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{\"word\": \"統\"}]}, {\"start\": 279.873, \"end\": 304.398, \"text\": \"沒有到國情報告的憲法義務那相對的立法院也無停取國情報告的憲法義務兩邊都沒有憲法義務是那這一個裡面他雖然對15條之一的第一項並沒有說是違憲不過要看到是第15條之後跟第15條之四那第15條之四已經是違憲了就不用再跟公務員報告\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 279.873, \"end\": 280.033, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 280.033, \"end\": 280.273, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 280.273, \"end\": 280.673, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 280.673, \"end\": 281.153, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 281.153, \"end\": 281.293, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 281.293, \"end\": 281.433, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"憲\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 281.433, \"end\": 282.594, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"義\"}, {\"word\": \"務\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 282.594, \"end\": 282.814, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 282.814, \"end\": 283.334, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": 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{\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 328.212, \"end\": 328.332, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"向\", \"start\": 328.332, \"end\": 328.513, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 328.513, \"end\": 328.633, \"score\": 0.852}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 328.633, \"end\": 328.833, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 328.833, \"end\": 329.033, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"負\", \"start\": 329.033, \"end\": 329.173, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"責\"}, {\"word\": \"吧\", \"start\": 329.173, \"end\": 329.653, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 329.653, \"end\": 329.773, \"score\": 0.97}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 329.773, \"end\": 330.033, \"score\": 0.842}, {\"word\": \"書\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 330.033, \"end\": 330.154, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 330.154, \"end\": 331.214, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"寫\"}, {\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 331.214, 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\"第三相處的立法院有沒有提案權我也花了很多時間跟我們的同事在研究那如果依照這個條文沒有的話根本現在就沒有在立法院沒有案了雖然國民黨跟民眾黨是有提一個案提一個做決議但是如果依照這個條文那個案就已經不存在了因為你已經違憲了所以已經失守護理了\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 334.83, \"end\": 334.99, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"三\", \"start\": 334.99, \"end\": 335.17, \"score\": 0.847}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 335.17, \"end\": 335.61, \"score\": 0.808}, {\"word\": \"處\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 335.61, \"end\": 335.971, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 335.971, \"end\": 336.191, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 336.191, \"end\": 336.371, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 336.371, \"end\": 336.671, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 336.671, \"end\": 336.851, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 336.851, \"end\": 336.991, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 336.991, \"end\": 337.111, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 337.111, \"end\": 337.231, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 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341.273, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"研\", \"start\": 341.273, \"end\": 341.573, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"究\", \"start\": 341.573, \"end\": 342.493, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 342.493, \"end\": 342.713, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 342.713, \"end\": 342.913, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 342.913, \"end\": 343.094, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"依\", \"start\": 343.094, \"end\": 343.274, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"照\", \"start\": 343.274, \"end\": 343.854, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"文\", \"start\": 343.854, \"end\": 343.994, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 343.994, \"end\": 344.194, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 344.194, \"end\": 344.314, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 344.314, \"end\": 345.034, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"話\"}, {\"word\": \"根\", \"start\": 345.034, \"end\": 345.234, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 345.234, \"end\": 345.595, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 345.595, \"end\": 345.755, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 345.755, \"end\": 345.895, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 345.895, \"end\": 346.015, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 346.015, \"end\": 346.175, \"score\": 0.871}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 346.175, \"end\": 346.315, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 346.315, \"end\": 346.435, \"score\": 0.798}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 346.435, \"end\": 346.455, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 346.455, \"end\": 346.595, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 346.595, \"end\": 346.735, \"score\": 0.737}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 346.735, \"end\": 346.915, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 346.915, \"end\": 348.016, \"score\": 0.866}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 348.016, \"end\": 349.216, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"雖\"}, {\"word\": \"然\", \"start\": 349.216, \"end\": 349.876, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 349.876, \"end\": 350.197, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"黨\"}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 350.197, \"end\": 350.337, \"score\": 0.863}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 350.337, \"end\": 350.877, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"眾\"}, {\"word\": \"黨\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 350.877, \"end\": 350.997, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 350.997, \"end\": 351.217, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 351.217, \"end\": 351.337, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 351.337, \"end\": 351.597, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 351.597, \"end\": 352.417, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 352.417, \"end\": 352.537, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 352.537, \"end\": 352.878, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"做\", \"start\": 352.878, \"end\": 353.978, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"決\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 353.978, \"end\": 354.138, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 354.138, \"end\": 354.318, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 354.318, \"end\": 354.498, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 354.498, \"end\": 354.678, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"依\", \"start\": 354.678, \"end\": 354.858, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"照\", \"start\": 354.858, \"end\": 355.479, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"文\", \"start\": 355.479, \"end\": 355.899, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 355.899, \"end\": 356.219, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 356.219, \"end\": 356.479, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 356.479, \"end\": 356.739, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"已\", \"start\": 356.739, \"end\": 358.06, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 358.06, \"end\": 358.22, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"存\", \"start\": 358.22, \"end\": 358.5, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 358.5, \"end\": 358.74, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 358.74, \"end\": 359.4, \"score\": 0.884}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 359.4, \"end\": 359.62, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 359.62, \"end\": 359.781, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"已\", \"start\": 359.781, \"end\": 360.421, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"違\"}, {\"word\": \"憲\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 360.421, \"end\": 361.161, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 361.161, \"end\": 361.381, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 361.381, \"end\": 361.721, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"已\", \"start\": 361.721, \"end\": 362.122, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"失\", \"start\": 362.122, \"end\": 362.322, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"守\", \"start\": 362.322, \"end\": 362.442, \"score\": 0.836}, {\"word\": \"護\"}, {\"word\": \"理\", \"start\": 362.442, \"end\": 362.462, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 362.462, \"end\": 362.482, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 363.382, \"end\": 382.502, \"text\": \"那現在只能再變成第15條之後的第二項去看了。