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\"詢\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,069 --> 00:00:00,449\n夏琳委員質詢\n\n2\n00:00:22,509 --> 00:00:47,077\n委員好主委好就是我想大家都非常關切嘛就是核一廠在12月3號已經開始了室內乾儲存的乾儲場的熱測試那也預計預計今年裡就會完成那如果測試完成之後呢臺電就會將相關的資料提供給核安會來申請運轉那順利通過的話我們的核一廠的燃料棒就可以開始採用乾式儲存那目前呢各核驗場的室外乾儲場除了剛\n\n3\n00:00:48,558 --> 00:00:51,319\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n\n4\n00:01:17,441 --> 00:01:30,454\n核一二廠的室內乾儲目前台電公司統一一個標目前正在公告當中等到公告收集廠家意見後他們就會正式進行招標作業\n\n5\n00:01:31,853 --> 00:01:56,230\n呃,我想問一下,就是因為我知道之前核一啊,它是因為金額嘛,金額太低,所以大家不太願意來標嘛,那我想我們知道說,那你們覺得核一、核二現在的金額目前,大家是會有意願來標的嗎?呃,報告委員,這部分因為涉及商務,不是核安徽。我說你們,你們關於,呃,你們接觸,你們接觸,應該之前有先了解過嘛,大家,不然你再開一個標,可能還是會留標啊。\n\n6\n00:01:59,145 --> 00:02:19,874\n報告委員,台電公司它其實就是經有合一廠招標不順的經驗,那他們有提高價金,但是至於這個部分,因為是屬於涉及台電公司的那個商務合約,所以我們就沒有事。好,沒關係,好,了解了。那剛剛其實由委員來了解就是說有關於到底我們這個\n\n7\n00:02:21,515 --> 00:02:23,376\n核廢選址辦公室\n\n8\n00:02:35,751 --> 00:02:36,051\n事由經濟部來進行推動\n\n9\n00:02:58,386 --> 00:03:25,397\n所以也就是說我們負責管制他們負責推動所以剛才說成立這個核廢專案辦公室是屬於經濟部推動的一環對但我想了解就是說第一放的最終處置場設置條例法官的法規的主管機關是核安會嘛主辦是經濟部但如果未來由經濟部核廢辦公室進行高放的最終處置設置條例的時候主委請問主委就是核安會在這邊還是就是\n\n10\n00:03:26,517 --> 00:03:27,198\n事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n\n11\n00:03:46,170 --> 00:04:02,126\n我們現在其實都有在學校進行實兵演習啦那是有一天如果不幸發生核子事故的時候也會責定避難收容處所鄰近學校作為安置學校那我想了解就是在我們進行核電廠除役的時候甚至是未來進行最終處置場的選址的過程中\n\n12\n00:04:03,667 --> 00:04:04,047\n獲得避難的能力。\n\n13\n00:04:20,513 --> 00:04:37,602\n及面對這樣的事故的一個能力所以我想要了解就是在CRC裡面就是國際兒童人權公約裡面其實有講到兒童有權利參與各個共事務所以我想了解我們目前是不是在這些教材裡面在這些溝通裡面有沒有納入兒童的意見\n\n14\n00:04:39,043 --> 00:04:56,079\n基本上我們目前針對核事故的這個宣導溝通的防護的部分事實上我們已經有把兒童納進來不是我說你有沒有要找他們你有沒有要納入他們的意見因為常常大人都是我做一個教材然後我就告訴你要這樣使用可是這個教材到底在小孩子來說到底是不是他能夠理解的\n\n15\n00:04:57,420 --> 00:05:01,043\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n\n16\n00:05:27,641 --> 00:05:40,734\n這部分我們來研議。這大概需要多久的時間可以研議呢?這部分給我們三個月的時間,因為這部分我們可能也要諮詢一些專家的意見。\n\n17\n00:05:44,312 --> 00:06:13,192\n好因為這部分的話我們就三個月之後給委員一個報告好沒問題那再來就是說因為其實我也知道我們其實是有相關的一些演講這個演講呢其實是有針對於從小到國小大到大專院校但是我統計了109年到113年總共57個場次高中以下只有占其中的12場那我想要問我們是不是還有可能\n\n18\n00:06:14,747 --> 00:06:41,847\n讓學校有更多的場次呢?是因為為什麼只有12場?是因為大家來申請的很少?還是大家不知道這個訊息?還是大家來了覺得聽不太懂?到底是哪個原因?目前我們相關的資訊都有在網路上公開有需要都可以來申請我想可能高中的場次這邊比較少的部分我相信因為可能也有很多環境的因素因為其實越到\n\n19\n00:06:43,326 --> 00:07:07,447\n閱到高中其實大家的升學壓力也很大但是這部分我們在這個資訊推廣上面我們會去努力跟學校這個去這個做相關的這個宣導我想因為這個活動宗旨這個活動宗旨就是來推廣原子能科普教育可是這個次數四年下來只有12場等於一年平均只有三場一年大概就只有\n\n20\n00:07:08,148 --> 00:07:09,109\n獲得核能安全委員會及所屬單位預\n\n21\n00:07:25,021 --> 00:07:48,224\n我們在我們的科普教育的部分對科普教育的部分我們可不可以一樣三個月之內因為我想這跟何少益建議是不是可以合併給我一個報告好不好看我們怎麼樣來積極的推廣啦好不好讓更多人了解但再來就是說我想要問主委代理主委就是說我們當時為什麼核研所要轉型成國研院用一個行政法人的身份這個原因是什麼\n\n22\n00:07:50,085 --> 00:08:15,032\n因為在主改的時候其實是把這個原能會改成三級的核安會的時候就希望成立一個獨立的安全管制的機關那事實上國研院是希望把它轉成法人的話那依照國外的經驗事實上這會讓國研院有更多的彈性不管他在禁用人力或者他們在研究的計劃的方面都可以有更多的彈性來發展他這個研究的量能\n\n23\n00:08:16,653 --> 00:08:30,269\n我希望是可以提升研究量的,但是主委可以看到從109年到現在我們扣除112年,如果我們扣除承接台電4年期計劃簽約金3.9億的話,我們112年的簽約金只剩下6.7億\n\n24\n00:08:36,176 --> 00:08:58,427\n所以大概其實是沒有我們轉型成國運院之後我們的研究量似乎也沒有提高不管是從簽約金來看或是從寄轉寄服的收入都是逐漸下滑的甚至113年的平均收入可能都不會到112年那這個似乎沒有達到我們當時轉成行政法人上面應該要有的一個業務成果啦這部分我們可以怎麼樣改善嗎\n\n25\n00:09:01,091 --> 00:09:28,926\n國運院轉型後,因為它有一些技術量能的研發跟各個部會的合作的部分,我是不是請院長來做一個說明。報告委員,因為這個1、2年通常我們接一個計畫大概都兩年前有個前置期才能接到,所以這個1、2年看起來簽約金是前一兩年就談的,自籌經費。對不起,就大聲一點嘛,聽不太清楚。\n\n26\n00:09:29,326 --> 00:09:55,561\n所以我是說我們的經費112年這個事實上降下來是由於是前一兩年的因素那我們法人化以後真正的績效會到114年開始會逐漸的呈現自籌經費應該會有某種程度的上漲依照我們的規劃目前我們因為運轉就是經營上營運上有更大的彈性用人也有更多的選擇但是\n\n27\n00:09:57,102 --> 00:10:24,882\n因為在法人化以後我們人數因為離退的關係或者請求轉到其他單位安置的關係所以人數大概降了大概兩成所以人力方面也比較不足跟先前的但我們今年人力已經慢慢補回來從今年開始那114年開始自籌經費我們期待應該會有某種程度的一個上揚因為12年應該是谷底跟委員做一個報告\n\n28\n00:10:26,112 --> 00:10:45,119\n所以你的意思是說我們在114年就可以看到我們不管是在簽約金或是寄轉寄服收入都可以超越我們1、2年跟1、3年的水準了是嗎是是我們是這樣的努力在爭取努力在爭取好那我們之後我們就是來繼續監督謝謝謝謝委員謝謝張雅琳委員的質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n69\t449\t夏琳委員質詢\n22509\t47077\t委員好主委好就是我想大家都非常關切嘛就是核一廠在12月3號已經開始了室內乾儲存的乾儲場的熱測試那也預計預計今年裡就會完成那如果測試完成之後呢臺電就會將相關的資料提供給核安會來申請運轉那順利通過的話我們的核一廠的燃料棒就可以開始採用乾式儲存那目前呢各核驗場的室外乾儲場除了剛\n48558\t51319\t二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n77441\t90454\t核一二廠的室內乾儲目前台電公司統一一個標目前正在公告當中等到公告收集廠家意見後他們就會正式進行招標作業\n91853\t116230\t呃,我想問一下,就是因為我知道之前核一啊,它是因為金額嘛,金額太低,所以大家不太願意來標嘛,那我想我們知道說,那你們覺得核一、核二現在的金額目前,大家是會有意願來標的嗎?呃,報告委員,這部分因為涉及商務,不是核安徽。我說你們,你們關於,呃,你們接觸,你們接觸,應該之前有先了解過嘛,大家,不然你再開一個標,可能還是會留標啊。\n119145\t139874\t報告委員,台電公司它其實就是經有合一廠招標不順的經驗,那他們有提高價金,但是至於這個部分,因為是屬於涉及台電公司的那個商務合約,所以我們就沒有事。好,沒關係,好,了解了。那剛剛其實由委員來了解就是說有關於到底我們這個\n141515\t143376\t核廢選址辦公室\n155751\t156051\t事由經濟部來進行推動\n178386\t205397\t所以也就是說我們負責管制他們負責推動所以剛才說成立這個核廢專案辦公室是屬於經濟部推動的一環對但我想了解就是說第一放的最終處置場設置條例法官的法規的主管機關是核安會嘛主辦是經濟部但如果未來由經濟部核廢辦公室進行高放的最終處置設置條例的時候主委請問主委就是核安會在這邊還是就是\n206517\t207198\t事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n226170\t242126\t我們現在其實都有在學校進行實兵演習啦那是有一天如果不幸發生核子事故的時候也會責定避難收容處所鄰近學校作為安置學校那我想了解就是在我們進行核電廠除役的時候甚至是未來進行最終處置場的選址的過程中\n243667\t244047\t獲得避難的能力。\n260513\t277602\t及面對這樣的事故的一個能力所以我想要了解就是在CRC裡面就是國際兒童人權公約裡面其實有講到兒童有權利參與各個共事務所以我想了解我們目前是不是在這些教材裡面在這些溝通裡面有沒有納入兒童的意見\n279043\t296079\t基本上我們目前針對核事故的這個宣導溝通的防護的部分事實上我們已經有把兒童納進來不是我說你有沒有要找他們你有沒有要納入他們的意見因為常常大人都是我做一個教材然後我就告訴你要這樣使用可是這個教材到底在小孩子來說到底是不是他能夠理解的\n297420\t301043\t二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n327641\t340734\t這部分我們來研議。這大概需要多久的時間可以研議呢?這部分給我們三個月的時間,因為這部分我們可能也要諮詢一些專家的意見。