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\"事實上如果有這個違反這個兒少或是性侵這些的案例我們事實上都會通報會通報是不是會通報會通報可是我問就沒有啊我問我問委員我就說他就我問他說欸那國外的有通報國內有通報嗎他說沒有啦國外的有啦所以國外的比較嚴重國內的比較不嚴重\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 603.621, \"end\": 603.781, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 603.781, \"end\": 604.382, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 604.382, \"end\": 604.562, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 604.562, \"end\": 604.702, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 604.702, \"end\": 606.024, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"違\"}, {\"word\": \"反\", \"start\": 606.024, \"end\": 607.105, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"兒\"}, {\"word\": \"少\", \"start\": 607.105, \"end\": 607.305, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"或\", \"start\": 607.305, \"end\": 607.485, \"score\": 0.906}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 607.485, \"end\": 607.605, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"性\", \"start\": 607.605, \"end\": 607.825, \"score\": 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\"這個問題我覺得非常奇怪第二個問題因為這個事情被媒體報導之後後來移民署就有接到很多記者的查證記者後來就直接公布了這個美國人他的長相、他的基本資料全部把它公布出來所以現在全台灣都知道他是誰了可是為什麼每一次只要是國內有發生這個狀況媒體都不敢報導\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 625.445, \"end\": 625.965, \"score\": 0.865}, {\"word\": \"覺\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 625.965, \"end\": 626.306, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"非\", \"start\": 626.306, \"end\": 626.966, \"score\": 0.819}, {\"word\": \"常\", \"start\": 626.966, \"end\": 627.166, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"奇\", \"start\": 627.166, \"end\": 627.306, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"怪\", \"start\": 627.306, \"end\": 627.506, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 627.506, \"end\": 627.766, \"score\": 0.841}, {\"word\": \"二\", \"start\": 627.766, \"end\": 628.747, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 628.747, \"end\": 629.227, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": 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742.258, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"葉\"}, {\"word\": \"元\", \"start\": 743.118, \"end\": 743.498, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 743.498, \"end\": 743.579, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 743.579, \"end\": 743.599, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,609 --> 00:00:18,100\n時間8加2麻煩請教育部、衛福部、法務部、警政署、事務發布以上五位謝謝委員好A4部長好\n\n2\n00:00:27,358 --> 00:00:53,405\n我們今天討論電子煙那剛剛也有很多人提到現在很多毒品透過電子煙的形式讓大家可以用這個方式來吸毒特別是有一個新興毒品叫伊托米子這個毒品現在大家都非常關注為什麼呢光是三個月內就有兩個警察因為跟就是這些毒價的關係有人毒價關係所以上升不幸的殉職大家都非常難過\n\n3\n00:00:54,724 --> 00:01:17,210\n但我們發現說針對這一個新興的毒品我們現在政府的管制還是非常的遲緩這個毒非常的恐怖為什麼它叫做上司煙彈或上司毒呢是因為吸了之後就會跟殭屍一樣它會沒有失去知覺這麼恐怖\n\n4\n00:01:19,071 --> 00:01:38,912\n那照道理來講我們政府單位應該要想辦法全面的防避讓這個毒品來販售可是你知道它有多氾濫嗎我給各位在場的所有官員看一下我們隨便在網路上都找得到這是在臉書隨便你只要Google關鍵字它的學名或者是中文依托咪子就有人在賣\n\n5\n00:01:40,493 --> 00:01:56,918\n除了這樣就算了還有社團有一個公開社團專門在討論這個依託彌子然後甚至於在討論怎麼交易用什麼方式交易呢我跟你講多誇張好不好這是另外在臉書上查到的啦\n\n6\n00:01:57,861 --> 00:02:18,719\n那你如果去跟他對話我的助理去跟他對話問他要怎麼買他說你哪個地區臺北市可以面交嗎可以啊我們現在的臺北市首都居然可以面交去買毒品我先問我先問那個蘇阿布蘇阿布是師長是不是你們對於網路的控管到底是怎麼樣\n\n7\n00:02:24,983 --> 00:02:43,629\n報告委員這涉及刑事案件是警政署在處理所以不關你們書發部的事啊不是因為這是網路欸大家對於書發部的期待都是希望能夠針對網路有些犯罪行為書發部要用你們的網路技術來做防弊嘛結果你居然說這是警政署的事好謝謝書發部我知道你們態度了那警政署書發部說是你們的事啊是你們辦事不利啦所以網路社團才出現這個狀況你可以接受嗎\n\n8\n00:02:54,141 --> 00:03:09,546\n報告委員我想我們網路查緝這一塊我們也是投了很多心力啦但是我們也有網路專門在網路刑查如果這部分有這些信息我們都會立案欸Google關鍵字查得到啊Google需要花你多少時間需要多少多少回答啊\n\n9\n00:03:16,260 --> 00:03:41,890\n我想網站查你當然很快啦對啊那為什麼你們會查不到那你們如果說查不到你請事務發布透過一些程式方式屏蔽可不可以可不可以根本也不好這兩部分你剛才講的這部分也許我們我們必須有在立案偵查因為是個案的方式我這個不是很清楚但是如果說個案當然你不清楚嘛我現在講的是說隨便都搜得到嘛我覺得我光跟事務發布光跟檢討講話我就覺得難怪這個毒品會這麼氾濫的嘛\n\n10\n00:03:45,911 --> 00:03:55,900\n一個書發布說不管我的事你們連透過你們的網路技術去防避你都覺得跟你無關另外警政署說哎呀我們今天很辛苦了啦然後自己又承認說啊Google當然很容易啊\n\n11\n00:03:56,840 --> 00:04:11,726\n你們兩個機關到底知道你們在講什麼嗎?