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{\"word\": \"指\", \"start\": 811.653, \"end\": 811.733, \"score\": 0.735}, {\"word\": \"教\", \"start\": 811.733, \"end\": 811.753, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,570 --> 00:00:03,176\n請外交部次長請田次長\n\n2\n00:00:10,369 --> 00:00:37,071\n黃仁您早好早有關於我們部長林佳龍出訪立陶宛在11月17日率冒險和國內無人機業者出訪歐洲的聯訪7天請問一下林部長出訪歐洲和台力的關係可能甚便有沒有關係這是第一點\n\n3\n00:00:38,901 --> 00:01:00,686\n另外就是部長出訪的歐洲如果和立陶宛沒有關係就不合理了待會再回答本席之前有執行過並指出在建立立陶宛在建立在一個新冠疫情和厄烏的戰爭兩個立即點在\n\n4\n00:01:05,131 --> 00:01:05,511\n兩點你來回答一下\n\n5\n00:01:27,588 --> 00:01:31,571\n部長這一次率領臺灣無人機的產業訪問團訪問立陶宛這個做法是具體要回應理念相近的夥伴建立可信賴的無人機產業鏈的需求\n\n6\n00:01:48,003 --> 00:01:56,909\n我國的無人機產業廠商也有機會去立陶宛等歐洲國家展現臺灣無人機的研發跟製造實力,共同強化臺灣無人機民主的供應鏈,\n\n7\n00:02:07,616 --> 00:02:20,305\n這個我覺得是林部長他的一個榮邦計畫的一部分另外一點是可能身邊的這個關係有沒有在這一次出訪的重要的一個拜訪\n\n8\n00:02:21,567 --> 00:02:46,415\n而立陶宛跟台灣我們是建立一個辦事處代表處那麼您談到的生變大概是哪一方面可不可以說明一下現在他要把台灣把台灣的我們在立陶宛設立的台灣要把台灣這兩個字要拔掉要未來可能要用什麼名稱\n\n9\n00:02:48,015 --> 00:03:01,562\n因為在從立陶宛駐代表處改名以台灣之名設立代表處是以外交的錯誤是立陶宛所講的喔那因為立陶宛在高科技元氣開發終止媒體報導準總理不接見\n\n10\n00:03:07,130 --> 00:03:35,669\n林部長反團這麼多不利的一個事件堆疊在一起那外交部必須要思考可能便其應對國發會也考慮我國之前對立陶宛的投資有沒有必要做調整因為這一次出訪是不是已經遭受到立陶宛外交部要我們的林佳龍部長本來要敗會結果後來被季節有沒有這個問題\n\n11\n00:03:37,559 --> 00:03:40,181\n我想這個題目我們從兩方面來談既然部長到立陶宛跟我們本來就是有友好的關係那勢必一定是跟高層裡面有見面啊但是你這邊要回答啊\n\n12\n00:03:55,103 --> 00:04:19,984\n我還是跟兩個方向提談第一個我們的無人機產業必須往外發展所以這一次林部長帶的20多位的無人機都是台灣非常著名的來增加我們跟歐洲除了歐洲以外立陶宛以外其他歐洲的國家也需要無人機這是第一點非常重要第二點台灣跟立陶宛建立的關係\n\n13\n00:04:21,525 --> 00:04:22,286\n這不是我們一廂情願我上次有質詢過我們林部長\n\n14\n00:04:40,862 --> 00:05:00,655\n今天如果他們決定跟對岸決定要做一個建交的話我們用什麼方法來調整讓他接受我們在立陶宛設立一個代表處他用台灣的名稱要拔掉台灣這兩個字所以這個有關於這個問題為什麼\n\n15\n00:05:03,337 --> 00:05:32,434\n因為我們之前已經補助2億的美金在那個地方另外即我們有10億的美金在做一個貸款給立陶宛所以對我們國內我們外交部所貸款出去的錢如何做一個未來萬一代表說要更名的話那我們所投資的所貸款的有沒有影響絕對有影響嘛那另外就是我特別要講的是\n\n16\n00:05:34,255 --> 00:06:01,254\n新加坡總理在黃順才在11月15號以中共的領導人習近平以IPEC場邊會晤的時候中方已經稱新加坡新國反對台灣獨立堅定恪守一個中國原則但我們的外交部亦反駁不過根據\n\n17\n00:06:02,154 --> 00:06:30,771\n我們新國外交部網站確實有新加坡有明確的一貫的一個中國政策反對台獨的文字你看什麼看法因為你們已經對外所反駁可是在新加坡的新國裡面的外交部網站有特別註明了新加坡明確的一貫的一個中國的政策反對台灣獨立的文字你怎麼說\n\n18\n00:06:32,378 --> 00:06:32,398\n請委員：\n\n19\n00:06:35,895 --> 00:07:04,975\n兩個字很重要的一個中國的原則跟一個中國的政策新加坡一直講的是一個中國的政策那麼中國把發新聞說新加坡講的是一個中國的原則這是偷糧換住移花接木的手法所以從這一點我們可以看得出來中國所發出來的訊息可能假訊息居多\n\n20\n00:07:06,055 --> 00:07:28,789\n這點我跟委員特別報告你不要再硬拗了好不好新加坡的他們自己的網站裡面就很明確的他只有一個中國而且反對台獨這是很明確但是你怎麼看待這樣的一個問題嘛你不要說文字上的一個遊戲這個一定要澄清\n\n21\n00:07:31,130 --> 00:07:38,615\n新加坡一直堅持是OneChinaPolicy中國把這個話放在他嘴巴講OneChinaPrinciple我請經濟部來針對\n\n22\n00:07:57,577 --> 00:08:09,065\n針對加徵的關稅10%,川普對於貿易逆差非常反感,認為這代表美國的錢被賺走,近年來對台灣貿易順差的擴增,\n\n23\n00:08:12,547 --> 00:08:34,083\n目前美國對我的順差超過五百億美元經濟部認為我們會不會因此被川普盯上那川普政府會不會因為對台灣的貿易逆差而對我們採取針對性的要求或制裁你來回答\n\n24\n00:08:34,722 --> 00:08:35,964\n你的報告裡面有沒有寫健康的逆差\n\n25\n00:08:51,543 --> 00:09:16,608\n報告沒有提到貿易順差逆差這一段不過委員垂詢我就來回應一下那麼我們出口到美國都是幫助美國振興製造業的產品也就是對美國其實是有利的和創造他就業機會的產品台美的合作會形成一個非常互惠互利而且堅韌的供應鏈所以這個我們要跟美方來說明那麼這個我們的貿易順差其實對美國是好的\n\n26\n00:09:17,108 --> 00:09:32,315\n那這個是明顯的事實,這任何經濟數據攤開來都會看得到的。