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\"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"己\", \"start\": 551.179, \"end\": 551.939, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 551.939, \"end\": 552.079, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"抓\", \"start\": 552.079, \"end\": 552.319, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"魚\"}, {\"word\": \"耶\", \"start\": 552.319, \"end\": 552.499, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 552.499, \"end\": 552.659, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 552.659, \"end\": 552.679, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"厲\"}, {\"word\": \"害\", \"start\": 552.679, \"end\": 552.799, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"耶\", \"start\": 552.799, \"end\": 552.819, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:03,218 --> 00:00:10,869\n好,請蔡議員。好,謝謝主席,那我是有請部長。請農業部陳部長。\n\n2\n00:00:19,793 --> 00:00:38,699\n部長,上次我跟你強調過漁業署的一個預算,那事實上我上次是講這個捕撈漁業,那現在講養殖漁業。那養殖漁業事實上是值得我們政府應該要投入更多預算,然後來強化我們國內的養殖漁業。\n\n3\n00:00:40,419 --> 00:01:01,294\n所以我們在2021年的時候有一個4年87億然後要產業轉型那這個4年是在今年是最後一年嗎?我們在114到117應該還有一個第二期計劃已經通過了還有第二期計劃所以未來還是有類似這樣在養殖漁業的一個應該有88億的一個計劃漁業總預算裡面對\n\n4\n00:01:07,659 --> 00:01:21,026\n總預算基本上做了一些工作包括漁電共生包括養殖專區包括供水系統其中供水系統我想我們在役主本來有要做一個浮流水然後去供給這個養殖讓他們有\n\n5\n00:01:22,987 --> 00:01:23,167\n發言委員：\n\n6\n00:01:44,548 --> 00:01:45,008\n發言委員：\n\n7\n00:02:02,055 --> 00:02:21,046\n可以說明一下到底浮流水跟所謂的找景取水有怎樣的不同?是不是可以說明一下?是,報告委員那個浮流水跟傳統講的這個地下水事實上是不一樣的,因為它在這個含水層是不一樣的。那麼基本上浮流水的取用是不會造成地層下陷。以上簡單報告。\n\n8\n00:02:21,926 --> 00:02:39,884\n復流水不會嘛,所以我現在是很高興啦,高興說地方現在有一點是在謠言不斷的擴散,然後大家在那邊擔心這個復流水供應系統會對地方造成怎樣的影響。所以我覺得一個進步的一個政策在推動,\n\n9\n00:02:41,025 --> 00:03:07,303\n可能一些說明的還是必要,所以我想這部分是不是漁業署這邊還是可以多下槍然後來跟地方來多一點的一些公聽會,讓地方可以說這個工程到底在做什麼,這樣好不好?我想謝謝委員,那這個部分我想後續我要求漁業署跟縣市政府一起合作,就是當他如果有誤解的時候會造成後面政策很難推動,特別是對浮流水的一些誤解,\n\n10\n00:03:08,604 --> 00:03:28,030\n那這個部分我想我們會透過相關的座談會的方式,或者相關的這些專區的方式,把特定的一些漁民的部分的認知或是農民的部分有些認知不一樣的地方我們會加強宣導。對,我覺得這部分說明一下啦,因為我們推動湖流水本來就是為了要減少用傑水嘛,那你用傑水就真的會一人下線。\n\n11\n00:03:31,511 --> 00:03:44,274\n我們用浮流水就是用新的水源來取代過去用井水照理這個是一個進步的方向可是這樣的方向事實上鄉親有誤解所以我們盡快的人來澄清那再下一個下一個就是說回到這個雜糧的部分那我們知道說現在玉米的價格跟烏鵝戰爭的時候的一個高價差不多到11塊現在玉米大概回到了\n\n12\n00:04:00,017 --> 00:04:00,037\n發言員：\n\n13\n00:04:58,092 --> 00:05:16,230\n不過我跟委員報告,當初要用脆米代替這些玉米的部分,有一部分是因為COVID-19的關係,它的那個傳運不穩定,造成我們國內的玉米量不足的時候的一個權宜措施。