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00:01:06,381\n去年的8月金裝國家峰會就傳出南非不斷施壓我國代表處要簽管之後不斷以聯大第2758號決議為理由的施壓這就是有跡可循為什麼因為有些國家的\n\n4\n00:01:07,996 --> 00:01:33,550\n議會及政要表態聯合國大會2758號決議無赦台灣其實這種宣誓在國際上根本無實質的影響力但是結果我們執政黨的政治人物曾其在這種無實質的一個表態中在國內大內宣所以本席特別提醒我們的部長一個建議\n\n5\n00:01:34,651 --> 00:01:56,828\n外交部是一個現實也是國際在政治上的一個現實那我們就以南非的為例子既然南非以275號決議為由要求我國簽管外交部也因應積極的運作向表態應該要表態2758號決議無涉台灣的國家要求讓我國駐館升級以做到\n\n6\n00:02:05,214 --> 00:02:32,270\n實施對我們的友好這是第一點提示我們的部長因為這個是有機可行從金磚的會議到我們2758號的這樣的一個國內的大內宣那這些政治人物影響到你們外交部的運作第二個這位特別也講到牽管的問題\n\n7\n00:02:34,056 --> 00:02:48,551\n他是在以我們南非行政首都普洱托爾利亞這是一個行政區的首都有三個首都這個是行政區的首都那他是非常的強硬的\n\n8\n00:02:49,454 --> 00:03:04,203\n要求10月30號簽管而且附帶沒有協商的一定所以部長這時候已經提示你應該有政治敏感簽管\n\n9\n00:03:05,023 --> 00:03:21,303\n如果今天我們還按照他是一個法制的國家最後我們要用他以交涉的法制在跟他們做這樣的議題的話如果他們是外界的力量影響到我們的外管\n\n10\n00:03:22,665 --> 00:03:46,336\n我們的這個代表處要強硬做連得談都沒有得談的時候我們還到哪裡簽簽到我們的這個代表處應該要積極的再進行溝通有沒有緩和的一定還是到另外一個首都因為他有三個首都嘛但是今天如果他連談都沒有談的話\n\n11\n00:03:47,964 --> 00:04:13,272\n到時候我們連機會談都沒有機會請問一下到時候我們顏面無光部長你來說明一下好不好我們有應變小組也做好因應的對策我們當然堅守立場距離力爭基於對等的原則我們當然也做好應變的計畫我們外交部也已經請住處正式復函匪方\n\n12\n00:04:15,373 --> 00:04:36,541\n政府基於1997年雙邊協議規定跟精神我們拒絕匪方無理的要求不配合將住處搬遷到這個其他地方但是我們當然知道這個外交各種發展包括等等他們是不是如果他們是遵守法治的政府那當然我們這些這個\n\n13\n00:04:39,122 --> 00:05:07,496\n希望說他們跟我們能夠來協商雙邊關係那如果他們採取一些不理性的行為當然我要確保住處同仁安全還有服務僑民的功能能夠持續這個都是我們綜合考量所以剛剛委員說沒有錯他有所謂三個首都那但是這不管他幾個首都啦他對我們有這種不合理的這種要求我們先據理力爭\n\n14\n00:05:08,880 --> 00:05:29,220\n我們也逐漸有發現這個事情經過報導之後已經各界的關注包括他們執政聯盟裡面的政黨包括有重大影響力的媒體以及國際各方面對這個事情的關注所以我們會\n\n15\n00:05:32,797 --> 00:05:55,548\n所以部長有稀可行這邊也應該也有一個中非合作的論壇有影響到這個我們跟南非的關係所以這個就是我們應該要趕快因應我相信你的智慧\n\n16\n00:05:56,849 --> 00:06:22,224\n但是在國際的壓力裡面已經造成我們國內的外交處處都是一個非常困境的但是我們非常很珍惜現有的外交如何維護我們外交的一個邦交的權利跟我們邦交的友好的關係我想你有這個智慧我想我們一定要固守堅守\n\n17\n00:06:25,006 --> 00:06:49,760\n謝謝委員的支持確實國內不分黨派的支持政府捍衛我們國家的主權跟尊嚴當然另外我再請教部長我常提的就是上次你上任的時候我也提過在吳前部長也提過就是在有原民外交的這個部分當然這個\n\n18\n00:06:51,681 --> 00:07:12,109\n我們總統也好行政院長也好部長也好你們都有聽到了大家聽到我在這一次的提出就希望能夠原民外交目前我們的我們外交的困境也借用我們原民的外交在南島語系的這個國家裡面做一個\n\n19\n00:07:13,169 --> 00:07:13,569\n李卓人議員\n\n20\n00:07:33,750 --> 00:07:56,289\n是教會的牧師那當然我們在希望他能夠有具備了各有專業的領域這個專業領域就是希望他能夠在能擴大面向那對原住民人才的幾把可以領先兩位\n\n21\n00:07:59,111 --> 00:08:26,381\n第一對我們外交原住民的母語的這個部分第二跟實質上我們原住民的整個的議題他非常的了解而不是只有宗教的了解我想宗教當然是比較溫和在外交上比較溫和但是實際上會碰到一個政治問題的時候那如何他可以他可以單單勝任\n\n22\n00:08:27,381 --> 00:08:27,801\n主席\n\n23\n00:08:47,153 --> 00:09:00,166\n要傳輸到你這裡來你要實質的掌握這樣才會有助於我們人民外交這樣的一個任派無認所的這個職務的一個實際上的一個任務\n\n24\n00:09:03,780 --> 00:09:32,643\n感謝委員的指導確實這個我認為原住民外交是我們總和外交很重要的一部分那我在業務報告也有再次提到那除了無論所大使這個總統任命10名有兩名就五分之一是原住民的這個背景以外我們對原住民外交的推動我有要求我們外交部的同仁要跨部會要來做這個列管\n\n25\n00:09:33,463 --> 00:09:53,509\n我們這些不管是委員或我們外交部自己在推動的重大業務那事實上我們的邦交國裡面以這個太平洋地區就是很重要的都是跟我們有相關的南島語系的背景那事實上在像我們的一些友好國家像加拿大、澳大利亞或紐西蘭其實他們都很重視原住民的經濟社會的平權\n\n26\n00:09:55,430 --> 00:09:55,990\n主席主席主席\n\n27\n00:10:17,501 --> 00:10:35,031\n本席向這個部長再進一步的建議我國目前在南太平洋有三位大使一位代表根據駐外外交領事人員任用的條例大使及代表是可以做政務官任命的方式\n\n28\n00:10:36,331 --> 00:10:37,772\n有沒有可能?