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00:00:34,336\n兩位次長好我想不是部長來因為你們兩位都是長期的事務官所以某種程度上我反而覺得是說可以更講一些專業的判斷而不要受政治立場或者是講這種空話所以本席也希望是說能夠救教因為\n\n3\n00:00:35,457 --> 00:00:53,117\n對我們今天召委提的這個議題其實是非常重要美國大選已經兩個禮拜了那結果完之後後續台灣跟美國的貿易或是相關的合作的部分其實都很受對沒錯新任的川普總統要上任的影響所以我先提醒\n\n4\n00:00:54,338 --> 00:01:14,812\n先不要我們官方這邊講是說不知道川普總統他選舉的承諾到底會不會兌現或說未來會不會推動我覺得這不是我們官方應該要去評論我們應該都要以人家總統候選人他競選時候的政見或想法就要以這樣的方向去準備\n\n5\n00:01:16,158 --> 00:01:21,462\n民嘴可以這樣子說我們官方立場不能有這樣的一個態度我覺得這第一個本席要很嚴正的一個先提醒再來第二個部分\n\n6\n00:01:37,864 --> 00:01:57,278\n川普總統當選人他在過去競選期間就已經講了他就說科增關稅把關稅調高晶片商會自己前來設廠美國一毛錢可能都不用花他甚至有點名到說台灣把美國95%的晶片市場都搶走了有注意到這個新聞嗎\n\n7\n00:01:59,090 --> 00:02:26,657\n好那如果說假設如同剛剛我們好幾位委員都在強調的就是說如果未來美國真的上川普真的上任之後他要調高這個相關的關稅那會不會勢必又希望是說連帶的把這一些上中下游廠商都集中到美國生產因為他美國再次偉大很重要的核心價值就是他們要恢復製造業嘛那這樣會不會擔心我們包括台積電或是相關我們的這一些高科技晶片廠\n\n8\n00:02:27,697 --> 00:02:53,487\n有可能到美國設廠甚至把我們更核心的技術也前往美國這個機率有多大有沒有評估過報告委員對外投資台灣最近幾年來因為委員剛說要做一些比較事務性的報告我報告一下我們最近幾年來台灣每年對外投資大概200億美金左右表示我們台商已經在做全球佈局因為台灣的\n\n9\n00:02:55,914 --> 00:03:20,907\n經濟、工業和科技的發展已經足以到全球去佈局來延伸我們的實力以及跟當地市場和其他貿易夥伴之間加深的合作這第一點第二個,台灣的產業特性跟日韓不一樣日韓他是集團他整個過去不管是三重或是LG等等他都是上中下游一起去台灣的產業特性是中小企業組成的螞蟻從兵\n\n10\n00:03:22,188 --> 00:03:47,556\n所以我們去的時候當台積電去必然它的供應鏈要過去服務它這樣才能夠維持我們的競爭力而不是扶植當地的供應鏈而已當然我們也希望跟當地供應鏈合作那麼這是一個彼此互惠互烈做法所以會不會過去當然為了維持我們的實力的成長這個合作是有必要的因為我們的產業形態跟日韓不同第三點\n\n11\n00:03:48,736 --> 00:04:15,732\n至於科技方面的外流的話我們有一個投資審查的機制所以任何對外投資都要經過經濟部跟各部會、跨部會的一個審查像比方說台積電去美國的投資雖然是相當先進的進變但是我們在審查過程中很整密地做了評估它的在美國的投資計畫是2028年量產在台灣是2025年量產在美國目前兩個場在台灣目前大概十個場\n\n12\n00:04:16,613 --> 00:04:18,374\n市長你講到重點重點就在於是說我們一直擔心跟\n\n13\n00:04:42,805 --> 00:05:02,873\n害怕或者是說我們也認為為什麼過去一直講台積電叫護國神山就是台積電的存在讓很多人會認為是說我們台灣是相對安全可是從過去這兩三年裡面其實開始有人在炒作說如果說台積電沒有在台灣的話可能台灣的處境就會相對危險\n\n14\n00:05:04,133 --> 00:05:20,287\n那再來是你剛剛有提到就是說我剛剛讓你完整的敘述就代表是說你現在講到的是台積電現在生產多數都還是在台灣技術都還是在台灣而且跟美國相差來講差不多有3年左右的時間對不對一個2005一個2025一個2028嘛\n\n15\n00:05:24,170 --> 00:05:40,353\n那但是現在美國的政權輪替、政黨交替了那我們未來因應這1月20號之後的狀況我們有沒有做過評估或是說如果說1月20號真的共和黨川普上任之後他也要求說我要改變遊戲規則增加成本你的進口關稅提高那還有你的技術\n\n16\n00:05:47,939 --> 00:06:00,333\n那時候我們投審會一個投審會有辦法阻擋或是抗拒美國政府的力量嗎?