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\"start\": 485.693, \"end\": 485.813, \"score\": 0.806}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"月\", \"start\": 485.813, \"end\": 485.953, \"score\": 0.781}, {\"word\": \"內\"}, {\"word\": \"加\", \"start\": 485.953, \"end\": 485.973, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"油\", \"start\": 485.973, \"end\": 486.153, \"score\": 0.801}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 486.153, \"end\": 486.173, \"score\": 0.114}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:07,151 --> 00:00:10,289\n謝謝主席楊瓊瓔發言邀請部長請何部長\n\n2\n00:00:16,029 --> 00:00:40,828\n我們來針對於缺工的問題來討論因為我們看到未來9年那麼我們所迎來的是378萬人的這個退休那也是史上到目前為止最大的退休潮的逼近那又加上少子化那導致我們整個在製造交通營建服務跟醫療等等的各行業普遍的來缺工\n\n3\n00:00:41,448 --> 00:01:01,525\n尤其特別是3K所謂的3K是什麼危險辛苦骯髒這3K的辛苦特定製造製成的產業缺工特別特別的嚴重那所以呢我們又看到你的統計在11年來15到29歲的青年勞動力人口是減少了16萬人而國防會推估我們臺灣勞動力人口缺口會在2030年會達到\n\n4\n00:01:10,872 --> 00:01:29,250\n在這樣的一個情況之下他不僅會影響到我們整個的就業市場影響到經濟的一個衝擊所以本期要在這邊請教部長賴清德總統在2017年的時候他擔任行政院長有一句口號讓我很很撼動他曾經提出了流財攬財還有什麼\n\n5\n00:01:33,133 --> 00:01:55,724\n預財這三個財那如果這三項的政策方向那如果剛剛用數字會講話告訴我們等於他的流覽域都是改變成一個字叫做山都越來越低了越來越低了所以在這樣的情況之下本席要請教像這樣子的情況你要怎麼因應這個市場的挑戰請做說明\n\n6\n00:01:57,143 --> 00:02:16,009\n市委員我想今天的報告案我們也呈現出說在這裡面其實最缺的是中階技術人力對那怎麼辦你怎麼因應委員我們現在在本土的中階技術人才培育上面也希望能夠強化學訓用的跟教育部經濟部一起來整合這三方的這樣子的\n\n7\n00:02:20,871 --> 00:02:22,152\n你剛才所做的回答我相信如果以目前你現在所做的書面資料跟回答\n\n8\n00:02:38,504 --> 00:02:55,897\n你的答案還是一樣一個字就是山越來越低越來越低他不是流他不是藍他不是玉所以我希望你還是針對目前我們所面臨到的這一切困境你再去做一個精準的一個盤點到底要怎麼做\n\n9\n00:02:56,417 --> 00:03:13,574\n好不好?到底要怎麼做?因為你剛剛針對本土的我們目前就是這樣做數字就是不好看那你剛剛要提到的一個外籍的部分我繼續來跟你討論因為我緊張這一個外籍的你如果所有的政策都依照這樣子那我們台灣的國力要怎麼辦?\n\n10\n00:03:14,355 --> 00:03:32,297\n待會我們繼續來討論那所以我用你實質目前在做的我們在去年因應旅宿還有餐飲這都最健康的在這樣的情況之下你推出了義後改善缺工擴大就業方案對不對你推出了從勞工端\n\n11\n00:03:32,998 --> 00:04:00,575\n及顧祖端來找手協助受疫情衝擊的造成以後缺工的這個產業來捕食人力喔捕食人力到目前為止到今年6月底你協助了2900人來就業那所以本期要在這邊請教你勞動部對這個數字你滿意嗎這當然是偏低偏低嗎那為什麼會偏低是政策錯誤還是執行無力\n\n12\n00:04:01,415 --> 00:04:28,517\n還是社會面相不夠還是怎麼樣因為既然連你自己推出的政策你都認為是偏低那我要再繼續跟你討論因為你願意承認你這個政策的執行率是不到位的所以在這樣的情況之下你要如何的來提高就業率你針對於缺工你還有什麼方案你現在所提出在做的你認為是偏低那怎麼辦專案來做到偏低那怎麼辦呢\n\n13\n00:04:29,238 --> 00:04:55,393\n我原理是只針對旅宿餐館﹖對也是因為這樣所以我們又擴大開放的橋外生﹖可以來從事旅宿業的中階工作請你再精準方案好不好你答案還是下一題本席要跟你討論的請你再就針對剛剛本席所提出你專案的在福島只有2900人是偏低的請你再去精準方案這個部分就是﹖如果你的政策方案是不對檔的\n\n14\n00:04:57,475 --> 00:05:16,494\n是不正確的那你應該去從內部去討論而不是都只有給我一個答案我們從外籍工因為你第一個提問我本席第一個提問跟第二個提問你都是給我回答這個所以我會中斷你的回答請你去精準精準你的方案告訴本席好不好\n\n15\n00:05:20,276 --> 00:05:36,126\n第3個我實質跟你討論從2024年9月份我們的失聯外籍移工的部分來台的部分已經失聯的80萬人那你比去年同期你增加了5萬人也是歷史新高近7年來最高\n\n16\n00:05:37,006 --> 00:06:02,533\n那在這樣的情況下你告訴我開放了資深移工轉任中階技術人力你開放了橋外剛才你回答橋外生轉任中階人力的業別國際勞動力勢必你不斷的不斷的在增加所以包括現在經濟部長告訴我們你勞動部最近要持續放寬包括了印度的移工對不對\n\n17\n00:06:03,513 --> 00:06:21,999\n所以換句話說本席告訴你如果依照你目前的政策你到2028年會突破多少百萬移工大關會突破百萬移工是不是有可能所以我們的方向看法是一致的所以本席要請教依照救福法的規定\n\n18\n00:06:23,379 --> 00:06:37,810\n蘭嶺移工每一年可以引進多少的總人數這個是舊法裡面規定依照外籍勞工聘僱警戒指標的訂定到今天為止你還沒有訂所以你就開了一個大口\n\n19\n00:06:38,510 --> 00:07:07,546\n大管道在這裡所以呢勞動部你是不是要怎麼樣解決我們的移工的問題在你必須要有外籍移工進來的時候你的相關法律的一個人數跟你要怎麼樣去調整這是目前我們必須要做的請做說明我們有定警戒指標了那我也一直在重申警戒指標要什麼時候定出來不能用開放移工來解決啦\n\n20\n00:07:08,066 --> 00:07:15,031\n那你竟然結論給我回答這個我本期問你的第一題跟第二題你都是運用外籍移工的對不對\n\n21\n00:07:19,097 --> 00:07:44,271\n不是好好的問題而且這個是社會面向的問題因為你這個如果沒有管抗也會影響到本級的勞工當然由本級的勞工從我們的百天工、幫忙工到目前為止他要兩個禮拜做的事情他現在可能五天就做好因為逃跑的外籍移工全部加入在這樣的情況你都清楚這些事情你為什麼沒有方法去研讀\n\n22\n00:07:45,612 --> 00:08:06,173\n那怎麼辦本期所說的社會面向你都說是對那你應該要好好的應對你所認識的台灣目前的困境去做調整好不好你怎麼去做調整多久時間告訴我方案好我們一個月內給委員一個月內好不好因為數字真的很難看好不好一個月內加油好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n7151\t10289\t謝謝主席楊瓊瓔發言 邀請部長請何部長\n16029\t40828\t我們來針對於缺工的問題來討論因為我們看到未來9年那麼我們所迎來的是378萬人的這個退休那也是史上到目前為止最大的退休潮的逼近那又加上少子化那導致我們整個在製造交通營建服務跟醫療等等的各行業普遍的來缺工\n41448\t61525\t尤其特別是3K所謂的3K是什麼危險辛苦骯髒這3K的辛苦特定製造製成的產業缺工特別特別的嚴重那所以呢我們又看到你的統計在11年來15到29歲的青年勞動力人口是減少了16萬人而國防會推估我們臺灣勞動力人口缺口會在2030年會達到\n70872\t89250\t在這樣的一個情況之下他不僅會影響到我們整個的就業市場影響到經濟的一個衝擊所以本期要在這邊請教部長賴清德總統在2017年的時候他擔任行政院長有一句口號讓我很很撼動他曾經提出了流財攬財還有什麼\n93133\t115724\t預財這三個財那如果這三項的政策方向那如果剛剛用數字會講話告訴我們等於他的流覽域都是改變成一個字叫做山都越來越低了越來越低了所以在這樣的情況之下本席要請教像這樣子的情況你要怎麼因應這個市場的挑戰請做說明\n117143\t136009\t市委員我想今天的報告案我們也呈現出說在這裡面其實最缺的是中階技術人力對那怎麼辦你怎麼因應委員我們現在在本土的中階技術人才培育上面也希望能夠強化學訓用的跟教育部經濟部一起來整合這三方的這樣子的\n140871\t142152\t你剛才所做的回答我相信如果以目前你現在所做的書面資料跟回答\n158504\t175897\t你的答案還是一樣一個字就是山越來越低越來越低他不是流他不是藍他不是玉所以我希望你還是針對目前我們所面臨到的這一切困境你再去做一個精準的一個盤點到底要怎麼做\n176417\t193574\t好不好?到底要怎麼做?因為你剛剛針對本土的我們目前就是這樣做數字就是不好看那你剛剛要提到的一個外籍的部分我繼續來跟你討論因為我緊張這一個外籍的你如果所有的政策都依照這樣子那我們台灣的國力要怎麼辦?