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這個大部分電子煙來源地大概都是中國大陸那邊比較多那中國大陸近年來也都積極對這個電子煙加強他們的一個管理措施所以說這個部分 可能電子煙進到台灣來 這個部分所以你現在的意思是說 我們查緝有成是因為對岸管理的好\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 490.101, \"end\": 490.241, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 490.241, \"end\": 491.102, \"score\": 0.906}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 491.102, \"end\": 491.222, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 491.222, \"end\": 491.402, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 491.402, \"end\": 491.543, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"概\", \"start\": 491.543, \"end\": 491.583, \"score\": 0.497}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 491.583, \"end\": 491.743, \"score\": 0.841}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 491.743, \"end\": 491.923, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 491.923, \"end\": 492.143, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"析\", \"start\": 492.143, \"end\": 493.484, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, 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00:01:20,073\n那今天我想特別來在這個我們教育部這裡也要讓部長去除了闡述一下您所遇到的困難我們各部會、跨部會到底應該要怎麼做這是今天最重要的議題我想部長剛剛特別有在聽到您的這個口頭報告當中您有提到說在校園的部分呢您如果查獲學生攜帶\n\n5\n00:01:29,259 --> 00:01:29,439\n我想我確實\n\n6\n00:01:53,162 --> 00:02:00,625\n謝謝委員關心學校的整個一個學習更友善的一個校園環境更安全的校園環境他確實以我們現在的一個生態來講老師他的一個專業在一個教學的專業但是我們又希望青少年學童有一個更好的一個成長發展的空間那外面的許多的這些誘因確實也很大所以我才會一直希望說所以嘛部長請問一下嘛我現在請教您嘛老師怎麼查\n\n7\n00:02:22,483 --> 00:02:37,456\n老師基本上我們就會從過去在校園裡邊有學生有抽煙或者有一些異常的一些行為您的意思是說我們先做一個調查表問問看大家有沒有抽煙然後針對有抽煙的人我們再來查所以我請教您一下老師該怎麼查老師基本上是從他日常教學裡邊去觀察到學生的一個行為所以老師就是用觀察的對嗎\n\n8\n00:02:48,971 --> 00:03:05,679\n例如說我們有一些除了這個教室的觀察當然還有一些廁所或者學校有一些好在不同的地方我們來進行觀察是這樣嗎可能例如說有一些他就會有一些丟棄煙蒂阿或者一些差別的一些部長阿我想喔其實喔我們要面對這個問題啦我就問您啦老師在去查這個電子煙的時候你覺得他有這個權力有這個能力嗎有沒有\n\n9\n00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:17,903\n在校園裡面查到有電子煙的就你知道有多少件在今年這一整年當中\n\n10\n00:03:33,117 --> 00:03:52,752\n目前有38件有通報的總共就從校園裡面查到老師查出來有38件是這樣嗎好我們來看一下你剛剛說查到有38件但是呢根據衛福部今天的資料看起來我們就講這個三年前的舊資料啦三年前的舊資料電子煙啦電子煙大概有7萬9千人有7萬9千人有這個吸食杯查緝7萬9這是舊資料喔\n\n11\n00:04:02,279 --> 00:04:24,310\n我相信黑書恐怕是這個好幾倍喔你看我們在校園查38件這是成比例嘛這是一個我想我就我質詢如果是各部會的可以來自己答喔那麼這個剛剛講到是舊資料但我今天在這邊還要特別講一件事電子煙我們大家都知道現在你不管是吸食啊製造什麼的通通都是違法的我們都知道但是今天還要講一個喔加熱煙大家不要以為加熱煙就是合法的喔\n\n12\n00:04:27,532 --> 00:04:35,601\n加熱煙現在其實是中央主管機關公告的指定煙品不管是輸入製造等等都要經過健康風險評估我請教衛福部現在加熱煙的部分我們有沒有哪一件來申請而且是通過審查沒有對\n\n13\n00:04:42,509 --> 00:04:43,971\n電子煙加熱煙加起來青少年將近10萬人去碰觸稀釋所以現在的資料\n\n14\n00:05:00,549 --> 00:05:04,670\n拿出來看我相信會讓所有的師長更痛心啦但我們校園查緝38件為什麼有困難嘛怎麼查你把這樣的責任丟給老師我跟你講這些老師這個是不可承受之重所以今天校園裡面發生這樣的事情電子煙的氾濫有的在校園裡面有的在校園周邊那誰的責任\n\n15\n00:05:22,935 --> 00:05:23,115\n主管機關說是衛福部\n\n16\n00:05:53,095 --> 00:05:57,416\n我問一下部長以及大家這個什麼叫電子維他命棒啊部長什麼叫電子維他命棒來以上都有知道什麼叫電子維他命棒的舉手好那什麼叫蒸汽果汁知道的舉手\n\n17\n00:06:16,361 --> 00:06:44,382\n來威福部告訴我什麼叫爭氣果汁因為電子煙本身就是它的煙彈本身所以電子煙的一種嘛是不是電子煙的一種嘛可見喔我今天要講啦大家都說在查緝大家都說要防制啦可是呢我必須要說啦有一些人傻傻的連電子煙加熱煙第一個還分不清楚法律的規範還不了解那麼有時候看到了學校老師看到甚至於還不知道那是電子煙部長有沒有這種可能\n\n18\n00:06:46,643 --> 00:06:49,764\n目前我手邊的資料確實如果按圖來比照我是可以的\n\n19\n00:07:09,611 --> 00:07:38,122\n暗圖來比較是可以食品拿來你可以嗎我目前沒有接受到食品所以我講部長這個我要講今天就是說雖然我們今天在教育部裡面排這個我們要知道打擊電子煙非法的這個不合法這些電子煙以及我們要維護我們青少年的健康我們都知道電子煙真的可以造成這個青少年不管他將來去吸食煙或者是很多的危害我們都很清楚了但是大家跨部會怎麼做嗎\n\n20\n00:07:39,212 --> 00:07:44,235\n對不對這才是重點啊所以我想今天關務署也在現場關務署啊沒上來啊算了積極一點好不好積極一點好不好我想這幾年我們看到海關在查緝這個電子煙110年的時候有12.7萬隻但113年有4.2萬那我想請教一下這是查緝有成還是什麼原因為什麼會下降\n\n21\n00:08:10,101 --> 00:08:35,945\n報告委員這個部分大概我們有分析過為什麼就是說電子煙講重點第一個這個大部分電子煙來源地大概都是中國大陸那邊比較多那中國大陸近年來也都積極對這個電子煙加強他們的一個管理措施所以說這個部分可能電子煙進到台灣來這個部分所以你現在的意思是說我們查緝有成是因為對岸管理的好\n\n22\n00:08:36,969 --> 00:09:00,681\n他因為就是說電子煙這個部分跟我們剛剛講的那個加熱煙這個部分可能有互相取代的關係我想這樣子講今天我們在這個境外的部分加強去查緝這當然是非常重要的一個重點不過我想一樣回到這個衛福部來看你看衛福部自己的國建署統計的資料今年的1月到10月我們查獲非法使用154件對嗎?