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00:01:13,652\n的機率跟第二輪抽獎的機率一個第一輪是五個中獎名額第二輪中獎是九個中獎名額九萬人來去參與的話那這樣子到最後得出來的結論同一人兩次中獎的機率為乎其為啊這個數字我都不會念那更何況是同一次抽獎裡面有四個人都符合這樣的一個機率那是代表什麼意思?乘四啊就是這樣的機率要乘以四次啊是不是?\n\n4\n00:01:14,622 --> 00:01:32,376\n那第一時間我看到財政部有講沒有違法那再來不到12個小時又講說來上一張沒有內定造假但是要請國稅局查證那請教國人大家都很關心阿\n\n5\n00:01:33,612 --> 00:01:52,937\n現在次長有沒有掌握到底是什麼狀況發生這樣的一個機率?包括委員目前我們還沒有完全掌握因為還沒有完全掌握對現在我們是國稅局已經去把那個就是承辦機關他們的那個電腦系統還有相關的資訊所以這個是委外的標案對是委外的標案對好這個委外標案多少錢?多少錢?\n\n6\n00:01:55,309 --> 00:02:08,002\n總共是...這個委案因為說實在話本席昨天也很關心我請我們的同仁上網看一下財政部的絕標公告我們還發覺這一個標案還真的很難找到\n\n7\n00:02:09,079 --> 00:02:14,645\n所以這個標案總共多少錢?應該是450.450萬吧450萬450萬的標案總共做時間是從6月到9月嘛對不對這是參與抽獎的時間那真正整個抽獎結束的時間是10月25號\n\n8\n00:02:28,020 --> 00:02:48,598\n450450萬有包含這些獎品、獎項以及辦理：洪孟楷那出現了這樣的一個狀況當然國人就會有質疑就覺得說為什麼會這樣子因為這個機率真的是不可思議甚至有人講說可以申請金氏世界紀錄那所以什麼時候會讓國人知道我們財政部的一個調查狀況\n\n9\n00:02:49,537 --> 00:03:13,095\n目前我們已經請國稅局在積極調查中我們也希望他們盡快能夠給我們答案啦所以我們希望在短時間之內幾天之內就可以有一個你知道這個對於財政部來講我覺得對所有機關當然都不應該發生這樣的事情但是尤其是發生在財政部因為大家會同仁會認為財政國稅這都是支柱必較數字都算得非常精準\n\n10\n00:03:13,795 --> 00:03:35,934\n你不能說跟國人要納稅的時候一塊錢兩塊錢都跑不掉結果突然間你們辦一個活動九萬人參與結果機率那麼低然後居然有四個人可以直接中獎那這樣子發生在財政部我覺得這對於公信力是非常大的折扣那現在你如果說講是說不是財政部問題可能是委外廠商的問題那委外廠商會不會有相關的一個連帶責任\n\n11\n00:03:37,824 --> 00:04:03,204\n這當然就是要看我們那個後續追查的結果到底實際上的狀況是怎樣如果確實有相關確實是在這個整個程序過程當中或每一個環節當中有發生一些有問題的事件我們會依照相關的規定來處理相關規定有怎麼樣處理就看是不是我不知道他們契約當時的契約裡面是不是有追究責任或賠償或只是後續的一些其他的處理事件\n\n12\n00:04:03,715 --> 00:04:14,377\n好,那本期再跟您再請教一下,像這個標案它也是用本預算的部分,那所以說它是不是某種程度上它也算是侵犯到人民、國人、納稅人的一個權益?\n\n13\n00:04:15,959 --> 00:04:36,406\n因為我今天早上居然還看到是說我不知道說是不是財政部正式的回應啊講說這個是用雲端發票的基金來去做辦理所以跟本預算沒關係所以這樣子即便是可能有瑕疵也不影響國人的權益是這樣嗎難道基金的預算基金的預算不是人民的納稅錢或是說我們相關的一個消費來去累積嗎\n\n14\n00:04:38,329 --> 00:04:53,430\n怎麼可能說縱容到這種程度好像不要沒關係辦活動沒關係換錢iPhone反正我也沒有參與啊iPhone不是我我也沒有問題啊但重點在於是說今天辦出來這樣的活動然後被國人質疑了\n\n15\n00:04:55,004 --> 00:05:08,304\n我們還會這樣子輕描淡寫嗎?不會,這件事情我們非常重視基本上我們一定會嚴查整個流程還有就是整個環節到底有沒有任何的狀況有沒有問題有沒有廠商這家廠商是第一次投票還是之前就有投票過?\n\n16\n00:05:09,165 --> 00:05:28,463\n有投標過也有投標過所以他也不是第一次來參與的廠商那既然如此的話會不會過去的活動可能沒有被人家踢爆也有類似的狀況因為現在PTT上面也有講還有另外一個抽獎活動也是我們財政部辦的說有特定姓氏的人30%的中獎機率\n\n17\n00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:47,956\n那這樣子會不會變成是說到最後大家會看原本我們以為財政部應該是最支柱必較的原本以為覺得說我們鼓勵雲端發票很好啊少無止化啊但沒想到原來你們拿450萬公帑原來你們拿700萬公帑辦的活動變成是都有瑕疵\n\n18\n00:05:49,108 --> 00:06:10,033\n報告委員剛才委員提到的另外一個標案不是我們財政部辦理的案不是財政部辦理嗎網路上有知道這個訊息是不是稅捐處對自己辦的活動也都是這個稅國稅、稅捐、財政怎麼會讓國人覺得應該是最支柱必較的\n\n19\n00:06:11,271 --> 00:06:36,390\n你查一稅查兩稅都要叫大家補稅要繳稅那結果沒有想到我們花450萬辦的一個活動居然變成是要上金氏世界紀錄我說實在話你也相對無辜啊今天部長在財政委員會還沒有來嘛那你當然我要好好的了解嘛那最後來我們看一下2025年說統一發票經費大增再加開雲端500元獎項\n\n20\n00:06:38,656 --> 00:07:00,357\n這是次長你前幾天的新聞嗎?