那現在如果說玉米的一個供應穩定的時候,大概就不會再用脆米的部分。\n\n14\n00:05:16,630 --> 00:05:16,790\n發言委員：\n\n15\n00:05:39,741 --> 00:05:39,881\n發言委員：\n\n16\n00:05:56,543 --> 00:06:25,326\n那所以我之前我有跟部長你提過我們現在有太多的河川工地河川工地在早期他有進走他大概都種植玉米因為他在二期的時候所以他他在二期的時候那時候也都比較沒風態他剛好那時候種植最大的好處就是由農民來管理這個河川工地然後讓河川工地他就不會發手腕手腕出來如果發手腕之後你要再去輸菌的話你就要相對付出更大的成本\n\n17\n00:06:26,226 --> 00:06:40,337\n所以這個讓農民來協助河川工地種植的這一件事情我覺得我們農業部可以去鼓勵他看要怎麼勾勒所以部長這部分你們後續的決定是怎樣?\n\n18\n00:06:40,837 --> 00:07:02,265\n我向委員報告,因為委員一直在關心這,就是河川工地的部分,那我們上個禮拜已經做政策的討論,現在大概有一個大的方向是確定的方向,就是河川工地你如果領有租約的時候,我們會有適度的獎勵,但是這個獎勵的水平不能跟一般的土地有沒有一般的農地的獎勵水平是一樣的。\n\n19\n00:07:02,705 --> 00:07:22,294\n因為當初在設計這個獎勵的時候有考慮到地租的問題啦,那相對的河川工地的地租是比較便宜的,所以我們會有一個比較好的一個……河川工地的地租大概幾百塊啦,所以我們的獎勵不會完全比照一般的農地,但是我們會給予獎勵但是我們會去設計它的金額。\n\n20\n00:07:26,215 --> 00:07:50,013\n好,所以我覺得這件事趕快宣佈出來,因為像我們以前那樣現在回到那種程度。他如果我就收好,讓他們可以順利,明年就可以讓農民上線。今年趕快處理好租約,然後明年就讓他們上線,就開始去那邊耕作了。這個東西起來,那等於是未來就不用再同樣的工作一直在那邊重複,好不好?好,了解。好,最後再三個,我覺得剛剛亞林委員問了一個很重點的,\n\n21\n00:07:53,536 --> 00:08:15,337\n對,說我們沿海地方,在鄉下地方這種野狗的一個狀況,事實上部長你說找不到地方,我都覺得說我們現在有那麼多在做漁電共生,在做還是說沿海地方正在做光電,那為什麼你那個光電你不能跟這個野狗的收容所就把它放在一起呢?\n\n22\n00:08:16,874 --> 00:08:44,133\n我們在收容所上面的屋頂型的我們是鼓勵的對就是說它本身的那個狗舍或是什麼它的屋頂型我們還是鼓勵的對阿如果是那一種那開放型的呢開放型的就是你沒有屋頂阿那我們基本上我感覺這個可以討論就是說因為大部分都找不到地你就把旁邊用網子圍起來阿也是一樣都可以讓它放在那裡\n\n23\n00:08:45,194 --> 00:09:12,819\n對啦這個我們來評估啦第二個就是說事實上你們應該要針對餵養流浪狗的人要開罰我一直希望說就是禁止在特定的區域禁止餵養應該有罰則啦有罰則就沒有用啦是啦是啦因為流浪狗很大的問題第一是有人餵養牠第二個如果是在養殖地區的話那個流浪狗自己會去抓魚耶那很厲害耶\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n3218\t10869\t好,請蔡議員。好,謝謝主席,那我是有請部長。請農業部陳部長。\n19793\t38699\t部長,上次我跟你強調過漁業署的一個預算,那事實上我上次是講這個捕撈漁業,那現在講養殖漁業。那養殖漁業事實上是值得我們政府應該要投入更多預算,然後來強化我們國內的養殖漁業。\n40419\t61294\t所以我們在2021年的時候有一個4年87億然後要產業轉型那這個4年是在今年是最後一年嗎?我們在114到117應該還有一個第二期計劃已經通過了還有第二期計劃所以未來還是有類似這樣在養殖漁業的一個應該有88億的一個計劃漁業總預算裡面對\n67659\t81026\t總預算基本上做了一些工作包括漁電共生包括養殖專區包括供水系統其中供水系統我想我們在役主本來有要做一個浮流水然後去供給這個養殖讓他們有\n82987\t83167\t發言委員：\n104548\t105008\t發言委員：\n122055\t141046\t可以說明一下到底浮流水跟所謂的找景取水有怎樣的不同?是不是可以說明一下?是,報告委員那個浮流水跟傳統講的這個地下水事實上是不一樣的,因為它在這個含水層是不一樣的。那麼基本上浮流水的取用是不會造成地層下陷。以上簡單報告。\n141926\t159884\t復流水不會嘛,所以我現在是很高興啦,高興說地方現在有一點是在謠言不斷的擴散,然後大家在那邊擔心這個復流水供應系統會對地方造成怎樣的影響。所以我覺得一個進步的一個政策在推動,\n161025\t187303\t可能一些說明的還是必要,所以我想這部分是不是漁業署這邊還是可以多下槍然後來跟地方來多一點的一些公聽會,讓地方可以說這個工程到底在做什麼,這樣好不好?