\n194355\t212297\t待會我們繼續來討論那所以我用你實質目前在做的我們在去年因應旅宿還有餐飲這都最健康的在這樣的情況之下你推出了義後改善缺工擴大就業方案對不對你推出了從勞工端\n212998\t240575\t及顧祖端來找手協助受疫情衝擊的造成以後缺工的這個產業來捕食人力喔捕食人力到目前為止到今年6月底你協助了2900人來就業那所以本期要在這邊請教你勞動部對這個數字你滿意嗎這當然是偏低偏低嗎那為什麼會偏低是政策錯誤還是執行無力\n241415\t268517\t還是社會面相不夠還是怎麼樣因為既然連你自己推出的政策你都認為是偏低那我要再繼續跟你討論因為你願意承認你這個政策的執行率是不到位的所以在這樣的情況之下你要如何的來提高就業率你針對於缺工你還有什麼方案你現在所提出在做的你認為是偏低那怎麼辦專案來做到偏低那怎麼辦呢\n269238\t295393\t我原理是只針對旅宿餐館﹖對也是因為這樣所以我們又擴大開放的橋外生﹖可以來從事旅宿業的中階工作請你再精準方案好不好你答案還是下一題本席要跟你討論的請你再就針對剛剛本席所提出你專案的在福島只有2900人是偏低的請你再去精準方案這個部分就是﹖如果你的政策方案是不對檔的\n297475\t316494\t是不正確的那你應該去從內部去討論而不是都只有給我一個答案我們從外籍工因為你第一個提問我本席第一個提問跟第二個提問你都是給我回答這個所以我會中斷你的回答請你去精準精準你的方案告訴本席好不好\n320276\t336126\t第3個我實質跟你討論從2024年9月份我們的失聯外籍移工的部分來台的部分已經失聯的80萬人那你比去年同期你增加了5萬人也是歷史新高近7年來最高\n337006\t362533\t那在這樣的情況下你告訴我開放了資深移工轉任中階技術人力你開放了橋外剛才你回答橋外生轉任中階人力的業別國際勞動力勢必你不斷的不斷的在增加所以包括現在經濟部長告訴我們你勞動部最近要持續放寬包括了印度的移工對不對\n363513\t381999\t所以換句話說本席告訴你如果依照你目前的政策你到2028年會突破多少百萬移工大關會突破百萬移工是不是有可能所以我們的方向看法是一致的所以本席要請教依照救福法的規定\n383379\t397810\t蘭嶺移工每一年可以引進多少的總人數這個是舊法裡面規定依照外籍勞工聘僱警戒指標的訂定到今天為止你還沒有訂所以你就開了一個大口\n398510\t427546\t大管道在這裡所以呢勞動部你是不是要怎麼樣解決我們的移工的問題在你必須要有外籍移工進來的時候你的相關法律的一個人數跟你要怎麼樣去調整這是目前我們必須要做的請做說明我們有定警戒指標了那我也一直在重申警戒指標要什麼時候定出來不能用開放移工來解決啦\n428066\t435031\t那你竟然結論給我回答這個我本期問你的第一題跟第二題你都是運用外籍移工的對不對\n439097\t464271\t不是好好的問題 而且這個是社會面向的問題因為你這個如果沒有管抗也會影響到本級的勞工當然 由本級的勞工 從我們的百天工、幫忙工到目前為止他要兩個禮拜做的事情 他現在可能五天就做好因為逃跑的外籍移工全部加入 在這樣的情況你都清楚這些事情你為什麼沒有方法去研讀\n465612\t486173\t那怎麼辦本期所說的社會面向你都說是對那你應該要好好的應對你所認識的台灣目前的困境去做調整好不好你怎麼去做調整多久時間告訴我方案好我們一個月內給委員一個月內好不好因為數字真的很難看好不好一個月內加油好謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席楊瓊瓔發言 邀請部長請何部長\n我們來針對於缺工的問題來討論因為我們看到未來9年那麼我們所迎來的是378萬人的這個退休那也是史上到目前為止最大的退休潮的逼近那又加上少子化那導致我們整個在製造交通營建服務跟醫療等等的各行業普遍的來缺工\n尤其特別是3K所謂的3K是什麼危險辛苦骯髒這3K的辛苦特定製造製成的產業缺工特別特別的嚴重那所以呢我們又看到你的統計在11年來15到29歲的青年勞動力人口是減少了16萬人而國防會推估我們臺灣勞動力人口缺口會在2030年會達到\n在這樣的一個情況之下他不僅會影響到我們整個的就業市場影響到經濟的一個衝擊所以本期要在這邊請教部長賴清德總統在2017年的時候他擔任行政院長有一句口號讓我很很撼動他曾經提出了流財攬財還有什麼\n預財這三個財那如果這三項的政策方向那如果剛剛用數字會講話告訴我們等於他的流覽域都是改變成一個字叫做山都越來越低了越來越低了所以在這樣的情況之下本席要請教像這樣子的情況你要怎麼因應這個市場的挑戰請做說明\n市委員我想今天的報告案我們也呈現出說在這裡面其實最缺的是中階技術人力對那怎麼辦你怎麼因應委員我們現在在本土的中階技術人才培育上面也希望能夠強化學訓用的跟教育部經濟部一起來整合這三方的這樣子的\n你剛才所做的回答我相信如果以目前你現在所做的書面資料跟回答\n你的答案還是一樣一個字就是山越來越低越來越低他不是流他不是藍他不是玉所以我希望你還是針對目前我們所面臨到的這一切困境你再去做一個精準的一個盤點到底要怎麼做\n好不好?到底要怎麼做?