\n\n29\n00:10:52,611 --> 00:11:17,540\n我們來這是評估目前當然外交部有原住民背景的我們的同仁大概有10名我們當然至於說部外的人才我們也是密切的注意希望說能夠有優秀可以來代表我們國家能夠在我們的住處來服務\n\n30\n00:11:18,872 --> 00:11:40,704\n按照你們政務官的條例裡面也應該可以領選一個有認所的一個原住民的大使這是你要考量一下好不好因為實質上現在這樣拓展的話會有助於外交的事務以前有過就是這樣的一個斐濟我們派駐斐濟那另外一個是\n\n31\n00:11:42,265 --> 00:12:09,497\n我在簡短的有關於中東駐台代表哀告顯外交危機後來這樣的一個當然這是一個非營利組織的單位裡面經過內政部的登記但是他們是以在中東裡面就發生了這種狀況要不是你們外交部行文給警戒要不然的話他沒有豁免錢\n\n32\n00:12:10,957 --> 00:12:11,157\n所謂的把關是什麼?\n\n33\n00:12:37,869 --> 00:12:40,390\n主席再給我一分鐘那你來解釋一下好不好\n\n34\n00:12:56,260 --> 00:12:56,280\n什麼問題?\n\n35\n00:13:20,421 --> 00:13:21,761\n所以本席提醒部長還有我們市長\n\n36\n00:13:46,606 --> 00:14:11,999\n現在特別要謹慎要特別跟駐外的外交使節這一些提醒他們甚至非營利組織經過內政部同意而且登入在你們的外交裡面的入案的時候外面提醒他們因為現在我們處處都是危機如果一旦小事情就變成大事情國內就會大內宣\n\n37\n00:14:13,940 --> 00:14:15,261\n謝謝委員提醒,我們會密切注意\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n490\t13673\t有請我們林部長請林部長部長好委員好\n15272\t41189\t剛剛我們在這個地方我都有仔細的聽到都針對南非的議題那你說南非的議題要簽出我們的代表處要簽出這個非首都的一個地方那當然你說有機有機可循那這個有機可循我特別提出這個有機可循的脈絡在\n45768\t66381\t去年的8月金裝國家峰會就傳出南非不斷施壓我國代表處要簽管之後不斷以聯大第2758號決議為理由的施壓這就是有跡可循為什麼因為有些國家的\n67996\t93550\t議會及政要表態聯合國大會2758號決議無赦台灣其實這種宣誓在國際上根本無實質的影響力但是結果我們執政黨的政治人物曾其在這種無實質的一個表態中在國內大內宣所以本席特別提醒我們的部長一個建議\n94651\t116828\t外交部是一個現實也是國際在政治上的一個現實那我們就以南非的為例子既然南非以275號決議為由要求我國簽管外交部也因應積極的運作向表態應該要表態2758號決議無涉台灣的國家要求讓我國駐館升級以做到\n125214\t152270\t實施對我們的友好這是第一點提示我們的部長因為這個是有機可行從金磚的會議到我們2758號的這樣的一個國內的大內宣那這些政治人物影響到你們外交部的運作第二個這位特別也講到牽管的問題\n154056\t168551\t他是在以我們南非行政首都普洱托爾利亞這是一個行政區的首都有三個首都這個是行政區的首都那他是非常的強硬的\n169454\t184203\t要求10月30號簽管而且附帶沒有協商的一定所以部長這時候已經提示你應該有政治敏感簽管\n185023\t201303\t如果今天我們還按照他是一個法制的國家最後我們要用他以交涉的法制在跟他們做這樣的議題的話如果他們是外界的力量影響到我們的外管\n202665\t226336\t我們的這個代表處要強硬做連得談都沒有得談的時候我們還到哪裡簽簽到我們的這個代表處應該要積極的再進行溝通有沒有緩和的一定還是到另外一個首都因為他有三個首都嘛但是今天如果他連談都沒有談的話\n227964\t253272\t到時候我們連機會談都沒有機會請問一下到時候我們顏面無光部長你來說明一下好不好我們有應變小組也做好因應的對策我們當然堅守立場距離力爭基於對等的原則我們當然也做好應變的計畫我們外交部也已經請住處正式復函匪方\n255373\t276541\t政府基於1997年雙邊協議規定跟精神我們拒絕匪方無理的要求不配合將住處搬遷到這個其他地方但是我們當然知道這個外交各種發展包括等等他們是不是如果他們是遵守法治的政府那當然我們這些這個\n279122\t307496\t希望說他們跟我們能夠來協商雙邊關係那如果他們採取一些不理性的行為當然我要確保住處同仁安全還有服務僑民的功能能夠持續這個都是我們綜合考量所以剛剛委員說沒有錯他有所謂三個首都那但是這不管他幾個首都啦他對我們有這種不合理的這種要求我們先據理力爭\n308880\t329220\t我們也逐漸有發現這個事情經過報導之後已經各界的關注包括他們執政聯盟裡面的政黨包括有重大影響力的媒體以及國際各方面對這個事情的關注所以我們會\n332797\t355548\t所以部長有稀可行這邊也應該也有一個中非合作的論壇有影響到這個我們跟南非的關係所以這個就是我們應該要趕快因應我相信你的智慧\n356849\t382224\t但是在國際的壓力裡面已經造成我們國內的外交處處都是一個非常困境的但是我們非常很珍惜現有的外交如何維護我們外交的一個邦交的權