好,我們現在我們在探討另外一個問題。川普針對在競選的時候,他已經對所有美國的進口品都加徵了10%的關稅。那關於這個問題,經濟部,我們郭部長\n\n27\n00:09:37,737 --> 00:10:00,798\n之前有說因為是對大家加徵百分之十的關稅所以對我們的影響不明顯他講的是這整個每一個國家都是徵稅百分之十是不是這樣這是川普在競選上所講的對全面性的世界各國所有產品加徵百分之十到二十的關稅根據他的競選上的說法\n\n28\n00:10:01,318 --> 00:10:29,742\n我們來做一個評估如果大家都立足點平等以台灣企業的競爭力不見得對我們有重大衝擊所以這個言所以這個言詞裡面那我們好像都是被霸凌的所以我們一樣被霸凌沒有關係我們是這種鴕鳥心態所以我們也有因應的對策為什麼要因應迎合他的10%的關稅所以這個就是你們經濟部要考慮的一個整個的觀點不要讓\n\n29\n00:10:30,582 --> 00:10:56,364\n我們國人說川普講的我們必須要迎合他們的10%的關稅你們有因應的對策才對阿那另外就是在美國加稅看起來很公平但我們之前郭部長卻覆列了這代表美國本土產業更具的優勢本席之前就有說過在川普眼中這個世界只分為一個美國和非美國\n\n30\n00:10:57,345 --> 00:11:12,345\n川普不會在乎台積電或三星的競爭誰輸誰贏他只會在乎如何讓所有外國企業輸給美國企業這樣的一個觀點裡面你有什麼樣的看法\n\n31\n00:11:12,785 --> 00:11:13,045\n有關於我們在\n\n32\n00:11:38,752 --> 00:11:55,710\n報告主席再給我一分鐘川普曾經公開表示對於晶片的法案非常反感川普認為美國政府花錢補助外國企業是非常愚蠢的行為他認為讓晶片留在美國生產只要加關稅就好了從美國外\n\n33\n00:11:58,392 --> 00:12:23,824\n從國外進口的晶片加高關稅晶片大廠自然就會選擇在美國生產晶片那從這樣的一個角色來講的話有沒有可能我們的台積電會把這一些重要的這些二奈米的製程會留在台灣還是用在美國這未來可能會被威脅到我們台灣如何因應\n\n34\n00:12:24,944 --> 00:12:42,383\n外委員兩題第一題是它的晶片法的補助款這個我們從新聞上看到商務部跟台積電已經簽署了那麼美國的法律程序這個是不是就完全確定我這邊不敢妄言不過看起來是一個確定的補助案第二點至於台積電2奈米的製造\n\n35\n00:12:44,446 --> 00:12:54,205\n臺積電也不是因為66億美元才到美國設廠可是在技術上是不是會把重要的技術會因為這樣子會轉移到美國設廠\n\n36\n00:12:56,724 --> 00:13:15,349\n任何我國企業對外投資都要經過經濟部跟跨部會的投審會的審查我們當時同意他去設美國第二廠的時候經過非常詳細的評估也就是2奈米的生產在台灣2025年就投產美國2028年投產而且研發中心在台灣先進技術會在台灣\n\n37\n00:13:16,590 --> 00:13:19,915\n並且台積電在台灣的擴廠的速度遠高於它在世界擴廠的速度我們經過一個縝密的評估之後才給它許可所以你們要因應而且要縝密的來隨時注意到美國的動態\n\n38\n00:13:31,553 --> 00:13:31,753\n謝謝委員指教\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n570\t3176\t請外交部次長請田次長\n10369\t37071\t黃仁 您早好 早有關於我們部長林佳龍出訪立陶宛在11月17日率冒險和國內無人機業者出訪歐洲的聯訪7天請問一下林部長出訪歐洲和台力的關係可能甚便有沒有關係這是第一點\n38901\t60686\t另外就是部長出訪的歐洲如果和立陶宛沒有關係就不合理了待會再回答本席之前有執行過並指出在建立立陶宛在建立在一個新冠疫情和厄烏的戰爭兩個立即點在\n65131\t65511\t兩點你來回答一下\n87588\t91571\t部長這一次率領臺灣無人機的產業訪問團訪問立陶宛這個做法是具體要回應理念相近的夥伴建立可信賴的無人機產業鏈的需求\n108003\t116909\t我國的無人機產業廠商也有機會去立陶宛等歐洲國家展現臺灣無人機的研發跟製造實力,共同強化臺灣無人機民主的供應鏈,\n127616\t140305\t這個我覺得是林部長他的一個榮邦計畫的一部分另外一點是可能身邊的這個關係有沒有在這一次出訪的重要的一個拜訪\n141567\t166415\t而立陶宛跟台灣我們是建立一個辦事處代表處那麼您談到的生變大概是哪一方面可不可以說明一下現在他要把台灣把台灣的我們在立陶宛設立的台灣要把台灣這兩個字要拔掉要未來可能要用什麼名稱\n168015\t181562\t因為在從立陶宛駐代表處改名以台灣之名設立代表處是以外交的錯誤是立陶宛所講的喔那因為立陶宛在高科技元氣開發終止媒體報導準總理不接見\n187130\t215669\t林部長反團這麼多不利的一個事件堆疊在一起那外交部必須要思考可能便其應對國發會也考慮我國之前對立陶宛的投資有沒有必要做調整因為這一次出訪是不是已經遭受到立陶宛外交部要我們的林佳龍部長本來要敗會結果後來被季節有沒有這個問題\n217559\t220181\t我想這個題目我們從兩方面來談既然部長到立陶宛跟我們本來就是有友好的關係那勢必一定是跟高層裡面有見面啊但是你這邊要回答啊\n235103\t259984\t我還是跟兩個方向提談第一個我們的無人機產業必須往外發展所以這一次林部長帶的20多位的無人機都是台灣非常著名的來增加我們跟歐洲除了歐洲以外立陶宛以外其他歐洲的國家也需要無人機這是第一點非常重要第二點台灣跟立陶宛建立的關係\n261525\t262286\t這不是我們一廂情願我上次有質詢過我們林部長\n280862\t300655\t今天如果他們決定跟對岸決定要做一個建交的話我們用什麼方法來調整讓他接受我們在立陶宛設立一個代表處他用台灣的名稱要拔掉台灣這兩個字所以這個有關於這個問題為什麼\n303337\t332434\t因為我們之前已經補助2億的美金在那個地方另外即我們有10億的美金在做一個貸款給立陶宛所以對我們國內我們外交部所貸款出去的錢如何做一個未來萬一代表說要更名的話那我們所投資的所貸款的有沒有影響 