除了投審會以外我們還有沒有什麼樣的機制作為是能夠\n\n17\n00:06:01,843 --> 00:06:05,245\n外交部的次長也是投審會的成員所以外交部次長單位到外交部而且整個國安體系都會做評估第三個我跟委員報告\n\n18\n00:06:29,759 --> 00:06:51,125\n因為我們也希望台積電的投資能夠成功而且國際局勢瞬息萬變我們會隨時滾動性來檢討他的投資計畫審查如何對台灣最為有利這個是最高原則好啦市長本席提出來啦這一個問題可能是賴總統才有辦法去回答但是本席先提出來是我們先看到問題了\n\n19\n00:06:52,606 --> 00:07:08,585\n我們當然都希望臺積電的投資成功但是怎麼樣能夠把核心技術跟流台灣在其他地方的投資成功這個是關鍵好不好那個田次長一個部分請教因為我們有看到說海地我們的友邦\n\n20\n00:07:11,068 --> 00:07:36,080\n這幾天的新聞從今年整個狀況其實海地我們的友邦其實不是太好的那在5月10號的時候就舊政府還是吳釗燮部長的時候他曾經被問到說有兩個邦交國長期是有隱憂的他沒有點名哪兩個邦交國但之後媒體去報導他說有推敲有可能他講的是海地跟瓜地馬拉這個我必須要先說明清楚\n\n21\n00:07:37,061 --> 00:07:48,463\n吳部長只有講兩個邦交國長期隱憂他是擔心有可能有斷交的風險但是沒有講哪兩個邦交國可是現在我們看到是說海地他的首都太子港\n\n22\n00:07:49,620 --> 00:08:09,230\n據外媒報導,被80%幫派份子把持,並且造成說有2萬多人顛沛流離是居無定所,也非常的辛苦。那我想請教一下,到目前為止,海地政府有沒有對於我們的外交部有提出什麼樣還有需求?\n\n23\n00:08:10,178 --> 00:08:28,543\n沒有,沒有額外的要求。海地我們只是擔心那個政局的不穩,然後內部的混亂,然後我們在駐大使館人員的安全。目前我們大使館人員安全是沒有問題的。那我們那邊的僑民或是僑胞,\n\n24\n00:08:29,775 --> 00:08:50,767\n的安全狀況也是有掌握也可以掌握那對於他們政府現在動盪當然因為是我們的友邦但有沒有會在這個時候提出超出預期或是不合理的要求沒有到目前為止是沒有的那我們會不會因應譬如說要維持友邦而反而會有一些狀況產生\n\n25\n00:08:53,597 --> 00:09:19,933\n不會在海地目前狀況我覺得他只是怎麼樣把內部的次序做好我們沒有感受到或者沒有那個質詢雙邊的邦交會問題好我希望邦交股票再有任何的散失但是也請注意關心因為在這個議題上面從上一任部長到現在好像比較少提及但是本期還是善意的提醒好不好以上謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n109\t6860\t主席謝謝麻煩要請我們田次長跟經濟部陳次長請田次長和陳次長\n14135\t34336\t兩位次長好我想不是部長來因為你們兩位都是長期的事務官所以某種程度上我反而覺得是說可以更講一些專業的判斷而不要受政治立場或者是講這種空話所以本席也希望是說能夠救教因為\n35457\t53117\t對我們今天召委提的這個議題其實是非常重要美國大選已經兩個禮拜了那結果完之後後續台灣跟美國的貿易或是相關的合作的部分其實都很受對沒錯新任的川普總統要上任的影響所以我先提醒\n54338\t74812\t先不要我們官方這邊講是說不知道川普總統他選舉的承諾到底會不會兌現或說未來會不會推動我覺得這不是我們官方應該要去評論我們應該都要以人家總統候選人他競選時候的政見或想法就要以這樣的方向去準備\n76158\t81462\t民嘴可以這樣子說我們官方立場不能有這樣的一個態度我覺得這第一個本席要很嚴正的一個先提醒再來第二個部分\n97864\t117278\t川普總統當選人他在過去競選期間就已經講了他就說科增關稅把關稅調高晶片商會自己前來設廠美國一毛錢可能都不用花他甚至有點名到說台灣把美國95%的晶片市場都搶走了有注意到這個新聞嗎\n119090\t146657\t好 那如果說假設如同剛剛我們好幾位委員都在強調的就是說 如果未來美國真的上川普真的上任之後他要調高這個相關的關稅那會不會勢必又希望是說連帶的把這一些上中下游廠商都集中到美國生產因為他美國再次偉大很重要的核心價值就是他們要恢復製造業嘛那這樣會不會擔心我們包括台積電或是相關我們的這一些高科技晶片廠\n147697\t173487\t有可能到美國設廠甚至把我們更核心的技術也前往美國這個機率有多大有沒有評估過報告委員對外投資台灣最近幾年來因為委員剛說要做一些比較事務性的報告我報告一下我們最近幾年來台灣每年對外投資大概200億美金左右表示我們台商已經在做全球佈局因為台灣的\n175914\t200907\t經濟、工業和科技的發展已經足以到全球去佈局來延伸我們的實力以及跟當地市場和其他貿易夥伴之間加深的合作這第一點第二個,台灣的產業特性跟日韓不一樣日韓他是集團他整個過去不管是三重或是LG等等他都是上中下游一起去台灣的產業特性是中小企業組成的螞蟻從兵\n202188\t227556\t所以我們去的時候當台積電去必然它的供應鏈要過去服務它這樣才能夠維持我們的競爭力而不是扶植當地的供應鏈而已當然我們也希望跟當地供應鏈合作那麼這是一個彼此互惠互烈做法所以會不會過去當然為了維持我們的實力的成長這個合作是有必要的因為我們的產業形態跟日韓不同第三點\n228736\t255732\t至於科技方面的外流的話我們有一個投資審查的機制所以任何對外投資都要經過經濟部跟各部會、跨部會的一個審查像比方說台積電去美國的投資雖然是相當先進的進變但是我們在審查過程中很整密地做了評估它的在美國的投資計畫是2028年量產在台灣是2025年量產在美國目前兩個場在台灣目前大概十個場\n256613\t258374\t市長你講到重點重點就在於是說我們一直擔心跟\n282805\t302873\t害怕或者是說我們也認為為什麼過去一直講台積電叫護國神山就是台積電的存在讓很多人會認為是說我們台灣是相對安全可是從過去這兩三年裡面其實開始有人在炒作說如果說台積電沒有在台灣的話可能台灣的處境就會相對危險\n304133\t320287\t那再來是你剛剛有提到就是說我剛剛讓你完整的敘述就代表是說你現在講到的是台積電現在生產多數都還是在台灣技術都還是在台灣而且跟美國相差來講差不多有3年左右的時間對不對一個2005一個2025一個2028嘛\n324170\t340353\t那但是現在美國的政權輪替、政黨交替了那我們未來因應這1月20號之後的狀況我們有沒有做過評估或是說如果說1月20號真的共和黨川普上任之後他也要求說我要改變遊戲規則增加成本你的進口關稅提高那還有你的技術\n347939\t360333\t那時候我們投審會一個投審會有辦法阻擋或是抗拒美國政府的力量嗎?