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\"start\": 539.137, \"end\": 539.337, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 539.337, \"end\": 539.357, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 542.438, \"end\": 542.518, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"席\", \"start\": 542.518, \"end\": 542.538, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:09,423 --> 00:00:32,837\n好謝謝請麻煩邱特緣部長邱部長這兩天因為勞動部的這個霸凌事件那也有爆料是說這個疾管署也有類似的狀況那當然已經講說一個禮拜內會調查完畢那但是我想請教一下您知道疾管署裡面有幾個組或幾個中心嗎\n\n2\n00:00:38,796 --> 00:01:02,976\n7個組5個組兩個中心5個組兩個中心那其中這個調職率或是離職率最高的是哪一個組整備組就是被報出來的這個組總共有37%那平均疾管署過去去年一年內調職率多少12%會不會覺得很奇怪為什麼\n\n3\n00:01:05,745 --> 00:01:26,392\n部長其實這件事情大家在講是說就如同勞動部為什麼我們會看到那個北區分署會有說兩年內這個分署長在那邊結果有81位員工寧願降調寧願平調我也要趕快逃離那個地方他就是明顯高於其他的這個單位不正常的離職狀況\n\n4\n00:01:27,833 --> 00:01:36,244\n那一樣的道理整備組在過去這5月到現在平調其他單位6人調到其他機關6人辭職1人調職或辭職總共13人達37%\n\n5\n00:01:41,308 --> 00:02:01,275\n不覺得這樣子高於平均是很奇怪的事情嗎異常的數據出來我們就要趕快來做系統性的處理因為部長你是醫學出身嘛醫學看到的很多時候我們是要用儀器用數據來去監控這個病人身體狀況有沒有其他的反應那一樣的道理如果說把衛福部當成是一個人體的話\n\n6\n00:02:02,455 --> 00:02:24,143\n是不是各個數據出來發生異常的時候指數是異常的我們要去了解一下應該是不是是部長本期真的希望這個可能不第一件但是我們希望是最後一件我們也不希望說有任何人在我們機關裡面要虎揚威或者是說把公天下變成是家天下\n\n7\n00:02:25,083 --> 00:02:37,712\n一個禮拜大家都會看你的報告請一定要如實秉公處理可以嗎絕對是絕對秉公處理好那部長秉公處理另外一個部分本席上一次在這邊質詢你什麼議題你記得嗎\n\n8\n00:02:43,274 --> 00:03:06,903\n沒關係啦電子菸啦我們明年的機關稅出稅入的這個增加預算本期看了一下300多億我們多增加衛福部多增加300多億元其中國民健康署增加了55億原本113年的預算只有56億國民健康署一次增加一倍變111億\n\n9\n00:03:11,605 --> 00:03:38,455\n111億其中最大中為什麼有這個癌症篩檢的部分41億所以整個提升了一倍是好瞭解要錢給錢但是重點在於是我們當然是會審查預算可是有沒有做到我們關心的議題我上個禮上一次我們職訓的時候已經三個禮拜過去了我講是說我們怎麼會放任電子煙那麼明明不是\n\n10\n00:03:41,225 --> 00:03:51,603\n指煙算合法喔可是他必須要有身份證件18歲以上才能購買到超商我還會看你的身份證件結果電子煙完全不合法\n\n11\n00:03:52,762 --> 00:04:20,317\n我們居然可以容忍讓他在網路上可以搜尋得到然後還可以購買購買完之後還來到這個超商他外包裝還沒有包裝就是還可以把他遮蔽所以你根本不知道說他裡面內容物是什麼所以也沒有檢查身份證件你說不能容忍我也看到了我們國建署新聞稿講說112年開始加強網路取締那我想請教三個禮拜過去了\n\n12\n00:04:21,957 --> 00:04:42,343\n部長現在google還是搜尋的到第1頁打電子煙三個字我都已經我我今天其實有點哀莫大於心死三個禮拜前我滿腔熱血我想說罵了之後你可能你不知道說那麼嚴重我罵完之後趕快是不是能夠比照其他違禁品\n\n13\n00:04:43,203 --> 00:04:44,405\n包委員我們其實一直在努力包括\n\n14\n00:04:58,524 --> 00:05:19,568\n包括各個地方政府都有說我們現在的NI防治法抓到以後沒辦法跟他默入跟銷毀所以我們最近也在研究來給他更大的力量部長我真的完全沒有感受到我要不要借一下我的ipad給你你現在搜尋一下電子煙三個字我們要不要看一下說現在google搜尋電子煙三個字出來會是什麼還是他們的官網\n\n15\n00:05:24,253 --> 00:05:38,264\n怎麼處理我講了三個禮拜了所有委員在上一次的專案報告裡面罵了那麼多結果到現在我今天如果我是打什麼很奇怪的特殊的暗號密碼拐彎抹角才搜尋到那可能大多數人已經搜尋不到了\n\n16\n00:05:45,796 --> 00:05:58,743\n但是現在不是現在是你搜尋網站一打開電子菸三個字大辣辣直接就搜尋到官網就出來了三天就到貨了便利商店就拿到了我們一點辦法都沒有嗎\n\n17\n00:06:04,019 --> 00:06:25,758\n謝謝委員的關心我們也一直很關心這個部分那我們除了跟持續在對這些網路平臺跨國的一些平臺做一些開發以外那麼我們也跟他們召開相關的管制會議那下個禮拜二我們在新加坡也有跨部會的一個檢討希望能夠加強各部會在這個部份的聯合的管制\n\n18\n00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:43,654\n抱歉喔占用一些時間喔來剛剛署長我其實都很客氣啦可是剛剛署長講說有針對跨平台跨國開罰這是你10秒鐘前講的來過去對於這些跨平台開罰你罰了多少錢罰了誰罰了誰\n\n19\n00:06:47,751 --> 00:06:57,329\n之前不是告訴我們說那個是外國的公司網站設在外面所以你根本不知道人在哪裡他的地址在哪裡你的罰單要寄給誰啊\n\n20\n00:06:58,717 --> 00:07:22,476\n我們對於像臉書在臺灣的混國書我現在不是講臉書欸不要混淆不要委員不是那好糊弄的啦拜託一下我現在從頭到尾沒有講臉書不是臉書上面我現在直接講google你打開google搜尋關鍵字不用什麼特殊技能電子煙就搜尋到他們官方網站了結果\n\n21\n00:07:23,416 --> 00:07:47,147\n之前質詢你們講說因為那是跨國公司跨國企業他的IP機房設在國外所以我們抓不到沒辦法那時候我們講是說我沒有辦法抓到他們因為那可能涉及跨國犯罪那我們能不能跟速發部大家討論就至少在我們境內臺灣境內擋IP要求Google臺灣境內不能搜尋到因為他在臺灣就是不合法有些國家也許合法\n\n22\n00:07:47,807 --> 00:07:48,407\n我剛剛提到了我們是對這些平台開罰\n\n23\n00:08:09,056 --> 00:08:16,281\n那剛剛提到的遮蔽的部分我們也跟蘇化部跟那個NCC一起討論那就是現在都還沒有遮蔽那各部會必須要來強力一起來合作部長\n\n24\n00:08:25,787 --> 00:08:40,408\n為什麼會那麼的語重心長就是因為我知道這個世界不完美但我們能夠做到除了法令的完整以外我們讓犯罪成本提高讓一般的民眾不會那麼容易取得違禁品\n\n25\n00:08:41,169 --> 00:08:59,357\n因為現在的狀況是如果說連一個12歲15歲的小朋友他只要會搜尋Google一打三天下訂便利商店就買的到了我們怎麼樣防止電子菸競效應我們怎樣防止我們青少年不去接觸這才是最大的問題\n\n26\n00:09:02,438 --> 00:09:02,538\n主席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n9423\t32837\t好 謝謝請麻煩邱特緣部長邱部長這兩天因為勞動部的這個霸凌事件那也有爆料是說這個疾管署也有類似的狀況那當然已經講說一個禮拜內會調查完畢那但是我想請教一下您知道疾管署裡面有幾個組或幾個中心嗎\n38796\t62976\t7個組5個組兩個中心5個組兩個中心那其中這個調職率或是離職率最高的是哪一個組整備組就是被報出來的這個組總共有37%那平均疾管署過去去年一年內調職率多少12%會不會覺得很奇怪為什麼\n65745\t86392\t部長其實這件事情大家在講是說就如同勞動部為什麼我們會看到那個北區分署會有說兩年內這個分署長在那邊結果有81位員工寧願降調寧願平調我也要趕快逃離那個地方他就是明顯高於其他的這個單位不正常的離職狀況\n87833\t96244\t那一樣的道理 整備組在過去這5月到現在平調其他單位6人調到其他機關6人 辭職1人 調職或辭職總共13人 達37%\n101308\t121275\t不覺得這樣子高於平均是很奇怪的事情嗎異常的數據出來我們就要趕快來做系統性的處理因為部長你是醫學出身嘛醫學看到的很多時候我們是要用儀器用數據來去監控這個病人身體狀況有沒有其他的反應那一樣的道理如果說把衛福部當成是一個人體的話\n122455\t144143\t是不是各個數據出來發生異常的時候指數是異常的我們要去了解一下應該是不是是部長本期真的希望這個可能不第一件但是我們希望是最後一件我們也不希望說有任何人在我們機關裡面要虎揚威或者是說把公天下變成是家天下\n145083\t157712\t一個禮拜大家都會看你的報告請一定要如實秉公處理可以嗎絕對是絕對秉公處理好那部長秉公處理另外一個部分本席上一次在這邊質詢你什麼議題你記得嗎\n163274\t186903\t沒關係啦 