這樣子?如果辦下去的話會不會讓大家質疑你的公信力可是這個是我們統一發票的中獎抽獎的活動我們那個都是公開抽獎的而且從來沒有人質疑過這個問題以前都是非常公正公開而且非常透明而且沒有重複對獎的問題次長\n\n21\n00:07:02,699 --> 00:07:17,549\n市長,你在一天前,你們在一天前不到12個小時前你們也是這樣講啊說這一次的雲端發票活動公開透明然後怎麼樣的部分本席現在提出來只是要告訴你就是說\n\n22\n00:07:18,149 --> 00:07:26,997\n我其實很痛心啊我說實在話沒有人想要看到你今天來這樣子備詢啊但是既然發生這樣的狀況短時間如果說還不能讓大家釐清的話只會讓大家覺得國人對於我們財政單位會以公信力大打折扣這才是最擔憂的地方啊報告委員我們一定會盡快的釐清而且會把釐清的結果對外說明清楚\n\n23\n00:07:38,666 --> 00:07:57,015\n市長,言政以待這件事,這件事情沒有黨派色彩,因為這個其實是傷害到是我們財政部這麼一個精緻招牌,大家覺得你最支柱必較,大家覺得你對數字最敏感,大家覺得你們應該是最公正客觀透明的,結果發生這樣的狀況。謝謝,謝謝洪委員,謝謝委員,謝謝市長,謝謝洪委員。\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6237\t7778\t理事長,這兩天財政部可能可以申請近視世界紀錄,有沒有注意到?\n23052\t43588\t有知道輿情在反映什麼事情是因為有人講說這個雲端發票的抽獎啊四人重複抽獎重複中獎以這個機率來看真的是為乎其為有網紅去用CHAP GDP還是用這些AI來去計算粉席剛剛也有去算過如果說第一輪的抽獎\n45148\t73652\t的機率跟第二輪抽獎的機率一個第一輪是五個中獎名額第二輪中獎是九個中獎名額九萬人來去參與的話那這樣子到最後得出來的結論同一人兩次中獎的機率為乎其為啊這個數字我都不會念那更何況是同一次抽獎裡面有四個人都符合這樣的一個機率那是代表什麼意思?乘四啊就是這樣的機率要乘以四次啊是不是?\n74622\t92376\t那第一時間我看到財政部有講沒有違法那再來不到12個小時又講說來上一張沒有內定造假但是要請國稅局查證那請教國人大家都很關心阿\n93612\t112937\t現在次長有沒有掌握到底是什麼狀況發生這樣的一個機率?包括委員目前我們還沒有完全掌握因為還沒有完全掌握對現在我們是國稅局已經去把那個就是承辦機關他們的那個電腦系統還有相關的資訊所以這個是委外的標案對是委外的標案對好這個委外標案多少錢?多少錢?\n115309\t128002\t總共是...這個委案因為說實在話本席昨天也很關心我請我們的同仁上網看一下財政部的絕標公告我們還發覺這一個標案還真的很難找到\n129079\t134645\t所以這個標案總共多少錢?應該是450.450萬吧450萬450萬的標案總共做時間是從6月到9月嘛 對不對這是參與抽獎的時間那真正整個抽獎結束的時間是10月25號\n148020\t168598\t450450萬有包含這些獎品、獎項以及辦理：洪孟楷那出現了這樣的一個狀況當然國人就會有質疑就覺得說為什麼會這樣子因為這個機率真的是不可思議甚至有人講說可以申請金氏世界紀錄那所以什麼時候會讓國人知道我們財政部的一個調查狀況\n169537\t193095\t目前我們已經請國稅局在積極調查中我們也希望他們盡快能夠給我們答案啦所以我們希望在短時間之內幾天之內就可以有一個你知道這個對於財政部來講我覺得對所有機關當然都不應該發生這樣的事情但是尤其是發生在財政部因為大家會同仁會認為財政國稅這都是支柱必較數字都算得非常精準\n193795\t215934\t你不能說跟國人要納稅的時候一塊錢兩塊錢都跑不掉結果突然間你們辦一個活動九萬人參與結果機率那麼低然後居然有四個人可以直接中獎那這樣子發生在財政部我覺得這對於公信力是非常大的折扣那現在你如果說講是說不是財政部問題可能是委外廠商的問題那委外廠商會不會有相關的一個連帶責任\n217824\t243204\t這當然就是要看我們那個後續追查的結果到底實際上的狀況是怎樣如果確實有相關確實是在這個整個程序過程當中或每一個環節當中有發生一些有問題的事件我們會依照相關的規定來處理相關規定有怎麼樣處理就看是不是我不知道他們契約當時的契約裡面是不是有追究責任或賠償或只是後續的一些其他的處理事件\n243715\t254377\t好,那本期再跟您再請教一下,像這個標案它也是用本預算的部分,那所以說它是不是某種程度上它也算是侵犯到人民、國人、納稅人的一個權益?