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452.242, \"text\": \"並且不會成功謝謝部長那再來就是說關於這個他對盟邦或者是安全保障的做法那一定跟拜登是不太一樣的那可能風格不一樣風格不一樣那我相信基本的一個民主國家他的政策法令還有一些關係是延續的對那我必須強調說那這樣的他的政策方針不一樣的話我們要相應的去調整嘛比方說他可能\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"並\"}, {\"word\": \"且\", \"start\": 425.649, \"end\": 425.949, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 425.949, \"end\": 426.17, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"成\", \"start\": 426.17, \"end\": 426.33, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"功\", \"start\": 426.33, \"end\": 427.21, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 427.21, \"end\": 427.65, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 427.65, \"end\": 427.91, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 427.91, \"end\": 428.131, \"score\": 0.97}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 428.131, \"end\": 428.271, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 428.271, \"end\": 429.151, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"於\", 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831.402, \"end\": 831.582, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"起\", \"start\": 831.582, \"end\": 831.762, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 831.762, \"end\": 831.842, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 831.842, \"end\": 831.882, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 831.882, \"end\": 832.223, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 832.223, \"end\": 832.503, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 832.503, \"end\": 832.523, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"長\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,604 --> 00:00:01,067\n您好我們請部長請您部長\n\n2\n00:00:13,220 --> 00:00:30,922\n部長好委員好部長這一次的總統大選之後我看到我們很多部門像昨天我在諮詢經濟部長的時候我問他說那台美關係還有會不會有變化那他是說不會有變化那就是堅若磐石跟過去一樣部長你覺得這樣的說法\n\n3\n00:00:33,180 --> 00:00:59,477\n其實民主國家選舉競爭跟政黨人力是常態也都有變與不變那有一些不管是法律或政策會延續但是也有一些人士可能因為新的政見主張那基本上台美關係除了總統的選舉以外其實國會是一個觀察指標我跟委員也可以報告一下因為您很關心在國會友台的力量\n\n4\n00:01:00,698 --> 00:01:10,069\n這部分我們到目前為止以這個參議院這一次我們有30幾位我們友台小組的成員9位是這一次面臨的改選目前知道的有6位已經公佈的都是連任所以相當穩定那在眾議院方面\n\n5\n00:01:20,701 --> 00:01:26,847\n四位共同主席也都順利連任所以更為增強對台灣在國會上面的支持的力量那部長講得很好有變與不變所以當我們說這個完全沒有改變這是錯誤的訊息\n\n6\n00:01:40,126 --> 00:02:01,897\n我們美台之間的夥伴關係不會改變但是美國的領導層的變化跟他們的未來任用的內閣當然會有不同的政治的意識形態當然有不同的外交政策只是說我們要怎麼樣因應這樣的情勢這才是重點首先要了解狀況不能說全部都一樣堅若磐石\n\n7\n00:02:02,757 --> 00:02:19,509\n但是卻沒有因應說川普政權接下來的這種貿易上面經濟上面外交上面安全保障上面的政策的改變所以我必須要來特別來強調我們要怎麼樣把我們的論述完整化才不會被\n\n8\n00:02:20,834 --> 00:02:39,849\n中國方面可能會用以美論來趁機來介入這就是重點比方說我想要請教一下在經貿的部分川普是非常注重要把企業留在美國要把工作機會留在美國要把科技業留在美國那甚至有可能會對其他國家我就\n\n9\n00:02:40,549 --> 00:02:47,390\n確實我們要了解對方現在新政府的政策方向比如說像投資美國創造就業機會那這個是我們正在做而且很明顯可以看到包括台積電還有各方面的投資\n\n10\n00:03:09,316 --> 00:03:29,994\n另外一個其實我們現在在推的經濟外交在美國方面就是川普總統我想他任內啟動的包括乾淨網路就是這一些都是去紅色供應鏈包括電信跟5G以及EPPD這最重要\n\n11\n00:03:30,555 --> 00:03:30,955\n首先我們是可以不斷地跟他們強調\n\n12\n00:03:50,299 --> 00:04:15,555\n在台灣生產這個高科技的晶片是有效率的經濟有效率上面所以要說服或者是用我們的論述比如說強調鞏固台灣對美國的經濟整體的發展是更有效率那第二部分有人會問說那我們的這個台灣的這個晶片會不會受到影響那我們當然會說會有影響可是他的影響也可以是正面的台灣不一定有這麼多的土地來去建設廠房\n\n13\n00:04:16,636 --> 00:04:36,625\n分散一部分的投資在美國把最高製程的留在台灣這確實是也符合台美之間的利益再來就是會有一些論述說這樣子這個美國不斷的要求台灣來增加我們的這個國防預算這也符合台灣利益跟美國利益啊當我們現在粗糙美國的時候代表說台灣跟美國之間的貿易是增長的\n\n14\n00:04:37,325 --> 00:04:58,185\n這就是經濟上面的互助既榮邦那又能夠把我們的貿易往上一層但是滿足我自己的國防需求是以符合台灣的利益啊所以哪有什麼有一些人會說什麼繳保護費什麼時候鞏固自己的國家的國防變成繳保護費這種說法我們必須第一時間就要把這個錯誤的論述把它打破是\n\n15\n00:04:58,826 --> 00:05:09,919\n除此之外我們不僅跟美國的貿易是這8年來是最好的狀況之外同時我們有多出來的這些如果要確保說貿易是平衡的貿易是對等的\n\n16\n00:05:10,902 --> 00:05:38,112\n跟美國來去採購最先進的防衛的系統防衛的服務這有什麼不對這當然是可以增加我國的防衛能量有人說川普說要提到10%但是我們另外一方面也要跟他們強調一點就是說我們當然願意緩慢的把我們的應該說是在暗部就班的把我們國防預算提高但是在暗部就班的把國防預算提高的時候也要確保美國的生產量能夠跟上我國的採購需求\n\n17\n00:05:38,892 --> 00:05:39,112\n李卓人議員\n\n18\n00:06:09,853 --> 00:06:25,260\n讓美國再次偉大不能沒有台灣如果沒有了台灣跟美國的這種夥伴關係那美國也很難再次偉大因為像台積電這樣的投資他是一個很國際化的公司外資佔了將近七成\n\n19\n00:06:28,502 --> 00:06:43,961\n所以我們要了解說在美國的投資這個是互惠的那因為他本身也要發展晶片產業所以有人講說是不是什麼台灣plusone要去把台灣的供應鏈從台灣移出其實我們從另外一個角度來講是台灣plusn\n\n20\n00:06:45,883 --> 00:07:02,828\n這台灣的全球布局隨著這個供應鏈的重組我們更有韌性這個因應未來的國際政經的變化所以我覺得美台關係沒有必要去分化我想中共在這方面不斷在操作所謂的以美論我認為是錯的而且沒有必要\n\n21\n00:07:05,649 --> 00:07:32,242\n並且不會成功謝謝部長那再來就是說關於這個他對盟邦或者是安全保障的做法那一定跟拜登是不太一樣的那可能風格不一樣風格不一樣那我相信基本的一個民主國家他的政策法令還有一些關係是延續的對那我必須強調說那這樣的他的政策方針不一樣的話我們要相應的去調整嘛比方說他可能\n\n22\n00:07:32,842 --> 00:07:36,325\n印太戰略本來就是一個區域乃至全球的戰略它是超越雙邊的同樣在第一島鏈我想川普總統就是\n\n23\n00:07:59,346 --> 00:07:59,506\n：陳冠廷\n\n24\n00:08:17,757 --> 00:08:39,629\n我們可能要立刻主動接洽多邊跟我們國家比較有利害相關的國家其實我跟委員報告因為美國選舉其實像包括在歐洲我們理念相近的國家他們也都開始在調整這個是必然的對這個時候我們可能就是要更加注重地緣政治那可能\n\n25\n00:08:40,529 --> 00:08:57,790\n部長上台之後價值外交的這個他的順位他也必須要相應調整對於川普來講所謂的價值外交我們要這樣子的跟他的這樣的接觸的方式跟縮帖也一定要調整因為對他來講\n\n26\n00:08:59,110 --> 00:09:00,051\n美國大選政策明顯不同\n\n27\n00:09:15,230 --> 00:09:42,492\n針對這個不同當然要調整我們的所有縮帖所以我當然是認同價值外交我當然是覺得說這個我們台灣跟許多歐洲的民主國家一樣子在倡導這個民主自由人權但是現在的美國他們重視的是國家利益那這個部分我們也必須因應新的政府來做出新的調整我想這個是非常重要但第二點我們也要擔心的齁包含這一個\n\n28\n00:09:43,713 --> 00:10:07,481\n馬斯克在這幾天我記得是新鏈的部分可能一些這個生產鏈都說因為地緣政治的挑戰可能會轉移我想這方面也必須要找到相應的人員來去說服說在台灣生產是有效率的在台灣生產是符合美國利益跟美國戰略的這些鞏固台灣的這些做法\n\n29\n00:10:08,081 --> 00:10:32,749\n我們也必須要跟他們一一的來去了解甚至他們是在商言商所以針對一些特殊的這些租稅或者是相關的這些經濟的措施可能都變成必須要我們要連串去思考就不可以說這是經濟部的事情外交部就變成要統合這一切就包含今天如何加入CPTPP在經濟委員會外交部也有書面報告所以大家要串起來因為現在\n\n30\n00:10:34,534 --> 00:10:39,299\n不比這過去四年完全不同的方針施政的方式必須要因應\n\n31\n00:10:40,492 --> 00:11:05,562\n我是覺得提升臺灣的一個就是競爭的優勢那技術深耕臺灣產線佈局全球其實供應的重組有它的趨勢那臺灣在這裡面怎麼應用這個趨勢來佈局所以並不是說好像供應要從臺灣移出其實這個也是一個我們國力的擴張嘛延伸嘛所以我想說剛剛講到比如說以這個新鏈它的這個供應鏈那臺灣的優勢\n\n32\n00:11:08,123 --> 00:11:10,345\n時間已經到,最後再補充一點就是我們剛剛提到的晶片相關的法案我們希望說我們在駐美的辦事處來去強調\n\n33\n00:11:32,761 --> 00:11:32,842\n陳冠廷\n\n34\n00:11:54,443 --> 00:11:58,285\n以晶片與半導體產業來講,臺美關係是分工合作,是互補的關係,所以它不會傷害自己,因為臺灣的重要性已經跟美國的晶片發展是融為一體。\n\n35\n00:12:23,135 --> 00:12:44,261\n他佈局什麼樣的策略我想業者也有相當的準備跟意義因為主要我們會談這個的我們的擔憂是因為之前的共和黨的眾議院議長有提到所以我們必須在他提到之後立刻要有我們的縮帖立刻去反映這是我們執行的目的他說清楚有些誤解的地方確實要呈現正確的資訊給對方參考有這個問題所以我們要解釋說這不是問題\n\n36\n00:12:49,662 --> 00:12:49,702\n臺灣每賺一塊錢\n\n37\n00:13:04,540 --> 00:13:04,740\n這部長你剛才\n\n38\n00:13:28,813 --> 00:13:52,523\n信守連台就把這些數字都已經有講到那如果方便的話相關的縮帖也給我們特別是針對晶片的我們希望說我們國會議員如果去訪美的時候必須有有所本現在已經有所本了有所準備我請那個港外議員我們同格拿給委員跟其他國家的國會議員交流的時候必須要有立刻的方式去把這樣的輿論來把它做起來好不好好謝謝部長\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n604\t1067\t您好 