘息還有包括我們現在我就是要推那個多元陪伴服務方案就是希望能夠cover這種有短期照顧需求的就是我們跟NGO合作然後讓NGO跟六職仲介合作那麼我們聘移工\n148826\t148866\t邱若華\n167478\t195645\t不明確的裁員那第二是高齡者超過90%都跟子女同住那所以高齡者的狀況他們的情形他們的子女最知道那當高齡者他們出現退化的問題的時候那子女只能先在他們申請政府的支援之前他們優先想到的就是來申請看護那子女他們才能夠順利出門上班可是那這邊請問部長一個問題喔薪水跟台籍的看護他們的落差大概是多大台籍的看護跟外籍\n197207\t202399\t當然是差距是相當大了。多大?差距相當大?大概是多大?部長瞭解嗎?\n205049\t226183\t你現在當然可能有到一半的差距就本席的了解外籍的看護是兩萬多塊一個月那我們台籍的看護一個月可能要五六萬塊所以這差距非常大那部長那台籍看護一天的薪水行情是臺幣2800多元那是很多上班族都是不搬不起的金額\n227823\t254616\t護士長者他們要去上班那長者在家的時候可能會有一些狀況比如說他們忘記服藥或是跌倒還是煮飯忘記關火或是出門的時候因為認知的問題還是他們肌力退化那導致出車禍或在路上跌倒然後沒有旁邊沒有人照顧那部長你有看到他們這些家庭的問題嗎是是是所以我才要推那個多元陪伴服務方案是那是不是放寬巴士量表我們來修法的話會比較快一點\n255416\t275763\t我們也會擴大多元免貧就是我們比較擔心用這個年齡限來劃會變成有需要跟沒需要的全部都會申請那會造成現在的缺工抗護工的缺工的狀態會更嚴峻主要是有這個負率\n276984\t289804\t會造成他們會挑工作那麼你會更難照顧對就是說你那個照顧會更緊繃啦那個照顧的所以這個恐怕沒有辦法真的解決這個照顧的問題\n291687\t295312\t市場勞動力不足,除了勞動力不足之外,人口高齡化對於看護的需求是增加的。我們必須要對這件事解決人力的問題。\n307949\t335159\t對所以我們現在也在對這一個我就說為什麼要推多元陪伴服務方案就是這樣子希望能夠把移工也進度照顧領域這個部分能夠來把它用國家的力量把它建置起來這樣子那部長那本席還是希望您回去可以和就是我們勞動部再討論一套就是巴士表演表的政策那根據本席今天向您提出的目前很多家庭的需求是是是當然謝謝主席\n337667\t337848\t邱若華議員\n","txt":"謝謝主席主席有請我們勞動部部長有請何部長委員好部長好先請教部長一個問題請問我國和社會邁入超高齡社會就2022\n目前進度為何?\n委員我們當然80歲以上免巴氏量表這是一個修這是我們在黨委員的修法案然後我們比較不贊成用一個80歲這樣的線來劃分免巴氏量表我們現在用擴大多元免貧\n來這樣的措施來處理所以我們現在其實所謂的擴大多元免貧已經有包括第一個使用長照服務6個月以上是長照服務2.0半年以上對就可以免貧了要針對這個2.0長照2.0這邊提到方官看護申請只要連續使用長照2.0半年以上嗎\n對﹗對﹗\n你說6個月的空窗嗎?就表示他竟然已經使用半年以上就表示他有照顧需求那家屬要怎麼來他本來就有啊他本來就有我是指他就是有這個需求他們就是需要巴士量表我是說他如果我們把他來放寬的話那比如那如果這些當事人他們去醫院定期都要回診那眼前的空窗期在家屬發現他們有異眾的時候又需要上班的話那這些家人怎麼\n是,所以我們也推了擴大喘息還有包括我們現在我就是要推那個多元陪伴服務方案就是希望能夠cover這種有短期照顧需求的就是我們跟NGO合作然後讓NGO跟六職仲介合作那麼我們聘移工\n邱若華\n不明確的裁員那第二是高齡者超過90%都跟子女同住那所以高齡者的狀況他們的情形他們的子女最知道那當高齡者他們出現退化的問題的時候那子女只能先在他們申請政府的支援之前他們優先想到的就是來申請看護那子女他們才能夠順利出門上班可是那這邊請問部長一個問題喔薪水跟台籍的看護他們的落差大概是多大台籍的看護跟外籍\n當然是差距是相當大了。