那第二項對於這些的議題上被設定是違憲的。那違憲的變成是什麼?只有總統得知請立法院同意後,至立法院進行國情報告。\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 363.382, \"end\": 363.662, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 363.662, \"end\": 364.083, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"只\", \"start\": 364.083, \"end\": 364.243, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 364.243, \"end\": 364.423, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 364.423, \"end\": 365.284, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"變\"}, {\"word\": \"成\", \"start\": 365.284, \"end\": 365.444, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 365.444, \"end\": 366.165, \"score\": 0.847}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"5\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 366.165, \"end\": 366.706, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 366.706, \"end\": 367.967, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 367.967, \"end\": 368.167, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 368.167, \"end\": 368.287, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"二\", \"start\": 368.287, \"end\": 368.668, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"項\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 368.668, \"end\": 368.828, \"score\": 0.98}, {\"word\": \"看\", \"start\": 368.828, \"end\": 369.629, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 369.629, \"end\": 369.649, \"score\": 0.183}, {\"word\": \"。\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 369.649, \"end\": 369.789, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 369.789, \"end\": 369.889, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"二\", \"start\": 369.889, \"end\": 370.71, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"項\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"於\", \"start\": 370.71, \"end\": 371.17, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 371.17, \"end\": 371.371, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 371.371, \"end\": 371.971, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 371.971, \"end\": 373.333, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"被\", \"start\": 373.333, \"end\": 374.154, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"設\"}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 374.154, \"end\": 374.394, \"score\": 0.841}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 374.394, \"end\": 374.574, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"違\"}, {\"word\": \"憲\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 374.574, \"end\": 375.595, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"。\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 375.595, \"end\": 376.056, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"違\"}, {\"word\": \"憲\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 376.056, \"end\": 376.156, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"變\"}, {\"word\": \"成\", \"start\": 376.156, \"end\": 376.276, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 376.276, \"end\": 376.336, \"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 376.336, \"end\": 376.896, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"?\"}, {\"word\": \"只\", \"start\": 376.896, \"end\": 377.037, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 377.037, \"end\": 378.238, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 378.238, \"end\": 378.538, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"知\", \"start\": 378.538, \"end\": 379.459, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 379.459, \"end\": 379.619, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 379.619, \"end\": 379.759, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 379.759, \"end\": 380.04, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 380.04, \"end\": 380.34, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"意\", \"start\": 380.34, \"end\": 380.54, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 380.54, \"end\": 381.061, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"至\", \"start\": 381.061, \"end\": 381.261, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 381.261, \"end\": 381.441, \"score\": 0.869}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 381.441, \"end\": 381.722, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 381.722, \"end\": 381.902, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 381.902, \"end\": 382.262, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 382.262, \"end\": 382.482, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 382.482, \"end\": 382.502, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"。\"}]}, {\"start\": 383.183, \"end\": 406.357, \"text\": \"那這邊就總統有主動的來立法院請你同意我來報告那這邊有兩個這種狀況總統自己要來喊就是好比我剛才跟某一個委員我特別說明在93年95年陳總統的時候曾經兩度向立法院他要來報告那沒有接受\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 383.183, \"end\": 383.323, \"score\": 0.887}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"邊\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 383.323, \"end\": 384.804, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 384.804, \"end\": 385.144, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 385.144, \"end\": 385.705, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 385.705, \"end\": 386.985, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 386.985, \"end\": 387.105, \"score\": 0.836}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 387.105, \"end\": 387.145, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 387.145, \"end\": 388.206, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 388.206, \"end\": 388.446, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 388.446, \"end\": 388.766, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"意\", \"start\": 388.766, \"end\": 389.227, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 389.227, \"end\": 389.627, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 389.627, \"end\": 390.367, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 390.367, \"end\": 392.188, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"邊\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 392.188, \"end\": 392.408, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"兩\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"種\"}, {\"word\": \"狀\"}, {\"word\": \"況\"}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"自\", \"start\": 392.408, \"end\": 392.549, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"己\", \"start\": 392.549, \"end\": 392.669, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 392.669, \"end\": 393.589, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"喊\", \"start\": 393.589, \"end\": 393.869, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 393.869, \"end\": 393.989, \"score\": 0.868}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 393.989, \"end\": 394.089, \"score\": 0.811}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 394.089, \"end\": 394.27, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"比\", \"start\": 394.27, \"end\": 394.39, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 394.39, \"end\": 394.77, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"才\", \"start\": 394.77, \"end\": 395.29, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 395.29, \"end\": 396.271, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"某\", \"start\": 396.271, \"end\": 396.451, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 396.451, \"end\": 396.671, \"score\": 0.826}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 396.671, \"end\": 396.971, \"score\": 0.869}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 396.971, \"end\": 397.291, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"特\", \"start\": 397.291, \"end\": 397.411, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"別\", \"start\": 397.411, \"end\": 397.792, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 397.792, \"end\": 398.332, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 398.332, \"end\": 