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889.431, \"score\": 0.495}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 889.431, \"end\": 889.631, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 889.631, \"end\": 889.751, \"score\": 0.847}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"王\", \"start\": 889.751, \"end\": 889.811, \"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"洪\", \"start\": 889.811, \"end\": 889.891, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"威\", \"start\": 889.891, \"end\": 889.931, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 889.931, \"end\": 889.951, \"score\": 0.007}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:01,170 --> 00:00:16,827\n委員好主委好你們今晚會我看您的這個決心不錯也有一點行動力那現在我看有如火如荼要做到兩年有感然後讓臺灣成為亞洲資產管理中心這個\n\n2\n00:00:18,828 --> 00:00:45,796\n這個計畫已經講了幾十年的計畫好像感覺有一點機會不過我感覺可能在這個你面臨最大的挑戰我看我們立委部分聽很多立委的這個質詢我們立委是這樣對法令的鬆綁還有這個政策方面我們都是相當支持的但是我感覺你一個人剛剛看我看賴委員在質詢的時候你這個有問題的話後面的這個下面的相關單位沒有上來協助提供資料我覺得這個你\n\n3\n00:00:47,256 --> 00:01:00,893\n面臨最大的挑戰可能不是來自於我們這些外部不是我們這是賴總統的政策這沒有問題我看比較大的挑戰可能是你的先進的頭腦要幫忙你這個相關的我們這個官僚體系要打開頭腦這個要open\n\n4\n00:01:02,495 --> 00:01:02,635\n委員會主席\n\n5\n00:01:25,111 --> 00:01:27,433\n那這些新的投資項目要對專業的投資人募集資金要怎麼做呢?\n\n6\n00:01:52,625 --> 00:01:59,347\n我們剛剛有提到我們現在有上市櫃剛剛董事長在這邊我們提到的我們對這些真的要籌資的話那個是上市櫃我們剛剛有有委員說到臺灣有98次中小企業\n\n7\n00:02:13,630 --> 00:02:15,732\n臺灣的詐騙這麼盛行其實也就是因為很多人沒有投資的管道\n\n8\n00:02:35,632 --> 00:02:57,100\n在比如說很多產業有一些單位拿不到錢一些人有錢那這中間的一些我們一些不管金融機構也好或是相關的這些協助募資的單位是不是也沒有相應的這個相關的法令啊比照美國其他國家一樣進步的法令讓他們可以來做這個相關的這個資金的這個募集啊\n\n9\n00:02:57,880 --> 00:03:14,547\n這當然比說其他國家有更好的制度我們會來參採不過本國有他自己的限制剛剛委員提到我們對於這些中小企業或中小微企業我們在過去假如銀行端我們在長期的那個有關融資的資助剛剛經濟部也有報告你剛剛講是融資喔我說的是投資那是銀行融資是兩個議題喔\n\n10\n00:03:16,648 --> 00:03:43,901\n對,再來就是有關我們所監管的金控、金融機構不管是銀行、保險公司都有創投的投資對於他們的創...我想請問你啦我直接問你喔因為你沒有回答專業投資人是不是很多都放在這個國外比如新加坡、香港啊都有很多做這個什麼這個家族的這個辦公室啊很多專業經理人那我國的資產管理業者怎麼樣跟這些可以跟這些怎麼樣跟這些對象進行公開的這個募集\n\n11\n00:03:45,288 --> 00:04:05,789\n就是我們現在的話就是這些高淨值的客戶他有兩個選擇一個是假如說他要做財富管理的話那會選擇是由我們金融機構那如果說你要做資產管理的話就會跟我們的這些投資他可能會選擇比如說創投啦還有像比如說我們的PE啊這些還有投信公司PE是虱目嘛對對對\n\n12\n00:04:07,990 --> 00:04:31,224\n對就類似像這樣他有不同的管道可以從他這邊得到一個投資的機會你現在要開放比如做資產管理中心外國的這些資產管理中心他們可以在因為外國的法律開放他們可以在外國募集資金對到臺灣來做相關的投資嘛這個沒問題嘛對不對但是我們本國呢本國的業者呢沒有辦法對外募資啊這是不是變成有不利的這個競爭地位啊\n\n13\n00:04:33,654 --> 00:04:57,928\n這個本國的投信公司他當然可以募集本國的基金對不對然後他也可以募集以後對海外銷售募集本國你是指比如說PE對不對不只但PE是他另外一個業務比如說他可以募集一般的基金這是對一些這個管道有管道的人那對很多投資大眾來講他沒有獲得這些訊息的管道啊也沒有這樣這個可以投資的方法那這個部分的落差你要怎麼補足呢\n\n14\n00:04:58,548 --> 00:05:17,978\n這個我們當然就是透過一些他們之間的銷售管理還有我們的教育訓練來做這些事情像比如說PE這些東西投資絕對不會是一般的專業投資人來做的比如說真的是一些已經成熟到可以上市櫃當然就一般人就可以投資前端的部分這樣就是要創造這麼多\n\n15\n00:05:23,141 --> 00:05:46,134\n所以在這個很專業的裡頭跟這個上市櫃那個也不用提那個是已經到了很進步的那個階段了那這中間一般的百姓除了去買這個基金做這樣的投資金融這個市場上投資實際上如果一般的百姓想要參與很多新創事業的投資的時候他們是沒有投資管道的沒有不知道怎麼樣去獲得這個這時候就很多所以很多詐騙集團會產生嘛\n\n16\n00:05:48,495 --> 00:06:08,704\n對這時候就是要如果真的正當管道就要透過資產管理業者來做這些事情他去提供那這個法令的部分如果我們限制太嚴格的話你現在在做亞洲資產管理中心如果在法令的部分你的限制比國外的相關法令嚴格的話你就會限這些本國的業者跟外國的資產管理業者在不公平的競爭地位\n\n17\n00:06:09,164 --> 00:06:30,237\n當然就是資金是國際競爭的假設台灣的一些法規對這些資金相對是比較不便利或是不友善當然這個競爭力就會下降我們要變成亞洲資產管理中心資金也是國際競爭如果我們的法令比較不進步我們的政策比較不open當然不要說我們的地緣政治\n\n18\n00:06:30,977 --> 00:06:47,046\n這樣子臺灣怎麼變成亞洲這個資產管理中心這個確實我們今晚會很努力我們請同仁盤點一下我們大概兩年之內我們要鬆綁54條我們關聯的規定好那我想請問今晚會哪一個單位每年都出國考察這個金融科技啊108年44萬109年到那個11年沒有出國110年25萬112年54萬113年46萬今年要這個預算數要增加到107萬了這些預算出國考察是哪個單位去做考察的\n\n19\n00:06:59,889 --> 00:07:27,160\n主要是我們創新中心我們中規處創新中心是中規處派員出國考察是嗎對就是開會或是看他的目的性質來派適當的人員出國比如說像這些今年107萬是為哪個單位出國考察呢請我們處長說明一下這個是像今年的話我們是就是3月份的時候有去日本那不是去哪裡沒關係派哪些單位去我們金管會裡面哪些單位\n\n20\n00:07:27,908 --> 00:07:28,529\n其實我們在每年我們大概\n\n21\n00:07:53,154 --> 00:08:04,197\n發佈過我們的金融科技發展路徑圖1.0跟2.0我們就是很多是參考我們考察回來的結果沒關係你把這個相關的考察報告先提供給我我想請問在你們報告裡頭這個怎麼不寫這個股權期末的這個績效我上個會期就諮詢過了這個研議民間版的創規機制金管會說104年開放證券商的經營這個\n\n22\n00:08:16,059 --> 00:08:16,219\n主席\n\n23\n00:09:29,005 --> 00:09:32,980\n答案然後績效還是掛零對吧我再請問國發會\n\n24\n00:09:35,120 --> 00:10:01,205\n局長您聽到嗎?您知道我的意思嗎?