我想謝謝委員,那這個部分我想後續我要求漁業署跟縣市政府一起合作,就是當他如果有誤解的時候會造成後面政策很難推動,特別是對浮流水的一些誤解,\n188604\t208030\t那這個部分我想我們會透過相關的座談會的方式,或者相關的這些專區的方式,把特定的一些漁民的部分的認知或是農民的部分有些認知不一樣的地方我們會加強宣導。對,我覺得這部分說明一下啦,因為我們推動湖流水本來就是為了要減少用傑水嘛,那你用傑水就真的會一人下線。\n211511\t224274\t我們用浮流水就是用新的水源來取代過去用井水照理這個是一個進步的方向可是這樣的方向事實上鄉親有誤解所以我們盡快的人來澄清那再下一個下一個就是說回到這個雜糧的部分那我們知道說現在玉米的價格跟烏鵝戰爭的時候的一個高價差不多到11塊現在玉米大概回到了\n240017\t240037\t發言員：\n269497\t298012\t議員：議員：\n298092\t316230\t不過我跟委員報告,當初要用脆米代替這些玉米的部分,有一部分是因為COVID-19的關係,它的那個傳運不穩定,造成我們國內的玉米量不足的時候的一個權宜措施。那現在如果說玉米的一個供應穩定的時候,大概就不會再用脆米的部分。\n316630\t316790\t發言委員：\n339741\t339881\t發言委員：\n356543\t385326\t那所以我之前我有跟部長你提過我們現在有太多的河川工地河川工地在早期他有進走他大概都種植玉米因為他在二期的時候所以他他在二期的時候那時候也都比較沒風態他剛好那時候種植最大的好處就是由農民來管理這個河川工地然後讓河川工地他就不會發手腕手腕出來如果發手腕之後你要再去輸菌的話你就要相對付出更大的成本\n386226\t400337\t所以這個讓農民來協助河川工地種植的這一件事情我覺得我們農業部可以去鼓勵他看要怎麼勾勒所以部長這部分你們後續的決定是怎樣?\n400837\t422265\t我向委員報告,因為委員一直在關心這,就是河川工地的部分,那我們上個禮拜已經做政策的討論,現在大概有一個大的方向是確定的方向,就是河川工地你如果領有租約的時候,我們會有適度的獎勵,但是這個獎勵的水平不能跟一般的土地有沒有一般的農地的獎勵水平是一樣的。\n422705\t442294\t因為當初在設計這個獎勵的時候有考慮到地租的問題啦,那相對的河川工地的地租是比較便宜的,所以我們會有一個比較好的一個……河川工地的地租大概幾百塊啦,所以我們的獎勵不會完全比照一般的農地,但是我們會給予獎勵但是我們會去設計它的金額。\n446215\t470013\t好,所以我覺得這件事趕快宣佈出來,因為像我們以前那樣現在回到那種程度。他如果我就收好,讓他們可以順利,明年就可以讓農民上線。今年趕快處理好租約,然後明年就讓他們上線,就開始去那邊耕作了。這個東西起來,那等於是未來就不用再同樣的工作一直在那邊重複,好不好?好,了解。好,最後再三個,我覺得剛剛亞林委員問了一個很重點的,\n473536\t495337\t對,說我們沿海地方,在鄉下地方這種野狗的一個狀況,事實上部長你說找不到地方,我都覺得說我們現在有那麼多在做漁電共生,在做還是說沿海地方正在做光電,那為什麼你那個光電你不能跟這個野狗的收容所就把它放在一起呢?\n496874\t524133\t我們在收容所上面的屋頂型的我們是鼓勵的對就是說它本身的那個狗舍或是什麼它的屋頂型我們還是鼓勵的對阿如果是那一種那開放型的呢開放型的就是你沒有屋頂阿那我們基本上我感覺這個可以討論就是說因為大部分都找不到地你就把旁邊用網子圍起來阿也是一樣都可以讓它放在那裡\n525194\t552819\t對啦 這個我們來評估啦第二個就是說事實上你們應該要針對餵養流浪狗的人要開罰我一直希望說就是禁止在特定的區域禁止餵養應該有罰則啦有罰則就沒有用啦 是啦是啦因為流浪狗很大的問題第一是有人餵養牠第二個如果是在養殖地區的話那個流浪狗自己會去抓魚耶 那很厲害耶\n553899\t580691\t議員：\n","txt":"好,請蔡議員。好,謝謝主席,那我是有請部長。請農業部陳部長。\n部長,上次我跟你強調過漁業署的一個預算,那事實上我上次是講這個捕撈漁業,那現在講養殖漁業。那養殖漁業事實上是值得我們政府應該要投入更多預算,然後來強化我們國內的養殖漁業。\n所以我們在2021年的時候有一個4年87億然後要產業轉型那這個4年是在今年是最後一年嗎?我們在114到117應該還有一個第二期計劃已經通過了還有第二期計劃所以未來還是有類似這樣在養殖漁業的一個應該有88億的一個計劃漁業總預算裡面對\n總預算基本上做了一些工作包括漁電共生包括養殖專區包括供水系統其中供水系統我想我們在役主本來有要做一個浮流水然後去供給這個養殖讓他們有\n發言委員：\n發言委員：\n可以說明一下到底浮流水跟所謂的找景取水有怎樣的不同?是不是可以說明一下?是,報告委員那個浮流水跟傳統講的這個地下水事實上是不一樣的,因為它在這個含水層是不一樣的。那麼基本上浮流水的取用是不會造成地層下陷。以上簡單報告。\n復流水不會嘛,所以我現在是很高興啦,高興說地方現在有一點是在謠言不斷的擴散,然後大家在那邊擔心這個復流水供應系統會對地方造成怎樣的影響。所以我覺得一個進步的一個政策在推動,\n可能一些說明的還是必要,所以我想這部分是不是漁業署這邊還是可以多下槍然後來跟地方來多一點的一些公聽會,讓地方可以說這個工程到底在做什麼,這樣好不好?