國建署\n\n23\n00:09:05,543 --> 00:09:29,578\n今年的1月到10月您的資料154件但是我們看到光舊資料這新時的少年就高達了將近8萬人這是舊資料現在搞不好超過10萬但你看你查到的只能有154件剛剛校園裡面只有38件這多麼可怕的一件事情所以今天大家的口頭報告簡直就是浪費大家的時間講來講去都在講查緝防制結果是什麼過去做不好\n\n24\n00:09:34,361 --> 00:09:38,142\n上次衛環委員會兩個禮拜開完會以後到現在網路上一樣看到啊對但是我要跟委員說明兩個禮拜前的衛環委員會之後我們做了相當多的事情包括跟縣市合作剛才部長提到的是38件是他們的統計我跟委員報告這一個禮拜不到兩個禮拜的時間我們的縣市查處\n\n25\n00:09:56,866 --> 00:10:03,891\n包括跟警政合作跟校園合作大概有1000件以上但是因為他那個真正採取的量數還在統計是不是容我一個禮拜內提供採取的具體的資料給您所以呢意思是說校園裡面查處38件但是我們各方這個合力查處有超過1000件\n\n26\n00:10:16,538 --> 00:10:39,247\n在校園周邊跟警政署合作的部分所以我一個禮拜內會把這些統計的資料交給你我想當然我們這個38件跟1000件我們感覺好像成績更好一點點但是呢我們來看稀釋的人口超過10萬的青少年我想這個成績還是慘不忍睹所以呢我想今天在這裡本席等一下也是有這個臨時提案我們希望我們要這個衛福部主責\n\n27\n00:10:43,709 --> 00:11:04,224\n那但是呢我們跨部會是不是要有一個這個稽查防制的平台上次在外防委員會結束之後你們沒有做那現在本席要具體要求你們到底的這個橫向的聯繫那大家的合作怎麼做嘛從境外的這個查緝這個境內的不管是警政署、衛福部再來數發部在哪裡\n\n28\n00:11:07,866 --> 00:11:24,419\n蘇發布就是更誇張了蘇發布難道都不會上網去看一下嗎這都跟你們沒有關係嗎不然蘇發布平常在幹嘛蘇發布都在做什麼這麼嚴重的事情對不對危害下一代的這個健康而且這是完全違法的你蘇發布都視而不見嗎\n\n29\n00:11:25,934 --> 00:11:54,118\n報告委員針對這個淹害的部分的話基本上全職單位是衛福部那我們協助了一些事情比如說像我們希望他能夠藉行用平台的方式通知相關平台業者能夠向下而且我們建立了所謂的MetaGoogle這種大型平台的綠色通道也可以協助衛福部那另外在提到所以書發部你現在的想法就是說你是協助衛福部嘛對不對報告委員因為基本上警政署\n\n30\n00:11:57,677 --> 00:12:24,088\n你也是協助衛福部是不是?跟委員報告你也協助衛福部嗎?這部分當然是大家要兩個部門都要跨機關來合作所以你會不會主動出擊?那基本上我想我們針對電子煙部我們還是在主軸還是在他有毒品的部分來做一個專責的查緝啦是,所以呢如果你不知道他有沒有毒品你就不查緝是這樣子講法嗎?\n\n31\n00:12:25,894 --> 00:12:45,709\n我們當然不是說他這個毒品要看看他整個情質來源我們做綜合考量來做好就看起來你也是在協助的角色好那我想我下一個結論今天在教育部排定但是我覺得這個如果我們把所有的茶器通通放在校園當源頭我們把所有的責任都給老師我跟你講將來很多人已經不想再當老師了給他很多的這個壓力但是你沒有給他權利給他很多的責任但是我覺得法規都不清晰\n\n32\n00:12:55,916 --> 00:12:56,136\n主席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n2712\t3032\t都上來了嗎?\n27511\t28772\t今天大家所關心的問題\n41489\t66484\t兩個禮拜前我們在衛福部才討論過這個問題兩個禮拜我們沒有看到在這個衛福委員會所提出來的這些問題點這些質疑點在這兩個禮拜當中在我們各部會有什麼樣進一步的去處理或解決所以也就是說委員會如果每一次開會完了以後我們還是原地踏步請問一下不管今天質詢也好 排專報也好意義在哪裡\n67304\t80073\t那今天我想特別來在這個我們教育部這裡也要讓部長去除了闡述一下您所遇到的困難我們各部會、跨部會到底應該要怎麼做這是今天最重要的議題我想部長剛剛特別有在聽到您的這個口頭報告當中您有提到說在校園的部分呢您如果查獲學生攜帶\n89259\t89439\t我想我確實\n113162\t120625\t謝謝委員關心學校的整個一個學習更友善的一個校園環境更安全的校園環境他確實以我們現在的一個生態來講老師他的一個專業在一個教學的專業但是我們又希望青少年學童有一個更好的一個成長發展的空間那外面的許多的這些誘因確實也很大所以我才會一直希望說所以嘛部長請問一下嘛我現在請教您嘛老師怎麼查\n142483\t157456\t老師基本上我們就會從過去在校園裡邊有學生有抽煙或者有一些異常的一些行為您的意思是說我們先做一個調查表問問看大家有沒有抽煙然後針對有抽煙的人我們再來查所以我請教您一下老師該怎麼查老師基本上是從他日常教學裡邊去觀察到學生的一個行為所以老師就是用觀察的對嗎\n168971\t185679\t例如說我們有一些除了這個教室的觀察當然還有一些廁所或者學校有一些好在不同的地方我們來進行觀察是這樣嗎可能例如說有一些他就會有一些丟棄煙蒂阿或者一些差別的一些部長阿我想喔其實喔我們要面對這個問題啦我就問您啦老師在去查這個電子煙的時候你覺得他有這個權力有這個能力嗎有沒有\n195560\t197903\t在校園裡面查到有電子煙的就你知道有多少件在今年這一整年當中\n213117\t232752\t目前有38件有通報的總共就從校園裡面查到老師查出來有38件是這樣嗎好 我們來看一下你剛剛說查到有38件但是呢根據衛福部今天的資料看起來我們就講這個三年前的舊資料啦三年前的舊資料電子煙啦電子煙大概有7萬9千人有7萬9千人有這個吸食杯查緝7萬9這是舊資料喔\n242279\t264310\t我相信黑書恐怕是這個好幾倍喔你看我們在校園查38件這是成比例嘛這是一個我想 我就 我質詢如果是各部會的可以來自己答喔那麼這個剛剛講到是舊資料但我今天在這邊還要特別講一件事電子煙我們大家都知道現在你不管是吸食啊 製造什麼的通通都是違法的我們都知道但是今天還要講一個喔加熱煙大家不要以為加熱煙就是合法的喔\n267532\t275601\t加熱煙現在其實是中央主管機關公告的指定煙品不管是輸入製造等等都要經過健康風險評估我請教衛福部現在加熱煙的部分我們有沒有哪一件來申請而且是通過審查沒有 