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{\"word\": \"毒\", \"start\": 485.659, \"end\": 485.819, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"品\", \"start\": 485.819, \"end\": 486.64, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"載\"}, {\"word\": \"具\", \"start\": 486.64, \"end\": 486.84, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 486.84, \"end\": 486.94, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"寫\"}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 486.94, \"end\": 487.18, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"句\", \"start\": 487.18, \"end\": 487.2, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"話\"}]}, {\"start\": 493.014, \"end\": 505.64, \"text\": \"結論是這樣嗎?對不對?所以你現在這樣笑我不懂你這個笑是什麼意思啊就是你寫出來是你們說你們現在加強然後透過中央地方可以避免可是結果就不是這樣啊\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"結\"}, {\"word\": \"論\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 493.014, \"end\": 495.455, \"score\": 0.815}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}, {\"word\": \"?\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 495.455, \"end\": 495.515, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"?\"}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 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\"end\": 581.765, \"score\": 0.906}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 581.765, \"end\": 582.005, \"score\": 0.84}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"努\", \"start\": 582.005, \"end\": 582.165, \"score\": 0.893}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 582.165, \"end\": 582.185, \"score\": 0.993}]}, {\"start\": 582.765, \"end\": 588.586, \"text\": \"請教部長現在各種醫事機構在經營上是不是比較困難?因為本席從9月底到現在不斷接獲醫藥相關的團體陳情這個電費調漲的事宜那我其實上次也跟你問過跟你請託過製藥產業跟藥局的電價是不是可以予以動漲或見面?\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"教\", \"start\": 582.765, \"end\": 582.925, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 582.925, \"end\": 582.945, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 582.945, \"end\": 583.025, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"各\", \"start\": 583.025, \"end\": 583.105, \"score\": 0.744}, {\"word\": \"種\"}, {\"word\": \"醫\"}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 583.105, \"end\": 583.245, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"機\"}, {\"word\": \"構\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 583.245, \"end\": 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00:01:32,182\n那7月7到9月的暑假大概是294件那反觀我們全國的警方7月到9月同一期間查獲喪失煙油違法案件是681件為衛福部的2.3倍我想要請問部長這樣的數字是不是反映衛福部對於非法新興煙品的怠惰跟失職因為這個數據差太多因為我們衛福部是用煙害防制法來\n\n5\n00:01:33,973 --> 00:01:40,398\n這部分你們有什麼辦法可以加強執法的部分因為這個數字真的差太多光喪失煙油在警察的這個同一期間7到9月2個月就是690幾件\n\n6\n00:02:00,933 --> 00:02:21,751\n對跟委員報告其實我們除了實際開立處分書之外我們的這個查緝的力道就是包括稽查的這個案件數也到高達23萬件次當然就如部長所說的查緝如果違法的話他必須依照陰害防治法的行政程序來完成我跟你說啦\n\n7\n00:02:22,371 --> 00:02:36,318\n這個在國建署的調查反正國中生還有跟高中職生的電子煙使用率分別是從2018年的1.9%與3.4%到2021年上升到3.9%跟8.8%到2021年到現在2024年我想最新的數據只會多不會少所以代表這個執法的結果論來看就是有問題啊就是有問題嘛這不然怎麼可能比例越來越高勒\n\n8\n00:02:52,408 --> 00:02:53,271\n這個電子煙的使用比例這麼高\n\n9\n00:02:54,738 --> 00:03:22,671\n我希望你們可以思考一下到底應該要怎麼樣把這件事情讓它的這個比率不要再持續的升高甚至要下降再來電子煙最可怕的危害是裡面不知道加了什麼東西嘛對不對我想你們也很頭痛但裡面到底加了什麼東西那刑事局的統計警方今年1月至8月查獲的電子煙油案是1415件那送檢吶吶含這個大麻的部分大概是53%喵喵卡西桶是28%\n\n10\n00:03:24,500 --> 00:03:40,610\n上司菸油依托米子6.1%我想剛剛很多人問了所以這6.1%剛剛在短短的7到9月就抓了這麼多代表有非常多的黑素在外面亂竄還有安非他命0.6%那混分部分混合兩種以上毒品\n\n11\n00:03:41,691 --> 00:04:06,895\n也就是說電子煙的載具實際上就是載具它已經成為了吸食毒品的工具那結合將近10%的高中生電子煙的吸食率毒品進入校園的情況是非常非常的嚴重我想要請問一下因為我看到很多大家都在講電子煙可能在講那煙油煙彈我想問一下載具的部分有哪一個單位管理載具的部分是衛福部管嗎\n\n12\n00:04:08,567 --> 00:04:29,450\n採聚是衛福部管嗎?燕子煙是我們管理。採聚,它下面的採聚,所以你們整個這樣管起來,都是屬於你們?對,燕子煙是我們管理。都是屬於你們管理嗎?但是如果採聚裡面含有其他的物質,比如說毒品化,就會依毒品防治條例來做管理。