\n344312\t373192\t好 因為這部分的話我們就三個月之後給委員一個報告好沒問題那再來就是說因為其實我也知道我們其實是有相關的一些演講這個演講呢其實是有針對於從小到國小大到大專院校但是我統計了109年到113年總共57個場次高中以下只有占其中的12場那我想要問我們是不是還有可能\n374747\t401847\t讓學校有更多的場次呢?是因為為什麼只有12場?是因為大家來申請的很少?還是大家不知道這個訊息?還是大家來了覺得聽不太懂?到底是哪個原因?目前我們相關的資訊都有在網路上公開有需要都可以來申請我想可能高中的場次這邊比較少的部分我相信因為可能也有很多環境的因素因為其實越到\n403326\t427447\t閱到高中其實大家的升學壓力也很大但是這部分我們在這個資訊推廣上面我們會去努力跟學校這個去這個做相關的這個宣導我想因為這個活動宗旨這個活動宗旨就是來推廣原子能科普教育可是這個次數四年下來只有12場等於一年平均只有三場一年大概就只有\n428148\t429109\t獲得核能安全委員會及所屬單位預\n445021\t468224\t我們在我們的科普教育的部分對科普教育的部分我們可不可以一樣三個月之內因為我想這跟何少益建議是不是可以合併給我一個報告好不好看我們怎麼樣來積極的推廣啦好不好讓更多人了解但再來就是說我想要問主委代理主委就是說我們當時為什麼核研所要轉型成國研院用一個行政法人的身份這個原因是什麼\n470085\t495032\t因為在主改的時候其實是把這個原能會改成三級的核安會的時候就希望成立一個獨立的安全管制的機關那事實上國研院是希望把它轉成法人的話那依照國外的經驗事實上這會讓國研院有更多的彈性不管他在禁用人力或者他們在研究的計劃的方面都可以有更多的彈性來發展他這個研究的量能\n496653\t510269\t我希望是可以提升研究量的,但是主委可以看到從109年到現在我們扣除112年,如果我們扣除承接台電4年期計劃簽約金3.9億的話,我們112年的簽約金只剩下6.7億\n516176\t538427\t所以大概其實是沒有我們轉型成國運院之後我們的研究量似乎也沒有提高不管是從簽約金來看或是從寄轉寄服的收入都是逐漸下滑的甚至113年的平均收入可能都不會到112年那這個似乎沒有達到我們當時轉成行政法人上面應該要有的一個業務成果啦這部分我們可以怎麼樣改善嗎\n541091\t568926\t國運院轉型後,因為它有一些技術量能的研發跟各個部會的合作的部分,我是不是請院長來做一個說明。報告委員,因為這個1、2年通常我們接一個計畫大概都兩年前有個前置期才能接到,所以這個1、2年看起來簽約金是前一兩年就談的,自籌經費。對不起,就大聲一點嘛,聽不太清楚。\n569326\t595561\t所以我是說我們的經費112年這個事實上降下來是由於是前一兩年的因素那我們法人化以後真正的績效會到114年開始會逐漸的呈現自籌經費應該會有某種程度的上漲依照我們的規劃目前我們因為運轉就是經營上營運上有更大的彈性用人也有更多的選擇但是\n597102\t624882\t因為在法人化以後我們人數因為離退的關係或者請求轉到其他單位安置的關係所以人數大概降了大概兩成所以人力方面也比較不足跟先前的但我們今年人力已經慢慢補回來從今年開始那114年開始自籌經費我們期待應該會有某種程度的一個上揚因為12年應該是谷底跟委員做一個報告\n626112\t645119\t所以你的意思是說我們在114年就可以看到我們不管是在簽約金或是寄轉寄服收入都可以超越我們1、2年跟1、3年的水準了是嗎是是我們是這樣的努力在爭取努力在爭取好那我們之後我們就是來繼續監督謝謝謝謝委員謝謝張雅琳委員的質詢\n","txt":"夏琳委員質詢\n委員好主委好就是我想大家都非常關切嘛就是核一廠在12月3號已經開始了室內乾儲存的乾儲場的熱測試那也預計預計今年裡就會完成那如果測試完成之後呢臺電就會將相關的資料提供給核安會來申請運轉那順利通過的話我們的核一廠的燃料棒就可以開始採用乾式儲存那目前呢各核驗場的室外乾儲場除了剛\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n核一二廠的室內乾儲目前台電公司統一一個標目前正在公告當中等到公告收集廠家意見後他們就會正式進行招標作業\n呃,我想問一下,就是因為我知道之前核一啊,它是因為金額嘛,金額太低,所以大家不太願意來標嘛,那我想我們知道說,那你們覺得核一、核二現在的金額目前,大家是會有意願來標的嗎?呃,報告委員,這部分因為涉及商務,不是核安徽。我說你們,你們關於,呃,你們接觸,你們接觸,應該之前有先了解過嘛,大家,不然你再開一個標,可能還是會留標啊。\n報告委員,台電公司它其實就是經有合一廠招標不順的經驗,那他們有提高價金,但是至於這個部分,因為是屬於涉及台電公司的那個商務合約,所以我們就沒有事。好,沒關係,好,了解了。那剛剛其實由委員來了解就是說有關於到底我們這個\n核廢選址辦公室\n事由經濟部來進行推動\n所以也就是說我們負責管制他們負責推動所以剛才說成立這個核廢專案辦公室是屬於經濟部推動的一環對但我想了解就是說第一放的最終處置場設置條例法官的法規的主管機關是核安會嘛主辦是經濟部但如果未來由經濟部核廢辦公室進行高放的最終處置設置條例的時候主委請問主委就是核安會在這邊還是就是\n事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n我們現在其實都有在學校進行實兵演習啦那是有一天如果不幸發生核子事故的時候也會責定避難收容處所鄰近學校作為安置學校那我想了解就是在我們進行核電廠除役的時候甚至是未來進行最終處置場的選址的過程中\n獲得避難的能力。\n及面對這樣的事故的一個能力所以我想要了解就是在CRC裡面就是國際兒童人權公約裡面其實有講到兒童有權利參與各個共事務所以我想了解我們目前是不是在這些教材裡面在這些溝通裡面有沒有納入兒童的意見\n基本上我們目前針對核事故的這個宣導溝通的防護的部分事實上我們已經有把兒童納進來不是我說你有沒有要找他們你有沒有要納入他們的意見因為常常大人都是我做一個教材然後我就告訴你要這樣使用可是這個教材到底在小孩子來說到底是不是他能夠理解的\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n這部分我們來研議。