絕對有影響嘛那另外就是我特別要講的是\n334255\t361254\t新加坡總理在黃順才在11月15號以中共的領導人習近平以IPEC場邊會晤的時候中方已經稱新加坡新國反對台灣獨立堅定恪守一個中國原則但我們的外交部亦反駁不過根據\n362154\t390771\t我們新國外交部網站確實有新加坡有明確的一貫的一個中國政策反對台獨的文字你看什麼看法因為你們已經對外所反駁可是在新加坡的新國裡面的外交部網站有特別註明了新加坡明確的一貫的一個中國的政策反對台灣獨立的文字你怎麼說\n392378\t392398\t請委員：\n395895\t424975\t兩個字很重要的一個中國的原則跟一個中國的政策新加坡一直講的是一個中國的政策那麼中國把發新聞說新加坡講的是一個中國的原則這是偷糧換住移花接木的手法所以從這一點我們可以看得出來中國所發出來的訊息可能假訊息居多\n426055\t448789\t這點我跟委員特別報告你不要再硬拗了好不好新加坡的他們自己的網站裡面就很明確的他只有一個中國而且反對台獨這是很明確但是你怎麼看待這樣的一個問題嘛你不要說文字上的一個遊戲這個一定要澄清\n451130\t458615\t新加坡一直堅持是One China Policy中國把這個話放在他嘴巴講One China Principle我請經濟部來針對\n477577\t489065\t針對加徵的關稅10%,川普對於貿易逆差非常反感,認為這代表美國的錢被賺走,近年來對台灣貿易順差的擴增,\n492547\t514083\t目前美國對我的順差超過五百億美元經濟部認為我們會不會因此被川普盯上那川普政府會不會因為對台灣的貿易逆差而對我們採取針對性的要求或制裁你來回答\n514722\t515964\t你的報告裡面有沒有寫健康的逆差\n531543\t556608\t報告沒有提到貿易順差逆差這一段不過委員垂詢我就來回應一下那麼我們出口到美國都是幫助美國振興製造業的產品也就是對美國其實是有利的和創造他就業機會的產品台美的合作會形成一個非常互惠互利而且堅韌的供應鏈所以這個我們要跟美方來說明那麼這個我們的貿易順差其實對美國是好的\n557108\t572315\t那這個是明顯的事實,這任何經濟數據攤開來都會看得到的。好,我們現在我們在探討另外一個問題。川普針對在競選的時候,他已經對所有美國的進口品都加徵了10%的關稅。那關於這個問題,經濟部,我們郭部長\n577737\t600798\t之前有說因為是對大家加徵百分之十的關稅所以對我們的影響不明顯他講的是這整個每一個國家都是徵稅百分之十是不是這樣這是川普在競選上所講的對全面性的世界各國所有產品加徵百分之十到二十的關稅根據他的競選上的說法\n601318\t629742\t我們來做一個評估如果大家都立足點平等以台灣企業的競爭力不見得對我們有重大衝擊所以這個言所以這個言詞裡面那我們好像都是被霸凌的所以我們一樣被霸凌沒有關係我們是這種鴕鳥心態所以我們也有因應的對策為什麼要因應迎合他的10%的關稅所以這個就是你們經濟部要考慮的一個整個的觀點不要讓\n630582\t656364\t我們國人說川普講的我們必須要迎合他們的10%的關稅你們有因應的對策才對阿那另外就是在美國加稅看起來很公平但我們之前郭部長卻覆列了這代表美國本土產業更具的優勢本席之前就有說過在川普眼中這個世界只分為一個美國和非美國\n657345\t672345\t川普不會在乎台積電或三星的競爭誰輸誰贏他只會在乎如何讓所有外國企業輸給美國企業這樣的一個觀點裡面你有什麼樣的看法\n672785\t673045\t有關於我們在\n698752\t715710\t報告主席再給我一分鐘川普曾經公開表示對於晶片的法案非常反感川普認為美國政府花錢補助外國企業是非常愚蠢的行為他認為讓晶片留在美國生產只要加關稅就好了從美國外\n718392\t743824\t從國外進口的晶片加高關稅晶片大廠自然就會選擇在美國生產晶片那從這樣的一個角色來講的話有沒有可能我們的台積電會把這一些重要的這些二奈米的製程會留在台灣還是用在美國這未來可能會被威脅到我們台灣如何因應\n744944\t762383\t外委員兩題第一題是它的晶片法的補助款這個我們從新聞上看到商務部跟台積電已經簽署了那麼美國的法律程序這個是不是就完全確定我這邊不敢妄言不過看起來是一個確定的補助案第二點至於台積電2奈米的製造\n764446\t774205\t臺積電也不是因為66億美元才到美國設廠可是在技術上是不是會把重要的技術會因為這樣子會轉移到美國設廠\n776724\t795349\t任何我國企業對外投資都要經過經濟部跟跨部會的投審會的審查我們當時同意他去設美國第二廠的時候經過非常詳細的評估也就是2奈米的生產在台灣2025年就投產美國2028年投產而且研發中心在台灣先進技術會在台灣\n796590\t799915\t並且台積電在台灣的擴廠的速度遠高於它在世界擴廠的速度我們經過一個縝密的評估之後才給它許可所以你們要因應而且要縝密的來隨時注意到美國的動態\n811553\t811753\t謝謝委員指教\n","txt":"請外交部次長請田次長\n黃仁 您早好 早有關於我們部長林佳龍出訪立陶宛在11月17日率冒險和國內無人機業者出訪歐洲的聯訪7天請問一下林部長出訪歐洲和台力的關係可能甚便有沒有關係這是第一點\n另外就是部長出訪的歐洲如果和立陶宛沒有關係就不合理了待會再回答本席之前有執行過並指出在建立立陶宛在建立在一個新冠疫情和厄烏的戰爭兩個立即點在\n兩點你來回答一下\n部長這一次率領臺灣無人機的產業訪問團訪問立陶宛這個做法是具體要回應理念相近的夥伴建立可信賴的無人機產業鏈的需求\n我國的無人機產業廠商也有機會去立陶宛等歐洲國家展現臺灣無人機的研發跟製造實力,共同強化臺灣無人機民主的供應鏈,\n這個我覺得是林部長他的一個榮邦計畫的一部分另外一點是可能身邊的這個關係有沒有在這一次出訪的重要的一個拜訪\n而立陶宛跟台灣我們是建立一個辦事處代表處那麼您談到的生變大概是哪一方面可不可以說明一下現在他要把台灣把台灣的我們在立陶宛設立的台灣要把台灣這兩個字要拔掉要未來可能要用什麼名稱\n因為在從立陶宛駐代表處改名以台灣之名設立代表處是以外交的錯誤是立陶宛所講的喔那因為立陶宛在高科技元氣開發終止媒體報導準總理不接見\n林部長反團這麼多不利的一個事件堆疊在一起那外交部必須要思考可能便其應對國發會也考慮我國之前對立陶宛的投資有沒有必要做調整因為這一次出訪是不是已經遭受到立陶宛外交部要我們的林佳龍部長本來要敗會結果後來被季節有沒有這個問題\n我想這個題目我們從兩方面來談既然部長到立陶宛跟我們本來就是有友好的關係那勢必一定是跟高層裡面有見面啊但是你這邊要回答啊\n我還是跟兩個方向提談第一個我們的無人機產業必須往外發展所以這一次林部長帶的20多位的無人機都是台灣非常著名的來增加我們跟歐洲除了歐洲以外立陶宛以外其他歐洲的國家也需要無人機這是第一點非常重要第二點台灣跟立陶宛建立的關係\n這不是我們一廂情願我上次有質詢過我們林部長\n今天如果他們決定跟對岸決定要做一個建交的話我們用什麼方法來調整讓他接受我們在立陶宛設立一個代表處他用台灣的名稱要拔掉台灣這兩個字所以這個有關於這個問題為什麼\n因為我們之前已經補助2億的美金在那個地方另外即我們有10億的美金在做一個貸款給立陶宛所以對我們國內我們外交部所貸款出去的錢如何做一個未來萬一代表說要更名的話那我們所投資的所貸款的有沒有影響 