好,所以基本上,採聚是你們管理,是包含那個煙油也都是你們管嗎?就是整支是不是?都是你們管?\n\n13\n00:04:31,251 --> 00:04:53,445\n電子煙是包含載具加上煙油還是你是分開來是合在一起合在一起那如果拆開來都算是你的嘛對不對就是不管是載具或是跟委員報告如果這個煙彈本身是含有其他物質那就有其他的法律來協同管沒關係但我只是想要說那誰要負責去把這件事情管控好就是說不會有這麼多非法的電子煙的載具\n\n14\n00:04:55,026 --> 00:05:22,396\n因為現在情況是這樣加熱煙是加強管制但是不禁止那電子煙是完全禁止對不對但現在問題就是兩者外形也很相似嘛你可以看一下現在甚至有這種那你要怎麼算這種就是一方面是加熱煙後面可以抽電子煙那這個你有辦法你怎麼管理目前為止是全禁包括加熱煙跟電子煙都是全禁加熱煙就是不是加強管制\n\n15\n00:05:23,496 --> 00:05:43,003\n現在還沒有任何一個品牌通過所以現在目前市面上加熱衣跟電源的所以照理說你全部看到全部都應該要禁止嘛對不對可是現在的比例就是很糟糕啊對不對所以我想要問說那未來未來如果這兩個混在一起你要怎麼去把它分辨出來我們會再瞭解清楚瞭解清楚它混在一起使用的一個狀態\n\n16\n00:05:51,909 --> 00:06:13,638\n所以你們現在有掌握這個狀態嗎?我們目前知道是有混用但是因為它都是全面禁止兩種煙品都是全面禁止的所以我們是全面查緝的在部長但是現在情況不是將加熱煙視為你們想要視為是3C然後衛福部沒有什麼想要管理嗎?你們把加熱煙變成視為3C產品\n\n17\n00:06:15,279 --> 00:06:37,035\n委員其實加熱煙是因為它的煙草柱本身是煙草所以我們納入《煙害防治法》來管轄那按照我們的法裡面的部分它必須經過我們健康風險評估後才能夠上市所以截至目前為止沒有任何一家長…我想要問那之前有你們有在說你們覺得加熱煙載具視為3C這件事情\n\n18\n00:06:39,372 --> 00:06:51,798\n加熱煙的載具是經濟部管轄我們管轄上面的那個煙草柱對那你現在就是會變成是你模糊不清你剛剛又說加熱煙這些也算是那你現在加熱煙載具又算是經濟部管轄\n\n19\n00:06:52,622 --> 00:06:54,803\n我們會跟經濟部管轄加熱菸的載具\n\n20\n00:07:14,115 --> 00:07:41,925\n這是有電子煙跟加熱煙兩種所以我要提醒部長就是現在網路就是很氾濫你可以否認嗎?現在氾濫這件事情你可以否認嗎?不能嘛對不對?到處都是買得到啊所以你看這PTT上面甚至有什麼電子的品牌叫做自己叫Canty啊Vape電子煙專門店啊煙導賞啊到處買得到甚至透過便利商店還可以在這個交貨付款啊\n\n21\n00:07:42,725 --> 00:08:07,200\n所以我想要問你們這個部分包含剛剛這個模糊不清的這個權責你們到底可不可以統一要統一的去處理這件事情因為你現在連你自己的報告上面我覺得很可笑是這樣子啊你的今天這份報告你們說中央與地方透過加強茶氣、電子煙等類煙品予以重罰將可避免電子煙彈電子煙彈這個成為毒品載具你寫出這句話\n\n22\n00:08:13,014 --> 00:08:25,640\n結論是這樣嗎?對不對?所以你現在這樣笑我不懂你這個笑是什麼意思啊就是你寫出來是你們說你們現在加強然後透過中央地方可以避免可是結果就不是這樣啊\n\n23\n00:08:27,290 --> 00:08:49,124\n所以這部分我真的是希望部長請加油你們可不可以給本席或是給委員會一個報告就是說究竟你們這個權責應該怎麼分因為你現在講出來都是空話你並沒有結論並不是這樣結果並不是這樣現在就是事實上在校園裡面就是非常多的這種電子煙品2021年8.8%現在多少%\n\n24\n00:08:52,932 --> 00:09:16,816\n這個是很誇張的事情我想這個必須要我們一起努力跨部會來努力所以你不能說只有跨部會努力這個部分到底誰要到時候你們要整合起來剛剛報告這個部分是我們站在煙害防治法方面我們會中央地方要合作應該是可以減少這樣的一個電子M的使用那當然這個剛剛也有提到校園或者是教育部\n\n25\n00:09:18,036 --> 00:09:42,185\n對,所以我意思是這個東西到底推來推去就會有問題所以你到底怎麼跨部會整合真的是可以有一個強而有力的執法這個是重要的事情我們必須要保護我們尤其是兒少的一個健康我想這是國人非常擔心的事情這個一定我們絕對不會推卸任何責任一定是全力來跟各部會全力來努力\n\n26\n00:09:42,765 --> 00:09:48,586\n請教部長現在各種醫事機構在經營上是不是比較困難?因為本席從9月底到現在不斷接獲醫藥相關的團體陳情這個電費調漲的事宜那我其實上次也跟你問過跟你請託過製藥產業跟藥局的電價是不是可以予以動漲或見面?\n\n27\n00:10:04,850 --> 00:10:18,961\n那我今天要再針對這些所有的醫事機構包含這個諮商所、物療所跟驗光所也就是行業類別是8、6、9的各類的醫事機構跟你請託我當初也拜託你去跟經濟部行政院反映動長變價\n\n28\n00:10:20,342 --> 00:10:38,684\n部長我想政府現在正在推動這個健康台灣的政策要有健康台灣就要有完整的醫療的照護體系那各個醫事機構無論是醫院或是藥局或是社區等等都是這個都在社區的第一線我想他們就是健康台灣的根基不是嗎\n\n29\n00:10:39,705 --> 00:10:59,572\n那現在醫療機構大部分受限於健保給付所以就是各類的醫事服務的健保給付如果沒有增加物價通膨、電費高漲的情況之下部長你覺得這樣子健康台灣的根基這個各類的各類的這種醫療機構、醫師機構會不會有所影響會不會也有可能影響到人民就醫的這個的品質或成本\n\n30\n00:11:00,212 --> 00:11:08,403\n報告委員謝謝您為醫院跟藥局的爭取那這個部分都已經是動長了我知道這是過去發生的事情所以我剛剛說這件事情各個其他的醫師類別我們\n\n31\n00:11:15,411 --> 00:11:20,976\n對,但是其實過去你們一直掛16萬然後我們會轉給經濟部但是絕對沒有說因為您寫的說衛福部沒找到經濟部因為經濟部長是啊,我那天就問他經濟部長我就問他說我們的衛福部長到底有沒有來找你他支支吾吾不敢講啊\n\n32\n00:11:38,750 --> 00:12:01,430\n我甚至問說下面單位有沒有溝通啊他最後跟我說他比較忙啊那我意思是說那你是比較不忙啊沒有啦我們跟經濟部長是隨時可以聯繫的那你到底有沒有去反映嘛我是說我們有把那個申請是轉過去給經濟部所以你有去反映嘛對不對有有有那最後沒有最後這個部分我是想要告訴你因為那天我去問他喔他跟我說你沒有找他嘛\n\n33\n00:12:01,950 --> 00:12:27,669\n後續的部﹖我們已經轉給經濟部就是說後續那個您剛剛講的其他的議事相關的我們已經把那個陳千涵也有給經濟部那經濟部會去請審議方面說真的我是覺得除了這個轉涵之外你想我想您還可以再多做一些努力畢竟你是衛福部長你可以真的瞭解這些狀況請你也可以多努力一點不是只是我轉過去而已你又不是總機對不對\n\n34\n00:12:29,190 --> 00:12:41,303\n我會跟那個行業講說明說大概他可以這樣怎麼樣去論述會比較對所以我希望你不要成為一個總機部長好不好你不要轉過去就好這些人一直不斷的在承襲這些狀況我們也給他專業的指導好謝謝部長好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n4885\t7327\t謝謝主席。有請我們部長。部長你好。今天討論這個議題是非常嚴重的一個議題。自我們《煙害防治法》112年的3月22日開始公告實施全面禁止電子煙至今也超過一年半。