\n255959\t276406\t因為我今天早上居然還看到是說我不知道說是不是財政部正式的回應啊講說這個是用雲端發票的基金來去做辦理所以跟本預算沒關係所以這樣子即便是可能有瑕疵也不影響國人的權益是這樣嗎難道基金的預算基金的預算不是人民的納稅錢或是說我們相關的一個消費來去累積嗎\n278329\t293430\t怎麼可能說縱容到這種程度好像不要沒關係辦活動沒關係換錢iPhone反正我也沒有參與啊iPhone不是我我也沒有問題啊但重點在於是說今天辦出來這樣的活動然後被國人質疑了\n295004\t308304\t我們還會這樣子輕描淡寫嗎?不會,這件事情我們非常重視基本上我們一定會嚴查整個流程還有就是整個環節到底有沒有任何的狀況有沒有問題有沒有廠商這家廠商是第一次投票還是之前就有投票過?\n309165\t328463\t有投標過也有投標過所以他也不是第一次來參與的廠商那既然如此的話會不會過去的活動可能沒有被人家踢爆也有類似的狀況因為現在PTT上面也有講還有另外一個抽獎活動也是我們財政部辦的說有特定姓氏的人30%的中獎機率\n331400\t347956\t那這樣子會不會變成是說到最後大家會看原本我們以為財政部應該是最支柱必較的原本以為覺得說我們鼓勵雲端發票很好啊少無止化啊但沒想到原來你們拿450萬公帑原來你們拿700萬公帑辦的活動變成是都有瑕疵\n349108\t370033\t報告委員剛才委員提到的另外一個標案不是我們財政部辦理的案不是財政部辦理嗎網路上有知道這個訊息是不是稅捐處對自己辦的活動也都是這個稅國稅、稅捐、財政怎麼會讓國人覺得應該是最支柱必較的\n371271\t396390\t你查一稅查兩稅都要叫大家補稅要繳稅那結果沒有想到我們花450萬辦的一個活動居然變成是要上金氏世界紀錄我說實在話你也相對無辜啊今天部長在財政委員會還沒有來嘛那你當然我要好好的了解嘛那最後來我們看一下2025年說統一發票經費大增再加開雲端500元獎項\n398656\t420357\t這是次長你前幾天的新聞嗎?這樣子?如果辦下去的話會不會讓大家質疑你的公信力可是這個是我們統一發票的中獎抽獎的活動我們那個都是公開抽獎的而且從來沒有人質疑過這個問題以前都是非常公正公開而且非常透明而且沒有重複對獎的問題次長\n422699\t437549\t市長,你在一天前,你們在一天前不到12個小時前你們也是這樣講啊說這一次的雲端發票活動公開透明然後怎麼樣的部分本席現在提出來只是要告訴你就是說\n438149\t446997\t我其實很痛心啊我說實在話沒有人想要看到你今天來這樣子備詢啊但是既然發生這樣的狀況短時間如果說還不能讓大家釐清的話只會讓大家覺得國人對於我們財政單位會以公信力大打折扣這才是最擔憂的地方啊報告委員我們一定會盡快的釐清而且會把釐清的結果對外說明清楚\n458666\t477015\t市長,言政以待這件事,這件事情沒有黨派色彩,因為這個其實是傷害到是我們財政部這麼一個精緻招牌,大家覺得你最支柱必較,大家覺得你對數字最敏感,大家覺得你們應該是最公正客觀透明的,結果發生這樣的狀況。謝謝,謝謝洪委員,謝謝委員,謝謝市長,謝謝洪委員。\n","txt":"理事長,這兩天財政部可能可以申請近視世界紀錄,有沒有注意到?\n有知道輿情在反映什麼事情是因為有人講說這個雲端發票的抽獎啊四人重複抽獎重複中獎以這個機率來看真的是為乎其為有網紅去用CHAP GDP還是用這些AI來去計算粉席剛剛也有去算過如果說第一輪的抽獎\n的機率跟第二輪抽獎的機率一個第一輪是五個中獎名額第二輪中獎是九個中獎名額九萬人來去參與的話那這樣子到最後得出來的結論同一人兩次中獎的機率為乎其為啊這個數字我都不會念那更何況是同一次抽獎裡面有四個人都符合這樣的一個機率那是代表什麼意思?乘四啊就是這樣的機率要乘以四次啊是不是?\n那第一時間我看到財政部有講沒有違法那再來不到12個小時又講說來上一張沒有內定造假但是要請國稅局查證那請教國人大家都很關心阿\n現在次長有沒有掌握到底是什麼狀況發生這樣的一個機率?包括委員目前我們還沒有完全掌握因為還沒有完全掌握對現在我們是國稅局已經去把那個就是承辦機關他們的那個電腦系統還有相關的資訊所以這個是委外的標案對是委外的標案對好這個委外標案多少錢?多少錢?\n總共是...這個委案因為說實在話本席昨天也很關心我請我們的同仁上網看一下財政部的絕標公告我們還發覺這一個標案還真的很難找到\n所以這個標案總共多少錢?應該是450.450萬吧450萬450萬的標案總共做時間是從6月到9月嘛 對不對這是參與抽獎的時間那真正整個抽獎結束的時間是10月25號\n450450萬有包含這些獎品、獎項以及辦理：洪孟楷那出現了這樣的一個狀況當然國人就會有質疑就覺得說為什麼會這樣子因為這個機率真的是不可思議甚至有人講說可以申請金氏世界紀錄那所以什麼時候會讓國人知道我們財政部的一個調查狀況\n目前我們已經請國稅局在積極調查中我們也希望他們盡快能夠給我們答案啦所以我們希望在短時間之內幾天之內就可以有一個你知道這個對於財政部來講我覺得對所有機關當然都不應該發生這樣的事情但是尤其是發生在財政部因為大家會同仁會認為財政國稅這都是支柱必較數字都算得非常精準\n你不能說跟國人要納稅的時候一塊錢兩塊錢都跑不掉結果突然間你們辦一個活動九萬人參與結果機率那麼低然後居然有四個人可以直接中獎那這樣子發生在財政部我覺得這對於公信力是非常大的折扣那現在你如果說講是說不是財政部問題可能是委外廠商的問題那委外廠商會不會有相關的一個連帶責任\n這當然就是要看我們那個後續追查的結果到底實際上的狀況是怎樣如果確實有相關確實是在這個整個程序過程當中或每一個環節當中有發生一些有問題的事件我們會依照相關的規定來處理相關規定有怎麼樣處理就看是不是我不知道他們契約當時的契約裡面是不是有追究責任或賠償或只是後續的一些其他的處理事件\n好,那本期再跟您再請教一下,像這個標案它也是用本預算的部分,那所以說它是不是某種程度上它也算是侵犯到人民、國人、納稅人的一個權益?