對\n282509\t283971\t電子煙加熱煙加起來青少年將近10萬人去碰觸稀釋所以現在的資料\n300549\t304670\t拿出來看我相信會讓所有的師長更痛心啦但我們校園查緝38件為什麼有困難嘛怎麼查你把這樣的責任丟給老師我跟你講這些老師這個是不可承受之重所以今天校園裡面發生這樣的事情電子煙的氾濫有的在校園裡面有的在校園周邊那誰的責任\n322935\t323115\t主管機關說是衛福部\n353095\t357416\t我問一下部長以及大家這個什麼叫電子維他命棒啊部長 什麼叫電子維他命棒來 以上都有知道什麼叫電子維他命棒的舉手好 那什麼叫蒸汽果汁知道的舉手\n376361\t404382\t來 威福部告訴我什麼叫爭氣果汁因為電子煙本身就是它的煙彈本身所以電子煙的一種嘛 是不是電子煙的一種嘛可見喔 我今天要講啦大家都說在查緝 大家都說要防制啦可是呢 我必須要說啦有一些人傻傻的連電子煙加熱煙第一個還分不清楚法律的規範還不了解那麼有時候看到了學校老師看到甚至於還不知道那是電子煙部長有沒有這種可能\n406643\t409764\t目前我手邊的資料確實如果按圖來比照我是可以的\n429611\t458122\t暗圖來比較是可以食品拿來你可以嗎我目前沒有接受到食品所以我講部長這個我要講今天就是說雖然我們今天在教育部裡面排這個我們要知道打擊電子煙非法的這個不合法這些電子煙以及我們要維護我們青少年的健康我們都知道電子煙真的可以造成這個青少年不管他將來去吸食煙或者是很多的危害我們都很清楚了但是大家跨部會怎麼做嗎\n459212\t464235\t對不對 這才是重點啊所以我想今天關務署也在現場關務署啊 沒上來啊算了 積極一點好不好積極一點好不好我想這幾年我們看到海關在查緝這個電子煙110年的時候有12.7萬隻但113年有4.2萬那我想請教一下這是查緝有成還是什麼原因為什麼會下降\n490101\t515945\t報告委員 這個部分大概我們有分析過為什麼就是說 電子煙 講重點第一個 這個大部分電子煙來源地大概都是中國大陸那邊比較多那中國大陸近年來也都積極對這個電子煙加強他們的一個管理措施所以說這個部分 可能電子煙進到台灣來 這個部分所以你現在的意思是說 我們查緝有成是因為對岸管理的好\n516969\t540681\t他因為就是說電子煙這個部分跟我們剛剛講的那個加熱煙這個部分可能有互相取代的關係我想這樣子講今天我們在這個境外的部分加強去查緝這當然是非常重要的一個重點不過我想一樣回到這個衛福部來看你看衛福部自己的國建署統計的資料今年的1月到10月我們查獲非法使用154件對嗎?國建署\n545543\t569578\t今年的1月到10月您的資料154件但是我們看到光舊資料這新時的少年就高達了將近8萬人這是舊資料現在搞不好超過10萬但你看你查到的只能有154件剛剛校園裡面只有38件這多麼可怕的一件事情所以今天大家的口頭報告簡直就是浪費大家的時間講來講去都在講查緝防制結果是什麼過去做不好\n574361\t578142\t上次衛環委員會兩個禮拜開完會以後到現在網路上一樣看到啊對但是我要跟委員說明兩個禮拜前的衛環委員會之後我們做了相當多的事情包括跟縣市合作剛才部長提到的是38件是他們的統計我跟委員報告這一個禮拜不到兩個禮拜的時間我們的縣市查處\n596866\t603891\t包括跟警政合作跟校園合作大概有1000件以上但是因為他那個真正採取的量數還在統計是不是容我一個禮拜內提供採取的具體的資料給您所以呢意思是說校園裡面查處38件但是我們各方這個合力查處有超過1000件\n616538\t639247\t在校園周邊跟警政署合作的部分所以我一個禮拜內會把這些統計的資料交給你我想當然我們這個38件跟1000件我們感覺好像成績更好一點點但是呢我們來看稀釋的人口超過10萬的青少年我想這個成績還是慘不忍睹所以呢我想今天在這裡本席等一下也是有這個臨時提案我們希望我們要這個衛福部主責\n643709\t664224\t那但是呢我們跨部會是不是要有一個這個稽查防制的平台上次在外防委員會結束之後你們沒有做那現在本席要具體要求你們到底的這個橫向的聯繫那大家的合作怎麼做嘛從境外的這個查緝這個境內的不管是警政署、衛福部再來數發部在哪裡\n667866\t684419\t蘇發布就是更誇張了蘇發布難道都不會上網去看一下嗎這都跟你們沒有關係嗎不然蘇發布平常在幹嘛蘇發布都在做什麼這麼嚴重的事情對不對危害下一代的這個健康而且這是完全違法的你蘇發布都視而不見嗎\n685934\t714118\t報告委員 針對這個淹害的部分的話基本上全職單位是衛福部那我們協助了一些事情比如說像我們希望他能夠藉行用平台的方式通知相關平台業者能夠向下而且我們建立了所謂的MetaGoogle這種大型平台的綠色通道也可以協助衛福部那另外在提到所以書發部你現在的想法就是說你是協助衛福部嘛對不對報告委員 因為基本上警政署\n717677\t744088\t你也是協助衛福部是不是?跟委員報告你也協助衛福部嗎?這部分當然是大家要兩個部門都要跨機關來合作所以你會不會主動出擊?那基本上我想我們針對電子煙部我們還是在主軸還是在他有毒品的部分來做一個專責的查緝啦是,所以呢如果你不知道他有沒有毒品你就不查緝是這樣子講法嗎?\n745894\t765709\t我們當然不是說他這個毒品要看看他整個情質來源我們做綜合考量來做好就看起來你也是在協助的角色好那我想我下一個結論今天在教育部排定但是我覺得這個如果我們把所有的茶器通通放在校園當源頭我們把所有的責任都給老師我跟你講將來很多人已經不想再當老師了給他很多的這個壓力但是你沒有給他權利給他很多的責任但是我覺得法規都不清晰\n775916\t776136\t主席\n","txt":"都上來了嗎?\n今天大家所關心的問題\n兩個禮拜前我們在衛福部才討論過這個問題兩個禮拜我們沒有看到在這個衛福委員會所提出來的這些問題點這些質疑點在這兩個禮拜當中在我們各部會有什麼樣進一步的去處理或解決所以也就是說委員會如果每一次開會完了以後我們還是原地踏步請問一下不管今天質詢也好 排專報也好意義在哪裡\n那今天我想特別來在這個我們教育部這裡也要讓部長去除了闡述一下您所遇到的困難我們各部會、跨部會到底應該要怎麼做這是今天最重要的議題我想部長剛剛特別有在聽到您的這個口頭報告當中您有提到說在校園的部分呢您如果查獲學生攜帶\n我想我確實\n謝謝委員關心學校的整個一個學習更友善的一個校園環境更安全的校園環境他確實以我們現在的一個生態來講老師他的一個專業在一個教學的專業但是我們又希望青少年學童有一個更好的一個成長發展的空間那外面的許多的這些誘因確實也很大所以我才會一直希望說所以嘛部長請問一下嘛我現在請教您嘛老師怎麼查\n老師基本上我們就會從過去在校園裡邊有學生有抽煙或者有一些異常的一些行為您的意思是說我們先做一個調查表問問看大家有沒有抽煙然後針對有抽煙的人我們再來查所以我請教您一下老師該怎麼查老師基本上是從他日常教學裡邊去觀察到學生的一個行為所以老師就是用觀察的對嗎\n例如說我們有一些除了這個教室的觀察當然還有一些廁所或者學校有一些好在不同的地方我們來進行觀察是這樣嗎可能例如說有一些他就會有一些丟棄煙蒂阿或者一些差別的一些部長阿我想喔其實喔我們要面對這個問題啦我就問您啦老師在去查這個電子煙的時候你覺得他有這個權力有這個能力嗎有沒有\n在校園裡面查到有電子煙的就你知道有多少件在今年這一整年當中\n目前有38件有通報的總共就從校園裡面查到老師查出來有38件是這樣嗎好 