我想謝謝委員,那這個部分我想後續我要求漁業署跟縣市政府一起合作,就是當他如果有誤解的時候會造成後面政策很難推動,特別是對浮流水的一些誤解,\n那這個部分我想我們會透過相關的座談會的方式,或者相關的這些專區的方式,把特定的一些漁民的部分的認知或是農民的部分有些認知不一樣的地方我們會加強宣導。對,我覺得這部分說明一下啦,因為我們推動湖流水本來就是為了要減少用傑水嘛,那你用傑水就真的會一人下線。\n我們用浮流水就是用新的水源來取代過去用井水照理這個是一個進步的方向可是這樣的方向事實上鄉親有誤解所以我們盡快的人來澄清那再下一個下一個就是說回到這個雜糧的部分那我們知道說現在玉米的價格跟烏鵝戰爭的時候的一個高價差不多到11塊現在玉米大概回到了\n發言員：\n議員：議員：\n不過我跟委員報告,當初要用脆米代替這些玉米的部分,有一部分是因為COVID-19的關係,它的那個傳運不穩定,造成我們國內的玉米量不足的時候的一個權宜措施。那現在如果說玉米的一個供應穩定的時候,大概就不會再用脆米的部分。\n發言委員：\n發言委員：\n那所以我之前我有跟部長你提過我們現在有太多的河川工地河川工地在早期他有進走他大概都種植玉米因為他在二期的時候所以他他在二期的時候那時候也都比較沒風態他剛好那時候種植最大的好處就是由農民來管理這個河川工地然後讓河川工地他就不會發手腕手腕出來如果發手腕之後你要再去輸菌的話你就要相對付出更大的成本\n所以這個讓農民來協助河川工地種植的這一件事情我覺得我們農業部可以去鼓勵他看要怎麼勾勒所以部長這部分你們後續的決定是怎樣?\n我向委員報告,因為委員一直在關心這,就是河川工地的部分,那我們上個禮拜已經做政策的討論,現在大概有一個大的方向是確定的方向,就是河川工地你如果領有租約的時候,我們會有適度的獎勵,但是這個獎勵的水平不能跟一般的土地有沒有一般的農地的獎勵水平是一樣的。\n因為當初在設計這個獎勵的時候有考慮到地租的問題啦,那相對的河川工地的地租是比較便宜的,所以我們會有一個比較好的一個……河川工地的地租大概幾百塊啦,所以我們的獎勵不會完全比照一般的農地,但是我們會給予獎勵但是我們會去設計它的金額。\n好,所以我覺得這件事趕快宣佈出來,因為像我們以前那樣現在回到那種程度。他如果我就收好,讓他們可以順利,明年就可以讓農民上線。今年趕快處理好租約,然後明年就讓他們上線,就開始去那邊耕作了。這個東西起來,那等於是未來就不用再同樣的工作一直在那邊重複,好不好?好,了解。好,最後再三個,我覺得剛剛亞林委員問了一個很重點的,\n對,說我們沿海地方,在鄉下地方這種野狗的一個狀況,事實上部長你說找不到地方,我都覺得說我們現在有那麼多在做漁電共生,在做還是說沿海地方正在做光電,那為什麼你那個光電你不能跟這個野狗的收容所就把它放在一起呢?\n我們在收容所上面的屋頂型的我們是鼓勵的對就是說它本身的那個狗舍或是什麼它的屋頂型我們還是鼓勵的對阿如果是那一種那開放型的呢開放型的就是你沒有屋頂阿那我們基本上我感覺這個可以討論就是說因為大部分都找不到地你就把旁邊用網子圍起來阿也是一樣都可以讓它放在那裡\n對啦 這個我們來評估啦第二個就是說事實上你們應該要針對餵養流浪狗的人要開罰我一直希望說就是禁止在特定的區域禁止餵養應該有罰則啦有罰則就沒有用啦 是啦是啦因為流浪狗很大的問題第一是有人餵養牠第二個如果是在養殖地區的話那個流浪狗自己會去抓魚耶 那很厲害耶\n議員：\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:03.218 --> 00:10.869\n好,請蔡議員。好,謝謝主席,那我是有請部長。請農業部陳部長。\n\n00:19.793 --> 00:38.699\n部長,上次我跟你強調過漁業署的一個預算,那事實上我上次是講這個捕撈漁業,那現在講養殖漁業。那養殖漁業事實上是值得我們政府應該要投入更多預算,然後來強化我們國內的養殖漁業。\n\n00:40.419 --> 01:01.294\n所以我們在2021年的時候有一個4年87億然後要產業轉型那這個4年是在今年是最後一年嗎?我們在114到117應該還有一個第二期計劃已經通過了還有第二期計劃所以未來還是有類似這樣在養殖漁業的一個應該有88億的一個計劃漁業總預算裡面對\n\n01:07.659 --> 01:21.026\n總預算基本上做了一些工作包括漁電共生包括養殖專區包括供水系統其中供水系統我想我們在役主本來有要做一個浮流水然後去供給這個養殖讓他們有\n\n01:22.987 --> 01:23.167\n發言委員：\n\n01:44.548 --> 01:45.008\n發言委員：\n\n02:02.055 --> 02:21.046\n可以說明一下到底浮流水跟所謂的找景取水有怎樣的不同?是不是可以說明一下?是,報告委員那個浮流水跟傳統講的這個地下水事實上是不一樣的,因為它在這個含水層是不一樣的。那麼基本上浮流水的取用是不會造成地層下陷。以上簡單報告。\n\n02:21.926 --> 02:39.884\n復流水不會嘛,所以我現在是很高興啦,高興說地方現在有一點是在謠言不斷的擴散,然後大家在那邊擔心這個復流水供應系統會對地方造成怎樣的影響。所以我覺得一個進步的一個政策在推動,\n\n02:41.025 --> 03:07.303\n可能一些說明的還是必要,所以我想這部分是不是漁業署這邊還是可以多下槍然後來跟地方來多一點的一些公聽會,讓地方可以說這個工程到底在做什麼,這樣好不好?