我們請部長請您部長\n13220\t30922\t部長好委員好部長這一次的總統大選之後我看到我們很多部門像昨天我在諮詢經濟部長的時候我問他說那台美關係還有會不會有變化那他是說不會有變化那就是堅若磐石跟過去一樣部長你覺得這樣的說法\n33180\t59477\t其實民主國家選舉競爭跟政黨人力是常態也都有變與不變那有一些不管是法律或政策會延續但是也有一些人士可能因為新的政見主張那基本上台美關係除了總統的選舉以外其實國會是一個觀察指標我跟委員也可以報告一下因為您很關心在國會友台的力量\n60698\t70069\t這部分我們到目前為止以這個參議院這一次我們有30幾位我們友台小組的成員9位是這一次面臨的改選目前知道的有6位已經公佈的都是連任所以相當穩定那在眾議院方面\n80701\t86847\t四位共同主席也都順利連任所以更為增強對台灣在國會上面的支持的力量那部長講得很好有變與不變所以當我們說這個完全沒有改變這是錯誤的訊息\n100126\t121897\t我們美台之間的夥伴關係不會改變但是美國的領導層的變化跟他們的未來任用的內閣當然會有不同的政治的意識形態當然有不同的外交政策只是說我們要怎麼樣因應這樣的情勢這才是重點首先要了解狀況不能說全部都一樣堅若磐石\n122757\t139509\t但是卻沒有因應說川普政權接下來的這種貿易上面經濟上面外交上面安全保障上面的政策的改變所以我必須要來特別來強調我們要怎麼樣把我們的論述完整化才不會被\n140834\t159849\t中國方面可能會用以美論來趁機來介入這就是重點比方說我想要請教一下在經貿的部分川普是非常注重要把企業留在美國要把工作機會留在美國要把科技業留在美國那甚至有可能會對其他國家我就\n160549\t167390\t確實我們要了解對方現在新政府的政策方向比如說像投資美國創造就業機會那這個是我們正在做而且很明顯可以看到包括台積電還有各方面的投資\n189316\t209994\t另外一個其實我們現在在推的經濟外交在美國方面就是川普總統我想他任內啟動的包括乾淨網路就是這一些都是去紅色供應鏈包括電信跟5G以及EPPD這最重要\n210555\t210955\t首先我們是可以不斷地跟他們強調\n230299\t255555\t在台灣生產這個高科技的晶片是有效率的經濟有效率上面所以要說服或者是用我們的論述比如說強調鞏固台灣對美國的經濟整體的發展是更有效率那第二部分有人會問說那我們的這個台灣的這個晶片會不會受到影響那我們當然會說會有影響可是他的影響也可以是正面的台灣不一定有這麼多的土地來去建設廠房\n256636\t276625\t分散一部分的投資在美國把最高製程的留在台灣這確實是也符合台美之間的利益再來就是會有一些論述說這樣子這個美國不斷的要求台灣來增加我們的這個國防預算這也符合台灣利益跟美國利益啊當我們現在粗糙美國的時候代表說台灣跟美國之間的貿易是增長的\n277325\t298185\t這就是經濟上面的互助既榮邦那又能夠把我們的貿易往上一層但是滿足我自己的國防需求是以符合台灣的利益啊所以哪有什麼有一些人會說什麼繳保護費什麼時候鞏固自己的國家的國防變成繳保護費這種說法我們必須第一時間就要把這個錯誤的論述把它打破是\n298826\t309919\t除此之外我們不僅跟美國的貿易是這8年來是最好的狀況之外同時我們有多出來的這些如果要確保說貿易是平衡的貿易是對等的\n310902\t338112\t跟美國來去採購最先進的防衛的系統防衛的服務這有什麼不對這當然是可以增加我國的防衛能量有人說川普說要提到10%但是我們另外一方面也要跟他們強調一點就是說我們當然願意緩慢的把我們的應該說是在暗部就班的把我們國防預算提高但是在暗部就班的把國防預算提高的時候也要確保美國的生產量能夠跟上我國的採購需求\n338892\t339112\t李卓人議員\n369853\t385260\t讓美國再次偉大不能沒有台灣如果沒有了台灣跟美國的這種夥伴關係那美國也很難再次偉大因為像台積電這樣的投資他是一個很國際化的公司外資佔了將近七成\n388502\t403961\t所以我們要了解說在美國的投資這個是互惠的那因為他本身也要發展晶片產業所以有人講說是不是什麼台灣plusone要去把台灣的供應鏈從台灣移出其實我們從另外一個角度來講是台灣plusn\n405883\t422828\t這台灣的全球布局隨著這個供應鏈的重組我們更有韌性這個因應未來的國際政經的變化所以我覺得美台關係沒有必要去分化我想中共在這方面不斷在操作所謂的以美論我認為是錯的而且沒有必要\n425649\t452242\t並且不會成功謝謝部長那再來就是說關於這個他對盟邦或者是安全保障的做法那一定跟拜登是不太一樣的那可能風格不一樣風格不一樣那我相信基本的一個民主國家他的政策法令還有一些關係是延續的對那我必須強調說那這樣的他的政策方針不一樣的話我們要相應的去調整嘛比方說他可能\n452842\t456325\t印太戰略本來就是一個區域乃至全球的戰略它是超越雙邊的同樣在第一島鏈我想川普總統就是\n479346\t479506\t：陳冠廷\n497757\t519629\t我們可能要立刻主動接洽多邊跟我們國家比較有利害相關的國家其實我跟委員報告因為美國選舉其實像包括在歐洲我們理念相近的國家他們也都開始在調整這個是必然的對 這個時候我們可能就是要更加注重地緣政治那可能\n520529\t537790\t部長上台之後價值外交的這個他的順位他也必須要相應調整對於川普來講所謂的價值外交我們要這樣子的跟他的這樣的接觸的方式跟縮帖也一定要調整因為對他來講\n539110\t540051\t美國大選政策明顯不同\n555230\t582492\t針對這個不同當然要調整我們的所有縮帖所以我當然是認同價值外交我當然是覺得說這個我們台灣跟許多歐洲的民主國家一樣子在倡導這個民主自由人權但是現在的美國他們重視的是國家利益那這個部分我們也必須因應新的政府來做出新的調整我想這個是非常重要但第二點我們也要擔心的齁包含這一個\n583713\t607481\t馬斯克在這幾天我記得是新鏈的部分可能一些這個生產鏈都說因為地緣政治的挑戰可能會轉移我想這方面也必須要找到相應的人員來去說服說在台灣生產是有效率的在台灣生產是符合美國利益跟美國戰略的這些鞏固台灣的這些做法\n608081\t632749\t我們也必須要跟他們一一的來去了解甚至他們是在商言商所以針對一些特殊的這些租稅或者是相關的這些經濟的措施可能都變成必須要我們要連串去思考就不可以說這是經濟部的事情外交部就變成要統合這一切就包含今天如何加入CPTPP在經濟委員會外交部也有書面報告所以大家要串起來因為現在\n634534\t639299\t不比這過去四年完全不同的方針施政的方式必須要因應\n640492\t665562\t我是覺得提升臺灣的一個就是競爭的優勢那技術深耕臺灣產線佈局全球其實供應的重組有它的趨勢那臺灣在這裡面怎麼應用這個趨勢來佈局所以並不是說好像供應要從臺灣移出其實這個也是一個我們國力的擴張嘛延伸嘛所以我想說剛剛講到比如說以這個新鏈它的這個供應鏈那臺灣的優勢\n668123\t670345\t時間已經到,最後再補充一點就是我們剛剛提到的晶片相關的法案我們希望說我們在駐美的辦事處來去強調\n692761\t692842\t陳冠廷\n714443\t718285\t以晶片與半導體產業來講,臺美關係是分工合作,是互補的關係,所以它不會傷害自己,因為臺灣的重要性已經跟美國的晶片發展是融為一體。\n743135\t764261\t他佈局什麼樣的策略我想業者也有相當的準備跟意義因為主要我們會談這個的我們的擔憂是因為之前的共和黨的眾議院議長有提到所以我們必須在他提到之後立刻要有我們的縮帖立刻去反映這是我們執行的目的他說清楚有些誤解的地方確實要呈現正確的資訊給對方參考有這個問題所以我們要解釋說這不是問題\n769662\t769702\t臺灣每賺一塊錢\n784540\t784740\t這部長你剛才\n808813\t832523\t信守連台就把這些數字都已經有講到那如果方便的話相關的縮帖也給我們特別是針對晶片的我們希望說我們國會議員如果去訪美的時候必須有有所本現在已經有所本了有所準備我請那個港外議員我們同格拿給委員跟其他國家的國會議員交流的時候必須要有立刻的方式去把這樣的輿論來把它做起來好不好好 謝謝部長\n","txt":"您好 