\n因為我今天早上居然還看到是說我不知道說是不是財政部正式的回應啊講說這個是用雲端發票的基金來去做辦理所以跟本預算沒關係所以這樣子即便是可能有瑕疵也不影響國人的權益是這樣嗎難道基金的預算基金的預算不是人民的納稅錢或是說我們相關的一個消費來去累積嗎\n怎麼可能說縱容到這種程度好像不要沒關係辦活動沒關係換錢iPhone反正我也沒有參與啊iPhone不是我我也沒有問題啊但重點在於是說今天辦出來這樣的活動然後被國人質疑了\n我們還會這樣子輕描淡寫嗎?不會,這件事情我們非常重視基本上我們一定會嚴查整個流程還有就是整個環節到底有沒有任何的狀況有沒有問題有沒有廠商這家廠商是第一次投票還是之前就有投票過?\n有投標過也有投標過所以他也不是第一次來參與的廠商那既然如此的話會不會過去的活動可能沒有被人家踢爆也有類似的狀況因為現在PTT上面也有講還有另外一個抽獎活動也是我們財政部辦的說有特定姓氏的人30%的中獎機率\n那這樣子會不會變成是說到最後大家會看原本我們以為財政部應該是最支柱必較的原本以為覺得說我們鼓勵雲端發票很好啊少無止化啊但沒想到原來你們拿450萬公帑原來你們拿700萬公帑辦的活動變成是都有瑕疵\n報告委員剛才委員提到的另外一個標案不是我們財政部辦理的案不是財政部辦理嗎網路上有知道這個訊息是不是稅捐處對自己辦的活動也都是這個稅國稅、稅捐、財政怎麼會讓國人覺得應該是最支柱必較的\n你查一稅查兩稅都要叫大家補稅要繳稅那結果沒有想到我們花450萬辦的一個活動居然變成是要上金氏世界紀錄我說實在話你也相對無辜啊今天部長在財政委員會還沒有來嘛那你當然我要好好的了解嘛那最後來我們看一下2025年說統一發票經費大增再加開雲端500元獎項\n這是次長你前幾天的新聞嗎?這樣子?如果辦下去的話會不會讓大家質疑你的公信力可是這個是我們統一發票的中獎抽獎的活動我們那個都是公開抽獎的而且從來沒有人質疑過這個問題以前都是非常公正公開而且非常透明而且沒有重複對獎的問題次長\n市長,你在一天前,你們在一天前不到12個小時前你們也是這樣講啊說這一次的雲端發票活動公開透明然後怎麼樣的部分本席現在提出來只是要告訴你就是說\n我其實很痛心啊我說實在話沒有人想要看到你今天來這樣子備詢啊但是既然發生這樣的狀況短時間如果說還不能讓大家釐清的話只會讓大家覺得國人對於我們財政單位會以公信力大打折扣這才是最擔憂的地方啊報告委員我們一定會盡快的釐清而且會把釐清的結果對外說明清楚\n市長,言政以待這件事,這件事情沒有黨派色彩,因為這個其實是傷害到是我們財政部這麼一個精緻招牌,大家覺得你最支柱必較,大家覺得你對數字最敏感,大家覺得你們應該是最公正客觀透明的,結果發生這樣的狀況。謝謝,謝謝洪委員,謝謝委員,謝謝市長,謝謝洪委員。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.237 --> 00:07.778\n理事長,這兩天財政部可能可以申請近視世界紀錄,有沒有注意到?\n\n00:23.052 --> 00:43.588\n有知道輿情在反映什麼事情是因為有人講說這個雲端發票的抽獎啊四人重複抽獎重複中獎以這個機率來看真的是為乎其為有網紅去用CHAPGDP還是用這些AI來去計算粉席剛剛也有去算過如果說第一輪的抽獎\n\n00:45.148 --> 01:13.652\n的機率跟第二輪抽獎的機率一個第一輪是五個中獎名額第二輪中獎是九個中獎名額九萬人來去參與的話那這樣子到最後得出來的結論同一人兩次中獎的機率為乎其為啊這個數字我都不會念那更何況是同一次抽獎裡面有四個人都符合這樣的一個機率那是代表什麼意思?乘四啊就是這樣的機率要乘以四次啊是不是?\n\n01:14.622 --> 01:32.376\n那第一時間我看到財政部有講沒有違法那再來不到12個小時又講說來上一張沒有內定造假但是要請國稅局查證那請教國人大家都很關心阿\n\n01:33.612 --> 01:52.937\n現在次長有沒有掌握到底是什麼狀況發生這樣的一個機率?包括委員目前我們還沒有完全掌握因為還沒有完全掌握對現在我們是國稅局已經去把那個就是承辦機關他們的那個電腦系統還有相關的資訊所以這個是委外的標案對是委外的標案對好這個委外標案多少錢?多少錢?\n\n01:55.309 --> 02:08.002\n總共是...這個委案因為說實在話本席昨天也很關心我請我們的同仁上網看一下財政部的絕標公告我們還發覺這一個標案還真的很難找到\n\n02:09.079 --> 02:14.645\n所以這個標案總共多少錢?