這大概需要多久的時間可以研議呢?這部分給我們三個月的時間,因為這部分我們可能也要諮詢一些專家的意見。\n好 因為這部分的話我們就三個月之後給委員一個報告好沒問題那再來就是說因為其實我也知道我們其實是有相關的一些演講這個演講呢其實是有針對於從小到國小大到大專院校但是我統計了109年到113年總共57個場次高中以下只有占其中的12場那我想要問我們是不是還有可能\n讓學校有更多的場次呢?是因為為什麼只有12場?是因為大家來申請的很少?還是大家不知道這個訊息?還是大家來了覺得聽不太懂?到底是哪個原因?目前我們相關的資訊都有在網路上公開有需要都可以來申請我想可能高中的場次這邊比較少的部分我相信因為可能也有很多環境的因素因為其實越到\n閱到高中其實大家的升學壓力也很大但是這部分我們在這個資訊推廣上面我們會去努力跟學校這個去這個做相關的這個宣導我想因為這個活動宗旨這個活動宗旨就是來推廣原子能科普教育可是這個次數四年下來只有12場等於一年平均只有三場一年大概就只有\n獲得核能安全委員會及所屬單位預\n我們在我們的科普教育的部分對科普教育的部分我們可不可以一樣三個月之內因為我想這跟何少益建議是不是可以合併給我一個報告好不好看我們怎麼樣來積極的推廣啦好不好讓更多人了解但再來就是說我想要問主委代理主委就是說我們當時為什麼核研所要轉型成國研院用一個行政法人的身份這個原因是什麼\n因為在主改的時候其實是把這個原能會改成三級的核安會的時候就希望成立一個獨立的安全管制的機關那事實上國研院是希望把它轉成法人的話那依照國外的經驗事實上這會讓國研院有更多的彈性不管他在禁用人力或者他們在研究的計劃的方面都可以有更多的彈性來發展他這個研究的量能\n我希望是可以提升研究量的,但是主委可以看到從109年到現在我們扣除112年,如果我們扣除承接台電4年期計劃簽約金3.9億的話,我們112年的簽約金只剩下6.7億\n所以大概其實是沒有我們轉型成國運院之後我們的研究量似乎也沒有提高不管是從簽約金來看或是從寄轉寄服的收入都是逐漸下滑的甚至113年的平均收入可能都不會到112年那這個似乎沒有達到我們當時轉成行政法人上面應該要有的一個業務成果啦這部分我們可以怎麼樣改善嗎\n國運院轉型後,因為它有一些技術量能的研發跟各個部會的合作的部分,我是不是請院長來做一個說明。報告委員,因為這個1、2年通常我們接一個計畫大概都兩年前有個前置期才能接到,所以這個1、2年看起來簽約金是前一兩年就談的,自籌經費。對不起,就大聲一點嘛,聽不太清楚。\n所以我是說我們的經費112年這個事實上降下來是由於是前一兩年的因素那我們法人化以後真正的績效會到114年開始會逐漸的呈現自籌經費應該會有某種程度的上漲依照我們的規劃目前我們因為運轉就是經營上營運上有更大的彈性用人也有更多的選擇但是\n因為在法人化以後我們人數因為離退的關係或者請求轉到其他單位安置的關係所以人數大概降了大概兩成所以人力方面也比較不足跟先前的但我們今年人力已經慢慢補回來從今年開始那114年開始自籌經費我們期待應該會有某種程度的一個上揚因為12年應該是谷底跟委員做一個報告\n所以你的意思是說我們在114年就可以看到我們不管是在簽約金或是寄轉寄服收入都可以超越我們1、2年跟1、3年的水準了是嗎是是我們是這樣的努力在爭取努力在爭取好那我們之後我們就是來繼續監督謝謝謝謝委員謝謝張雅琳委員的質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.069 --> 00:00.449\n夏琳委員質詢\n\n00:22.509 --> 00:47.077\n委員好主委好就是我想大家都非常關切嘛就是核一廠在12月3號已經開始了室內乾儲存的乾儲場的熱測試那也預計預計今年裡就會完成那如果測試完成之後呢臺電就會將相關的資料提供給核安會來申請運轉那順利通過的話我們的核一廠的燃料棒就可以開始採用乾式儲存那目前呢各核驗場的室外乾儲場除了剛\n\n00:48.558 --> 00:51.319\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n\n01:17.441 --> 01:30.454\n核一二廠的室內乾儲目前台電公司統一一個標目前正在公告當中等到公告收集廠家意見後他們就會正式進行招標作業\n\n01:31.853 --> 01:56.230\n呃,我想問一下,就是因為我知道之前核一啊,它是因為金額嘛,金額太低,所以大家不太願意來標嘛,那我想我們知道說,那你們覺得核一、核二現在的金額目前,大家是會有意願來標的嗎?呃,報告委員,這部分因為涉及商務,不是核安徽。我說你們,你們關於,呃,你們接觸,你們接觸,應該之前有先了解過嘛,大家,不然你再開一個標,可能還是會留標啊。\n\n01:59.145 --> 02:19.874\n報告委員,台電公司它其實就是經有合一廠招標不順的經驗,那他們有提高價金,但是至於這個部分,因為是屬於涉及台電公司的那個商務合約,所以我們就沒有事。好,沒關係,好,了解了。那剛剛其實由委員來了解就是說有關於到底我們這個\n\n02:21.515 --> 02:23.376\n核廢選址辦公室\n\n02:35.751 --> 02:36.051\n事由經濟部來進行推動\n\n02:58.386 --> 03:25.397\n所以也就是說我們負責管制他們負責推動所以剛才說成立這個核廢專案辦公室是屬於經濟部推動的一環對但我想了解就是說第一放的最終處置場設置條例法官的法規的主管機關是核安會嘛主辦是經濟部但如果未來由經濟部核廢辦公室進行高放的最終處置設置條例的時候主委請問主委就是核安會在這邊還是就是\n\n03:26.517 --> 03:27.198\n事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n\n03:46.170 --> 04:02.126\n我們現在其實都有在學校進行實兵演習啦那是有一天如果不幸發生核子事故的時候也會責定避難收容處所鄰近學校作為安置學校那我想了解就是在我們進行核電廠除役的時候甚至是未來進行最終處置場的選址的過程中\n\n04:03.667 --> 04:04.047\n獲得避難的能力。