我們請部長請您部長\n部長好委員好部長這一次的總統大選之後我看到我們很多部門像昨天我在諮詢經濟部長的時候我問他說那台美關係還有會不會有變化那他是說不會有變化那就是堅若磐石跟過去一樣部長你覺得這樣的說法\n其實民主國家選舉競爭跟政黨人力是常態也都有變與不變那有一些不管是法律或政策會延續但是也有一些人士可能因為新的政見主張那基本上台美關係除了總統的選舉以外其實國會是一個觀察指標我跟委員也可以報告一下因為您很關心在國會友台的力量\n這部分我們到目前為止以這個參議院這一次我們有30幾位我們友台小組的成員9位是這一次面臨的改選目前知道的有6位已經公佈的都是連任所以相當穩定那在眾議院方面\n四位共同主席也都順利連任所以更為增強對台灣在國會上面的支持的力量那部長講得很好有變與不變所以當我們說這個完全沒有改變這是錯誤的訊息\n我們美台之間的夥伴關係不會改變但是美國的領導層的變化跟他們的未來任用的內閣當然會有不同的政治的意識形態當然有不同的外交政策只是說我們要怎麼樣因應這樣的情勢這才是重點首先要了解狀況不能說全部都一樣堅若磐石\n但是卻沒有因應說川普政權接下來的這種貿易上面經濟上面外交上面安全保障上面的政策的改變所以我必須要來特別來強調我們要怎麼樣把我們的論述完整化才不會被\n中國方面可能會用以美論來趁機來介入這就是重點比方說我想要請教一下在經貿的部分川普是非常注重要把企業留在美國要把工作機會留在美國要把科技業留在美國那甚至有可能會對其他國家我就\n確實我們要了解對方現在新政府的政策方向比如說像投資美國創造就業機會那這個是我們正在做而且很明顯可以看到包括台積電還有各方面的投資\n另外一個其實我們現在在推的經濟外交在美國方面就是川普總統我想他任內啟動的包括乾淨網路就是這一些都是去紅色供應鏈包括電信跟5G以及EPPD這最重要\n首先我們是可以不斷地跟他們強調\n在台灣生產這個高科技的晶片是有效率的經濟有效率上面所以要說服或者是用我們的論述比如說強調鞏固台灣對美國的經濟整體的發展是更有效率那第二部分有人會問說那我們的這個台灣的這個晶片會不會受到影響那我們當然會說會有影響可是他的影響也可以是正面的台灣不一定有這麼多的土地來去建設廠房\n分散一部分的投資在美國把最高製程的留在台灣這確實是也符合台美之間的利益再來就是會有一些論述說這樣子這個美國不斷的要求台灣來增加我們的這個國防預算這也符合台灣利益跟美國利益啊當我們現在粗糙美國的時候代表說台灣跟美國之間的貿易是增長的\n這就是經濟上面的互助既榮邦那又能夠把我們的貿易往上一層但是滿足我自己的國防需求是以符合台灣的利益啊所以哪有什麼有一些人會說什麼繳保護費什麼時候鞏固自己的國家的國防變成繳保護費這種說法我們必須第一時間就要把這個錯誤的論述把它打破是\n除此之外我們不僅跟美國的貿易是這8年來是最好的狀況之外同時我們有多出來的這些如果要確保說貿易是平衡的貿易是對等的\n跟美國來去採購最先進的防衛的系統防衛的服務這有什麼不對這當然是可以增加我國的防衛能量有人說川普說要提到10%但是我們另外一方面也要跟他們強調一點就是說我們當然願意緩慢的把我們的應該說是在暗部就班的把我們國防預算提高但是在暗部就班的把國防預算提高的時候也要確保美國的生產量能夠跟上我國的採購需求\n李卓人議員\n讓美國再次偉大不能沒有台灣如果沒有了台灣跟美國的這種夥伴關係那美國也很難再次偉大因為像台積電這樣的投資他是一個很國際化的公司外資佔了將近七成\n所以我們要了解說在美國的投資這個是互惠的那因為他本身也要發展晶片產業所以有人講說是不是什麼台灣plusone要去把台灣的供應鏈從台灣移出其實我們從另外一個角度來講是台灣plusn\n這台灣的全球布局隨著這個供應鏈的重組我們更有韌性這個因應未來的國際政經的變化所以我覺得美台關係沒有必要去分化我想中共在這方面不斷在操作所謂的以美論我認為是錯的而且沒有必要\n並且不會成功謝謝部長那再來就是說關於這個他對盟邦或者是安全保障的做法那一定跟拜登是不太一樣的那可能風格不一樣風格不一樣那我相信基本的一個民主國家他的政策法令還有一些關係是延續的對那我必須強調說那這樣的他的政策方針不一樣的話我們要相應的去調整嘛比方說他可能\n印太戰略本來就是一個區域乃至全球的戰略它是超越雙邊的同樣在第一島鏈我想川普總統就是\n：陳冠廷\n我們可能要立刻主動接洽多邊跟我們國家比較有利害相關的國家其實我跟委員報告因為美國選舉其實像包括在歐洲我們理念相近的國家他們也都開始在調整這個是必然的對 這個時候我們可能就是要更加注重地緣政治那可能\n部長上台之後價值外交的這個他的順位他也必須要相應調整對於川普來講所謂的價值外交我們要這樣子的跟他的這樣的接觸的方式跟縮帖也一定要調整因為對他來講\n美國大選政策明顯不同\n針對這個不同當然要調整我們的所有縮帖所以我當然是認同價值外交我當然是覺得說這個我們台灣跟許多歐洲的民主國家一樣子在倡導這個民主自由人權但是現在的美國他們重視的是國家利益那這個部分我們也必須因應新的政府來做出新的調整我想這個是非常重要但第二點我們也要擔心的齁包含這一個\n馬斯克在這幾天我記得是新鏈的部分可能一些這個生產鏈都說因為地緣政治的挑戰可能會轉移我想這方面也必須要找到相應的人員來去說服說在台灣生產是有效率的在台灣生產是符合美國利益跟美國戰略的這些鞏固台灣的這些做法\n我們也必須要跟他們一一的來去了解甚至他們是在商言商所以針對一些特殊的這些租稅或者是相關的這些經濟的措施可能都變成必須要我們要連串去思考就不可以說這是經濟部的事情外交部就變成要統合這一切就包含今天如何加入CPTPP在經濟委員會外交部也有書面報告所以大家要串起來因為現在\n不比這過去四年完全不同的方針施政的方式必須要因應\n我是覺得提升臺灣的一個就是競爭的優勢那技術深耕臺灣產線佈局全球其實供應的重組有它的趨勢那臺灣在這裡面怎麼應用這個趨勢來佈局所以並不是說好像供應要從臺灣移出其實這個也是一個我們國力的擴張嘛延伸嘛所以我想說剛剛講到比如說以這個新鏈它的這個供應鏈那臺灣的優勢\n時間已經到,最後再補充一點就是我們剛剛提到的晶片相關的法案我們希望說我們在駐美的辦事處來去強調\n陳冠廷\n以晶片與半導體產業來講,臺美關係是分工合作,是互補的關係,所以它不會傷害自己,因為臺灣的重要性已經跟美國的晶片發展是融為一體。\n他佈局什麼樣的策略我想業者也有相當的準備跟意義因為主要我們會談這個的我們的擔憂是因為之前的共和黨的眾議院議長有提到所以我們必須在他提到之後立刻要有我們的縮帖立刻去反映這是我們執行的目的他說清楚有些誤解的地方確實要呈現正確的資訊給對方參考有這個問題所以我們要解釋說這不是問題\n臺灣每賺一塊錢\n這部長你剛才\n信守連台就把這些數字都已經有講到那如果方便的話相關的縮帖也給我們特別是針對晶片的我們希望說我們國會議員如果去訪美的時候必須有有所本現在已經有所本了有所準備我請那個港外議員我們同格拿給委員跟其他國家的國會議員交流的時候必須要有立刻的方式去把這樣的輿論來把它做起來好不好好 謝謝部長\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.604 --> 00:01.067\n您好我們請部長請您部長\n\n00:13.220 --> 00:30.922\n部長好委員好部長這一次的總統大選之後我看到我們很多部門像昨天我在諮詢經濟部長的時候我問他說那台美關係還有會不會有變化那他是說不會有變化那就是堅若磐石跟過去一樣部長你覺得這樣的說法\n\n00:33.180 --> 00:59.477\n其實民主國家選舉競爭跟政黨人力是常態也都有變與不變那有一些不管是法律或政策會延續但是也有一些人士可能因為新的政見主張那基本上台美關係除了總統的選舉以外其實國會是一個觀察指標我跟委員也可以報告一下因為您很關心在國會友台的力量\n\n01:00.698 --> 01:10.069\n這部分我們到目前為止以這個參議院這一次我們有30幾位我們友台小組的成員9位是這一次面臨的改選目前知道的有6位已經公佈的都是連任所以相當穩定那在眾議院方面\n\n01:20.701 --> 