電子菸啦我們明年的機關稅出稅入的這個增加預算本期看了一下 300多億我們多增加衛福部多增加300多億元其中國民健康署增加了55億原本113年的預算只有56億國民健康署一次增加一倍變111億\n191605\t218455\t111億其中最大中為什麼有這個癌症篩檢的部分41億所以整個提升了一倍是好瞭解要錢給錢但是重點在於是我們當然是會審查預算可是有沒有做到我們關心的議題我上個禮上一次我們職訓的時候已經三個禮拜過去了我講是說我們怎麼會放任電子煙那麼明明不是\n221225\t231603\t指煙算合法喔可是他必須要有身份證件18歲以上才能購買到超商我還會看你的身份證件結果電子煙完全不合法\n232762\t260317\t我們居然可以容忍讓他在網路上可以搜尋得到然後還可以購買購買完之後還來到這個超商他外包裝還沒有包裝就是還可以把他遮蔽所以你根本不知道說他裡面內容物是什麼所以也沒有檢查身份證件你說不能容忍我也看到了我們國建署新聞稿講說112年開始加強網路取締那我想請教三個禮拜過去了\n261957\t282343\t部長現在google還是搜尋的到第1頁打電子煙三個字我都已經我我今天其實有點哀莫大於心死三個禮拜前我滿腔熱血我想說罵了之後你可能你不知道說那麼嚴重我罵完之後趕快是不是能夠比照其他違禁品\n283203\t284405\t包委員我們其實一直在努力包括\n298524\t319568\t包括各個地方政府都有說我們現在的NI防治法抓到以後沒辦法跟他默入跟銷毀所以我們最近也在研究來給他更大的力量部長我真的完全沒有感受到我要不要借一下我的ipad給你你現在搜尋一下電子煙三個字我們要不要看一下說現在google搜尋電子煙三個字出來會是什麼還是他們的官網\n324253\t338264\t怎麼處理我講了三個禮拜了所有委員在上一次的專案報告裡面罵了那麼多結果到現在我今天如果我是打什麼很奇怪的特殊的暗號密碼拐彎抹角才搜尋到那可能大多數人已經搜尋不到了\n345796\t358743\t但是現在不是現在是你搜尋網站一打開電子菸三個字大辣辣直接就搜尋到官網就出來了三天就到貨了便利商店就拿到了我們一點辦法都沒有嗎\n364019\t385758\t謝謝委員的關心我們也一直很關心這個部分那我們除了跟持續在對這些網路平臺跨國的一些平臺做一些開發以外那麼我們也跟他們召開相關的管制會議那下個禮拜二我們在新加坡也有跨部會的一個檢討希望能夠加強各部會在這個部份的聯合的管制\n388400\t403654\t抱歉喔 占用一些時間喔來剛剛署長我其實都很客氣啦可是剛剛署長講說有針對跨平台跨國開罰這是你10秒鐘前講的來過去對於這些跨平台開罰你罰了多少錢罰了誰罰了誰\n407751\t417329\t之前不是告訴我們說那個是外國的公司網站設在外面所以你根本不知道人在哪裡他的地址在哪裡你的罰單要寄給誰啊\n418717\t442476\t我們對於像臉書在臺灣的混國書我現在不是講臉書欸不要混淆不要委員不是那好糊弄的啦拜託一下我現在從頭到尾沒有講臉書不是臉書上面我現在直接講google你打開google搜尋關鍵字不用什麼特殊技能電子煙就搜尋到他們官方網站了結果\n443416\t467147\t之前質詢你們講說因為那是跨國公司跨國企業他的IP機房設在國外所以我們抓不到沒辦法那時候我們講是說我沒有辦法抓到他們因為那可能涉及跨國犯罪那我們能不能跟速發部大家討論就至少在我們境內臺灣境內擋IP要求Google臺灣境內不能搜尋到因為他在臺灣就是不合法有些國家也許合法\n467807\t468407\t我剛剛提到了我們是對這些平台開罰\n489056\t496281\t那剛剛提到的遮蔽的部分我們也跟蘇化部跟那個NCC一起討論那就是現在都還沒有遮蔽那各部會必須要來強力一起來合作部長\n505787\t520408\t為什麼會那麼的語重心長就是因為我知道這個世界不完美但我們能夠做到除了法令的完整以外我們讓犯罪成本提高讓一般的民眾不會那麼容易取得違禁品\n521169\t539357\t因為現在的狀況是如果說連一個12歲15歲的小朋友他只要會搜尋Google一打三天下訂便利商店就買的到了我們怎麼樣防止電子菸競效應我們怎樣防止我們青少年不去接觸這才是最大的問題\n542438\t542538\t主席\n","txt":"好 謝謝請麻煩邱特緣部長邱部長這兩天因為勞動部的這個霸凌事件那也有爆料是說這個疾管署也有類似的狀況那當然已經講說一個禮拜內會調查完畢那但是我想請教一下您知道疾管署裡面有幾個組或幾個中心嗎\n7個組5個組兩個中心5個組兩個中心那其中這個調職率或是離職率最高的是哪一個組整備組就是被報出來的這個組總共有37%那平均疾管署過去去年一年內調職率多少12%會不會覺得很奇怪為什麼\n部長其實這件事情大家在講是說就如同勞動部為什麼我們會看到那個北區分署會有說兩年內這個分署長在那邊結果有81位員工寧願降調寧願平調我也要趕快逃離那個地方他就是明顯高於其他的這個單位不正常的離職狀況\n那一樣的道理 