399.032, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"9\"}, {\"word\": \"3\"}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 399.032, \"end\": 400.793, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"9\"}, {\"word\": \"5\"}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 400.793, \"end\": 400.953, \"score\": 0.871}, {\"word\": \"陳\"}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 400.953, \"end\": 401.274, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 401.274, \"end\": 401.794, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"曾\", \"start\": 401.794, \"end\": 402.574, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"兩\"}, {\"word\": \"度\", \"start\": 402.574, \"end\": 402.795, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"向\", \"start\": 402.795, \"end\": 402.995, \"score\": 0.98}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 402.995, \"end\": 403.095, \"score\": 0.806}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 403.095, \"end\": 403.135, \"score\": 0.499}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 403.135, \"end\": 403.795, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 403.795, \"end\": 403.995, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 403.995, \"end\": 404.536, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 404.536, \"end\": 405.276, \"score\": 0.959}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 405.276, \"end\": 405.676, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 405.676, \"end\": 405.916, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 405.916, \"end\": 406.117, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 406.117, \"end\": 406.337, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"受\", \"start\": 406.337, \"end\": 406.357, \"score\": 0.131}]}, {\"start\": 407.077, \"end\": 434.297, \"text\": \"李委員沒有接受,所以這個可能會被你到那種情況。好,秘書長,我們立法院是站在被動的角度,被動啦。那總統府現在看起來是主動,他也認同說要來這個立法院做國情報告啦。那我現在問的就是說,我們未來我們立法院的這個被動,是不是也能夠主動來研討這個未來有可能因應總統要來國情報告的事項啦。\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"李\", \"start\": 407.077, \"end\": 407.197, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 407.197, \"end\": 407.337, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 407.337, \"end\": 407.457, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 407.457, \"end\": 407.557, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 407.557, \"end\": 407.738, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"受\", \"start\": 407.738, \"end\": 408.138, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 408.138, \"end\": 408.338, \"score\": 0.847}, 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\"text\": \"我相信在技術上的問題我們立法院的幕僚單位應該都能夠妥善來因應那但是能否邀請到我們賴清德總統來進行這個國情報告還是需要等待\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 576.794, \"end\": 576.934, \"score\": 0.854}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 576.934, \"end\": 576.954, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"信\", \"start\": 576.954, \"end\": 576.974, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 576.974, \"end\": 577.094, \"score\": 0.789}, {\"word\": \"技\", \"start\": 577.094, \"end\": 577.214, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"術\"}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 577.214, \"end\": 577.234, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 577.234, \"end\": 577.254, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 577.254, \"end\": 577.314, \"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 577.314, \"end\": 577.394, \"score\": 0.748}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 577.394, \"end\": 577.414, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 577.414, \"end\": 577.574, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"的\", 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\"我們也是要釋出善意啊你說總統府那邊單方面的認為說要來國情報告可是立法院這邊沒有釋出善意也不可能能夠促成這個國情報告\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 650.649, \"end\": 650.849, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 650.849, \"end\": 650.989, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 650.989, \"end\": 651.11, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 651.11, \"end\": 651.49, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"釋\"}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 651.49, \"end\": 651.69, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"善\", \"start\": 651.69, \"end\": 651.89, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"意\", \"start\": 651.89, \"end\": 652.03, \"score\": 0.867}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 652.03, \"end\": 652.191, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 652.191, \"end\": 653.032, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"府\", \"start\": 653.032, \"end\": 653.312, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 653.312, \"end\": 654.373, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": 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{\"word\": \"．\"}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 700.895, \"end\": 701.035, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 701.035, \"end\": 701.175, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 701.175, \"end\": 702.256, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 702.256, \"end\": 702.577, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"當\"}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 702.577, \"end\": 702.837, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 702.837, \"end\": 703.297, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"敘\"}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 703.297, \"end\": 704.339, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"審\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 704.339, \"end\": 704.659, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 704.659, \"end\": 704.899, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"序\", \"start\": 704.899, \"end\": 705.44, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"將\"}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 705.44, \"end\": 705.78, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"未\", \"start\": 705.78, \"end\": 706.801, 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0.94}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"講\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 742.572, \"end\": 742.812, \"score\": 0.834}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 742.812, \"end\": 742.973, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 742.973, \"end\": 743.133, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 743.133, \"end\": 743.373, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"序\", \"start\": 743.373, \"end\": 743.573, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 743.573, \"end\": 743.773, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 743.773, \"end\": 743.873, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 743.873, \"end\": 744.374, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"安\", \"start\": 744.374, \"end\": 744.654, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"排\", \"start\": 744.654, \"end\": 744.674, \"score\": 0.891}]}, {\"start\": 745.495, \"end\": 764.535, \"text\": \"那至於裡面的很多違憲的地方我們就沒有辦法去做一個處理至於因為現在裡面有一個狀況的目前不同點的幾個跟陳委員報告一下一個原來是吳季明投票了現在改成季明投票了\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 745.495, \"end\": 746.016, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"至\", \"start\": 746.016, \"end\": 746.176, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"於\", \"start\": 746.176, \"end\": 746.536, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"裡\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 746.536, \"end\": 746.696, \"score\": 0.827}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 746.696, \"end\": 746.816, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 746.816, \"end\": 747.037, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 747.037, \"end\": 747.697, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"違\"}, {\"word\": \"憲\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 747.697, \"end\": 747.837, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 747.837, \"end\": 747.998, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 747.998, \"end\": 748.538, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 748.538, \"end\": 748.899, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 748.899, \"end\": 749.079, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 749.079, \"end\": 749.219, \"score\": 0.838}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 749.219, \"end\": 749.319, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"辦\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 