因為你剛剛針對本土的我們目前就是這樣做數字就是不好看那你剛剛要提到的一個外籍的部分我繼續來跟你討論因為我緊張這一個外籍的你如果所有的政策都依照這樣子那我們台灣的國力要怎麼辦?\n待會我們繼續來討論那所以我用你實質目前在做的我們在去年因應旅宿還有餐飲這都最健康的在這樣的情況之下你推出了義後改善缺工擴大就業方案對不對你推出了從勞工端\n及顧祖端來找手協助受疫情衝擊的造成以後缺工的這個產業來捕食人力喔捕食人力到目前為止到今年6月底你協助了2900人來就業那所以本期要在這邊請教你勞動部對這個數字你滿意嗎這當然是偏低偏低嗎那為什麼會偏低是政策錯誤還是執行無力\n還是社會面相不夠還是怎麼樣因為既然連你自己推出的政策你都認為是偏低那我要再繼續跟你討論因為你願意承認你這個政策的執行率是不到位的所以在這樣的情況之下你要如何的來提高就業率你針對於缺工你還有什麼方案你現在所提出在做的你認為是偏低那怎麼辦專案來做到偏低那怎麼辦呢\n我原理是只針對旅宿餐館﹖對也是因為這樣所以我們又擴大開放的橋外生﹖可以來從事旅宿業的中階工作請你再精準方案好不好你答案還是下一題本席要跟你討論的請你再就針對剛剛本席所提出你專案的在福島只有2900人是偏低的請你再去精準方案這個部分就是﹖如果你的政策方案是不對檔的\n是不正確的那你應該去從內部去討論而不是都只有給我一個答案我們從外籍工因為你第一個提問我本席第一個提問跟第二個提問你都是給我回答這個所以我會中斷你的回答請你去精準精準你的方案告訴本席好不好\n第3個我實質跟你討論從2024年9月份我們的失聯外籍移工的部分來台的部分已經失聯的80萬人那你比去年同期你增加了5萬人也是歷史新高近7年來最高\n那在這樣的情況下你告訴我開放了資深移工轉任中階技術人力你開放了橋外剛才你回答橋外生轉任中階人力的業別國際勞動力勢必你不斷的不斷的在增加所以包括現在經濟部長告訴我們你勞動部最近要持續放寬包括了印度的移工對不對\n所以換句話說本席告訴你如果依照你目前的政策你到2028年會突破多少百萬移工大關會突破百萬移工是不是有可能所以我們的方向看法是一致的所以本席要請教依照救福法的規定\n蘭嶺移工每一年可以引進多少的總人數這個是舊法裡面規定依照外籍勞工聘僱警戒指標的訂定到今天為止你還沒有訂所以你就開了一個大口\n大管道在這裡所以呢勞動部你是不是要怎麼樣解決我們的移工的問題在你必須要有外籍移工進來的時候你的相關法律的一個人數跟你要怎麼樣去調整這是目前我們必須要做的請做說明我們有定警戒指標了那我也一直在重申警戒指標要什麼時候定出來不能用開放移工來解決啦\n那你竟然結論給我回答這個我本期問你的第一題跟第二題你都是運用外籍移工的對不對\n不是好好的問題 而且這個是社會面向的問題因為你這個如果沒有管抗也會影響到本級的勞工當然 由本級的勞工 從我們的百天工、幫忙工到目前為止他要兩個禮拜做的事情 他現在可能五天就做好因為逃跑的外籍移工全部加入 在這樣的情況你都清楚這些事情你為什麼沒有方法去研讀\n那怎麼辦本期所說的社會面向你都說是對那你應該要好好的應對你所認識的台灣目前的困境去做調整好不好你怎麼去做調整多久時間告訴我方案好我們一個月內給委員一個月內好不好因為數字真的很難看好不好一個月內加油好謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:07.151 --> 00:10.289\n謝謝主席楊瓊瓔發言邀請部長請何部長\n\n00:16.029 --> 00:40.828\n我們來針對於缺工的問題來討論因為我們看到未來9年那麼我們所迎來的是378萬人的這個退休那也是史上到目前為止最大的退休潮的逼近那又加上少子化那導致我們整個在製造交通營建服務跟醫療等等的各行業普遍的來缺工\n\n00:41.448 --> 01:01.525\n尤其特別是3K所謂的3K是什麼危險辛苦骯髒這3K的辛苦特定製造製成的產業缺工特別特別的嚴重那所以呢我們又看到你的統計在11年來15到29歲的青年勞動力人口是減少了16萬人而國防會推估我們臺灣勞動力人口缺口會在2030年會達到\n\n01:10.872 --> 01:29.250\n在這樣的一個情況之下他不僅會影響到我們整個的就業市場影響到經濟的一個衝擊所以本期要在這邊請教部長賴清德總統在2017年的時候他擔任行政院長有一句口號讓我很很撼動他曾經提出了流財攬財還有什麼\n\n01:33.133 --> 01:55.724\n預財這三個財那如果這三項的政策方向那如果剛剛用數字會講話告訴我們等於他的流覽域都是改變成一個字叫做山都越來越低了越來越低了所以在這樣的情況之下本席要請教像這樣子的情況你要怎麼因應這個市場的挑戰請做說明\n\n01:57.143 --> 02:16.009\n市委員我想今天的報告案我們也呈現出說在這裡面其實最缺的是中階技術人力對那怎麼辦你怎麼因應委員我們現在在本土的中階技術人才培育上面也希望能夠強化學訓用的跟教育部經濟部一起來整合這三方的這樣子的\n\n02:20.871 --> 02:22.152\n你剛才所做的回答我相信如果以目前你現在所做的書面資料跟回答\n\n02:38.504 --> 02:55.897\n你的答案還是一樣一個字就是山越來越低越來越低他不是流他不是藍他不是玉所以我希望你還是針對目前我們所面臨到的這一切困境你再去做一個精準的一個盤點到底要怎麼做\n\n02:56.417 --> 03:13.574\n好不好?