除了投審會以外我們還有沒有什麼樣的機制作為是能夠\n361843\t365245\t外交部的次長也是投審會的成員所以外交部次長單位到外交部而且整個國安體系都會做評估第三個我跟委員報告\n389759\t411125\t因為我們也希望台積電的投資能夠成功而且國際局勢瞬息萬變我們會隨時滾動性來檢討他的投資計畫審查如何對台灣最為有利這個是最高原則好啦 市長本席提出來啦這一個問題可能是賴總統才有辦法去回答但是本席先提出來是我們先看到問題了\n412606\t428585\t我們當然都希望臺積電的投資成功但是怎麼樣能夠把核心技術跟流台灣在其他地方的投資成功這個是關鍵好不好那個田次長一個部分請教因為我們有看到說海地我們的友邦\n431068\t456080\t這幾天的新聞從今年整個狀況其實海地我們的友邦其實不是太好的那在5月10號的時候就舊政府還是吳釗燮部長的時候他曾經被問到說有兩個邦交國長期是有隱憂的他沒有點名哪兩個邦交國但之後媒體去報導他說有推敲有可能他講的是海地跟瓜地馬拉這個我必須要先說明清楚\n457061\t468463\t吳部長只有講兩個邦交國長期隱憂他是擔心有可能有斷交的風險但是沒有講哪兩個邦交國可是現在我們看到是說海地他的首都太子港\n469620\t489230\t據外媒報導,被80%幫派份子把持,並且造成說有2萬多人顛沛流離是居無定所,也非常的辛苦。那我想請教一下,到目前為止,海地政府有沒有對於我們的外交部有提出什麼樣還有需求?\n490178\t508543\t沒有,沒有額外的要求。海地我們只是擔心那個政局的不穩,然後內部的混亂,然後我們在駐大使館人員的安全。目前我們大使館人員安全是沒有問題的。那我們那邊的僑民或是僑胞,\n509775\t530767\t的安全狀況也是有掌握也可以掌握那對於他們政府現在動盪當然因為是我們的友邦但有沒有會在這個時候提出超出預期或是不合理的要求沒有到目前為止是沒有的那我們會不會因應譬如說要維持友邦而反而會有一些狀況產生\n533597\t559933\t不會在海地目前狀況我覺得他只是怎麼樣把內部的次序做好我們沒有感受到或者沒有那個質詢雙邊的邦交會問題好我希望邦交股票再有任何的散失但是也請注意關心因為在這個議題上面從上一任部長到現在好像比較少提及但是本期還是善意的提醒好不好以上謝謝\n","txt":"主席謝謝麻煩要請我們田次長跟經濟部陳次長請田次長和陳次長\n兩位次長好我想不是部長來因為你們兩位都是長期的事務官所以某種程度上我反而覺得是說可以更講一些專業的判斷而不要受政治立場或者是講這種空話所以本席也希望是說能夠救教因為\n對我們今天召委提的這個議題其實是非常重要美國大選已經兩個禮拜了那結果完之後後續台灣跟美國的貿易或是相關的合作的部分其實都很受對沒錯新任的川普總統要上任的影響所以我先提醒\n先不要我們官方這邊講是說不知道川普總統他選舉的承諾到底會不會兌現或說未來會不會推動我覺得這不是我們官方應該要去評論我們應該都要以人家總統候選人他競選時候的政見或想法就要以這樣的方向去準備\n民嘴可以這樣子說我們官方立場不能有這樣的一個態度我覺得這第一個本席要很嚴正的一個先提醒再來第二個部分\n川普總統當選人他在過去競選期間就已經講了他就說科增關稅把關稅調高晶片商會自己前來設廠美國一毛錢可能都不用花他甚至有點名到說台灣把美國95%的晶片市場都搶走了有注意到這個新聞嗎\n好 那如果說假設如同剛剛我們好幾位委員都在強調的就是說 如果未來美國真的上川普真的上任之後他要調高這個相關的關稅那會不會勢必又希望是說連帶的把這一些上中下游廠商都集中到美國生產因為他美國再次偉大很重要的核心價值就是他們要恢復製造業嘛那這樣會不會擔心我們包括台積電或是相關我們的這一些高科技晶片廠\n有可能到美國設廠甚至把我們更核心的技術也前往美國這個機率有多大有沒有評估過報告委員對外投資台灣最近幾年來因為委員剛說要做一些比較事務性的報告我報告一下我們最近幾年來台灣每年對外投資大概200億美金左右表示我們台商已經在做全球佈局因為台灣的\n經濟、工業和科技的發展已經足以到全球去佈局來延伸我們的實力以及跟當地市場和其他貿易夥伴之間加深的合作這第一點第二個,台灣的產業特性跟日韓不一樣日韓他是集團他整個過去不管是三重或是LG等等他都是上中下游一起去台灣的產業特性是中小企業組成的螞蟻從兵\n所以我們去的時候當台積電去必然它的供應鏈要過去服務它這樣才能夠維持我們的競爭力而不是扶植當地的供應鏈而已當然我們也希望跟當地供應鏈合作那麼這是一個彼此互惠互烈做法所以會不會過去當然為了維持我們的實力的成長這個合作是有必要的因為我們的產業形態跟日韓不同第三點\n至於科技方面的外流的話我們有一個投資審