\n\n04:20.513 --> 04:37.602\n及面對這樣的事故的一個能力所以我想要了解就是在CRC裡面就是國際兒童人權公約裡面其實有講到兒童有權利參與各個共事務所以我想了解我們目前是不是在這些教材裡面在這些溝通裡面有沒有納入兒童的意見\n\n04:39.043 --> 04:56.079\n基本上我們目前針對核事故的這個宣導溝通的防護的部分事實上我們已經有把兒童納進來不是我說你有沒有要找他們你有沒有要納入他們的意見因為常常大人都是我做一個教材然後我就告訴你要這樣使用可是這個教材到底在小孩子來說到底是不是他能夠理解的\n\n04:57.420 --> 05:01.043\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預\n\n05:27.641 --> 05:40.734\n這部分我們來研議。這大概需要多久的時間可以研議呢?這部分給我們三個月的時間,因為這部分我們可能也要諮詢一些專家的意見。\n\n05:44.312 --> 06:13.192\n好因為這部分的話我們就三個月之後給委員一個報告好沒問題那再來就是說因為其實我也知道我們其實是有相關的一些演講這個演講呢其實是有針對於從小到國小大到大專院校但是我統計了109年到113年總共57個場次高中以下只有占其中的12場那我想要問我們是不是還有可能\n\n06:14.747 --> 06:41.847\n讓學校有更多的場次呢?是因為為什麼只有12場?是因為大家來申請的很少?還是大家不知道這個訊息?還是大家來了覺得聽不太懂?到底是哪個原因?目前我們相關的資訊都有在網路上公開有需要都可以來申請我想可能高中的場次這邊比較少的部分我相信因為可能也有很多環境的因素因為其實越到\n\n06:43.326 --> 07:07.447\n閱到高中其實大家的升學壓力也很大但是這部分我們在這個資訊推廣上面我們會去努力跟學校這個去這個做相關的這個宣導我想因為這個活動宗旨這個活動宗旨就是來推廣原子能科普教育可是這個次數四年下來只有12場等於一年平均只有三場一年大概就只有\n\n07:08.148 --> 07:09.109\n獲得核能安全委員會及所屬單位預\n\n07:25.021 --> 07:48.224\n我們在我們的科普教育的部分對科普教育的部分我們可不可以一樣三個月之內因為我想這跟何少益建議是不是可以合併給我一個報告好不好看我們怎麼樣來積極的推廣啦好不好讓更多人了解但再來就是說我想要問主委代理主委就是說我們當時為什麼核研所要轉型成國研院用一個行政法人的身份這個原因是什麼\n\n07:50.085 --> 08:15.032\n因為在主改的時候其實是把這個原能會改成三級的核安會的時候就希望成立一個獨立的安全管制的機關那事實上國研院是希望把它轉成法人的話那依照國外的經驗事實上這會讓國研院有更多的彈性不管他在禁用人力或者他們在研究的計劃的方面都可以有更多的彈性來發展他這個研究的量能\n\n08:16.653 --> 08:30.269\n我希望是可以提升研究量的,但是主委可以看到從109年到現在我們扣除112年,如果我們扣除承接台電4年期計劃簽約金3.9億的話,我們112年的簽約金只剩下6.7億\n\n08:36.176 --> 08:58.427\n所以大概其實是沒有我們轉型成國運院之後我們的研究量似乎也沒有提高不管是從簽約金來看或是從寄轉寄服的收入都是逐漸下滑的甚至113年的平均收入可能都不會到112年那這個似乎沒有達到我們當時轉成行政法人上面應該要有的一個業務成果啦這部分我們可以怎麼樣改善嗎\n\n09:01.091 --> 09:28.926\n國運院轉型後,因為它有一些技術量能的研發跟各個部會的合作的部分,我是不是請院長來做一個說明。報告委員,因為這個1、2年通常我們接一個計畫大概都兩年前有個前置期才能接到,所以這個1、2年看起來簽約金是前一兩年就談的,自籌經費。對不起,就大聲一點嘛,聽不太清楚。\n\n09:29.326 --> 09:55.561\n所以我是說我們的經費112年這個事實上降下來是由於是前一兩年的因素那我們法人化以後真正的績效會到114年開始會逐漸的呈現自籌經費應該會有某種程度的上漲依照我們的規劃目前我們因為運轉就是經營上營運上有更大的彈性用人也有更多的選擇但是\n\n09:57.102 --> 10:24.882\n因為在法人化以後我們人數因為離退的關係或者請求轉到其他單位安置的關係所以人數大概降了大概兩成所以人力方面也比較不足跟先前的但我們今年人力已經慢慢補回來從今年開始那114年開始自籌經費我們期待應該會有某種程度的一個上揚因為12年應該是谷底跟委員做一個報告\n\n10:26.112 --> 10:45.119\n所以你的意思是說我們在114年就可以看到我們不管是在簽約金或是寄轉寄服收入都可以超越我們1、2年跟1、3年的水準了是嗎是是我們是這樣的努力在爭取努力在爭取好那我們之後我們就是來繼續監督謝謝謝謝委員謝謝張雅琳委員的質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.069,"end":0.449,"text":"夏琳委員質詢"},{"start":22.509,"end":47.077,"text":"委員好主委好就是我想大家都非常關切嘛就是核一廠在12月3號已經開始了室內乾儲存的乾儲場的熱測試那也預計預計今年裡就會完成那如果測試完成之後呢臺電就會將相關的資料提供給核安會來申請運轉那順利通過的話我們的核一廠的燃料棒就可以開始採用乾式儲存那目前呢各核驗場的室外乾儲場除了剛"},{"start":48.558,"end":51.319,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預"},{"start":77.441,"end":90.454,"text":"核一二廠的室內乾儲目前台電公司統一一個標目前正在公告當中等到公告收集廠家意見後他們就會正式進行招標作業"},{"start":91.853,"end":116.23,"text":"呃,我想問一下,就是因為我知道之前核一啊,它是因為金額嘛,金額太低,所以大家不太願意來標嘛,那我想我們知道說,那你們覺得核一、核二現在的金額目前,大家是會有意願來標的嗎?