政府是創造環境不是自己做然後做不好然後績效掛鈴你們工作實在量源很大副主委請教這個臺灣新創產業的這個企業齁你們這個也支持新創產業嘛齁新創產業新增數逐年減少齁這個齁現在大概有7900家身為國發會你看看我們的那個數據齁這個Fintech那個數據從20\n\n25\n00:10:04,805 --> 00:10:12,250\n2017年開始每年逐年下降從800多加800多到700多、600多、300多、200多、100多到2024現在22加這個逐年檢討的主因是什麼跟委員報告第一個因為今年還沒到沒關係不算今年從87654321一直下降國發會不是很支持嗎這不是國家的政策嗎我們的支持力道一直沒有減弱但是為什麼一直下降\n\n26\n00:10:32,822 --> 00:10:48,692\n其實如果委員注意大概這幾年我覺得一方面可能跟大環境有關係大環境因為你有注意到21、22年這幾年比較少的是正好是疫情的關係那前幾年一直下降23開始就沒有疫情了22以後就沒有疫情了從200多要變100多家\n\n27\n00:10:49,918 --> 00:11:06,056\n其實如果注意的話其實前幾年大概都還維持在六七百家以上不要講總數嘛你們新創就是就是每年增加的每年哪有呢去年113去年已經沒有疫情囉不要騙我是是是為什麼你們在做什麼沒有\n\n28\n00:11:06,696 --> 00:11:30,927\n委員我們的政策其實一直都在增加如果您...政策一直增加但是加速一直減少這是原因所以我們也希望這個源頭活水能夠維持我們會繼續加大你們不是希望這是你們要去擋到的目的啊是是是沒有做到的原因是什麼沒有所以我們現在會...經濟部上來的時候會加速跟...經濟部有中小企業署嗎我們中小企業署要上來中小企業新創署喔沒有國防委員會回答完畢你把它回答完為什麼是\n\n29\n00:11:33,068 --> 00:11:54,573\n沒有所以我沒有注意到這個當然原因可能很複雜那我們希望在大學、法人、新創或者是企業部份大學法人我順便跟你講我看你們今天有提供是一個假消息嗎你們說你們跟這個臺大校友臺大校友基金嘛對不對做一個校園這個要投資什麼校園這個成立臺灣第一個校友VC投資基金這是假新聞嗎\n\n30\n00:11:56,301 --> 00:12:10,010\n不是嘛,什麼叫做第一個校友投資,20年前成大,交通大學早就有了,你是在詐騙國人還是在詐騙立法院?不是,因為他們很多校友基金的目的是透過投資上市櫃股票有獲利回饋給學校,\n\n31\n00:12:11,158 --> 00:12:38,733\n那我們臺大規劃的這個校友基金就純粹就類似於VC的方式是直接投資新創就是不太一樣所以講第一個的意思是這個意思就性質不太一樣你們現在我據本席得到的訊息是你們沒有想要鼓勵提供資源給一些民間業者反而是找特定對象跟臺大洽談這是圖利特定對象不會啦而且還做假新聞說只有這個好像第一個校友基金沒有啦其實這個交大跟成大早就辦過還是這只是你\n\n32\n00:12:40,294 --> 00:12:51,218\n為了這個報告寫的故意要寫個東西好像你們有做什麼事情一樣那這個你們的這個創投天使方案現在是成資金已經成為零了是嗎沒有啊沒有嗎\n\n33\n00:12:53,790 --> 00:13:12,305\n我幫了50億元去做天使投資現在的資金是多少現在已經投了三十幾億了現在的資金是多少不是投了多少你現在的資金是多少現在已經投了38億了所以這個額度還有十幾億那如果額度要完還可以繼續增加那我請問在疫情期間你的這個特別書庫你剛剛說疫情嘛項目你回收了多少\n\n34\n00:13:13,969 --> 00:13:14,269\n美國跟日本\n\n35\n00:13:36,687 --> 00:13:56,539\n我看你們新創署的計畫裡頭在議題就好了還沒問到亞洲資產管理中心新創署的計畫裡頭多部分都是法人在學校在辦理你沒有規劃一個好的生態系讓民間人自主發展一個新創生態系的平台這個部分是不是你們要回去檢討一下\n\n36\n00:13:57,039 --> 00:14:01,262\n市長請你看一下美國、日本、以色列都是民間在發展我們政府不要什麼都自己辦剛剛跟鄭麒麟說軍管會說的也是一樣什麼事情都想說政府自己辦政府第一個修理很慢第二個實際上\n\n37\n00:14:22,138 --> 00:14:48,351\n本席所接觸的各個產業裡頭對我們的政府的這種高度監管還有反應很慢還有很多的這個思維跟民間的創新都跟不上事實上很多產業都頗有危言很多產業各行各業所以我希望在這個我們新的這個主委的帶領之下要openmind把那個頭腦打開然後那個下面的相關的要跟上不然這個我們事實上也是站在\n\n38\n00:14:48,891 --> 00:14:49,951\n陳玉珍委員．下一位質詢委員王洪威委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1170\t16827\t委員好主委好你們今晚會我看您的這個決心不錯也有一點行動力那現在我看有如火如荼要做到兩年有感然後讓臺灣成為亞洲資產管理中心這個\n18828\t45796\t這個計畫已經講了幾十年的計畫好像感覺有一點機會不過我感覺可能在這個你面臨最大的挑戰我看我們立委部分聽很多立委的這個質詢我們立委是這樣對法令的鬆綁還有這個政策方面我們都是相當支持的但是我感覺你一個人剛剛看我看賴委員在質詢的時候你這個有問題的話後面的這個下面的相關單位沒有上來協助提供資料我覺得這個你\n47256\t60893\t面臨最大的挑戰可能不是來自於我們這些外部不是我們這是賴總統的政策這沒有問題我看比較大的挑戰可能是你的先進的頭腦要幫忙你這個相關的我們這個官僚體系要打開頭腦這個要open\n62495\t62635\t委員會主席\n85111\t87433\t那這些新的投資項目要對專業的投資人募集資金要怎麼做呢?\n112625\t119347\t我們剛剛有提到我們現在有上市櫃剛剛董事長在這邊我們提到的我們對這些真的要籌資的話那個是上市櫃我們剛剛有有委員說到臺灣有98次中小企業\n133630\t135732\t臺灣的詐騙這麼盛行其實也就是因為很多人沒有投資的管道\n155632\t177100\t在比如說很多產業有一些單位拿不到錢一些人有錢那這中間的一些我們一些不管金融機構也好或是相關的這些協助募資的單位是不是也沒有相應的這個相關的法令啊比照美國其他國家一樣進步的法令讓他們可以來做這個相關的這個資金的這個募集啊\n177880\t194547\t這當然比說其他國家有更好的制度我們會來參採不過本國有他自己的限制剛剛委員提到我們對於這些中小企業或中小微企業我們在過去假如銀行端我們在長期的那個有關融資的資助剛剛經濟部也有報告你剛剛講是融資喔我說的是投資那是銀行融資是兩個議題喔\n196648\t223901\t對,再來就是有關我們所監管的金控、金融機構不管是銀行、保險公司都有創投的投資對於他們的創...我想請問你啦我直接問你喔因為你沒有回答專業投資人是不是很多都放在這個國外比如新加坡、香港啊都有很多做這個什麼這個家族的這個辦公室啊很多專業經理人那我國的資產管理業者怎麼樣跟這些可以跟這些怎麼樣跟這些對象進行公開的這個募集\n225288\t245789\t就是我們現在的話就是這些高淨值的客戶他有兩個選擇一個是假如說他要做財富管理的話那會選擇是由我們金融機構那如果說你要做資產管理的話就會跟我們的這些投資他可能會選擇比如說創投啦還有像比如說我們的PE啊這些還有投信公司PE是虱目嘛對對對\n247990\t271224\t對就類似像這樣他有不同的管道可以從他這邊得到一個投資的機會你現在要開放比如做資產管理中心外國的這些資產管理中心他們可以在因為外國的法律開放他們可以在外國募集資金對到臺灣來做相關的投資嘛這個沒問題嘛對不對但是我們本國呢本國的業者呢沒有辦法對外募資啊這是不是變成有不利的這個競爭地位啊\n273654\t297928\t這個本國的投信公司他當然可以募集本國的基金對不對然後他也可以募集以後對海外銷售募集本國你是指比如說PE對不對不只但PE是他另外一個業務比如說他可以募集一般的基金這是對一些這個管道有管道的人那對很多投資大眾來講他沒有獲得這些訊息的管道啊也沒有這樣這個可以投資的方法那這個部分的落差你要怎麼補足呢\n298548\t317978\t這個我們當然就是透過一些他們之間的銷售管理還有我們的教育訓練來做這些事情像比如說PE這些東西投資絕對不會是一般的專業投資人來做的比如說真的是一些已經成熟到可以上市櫃當然就一般人就可以投資前端的部分這樣就是要創造這麼多\n323141\t346134\t所以在這個很專業的裡頭跟這個上市櫃那個也不用提那個是已經到了很進步的那個階段了那這中間一般的百姓除了去買這個基金做這樣的投資金融這個市場上投資實際上如果一般的百姓想要參與很多新創事業的投資的時候他們是沒有投資管道的沒有不知道怎麼樣去獲得這個這時候就很多所以很多詐騙集團會產生嘛\n348495\t368704\t對 這時候就是要 如果真的正當管道就要透過資產管理業者來做這些事情他去提供那這個法令的部分如果我們限制太嚴格的話你現在在做亞洲資產管理中心如果在法令的部分你的限制比國外的相關法令嚴格的話你就會限這些本國的業者跟外國的資產管理業者在不公平的競爭地位\n369164\t390237\t當然就是資金是國際競爭的假設台灣的一些法規對這些資金相對是比較不便利或是不友善當然這個競爭力就會下降我們要變成亞洲資產管理中心資金也是國際競爭如果我們的法令比較不進步我們的政策比較不open當然不要說我們的地緣政治\n390977\t407046\t這樣子臺灣怎麼變成亞洲這個資產管理中心這個確實我們今晚會很努力我們請同仁盤點一下我們大概兩年之內我們要鬆綁54條我們關聯的規定好 那我想請問今晚會哪一個單位每年都出國考察這個金融科技啊108年44萬109年到那個11年沒有出國110年25萬112年54萬113年46萬今年要這個預算數要增加到107萬了這些預算出國考察是哪個單位去做考察的\n419889\t447160\t主要是我們創新中心我們中規處創新中心是中規處派員出國考察是嗎對就是開會或是看他的目的性質來派適當的人員出國比如說像這些今年107萬是為哪個單位出國考察呢請我們處長說明一下這個是像今年的話我們是就是3月份的時候有去日本那不是去哪裡沒關係派哪些單位去我們金管會裡面哪些單位\n447908\t448529\t其實我們在每年我們大概\n473154\t484197\t發佈過我們的金融科技發展路徑圖1.0跟2.0我們就是很多是參考我們考察回來的結果沒關係你把這個相關的考察報告先提供給我我想請問在你們報告裡頭這個怎麼不寫這個股權期末的這個績效我上個會期就諮詢過了這個研議民間版的創規機制金管會說104年開放證券商的經營這個\n496059\t496219\t主席\n569005\t572980\t答案然後績效還是掛零對吧我再請問國發會\n575120\t601205\t局長您聽到嗎?