01:26.847\n四位共同主席也都順利連任所以更為增強對台灣在國會上面的支持的力量那部長講得很好有變與不變所以當我們說這個完全沒有改變這是錯誤的訊息\n\n01:40.126 --> 02:01.897\n我們美台之間的夥伴關係不會改變但是美國的領導層的變化跟他們的未來任用的內閣當然會有不同的政治的意識形態當然有不同的外交政策只是說我們要怎麼樣因應這樣的情勢這才是重點首先要了解狀況不能說全部都一樣堅若磐石\n\n02:02.757 --> 02:19.509\n但是卻沒有因應說川普政權接下來的這種貿易上面經濟上面外交上面安全保障上面的政策的改變所以我必須要來特別來強調我們要怎麼樣把我們的論述完整化才不會被\n\n02:20.834 --> 02:39.849\n中國方面可能會用以美論來趁機來介入這就是重點比方說我想要請教一下在經貿的部分川普是非常注重要把企業留在美國要把工作機會留在美國要把科技業留在美國那甚至有可能會對其他國家我就\n\n02:40.549 --> 02:47.390\n確實我們要了解對方現在新政府的政策方向比如說像投資美國創造就業機會那這個是我們正在做而且很明顯可以看到包括台積電還有各方面的投資\n\n03:09.316 --> 03:29.994\n另外一個其實我們現在在推的經濟外交在美國方面就是川普總統我想他任內啟動的包括乾淨網路就是這一些都是去紅色供應鏈包括電信跟5G以及EPPD這最重要\n\n03:30.555 --> 03:30.955\n首先我們是可以不斷地跟他們強調\n\n03:50.299 --> 04:15.555\n在台灣生產這個高科技的晶片是有效率的經濟有效率上面所以要說服或者是用我們的論述比如說強調鞏固台灣對美國的經濟整體的發展是更有效率那第二部分有人會問說那我們的這個台灣的這個晶片會不會受到影響那我們當然會說會有影響可是他的影響也可以是正面的台灣不一定有這麼多的土地來去建設廠房\n\n04:16.636 --> 04:36.625\n分散一部分的投資在美國把最高製程的留在台灣這確實是也符合台美之間的利益再來就是會有一些論述說這樣子這個美國不斷的要求台灣來增加我們的這個國防預算這也符合台灣利益跟美國利益啊當我們現在粗糙美國的時候代表說台灣跟美國之間的貿易是增長的\n\n04:37.325 --> 04:58.185\n這就是經濟上面的互助既榮邦那又能夠把我們的貿易往上一層但是滿足我自己的國防需求是以符合台灣的利益啊所以哪有什麼有一些人會說什麼繳保護費什麼時候鞏固自己的國家的國防變成繳保護費這種說法我們必須第一時間就要把這個錯誤的論述把它打破是\n\n04:58.826 --> 05:09.919\n除此之外我們不僅跟美國的貿易是這8年來是最好的狀況之外同時我們有多出來的這些如果要確保說貿易是平衡的貿易是對等的\n\n05:10.902 --> 05:38.112\n跟美國來去採購最先進的防衛的系統防衛的服務這有什麼不對這當然是可以增加我國的防衛能量有人說川普說要提到10%但是我們另外一方面也要跟他們強調一點就是說我們當然願意緩慢的把我們的應該說是在暗部就班的把我們國防預算提高但是在暗部就班的把國防預算提高的時候也要確保美國的生產量能夠跟上我國的採購需求\n\n05:38.892 --> 05:39.112\n李卓人議員\n\n06:09.853 --> 06:25.260\n讓美國再次偉大不能沒有台灣如果沒有了台灣跟美國的這種夥伴關係那美國也很難再次偉大因為像台積電這樣的投資他是一個很國際化的公司外資佔了將近七成\n\n06:28.502 --> 06:43.961\n所以我們要了解說在美國的投資這個是互惠的那因為他本身也要發展晶片產業所以有人講說是不是什麼台灣plusone要去把台灣的供應鏈從台灣移出其實我們從另外一個角度來講是台灣plusn\n\n06:45.883 --> 07:02.828\n這台灣的全球布局隨著這個供應鏈的重組我們更有韌性這個因應未來的國際政經的變化所以我覺得美台關係沒有必要去分化我想中共在這方面不斷在操作所謂的以美論我認為是錯的而且沒有必要\n\n07:05.649 --> 07:32.242\n並且不會成功謝謝部長那再來就是說關於這個他對盟邦或者是安全保障的做法那一定跟拜登是不太一樣的那可能風格不一樣風格不一樣那我相信基本的一個民主國家他的政策法令還有一些關係是延續的對那我必須強調說那這樣的他的政策方針不一樣的話我們要相應的去調整嘛比方說他可能\n\n07:32.842 --> 07:36.325\n印太戰略本來就是一個區域乃至全球的戰略它是超越雙邊的同樣在第一島鏈我想川普總統就是\n\n07:59.346 --> 07:59.506\n：陳冠廷\n\n08:17.757 --> 08:39.629\n我們可能要立刻主動接洽多邊跟我們國家比較有利害相關的國家其實我跟委員報告因為美國選舉其實像包括在歐洲我們理念相近的國家他們也都開始在調整這個是必然的對這個時候我們可能就是要更加注重地緣政治那可能\n\n08:40.529 --> 08:57.790\n部長上台之後價值外交的這個他的順位他也必須要相應調整對於川普來講所謂的價值外交我們要這樣子的跟他的這樣的接觸的方式跟縮帖也一定要調整因為對他來講\n\n08:59.110 --> 09:00.051\n美國大選政策明顯不同\n\n09:15.230 --> 09:42.492\n針對這個不同當然要調整我們的所有縮帖所以我當然是認同價值外交我當然是覺得說這個我們台灣跟許多歐洲的民主國家一樣子在倡導這個民主自由人權但是現在的美國他們重視的是國家利益那這個部分我們也必須因應新的政府來做出新的調整我想這個是非常重要但第二點我們也要擔心的齁包含這一個\n\n09:43.713 --> 10:07.481\n馬斯克在這幾天我記得是新鏈的部分可能一些這個生產鏈都說因為地緣政治的挑戰可能會轉移我想這方面也必須要找到相應的人員來去說服說在台灣生產是有效率的在台灣生產是符合美國利益跟美國戰略的這些鞏固台灣的這些做法\n\n10:08.081 --> 10:32.749\n我們也必須要跟他們一一的來去了解甚至他們是在商言商所以針對一些特殊的這些租稅或者是相關的這些經濟的措施可能都變成必須要我們要連串去思考就不可以說這是經濟部的事情外交部就變成要統合這一切就包含今天如何加入CPTPP在經濟委員會外交部也有書面報告所以大家要串起來因為現在\n\n10:34.534 --> 10:39.299\n不比這過去四年完全不同的方針施政的方式必須要因應\n\n10:40.492 --> 11:05.562\n我是覺得提升臺灣的一個就是競爭的優勢那技術深耕臺灣產線佈局全球其實供應的重組有它的趨勢那臺灣在這裡面怎麼應用這個趨勢來佈局所以並不是說好像供應要從臺灣移出其實這個也是一個我們國力的擴張嘛延伸嘛所以我想說剛剛講到比如說以這個新鏈它的這個供應鏈那臺灣的優勢\n\n11:08.123 --> 11:10.345\n時間已經到,最後再補充一點就是我們剛剛提到的晶片相關的法案我們希望說我們在駐美的辦事處來去強調\n\n11:32.761 --> 11:32.842\n陳冠廷\n\n11:54.443 --> 11:58.285\n以晶片與半導體產業來講,臺美關係是分工合作,是互補的關係,所以它不會傷害自己,因為臺灣的重要性已經跟美國的晶片發展是融為一體。