利跟我們邦交的友好的關係我想你有這個智慧我想我們一定要固守堅守\n385006\t409760\t謝謝委員的支持確實國內不分黨派的支持政府捍衛我們國家的主權跟尊嚴當然另外我再請教部長我常提的就是上次你上任的時候我也提過在吳前部長也提過就是在有原民外交的這個部分當然這個\n411681\t432109\t我們總統也好行政院長也好部長也好你們都有聽到了大家聽到我在這一次的提出就希望能夠原民外交目前我們的我們外交的困境也借用我們原民的外交在南島語系的這個國家裡面做一個\n433169\t433569\t李卓人議員\n453750\t476289\t是教會的牧師那當然我們在希望他能夠有具備了各有專業的領域這個專業領域就是希望他能夠在能擴大面向那對原住民人才的幾把可以領先兩位\n479111\t506381\t第一對我們外交原住民的母語的這個部分第二跟實質上我們原住民的整個的議題他非常的了解而不是只有宗教的了解我想宗教當然是比較溫和在外交上比較溫和但是實際上會碰到一個政治問題的時候那如何他可以他可以單單勝任\n507381\t507801\t主席\n527153\t540166\t要傳輸到你這裡來你要實質的掌握這樣才會有助於我們人民外交這樣的一個任派無認所的這個職務的一個實際上的一個任務\n543780\t572643\t感謝委員的指導確實這個我認為原住民外交是我們總和外交很重要的一部分那我在業務報告也有再次提到那除了無論所大使這個總統任命10名有兩名就五分之一是原住民的這個背景以外我們對原住民外交的推動我有要求我們外交部的同仁要跨部會要來做這個列管\n573463\t593509\t我們這些不管是委員或我們外交部自己在推動的重大業務那事實上我們的邦交國裡面以這個太平洋地區就是很重要的都是跟我們有相關的南島語系的背景那事實上在像我們的一些友好國家像加拿大、澳大利亞或紐西蘭其實他們都很重視原住民的經濟社會的平權\n595430\t595990\t主席主席主席\n617501\t635031\t本席向這個部長再進一步的建議我國目前在南太平洋有三位大使一位代表根據駐外外交領事人員任用的條例大使及代表是可以做政務官任命的方式\n636331\t637772\t有沒有可能?\n652611\t677540\t我們來這是評估目前當然外交部有原住民背景的我們的同仁大概有10名我們當然至於說部外的人才我們也是密切的注意希望說能夠有優秀可以來代表我們國家能夠在我們的住處來服務\n678872\t700704\t按照你們政務官的條例裡面也應該可以領選一個有認所的一個原住民的大使這是你要考量一下好不好因為實質上現在這樣拓展的話會有助於外交的事務以前有過就是這樣的一個斐濟我們派駐斐濟那另外一個是\n702265\t729497\t我在簡短的有關於中東駐台代表哀告顯外交危機後來這樣的一個當然這是一個非營利組織的單位裡面經過內政部的登記但是他們是以在中東裡面就發生了這種狀況要不是你們外交部行文給警戒要不然的話他沒有豁免錢\n730957\t731157\t所謂的把關是什麼?\n757869\t760390\t主席再給我一分鐘那你來解釋一下好不好\n776260\t776280\t什麼問題?\n800421\t801761\t所以本席提醒部長還有我們市長\n826606\t851999\t現在特別要謹慎要特別跟駐外的外交使節這一些提醒他們甚至非營利組織經過內政部同意而且登入在你們的外交裡面的入案的時候外面提醒他們因為現在我們處處都是危機如果一旦小事情就變成大事情國內就會大內宣\n853940\t855261\t謝謝委員提醒,我們會密切注意\n","txt":"有請我們林部長請林部長部長好委員好\n剛剛我們在這個地方我都有仔細的聽到都針對南非的議題那你說南非的議題要簽出我們的代表處要簽出這個非首都的一個地方那當然你說有機有機可循那這個有機可循我特別提出這個有機可循的脈絡在\n去年的8月金裝國家峰會就傳出南非不斷施壓我國代表處要簽管之後不斷以聯大第2758號決議為理由的施壓這就是有跡可循為什麼因為有些國家的\n議會及政要表態聯合國大會2758號決議無赦台灣其實這種宣誓在國際上根本無實質的影響力但是結果我們執政黨的政治人物曾其在這種無實質的一個表態中在國內大內宣所以本席特別提醒我們的部長一個建議\n外交部是一個現實也是國際在政治上的一個現實那我們就以南非的為例子既然南非以275號決議為由要求我國簽管外交部也因應積極的運作向表態應該要表態2758號決議無涉台灣的國家要求讓我國駐館升級以做到\n實施對我們的友好這是第一點提示我們的部長因為這個是有機可行從金磚的會議到我們2758號的這樣的一個國內的大內宣那這些政治人物影響到你們外交部的運作第二個這位特別也講到牽管的問題\n他是在以我們南非行政首都普洱托爾利亞這是一個行政區的首都有三個首都這個是行政區的首都那他是非常的強硬的\n要求10月30號簽管而且附帶沒有協商的一定所以部長這時候已經提示你應該有政治敏感簽管\n如果今天我們還按照他是一個法制的國家最後我們要用他以交涉的法制在跟他們做這樣的議題的話如果他們是外界的力量影響到我們的外管\n我們的這個代表處要強硬做連得談都沒有得談的時候我們還到哪裡簽簽到我們的這個代表處應該要積極的再進行溝通有沒有緩和的一定還是到另外一個首都因為他有三個首都嘛但是今天如果他連談都沒有談的話\n到時候我們連機會談都沒有機會請問一下到時候我們顏面無光部長你來說明一下好不好我們有應變小組也做好因應的對策我們當然堅守立場距離力爭基於對等的原則我們當然也做好應變的計畫我們外交部也已經請住處正式復函匪方\n政府基於1997年雙邊協議規定跟精神我們拒絕匪方無理的要求不配合將住處搬遷到這個其他地方但是我們當然知道這個外交各種發展包括等等他們是不是如果他們是遵守法治的政府那當然我們這些這個\n希望說他們跟我們能夠來協商雙邊關係那如果他們採取一些不理性的行為當然我要確保住處同仁安全還有服務僑民的功能能夠持續這個都是我們綜合考量所以剛剛委員說沒有錯他有所謂三個首都那但是這不管他幾個首都啦他對我們有這種不合理的這種要求我們先據理力爭\n我們也逐漸有