絕對有影響嘛那另外就是我特別要講的是\n新加坡總理在黃順才在11月15號以中共的領導人習近平以IPEC場邊會晤的時候中方已經稱新加坡新國反對台灣獨立堅定恪守一個中國原則但我們的外交部亦反駁不過根據\n我們新國外交部網站確實有新加坡有明確的一貫的一個中國政策反對台獨的文字你看什麼看法因為你們已經對外所反駁可是在新加坡的新國裡面的外交部網站有特別註明了新加坡明確的一貫的一個中國的政策反對台灣獨立的文字你怎麼說\n請委員：\n兩個字很重要的一個中國的原則跟一個中國的政策新加坡一直講的是一個中國的政策那麼中國把發新聞說新加坡講的是一個中國的原則這是偷糧換住移花接木的手法所以從這一點我們可以看得出來中國所發出來的訊息可能假訊息居多\n這點我跟委員特別報告你不要再硬拗了好不好新加坡的他們自己的網站裡面就很明確的他只有一個中國而且反對台獨這是很明確但是你怎麼看待這樣的一個問題嘛你不要說文字上的一個遊戲這個一定要澄清\n新加坡一直堅持是One China Policy中國把這個話放在他嘴巴講One China Principle我請經濟部來針對\n針對加徵的關稅10%,川普對於貿易逆差非常反感,認為這代表美國的錢被賺走,近年來對台灣貿易順差的擴增,\n目前美國對我的順差超過五百億美元經濟部認為我們會不會因此被川普盯上那川普政府會不會因為對台灣的貿易逆差而對我們採取針對性的要求或制裁你來回答\n你的報告裡面有沒有寫健康的逆差\n報告沒有提到貿易順差逆差這一段不過委員垂詢我就來回應一下那麼我們出口到美國都是幫助美國振興製造業的產品也就是對美國其實是有利的和創造他就業機會的產品台美的合作會形成一個非常互惠互利而且堅韌的供應鏈所以這個我們要跟美方來說明那麼這個我們的貿易順差其實對美國是好的\n那這個是明顯的事實,這任何經濟數據攤開來都會看得到的。好,我們現在我們在探討另外一個問題。川普針對在競選的時候,他已經對所有美國的進口品都加徵了10%的關稅。那關於這個問題,經濟部,我們郭部長\n之前有說因為是對大家加徵百分之十的關稅所以對我們的影響不明顯他講的是這整個每一個國家都是徵稅百分之十是不是這樣這是川普在競選上所講的對全面性的世界各國所有產品加徵百分之十到二十的關稅根據他的競選上的說法\n我們來做一個評估如果大家都立足點平等以台灣企業的競爭力不見得對我們有重大衝擊所以這個言所以這個言詞裡面那我們好像都是被霸凌的所以我們一樣被霸凌沒有關係我們是這種鴕鳥心態所以我們也有因應的對策為什麼要因應迎合他的10%的關稅所以這個就是你們經濟部要考慮的一個整個的觀點不要讓\n我們國人說川普講的我們必須要迎合他們的10%的關稅你們有因應的對策才對阿那另外就是在美國加稅看起來很公平但我們之前郭部長卻覆列了這代表美國本土產業更具的優勢本席之前就有說過在川普眼中這個世界只分為一個美國和非美國\n川普不會在乎台積電或三星的競爭誰輸誰贏他只會在乎如何讓所有外國企業輸給美國企業這樣的一個觀點裡面你有什麼樣的看法\n有關於我們在\n報告主席再給我一分鐘川普曾經公開表示對於晶片的法案非常反感川普認為美國政府花錢補助外國企業是非常愚蠢的行為他認為讓晶片留在美國生產只要加關稅就好了從美國外\n從國外進口的晶片加高關稅晶片大廠自然就會選擇在美國生產晶片那從這樣的一個角色來講的話有沒有可能我們的台積電會把這一些重要的這些二奈米的製程會留在台灣還是用在美國這未來可能會被威脅到我們台灣如何因應\n外委員兩題第一題是它的晶片法的補助款這個我們從新聞上看到商務部跟台積電已經簽署了那麼美國的法律程序這個是不是就完全確定我這邊不敢妄言不過看起來是一個確定的補助案第二點至於台積電2奈米的製造\n臺積電也不是因為66億美元才到美國設廠可是在技術上是不是會把重要的技術會因為這樣子會轉移到美國設廠\n任何我國企業對外投資都要經過經濟部跟跨部會的投審會的審查我們當時同意他去設美國第二廠的時候經過非常詳細的評估也就是2奈米的生產在台灣2025年就投產美國2028年投產而且研發中心在台灣先進技術會在台灣\n並且台積電在台灣的擴廠的速度遠高於它在世界擴廠的速度我們經過一個縝密的評估之後才給它許可所以你們要因應而且要縝密的來隨時注意到美國的動態\n謝謝委員指教\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.570 --> 00:03.176\n請外交部次長請田次長\n\n00:10.369 --> 00:37.071\n黃仁您早好早有關於我們部長林佳龍出訪立陶宛在11月17日率冒險和國內無人機業者出訪歐洲的聯訪7天請問一下林部長出訪歐洲和台力的關係可能甚便有沒有關係這是第一點\n\n00:38.901 --> 01:00.686\n另外就是部長出訪的歐洲如果和立陶宛沒有關係就不合理了待會再回答本席之前有執行過並指出在建立立陶宛在建立在一個新冠疫情和厄烏的戰爭兩個立即點在\n\n01:05.131 --> 01:05.511\n兩點你來回答一下\n\n01:27.588 --> 01:31.571\n部長這一次率領臺灣無人機的產業訪問團訪問立陶宛這個做法是具體要回應理念相近的夥伴建立可信賴的無人機產業鏈的需求\n\n01:48.003 --> 01:56.909\n我國的無人機產業廠商也有機會去立陶宛等歐洲國家展現臺灣無人機的研發跟製造實力,共同強化臺灣無人機民主的供應鏈,\n\n02:07.616 --> 02:20.305\n這個我覺得是林部長他的一個榮邦計畫的一部分另外一點是可能身邊的這個關係有沒有在這一次出訪的重要的一個拜訪\n\n02:21.567 --> 02:46.415\n而立陶宛跟台灣我們是建立一個辦事處代表處那麼您談到的生變大概是哪一方面可不可以說明一下現在他要把台灣把台灣的我們在立陶宛設立的台灣要把台灣這兩個字要拔掉要未來可能要用什麼名稱\n\n02:48.015 --> 03:01.562\n因為在從立陶宛駐代表處改名以台灣之名設立代表處是以外交的錯誤是立陶宛所講的喔那因為立陶宛在高科技元氣開發終止媒體報導準總理不接見\n\n03:07.130 --> 03:35.669\n林部長反團這麼多不利的一個事件堆疊在一起那外交部必須要思考可能便其應對國發會也考慮我國之前對立陶宛的投資有沒有必要做調整因為這一次出訪是不是已經遭受到立陶宛外交部要我們的林佳龍部長本來要敗會結果後來被季節有沒有這個問題\n\n03:37.559 --> 03:40.181\n我想這個題目我們從兩方面來談既然部長到立陶宛跟我們本來就是有友好的關係那勢必一定是跟高層裡面有見面啊但是你這邊要回答啊\n\n03:55.103 --> 04:19.984\n我還是跟兩個方向提談第一個我們的無人機產業必須往外發展所以這一次林部長帶的20多位的無人機都是台灣非常著名的來增加我們跟歐洲除了歐洲以外立陶宛以外其他歐洲的國家也需要無人機這是第一點非常重要第二點台灣跟立陶宛建立的關係\n\n04:21.525 --> 04:22.286\n這不是我們一廂情願我上次有質詢過我們林部長\n\n04:40.862 --> 05:00.655\n今天如果他們決定跟對岸決定要做一個建交的話我們用什麼方法來調整讓他接受我們在立陶宛設立一個代表處他用台灣的名稱要拔掉台灣這兩個字所以這個有關於這個問題為什麼\n\n05:03.337 --> 05:32.434\n因為我們之前已經補助2億的美金在那個地方另外即我們有10億的美金在做一個貸款給立陶宛所以對我們國內我們外交部所貸款出去的錢如何做一個未來萬一代表說要更名的話那我們所投資的所貸款的有沒有影響絕對有影響嘛那另外就是我特別要講的是\n\n05:34.255 --> 06:01.254\n新加坡總理在黃順才在11月15號以中共的領導人習近平以IPEC場邊會晤的時候中方已經稱新加坡新國反對台灣獨立堅定恪守一個中國原則但我們的外交部亦反駁不過根據\n\n06:02.154 --> 06:30.771\n我們新國外交部網站確實有新加坡有明確的一貫的一個中國政策反對台獨的文字你看什麼看法因為你們已經對外所反駁可是在新加坡的新國裡面的外交部網站有特別註明了新加坡明確的一貫的一個中國的政策反對台灣獨立的文字你怎麼說\n\n06:32.378 --> 06:32.398\n請委員：\n\n06:35.895 --> 07:04.975\n兩個字很重要的一個中國的原則跟一個中國的政策新加坡一直講的是一個中國的政策那麼中國把發新聞說新加坡講的是一個中國的原則這是偷糧換住移花接木的手法所以從這一點我們可以看得出來中國所發出來的訊息可能假訊息居多\n\n07:06.055 --> 07:28.789\n這點我跟委員特別報告你不要再硬拗了好不好新加坡的他們自己的網站裡面就很明確的他只有一個中國而且反對台獨這是很明確但是你怎麼看待這樣的一個問題嘛你不要說文字上的一個遊戲這個一定要澄清\n\n07:31.130 --> 07:38.615\n新加坡一直堅持是OneChinaPolicy中國把這個話放在他嘴巴講OneChinaPrinciple我請經濟部來針對\n\n07:57.577 --> 08:09.065\n針對加徵的關稅10%,川普對於貿易逆差非常反感,認為這代表美國的錢被賺走,近年來對台灣貿易順差的擴增,\n\n08:12.547 --> 08:34.083\n目前美國對我的順差超過五百億美元經濟部認為我們會不會因此被川普盯上那川普政府會不會因為對台灣的貿易逆差而對我們採取針對性的要求或制裁你來回答\n\n08:34.722 --> 08:35.964\n你的報告裡面有沒有寫健康的逆差\n\n08:51.543 --> 09:16.608\n報告沒有提到貿易順差逆差這一段不過委員垂詢我就來回應一下那麼我們出口到美國都是幫助美國振興製造業的產品也就是對美國其實是有利的和創造他就業機會的產品台美的合作會形成一個非常互惠互利而且堅韌的供應鏈所以這個我們要跟美方來說明那麼這個我們的貿易順差其實對美國是好的\n\n09:17.108 --> 09:32.315\n那這個是明顯的事實,這任何經濟數據攤開來都會看得到的。好,我們現在我們在探討另外一個問題。川普針對在競選的時候,他已經對所有美國的進口品都加徵了10%的關稅。那關於這個問題,經濟部,我們郭部長\n\n09:37.737 --> 10:00.798\n之前有說因為是對大家加徵百分之十的關稅所以對我們的影響不明顯他講的是這整個每一個國家都是徵稅百分之十是不是這樣這是川普在競選上所講的對全面性的世界各國所有產品加徵百分之十到二十的關稅根據他的競選上的說法\n\n10:01.318 --> 10:29.742\n我們來做一個評估如果大家都立足點平等以台灣企業的競爭力不見得對我們有重大衝擊所以這個言所以這個言詞裡面那我們好像都是被霸凌的所以我們一樣被霸凌沒有關係我們是這種鴕鳥心態所以我們也有因應的對策為什麼要因應迎合他的10%的關稅所以這個就是你們經濟部要考慮的一個整個的觀點不要讓\n\n10:30.582 --> 10:56.364\n我們國人說川普講的我們必須要迎合他們的10%的關稅你們有因應的對策才對阿那另外就是在美國加稅看起來很公平但我們之前郭部長卻覆列了這代表美國本土產業更具的優勢本席之前就有說過在川普眼中這個世界只分為一個美國和非美國\n\n10:57.345 --> 11:12.345\n川普不會在乎台積電或三星的競爭誰輸誰贏他只會在乎如何讓所有外國企業輸給美國企業這樣的一個觀點裡面你有什麼樣的看法\n\n11:12.785 --> 11:13.045\n有關於我們在\n\n11:38.752 --> 11:55.710\n報告主席再給我一分鐘川普曾經公開表示對於晶片的法案非常反感川普認為美國政府花錢補助外國企業是非常愚蠢的行為他認為讓晶片留在美國生產只要加關稅就好了從美國外\n\n11:58.392 --> 12:23.824\n從國外進口的晶片加高關稅晶片大廠自然就會選擇在美國生產晶片那從這樣的一個角色來講的話有沒有可能我們的台積電會把這一些重要的這些二奈米的製程會留在台灣還是用在美國這未來可能會被威脅到我們台灣如何因應\n\n12:24.944 --> 12:42.383\n外委員兩題第一題是它的晶片法的補助款這個我們從新聞上看到商務部跟台積電已經簽署了那麼美國的法律程序這個是不是就完全確定我這邊不敢妄言不過看起來是一個確定的補助案第二點至於台積電2奈米的製造\n\n12:44.446 --> 12:54.205\n臺積電也不是因為66億美元才到美國設廠可是在技術上是不是會把重要的技術會因為這樣子會轉移到美國設廠\n\n12:56.724 --> 13:15.349\n任何我國企業對外投資都要經過經濟部跟跨部會的投審會的審查我們當時同意他去設美國第二廠的時候經過非常詳細的評估也就是2奈米的生產在台灣2025年就投產美國2028年投產而且研發中心在台灣先進技術會在台灣\n\n13:16.590 --> 13:19.915\n並且台積電在台灣的擴廠的速度遠高於它在世界擴廠的速度我們經過一個縝密的評估之後才給它許可所以你們要因應而且要縝密的來隨時注意到美國的動態\n\n13:31.553 --> 13:31.753\n謝謝委員指教\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.57,"end":3.176,"text":"請外交部次長請田次長"},{"start":10.369,"end":37.071,"text":"黃仁 