我們來看一下你剛剛說查到有38件但是呢根據衛福部今天的資料看起來我們就講這個三年前的舊資料啦三年前的舊資料電子煙啦電子煙大概有7萬9千人有7萬9千人有這個吸食杯查緝7萬9這是舊資料喔\n我相信黑書恐怕是這個好幾倍喔你看我們在校園查38件這是成比例嘛這是一個我想 我就 我質詢如果是各部會的可以來自己答喔那麼這個剛剛講到是舊資料但我今天在這邊還要特別講一件事電子煙我們大家都知道現在你不管是吸食啊 製造什麼的通通都是違法的我們都知道但是今天還要講一個喔加熱煙大家不要以為加熱煙就是合法的喔\n加熱煙現在其實是中央主管機關公告的指定煙品不管是輸入製造等等都要經過健康風險評估我請教衛福部現在加熱煙的部分我們有沒有哪一件來申請而且是通過審查沒有 對\n電子煙加熱煙加起來青少年將近10萬人去碰觸稀釋所以現在的資料\n拿出來看我相信會讓所有的師長更痛心啦但我們校園查緝38件為什麼有困難嘛怎麼查你把這樣的責任丟給老師我跟你講這些老師這個是不可承受之重所以今天校園裡面發生這樣的事情電子煙的氾濫有的在校園裡面有的在校園周邊那誰的責任\n主管機關說是衛福部\n我問一下部長以及大家這個什麼叫電子維他命棒啊部長 什麼叫電子維他命棒來 以上都有知道什麼叫電子維他命棒的舉手好 那什麼叫蒸汽果汁知道的舉手\n來 威福部告訴我什麼叫爭氣果汁因為電子煙本身就是它的煙彈本身所以電子煙的一種嘛 是不是電子煙的一種嘛可見喔 我今天要講啦大家都說在查緝 大家都說要防制啦可是呢 我必須要說啦有一些人傻傻的連電子煙加熱煙第一個還分不清楚法律的規範還不了解那麼有時候看到了學校老師看到甚至於還不知道那是電子煙部長有沒有這種可能\n目前我手邊的資料確實如果按圖來比照我是可以的\n暗圖來比較是可以食品拿來你可以嗎我目前沒有接受到食品所以我講部長這個我要講今天就是說雖然我們今天在教育部裡面排這個我們要知道打擊電子煙非法的這個不合法這些電子煙以及我們要維護我們青少年的健康我們都知道電子煙真的可以造成這個青少年不管他將來去吸食煙或者是很多的危害我們都很清楚了但是大家跨部會怎麼做嗎\n對不對 這才是重點啊所以我想今天關務署也在現場關務署啊 沒上來啊算了 積極一點好不好積極一點好不好我想這幾年我們看到海關在查緝這個電子煙110年的時候有12.7萬隻但113年有4.2萬那我想請教一下這是查緝有成還是什麼原因為什麼會下降\n報告委員 這個部分大概我們有分析過為什麼就是說 電子煙 講重點第一個 這個大部分電子煙來源地大概都是中國大陸那邊比較多那中國大陸近年來也都積極對這個電子煙加強他們的一個管理措施所以說這個部分 可能電子煙進到台灣來 這個部分所以你現在的意思是說 我們查緝有成是因為對岸管理的好\n他因為就是說電子煙這個部分跟我們剛剛講的那個加熱煙這個部分可能有互相取代的關係我想這樣子講今天我們在這個境外的部分加強去查緝這當然是非常重要的一個重點不過我想一樣回到這個衛福部來看你看衛福部自己的國建署統計的資料今年的1月到10月我們查獲非法使用154件對嗎?國建署\n今年的1月到10月您的資料154件但是我們看到光舊資料這新時的少年就高達了將近8萬人這是舊資料現在搞不好超過10萬但你看你查到的只能有154件剛剛校園裡面只有38件這多麼可怕的一件事情所以今天大家的口頭報告簡直就是浪費大家的時間講來講去都在講查緝防制結果是什麼過去做不好\n上次衛環委員會兩個禮拜開完會以後到現在網路上一樣看到啊對但是我要跟委員說明兩個禮拜前的衛環委員會之後我們做了相當多的事情包括跟縣市合作剛才部長提到的是38件是他們的統計我跟委員報告這一個禮拜不到兩個禮拜的時間我們的縣市查處\n包括跟警政合作跟校園合作大概有1000件以上但是因為他那個真正採取的量數還在統計是不是容我一個禮拜內提供採取的具體的資料給您所以呢意思是說校園裡面查處38件但是我們各方這個合力查處有超過1000件\n在校園周邊跟警政署合作的部分所以我一個禮拜內會把這些統計的資料交給你我想當然我們這個38件跟1000件我們感覺好像成績更好一點點但是呢我們來看稀釋的人口超過10萬的青少年我想這個成績還是慘不忍睹所以呢我想今天在這裡本席等一下也是有這個臨時提案我們希望我們要這個衛福部主責\n那但是呢我們跨部會是不是要有一個這個稽查防制的平台上次在外防委員會結束之後你們沒有做那現在本席要具體要求你們到底的這個橫向的聯繫那大家的合作怎麼做嘛從境外的這個查緝這個境內的不管是警政署、衛福部再來數發部在哪裡\n蘇發布就是更誇張了蘇發布難道都不會上網去看一下嗎這都跟你們沒有關係嗎不然蘇發布平常在幹嘛蘇發布都在做什麼這麼嚴重的事情對不對危害下一代的這個健康而且這是完全違法的你蘇發布都視而不見嗎\n報告委員 針對這個淹害的部分的話基本上全職單位是衛福部那我們協助了一些事情比如說像我們希望他能夠藉行用平台的方式通知相關平台業者能夠向下而且我們建立了所謂的MetaGoogle這種大型平台的綠色通道也可以協助衛福部那另外在提到所以書發部你現在的想法就是說你是協助衛福部嘛對不對報告委員 因為基本上警政署\n你也是協助衛福部是不是?跟委員報告你也協助衛福部嗎?這部分當然是大家要兩個部門都要跨機關來合作所以你會不會主動出擊?那基本上我想我們針對電子煙部我們還是在主軸還是在他有毒品的部分來做一個專責的查緝啦是,所以呢如果你不知道他有沒有毒品你就不查緝是這樣子講法嗎?\n我們當然不是說他這個毒品要看看他整個情質來源我們做綜合考量來做好就看起來你也是在協助的角色好那我想我下一個結論今天在教育部排定但是我覺得這個如果我們把所有的茶器通通放在校園當源頭我們把所有的責任都給老師我跟你講將來很多人已經不想再當老師了給他很多的這個壓力但是你沒有給他權利給他很多的責任但是我覺得法規都不清晰\n主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:02.712 --> 00:03.032\n都上來了嗎?\n\n00:27.511 --> 00:28.772\n今天大家所關心的問題\n\n00:41.489 --> 01:06.484\n兩個禮拜前我們在衛福部才討論過這個問題兩個禮拜我們沒有看到在這個衛福委員會所提出來的這些問題點這些質疑點在這兩個禮拜當中在我們各部會有什麼樣進一步的去處理或解決所以也就是說委員會如果每一次開會完了以後我們還是原地踏步請問一下不管今天質詢也好排專報也好意義在哪裡\n\n01:07.304 --> 01:20.073\n那今天我想特別來在這個我們教育部這裡也要讓部長去除了闡述一下您所遇到的困難我們各部會、跨部會到底應該要怎麼做這是今天最重要的議題我想部長剛剛特別有在聽到您的這個口頭報告當中您有提到說在校園的部分呢您如果查獲學生攜帶\n\n01:29.259 --> 01:29.439\n我想我確實\n\n01:53.162 --> 02:00.625\n謝謝委員關心學校的整個一個學習更友善的一個校園環境更安全的校園環境他確實以我們現在的一個生態來講老師他的一個專業在一個教學的專業但是我們又希望青少年學童有一個更好的一個成長發展的空間那外面的許多的這些誘因確實也很大所以我才會一直希望說所以嘛部長請問一下嘛我現在請教您嘛老師怎麼查\n\n02:22.483 --> 02:37.456\n老師基本上我們就會從過去在校園裡邊有學生有抽煙或者有一些異常的一些行為您的意思是說我們先做一個調查表問問看大家有沒有抽煙然後針對有抽煙的人我們再來查所以我請教您一下老師該怎麼查老師基本上是從他日常教學裡邊去觀察到學生的一個行為所以老師就是用觀察的對嗎\n\n02:48.971 --> 03:05.679\n例如說我們有一些除了這個教室的觀察當然還有一些廁所或者學校有一些好在不同的地方我們來進行觀察是這樣嗎可能例如說有一些他就會有一些丟棄煙蒂阿或者一些差別的一些部長阿我想喔其實喔我們要面對這個問題啦我就問您啦老師在去查這個電子煙的時候你覺得他有這個權力有這個能力嗎有沒有\n\n03:15.560 --> 03:17.903\n在校園裡面查到有電子煙的就你知道有多少件在今年這一整年當中\n\n03:33.117 --> 03:52.752\n目前有38件有通報的總共就從校園裡面查到老師查出來有38件是這樣嗎好我們來看一下你剛剛說查到有38件但是呢根據衛福部今天的資料看起來我們就講這個三年前的舊資料啦三年前的舊資料電子煙啦電子煙大概有7萬9千人有7萬9千人有這個吸食杯查緝7萬9這是舊資料喔\n\n04:02.279 --> 04:24.310\n我相信黑書恐怕是這個好幾倍喔你看我們在校園查38件這是成比例嘛這是一個我想我就我質詢如果是各部會的可以來自己答喔那麼這個剛剛講到是舊資料但我今天在這邊還要特別講一件事電子煙我們大家都知道現在你不管是吸食啊製造什麼的通通都是違法的我們都知道但是今天還要講一個喔加熱煙大家不要以為加熱煙就是合法的喔\n\n04:27.532 --> 04:35.601\n加熱煙現在其實是中央主管機關公告的指定煙品不管是輸入製造等等都要經過健康風險評估我請教衛福部現在加熱煙的部分我們有沒有哪一件來申請而且是通過審查沒有對\n\n04:42.509 --> 04:43.971\n電子煙加熱煙加起來青少年將近10萬人去碰觸稀釋所以現在的資料\n\n05:00.549 --> 05:04.670\n拿出來看我相信會讓所有的師長更痛心啦但我們校園查緝38件為什麼有困難嘛怎麼查你把這樣的責任丟給老師我跟你講這些老師這個是不可承受之重所以今天校園裡面發生這樣的事情電子煙的氾濫有的在校園裡面有的在校園周邊那誰的責任\n\n05:22.935 --> 05:23.115\n主管機關說是衛福部\n\n05:53.095 --> 05:57.416\n我問一下部長以及大家這個什麼叫電子維他命棒啊部長什麼叫電子維他命棒來以上都有知道什麼叫電子維他命棒的舉手好那什麼叫蒸汽果汁知道的舉手\n\n06:16.361 --> 06:44.382\n來威福部告訴我什麼叫爭氣果汁因為電子煙本身就是它的煙彈本身所以電子煙的一種嘛是不是電子煙的一種嘛可見喔我今天要講啦大家都說在查緝大家都說要防制啦可是呢我必須要說啦有一些人傻傻的連電子煙加熱煙第一個還分不清楚法律的規範還不了解那麼有時候看到了學校老師看到甚至於還不知道那是電子煙部長有沒有這種可能\n\n06:46.643 --> 06:49.764\n目前我手邊的資料確實如果按圖來比照我是可以的\n\n07:09.611 --> 07:38.122\n暗圖來比較是可以食品拿來你可以嗎我目前沒有接受到食品所以我講部長這個我要講今天就是說雖然我們今天在教育部裡面排這個我們要知道打擊電子煙非法的這個不合法這些電子煙以及我們要維護我們青少年的健康我們都知道電子煙真的可以造成這個青少年不管他將來去吸食煙或者是很多的危害我們都很清楚了但是大家跨部會怎麼做嗎\n\n07:39.212 --> 07:44.235\n對不對這才是重點啊所以我想今天關務署也在現場關務署啊沒上來啊算了積極一點好不好積極一點好不好我想這幾年我們看到海關在查緝這個電子煙110年的時候有12.7萬隻但113年有4.2萬那我想請教一下這是查緝有成還是什麼原因為什麼會下降\n\n08:10.101 --> 08:35.945\n報告委員這個部分大概我們有分析過為什麼就是說電子煙講重點第一個這個大部分電子煙來源地大概都是中國大陸那邊比較多那中國大陸近年來也都積極對這個電子煙加強他們的一個管理措施所以說這個部分可能電子煙進到台灣來這個部分所以你現在的意思是說我們查緝有成是因為對岸管理的好\n\n08:36.969 --> 09:00.681\n他因為就是說電子煙這個部分跟我們剛剛講的那個加熱煙這個部分可能有互相取代的關係我想這樣子講今天我們在這個境外的部分加強去查緝這當然是非常重要的一個重點不過我想一樣回到這個衛福部來看你看衛福部自己的國建署統計的資料今年的1月到10月我們查獲非法使用154件對嗎?國建署\n\n09:05.543 --> 09:29.578\n今年的1月到10月您的資料154件但是我們看到光舊資料這新時的少年就高達了將近8萬人這是舊資料現在搞不好超過10萬但你看你查到的只能有154件剛剛校園裡面只有38件這多麼可怕的一件事情所以今天大家的口頭報告簡直就是浪費大家的時間講來講去都在講查緝防制結果是什麼過去做不好\n\n09:34.361 --> 09:38.142\n上次衛環委員會兩個禮拜開完會以後到現在網路上一樣看到啊對但是我要跟委員說明兩個禮拜前的衛環委員會之後我們做了相當多的事情包括跟縣市合作剛才部長提到的是38件是他們的統計我跟委員報告這一個禮拜不到兩個禮拜的時間我們的縣市查處\n\n09:56.866 --> 10:03.891\n包括跟警政合作跟校園合作大概有1000件以上但是因為他那個真正採取的量數還在統計是不是容我一個禮拜內提供採取的具體的資料給您所以呢意思是說校園裡面查處38件但是我們各方這個合力查處有超過1000件\n\n10:16.538 --> 10:39.247\n在校園周邊跟警政署合作的部分所以我一個禮拜內會把這些統計的資料交給你我想當然我們這個38件跟1000件我們感覺好像成績更好一點點但是呢我們來看稀釋的人口超過10萬的青少年我想這個成績還是慘不忍睹所以呢我想今天在這裡本席等一下也是有這個臨時提案我們希望我們要這個衛福部主責\n\n10:43.709 --> 11:04.224\n那但是呢我們跨部會是不是要有一個這個稽查防制的平台上次在外防委員會結束之後你們沒有做那現在本席要具體要求你們到底的這個橫向的聯繫那大家的合作怎麼做嘛從境外的這個查緝這個境內的不管是警政署、衛福部再來數發部在哪裡\n\n11:07.866 --> 11:24.419\n蘇發布就是更誇張了蘇發布難道都不會上網去看一下嗎這都跟你們沒有關係嗎不然蘇發布平常在幹嘛蘇發布都在做什麼這麼嚴重的事情對不對危害下一代的這個健康而且這是完全違法的你蘇發布都視而不見嗎\n\n11:25.934 --> 11:54.118\n報告委員針對這個淹害的部分的話基本上全職單位是衛福部那我們協助了一些事情比如說像我們希望他能夠藉行用平台的方式通知相關平台業者能夠向下而且我們建立了所謂的MetaGoogle這種大型平台的綠色通道也可以協助衛福部那另外在提到所以書發部你現在的想法就是說你是協助衛福部嘛對不對報告委員因為基本上警政署\n\n11:57.677 --> 12:24.088\n你也是協助衛福部是不是?跟委員報告你也協助衛福部嗎?這部分當然是大家要兩個部門都要跨機關來合作所以你會不會主動出擊?那基本上我想我們針對電子煙部我們還是在主軸還是在他有毒品的部分來做一個專責的查緝啦是,所以呢如果你不知道他有沒有毒品你就不查緝是這樣子講法嗎?\n\n12:25.894 --> 12:45.709\n我們當然不是說他這個毒品要看看他整個情質來源我們做綜合考量來做好就看起來你也是在協助的角色好那我想我下一個結論今天在教育部排定但是我覺得這個如果我們把所有的茶器通通放在校園當源頭我們把所有的責任都給老師我跟你講將來很多人已經不想再當老師了給他很多的這個壓力但是你沒有給他權利給他很多的責任但是我覺得法規都不清晰\n\n12:55.916 --> 12:56.136\n主席\n\n","segments":[{"start":2.712,"end":3.032,"text":"都上來了嗎?"