多大?差距相當大?大概是多大?部長瞭解嗎?\n你現在當然可能有到一半的差距就本席的了解外籍的看護是兩萬多塊一個月那我們台籍的看護一個月可能要五六萬塊所以這差距非常大那部長那台籍看護一天的薪水行情是臺幣2800多元那是很多上班族都是不搬不起的金額\n護士長者他們要去上班那長者在家的時候可能會有一些狀況比如說他們忘記服藥或是跌倒還是煮飯忘記關火或是出門的時候因為認知的問題還是他們肌力退化那導致出車禍或在路上跌倒然後沒有旁邊沒有人照顧那部長你有看到他們這些家庭的問題嗎是是是所以我才要推那個多元陪伴服務方案是那是不是放寬巴士量表我們來修法的話會比較快一點\n我們也會擴大多元免貧就是我們比較擔心用這個年齡限來劃會變成有需要跟沒需要的全部都會申請那會造成現在的缺工抗護工的缺工的狀態會更嚴峻主要是有這個負率\n會造成他們會挑工作那麼你會更難照顧對就是說你那個照顧會更緊繃啦那個照顧的所以這個恐怕沒有辦法真的解決這個照顧的問題\n市場勞動力不足,除了勞動力不足之外,人口高齡化對於看護的需求是增加的。我們必須要對這件事解決人力的問題。\n對所以我們現在也在對這一個我就說為什麼要推多元陪伴服務方案就是這樣子希望能夠把移工也進度照顧領域這個部分能夠來把它用國家的力量把它建置起來這樣子那部長那本席還是希望您回去可以和就是我們勞動部再討論一套就是巴士表演表的政策那根據本席今天向您提出的目前很多家庭的需求是是是當然謝謝主席\n邱若華議員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:09.326 --> 00:18.569\n謝謝主席主席有請我們勞動部部長有請何部長委員好部長好先請教部長一個問題請問我國和社會邁入超高齡社會就2022\n\n00:24.369 --> 00:24.649\n目前進度為何?\n\n00:38.375 --> 00:53.380\n委員我們當然80歲以上免巴氏量表這是一個修這是我們在黨委員的修法案然後我們比較不贊成用一個80歲這樣的線來劃分免巴氏量表我們現在用擴大多元免貧\n\n00:55.541 --> 01:07.991\n來這樣的措施來處理所以我們現在其實所謂的擴大多元免貧已經有包括第一個使用長照服務6個月以上是長照服務2.0半年以上對就可以免貧了要針對這個2.0長照2.0這邊提到方官看護申請只要連續使用長照2.0半年以上嗎\n\n01:35.860 --> 02:03.060\n你說6個月的空窗嗎?就表示他竟然已經使用半年以上就表示他有照顧需求那家屬要怎麼來他本來就有啊他本來就有我是指他就是有這個需求他們就是需要巴士量表我是說他如果我們把他來放寬的話那比如那如果這些當事人他們去醫院定期都要回診那眼前的空窗期在家屬發現他們有異眾的時候又需要上班的話那這些家人怎麼\n\n02:03.900 --> 02:25.565\n是,所以我們也推了擴大喘息還有包括我們現在我就是要推那個多元陪伴服務方案就是希望能夠cover這種有短期照顧需求的就是我們跟NGO合作然後讓NGO跟六職仲介合作那麼我們聘移工\n\n02:28.826 --> 02:28.866\n邱若華\n\n02:47.478 --> 03:15.645\n不明確的裁員那第二是高齡者超過90%都跟子女同住那所以高齡者的狀況他們的情形他們的子女最知道那當高齡者他們出現退化的問題的時候那子女只能先在他們申請政府的支援之前他們優先想到的就是來申請看護那子女他們才能夠順利出門上班可是那這邊請問部長一個問題喔薪水跟台籍的看護他們的落差大概是多大台籍的看護跟外籍\n\n03:17.207 --> 03:22.399\n當然是差距是相當大了。