\n28746\t47267\t但是我們可以在大街小巷其實可以看到很多民眾或者是各個地方甚至校園都可以看到這個吸食電子煙的狀況而且電子煙的載具跟它那個煙油是可以輕易購買取得那我想執法不力是最大的一個原因之一\n48649\t56139\t衛福部資料顯示,從今年9月中央及地方衛生局依《煙害防治法》裁罰639件電子煙違規案件,平均一天不到2件,今年2月至4月甚至只有4件\n64890\t92182\t那7月7到9月的暑假大概是294件那反觀我們全國的警方7月到9月同一期間查獲喪失煙油違法案件是681件為衛福部的2.3倍我想要請問部長這樣的數字是不是反映衛福部對於非法新興煙品的怠惰跟失職因為這個數據差太多因為我們衛福部是用煙害防制法來\n93973\t100398\t這部分你們有什麼辦法可以加強執法的部分因為這個數字真的差太多光喪失煙油在警察的這個同一期間7到9月2個月就是690幾件\n120933\t141751\t對 跟委員報告其實我們除了實際開立處分書之外我們的這個查緝的力道就是包括稽查的這個案件數也到高達23萬件次當然就如部長所說的查緝如果違法的話他必須依照陰害防治法的行政程序來完成我跟你說啦\n142371\t156318\t這個在國建署的調查反正國中生還有跟高中職生的電子煙使用率分別是從2018年的1.9%與3.4%到2021年上升到3.9%跟8.8%到2021年到現在2024年我想最新的數據只會多不會少所以代表這個執法的結果論來看就是有問題啊就是有問題嘛這不然怎麼可能比例越來越高勒\n172408\t173271\t這個電子煙的使用比例這麼高\n174738\t202671\t我希望你們可以思考一下到底應該要怎麼樣把這件事情讓它的這個比率不要再持續的升高甚至要下降再來電子煙最可怕的危害是裡面不知道加了什麼東西嘛對不對我想你們也很頭痛但裡面到底加了什麼東西那刑事局的統計警方今年1月至8月查獲的電子煙油案是1415件那送檢吶吶含這個大麻的部分大概是53%喵喵卡西桶是28%\n204500\t220610\t上司菸油依托米子6.1%我想剛剛很多人問了所以這6.1%剛剛在短短的7到9月就抓了這麼多代表有非常多的黑素在外面亂竄還有安非他命0.6%那混分部分混合兩種以上毒品\n221691\t246895\t也就是說電子煙的載具實際上就是載具它已經成為了吸食毒品的工具那結合將近10%的高中生電子煙的吸食率毒品進入校園的情況是非常非常的嚴重我想要請問一下因為我看到很多大家都在講電子煙可能在講那煙油煙彈我想問一下載具的部分有哪一個單位管理載具的部分是衛福部管嗎\n248567\t269450\t採聚是衛福部管嗎?燕子煙是我們管理。採聚,它下面的採聚,所以你們整個這樣管起來,都是屬於你們?對,燕子煙是我們管理。都是屬於你們管理嗎?但是如果採聚裡面含有其他的物質,比如說毒品化,就會依毒品防治條例來做管理。好,所以基本上,採聚是你們管理,是包含那個煙油也都是你們管嗎?就是整支是不是?都是你們管?\n271251\t293445\t電子煙是包含載具加上煙油還是你是分開來是合在一起合在一起那如果拆開來都算是你的嘛對不對就是不管是載具或是跟委員報告如果這個煙彈本身是含有其他物質那就有其他的法律來協同管沒關係但我只是想要說那誰要負責去把這件事情管控好就是說不會有這麼多非法的電子煙的載具\n295026\t322396\t因為現在情況是這樣加熱煙是加強管制但是不禁止那電子煙是完全禁止對不對但現在問題就是兩者外形也很相似嘛你可以看一下現在甚至有這種那你要怎麼算這種就是一方面是加熱煙後面可以抽電子煙那這個你有辦法你怎麼管理目前為止是全禁包括加熱煙跟電子煙都是全禁加熱煙就是不是加強管制\n323496\t343003\t現在還沒有任何一個品牌通過所以現在目前市面上加熱衣跟電源的所以照理說你全部看到全部都應該要禁止嘛對不對可是現在的比例就是很糟糕啊對不對所以我想要問說那未來未來如果這兩個混在一起你要怎麼去把它分辨出來我們會再瞭解清楚瞭解清楚它混在一起使用的一個狀態\n351909\t373638\t所以你們現在有掌握這個狀態嗎?我們目前知道是有混用但是因為它都是全面禁止兩種煙品都是全面禁止的所以我們是全面查緝的在部長但是現在情況不是將加熱煙視為你們想要視為是3C然後衛福部沒有什麼想要管理嗎?你們把加熱煙變成視為3C產品\n375279\t397035\t委員其實加熱煙是因為它的煙草柱本身是煙草所以我們納入《煙害防治法》來管轄那按照我們的法裡面的部分它必須經過我們健康風險評估後才能夠上市所以截至目前為止沒有任何一家長…我想要問那之前有你們有在說你們覺得加熱煙載具視為3C這件事情\n399372\t411798\t加熱煙的載具是經濟部管轄我們管轄上面的那個煙草柱對那你現在就是會變成是你模糊不清你剛剛又說加熱煙這些也算是那你現在加熱煙載具又算是經濟部管轄\n412622\t414803\t我們會跟經濟部管轄加熱菸的載具\n434115\t461925\t這是有電子煙跟加熱煙兩種所以我要提醒部長就是現在網路就是很氾濫你可以否認嗎?現在氾濫這件事情你可以否認嗎?不能嘛對不對?到處都是買得到啊所以你看這PTT上面甚至有什麼電子的品牌叫做自己叫Canty啊Vape電子煙專門店啊煙導賞啊到處買得到甚至透過便利商店還可以在這個交貨付款啊\n462725\t487200\t所以我想要問你們這個部分包含剛剛這個模糊不清的這個權責你們到底可不可以統一要統一的去處理這件事情因為你現在連你自己的報告上面我覺得很可笑是這樣子啊你的今天這份報告你們說中央與地方透過加強茶氣、電子煙等類煙品予以重罰將可避免電子煙彈電子煙彈這個成為毒品載具你寫出這句話\n493014\t505640\t結論是這樣嗎?對不對?所以你現在這樣笑我不懂你這個笑是什麼意思啊就是你寫出來是你們說你們現在加強然後透過中央地方可以避免可是結果就不是這樣啊\n507290\t529124\t所以這部分我真的是希望部長請加油你們可不可以給本席或是給委員會一個報告就是說究竟你們這個權責應該怎麼分因為你現在講出來都是空話你並沒有結論並不是這樣結果並不是這樣現在就是事實上在校園裡面就是非常多的這種電子煙品 2021年8.8%現在多少%\n532932\t556816\t這個是很誇張的事情我想這個必須要我們一起努力跨部會來努力所以你不能說只有跨部會努力這個部分到底誰要到時候你們要整合起來剛剛報告這個部分是我們站在煙害防治法方面我們會中央地方要合作應該是可以減少這樣的一個電子M的使用那當然這個剛剛也有提到校園或者是教育部\n558036\t582185\t對,所以我意思是這個東西到底推來推去就會有問題所以你到底怎麼跨部會整合真的是可以有一個強而有力的執法這個是重要的事情我們必須要保護我們尤其是兒少的一個健康我想這是國人非常擔心的事情這個一定我們絕對不會推卸任何責任一定是全力來跟各部會全力來努力\n582765\t588586\t請教部長現在各種醫事機構在經營上是不是比較困難?因為本席從9月底到現在不斷接獲醫藥相關的團體陳情這個電費調漲的事宜那我其實上次也跟你問過跟你請託過製藥產業跟藥局的電價是不是可以予以動漲或見面?\n604850\t618961\t那我今天要再針對這些所有的醫事機構包含這個諮商所、物療所跟驗光所也就是行業類別是8、6、9的各類的醫事機構跟你請託我當初也拜託你去跟經濟部行政院反映動長變價\n620342\t638684\t部長我想政府現在正在推動這個健康台灣的政策要有健康台灣就要有完整的醫療的照護體系那各個醫事機構無論是醫院或是藥局或是社區等等都是這個都在社區的第一線我想他們就是健康台灣的根基不是嗎\n639705\t659572\t那現在醫療機構大部分受限於健保給付所以就是各類的醫事服務的健保給付如果沒有增加物價通膨、電費高漲的情況之下部長你覺得這樣子健康台灣的根基這個各類的各類的這種醫療機構、醫師機構會不會有所影響會不會也有可能影響到人民就醫的這個的品質或成本\n660212\t668403\t報告委員謝謝您為醫院跟藥局的爭取那這個部分都已經是動長了我知道這是過去發生的事情所以我剛剛說這件事情各個其他的醫師類別我們\n675411\t680976\t對,但是其實過去你們一直掛16萬然後我們會轉給經濟部但是絕對沒有說因為您寫的說衛福部沒找到經濟部因為經濟部長是啊,我那天就問他經濟部長我就問他說我們的衛福部長到底有沒有來找你他支支吾吾不敢講啊\n698750\t721430\t我甚至問說下面單位有沒有溝通啊他最後跟我說他比較忙啊那我意思是說那你是比較不忙啊沒有啦我們跟經濟部長是隨時可以聯繫的那你到底有沒有去反映嘛我是說我們有把那個申請是轉過去給經濟部所以你有去反映嘛對不對有有有那最後沒有最後這個部分我是想要告訴你因為那天我去問他喔他跟我說你沒有找他嘛\n721950\t747669\t後續的部﹖我們已經轉給經濟部就是說後續那個您剛剛講的其他的議事相關的我們已經把那個陳千涵也有給經濟部那經濟部會去請審議方面說真的我是覺得除了這個轉涵之外你想我想您還可以再多做一些努力畢竟你是衛福部長你可以真的瞭解這些狀況請你也可以多努力一點不是只是我轉過去而已你又不是總機對不對\n749190\t761303\t我會跟那個行業講說明說大概他可以這樣怎麼樣去論述會比較對所以我希望你不要成為一個總機部長好不好你不要轉過去就好這些人一直不斷的在承襲這些狀況我們也給他專業的指導好謝謝部長好謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席。