您早好 早有關於我們部長林佳龍出訪立陶宛在11月17日率冒險和國內無人機業者出訪歐洲的聯訪7天請問一下林部長出訪歐洲和台力的關係可能甚便有沒有關係這是第一點"},{"start":38.901,"end":60.686,"text":"另外就是部長出訪的歐洲如果和立陶宛沒有關係就不合理了待會再回答本席之前有執行過並指出在建立立陶宛在建立在一個新冠疫情和厄烏的戰爭兩個立即點在"},{"start":65.131,"end":65.511,"text":"兩點你來回答一下"},{"start":87.588,"end":91.571,"text":"部長這一次率領臺灣無人機的產業訪問團訪問立陶宛這個做法是具體要回應理念相近的夥伴建立可信賴的無人機產業鏈的需求"},{"start":108.003,"end":116.909,"text":"我國的無人機產業廠商也有機會去立陶宛等歐洲國家展現臺灣無人機的研發跟製造實力,共同強化臺灣無人機民主的供應鏈,"},{"start":127.616,"end":140.305,"text":"這個我覺得是林部長他的一個榮邦計畫的一部分另外一點是可能身邊的這個關係有沒有在這一次出訪的重要的一個拜訪"},{"start":141.567,"end":166.415,"text":"而立陶宛跟台灣我們是建立一個辦事處代表處那麼您談到的生變大概是哪一方面可不可以說明一下現在他要把台灣把台灣的我們在立陶宛設立的台灣要把台灣這兩個字要拔掉要未來可能要用什麼名稱"},{"start":168.015,"end":181.562,"text":"因為在從立陶宛駐代表處改名以台灣之名設立代表處是以外交的錯誤是立陶宛所講的喔那因為立陶宛在高科技元氣開發終止媒體報導準總理不接見"},{"start":187.13,"end":215.669,"text":"林部長反團這麼多不利的一個事件堆疊在一起那外交部必須要思考可能便其應對國發會也考慮我國之前對立陶宛的投資有沒有必要做調整因為這一次出訪是不是已經遭受到立陶宛外交部要我們的林佳龍部長本來要敗會結果後來被季節有沒有這個問題"},{"start":217.559,"end":220.181,"text":"我想這個題目我們從兩方面來談既然部長到立陶宛跟我們本來就是有友好的關係那勢必一定是跟高層裡面有見面啊但是你這邊要回答啊"},{"start":235.103,"end":259.984,"text":"我還是跟兩個方向提談第一個我們的無人機產業必須往外發展所以這一次林部長帶的20多位的無人機都是台灣非常著名的來增加我們跟歐洲除了歐洲以外立陶宛以外其他歐洲的國家也需要無人機這是第一點非常重要第二點台灣跟立陶宛建立的關係"},{"start":261.525,"end":262.286,"text":"這不是我們一廂情願我上次有質詢過我們林部長"},{"start":280.862,"end":300.655,"text":"今天如果他們決定跟對岸決定要做一個建交的話我們用什麼方法來調整讓他接受我們在立陶宛設立一個代表處他用台灣的名稱要拔掉台灣這兩個字所以這個有關於這個問題為什麼"},{"start":303.337,"end":332.434,"text":"因為我們之前已經補助2億的美金在那個地方另外即我們有10億的美金在做一個貸款給立陶宛所以對我們國內我們外交部所貸款出去的錢如何做一個未來萬一代表說要更名的話那我們所投資的所貸款的有沒有影響 絕對有影響嘛那另外就是我特別要講的是"},{"start":334.255,"end":361.254,"text":"新加坡總理在黃順才在11月15號以中共的領導人習近平以IPEC場邊會晤的時候中方已經稱新加坡新國反對台灣獨立堅定恪守一個中國原則但我們的外交部亦反駁不過根據"},{"start":362.154,"end":390.771,"text":"我們新國外交部網站確實有新加坡有明確的一貫的一個中國政策反對台獨的文字你看什麼看法因為你們已經對外所反駁可是在新加坡的新國裡面的外交部網站有特別註明了新加坡明確的一貫的一個中國的政策反對台灣獨立的文字你怎麼說"},{"start":392.378,"end":392.398,"text":"請委員："},{"start":395.895,"end":424.975,"text":"兩個字很重要的一個中國的原則跟一個中國的政策新加坡一直講的是一個中國的政策那麼中國把發新聞說新加坡講的是一個中國的原則這是偷糧換住移花接木的手法所以從這一點我們可以看得出來中國所發出來的訊息可能假訊息居多"},{"start":426.055,"end":448.789,"text":"這點我跟委員特別報告你不要再硬拗了好不好新加坡的他們自己的網站裡面就很明確的他只有一個中國而且反對台獨這是很明確但是你怎麼看待這樣的一個問題嘛你不要說文字上的一個遊戲這個一定要澄清"},{"start":451.13,"end":458.615,"text":"新加坡一直堅持是One China Policy中國把這個話放在他嘴巴講One China Principle我請經濟部來針對"},{"start":477.577,"end":489.065,"text":"針對加徵的關稅10%,川普對於貿易逆差非常反感,認為這代表美國的錢被賺走,近年來對台灣貿易順差的擴增,"},{"start":492.547,"end":514.083,"text":"目前美國對我的順差超過五百億美元經濟部認為我們會不會因此被川普盯上那川普政府會不會因為對台灣的貿易逆差而對我們採取針對性的要求或制裁你來回答"},{"start":514.722,"end":515.964,"text":"你的報告裡面有沒有寫健康的逆差"},{"start":531.543,"end":556.608,"text":"報告沒有提到貿易順差逆差這一段不過委員垂詢我就來回應一下那麼我們出口到美國都是幫助美國振興製造業的產品也就是對美國其實是有利的和創造他就業機會的產品台美的合作會形成一個非常互惠互利而且堅韌的供應鏈所以這個我們要跟美方來說明那麼這個我們的貿易順差其實對美國是好的"},{"start":557.108,"end":572.315,"text":"那這個是明顯的事實,這任何經濟數據攤開來都會看得到的。好,我們現在我們在探討另外一個問題。川普針對在競選的時候,他已經對所有美國的進口品都加徵了10%的關稅。