你們到底知道在講什麼嗎?好繼續我們繼續來看我們其實實際上是編了很多的防毒的預算總共分三期第一期編了100億第二期150億我們現在正要編第三期150億這是你們的預算分配啦其中我們的\n\n12\n00:04:19,366 --> 00:04:35,280\n防毒的預算大概超過一半都是用在戒毒那在驗毒的部分大概只編了7.69而已啊只編了7.69那最誇張是什麼呢請問一下警政署你們現在有沒有在買脫民衣紙的快篩試劑有沒有\n\n13\n00:04:36,688 --> 00:05:01,595\n目前我們已經有配花九千七百七九千七嘛對不對對然後你覺得夠嗎當然這個後期我們會你覺得夠嗎你覺得夠嗎目前在數量上當然還有在不足但是對好那請教一下現在不夠的原因是因為你你覺得太貴沒有經費還是你買不到跟委員報告因為一脫名職累生也是進來的事那第一期所以是買不到是不是不是買不到因為還是沒有經費\n\n14\n00:05:03,479 --> 00:05:28,866\n在第一章本來這個驗毒的經費都地方在編列啦地方編列所以又退給地方那地方經費夠不夠你有去問嗎因為這是新增的業務啊事實上我們在今年啦我們在年底我們最近也剛撥了一筆經費給地方要他們來購買這一些相關的那所以會跟你們警政署無關的是地方的事沒有沒有這個我們已經警政署編列一下才資源給地方我跟您報告喔九千七根本就不夠啦\n\n15\n00:05:30,165 --> 00:05:57,300\n很多地方的派出所只分到一支啦那一支他不敢用啦因為只有一支啦政局之寶啦不敢用啦我們總共有一千六百多個派出所你如果加偵查隊加上各個寶大你覺得夠嗎一個地方可能就分到三四支一個晚上就用完了啦他不敢用啦所以你們告訴我們說你們要棄毒連這個四季都不夠你棄什麼毒啦這個要怎麼去解決\n\n16\n00:06:01,184 --> 00:06:29,212\n報告委員、警政署這邊補充報告剛剛陳委員這邊垂詢我們現在目前針對已經採購9000多劑的部分我們在追加現在目前採購一萬多一萬兩千一萬兩千還是不夠嘛我剛剛就跟你講嘛九千七百劑的狀況之下有的派出所只有一劑啦那我們現在變兩劑我們現在有一萬六千四百劑也追加兩百三十幾萬還是不夠啦你現在是沒有錢還是買不到嘛我們有經費也有給有經費也買得到是不是那你不願意買是為什麼\n\n17\n00:06:30,953 --> 00:06:40,448\n請你們去補足好不好請你們去補足請你們去補足好謝謝那另外這跟再不有關因為像是國教聯盟也有特別有提到有針對我剛剛講那個議題\n\n18\n00:06:43,462 --> 00:07:05,934\n就有提到就是說這個網路的監控力道根本不足法律雖然禁止網路的販售但是根本沒有嚴格的查緝機制因為今天在場所有官員部長你的位階最高只有你可能平常會跟行政院長開會請你把剛剛各單位他們回答我的問題的回答方式跟院長講一下好不好他們就是偷推來推去也不認為這是一件事\n\n19\n00:07:07,205 --> 00:07:30,513\n但是實際上今天來教育文化委員會是因為大家非常擔心校園會發生這個狀況可是各單位就是那個樣子你有看到嗎?所以請部長跟院長報告這個事情可以嗎?可以嗎?可以嗎?可以好數八部說網路監控跟他無關警政署的事警政署說他已經很累了這些狀況跟他講喔第二個校園檢測跟執行也很困難傳統的檢測方法對電子煙也無效所以這個問題要怎麼解決?\n\n20\n00:07:37,950 --> 00:08:04,266\n我想我們確實現在目前在做就是比較就是一個從宣導到尿特殊學生的這個尿液篩檢然後到春葵莊就是說檢驗方式很困因為我的了解現在的校園就是針對傳統的菸的方式去檢測嘛我們在這個部我們我們對學生的一個人權有一定的因為教育單位我們必須要對每個學生的一個人權\n\n21\n00:08:05,707 --> 00:08:23,321\n所以這個部我們會跟這個衛福部還有這個警政署、法務部裡面我們會合作怎麼做嗎?怎麼做啊?這個怎麼做啊?這個國教行動聯盟意見也可能也不會只給我們嘛網路上看到應該也會給你們你們要怎麼做嗎?\n\n22\n00:08:27,526 --> 00:08:54,292\n我們為什麼受這個檢測就是說懷疑所裡面檢測然後剛才委員所提的有許多的那些檢測的試劑我們現在大概並沒有針對好你等一下去思考一下好不好看起來是沒準備啦檢測試劑如果你們能夠購買的話買一些啦好再來還有一個議題可能剛剛有些委員有問到就是移民署有通函給\n\n23\n00:08:55,012 --> 00:09:17,998\n外交部、勞動部、教育部所有一個美國的有性犯罪的前科的一個人已經入境了那就我的了解教育部好像也有發文給一些學校教育局透過教育局發文給一些學校幼兒園也有就是希望他們能夠知道有這個狀況然後如果要聘外師的話這個是高風險族群對吧你沒有做這個事吧但是我現在不解的也是一件事情\n\n24\n00:09:19,598 --> 00:09:47,188\n針對國外的這樣有性犯罪前科的人我們教育部可以做這個動作可是為什麼針對我們國內有性犯罪前科的人卻不能做這個動作舉例來講齁前一段時間有爆發一個幼兒園有一個毛性的這個老師性侵害了39個兒童嘛我特別去問了一些幼兒園的園長我說教育部有沒有通知你們說這個人有問題請你們以後不要有機會的話也要特別小心\n\n25\n00:09:49,653 --> 00:10:02,604\n你們總會撤交他的執照嗎?撤交執照讓他沒有辦法...讓他不能這樣做,但是有沒有只要一有類似的狀況就立刻同意?做任何的防避機制有沒有?\n\n26\n00:10:03,621 --> 00:10:23,602\n事實上如果有這個違反這個兒少或是性侵這些的案例我們事實上都會通報會通報是不是會通報會通報可是我問就沒有啊我問我問委員我就說他就我問他說欸那國外的有通報國內有通報嗎他說沒有啦國外的有啦所以國外的比較嚴重國內的比較不嚴重\n\n27\n00:10:25,445 --> 00:10:43,795\n這個問題我覺得非常奇怪第二個問題因為這個事情被媒體報導之後後來移民署就有接到很多記者的查證記者後來就直接公布了這個美國人他的長相、他的基本資料全部把它公布出來所以現在全台灣都知道他是誰了可是為什麼每一次只要是國內有發生這個狀況媒體都不敢報導\n\n28\n00:10:47,076 --> 00:11:01,728\n比如就要說某某幼兒園然後或者是某某毛姓老師甚至於什麼姓都不敢講為什麼台灣的媒體碰到這A4事件的時候都不能夠公布為什麼是因為被衛福部保護師恐嚇過還是怎樣衛福有來嗎為什麼為什麼國外的可以國內的不行\n\n29\n00:11:10,250 --> 00:11:27,630\n各位委員報告我是衛福部保護服務司那有關於那個兒犬法是有規定69條是有規定是針對兒少的個資是不能公佈的所以可以負向的行為是就是如果兒童的行為可以但為什麼上一次所有媒體都不敢公佈那位狼屍的資料為什麼\n\n30\n00:11:29,500 --> 00:11:52,297\n可能是媒體比較擔心沒有媒體講說都不敢啊因為私下你們都會跟他說不行啊你們公開講都說可以但是他們私下接受的訊息都是不可以所以他們不敢公布啊那你現在公開呼籲說以後大家所有的媒體都可以比照好不好只要有發生類似事件不管是國外國內有媒體查證我們一律可以公布他的全部的資料給國人警惕這樣可以嗎\n\n31\n00:11:53,058 --> 00:12:22,258\n各位委員報告因為這件事情後來我們其實有做了一個跟媒體的單位有做一些討論那我們未來會做一個媒體的會編提供給媒體因為我們最主要是之前最主要在法裡面是規定不能公告的是兒少的個資但是可能在公告兒少個資的時候可能會影射去可能在這個公告這個加害人的時候可能會影射到這個兒少那為了讓大家在報導上可以比較周全所以我們未來會做一個會議\n\n32\n00:12:23,118 --> 