},{"start":27.511,"end":28.772,"text":"今天大家所關心的問題"},{"start":41.489,"end":66.484,"text":"兩個禮拜前我們在衛福部才討論過這個問題兩個禮拜我們沒有看到在這個衛福委員會所提出來的這些問題點這些質疑點在這兩個禮拜當中在我們各部會有什麼樣進一步的去處理或解決所以也就是說委員會如果每一次開會完了以後我們還是原地踏步請問一下不管今天質詢也好 排專報也好意義在哪裡"},{"start":67.304,"end":80.073,"text":"那今天我想特別來在這個我們教育部這裡也要讓部長去除了闡述一下您所遇到的困難我們各部會、跨部會到底應該要怎麼做這是今天最重要的議題我想部長剛剛特別有在聽到您的這個口頭報告當中您有提到說在校園的部分呢您如果查獲學生攜帶"},{"start":89.259,"end":89.439,"text":"我想我確實"},{"start":113.162,"end":120.625,"text":"謝謝委員關心學校的整個一個學習更友善的一個校園環境更安全的校園環境他確實以我們現在的一個生態來講老師他的一個專業在一個教學的專業但是我們又希望青少年學童有一個更好的一個成長發展的空間那外面的許多的這些誘因確實也很大所以我才會一直希望說所以嘛部長請問一下嘛我現在請教您嘛老師怎麼查"},{"start":142.483,"end":157.456,"text":"老師基本上我們就會從過去在校園裡邊有學生有抽煙或者有一些異常的一些行為您的意思是說我們先做一個調查表問問看大家有沒有抽煙然後針對有抽煙的人我們再來查所以我請教您一下老師該怎麼查老師基本上是從他日常教學裡邊去觀察到學生的一個行為所以老師就是用觀察的對嗎"},{"start":168.971,"end":185.679,"text":"例如說我們有一些除了這個教室的觀察當然還有一些廁所或者學校有一些好在不同的地方我們來進行觀察是這樣嗎可能例如說有一些他就會有一些丟棄煙蒂阿或者一些差別的一些部長阿我想喔其實喔我們要面對這個問題啦我就問您啦老師在去查這個電子煙的時候你覺得他有這個權力有這個能力嗎有沒有"},{"start":195.56,"end":197.903,"text":"在校園裡面查到有電子煙的就你知道有多少件在今年這一整年當中"},{"start":213.117,"end":232.752,"text":"目前有38件有通報的總共就從校園裡面查到老師查出來有38件是這樣嗎好 我們來看一下你剛剛說查到有38件但是呢根據衛福部今天的資料看起來我們就講這個三年前的舊資料啦三年前的舊資料電子煙啦電子煙大概有7萬9千人有7萬9千人有這個吸食杯查緝7萬9這是舊資料喔"},{"start":242.279,"end":264.31,"text":"我相信黑書恐怕是這個好幾倍喔你看我們在校園查38件這是成比例嘛這是一個我想 我就 我質詢如果是各部會的可以來自己答喔那麼這個剛剛講到是舊資料但我今天在這邊還要特別講一件事電子煙我們大家都知道現在你不管是吸食啊 製造什麼的通通都是違法的我們都知道但是今天還要講一個喔加熱煙大家不要以為加熱煙就是合法的喔"},{"start":267.532,"end":275.601,"text":"加熱煙現在其實是中央主管機關公告的指定煙品不管是輸入製造等等都要經過健康風險評估我請教衛福部現在加熱煙的部分我們有沒有哪一件來申請而且是通過審查沒有 對"},{"start":282.509,"end":283.971,"text":"電子煙加熱煙加起來青少年將近10萬人去碰觸稀釋所以現在的資料"},{"start":300.549,"end":304.67,"text":"拿出來看我相信會讓所有的師長更痛心啦但我們校園查緝38件為什麼有困難嘛怎麼查你把這樣的責任丟給老師我跟你講這些老師這個是不可承受之重所以今天校園裡面發生這樣的事情電子煙的氾濫有的在校園裡面有的在校園周邊那誰的責任"},{"start":322.935,"end":323.115,"text":"主管機關說是衛福部"},{"start":353.095,"end":357.416,"text":"我問一下部長以及大家這個什麼叫電子維他命棒啊部長 什麼叫電子維他命棒來 以上都有知道什麼叫電子維他命棒的舉手好 那什麼叫蒸汽果汁知道的舉手"},{"start":376.361,"end":404.382,"text":"來 威福部告訴我什麼叫爭氣果汁因為電子煙本身就是它的煙彈本身所以電子煙的一種嘛 是不是電子煙的一種嘛可見喔 我今天要講啦大家都說在查緝 大家都說要防制啦可是呢 我必須要說啦有一些人傻傻的連電子煙加熱煙第一個還分不清楚法律的規範還不了解那麼有時候看到了學校老師看到甚至於還不知道那是電子煙部長有沒有這種可能"},{"start":406.643,"end":409.764,"text":"目前我手邊的資料確實如果按圖來比照我是可以的"},{"start":429.611,"end":458.122,"text":"暗圖來比較是可以食品拿來你可以嗎我目前沒有接受到食品所以我講部長這個我要講今天就是說雖然我們今天在教育部裡面排這個我們要知道打擊電子煙非法的這個不合法這些電子煙以及我們要維護我們青少年的健康我們都知道電子煙真的可以造成這個青少年不管他將來去吸食煙或者是很多的危害我們都很清楚了但是大家跨部會怎麼做嗎"},{"start":459.212,"end":464.235,"text":"對不對 這才是重點啊所以我想今天關務署也在現場關務署啊 沒上來啊算了 積極一點好不好積極一點好不好我想這幾年我們看到海關在查緝這個電子煙110年的時候有12.7萬隻但113年有4.2萬那我想請教一下這是查緝有成還是什麼原因為什麼會下降"},{"start":490.101,"end":515.945,"text":"報告委員 這個部分大概我們有分析過為什麼就是說 電子煙 講重點第一個 這個大部分電子煙來源地大概都是中國大陸那邊比較多那中國大陸近年來也都積極對這個電子煙加強他們的一個管理措施所以說這個部分 可能電子煙進到台灣來 這個部分所以你現在的意思是說 我們查緝有成是因為對岸管理的好"},{"start":516.969,"end":540.681,"text":"他因為就是說電子煙這個部分跟我們剛剛講的那個加熱煙這個部分可能有互相取代的關係我想這樣子講今天我們在這個境外的部分加強去查緝這當然是非常重要的一個重點不過我想一樣回到這個衛福部來看你看衛福部自己的國建署統計的資料今年的1月到10月我們查獲非法使用154件對嗎?