有請我們部長。部長你好。今天討論這個議題是非常嚴重的一個議題。自我們《煙害防治法》112年的3月22日開始公告實施全面禁止電子煙至今也超過一年半。\n但是我們可以在大街小巷其實可以看到很多民眾或者是各個地方甚至校園都可以看到這個吸食電子煙的狀況而且電子煙的載具跟它那個煙油是可以輕易購買取得那我想執法不力是最大的一個原因之一\n衛福部資料顯示,從今年9月中央及地方衛生局依《煙害防治法》裁罰639件電子煙違規案件,平均一天不到2件,今年2月至4月甚至只有4件\n那7月7到9月的暑假大概是294件那反觀我們全國的警方7月到9月同一期間查獲喪失煙油違法案件是681件為衛福部的2.3倍我想要請問部長這樣的數字是不是反映衛福部對於非法新興煙品的怠惰跟失職因為這個數據差太多因為我們衛福部是用煙害防制法來\n這部分你們有什麼辦法可以加強執法的部分因為這個數字真的差太多光喪失煙油在警察的這個同一期間7到9月2個月就是690幾件\n對 跟委員報告其實我們除了實際開立處分書之外我們的這個查緝的力道就是包括稽查的這個案件數也到高達23萬件次當然就如部長所說的查緝如果違法的話他必須依照陰害防治法的行政程序來完成我跟你說啦\n這個在國建署的調查反正國中生還有跟高中職生的電子煙使用率分別是從2018年的1.9%與3.4%到2021年上升到3.9%跟8.8%到2021年到現在2024年我想最新的數據只會多不會少所以代表這個執法的結果論來看就是有問題啊就是有問題嘛這不然怎麼可能比例越來越高勒\n這個電子煙的使用比例這麼高\n我希望你們可以思考一下到底應該要怎麼樣把這件事情讓它的這個比率不要再持續的升高甚至要下降再來電子煙最可怕的危害是裡面不知道加了什麼東西嘛對不對我想你們也很頭痛但裡面到底加了什麼東西那刑事局的統計警方今年1月至8月查獲的電子煙油案是1415件那送檢吶吶含這個大麻的部分大概是53%喵喵卡西桶是28%\n上司菸油依托米子6.1%我想剛剛很多人問了所以這6.1%剛剛在短短的7到9月就抓了這麼多代表有非常多的黑素在外面亂竄還有安非他命0.6%那混分部分混合兩種以上毒品\n也就是說電子煙的載具實際上就是載具它已經成為了吸食毒品的工具那結合將近10%的高中生電子煙的吸食率毒品進入校園的情況是非常非常的嚴重我想要請問一下因為我看到很多大家都在講電子煙可能在講那煙油煙彈我想問一下載具的部分有哪一個單位管理載具的部分是衛福部管嗎\n採聚是衛福部管嗎?燕子煙是我們管理。採聚,它下面的採聚,所以你們整個這樣管起來,都是屬於你們?對,燕子煙是我們管理。都是屬於你們管理嗎?但是如果採聚裡面含有其他的物質,比如說毒品化,就會依毒品防治條例來做管理。好,所以基本上,採聚是你們管理,是包含那個煙油也都是你們管嗎?就是整支是不是?都是你們管?\n電子煙是包含載具加上煙油還是你是分開來是合在一起合在一起那如果拆開來都算是你的嘛對不對就是不管是載具或是跟委員報告如果這個煙彈本身是含有其他物質那就有其他的法律來協同管沒關係但我只是想要說那誰要負責去把這件事情管控好就是說不會有這麼多非法的電子煙的載具\n因為現在情況是這樣加熱煙是加強管制但是不禁止那電子煙是完全禁止對不對但現在問題就是兩者外形也很相似嘛你可以看一下現在甚至有這種那你要怎麼算這種就是一方面是加熱煙後面可以抽電子煙那這個你有辦法你怎麼管理目前為止是全禁包括加熱煙跟電子煙都是全禁加熱煙就是不是加強管制\n現在還沒有任何一個品牌通過所以現在目前市面上加熱衣跟電源的所以照理說你全部看到全部都應該要禁止嘛對不對可是現在的比例就是很糟糕啊對不對所以我想要問說那未來未來如果這兩個混在一起你要怎麼去把它分辨出來我們會再瞭解清楚瞭解清楚它混在一起使用的一個狀態\n所以你們現在有掌握這個狀態嗎?我們目前知道是有混用但是因為它都是全面禁止兩種煙品都是全面禁止的所以我們是全面查緝的在部長但是現在情況不是將加熱煙視為你們想要視為是3C然後衛福部沒有什麼想要管理嗎?你們把加熱煙變成視為3C產品\n委員其實加熱煙是因為它的煙草柱本身是煙草所以我們納入《煙害防治法》來管轄那按照我們的法裡面的部分它必須經過我們健康風險評估後才能夠上市所以截至目前為止沒有任何一家長…我想要問那之前有你們有在說你們覺得加熱煙載具視為3C這件事情\n加熱煙的載具是經濟部管轄我們管轄上面的那個煙草柱對那你現在就是會變成是你模糊不清你剛剛又說加熱煙這些也算是那你現在加熱煙載具又算是經濟部管轄\n我們會跟經濟部管轄加熱菸的載具\n這是有電子煙跟加熱煙兩種所以我要提醒部長就是現在網路就是很氾濫你可以否認嗎?現在氾濫這件事情你可以否認嗎?不能嘛對不對?到處都是買得到啊所以你看這PTT上面甚至有什麼電子的品牌叫做自己叫Canty啊Vape電子煙專門店啊煙導賞啊到處買得到甚至透過便利商店還可以在這個交貨付款啊\n所以我想要問你們這個部分包含剛剛這個模糊不清的這個權責你們到底可不可以統一要統一的去處理這件事情因為你現在連你自己的報告上面我覺得很可笑是這樣子啊你的今天這份報告你們說中央與地方透過加強茶氣、電子煙等類煙品予以重罰將可避免電子煙彈電子煙彈這個成為毒品載具你寫出這句話\n結論是這樣嗎?對不對?所以你現在這樣笑我不懂你這個笑是什麼意思啊就是你寫出來是你們說你們現在加強然後透過中央地方可以避免可是結果就不是這樣啊\n所以這部分我真的是希望部長請加油你們可不可以給本席或是給委員會一個報告就是說究竟你們這個權責應該怎麼分因為你現在講出來都是空話你並沒有結論並不是這樣結果並不是這樣現在就是事實上在校園裡面就是非常多的這種電子煙品 2021年8.8%現在多少%\n這個是很誇張的事情我想這個必須要我們一起努力跨部會來努力所以你不能說只有跨部會努力這個部分到底誰要到時候你們要整合起來剛剛報告這個部分是我們站在煙害防治法方面我們會中央地方要合作應該是可以減少這樣的一個電子M的使用那當然這個剛剛也有提到校園或者是教育部\n對,所以我意思是這個東西到底推來推去就會有問題所以你到底怎麼跨部會整合真的是可以有一個強而有力的執法這個是重要的事情我們必須要保護我們尤其是兒少的一個健康我想這是國人非常擔心的事情這個一定我們絕對不會推卸任何責任一定是全力來跟各部會全力來努力\n請教部長現在各種醫事機構在經營上是不是比較困難?因為本席從9月底到現在不斷接獲醫藥相關的團體陳情這個電費調漲的事宜那我其實上次也跟你問過跟你請託過製藥產業跟藥局的電價是不是可以予以動漲或見面?\n那我今天要再針對這些所有的醫事機構包含這個諮商所、物療所跟驗光所也就是行業類別是8、6、9的各類的醫事機構跟你請託我當初也拜託你去跟經濟部行政院反映動長變價\n部長我想政府現在正在推動這個健康台灣的政策要有健康台灣就要有完整的醫療的照護體系那各個醫事機構無論是醫院或是藥局或是社區等等都是這個都在社區的第一線我想他們就是健康台灣的根基不是嗎\n那現在醫療機構大部分受限於健保給付所以就是各類的醫事服務的健保給付如果沒有增加物價通膨、電費高漲的情況之下部長你覺得這樣子健康台灣的根基這個各類的各類的這種醫療機構、醫師機構會不會有所影響會不會也有可能影響到人民就醫的這個的品質或成本\n報告委員謝謝您為醫院跟藥局的爭取那這個部分都已經是動長了我知道這是過去發生的事情所以我剛剛說這件事情各個其他的醫師類別我們\n對,但是其實過去你們一直掛16萬然後我們會轉給經濟部但是絕對沒有說因為您寫的說衛福部沒找到經濟部因為經濟部長是啊,我那天就問他經濟部長我就問他說我們的衛福部長到底有沒有來找你他支支吾吾不敢講啊\n我甚至問說下面單位有沒有溝通啊他最後跟我說他比較忙啊那我意思是說那你是比較不忙啊沒有啦我們跟經濟部長是隨時可以聯繫的那你到底有沒有去反映嘛我是說我們有把那個申請是轉過去給經濟部所以你有去反映嘛對不對有有有那最後沒有最後這個部分我是想要告訴你因為那天我去問他喔他跟我說你沒有找他嘛\n後續的部﹖我們已經轉給經濟部就是說後續那個您剛剛講的其他的議事相關的我們已經把那個陳千涵也有給經濟部那經濟部會去請審議方面說真的我是覺得除了這個轉涵之外你想我想您還可以再多做一些努力畢竟你是衛福部長你可以真的瞭解這些狀況請你也可以多努力一點不是只是我轉過去而已你又不是總機對不對\n我會跟那個行業講說明說大概他可以這樣怎麼樣去論述會比較對所以我希望你不要成為一個總機部長好不好你不要轉過去就好這些人一直不斷的在承襲這些狀況我們也給他專業的指導好謝謝部長好謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:04.885 --> 00:07.327\n謝謝主席。有請我們部長。部長你好。