00:12:23,599\n葉元之委員質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n609\t18100\t時間8加2麻煩請教育部、衛福部、法務部、警政署、事務發布以上五位謝謝委員好A4部長好\n27358\t53405\t我們今天討論電子煙那剛剛也有很多人提到現在很多毒品透過電子煙的形式讓大家可以用這個方式來吸毒特別是有一個新興毒品叫伊托米子這個毒品現在大家都非常關注為什麼呢光是三個月內就有兩個警察因為跟就是這些毒價的關係有人毒價關係所以上升不幸的殉職大家都非常難過\n54724\t77210\t但我們發現說針對這一個新興的毒品我們現在政府的管制還是非常的遲緩這個毒非常的恐怖為什麼它叫做上司煙彈或上司毒呢是因為吸了之後就會跟殭屍一樣它會沒有失去知覺這麼恐怖\n79071\t98912\t那照道理來講我們政府單位應該要想辦法全面的防避讓這個毒品來販售可是你知道它有多氾濫嗎我給各位在場的所有官員看一下我們隨便在網路上都找得到這是在臉書隨便你只要Google關鍵字它的學名或者是中文依托咪子就有人在賣\n100493\t116918\t除了這樣就算了還有社團有一個公開社團專門在討論這個依託彌子然後甚至於在討論怎麼交易用什麼方式交易呢我跟你講多誇張好不好這是另外在臉書上查到的啦\n117861\t138719\t那你如果去跟他對話我的助理去跟他對話問他要怎麼買他說你哪個地區臺北市可以面交嗎可以啊我們現在的臺北市首都居然可以面交去買毒品我先問我先問那個蘇阿布蘇阿布是師長是不是你們對於網路的控管到底是怎麼樣\n144983\t163629\t報告委員這涉及刑事案件是警政署在處理所以不關你們書發部的事啊不是因為這是網路欸大家對於書發部的期待都是希望能夠針對網路有些犯罪行為書發部要用你們的網路技術來做防弊嘛結果你居然說這是警政署的事好謝謝書發部我知道你們態度了那警政署書發部說是你們的事啊是你們辦事不利啦所以網路社團才出現這個狀況你可以接受嗎\n174141\t189546\t報告委員我想我們網路查緝這一塊我們也是投了很多心力啦但是我們也有網路專門在網路刑查如果這部分有這些信息我們都會立案欸 Google關鍵字查得到啊Google需要花你多少時間需要多少多少回答啊\n196260\t221890\t我想網站查你當然很快啦對啊那為什麼你們會查不到那你們如果說查不到你請事務發布透過一些程式方式屏蔽可不可以可不可以根本也不好這兩部分你剛才講的這部分也許我們我們必須有在立案偵查因為是個案的方式我這個不是很清楚但是如果說個案當然你不清楚嘛我現在講的是說隨便都搜得到嘛我覺得我光跟事務發布光跟檢討講話我就覺得難怪這個毒品會這麼氾濫的嘛\n225911\t235900\t一個書發布說不管我的事你們連透過你們的網路技術去防避你都覺得跟你無關另外警政署說哎呀我們今天很辛苦了啦然後自己又承認說啊Google當然很容易啊\n236840\t251726\t你們兩個機關到底知道你們在講什麼嗎?你們到底知道在講什麼嗎?好 繼續 我們繼續來看我們其實實際上是編了很多的防毒的預算總共分三期第一期編了100億第二期150億我們現在正要編第三期150億這是你們的預算分配啦其中我們的\n259366\t275280\t防毒的預算大概超過一半都是用在戒毒那在驗毒的部分大概只編了7.69而已啊只編了7.69那最誇張是什麼呢請問一下警政署你們現在有沒有在買脫民衣紙的快篩試劑有沒有\n276688\t301595\t目前我們已經有配花九千七百七九千七嘛對不對對然後你覺得夠嗎當然這個後期我們會你覺得夠嗎你覺得夠嗎目前在數量上當然還有在不足但是對好那請教一下現在不夠的原因是因為你你覺得太貴沒有經費還是你買不到跟委員報告因為一脫名職累生也是進來的事那第一期所以是買不到是不是不是買不到因為還是沒有經費\n303479\t328866\t在第一章 本來這個驗毒的經費都地方在編列啦地方編列所以又退給地方那地方經費夠不夠你有去問嗎因為這是新增的業務啊事實上我們在今年啦我們在年底我們最近也剛撥了一筆經費給地方要他們來購買這一些相關的那所以會跟你們警政署無關的是地方的事沒有沒有 這個我們已經警政署編列一下才資源給地方我跟您報告喔九千七根本就不夠啦\n330165\t357300\t很多地方的派出所只分到一支啦那一支他不敢用啦因為只有一支啦政局之寶啦不敢用啦我們總共有一千六百多個派出所你如果加偵查隊加上各個寶大你覺得夠嗎一個地方可能就分到三四支一個晚上就用完了啦他不敢用啦所以你們告訴我們說你們要棄毒連這個四季都不夠你棄什麼毒啦這個要怎麼去解決\n361184\t389212\t報告委員、警政署這邊補充報告剛剛陳委員這邊垂詢我們現在目前針對已經採購9000多劑的部分我們在追加現在目前採購一萬多一萬兩千一萬兩千還是不夠嘛我剛剛就跟你講嘛九千七百劑的狀況之下有的派出所只有一劑啦那我們現在變兩劑我們現在有一萬六千四百劑也追加兩百三十幾萬還是不夠啦你現在是沒有錢還是買不到嘛我們有經費也有給有經費也買得到是不是那你不願意買是為什麼\n390953\t400448\t請你們去補足好不好請你們去補足請你們去補足好 謝謝那另外這跟再不有關因為像是國教聯盟也有特別有提到有針對我剛剛講那個議題\n403462\t425934\t就有提到就是說這個網路的監控力道根本不足法律雖然禁止網路的販售但是根本沒有嚴格的查緝機制因為今天在場所有官員部長你的位階最高只有你可能平常會跟行政院長開會請你把剛剛各單位他們回答我的問題的回答方式跟院長講一下好不好他們就是偷推來推去也不認為這是一件事\n427205\t450513\t但是實際上今天來教育文化委員會是因為大家非常擔心校園會發生這個狀況可是各單位就是那個樣子你有看到嗎?所以請部長跟院長報告這個事情可以嗎?可以嗎?可以嗎?可以好 數八部說網路監控跟他無關警政署的事警政署說他已經很累了這些狀況跟他講喔第二個校園檢測跟執行也很困難傳統的檢測方法對電子煙也無效所以這個問題要怎麼解決?\n457950\t484266\t我想我們確實現在目前在做就是比較就是一個從宣導到尿特殊學生的這個尿液篩檢然後到春葵莊就是說檢驗方式很困因為我的了解現在的校園就是針對傳統的菸的方式去檢測嘛我們在這個部我們我們對學生的一個人權有一定的因為教育單位我們必須要對每個學生的一個人權\n485707\t503321\t所以這個部我們會跟這個衛福部還有這個警政署、法務部裡面我們會合作怎麼做嗎?怎麼做啊?這個怎麼做啊?這個國教行動聯盟意見也可能也不會只給我們嘛網路上看到應該也會給你們你們要怎麼做嗎?\n507526\t534292\t我們為什麼受這個檢測就是說懷疑所裡面檢測然後剛才委員所提的有許多的那些檢測的試劑我們現在大概並沒有針對好你等一下去思考一下好不好看起來是沒準備啦檢測試劑如果你們能夠購買的話買一些啦好再來還有一個議題可能剛剛有些委員有問到就是移民署有通函給\n535012\t557998\t外交部、勞動部、教育部所有一個美國的有性犯罪的前科的一個人已經入境了那就我的了解教育部好像也有發文給一些學校教育局透過教育局發文給一些學校幼兒園也有就是希望他們能夠知道有這個狀況然後如果要聘外師的話這個是高風險族群對吧你沒有做這個事吧但是我現在不解的也是一件事情\n559598\t587188\t針對國外的這樣有性犯罪前科的人我們教育部可以做這個動作可是為什麼針對我們國內有性犯罪前科的人卻不能做這個動作舉例來講齁前一段時間有爆發一個幼兒園有一個毛性的這個老師性侵害了39個兒童嘛我特別去問了一些幼兒園的園長我說教育部有沒有通知你們說這個人有問題請你們以後不要有機會的話也要特別小心\n589653\t602604\t你們總會撤交他的執照嗎?撤交執照讓他沒有辦法...讓他不能這樣做,但是有沒有只要一有類似的狀況就立刻同意?做任何的防避機制有沒有?\n603621\t623602\t事實上如果有這個違反這個兒少或是性侵這些的案例我們事實上都會通報會通報是不是會通報會通報可是我問就沒有啊我問我問委員我就說他就我問他說欸那國外的有通報國內有通報嗎他說沒有啦國外的有啦所以國外的比較嚴重國內的比較不嚴重\n625445\t643795\t這個問題我覺得非常奇怪第二個問題因為這個事情被媒體報導之後後來移民署就有接到很多記者的查證記者後來就直接公布了這個美國人他的長相、他的基本資料全部把它公布出來所以現在全台灣都知道他是誰了可是為什麼每一次只要是國內有發生這個狀況媒體都不敢報導\n647076\t661728\t比如就要說某某幼兒園然後或者是某某毛姓老師甚至於什麼姓都不敢講為什麼台灣的媒體碰到這A4事件的時候都不能夠公布為什麼是因為被衛福部保護師恐嚇過還是怎樣衛福有來嗎為什麼為什麼國外的可以國內的不行\n670250\t687630\t各位委員報告我是衛福部保護服務司那有關於那個兒犬法是有規定69條是有規定是針對兒少的個資是不能公佈的所以可以負向的行為是就是如果兒童的行為可以但為什麼上一次所有媒體都不敢公佈那位狼屍的資料為什麼\n689500\t712297\t可能是媒體比較擔心沒有媒體講說都不敢啊因為私下你們都會跟他說不行啊你們公開講都說可以但是他們私下接受的訊息都是不可