749.319, \"end\": 750.36, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 750.36, \"end\": 750.861, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"做\", \"start\": 750.861, \"end\": 751.021, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 751.021, \"end\": 751.501, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"處\"}, {\"word\": \"理\", \"start\": 751.501, \"end\": 752.022, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"至\", \"start\": 752.022, \"end\": 752.182, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"於\", \"start\": 752.182, \"end\": 753.383, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 753.383, \"end\": 753.844, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 753.844, \"end\": 754.164, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"裡\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 754.164, \"end\": 754.324, \"score\": 0.869}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 754.324, \"end\": 754.424, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 754.424, \"end\": 754.945, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"狀\"}, {\"word\": \"況\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 754.945, \"end\": 756.607, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"目\", \"start\": 756.607, \"end\": 756.807, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"前\", \"start\": 756.807, \"end\": 757.067, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 757.067, \"end\": 757.207, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 757.207, \"end\": 757.547, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"點\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 757.547, \"end\": 758.088, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"幾\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 758.088, \"end\": 758.388, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"陳\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 758.388, \"end\": 758.769, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 758.769, \"end\": 758.949, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 758.949, \"end\": 759.009, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 759.009, \"end\": 759.449, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 759.449, \"end\": 759.77, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"原\", \"start\": 759.77, \"end\": 760.09, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 760.09, \"end\": 760.39, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"吳\"}, {\"word\": \"季\", \"start\": 760.39, \"end\": 761.211, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 761.211, \"end\": 762.292, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"投\", \"start\": 762.292, \"end\": 762.473, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"票\", \"start\": 762.473, \"end\": 762.673, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 762.673, \"end\": 763.233, \"score\": 0.959}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 763.233, \"end\": 763.414, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"改\", \"start\": 763.414, \"end\": 763.534, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"成\", \"start\": 763.534, \"end\": 763.734, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"季\", \"start\": 763.734, \"end\": 763.874, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 763.874, \"end\": 764.054, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"投\", \"start\": 764.054, \"end\": 764.274, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"票\", \"start\": 764.274, \"end\": 764.515, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 764.515, \"end\": 764.535, \"score\": 0.83}]}, {\"start\": 765.275, \"end\": 794.035, \"text\": \"那另外一個委員會原來他是只有初期委員過半數現在兩個都一樣要全體委員過半數那現在就是說全院委員會審查以後這個審查報告跟這一個投票一定要10天那至於這一個要分開裡面還有一個很重要就是像我當考試委員是一起的總共10個人在一起現在不行了要分別要分別的\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 765.275, \"end\": 765.435, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"另\", \"start\": 765.435, \"end\": 765.596, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"外\", \"start\": 765.596, \"end\": 765.776, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 765.776, \"end\": 766.416, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 766.416, \"end\": 767.297, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, 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{\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"審\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 775.742, \"end\": 776.043, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 776.043, \"end\": 777.203, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 777.203, \"end\": 777.424, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"審\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 777.424, \"end\": 777.884, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 777.884, \"end\": 778.424, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 778.424, \"end\": 778.724, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 778.724, \"end\": 778.945, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"投\", \"start\": 778.945, \"end\": 779.085, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"票\", \"start\": 779.085, \"end\": 779.305, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 779.305, \"end\": 779.425, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 779.425, \"end\": 779.565, \"score\": 0.999}, 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0.958}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"共\", \"start\": 789.372, \"end\": 789.812, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 789.812, \"end\": 789.932, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 789.932, \"end\": 790.112, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 790.112, \"end\": 790.252, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"起\", \"start\": 790.252, \"end\": 790.873, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 790.873, \"end\": 791.013, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 791.013, \"end\": 791.173, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 791.173, \"end\": 791.373, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 791.373, \"end\": 791.713, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 791.713, \"end\": 792.033, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 792.033, \"end\": 792.434, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"別\", \"start\": 792.434, \"end\": 793.214, \"score\": 0.97}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 793.214, \"end\": 793.474, \"score\": 0.98}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 793.474, \"end\": 793.835, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"別\", \"start\": 793.835, \"end\": 794.015, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 794.015, \"end\": 794.035, \"score\": 0.694}]}, {\"start\": 794.475, \"end\": 794.515, \"text\": \"陳俊宇議員\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"陳\"}, {\"word\": \"俊\", \"start\": 794.475, \"end\": 794.495, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"宇\", \"start\": 794.495, \"end\": 794.515, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"員\"}]}, {\"start\": 814.059, \"end\": 838.557, \"text\": \"好我想有關這個職權行使法的相關修法那在本次這個憲判當中大法官已經給出非常明確的指引對於這個憲政機關的權力分立劃出界限也不應該再出現國會優位的這個情況那接下來我們國會改革修法還會繼續的持續進行判決也會讓後續的這個相關法有一個\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 814.059, \"end\": 814.96, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 814.96, \"end\": 815.06, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 815.06, \"end\": 815.42, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"有\", 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{\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 876.041, \"end\": 876.201, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 876.201, \"end\": 876.361, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 876.361, \"end\": 876.741, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"機\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 876.741, \"end\": 877.001, \"score\": 0.738}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 877.001, \"end\": 877.522, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 877.522, \"end\": 877.682, \"score\": 0.866}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 877.682, \"end\": 877.802, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"教\", \"start\": 877.802, \"end\": 877.982, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"秘\", \"start\": 877.982, \"end\": 879.142, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"書\"}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 879.142, \"end\": 879.362, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 