國建署"},{"start":545.543,"end":569.578,"text":"今年的1月到10月您的資料154件但是我們看到光舊資料這新時的少年就高達了將近8萬人這是舊資料現在搞不好超過10萬但你看你查到的只能有154件剛剛校園裡面只有38件這多麼可怕的一件事情所以今天大家的口頭報告簡直就是浪費大家的時間講來講去都在講查緝防制結果是什麼過去做不好"},{"start":574.361,"end":578.142,"text":"上次衛環委員會兩個禮拜開完會以後到現在網路上一樣看到啊對但是我要跟委員說明兩個禮拜前的衛環委員會之後我們做了相當多的事情包括跟縣市合作剛才部長提到的是38件是他們的統計我跟委員報告這一個禮拜不到兩個禮拜的時間我們的縣市查處"},{"start":596.866,"end":603.891,"text":"包括跟警政合作跟校園合作大概有1000件以上但是因為他那個真正採取的量數還在統計是不是容我一個禮拜內提供採取的具體的資料給您所以呢意思是說校園裡面查處38件但是我們各方這個合力查處有超過1000件"},{"start":616.538,"end":639.247,"text":"在校園周邊跟警政署合作的部分所以我一個禮拜內會把這些統計的資料交給你我想當然我們這個38件跟1000件我們感覺好像成績更好一點點但是呢我們來看稀釋的人口超過10萬的青少年我想這個成績還是慘不忍睹所以呢我想今天在這裡本席等一下也是有這個臨時提案我們希望我們要這個衛福部主責"},{"start":643.709,"end":664.224,"text":"那但是呢我們跨部會是不是要有一個這個稽查防制的平台上次在外防委員會結束之後你們沒有做那現在本席要具體要求你們到底的這個橫向的聯繫那大家的合作怎麼做嘛從境外的這個查緝這個境內的不管是警政署、衛福部再來數發部在哪裡"},{"start":667.866,"end":684.419,"text":"蘇發布就是更誇張了蘇發布難道都不會上網去看一下嗎這都跟你們沒有關係嗎不然蘇發布平常在幹嘛蘇發布都在做什麼這麼嚴重的事情對不對危害下一代的這個健康而且這是完全違法的你蘇發布都視而不見嗎"},{"start":685.934,"end":714.118,"text":"報告委員 針對這個淹害的部分的話基本上全職單位是衛福部那我們協助了一些事情比如說像我們希望他能夠藉行用平台的方式通知相關平台業者能夠向下而且我們建立了所謂的MetaGoogle這種大型平台的綠色通道也可以協助衛福部那另外在提到所以書發部你現在的想法就是說你是協助衛福部嘛對不對報告委員 因為基本上警政署"},{"start":717.677,"end":744.088,"text":"你也是協助衛福部是不是?跟委員報告你也協助衛福部嗎?這部分當然是大家要兩個部門都要跨機關來合作所以你會不會主動出擊?那基本上我想我們針對電子煙部我們還是在主軸還是在他有毒品的部分來做一個專責的查緝啦是,所以呢如果你不知道他有沒有毒品你就不查緝是這樣子講法嗎?"},{"start":745.894,"end":765.709,"text":"我們當然不是說他這個毒品要看看他整個情質來源我們做綜合考量來做好就看起來你也是在協助的角色好那我想我下一個結論今天在教育部排定但是我覺得這個如果我們把所有的茶器通通放在校園當源頭我們把所有的責任都給老師我跟你講將來很多人已經不想再當老師了給他很多的這個壓力但是你沒有給他權利給他很多的責任但是我覺得法規都不清晰"},{"start":775.916,"end":776.136,"text":"主席"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":285,"blocks":[["萬委員美玲：（9時49分）謝謝主席，今天有來的各部會，我想都請一個代表。"],["主席：我們就請教育部、衛福部、法務部、數發部及警政署都上來，好不好？謝謝。"],["萬委員美玲：都上來了嗎？好。"],["鄭部長英耀：委員好。"],["萬委員美玲：部長，您現在這樣站著還可以吧？好，那我們來問一下。我想不管是我們洪孟楷委員、柯志恩委員今天所問的，其實是今天大家所關心的，我不免今天要在這裡講，兩個禮拜前我們在衛福部才討論過這個問題，而衛環委員會所提出來的這些問題點、這些質疑點，在這兩個禮拜當中，我們沒有看到我們各部會有什麼樣進一步的處理或解決，也就是說，委員會如果每次開完會以後，我們還是原地踏步，請問一下，不管今天是質詢也好，排專報也好，意義在哪裡？今天我想特別我們教育部在這裡，也要讓部長除了闡述一下你所遇到的困難，我們各部會跨部會到底應該要怎麼做，這是今天最重要的議題。","部長，剛剛聽到您的口頭報告當中有提到，在校園的部分，如果查獲學生攜帶，你就會轉衛生單位，這個源頭聽起來好像在學校裡面，你又說，如果查獲會給予適當的處置。剛剛我聽柯志恩委員在質詢的時候，您也沒有說出來現在到底要怎麼查、怎麼罰，難道源頭都是學校，責任都是老師嗎？請部長簡要的回答一下。"],["鄭部長英耀：謝謝委員關心學校的整個學習、更友善的一個校園環境、更安全的校園環境。確實以我們現在的生態來講，老師的專業是在教學的專業，但是我們又希望青少年學童有一個更好的成長發展的空間，外面許多的誘因確實也很大，所以我才會一直希望說……"],["萬委員美玲：所以部長，請問一下，我現在請教您，老師要怎麼查？"],["鄭部長英耀：基本上，我們就會從過去在校園裡面，有學生抽菸或者一些異常的行為……"],["萬委員美玲：您的意思是說，我們先做一個調查表，問問看大家有沒有抽菸，然後針對有抽菸的人，我們再來查？所以我請教您一下，老師該怎麼查？"],["鄭部長英耀：老師基本上是從他日常教學裡面去觀察學生的行為。"],["萬委員美玲：所以老師就是用觀察的，對嗎？"],["鄭部長英耀：譬如說，我們有一些除了教室的觀察，當然還有一些廁所或者學校有一些……"],["萬委員美玲：在不同的地方我們來進行觀察，是這樣嗎？"],["鄭部長英耀：譬如說會有一些丟棄菸蒂或者一些……"],["萬委員美玲：部長，我想我們要面對這個問題，我就問您，老師去查電子煙的時候，你覺得他有這個權力、有這個能力嗎？有沒有？"],["鄭部長英耀：就我們學生的受教權跟……"],["萬委員美玲：有沒有困難？我問你有沒有困難？"],["鄭部長英耀：當然是有挑戰、有困難的。"],["萬委員美玲：有困難、有困難嘛！"],["鄭部長英耀：是。"],["萬委員美玲：執行率高不高？"],["鄭部長英耀：確實我們基本上……"],["萬委員美玲：現在校園裡面查到有電子煙的，就你知道有多少件？在今年這一整年當中。"],["鄭部長英耀：目前有通報的有38件。"],["萬委員美玲：從校園裡面查到、老師查出來的總共有38件，是這樣嗎？好，我們來看一下，你剛剛說查到有38件，但是根據衛福部今天的資料看起來，我們就講三年前的舊資料，電子煙大概有7萬9,000人，有7萬9,000人有吸食被查緝，這是舊資料哦！我相信黑數恐怕是這個的好幾倍，你看我們在校園查到38件，這成比例嗎？這是一個，如果我的質詢是關於各部會的，可以自己來回答。剛剛講到的是舊資料，但我今天在這邊還要特別講一件事，電子煙，我們大家都知道，現在不管是吸食、製造什麼等等，統統都是違法的，我們都知道，但是今天還要講一個加熱菸，大家不要以為加熱菸就是合法的，加熱菸現在其實是中央主管機關公告的指定菸品，不管是輸入、製造等等，都要經過健康風險評估。我請教衛福部，現在加熱菸的部分，我們有沒有哪一件來申請而且是通過審查的？"],["賈副署長淑麗：沒有，目前沒有。"],["萬委員美玲：沒有，對，但是事實上加熱菸一樣氾濫，所以今天本席要在這裡講清楚，到目前為止，加熱菸也都是違法的。好，那我們來看，電子煙、加熱菸兩者加起來，我們青少年將近有十萬人，這是舊資料、三年前的舊資料，有將近十萬人去碰觸、吸食，所以現在的資料拿出來看，我相信會讓所有的師長更痛心，但我們的校園查緝是38件，為什麼？有困難嘛！怎麼查？你把這樣的責任丟給老師，我跟你講，對於這些老師這是不可承受之重！所以今天校園裡面發生這樣的事情，電子煙的氾濫，有的在校園裡面，有的在校園周邊，那是誰的責任？誰應該去做？今天不是你推我、我推他，主管機關今天說是衛福部，那請問一下，我想國健署是主管機關，但你做了什麼？第一個，校園裡面的查緝，你還是要由校園裡面的老師來做？"],["賈副署長淑麗：是。"],["萬委員美玲：你衛福部能做什麼？今天我們又看到了，在網路上面隨便google出來就這麼多、這麼多，我想剛剛洪孟楷委員google出來的，你也可以查一下，今天早上本席看了一下以後多得不得了，真的多得不得了。