\n\n12:23.135 --> 12:44.261\n他佈局什麼樣的策略我想業者也有相當的準備跟意義因為主要我們會談這個的我們的擔憂是因為之前的共和黨的眾議院議長有提到所以我們必須在他提到之後立刻要有我們的縮帖立刻去反映這是我們執行的目的他說清楚有些誤解的地方確實要呈現正確的資訊給對方參考有這個問題所以我們要解釋說這不是問題\n\n12:49.662 --> 12:49.702\n臺灣每賺一塊錢\n\n13:04.540 --> 13:04.740\n這部長你剛才\n\n13:28.813 --> 13:52.523\n信守連台就把這些數字都已經有講到那如果方便的話相關的縮帖也給我們特別是針對晶片的我們希望說我們國會議員如果去訪美的時候必須有有所本現在已經有所本了有所準備我請那個港外議員我們同格拿給委員跟其他國家的國會議員交流的時候必須要有立刻的方式去把這樣的輿論來把它做起來好不好好謝謝部長\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.604,"end":1.067,"text":"您好 我們請部長請您部長"},{"start":13.22,"end":30.922,"text":"部長好委員好部長這一次的總統大選之後我看到我們很多部門像昨天我在諮詢經濟部長的時候我問他說那台美關係還有會不會有變化那他是說不會有變化那就是堅若磐石跟過去一樣部長你覺得這樣的說法"},{"start":33.18,"end":59.477,"text":"其實民主國家選舉競爭跟政黨人力是常態也都有變與不變那有一些不管是法律或政策會延續但是也有一些人士可能因為新的政見主張那基本上台美關係除了總統的選舉以外其實國會是一個觀察指標我跟委員也可以報告一下因為您很關心在國會友台的力量"},{"start":60.698,"end":70.069,"text":"這部分我們到目前為止以這個參議院這一次我們有30幾位我們友台小組的成員9位是這一次面臨的改選目前知道的有6位已經公佈的都是連任所以相當穩定那在眾議院方面"},{"start":80.701,"end":86.847,"text":"四位共同主席也都順利連任所以更為增強對台灣在國會上面的支持的力量那部長講得很好有變與不變所以當我們說這個完全沒有改變這是錯誤的訊息"},{"start":100.126,"end":121.897,"text":"我們美台之間的夥伴關係不會改變但是美國的領導層的變化跟他們的未來任用的內閣當然會有不同的政治的意識形態當然有不同的外交政策只是說我們要怎麼樣因應這樣的情勢這才是重點首先要了解狀況不能說全部都一樣堅若磐石"},{"start":122.757,"end":139.509,"text":"但是卻沒有因應說川普政權接下來的這種貿易上面經濟上面外交上面安全保障上面的政策的改變所以我必須要來特別來強調我們要怎麼樣把我們的論述完整化才不會被"},{"start":140.834,"end":159.849,"text":"中國方面可能會用以美論來趁機來介入這就是重點比方說我想要請教一下在經貿的部分川普是非常注重要把企業留在美國要把工作機會留在美國要把科技業留在美國那甚至有可能會對其他國家我就"},{"start":160.549,"end":167.39,"text":"確實我們要了解對方現在新政府的政策方向比如說像投資美國創造就業機會那這個是我們正在做而且很明顯可以看到包括台積電還有各方面的投資"},{"start":189.316,"end":209.994,"text":"另外一個其實我們現在在推的經濟外交在美國方面就是川普總統我想他任內啟動的包括乾淨網路就是這一些都是去紅色供應鏈包括電信跟5G以及EPPD這最重要"},{"start":210.555,"end":210.955,"text":"首先我們是可以不斷地跟他們強調"},{"start":230.299,"end":255.555,"text":"在台灣生產這個高科技的晶片是有效率的經濟有效率上面所以要說服或者是用我們的論述比如說強調鞏固台灣對美國的經濟整體的發展是更有效率那第二部分有人會問說那我們的這個台灣的這個晶片會不會受到影響那我們當然會說會有影響可是他的影響也可以是正面的台灣不一定有這麼多的土地來去建設廠房"},{"start":256.636,"end":276.625,"text":"分散一部分的投資在美國把最高製程的留在台灣這確實是也符合台美之間的利益再來就是會有一些論述說這樣子這個美國不斷的要求台灣來增加我們的這個國防預算這也符合台灣利益跟美國利益啊當我們現在粗糙美國的時候代表說台灣跟美國之間的貿易是增長的"},{"start":277.325,"end":298.185,"text":"這就是經濟上面的互助既榮邦那又能夠把我們的貿易往上一層但是滿足我自己的國防需求是以符合台灣的利益啊所以哪有什麼有一些人會說什麼繳保護費什麼時候鞏固自己的國家的國防變成繳保護費這種說法我們必須第一時間就要把這個錯誤的論述把它打破是"},{"start":298.826,"end":309.919,"text":"除此之外我們不僅跟美國的貿易是這8年來是最好的狀況之外同時我們有多出來的這些如果要確保說貿易是平衡的貿易是對等的"},{"start":310.902,"end":338.112,"text":"跟美國來去採購最先進的防衛的系統防衛的服務這有什麼不對這當然是可以增加我國的防衛能量有人說川普說要提到10%但是我們另外一方面也要跟他們強調一點就是說我們當然願意緩慢的把我們的應該說是在暗部就班的把我們國防預算提高但是在暗部就班的把國防預算提高的時候也要確保美國的生產量能夠跟上我國的採購需求"},{"start":338.892,"end":339.112,"text":"李卓人議員"},{"start":369.853,"end":385.26,"text":"讓美國再次偉大不能沒有台灣如果沒有了台灣跟美國的這種夥伴關係那美國也很難再次偉大因為像台積電這樣的投資他是一個很國際化的公司外資佔了將近七成"},{"start":388.502,"end":403.961,"text":"所以我們要了解說在美國的投資這個是互惠的那因為他本身也要發展晶片產業所以有人講說是不是什麼台灣plusone要去把台灣的供應鏈從台灣移出其實我們從另外一個角度來講是台灣plusn"},{"start":405.883,"end":422.828,"text":"這台灣的全球布局隨著這個供應鏈的重組我們更有韌性這個因應未來的國際政經的變化所以我覺得美台關係沒有必要去分化我想中共在這方面不斷在操作所謂的以美論我認為是錯的而且沒有必要"},{"start":425.649,"end":452.242,"text":"並且不會成功謝謝部長那再來就是說關於這個他對盟邦或者是安全保障的做法那一定跟拜登是不太一樣的那可能風格不一樣風格不一樣那我相信基本的一個民主國家他的政策法令還有一些關係是延續的對那我必須強調說那這樣的他的政策方針不一樣的話我們要相應的去調整嘛比方說他可能"},{"start":452.842,"end":456.325,"text":"印太戰略本來就是一個區域乃至全球的戰略它是超越雙邊的同樣在第一島鏈我想川普總統就是"},{"start":479.346,"end":479.506,"text":"：陳冠廷"},{"start":497.757,"end":519.629,"text":"我們可能要立刻主動接洽多邊跟我們國家比較有利害相關的國家其實我跟委員報告因為美國選舉其實像包括在歐洲我們理念相近的國家他們也都開始在調整這個是必然的對 