879.362, \"end\": 879.582, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 879.582, \"end\": 879.783, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"追\", \"start\": 879.783, \"end\": 880.123, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"蹤\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 880.123, \"end\": 880.203, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 880.203, \"end\": 880.363, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 880.363, \"end\": 880.503, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 880.503, \"end\": 880.663, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 880.663, \"end\": 881.563, \"score\": 0.868}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"擴\"}, {\"word\": \"建\", \"start\": 881.563, \"end\": 881.723, \"score\": 0.805}, {\"word\": \"目\", \"start\": 881.723, \"end\": 881.923, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"前\", \"start\": 881.923, \"end\": 882.123, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 882.123, \"end\": 882.884, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"推\", \"start\": 882.884, \"end\": 883.184, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 883.184, \"end\": 883.584, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"度\", \"start\": 883.584, \"end\": 884.324, \"score\": 0.959}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 884.324, \"end\": 884.464, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"秘\", \"start\": 884.464, \"end\": 884.804, \"score\": 0.879}, {\"word\": \"書\"}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 884.804, \"end\": 884.964, \"score\": 0.884}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 884.964, \"end\": 885.065, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 885.065, \"end\": 885.205, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 885.205, \"end\": 885.505, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 885.505, \"end\": 885.525, \"score\": 0.998}]}, {\"start\": 886.625, \"end\": 901.38, \"text\": \"本席非常關心這個國會這個擴建的相關計畫也多次向您來詢問這個問題那今年4月份的時候詢討的時候秘書長您也表示說個人的立場上\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 886.625, \"end\": 886.765, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"席\", \"start\": 886.765, \"end\": 886.906, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"非\", \"start\": 886.906, \"end\": 887.006, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"常\", \"start\": 887.006, \"end\": 887.386, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"心\", \"start\": 887.386, \"end\": 889.168, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"擴\"}, {\"word\": \"建\", \"start\": 889.168, \"end\": 889.328, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 889.328, \"end\": 889.428, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 889.428, \"end\": 890.729, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"計\"}, {\"word\": \"畫\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 890.729, \"end\": 890.89, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 890.89, \"end\": 891.11, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"次\", \"start\": 891.11, \"end\": 891.27, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"向\", \"start\": 891.27, \"end\": 891.51, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"您\", \"start\": 891.51, \"end\": 895.034, \"score\": 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\"陳\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 1077.833, \"end\": 1078.514, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 1078.514, \"end\": 1078.634, \"score\": 0.816}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 1078.634, \"end\": 1078.794, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 1078.794, \"end\": 1079.175, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 1079.175, \"end\": 1079.335, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 1079.335, \"end\": 1079.756, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 1079.756, \"end\": 1079.896, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 1079.896, \"end\": 1079.916, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"。\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:25,068 --> 00:00:27,409\n好,謝謝主席,我們有請周秘書長好,請周秘書長\n\n2\n00:00:30,953 --> 00:00:53,103\n好秘書長早秘書長我們今天還是就上週五那個剛出爐的憲判字第9號判決來進行相關意見上的交流那有關國會這個職權行使相關的修法也是本委員會第一會期的一個核心焦點那從過去幾個月我們經過這個畸變和對抗也聽到\n\n3\n00:00:59,086 --> 00:01:16,313\n來自各方立場不同的意見但作為民主法治的國家各機關的職權的行使都應該在符合憲法的框架內國會改革的運作和修法也應當在符合憲法權利分立的原則下來進行\n\n4\n00:01:17,634 --> 00:01:42,500\n大法官為解決憲政上的爭議．秉持著法學的專業．來做出本次憲法判決．各機關或各人也都應該要遵照解釋．尊重我們憲法法庭．並接受判決的結果．我想在此我們來請問秘書長．立法院是不是也應該遵守憲法的判決．來處理有關的事項．\n\n5\n00:01:43,080 --> 00:01:46,541\n那我們立法院就是要遵守嗎?\n\n6\n00:02:00,545 --> 00:02:26,693\n就配合這個所作的這個判決的解釋來處理所以我們就尊重憲法法庭的判決結果了那從這次的這個判決所顯示出來有部分是違憲有部分是合憲那也做出更細緻的解釋該如何在符合憲判的這個意旨下來行使職權也是未來我們要持續來討論的一個課題那首先\n\n7\n00:02:29,096 --> 00:02:54,918\n就這個判決當中有關聽取總統國情報告的部分我想來就教我們秘書長那對於有關這個國情報告大法官認為總統可以決定是否且何時前來報告並自行決定報告的內容詢問總統或是要求答覆則抵觸憲法權力分立的這個原則且這個憲法徵修條文\n\n8\n00:02:57,260 --> 00:03:12,193\n僅賦予立法院被動來聽取總統國情報告的權利因此有關定期報告和疾問疾打的條文也都被大法官判決屬於違憲而我們看到立法院提供的書面報告寫道\n\n9\n00:03:13,454 --> 00:03:32,944\n對於判決的內容予以尊重那我想再次的就叫我們秘書長如何來解讀這個憲判對國情報告的解釋以及未來如何邀請總統來進行報告並且在這個形式上應該要如何來設計才能夠符合憲判的這個意旨謝謝陳委員所提示\n\n10\n00:03:38,188 --> 00:03:53,465\n大概一般來講我這一個報告首先必須要說明我是只按照這一個憲法的裁判依照這一個所做的一個整理並沒有以幕僚長的立場\n\n11\n00:03:55,247 --> 00:03:55,427\n陳俊宇議員\n\n12\n00:04:13,275 --> 00:04:38,232\n把後面的從第6到第15頁每一個法條之間有沒有違憲都有用紅紙跟藍紙寫出來那再來我現在跟針對陳委員所提的我做一個簡單的報告因為我們是已經被動了我這裡有特別寫說被動聽取國情報告之權那在這個裁判裡面所寫的就是總統\n\n13\n00:04:39,873 --> 00:05:04,398\n沒有到國情報告的憲法義務那相對的立法院也無停取國情報告的憲法義務兩邊都沒有憲法義務是那這一個裡面他雖然對15條之一的第一項並沒有說是違憲不過要看到是第15條之後跟第15條之四那第15條之四已經是違憲了就不用再跟公務員報告\n\n14\n00:05:05,678 --> 00:05:33,636\n那現在的涉及到怎麼應應第15條之後的問題那第15條之後本來我在陳委員還記得我上次來報告的時候我特別講立法院有決定權那立法院有決定權就是因為這一個條文本來總統就沒有到立法院來我們沒辦法總統不向立法院負責吧我的書也是這樣寫但是現在的情況是第一項被刪除掉\n\n15\n00:05:34,830 --> 00:06:02,482\n第三相處的立法院有沒有提案權我也花了很多時間跟我們的同事在研究那如果依照這個條文沒有的話根本現在就沒有在立法院沒有案了雖然國民黨跟民眾黨是有提一個案提一個做決議但是如果依照這個條文那個案就已經不存在了因為你已經違憲了所以已經失守護理了\n\n16\n00:06:03,382 --> 00:06:22,502\n那現在只能再變成第15條之後的第二項去看了。那第二項對於這些的議題上被設定是違憲的。那違憲的變成是什麼?只有總統得知請立法院同意後,至立法院進行國情報告。\n\n17\n00:06:23,183 --> 00:06:46,357\n那這邊就總統有主動的來立法院請你同意我來報告那這邊有兩個這種狀況總統自己要來喊就是好比我剛才跟某一個委員我特別說明在93年95年陳總統的時候曾經兩度向立法院他要來報告那沒有接受\n\n18\n00:06:47,077 --> 00:07:14,297\n李委員沒有接受,所以這個可能會被你到那種情況。好,秘書長,我們立法院是站在被動的角度,被動啦。那總統府現在看起來是主動,他也認同說要來這個立法院做國情報告啦。那我現在問的就是說,我們未來我們立法院的這個被動,是不是也能夠主動來研討這個未來有可能因應總統要來國情報告的事項啦。\n\n19\n00:07:14,961 --> 00:07:31,874\n是怎樣事務性的我們都已經在上一次已經都有大概都有一個方案在啦只不過現在的一個情況這個條文裡面到底立法院要不要同意他來報告那這不是我秘書長所能跟你答覆的\n\n20\n00:07:33,275 --> 00:07:59,486\n就對於要不要邀請總統來做這個國情報告我想在各方都近期內也表達了許多不同的立場那在憲判出爐之後總統府也立即有表示賴總統願意到立法院來進行國情報告這是確定的那這與賴總統在不論是競選的時候還是說他在就職的時候所表達的立場都沒有改變過\n\n21\n00:08:00,666 --> 00:08:27,504\n那只要在我們依法合憲的情況之下賴總統都願意到我們國會來做國情報告並且先前也曾經有過相關的這個議案朝野已經進行多次的這個協商討論那我們上會期也曾經對於這個國情報告的形式進行過討論參考其他國家的執行情況以及這個憲法機關相互尊重的這個原則之下我想總統到國會來做國情報告\n\n22\n00:08:30,507 --> 00:08:55,048\n更是可以讓我們國會來遵受到尊重那展現這個實際的這個情況黨團協商若是決定要邀請我們賴總統來進行報告那準備的工作就是需要仰賴我們院內在我們周秘書長所帶領的團隊來做籌組那我想我還是請教我們秘書長這個立法院\n\n23\n00:08:57,390 --> 00:09:12,899\n我們是不是已經對於這個賴總統要來做國情報告的這個事項有已經安排其他相關的這個流程還有列席的對象以及動線的安排等等的規劃這個部分我們是不是已經有推演過了\n\n24\n00:09:13,598 --> 00:09:16,239\n我們是不是已經和府方也進行溝通隨時能邀請總統到本院來做報告\n\n25\n00:09:36,794 --> 00:09:40,635\n我相信在技術上的問題我們立法院的幕僚單位應該都能夠妥善來因應那但是能否邀請到我們賴清德總統來進行這個國情報告還是需要等待\n\n26\n00:09:57,941 --> 00:10:19,827\n我們院長在召開相關的協商會議並凝聚共事還是期待我們能夠正式的來邀請賴總統首次到國會來進行國情報告以建立我們良好的憲政慣例我想作為在立法院近40年的歷史見證者秘書長您是不是也樂觀其成\n\n27\n00:10:21,938 --> 00:10:46,467\n本來在以我曾經要寫一個東西對於這個特別席位我很期待但是以目前的這個現實面來看我剛才跟陳委員報告過總統要指動來不是我們去跟他邀請那第二個狀況就是說黨團協商的那些那兩個案已經因為這個關係已經沒有案了所以院長沒辦法協商\n\n28\n00:10:50,649 --> 00:11:01,020\n我們也是要釋出善意啊你說總統府那邊單方面的認為說要來國情報告可是立法院這邊沒有釋出善意也不可能能夠促成這個國情報告\n\n29\n00:11:02,851 --> 00:11:29,223\n陳俊宇所說的是對的另外我想就本次的判決當中有關人事同意權的部分解釋來進行討論我們也看到憲判指出對於逾越立法院職權和人事同意權範圍的部分違憲立法院的人事同意權僅有同意與否決被同意人的人事任命的\n\n30\n00:11:31,204 --> 00:11:49,064\n並無立法刻以被提名人特定義務的權限．更無施以行政法制裁的權限．立法院報告當中也敘明審查程序將以未經宣告違憲的新規定運作\n\n31\n00:11:50,345 --> 00:12:03,693\n那我想請教秘書長就是未經宣告違憲的新規定與現行規定在運作上區別為何以及這個審查不得少於一個月的規定實施上應該要如何來安排相關的期程\n\n32\n00:12:05,635 --> 00:12:24,674\n謝謝因為這個法條裡面其實是從632號解釋是可以看得到而且我如果沒有記錯632號解釋是由賴總統去申請釋憲的那現在的一個情形就是這個本身整個一個琢磨上來講因為他是程序上的一個安排\n\n33\n00:12:25,495 --> 00:12:44,535\n那至於裡面的很多違憲的地方我們就沒有辦法去做一個處理至於因為現在裡面有一個狀況的目前不同點的幾個跟陳委員報告一下一個原來是吳季明投票了現在改成季明投票了\n\n34\n00:12:45,275 --> 00:13:14,035\n那另外一個委員會原來他是只有初期委員過半數現在兩個都一樣要全體委員過半數那現在就是說全院委員會審查以後這個審查報告跟這一個投票一定要10天那至於這一個要分開裡面還有一個很重要就是像我當考試委員是一起的總共10個人在一起現在不行了要分別要分別的\n\n35\n00:13:14,475 --> 00:13:14,515\n陳俊宇議員\n\n36\n00:13:34,059 --> 00:13:58,557\n好我想有關這個職權行使法的相關修法那在本次這個憲判當中大法官已經給出非常明確的指引對於這個憲政機關的權力分立劃出界限也不應該再出現國會優位的這個情況那接下來我們國會改革修法還會繼續的持續進行判決也會讓後續的這個相關法有一個\n\n37\n00:14:02,820 --> 00:14:24,336\n一行的一個準則那我想這個部分還是請我們秘書長這邊就是能夠針對這個部分來重視那另外我想還是針對國會改革在憲判之後應該重整腳步那務實來討論下一步除了符合這個憲政架構權力分立的這個原則也必須要落實\n\n38\n00:14:25,937 --> 00:14:45,525\n全責相輔的國會改革接下來這個修法工作也必須是符合憲判意旨在憲法框架下來進行這個改革那藉此今天的機會我還是要就教秘書長我想再追蹤一下就是有關國會擴建目前的這個推動的進度那秘書長也可能了解\n\n39\n00:14:46,625 --> 00:15:01,380\n本席非常關心這個國會這個擴建的相關計畫也多次向您來詢問這個問題那今年4月份的時候詢討的時候秘書長您也表示說個人的立場上\n\n40\n00:15:02,481 --> 00:15:18,940\n希望能夠擴建以外同時當時也只是我們總務處在6個月內來完成相關的研議至今也經過半年的時間我想請教秘書長有關國會擴建的研議的意見是否已經有向前進一步的進度\n\n41\n00:15:20,121 --> 00:15:46,919\n非常謝謝其實我跟陳委員一樣以在立法院的這個幾乎我從公主信仰就在立法院我一直強調過對這很有感情是所以陳委員一直提我也是非常著急這個狀況大概總務處都有處理但是可以請我總務處長跟你稍微簡單報告一下因為時間到\n\n42\n00:15:50,139 --> 00:15:51,321\n國會擴建案目瞭作業簽辦\n\n43\n00:16:04,217 --> 00:16:19,054\n目前規劃的還是以6個原先圈列的地點,有沒有已經確定大概會在哪一個位置?