今天討論這個議題是非常嚴重的一個議題。自我們《煙害防治法》112年的3月22日開始公告實施全面禁止電子煙至今也超過一年半。\n\n00:28.746 --> 00:47.267\n但是我們可以在大街小巷其實可以看到很多民眾或者是各個地方甚至校園都可以看到這個吸食電子煙的狀況而且電子煙的載具跟它那個煙油是可以輕易購買取得那我想執法不力是最大的一個原因之一\n\n00:48.649 --> 00:56.139\n衛福部資料顯示,從今年9月中央及地方衛生局依《煙害防治法》裁罰639件電子煙違規案件,平均一天不到2件,今年2月至4月甚至只有4件\n\n01:04.890 --> 01:32.182\n那7月7到9月的暑假大概是294件那反觀我們全國的警方7月到9月同一期間查獲喪失煙油違法案件是681件為衛福部的2.3倍我想要請問部長這樣的數字是不是反映衛福部對於非法新興煙品的怠惰跟失職因為這個數據差太多因為我們衛福部是用煙害防制法來\n\n01:33.973 --> 01:40.398\n這部分你們有什麼辦法可以加強執法的部分因為這個數字真的差太多光喪失煙油在警察的這個同一期間7到9月2個月就是690幾件\n\n02:00.933 --> 02:21.751\n對跟委員報告其實我們除了實際開立處分書之外我們的這個查緝的力道就是包括稽查的這個案件數也到高達23萬件次當然就如部長所說的查緝如果違法的話他必須依照陰害防治法的行政程序來完成我跟你說啦\n\n02:22.371 --> 02:36.318\n這個在國建署的調查反正國中生還有跟高中職生的電子煙使用率分別是從2018年的1.9%與3.4%到2021年上升到3.9%跟8.8%到2021年到現在2024年我想最新的數據只會多不會少所以代表這個執法的結果論來看就是有問題啊就是有問題嘛這不然怎麼可能比例越來越高勒\n\n02:52.408 --> 02:53.271\n這個電子煙的使用比例這麼高\n\n02:54.738 --> 03:22.671\n我希望你們可以思考一下到底應該要怎麼樣把這件事情讓它的這個比率不要再持續的升高甚至要下降再來電子煙最可怕的危害是裡面不知道加了什麼東西嘛對不對我想你們也很頭痛但裡面到底加了什麼東西那刑事局的統計警方今年1月至8月查獲的電子煙油案是1415件那送檢吶吶含這個大麻的部分大概是53%喵喵卡西桶是28%\n\n03:24.500 --> 03:40.610\n上司菸油依托米子6.1%我想剛剛很多人問了所以這6.1%剛剛在短短的7到9月就抓了這麼多代表有非常多的黑素在外面亂竄還有安非他命0.6%那混分部分混合兩種以上毒品\n\n03:41.691 --> 04:06.895\n也就是說電子煙的載具實際上就是載具它已經成為了吸食毒品的工具那結合將近10%的高中生電子煙的吸食率毒品進入校園的情況是非常非常的嚴重我想要請問一下因為我看到很多大家都在講電子煙可能在講那煙油煙彈我想問一下載具的部分有哪一個單位管理載具的部分是衛福部管嗎\n\n04:08.567 --> 04:29.450\n採聚是衛福部管嗎?燕子煙是我們管理。採聚,它下面的採聚,所以你們整個這樣管起來,都是屬於你們?對,燕子煙是我們管理。都是屬於你們管理嗎?但是如果採聚裡面含有其他的物質,比如說毒品化,就會依毒品防治條例來做管理。好,所以基本上,採聚是你們管理,是包含那個煙油也都是你們管嗎?就是整支是不是?都是你們管?\n\n04:31.251 --> 04:53.445\n電子煙是包含載具加上煙油還是你是分開來是合在一起合在一起那如果拆開來都算是你的嘛對不對就是不管是載具或是跟委員報告如果這個煙彈本身是含有其他物質那就有其他的法律來協同管沒關係但我只是想要說那誰要負責去把這件事情管控好就是說不會有這麼多非法的電子煙的載具\n\n04:55.026 --> 05:22.396\n因為現在情況是這樣加熱煙是加強管制但是不禁止那電子煙是完全禁止對不對但現在問題就是兩者外形也很相似嘛你可以看一下現在甚至有這種那你要怎麼算這種就是一方面是加熱煙後面可以抽電子煙那這個你有辦法你怎麼管理目前為止是全禁包括加熱煙跟電子煙都是全禁加熱煙就是不是加強管制\n\n05:23.496 --> 05:43.003\n現在還沒有任何一個品牌通過所以現在目前市面上加熱衣跟電源的所以照理說你全部看到全部都應該要禁止嘛對不對可是現在的比例就是很糟糕啊對不對所以我想要問說那未來未來如果這兩個混在一起你要怎麼去把它分辨出來我們會再瞭解清楚瞭解清楚它混在一起使用的一個狀態\n\n05:51.909 --> 06:13.638\n所以你們現在有掌握這個狀態嗎?我們目前知道是有混用但是因為它都是全面禁止兩種煙品都是全面禁止的所以我們是全面查緝的在部長但是現在情況不是將加熱煙視為你們想要視為是3C然後衛福部沒有什麼想要管理嗎?你們把加熱煙變成視為3C產品\n\n06:15.279 --> 06:37.035\n委員其實加熱煙是因為它的煙草柱本身是煙草所以我們納入《煙害防治法》來管轄那按照我們的法裡面的部分它必須經過我們健康風險評估後才能夠上市所以截至目前為止沒有任何一家長…我想要問那之前有你們有在說你們覺得加熱煙載具視為3C這件事情\n\n06:39.372 --> 06:51.798\n加熱煙的載具是經濟部管轄我們管轄上面的那個煙草柱對那你現在就是會變成是你模糊不清你剛剛又說加熱煙這些也算是那你現在加熱煙載具又算是經濟部管轄\n\n06:52.622 --> 06:54.803\n我們會跟經濟部管轄加熱菸的載具\n\n07:14.115 --> 07:41.925\n這是有電子煙跟加熱煙兩種所以我要提醒部長就是現在網路就是很氾濫你可以否認嗎?現在氾濫這件事情你可以否認嗎?不能嘛對不對?到處都是買得到啊所以你看這PTT上面甚至有什麼電子的品牌叫做自己叫Canty啊Vape電子煙專門店啊煙導賞啊到處買得到甚至透過便利商店還可以在這個交貨付款啊\n\n07:42.725 --> 08:07.200\n所以我想要問你們這個部分包含剛剛這個模糊不清的這個權責你們到底可不可以統一要統一的去處理這件事情因為你現在連你自己的報告上面我覺得很可笑是這樣子啊你的今天這份報告你們說中央與地方透過加強茶氣、電子煙等類煙品予以重罰將可避免電子煙彈電子煙彈這個成為毒品載具你寫出這句話\n\n08:13.014 --> 08:25.640\n結論是這樣嗎?對不對?所以你現在這樣笑我不懂你這個笑是什麼意思啊就是你寫出來是你們說你們現在加強然後透過中央地方可以避免可是結果就不是這樣啊\n\n08:27.290 --> 08:49.124\n所以這部分我真的是希望部長請加油你們可不可以給本席或是給委員會一個報告就是說究竟你們這個權責應該怎麼分因為你現在講出來都是空話你並沒有結論並不是這樣結果並不是這樣現在就是事實上在校園裡面就是非常多的這種電子煙品2021年8.8%現在多少%\n\n08:52.932 --> 09:16.816\n這個是很誇張的事情我想這個必須要我們一起努力跨部會來努力所以你不能說只有跨部會努力這個部分到底誰要到時候你們要整合起來剛剛報告這個部分是我們站在煙害防治法方面我們會中央地方要合作應該是可以減少這樣的一個電子M的使用那當然這個剛剛也有提到校園或者是教育部\n\n09:18.036 --> 09:42.185\n對,所以我意思是這個東西到底推來推去就會有問題所以你到底怎麼跨部會整合真的是可以有一個強而有力的執法這個是重要的事情我們必須要保護我們尤其是兒少的一個健康我想這是國人非常擔心的事情這個一定我們絕對不會推卸任何責任一定是全力來跟各部會全力來努力\n\n09:42.765 --> 09:48.586\n請教部長現在各種醫事機構在經營上是不是比較困難?因為本席從9月底到現在不斷接獲醫藥相關的團體陳情這個電費調漲的事宜那我其實上次也跟你問過跟你請託過製藥產業跟藥局的電價是不是可以予以動漲或見面?