我想謝謝委員,那這個部分我想後續我要求漁業署跟縣市政府一起合作,就是當他如果有誤解的時候會造成後面政策很難推動,特別是對浮流水的一些誤解,\n\n03:08.604 --> 03:28.030\n那這個部分我想我們會透過相關的座談會的方式,或者相關的這些專區的方式,把特定的一些漁民的部分的認知或是農民的部分有些認知不一樣的地方我們會加強宣導。對,我覺得這部分說明一下啦,因為我們推動湖流水本來就是為了要減少用傑水嘛,那你用傑水就真的會一人下線。\n\n03:31.511 --> 03:44.274\n我們用浮流水就是用新的水源來取代過去用井水照理這個是一個進步的方向可是這樣的方向事實上鄉親有誤解所以我們盡快的人來澄清那再下一個下一個就是說回到這個雜糧的部分那我們知道說現在玉米的價格跟烏鵝戰爭的時候的一個高價差不多到11塊現在玉米大概回到了\n\n04:00.017 --> 04:00.037\n發言員：\n\n04:58.092 --> 05:16.230\n不過我跟委員報告,當初要用脆米代替這些玉米的部分,有一部分是因為COVID-19的關係,它的那個傳運不穩定,造成我們國內的玉米量不足的時候的一個權宜措施。那現在如果說玉米的一個供應穩定的時候,大概就不會再用脆米的部分。\n\n05:16.630 --> 05:16.790\n發言委員：\n\n05:39.741 --> 05:39.881\n發言委員：\n\n05:56.543 --> 06:25.326\n那所以我之前我有跟部長你提過我們現在有太多的河川工地河川工地在早期他有進走他大概都種植玉米因為他在二期的時候所以他他在二期的時候那時候也都比較沒風態他剛好那時候種植最大的好處就是由農民來管理這個河川工地然後讓河川工地他就不會發手腕手腕出來如果發手腕之後你要再去輸菌的話你就要相對付出更大的成本\n\n06:26.226 --> 06:40.337\n所以這個讓農民來協助河川工地種植的這一件事情我覺得我們農業部可以去鼓勵他看要怎麼勾勒所以部長這部分你們後續的決定是怎樣?\n\n06:40.837 --> 07:02.265\n我向委員報告,因為委員一直在關心這,就是河川工地的部分,那我們上個禮拜已經做政策的討論,現在大概有一個大的方向是確定的方向,就是河川工地你如果領有租約的時候,我們會有適度的獎勵,但是這個獎勵的水平不能跟一般的土地有沒有一般的農地的獎勵水平是一樣的。\n\n07:02.705 --> 07:22.294\n因為當初在設計這個獎勵的時候有考慮到地租的問題啦,那相對的河川工地的地租是比較便宜的,所以我們會有一個比較好的一個……河川工地的地租大概幾百塊啦,所以我們的獎勵不會完全比照一般的農地,但是我們會給予獎勵但是我們會去設計它的金額。\n\n07:26.215 --> 07:50.013\n好,所以我覺得這件事趕快宣佈出來,因為像我們以前那樣現在回到那種程度。他如果我就收好,讓他們可以順利,明年就可以讓農民上線。今年趕快處理好租約,然後明年就讓他們上線,就開始去那邊耕作了。這個東西起來,那等於是未來就不用再同樣的工作一直在那邊重複,好不好?好,了解。好,最後再三個,我覺得剛剛亞林委員問了一個很重點的,\n\n07:53.536 --> 08:15.337\n對,說我們沿海地方,在鄉下地方這種野狗的一個狀況,事實上部長你說找不到地方,我都覺得說我們現在有那麼多在做漁電共生,在做還是說沿海地方正在做光電,那為什麼你那個光電你不能跟這個野狗的收容所就把它放在一起呢?\n\n08:16.874 --> 08:44.133\n我們在收容所上面的屋頂型的我們是鼓勵的對就是說它本身的那個狗舍或是什麼它的屋頂型我們還是鼓勵的對阿如果是那一種那開放型的呢開放型的就是你沒有屋頂阿那我們基本上我感覺這個可以討論就是說因為大部分都找不到地你就把旁邊用網子圍起來阿也是一樣都可以讓它放在那裡\n\n08:45.194 --> 09:12.819\n對啦這個我們來評估啦第二個就是說事實上你們應該要針對餵養流浪狗的人要開罰我一直希望說就是禁止在特定的區域禁止餵養應該有罰則啦有罰則就沒有用啦是啦是啦因為流浪狗很大的問題第一是有人餵養牠第二個如果是在養殖地區的話那個流浪狗自己會去抓魚耶那很厲害耶\n\n","segments":[{"start":3.218,"end":10.869,"text":"好,請蔡議員。好,謝謝主席,那我是有請部長。請農業部陳部長。"},{"start":19.793,"end":38.699,"text":"部長,上次我跟你強調過漁業署的一個預算,那事實上我上次是講這個捕撈漁業,那現在講養殖漁業。那養殖漁業事實上是值得我們政府應該要投入更多預算,然後來強化我們國內的養殖漁業。"},{"start":40.419,"end":61.294,"text":"所以我們在2021年的時候有一個4年87億然後要產業轉型那這個4年是在今年是最後一年嗎?