整備組在過去這5月到現在平調其他單位6人調到其他機關6人 辭職1人 調職或辭職總共13人 達37%\n不覺得這樣子高於平均是很奇怪的事情嗎異常的數據出來我們就要趕快來做系統性的處理因為部長你是醫學出身嘛醫學看到的很多時候我們是要用儀器用數據來去監控這個病人身體狀況有沒有其他的反應那一樣的道理如果說把衛福部當成是一個人體的話\n是不是各個數據出來發生異常的時候指數是異常的我們要去了解一下應該是不是是部長本期真的希望這個可能不第一件但是我們希望是最後一件我們也不希望說有任何人在我們機關裡面要虎揚威或者是說把公天下變成是家天下\n一個禮拜大家都會看你的報告請一定要如實秉公處理可以嗎絕對是絕對秉公處理好那部長秉公處理另外一個部分本席上一次在這邊質詢你什麼議題你記得嗎\n沒關係啦 電子菸啦我們明年的機關稅出稅入的這個增加預算本期看了一下 300多億我們多增加衛福部多增加300多億元其中國民健康署增加了55億原本113年的預算只有56億國民健康署一次增加一倍變111億\n111億其中最大中為什麼有這個癌症篩檢的部分41億所以整個提升了一倍是好瞭解要錢給錢但是重點在於是我們當然是會審查預算可是有沒有做到我們關心的議題我上個禮上一次我們職訓的時候已經三個禮拜過去了我講是說我們怎麼會放任電子煙那麼明明不是\n指煙算合法喔可是他必須要有身份證件18歲以上才能購買到超商我還會看你的身份證件結果電子煙完全不合法\n我們居然可以容忍讓他在網路上可以搜尋得到然後還可以購買購買完之後還來到這個超商他外包裝還沒有包裝就是還可以把他遮蔽所以你根本不知道說他裡面內容物是什麼所以也沒有檢查身份證件你說不能容忍我也看到了我們國建署新聞稿講說112年開始加強網路取締那我想請教三個禮拜過去了\n部長現在google還是搜尋的到第1頁打電子煙三個字我都已經我我今天其實有點哀莫大於心死三個禮拜前我滿腔熱血我想說罵了之後你可能你不知道說那麼嚴重我罵完之後趕快是不是能夠比照其他違禁品\n包委員我們其實一直在努力包括\n包括各個地方政府都有說我們現在的NI防治法抓到以後沒辦法跟他默入跟銷毀所以我們最近也在研究來給他更大的力量部長我真的完全沒有感受到我要不要借一下我的ipad給你你現在搜尋一下電子煙三個字我們要不要看一下說現在google搜尋電子煙三個字出來會是什麼還是他們的官網\n怎麼處理我講了三個禮拜了所有委員在上一次的專案報告裡面罵了那麼多結果到現在我今天如果我是打什麼很奇怪的特殊的暗號密碼拐彎抹角才搜尋到那可能大多數人已經搜尋不到了\n但是現在不是現在是你搜尋網站一打開電子菸三個字大辣辣直接就搜尋到官網就出來了三天就到貨了便利商店就拿到了我們一點辦法都沒有嗎\n謝謝委員的關心我們也一直很關心這個部分那我們除了跟持續在對這些網路平臺跨國的一些平臺做一些開發以外那麼我們也跟他們召開相關的管制會議那下個禮拜二我們在新加坡也有跨部會的一個檢討希望能夠加強各部會在這個部份的聯合的管制\n抱歉喔 占用一些時間喔來剛剛署長我其實都很客氣啦可是剛剛署長講說有針對跨平台跨國開罰這是你10秒鐘前講的來過去對於這些跨平台開罰你罰了多少錢罰了誰罰了誰\n之前不是告訴我們說那個是外國的公司網站設在外面所以你根本不知道人在哪裡他的地址在哪裡你的罰單要寄給誰啊\n我們對於像臉書在臺灣的混國書我現在不是講臉書欸不要混淆不要委員不是那好糊弄的啦拜託一下我現在從頭到尾沒有講臉書不是臉書上面我現在直接講google你打開google搜尋關鍵字不用什麼特殊技能電子煙就搜尋到他們官方網站了結果\n之前質詢你們講說因為那是跨國公司跨國企業他的IP機房設在國外所以我們抓不到沒辦法那時候我們講是說我沒有辦法抓到他們因為那可能涉及跨國犯罪那我們能不能跟速發部大家討論就至少在我們境內臺灣境內擋IP要求Google臺灣境內不能搜尋到因為他在臺灣就是不合法有些國家也許合法\n我剛剛提到了我們是對這些平台開罰\n那剛剛提到的遮蔽的部分我們也跟蘇化部跟那個NCC一起討論那就是現在都還沒有遮蔽那各部會必須要來強力一起來合作部長\n為什麼會那麼的語重心長就是因為我知道這個世界不完美但我們能夠做到除了法令的完整以外我們讓犯罪成本提高讓一般的民眾不會那麼容易取得違禁品\n因為現在的狀況是如果說連一個12歲15歲的小朋友他只要會搜尋Google一打三天下訂便利商店就買的到了我們怎麼樣防止電子菸競效應我們怎樣防止我們青少年不去接觸這才是最大的問題\n主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:09.423 --> 00:32.837\n好謝謝請麻煩邱特緣部長邱部長這兩天因為勞動部的這個霸凌事件那也有爆料是說這個疾管署也有類似的狀況那當然已經講說一個禮拜內會調查完畢那但是我想請教一下您知道疾管署裡面有幾個組或幾個中心嗎\n\n00:38.796 --> 