\n\n10:04.850 --> 10:18.961\n那我今天要再針對這些所有的醫事機構包含這個諮商所、物療所跟驗光所也就是行業類別是8、6、9的各類的醫事機構跟你請託我當初也拜託你去跟經濟部行政院反映動長變價\n\n10:20.342 --> 10:38.684\n部長我想政府現在正在推動這個健康台灣的政策要有健康台灣就要有完整的醫療的照護體系那各個醫事機構無論是醫院或是藥局或是社區等等都是這個都在社區的第一線我想他們就是健康台灣的根基不是嗎\n\n10:39.705 --> 10:59.572\n那現在醫療機構大部分受限於健保給付所以就是各類的醫事服務的健保給付如果沒有增加物價通膨、電費高漲的情況之下部長你覺得這樣子健康台灣的根基這個各類的各類的這種醫療機構、醫師機構會不會有所影響會不會也有可能影響到人民就醫的這個的品質或成本\n\n11:00.212 --> 11:08.403\n報告委員謝謝您為醫院跟藥局的爭取那這個部分都已經是動長了我知道這是過去發生的事情所以我剛剛說這件事情各個其他的醫師類別我們\n\n11:15.411 --> 11:20.976\n對,但是其實過去你們一直掛16萬然後我們會轉給經濟部但是絕對沒有說因為您寫的說衛福部沒找到經濟部因為經濟部長是啊,我那天就問他經濟部長我就問他說我們的衛福部長到底有沒有來找你他支支吾吾不敢講啊\n\n11:38.750 --> 12:01.430\n我甚至問說下面單位有沒有溝通啊他最後跟我說他比較忙啊那我意思是說那你是比較不忙啊沒有啦我們跟經濟部長是隨時可以聯繫的那你到底有沒有去反映嘛我是說我們有把那個申請是轉過去給經濟部所以你有去反映嘛對不對有有有那最後沒有最後這個部分我是想要告訴你因為那天我去問他喔他跟我說你沒有找他嘛\n\n12:01.950 --> 12:27.669\n後續的部﹖我們已經轉給經濟部就是說後續那個您剛剛講的其他的議事相關的我們已經把那個陳千涵也有給經濟部那經濟部會去請審議方面說真的我是覺得除了這個轉涵之外你想我想您還可以再多做一些努力畢竟你是衛福部長你可以真的瞭解這些狀況請你也可以多努力一點不是只是我轉過去而已你又不是總機對不對\n\n12:29.190 --> 12:41.303\n我會跟那個行業講說明說大概他可以這樣怎麼樣去論述會比較對所以我希望你不要成為一個總機部長好不好你不要轉過去就好這些人一直不斷的在承襲這些狀況我們也給他專業的指導好謝謝部長好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":4.885,"end":7.327,"text":"謝謝主席。有請我們部長。部長你好。今天討論這個議題是非常嚴重的一個議題。自我們《煙害防治法》112年的3月22日開始公告實施全面禁止電子煙至今也超過一年半。"},{"start":28.746,"end":47.267,"text":"但是我們可以在大街小巷其實可以看到很多民眾或者是各個地方甚至校園都可以看到這個吸食電子煙的狀況而且電子煙的載具跟它那個煙油是可以輕易購買取得那我想執法不力是最大的一個原因之一"},{"start":48.649,"end":56.139,"text":"衛福部資料顯示,從今年9月中央及地方衛生局依《煙害防治法》裁罰639件電子煙違規案件,平均一天不到2件,今年2月至4月甚至只有4件"},{"start":64.89,"end":92.182,"text":"那7月7到9月的暑假大概是294件那反觀我們全國的警方7月到9月同一期間查獲喪失煙油違法案件是681件為衛福部的2.3倍我想要請問部長這樣的數字是不是反映衛福部對於非法新興煙品的怠惰跟失職因為這個數據差太多因為我們衛福部是用煙害防制法來"},{"start":93.973,"end":100.398,"text":"這部分你們有什麼辦法可以加強執法的部分因為這個數字真的差太多光喪失煙油在警察的這個同一期間7到9月2個月就是690幾件"},{"start":120.933,"end":141.751,"text":"對 跟委員報告其實我們除了實際開立處分書之外我們的這個查緝的力道就是包括稽查的這個案件數也到高達23萬件次當然就如部長所說的查緝如果違法的話他必須依照陰害防治法的行政程序來完成我跟你說啦"},{"start":142.371,"end":156.318,"text":"這個在國建署的調查反正國中生還有跟高中職生的電子煙使用率分別是從2018年的1.9%與3.4%到2021年上升到3.9%跟8.8%到2021年到現在2024年我想最新的數據只會多不會少所以代表這個執法的結果論來看就是有問題啊就是有問題嘛這不然怎麼可能比例越來越高勒"},{"start":172.408,"end":173.271,"text":"這個電子煙的使用比例這麼高"},{"start":174.738,"end":202.671,"text":"我希望你們可以思考一下到底應該要怎麼樣把這件事情讓它的這個比率不要再持續的升高甚至要下降再來電子煙最可怕的危害是裡面不知道加了什麼東西嘛對不對我想你們也很頭痛但裡面到底加了什麼東西那刑事局的統計警方今年1月至8月查獲的電子煙油案是1415件那送檢吶吶含這個大麻的部分大概是53%喵喵卡西桶是28%"},{"start":204.5,"end":220.61,"text":"上司菸油依托米子6.1%我想剛剛很多人問了所以這6.1%剛剛在短短的7到9月就抓了這麼多代表有非常多的黑素在外面亂竄還有安非他命0.6%那混分部分混合兩種以上毒品"},{"start":221.691,"end":246.895,"text":"也就是說電子煙的載具實際上就是載具它已經成為了吸食毒品的工具那結合將近10%的高中生電子煙的吸食率毒品進入校園的情況是非常非常的嚴重我想要請問一下因為我看到很多大家都在講電子煙可能在講那煙油煙彈我想問一下載具的部分有哪一個單位管理載具的部分是衛福部管嗎"},{"start":248.567,"end":269.45,"text":"採聚是衛福部管嗎?燕子煙是我們管理。採聚,它下面的採聚,所以你們整個這樣管起來,都是屬於你們?對,燕子煙是我們管理。都是屬於你們管理嗎?但是如果採聚裡面含有其他的物質,比如說毒品化,就會依毒品防治條例來做管理。好,所以基本上,採聚是你們管理,是包含那個煙油也都是你們管嗎?就是整支是不是?都是你們管?"},{"start":271.251,"end":293.445,"text":"電子煙是包含載具加上煙油還是你是分開來是合在一起合在一起那如果拆開來都算是你的嘛對不對就是不管是載具或是跟委員報告如果這個煙彈本身是含有其他物質那就有其他的法律來協同管沒關係但我只是想要說那誰要負責去把這件事情管控好就是說不會有這麼多非法的電子煙的載具"},{"start":295.026,"end":322.396,"text":"因為現在情況是這樣加熱煙是加強管制但是不禁止那電子煙是完全禁止對不對但現在問題就是兩者外形也很相似嘛你可以看一下現在甚至有這種那你要怎麼算這種就是一方面是加熱煙後面可以抽電子煙那這個你有辦法你怎麼管理目前為止是全禁包括加熱煙跟電子煙都是全禁加熱煙就是不是加強管制"},{"start":323.496,"end":343.003,"text":"現在還沒有任何一個品牌通過所以現在目前市面上加熱衣跟電源的所以照理說你全部看到全部都應該要禁止嘛對不對可是現在的比例就是很糟糕啊對不對所以我想要問說那未來未來如果這兩個混在一起你要怎麼去把它分辨出來我們會再瞭解清楚瞭解清楚它混在一起使用的一個狀態"},{"start":351.909,"end":373.638,"text":"所以你們現在有掌握這個狀態嗎?我們目前知道是有混用但是因為它都是全面禁止兩種煙品都是全面禁止的所以我們是全面查緝的在部長但是現在情況不是將加熱煙視為你們想要視為是3C然後衛福部沒有什麼想要管理嗎?你們把加熱煙變成視為3C產品"},{"start":375.279,"end":397.035,"text":"委員其實加熱煙是因為它的煙草柱本身是煙草所以我們納入《煙害防治法》來管轄那按照我們的法裡面的部分它必須經過我們健康風險評估後才能夠上市所以截至目前為止沒有任何一家長…我想要問那之前有你們有在說你們覺得加熱煙載具視為3C這件事情"},{"start":399.372,"end":411.798,"text":"加熱煙的載具是經濟部管轄我們管轄上面的那個煙草柱對那你現在就是會變成是你模糊不清你剛剛又說加熱煙這些也算是那你現在加熱煙載具又算是經濟部管轄"},{"start":412.622,"end":414.803,"text":"我們會跟經濟部管轄加熱菸的載具"},{"start":434.115,"end":461.925,"text":"這是有電子煙跟加熱煙兩種所以我要提醒部長就是現在網路就是很氾濫你可以否認嗎?現在氾濫這件事情你可以否認嗎?不能嘛對不對?到處都是買得到啊所以你看這PTT上面甚至有什麼電子的品牌叫做自己叫Canty啊Vape電子煙專門店啊煙導賞啊到處買得到甚至透過便利商店還可以在這個交貨付款啊"},{"start":462.725,"end":487.2,"text":"所以我想要問你們這個部分包含剛剛這個模糊不清的這個權責你們到底可不可以統一要統一的去處理這件事情因為你現在連你自己的報告上面我覺得很可笑是這樣子啊你的今天這份報告你們說中央與地方透過加強茶氣、電子煙等類煙品予以重罰將可避免電子煙彈電子煙彈這個成為毒品載具你寫出這句話"},{"start":493.014,"end":505.64,"text":"結論是這樣嗎?