我們在114到117應該還有一個第二期計劃已經通過了還有第二期計劃所以未來還是有類似這樣在養殖漁業的一個應該有88億的一個計劃漁業總預算裡面對"},{"start":67.659,"end":81.026,"text":"總預算基本上做了一些工作包括漁電共生包括養殖專區包括供水系統其中供水系統我想我們在役主本來有要做一個浮流水然後去供給這個養殖讓他們有"},{"start":82.987,"end":83.167,"text":"發言委員："},{"start":104.548,"end":105.008,"text":"發言委員："},{"start":122.055,"end":141.046,"text":"可以說明一下到底浮流水跟所謂的找景取水有怎樣的不同?是不是可以說明一下?是,報告委員那個浮流水跟傳統講的這個地下水事實上是不一樣的,因為它在這個含水層是不一樣的。那麼基本上浮流水的取用是不會造成地層下陷。以上簡單報告。"},{"start":141.926,"end":159.884,"text":"復流水不會嘛,所以我現在是很高興啦,高興說地方現在有一點是在謠言不斷的擴散,然後大家在那邊擔心這個復流水供應系統會對地方造成怎樣的影響。所以我覺得一個進步的一個政策在推動,"},{"start":161.025,"end":187.303,"text":"可能一些說明的還是必要,所以我想這部分是不是漁業署這邊還是可以多下槍然後來跟地方來多一點的一些公聽會,讓地方可以說這個工程到底在做什麼,這樣好不好?我想謝謝委員,那這個部分我想後續我要求漁業署跟縣市政府一起合作,就是當他如果有誤解的時候會造成後面政策很難推動,特別是對浮流水的一些誤解,"},{"start":188.604,"end":208.03,"text":"那這個部分我想我們會透過相關的座談會的方式,或者相關的這些專區的方式,把特定的一些漁民的部分的認知或是農民的部分有些認知不一樣的地方我們會加強宣導。對,我覺得這部分說明一下啦,因為我們推動湖流水本來就是為了要減少用傑水嘛,那你用傑水就真的會一人下線。"},{"start":211.511,"end":224.274,"text":"我們用浮流水就是用新的水源來取代過去用井水照理這個是一個進步的方向可是這樣的方向事實上鄉親有誤解所以我們盡快的人來澄清那再下一個下一個就是說回到這個雜糧的部分那我們知道說現在玉米的價格跟烏鵝戰爭的時候的一個高價差不多到11塊現在玉米大概回到了"},{"start":240.017,"end":240.037,"text":"發言員："},{"start":269.497,"end":298.012,"text":"議員：議員："},{"start":298.092,"end":316.23,"text":"不過我跟委員報告,當初要用脆米代替這些玉米的部分,有一部分是因為COVID-19的關係,它的那個傳運不穩定,造成我們國內的玉米量不足的時候的一個權宜措施。那現在如果說玉米的一個供應穩定的時候,大概就不會再用脆米的部分。"},{"start":316.63,"end":316.79,"text":"發言委員："},{"start":339.741,"end":339.881,"text":"發言委員："},{"start":356.543,"end":385.326,"text":"那所以我之前我有跟部長你提過我們現在有太多的河川工地河川工地在早期他有進走他大概都種植玉米因為他在二期的時候所以他他在二期的時候那時候也都比較沒風態他剛好那時候種植最大的好處就是由農民來管理這個河川工地然後讓河川工地他就不會發手腕手腕出來如果發手腕之後你要再去輸菌的話你就要相對付出更大的成本"},{"start":386.226,"end":400.337,"text":"所以這個讓農民來協助河川工地種植的這一件事情我覺得我們農業部可以去鼓勵他看要怎麼勾勒所以部長這部分你們後續的決定是怎樣?"},{"start":400.837,"end":422.265,"text":"我向委員報告,因為委員一直在關心這,就是河川工地的部分,那我們上個禮拜已經做政策的討論,現在大概有一個大的方向是確定的方向,就是河川工地你如果領有租約的時候,我們會有適度的獎勵,但是這個獎勵的水平不能跟一般的土地有沒有一般的農地的獎勵水平是一樣的。"},{"start":422.705,"end":442.294,"text":"因為當初在設計這個獎勵的時候有考慮到地租的問題啦,那相對的河川工地的地租是比較便宜的,所以我們會有一個比較好的一個……河川工地的地租大概幾百塊啦,所以我們的獎勵不會完全比照一般的農地,但是我們會給予獎勵但是我們會去設計它的金額。"},{"start":446.215,"end":470.013,"text":"好,所以我覺得這件事趕快宣佈出來,因為像我們以前那樣現在回到那種程度。他如果我就收好,讓他們可以順利,明年就可以讓農民上線。今年趕快處理好租約,然後明年就讓他們上線,就開始去那邊耕作了。這個東西起來,那等於是未來就不用再同樣的工作一直在那邊重複,好不好?好,了解。好,最後再三個,我覺得剛剛亞林委員問了一個很重點的,"},{"start":473.536,"end":495.337,"text":"對,說我們沿海地方,在鄉下地方這種野狗的一個狀況,事實上部長你說找不到地方,我都覺得說我們現在有那麼多在做漁電共生,在做還是說沿海地方正在做光電,那為什麼你那個光電你不能跟這個野狗的收容所就把它放在一起呢?"