那關於這個問題,經濟部,我們郭部長"},{"start":577.737,"end":600.798,"text":"之前有說因為是對大家加徵百分之十的關稅所以對我們的影響不明顯他講的是這整個每一個國家都是徵稅百分之十是不是這樣這是川普在競選上所講的對全面性的世界各國所有產品加徵百分之十到二十的關稅根據他的競選上的說法"},{"start":601.318,"end":629.742,"text":"我們來做一個評估如果大家都立足點平等以台灣企業的競爭力不見得對我們有重大衝擊所以這個言所以這個言詞裡面那我們好像都是被霸凌的所以我們一樣被霸凌沒有關係我們是這種鴕鳥心態所以我們也有因應的對策為什麼要因應迎合他的10%的關稅所以這個就是你們經濟部要考慮的一個整個的觀點不要讓"},{"start":630.582,"end":656.364,"text":"我們國人說川普講的我們必須要迎合他們的10%的關稅你們有因應的對策才對阿那另外就是在美國加稅看起來很公平但我們之前郭部長卻覆列了這代表美國本土產業更具的優勢本席之前就有說過在川普眼中這個世界只分為一個美國和非美國"},{"start":657.345,"end":672.345,"text":"川普不會在乎台積電或三星的競爭誰輸誰贏他只會在乎如何讓所有外國企業輸給美國企業這樣的一個觀點裡面你有什麼樣的看法"},{"start":672.785,"end":673.045,"text":"有關於我們在"},{"start":698.752,"end":715.71,"text":"報告主席再給我一分鐘川普曾經公開表示對於晶片的法案非常反感川普認為美國政府花錢補助外國企業是非常愚蠢的行為他認為讓晶片留在美國生產只要加關稅就好了從美國外"},{"start":718.392,"end":743.824,"text":"從國外進口的晶片加高關稅晶片大廠自然就會選擇在美國生產晶片那從這樣的一個角色來講的話有沒有可能我們的台積電會把這一些重要的這些二奈米的製程會留在台灣還是用在美國這未來可能會被威脅到我們台灣如何因應"},{"start":744.944,"end":762.383,"text":"外委員兩題第一題是它的晶片法的補助款這個我們從新聞上看到商務部跟台積電已經簽署了那麼美國的法律程序這個是不是就完全確定我這邊不敢妄言不過看起來是一個確定的補助案第二點至於台積電2奈米的製造"},{"start":764.446,"end":774.205,"text":"臺積電也不是因為66億美元才到美國設廠可是在技術上是不是會把重要的技術會因為這樣子會轉移到美國設廠"},{"start":776.724,"end":795.349,"text":"任何我國企業對外投資都要經過經濟部跟跨部會的投審會的審查我們當時同意他去設美國第二廠的時候經過非常詳細的評估也就是2奈米的生產在台灣2025年就投產美國2028年投產而且研發中心在台灣先進技術會在台灣"},{"start":796.59,"end":799.915,"text":"並且台積電在台灣的擴廠的速度遠高於它在世界擴廠的速度我們經過一個縝密的評估之後才給它許可所以你們要因應而且要縝密的來隨時注意到美國的動態"},{"start":811.553,"end":811.753,"text":"謝謝委員指教"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":155,"blocks":[["黃委員仁：（9時50分）謝謝主席，有請外交部次長。"],["主席：請田次長。"],["田次長中光：黃委員，您早。"],["黃委員仁：早。有關於我們部長林佳龍出訪立陶宛，在11月17號率貿協和國內無人機業者出訪歐洲，連訪7天，請問一下，林部長出訪歐洲和臺立關係可能生變有沒有關係？這是第一點。另外，部長出訪歐洲如果和立陶宛沒有關係就不合理了，待會再回答。本席之前有質詢過並指出，立陶宛建立在新冠疫情和俄烏戰爭兩個立基點，臺立的關係其實非常不穩固，立陶宛政府現在從總統瑙塞達到準總理帕魯克斯，對我國稱不上友善，而且對我們表示它與大陸恢復關係的渴望，針對這兩點，你來回答一下。"],["田次長中光：跟委員先報告一下，部長這一次是率領臺灣無人機的產業訪問團訪問立陶宛，這個作法是具體要回應理念相近的夥伴，建立可信賴的無人機產業鏈的需求。我國的無人機產業廠商也有機會去立陶宛和歐洲國家並展現臺灣無人機的研發跟製造的實力，這一個是相互有關係的，以共同強化臺灣無人機民主的供應鏈，我覺得這是林部長榮邦計畫的一部分。"],["黃委員仁：另外一點是針對可能生變的關係，有沒有在這一次出訪中有重要的拜訪？"],["田次長中光：立陶宛跟臺灣，我們有建立一個辦事處、代表處，您談到的生變大概是哪一方面？可不可以說明一下？"],["黃委員仁：現在它針對臺灣在立陶宛設立的辦事處，要把「臺灣」這兩個字要拔掉，未來可能要用什麼名稱？針對立陶宛駐代表處改名，對方說以臺灣之名設立代表處是一項外交的錯誤，這是立陶宛所講的，因為立陶宛高科技園區開發中止，媒體報導準總理不接見林部長訪團，這麼多不利的事件堆疊在一起，外交部必須要思考可能的應對，國發會也考慮我國之前對立陶宛的投資有沒有必要做調整，因為這一次出訪，本來我們林佳龍部長要拜會立陶宛外交部，結果後來被拒絕，有沒有這個問題？"],["田次長中光：跟委員報告，這個題目我們從兩方面來談……"],["黃委員仁：既然部長到立陶宛，而它跟我們本來就有友好的關係，勢必一定要跟高層見面啊！但是你這邊要回答啊！"],["田次長中光：跟委員報告，我還是從兩個方向來談，第一個，我們的無人機產業必須要往外發展，所以這一次林部長帶了二十多家無人機廠商出訪，他們都是臺灣非常著名的，希望增加我們跟歐洲，就是除了立陶宛以外其他歐洲的國家也是需要無人機的，這是第一點，非常的重要。","第二點，臺灣跟立陶宛建立關係的這個名稱，是前政府雙邊已經談了很久所談出來的一個結果，現在立陶宛政府有改組，如果要做任何的改變，應該要經過兩方政府的再次協商。"],["黃委員仁：這不是我們一廂情願，我上次有質詢過我們林部長，今天如果他們決定跟對岸做一個建交，我們用什麼方法來調整，讓它接受我們在立陶宛設立一個代表處，然後是用「臺灣」的名稱，但它是想要拔掉「臺灣」這兩個字的，為什麼提這個問題？是因為我們之前已經在那邊補助兩億美金，另外我們還有10億美金貸款給立陶宛，所以對於我們國內、外交部所貸款出去的錢，未來萬一代表處要更名的話，我們所投資的、所貸款的會不會受到影響？絕對有影響嘛！","另外我特別要講的是，新加坡總理黃循財11月15號與中共領導人習近平於APEC場邊會晤的時候，中方已經稱新加坡、星國反對臺灣獨立，堅定恪守一個中國原則，但我們的外交部予以反駁。不過，根據星國外交部網站，確實新加坡有明確的、一貫的一個中國政策，反對臺獨的文字，你有什麼看法？