以所以他們不敢公布啊那你現在公開呼籲說以後大家所有的媒體都可以比照好不好只要有發生類似事件不管是國外國內有媒體查證我們一律可以公布他的全部的資料給國人警惕這樣可以嗎\n713058\t742258\t各位委員報告因為這件事情後來我們其實有做了一個跟媒體的單位有做一些討論那我們未來會做一個媒體的會編提供給媒體因為我們最主要是之前最主要在法裡面是規定不能公告的是兒少的個資但是可能在公告兒少個資的時候可能會影射去可能在這個公告這個加害人的時候可能會影射到這個兒少那為了讓大家在報導上可以比較周全所以我們未來會做一個會議\n743118\t743599\t葉元之委員質詢\n","txt":"時間8加2麻煩請教育部、衛福部、法務部、警政署、事務發布以上五位謝謝委員好A4部長好\n我們今天討論電子煙那剛剛也有很多人提到現在很多毒品透過電子煙的形式讓大家可以用這個方式來吸毒特別是有一個新興毒品叫伊托米子這個毒品現在大家都非常關注為什麼呢光是三個月內就有兩個警察因為跟就是這些毒價的關係有人毒價關係所以上升不幸的殉職大家都非常難過\n但我們發現說針對這一個新興的毒品我們現在政府的管制還是非常的遲緩這個毒非常的恐怖為什麼它叫做上司煙彈或上司毒呢是因為吸了之後就會跟殭屍一樣它會沒有失去知覺這麼恐怖\n那照道理來講我們政府單位應該要想辦法全面的防避讓這個毒品來販售可是你知道它有多氾濫嗎我給各位在場的所有官員看一下我們隨便在網路上都找得到這是在臉書隨便你只要Google關鍵字它的學名或者是中文依托咪子就有人在賣\n除了這樣就算了還有社團有一個公開社團專門在討論這個依託彌子然後甚至於在討論怎麼交易用什麼方式交易呢我跟你講多誇張好不好這是另外在臉書上查到的啦\n那你如果去跟他對話我的助理去跟他對話問他要怎麼買他說你哪個地區臺北市可以面交嗎可以啊我們現在的臺北市首都居然可以面交去買毒品我先問我先問那個蘇阿布蘇阿布是師長是不是你們對於網路的控管到底是怎麼樣\n報告委員這涉及刑事案件是警政署在處理所以不關你們書發部的事啊不是因為這是網路欸大家對於書發部的期待都是希望能夠針對網路有些犯罪行為書發部要用你們的網路技術來做防弊嘛結果你居然說這是警政署的事好謝謝書發部我知道你們態度了那警政署書發部說是你們的事啊是你們辦事不利啦所以網路社團才出現這個狀況你可以接受嗎\n報告委員我想我們網路查緝這一塊我們也是投了很多心力啦但是我們也有網路專門在網路刑查如果這部分有這些信息我們都會立案欸 Google關鍵字查得到啊Google需要花你多少時間需要多少多少回答啊\n我想網站查你當然很快啦對啊那為什麼你們會查不到那你們如果說查不到你請事務發布透過一些程式方式屏蔽可不可以可不可以根本也不好這兩部分你剛才講的這部分也許我們我們必須有在立案偵查因為是個案的方式我這個不是很清楚但是如果說個案當然你不清楚嘛我現在講的是說隨便都搜得到嘛我覺得我光跟事務發布光跟檢討講話我就覺得難怪這個毒品會這麼氾濫的嘛\n一個書發布說不管我的事你們連透過你們的網路技術去防避你都覺得跟你無關另外警政署說哎呀我們今天很辛苦了啦然後自己又承認說啊Google當然很容易啊\n你們兩個機關到底知道你們在講什麼嗎?你們到底知道在講什麼嗎?好 繼續 我們繼續來看我們其實實際上是編了很多的防毒的預算總共分三期第一期編了100億第二期150億我們現在正要編第三期150億這是你們的預算分配啦其中我們的\n防毒的預算大概超過一半都是用在戒毒那在驗毒的部分大概只編了7.69而已啊只編了7.69那最誇張是什麼呢請問一下警政署你們現在有沒有在買脫民衣紙的快篩試劑有沒有\n目前我們已經有配花九千七百七九千七嘛對不對對然後你覺得夠嗎當然這個後期我們會你覺得夠嗎你覺得夠嗎目前在數量上當然還有在不足但是對好那請教一下現在不夠的原因是因為你你覺得太貴沒有經費還是你買不到跟委員報告因為一脫名職累生也是進來的事那第一期所以是買不到是不是不是買不到因為還是沒有經費\n在第一章 本來這個驗毒的經費都地方在編列啦地方編列所以又退給地方那地方經費夠不夠你有去問嗎因為這是新增的業務啊事實上我們在今年啦我們在年底我們最近也剛撥了一筆經費給地方要他們來購買這一些相關的那所以會跟你們警政署無關的是地方的事沒有沒有 這個我們已經警政署編列一下才資源給地方我跟您報告喔九千七根本就不夠啦\n很多地方的派出所只分到一支啦那一支他不敢用啦因為只有一支啦政局之寶啦不敢用啦我們總共有一千六百多個派出所你如果加偵查隊加上各個寶大你覺得夠嗎一個地方可能就分到三四支一個晚上就用完了啦他不敢用啦所以你們告訴我們說你們要棄毒連這個四季都不夠你棄什麼毒啦這個要怎麼去解決\n報告委員、警政署這邊補充報告剛剛陳委員這邊垂詢我們現在目前針對已經採購9000多劑的部分我們在追加現在目前採購一萬多一萬兩千一萬兩千還是不夠嘛我剛剛就跟你講嘛九千七百劑的狀況之下有的派出所只有一劑啦那我們現在變兩劑我們現在有一萬六千四百劑也追加兩百三十幾萬還是不夠啦你現在是沒有錢還是買不到嘛我們有經費也有給有經費也買得到是不是那你不願意買是為什麼\n請你們去補足好不好請你們去補足請你們去補足好 謝謝那另外這跟再不有關因為像是國教聯盟也有特別有提到有針對我剛剛講那個議題\n就有提到就是說這個網路的監控力道根本不足法律雖然禁止網路的販售但是根本沒有嚴格的查緝機制因為今天在場所有官員部長你的位階最高只有你可能平常會跟行政院長開會請你把剛剛各單位他們回答我的問題的回答方式跟院長講一下好不好他們就是偷推來推去也不認為這是一件事\n但是實際上今天來教育文化委員會是因為大家非常擔心校園會發生這個狀況可是各單位就是那個樣子你有看到嗎?所以請部長跟院長報告這個事情可以嗎?可以嗎?可以嗎?可以好 數八部說網路監控跟他無關警政署的事警政署說他已經很累了這些狀況跟他講喔第二個校園檢測跟執行也很困難傳統的檢測方法對電子煙也無效所以這個問題要怎麼解決?\n我想我們確實現在目前在做就是比較就是一個從宣導到尿特殊學生的這個尿液篩檢然後到春葵莊就是說檢驗方式很困因為我的了解現在的校園就是針對傳統的菸的方式去檢測嘛我們在這個部我們我們對學生的一個人權有一定的因為教育單位我們必須要對每個學生的一個人權\n所以這個部我們會跟這個衛福部還有這個警政署、法務部裡面我們會合作怎麼做嗎?怎麼做啊?這個怎麼做啊?這個國教行動聯盟意見也可能也不會只給我們嘛網路上看到應該也會給你們你們要怎麼做嗎?\n我們為什麼受這個檢測就是說懷疑所裡面檢測然後剛才委員所提的有許多的那些檢測的試劑我們現在大概並沒有針對好你等一下去思考一下好不好看起來是沒準備啦檢測試劑如果你們能夠購買的話買一些啦好再來還有一個議題可能剛剛有些委員有問到就是移民署有通函給\n外交部、勞動部、教育部所有一個美國的有性犯罪的前科的一個人已經入境了那就我的了解教育部好像也有發文給一些學校教育局透過教育局發文給一些學校幼兒園也有就是希望他們能夠知道有這個狀況然後如果要聘外師的話這個是高風險族群對吧你沒有做這個事吧但是我現在不解的也是一件事情\n針對國外的這樣有性犯罪前科的人我們教育部可以做這個動作可是為什麼針對我們國內有性犯罪前科的人卻不能做這個動作舉例來講齁前一段時間有爆發一個幼兒園有一個毛性的這個老師性侵害了39個兒童嘛我特別去問了一些幼兒園的園長我說教育部有沒有通知你們說這個人有問題請你們以後不要有機會的話也要特別小心\n你們總會撤交他的執照嗎?撤交執照讓他沒有辦法...讓他不能這樣做,但是有沒有只要一有類似的狀況就立刻同意?做任何的防避機制有沒有?\n事實上如果有這個違反這個兒少或是性侵這些的案例我們事實上都會通報會通報是不是會通報會通報可是我問就沒有啊我問我問委員我就說他就我問他說欸那國外的有通報國內有通報嗎他說沒有啦國外的有啦所以國外的比較嚴重國內的比較不嚴重\n這個問題我覺得非常奇怪第二個問題因為這個事情被媒體報導之後後來移民署就有接到很多記者的查證記者後來就直接公布了這個美國人他的長相、他的基本資料全部把它公布出來所以現在全台灣都知道他是誰了可是為什麼每一次只要是國內有發生這個狀況媒體都不敢報導\n比如就要說某某幼兒園然後或者是某某毛姓老師甚至於什麼姓都不敢講為什麼台灣的媒體碰到這A4事件的時候都不能夠公布為什麼是因為被衛福部保護師恐嚇過還是怎樣衛福有來嗎為什麼為什麼國外的可以國內的不行\n各位委員報告我是衛福部保護服務司那有關於那個兒犬法是有規定69條是有規定是針對兒少的個資是不能公佈的所以可以負向的行為是就是如果兒童的行為可以但為什麼上一次所有媒體都不敢公佈那位狼屍的資料為什麼\n可能是媒體比較擔心沒有媒體講說都不敢啊因為私下你們都會跟他說不行啊你們公開講都說可以但是他們私下接受的訊息都是不可以所以他們不敢公布啊那你現在公開呼籲說以後大家所有的媒體都可以比照好不好只要有發生類似事件不管是國外國內有媒體查證我們一律可以公布他的全部的資料給國人警惕這樣可以嗎\n各位委員報告因為這件事情後來我們其實有做了一個跟媒體的單位有做一些討論那我們未來會做一個媒體的會編提供給媒體因為我們最主要是之前最主要在法裡面是規定不能公告的是兒少的個資但是可能在公告兒少個資的時候可能會影射去可能在這個公告這個加害人的時候可能會影射到這個兒少那為了讓大家在報導上可以比較周全所以我們未來會做一個會議\n葉元之委員質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.609 --> 00:18.100\n時間8加2麻煩請教育部、衛福部、法務部、警政署、事務發布以上五位謝謝委員好A4部長好\n\n00:27.358 --> 00:53.405\n我們今天討論電子煙那剛剛也有很多人提到現在很多毒品透過電子煙的形式讓大家可以用這個方式來吸毒特別是有一個新興毒品叫伊托米子這個毒品現在大家都非常關注為什麼呢光是三個月內就有兩個警察因為跟就是這些毒價的關係有人毒價關係所以上升不幸的殉職大家都非常難過\n\n00:54.724 --> 01:17.210\n但我們發現說針對這一個新興的毒品我們現在政府的管制還是非常的遲緩這個毒非常的恐怖為什麼它叫做上司煙彈或上司毒呢是因為吸了之後就會跟殭屍一樣它會沒有失去知覺這麼恐怖\n\n01:19.071 --> 01:38.912\n那照道理來講我們政府單位應該要想辦法全面的防避讓這個毒品來販售可是你知道它有多氾濫嗎我給各位在場的所有官員看一下我們隨便在網路上都找得到這是在臉書隨便你只要Google關鍵字它的學名或者是中文依托咪子就有人在賣\n\n01:40.493 --> 01:56.918\n除了這樣就算了還有社團有一個公開社團專門在討論這個依託彌子然後甚至於在討論怎麼交易用什麼方式交易呢我跟你講多誇張好不好這是另外在臉書上查到的啦\n\n01:57.861 --> 02:18.719\n那你如果去跟他對話我的助理去跟他對話問他要怎麼買他說你哪個地區臺北市可以面交嗎可以啊我們現在的臺北市首都居然可以面交去買毒品我先問我先問那個蘇阿布蘇阿布是師長是不是你們對於網路的控管到底是怎麼樣\n\n02:24.983 --> 02:43.629\n報告委員這涉及刑事案件是警政署在處理所以不關你們書發部的事啊不是因為這是網路欸大家對於書發部的期待都是希望能夠針對網路有些犯罪行為書發部要用你們的網路技術來做防弊嘛結果你居然說這是警政署的事好謝謝書發部我知道你們態度了那警政署書發部說是你們的事啊是你們辦事不利啦所以網路社團才出現這個狀況你可以接受嗎\n\n02:54.141 --> 03:09.546\n報告委員我想我們網路查緝這一塊我們也是投了很多心力啦但是我們也有網路專門在網路刑查如果這部分有這些信息我們都會立案欸Google關鍵字查得到啊Google需要花你多少時間需要多少多少回答啊\n\n03:16.260 --> 03:41.890\n我想網站查你當然很快啦對啊那為什麼你們會查不到那你們如果說查不到你請事務發布透過一些程式方式屏蔽可不可以可不可以根本也不好這兩部分你剛才講的這部分也許我們我們必須有在立案偵查因為是個案的方式我這個不是很清楚但是如果說個案當然你不清楚嘛我現在講的是說隨便都搜得到嘛我覺得我光跟事務發布光跟檢討講話我就覺得難怪這個毒品會這麼氾濫的嘛\n\n03:45.911 --> 03:55.900\n一個書發布說不管我的事你們連透過你們的網路技術去防避你都覺得跟你無關另外警政署說哎呀我們今天很辛苦了啦然後自己又承認說啊Google當然很容易啊\n\n03:56.840 --> 04:11.726\n你們兩個機關到底知道你們在講什麼嗎?你們到底知道在講什麼嗎?好繼續我們繼續來看我們其實實際上是編了很多的防毒的預算總共分三期第一期編了100億第二期150億我們現在正要編第三期150億這是你們的預算分配啦其中我們的\n\n04:19.366 --> 04:35.280\n防毒的預算大概超過一半都是用在戒毒那在驗毒的部分大概只編了7.69而已啊只編了7.69那最誇張是什麼呢請問一下警政署你們現在有沒有在買脫民衣紙的快篩試劑有沒有\n\n04:36.688 --> 05:01.595\n目前我們已經有配花九千七百七九千七嘛對不對對然後你覺得夠嗎當然這個後期我們會你覺得夠嗎你覺得夠嗎目前在數量上當然還有在不足但是對好那請教一下現在不夠的原因是因為你你覺得太貴沒有經費還是你買不到跟委員報告因為一脫名職累生也是進來的事那第一期所以是買不到是不是不是買不到因為還是沒有經費\n\n05:03.479 --> 05:28.866\n在第一章本來這個驗毒的經費都地方在編列啦地方編列所以又退給地方那地方經費夠不夠你有去問嗎因為這是新增的業務啊事實上我們在今年啦我們在年底我們最近也剛撥了一筆經費給地方要他們來購買這一些相關的那所以會跟你們警政署無關的是地方的事沒有沒有這個我們已經警政署編列一下才資源給地方我跟您報告喔九千七根本就不夠啦\n\n05:30.165 --> 05:57.300\n很多地方的派出所只分到一支啦那一支他不敢用啦因為只有一支啦政局之寶啦不敢用啦我們總共有一千六百多個派出所你如果加偵查隊加上各個寶大你覺得夠嗎一個地方可能就分到三四支一個晚上就用完了啦他不敢用啦所以你們告訴我們說你們要棄毒連這個四季都不夠你棄什麼毒啦這個要怎麼去解決\n\n06:01.184 --> 06:29.212\n報告委員、警政署這邊補充報告剛剛陳委員這邊垂詢我們現在目前針對已經採購9000多劑的部分我們在追加現在目前採購一萬多一萬兩千一萬兩千還是不夠嘛我剛剛就跟你講嘛九千七百劑的狀況之下有的派出所只有一劑啦那我們現在變兩劑我們現在有一萬六千四百劑也追加兩百三十幾萬還是不夠啦你現在是沒有錢還是買不到嘛我們有經費也有給有經費也買得到是不是那你不願意買是為什麼\n\n06:30.953 --> 06:40.448\n請你們去補足好不好請你們去補足請你們去補足好謝謝那另外這跟再不有關因為像是國教聯盟也有特別有提到有針對我剛剛講那個議題\n\n06:43.462 --> 07:05.934\n就有提到就是說這個網路的監控力道根本不足法律雖然禁止網路的販售但是根本沒有嚴格的查緝機制因為今天在場所有官員部長你的位階最高只有你可能平常會跟行政院長開會請你把剛剛各單位他們回答我的問題的回答方式跟院長講一下好不好他們就是偷推來推去也不認為這是一件事\n\n07:07.205 --> 07:30.513\n但是實際上今天來教育文化委員會是因為大家非常擔心校園會發生這個狀況可是各單位就是那個樣子你有看到嗎?所以請部長跟院長報告這個事情可以嗎?可以嗎?可以嗎?可以好數八部說網路監控跟他無關警政署的事警政署說他已經很累了這些狀況跟他講喔第二個校園檢測跟執行也很困難傳統的檢測方法對電子煙也無效所以這個問題要怎麼解決?\n\n07:37.950 --> 08:04.266\n我想我們確實現在目前在做就是比較就是一個從宣導到尿特殊學生的這個尿液篩檢然後到春葵莊就是說檢驗方式很困因為我的了解現在的校園就是針對傳統的菸的方式去檢測嘛我們在這個部我們我們對學生的一個人權有一定的因為教育單位我們必須要對每個學生的一個人權\n\n08:05.707 --> 08:23.321\n所以這個部我們會跟這個衛福部還有這個警政署、法務部裡面我們會合作怎麼做嗎?怎麼做啊?這個怎麼做啊?這個國教行動聯盟意見也可能也不會只給我們嘛網路上看到應該也會給你們你們要怎麼做嗎?\n\n08:27.526 --> 08:54.292\n我們為什麼受這個檢測就是說懷疑所裡面檢測然後剛才委員所提的有許多的那些檢測的試劑我們現在大概並沒有針對好你等一下去思考一下好不好看起來是沒準備啦檢測試劑如果你們能夠購買的話買一些啦好再來還有一個議題可能剛剛有些委員有問到就是移民署有通函給\n\n08:55.012 --> 09:17.998\n外交部、勞動部、教育部所有一個美國的有性犯罪的前科的一個人已經入境了那就我的了解教育部好像也有發文給一些學校教育局透過教育局發文給一些學校幼兒園也有就是希望他們能夠知道有這個狀況然後如果要聘外師的話這個是高風險族群對吧你沒有做這個事吧但是我現在不解的也是一件事情\n\n09:19.598 --> 09:47.188\n針對國外的這樣有性犯罪前科的人我們教育部可以做這個動作可是為什麼針對我們國內有性犯罪前科的人卻不能做這個動作舉例來講齁前一段時間有爆發一個幼兒園有一個毛性的這個老師性侵害了39個兒童嘛我特別去問了一些幼兒園的園長我說教育部有沒有通知你們說這個人有問題請你們以後不要有機會的話也要特別小心\n\n09:49.653 --> 10:02.604\n你們總會撤交他的執照嗎?撤交執照讓他沒有辦法...