應該是450.450萬吧450萬450萬的標案總共做時間是從6月到9月嘛對不對這是參與抽獎的時間那真正整個抽獎結束的時間是10月25號\n\n02:28.020 --> 02:48.598\n450450萬有包含這些獎品、獎項以及辦理：洪孟楷那出現了這樣的一個狀況當然國人就會有質疑就覺得說為什麼會這樣子因為這個機率真的是不可思議甚至有人講說可以申請金氏世界紀錄那所以什麼時候會讓國人知道我們財政部的一個調查狀況\n\n02:49.537 --> 03:13.095\n目前我們已經請國稅局在積極調查中我們也希望他們盡快能夠給我們答案啦所以我們希望在短時間之內幾天之內就可以有一個你知道這個對於財政部來講我覺得對所有機關當然都不應該發生這樣的事情但是尤其是發生在財政部因為大家會同仁會認為財政國稅這都是支柱必較數字都算得非常精準\n\n03:13.795 --> 03:35.934\n你不能說跟國人要納稅的時候一塊錢兩塊錢都跑不掉結果突然間你們辦一個活動九萬人參與結果機率那麼低然後居然有四個人可以直接中獎那這樣子發生在財政部我覺得這對於公信力是非常大的折扣那現在你如果說講是說不是財政部問題可能是委外廠商的問題那委外廠商會不會有相關的一個連帶責任\n\n03:37.824 --> 04:03.204\n這當然就是要看我們那個後續追查的結果到底實際上的狀況是怎樣如果確實有相關確實是在這個整個程序過程當中或每一個環節當中有發生一些有問題的事件我們會依照相關的規定來處理相關規定有怎麼樣處理就看是不是我不知道他們契約當時的契約裡面是不是有追究責任或賠償或只是後續的一些其他的處理事件\n\n04:03.715 --> 04:14.377\n好,那本期再跟您再請教一下,像這個標案它也是用本預算的部分,那所以說它是不是某種程度上它也算是侵犯到人民、國人、納稅人的一個權益?\n\n04:15.959 --> 04:36.406\n因為我今天早上居然還看到是說我不知道說是不是財政部正式的回應啊講說這個是用雲端發票的基金來去做辦理所以跟本預算沒關係所以這樣子即便是可能有瑕疵也不影響國人的權益是這樣嗎難道基金的預算基金的預算不是人民的納稅錢或是說我們相關的一個消費來去累積嗎\n\n04:38.329 --> 04:53.430\n怎麼可能說縱容到這種程度好像不要沒關係辦活動沒關係換錢iPhone反正我也沒有參與啊iPhone不是我我也沒有問題啊但重點在於是說今天辦出來這樣的活動然後被國人質疑了\n\n04:55.004 --> 05:08.304\n我們還會這樣子輕描淡寫嗎?不會,這件事情我們非常重視基本上我們一定會嚴查整個流程還有就是整個環節到底有沒有任何的狀況有沒有問題有沒有廠商這家廠商是第一次投票還是之前就有投票過?\n\n05:09.165 --> 05:28.463\n有投標過也有投標過所以他也不是第一次來參與的廠商那既然如此的話會不會過去的活動可能沒有被人家踢爆也有類似的狀況因為現在PTT上面也有講還有另外一個抽獎活動也是我們財政部辦的說有特定姓氏的人30%的中獎機率\n\n05:31.400 --> 05:47.956\n那這樣子會不會變成是說到最後大家會看原本我們以為財政部應該是最支柱必較的原本以為覺得說我們鼓勵雲端發票很好啊少無止化啊但沒想到原來你們拿450萬公帑原來你們拿700萬公帑辦的活動變成是都有瑕疵\n\n05:49.108 --> 06:10.033\n報告委員剛才委員提到的另外一個標案不是我們財政部辦理的案不是財政部辦理嗎網路上有知道這個訊息是不是稅捐處對自己辦的活動也都是這個稅國稅、稅捐、財政怎麼會讓國人覺得應該是最支柱必較的\n\n06:11.271 --> 06:36.390\n你查一稅查兩稅都要叫大家補稅要繳稅那結果沒有想到我們花450萬辦的一個活動居然變成是要上金氏世界紀錄我說實在話你也相對無辜啊今天部長在財政委員會還沒有來嘛那你當然我要好好的了解嘛那最後來我們看一下2025年說統一發票經費大增再加開雲端500元獎項\n\n06:38.656 --> 07:00.357\n這是次長你前幾天的新聞嗎?這樣子?如果辦下去的話會不會讓大家質疑你的公信力可是這個是我們統一發票的中獎抽獎的活動我們那個都是公開抽獎的而且從來沒有人質疑過這個問題以前都是非常公正公開而且非常透明而且沒有重複對獎的問題次長\n\n07:02.699 --> 07:17.549\n市長,你在一天前,你們在一天前不到12個小時前你們也是這樣講啊說這一次的雲端發票活動公開透明然後怎麼樣的部分本席現在提出來只是要告訴你就是說\n\n07:18.149 --> 07:26.997\n我其實很痛心啊我說實在話沒有人想要看到你今天來這樣子備詢啊但是既然發生這樣的狀況短時間如果說還不能讓大家釐清的話只會讓大家覺得國人對於我們財政單位會以公信力大打折扣這才是最擔憂的地方啊報告委員我們一定會盡快的釐清而且會把釐清的結果對外說明清楚\n\n07:38.666 --> 07:57.015\n市長,言政以待這件事,這件事情沒有黨派色彩,因為這個其實是傷害到是我們財政部這麼一個精緻招牌,大家覺得你最支柱必較,大家覺得你對數字最敏感,大家覺得你們應該是最公正客觀透明的,結果發生這樣的狀況。謝謝,謝謝洪委員,謝謝委員,謝謝市長,謝謝洪委員。\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.237,"end":7.778,"text":"理事長,這兩天財政部可能可以申請近視世界紀錄,有沒有注意到?"},{"start":23.052,"end":43.588,"text":"有知道輿情在反映什麼事情是因為有人講說這個雲端發票的抽獎啊四人重複抽獎重複中獎以這個機率來看真的是為乎其為有網紅去用CHAP GDP還是用這些AI來去計算粉席剛剛也有去算過如果說第一輪的抽獎"},{"start":45.148,"end":73.652,"text":"的機率跟第二輪抽獎的機率一個第一輪是五個中獎名額第二輪中獎是九個中獎名額九萬人來去參與的話那這樣子到最後得出來的結論同一人兩次中獎的機率為乎其為啊這個數字我都不會念那更何況是同一次抽獎裡面有四個人都符合這樣的一個機率那是代表什麼意思?