因為你們已經對外反駁，可是在新加坡、星國的外交部網站，有特別註明了新加坡明確的、一貫的一個中國的政策，反對臺灣獨立的文字，你怎麼說？"],["田次長中光：兩個字，很重要的，一個中國的原則跟一個中國的政策，新加坡一直講的是一個中國的政策，中國發新聞說，新加坡講的是一個中國的原則，這是偷梁換柱、移花接木的手法，所以從這一點我們可以看得出來，中國所發出的訊息可能假訊息居多，這一點我跟委員特別報告。"],["黃委員仁：你們不要再硬拗了，好不好？"],["田次長中光：它文字寫得很清楚……"],["黃委員仁：新加坡外交部自己的網站裡面很明確的，它是用一個中國，而且反對臺獨，這是很明確的，但是你怎麼看待這樣一個問題？你不要做文字上的遊戲嘛！"],["田次長中光：這個一定要澄清，One China Policy跟One China Principle，這有很大的不同，新加坡一直堅持是One China Policy，中國把這個話放在它嘴巴講，卻是One China Principle……"],["黃委員仁：它已經直接打你們外交部的臉！"],["田次長中光：我不認為。"],["黃委員仁：你不用再解釋了。","再來，我請教經濟部，針對加徵關稅10%，川普對於貿易逆差非常的反感，認為這代表美國的錢被賺走。近年來臺灣對美國貿易順差擴增，目前我國對美國的順差超過500億美元，經濟部認為，我們會不會因此被川普盯上？川普政府會不會因為對臺灣的貿易逆差，而對我們採取針對性的要求或制裁？"],["陳次長正祺：委員好，謝謝委員的問題，第一個，我們要跟美方說明，貿易逆差有分健康的逆差跟不健康的逆差，我們出口到美國的產品，百分之七十到八十都是中間產品……"],["黃委員仁：你的報告裡面有沒有寫到健康的逆差或是不健康的逆差？"],["陳次長正祺：報告沒有提到貿易順差、逆差這一段，不過，委員垂詢了，我就來回應一下，我們出口到美國，都是幫助美國振興製造業的產品，也就是對美國其實是有利的和創造它就業機會的產品，臺美的合作會形成一個非常互惠互利而且堅韌的供應鏈，所以我們要跟美方來說明，我們的貿易順差其實對美國是好的，這個是明顯的事實，任何經濟數據攤開來都會看得到的。"],["黃委員仁：好，我們現在再探討另外一個問題，川普在競選的時候，提到對所有美國進口品都加徵了10%的關稅，關於這個問題，經濟部郭部長之前有說，因為是對大家都加徵10%的關稅，所以對我們的影響不明顯，他講的是每一個國家都是增稅10%，是不是這樣？"],["陳次長正祺：這是川普在競選上所講的，是全面性的對世界各國所有產品加徵10%到20%，所以根據他競選上的說法，我們來做一個評估，如果大家都立足點平等，以臺灣企業的競爭力，不見得對我們有重大衝擊。"],["黃委員仁：所以這個言詞裡面，我們好像都是被霸凌的，都一樣被霸凌所以沒有關係，我們是基於這種鴕鳥心態，所以我們也有因應的對策，為什麼要迎合他增加10%的關稅？所以這就是你們經濟部要整個考慮的觀點，不要讓我們國人認為，是川普講的，我們就必須要迎合他們增加10%的關稅，你們要有因應的對策才對。","另外，美國加稅看起來很公平，但我們的郭部長卻忽略了，這代表美國本土產業更具有優勢，本席之前就有說過，在川普眼中，這個世界只分為美國和非美國，川普不會在乎台積電或三星的競爭誰輸誰贏，他只在乎如何讓所有外國企業輸給美國企業，針對這樣一個觀點，你有什麼樣的看法？"],["陳次長正祺：報告委員，第一點，經濟部並不支持川普要加關稅的政策，我們純粹從因應的角度來做評估；第二點，川普的政策，就我們的了解，在於振興美國的製造業，而不是振興美國企業，也就是美國的製造業、美國的就業機會、美國的科技能力是他的政策，這個地方是臺美可以合作的空間。"],["黃委員仁：好。報告主席，再給我一分鐘。再來，川普曾經公開表示，對於晶片法案非常的反感，川普認為美國政府花錢補助外國企業是非常愚蠢的行為，他認為讓晶片留在美國生產，只要加關稅就好了，從國外進口的晶片加高關稅，晶片大廠自然就會選擇在美國生產晶片，從這樣的一個角度來講的話，有沒有可能我們台積電會把一些重要的2奈米製程留在臺灣，還是在美國？未來這可能會威脅到我們，臺灣如何因應？"],["陳次長正祺：報告委員，這有兩題，第一題是它晶片法的補助款，我們從新聞上看到，商務部跟台積電已經簽署了，在美國的法律程序上，這是不是就完全確定了，我這邊不敢妄言，不過，看起來是一個確定的補助案；第二題，至於台積電2奈米的製造……"],["黃委員仁：台積電也不是因為66億美元才到美國設廠啊！"],["陳次長正祺：是，它……"],["黃委員仁：可是在技術上，是不是會把重要的技術因為這樣子而轉移到美國設廠？"],["陳次長正祺：任何我國企業的對外投資，都要經過經濟部跟跨部會的投審會審查，我們當時同意它去設美國第二廠的時候，有經過非常詳細的評估，也就是2奈米的生產，臺灣是2025年投產，美國2028年投產，而且研發中心會在臺灣，先進技術會在臺灣，並且台積電在臺灣擴廠的速度，遠高於它在世界擴廠的速度，我們經過縝密的評估之後才給他許可，我們未來會繼續嚴密地審查……"],["黃委員仁：你們不但要因應，還要縝密且隨時注意美國的動態。"],["陳次長正祺：是、是。"],["黃委員仁：這對我們臺灣非常重要，尤其要防範護國神山台積電技術轉移，最好是把高科技技術留在臺灣，不要因為兩國或國際情勢而影響到我們本身，好不好？"],["陳次長正祺：是，謝謝委員指教。"],["主席：謝謝黃仁委員。陳次長請回。","洪申翰、洪申翰、洪申翰委員不在。","接下來我們請徐巧芯委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":322,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-35-15","speakers":["林憶君","沈伯洋","羅美玲","黃仁","徐巧芯","林楚茵","陳冠廷","陳永康","馬文君","王鴻薇","賴士葆","洪孟楷","楊瓊瓔","葉元之","王定宇","洪申翰","邱志偉"],"page_start":273,"meetingDate":["2024-11-20"],"gazette_id":"11310101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11310101_00007"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第15次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請外交部部長、國家發展委員會、經濟部報告「美國總統大選後，對於推動台美貿易及科技建\n立合作架構之影響」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"11310101_00006"}}}