查的機制所以任何對外投資都要經過經濟部跟各部會、跨部會的一個審查像比方說台積電去美國的投資雖然是相當先進的進變但是我們在審查過程中很整密地做了評估它的在美國的投資計畫是2028年量產在台灣是2025年量產在美國目前兩個場在台灣目前大概十個場\n市長你講到重點重點就在於是說我們一直擔心跟\n害怕或者是說我們也認為為什麼過去一直講台積電叫護國神山就是台積電的存在讓很多人會認為是說我們台灣是相對安全可是從過去這兩三年裡面其實開始有人在炒作說如果說台積電沒有在台灣的話可能台灣的處境就會相對危險\n那再來是你剛剛有提到就是說我剛剛讓你完整的敘述就代表是說你現在講到的是台積電現在生產多數都還是在台灣技術都還是在台灣而且跟美國相差來講差不多有3年左右的時間對不對一個2005一個2025一個2028嘛\n那但是現在美國的政權輪替、政黨交替了那我們未來因應這1月20號之後的狀況我們有沒有做過評估或是說如果說1月20號真的共和黨川普上任之後他也要求說我要改變遊戲規則增加成本你的進口關稅提高那還有你的技術\n那時候我們投審會一個投審會有辦法阻擋或是抗拒美國政府的力量嗎?除了投審會以外我們還有沒有什麼樣的機制作為是能夠\n外交部的次長也是投審會的成員所以外交部次長單位到外交部而且整個國安體系都會做評估第三個我跟委員報告\n因為我們也希望台積電的投資能夠成功而且國際局勢瞬息萬變我們會隨時滾動性來檢討他的投資計畫審查如何對台灣最為有利這個是最高原則好啦 市長本席提出來啦這一個問題可能是賴總統才有辦法去回答但是本席先提出來是我們先看到問題了\n我們當然都希望臺積電的投資成功但是怎麼樣能夠把核心技術跟流台灣在其他地方的投資成功這個是關鍵好不好那個田次長一個部分請教因為我們有看到說海地我們的友邦\n這幾天的新聞從今年整個狀況其實海地我們的友邦其實不是太好的那在5月10號的時候就舊政府還是吳釗燮部長的時候他曾經被問到說有兩個邦交國長期是有隱憂的他沒有點名哪兩個邦交國但之後媒體去報導他說有推敲有可能他講的是海地跟瓜地馬拉這個我必須要先說明清楚\n吳部長只有講兩個邦交國長期隱憂他是擔心有可能有斷交的風險但是沒有講哪兩個邦交國可是現在我們看到是說海地他的首都太子港\n據外媒報導,被80%幫派份子把持,並且造成說有2萬多人顛沛流離是居無定所,也非常的辛苦。那我想請教一下,到目前為止,海地政府有沒有對於我們的外交部有提出什麼樣還有需求?\n沒有,沒有額外的要求。海地我們只是擔心那個政局的不穩,然後內部的混亂,然後我們在駐大使館人員的安全。目前我們大使館人員安全是沒有問題的。那我們那邊的僑民或是僑胞,\n的安全狀況也是有掌握也可以掌握那對於他們政府現在動盪當然因為是我們的友邦但有沒有會在這個時候提出超出預期或是不合理的要求沒有到目前為止是沒有的那我們會不會因應譬如說要維持友邦而反而會有一些狀況產生\n不會在海地目前狀況我覺得他只是怎麼樣把內部的次序做好我們沒有感受到或者沒有那個質詢雙邊的邦交會問題好我希望邦交股票再有任何的散失但是也請注意關心因為在這個議題上面從上一任部長到現在好像比較少提及但是本期還是善意的提醒好不好以上謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.109 --> 00:06.860\n主席謝謝麻煩要請我們田次長跟經濟部陳次長請田次長和陳次長\n\n00:14.135 --> 00:34.336\n兩位次長好我想不是部長來因為你們兩位都是長期的事務官所以某種程度上我反而覺得是說可以更講一些專業的判斷而不要受政治立場或者是講這種空話所以本席也希望是說能夠救教因為\n\n00:35.457 --> 00:53.117\n對我們今天召委提的這個議題其實是非常重要美國大選已經兩個禮拜了那結果完之後後續台灣跟美國的貿易或是相關的合作的部分其實都很受對沒錯新任的川普總統要上任的影響所以我先提醒\n\n00:54.338 --> 01:14.812\n先不要我們官方這邊講是說不知道川普總統他選舉的承諾到底會不會兌現或說未來會不會推動我覺得這不是我們官方應該要去評論我們應該都要以人家總統候選人他競選時候的政見或想法就要以這樣的方向去準備\n\n01:16.158 --> 01:21.462\n民嘴可以這樣子說我們官方立場不能有這樣的一個態度我覺得這第一個本席要很嚴正的一個先提醒再來第二個部分\n\n01:37.864 --> 01:57.278\n川普總統當選人他在過去競選期間就已經講了他就說科增關稅把關稅調高晶片商會自己前來設廠美國一毛錢可能都不用花他甚至有點名到說台灣把美國95%的晶片市場都搶走了有注意到這個新聞嗎\n\n01:59.090 --> 02:26.657\n好那如果說假設如同剛剛我們好幾位委員都在強調的就是說如果未來美國真的上川普真的上任之後他要調高這個相關的關稅那會不會勢必又希望是說連帶的把這一些上中下游廠商都集中到美國生產因為他美國再次偉大很重要的核心價值就是他們要恢復製造業嘛那這樣會不會擔心我們包括台積電或是相關我們的這一些高科技晶片廠\n\n02:27.697 --> 02:53.487\n有可能到美國設廠甚至把我們更核心的技術也前往美國這個機率有多大有沒有評估過報告委員對外投資台灣最近幾年來因為委員剛說要做一些比較事務性的報告我報告一下我們最近幾年來台灣每年對外投資大概200億美金左右表示我們台商已經在做全球佈局因為台灣的\n\n02:55.914 --> 