這個時候我們可能就是要更加注重地緣政治那可能"},{"start":520.529,"end":537.79,"text":"部長上台之後價值外交的這個他的順位他也必須要相應調整對於川普來講所謂的價值外交我們要這樣子的跟他的這樣的接觸的方式跟縮帖也一定要調整因為對他來講"},{"start":539.11,"end":540.051,"text":"美國大選政策明顯不同"},{"start":555.23,"end":582.492,"text":"針對這個不同當然要調整我們的所有縮帖所以我當然是認同價值外交我當然是覺得說這個我們台灣跟許多歐洲的民主國家一樣子在倡導這個民主自由人權但是現在的美國他們重視的是國家利益那這個部分我們也必須因應新的政府來做出新的調整我想這個是非常重要但第二點我們也要擔心的齁包含這一個"},{"start":583.713,"end":607.481,"text":"馬斯克在這幾天我記得是新鏈的部分可能一些這個生產鏈都說因為地緣政治的挑戰可能會轉移我想這方面也必須要找到相應的人員來去說服說在台灣生產是有效率的在台灣生產是符合美國利益跟美國戰略的這些鞏固台灣的這些做法"},{"start":608.081,"end":632.749,"text":"我們也必須要跟他們一一的來去了解甚至他們是在商言商所以針對一些特殊的這些租稅或者是相關的這些經濟的措施可能都變成必須要我們要連串去思考就不可以說這是經濟部的事情外交部就變成要統合這一切就包含今天如何加入CPTPP在經濟委員會外交部也有書面報告所以大家要串起來因為現在"},{"start":634.534,"end":639.299,"text":"不比這過去四年完全不同的方針施政的方式必須要因應"},{"start":640.492,"end":665.562,"text":"我是覺得提升臺灣的一個就是競爭的優勢那技術深耕臺灣產線佈局全球其實供應的重組有它的趨勢那臺灣在這裡面怎麼應用這個趨勢來佈局所以並不是說好像供應要從臺灣移出其實這個也是一個我們國力的擴張嘛延伸嘛所以我想說剛剛講到比如說以這個新鏈它的這個供應鏈那臺灣的優勢"},{"start":668.123,"end":670.345,"text":"時間已經到,最後再補充一點就是我們剛剛提到的晶片相關的法案我們希望說我們在駐美的辦事處來去強調"},{"start":692.761,"end":692.842,"text":"陳冠廷"},{"start":714.443,"end":718.285,"text":"以晶片與半導體產業來講,臺美關係是分工合作,是互補的關係,所以它不會傷害自己,因為臺灣的重要性已經跟美國的晶片發展是融為一體。"},{"start":743.135,"end":764.261,"text":"他佈局什麼樣的策略我想業者也有相當的準備跟意義因為主要我們會談這個的我們的擔憂是因為之前的共和黨的眾議院議長有提到所以我們必須在他提到之後立刻要有我們的縮帖立刻去反映這是我們執行的目的他說清楚有些誤解的地方確實要呈現正確的資訊給對方參考有這個問題所以我們要解釋說這不是問題"},{"start":769.662,"end":769.702,"text":"臺灣每賺一塊錢"},{"start":784.54,"end":784.74,"text":"這部長你剛才"},{"start":808.813,"end":832.523,"text":"信守連台就把這些數字都已經有講到那如果方便的話相關的縮帖也給我們特別是針對晶片的我們希望說我們國會議員如果去訪美的時候必須有有所本現在已經有所本了有所準備我請那個港外議員我們同格拿給委員跟其他國家的國會議員交流的時候必須要有立刻的方式去把這樣的輿論來把它做起來好不好好 謝謝部長"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":123,"blocks":[["陳委員冠廷：（9時34分）你好，請部長。"],["主席：請林部長。"],["陳委員冠廷：部長好。"],["林部長佳龍：委員好。部長，這一次的總統大選之後，我看到我們很多部門……像昨天我在質詢經濟部長的時候問他說，臺美關係會不會有變化？他是說：不會有變化，堅如磐石、跟過去一樣。部長，你同不同意這樣的說法？"],["林部長佳龍：其實民主國家的選舉競爭跟政黨輪替是常態，也都有變與不變，不管是法律或政策會延續，但是也有一些人事可能會有新的政見、主張。基本上，臺美關係除了總統選舉以外，其實國會是一個觀察指標，我跟委員也可以報告一下，因為你很關心在國會友臺的力量，這部分到目前為止，以參議院這一次來說，我們有三十幾位友臺小組的成員，9位面臨這次的改選，目前據我們知道的，已經公布6位都是連任，所以相當穩定，在眾議院方面，4位共同主席也都順利連任……"],["陳委員冠廷：謝謝部長……"],["林部長佳龍：所以更為增強在國會上面支持臺灣的力量……"],["陳委員冠廷：通知我們……在國會上面，很快速地給我們這樣子的盤點，部長講得很好，有變與不變，所以當我們說完全沒有改變，這是錯誤的訊息，我們美臺之間的夥伴關係不會改變，但是美國領導層的變化跟他們未來任用的內閣當然會有不同的政治意識形態，當然有不同的外交政策，只是說我們要怎麼樣因應這樣的情勢，這才是重點。"],["林部長佳龍：對。"],["陳委員冠廷：首先要了解狀況，不會說全部都一樣，堅如磐石，但是卻沒有因應川普政權接下來在貿易、經濟、外交、安全保障的政策的改變，所以我必須要特別強調，我們要怎麼樣把我們的論述完整化，才不會被……因為中國方面可能會用疑美論來趁機揭露，這就是重點。我想要請教一下在經貿的部分，川普非常注重，要把企業留在美國、要把工作機會留在美國、要把科技業留在美國，甚至有可能會對其他國家包含臺灣，晶片可能會徵稅，或者是說過去晶片法案給臺灣也好，或者是其他鼓勵設廠的這些補助也有可能會減少，我們要怎麼因應這樣的說法？"],["林部長佳龍：確實我們要了解對方現在新政府的政策方向，比如說像投資美國創造就業機會，這個我們正在做，而且很明顯可以看到包括台積電還有各方面的投資；另外一個我們現在在推的經濟外交，在美國方面就是川普總統，我想他任內啟動的包括乾淨網路這一些都是，包括去紅色供應鏈，包括電信跟5G以及EPPD，這最重要，也就是美臺之間經濟繁榮夥伴架構，就是美臺合作到第三國或第三地去合作，能夠強化對我們邦交國，這就跟固邦到榮邦的關係概念是一樣的……"],["陳委員冠廷：第一點，就是我們剛才提到的晶片法案，首先我們可以不斷地跟他們強調，第一個，在臺灣生產高科技晶片是有效率的，經濟是有效率的，所以要說服或者是用我們的論述，比如說強調鞏固臺灣對美國整體經濟的發展是更有效率，第二個部分，有人會問臺灣的晶片會不會受到影響，我們當然會說有所影響，可是它的影響也可以是正面的，臺灣不一定有這麼多的土地來建設廠房，分散一部分的投資在美國，把最高製程的留在臺灣，這確實也符合臺美之間的利益，再來就是會有一些論述，說美國不斷地要求臺灣增加國防預算，這也符合臺灣利益跟美國利益，當我們現在出超美國的時候，代表臺灣跟美國之間的貿易是增長的，這就是經濟上面的互助，既榮邦又能夠把我們的貿易往上一層，並且滿足我國自己的國防需求，這是符合臺灣的利益，所以哪有什麼……有一些人會說什麼繳保護費，什麼時候鞏固自己國家的國防變成要繳保護費這種說法？我們必須第一時間就要把這個錯誤的論述給打破。"],["林部長佳龍：是。"],["陳委員冠廷：除此之外，我們跟美國的貿易狀況不僅是這8年來最好的之外，同時我們有多出來的這些，如果要確保貿易是平衡的、對等的，跟美國採購最先進的防衛系統、防衛的服務，這有什麼不對？這當然可以增加我國的防衛能量，有人說川普說要提到10%，但是我們另外一方面也要跟他們強調一點，我們當然願意緩慢地把我們的……應該說是在按部就班地提高我們的國防預算，但是在按部就班地把國防預算提高的時候，也要確保美國的生產量能夠跟上我國的採購需求，所以這是一連串的論述，當我們達成這個論述的時候，相關的疑美論自然而然的就可以把它給化解掉，你覺得這個看法怎麼樣？"],["林部長佳龍：我覺得疑美論是沒有必要啦！