01:02.976\n7個組5個組兩個中心5個組兩個中心那其中這個調職率或是離職率最高的是哪一個組整備組就是被報出來的這個組總共有37%那平均疾管署過去去年一年內調職率多少12%會不會覺得很奇怪為什麼\n\n01:05.745 --> 01:26.392\n部長其實這件事情大家在講是說就如同勞動部為什麼我們會看到那個北區分署會有說兩年內這個分署長在那邊結果有81位員工寧願降調寧願平調我也要趕快逃離那個地方他就是明顯高於其他的這個單位不正常的離職狀況\n\n01:27.833 --> 01:36.244\n那一樣的道理整備組在過去這5月到現在平調其他單位6人調到其他機關6人辭職1人調職或辭職總共13人達37%\n\n01:41.308 --> 02:01.275\n不覺得這樣子高於平均是很奇怪的事情嗎異常的數據出來我們就要趕快來做系統性的處理因為部長你是醫學出身嘛醫學看到的很多時候我們是要用儀器用數據來去監控這個病人身體狀況有沒有其他的反應那一樣的道理如果說把衛福部當成是一個人體的話\n\n02:02.455 --> 02:24.143\n是不是各個數據出來發生異常的時候指數是異常的我們要去了解一下應該是不是是部長本期真的希望這個可能不第一件但是我們希望是最後一件我們也不希望說有任何人在我們機關裡面要虎揚威或者是說把公天下變成是家天下\n\n02:25.083 --> 02:37.712\n一個禮拜大家都會看你的報告請一定要如實秉公處理可以嗎絕對是絕對秉公處理好那部長秉公處理另外一個部分本席上一次在這邊質詢你什麼議題你記得嗎\n\n02:43.274 --> 03:06.903\n沒關係啦電子菸啦我們明年的機關稅出稅入的這個增加預算本期看了一下300多億我們多增加衛福部多增加300多億元其中國民健康署增加了55億原本113年的預算只有56億國民健康署一次增加一倍變111億\n\n03:11.605 --> 03:38.455\n111億其中最大中為什麼有這個癌症篩檢的部分41億所以整個提升了一倍是好瞭解要錢給錢但是重點在於是我們當然是會審查預算可是有沒有做到我們關心的議題我上個禮上一次我們職訓的時候已經三個禮拜過去了我講是說我們怎麼會放任電子煙那麼明明不是\n\n03:41.225 --> 03:51.603\n指煙算合法喔可是他必須要有身份證件18歲以上才能購買到超商我還會看你的身份證件結果電子煙完全不合法\n\n03:52.762 --> 04:20.317\n我們居然可以容忍讓他在網路上可以搜尋得到然後還可以購買購買完之後還來到這個超商他外包裝還沒有包裝就是還可以把他遮蔽所以你根本不知道說他裡面內容物是什麼所以也沒有檢查身份證件你說不能容忍我也看到了我們國建署新聞稿講說112年開始加強網路取締那我想請教三個禮拜過去了\n\n04:21.957 --> 04:42.343\n部長現在google還是搜尋的到第1頁打電子煙三個字我都已經我我今天其實有點哀莫大於心死三個禮拜前我滿腔熱血我想說罵了之後你可能你不知道說那麼嚴重我罵完之後趕快是不是能夠比照其他違禁品\n\n04:43.203 --> 04:44.405\n包委員我們其實一直在努力包括\n\n04:58.524 --> 05:19.568\n包括各個地方政府都有說我們現在的NI防治法抓到以後沒辦法跟他默入跟銷毀所以我們最近也在研究來給他更大的力量部長我真的完全沒有感受到我要不要借一下我的ipad給你你現在搜尋一下電子煙三個字我們要不要看一下說現在google搜尋電子煙三個字出來會是什麼還是他們的官網\n\n05:24.253 --> 05:38.264\n怎麼處理我講了三個禮拜了所有委員在上一次的專案報告裡面罵了那麼多結果到現在我今天如果我是打什麼很奇怪的特殊的暗號密碼拐彎抹角才搜尋到那可能大多數人已經搜尋不到了\n\n05:45.796 --> 05:58.743\n但是現在不是現在是你搜尋網站一打開電子菸三個字大辣辣直接就搜尋到官網就出來了三天就到貨了便利商店就拿到了我們一點辦法都沒有嗎\n\n06:04.019 --> 06:25.758\n謝謝委員的關心我們也一直很關心這個部分那我們除了跟持續在對這些網路平臺跨國的一些平臺做一些開發以外那麼我們也跟他們召開相關的管制會議那下個禮拜二我們在新加坡也有跨部會的一個檢討希望能夠加強各部會在這個部份的聯合的管制\n\n06:28.400 --> 06:43.654\n抱歉喔占用一些時間喔來剛剛署長我其實都很客氣啦可是剛剛署長講說有針對跨平台跨國開罰這是你10秒鐘前講的來過去對於這些跨平台開罰你罰了多少錢罰了誰罰了誰\n\n06:47.751 --> 06:57.329\n之前不是告訴我們說那個是外國的公司網站設在外面所以你根本不知道人在哪裡他的地址在哪裡你的罰單要寄給誰啊\n\n06:58.717 --> 07:22.476\n我們對於像臉書在臺灣的混國書我現在不是講臉書欸不要混淆不要委員不是那好糊弄的啦拜託一下我現在從頭到尾沒有講臉書不是臉書上面我現在直接講google你打開google搜尋關鍵字不用什麼特殊技能電子煙就搜尋到他們官方網站了結果\n\n07:23.416 --> 07:47.147\n之前質詢你們講說因為那是跨國公司跨國企業他的IP機房設在國外所以我們抓不到沒辦法那時候我們講是說我沒有辦法抓到他們因為那可能涉及跨國犯罪那我們能不能跟速發部大家討論就至少在我們境內臺灣境內擋IP要求Google臺灣境內不能搜尋到因為他在臺灣就是不合法有些國家也許合法\n\n07:47.807 --> 07:48.407\n我剛剛提到了我們是對這些平台開罰\n\n08:09.056 --> 08:16.281\n那剛剛提到的遮蔽的部分我們也跟蘇化部跟那個NCC一起討論那就是現在都還沒有遮蔽那各部會必須要來強力一起來合作部長\n\n08:25.787 --> 08:40.408\n為什麼會那麼的語重心長就是因為我知道這個世界不完美但我們能夠做到除了法令的完整以外我們讓犯罪成本提高讓一般的民眾不會那麼容易取得違禁品\n\n08:41.169 --> 08:59.357\n因為現在的狀況是如果說連一個12歲15歲的小朋友他只要會搜尋Google一打三天下訂便利商店就買的到了我們怎麼樣防止電子菸競效應我們怎樣防止我們青少年不去接觸這才是最大的問題\n\n09:02.438 --> 09:02.538\n主席\n\n","segments":[{"start":9.423,"end":32.837,"text":"好 謝謝請麻煩邱特緣部長邱部長這兩天因為勞動部的這個霸凌事件那也有爆料是說這個疾管署也有類似的狀況那當然已經講說一個禮拜內會調查完畢那但是我想請教一下您知道疾管署裡面有幾個組或幾個中心嗎"},{"start":38.796,"end":62.976,"text":"7個組5個組兩個中心5個組兩個中心那其中這個調職率或是離職率最高的是哪一個組整備組就是被報出來的這個組總共有37%那平均疾管署過去去年一年內調職率多少12%會不會覺得很奇怪為什麼"},{"start":65.745,"end":86.392,"text":"部長其實這件事情大家在講是說就如同勞動部為什麼我們會看到那個北區分署會有說兩年內這個分署長在那邊結果有81位員工寧願降調寧願平調我也要趕快逃離那個地方他就是明顯高於其他的這個單位不正常的離職狀況"},{"start":87.833,"end":96.244,"text":"那一樣的道理 整備組在過去這5月到現在平調其他單位6人調到其他機關6人 辭職1人 調職或辭職總共13人 達37%"},{"start":101.308,"end":121.275,"text":"不覺得這樣子高於平均是很奇怪的事情嗎異常的數據出來我們就要趕快來做系統性的處理因為部長你是醫學出身嘛醫學看到的很多時候我們是要用儀器用數據來去監控這個病人身體狀況有沒有其他的反應那一樣的道理如果說把衛福部當成是一個人體的話"},{"start":122.455,"end":144.143,"text":"是不是各個數據出來發生異常的時候指數是異常的我們要去了解一下應該是不是是部長本期真的希望這個可能不第一件但是我們希望是最後一件我們也不希望說有任何人在我們機關裡面要虎揚威或者是說把公天下變成是家天下"},{"start":145.083,"end":157.712,"text":"一個禮拜大家都會看你的報告請一定要如實秉公處理可以嗎絕對是絕對秉公處理好那部長秉公處理另外一個部分本席上一次在這邊質詢你什麼議題你記得嗎"},{"start":163.274,"end":186.903,"text":"沒關係啦 電子菸啦我們明年的機關稅出稅入的這個增加預算本期看了一下 300多億我們多增加衛福部多增加300多億元其中國民健康署增加了55億原本113年的預算只有56億國民健康署一次增加一倍變111億"},{"start":191.605,"end":218.455,"text":"111億其中最大中為什麼有這個癌症篩檢的部分41億所以整個提升了一倍是好瞭解要錢給錢但是重點在於是我們當然是會審查預算可是有沒有做到我們關心的議題我上個禮上一次我們職訓的時候已經三個禮拜過去了我講是說我們怎麼會放任電子煙那麼明明不是"},{"start":221.225,"end":231.603,"text":"指煙算合法喔可是他必須要有身份證件18歲以上才能購買到超商我還會看你的身份證件結果電子煙完全不合法"},{"start":232.762,"end":260.317,"text":"我們居然可以容忍讓他在網路上可以搜尋得到然後還可以購買購買完之後還來到這個超商他外包裝還沒有包裝就是還可以把他遮蔽所以你根本不知道說他裡面內容物是什麼所以也沒有檢查身份證件你說不能容忍我也看到了我們國建署新聞稿講說112年開始加強網路取締那我想請教三個禮拜過去了"},{"start":261.957,"end":282.343,"text":"部長現在google還是搜尋的到第1頁打電子煙三個字我都已經我我今天其實有點哀莫大於心死三個禮拜前我滿腔熱血我