讓他不能這樣做,但是有沒有只要一有類似的狀況就立刻同意?做任何的防避機制有沒有?\n\n10:03.621 --> 10:23.602\n事實上如果有這個違反這個兒少或是性侵這些的案例我們事實上都會通報會通報是不是會通報會通報可是我問就沒有啊我問我問委員我就說他就我問他說欸那國外的有通報國內有通報嗎他說沒有啦國外的有啦所以國外的比較嚴重國內的比較不嚴重\n\n10:25.445 --> 10:43.795\n這個問題我覺得非常奇怪第二個問題因為這個事情被媒體報導之後後來移民署就有接到很多記者的查證記者後來就直接公布了這個美國人他的長相、他的基本資料全部把它公布出來所以現在全台灣都知道他是誰了可是為什麼每一次只要是國內有發生這個狀況媒體都不敢報導\n\n10:47.076 --> 11:01.728\n比如就要說某某幼兒園然後或者是某某毛姓老師甚至於什麼姓都不敢講為什麼台灣的媒體碰到這A4事件的時候都不能夠公布為什麼是因為被衛福部保護師恐嚇過還是怎樣衛福有來嗎為什麼為什麼國外的可以國內的不行\n\n11:10.250 --> 11:27.630\n各位委員報告我是衛福部保護服務司那有關於那個兒犬法是有規定69條是有規定是針對兒少的個資是不能公佈的所以可以負向的行為是就是如果兒童的行為可以但為什麼上一次所有媒體都不敢公佈那位狼屍的資料為什麼\n\n11:29.500 --> 11:52.297\n可能是媒體比較擔心沒有媒體講說都不敢啊因為私下你們都會跟他說不行啊你們公開講都說可以但是他們私下接受的訊息都是不可以所以他們不敢公布啊那你現在公開呼籲說以後大家所有的媒體都可以比照好不好只要有發生類似事件不管是國外國內有媒體查證我們一律可以公布他的全部的資料給國人警惕這樣可以嗎\n\n11:53.058 --> 12:22.258\n各位委員報告因為這件事情後來我們其實有做了一個跟媒體的單位有做一些討論那我們未來會做一個媒體的會編提供給媒體因為我們最主要是之前最主要在法裡面是規定不能公告的是兒少的個資但是可能在公告兒少個資的時候可能會影射去可能在這個公告這個加害人的時候可能會影射到這個兒少那為了讓大家在報導上可以比較周全所以我們未來會做一個會議\n\n12:23.118 --> 12:23.599\n葉元之委員質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.609,"end":18.1,"text":"時間8加2麻煩請教育部、衛福部、法務部、警政署、事務發布以上五位謝謝委員好A4部長好"},{"start":27.358,"end":53.405,"text":"我們今天討論電子煙那剛剛也有很多人提到現在很多毒品透過電子煙的形式讓大家可以用這個方式來吸毒特別是有一個新興毒品叫伊托米子這個毒品現在大家都非常關注為什麼呢光是三個月內就有兩個警察因為跟就是這些毒價的關係有人毒價關係所以上升不幸的殉職大家都非常難過"},{"start":54.724,"end":77.21,"text":"但我們發現說針對這一個新興的毒品我們現在政府的管制還是非常的遲緩這個毒非常的恐怖為什麼它叫做上司煙彈或上司毒呢是因為吸了之後就會跟殭屍一樣它會沒有失去知覺這麼恐怖"},{"start":79.071,"end":98.912,"text":"那照道理來講我們政府單位應該要想辦法全面的防避讓這個毒品來販售可是你知道它有多氾濫嗎我給各位在場的所有官員看一下我們隨便在網路上都找得到這是在臉書隨便你只要Google關鍵字它的學名或者是中文依托咪子就有人在賣"},{"start":100.493,"end":116.918,"text":"除了這樣就算了還有社團有一個公開社團專門在討論這個依託彌子然後甚至於在討論怎麼交易用什麼方式交易呢我跟你講多誇張好不好這是另外在臉書上查到的啦"},{"start":117.861,"end":138.719,"text":"那你如果去跟他對話我的助理去跟他對話問他要怎麼買他說你哪個地區臺北市可以面交嗎可以啊我們現在的臺北市首都居然可以面交去買毒品我先問我先問那個蘇阿布蘇阿布是師長是不是你們對於網路的控管到底是怎麼樣"},{"start":144.983,"end":163.629,"text":"報告委員這涉及刑事案件是警政署在處理所以不關你們書發部的事啊不是因為這是網路欸大家對於書發部的期待都是希望能夠針對網路有些犯罪行為書發部要用你們的網路技術來做防弊嘛結果你居然說這是警政署的事好謝謝書發部我知道你們態度了那警政署書發部說是你們的事啊是你們辦事不利啦所以網路社團才出現這個狀況你可以接受嗎"},{"start":174.141,"end":189.546,"text":"報告委員我想我們網路查緝這一塊我們也是投了很多心力啦但是我們也有網路專門在網路刑查如果這部分有這些信息我們都會立案欸 Google關鍵字查得到啊Google需要花你多少時間需要多少多少回答啊"},{"start":196.26,"end":221.89,"text":"我想網站查你當然很快啦對啊那為什麼你們會查不到那你們如果說查不到你請事務發布透過一些程式方式屏蔽可不可以可不可以根本也不好這兩部分你剛才講的這部分也許我們我們必須有在立案偵查因為是個案的方式我這個不是很清楚但是如果說個案當然你不清楚嘛我現在講的是說隨便都搜得到嘛我覺得我光跟事務發布光跟檢討講話我就覺得難怪這個毒品會這麼氾濫的嘛"},{"start":225.911,"end":235.9,"text":"一個書發布說不管我的事你們連透過你們的網路技術去防避你都覺得跟你無關另外警政署說哎呀我們今天很辛苦了啦然後自己又承認說啊Google當然很容易啊"},{"start":236.84,"end":251.726,"text":"你們兩個機關到底知道你們在講什麼嗎?你們到底知道在講什麼嗎?好 繼續 我們繼續來看我們其實實際上是編了很多的防毒的預算總共分三期第一期編了100億第二期150億我們現在正要編第三期150億這是你們的預算分配啦其中我們的"},{"start":259.366,"end":275.28,"text":"防毒的預算大概超過一半都是用在戒毒那在驗毒的部分大概只編了7.69而已啊只編了7.69那最誇張是什麼呢請問一下警政署你們現在有沒有在買脫民衣紙的快篩試劑有沒有"},{"start":276.688,"end":301.595,"text":"目前我們已經有配花九千七百七九千七嘛對不對對然後你覺得夠嗎當然這個後期我們會你覺得夠嗎你覺得夠嗎目前在數量上當然還有在不足但是對好那請教一下現在不夠的原因是因為你你覺得太貴沒有經費還是你買不到跟委員報告因為一脫名職累生也是進來的事那第一期所以是買不到是不是不是買不到因為還是沒有經費"},{"start":303.479,"end":328.866,"text":"在第一章 本來這個驗毒的經費都地方在編列啦地方編列所以又退給地方那地方經費夠不夠你有去問嗎因為這是新增的業務啊事實上我們在今年啦我們在年底我們最近也剛撥了一筆經費給地方要他們來購買這一些相關的那所以會跟你們警政署無關的是地方的事沒有沒有 這個我們已經警政署編列一下才資源給地方我跟您報告喔九千七根本就不夠啦"},{"start":330.165,"end":357.3,"text":"很多地方的派出所只分到一支啦那一支他不敢用啦因為只有一支啦政局之寶啦不敢用啦我們總共有一千六百多個派出所你如果加偵查隊加上各個寶大你覺得夠嗎一個地方可能就分到三四支一個晚上就用完了啦他不敢用啦所以你們告訴我們說你們要棄毒連這個四季都不夠你棄什麼毒啦這個要怎麼去解決"},{"start":361.184,"end":389.212,"text":"報告委員、警政署這邊補充報告剛剛陳委員這邊垂詢我們現在目前針對已經採購9000多劑的部分我們在追加現在目前採購一萬多一萬兩千一萬兩千還是不夠嘛我剛剛就跟你講嘛九千七百劑的狀況之下有的派出所只有一劑啦那我們現在變兩劑我們現在有一萬六千四百劑也追加兩百三十幾萬還是不夠啦你現在是沒有錢還是買不到嘛我們有經費也有給有經費也買得到是不是那你不願意買是為什麼"},{"start":390.953,"end":400.448,"text":"請你們去補足好不好請你們去補足請你們去補足好 謝謝那另外這跟再不有關因為像是國教聯盟也有特別有提到有針對我剛剛講那個議題"},{"start":403.462,"end":425.934,"text":"就有提到就是說這個網路的監控力道根本不足法律雖然禁止網路的販售但是根本沒有嚴格的查緝機制因為今天在場所有官員部長你的位階最高只有你可能平常會跟行政院長開會請你把剛剛各單位他們回答我的問題的回答方式跟院長講一下好不好他們就是偷推來推去也不認為這是一件事"},{"start":427.205,"end":450.513,"text":"但是實際上今天來教育文化委員會是因為大家非常擔心校園會發生這個狀況可是各單位就是那個樣子你有看到嗎?