到底要怎麼做?因為你剛剛針對本土的我們目前就是這樣做數字就是不好看那你剛剛要提到的一個外籍的部分我繼續來跟你討論因為我緊張這一個外籍的你如果所有的政策都依照這樣子那我們台灣的國力要怎麼辦?\n\n03:14.355 --> 03:32.297\n待會我們繼續來討論那所以我用你實質目前在做的我們在去年因應旅宿還有餐飲這都最健康的在這樣的情況之下你推出了義後改善缺工擴大就業方案對不對你推出了從勞工端\n\n03:32.998 --> 04:00.575\n及顧祖端來找手協助受疫情衝擊的造成以後缺工的這個產業來捕食人力喔捕食人力到目前為止到今年6月底你協助了2900人來就業那所以本期要在這邊請教你勞動部對這個數字你滿意嗎這當然是偏低偏低嗎那為什麼會偏低是政策錯誤還是執行無力\n\n04:01.415 --> 04:28.517\n還是社會面相不夠還是怎麼樣因為既然連你自己推出的政策你都認為是偏低那我要再繼續跟你討論因為你願意承認你這個政策的執行率是不到位的所以在這樣的情況之下你要如何的來提高就業率你針對於缺工你還有什麼方案你現在所提出在做的你認為是偏低那怎麼辦專案來做到偏低那怎麼辦呢\n\n04:29.238 --> 04:55.393\n我原理是只針對旅宿餐館﹖對也是因為這樣所以我們又擴大開放的橋外生﹖可以來從事旅宿業的中階工作請你再精準方案好不好你答案還是下一題本席要跟你討論的請你再就針對剛剛本席所提出你專案的在福島只有2900人是偏低的請你再去精準方案這個部分就是﹖如果你的政策方案是不對檔的\n\n04:57.475 --> 05:16.494\n是不正確的那你應該去從內部去討論而不是都只有給我一個答案我們從外籍工因為你第一個提問我本席第一個提問跟第二個提問你都是給我回答這個所以我會中斷你的回答請你去精準精準你的方案告訴本席好不好\n\n05:20.276 --> 05:36.126\n第3個我實質跟你討論從2024年9月份我們的失聯外籍移工的部分來台的部分已經失聯的80萬人那你比去年同期你增加了5萬人也是歷史新高近7年來最高\n\n05:37.006 --> 06:02.533\n那在這樣的情況下你告訴我開放了資深移工轉任中階技術人力你開放了橋外剛才你回答橋外生轉任中階人力的業別國際勞動力勢必你不斷的不斷的在增加所以包括現在經濟部長告訴我們你勞動部最近要持續放寬包括了印度的移工對不對\n\n06:03.513 --> 06:21.999\n所以換句話說本席告訴你如果依照你目前的政策你到2028年會突破多少百萬移工大關會突破百萬移工是不是有可能所以我們的方向看法是一致的所以本席要請教依照救福法的規定\n\n06:23.379 --> 06:37.810\n蘭嶺移工每一年可以引進多少的總人數這個是舊法裡面規定依照外籍勞工聘僱警戒指標的訂定到今天為止你還沒有訂所以你就開了一個大口\n\n06:38.510 --> 07:07.546\n大管道在這裡所以呢勞動部你是不是要怎麼樣解決我們的移工的問題在你必須要有外籍移工進來的時候你的相關法律的一個人數跟你要怎麼樣去調整這是目前我們必須要做的請做說明我們有定警戒指標了那我也一直在重申警戒指標要什麼時候定出來不能用開放移工來解決啦\n\n07:08.066 --> 07:15.031\n那你竟然結論給我回答這個我本期問你的第一題跟第二題你都是運用外籍移工的對不對\n\n07:19.097 --> 07:44.271\n不是好好的問題而且這個是社會面向的問題因為你這個如果沒有管抗也會影響到本級的勞工當然由本級的勞工從我們的百天工、幫忙工到目前為止他要兩個禮拜做的事情他現在可能五天就做好因為逃跑的外籍移工全部加入在這樣的情況你都清楚這些事情你為什麼沒有方法去研讀\n\n07:45.612 --> 08:06.173\n那怎麼辦本期所說的社會面向你都說是對那你應該要好好的應對你所認識的台灣目前的困境去做調整好不好你怎麼去做調整多久時間告訴我方案好我們一個月內給委員一個月內好不好因為數字真的很難看好不好一個月內加油好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":7.151,"end":10.289,"text":"謝謝主席楊瓊瓔發言 