呃,報告委員,這部分因為涉及商務,不是核安徽。我說你們,你們關於,呃,你們接觸,你們接觸,應該之前有先了解過嘛,大家,不然你再開一個標,可能還是會留標啊。"},{"start":119.145,"end":139.874,"text":"報告委員,台電公司它其實就是經有合一廠招標不順的經驗,那他們有提高價金,但是至於這個部分,因為是屬於涉及台電公司的那個商務合約,所以我們就沒有事。好,沒關係,好,了解了。那剛剛其實由委員來了解就是說有關於到底我們這個"},{"start":141.515,"end":143.376,"text":"核廢選址辦公室"},{"start":155.751,"end":156.051,"text":"事由經濟部來進行推動"},{"start":178.386,"end":205.397,"text":"所以也就是說我們負責管制他們負責推動所以剛才說成立這個核廢專案辦公室是屬於經濟部推動的一環對但我想了解就是說第一放的最終處置場設置條例法官的法規的主管機關是核安會嘛主辦是經濟部但如果未來由經濟部核廢辦公室進行高放的最終處置設置條例的時候主委請問主委就是核安會在這邊還是就是"},{"start":206.517,"end":207.198,"text":"事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預"},{"start":226.17,"end":242.126,"text":"我們現在其實都有在學校進行實兵演習啦那是有一天如果不幸發生核子事故的時候也會責定避難收容處所鄰近學校作為安置學校那我想了解就是在我們進行核電廠除役的時候甚至是未來進行最終處置場的選址的過程中"},{"start":243.667,"end":244.047,"text":"獲得避難的能力。"},{"start":260.513,"end":277.602,"text":"及面對這樣的事故的一個能力所以我想要了解就是在CRC裡面就是國際兒童人權公約裡面其實有講到兒童有權利參與各個共事務所以我想了解我們目前是不是在這些教材裡面在這些溝通裡面有沒有納入兒童的意見"},{"start":279.043,"end":296.079,"text":"基本上我們目前針對核事故的這個宣導溝通的防護的部分事實上我們已經有把兒童納進來不是我說你有沒有要找他們你有沒有要納入他們的意見因為常常大人都是我做一個教材然後我就告訴你要這樣使用可是這個教材到底在小孩子來說到底是不是他能夠理解的"},{"start":297.42,"end":301.043,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預"},{"start":327.641,"end":340.734,"text":"這部分我們來研議。這大概需要多久的時間可以研議呢?這部分給我們三個月的時間,因為這部分我們可能也要諮詢一些專家的意見。"},{"start":344.312,"end":373.192,"text":"好 因為這部分的話我們就三個月之後給委員一個報告好沒問題那再來就是說因為其實我也知道我們其實是有相關的一些演講這個演講呢其實是有針對於從小到國小大到大專院校但是我統計了109年到113年總共57個場次高中以下只有占其中的12場那我想要問我們是不是還有可能"},{"start":374.747,"end":401.847,"text":"讓學校有更多的場次呢?是因為為什麼只有12場?是因為大家來申請的很少?還是大家不知道這個訊息?還是大家來了覺得聽不太懂?到底是哪個原因?目前我們相關的資訊都有在網路上公開有需要都可以來申請我想可能高中的場次這邊比較少的部分我相信因為可能也有很多環境的因素因為其實越到"},{"start":403.326,"end":427.447,"text":"閱到高中其實大家的升學壓力也很大但是這部分我們在這個資訊推廣上面我們會去努力跟學校這個去這個做相關的這個宣導我想因為這個活動宗旨這個活動宗旨就是來推廣原子能科普教育可是這個次數四年下來只有12場等於一年平均只有三場一年大概就只有"},{"start":428.148,"end":429.109,"text":"獲得核能安全委員會及所屬單位預"},{"start":445.021,"end":468.224,"text":"我們在我們的科普教育的部分對科普教育的部分我們可不可以一樣三個月之內因為我想這跟何少益建議是不是可以合併給我一個報告好不好看我們怎麼樣來積極的推廣啦好不好讓更多人了解但再來就是說我想要問主委代理主委就是說我們當時為什麼核研所要轉型成國研院用一個行政法人的身份這個原因是什麼"},{"start":470.085,"end":495.032,"text":"因為在主改的時候其實是把這個原能會改成三級的核安會的時候就希望成立一個獨立的安全管制的機關那事實上國研院是希望把它轉成法人的話那依照國外的經驗事實上這會讓國研院有更多的彈性不管他在禁用人力或者他們在研究的計劃的方面都可以有更多的彈性來發展他這個研究的量能"},{"start":496.653,"end":510.269,"text":"我希望是可以提升研究量的,但是主委可以看到從109年到現在我們扣除112年,如果我們扣除承接台電4年期計劃簽約金3.9億的話,我們112年的簽約金只剩下6.7億"},{"start":516.176,"end":538.427,"text":"所以大概其實是沒有我們轉型成國運院之後我們的研究量似乎也沒有提高不管是從簽約金來看或是從寄轉寄服的收入都是逐漸下滑的甚至113年的平均收入可能都不會到112年那這個似乎沒有達到我們當時轉成行政法人上面應該要有的一個業務成果啦這部分我們可以怎麼樣改善嗎"},{"start":541.091,"end":568.926,"text":"國運院轉型後,因為它有一些技術量能的研發跟各個部會的合作的部分,我是不是請院長來做一個說明。