因為美國跟臺灣的關係不只是分享共同的理念，還是互利的關係，而且美臺的經濟整合可以說是相當的深，簡單來講就是讓美國再次偉大不能沒有臺灣，如果沒有臺灣跟美國這種夥伴關係，那美國也很難再次偉大，因為像台積電這樣的投資，它是一個很國際化的公司，外資占了將近七成，所以我們要了解在美國的投資是互惠的，因為它本身也要發展晶片產業，所以有人講說是不是Taiwan plus one，要把臺灣的供應鏈從臺灣移出，其實我們從另外一個角度來講是Taiwan plus n，臺灣的全球布局隨著供應鏈的重組，我們更有韌性，這個是因應未來國際政經的變化。","所以我覺得美臺關係沒有必要去分化，我想中共在這方面不斷在操作所謂的疑美論，我認為是錯的，而且沒有必要，並且不會成功。"],["陳委員冠廷：謝謝部長。再來是關於他對盟邦或者是安全保障的作法，一定跟拜登不太一樣，可能……"],["林部長佳龍：對，風格不一樣。"],["陳委員冠廷：風格不一樣，我相信……"],["林部長佳龍：但是基本的民主國家的政策法令還有一些關係是延續的。"],["陳委員冠廷：對，但我必須強調，他的政策方針如果不一樣，我們要相應的去調整，比方說，過去拜登跟北約之間的關係是很密切的，跟歐洲盟邦關係很密切，對美、日、韓的關係是非常密切的，現在可能更注重雙邊，在這個情況下，你覺得我們的外交作為該如何？"],["林部長佳龍：我想印太戰略本來就是區域乃至全球的戰略，它是超越雙邊的，同樣在第一島鏈，我想川普總統讓美國真正重返亞洲，甚至到太平洋到印度洋連結，因為國際政治有互相連動，所以在歐洲的一個情況，包括俄烏戰爭的發展，我們要密切關注，因為這也代表新政府可能的作風……"],["陳委員冠廷：我想我們可能要立刻主動接洽多邊跟我們國家比較有利害相關的國家。"],["林部長佳龍：我跟委員報告，因應美國選舉，其實包括歐洲跟我們理念相近的國家，他們也都開始在調整，這個是必然的。"],["陳委員冠廷：對，這個時候我們可能就是要更加注重地緣政治，部長上臺之後，價值外交的順位也必須要相應調整。對於川普來講，所謂的價值外交，我們跟他接觸的方式跟說帖也一定要調整，因為對他來講，地緣政治的挑戰他放在比較前面，他對於美國的貿易跟美國的產業，他的重心會放得更重要，所以說這次從美國大選的政策就可以看出明顯的不同，針對這個不同，我們當然要調整所有的說帖，我當然是認同價值外交，我當然是覺得臺灣跟許多歐洲的民主國家一樣在倡導民主、自由、人權，但是現在的美國重視的是國家利益，這個部分我們也必須因應新的政府來做出新的調整，我想這個是非常重要。","但第二點，我們也要擔心，包含馬斯克在這幾天，我記得是星鏈SpaceX的部分，可能一些生產鏈會因為地緣政治的挑戰，可能會轉移，我想這方面也必須要找到相應的人員來去說服在臺灣生產是有效率的，在臺灣生產是符合美國利益跟美國戰略的，這些鞏固臺灣的作法，我們也必須要跟他們一一地來去了解，甚至他們是在商言商，所以，針對一些特殊的租稅，或者是相關的經濟措施，可能變成必須要……我們要連串去思考，不可以說這是經濟部的事情，外交部就變成要統合這一切，就像今天經濟委員會安排了包括如何加入CPTPP的相關議程，外交部也有提書面報告嘛，所以大家要串起來，因為現在不比過去四年，完全不同的方針、施政的方式必須要因應。"],["林部長佳龍：我是覺得提升臺灣的競爭優勢，技術深耕臺灣、產線布局全球，其實供應鏈的重組有它的趨勢，臺灣在這裡面怎麼因應這個趨勢來布局，並不是說好像供應鏈要從臺灣移出，其實這個也是我們國力的擴張、延伸，所以委員剛剛講到的，比如以星鏈的供應鏈來說，臺灣的優勢是不能沒有臺灣，因為這個很清楚，我們在資通訊上、在晶片產業上，但是在布局上怎麼樣做有其一定的經濟邏輯，配合地緣政治的變化，我們確實要……"],["陳委員冠廷：部長，因為時間已經到，我最後再補充一點就好，不好意思，召委，就是我剛剛提到晶片相關的法案，我們希望駐美辦事處應該要去強調，用鼓勵的政策，不要用類似提高關稅的政策來懲罰像我們這些重要的盟邦，這是很重要的，必須要說服他們，鼓勵晶片，透過租稅的獎勵或者是其他財政的方式讓這些公司接受輔助，有助於美國跟包含臺灣的各個國家的利益，但是如果只是用單純的提高關稅，然後進口晶片要課稅的話，是既傷害到美國的利益，也傷害到支持美國的盟邦，所以我認為這是一個重中之重。"],["林部長佳龍：對，以晶片跟半導體產業來講，臺美關係是分工合作、互補的關係，所以它不會傷害自己啦，臺灣的重要性已經跟美國的晶片發展融為一體……"],["陳委員冠廷：我們當然希望不要傷害自己，畢竟共和黨籍的眾議院議長是有……"],["林部長佳龍：至於布局什麼樣的策略，我想業者也有相當的準備跟因應。"],["陳委員冠廷：我們會談這個，我們會擔憂，主要是因為之前共和黨的眾議院議長有提到嘛，所以必須在他提到之後立刻要有我們的說帖，立刻去反映，這就是我們質詢的目的……"],["林部長佳龍：對，要說清楚，有一些誤解的地方……"],["陳委員冠廷：我們不是說這個沒有問題，都沒有問題……"],["林部長佳龍：確實要呈現正確的資訊給對方參考。"],["陳委員冠廷：有這個問題，所以我們要解釋說這不是問題嘛，這樣是符合臺灣利益的。"],["林部長佳龍：所以我講說，比如以晶片來講，臺灣跟美國的關係，最重要的是在供應鏈裡面還是占最大的一個產值，臺灣每賺1塊錢它會賺3塊錢，我們是做苦工，在做晶片製造，它在設計還有相關的設備上，跟著我們的包括半導體大廠的發展，它也會得利，所以我想說，讓彼此利益一致的關係就是外交最重要的，所以感謝委員對這方面的提醒。"],["陳委員冠廷：部長，你剛才信手拈來就把這些數字都講到了，如果方便的話，相關的說帖也給我們，特別是針對晶片的部分，我們希望我們國會議員如果去訪美的時候必須有所本，特別是……"],["林部長佳龍：現在已經有所本了，有所準備，我請同仁趕快拿給委員。"],["陳委員冠廷：我們跟其他國家的國會議員交流時，必須要有立刻的方式去把這樣的輿論做起來，好不好？"],["林部長佳龍：好，謝謝。"],["陳委員冠廷：好，謝謝部長。"],["主席：謝謝陳冠廷委員，部長請回。","接下來請黃仁委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":364,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-35-11","speakers":["林憶君","王定宇","陳冠廷","黃仁","馬文君","林楚茵","徐巧芯","羅美玲","沈伯洋","洪申翰","楊瓊瓔","洪孟楷","賴士葆","李坤城","牛煦庭","羅智強","葉元之","陳永康"],"page_start":301,"meetingDate":["2024-11-07"],"gazette_id":"1139501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1139501_00009"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第11次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請外交部部長、大陸委員會報告「美國總統大選後，對於美中台三邊關係及未來國際局勢發展\n之影響」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1139501_00018"}}}