沒有,因為地點的選擇是要等全院的共識\n\n44\n00:16:20,492 --> 00:16:32,321\n要全委員可是到目前為止好像我們本會期本屆次我想請教秘書長就是好像我們的院長方面都還沒召開過相關的這個會議的協商\n\n45\n00:16:35,900 --> 00:16:50,204\n很抱歉,因為這次政治議題太多了,上個禮拜都是為了總預算案,院長也花了很多心思為了總預算。我會再跟他報告。院長對國會擴建的相關案子有沒有在進行了解?\n\n46\n00:16:58,784 --> 00:17:26,850\n我會再跟他報告細一點因為他對我們簽上去他有看過有看過好那我還是希望我們這個整個擴建的這個計畫能夠盡速啟動不管是過去選出的這個6個點位或是有考慮加入新的擴建的這個地點都需要這個程序和工程往往都是10年起跳所以你如果沒有啟動的話那個10年是遙遙無期那\n\n47\n00:17:28,925 --> 00:17:47,035\n我希望說趕快啟動那因為這個過程也需要跟社會來做溝通實在不宜再拖延那為了國會有更好的這個議事品質也符合我們親近人民的這個國會所需的這個場域我想還是再次請秘書長跟韓院長積極的來做討論重視我們國會這個擴建的計畫相關的期程我希望說能夠儘速啟動\n\n48\n00:17:56,111 --> 00:17:59,916\n謝謝我,我會把陳委員今天的主事會再進行。\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n25068\t27409\t好,謝謝主席,我們有請周秘書長好,請周秘書長\n30953\t53103\t好 秘書長 早秘書長 我們今天還是就上週五那個剛出爐的憲判字第9號判決來進行相關意見上的交流那有關國會這個職權行使相關的修法也是本委員會第一會期的一個核心焦點那從過去幾個月我們經過這個畸變和對抗也聽到\n59086\t76313\t來自各方立場不同的意見但作為民主法治的國家各機關的職權的行使都應該在符合憲法的框架內國會改革的運作和修法也應當在符合憲法權利分立的原則下來進行\n77634\t102500\t大法官為解決憲政上的爭議．秉持著法學的專業．來做出本次憲法判決．各機關或各人也都應該要遵照解釋．尊重我們憲法法庭．並接受判決的結果．我想在此我們來請問秘書長．立法院是不是也應該遵守憲法的判決．來處理有關的事項．\n103080\t106541\t那我們立法院就是要遵守嗎?\n120545\t146693\t就配合這個所作的這個判決的解釋來處理所以我們就尊重憲法法庭的判決結果了那從這次的這個判決所顯示出來有部分是違憲有部分是合憲那也做出更細緻的解釋該如何在符合憲判的這個意旨下來行使職權也是未來我們要持續來討論的一個課題那首先\n149096\t174918\t就這個判決當中有關聽取總統國情報告的部分我想來就教我們秘書長那對於有關這個國情報告大法官認為總統可以決定是否且何時前來報告並自行決定報告的內容詢問總統或是要求答覆則抵觸憲法權力分立的這個原則且這個憲法徵修條文\n177260\t192193\t僅賦予立法院被動來聽取總統國情報告的權利因此有關定期報告和疾問疾打的條文也都被大法官判決屬於違憲而我們看到立法院提供的書面報告寫道\n193454\t212944\t對於判決的內容予以尊重那我想再次的就叫我們秘書長如何來解讀這個憲判對國情報告的解釋以及未來如何邀請總統來進行報告並且在這個形式上應該要如何來設計才能夠符合憲判的這個意旨謝謝陳委員所提示\n218188\t233465\t大概一般來講我這一個報告首先必須要說明我是只按照這一個憲法的裁判依照這一個所做的一個整理並沒有以幕僚長的立場\n235247\t235427\t陳俊宇議員\n253275\t278232\t把後面的從第6到第15頁每一個法條之間有沒有違憲都有用紅紙跟藍紙寫出來那再來我現在跟針對陳委員所提的我做一個簡單的報告因為我們是已經被動了我這裡有特別寫說被動聽取國情報告之權那在這個裁判裡面所寫的就是總統\n279873\t304398\t沒有到國情報告的憲法義務那相對的立法院也無停取國情報告的憲法義務兩邊都沒有憲法義務是那這一個裡面他雖然對15條之一的第一項並沒有說是違憲不過要看到是第15條之後跟第15條之四那第15條之四已經是違憲了就不用再跟公務員報告\n305678\t333636\t那現在的涉及到怎麼應應第15條之後的問題那第15條之後本來我在陳委員還記得我上次來報告的時候我特別講立法院有決定權那立法院有決定權就是因為這一個條文本來總統就沒有到立法院來我們沒辦法總統不向立法院負責吧我的書也是這樣寫但是現在的情況是第一項被刪除掉\n334830\t362482\t第三相處的立法院有沒有提案權我也花了很多時間跟我們的同事在研究那如果依照這個條文沒有的話根本現在就沒有在立法院沒有案了雖然國民黨跟民眾黨是有提一個案提一個做決議但是如果依照這個條文那個案就已經不存在了因為你已經違憲了所以已經失守護理了\n363382\t382502\t那現在只能再變成第15條之後的第二項去看了。那第二項對於這些的議題上被設定是違憲的。那違憲的變成是什麼?只有總統得知請立法院同意後,至立法院進行國情報告。\n383183\t406357\t那這邊就總統有主動的來立法院請你同意我來報告那這邊有兩個這種狀況總統自己要來喊就是好比我剛才跟某一個委員我特別說明在93年95年陳總統的時候曾經兩度向立法院他要來報告那沒有接受\n407077\t434297\t李委員沒有接受,所以這個可能會被你到那種情況。好,秘書長,我們立法院是站在被動的角度,被動啦。那總統府現在看起來是主動,他也認同說要來這個立法院做國情報告啦。那我現在問的就是說,我們未來我們立法院的這個被動,是不是也能夠主動來研討這個未來有可能因應總統要來國情報告的事項啦。\n434961\t451874\t是怎樣事務性的我們都已經在上一次已經都有大概都有一個方案在啦只不過現在的一個情況這個條文裡面到底立法院要不要同意他來報告那這不是我秘書長所能跟你答覆的\n453275\t479486\t就對於要不要邀請總統來做這個國情報告我想在各方都近期內也表達了許多不同的立場那在憲判出爐之後總統府也立即有表示賴總統願意到立法院來進行國情報告這是確定的那這與賴總統在不論是競選的時候還是說他在就職的時候所表達的立場都沒有改變過\n480666\t507504\t那只要在我們依法合憲的情況之下賴總統都願意到我們國會來做國情報告並且先前也曾經有過相關的這個議案朝野已經進行多次的這個協商討論那我們上會期也曾經對於這個國情報告的形式進行過討論參考其他國家的執行情況以及這個憲法機關相互尊重的這個原則之下我想總統到國會來做國情報告\n510507\t535048\t更是可以讓我們國會來遵受到尊重那展現這個實際的這個情況黨團協商若是決定要邀請我們賴總統來進行報告那準備的工作就是需要仰賴我們院內在我們周秘書長所帶領的團隊來做籌組那我想我還是請教我們秘書長這個立法院\n537390\t552899\t我們是不是已經對於這個賴總統要來做國情報告的這個事項有已經安排其他相關的這個流程還有列席的對象以及動線的安排等等的規劃這個部分我們是不是已經有推演過了\n553598\t556239\t我們是不是已經和府方也進行溝通隨時能邀請總統到本院來做報告\n576794\t580635\t我相信在技術上的問題我們立法院的幕僚單位應該都能夠妥善來因應那但是能否邀請到我們賴清德總統來進行這個國情報告還是需要等待\n597941\t619827\t我們院長在召開相關的協商會議並凝聚共事還是期待我們能夠正式的來邀請賴總統首次到國會來進行國情報告以建立我們良好的憲政慣例我想作為在立法院近40年的歷史見證者秘書長您是不是也樂觀其成\n621938\t646467\t本來在以我曾經要寫一個東西對於這個特別席位我很期待但是以目前的這個現實面來看我剛才跟陳委員報告過總統要指動來不是我們去跟他邀請那第二個狀況就是說黨團協商的那些那兩個案已經因為這個關係已經沒有案了所以院長沒辦法協商\n650649\t661020\t我們也是要釋出善意啊你說總統府那邊單方面的認為說要來國情報告可是立法院這邊沒有釋出善意也不可能能夠促成這個國情報告\n662851\t689223\t陳俊宇所說的是對的另外我想就本次的判決當中有關人事同意權的部分解釋來進行討論我們也看到憲判指出對於逾越立法院職權和人事同意權範圍的部分違憲立法院的人事同意權僅有同意與否決被同意人的人事任命的\n691204\t709064\t並無立法刻以被提名人特定義務的權限．更無施以行政法制裁的權限．立法院報告當中也敘明審查程序將以未經宣告違憲的新規定運作\n710345\t723693\t那我想請教秘書長就是未經宣告違憲的新規定與現行規定在運作上區別為何以及這個審查不得少於一個月的規定實施上應該要如何來安排相關的期程\n725635\t744674\t謝謝因為這個法條裡面其實是從632號解釋是可以看得到而且我如果沒有記錯632號解釋是由賴總統去申請釋憲的那現在的一個情形就是這個本身整個一個琢磨上來講因為他是程序上的一個安排\n745495\t764535\t那至於裡面的很多違憲的地方我們就沒有辦法去做一個處理至於因為現在裡面有一個狀況的目前不同點的幾個跟陳委員報告一下一個原來是吳季明投票了現在改成季明投票了\n765275\t794035\t那另外一個委員會原來他是只有初期委員過半數現在兩個都一樣要全體委員過半數那現在就是說全院委員會審查以後這個審查報告跟這一個投票一定要10天那至於這一個要分開裡面還有一個很重要就是像我當考試委員是一起的總共10個人在一起現在不行了要分別要分別的\n794475\t794515\t陳俊宇議員\n814059\t838557\t好我想有關這個職權行使法的相關修法那在本次這個憲判當中大法官已經給出非常明確的指引對於這個憲政機關的權力分立劃出界限也不應該再出現國會優位的這個情況那接下來我們國會改革修法還會繼續的持續進行判決也會讓後續的這個相關法有一個\n842820\t864336\t一行的一個準則那我想這個部分還是請我們秘書長這邊就是能夠針對這個部分來重視那另外我想還是針對國會改革在憲判之後應該重整腳步那務實來討論下一步除了符合這個憲政架構權力分立的這個原則也必須要落實\n865937\t885525\t全責相輔的國會改革接下來這個修法工作也必須是符合憲判意旨在憲法框架下來進行這個改革那藉此今天的機會我還是要就教秘書長我想再追蹤一下就是有關國會擴建目前的這個推動的進度那秘書長也可能了解\n886625\t901380\t本席非常關心這個國會這個擴建的相關計畫也多次向您來詢問這個問題那今年4月份的時候詢討的時候秘書長您也表示說個人的立場上\n902481\t918940\t希望能夠擴建以外同時當時也只是我們總務處在6個月內來完成相關的研議至今也經過半年的時間我想請教秘書長有關國會擴建的研議的意見是否已經有向前進一步的進度\n920121\t946919\t非常謝謝其實我跟陳委員一樣以在立法院的這個幾乎我從公主信仰就在立法院我一直強調過對這很有感情是所以陳委員一直提我也是非常著急這個狀況大概總務處都有處理但是可以請我總務處長跟你稍微簡單報告一下因為時間到\n950139\t951321\t國會擴建案目瞭作業簽辦\n964217\t979054\t目前規劃的還是以6個原先圈列的地點,有沒有已經確定大概會在哪一個位置?沒有,因為地點的選擇是要等全院的共識\n980492\t992321\t要全委員可是到目前為止好像我們本會期本屆次我想請教秘書長就是好像我們的院長方面都還沒召開過相關的這個會議的協商\n995900\t1010204\t很抱歉,因為這次政治議題太多了,上個禮拜都是為了總預算案,院長也花了很多心思為了總預算。我會再跟他報告。院長對國會擴建的相關案子有沒有在進行了解?\n1018784\t1046850\t我會再跟他報告細一點因為他對我們簽上去他有看過有看過好那我還是希望我們這個整個擴建的這個計畫能夠盡速啟動不管是過去選出的這個6個點位或是有考慮加入新的擴建的這個地點都需要這個程序和工程往往都是10年起跳所以你如果沒有啟動的話那個10年是遙遙無期那\n1048925\t1067035\t我希望說趕快啟動那因為這個過程也需要跟社會來做溝通實在不宜再拖延那為了國會有更好的這個議事品質也符合我們親近人民的這個國會所需的這個場域我想還是再次請秘書長跟韓院長積極的來做討論重視我們國會這個擴建的計畫相關的期程我希望說能夠儘速啟動\n1076111\t1079916\t謝謝我,我會把陳委員今天的主事會再進行。\n","txt":"好,謝謝主席,我們有請周秘書長好,請周秘書長\n好 秘書長 早秘書長 我們今天還是就上週五那個剛出爐的憲判字第9號判決來進行相關意見上的交流那有關國會這個職權行使相關的修法也是本委員會第一會期的一個核心焦點那從過去幾個月我們經過這個畸變和對抗也聽到\n來自各方立場不同的意見但作為民主法治的國家各機關的職權的行使都應該在符合憲法的框架內國會改革的運作和修法也應當在符合憲法權利分立的原則下來進行\n大法官為解決憲政上的爭議．秉持著法學的專業．來做出本次憲法判決．各機關或各人也都應該要遵照解釋．尊重我們憲法法庭．並接受判決的結果．我想在此我們來請問秘書長．立法院是不是也應該遵守憲法的判決．來處理有關的事項．\n那我們立法院就是要遵守嗎?\n就配合這個所作的這個判決的解釋來處理所以我們就尊重憲法法庭的判決結果了那從這次的這個判決所顯示出來有部分是違憲有部分是合憲那也做出更細緻的解釋該如何在符合憲判的這個意旨下來行使職權也是未來我們要持續來討論的一個課題那首先\n就這個判決當中有關聽取總統國情報告的部分我想來就教我們秘書長那對於有關這個國情報告大法官認為總統可以決定是否且何時前來報告並自行決定報告的內容詢問總統或是要求答覆則抵觸憲法權力分立的這個原則且這個憲法徵修條文\n僅賦予立法院被動來聽取總統國情報告的權利因此有關定期報告和疾問疾打的條文也都被大法官判決屬於違憲而我們看到立法院提供的書面報告寫道\n對於判決的內容予以尊重那我想再次的就叫我們秘書長如何來解讀這個憲判對國情報告的解釋以及未來如何邀請總統來進行報告並且在這個形式上應該要如何來設計才能夠符合憲判的這個意旨謝謝陳委員所提示\n大概一般來講我這一個報告首先必須要說明我是只按照這一個憲法的裁判依照這一個所做的一個整理並沒有以幕僚長的立場\n陳俊宇議員\n把後面的從第6到第15頁每一個法條之間有沒有違憲都有用紅紙跟藍紙寫出來那再來我現在跟針對陳委員所提的我做一個簡單的報告因為我們是已經被動了我這裡有特別寫說被動聽取國情報告之權那在這個裁判裡面所寫的就是總統\n沒有到國情報告的憲法義務那相對的立法院也無停取國情報告的憲法義務兩邊都沒有憲法義務是那這一個裡面他雖然對15條之一的第一項並沒有說是違憲不過要看到是第15條之後跟第15條之四那第15條之四已經是違憲了就不用再跟公務員報告\n那現在的涉及到怎麼應應第15條之後的問題那第15條之後本來我在陳委員還記得我上次來報告的時候我特別講立法院有決定權那立法院有決定權就是因為這一個條文本來總統就沒有到立法院來我們沒辦法總統不向立法院負責吧我的書也是這樣寫但是現在的情況是第一項被刪除掉\n第三相處的立法院有沒有提案權我也花了很多時間跟我們的同事在研究那如果依照這個條文沒有的話根本現在就沒有在立法院沒有案了雖然國民黨跟民眾黨是有提一個案提一個做決議但是如果依照這個條文那個案就已經不存在了因為你已經違憲了所以已經失守護理了\n那現在只能再變成第15條之後的第二項去看了。那第二項對於這些的議題上被設定是違憲的。那違憲的變成是什麼?只有總統得知請立法院同意後,至立法院進行國情報告。\n那這邊就總統有主動的來立法院請你同意我來報告那這邊有兩個這種狀況總統自己要來喊就是好比我剛才跟某一個委員我特別說明在93年95年陳總統的時候曾經兩度向立法院他要來報告那沒有接受\n李委員沒有接受,所以這個可能會被你到那種情況。好,秘書長,我們立法院是站在被動的角度,被動啦。那總統府現在看起來是主動,他也認同說要來這個立法院做國情報告啦。那我現在問的就是說,我們未來我們立法院的這個被動,是不是也能夠主動來研討這個未來有可能因應總統要來國情報告的事項啦。\n是怎樣事務性的我們都已經在上一次已經都有大概都有一個方案在啦只不過現在的一個情況這個條文裡面到底立法院要不要同意他來報告那這不是我秘書長所能跟你答覆的\n就對於要不要邀請總統來做這個國情報告我想在各方都近期內也表達了許多不同的立場那在憲判出爐之後總統府也立即有表示賴總統願意到立法院來進行國情報告這是確定的那這與賴總統在不論是競選的時候還是說他在就職的時候所表達的立場都沒有改變過\n那只要在我們依法合憲的情況之下賴總統都願意到我們國會來做國情報告並且先前也曾經有過相關的這個議案朝野已經進行多次的這個協商討論那我們上會期也曾經對於這個國情報告的形式進行過討論參考其他國家的執行情況以及這個憲法機關相互尊重的這個原則之下我想總統到國會來做國情報告\n更是可以讓我們國會來遵受到尊重那展現這個實際的這個情況黨團協商若是決定要邀請我們賴總統來進行報告那準備的工作就是需要仰賴我們院內在我們周秘書長所帶領的團隊來做籌組那我想我還是請教我們秘書長這個立法院\n我們是不是已經對於這個賴總統要來做國情報告的這個事項有已經安排其他相關的這個流程還有列席的對象以及動線的安排等等的規劃這個部分我們是不是已經有推演過了\n我們是不是已經和府方也進行溝通隨時能邀請總統到本院來做報告\n我相信在技術上的問題我們立法院的幕僚單位應該都能夠妥善來因應那但是能否邀請到我們賴清德總統來進行這個國情報告還是需要等待\n我們院長在召開相關的協商會議並凝聚共事還是期待我們能夠正式的來邀請賴總統首次到國會來進行國情報告以建立我們良好的憲政慣例我想作為在立法院近40年的歷史見證者秘書長您是不是也樂觀其成\n本來在以我曾經要寫一個東西對於這個特別席位我很期待但是以目前的這個現實面來看我剛才跟陳委員報告過總統要指動來不是我們去跟他邀請那第二個狀況就是說黨團協商的那些那兩個案已經因為這個關係已經沒有案了所以院長沒辦法協商\n我們也是要釋出善意啊你說總統府那邊單方面的認為說要來國情報告可是立法院這邊沒有釋出善意也不可能能夠促成這個國情報告\n陳俊宇所說的是對的另外我想就本次的判決當中有關人事同意權的部分解釋來進行討論我們也看到憲判指出對於逾越立法院職權和人事同意權範圍的部分違憲立法院的人事同意權僅有同意與否決被同意人的人事任命的\n並無立法刻以被提名人特定義務的權限．更無施以行政法制裁的權限．