對不對?所以你現在這樣笑我不懂你這個笑是什麼意思啊就是你寫出來是你們說你們現在加強然後透過中央地方可以避免可是結果就不是這樣啊"},{"start":507.29,"end":529.124,"text":"所以這部分我真的是希望部長請加油你們可不可以給本席或是給委員會一個報告就是說究竟你們這個權責應該怎麼分因為你現在講出來都是空話你並沒有結論並不是這樣結果並不是這樣現在就是事實上在校園裡面就是非常多的這種電子煙品 2021年8.8%現在多少%"},{"start":532.932,"end":556.816,"text":"這個是很誇張的事情我想這個必須要我們一起努力跨部會來努力所以你不能說只有跨部會努力這個部分到底誰要到時候你們要整合起來剛剛報告這個部分是我們站在煙害防治法方面我們會中央地方要合作應該是可以減少這樣的一個電子M的使用那當然這個剛剛也有提到校園或者是教育部"},{"start":558.036,"end":582.185,"text":"對,所以我意思是這個東西到底推來推去就會有問題所以你到底怎麼跨部會整合真的是可以有一個強而有力的執法這個是重要的事情我們必須要保護我們尤其是兒少的一個健康我想這是國人非常擔心的事情這個一定我們絕對不會推卸任何責任一定是全力來跟各部會全力來努力"},{"start":582.765,"end":588.586,"text":"請教部長現在各種醫事機構在經營上是不是比較困難?因為本席從9月底到現在不斷接獲醫藥相關的團體陳情這個電費調漲的事宜那我其實上次也跟你問過跟你請託過製藥產業跟藥局的電價是不是可以予以動漲或見面?"},{"start":604.85,"end":618.961,"text":"那我今天要再針對這些所有的醫事機構包含這個諮商所、物療所跟驗光所也就是行業類別是8、6、9的各類的醫事機構跟你請託我當初也拜託你去跟經濟部行政院反映動長變價"},{"start":620.342,"end":638.684,"text":"部長我想政府現在正在推動這個健康台灣的政策要有健康台灣就要有完整的醫療的照護體系那各個醫事機構無論是醫院或是藥局或是社區等等都是這個都在社區的第一線我想他們就是健康台灣的根基不是嗎"},{"start":639.705,"end":659.572,"text":"那現在醫療機構大部分受限於健保給付所以就是各類的醫事服務的健保給付如果沒有增加物價通膨、電費高漲的情況之下部長你覺得這樣子健康台灣的根基這個各類的各類的這種醫療機構、醫師機構會不會有所影響會不會也有可能影響到人民就醫的這個的品質或成本"},{"start":660.212,"end":668.403,"text":"報告委員謝謝您為醫院跟藥局的爭取那這個部分都已經是動長了我知道這是過去發生的事情所以我剛剛說這件事情各個其他的醫師類別我們"},{"start":675.411,"end":680.976,"text":"對,但是其實過去你們一直掛16萬然後我們會轉給經濟部但是絕對沒有說因為您寫的說衛福部沒找到經濟部因為經濟部長是啊,我那天就問他經濟部長我就問他說我們的衛福部長到底有沒有來找你他支支吾吾不敢講啊"},{"start":698.75,"end":721.43,"text":"我甚至問說下面單位有沒有溝通啊他最後跟我說他比較忙啊那我意思是說那你是比較不忙啊沒有啦我們跟經濟部長是隨時可以聯繫的那你到底有沒有去反映嘛我是說我們有把那個申請是轉過去給經濟部所以你有去反映嘛對不對有有有那最後沒有最後這個部分我是想要告訴你因為那天我去問他喔他跟我說你沒有找他嘛"},{"start":721.95,"end":747.669,"text":"後續的部﹖我們已經轉給經濟部就是說後續那個您剛剛講的其他的議事相關的我們已經把那個陳千涵也有給經濟部那經濟部會去請審議方面說真的我是覺得除了這個轉涵之外你想我想您還可以再多做一些努力畢竟你是衛福部長你可以真的瞭解這些狀況請你也可以多努力一點不是只是我轉過去而已你又不是總機對不對"},{"start":749.19,"end":761.303,"text":"我會跟那個行業講說明說大概他可以這樣怎麼樣去論述會比較對所以我希望你不要成為一個總機部長好不好你不要轉過去就好這些人一直不斷的在承襲這些狀況我們也給他專業的指導好謝謝部長好謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":641,"blocks":[["廖委員偉翔：（10時13分）謝謝主席，有請部長。"],["邱部長泰源：委員好。"],["廖委員偉翔：部長你好。今天討論這個議題是非常嚴重的一個議題，自菸害防制法112年3月22日開始公告實施，全面禁止電子煙至今也超過一年半，但是我們在大街小巷其實可以看到很多民眾，或者是各個地方，甚至校園，都可以看到吸食電子煙的狀況，而且電子煙的載具跟它的煙油可以輕易購買取得，我想執法不力是最大的一個原因之一。","衛福部的資料顯示，今年前九月中央跟地方衛生局依菸害防制法裁罰電子煙的違規案件大概是639件，平均一天其實不到2件；今年2月到4月甚至只有4件；7月到9月的暑假其間大概是294件。反觀我們全國警方7月到9月同一期間查獲喪屍煙油違法案件是681件，為衛福部的2.3倍。我想要請問部長，這樣的數字是不是反映衛福部對於非法新興菸品的怠惰跟失職？因為這個數據差太多。"],["邱部長泰源：因為我們衛福部是用菸害防制法來處理，行政程序比較長一點，所以不像……"],["廖委員偉翔：這個差異非常大，這個喪屍煙油……"],["邱部長泰源：這個部分我們會請健康署研擬如何改善。"],["廖委員偉翔：你們有什麼辦法可以加強執法？因為這個數字真的差太多，光喪屍煙油在同一期間（7到9月），兩個月警察查到的件數就是六百九十幾件，你們查緝的部分到底怎麼做？"],["賈副署長淑麗：跟委員報告，我們除了實際開立處分書之外，我們查緝的力道，包括稽查的案件數也高達23萬件次，但就如部長所說的，查緝如果違法的話，他必須依照菸害防制法的行政程序來完成……"],["廖委員偉翔：好，我跟你說啦！根據國健署的調查，國中生跟高中職生的電子煙使用率，分別是從2018年的1.9%與3.4%，到2021年上升到3.9%與8.8%，到現在2024年，我想最新的數據只會多，不會少，代表以執法的結果論來看就是有問題，不然怎麼可能比例越來越高呢？電子煙的使用比例這麼高，我希望你們可以思考一下到底應該要怎麼樣讓它的比例不要再持續的升高，甚至要下降。","再來，電子煙最可怕的危害是裡面不知道加了什麼東西，對不對？我想你們也很頭痛，到底裡面到底加了什麼東西。根據刑事局的統計，警方今年1月至8月查獲的電子煙油案是1,415件，送檢含大麻的部分大概是53%、「喵喵」卡西酮是28%、「喪屍煙油」依托咪酯6.1%。我想剛剛很多人問了，在短短的7到9月就抓了6.1%這麼多，代表有非常多的黑數在外面亂竄，還有安非他命0.6%，部分混合兩種以上毒品，也就是說，電子煙的載具實際上已經成為吸食毒品的工具，結合將近10%高中生電子煙的吸食率，毒品進入校園的情況是非常非常的嚴重。因為大家講到電子煙，可能都會講煙油、煙彈，我想問一下，載具的部分是由哪一個單位管理？是衛福部管嗎？"],["賈副署長淑麗：電子煙是我們管理。"],["廖委員偉翔：它下面的載具呢？所以你們是整個管，都是屬於你們管的？"],["賈副署長淑麗：對，電子煙是我們管理。"],["廖委員偉翔：都是屬於你們管理嘛？"],["賈副署長淑麗：但是如果載具裡面含有其他的物質，比如說毒品的話，就會依毒品防制條例來做管理。"],["廖委員偉翔：好，所以基本上載具是你們管理，包含煙油也都是你們管，就是整支都是你們管。"],["賈副署長淑麗：電子煙是我們管。"],["廖委員偉翔：電子煙是包含載具加上煙油，還是是分開來的？"],["賈副署長淑麗：是合在一起。"],["廖委員偉翔：如果拆開來都算是你的嘛？就是不管是載具或是煙油……"],["賈副署長淑麗：跟委員報告，如果這個煙彈本身是含有其他物質，那就有其他的法律來協同管理。"],["廖委員偉翔：沒關係，我只是想要問，誰要負責去把這件事情管控好？就是說不會有這麼多非法的電子煙的載具。因為現在的情況是這樣，加熱菸是加強管制，但是不禁止；電子煙是完全禁止，對不對？"],["賈副署長淑麗：對。"],["廖委員偉翔：但現在問題是兩者外形也很相似，你可以看一下，現在甚至有圖上這種，那你要怎麼算？