想說罵了之後你可能你不知道說那麼嚴重我罵完之後趕快是不是能夠比照其他違禁品"},{"start":283.203,"end":284.405,"text":"包委員我們其實一直在努力包括"},{"start":298.524,"end":319.568,"text":"包括各個地方政府都有說我們現在的NI防治法抓到以後沒辦法跟他默入跟銷毀所以我們最近也在研究來給他更大的力量部長我真的完全沒有感受到我要不要借一下我的ipad給你你現在搜尋一下電子煙三個字我們要不要看一下說現在google搜尋電子煙三個字出來會是什麼還是他們的官網"},{"start":324.253,"end":338.264,"text":"怎麼處理我講了三個禮拜了所有委員在上一次的專案報告裡面罵了那麼多結果到現在我今天如果我是打什麼很奇怪的特殊的暗號密碼拐彎抹角才搜尋到那可能大多數人已經搜尋不到了"},{"start":345.796,"end":358.743,"text":"但是現在不是現在是你搜尋網站一打開電子菸三個字大辣辣直接就搜尋到官網就出來了三天就到貨了便利商店就拿到了我們一點辦法都沒有嗎"},{"start":364.019,"end":385.758,"text":"謝謝委員的關心我們也一直很關心這個部分那我們除了跟持續在對這些網路平臺跨國的一些平臺做一些開發以外那麼我們也跟他們召開相關的管制會議那下個禮拜二我們在新加坡也有跨部會的一個檢討希望能夠加強各部會在這個部份的聯合的管制"},{"start":388.4,"end":403.654,"text":"抱歉喔 占用一些時間喔來剛剛署長我其實都很客氣啦可是剛剛署長講說有針對跨平台跨國開罰這是你10秒鐘前講的來過去對於這些跨平台開罰你罰了多少錢罰了誰罰了誰"},{"start":407.751,"end":417.329,"text":"之前不是告訴我們說那個是外國的公司網站設在外面所以你根本不知道人在哪裡他的地址在哪裡你的罰單要寄給誰啊"},{"start":418.717,"end":442.476,"text":"我們對於像臉書在臺灣的混國書我現在不是講臉書欸不要混淆不要委員不是那好糊弄的啦拜託一下我現在從頭到尾沒有講臉書不是臉書上面我現在直接講google你打開google搜尋關鍵字不用什麼特殊技能電子煙就搜尋到他們官方網站了結果"},{"start":443.416,"end":467.147,"text":"之前質詢你們講說因為那是跨國公司跨國企業他的IP機房設在國外所以我們抓不到沒辦法那時候我們講是說我沒有辦法抓到他們因為那可能涉及跨國犯罪那我們能不能跟速發部大家討論就至少在我們境內臺灣境內擋IP要求Google臺灣境內不能搜尋到因為他在臺灣就是不合法有些國家也許合法"},{"start":467.807,"end":468.407,"text":"我剛剛提到了我們是對這些平台開罰"},{"start":489.056,"end":496.281,"text":"那剛剛提到的遮蔽的部分我們也跟蘇化部跟那個NCC一起討論那就是現在都還沒有遮蔽那各部會必須要來強力一起來合作部長"},{"start":505.787,"end":520.408,"text":"為什麼會那麼的語重心長就是因為我知道這個世界不完美但我們能夠做到除了法令的完整以外我們讓犯罪成本提高讓一般的民眾不會那麼容易取得違禁品"},{"start":521.169,"end":539.357,"text":"因為現在的狀況是如果說連一個12歲15歲的小朋友他只要會搜尋Google一打三天下訂便利商店就買的到了我們怎麼樣防止電子菸競效應我們怎樣防止我們青少年不去接觸這才是最大的問題"},{"start":542.438,"end":542.538,"text":"主席"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":856,"blocks":[["洪委員孟楷：（12時11分）好，謝謝。麻煩請邱泰源部長。"],["邱部長泰源：委員好。"],["洪委員孟楷：邱部長，這兩天因為勞動部的霸凌事件，也有爆料說疾管署也有類似狀況，當然，已經說一個禮拜內會調查完畢，但是我想請教一下，您知道疾管署裡面有幾個組或幾個中心嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：7個組……"],["莊署長人祥：5個組、2個中心。"],["洪委員孟楷：5個組、2個中心嘛！其中調職率或是離職率最高的是哪一個組？"],["邱部長泰源：整備組。"],["洪委員孟楷：對，整備組，就是被爆出來的這個組，總共有37%，疾管署去年一年內調職率多少？"],["邱部長泰源：12%。"],["洪委員孟楷：會不會覺得很奇怪？為什麼？部長，其實這件事情，大家在講的就如同勞動部，為什麼我們會看到那個北區分署，會有兩年內這個分署長在那邊，結果有81位員工寧願降調，寧願平調，也要趕快逃離那個地方？