立法院報告當中也敘明審查程序將以未經宣告違憲的新規定運作\n那我想請教秘書長就是未經宣告違憲的新規定與現行規定在運作上區別為何以及這個審查不得少於一個月的規定實施上應該要如何來安排相關的期程\n謝謝因為這個法條裡面其實是從632號解釋是可以看得到而且我如果沒有記錯632號解釋是由賴總統去申請釋憲的那現在的一個情形就是這個本身整個一個琢磨上來講因為他是程序上的一個安排\n那至於裡面的很多違憲的地方我們就沒有辦法去做一個處理至於因為現在裡面有一個狀況的目前不同點的幾個跟陳委員報告一下一個原來是吳季明投票了現在改成季明投票了\n那另外一個委員會原來他是只有初期委員過半數現在兩個都一樣要全體委員過半數那現在就是說全院委員會審查以後這個審查報告跟這一個投票一定要10天那至於這一個要分開裡面還有一個很重要就是像我當考試委員是一起的總共10個人在一起現在不行了要分別要分別的\n陳俊宇議員\n好我想有關這個職權行使法的相關修法那在本次這個憲判當中大法官已經給出非常明確的指引對於這個憲政機關的權力分立劃出界限也不應該再出現國會優位的這個情況那接下來我們國會改革修法還會繼續的持續進行判決也會讓後續的這個相關法有一個\n一行的一個準則那我想這個部分還是請我們秘書長這邊就是能夠針對這個部分來重視那另外我想還是針對國會改革在憲判之後應該重整腳步那務實來討論下一步除了符合這個憲政架構權力分立的這個原則也必須要落實\n全責相輔的國會改革接下來這個修法工作也必須是符合憲判意旨在憲法框架下來進行這個改革那藉此今天的機會我還是要就教秘書長我想再追蹤一下就是有關國會擴建目前的這個推動的進度那秘書長也可能了解\n本席非常關心這個國會這個擴建的相關計畫也多次向您來詢問這個問題那今年4月份的時候詢討的時候秘書長您也表示說個人的立場上\n希望能夠擴建以外同時當時也只是我們總務處在6個月內來完成相關的研議至今也經過半年的時間我想請教秘書長有關國會擴建的研議的意見是否已經有向前進一步的進度\n非常謝謝其實我跟陳委員一樣以在立法院的這個幾乎我從公主信仰就在立法院我一直強調過對這很有感情是所以陳委員一直提我也是非常著急這個狀況大概總務處都有處理但是可以請我總務處長跟你稍微簡單報告一下因為時間到\n國會擴建案目瞭作業簽辦\n目前規劃的還是以6個原先圈列的地點,有沒有已經確定大概會在哪一個位置?沒有,因為地點的選擇是要等全院的共識\n要全委員可是到目前為止好像我們本會期本屆次我想請教秘書長就是好像我們的院長方面都還沒召開過相關的這個會議的協商\n很抱歉,因為這次政治議題太多了,上個禮拜都是為了總預算案,院長也花了很多心思為了總預算。我會再跟他報告。院長對國會擴建的相關案子有沒有在進行了解?\n我會再跟他報告細一點因為他對我們簽上去他有看過有看過好那我還是希望我們這個整個擴建的這個計畫能夠盡速啟動不管是過去選出的這個6個點位或是有考慮加入新的擴建的這個地點都需要這個程序和工程往往都是10年起跳所以你如果沒有啟動的話那個10年是遙遙無期那\n我希望說趕快啟動那因為這個過程也需要跟社會來做溝通實在不宜再拖延那為了國會有更好的這個議事品質也符合我們親近人民的這個國會所需的這個場域我想還是再次請秘書長跟韓院長積極的來做討論重視我們國會這個擴建的計畫相關的期程我希望說能夠儘速啟動\n謝謝我,我會把陳委員今天的主事會再進行。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:25.068 --> 00:27.409\n好,謝謝主席,我們有請周秘書長好,請周秘書長\n\n00:30.953 --> 00:53.103\n好秘書長早秘書長我們今天還是就上週五那個剛出爐的憲判字第9號判決來進行相關意見上的交流那有關國會這個職權行使相關的修法也是本委員會第一會期的一個核心焦點那從過去幾個月我們經過這個畸變和對抗也聽到\n\n00:59.086 --> 01:16.313\n來自各方立場不同的意見但作為民主法治的國家各機關的職權的行使都應該在符合憲法的框架內國會改革的運作和修法也應當在符合憲法權利分立的原則下來進行\n\n01:17.634 --> 01:42.500\n大法官為解決憲政上的爭議．秉持著法學的專業．來做出本次憲法判決．各機關或各人也都應該要遵照解釋．尊重我們憲法法庭．並接受判決的結果．我想在此我們來請問秘書長．立法院是不是也應該遵守憲法的判決．來處理有關的事項．\n\n01:43.080 --> 01:46.541\n那我們立法院就是要遵守嗎?\n\n02:00.545 --> 02:26.693\n就配合這個所作的這個判決的解釋來處理所以我們就尊重憲法法庭的判決結果了那從這次的這個判決所顯示出來有部分是違憲有部分是合憲那也做出更細緻的解釋該如何在符合憲判的這個意旨下來行使職權也是未來我們要持續來討論的一個課題那首先\n\n02:29.096 --> 02:54.918\n就這個判決當中有關聽取總統國情報告的部分我想來就教我們秘書長那對於有關這個國情報告大法官認為總統可以決定是否且何時前來報告並自行決定報告的內容詢問總統或是要求答覆則抵觸憲法權力分立的這個原則且這個憲法徵修條文\n\n02:57.260 --> 03:12.193\n僅賦予立法院被動來聽取總統國情報告的權利因此有關定期報告和疾問疾打的條文也都被大法官判決屬於違憲而我們看到立法院提供的書面報告寫道\n\n03:13.454 --> 03:32.944\n對於判決的內容予以尊重那我想再次的就叫我們秘書長如何來解讀這個憲判對國情報告的解釋以及未來如何邀請總統來進行報告並且在這個形式上應該要如何來設計才能夠符合憲判的這個意旨謝謝陳委員所提示\n\n03:38.188 --> 03:53.465\n大概一般來講我這一個報告首先必須要說明我是只按照這一個憲法的裁判依照這一個所做的一個整理並沒有以幕僚長的立場\n\n03:55.247 --> 03:55.427\n陳俊宇議員\n\n04:13.275 --> 04:38.232\n把後面的從第6到第15頁每一個法條之間有沒有違憲都有用紅紙跟藍紙寫出來那再來我現在跟針對陳委員所提的我做一個簡單的報告因為我們是已經被動了我這裡有特別寫說被動聽取國情報告之權那在這個裁判裡面所寫的就是總統\n\n04:39.873 --> 05:04.398\n沒有到國情報告的憲法義務那相對的立法院也無停取國情報告的憲法義務兩邊都沒有憲法義務是那這一個裡面他雖然對15條之一的第一項並沒有說是違憲不過要看到是第15條之後跟第15條之四那第15條之四已經是違憲了就不用再跟公務員報告\n\n05:05.678 --> 05:33.636\n那現在的涉及到怎麼應應第15條之後的問題那第15條之後本來我在陳委員還記得我上次來報告的時候我特別講立法院有決定權那立法院有決定權就是因為這一個條文本來總統就沒有到立法院來我們沒辦法總統不向立法院負責吧我的書也是這樣寫但是現在的情況是第一項被刪除掉\n\n05:34.830 --> 06:02.482\n第三相處的立法院有沒有提案權我也花了很多時間跟我們的同事在研究那如果依照這個條文沒有的話根本現在就沒有在立法院沒有案了雖然國民黨跟民眾黨是有提一個案提一個做決議但是如果依照這個條文那個案就已經不存在了因為你已經違憲了所以已經失守護理了\n\n06:03.382 --> 06:22.502\n那現在只能再變成第15條之後的第二項去看了。那第二項對於這些的議題上被設定是違憲的。那違憲的變成是什麼?只有總統得知請立法院同意後,至立法院進行國情報告。\n\n06:23.183 --> 06:46.357\n那這邊就總統有主動的來立法院請你同意我來報告那這邊有兩個這種狀況總統自己要來喊就是好比我剛才跟某一個委員我特別說明在93年95年陳總統的時候曾經兩度向立法院他要來報告那沒有接受\n\n06:47.077 --> 07:14.297\n李委員沒有接受,所以這個可能會被你到那種情況。好,秘書長,我們立法院是站在被動的角度,被動啦。那總統府現在看起來是主動,他也認同說要來這個立法院做國情報告啦。那我現在問的就是說,我們未來我們立法院的這個被動,是不是也能夠主動來研討這個未來有可能因應總統要來國情報告的事項啦。\n\n07:14.961 --> 07:31.874\n是怎樣事務性的我們都已經在上一次已經都有大概都有一個方案在啦只不過現在的一個情況這個條文裡面到底立法院要不要同意他來報告那這不是我秘書長所能跟你答覆的\n\n07:33.275 --> 07:59.486\n就對於要不要邀請總統來做這個國情報告我想在各方都近期內也表達了許多不同的立場那在憲判出爐之後總統府也立即有表示賴總統願意到立法院來進行國情報告這是確定的那這與賴總統在不論是競選的時候還是說他在就職的時候所表達的立場都沒有改變過\n\n08:00.666 --> 08:27.504\n那只要在我們依法合憲的情況之下賴總統都願意到我們國會來做國情報告並且先前也曾經有過相關的這個議案朝野已經進行多次的這個協商討論那我們上會期也曾經對於這個國情報告的形式進行過討論參考其他國家的執行情況以及這個憲法機關相互尊重的這個原則之下我想總統到國會來做國情報告\n\n08:30.507 --> 08:55.048\n更是可以讓我們國會來遵受到尊重那展現這個實際的這個情況黨團協商若是決定要邀請我們賴總統來進行報告那準備的工作就是需要仰賴我們院內在我們周秘書長所帶領的團隊來做籌組那我想我還是請教我們秘書長這個立法院\n\n08:57.390 --> 09:12.899\n我們是不是已經對於這個賴總統要來做國情報告的這個事項有已經安排其他相關的這個流程還有列席的對象以及動線的安排等等的規劃這個部分我們是不是已經有推演過了\n\n09:13.598 --> 09:16.239\n我們是不是已經和府方也進行溝通隨時能邀請總統到本院來做報告\n\n09:36.794 --> 09:40.635\n我相信在技術上的問題我們立法院的幕僚單位應該都能夠妥善來因應那但是能否邀請到我們賴清德總統來進行這個國情報告還是需要等待\n\n09:57.941 --> 10:19.827\n我們院長在召開相關的協商會議並凝聚共事還是期待我們能夠正式的來邀請賴總統首次到國會來進行國情報告以建立我們良好的憲政慣例我想作為在立法院近40年的歷史見證者秘書長您是不是也樂觀其成\n\n10:21.938 --> 10:46.467\n本來在以我曾經要寫一個東西對於這個特別席位我很期待但是以目前的這個現實面來看我剛才跟陳委員報告過總統要指動來不是我們去跟他邀請那第二個狀況就是說黨團協商的那些那兩個案已經因為這個關係已經沒有案了所以院長沒辦法協商\n\n10:50.649 --> 11:01.020\n我們也是要釋出善意啊你說總統府那邊單方面的認為說要來國情報告可是立法院這邊沒有釋出善意也不可能能夠促成這個國情報告\n\n11:02.851 --> 11:29.223\n陳俊宇所說的是對的另外我想就本次的判決當中有關人事同意權的部分解釋來進行討論我們也看到憲判指出對於逾越立法院職權和人事同意權範圍的部分違憲立法院的人事同意權僅有同意與否決被同意人的人事任命的\n\n11:31.204 --> 11:49.064\n並無立法刻以被提名人特定義務的權限．更無施以行政法制裁的權限．立法院報告當中也敘明審查程序將以未經宣告違憲的新規定運作\n\n11:50.345 --> 12:03.693\n那我想請教秘書長就是未經宣告違憲的新規定與現行規定在運作上區別為何以及這個審查不得少於一個月的規定實施上應該要如何來安排相關的期程\n\n12:05.635 --> 12:24.674\n謝謝因為這個法條裡面其實是從632號解釋是可以看得到而且我如果沒有記錯632號解釋是由賴總統去申請釋憲的那現在的一個情形就是這個本身整個一個琢磨上來講因為他是程序上的一個安排\n\n12:25.495 --> 12:44.535\n那至於裡面的很多違憲的地方我們就沒有辦法去做一個處理至於因為現在裡面有一個狀況的目前不同點的幾個跟陳委員報告一下一個原來是吳季明投票了現在改成季明投票了\n\n12:45.275 --> 13:14.035\n那另外一個委員會原來他是只有初期委員過半數現在兩個都一樣要全體委員過半數那現在就是說全院委員會審查以後這個審查報告跟這一個投票一定要10天那至於這一個要分開裡面還有一個很重要就是像我當考試委員是一起的總共10個人在一起現在不行了要分別要分別的\n\n13:14.475 --> 13:14.515\n陳俊宇議員\n\n13:34.059 --> 13:58.557\n好我想有關這個職權行使法的相關修法那在本次這個憲判當中大法官已經給出非常明確的指引對於這個憲政機關的權力分立劃出界限也不應該再出現國會優位的這個情況那接下來我們國會改革修法還會繼續的持續進行判決也會讓後續的這個相關法有一個\n\n14:02.820 --> 14:24.336\n一行的一個準則那我想這個部分還是請我們秘書長這邊就是能夠針對這個部分來重視那另外我想還是針對國會改革在憲判之後應該重整腳步那務實來討論下一步除了符合這個憲政架構權力分立的這個原則也必須要落實\n\n14:25.937 --> 14:45.525\n全責相輔的國會改革接下來這個修法工作也必須是符合憲判意旨在憲法框架下來進行這個改革那藉此今天的機會我還是要就教秘書長我想再追蹤一下就是有關國會擴建目前的這個推動的進度那秘書長也可能了解\n\n14:46.625 --> 15:01.380\n本席非常關心這個國會這個擴建的相關計畫也多次向您來詢問這個問題那今年4月份的時候詢討的時候秘書長您也表示說個人的立場上\n\n15:02.481 --> 15:18.940\n希望能夠擴建以外同時當時也只是我們總務處在6個月內來完成相關的研議至今也經過半年的時間我想請教秘書長有關國會擴建的研議的意見是否已經有向前進一步的進度\n\n15:20.121 --> 15:46.919\n非常謝謝其實我跟陳委員一樣以在立法院的這個幾乎我從公主信仰就在立法院我一直強調過對這很有感情是所以陳委員一直提我也是非常著急這個狀況大概總務處都有處理但是可以請我總務處長跟你稍微簡單報告一下因為時間到\n\n15:50.139 --> 15:51.321\n國會擴建案目瞭作業簽辦\n\n16:04.217 --> 16:19.054\n目前規劃的還是以6個原先圈列的地點,有沒有已經確定大概會在哪一個位置?沒有,因為地點的選擇是要等全院的共識\n\n16:20.492 --> 16:32.321\n要全委員可是到目前為止好像我們本會期本屆次我想請教秘書長就是好像我們的院長方面都還沒召開過相關的這個會議的協商\n\n16:35.900 --> 16:50.204\n很抱歉,因為這次政治議題太多了,上個禮拜都是為了總預算案,院長也花了很多心思為了總預算。我會再跟他報告。院長對國會擴建的相關案子有沒有在進行了解?\n\n16:58.784 --> 17:26.850\n我會再跟他報告細一點因為他對我們簽上去他有看過有看過好那我還是希望我們這個整個擴建的這個計畫能夠盡速啟動不管是過去選出的這個6個點位或是有考慮加入新的擴建的這個地點都需要這個程序和工程往往都是10年起跳所以你如果沒有啟動的話那個10年是遙遙無期那\n\n17:28.925 --> 17:47.035\n我希望說趕快啟動那因為這個過程也需要跟社會來做溝通實在不宜再拖延那為了國會有更好的這個議事品質也符合我們親近人民的這個國會所需的這個場域我想還是再次請秘書長跟韓院長積極的來做討論重視我們國會這個擴建的計畫相關的期程我希望說能夠儘速啟動\n\n17:56.111 --> 17:59.916\n謝謝我,我會把陳委員今天的主事會再進行。\n\n","segments":[{"start":25.068,"end":27.409,"text":"好,謝謝主席,我們有請周秘書長好,請周秘書長"},{"start":30.953,"end":53.103,"text":"好 秘書長 早秘書長 我們今天還是就上週五那個剛出爐的憲判字第9號判決來進行相關意見上的交流那有關國會這個職權行使相關的修法也是本委員會第一會期的一個核心焦點那從過去幾個月我們經過這個畸變和對抗也聽到"},{"start":59.086,"end":76.313,"text":"來自各方立場不同的意見但作為民主法治的國家各機關的職權的行使都應該在符合憲法的框架內國會改革的運作和修法也應當在符合憲法權利分立的原則下來進行"},{"start":77.634,"end":102.5,"text":"大法官為解決憲政上的爭議．秉持著法學的專業．來做出本次憲法判決．各機關或各人也都應該要遵照解釋．尊重我們憲法法庭．並接受判決的結果．我想在此我們來請問秘書長．立法院是不是也應該遵守憲法的判決．來處理有關的事項．"},{"start":103.08,"end":106.541,"text":"那我們立法院就是要遵守嗎?"},{"start":120.545,"end":146.693,"text":"就配合這個所作的這個判決的解釋來處理所以我們就尊重憲法法庭的判決結果了那從這次的這個判決所顯示出來有部分是違憲有部分是合憲那也做出更細緻的解釋該如何在符合憲判的這個意旨下來行使職權也是未來我們要持續來討論的一個課題那首先"},{"start":149.096,"end":174.918,"text":"就這個判決當中有關聽取總統國情報告的部分我想來就教我們秘書長那對於有關這個國情報告大法官認為總統可以決定是否且何時前來報告並自行決定報告的內容詢問總統或是要求答覆則抵觸憲法權力分立的這個原則且這個憲法徵修條文"},{"start":177.26,"end":192.193,"text":"僅賦予立法院被動來聽取總統國情報告的權利因此有關定期報告和疾問疾打的條文也都被大法官判決屬於違憲而我們看到立法院提供的書面報告寫道"},{"start":193.454,"end":212.944,"text":"對於判決的內容予以尊重那我想再次的就叫我們秘書長如何來解讀這個憲判對國情報告的解釋以及未來如何邀請總統來進行報告並且在這個形式上應該要如何來設計才能夠符合憲判的這個意旨謝謝陳委員所提示"},{"start":218.188,"end":233.465,"text":"大概一般來講我這一個報告首先必須要說明我是只按照這一個憲法的裁判依照這一個所做的一個整理並沒有以幕僚長的立場"},{"start":235.247,"end":235.427,"text":"陳俊宇議員"},{"start":253.275,"end":278.232,"text":"把後面的從第6到第15頁每一個法條之間有沒有違憲都有用紅紙跟藍紙寫出來那再來我現在跟針對陳委員所提的我做一個簡單的報告因為我們是已經被動了我這裡有特別寫說被動聽取國情報告之權那在這個裁判裡面所寫的就是總統"},{"start":279.873,"end":304.398,"text":"沒有到國情報告的憲法義務那相對的立法院也無停取國情報告的憲法義務兩邊都沒有憲法義務是那這一個裡面他雖然對15條之一的第一項並沒有說是違憲不過要看到是第15條之後跟第15條之四那第15條之四已經是違憲了就不用再跟公務員報告"},{"start":305.678,"end":333.636,"text":"那現在的涉及到怎麼應應第15條之後的問題那第15條之後本來我在陳委員還記得我上次來報告的時候我特別講立法院有決定權那立法院有決定權就是因為這一個條文本來總統就沒有到立法院來我們沒辦法總統不向立法院負責吧我的書也是這樣寫但是現在的情況是第一項被刪除掉"},{"start":334.83,"end":362.482,"text":"第三相處的立法院有沒有提案權我也花了很多時間跟我們的同事在研究那如果依照這個條文沒有的話根本現在就沒有在立法院沒有案了雖然國民黨跟民眾黨是有提一個案提一個做決議但是如果依照這個條文那個案就已經不存在了因為你已經違憲了所以已經失守護理了"},{"start":363.382,"end":382.502,"text":"那現在只能再變成第15條之後的第二項去看了。那第二項對於這些的議題上被設定是違憲的。那違憲的變成是什麼?只有總統得知請立法院同意後,至立法院進行國情報告。"},{"start":383.183,"end":406.357,"text":"那這邊就總統有主動的來立法院請你同意我來報告那這邊有兩個這種狀況總統自己要來喊就是好比我剛才跟某一個委員我特別說明在93年95年陳總統的時候曾經兩度向立法院他要來報告那沒有接受"},{"start":407.077,"end":434.297,"text":"李委員沒有接受,所以這個可能會被你到那種情況。好,秘書長,我們立法院是站在被動的角度,被動啦。那總統府現在看起來是主動,他也認同說要來這個立法院做國情報告啦。那我現在問的就是說,我們未來我們立法院的這個被動,是不是也能夠主動來研討這個未來有可能因應總統要來國情報告的事項啦。"