發現這個事情經過報導之後已經各界的關注包括他們執政聯盟裡面的政黨包括有重大影響力的媒體以及國際各方面對這個事情的關注所以我們會\n所以部長有稀可行這邊也應該也有一個中非合作的論壇有影響到這個我們跟南非的關係所以這個就是我們應該要趕快因應我相信你的智慧\n但是在國際的壓力裡面已經造成我們國內的外交處處都是一個非常困境的但是我們非常很珍惜現有的外交如何維護我們外交的一個邦交的權利跟我們邦交的友好的關係我想你有這個智慧我想我們一定要固守堅守\n謝謝委員的支持確實國內不分黨派的支持政府捍衛我們國家的主權跟尊嚴當然另外我再請教部長我常提的就是上次你上任的時候我也提過在吳前部長也提過就是在有原民外交的這個部分當然這個\n我們總統也好行政院長也好部長也好你們都有聽到了大家聽到我在這一次的提出就希望能夠原民外交目前我們的我們外交的困境也借用我們原民的外交在南島語系的這個國家裡面做一個\n李卓人議員\n是教會的牧師那當然我們在希望他能夠有具備了各有專業的領域這個專業領域就是希望他能夠在能擴大面向那對原住民人才的幾把可以領先兩位\n第一對我們外交原住民的母語的這個部分第二跟實質上我們原住民的整個的議題他非常的了解而不是只有宗教的了解我想宗教當然是比較溫和在外交上比較溫和但是實際上會碰到一個政治問題的時候那如何他可以他可以單單勝任\n主席\n要傳輸到你這裡來你要實質的掌握這樣才會有助於我們人民外交這樣的一個任派無認所的這個職務的一個實際上的一個任務\n感謝委員的指導確實這個我認為原住民外交是我們總和外交很重要的一部分那我在業務報告也有再次提到那除了無論所大使這個總統任命10名有兩名就五分之一是原住民的這個背景以外我們對原住民外交的推動我有要求我們外交部的同仁要跨部會要來做這個列管\n我們這些不管是委員或我們外交部自己在推動的重大業務那事實上我們的邦交國裡面以這個太平洋地區就是很重要的都是跟我們有相關的南島語系的背景那事實上在像我們的一些友好國家像加拿大、澳大利亞或紐西蘭其實他們都很重視原住民的經濟社會的平權\n主席主席主席\n本席向這個部長再進一步的建議我國目前在南太平洋有三位大使一位代表根據駐外外交領事人員任用的條例大使及代表是可以做政務官任命的方式\n有沒有可能?\n我們來這是評估目前當然外交部有原住民背景的我們的同仁大概有10名我們當然至於說部外的人才我們也是密切的注意希望說能夠有優秀可以來代表我們國家能夠在我們的住處來服務\n按照你們政務官的條例裡面也應該可以領選一個有認所的一個原住民的大使這是你要考量一下好不好因為實質上現在這樣拓展的話會有助於外交的事務以前有過就是這樣的一個斐濟我們派駐斐濟那另外一個是\n我在簡短的有關於中東駐台代表哀告顯外交危機後來這樣的一個當然這是一個非營利組織的單位裡面經過內政部的登記但是他們是以在中東裡面就發生了這種狀況要不是你們外交部行文給警戒要不然的話他沒有豁免錢\n所謂的把關是什麼?\n主席再給我一分鐘那你來解釋一下好不好\n什麼問題?\n所以本席提醒部長還有我們市長\n現在特別要謹慎要特別跟駐外的外交使節這一些提醒他們甚至非營利組織經過內政部同意而且登入在你們的外交裡面的入案的時候外面提醒他們因為現在我們處處都是危機如果一旦小事情就變成大事情國內就會大內宣\n謝謝委員提醒,我們會密切注意\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.490 --> 00:13.673\n有請我們林部長請林部長部長好委員好\n\n00:15.272 --> 00:41.189\n剛剛我們在這個地方我都有仔細的聽到都針對南非的議題那你說南非的議題要簽出我們的代表處要簽出這個非首都的一個地方那當然你說有機有機可循那這個有機可循我特別提出這個有機可循的脈絡在\n\n00:45.768 --> 01:06.381\n去年的8月金裝國家峰會就傳出南非不斷施壓我國代表處要簽管之後不斷以聯大第2758號決議為理由的施壓這就是有跡可循為什麼因為有些國家的\n\n01:07.996 --> 01:33.550\n議會及政要表態聯合國大會2758號決議無赦台灣其實這種宣誓在國際上根本無實質的影響力但是結果我們執政黨的政治人物曾其在這種無實質的一個表態中在國內大內宣所以本席特別提醒我們的部長一個建議\n\n01:34.651 --> 01:56.828\n外交部是一個現實也是國際在政治上的一個現實那我們就以南非的為例子既然南非以275號決議為由要求我國簽管外交部也因應積極的運作向表態應該要表態2758號決議無涉台灣的國家要求讓我國駐館升級以做到\n\n02:05.214 --> 02:32.270\n實施對我們的友好這是第一點提示我們的部長因為這個是有機可行從金磚的會議到我們2758號的這樣的一個國內的大內宣那這些政治人物影響到你們外交部的運作第二個這位特別也講到牽管的問題\n\n02:34.056 --> 02:48.551\n他是在以我們南非行政首都普洱托爾利亞這是一個行政區的首都有三個首都這個是行政區的首都那他是非常的強硬的\n\n02:49.454 --> 03:04.203\n要求10月30號簽管而且附帶沒有協商的一定所以部長這時候已經提示你應該有政治敏感簽管\n\n03:05.023 --> 03:21.303\n如果今天我們還按照他是一個法制的國家最後我們要用他以交涉的法制在跟他們做這樣的議題的話如果他們是外界的力量影響到我們的外管\n\n03:22.665 --> 03:46.336\n我們的這個代表處要強硬做連得談都沒有得談的時候我們還到哪裡簽簽到我們的這個代表處應該要積極的再進行溝通有沒有緩和的一定還是到另外一個首都因為他有三個首都嘛但是今天如果他連談都沒有談的話\n\n03:47.964 --> 04:13.272\n到時候我們連機會談都沒有機會請問一下到時候我們顏面無光部長你來說明一下好不好我們有應變小組也做好因應的對策我們當然堅守立場距離力爭基於對等的原則我們當然也做好應變的計畫我們外交部也已經請住處正式復函匪方\n\n04:15.373 --> 