03:20.907\n經濟、工業和科技的發展已經足以到全球去佈局來延伸我們的實力以及跟當地市場和其他貿易夥伴之間加深的合作這第一點第二個,台灣的產業特性跟日韓不一樣日韓他是集團他整個過去不管是三重或是LG等等他都是上中下游一起去台灣的產業特性是中小企業組成的螞蟻從兵\n\n03:22.188 --> 03:47.556\n所以我們去的時候當台積電去必然它的供應鏈要過去服務它這樣才能夠維持我們的競爭力而不是扶植當地的供應鏈而已當然我們也希望跟當地供應鏈合作那麼這是一個彼此互惠互烈做法所以會不會過去當然為了維持我們的實力的成長這個合作是有必要的因為我們的產業形態跟日韓不同第三點\n\n03:48.736 --> 04:15.732\n至於科技方面的外流的話我們有一個投資審查的機制所以任何對外投資都要經過經濟部跟各部會、跨部會的一個審查像比方說台積電去美國的投資雖然是相當先進的進變但是我們在審查過程中很整密地做了評估它的在美國的投資計畫是2028年量產在台灣是2025年量產在美國目前兩個場在台灣目前大概十個場\n\n04:16.613 --> 04:18.374\n市長你講到重點重點就在於是說我們一直擔心跟\n\n04:42.805 --> 05:02.873\n害怕或者是說我們也認為為什麼過去一直講台積電叫護國神山就是台積電的存在讓很多人會認為是說我們台灣是相對安全可是從過去這兩三年裡面其實開始有人在炒作說如果說台積電沒有在台灣的話可能台灣的處境就會相對危險\n\n05:04.133 --> 05:20.287\n那再來是你剛剛有提到就是說我剛剛讓你完整的敘述就代表是說你現在講到的是台積電現在生產多數都還是在台灣技術都還是在台灣而且跟美國相差來講差不多有3年左右的時間對不對一個2005一個2025一個2028嘛\n\n05:24.170 --> 05:40.353\n那但是現在美國的政權輪替、政黨交替了那我們未來因應這1月20號之後的狀況我們有沒有做過評估或是說如果說1月20號真的共和黨川普上任之後他也要求說我要改變遊戲規則增加成本你的進口關稅提高那還有你的技術\n\n05:47.939 --> 06:00.333\n那時候我們投審會一個投審會有辦法阻擋或是抗拒美國政府的力量嗎?除了投審會以外我們還有沒有什麼樣的機制作為是能夠\n\n06:01.843 --> 06:05.245\n外交部的次長也是投審會的成員所以外交部次長單位到外交部而且整個國安體系都會做評估第三個我跟委員報告\n\n06:29.759 --> 06:51.125\n因為我們也希望台積電的投資能夠成功而且國際局勢瞬息萬變我們會隨時滾動性來檢討他的投資計畫審查如何對台灣最為有利這個是最高原則好啦市長本席提出來啦這一個問題可能是賴總統才有辦法去回答但是本席先提出來是我們先看到問題了\n\n06:52.606 --> 07:08.585\n我們當然都希望臺積電的投資成功但是怎麼樣能夠把核心技術跟流台灣在其他地方的投資成功這個是關鍵好不好那個田次長一個部分請教因為我們有看到說海地我們的友邦\n\n07:11.068 --> 07:36.080\n這幾天的新聞從今年整個狀況其實海地我們的友邦其實不是太好的那在5月10號的時候就舊政府還是吳釗燮部長的時候他曾經被問到說有兩個邦交國長期是有隱憂的他沒有點名哪兩個邦交國但之後媒體去報導他說有推敲有可能他講的是海地跟瓜地馬拉這個我必須要先說明清楚\n\n07:37.061 --> 07:48.463\n吳部長只有講兩個邦交國長期隱憂他是擔心有可能有斷交的風險但是沒有講哪兩個邦交國可是現在我們看到是說海地他的首都太子港\n\n07:49.620 --> 08:09.230\n據外媒報導,被80%幫派份子把持,並且造成說有2萬多人顛沛流離是居無定所,也非常的辛苦。那我想請教一下,到目前為止,海地政府有沒有對於我們的外交部有提出什麼樣還有需求?\n\n08:10.178 --> 08:28.543\n沒有,沒有額外的要求。海地我們只是擔心那個政局的不穩,然後內部的混亂,然後我們在駐大使館人員的安全。目前我們大使館人員安全是沒有問題的。那我們那邊的僑民或是僑胞,\n\n08:29.775 --> 08:50.767\n的安全狀況也是有掌握也可以掌握那對於他們政府現在動盪當然因為是我們的友邦但有沒有會在這個時候提出超出預期或是不合理的要求沒有到目前為止是沒有的那我們會不會因應譬如說要維持友邦而反而會有一些狀況產生\n\n08:53.597 --> 09:19.933\n不會在海地目前狀況我覺得他只是怎麼樣把內部的次序做好我們沒有感受到或者沒有那個質詢雙邊的邦交會問題好我希望邦交股票再有任何的散失但是也請注意關心因為在這個議題上面從上一任部長到現在好像比較少提及但是本期還是善意的提醒好不好以上謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.109,"end":6.86,"text":"主席謝謝麻煩要請我們田次長跟經濟部陳次長請田次長和陳次長"},{"start":14.135,"end":34.336,"text":"兩位次長好我想不是部長來因為你們兩位都是長期的事務官所以某種程度上我反而覺得是說可以更講一些專業的判斷而不要受政治立場或者是講這種空話所以本席也希望是說能夠救教因為"},{"start":35.457,"end":53.117,"text":"對我們今天召委