您知道我的意思嗎?政府是創造環境不是自己做然後做不好然後績效掛鈴你們工作實在量源很大副主委請教這個臺灣新創產業的這個企業齁你們這個也支持新創產業嘛齁新創產業新增數逐年減少齁這個齁現在大概有7900家身為國發會你看看我們的那個數據齁這個Fintech那個數據從20\n604805\t612250\t2017年開始每年逐年下降從800多加800多到700多、600多、300多、200多、100多到2024現在22加這個逐年檢討的主因是什麼跟委員報告第一個因為今年還沒到沒關係不算今年從87654321一直下降國發會不是很支持嗎這不是國家的政策嗎我們的支持力道一直沒有減弱但是為什麼一直下降\n632822\t648692\t其實如果委員注意大概這幾年我覺得一方面可能跟大環境有關係大環境因為你有注意到21、22年這幾年比較少的是正好是疫情的關係那前幾年一直下降23開始就沒有疫情了22以後就沒有疫情了從200多要變100多家\n649918\t666056\t其實如果注意的話其實前幾年大概都還維持在六七百家以上不要講總數嘛你們新創就是就是每年增加的每年哪有呢去年113去年已經沒有疫情囉不要騙我是是是為什麼你們在做什麼沒有\n666696\t690927\t委員我們的政策其實一直都在增加如果您...政策一直增加但是加速一直減少這是原因所以我們也希望這個源頭活水能夠維持我們會繼續加大你們不是希望這是你們要去擋到的目的啊是是是沒有做到的原因是什麼沒有所以我們現在會...經濟部上來的時候會加速跟...經濟部有中小企業署嗎我們中小企業署要上來中小企業新創署喔沒有國防委員會回答完畢你把它回答完為什麼是\n693068\t714573\t沒有 所以我沒有注意到這個當然原因可能很複雜那我們希望在大學、法人、新創或者是企業部份大學法人我順便跟你講我看你們今天有提供是一個假消息嗎你們說你們跟這個臺大校友臺大校友基金嘛 對不對做一個校園這個要投資什麼校園這個成立臺灣第一個校友VC投資基金這是假新聞嗎\n716301\t730010\t不是嘛,什麼叫做第一個校友投資,20年前成大,交通大學早就有了,你是在詐騙國人還是在詐騙立法院?不是,因為他們很多校友基金的目的是透過投資上市櫃股票有獲利回饋給學校,\n731158\t758733\t那我們臺大規劃的這個校友基金就純粹就類似於VC的方式是直接投資新創就是不太一樣所以講第一個的意思是這個意思就性質不太一樣你們現在我據本席得到的訊息是你們沒有想要鼓勵提供資源給一些民間業者反而是找特定對象跟臺大洽談這是圖利特定對象不會啦而且還做假新聞說只有這個好像第一個校友基金沒有啦其實這個交大跟成大早就辦過還是這只是你\n760294\t771218\t為了這個報告寫的故意要寫個東西好像你們有做什麼事情一樣那這個你們的這個創投天使方案現在是成資金已經成為零了是嗎沒有啊沒有嗎\n773790\t792305\t我幫了50億元去做天使投資現在的資金是多少現在已經投了三十幾億了現在的資金是多少不是投了多少你現在的資金是多少現在已經投了38億了所以這個額度還有十幾億那如果額度要完還可以繼續增加那我請問在疫情期間你的這個特別書庫你剛剛說疫情嘛項目你回收了多少\n793969\t794269\t美國跟日本\n816687\t836539\t我看你們新創署的計畫裡頭在議題就好了還沒問到亞洲資產管理中心新創署的計畫裡頭多部分都是法人在學校在辦理你沒有規劃一個好的生態系讓民間人自主發展一個新創生態系的平台這個部分是不是你們要回去檢討一下\n837039\t841262\t市長請你看一下美國、日本、以色列都是民間在發展我們政府不要什麼都自己辦剛剛跟鄭麒麟說軍管會說的也是一樣什麼事情都想說政府自己辦政府第一個修理很慢第二個實際上\n862138\t888351\t本席所接觸的各個產業裡頭對我們的政府的這種高度監管還有反應很慢還有很多的這個思維跟民間的創新都跟不上事實上很多產業都頗有危言很多產業各行各業所以我希望在這個我們新的這個主委的帶領之下要open mind把那個頭腦打開然後那個下面的相關的要跟上不然這個我們事實上也是站在\n888891\t889951\t陳玉珍委員．下一位質詢委員王洪威委員\n","txt":"委員好主委好你們今晚會我看您的這個決心不錯也有一點行動力那現在我看有如火如荼要做到兩年有感然後讓臺灣成為亞洲資產管理中心這個\n這個計畫已經講了幾十年的計畫好像感覺有一點機會不過我感覺可能在這個你面臨最大的挑戰我看我們立委部分聽很多立委的這個質詢我們立委是這樣對法令的鬆綁還有這個政策方面我們都是相當支持的但是我感覺你一個人剛剛看我看賴委員在質詢的時候你這個有問題的話後面的這個下面的相關單位沒有上來協助提供資料我覺得這個你\n面臨最大的挑戰可能不是來自於我們這些外部不是我們這是賴總統的政策這沒有問題我看比較大的挑戰可能是你的先進的頭腦要幫忙你這個相關的我們這個官僚體系要打開頭腦這個要open\n委員會主席\n那這些新的投資項目要對專業的投資人募集資金要怎麼做呢?\n我們剛剛有提到我們現在有上市櫃剛剛董事長在這邊我們提到的我們對這些真的要籌資的話那個是上市櫃我們剛剛有有委員說到臺灣有98次中小企業\n臺灣的詐騙這麼盛行其實也就是因為很多人沒有投資的管道\n在比如說很多產業有一些單位拿不到錢一些人有錢那這中間的一些我們一些不管金融機構也好或是相關的這些協助募資的單位是不是也沒有相應的這個相關的法令啊比照美國其他國家一樣進步的法令讓他們可以來做這個相關的這個資金的這個募集啊\n這當然比說其他國家有更好的制度我們會來參採不過本國有他自己的限制剛剛委員提到我們對於這些中小企業或中小微企業我們在過去假如銀行端我們在長期的那個有關融資的資助剛剛經濟部也有報告你剛剛講是融資喔我說的是投資那是銀行融資是兩個議題喔\n對,再來就是有關我們所監管的金控、金融機構不管是銀行、保險公司都有創投的投資對於他們的創...我想請問你啦我直接問你喔因為你沒有回答專業投資人是不是很多都放在這個國外比如新加坡、香港啊都有很多做這個什麼這個家族的這個辦公室啊很多專業經理人那我國的資產管理業者怎麼樣跟這些可以跟這些怎麼樣跟這些對象進行公開的這個募集\n就是我們現在的話就是這些高淨值的客戶他有兩個選擇一個是假如說他要做財富管理的話那會選擇是由我們金融機構那如果說你要做資產管理的話就會跟我們的這些投資他可能會選擇比如說創投啦還有像比如說我們的PE啊這些還有投信公司PE是虱目嘛對對對\n對就類似像這樣他有不同的管道可以從他這邊得到一個投資的機會你現在要開放比如做資產管理中心外國的這些資產管理中心他們可以在因為外國的法律開放他們可以在外國募集資金對到臺灣來做相關的投資嘛這個沒問題嘛對不對但是我們本國呢本國的業者呢沒有辦法對外募資啊這是不是變成有不利的這個競爭地位啊\n這個本國的投信公司他當然可以募集本國的基金對不對然後他也可以募集以後對海外銷售募集本國你是指比如說PE對不對不只但PE是他另外一個業務比如說他可以募集一般的基金這是對一些這個管道有管道的人那對很多投資大眾來講他沒有獲得這些訊息的管道啊也沒有這樣這個可以投資的方法那這個部分的落差你要怎麼補足呢\n這個我們當然就是透過一些他們之間的銷售管理還有我們的教育訓練來做這些事情像比如說PE這些東西投資絕對不會是一般的專業投資人來做的比如說真的是一些已經成熟到可以上市櫃當然就一般人就可以投資前端的部分這樣就是要創造這麼多\n所以在這個很專業的裡頭跟這個上市櫃那個也不用提那個是已經到了很進步的那個階段了那這中間一般的百姓除了去買這個基金做這樣的投資金融這個市場上投資實際上如果一般的百姓想要參與很多新創事業的投資的時候他們是沒有投資管道的沒有不知道怎麼樣去獲得這個這時候就很多所以很多詐騙集團會產生嘛\n對 這時候就是要 如果真的正當管道就要透過資產管理業者來做這些事情他去提供那這個法令的部分如果我們限制太嚴格的話你現在在做亞洲資產管理中心如果在法令的部分你的限制比國外的相關法令嚴格的話你就會限這些本國的業者跟外國的資產管理業者在不公平的競爭地位\n當然就是資金是國際競爭的假設台灣的一些法規對這些資金相對是比較不便利或是不友善當然這個競爭力就會下降我們要變成亞洲資產管理中心資金也是國際競爭如果我們的法令比較不進步我們的政策比較不open當然不要說我們的地緣政治\n這樣子臺灣怎麼變成亞洲這個資產管理中心這個確實我們今晚會很努力我們請同仁盤點一下我們大概兩年之內我們要鬆綁54條我們關聯的規定好 那我想請問今晚會哪一個單位每年都出國考察這個金融科技啊108年44萬109年到那個11年沒有出國110年25萬112年54萬113年46萬今年要這個預算數要增加到107萬了這些預算出國考察是哪個單位去做考察的\n主要是我們創新中心我們中規處創新中心是中規處派員出國考察是嗎對就是開會或是看他的目的性質來派適當的人員出國比如說像這些今年107萬是為哪個單位出國考察呢請我們處長說明一下這個是像今年的話我們是就是3月份的時候有去日本那不是去哪裡沒關係派哪些單位去我們金管會裡面哪些單位\n其實我們在每年我們大概\n發佈過我們的金融科技發展路徑圖1.0跟2.0我們就是很多是參考我們考察回來的結果沒關係你把這個相關的考察報告先提供給我我想請問在你們報告裡頭這個怎麼不寫這個股權期末的這個績效我上個會期就諮詢過了這個研議民間版的創規機制金管會說104年開放證券商的經營這個\n主席\n答案然後績效還是掛零對吧我再請問國發會\n局長您聽到嗎?