04:36.541\n政府基於1997年雙邊協議規定跟精神我們拒絕匪方無理的要求不配合將住處搬遷到這個其他地方但是我們當然知道這個外交各種發展包括等等他們是不是如果他們是遵守法治的政府那當然我們這些這個\n\n04:39.122 --> 05:07.496\n希望說他們跟我們能夠來協商雙邊關係那如果他們採取一些不理性的行為當然我要確保住處同仁安全還有服務僑民的功能能夠持續這個都是我們綜合考量所以剛剛委員說沒有錯他有所謂三個首都那但是這不管他幾個首都啦他對我們有這種不合理的這種要求我們先據理力爭\n\n05:08.880 --> 05:29.220\n我們也逐漸有發現這個事情經過報導之後已經各界的關注包括他們執政聯盟裡面的政黨包括有重大影響力的媒體以及國際各方面對這個事情的關注所以我們會\n\n05:32.797 --> 05:55.548\n所以部長有稀可行這邊也應該也有一個中非合作的論壇有影響到這個我們跟南非的關係所以這個就是我們應該要趕快因應我相信你的智慧\n\n05:56.849 --> 06:22.224\n但是在國際的壓力裡面已經造成我們國內的外交處處都是一個非常困境的但是我們非常很珍惜現有的外交如何維護我們外交的一個邦交的權利跟我們邦交的友好的關係我想你有這個智慧我想我們一定要固守堅守\n\n06:25.006 --> 06:49.760\n謝謝委員的支持確實國內不分黨派的支持政府捍衛我們國家的主權跟尊嚴當然另外我再請教部長我常提的就是上次你上任的時候我也提過在吳前部長也提過就是在有原民外交的這個部分當然這個\n\n06:51.681 --> 07:12.109\n我們總統也好行政院長也好部長也好你們都有聽到了大家聽到我在這一次的提出就希望能夠原民外交目前我們的我們外交的困境也借用我們原民的外交在南島語系的這個國家裡面做一個\n\n07:13.169 --> 07:13.569\n李卓人議員\n\n07:33.750 --> 07:56.289\n是教會的牧師那當然我們在希望他能夠有具備了各有專業的領域這個專業領域就是希望他能夠在能擴大面向那對原住民人才的幾把可以領先兩位\n\n07:59.111 --> 08:26.381\n第一對我們外交原住民的母語的這個部分第二跟實質上我們原住民的整個的議題他非常的了解而不是只有宗教的了解我想宗教當然是比較溫和在外交上比較溫和但是實際上會碰到一個政治問題的時候那如何他可以他可以單單勝任\n\n08:27.381 --> 08:27.801\n主席\n\n08:47.153 --> 09:00.166\n要傳輸到你這裡來你要實質的掌握這樣才會有助於我們人民外交這樣的一個任派無認所的這個職務的一個實際上的一個任務\n\n09:03.780 --> 09:32.643\n感謝委員的指導確實這個我認為原住民外交是我們總和外交很重要的一部分那我在業務報告也有再次提到那除了無論所大使這個總統任命10名有兩名就五分之一是原住民的這個背景以外我們對原住民外交的推動我有要求我們外交部的同仁要跨部會要來做這個列管\n\n09:33.463 --> 09:53.509\n我們這些不管是委員或我們外交部自己在推動的重大業務那事實上我們的邦交國裡面以這個太平洋地區就是很重要的都是跟我們有相關的南島語系的背景那事實上在像我們的一些友好國家像加拿大、澳大利亞或紐西蘭其實他們都很重視原住民的經濟社會的平權\n\n09:55.430 --> 09:55.990\n主席主席主席\n\n10:17.501 --> 10:35.031\n本席向這個部長再進一步的建議我國目前在南太平洋有三位大使一位代表根據駐外外交領事人員任用的條例大使及代表是可以做政務官任命的方式\n\n10:36.331 --> 10:37.772\n有沒有可能?\n\n10:52.611 --> 11:17.540\n我們來這是評估目前當然外交部有原住民背景的我們的同仁大概有10名我們當然至於說部外的人才我們也是密切的注意希望說能夠有優秀可以來代表我們國家能夠在我們的住處來服務\n\n11:18.872 --> 11:40.704\n按照你們政務官的條例裡面也應該可以領選一個有認所的一個原住民的大使這是你要考量一下好不好因為實質上現在這樣拓展的話會有助於外交的事務以前有過就是這樣的一個斐濟我們派駐斐濟那另外一個是\n\n11:42.265 --> 12:09.497\n我在簡短的有關於中東駐台代表哀告顯外交危機後來這樣的一個當然這是一個非營利組織的單位裡面經過內政部的登記但是他們是以在中東裡面就發生了這種狀況要不是你們外交部行文給警戒要不然的話他沒有豁免錢\n\n12:10.957 --> 12:11.157\n所謂的把關是什麼?\n\n12:37.869 --> 12:40.390\n主席再給我一分鐘那你來解釋一下好不好\n\n12:56.260 --> 12:56.280\n什麼問題?\n\n13:20.421 --> 13:21.761\n所以本席提醒部長還有我們市長\n\n13:46.606 --> 14:11.999\n現在特別要謹慎要特別跟駐外的外交使節這一些提醒他們甚至非營利組織經過內政部同意而且登入在你們的外交裡面的入案的時候外面提醒他們因為現在我們處處都是危機如果一旦小事情就變成大事情國內就會大內宣\n\n14:13.940 --> 