多大?差距相當大?大概是多大?部長瞭解嗎?\n\n03:25.049 --> 03:46.183\n你現在當然可能有到一半的差距就本席的了解外籍的看護是兩萬多塊一個月那我們台籍的看護一個月可能要五六萬塊所以這差距非常大那部長那台籍看護一天的薪水行情是臺幣2800多元那是很多上班族都是不搬不起的金額\n\n03:47.823 --> 04:14.616\n護士長者他們要去上班那長者在家的時候可能會有一些狀況比如說他們忘記服藥或是跌倒還是煮飯忘記關火或是出門的時候因為認知的問題還是他們肌力退化那導致出車禍或在路上跌倒然後沒有旁邊沒有人照顧那部長你有看到他們這些家庭的問題嗎是是是所以我才要推那個多元陪伴服務方案是那是不是放寬巴士量表我們來修法的話會比較快一點\n\n04:15.416 --> 04:35.763\n我們也會擴大多元免貧就是我們比較擔心用這個年齡限來劃會變成有需要跟沒需要的全部都會申請那會造成現在的缺工抗護工的缺工的狀態會更嚴峻主要是有這個負率\n\n04:36.984 --> 04:49.804\n會造成他們會挑工作那麼你會更難照顧對就是說你那個照顧會更緊繃啦那個照顧的所以這個恐怕沒有辦法真的解決這個照顧的問題\n\n04:51.687 --> 04:55.312\n市場勞動力不足,除了勞動力不足之外,人口高齡化對於看護的需求是增加的。我們必須要對這件事解決人力的問題。\n\n05:07.949 --> 05:35.159\n對所以我們現在也在對這一個我就說為什麼要推多元陪伴服務方案就是這樣子希望能夠把移工也進度照顧領域這個部分能夠來把它用國家的力量把它建置起來這樣子那部長那本席還是希望您回去可以和就是我們勞動部再討論一套就是巴士表演表的政策那根據本席今天向您提出的目前很多家庭的需求是是是當然謝謝主席\n\n05:37.667 --> 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12:36:14","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。\n【10月16日及17日二天一次會】）","id":155595,"gazette":{"lineno":1197,"blocks":[["邱委員若華：（12時30分）謝謝主席，有請勞動部部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["何部長佩珊：委員好。"],["邱委員若華：部長好。先請教部長一個問題，請問我國何時會邁入超高齡社會？"],["何部長佩珊：明年。"],["邱委員若華：在2025年，我國會邁入超高齡社會。"],["何部長佩珊：對。"],["邱委員若華：本席在上個會期有提到80歲以上的長者免巴氏量表，請問後續你們對這個議題討論到什麼地方？目前進度為何？"],["何部長佩珊：80歲以上免巴氏量表是在野黨委員的修法案，我們比較不贊成用80歲這樣的線來劃分免巴氏量表，我們現在用擴大多元免評的措施來處理。所謂擴大多元免評已經有包括第一個使用長照服務6個月以上，就是長照服務2.0半年以上就可以免評了。"],["邱委員若華：針對2.0長照，有提到放寬看護申請只要連續使用長照2.0半年以上，或是有輕度失智診斷或是特定中重度身心障礙就可以免巴氏量表，可是使用長照2.0半年以上就表示他有照護需求，這半年的空窗期，請問家屬要怎麼處理？"],["何部長佩珊：委員是說6個月的空窗期嗎？"],["邱委員若華：他已經使用半年以上，也就是表示他有照護需求，那家屬要如何處理？"],["何部長佩珊：他本來就有啊！"],["邱委員若華：我是指他就是有這個需求，他們就是需要巴氏量表。