報告委員,因為這個1、2年通常我們接一個計畫大概都兩年前有個前置期才能接到,所以這個1、2年看起來簽約金是前一兩年就談的,自籌經費。對不起,就大聲一點嘛,聽不太清楚。"},{"start":569.326,"end":595.561,"text":"所以我是說我們的經費112年這個事實上降下來是由於是前一兩年的因素那我們法人化以後真正的績效會到114年開始會逐漸的呈現自籌經費應該會有某種程度的上漲依照我們的規劃目前我們因為運轉就是經營上營運上有更大的彈性用人也有更多的選擇但是"},{"start":597.102,"end":624.882,"text":"因為在法人化以後我們人數因為離退的關係或者請求轉到其他單位安置的關係所以人數大概降了大概兩成所以人力方面也比較不足跟先前的但我們今年人力已經慢慢補回來從今年開始那114年開始自籌經費我們期待應該會有某種程度的一個上揚因為12年應該是谷底跟委員做一個報告"},{"start":626.112,"end":645.119,"text":"所以你的意思是說我們在114年就可以看到我們不管是在簽約金或是寄轉寄服收入都可以超越我們1、2年跟1、3年的水準了是嗎是是我們是這樣的努力在爭取努力在爭取好那我們之後我們就是來繼續監督謝謝謝謝委員謝謝張雅琳委員的質詢"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":278,"blocks":[["張委員雅琳：（10時）謝謝主席，我們有請代理主委。"],["主席：有請代理主委。"],["張代理主任委員欣：委員好。"],["張委員雅琳：主委好。我想大家都非常關切核一廠在10月23號，已經開始室內乾式貯存場的熱測試，也預計今年底就會完成，如果測試完成之後，台電就會將相關的資料提供給核安會來申請運轉，順利通過的話，我們核一廠的燃料棒就可以開始採用乾式貯存，目前各核電廠的室外乾貯場，除了剛剛說的核一廠之外，核二廠目前8月也已經通過建照申請，順利的話，5年之後我們也會有核二廠的乾式貯存。但是我也知道室內的乾貯場，因為發包失敗，現在是合併一起統一發包，所以我想要瞭解目前的進度如何？"],["張代理主任委員欣：室內乾貯的進度，是不是請我們的組長做一個補充？"],["張委員雅琳：好，謝謝。"],["陳組長文泉：報告委員，核一、二廠的室內乾貯，目前台電公司統一為一個標，目前正在公告當中，等到公告蒐集廠家意見後，他們就會正式進行招標作業。"],["張委員雅琳：我想問一下，我知道之前核一是因為金額太低，大家不太願意來標，我想知道你們覺得核一、核二現在的金額，目前大家會有意願來標的嗎？"],["張代理主任委員欣：報告委員，這部分因為涉及商務，不是核安會可以去做……"],["張委員雅琳：沒有，我是說就你們接觸的，應該之前有先瞭解過，不然你再開一個標，可能還是會流標啊！"],["陳組長文泉：報告委員，台電公司其實經由核一廠招標不順的經驗，他們有提高價金，至於這個部分，因為是涉及台電公司的商務合約，我們並沒有涉入。"],["張委員雅琳：好，沒關係，瞭解了。剛剛其實也有委員想瞭解核廢選址辦公室，我剛剛有聽到你們現在是有設置要點，但是還沒有成立辦公室，我想瞭解一下，為什麼這一項法案是由經濟部來進行推動的？"],["張代理主任委員欣：基本上，剛才我們有提供選址的相關管理機制，這是給經濟部跟台電在選址上做一個參據。可是在推動的部分，是屬於經濟部跟台電公司去推動，也就是我們負責管制，他們負責推動，所以剛才說成立核廢專案辦公室是屬於經濟部推動的一環。"],["張委員雅琳：對！但我想瞭解，第一，低放的最終處置場設置條例，法規的主管機關是核安會，主辦是經濟部，如果未來由經濟部核廢辦公室進行高放的最終處置設置條例的時候，請問主委，核安會還是負責安全管制的部分，對嗎？"],["張代理主任委員欣：對，事實上他們在過程裡面，我們都會跟他們持續、密切地進行監督、溝通的工作。"],["張委員雅琳：瞭解。我想再問一題，就是有關於核安的部分，我知道我們現在其實都有在學校進行實兵演習，但是有一天，如果不幸發生核子事故的時候，也會責定避難收容處所、鄰近學校作為安置學校，我想瞭解在我們進行核電廠除役的時候，甚至是未來進行最終處置場選址的過程中，針對附近學校來宣導，或是辦理座談會時，我們是不是可以製作適合兒童的教材？如果真的不小心發生了什麼樣的事故，孩子應該要具備避難的能力，要有面對這樣事故的能力，所以我想要了解的是，在CRC（兒童人權公約）裡面其實有提到，兒童有權利參與各個公共事務，所以我想了解，我們目前在這些教材裡面、在這些溝通裡面有沒有納入兒少的意見？"],["張代理主任委員欣：基本上，我們目前針對核事故的宣導、溝通及防護的部分，事實上，我們已經有把兒童納進來。"],["張委員雅琳：不是，我是說你有沒有找他們？你有沒有納入他們的意見？