14:15.261\n謝謝委員提醒,我們會密切注意\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.49,"end":13.673,"text":"有請我們林部長請林部長部長好委員好"},{"start":15.272,"end":41.189,"text":"剛剛我們在這個地方我都有仔細的聽到都針對南非的議題那你說南非的議題要簽出我們的代表處要簽出這個非首都的一個地方那當然你說有機有機可循那這個有機可循我特別提出這個有機可循的脈絡在"},{"start":45.768,"end":66.381,"text":"去年的8月金裝國家峰會就傳出南非不斷施壓我國代表處要簽管之後不斷以聯大第2758號決議為理由的施壓這就是有跡可循為什麼因為有些國家的"},{"start":67.996,"end":93.55,"text":"議會及政要表態聯合國大會2758號決議無赦台灣其實這種宣誓在國際上根本無實質的影響力但是結果我們執政黨的政治人物曾其在這種無實質的一個表態中在國內大內宣所以本席特別提醒我們的部長一個建議"},{"start":94.651,"end":116.828,"text":"外交部是一個現實也是國際在政治上的一個現實那我們就以南非的為例子既然南非以275號決議為由要求我國簽管外交部也因應積極的運作向表態應該要表態2758號決議無涉台灣的國家要求讓我國駐館升級以做到"},{"start":125.214,"end":152.27,"text":"實施對我們的友好這是第一點提示我們的部長因為這個是有機可行從金磚的會議到我們2758號的這樣的一個國內的大內宣那這些政治人物影響到你們外交部的運作第二個這位特別也講到牽管的問題"},{"start":154.056,"end":168.551,"text":"他是在以我們南非行政首都普洱托爾利亞這是一個行政區的首都有三個首都這個是行政區的首都那他是非常的強硬的"},{"start":169.454,"end":184.203,"text":"要求10月30號簽管而且附帶沒有協商的一定所以部長這時候已經提示你應該有政治敏感簽管"},{"start":185.023,"end":201.303,"text":"如果今天我們還按照他是一個法制的國家最後我們要用他以交涉的法制在跟他們做這樣的議題的話如果他們是外界的力量影響到我們的外管"},{"start":202.665,"end":226.336,"text":"我們的這個代表處要強硬做連得談都沒有得談的時候我們還到哪裡簽簽到我們的這個代表處應該要積極的再進行溝通有沒有緩和的一定還是到另外一個首都因為他有三個首都嘛但是今天如果他連談都沒有談的話"},{"start":227.964,"end":253.272,"text":"到時候我們連機會談都沒有機會請問一下到時候我們顏面無光部長你來說明一下好不好我們有應變小組也做好因應的對策我們當然堅守立場距離力爭基於對等的原則我們當然也做好應變的計畫我們外交部也已經請住處正式復函匪方"},{"start":255.373,"end":276.541,"text":"政府基於1997年雙邊協議規定跟精神我們拒絕匪方無理的要求不配合將住處搬遷到這個其他地方但是我們當然知道這個外交各種發展包括等等他們是不是如果他們是遵守法治的政府那當然我們這些這個"},{"start":279.122,"end":307.496,"text":"希望說他們跟我們能夠來協商雙邊關係那如果他們採取一些不理性的行為當然我要確保住處同仁安全還有服務僑民的功能能夠持續這個都是我們綜合考量所以剛剛委員說沒有錯他有所謂三個首都那但是這不管他幾個首都啦他對我們有這種不合理的這種要求我們先據理力爭"},{"start":308.88,"end":329.22,"text":"我們也逐漸有發現這個事情經過報導之後已經各界的關注包括他們執政聯盟裡面的政黨包括有重大影響力的媒體以及國際各方面對這個事情的關注所以我們會"},{"start":332.797,"end":355.548,"text":"所以部長有稀可行這邊也應該也有一個中非合作的論壇有影響到這個我們跟南非的關係所以這個就是我們應該要趕快因應我相信你的智慧"},{"start":356.849,"end":382.224,"text":"但是在國際的壓力裡面已經造成我們國內的外交處處都是一個非常困境的但是我們非常很珍惜現有的外交如何維護我們外交的一個邦交的權利跟我們邦交的友好的關係我想你有這個智慧我想我們一定要固守堅守"},{"start":385.006,"end":409.76,"text":"謝謝委員的支持確實國內不分黨派的支持政府捍衛我們國家的主權跟尊嚴當然另外我再請教部長我常提的就是上次你上任的時候我也提過在吳前部長也提過就是在有原民外交的這個部分當然這個"},{"start":411.681,"end":432.109,"text":"我們總統也好行政院長也好部長也好你們都有聽到了大家聽到我在這一次的提出就希望能夠原民外交目前我們的我們外交的困境也借用我們原民的外交在南島語系的這個國家裡面做一個"},{"start":433.169,"end":433.569,"text":"李卓人議員"},{"start":453.75,"end":476.289,"text":"是教會的牧師那當然我們在希望他能夠有具備了各有專業的領域這個專業領域就是希望他能夠在能擴大面向那對原住民人才的幾把可以領先兩位"},{"start":479.111,"end":506.381,"text":"第一對我們外交原住民的母語的這個部分第二跟實質上我們原住民的整個的議題他非常的了解而不是只有宗教的了解我想宗教當然是比較溫和在外交上比較溫和但是實際上會碰到一個政治問題的時候那如何他可以他可以單單勝任"},{"start":507.381,"end":507.801,"text":"主席"},{"start":527.153,"end":540.166,"text":"要傳輸到你這裡來你要實質的掌握這樣才會有助於我們人民外交這樣的一個任派無認所的這個職務的一個實際上的一個任務"},{"start":543.78,"end":572.643,"text":"感謝委員的指導確實這個我認為原住民外交是我們總和外交很重要的一部分那我在業務報告也有再次提到那除了無論所大使這個總統任命10名有兩名就五分之一是原住民的這個背景以外我們對原住民外交的推動我有要求我們外交部的同仁要跨部會要來做這個列管"},{"start":573.463,"end":593.509,"text":"我們這些不管是委員或我們外交部自己在推動的重大業務那事實上我們的邦交國裡面以這個太平洋地區就是很重要的都是跟我們有相關的南島語系的背景那事實上在像我們的一些友好國家像加拿大、澳大利亞或紐西蘭其實他們都很重視原住民的經濟社會的平權"},{"start":595.43,"end":595.99,"text":"主席主席主席"},{"start":617.501,"end":635.031,"text":"本席向這個部長再進一步的建議我國目前在南太平洋有三位大使一位代表根據駐外外交領事人員任用的條例大使及代表是可以做政務官任命的方式"},{"start":636.331,"end":637.772,"text":"有沒有可能?"