您知道我的意思嗎?政府是創造環境不是自己做然後做不好然後績效掛鈴你們工作實在量源很大副主委請教這個臺灣新創產業的這個企業齁你們這個也支持新創產業嘛齁新創產業新增數逐年減少齁這個齁現在大概有7900家身為國發會你看看我們的那個數據齁這個Fintech那個數據從20\n2017年開始每年逐年下降從800多加800多到700多、600多、300多、200多、100多到2024現在22加這個逐年檢討的主因是什麼跟委員報告第一個因為今年還沒到沒關係不算今年從87654321一直下降國發會不是很支持嗎這不是國家的政策嗎我們的支持力道一直沒有減弱但是為什麼一直下降\n其實如果委員注意大概這幾年我覺得一方面可能跟大環境有關係大環境因為你有注意到21、22年這幾年比較少的是正好是疫情的關係那前幾年一直下降23開始就沒有疫情了22以後就沒有疫情了從200多要變100多家\n其實如果注意的話其實前幾年大概都還維持在六七百家以上不要講總數嘛你們新創就是就是每年增加的每年哪有呢去年113去年已經沒有疫情囉不要騙我是是是為什麼你們在做什麼沒有\n委員我們的政策其實一直都在增加如果您...政策一直增加但是加速一直減少這是原因所以我們也希望這個源頭活水能夠維持我們會繼續加大你們不是希望這是你們要去擋到的目的啊是是是沒有做到的原因是什麼沒有所以我們現在會...經濟部上來的時候會加速跟...經濟部有中小企業署嗎我們中小企業署要上來中小企業新創署喔沒有國防委員會回答完畢你把它回答完為什麼是\n沒有 所以我沒有注意到這個當然原因可能很複雜那我們希望在大學、法人、新創或者是企業部份大學法人我順便跟你講我看你們今天有提供是一個假消息嗎你們說你們跟這個臺大校友臺大校友基金嘛 對不對做一個校園這個要投資什麼校園這個成立臺灣第一個校友VC投資基金這是假新聞嗎\n不是嘛,什麼叫做第一個校友投資,20年前成大,交通大學早就有了,你是在詐騙國人還是在詐騙立法院?不是,因為他們很多校友基金的目的是透過投資上市櫃股票有獲利回饋給學校,\n那我們臺大規劃的這個校友基金就純粹就類似於VC的方式是直接投資新創就是不太一樣所以講第一個的意思是這個意思就性質不太一樣你們現在我據本席得到的訊息是你們沒有想要鼓勵提供資源給一些民間業者反而是找特定對象跟臺大洽談這是圖利特定對象不會啦而且還做假新聞說只有這個好像第一個校友基金沒有啦其實這個交大跟成大早就辦過還是這只是你\n為了這個報告寫的故意要寫個東西好像你們有做什麼事情一樣那這個你們的這個創投天使方案現在是成資金已經成為零了是嗎沒有啊沒有嗎\n我幫了50億元去做天使投資現在的資金是多少現在已經投了三十幾億了現在的資金是多少不是投了多少你現在的資金是多少現在已經投了38億了所以這個額度還有十幾億那如果額度要完還可以繼續增加那我請問在疫情期間你的這個特別書庫你剛剛說疫情嘛項目你回收了多少\n美國跟日本\n我看你們新創署的計畫裡頭在議題就好了還沒問到亞洲資產管理中心新創署的計畫裡頭多部分都是法人在學校在辦理你沒有規劃一個好的生態系讓民間人自主發展一個新創生態系的平台這個部分是不是你們要回去檢討一下\n市長請你看一下美國、日本、以色列都是民間在發展我們政府不要什麼都自己辦剛剛跟鄭麒麟說軍管會說的也是一樣什麼事情都想說政府自己辦政府第一個修理很慢第二個實際上\n本席所接觸的各個產業裡頭對我們的政府的這種高度監管還有反應很慢還有很多的這個思維跟民間的創新都跟不上事實上很多產業都頗有危言很多產業各行各業所以我希望在這個我們新的這個主委的帶領之下要open mind把那個頭腦打開然後那個下面的相關的要跟上不然這個我們事實上也是站在\n陳玉珍委員．下一位質詢委員王洪威委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.170 --> 00:16.827\n委員好主委好你們今晚會我看您的這個決心不錯也有一點行動力那現在我看有如火如荼要做到兩年有感然後讓臺灣成為亞洲資產管理中心這個\n\n00:18.828 --> 00:45.796\n這個計畫已經講了幾十年的計畫好像感覺有一點機會不過我感覺可能在這個你面臨最大的挑戰我看我們立委部分聽很多立委的這個質詢我們立委是這樣對法令的鬆綁還有這個政策方面我們都是相當支持的但是我感覺你一個人剛剛看我看賴委員在質詢的時候你這個有問題的話後面的這個下面的相關單位沒有上來協助提供資料我覺得這個你\n\n00:47.256 --> 01:00.893\n面臨最大的挑戰可能不是來自於我們這些外部不是我們這是賴總統的政策這沒有問題我看比較大的挑戰可能是你的先進的頭腦要幫忙你這個相關的我們這個官僚體系要打開頭腦這個要open\n\n01:02.495 --> 01:02.635\n委員會主席\n\n01:25.111 --> 01:27.433\n那這些新的投資項目要對專業的投資人募集資金要怎麼做呢?\n\n01:52.625 --> 01:59.347\n我們剛剛有提到我們現在有上市櫃剛剛董事長在這邊我們提到的我們對這些真的要籌資的話那個是上市櫃我們剛剛有有委員說到臺灣有98次中小企業\n\n02:13.630 --> 02:15.732\n臺灣的詐騙這麼盛行其實也就是因為很多人沒有投資的管道\n\n02:35.632 --> 02:57.100\n在比如說很多產業有一些單位拿不到錢一些人有錢那這中間的一些我們一些不管金融機構也好或是相關的這些協助募資的單位是不是也沒有相應的這個相關的法令啊比照美國其他國家一樣進步的法令讓他們可以來做這個相關的這個資金的這個募集啊\n\n02:57.880 --> 03:14.547\n這當然比說其他國家有更好的制度我們會來參採不過本國有他自己的限制剛剛委員提到我們對於這些中小企業或中小微企業我們在過去假如銀行端我們在長期的那個有關融資的資助剛剛經濟部也有報告你剛剛講是融資喔我說的是投資那是銀行融資是兩個議題喔\n\n03:16.648 --> 03:43.901\n對,再來就是有關我們所監管的金控、金融機構不管是銀行、保險公司都有創投的投資對於他們的創...我想請問你啦我直接問你喔因為你沒有回答專業投資人是不是很多都放在這個國外比如新加坡、香港啊都有很多做這個什麼這個家族的這個辦公室啊很多專業經理人那我國的資產管理業者怎麼樣跟這些可以跟這些怎麼樣跟這些對象進行公開的這個募集\n\n03:45.288 --> 04:05.789\n就是我們現在的話就是這些高淨值的客戶他有兩個選擇一個是假如說他要做財富管理的話那會選擇是由我們金融機構那如果說你要做資產管理的話就會跟我們的這些投資他可能會選擇比如說創投啦還有像比如說我們的PE啊這些還有投信公司PE是虱目嘛對對對\n\n04:07.990 --> 04:31.224\n對就類似像這樣他有不同的管道可以從他這邊得到一個投資的機會你現在要開放比如做資產管理中心外國的這些資產管理中心他們可以在因為外國的法律開放他們可以在外國募集資金對到臺灣來做相關的投資嘛這個沒問題嘛對不對但是我們本國呢本國的業者呢沒有辦法對外募資啊這是不是變成有不利的這個競爭地位啊\n\n04:33.654 --> 04:57.928\n這個本國的投信公司他當然可以募集本國的基金對不對然後他也可以募集以後對海外銷售募集本國你是指比如說PE對不對不只但PE是他另外一個業務比如說他可以募集一般的基金這是對一些這個管道有管道的人那對很多投資大眾來講他沒有獲得這些訊息的管道啊也沒有這樣這個可以投資的方法那這個部分的落差你要怎麼補足呢\n\n04:58.548 --> 05:17.978\n這個我們當然就是透過一些他們之間的銷售管理還有我們的教育訓練來做這些事情像比如說PE這些東西投資絕對不會是一般的專業投資人來做的比如說真的是一些已經成熟到可以上市櫃當然就一般人就可以投資前端的部分這樣就是要創造這麼多\n\n05:23.141 --> 05:46.134\n所以在這個很專業的裡頭跟這個上市櫃那個也不用提那個是已經到了很進步的那個階段了那這中間一般的百姓除了去買這個基金做這樣的投資金融這個市場上投資實際上如果一般的百姓想要參與很多新創事業的投資的時候他們是沒有投資管道的沒有不知道怎麼樣去獲得這個這時候就很多所以很多詐騙集團會產生嘛\n\n05:48.495 --> 06:08.704\n對這時候就是要如果真的正當管道就要透過資產管理業者來做這些事情他去提供那這個法令的部分如果我們限制太嚴格的話你現在在做亞洲資產管理中心如果在法令的部分你的限制比國外的相關法令嚴格的話你就會限這些本國的業者跟外國的資產管理業者在不公平的競爭地位\n\n06:09.164 --> 06:30.237\n當然就是資金是國際競爭的假設台灣的一些法規對這些資金相對是比較不便利或是不友善當然這個競爭力就會下降我們要變成亞洲資產管理中心資金也是國際競爭如果我們的法令比較不進步我們的政策比較不open當然不要說我們的地緣政治\n\n06:30.977 --> 06:47.046\n這樣子臺灣怎麼變成亞洲這個資產管理中心這個確實我們今晚會很努力我們請同仁盤點一下我們大概兩年之內我們要鬆綁54條我們關聯的規定好那我想請問今晚會哪一個單位每年都出國考察這個金融科技啊108年44萬109年到那個11年沒有出國110年25萬112年54萬113年46萬今年要這個預算數要增加到107萬了這些預算出國考察是哪個單位去做考察的\n\n06:59.889 --> 07:27.160\n主要是我們創新中心我們中規處創新中心是中規處派員出國考察是嗎對就是開會或是看他的目的性質來派適當的人員出國比如說像這些今年107萬是為哪個單位出國考察呢請我們處長說明一下這個是像今年的話我們是就是3月份的時候有去日本那不是去哪裡沒關係派哪些單位去我們金管會裡面哪些單位\n\n07:27.908 --> 07:28.529\n其實我們在每年我們大概\n\n07:53.154 --> 08:04.197\n發佈過我們的金融科技發展路徑圖1.0跟2.0我們就是很多是參考我們考察回來的結果沒關係你把這個相關的考察報告先提供給我我想請問在你們報告裡頭這個怎麼不寫這個股權期末的這個績效我上個會期就諮詢過了這個研議民間版的創規機制金管會說104年開放證券商的經營這個\n\n08:16.059 --> 08:16.219\n主席\n\n09:29.005 --> 09:32.980\n答案然後績效還是掛零對吧我再請問國發會\n\n09:35.120 --> 10:01.205\n局長您聽到嗎?您知道我的意思嗎?政府是創造環境不是自己做然後做不好然後績效掛鈴你們工作實在量源很大副主委請教這個臺灣新創產業的這個企業齁你們這個也支持新創產業嘛齁新創產業新增數逐年減少齁這個齁現在大概有7900家身為國發會你看看我們的那個數據齁這個Fintech那個數據從20\n\n10:04.805 --> 10:12.250\n2017年開始每年逐年下降從800多加800多到700多、600多、300多、200多、100多到2024現在22加這個逐年檢討的主因是什麼跟委員報告第一個因為今年還沒到沒關係不算今年從87654321一直下降國發會不是很支持嗎這不是國家的政策嗎我們的支持力道一直沒有減弱但是為什麼一直下降\n\n10:32.822 --> 10:48.692\n其實如果委員注意大概這幾年我覺得一方面可能跟大環境有關係大環境因為你有注意到21、22年這幾年比較少的是正好是疫情的關係那前幾年一直下降23開始就沒有疫情了22以後就沒有疫情了從200多要變100多家\n\n10:49.918 --> 11:06.056\n其實如果注意的話其實前幾年大概都還維持在六七百家以上不要講總數嘛你們新創就是就是每年增加的每年哪有呢去年113去年已經沒有疫情囉不要騙我是是是為什麼你們在做什麼沒有\n\n11:06.696 --> 11:30.927\n委員我們的政策其實一直都在增加如果您...政策一直增加但是加速一直減少這是原因所以我們也希望這個源頭活水能夠維持我們會繼續加大你們不是希望這是你們要去擋到的目的啊是是是沒有做到的原因是什麼沒有所以我們現在會...經濟部上來的時候會加速跟...經濟部有中小企業署嗎我們中小企業署要上來中小企業新創署喔沒有國防委員會回答完畢你把它回答完為什麼是\n\n11:33.068 --> 11:54.573\n沒有所以我沒有注意到這個當然原因可能很複雜那我們希望在大學、法人、新創或者是企業部份大學法人我順便跟你講我看你們今天有提供是一個假消息嗎你們說你們跟這個臺大校友臺大校友基金嘛對不對做一個校園這個要投資什麼校園這個成立臺灣第一個校友VC投資基金這是假新聞嗎\n\n11:56.301 --> 12:10.010\n不是嘛,什麼叫做第一個校友投資,20年前成大,交通大學早就有了,你是在詐騙國人還是在詐騙立法院?不是,因為他們很多校友基金的目的是透過投資上市櫃股票有獲利回饋給學校,\n\n12:11.158 --> 12:38.733\n那我們臺大規劃的這個校友基金就純粹就類似於VC的方式是直接投資新創就是不太一樣所以講第一個的意思是這個意思就性質不太一樣你們現在我據本席得到的訊息是你們沒有想要鼓勵提供資源給一些民間業者反而是找特定對象跟臺大洽談這是圖利特定對象不會啦而且還做假新聞說只有這個好像第一個校友基金沒有啦其實這個交大跟成大早就辦過還是這只是你\n\n12:40.294 --> 12:51.218\n為了這個報告寫的故意要寫個東西好像你們有做什麼事情一樣那這個你們的這個創投天使方案現在是成資金已經成為零了是嗎沒有啊沒有嗎\n\n12:53.790 --> 13:12.305\n我幫了50億元去做天使投資現在的資金是多少現在已經投了三十幾億了現在的資金是多少不是投了多少你現在的資金是多少現在已經投了38億了所以這個額度還有十幾億那如果額度要完還可以繼續增加那我請問在疫情期間你的這個特別書庫你剛剛說疫情嘛項目你回收了多少\n\n13:13.969 --> 13:14.269\n美國跟日本\n\n13:36.687 --> 13:56.539\n我看你們新創署的計畫裡頭在議題就好了還沒問到亞洲資產管理中心新創署的計畫裡頭多部分都是法人在學校在辦理你沒有規劃一個好的生態系讓民間人自主發展一個新創生態系的平台這個部分是不是你們要回去檢討一下\n\n13:57.039 --> 14:01.262\n市長請你看一下美國、日本、以色列都是民間在發展我們政府不要什麼都自己辦剛剛跟鄭麒麟說軍管會說的也是一樣什麼事情都想說政府自己辦政府第一個修理很慢第二個實際上\n\n14:22.138 --> 14:48.351\n本席所接觸的各個產業裡頭對我們的政府的這種高度監管還有反應很慢還有很多的這個思維跟民間的創新都跟不上事實上很多產業都頗有危言很多產業各行各業所以我希望在這個我們新的這個主委的帶領之下要openmind把那個頭腦打開然後那個下面的相關的要跟上不然這個我們事實上也是站在\n\n14:48.891 --> 14:49.951\n陳玉珍委員．下一位質詢委員王洪威委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.17,"end":16.827,"text":"委員好主委好你們今晚會我看您的這個決心不錯也有一點行動力那現在我看有如火如荼要做到兩年有感然後讓臺灣成為亞洲資產管理中心這個"},{"start":18.828,"end":45.796,"text":"這個計畫已經講了幾十年的計畫好像感覺有一點機會不過我感覺可能在這個你面臨最大的挑戰我看我們立委部分聽很多立委的這個質詢我們立委是這樣對法令的鬆綁還有這個政策方面我們都是相當支持的但是我感覺你一個人剛剛看我看賴委員在質詢的時候你這個有問題的話後面的這個下面的相關單位沒有上來協助提供資料我覺得這個你"},{"start":47.256,"end":60.893,"text":"面臨最大的挑戰可能不是來自於我們這些外部不是我們這是賴總統的政策這沒有問題我看比較大的挑戰可能是你的先進的頭腦要幫忙你這個相關的我們這個官僚體系要打開頭腦這個要open"},{"start":62.495,"end":62.635,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":85.111,"end":87.433,"text":"那這些新的投資項目要對專業的投資人募集資金要怎麼做呢?"},{"start":112.625,"end":119.347,"text":"我們剛剛有提到我們現在有上市櫃剛剛董事長在這邊我們提到的我們對這些真的要籌資的話那個是上市櫃我們剛剛有有委員說到臺灣有98次中小企業"},{"start":133.63,"end":135.732,"text":"臺灣的詐騙這麼盛行其實也就是因為很多人沒有投資的管道"},{"start":155.632,"end":177.1,"text":"在比如說很多產業有一些單位拿不到錢一些人有錢那這中間的一些我們一些不管金融機構也好或是相關的這些協助募資的單位是不是也沒有相應的這個相關的法令啊比照美國其他國家一樣進步的法令讓他們可以來做這個相關的這個資金的這個募集啊"},{"start":177.88,"end":194.547,"text":"這當然比說其他國家有更好的制度我們會來參採不過本國有他自己的限制剛剛委員提到我們對於這些中小企業或中小微企業我們在過去假如銀行端我們在長期的那個有關融資的資助剛剛經濟部也有報告你剛剛講是融資喔我說的是投資那是銀行融資是兩個議題喔"},{"start":196.648,"end":223.901,"text":"對,再來就是有關我們所監管的金控、金融機構不管是銀行、保險公司都有創投的投資對於他們的創...