提的這個議題其實是非常重要美國大選已經兩個禮拜了那結果完之後後續台灣跟美國的貿易或是相關的合作的部分其實都很受對沒錯新任的川普總統要上任的影響所以我先提醒"},{"start":54.338,"end":74.812,"text":"先不要我們官方這邊講是說不知道川普總統他選舉的承諾到底會不會兌現或說未來會不會推動我覺得這不是我們官方應該要去評論我們應該都要以人家總統候選人他競選時候的政見或想法就要以這樣的方向去準備"},{"start":76.158,"end":81.462,"text":"民嘴可以這樣子說我們官方立場不能有這樣的一個態度我覺得這第一個本席要很嚴正的一個先提醒再來第二個部分"},{"start":97.864,"end":117.278,"text":"川普總統當選人他在過去競選期間就已經講了他就說科增關稅把關稅調高晶片商會自己前來設廠美國一毛錢可能都不用花他甚至有點名到說台灣把美國95%的晶片市場都搶走了有注意到這個新聞嗎"},{"start":119.09,"end":146.657,"text":"好 那如果說假設如同剛剛我們好幾位委員都在強調的就是說 如果未來美國真的上川普真的上任之後他要調高這個相關的關稅那會不會勢必又希望是說連帶的把這一些上中下游廠商都集中到美國生產因為他美國再次偉大很重要的核心價值就是他們要恢復製造業嘛那這樣會不會擔心我們包括台積電或是相關我們的這一些高科技晶片廠"},{"start":147.697,"end":173.487,"text":"有可能到美國設廠甚至把我們更核心的技術也前往美國這個機率有多大有沒有評估過報告委員對外投資台灣最近幾年來因為委員剛說要做一些比較事務性的報告我報告一下我們最近幾年來台灣每年對外投資大概200億美金左右表示我們台商已經在做全球佈局因為台灣的"},{"start":175.914,"end":200.907,"text":"經濟、工業和科技的發展已經足以到全球去佈局來延伸我們的實力以及跟當地市場和其他貿易夥伴之間加深的合作這第一點第二個,台灣的產業特性跟日韓不一樣日韓他是集團他整個過去不管是三重或是LG等等他都是上中下游一起去台灣的產業特性是中小企業組成的螞蟻從兵"},{"start":202.188,"end":227.556,"text":"所以我們去的時候當台積電去必然它的供應鏈要過去服務它這樣才能夠維持我們的競爭力而不是扶植當地的供應鏈而已當然我們也希望跟當地供應鏈合作那麼這是一個彼此互惠互烈做法所以會不會過去當然為了維持我們的實力的成長這個合作是有必要的因為我們的產業形態跟日韓不同第三點"},{"start":228.736,"end":255.732,"text":"至於科技方面的外流的話我們有一個投資審查的機制所以任何對外投資都要經過經濟部跟各部會、跨部會的一個審查像比方說台積電去美國的投資雖然是相當先進的進變但是我們在審查過程中很整密地做了評估它的在美國的投資計畫是2028年量產在台灣是2025年量產在美國目前兩個場在台灣目前大概十個場"},{"start":256.613,"end":258.374,"text":"市長你講到重點重點就在於是說我們一直擔心跟"},{"start":282.805,"end":302.873,"text":"害怕或者是說我們也認為為什麼過去一直講台積電叫護國神山就是台積電的存在讓很多人會認為是說我們台灣是相對安全可是從過去這兩三年裡面其實開始有人在炒作說如果說台積電沒有在台灣的話可能台灣的處境就會相對危險"},{"start":304.133,"end":320.287,"text":"那再來是你剛剛有提到就是說我剛剛讓你完整的敘述就代表是說你現在講到的是台積電現在生產多數都還是在台灣技術都還是在台灣而且跟美國相差來講差不多有3年左右的時間對不對一個2005一個2025一個2028嘛"},{"start":324.17,"end":340.353,"text":"那但是現在美國的政權輪替、政黨交替了那我們未來因應這1月20號之後的狀況我們有沒有做過評估或是說如果說1月20號真的共和黨川普上任之後他也要求說我要改變遊戲規則增加成本你的進口關稅提高那還有你的技術"},{"start":347.939,"end":360.333,"text":"那時候我們投審會一個投審會有辦法阻擋或是抗拒美國政府的力量嗎?除了投審會以外我們還有沒有什麼樣的機制作為是能夠"},{"start":361.843,"end":365.245,"text":"外交部的次長也是投審會的成員所以外交部次長單位到外交部而且整個國安體系都會做評估第三個我跟委員報告"},{"start":389.759,"end":411.125,"text":"因為我們也希望台積電的投資能夠成功而且國際局勢瞬息萬變我們會隨時滾動性來檢討他的投資計畫審查如何對台灣最為有利這個是最高原則好啦 市長本席提出來啦這一個問題可能是賴總統才有辦法去回答但是本席先提出來是我們先看到問題了"},{"start":412.606,"end":428.585,"text":"我們當然都希望臺積電的投資成功但是怎麼樣能夠把核心技術跟流台灣在其他地方的投資成功這個是關鍵好不好那個田次長一個部分請教因為我們有看到說海地我們的友邦"},{"start":431.068,"end":456.08,"text":"這幾天的新聞從今年整個狀況其實海地我們的友邦其實不是太好的那在5月10號的時候就舊政府還是吳釗燮部長的時候他曾經被問到說有兩個邦交國長期是有隱憂的他沒有點名哪兩個邦交國但之後媒體去報導他說有推敲有可能他講的是海地跟瓜地馬拉這個我必須要先說明清楚"},{"start":457.061,"end":468.463,"text":"吳部長只有講兩個邦交國長期隱憂他是擔心有可能有斷交的風險但是沒有講哪兩個邦交國可是現在我們看到是說海地他的首都太子港"},{"start":469.62,"end":489.23,"text":"據外媒報導,被80%幫派份子把持,並且造成說有2萬多人顛沛流離是居無定所,也非常的辛苦。