乘四啊就是這樣的機率要乘以四次啊是不是?"},{"start":74.622,"end":92.376,"text":"那第一時間我看到財政部有講沒有違法那再來不到12個小時又講說來上一張沒有內定造假但是要請國稅局查證那請教國人大家都很關心阿"},{"start":93.612,"end":112.937,"text":"現在次長有沒有掌握到底是什麼狀況發生這樣的一個機率?包括委員目前我們還沒有完全掌握因為還沒有完全掌握對現在我們是國稅局已經去把那個就是承辦機關他們的那個電腦系統還有相關的資訊所以這個是委外的標案對是委外的標案對好這個委外標案多少錢?多少錢?"},{"start":115.309,"end":128.002,"text":"總共是...這個委案因為說實在話本席昨天也很關心我請我們的同仁上網看一下財政部的絕標公告我們還發覺這一個標案還真的很難找到"},{"start":129.079,"end":134.645,"text":"所以這個標案總共多少錢?應該是450.450萬吧450萬450萬的標案總共做時間是從6月到9月嘛 對不對這是參與抽獎的時間那真正整個抽獎結束的時間是10月25號"},{"start":148.02,"end":168.598,"text":"450450萬有包含這些獎品、獎項以及辦理：洪孟楷那出現了這樣的一個狀況當然國人就會有質疑就覺得說為什麼會這樣子因為這個機率真的是不可思議甚至有人講說可以申請金氏世界紀錄那所以什麼時候會讓國人知道我們財政部的一個調查狀況"},{"start":169.537,"end":193.095,"text":"目前我們已經請國稅局在積極調查中我們也希望他們盡快能夠給我們答案啦所以我們希望在短時間之內幾天之內就可以有一個你知道這個對於財政部來講我覺得對所有機關當然都不應該發生這樣的事情但是尤其是發生在財政部因為大家會同仁會認為財政國稅這都是支柱必較數字都算得非常精準"},{"start":193.795,"end":215.934,"text":"你不能說跟國人要納稅的時候一塊錢兩塊錢都跑不掉結果突然間你們辦一個活動九萬人參與結果機率那麼低然後居然有四個人可以直接中獎那這樣子發生在財政部我覺得這對於公信力是非常大的折扣那現在你如果說講是說不是財政部問題可能是委外廠商的問題那委外廠商會不會有相關的一個連帶責任"},{"start":217.824,"end":243.204,"text":"這當然就是要看我們那個後續追查的結果到底實際上的狀況是怎樣如果確實有相關確實是在這個整個程序過程當中或每一個環節當中有發生一些有問題的事件我們會依照相關的規定來處理相關規定有怎麼樣處理就看是不是我不知道他們契約當時的契約裡面是不是有追究責任或賠償或只是後續的一些其他的處理事件"},{"start":243.715,"end":254.377,"text":"好,那本期再跟您再請教一下,像這個標案它也是用本預算的部分,那所以說它是不是某種程度上它也算是侵犯到人民、國人、納稅人的一個權益?"},{"start":255.959,"end":276.406,"text":"因為我今天早上居然還看到是說我不知道說是不是財政部正式的回應啊講說這個是用雲端發票的基金來去做辦理所以跟本預算沒關係所以這樣子即便是可能有瑕疵也不影響國人的權益是這樣嗎難道基金的預算基金的預算不是人民的納稅錢或是說我們相關的一個消費來去累積嗎"},{"start":278.329,"end":293.43,"text":"怎麼可能說縱容到這種程度好像不要沒關係辦活動沒關係換錢iPhone反正我也沒有參與啊iPhone不是我我也沒有問題啊但重點在於是說今天辦出來這樣的活動然後被國人質疑了"},{"start":295.004,"end":308.304,"text":"我們還會這樣子輕描淡寫嗎?不會,這件事情我們非常重視基本上我們一定會嚴查整個流程還有就是整個環節到底有沒有任何的狀況有沒有問題有沒有廠商這家廠商是第一次投票還是之前就有投票過?"},{"start":309.165,"end":328.463,"text":"有投標過也有投標過所以他也不是第一次來參與的廠商那既然如此的話會不會過去的活動可能沒有被人家踢爆也有類似的狀況因為現在PTT上面也有講還有另外一個抽獎活動也是我們財政部辦的說有特定姓氏的人30%的中獎機率"},{"start":331.4,"end":347.956,"text":"那這樣子會不會變成是說到最後大家會看原本我們以為財政部應該是最支柱必較的原本以為覺得說我們鼓勵雲端發票很好啊少無止化啊但沒想到原來你們拿450萬公帑原來你們拿700萬公帑辦的活動變成是都有瑕疵"},{"start":349.108,"end":370.033,"text":"報告委員剛才委員提到的另外一個標案不是我們財政部辦理的案不是財政部辦理嗎網路上有知道這個訊息是不是稅捐處對自己辦的活動也都是這個稅國稅、稅捐、財政怎麼會讓國人覺得應該是最支柱必較的"},{"start":371.271,"end":396.39,"text":"你查一稅查兩稅都要叫大家補稅要繳稅那結果沒有想到我們花450萬辦的一個活動居然變成是要上金氏世界紀錄我說實在話你也相對無辜啊今天部長在財政委員會還沒有來嘛那你當然我要好好的了解嘛那最後來我們看一下2025年說統一發票經費大增再加開雲端500元獎項"},{"start":398.656,"end":420.357,"text":"這是次長你前幾天的新聞嗎?