所以請部長跟院長報告這個事情可以嗎?可以嗎?可以嗎?可以好 數八部說網路監控跟他無關警政署的事警政署說他已經很累了這些狀況跟他講喔第二個校園檢測跟執行也很困難傳統的檢測方法對電子煙也無效所以這個問題要怎麼解決?"},{"start":457.95,"end":484.266,"text":"我想我們確實現在目前在做就是比較就是一個從宣導到尿特殊學生的這個尿液篩檢然後到春葵莊就是說檢驗方式很困因為我的了解現在的校園就是針對傳統的菸的方式去檢測嘛我們在這個部我們我們對學生的一個人權有一定的因為教育單位我們必須要對每個學生的一個人權"},{"start":485.707,"end":503.321,"text":"所以這個部我們會跟這個衛福部還有這個警政署、法務部裡面我們會合作怎麼做嗎?怎麼做啊?這個怎麼做啊?這個國教行動聯盟意見也可能也不會只給我們嘛網路上看到應該也會給你們你們要怎麼做嗎?"},{"start":507.526,"end":534.292,"text":"我們為什麼受這個檢測就是說懷疑所裡面檢測然後剛才委員所提的有許多的那些檢測的試劑我們現在大概並沒有針對好你等一下去思考一下好不好看起來是沒準備啦檢測試劑如果你們能夠購買的話買一些啦好再來還有一個議題可能剛剛有些委員有問到就是移民署有通函給"},{"start":535.012,"end":557.998,"text":"外交部、勞動部、教育部所有一個美國的有性犯罪的前科的一個人已經入境了那就我的了解教育部好像也有發文給一些學校教育局透過教育局發文給一些學校幼兒園也有就是希望他們能夠知道有這個狀況然後如果要聘外師的話這個是高風險族群對吧你沒有做這個事吧但是我現在不解的也是一件事情"},{"start":559.598,"end":587.188,"text":"針對國外的這樣有性犯罪前科的人我們教育部可以做這個動作可是為什麼針對我們國內有性犯罪前科的人卻不能做這個動作舉例來講齁前一段時間有爆發一個幼兒園有一個毛性的這個老師性侵害了39個兒童嘛我特別去問了一些幼兒園的園長我說教育部有沒有通知你們說這個人有問題請你們以後不要有機會的話也要特別小心"},{"start":589.653,"end":602.604,"text":"你們總會撤交他的執照嗎?撤交執照讓他沒有辦法...讓他不能這樣做,但是有沒有只要一有類似的狀況就立刻同意?做任何的防避機制有沒有?"},{"start":603.621,"end":623.602,"text":"事實上如果有這個違反這個兒少或是性侵這些的案例我們事實上都會通報會通報是不是會通報會通報可是我問就沒有啊我問我問委員我就說他就我問他說欸那國外的有通報國內有通報嗎他說沒有啦國外的有啦所以國外的比較嚴重國內的比較不嚴重"},{"start":625.445,"end":643.795,"text":"這個問題我覺得非常奇怪第二個問題因為這個事情被媒體報導之後後來移民署就有接到很多記者的查證記者後來就直接公布了這個美國人他的長相、他的基本資料全部把它公布出來所以現在全台灣都知道他是誰了可是為什麼每一次只要是國內有發生這個狀況媒體都不敢報導"},{"start":647.076,"end":661.728,"text":"比如就要說某某幼兒園然後或者是某某毛姓老師甚至於什麼姓都不敢講為什麼台灣的媒體碰到這A4事件的時候都不能夠公布為什麼是因為被衛福部保護師恐嚇過還是怎樣衛福有來嗎為什麼為什麼國外的可以國內的不行"},{"start":670.25,"end":687.63,"text":"各位委員報告我是衛福部保護服務司那有關於那個兒犬法是有規定69條是有規定是針對兒少的個資是不能公佈的所以可以負向的行為是就是如果兒童的行為可以但為什麼上一次所有媒體都不敢公佈那位狼屍的資料為什麼"},{"start":689.5,"end":712.297,"text":"可能是媒體比較擔心沒有媒體講說都不敢啊因為私下你們都會跟他說不行啊你們公開講都說可以但是他們私下接受的訊息都是不可以所以他們不敢公布啊那你現在公開呼籲說以後大家所有的媒體都可以比照好不好只要有發生類似事件不管是國外國內有媒體查證我們一律可以公布他的全部的資料給國人警惕這樣可以嗎"},{"start":713.058,"end":742.258,"text":"各位委員報告因為這件事情後來我們其實有做了一個跟媒體的單位有做一些討論那我們未來會做一個媒體的會編提供給媒體因為我們最主要是之前最主要在法裡面是規定不能公告的是兒少的個資但是可能在公告兒少個資的時候可能會影射去可能在這個公告這個加害人的時候可能會影射到這個兒少那為了讓大家在報導上可以比較周全所以我們未來會做一個會議"},{"start":743.118,"end":743.599,"text":"葉元之委員質詢"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":1181,"blocks":[["葉委員元之：（12時59分）麻煩請教育部、衛福部、法務部、警政署和數發部。"],["主席：以上5位，謝謝。"],["鄭部長英耀：委員好。"],["葉委員元之：部長好。我們今天討論電子煙，剛剛也有很多委員提到，現在很多毒品透過電子煙的形式，讓大家可以用這個方式來吸毒，特別是一個叫依托咪酯的新興毒品，這個毒品現在大家都非常關注。為什麼呢？因為光是三個月內，就有兩位警察因為他人毒駕的關係而不幸殉職，大家都非常難過，但我們發現針對這個新興的毒品，現在政府的管制還是非常的遲緩，這個毒非常的恐怖，為什麼它叫做喪屍煙彈或喪屍毒呢？是因為吸了之後就會跟殭屍一樣，會失去知覺，這麼恐怖！照道理來講，我們政府單位應該要想辦法針對這個毒品的販售全面來防避嘛！可是你知道它有多氾濫嗎？我給各位在場所有官員看一下，我們隨便在網路上都找得到耶！這是在臉書，你只要隨便google關鍵字比如它的學名或者是中文「依托咪酯」，就會看到有人在賣；這樣就算了，還有社團！有一個公開社團專門在討論這個依托咪酯，甚至討論怎麼交易。他們用什麼方式交易呢？我跟你講多誇張好不好？這是另外在臉書上查到的，你如果去跟他對話，我的助理去跟他對話，問他要怎麼買，他問在哪個地區，回說在臺北市，問「可以面交嗎？」回答是「可以啊」！我們現在的臺北市──首都居然可以面交去買毒品！我先問數發部，數發部是司長列席是不是？你們對於網路的控管到底是怎麼樣？"],["牛司長信仁：報告委員，這涉及刑事案件，是警政署在處理。"],["葉委員元之：所以不關你們數發部的事？"],["牛司長信仁：不是，因為這是……"],["葉委員元之：這是網路耶！大家對於數發部的期待，都是希望針對網路上的……尤其是犯罪行為，數發部能用你們的網路技術來防避，結果你居然說這是警政署的事！好，謝謝數發部，我知道你們的態度了。那就請問警政署，數發部說是你們的事，是你們辦事不力，所以網路社團才出現這個狀況。這個你可以接受嗎？"],["陳副局長炯旭：報告委員，在網路查緝這塊，我們也是投了很多心力，我們也有人專門在網路巡查，如果這部分有這些信息，我們都會立案。"],["葉委員元之：Google關鍵字查得到耶！google一下需要花你多少時間？需要多少時間？回答啊！"],["陳副局長炯旭：我想網站查詢當然很快。"],["葉委員元之：對啊！那為什麼你們會查不到？你們如果查不到，請數發部透過一些程式方式去屏蔽，可不可以？"],["陳副局長炯旭：跟委員報告，這是兩部分，你剛才講的這部分也許我們地區有在立案偵查，因為是個案，我不是很清楚，但是如果有查到……"],["葉委員元之：個案你當然不清楚，我現在講的是說網上隨便都搜得到嘛！我光跟數發部、跟警政署講話，就覺得難怪這個毒品會這麼氾濫了嘛！數發部說不關我的事，你們連透過你們的網路技術防避你都覺得跟你無關；警政署則說：「唉呦！我們已經很辛苦了啦」，然後自己又承認說google一下當然很容易啊！你們兩個機關到底知道你們在講什麼嗎？你們到底知道在講什麼嗎？我們繼續來看，我們實際上編了很多的防毒預算，總共分三期，第一期編了100億元，第二期編150億元，我們現在正要編第三期的150億元，這是你們的預算分配，防毒預算中大概超過一半都是用在戒毒，在驗毒的部分大概只編了7.69%而已，最誇張的是什麼呢？請問一下警政署，你們現在有沒有在買依托咪酯的快篩試劑？有沒有？"],["陳副局長炯旭：目前我們已經有配發9,700劑。"],["葉委員元之：9,700嘛，對不對？