我想請問你啦我直接問你喔因為你沒有回答專業投資人是不是很多都放在這個國外比如新加坡、香港啊都有很多做這個什麼這個家族的這個辦公室啊很多專業經理人那我國的資產管理業者怎麼樣跟這些可以跟這些怎麼樣跟這些對象進行公開的這個募集"},{"start":225.288,"end":245.789,"text":"就是我們現在的話就是這些高淨值的客戶他有兩個選擇一個是假如說他要做財富管理的話那會選擇是由我們金融機構那如果說你要做資產管理的話就會跟我們的這些投資他可能會選擇比如說創投啦還有像比如說我們的PE啊這些還有投信公司PE是虱目嘛對對對"},{"start":247.99,"end":271.224,"text":"對就類似像這樣他有不同的管道可以從他這邊得到一個投資的機會你現在要開放比如做資產管理中心外國的這些資產管理中心他們可以在因為外國的法律開放他們可以在外國募集資金對到臺灣來做相關的投資嘛這個沒問題嘛對不對但是我們本國呢本國的業者呢沒有辦法對外募資啊這是不是變成有不利的這個競爭地位啊"},{"start":273.654,"end":297.928,"text":"這個本國的投信公司他當然可以募集本國的基金對不對然後他也可以募集以後對海外銷售募集本國你是指比如說PE對不對不只但PE是他另外一個業務比如說他可以募集一般的基金這是對一些這個管道有管道的人那對很多投資大眾來講他沒有獲得這些訊息的管道啊也沒有這樣這個可以投資的方法那這個部分的落差你要怎麼補足呢"},{"start":298.548,"end":317.978,"text":"這個我們當然就是透過一些他們之間的銷售管理還有我們的教育訓練來做這些事情像比如說PE這些東西投資絕對不會是一般的專業投資人來做的比如說真的是一些已經成熟到可以上市櫃當然就一般人就可以投資前端的部分這樣就是要創造這麼多"},{"start":323.141,"end":346.134,"text":"所以在這個很專業的裡頭跟這個上市櫃那個也不用提那個是已經到了很進步的那個階段了那這中間一般的百姓除了去買這個基金做這樣的投資金融這個市場上投資實際上如果一般的百姓想要參與很多新創事業的投資的時候他們是沒有投資管道的沒有不知道怎麼樣去獲得這個這時候就很多所以很多詐騙集團會產生嘛"},{"start":348.495,"end":368.704,"text":"對 這時候就是要 如果真的正當管道就要透過資產管理業者來做這些事情他去提供那這個法令的部分如果我們限制太嚴格的話你現在在做亞洲資產管理中心如果在法令的部分你的限制比國外的相關法令嚴格的話你就會限這些本國的業者跟外國的資產管理業者在不公平的競爭地位"},{"start":369.164,"end":390.237,"text":"當然就是資金是國際競爭的假設台灣的一些法規對這些資金相對是比較不便利或是不友善當然這個競爭力就會下降我們要變成亞洲資產管理中心資金也是國際競爭如果我們的法令比較不進步我們的政策比較不open當然不要說我們的地緣政治"},{"start":390.977,"end":407.046,"text":"這樣子臺灣怎麼變成亞洲這個資產管理中心這個確實我們今晚會很努力我們請同仁盤點一下我們大概兩年之內我們要鬆綁54條我們關聯的規定好 那我想請問今晚會哪一個單位每年都出國考察這個金融科技啊108年44萬109年到那個11年沒有出國110年25萬112年54萬113年46萬今年要這個預算數要增加到107萬了這些預算出國考察是哪個單位去做考察的"},{"start":419.889,"end":447.16,"text":"主要是我們創新中心我們中規處創新中心是中規處派員出國考察是嗎對就是開會或是看他的目的性質來派適當的人員出國比如說像這些今年107萬是為哪個單位出國考察呢請我們處長說明一下這個是像今年的話我們是就是3月份的時候有去日本那不是去哪裡沒關係派哪些單位去我們金管會裡面哪些單位"},{"start":447.908,"end":448.529,"text":"其實我們在每年我們大概"},{"start":473.154,"end":484.197,"text":"發佈過我們的金融科技發展路徑圖1.0跟2.0我們就是很多是參考我們考察回來的結果沒關係你把這個相關的考察報告先提供給我我想請問在你們報告裡頭這個怎麼不寫這個股權期末的這個績效我上個會期就諮詢過了這個研議民間版的創規機制金管會說104年開放證券商的經營這個"},{"start":496.059,"end":496.219,"text":"主席"},{"start":569.005,"end":572.98,"text":"答案然後績效還是掛零對吧我再請問國發會"},{"start":575.12,"end":601.205,"text":"局長您聽到嗎?您知道我的意思嗎?政府是創造環境不是自己做然後做不好然後績效掛鈴你們工作實在量源很大副主委請教這個臺灣新創產業的這個企業齁你們這個也支持新創產業嘛齁新創產業新增數逐年減少齁這個齁現在大概有7900家身為國發會你看看我們的那個數據齁這個Fintech那個數據從20"},{"start":604.805,"end":612.25,"text":"2017年開始每年逐年下降從800多加800多到700多、600多、300多、200多、100多到2024現在22加這個逐年檢討的主因是什麼跟委員報告第一個因為今年還沒到沒關係不算今年從87654321一直下降國發會不是很支持嗎這不是國家的政策嗎我們的支持力道一直沒有減弱但是為什麼一直下降"},{"start":632.822,"end":648.692,"text":"其實如果委員注意大概這幾年我覺得一方面可能跟大環境有關係大環境因為你有注意到21、22年這幾年比較少的是正好是疫情的關係那前幾年一直下降23開始就沒有疫情了22以後就沒有疫情了從200多要變100多家"},{"start":649.918,"end":666.056,"text":"其實如果注意的話其實前幾年大概都還維持在六七百家以上不要講總數嘛你們新創就是就是每年增加的每年哪有呢去年113去年已經沒有疫情囉不要騙我是是是為什麼你們在做什麼沒有"},{"start":666.696,"end":690.927,"text":"委員我們的政策其實一直都在增加如果您...政策一直增加但是加速一直減少這是原因所以我們也希望這個源頭活水能夠維持我們會繼續加大你們不是希望這是你們要去擋到的目的啊是是是沒有做到的原因是什麼沒有所以我們現在會...經濟部上來的時候會加速跟...經濟部有中小企業署嗎我們中小企業署要上來中小企業新創署喔沒有國防委員會回答完畢你把它回答完為什麼是"},{"start":693.068,"end":714.573,"text":"沒有 所以我沒有注意到這個當然原因可能很複雜那我們希望在大學、法人、新創或者是企業部份大學法人我順便跟你講我看你們今天有提供是一個假消息嗎你們說你們跟這個臺大校友臺大校友基金嘛 對不對做一個校園這個要投資什麼校園這個成立臺灣第一個校友VC投資基金這是假新聞嗎"},{"start":716.301,"end":730.01,"text":"不是嘛,什麼叫做第一個校友投資,20年前成大,交通大學早就有了,你是在詐騙國人還是在詐騙立法院?不是,因為他們很多校友基金的目的是透過投資上市櫃股票有獲利回饋給學校,"},{"start":731.158,"end":758.733,"text":"那我們臺大規劃的這個校友基金就純粹就類似於VC的方式是直接投資新創就是不太一樣所以講第一個的意思是這個意思就性質不太一樣你們現在我據本席得到的訊息是你們沒有想要鼓勵提供資源給一些民間業者反而是找特定對象跟臺大洽談這是圖利特定對象不會啦而且還做假新聞說只有這個好像第一個校友基金沒有啦其實這個交大跟成大早就辦過還是這只是你"},{"start":760.294,"end":771.218,"text":"為了這個報告寫的故意要寫個東西好像你們有做什麼事情一樣那這個你們的這個創投天使方案現在是成資金已經成為零了是嗎沒有啊沒有嗎"},{"start":773.79,"end":792.305,"text":"我幫了50億元去做天使投資現在的資金是多少現在已經投了三十幾億了現在的資金是多少不是投了多少你現在的資金是多少現在已經投了38億了所以這個額度還有十幾億那如果額度要完還可以繼續增加那我請問在疫情期間你的這個特別書庫你剛剛說疫情嘛項目你回收了多少"},{"start":793.969,"end":794.269,"text":"美國跟日本"},{"start":816.687,"end":836.539,"text":"我看你們新創署的計畫裡頭在議題就好了還沒問到亞洲資產管理中心新創署的計畫裡頭多部分都是法人在學校在辦理你沒有規劃一個好的生態系讓民間人自主發展一個新創生態系的平台這個部分是不是你們要回去檢討一下"},{"start":837.039,"end":841.262,"text":"市長請你看一下美國、日本、以色列都是民間在發展我們政府不要什麼都自己辦剛剛跟鄭麒麟說軍管會說的也是一樣什麼事情都想說政府自己辦政府第一個修理很慢第二個實際上"},{"start":862.138,"end":888.351,"text":"本席所接觸的各個產業裡頭對我們的政府的這種高度監管還有反應很慢還有很多的這個思維跟民間的創新都跟不上事實上很多產業都頗有危言很多產業各行各業所以我希望在這個我們新的這個主委的帶領之下要open mind把那個頭腦打開然後那個下面的相關的要跟上不然這個我們事實上也是站在"},{"start":888.891,"end":889.951,"text":"陳玉珍委員．