},{"start":652.611,"end":677.54,"text":"我們來這是評估目前當然外交部有原住民背景的我們的同仁大概有10名我們當然至於說部外的人才我們也是密切的注意希望說能夠有優秀可以來代表我們國家能夠在我們的住處來服務"},{"start":678.872,"end":700.704,"text":"按照你們政務官的條例裡面也應該可以領選一個有認所的一個原住民的大使這是你要考量一下好不好因為實質上現在這樣拓展的話會有助於外交的事務以前有過就是這樣的一個斐濟我們派駐斐濟那另外一個是"},{"start":702.265,"end":729.497,"text":"我在簡短的有關於中東駐台代表哀告顯外交危機後來這樣的一個當然這是一個非營利組織的單位裡面經過內政部的登記但是他們是以在中東裡面就發生了這種狀況要不是你們外交部行文給警戒要不然的話他沒有豁免錢"},{"start":730.957,"end":731.157,"text":"所謂的把關是什麼?"},{"start":757.869,"end":760.39,"text":"主席再給我一分鐘那你來解釋一下好不好"},{"start":776.26,"end":776.28,"text":"什麼問題?"},{"start":800.421,"end":801.761,"text":"所以本席提醒部長還有我們市長"},{"start":826.606,"end":851.999,"text":"現在特別要謹慎要特別跟駐外的外交使節這一些提醒他們甚至非營利組織經過內政部同意而且登入在你們的外交裡面的入案的時候外面提醒他們因為現在我們處處都是危機如果一旦小事情就變成大事情國內就會大內宣"},{"start":853.94,"end":855.261,"text":"謝謝委員提醒,我們會密切注意"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":377,"blocks":[["黃委員仁：（10時38分）有請林部長。"],["主席：請林部長。"],["黃委員仁：部長好。"],["林部長佳龍：委員好。"],["黃委員仁：剛剛針對南非的議題我都有仔細的聽到，他們要我們的代表處遷出首都的地方，當然你說有跡可循，這裡我特別提出有跡可循的脈絡。在去年的8月金磚國家峰會上，就傳出南非不斷的施壓我國代表處要遷館，之後不斷以聯大第2758號決議為理由施壓，這就是有跡可循。為什麼？因為有些國家的議會正要表態聯合國大會第2758號決議無涉臺灣，其實這種宣示在國際上根本無實質的影響力，結果我們執政黨的政治人物承襲在這種無實質的一個表態中，在國內大內宣，所以本席特別提醒我們的部長，也提出一個建議，外交是一個現實，也是在國際政治上的一個現實，我們就以南非為例子，既然南非以2758號決議為由要求我國遷館，外交部也應積極運作，應該要表態2758號決議無涉臺灣的國家要求，讓我國駐館升級，以做到實質對我們的友好，這是第一點，提示我們的部長。因為這個是有跡可循，從金磚會議到2758號這樣一個國內的大內宣，這些政治人物影響到你們外交部的運作。","第二個，這裡特別也講到遷館的問題，館處是在於南非行政首都普利托利亞，這是一個行政區的首都，南非有三個首都，這個是行政區的首都，它非常強硬的要求10月30號要遷館，而且附帶沒有協商的餘地。所以部長，這個已經提示，你應該有政治敏感，遷館，如果今天我們還按照它是一個法治的國家，最後我們要用它已交涉的法治再跟他們做這樣的議題的話，如果他們是外界的力量影響到我們的外館、我們的代表處，要強硬運作，連談都沒有得談的時候，我們的代表處要遷到哪裡？應該要積極的再進行溝通，看看有沒有緩和的餘地，還是到另外一個首都，因為它有三個首都嘛，但是今天如果連談都沒有談的話，到時候我們連談都沒有機會，請問一下，到時候我們顏面無光，部長，你來說明一下，好不好？"],["林部長佳龍：我們有應變小組，也做好因應的對策，我們當然堅守立場、據理力爭，基於對等的原則，我們當然也做好應變的計畫。我們外交部也已經請駐處正式復函斐方，就是我政府基於1997年雙邊協議規定跟精神，我們拒絕斐方無理的要求，不配合將駐處搬遷到其他地方。但是我們當然知道外交的各種發展，如果他們是遵守法治的政府，當然我們希望他們跟我們能夠來協商雙邊關係，如果他們採取一些不理性的行為，當然我要確保駐處同仁的安全，還有服務僑民的功能能夠持續，這個都是我們要去綜合考量。剛剛委員所說的沒有錯，它有所謂三個首都，但是不管它有幾個首都，它對我們有這種不合理的要求，我們先據理力爭，我們也逐漸發現這個事情經過報導之後，已經引起各界的關注，包括他們執政聯盟裡面的政黨，包括有重大影響力的媒體，以及國際各方面對這個事情的關注，所以我們也是會步步為營，一步一步的來做好應處。"],["黃委員仁：所以部長，有跡可循，這邊應該也有一個中非合作論壇有影響到我們跟南非的關係，這個就是我們應該要趕快因應，我相信你的智慧，但是在國際的壓力裡面，已經造成我國的外交處處都是非常困境的狀況，但是我們非常珍惜現有的外交，如何維護我們外交的邦交的權利，跟我們邦交的友好的關係，我想你有這個智慧，我想我們一定要固守、堅守。"],["林部長佳龍：是，謝謝委員的支持，確實國內不分黨派的支持政府捍衛我們國家的主權跟尊嚴。"],["黃委員仁：是。