因為常常大人都是自己做一個教材，然後就告訴孩子要這樣使用，可是這個教材對小孩子來說到底是不是他能夠理解的？"],["張代理主任委員欣：針對這個部分，我們確實有做兒童的相關宣導及溝通，之後針對意見採計的部分，我們會更注意，就是兒童意見的反映……"],["張委員雅琳：我講的應該不是只有宣導跟溝通啦，最重要的是說，因為我們常常遇見嘛，有很多教材是從大人的視角去看的，其實小孩子並不能夠理解，在小孩子不能理解的狀況下，他就不能夠真正地去保護他自己、照顧他自己，所以我想要您做的事情就是徵詢兒少的意見，所以是不是有可能成立兒少諮詢會議小組呢？"],["張代理主任委員欣：這部分我們來研議。"],["張委員雅琳：這個大概需要多久時間可以完成研議呢？"],["張代理主任委員欣：這個部分給我們三個月的時間，因為這個部分我們可能也要諮詢一些專家的意見。"],["張委員雅琳：好，這個部分就三個月之後給我們……"],["張代理主任委員欣：三個月之後給委員一個報告。"],["張委員雅琳：好，沒問題。","再來，其實我也知道，我們是有相關的一些演講，而這個演講的對象是從小到國小、大到大專院校，但是我統計了109年到113年總共57個場次，高中以下只占其中的12場，我想要問我們是不是還有可能讓學校有更多的場次呢？為什麼只有12場？是因為大家來申請的很少，還是大家不知道這個訊息，還是大家來了覺得聽不太懂，到底是哪個原因？"],["張代理主任委員欣：目前我們相關的資訊都有在網路上公開，有需要的都可以來申請，高中的場次比較少的部分，我相信可能也有很多環境的因素，因為越到高中，其實大家的升學壓力也很大，但是在資訊的推廣上面，我們會努力跟學校去做相關的宣導，來增加……"],["張委員雅琳：因為這個活動宗旨就是推廣原子能科普教育，可是這個次數4年下來只有12場，等於一年平均只有3場，一年大概就只有不到500人，我覺得這個數字有點太少了，離我們的目標應該有點遠，我們是不是可以再更積極地去宣傳，讓更多的學校來參與？不然我覺得我們設計這個課程就有點可惜了，有點太被動了。"],["張代理主任委員欣：我們會在我們的科普教育部分看怎麼來加強。"],["張委員雅琳：對，科普教育的部分，你們可不可以一樣在三個月之內，這個跟兒少意見是不是可以合併給我一個報告？好不好？"],["張代理主任委員欣：好。"],["張委員雅琳：我們要怎麼樣來積極地推廣，讓更多人了解。"],["張代理主任委員欣：好。"],["張委員雅琳：再來，我想要問代理主委，當時為什麼核研所要轉型成國原院，用一個行政法人的身分，這個原因是什麼？"],["張代理主任委員欣：因為在組改的時候，把原能會改成三級的核安會的時候，希望成立一個獨立的安全管制機關，事實上，把國原院轉成法人的話，依照國外的經驗，這會讓國原院有更多的彈性，不管在進用人力或者是在研究計畫方面，都可以有更多的彈性來發展研究的量能。"],["張委員雅琳：好，但是我們剛剛講了，希望它是可以提升研究量能，但是主委可以看到，從109年到現在，如果扣除112年，如果我們扣除承接台電4年期計畫簽約金3.9億的話，我們112年的簽約金只剩下6.7億，所以其實在它轉型成國原院之後，我們的研究量能似乎也沒有提高，不管是從簽約金或是從技轉、技服的收入來看，都是逐漸下滑的，甚至113年的平均收入可能都不會到112年耶，似乎沒有達到我們當時轉成行政法人所應該要有的業務成果，這個部分我們可以怎麼樣改善嗎？"],["張代理主任委員欣：針對國原院在轉型之後，因為它有一些技術量能的研發，跟各個部會合作的部分，我是不是請院長來做說明？"],["張委員雅琳：好。"],["高院長梓木：報告委員，因為112年，通常我們接一個計畫大概都是兩年前有個前置期才能接到，所以這個112年的部分看起來，簽約金是前一、兩年就談的自籌經費……"],["張委員雅琳：對不起，你可以大聲一點嗎？我聽不太清楚。"],["高院長梓木：我是說我們的經費，112年的部分降下來是因為前一、兩年的因素，我們法人化以後，真正的績效會到114年開始逐漸的呈現，自籌經費應該會有某種程度的上漲，依照我們的規劃。目前我們的運轉，就是在經營上、營運上有更大的彈性，用人也有更多的選擇，但是在法人化以後，我們的人數因為離退的關係或者請求轉到其他單位安置的關係，所以人數大概降了兩成，跟先前相比，人力方面也比較不足，但今年我們的人力已經慢慢補回來，從今年開始，114年開始自籌經費，我們期待應該會有某種程度的上揚，因為112年應該是谷底，跟委員做一個報告。"],["張委員雅琳：所以你的意思是說我們在114年就可以看到，不管是簽約金或是技轉、技服收入都可以超越112年跟113年的水準了，是嗎？"],["高院長梓木：是，我們是這樣努力在爭取。"],["張委員雅琳：努力在爭取？好，我們之後會繼續監督，謝謝。"],["張代理主任委員欣：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝張雅琳委員的質詢，代理主委請回。","下一位請柯志恩委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":358,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-22-9","speakers":["范雲","洪孟楷","萬美玲","林宜瑾","林倩綺","張雅琳","柯志恩","葛如鈞","陳秀寳","郭昱晴","吳沛憶","陳培瑜","羅廷瑋","葉元之","吳春城"],"page_start":313,"meetingDate":["2024-11-20"],"gazette_id":"11310401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11310401_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期教育及文化委員會第9次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請核能安全委員會代理主任委員張欣列席報告業務概況，並備質詢；二、審查114年度中\n央政府總預算案有關核能安全委員會及所屬單位預算案；三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案有\n關核能安全委員會主管核子事故緊急應變基金附屬單位預算案；四、審查114年度行政法人國家\n原子能科技研究院預算案（第二案至第四案僅進行詢答）","agenda_id":"11310401_00005"}}}