下一位質詢委員王洪威委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":797,"blocks":[["陳委員玉珍：（11時46分）主席，我先請金管會主委，待會有國發會和經濟部。"],["主席：請彭主委。"],["彭主任委員金隆：委員好。"],["陳委員玉珍：主委好。我看你的決心不錯，也有一點行動力，現在我看有如火如荼要做到兩年有感，讓臺灣成為亞洲資產管理中心這個計畫，已經講了幾十年的計畫好像感覺有一點機會，不過我感覺你面臨最大的挑戰，我聽很多立委的質詢，對法令的鬆綁和政策方面，我們都是相當支持的，但是我剛剛看到你在備詢的時候，有問題的話，下面的相關單位沒有上來協助提供資料，我覺得你面臨最大的挑戰可能不是來自我們這些外部，這是賴總統的政策，沒有問題，我看比較大的挑戰可能是你的先進的頭腦要幫忙你相關官僚體系要打開頭腦，這個要open。"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們同仁很不錯，待會他們會……"],["陳委員玉珍：認真很不錯，我沒有否定他們很認真，但是很多觀念這麼多年來就是這個樣子，可能還有其他部會，像財政部稅負方面的觀念、央行的外匯，不認為自己是管制，但是民間聲音就這麼多，國發會的政策、各方面可能也要一起來跟上，不然會非常非常辛苦，我們立法院當然站在支持的立場。你在書面報告中提到為了協助金融科技及新創業者籌得充足持續的多元資金，你要支持投資臺灣、支持產業發展，推動策略性投資項目。這些新的投資項目要對專業的投資人募集資金要怎麼做呢？"],["彭主任委員金隆：剛剛有提到，我們現在有上市櫃，剛剛董事長也在這邊，就像我們提到我們對這些真的要籌資的話，當然如果能夠在……"],["陳委員玉珍：那個是上市櫃，我們剛剛也有委員提到，臺灣有98%是中小企業，就業人口也占很高，新創還沒有上市櫃以前的資金取得來源，例如要經過新創公司的投資，在這個部分的話，臺灣的詐騙這麼多、這麼盛行，其實也就是因為很多人沒有投資的管道嘛！再比如說很多產業，有一些單位拿不到錢，有一些人有錢，那這中間不管金融機構也好，或是這些相關協助募資的單位，是不是也沒有相應、相關的法令，比照美國其他國家一樣進步的法令，讓他們可以做資金的募集？"],["彭主任委員金隆：當然其他國家有更好的制度我們會來參採，不過本國有自己的限制。剛剛委員有提到，我們對於這些中小企業或中小微企業，在過去假如銀行端有長期融資的資助，剛剛經濟部也有報告過……"],["陳委員玉珍：你剛剛講的是融資，我說的是投資，那是銀行融資，是兩個議題啊！"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，再來就是有關我們所經管金控金融機構，不管是銀行、保險公司，都有創投的投資……"],["陳委員玉珍：我知道。"],["彭主任委員金隆：對於他們……"],["陳委員玉珍：我直接問你啦！因為你沒有回答。專業投資人是不是很多都放在國外，比如新加坡、香港都有很多做家族的辦公室，很多專業經理人。那我國的資產管理業者，怎麼跟這些對象進行公開的募集？"],["彭主任委員金隆：現在的話，就是這些高淨值的客戶，他有兩個選擇，一個是假如他要做財富管理的話，那會選擇是由我們金融機構；如果要做資產管理的話，他可能會選擇比如說創投，還有像我們的PE，還有投信公司……"],["陳委員玉珍：PE是私募嘛！"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，類似像這樣，他有不同的管道，可以從他這邊得到一個投資的機會。"],["陳委員玉珍：好，你現在要開放，比如做資產管理中心，外國的資產管理中心，因為外國的法律開放，他們可以在外國募集資金，到臺灣來做相關的投資，這個沒問題對不對？"],["彭主任委員金隆：是，就比如……"],["陳委員玉珍：但是我們本國呢？本國的業者呢？沒有辦法對外募資啊！這是不是變成不利的競爭地位啊？"],["彭主任委員金隆：本國的投信公司當然可以募集本國的基金，然後它也可以募集以後對海外銷售……"],["陳委員玉珍：募集本國，你是指比如說PE對不對？"],["彭主任委員金隆：不只，PE是它另外一個業務，比如說它可以募集一般的基金……"],["陳委員玉珍：這是對一些有管道的，對很多投資大眾來講，他沒有獲得這些訊息的管道啊！也沒有這個可以投資的方法。"],["彭主任委員金隆：對。"],["陳委員玉珍：那這個部分的落差你要怎麼補足呢？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這個我們當然就是透過一些他們之間的銷售管道，還有我們的教育訓練來做這些事情，像PE這些東西，投資絕對不會是一般的……"],["陳委員玉珍：專業投資。"],["彭主任委員金隆：是專業投資人來做的。"],["陳委員玉珍：是專業投資的沒有問題。"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，比如真的是一些成熟到已經可以上市櫃，當然是一般人就可以投資。"],["陳委員玉珍：那些我都說沒有問題，我們在說那個部分。"],["彭主任委員金隆：前端的部分就是要創造這麼多……"],["陳委員玉珍：所以上市櫃也不用提了，那也是已經到很進步的階段了。這中間一般的百姓，除了去買基金做這樣的投資，在金融市場上投資，實際上如果一般的百姓想要參與很多新創事業投資的時候，他們是沒有投資管道的。不知道怎麼樣去獲得……"],["彭主任委員金隆：這時候就透過……"],["陳委員玉珍：所以這時候就很多詐騙集團會產生嘛！"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，這時候如果是真的正當管道，就要透過資產管理業者來做這些事情，他去提供這些投資機會……"],["陳委員玉珍：這個法令的部分，如果我們限制太嚴格的話，你現在在做亞洲資產管理中心，如果法令限制比國外的相關法令嚴格的話，就會使得本國的業者跟外國的資產管理業者處在不公平的競爭地位啊！"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，當然資金是國際競爭的，假設臺灣的一些法規，對這些資金相對是比較不便利或是不友善，當然這個競爭力就會下降。"],["陳委員玉珍：是啊！我們要變成亞洲資產管理中心，資金也是國際競爭，如果我們的法令比較不進步，我們的政策比較不開放，那當然就不要說我們的地緣政治，這樣子臺灣怎麼變成亞洲資產管理中心？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這個確實，我們金管會很努力，我們請同仁盤點一下，大概兩年之內要鬆綁54個管理規定。"],["陳委員玉珍：好，那我想請問，金管會哪一個單位每年都出國考察金融科技？108年44萬，109年到110年沒有出國，111年25萬，112年54萬，113年46萬，今年預算數要增加到107萬，這些預算出國考察，是哪個單位去做考察的？"],["彭主任委員金隆：主要是我們綜規處創新中心。"],["陳委員玉珍：是綜規處派員出國考察是嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：就是開會或是看它的目的性質，來派適當的人員出國。"],["陳委員玉珍：今年的107萬是為哪個單位出國考察呢？"],["彭主任委員金隆：請我們處長說明一下。"],["胡處長則華：今年的話我們是3月的時候有去日本。"],["陳委員玉珍：不是，去哪裡沒關係，派哪些單位去？我們金管會裡面哪些單位？"],["胡處長則華：原則上是創新中心，專門在負責金融科技的。"],["陳委員玉珍：金融科技創新中心？"],["胡處長則華：對。"],["陳委員玉珍：如果考察過別的國家的政策，回來後發現國內的政策比別的國家不進步，就不能用國情不同來講，你們有提出什麼真正的計畫嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：其實我們發布過我們的金融科技發展路徑圖1.0跟2.0，就是參考很多我們考察回來的結果。"],["陳委員玉珍：好，沒關係，你把相關的考察報告先提供給我。"],["彭主任委員金隆：可以，沒問題。"],["陳委員玉珍：我想請問，在你們的報告裡怎麼不寫股權群募績效？我上個會期就質詢過研議民間版創櫃機制，金管會說104年開放證券商得經營股權性質的群眾募資業，成效為3家新創公司，募資新臺幣1,700萬元，請問3年到5年有績效嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：就是我們在……"],["陳委員玉珍：證期局，有績效嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們確實有3家，詳細的內容我請局長說明。"],["陳委員玉珍：這3年有什麼績效嗎？"],["張局長振山：目前來講有3家業者。"],["陳委員玉珍：是，這已經講很久了，這104年開始，那過去3年到5年的績效是不是掛零？"],["張局長振山：一千七百多萬募資成功。"],["陳委員玉珍：1,700萬是從104年開始，那是累積的，我有查過數據。