另外我再請教部長，我常常提的，上次你上任的時候我也提過，在吳前部長的時候也提過，就是原民外交的部分，我們的總統也好，行政院長也好，部長也好，你們都有聽到了，聽到我再一次的提出希望能夠推展原民外交，目前我們外交的困境也借用我們原民外交在南島語系的國家裡面做前置部隊來進行友誼的聯繫，當然也有特別派出了兩個無任所的大使……"],["林部長佳龍：是。"],["黃委員仁：無任所大使有兩個原住民，一個是阿美族，一個是泰雅族，後來我一看，是教會的牧師，當然我們希望他能夠具備各自的專業領域，這個專業領域就是希望他能夠擴大面向，對原住民人才的提拔可以遴選兩位，第一，對我們外交原住民母語的這個部分，第二，實質上對我們原住民的整個議題非常了解，而不是只有對宗教的了解。我想宗教當然是比較溫和，在外交上比較溫和，但是當實際上碰到一個政治問題的時候，他如何可以擔當、勝任我們的原民外交，所以部長，你們要審慎的遴選原民外交大使，當然現在已經任派，但是我也希望你能夠審慎，請他們將外交的實質經驗要傳輸到你這裡來，你要實質的掌握，這樣才會有助於我們原民外交任派無任所職務的一個實際上任務。"],["林部長佳龍：感謝委員的指導，確實，我認為原住民外交是我們總合外交很重要的一部分，我在業務報告中也有再次提到，除了無任所大使在總統任命的10名中有2名，也就是有五分之一是原住民的背景以外，對於原住民外交的推動，我有要求外交部的同仁要跨部會來做列管，不管是委員或我們外交部自己在推動的重大業務。事實上，在我們的邦交國裡面，以太平洋地區為例，就是很重要的，都是跟我們一樣具有相關南島語系的背景，事實上，我們的一些友好國家，像加拿大、澳大利亞或紐西蘭，其實他們都很重視原住民的經濟社會的平權，還有婦女的所謂賦能的培力計畫，這些都是我們可以做外交最好的……"],["黃委員仁：因為時間關係，我很抱歉，我希望的是什麼，原民研究包含專注在族群的關係，有擅長傳統服飾及建築等等的專業。另外，本席再向部長做進一步的建議，我國目前在南太平洋有三位大使、一位代表，根據駐外外交領事人員任用條例，大使及代表是可以用政務官任命的方式來任派，因此，希望未來如果有機會的話，我國在南太平洋的三個大使、一個代表裡面能優先考量由原住民族來出任，有沒有可能？"],["林部長佳龍：我們來評估，目前當然外交部有原住民背景的同仁大概有10名，至於說部外的人才，我們也是會密切注意，希望能夠有優秀可以代表我們國家的人能夠在我們的駐處來服務。"],["黃委員仁：按照你們政務官條例裡面的規定，也應該可以遴選一個有任所的原住民大使，這個事情你要考量一下，好不好？"],["林部長佳龍：好。"],["黃委員仁：因為現在這樣實質上拓展的話，會有助於外交的事務。"],["林部長佳龍：對，以前有過，就是我們派駐斐濟的原住民大使。"],["黃委員仁：好。另外一個我再簡短的問，有關於中東駐台代表挨告險釀外交危機一事，這是一個非營利組織的單位，經過內政部的登記，但是導致中東駐台代表發生了這種狀況，要不是你們外交部行文給警界，要不然的話他沒有豁免權，如何因應這些外交的危機，而且此事最後是怎麼處理的？"],["林部長佳龍：因為不管是檢警調或是司法單位，當涉及到駐台代表的傳喚時，依程序是要會我們外交部嘛，我們在最後的時間有把關，沒有造成剛剛委員講的這樣的事情。"],["黃委員仁：你所謂的「把關」是什麼？它本來要發生什麼樣的狀況，本來它要發生什麼狀況？"],["林部長佳龍：他有外交豁免，他在我們國家是代表他們的政府在這裡行使職權，我們外交部都要當作自己的事情。"],["黃委員仁：主席，再給我1分鐘。","那你來解釋一下，好不好？"],["陳處長欣新：這個事件發生的時候，我們知道之後是有立刻去回復我們的司法機關，我們有查明雙方的豁免的待遇，然後有告訴他們，之後我們有發函提醒我們的警方說，類似這樣的事件應該事先要先來通知我們，他們直接去傳喚代表，的確是有一些問題。"],["黃委員仁：什麼問題？"],["陳處長欣新：因為照理說他們的確是應該要先來知會我們，可是主要是因為司法機關並沒有做這樣子的事情，以致於我們這些駐台代表的確有遭到傳喚，可是事實上我們在查明、回復之後，他們後來就沒有再去傳喚，所以我們是在後來提醒我們的司法單位，之後類似的事件應該要先知會我們。"],["黃委員仁：所以本席提醒部長還有司長……"],["林部長佳龍：是。"],["黃委員仁：現在特別要謹慎，要特別跟駐外的外交使節這一些要提醒他們，甚至非營利組織，經過內政部同意而且登錄在你們外交部裡面錄案的時候，要提醒他們，因為現在我們處處都是危機，如果一旦小事情就會變成大事情，國內就會大內宣，對我們的外交絕對沒有幫助的，好不好？部長。"],["林部長佳龍：好，謝謝委員提醒，我們會密切注意。"],["主席：謝謝黃仁委員，部長請回。"],["主席（黃委員仁代）：接下來由林憶君委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":150,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-35-6","speakers":["林憶君","羅美玲","陳永康","徐巧芯","王定宇","沈伯洋","馬文君","黃仁","洪申翰","林楚茵","陳冠廷","林德福","牛煦庭","王鴻薇","賴士葆","洪孟楷","陳培瑜","黃國昌","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","羅智強"],"page_start":81,"meetingDate":["2024-10-21"],"gazette_id":"1138601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1138601_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第6次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請外交部部長林佳龍報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1138601_00003"}}}