這樣子?如果辦下去的話會不會讓大家質疑你的公信力可是這個是我們統一發票的中獎抽獎的活動我們那個都是公開抽獎的而且從來沒有人質疑過這個問題以前都是非常公正公開而且非常透明而且沒有重複對獎的問題次長"},{"start":422.699,"end":437.549,"text":"市長,你在一天前,你們在一天前不到12個小時前你們也是這樣講啊說這一次的雲端發票活動公開透明然後怎麼樣的部分本席現在提出來只是要告訴你就是說"},{"start":438.149,"end":446.997,"text":"我其實很痛心啊我說實在話沒有人想要看到你今天來這樣子備詢啊但是既然發生這樣的狀況短時間如果說還不能讓大家釐清的話只會讓大家覺得國人對於我們財政單位會以公信力大打折扣這才是最擔憂的地方啊報告委員我們一定會盡快的釐清而且會把釐清的結果對外說明清楚"},{"start":458.666,"end":477.015,"text":"市長,言政以待這件事,這件事情沒有黨派色彩,因為這個其實是傷害到是我們財政部這麼一個精緻招牌,大家覺得你最支柱必較,大家覺得你對數字最敏感,大家覺得你們應該是最公正客觀透明的,結果發生這樣的狀況。謝謝,謝謝洪委員,謝謝委員,謝謝市長,謝謝洪委員。"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":833,"blocks":[["洪委員孟楷：（12時8分）好，謝謝召委。麻煩請李慶華次長。"],["主席：請李次長。"],["李次長慶華：委員好。"],["洪委員孟楷：次長，這兩天財政部可能可以申請金氏世界紀錄，有沒有注意到？"],["李次長慶華：有，知道輿情在反映什麼事情。"],["洪委員孟楷：是。因為有人講說，雲端發票的抽獎有4人重複抽獎，重複中獎，以機率來看，真的是微乎其微。有網紅用ChatGPT或AI去計算，本席剛剛也有去算過第一輪抽獎的機率跟第二輪抽獎的機率，第一輪是5個中獎名額，第二輪是9個中獎名額，9萬人參與的話，到最後得出來的結論，同一人兩次中獎的機率微乎其微，這個數字我都不會唸，更何況是同一次抽獎裡面，有4個人都符合這樣的機率，那是代表什麼意思？就是這樣的機率要乘以4次，是不是？第一時間我看到財政部講沒有違法，再來不到12個小時又說沒有內定造假，但是要請國稅局查證，國人都很關心，請教現在次長有沒有掌握到底是什麼狀況，發生這樣的機率？"],["李次長慶華：報告委員，目前我們還沒有完全掌握，因為……"],["洪委員孟楷：還沒有完全掌握？"],["李次長慶華：對。現在國稅局已經去把承辦機關的電腦系統和相關……"],["洪委員孟楷：所以這個是委外的標案？"],["李次長慶華：對，是委外的標案。"],["洪委員孟楷：好，這一個委外標案多少錢？"],["李次長慶華：總共是……"],["洪委員孟楷：說實在的話，本席昨天也很關心，我請我們的同仁上網看一下財政部的決標公告，我們發覺這一個標案還真的很難找到，所以這個標案總共多少錢？"],["李次長慶華：應該是450萬。"],["洪委員孟楷：450萬？"],["李次長慶華：是。"],["洪委員孟楷：好，450萬的標案，時間是從6月到9月，對不對？"],["李次長慶華：對，6月6日到9月30日。"],["洪委員孟楷：好。"],["李次長慶華：這是參與抽獎的時間，真正整個抽獎結束的時間是10月25日。"],["洪委員孟楷：450萬有包含這一些獎品獎項？"],["李次長慶華：都包含在裡面。"],["洪委員孟楷：好，那出現了這樣的狀況，當然國人就會有質疑，就覺得為什麼會這樣子？因為這個機率真的是不可思議，甚至有人說可以申請金氏世界紀錄，什麼時候會讓國人知道財政部的調查狀況？"],["李次長慶華：目前我們已經請國稅局在積極調查中，我們也希望他們儘快能夠給我們答案，所以我們希望在短時間之內，幾天之內就可以有一個查證的結果。"],["洪委員孟楷：你知道這個對於財政部來講，我覺得所有機關當然都不應該發生這樣的事情，但是尤其是發生在財政部。"],["李次長慶華：是，了解。"],["洪委員孟楷：因為同仁會認為財政、國稅都是錙銖必較，數字都算得非常精準，你不能要跟國人納稅的時候，一塊錢、兩塊錢都跑不掉，結果突然間你們辦一個活動，9萬人參與，機率那麼低，居然有4個人可以直接中獎，發生在財政部，我覺得這對於公信力是非常大的折扣。"],["李次長慶華：了解。"],["洪委員孟楷：現在你如果說不是財政部的問題，可能是委外廠商的問題，那委外廠商會不會有相關的連帶責任？"],["李次長慶華：這個當然就是要看我們後續追查的結果，到底實際上的狀況是怎麼樣，如果確實是在整個程序過程當中或每一個環節當中有發生一些有問題的事件，我們會依照相關的規定來處理。"],["洪委員孟楷：相關規定有怎麼樣的處理？"],["李次長慶華：我不知道他們當時的契約裡面是不是有追究責任或賠償，或者是後續一些其他的處理事件。"],["洪委員孟楷：好。本席再跟您請教一下，這個標案也是用本預算的部分，所以說是不是某種程度上也算是侵犯到人民、國人、納稅人的權益？