過去3年到5年的績效在哪裡？你不知道是不是？"],["張局長振山：當然現在看起來那個……"],["陳委員玉珍：是不是掛零？我會問你就是因為我查過了。"],["張局長振山：最近來講是掛零沒錯。"],["陳委員玉珍：掛零嘛！沒錯嘛！"],["張局長振山：櫃買中心已經在做專案處理。"],["陳委員玉珍：為什麼呢？你們這麼努力，也在研議民間版的創櫃制度，為什麼績效會是掛零？這3年到5年都掛零！現在櫃買中心用免費服務給新創公司對不對？事實上政府應該提供環境嘛！讓民間的產業可以去發展，做好一個規則提供環境，而不是政府自己又球員兼裁判，然後績效還是掛零，對吧？"],["張局長振山：是。"],["陳委員玉珍：局長您有聽到嗎？您知道我的意思嗎？政府是創造環境，不是自己做，然後做不好，然後績效掛零，你們工作量實在也很大。我再請問國發會，請教副主委，你們也支持新創產業，臺灣新創產業新增數逐年減少，現在大概有7,900家。國發會你看看FINDIT的數據，從2017年開始，每年逐年下降，從八百多、七百多、六百多、三百多、二百多，到2024年現在22家，這個逐年減少的主因是什麼？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：跟委員報告，第一，因為今年還沒到……"],["陳委員玉珍：沒關係不算今年，從8、7、6、5、4、3、2、1一直下降，國發會不是很支持嗎？這不是國家的政策嗎？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：我們的支持力道一直沒有減弱。"],["陳委員玉珍：但是為什麼一直下降？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：這幾年我覺得一方面可能跟大環境有關係……"],["陳委員玉珍：大環境？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：2021、2022年這幾年比較少，正好是疫情的關係……"],["陳委員玉珍：好，那前幾年就一直下降啊！2023年以後就沒有疫情了，從二百多家變一百多家。"],["詹副主任委員方冠：其實前幾年大概都還維持在6、700家以上。"],["陳委員玉珍：不要講總數嘛！你們新創就是……"],["詹副主任委員方冠：沒有，就是每年增加的家數。"],["陳委員玉珍：哪有？去年（112年）已經沒有疫情囉！不要騙我。"],["詹副主任委員方冠：是。"],["陳委員玉珍：為什麼？你們在做什麼？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：委員，我們的政策其實一直都在增加，如果您……"],["陳委員玉珍：政策一直增加，但是家數一直減少，這是什麼原因？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：所以我們也希望這個源頭活水能夠維持，我們會繼續加大。"],["陳委員玉珍：你們不是希望，這是你們要去達到的目的。"],["詹副主任委員方冠：是。"],["陳委員玉珍：沒有做到的原因是什麼？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：所以我們現在會加速跟……"],["陳委員玉珍：經濟部上來一下，有中小企業署吧？換中小企業新創署上來。國發會你把它回答完，為什麼？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：所以我們有注意到這個，當然原因可能很複雜，我們希望在大學、法人新創或者是企業部分……"],["陳委員玉珍：很複雜？那大學法人我順便跟你講，我看你們今天是提供一個假消息嗎？你們說你們跟台大校友基金做一個……"],["詹副主任委員方冠：是，臺大在規劃……"],["陳委員玉珍：要成立臺灣第一個校友VC投資基金，這是假新聞嗎？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：不是。"],["陳委員玉珍：不是嘛！什麼叫做第一個校友投資基金？20年前成大、交通大學早就有了，你是在詐騙國人，還是在詐騙立法委員？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：不是，因為很多校友基金的目的是透過投資上市櫃股票有獲利回饋給學校，臺大規劃的這個校友基金就純粹類似於VC的方式，是直接投資新創，所以講第一個的意思是這樣，就是性質不太一樣。"],["陳委員玉珍：據本席得到的訊息是，你們沒有想要鼓勵提供資源給一些民間業者，反而是找特定對象跟臺大洽談，這是圖利特定對象。"],["詹副主任委員方冠：不會啦！"],["陳委員玉珍：而且還做假新聞說這個好像是第一個校友基金，其實交大跟成大早就做過。還是這只是你為了報告寫的，故意要寫一個東西，好像你們有做什麼事情一樣。現在你們這個創投天使方案，資金已經成為零了是嗎？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：沒有啊！"],["陳委員玉珍：沒有嗎？那我再請問你……"],["詹副主任委員方冠：我們花了50億元去做天使投資。"],["陳委員玉珍：現在資金是多少？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：現在已經投了三十幾億了。"],["陳委員玉珍：現在的資金多少？不是投了多少，你現在的資金是多少？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：現在已經投了38億了，所以額度還有十幾億，如果額度用完還可以繼續增加。"],["陳委員玉珍：那我請問在疫情期間，你的特別紓困項目回收了多少？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：不好意思，這個回收多少，我可能要問一下國發基金。"],["陳委員玉珍：好，那你會後提供資料給我。"],["詹副主任委員方冠：是。"],["陳委員玉珍：請問台杉作為國家級的投資公司，投資了臺灣多少新創公司？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：這個我會後也一併提供。"],["陳委員玉珍：也是會後提供資料？"],["詹副主任委員方冠：是，不好意思，謝謝委員。"],["陳委員玉珍：國發會都沒有辦法回答，都要會後提供。我想請問經濟部，美國跟日本……再一題就好了，還沒問到亞洲資產管理中心。我看你們新創署的計畫裡頭，多半都是法人、學校在辦理，你沒有一個規劃好的生態系，讓民間能自主發展一個新創生態系的平台，這個部分是不是你們要回去檢討一下？"],["何次長晉滄：報告委員，我們最近這幾年也在鼓勵民間成立加速器，也有補助許多民間的創意機構，在做一些新創的輔導。"],["陳委員玉珍：次長，請你看一下美國、日本、以色列都是民間在發展，我們政府不要什麼都自己辦，剛剛跟金管會證期局說的也是一樣，什麼事情都想政府自己辦。政府第一個效率很慢，第二，事實上據本席所接觸的各個產業，對我們政府的這種高度監管，還有反應很慢以及很多思維都跟民間的創新跟不上，事實上很多產業都頗有微詞。所以我希望在我們新主委的帶領之下，要open mind把頭腦打開，然後下面的相關單位也要跟上。我們事實上也是站在支持主委、支持次長的立場，這個政策就要儘量來做開放。因為時間的關係，亞洲資產管理中心下次再來問財政部，謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝陳玉珍委員，下一位質詢委員為王鴻薇委員。"],["主席（陳委員玉珍）：現在已經12點，所以我們中午不休息，便當在各自座位上就各自用餐。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":308,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-20-4","speakers":["陳玉珍","林德福","吳秉叡","郭國文","賴惠員","李彥秀","李坤城","賴士葆","顏寬恒","黃珊珊","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","王鴻薇","王世堅","廖先翔","黃國昌","鍾佳濱","葉元之","沈發惠","葛如鈞","賴瑞隆","羅明才","邱志偉","林楚茵"],"page_start":225,"meetingDate":["2024-10-24"],"gazette_id":"1138901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1138901_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆、財政部莊部長翠雲、中央銀行、國家發展委員會、經\n濟部、交通部就「政府推動臺灣成為亞洲資產管理中心之具體作為暨如何協助金融科技及新創產\n業籌資現況與未來發展」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1138901_00004"}}}