那我想請教一下,到目前為止,海地政府有沒有對於我們的外交部有提出什麼樣還有需求?"},{"start":490.178,"end":508.543,"text":"沒有,沒有額外的要求。海地我們只是擔心那個政局的不穩,然後內部的混亂,然後我們在駐大使館人員的安全。目前我們大使館人員安全是沒有問題的。那我們那邊的僑民或是僑胞,"},{"start":509.775,"end":530.767,"text":"的安全狀況也是有掌握也可以掌握那對於他們政府現在動盪當然因為是我們的友邦但有沒有會在這個時候提出超出預期或是不合理的要求沒有到目前為止是沒有的那我們會不會因應譬如說要維持友邦而反而會有一些狀況產生"},{"start":533.597,"end":559.933,"text":"不會在海地目前狀況我覺得他只是怎麼樣把內部的次序做好我們沒有感受到或者沒有那個質詢雙邊的邦交會問題好我希望邦交股票再有任何的散失但是也請注意關心因為在這個議題上面從上一任部長到現在好像比較少提及但是本期還是善意的提醒好不好以上謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":519,"blocks":[["洪委員孟楷：（11時45分）謝謝主席，麻煩一樣請田次長跟經濟部陳次長。"],["主席：請田次長和陳次長。"],["田次長中光：洪委員早。"],["陳次長正祺：委員好。"],["洪委員孟楷：兩位次長好。我想雖然今天不是部長來，但是因為你們兩位都是長期的事務官，所以某種程度上，我反而覺得可以講一些更專業的判斷，而不要受政治立場，或者是講這種空話啦！所以本席也希望能夠就教，因為今天召委提的這個議題其實是非常重要，美國大選已經兩個禮拜了，那結束之後，後續臺灣跟美國的貿易或是相關的合作其實都很受新任川普總統要上任的影響沒錯，所以我先提醒啦！我們官方這邊先不要講說不知道川普總統他的選舉承諾到底會不會兌現或是未來會不會推動，我覺得這不是我們官方應該要去評論，我們應該都要以總統候選人他在競選時候的政見或想法，就要以這樣的方向去準備啊！因為你剛剛這樣子的回答，其實某種程度上你好像在講人家是所謂的競選支票不一定兌現，但是名嘴可以這樣子說，我們官方立場不能有這樣的態度，這是第一個，本席要很嚴正的先提醒。","再來第二個部分，川普總統當選人在過去競選期間就已經講了，他就說課徵關稅，把關稅調高，晶片商會自己前來設廠，美國一毛錢可能都不用花，他甚至有點名到說臺灣把美國百分之九十五的晶片市場都搶走了，有注意到這個新聞嘛？好，假設如同剛剛我們好幾位委員都在強調的，如果未來美國川普真的上任之後要調高相關關稅，會不會又希望連帶地把這些上、中、下游廠商都集中到美國生產？因為美國再次偉大很重要的核心價值，就是他們要恢復製造業嘛！這樣會不會擔心，包括我們的台積電或是我們相關的高科技晶片廠有可能到美國設廠，甚至把我們更核心的技術也前往美國？這個機率有多大？有沒有評估過？"],["陳次長正祺：報告委員，臺灣最近幾年對外投資……因為委員剛剛說要做一些比較事務性的報告，我報告一下，我們最近幾年來，臺灣每年對外投資大概200億美金左右，表示我們臺商已經在做全球布局，因為臺灣的經濟、工業和科技的發展已經足以到全球去布局，來延伸我們的實力，以及跟當地市場和其他貿易夥伴之間加深合作，這是第一點。第二個，臺灣的產業特性跟日、韓不一樣，日、韓是集團，它是整個過去，不管是Samsung或是LG等等都是上、中、下游一起去，臺灣的產業特性是中小企業組成的螞蟻雄兵。所以我們去的時候，當台積電去，必然它的供應鏈要過去服務它，這樣才能夠維持我們的競爭力，而不是扶植當地的供應鏈而已，當然我們也希望跟當地供應鏈合作，這是一個彼此互惠互利的作法。所以，會不會過去，當然為了維持我們實力的成長，這個合作是有必要的，因為我們的產業型態跟日、韓不同。第三點，至於科技方面的外流，我們有一個投資審查的機制，所以任何對外投資都要經過經濟部跟各部會跨部會的審查，比方說台積電去美國的投資，雖然是相當先進的晶片，但是我們在審查過程中很縝密地做了評估，它在美國的投資計畫是2028年量產，在臺灣是2025年量產，在美國目前2個廠，在臺灣目前大概10個廠。那麼，臺灣在台積電全球的晶片大概一個月200萬片，在美國大概是2萬片等等，這個數字我回去要確認。不過我們是經過一個評估，要確保臺灣的國家利益、經濟實力和科技實力為前提的情況下，來協助我們的供應鏈跟我們的廠商對外投資。"],["洪委員孟楷：是，次長，你講到重點，重點就在於，我們一直擔心跟害怕，或者是我們也認為為什麼過去一直講台積電叫護國神山，就是台積電的存在讓很多人會認為我們臺灣是相對安全，可是從過去這兩三年裡面，已經開始有人在炒作如果台積電沒有在臺灣的話，可能臺灣的處境就會相對危險。