},{"start":496.874,"end":524.133,"text":"我們在收容所上面的屋頂型的我們是鼓勵的對就是說它本身的那個狗舍或是什麼它的屋頂型我們還是鼓勵的對阿如果是那一種那開放型的呢開放型的就是你沒有屋頂阿那我們基本上我感覺這個可以討論就是說因為大部分都找不到地你就把旁邊用網子圍起來阿也是一樣都可以讓它放在那裡"},{"start":525.194,"end":552.819,"text":"對啦 這個我們來評估啦第二個就是說事實上你們應該要針對餵養流浪狗的人要開罰我一直希望說就是禁止在特定的區域禁止餵養應該有罰則啦有罰則就沒有用啦 是啦是啦因為流浪狗很大的問題第一是有人餵養牠第二個如果是在養殖地區的話那個流浪狗自己會去抓魚耶 那很厲害耶"},{"start":553.899,"end":580.691,"text":"議員："}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":1164,"blocks":[["蔡委員易餘：（12時19分）謝謝主席，是不是有請部長？"],["主席：請農業部陳部長。"],["陳部長駿季：委員好。"],["蔡委員易餘：部長，上次我跟你強調過漁業署的預算，我上次是講捕撈漁業，現在來講養殖漁業。養殖漁業值得我們政府投入更多預算，來強化我們國內的養殖漁業，所以在2021年的時候，有一個四年87億要產業轉型的相關計畫，這個四年在今年是最後一年嘛？"],["陳部長駿季：我們在114到117年應該還有一個……"],["王代理署長正芳：第二期計畫已經通過了。"],["蔡委員易餘：還有第二期計畫？"],["王代理署長正芳：對。"],["陳部長駿季：對。"],["蔡委員易餘：所以未來還是有類似這樣在養殖漁業的一個……"],["陳部長駿季：應該有88億。"],["蔡委員易餘：有一個計畫嗎？"],["陳部長駿季：在漁業署總預算裡面。"],["蔡委員易餘：對，在這樣的總預算裡面，基本上它做了一些工作，包括漁電共生，包括養殖專區，包括供水系統，其中供水系統，我們在義竹本來有要做伏流水去供給養殖，讓他們有乾淨的水源，就是淡水供應系統，這個淡水對於養殖非常重要，因為養殖雖然是需要鹽水，不過主要還是需要淡水的供應。但是在義竹這邊，地方卻不斷在傳出用伏流水會造成地層下陷，造成地層下陷之後就會不可逆了，我忽然覺得說這件事怎麼會造成這麼多的誤解呢？今天水利署沒有來，事實上全國各地在推動伏流水的工程……還是農水處這邊可以說明一下？到底伏流水跟所謂的鑿井取水有怎麼樣的不同，是不是可以說明一下？"],["蔡署長昇甫：報告委員，伏流水跟傳統講的地下水事實上是不一樣的，因為它在含水層是不一樣的，基本上伏流水的取用不會造成地層下陷，以上簡單報告。"],["蔡委員易餘：伏流水不會嘛！"],["蔡署長昇甫：是。"],["蔡委員易餘：所以我現在是有點煩惱啦，煩惱地方現在有謠言在不斷地擴散，然後大家在那邊擔心這個伏流水供應系統會對地方造成怎麼樣的影響。我覺得推動一個進步的政策，可能一些說明還是必要的，所以我想這部分漁業署這邊還是可以多下鄉來跟地方辦公聽會，讓地方可以了解這個工程到底在做什麼，這樣好不好？"],["陳部長駿季：謝謝委員，這個部分後續我會要求漁業署跟縣市政府一起合作，因為如果有誤解的話，會造成後面政策很難推動，特別是對伏流水的一些誤解。這個部分我想我們會透過相關座談會方式或者相關的專區的方式，把特定的一些漁民或是農民有些認知不一樣的地方，我們會加強宣導。"],["蔡委員易餘：對，我覺得這部分要說明一下啦，因為我們推動伏流水本來就是為了要減少用井水嘛……"],["陳部長駿季：地下水，對。"],["蔡委員易餘：用井水就真的會地層下陷，我們用伏流水就是用新的水源來取代過去用井水，照理說這是一個進步的方向，可是這樣的方向鄉親有誤解，我覺得這個要說明一下。"],["陳部長駿季：好，這個我們儘快來澄清。"],["蔡委員易餘：好。","下一個回到雜糧的部分，我們知道現在玉米的價格，烏俄戰爭時的高價差不多到11塊，現在玉米大概回到了戰爭前的盤勢，差不多都回到7塊左右，既然玉米已經到了一個合理的價格，在玉米十幾塊的時候，我常常聽到很多飼料廠、在做飼料的，都用米糠來代替玉米，用米糠代替玉米最大的麻煩就是……"],["陳部長駿季：用碎米。"],["蔡委員易餘：好，它如果用碎米來代替玉米的話，碎米對於養殖業的換肉率是不夠的，所以這部分我覺得漁業署這邊應該要進一步去跟這些飼料廠說，他們的調配方式還是要回到以玉米為主，然後讓養殖魚的換肉率才會符合比較好的水準。"],["陳部長駿季：我跟委員報告，當初要用碎米代替這些玉米，有一部分是因為COVID-19的關係使船運不穩定，造成我們國內的玉米量不足時的一個權宜措施，現在如果玉米供應穩定，大概就不會再用碎米，然後我們也會請漁業署，這不只是漁業署，還有其他的，像國內的玉米的部分，要怎麼樣拉它，它的拉力才夠，我也跟很多飼料工會在談，希望它可以用比較高的價格去買國內的玉米，因為它本身就是一個糧食安全的緩衝。有關這個部分，我想很多國內的飼料業者會把這些玉米當作比較高價的寵物飼料，這部分我想我們也會來努力。"],["蔡委員易餘：對，就是玉米的使用要回到正常的使用水平；第二個，要增加種植玉米的面積，這個也是很重要。"],["陳部長駿季：對。"],["蔡委員易餘：我之前也有跟部長提過，我們現在有太多的河川公地，河川公地在早期有種植，大概都是種植玉米，因為是在二期，那時候也都比較沒有颱風，剛好那時候種植的最大好處就是由農民來管理河川公地，然後河川公地就不會長雜草樹木，如果長了雜草樹木，要再去疏濬的話，相對要付出更大的成本。