因為我今天早上居然還看到財政部回應，我不知道是不是財政部正式的回應，回應說這個是用雲端發票的基金來辦理，所以跟本預算沒關係，即便是可能有瑕疵，也不影響國人的權益，是這樣嗎？難道基金的預算不是人民的納稅錢或是相關消費去累積的嗎？怎麼可能縱容到這種程度？好像「無要無緊」，辦活動，沒關係，反正送iPhone。我沒有參與，iPhone不是我的，我也沒有問題啊，但重點在於今天辦出這樣的活動，然後被國人質疑了，我們還會這樣子輕描淡寫嗎？"],["李次長慶華：不會，這件事情我們非常重視，基本上我們一定會嚴查整個流程，還有整個環節到底有沒有有任何的狀況，有沒有問題，有沒有廠商該負的責任……"],["洪委員孟楷：這一家廠商是第一次投標，還是之前就有投標過？"],["李次長慶華：有投標過。"],["洪委員孟楷：也有投標過？"],["李次長慶華：有投標過。"],["洪委員孟楷：所以也不是第一次來參與的廠商？"],["李次長慶華：是。"],["洪委員孟楷：既然如此的話，會不會過去的活動可能沒有被人家踢爆也有類似的狀況？因為現在PTT上面也有講，還有另外一個抽獎活動，也是財政部辦的，說有特定姓氏的人有30%的中獎機率，那這樣子會不會變成是說到最後大家會看，原本我們以為財政部應該是最錙銖必較的，原本覺得鼓勵雲端發票很好，促進無紙化，但沒想到原來你們拿450萬或幾百萬公帑辦的活動，變成都有瑕疵。"],["李次長慶華：報告委員，剛才委員提到的另外一個標案，不是財政部辦理的案子。"],["洪委員孟楷：不是財政部辦理的嗎？網路上有知道這個訊息，是不是？"],["李次長慶華：是高雄市稅捐處自己辦的活動。"],["洪委員孟楷：也都是國稅、稅捐、財政相關單位，怎麼會讓國人覺得應該是最錙銖必較的單位，差一塊、兩塊都要叫大家補稅，要繳稅，結果沒有想到花450萬辦的活動，居然變成躍上金氏世界紀錄。我說實在話，你也相對無辜啊。今天部長在財政委員會還沒有來，當然我要好好地瞭解嘛。"],["李次長慶華：是。"],["洪委員孟楷：最後我們看一下，說2025年統一發票經費大增，再加開雲端發票獎金500元獎項，這是次長前幾天的新聞嘛。"],["李次長慶華：對。這個跟中獎沒有關係……"],["洪委員孟楷：如果辦下去的話，會不會讓大家質疑你的公信力？"],["李次長慶華：可是這個是統一發票的中獎、抽獎的活動，那個都是公開抽獎的，而且從來沒有人質疑過這個問題，目前都是非常公正、公開，非常透明而且沒有重複兌獎的問題。但是另外那個是委外，這個是我們自己承辦的。"],["洪委員孟楷：次長，在一天前，不到12個小時前，你們也是這樣講，說這一次的雲端發票活動公開透明。本席現在提出來，只是要告訴你，我其實很痛心，說實在話，沒有人想要看到你今天來這樣子備詢。"],["李次長慶華：對，我們也很不願意發生。"],["洪委員孟楷：但是既然發生這樣的狀況，短時間如果還不能讓大家釐清的話，只會讓國人對財政單位的公信力大打折扣，這才是最令人擔憂的地方。"],["李次長慶華：報告委員，我們一定會儘快釐清，而且會把釐清的結果對外說明清楚。"],["主席：好，請財政部釐清，檢討改進。"],["洪委員孟楷：次長，嚴正以待這件事情，這件事情沒有黨派色彩，因為這個其實是傷害到財政部這一個金字招牌，大家覺得你最錙銖必較，大家覺得你對數字最敏感，大家覺得你們應該是最公正、客觀、透明的，結果發生這樣的狀況。提醒一下，好不好？"],["李次長慶華：謝謝委員。"],["主席：好，謝謝，謝謝洪委員，謝謝次長。","現在有請陳亭妃委員。陳亭妃、陳亭妃委員不在。","有請傅崐萁委員。傅崐萁、傅崐萁委員不在。","有請楊瓊瓔委員。楊瓊瓔、楊瓊瓔委員不在。","有請蘇清泉委員。蘇清泉、蘇清泉委員不在。","有請吳春城委員。吳春城、吳春城委員不在。","有請林思銘委員。林思銘、林思銘委員不在。","有請鄭正鈐委員。鄭正鈐、鄭正鈐委員不在。","所有登記發言委員均已發言完畢，詢答結束。委員質詢時要求提供相關資料或以書面答復者，請相關機關儘速送交個別委員及本會。委員林思銘、傅崐萁所提書面質詢，均列入紀錄，刊登公報，並請相關機關以書面答復。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":198,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-36-10","speakers":["鍾佳濱","黃國昌","謝龍介","羅智強","沈發惠","吳宗憲","吳思瑤","陳俊宇","莊瑞雄","翁曉玲","賴士葆","洪孟楷","林思銘","傅崐萁"],"page_start":145,"meetingDate":["2024-10-30"],"gazette_id":"1139201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1139201_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第10次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查司法院函請審議「稅務行政事件審理法草案」案；二、審查司法院函請審議「行政法院\n組織法部分條文修正草案」案","agenda_id":"1139201_00003"}}}