再來是你剛剛有提到，我剛剛讓你完整的敘述，就代表你現在講到的是台積電現在生產多數都還是在臺灣、技術都還在臺灣，而且跟美國相差差不多有3年左右的時間，一個是2025年，一個是2028年。"],["陳次長正祺：是。"],["洪委員孟楷：但是現在美國的政權輪替，政黨交替了，未來因應1月20號之後的狀況，我們有沒有做過評估？或是說如果1月20號真的共和黨川普上任之後，他也要求要改變遊戲規則，增加成本，你的進口關稅提高，還有你的技術，那時候我們一個投審會有辦法阻擋或是抗拒美國政府的力量嗎？"],["陳次長正祺：報告委員，第一個，我們內部……"],["洪委員孟楷：除了投審會以外，我們還有沒有什麼樣的機制作為是能夠去阻擋，或是能夠抗拒這樣的力量？"],["陳次長正祺：報告委員，第一個，我們內部當然有做準備跟評估。第二個，投審會是一個跨部會的機制，它是每一個都上到自己的首長，它並不是就這個會議來決定，各個部會各司其職做經濟的評估、安全的評估、產業的評估、國際關係的評估，外交部次長也是投審會的成員，所以外交部次長當然是到外交部，而且整個國安體系都會做評估。第三個，我跟委員報告，因為我們也希望台積電的投資能夠成功，而且國際局勢瞬息萬變，我們會隨時滾動性來檢討它的投資計畫審查如何對臺灣最為有利，這個是最高原則。"],["洪委員孟楷：好啦！次長，本席提出來啦！這一個問題可能是賴總統才有辦法回答，但是本席先提出來是我們先看到問題了，我們當然都希望台積電的投資成功，但是怎麼樣能夠把核心技術根留臺灣，在其他地方的投資成功，這個是關鍵！好不好？","田次長，一個部分請教，因為我們有看到海地，我們的友邦，這幾天的新聞，今年整個狀況，其實海地，我們的友邦並不是太好，在5月10號還是吳釗燮任部長的時候，他曾經被問到有兩個邦交國長期是有隱憂的，他沒有點名哪兩個邦交國，但之後媒體報導是有推敲，有可能他講的是海地跟瓜地馬拉，這個我必須要先說明清楚，吳部長只有講兩個邦交國長期隱憂，他是擔心有可能有斷交的風險，但是沒有講哪兩個邦交國，可是現在我們看到海地的首都太子港，據外媒報導，百分之八十被幫派分子把持，並且造成有兩萬多人顛沛流離、居無定所，也非常的辛苦。我想請教一下，到目前為止，海地政府有沒有對我們的外交部提出什麼樣的需求？"],["田次長中光：沒有，沒有額外的要求。"],["洪委員孟楷：沒有額外的要求？"],["田次長中光：海地我們只是擔心政局的不穩，然後內部的混亂，以及我們駐大使館人員的安全。"],["洪委員孟楷：對。"],["田次長中光：這部分是我們比較……"],["洪委員孟楷：目前我們大使館的人員安全是沒有問題的？"],["田次長中光：對。"],["洪委員孟楷：好，我們那邊的僑民或是僑胞的安全狀況？"],["田次長中光：也是有掌握。"],["洪委員孟楷：也可以掌握？"],["田次長中光：是。"],["洪委員孟楷：對於他們政府現在動盪，當然因為是我們的友邦，但有沒有會在這個時候提出超出預期或是不合理的要求？"],["田次長中光：沒有。"],["洪委員孟楷：到目前為止是沒有的？"],["田次長中光：沒有。"],["洪委員孟楷：我們會不會因應，譬如說要維持友邦反而會有一些狀況產生？"],["田次長中光：不會，海地目前的狀況，我覺得它只是怎麼樣把內部的秩序做好，我們沒有感受到，或者沒有那個資訊顯示雙邊的邦交會有問題。"],["洪委員孟楷：好，我希望邦交國不要再有任何的閃失，但是也請注意關心，因為在這個議題上面，從上一任部長到現在好像比較少提及，但是本席還是善意的提醒，好不好？"],["田次長中光：好。"],["洪委員孟楷：以上，謝謝。"],["田次長中光：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝洪孟楷委員，次長請回。","鄭天財、鄭天財、鄭天財委員不在。","邱志偉、邱志偉、邱志偉委員不在。","鄭正鈐、鄭正鈐、鄭正鈐委員不在。","林思銘、林思銘、林思銘委員不在。","我們請楊瓊瓔委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":322,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-35-15","speakers":["林憶君","沈伯洋","羅美玲","黃仁","徐巧芯","林楚茵","陳冠廷","陳永康","馬文君","王鴻薇","賴士葆","洪孟楷","楊瓊瓔","葉元之","王定宇","洪申翰","邱志偉"],"page_start":273,"meetingDate":["2024-11-20"],"gazette_id":"11310101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11310101_00007"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第15次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請外交部部長、國家發展委員會、經濟部報告「美國總統大選後，對於推動台美貿易及科技建\n立合作架構之影響」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"11310101_00006"}}}