你覺得夠嗎？"],["陳副局長炯旭：當然這個後續我們會……"],["葉委員元之：你覺得夠嗎？"],["陳副局長炯旭：目前在數量上當然還有些不足，但是我們實際的……"],["葉委員元之：請教一下，現在不夠的原因是因為覺得太貴、沒有經費，還是買不到？"],["陳副局長炯旭：跟委員報告，因為依托咪指列為三級是近來的事，那……"],["葉委員元之：所以是買不到是不是？"],["陳副局長炯旭：不是買不到。"],["葉委員元之：還是沒有經費？"],["陳副局長炯旭：這個驗毒的經費都是地方在編列……"],["葉委員元之：地方編列？所以又推給地方？地方的經費夠不夠你有去問嗎？因為這是新增的業務啊！"],["陳副局長炯旭：事實上我們在今年年底就是最近也剛撥了一筆經費給地方，要他們來購買這些相關的試劑。"],["葉委員元之：所以跟你們警政署無關了，是地方的事？"],["陳副局長炯旭：我們警政署已經編列預算來支援地方。"],["葉委員元之：我跟你報告，9,700劑根本就不夠，很多地方的派出所只分到一支，那一支他還不敢用，因為只有一支，鎮局之寶啊！所以不敢用。我們總共有一千六百多個派出所，如果加上偵查隊再加上各個保大，你覺得夠嗎？一個地方可能就分到三、四支，一個晚上就用完了，他都不敢用啊！所以你們告訴我們說你們要緝毒，連試劑都不夠，你緝什麼毒啦！這個要怎麼去解決？"],["劉副大隊長貞汝：報告委員，警政署這邊補充報告。誠如委員垂詢，針對目前已經採購九千多劑的部分，我們現在再追加，目前採購1萬2,000劑。"],["葉委員元之：1萬2,000劑還是不夠嘛！我剛剛跟你講了，採購9,700劑的狀況之下，有的派出所只有一劑啦！現在是變兩劑。"],["劉副大隊長貞汝：我們現在有1萬6,400劑，也追加二百三十幾萬。"],["葉委員元之：還是不夠啦！你們現在是沒有錢還是買不到？"],["劉副大隊長貞汝：我們有經費也有給地方……"],["葉委員元之：有經費也買得到，是不是？那你不願意買是為什麼？"],["劉副大隊長貞汝：不是，地方這邊……"],["葉委員元之：請你們去補足好不好？"],["劉副大隊長貞汝：是，這個有補助。"],["葉委員元之：請你們去補足。謝謝！"],["劉副大隊長貞汝：是！是！是！"],["葉委員元之：另外一點跟教育部有關，針對我剛剛講的那個議題，國教聯盟也特別提到，網路的監控力道根本不足，法律雖然禁止網路的販售，但是根本沒有嚴格的查緝機制。因為部長是今天在場所有官員中位階最高的，只有你平常可能會跟行政院長開會，所以請你把剛剛各單位針對我所提問題的回答方式跟院長講一下，好不好？他們就是推來推去，也不認為這是一件事啦！但是實際上我們今天來教育及文化委員會是因為大家非常擔心校園會發生這個狀況，可是各單位就是那個樣子，你有看到嘛！所以請部長跟院長報告這個事情，可以嗎？可以嗎？"],["鄭部長英耀：可以。"],["葉委員元之：數發部說網路監控跟他無關，是警政署的事；警政署說他已經很累了。以上這些狀況要跟他講喔！","國教聯盟的第二個意見是校園檢測跟執行也很困難，傳統的檢測方法對電子煙也無效，所以這個問題要怎麼解決？"],["鄭部長英耀：確實我們目前比較在做的，就是從宣導到特殊學生的尿液篩檢然後到春暉專案……"],["葉委員元之：就是檢驗方式很困難嘛！因為據我的瞭解，現在校園就是針對傳統菸的方式去檢測嘛！"],["鄭部長英耀：在這個部分，因為是教育單位，我們必須要對每個學生的人權有一定的尊重，所以對這個部分，我們會跟衛福部還有警政署、法務部合作。"],["葉委員元之：怎麼做嘛？到底這個要怎麼做啊？國教行動聯盟的意見不會只給我們嘛！網路上看得到，應該也會給你們，你們要怎麼做嘛？"],["鄭部長英耀：我們現在看到的這個檢測，就是說環醫所裡邊的檢測，剛才委員所提的有許多檢測的試劑，我們現在大概並沒有針對特別……"],["葉委員元之：好，OK，你再去思考一下好不好？看起來是沒準備啦！檢驗試劑如果你們能夠購買的話也買一些啦。","再來還有一個議題，可能剛剛有些委員有問到，就是移民署有通函給外交部、勞動部、教育部說有一個有性犯罪前科的美國人已經入境了，據我的瞭解，教育部好像也有發文給教育局，透過教育局發文給一些學校、幼兒園，希望他們能夠知道有這個狀況，如果要聘外師的話，這個是高風險族群，對吧？你們有做這個事吧？"],["鄭部長英耀：是。"],["葉委員元之：我現在不解的一件事是針對國外這樣有性犯罪前科的人，我們教育部可以做這個動作，可是為什麼針對我們國內有性犯罪前科的人卻不能做這個動作？舉例來講，前一段時間爆發了一家幼兒園有一個毛姓老師性侵害了39個兒童的事件，我特別去問了一些幼兒園的園長，問他們教育部有沒有通知你們說這個人有問題，請你們以後有機會的話也要特別小心。你們可能會撤銷他的執照，讓他沒有辦法這樣做，但是有沒有只要一有類似的狀況就立刻通報，有沒有做任何的防弊機制？"],["鄭部長英耀：如果有違反兒少或是性侵這些案例，我們事實上都會通報。"],["葉委員元之：會通報是不是？"],["鄭部長英耀：會通報。"],["葉委員元之：可是我問了就沒有啊！我問幼兒園說國外的有通報，那國內的有通報嗎，他說：沒有啦！國外的有啦！所以是國外的比較嚴重，國內的比較不嚴重？這個問題我覺得非常奇怪。第二個問題，因為這個事情被媒體報導出來，之後移民署就接到很多記者的查證，記者後來就直接公布了這個美國人的長相、基本資料等，全部把它公布出來，所以現在全臺灣都知道他是誰了。可是為什麼每一次只要是國內有發生這個狀況，媒體都不敢報導？就要說「某某幼兒園」或者是「某某毛姓老師」，甚至於什麼姓都不敢講，為什麼臺灣的媒體碰到類似事件的時候都不能夠公布？為什麼？是因為被衛福部保護司恐嚇過還是怎樣？衛福部有人列席嗎？為什麼國外的可以國內的不行？"],["黃科長瑞雯：跟委員報告，我是衛福部保護服務司科長，兒權法第六十九條有規定針對兒少的個資是不能公布的，負向的行為是……"],["葉委員元之：所以負向行為可以？但上一次所有媒體都不敢公布那位狼師的資料，為什麼？"],["黃科長瑞雯：可能是媒體比較擔心……"],["葉委員元之：沒有，媒體說都不敢，因為你們私下都會跟他說不行啊！你們公開講都說可以，但是他們私下接到的訊息都是不可以，所以他們不敢公布，那你現在公開呼籲說以後所有的媒體都可以比照，好不好？只要有發生類似事件，不管是國外國內，有媒體查證，一律可以公布他的全部資料給國人警惕，這樣可以嗎？"],["黃科長瑞雯：跟委員報告，因為這件事情後來我們其實也有跟媒體的單位做了一些討論，我們未來會做一個媒體的彙編提供給媒體，最主要是因為依法規定是不能公告兒少的個資，但是在公告這個加害人的時候可能會影射到這個兒少，為了讓大家在報導上可以比較周全，所以我們未來會做一個彙編。"],["葉委員元之：會彙編是不是？什麼時候會出來？"],["黃科長瑞雯：下個月應該會出來。"],["葉委員元之：下個月？這個事情都發生多久了！"],["黃科長瑞雯：因為我們是找媒體單位還有相關的兒少代表來一起討論。"],["葉委員元之：OK！好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝葉元之委員的質詢。","接下來我們有請莊瑞雄委員質詢，時間4分鐘，謝謝。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":74,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-22-7","speakers":["萬美玲","洪孟楷","柯志恩","葛如鈞","張雅琳","陳秀寳","陳培瑜","吳沛憶","林倩綺","郭昱晴","羅智強","李坤城","沈伯洋","黃健豪","楊瓊瓔","麥玉珍","羅廷瑋","林月琴","范雲","翁曉玲","鍾佳濱","葉元之","莊瑞雄","林宜瑾","林倩綺","吳春城"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-11-07"],"gazette_id":"1139601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1139601_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期教育及文化委員會第7次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請教育部部長鄭英耀、衛生福利部、法務部、數位發展部、內政部警政署、財政部關務署列席\n就「電子煙入侵校園危害青少年防制檢討」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1139601_00001"}}}