這種就是一方面是加熱菸，後面還可以抽電子煙，這種要你怎麼管理？"],["賈副署長淑麗：目前為止是全禁，包括加熱菸跟電子煙都是全禁。"],["廖委員偉翔：加熱菸不是加強管制？"],["賈副署長淑麗：現在還沒有任何一個品牌通過，所以目前市面上加熱菸跟電子煙都全禁。"],["廖委員偉翔：所以照理說，你全部看到，全部都應該要禁止嘛，對不對？可是現在的比例就是很糟糕啊！所以我想問，未來如果這兩個混在一起，你要怎麼去把它分辨出來？"],["賈副署長淑麗：我們會再了解清楚它混在一起使用的狀態。"],["廖委員偉翔：所以你們現在有掌握這個狀態嗎？"],["賈副署長淑麗：我們目前知道是有混用，但是因為兩種菸品都是全面禁止的，所以我們是全面查緝。"],["廖委員偉翔：但部長，現在的情況不是你們想要將加熱菸的載具視為是3C產品，衛福部沒有什麼想要管理，你們要把加熱菸的載具視為3C產品嘛？"],["賈副署長淑麗：委員，其實加熱菸是因為它的菸草柱本身是菸草，所以我們納入菸害防制法來管轄，而按照我們法，它必須經過我們健康風險評估後才能夠上市，所以截至目前為止，沒有任何一家……"],["廖委員偉翔：我想要問，之前你們有說你們覺得要將加熱菸的載具視為3C產品這件事情嗎？"],["賈副署長淑麗：加熱菸的載具是經濟部管轄，我們是管轄上面的菸草柱。"],["廖委員偉翔：對，現在就是會變成模糊不清，你剛剛說加熱菸這些算是你們管轄，然後現在加熱菸的載具又算是經濟部管轄。"],["賈副署長淑麗：經濟部管轄加熱菸的載具……"],["廖委員偉翔：所以我就是點出這個問題嘛！你剛剛一下子說這個管、那個管，然後不同部，變成到底是誰要負這個權責，導致你現在很難……"],["賈副署長淑麗：了解。"],["廖委員偉翔：對不對？你剛剛自己又露出來說，這個是經濟部管，然後你剛剛又說全部是你管。"],["賈副署長淑麗：對，了解委員的意見，所以我們會跨部會來合作。"],["廖委員偉翔：所以我要提醒……"],["賈副署長淑麗：就是有電子煙跟加熱菸兩種。"],["廖委員偉翔：所以我要提醒部長，現在網路就是很氾濫，對於氾濫這件事情，你可以否認嗎？不能嘛！到處都買得到，所以你看PTT上面，甚至有電子煙的品牌自己叫CANDY，還有電子煙專門店、煙島桑，到處都買得到，甚至透過便利商店還可以交貨付款。所以我想要問你們這個部分，包含剛剛模糊不清的權責，你們到底可不可以統一？要統一去處理這件事情。因為現在連你自己的報告上面，我覺得很可笑的是這樣子，你們今天這份報告上說，中央與地方透過加強查緝電子煙等類菸品予以重罰，將可避免電子煙彈成為毒品載具。你寫出這句話，結論是這樣嗎？對不對？你現在這樣笑，我不懂你這個笑是什麼意思？你們寫說，你們現在加強查緝，然後透過中央、地方可以避免，可是結果就不是這樣啊！所以這個部分，我真的是希望部長加油，你們可不可以給本席或是給委員會一個報告，就是究竟這個權責應該怎麼分？因為你現在講出來的都是空話，結果並不是這樣，事實上現在在校園裡面就是非常多這種電子煙品，2021年8.8%，現在都多少%了？這個是很誇張的事情。"],["邱部長泰源：報告委員，我想這個必須要我們一起努力，跨部會來努力。"],["廖委員偉翔：所以你不能說只有跨部會努力，這個部分到時候你們要整合起來，好不好？"],["邱部長泰源：剛剛報告這個部分是我們站在菸害防制法方面，我們會中央、地方來合作，這樣應該是可以減少電子煙的使用。當然剛剛也有提到校園或者是教育部……"],["廖委員偉翔：對，所以我的意思就是，這個東西推來推去就會有問題，所以你們到底要怎麼跨部會整合，才能真的有一個強而有力的執法。"],["邱部長泰源：這個是重要的事情，我們必須要保護我們的國人，尤其是兒少的健康。"],["廖委員偉翔：我想這是國人非常擔心的事情。"],["邱部長泰源：我們絕對不會推卸任何的責任，一定是全力來協同，跟各部會全力來努力。"],["廖委員偉翔：好，請教部長另外一題，現在各種醫事機構在經營上是不是比較困難？部長，因為本席從9月底到現在不斷的接獲醫藥相關團體陳情電費調漲的事宜，其實我上次也跟你問過、跟你請託過，製藥產業跟藥局的電價是不是可以予以凍漲或減免？我今天要再針對這些所有的醫事機構，包含諮商所、物療所跟驗光所，也就是行業類別是869各類的醫事機構跟你請託，我當初也拜託你去跟經濟部、行政院反映凍漲電價的事。部長，政府現在正在推動健康臺灣的政策，而要有健康臺灣，就要先有完整的醫療照護體系，各個醫事機構，無論是醫院、藥局或是社區等等，都是在社區的第一線，他們就是健康臺灣的根基，不是嗎？現在醫療機構大部分受限於健保給付，所以各類醫事服務的健保給付如果沒有增加，在物價通膨、電費高漲的情況之下，部長覺得這樣對於健康臺灣的根基、這些各類的醫療機構、醫事機構會不會有所影響？會不會也有可能影響到人民就醫的品質或成本？"],["邱部長泰源：報告委員，謝謝您為醫院跟藥局爭取，這個部分都已經是凍漲了。"],["廖委員偉翔：我知道，這是過去發生的事情，所以我剛剛說這些事情……"],["邱部長泰源：謝謝，後續如果……"],["廖委員偉翔：各個其他的醫事類別。"],["邱部長泰源：各個其他需要的醫事類別，我們都會非常尊重，而且我們也希望他把他們……"],["廖委員偉翔：對，但是過去你們一直掛一漏萬嘛！其實前面我要講……"],["邱部長泰源：然後我們會轉給經濟部，但是絕對不會像您寫的那樣，衛福部沒找經濟部溝通，是因為經濟部長……"],["廖委員偉翔：是啊，我那天就問經濟部長說，衛福部長到底有沒有來找你？他支支吾吾不敢講啊！我甚至問說，下面單位有沒有溝通？他最後跟我說，他比較忙。我的意思是，你是比較不忙嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：不會啦，我們跟經濟部長是隨時可以聯繫的。"],["廖委員偉翔：那你到底有沒有去反映？"],["邱部長泰源：我是說我們有把那個申請書轉過去給經濟部。"],["廖委員偉翔：所以你有去反映嘛，對不對？"],["邱部長泰源：有、有、有。"],["廖委員偉翔：最後這個部分，我是想要告訴你，因為那天我去問他，他跟我說你沒有找他。"],["邱部長泰源：我們已經轉給經濟部了，至於後續您剛剛講的其他醫事相關的部分，我們也有把陳情函給經濟部了，經濟部會去請審議……"],["廖委員偉翔：說真的，我是覺得除了轉函之外，你應該還可以再多做一些努力，畢竟你是衛福部長嘛！你可以真正了解這些狀況，請你也可以多努力一點，而不是只是把函轉過去而已，你又不是總機，對不對？"],["邱部長泰源：我會跟那個行業說明，大概他可以怎麼樣去論述會比較適當。"],["廖委員偉翔：對，所以部長，我希望你不要成為一個總機，不要只是轉過去就好，這些人一直不斷的在陳情有這些狀況……"],["邱部長泰源：我們會給他專業的指導。"],["廖委員偉翔：謝謝部長。"],["邱部長泰源：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝廖偉翔委員。","接下來請蘇清泉委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":104,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-26-5","speakers":["蘇清泉","陳昭姿","王育敏","林月琴","陳菁徽","邱鎮軍","廖偉翔","王正旭","劉建國","羅廷瑋","林淑芬","羅智強","楊瓊瓔","賴士葆","涂權吉","李坤城","洪孟楷","林國成","張雅琳","陳培瑜","郭昱晴","徐富癸","楊曜","葉元之","黃秀芳","陳瑩","盧縣一"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-10-23"],"gazette_id":"1138901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1138901_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第5次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請衛生福利部部長、法務部、內政部、財政部、教育部列席就「有關新興煙毒品防制及強化虐\n童防治作為」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1138901_00001"}}}