邀請部長請何部長"},{"start":16.029,"end":40.828,"text":"我們來針對於缺工的問題來討論因為我們看到未來9年那麼我們所迎來的是378萬人的這個退休那也是史上到目前為止最大的退休潮的逼近那又加上少子化那導致我們整個在製造交通營建服務跟醫療等等的各行業普遍的來缺工"},{"start":41.448,"end":61.525,"text":"尤其特別是3K所謂的3K是什麼危險辛苦骯髒這3K的辛苦特定製造製成的產業缺工特別特別的嚴重那所以呢我們又看到你的統計在11年來15到29歲的青年勞動力人口是減少了16萬人而國防會推估我們臺灣勞動力人口缺口會在2030年會達到"},{"start":70.872,"end":89.25,"text":"在這樣的一個情況之下他不僅會影響到我們整個的就業市場影響到經濟的一個衝擊所以本期要在這邊請教部長賴清德總統在2017年的時候他擔任行政院長有一句口號讓我很很撼動他曾經提出了流財攬財還有什麼"},{"start":93.133,"end":115.724,"text":"預財這三個財那如果這三項的政策方向那如果剛剛用數字會講話告訴我們等於他的流覽域都是改變成一個字叫做山都越來越低了越來越低了所以在這樣的情況之下本席要請教像這樣子的情況你要怎麼因應這個市場的挑戰請做說明"},{"start":117.143,"end":136.009,"text":"市委員我想今天的報告案我們也呈現出說在這裡面其實最缺的是中階技術人力對那怎麼辦你怎麼因應委員我們現在在本土的中階技術人才培育上面也希望能夠強化學訓用的跟教育部經濟部一起來整合這三方的這樣子的"},{"start":140.871,"end":142.152,"text":"你剛才所做的回答我相信如果以目前你現在所做的書面資料跟回答"},{"start":158.504,"end":175.897,"text":"你的答案還是一樣一個字就是山越來越低越來越低他不是流他不是藍他不是玉所以我希望你還是針對目前我們所面臨到的這一切困境你再去做一個精準的一個盤點到底要怎麼做"},{"start":176.417,"end":193.574,"text":"好不好?到底要怎麼做?因為你剛剛針對本土的我們目前就是這樣做數字就是不好看那你剛剛要提到的一個外籍的部分我繼續來跟你討論因為我緊張這一個外籍的你如果所有的政策都依照這樣子那我們台灣的國力要怎麼辦?"},{"start":194.355,"end":212.297,"text":"待會我們繼續來討論那所以我用你實質目前在做的我們在去年因應旅宿還有餐飲這都最健康的在這樣的情況之下你推出了義後改善缺工擴大就業方案對不對你推出了從勞工端"},{"start":212.998,"end":240.575,"text":"及顧祖端來找手協助受疫情衝擊的造成以後缺工的這個產業來捕食人力喔捕食人力到目前為止到今年6月底你協助了2900人來就業那所以本期要在這邊請教你勞動部對這個數字你滿意嗎這當然是偏低偏低嗎那為什麼會偏低是政策錯誤還是執行無力"},{"start":241.415,"end":268.517,"text":"還是社會面相不夠還是怎麼樣因為既然連你自己推出的政策你都認為是偏低那我要再繼續跟你討論因為你願意承認你這個政策的執行率是不到位的所以在這樣的情況之下你要如何的來提高就業率你針對於缺工你還有什麼方案你現在所提出在做的你認為是偏低那怎麼辦專案來做到偏低那怎麼辦呢"},{"start":269.238,"end":295.393,"text":"我原理是只針對旅宿餐館﹖對也是因為這樣所以我們又擴大開放的橋外生﹖可以來從事旅宿業的中階工作請你再精準方案好不好你答案還是下一題本席要跟你討論的請你再就針對剛剛本席所提出你專案的在福島只有2900人是偏低的請你再去精準方案這個部分就是﹖如果你的政策方案是不對檔的"},{"start":297.475,"end":316.494,"text":"是不正確的那你應該去從內部去討論而不是都只有給我一個答案我們從外籍工因為你第一個提問我本席第一個提問跟第二個提問你都是給我回答這個所以我會中斷你的回答請你去精準精準你的方案告訴本席好不好"},{"start":320.276,"end":336.126,"text":"第3個我實質跟你討論從2024年9月份我們的失聯外籍移工的部分來台的部分已經失聯的80萬人那你比去年同期你增加了5萬人也是歷史新高近7年來最高"},{"start":337.006,"end":362.533,"text":"那在這樣的情況下你告訴我開放了資深移工轉任中階技術人力你開放了橋外剛才你回答橋外生轉任中階人力的業別國際勞動力勢必你不斷的不斷的在增加所以包括現在經濟部長告訴我們你勞動部最近要持續放寬包括了印度的移工對不對"},{"start":363.513,"end":381.999,"text":"所以換句話說本席告訴你如果依照你目前的政策你到2028年會突破多少百萬移工大關會突破百萬移工是不是有可能所以我們的方向看法是一致的所以本席要請教依照救福法的規定"},{"start":383.379,"end":397.81,"text":"蘭嶺移工每一年可以引進多少的總人數這個是舊法裡面規定依照外籍勞工聘僱警戒指標的訂定到今天為止你還沒有訂所以你就開了一個大口"},{"start":398.51,"end":427.546,"text":"大管道在這裡所以呢勞動部你是不是要怎麼樣解決我們的移工的問題在你必須要有外籍移工進來的時候你的相關法律的一個人數跟你要怎麼樣去調整這是目前我們必須要做的請做說明我們有定警戒指標了那我也一直在重申警戒指標要什麼時候定出來不能用開放移工來解決啦"},{"start":428.066,"end":435.031,"text":"那你竟然結論給我回答這個我本期問你的第一題跟第二題你都是運用外籍移工的對不對"},{"start":439.097,"end":464.271,"text":"不是好好的問題 