事實上，這些當事人都要去醫院定期回診，那眼前的空窗期，如果家屬發現他們有異狀而自己又需要上班，那要怎麼辦？"],["何部長佩珊：是，所以我們也推了擴大喘息，包括我們現在要推多元陪伴服務方案，就是希望能夠cover這種有短期照顧需求的，就是我們跟NGO合作，讓NGO眾體跟仲介合作，讓他們聘移工。"],["邱委員若華：移工是適用勞基法？"],["何部長佩珊：他可以進入家庭裡面，比如手術後或者是臨時有陪伴的服務需求，就是短期的。"],["邱委員若華：因為我國在明年就要邁入超高齡社會，衛福部在因應對策指出兩點，其中一個是長照資源的資金應仰賴明確的財源，第二是高齡者超過90%都跟子女同住，所以子女最知道高齡者的狀況情形，當高齡者出現退化問題的時候，子女在申請政府資源之前，他們優先想到的就是申請看護，子女才能夠順利出門上班。可是我請問部長一個問題，臺籍看護跟外籍看護的薪水差距是多大？"],["何部長佩珊：當然差距是相當大。"],["邱委員若華：多大？部長了解嗎？"],["何部長佩珊：以現在可能應該有到一半的差距。"],["邱委員若華：就本席的了解，外籍的看護是兩萬多塊一個月，臺籍的看護一個月可能要五、六萬塊，所以這差距非常大。部長，臺籍看護一天的薪水行情是臺幣兩千八百多元，那是很多上班族都負擔不起的金額。或是孩子要去上班，長者在家的時候可能會有一些狀況，比如他們忘記服藥或是跌倒，還是煮飯忘記關火，或是出門的時候因為認知的問題，還是他們記憶力退化，導致出車禍或是在路上跌倒旁邊沒有人照顧，部長有看到這些家庭的問題嗎？"],["何部長佩珊：是，所以我才要推多元陪伴服務方案。"],["邱委員若華：是不是修法放寬巴氏量表會比較快一點？"],["何部長佩珊：我們也會擴大多元免評。委員，我們比較擔心用年齡線來劃分，會變成有需要跟沒需要的全部都會申請，會造成現在看護工缺工的狀態會更嚴峻，主要是有這個顧慮，也會造成他們可能會挑工作，那麼會更難照顧，就是說照顧會更緊繃，所以恐怕沒有辦法真的解決照顧的問題。"],["邱委員若華：部長，正本清源來說，就是因為看護的市場勞動力不足，除了勞動力不足之外，人口高齡化對看護的需求是增加的，所以我們必須要對症下藥，解決人力的問題。"],["何部長佩珊：對，所以我說要推多元陪伴服務方案也就是這樣子，希望讓移工也進入照顧領域的部分，用國家的力量把它建置起來。"],["邱委員若華：部長，本席還是希望您可以和勞動部再討論巴氏量表的政策，根據本席今天向您提出目前很多家庭的需求。"],["何部長佩珊：是，當然，謝謝委員。"],["邱委員若華：謝謝部長，謝謝主席。"],["主席：謝謝邱若華委員。","接下來請牛煦庭委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":362,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-26-4","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","王育敏","邱鎮軍","廖偉翔","蘇清泉","涂權吉","王正旭","林淑芬","王鴻薇","羅廷瑋","陳瑩","楊瓊瓔","洪孟楷","吳宗憲","林國成","羅智強","吳春城","邱若華","牛煦庭","蔡易餘","葉元之","楊曜","劉建國","麥玉珍"],"page_start":265,"meetingDate":["2024-10-16"],"gazette_id":"1138601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1138601_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1138601_00005"}}}