},{"start":434.961,"end":451.874,"text":"是怎樣事務性的我們都已經在上一次已經都有大概都有一個方案在啦只不過現在的一個情況這個條文裡面到底立法院要不要同意他來報告那這不是我秘書長所能跟你答覆的"},{"start":453.275,"end":479.486,"text":"就對於要不要邀請總統來做這個國情報告我想在各方都近期內也表達了許多不同的立場那在憲判出爐之後總統府也立即有表示賴總統願意到立法院來進行國情報告這是確定的那這與賴總統在不論是競選的時候還是說他在就職的時候所表達的立場都沒有改變過"},{"start":480.666,"end":507.504,"text":"那只要在我們依法合憲的情況之下賴總統都願意到我們國會來做國情報告並且先前也曾經有過相關的這個議案朝野已經進行多次的這個協商討論那我們上會期也曾經對於這個國情報告的形式進行過討論參考其他國家的執行情況以及這個憲法機關相互尊重的這個原則之下我想總統到國會來做國情報告"},{"start":510.507,"end":535.048,"text":"更是可以讓我們國會來遵受到尊重那展現這個實際的這個情況黨團協商若是決定要邀請我們賴總統來進行報告那準備的工作就是需要仰賴我們院內在我們周秘書長所帶領的團隊來做籌組那我想我還是請教我們秘書長這個立法院"},{"start":537.39,"end":552.899,"text":"我們是不是已經對於這個賴總統要來做國情報告的這個事項有已經安排其他相關的這個流程還有列席的對象以及動線的安排等等的規劃這個部分我們是不是已經有推演過了"},{"start":553.598,"end":556.239,"text":"我們是不是已經和府方也進行溝通隨時能邀請總統到本院來做報告"},{"start":576.794,"end":580.635,"text":"我相信在技術上的問題我們立法院的幕僚單位應該都能夠妥善來因應那但是能否邀請到我們賴清德總統來進行這個國情報告還是需要等待"},{"start":597.941,"end":619.827,"text":"我們院長在召開相關的協商會議並凝聚共事還是期待我們能夠正式的來邀請賴總統首次到國會來進行國情報告以建立我們良好的憲政慣例我想作為在立法院近40年的歷史見證者秘書長您是不是也樂觀其成"},{"start":621.938,"end":646.467,"text":"本來在以我曾經要寫一個東西對於這個特別席位我很期待但是以目前的這個現實面來看我剛才跟陳委員報告過總統要指動來不是我們去跟他邀請那第二個狀況就是說黨團協商的那些那兩個案已經因為這個關係已經沒有案了所以院長沒辦法協商"},{"start":650.649,"end":661.02,"text":"我們也是要釋出善意啊你說總統府那邊單方面的認為說要來國情報告可是立法院這邊沒有釋出善意也不可能能夠促成這個國情報告"},{"start":662.851,"end":689.223,"text":"陳俊宇所說的是對的另外我想就本次的判決當中有關人事同意權的部分解釋來進行討論我們也看到憲判指出對於逾越立法院職權和人事同意權範圍的部分違憲立法院的人事同意權僅有同意與否決被同意人的人事任命的"},{"start":691.204,"end":709.064,"text":"並無立法刻以被提名人特定義務的權限．更無施以行政法制裁的權限．立法院報告當中也敘明審查程序將以未經宣告違憲的新規定運作"},{"start":710.345,"end":723.693,"text":"那我想請教秘書長就是未經宣告違憲的新規定與現行規定在運作上區別為何以及這個審查不得少於一個月的規定實施上應該要如何來安排相關的期程"},{"start":725.635,"end":744.674,"text":"謝謝因為這個法條裡面其實是從632號解釋是可以看得到而且我如果沒有記錯632號解釋是由賴總統去申請釋憲的那現在的一個情形就是這個本身整個一個琢磨上來講因為他是程序上的一個安排"},{"start":745.495,"end":764.535,"text":"那至於裡面的很多違憲的地方我們就沒有辦法去做一個處理至於因為現在裡面有一個狀況的目前不同點的幾個跟陳委員報告一下一個原來是吳季明投票了現在改成季明投票了"},{"start":765.275,"end":794.035,"text":"那另外一個委員會原來他是只有初期委員過半數現在兩個都一樣要全體委員過半數那現在就是說全院委員會審查以後這個審查報告跟這一個投票一定要10天那至於這一個要分開裡面還有一個很重要就是像我當考試委員是一起的總共10個人在一起現在不行了要分別要分別的"},{"start":794.475,"end":794.515,"text":"陳俊宇議員"},{"start":814.059,"end":838.557,"text":"好我想有關這個職權行使法的相關修法那在本次這個憲判當中大法官已經給出非常明確的指引對於這個憲政機關的權力分立劃出界限也不應該再出現國會優位的這個情況那接下來我們國會改革修法還會繼續的持續進行判決也會讓後續的這個相關法有一個"},{"start":842.82,"end":864.336,"text":"一行的一個準則那我想這個部分還是請我們秘書長這邊就是能夠針對這個部分來重視那另外我想還是針對國會改革在憲判之後應該重整腳步那務實來討論下一步除了符合這個憲政架構權力分立的這個原則也必須要落實"},{"start":865.937,"end":885.525,"text":"全責相輔的國會改革接下來這個修法工作也必須是符合憲判意旨在憲法框架下來進行這個改革那藉此今天的機會我還是要就教秘書長我想再追蹤一下就是有關國會擴建目前的這個推動的進度那秘書長也可能了解"},{"start":886.625,"end":901.38,"text":"本席非常關心這個國會這個擴建的相關計畫也多次向您來詢問這個問題那今年4月份的時候詢討的時候秘書長您也表示說個人的立場上"},{"start":902.481,"end":918.94,"text":"希望能夠擴建以外同時當時也只是我們總務處在6個月內來完成相關的研議至今也經過半年的時間我想請教秘書長有關國會擴建的研議的意見是否已經有向前進一步的進度"},{"start":920.121,"end":946.919,"text":"非常謝謝其實我跟陳委員一樣以在立法院的這個幾乎我從公主信仰就在立法院我一直強調過對這很有感情是所以陳委員一直提我也是非常著急這個狀況大概總務處都有處理但是可以請我總務處長跟你稍微簡單報告一下因為時間到"},{"start":950.139,"end":951.321,"text":"國會擴建案目瞭作業簽辦"},{"start":964.217,"end":979.054,"text":"目前規劃的還是以6個原先圈列的地點,有沒有已經確定大概會在哪一個位置?沒有,因為地點的選擇是要等全院的共識"},{"start":980.492,"end":992.321,"text":"要全委員可是到目前為止好像我們本會期本屆次我想請教秘書長就是好像我們的院長方面都還沒召開過相關的這個會議的協商"},{"start":995.9,"end":1010.204,"text":"很抱歉,因為這次政治議題太多了,上個禮拜都是為了總預算案,院長也花了很多心思為了總預算。我會再跟他報告。院長對國會擴建的相關案子有沒有在進行了解?"},{"start":1018.784,"end":1046.85,"text":"我會再跟他報告細一點因為他對我們簽上去他有看過有看過好那我還是希望我們這個整個擴建的這個計畫能夠盡速啟動不管是過去選出的這個6個點位或是有考慮加入新的擴建的這個地點都需要這個程序和工程往往都是10年起跳所以你如果沒有啟動的話那個10年是遙遙無期那"},{"start":1048.925,"end":1067.035,"text":"我希望說趕快啟動那因為這個過程也需要跟社會來做溝通實在不宜再拖延那為了國會有更好的這個議事品質也符合我們親近人民的這個國會所需的這個場域我想還是再次請秘書長跟韓院長積極的來做討論重視我們國會這個擴建的計畫相關的期程我希望說能夠儘速啟動"},{"start":1076.111,"end":1079.916,"text":"謝謝我,我會把陳委員今天的主事會再進行。"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":427,"blocks":[["陳委員俊宇：（11時8分）謝謝主席，有請周秘書長。"],["主席：請周秘書長。"],["陳委員俊宇：秘書長早。"],["周秘書長萬來：陳委員早。"],["陳委員俊宇：秘書長，我們今天還是就上周五那個剛出爐的憲判字第9號判決來進行相關意見上的交流。有關國會職權行使相關的修法也是本委員會第一會期的一個核心焦點，過去幾個月來，我們經過激辯和對抗，也聽到來自各方立場不同的意見，但作為民主法治的國家，各機關職權的行使都應該在符合憲法的框架內，國會改革的運作、修法也應當在符合憲法權力分立的原則下來進行。大法官為解決憲政上的爭議，秉持著法學的專業來做出本次憲法判決，各機關或個人也都應該要遵照這個解釋，尊重憲法法庭，並接受判決的結果。我想在此來請問秘書長，立法院是不是也應該遵守憲法的判決來處理有關的事項？"],["周秘書長萬來：謝謝陳委員提示。按照第185號解釋，有權機關的解釋當然就有拘束力，它有拘束力，我們就當然要遵守。"],["陳委員俊宇：我們立法院就是要遵守？"],["周秘書長萬來：就配合所做的判決的解釋來處理。"],["陳委員俊宇：所以我們就尊重憲法法庭的判決結果。從這次的判決顯示，有部分是違憲，有部分是合憲，也做出更細緻的解釋，該如何在符合憲判的意旨下來行使職權，也是未來我們要持續來討論的一個課題。","首先，我想就這個判決當中有關聽取總統國情報告的部分來就教秘書長。有關國情報告，大法官認為總統可以決定是否且何時前來報告，並自行決定報告的內容；詢問總統或是要求答復則牴觸憲法權力分立的原則；且憲法增修條文僅賦予立法院得被動聽取總統國情報告之權。因此，有關定期報告和即問即答的條文也都被大法官判決屬於違憲。而我們看到立法院提供的書面報告寫到，對於判決的內容予以尊重。我想再次的就教秘書長，如何來解讀憲判對國情報告的解釋，以及未來如何邀請總統來進行報告，並且在這個形式上應該要如何來設計才能夠符合憲判的意旨？"],["周秘書長萬來：謝謝陳委員提示。關於這份報告，首先必須要說明，我是按照這個憲法的裁判，是依照這個所做的一個整理，以幕僚長的立場，不可以對於每一個條文加以批判，我必須要先補充，不要被外界一直解讀成好像我有特別的想法，我不是這樣的意思。所以我才花了很多的時間，請法制單位把後面的第6到第15頁，每一個法條之間有沒有違憲，都用紅字跟藍字寫出來。","再來，針對陳委員所提的，我簡單報告。因為我們已經是被動了，我這裡有特別寫，被動聽取國情報告之權，在這個裁判裡面所寫的，就是總統沒有國情報告的憲法義務；相對的，立法院也無聽取國情報告的憲法義務，兩邊都沒有憲法義務。雖然對第十五條之一第一項，這個裁判裡面並沒有說是違憲，不過要看的是第十五條之二跟第十五條之四。第十五條之四已經是違憲的，就不用再跟陳委員報告，現在涉及到的是，怎麼因應第十五條之二的問題。","有關第十五條之二，陳委員應該還記得我上次來報告的時候特別講，立法院有決定權。立法院有決定權就是因為這一個條文，本來總統就沒有到立法院來的義務，總統不向立法院負責，我的書也是這樣寫。但現在的情況是第一項被刪除掉了，既然刪除了，立法院有沒有提案權？我花了很多時間跟我們的同事在研究，如果依照這個條文沒有的話，現在在立法院根本就沒有案了。雖然國民黨跟民眾黨有提一個案，也做了決議，但是依照這個條文，那個案子已經不存在了，因為已經違憲了，所以已經失所附麗。現在就變成只能從第十五條之二第二項去看，第二項對於這些議題，被認定為是違憲的，違憲變成什麼？只有總統得咨請立法院同意後，至立法院進行國情報告，就變成總統可以主動請立法院同意他來報告，這變成兩種狀況。總統自己要來咨文，就好比我剛才跟某一個委員特別說明，93年、95年陳總統在任的時候，曾經兩度向立法院說他要來報告，立法院沒有接受，所以這個可能會面臨到那種情況。"],["陳委員俊宇：好，秘書長，立法院是站在被動的角度……"],["周秘書長萬來：對。"],["陳委員俊宇：總統府現在看起來是主動，他也認同要來立法院國情報告。我現在問的是，未來立法院的被動是不是也能夠主動來研討？未來有可能得因應總統要來國情報告的事項。"],["周秘書長萬來：事務性的，我們在上一次已經大概有一個方案，只不過現在的情況在這個條文裡面，到底立法院要不要同意他來報告？這不是我身為秘書長能跟你答復的。"],["陳委員俊宇：對於要不要邀請總統來國情報告，各方近期內都表達了許多不同的立場。那在憲判出爐之後，總統府也立即表示賴總統願意到立法院進行國情報告，這是確定的。這與賴總統不論是在競選的時候，還是在就職的時候，所表達的立場都沒有改變過。只要在依法、合憲的情況之下，賴總統都願意到國會來國情報告，並且先前也曾經有過相關議案，朝野已經進行多次協商、討論。我們上會期也曾經對於國情報告的形式進行過討論，參考其他國家執行的情況，以及基於憲法機關相互尊重的原則之下，總統到國會來國情報告，更是可以讓國會受到尊重，展現實際的情況。黨團協商若是決定要邀請賴總統來進行報告，準備的工作就需要仰賴院內周秘書長所帶領的團隊來籌組。","我想我還是請教我們秘書長。有關立法院，我們是不是對於賴總統要來做國情報告的這個事項已經安排其他相關的流程，還有列席的對象，以及動線的安排等等的規劃？這個部分，我們是不是已經有推演過了？"],["周秘書長萬來：有簡單的跟院長報告過了，都有報告過，但是我未便在這邊說明，因為這有涉及到總統維安的問題，我不方便在這邊說明。"],["陳委員俊宇：好，我們是不是已經和府方也進行溝通，隨時能邀請總統到本院來做報告？"],["周秘書長萬來：如果從這樣的條文變成是總統的主動權，倒不是立法院能夠有著墨的餘地。"],["陳委員俊宇：好。我相信在技術上的問題，我們立法院的幕僚單位應該都能夠妥善來因應，但是能否邀請到我們賴清德總統來進行國情報告，還是需要等待我們院長再召開相關的協商會議並凝聚共識，還是期待我們能夠正式的來邀請我們賴總統首次到國會來進行國情報告，以建立我們良好的憲政慣例。我想，作為在立法院近四十年的歷史見證者，秘書長，您是不是也樂觀其成？"],["周秘書長萬來：本來我曾經要寫一個東西，對於這個特別席位，我很期待，但是以目前的現實面來看，我剛才跟陳委員報告過，總統要主動來，不是我們去跟他邀請的。第二個狀況就是說黨團協商的那兩個案，因為這個關係已經沒有案了，所以院長沒辦法協商。"],["陳委員俊宇：我們也是要釋出善意，你說總統府那邊單方面的認為說要來國情報告，可是立法院這邊沒有釋出善意，也不可能促成這個國情報告。"],["周秘書長萬來：陳委員所說的是對的。"],["陳委員俊宇：好，另外，我想就本次的判決當中有關人事同意權部分的解釋來進行討論。我們也看到這個憲判指出，對於逾越立法院職權和人事同意權範圍的部分違憲，立法院的人事同意權僅有同意與否決被同意人人事任命的權力，並無立法課予被提名人特定義務的權限，更無施以行政罰制裁的權限；立法院的報告當中也敘明，審查程序將以未經宣告違憲的新規定來運作。我想請教秘書長，未經宣告違憲的新規定與現行規定在運作上區別為何？以及審查不得少於一個月的規定，實施上應該要如何來安排相關的期程？"],["周秘書長萬來：謝謝，因為這個法條裡面其實是從第632號解釋是可以看得到，而且我如果沒有記錯，第632號解釋是由賴總統去聲請釋憲的。而現在的一個情形就是，這個本身在整個著墨上來講，因為它是程序上的一個安排，至於裡面很多違憲的地方，我們就沒有辦法去做處理。至於因為現在裡面有一個狀況，跟目前不同點的幾個部分跟陳委員報告一下，一個原來是無記名投票，現在改成記名投票。"],["陳委員俊宇：是。"],["周秘書長萬來：另外一個，委員會原來只有出席委員過半數，現在兩個都一樣要全體委員過半數，現在就是全院委員會審查以後，這個審查報告跟投票一定要10天。至於這個要分開，裡面還有一個很重要的，像我當考試委員是總共10個人在一起，現在不行了，要分別！在全院委員審查要分別來為之，這是幾個比較重要的地方。至於陳委員所說的幕僚有沒有對這方面……交通委員會主任秘書跟我們議事處處長對於議事的程序流程早就已經有安排了。"],["陳委員俊宇：好，我想有關職權行使法的相關修法，在本次這個憲判當中，大法官已經給出非常明確的指引。對於這個憲政機關的權力分立劃出界線，也不應該再出現國會優位的這個情況。接下來我們國會改革修法還會持續進行，判決也會讓後續的相關法有一個依循的準則，所以還是請秘書長這邊針對這個部分能加以重視。另外，國會改革在憲判之後，應該重整腳步，務實來討論下一步，除了須符合憲政架構權力分立原則外，也必須落實權責相符的國會改革，所以接下來的修法工作必須符合憲判意旨，在憲法框架下進行改革。","藉由今天的機會，我還是要就教秘書長，我想再追蹤一下有關國會擴建目前推動的進度。秘書長可能也了解，本席非常關心國會擴建相關計畫，也多次向您詢問這個問題。今年4月份詢答的時候，秘書長表示在個人立場上，除了希望能夠擴建外，同時也指示總務處在六個月內完成相關研議，至今已經過半年時間，請教秘書長，有關國會擴建研議的意見，是否已經有向前進一步的進度？"],["周秘書長萬來：非常謝謝。其實我跟陳委員一樣，幾乎從我任公職以來就在立法院，我也一直強調對這裡很有感情，所以陳委員一直提的問題，我也是非常著急。相關狀況大概總務處都有在處理，可以請總務處長跟委員稍微簡單報告。"],["陳委員俊宇：好，請處長簡單說明。"],["廖處長烱志：謝謝委員的關心。針對國會擴建案，我們的幕僚作業已經簽辦上來，待朝野協商後，就會進行後續發包的規劃作業，以上。"],["陳委員俊宇：目前規劃的，還是以原先圈列的那6個場址、地點……"],["廖處長烱志：是。"],["陳委員俊宇：就這6個？有沒有已經確定大概會在哪一個位置？"],["廖處長烱志：沒有，因為地點的選擇要等全院的共識。"],["陳委員俊宇：要全院委員？"],["廖處長烱志：是。"],["陳委員俊宇：好，再請教秘書長，到目前為止，好像本屆院長都還沒有召開過相關會議的協商，是不是？"],["周秘書長萬來：很抱歉，因為這次政治議題太多了，包括現在還有上個禮拜的總預算案，院長也花了很多心思在處理總預算的問題，這部分我會再跟院長報告。"],["陳委員俊宇：好，請問院長對於國會擴建的相關案子，有沒有進行了解？"],["周秘書長萬來：我會再跟他報告細一點，我們簽上去的，他是有看過。"],["陳委員俊宇：有看過？"],["周秘書長萬來：看過。"],["陳委員俊宇：好，還是希望整個擴建計畫能夠儘速啟動，不管是過去選出的6個點位，或是有考慮加入新的擴建地點，需要的程序和工程往往都是10年起跳；如果沒有啟動的話，那個10年是遙遙無期！我希望能趕快啟動，因為這個過程也需要跟社會溝通，實在不宜再拖延，為了讓國會有更好的議事品質，也符合親近人民的國會所需的場域，還是再次請秘書長跟韓院長積極討論，重視我們國會擴建計畫，相關的期程，也希望能夠儘速啟動，以上。"],["周秘書長萬來：謝謝委員，我們會依陳委員今天的指示再儘速處理。"],["陳委員俊宇：好，謝謝秘書長。"],["主席：謝謝陳委員，謝謝周秘書長。","接下來有請翁委員曉玲詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":116,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-36-9","speakers":["鍾佳濱","黃國昌","林思銘","沈發惠","吳思瑤","莊瑞雄","陳俊宇","翁曉玲","吳宗憲","羅智強","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","李坤城","張啓楷","賴士葆","謝龍介","傅崐萁"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-10-28"],"gazette_id":"1139102","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1139102_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第9次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查及處理113年度中央政府總預算關於監察院主管預算凍結項目共6案；二、邀請立法院秘\n書長列席就「『113年憲判字第9號判決』，國會行使職權之困境與未來」進行專題報告，並備質\n詢","agenda_id":"1139102_00001"}}}