而且這個是社會面向的問題因為你這個如果沒有管抗也會影響到本級的勞工當然 由本級的勞工 從我們的百天工、幫忙工到目前為止他要兩個禮拜做的事情 他現在可能五天就做好因為逃跑的外籍移工全部加入 在這樣的情況你都清楚這些事情你為什麼沒有方法去研讀"},{"start":465.612,"end":486.173,"text":"那怎麼辦本期所說的社會面向你都說是對那你應該要好好的應對你所認識的台灣目前的困境去做調整好不好你怎麼去做調整多久時間告訴我方案好我們一個月內給委員一個月內好不好因為數字真的很難看好不好一個月內加油好謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":854,"blocks":[["楊委員瓊瓔：（11時26分）謝謝主席！楊瓊瓔發言，邀請部長。"],["主席：請何部長。"],["何部長佩珊：委員好。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：部長好。我們來針對契約工的問題討論，因為我們看到未來9年迎來的是378萬人的退休，也是到目前為止史上最大退休潮的逼近，又加上少子化，導致我們整個在製造、交通、營建、服務跟醫療等等各行業普遍的缺工，特別是「3K」，所謂的「3K」是什麼？是指危險、辛苦、骯髒俗稱「3K」的辛苦特定製程產業，缺工得特別嚴重。根據勞動部的統計，這10年來，15到29歲的青年勞動力人口減少了16萬人，而國發會推估我們臺灣勞動力人口缺口會在2030年達到40萬人，在這樣的一個情況之下，它不僅會影響到我們整個的就業市場，也影響到經濟造成衝擊。所以本席要在這邊請教部長，賴清德總統在2017年擔任行政院長時有一句口號讓我很撼動，他曾經提出了「留才、攬才、育才」這三個才的政策方向，如果數字會講話，剛剛的數字就告訴我們他的「留、攬、育」都變成一個字，就是「刪」，都愈來愈低了。本席要請教的是，像這樣子的情況，你要怎麼因應市場的挑戰？請做說明。"],["何部長佩珊：委員，我想在今天的報告中我們也呈現出在這裡面其實最缺的是中階技術人力……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：那怎麼辦？你怎麼因應？"],["何部長佩珊：在本土的中階技術人才培育上面，我們現在也希望能夠強化學訓用，跟教育部、經濟部一起來整合這三方，解決學用落差以及產業的需求，這是本土的部分。那引進外籍的中階人才……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：外籍部分我們待會兒討論，聽到部長剛剛所做的回答，我相信如果以目前你所做的書面資料跟回答，你的答案還是一樣一個字，就是「刪」，愈來愈低，愈來愈低！它不是留，它不是攬，它不是育，所以我希望你還是針對目前我們所面臨到的這些困境再去做一個精準的盤點，到底要怎麼做，好不好？你剛剛是針對本土的做說明，我們目前就是這樣做，數字就是不好看。","現在我繼續針對你剛剛要提到的外籍部分來跟你討論，因為我很緊張，這個外籍的部分，如果所有的政策都依照這樣子，那我們臺灣的國力要怎麼辦？待會兒我們繼續來討論。我以你目前實質在做的來看，去年為因應旅宿還有餐飲，這些都是最缺工的，在這樣的情況之下，你推出了「疫後改善缺工擴大就業方案」，對不對？"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：從勞工端及僱主端來著手協助受疫情衝擊造成疫後缺工的產業，以補實人力，到今年6月底為止，協助了2,900人就業，本席要請教部長，勞動部對這個數字滿意嗎？"],["何部長佩珊：這當然是偏低。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：偏低嗎？"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：那為什麼會偏低？是政策錯誤還是執行無力？還是社會面向「無救」抑或有其他什麼原因？竟然連你自己推出的政策你都認為是偏低的，因為你願意承認你這個政策的執行率是不到位的，那我要再繼續跟你討論，在這樣的情況之下，你要如何提高就業率？針對於缺工，你還有什麼方案？你認為現在所提出的、在做的是偏低的，那怎麼辦？專案來做都偏低，那要怎麼辦呢？"],["何部長佩珊：委員你是指針對旅宿餐飲？"],["楊委員瓊瓔：對，請做說明。"],["何部長佩珊：也是因為這樣，所以我們又擴大開放僑外生可以來從事旅宿業的中階工作。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：請你再精準方案好不好？