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["蔡委員易餘：所以讓農民來協助河川公地種植的這件事情，我覺得農業部可以去鼓勵他，看要怎麼樣來鼓勵。部長，這部分你們後續的決定是怎麼樣？"],["陳部長駿季：我跟委員報告，委員一直在關心的河川公地的部分，我們上個禮拜已經做政策的討論，現在有一個大概確定的大的方向，就是河川公地如果領有租約的時候，我們會有適度的獎勵，但是這個獎勵的水平不能跟一般土地、一般農地的獎勵水平一樣，因為當初在設計這個獎勵的時候有考慮到地租的問題，相對地河川公地的地租是比較便宜的，所以我們會有一個比較好的設計……"],["蔡委員易餘：河川公地的地租大概幾百塊啦，那個是比較便宜沒錯。"],["陳部長駿季：對，所以我們的獎勵不會完全比照一般的農地，但是我們會給予獎勵，我們會去設計它的金額。"],["蔡委員易餘：好，我覺得這件事趕快宣布，因為像我們八掌溪那邊現在正在疏濬，如果有辦法疏濬完成，讓他們可以馬上來做，明年就可以讓農民上線，今年趕快處理好租約，明年就讓他們上線，就開始去那邊耕作了，這個部分如果處理好，未來就不用同樣的工作一直在那邊重複，好不好？"],["陳部長駿季：好，了解。"],["蔡委員易餘：好。","最後，我覺得剛剛雅琳委員問到一個很重點的部分，就是我們沿海的地方、鄉下地方有這種野狗的狀況，部長你說找不到地方，我都覺得我們現在有那麼多在做漁電共生，或是沿海地方正在做光電，為什麼光電不能跟野狗收容所放在一起呢？"],["陳部長駿季：在收容所上面的屋頂型的，我們是鼓勵的，就是它本身的狗舍或是什麼，如果是屋頂型的我們還是鼓勵的。"],["蔡委員易餘：對，如果是那種開放型的呢？"],["陳部長駿季：開放型的就是沒有屋頂啊，我覺得這個可以討論，因為大部分都是找不到地。"],["蔡委員易餘：你就把旁邊用網子圍起來，也是一樣可以讓它放在那裡。"],["陳部長駿季：對啦，這個我們來評估啦。"],["蔡委員易餘：第二個就是，事實上你們應該要針對餵養流浪狗的人開罰。"],["陳部長駿季：我一直希望在特定的區域禁止餵養，且應該有罰則，沒有罰則就沒有用啦，因為飼主的責任是一個更重要的……"],["蔡委員易餘：是啊、是啊，因為流浪狗很大的問題第一個就是有人餵養牠……"],["陳部長駿季：對，這個我們來……"],["蔡委員易餘：第二個，如果是在養殖地區的話，流浪狗自己會去抓魚，那很厲害耶！牠自己會去游泳抓魚耶，所以我們那邊養殖密度比較高的地方，遇到流浪狗，縱使沒有餵養牠，牠會自己去抓耶！所以你看，現在養殖密度越高的地方，流浪狗越多，這也是一個問題。"],["陳部長駿季：是，我們未來會把它當作熱區更積極地處理。"],["蔡委員易餘：好，可能要積極處理一下，好不好？"],["陳部長駿季：好，謝謝。"],["蔡委員易餘：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝蔡易餘委員，部長請回座。聽到蔡易餘委員的質詢，如同長夜遇明燈，令人可敬又可佩。","下一位馬文君、馬文君，馬文君不在。","郭國文、郭國文，郭國文不在。","葉元之、葉元之，葉元之不在。","登記發言委員除不在場之外，其餘均已發言完畢，詢答結束。書面質詢以及未及答復部分，請相關單位於一週內以書面答復，並副知本會。","各位同仁針對預算案如有修正動議或相關提案，請於11月25日下午5時之前送經濟委員會辦公室，以利後續彙整，逾時不再收案。本日討論事項所列預算案詢答結束，另定期繼續進行審查，現在散會。","散會（12時30分）"]],"agenda":{"page_end":132,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-19-14","speakers":["邱志偉","林岱樺","邱議瑩","鄭正鈐","陳亭妃","謝衣鳯","張啓楷","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","陳超明","楊瓊瓔","賴瑞隆","張嘉郡","呂玉玲","鍾佳濱","林俊憲","牛煦庭","洪孟楷","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","張雅琳","蔡易餘"],"page_start":59,"meetingDate":["2024-11-18"],"gazette_id":"11310101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11310101_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第14次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於農業部及所屬單位預算部分；二、審查114年度中央政府\n總預算案附屬單位預算關於農業部主管，非營業部分：農業作業基金、農田水利事業作業基金、\n農業特別收入基金及農民退休基金（詢答）","agenda_id":"11310101_00002"}}}