我問一下部長以及大家，什麼叫做電子維他命棒？部長，什麼叫做電子維他命棒？以上都有，知道什麼叫做電子維他命棒的舉手。好，那什麼叫做蒸氣果汁？知道的舉手。來，衛福部告訴我什麼叫蒸氣果汁。"],["賈副署長淑麗：因為電子煙本身就是它的煙彈本身……"],["萬委員美玲：所以是電子煙的一種嘛，是不是？電子煙的一種嘛？我今天要講，大家都說在查緝，大家都說要防制，可是我必須要說，有一些人傻傻的，連電子煙、加熱菸還分不清楚，法律的規範還不了解，有時候學校老師看到了，甚至還不知道那是電子煙，部長，有沒有這種可能？"],["鄭部長英耀：當然是存在的。"],["萬委員美玲：如果你看到你會知道嗎？"],["鄭部長英耀：跟委員報告，確實這幾天我們同仁有拿……"],["萬委員美玲：部長，如果你從孩子的書包看到一樣東西，其實它是電子煙，可是它有不同的表現狀態，你能夠辨識出那個就是電子煙嗎？"],["鄭部長英耀：目前我手邊的資料，確實如果按圖來比照，我是可以的。"],["萬委員美玲：按圖來比照是可以，那實品拿來你可以嗎？"],["鄭部長英耀：我目前沒有接受到實品。"],["萬委員美玲：所以部長，這個我要講，雖然我們今天在教育部裡面排這個，我們要知道，打擊電子煙、非法的、不合法的這些電子煙，以及我們要維護我們青少年的健康，我們都知道，電子煙真的可以造成青少年不管他將來去吸食菸，或者是很多的危害，這些我們都很清楚了，但是大家跨部會怎麼做，這才是重點啊！","今天關務署也在現場，關務署沒上來？署長，積極一點好不好？積極一點好不好？這幾年我們看到海關在查緝電子煙，110年的時候有12.7萬支，113年有4.2萬支，我想請教一下，這是查緝有成還是什麼原因，為什麼會下降？"],["陳副署長世鋒：報告委員，這個部分我們有分析過了，為什麼電子煙……"],["萬委員美玲：講重點！"],["陳副署長世鋒：第一個，大部分電子煙來源地大概都是中國大陸那邊比較多，中國大陸近年來也都積極對電子煙加強他們的管理措施，所以可能電子煙進到臺灣來這部分……"],["萬委員美玲：所以你現在的意思是說，我們查緝有成是因為對岸管理得好？"],["陳副署長世鋒：不是，因為就是說電子煙這個部分跟我們剛剛講的那個加熱菸這個部分，可能有互相取代的關係。"],["萬委員美玲：好，我想這樣子講啦，今天我們在境外的部分加強去查緝，這當然是非常重要的一個重點，不過，我想一樣回到衛福部來看，你看衛福部國健署自己統計的資料，今年的1月到10月，我們查獲非法使用有154件，對嗎？國健署，今年的1月到10月，您的資料是154件。"],["賈副署長淑麗：對。"],["萬委員美玲：但是我們看到舊資料，吸食的少年就高達將近八萬人，這是舊資料哦！現在搞不好超過十萬，但是你看，你查到的只有154件，剛剛校園裡面只有38件，這是多麼可怕的一件事情啊！所以今天大家的口頭報告，簡直就是浪費大家的時間，講來講去都在講查緝、防制、查緝、防制，結果是什麼？過去做不好，上次衛環委員會兩個禮拜開完會以後，到現在網路上一樣看到啊！"],["賈副署長淑麗：對，但是我要跟委員說明，兩個禮拜前的衛環委員會之後，我們做了相當多的事情，包括跟縣市合作，剛才部長提到的38件是他們的統計，我跟委員報告，這一個禮拜、不到兩個禮拜的時間，我們的縣市查處，包括跟警政合作、跟校園合作，大概有一千件以上，但是因為真正裁處的量數還在統計，是不是容我一個禮拜內提供裁處的具體資料給您？"],["萬委員美玲：所以你的意思是說，校園裡面查處38件，但是我們各方合力查處的超過一千件，是這樣嗎？"],["賈副署長淑麗：對，包括在校園周邊，跟警政署合作的部分，所以我一個禮拜內會把這些統計的資料交給您。"],["萬委員美玲：我想，這個38件跟1,000件，我們感覺好像成績更好一點點，但是我們來看吸食人口超過10萬的青少年，我想這個成績還是慘不忍睹。所以今天本席等一下也是有臨時提案，我們希望，這是衛福部主責，但是跨部會是不是要有一個稽查防制的平臺？上次在衛環委員會結束之後你們沒有做，現在本席要具體要求，你們到底橫向的聯繫、大家的合作，怎麼做嘛？從境外的查緝，還有境內的不管是警政署、衛福部，再來數發部在哪裡？數發部就更誇張了，數發部難道都不會上網去看一下嗎？這都跟你們沒有關係嗎？不然數發部平常在幹嘛？數發部都在做什麼？這麼嚴重的事情！對不對？危害下一代的健康，而且這完全是違法的，你數發部都視而不見嗎？"],["牛司長信仁：報告委員，針對菸害的部分，基本上權責單位是衛福部，我們協助了一些事情，比如說，我們希望它能夠用平臺的方式通知相關平臺業者下架，而且我們建立了所謂的Meta、Google這種大型平臺的綠色通道，也可以協助衛福部。另外在TW……"],["萬委員美玲：所以數發部你現在的想法就是，你是協助衛福部嘛，對不對？"],["牛司長信仁：報告委員……"],["萬委員美玲：警政署，你也是協助衛福部，是不是？"],["陳副局長炯旭：跟委員報告……"],["萬委員美玲：你也協助衛福部嗎？"],["陳副局長炯旭：這部分當然是兩個部門要跨機關合作。"],["萬委員美玲：所以你會不會主動出擊？"],["陳副局長炯旭：基本上，我想針對電子煙部分，主軸還是在它有毒品的部分來做一個專責的查緝。"],["萬委員美玲：是，所以，如果你不知道他有沒有毒品，你就不查緝！是這樣子講法嗎？"],["陳副局長炯旭：有沒有毒品要看整個情資來源，我們做綜合考量。"],["萬委員美玲：看起來你也是協助的角色嘛！好，我想我下一個結論，今天在教育部排定，但是我覺得如果我們把所有的查緝通通放在校園當源頭，我們把所有的責任都給老師，我跟你講，將來很多人已經不想再當老師了，給他很多的壓力，但是你沒有給他權力，給他很多的責任，但是我覺得法規都不清楚，所以我希望各部會一起來協助教育部，會後一定要成立一個跨部會的查緝防制平臺小組，等一下在我的臨時提案當中，我們來做一個決議，好不好？以上，謝謝。"],["賈副署長淑麗：謝謝委員。"],["主席（萬委員美玲）：接下來有請葛如鈞委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":74,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-22-7","speakers":["萬美玲","洪孟楷","柯志恩","葛如鈞","張雅琳","陳秀寳","陳培瑜","吳沛憶","林倩綺","郭昱晴","羅智強","李坤城","沈伯洋","黃健豪","楊瓊瓔","麥玉珍","羅廷瑋","林月琴","范雲","翁曉玲","鍾佳濱","葉元之","莊瑞雄","林宜瑾","林倩綺","吳春城"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-11-07"],"gazette_id":"1139601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1139601_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期教育及文化委員會第7次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請教育部部長鄭英耀、衛生福利部、法務部、數位發展部、內政部警政署、財政部關務署列席\n就「電子煙入侵校園危害青少年防制檢討」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1139601_00001"}}}