你的答案是下一題本席要跟你討論的，請你再針對剛剛本席所提，你說專案輔導的部分只有2,900人是偏低的，那就請你再去精準方案，如果你的政策方案是不對檔的、是不正確的，那你應該從內部去討論，而不是都只給我同一個答案──我們從外籍工著手，因為你對本席第一個提問跟第二個提問給的回答都是這個，所以我會中斷你的回答，請你去精準你的方案再告訴本席，好不好？"],["何部長佩珊：這個方案我們要檢討。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：好，要去檢討。第三個我實質跟你討論，從2024年9月份，來臺的失聯外籍移工已經有80萬人，比去年同期增加了5萬人，也是歷史新高，是近7年來最高，在這樣的情況下，你告訴我開放了資深移工轉任中階技術人力，剛剛你又回答說開放僑外生轉任中階人力的業別，你不斷的不斷的在增加國際勞動力，包括現在經濟部長告訴我們，勞動部最近要持續放寬，包括了印度的移工，對不對？換句話說，如果依照你目前的政策，到2028年會突破多少，會突破百萬移工大關，是不是？"],["何部長佩珊：有可能。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：有可能喔！可見我們的方向看法是一致的，所以本席要請教，依照就業服務法的規定，每一年可以引進多少藍領移工的總人數在就服法裡面是有規定的，外籍勞工聘僱警戒指標到今天為止還沒有訂，所以你就在這裡開了一個大口、大管道。"],["何部長佩珊：有訂。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：所以勞動部是不是要設法解決我們移工的問題？在必須要引進外籍移工的時候，相關法律中對於人數跟怎麼樣去調整是目前我們必須要做的，請做說明。"],["何部長佩珊：委員，我們有訂警戒指標了，那我也一直在重申……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：警戒指標什麼時候訂出來的？"],["何部長佩珊：缺工問題不能用開放移工來解決，我也一直重申這一點是……"],["楊委員瓊瓔：既然你的結論是這個，但本席問你的第一題跟第二題你都是說運用外籍移工來補充啊，對不對？"],["何部長佩珊：可是委員沒有時間讓我們講，好！好！是。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：不是「好！好！」的問題，而且這個是社會面向的問題，因為如果你對這個沒有管控好，也會影響到本籍的勞工。"],["何部長佩珊：當然，我非常同意。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：本籍勞工比如綁鋼筋的、做模板這些，原本要兩個禮拜做完的事情現在可能5天就做好了，因為逃跑的外籍移工全部加入。"],["何部長佩珊：是啊！"],["楊委員瓊瓔：你都清楚這些事情，為什麼沒有方法去嚴堵？那怎麼辦？本席說的這些社會面向，你都說「是」、「對」，那就應該好好的應對，就你所認知的臺灣目前的困境去做調整，好不好？你怎麼去做調整，多久時間告訴我方案？"],["何部長佩珊：好，我們一個月內給委員報告。"],["楊委員瓊瓔：一個月內，好不好？因為數字真的很難看。一個月內！加油！"],["何部長佩珊：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝楊瓊瓔委員。","今天沒有臨時提案，所以我們繼續發言，接下來請廖偉翔委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":276,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-26-6","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","盧縣一","王育敏","邱鎮軍","蘇清泉","王正旭","徐巧芯","洪孟楷","林楚茵","陳亭妃","吳宗憲","鍾佳濱","楊瓊瓔","廖偉翔","張雅琳","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","林淑芬","羅廷瑋","李柏毅","劉建國","楊曜","陳瑩","吳春城","涂權吉"],"page_start":199,"meetingDate":["2024-10-30"],"gazette_id":"1139201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1139201_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第6次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"請勞動部部長就「我國全時職位缺工概況」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1139201_00004"}}}