他就是明顯高於其他單位的不正常離職狀況，一樣的道理，整備組從5月到現在，平調其他單位6人，調到其他機關6人，辭職1人，調職或辭職總共13人，達37%，不覺得這樣子高於平均是很奇怪的事情嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：異常的數據出來，我們就要趕快來做系統性的處理。"],["洪委員孟楷：是，因為部長是醫學出身，醫學看到的，很多時候我們是要用儀器、用數據來監控病人的身體狀況有沒有其他反應，一樣道理，如果說把衛福部當成是一個人體的話，當各個數據出來發生異常、指數異常的時候，我們也要去了解一下，是不是？"],["邱部長泰源：應該是。"],["洪委員孟楷：部長，這個可能不是第一件，但是我們希望是最後一件，我們也不希望有任何人在我們機關裡面耀武揚威，或者把公天下變成是家天下。一個禮拜，大家都會看你的報告，請一定要如實秉公處理，可以嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：絕對秉公處理。"],["洪委員孟楷：好，部長，秉公處理的另外一個部分，本席上一次在這邊質詢你什麼議題，你記得嗎？沒關係啦！電子煙啦！"],["邱部長泰源：喔！有，有。"],["洪委員孟楷：明年的機關歲出歲入增加預算，本席看了一下，哇！三百多億，衛福部多增加了三百多億元，其中國民健康署增加了55億，原本113年的預算只有56億，國民健康署一次增加一倍，變111億，其中最大宗是什麼？有癌症篩檢部分的41億，所以整個提升了一倍。"],["邱部長泰源：是，了解。"],["洪委員孟楷：好，要錢給錢，當然我們會審查預算，但重點在於有沒有做到我們關心的議題？上一次我質詢到現在已經三個禮拜過去了，我講的是我們怎麼會放任電子煙那種明明不是合法的東西，紙菸算合法，可是必須要有身分證件，18歲以上才能購買，到超商還會看你的身分證件，結果電子煙完全不合法，我們居然容忍它可以在網路上搜尋到，然後還可以購買……"],["邱部長泰源：當然不能容忍，絕對不能容忍。"],["洪委員孟楷：購買完之後，它還可以遮蔽外包裝送來超商，根本不知道裡面的內容物是什麼，所以也沒有檢查身分證件。"],["邱部長泰源：是。"],["洪委員孟楷：你說不能容忍，我也看到了我們國健署新聞稿講說112年開始加強網路取締，那我想請教，三個禮拜過去了，部長，現在Google還是搜尋得到，第一頁，打「電子煙」三個字，我今天其實有點哀莫大於心死，三個禮拜前我滿腔熱血，認為你可能不知道那麼嚴重，在我罵完之後，是不是能夠比照其他違禁品趕快處理？如果我們不能容許毒品可以在網路上買得到，不能容許刀槍、刀械可以在網路上買得到，結果沒想到一個完全不合法的電子煙，我們居然可以讓它持續在網路上？"],["邱部長泰源：報告委員，我們其實一直在努力，包括各個地方政府都有說我們現在的菸害防制法，抓到以後，沒辦法把它沒入跟銷毀，所以我們最近也在研究給他們更大的力量。"],["洪委員孟楷：部長，我真的完全沒有感受到，我要不要借一下我的iPad給你？你現在搜尋一下「電子煙」三個字……"],["邱部長泰源：我想網路上那個……"],["洪委員孟楷：我們要不要看一下，現在Google搜尋「電子煙」三個字出來會是什麼？還是他們的官網，怎麼處理？我講了三個禮拜了，所有委員在上一次的專案報告裡面罵了那麼多，結果到現在，今天如果我是打什麼很奇怪的特殊暗號、密碼，拐彎抹角才搜尋到，那可能大多數人已經搜尋不到了，但是現在不是，現在是你搜尋網站一打開，「電子煙」三個字大剌剌直接就搜尋到，官網就出來了，三天就到貨了，便利商店就拿到了，我們一點辦法都沒有嗎？"],["吳署長昭軍：謝謝委員的關心，我們也一直很關心這個部分，除了持續對這些跨部會、跨國的網路平臺開罰以外，我們也跟他們召開相關的管制會議，下個禮拜二，我們在行院也有跨部會的檢討會議，希望能夠加強各部會在這個部分的源頭管制。"],["洪委員孟楷：來，來，抱歉，占用一些時間。署長，我其實都很客氣，可是剛剛署長說有針對跨平臺、跨國開罰，這是你10秒鐘前講的，來，過去對於這些跨平臺開罰，你罰了多少錢？罰了誰？罰了誰？之前不是告訴我們那個是外國的公司，網站設在外面，所以你根本不知道人在哪裡，他的地址在哪裡，你的罰單要寄給誰啊？"],["吳署長昭軍：我們對於像臉書在臺灣的分司，我們……"],["洪委員孟楷：我現在不是講臉書，不要混淆，不要……"],["吳署長昭軍：不會啊！"],["洪委員孟楷：委員不是那麼好糊弄的，拜託一下！"],["吳署長昭軍：不會糊弄委員啦！"],["洪委員孟楷：我從頭到尾沒有講臉書，不是臉書上面，我現在直接講Google，你打開Google搜尋關鍵字，不用什麼特殊技能，「電子煙」就可以搜尋到他們官方網站，結果之前質詢你們說因為那是跨國公司、跨國企業，它的IP、機房設在國外，所以我們抓不到，沒辦法，那時候我們是說沒有辦法抓到他們，因為那可能涉及跨國犯罪，那能不能跟數發部大家討論，至少在我們臺灣境內擋IP，要求Google臺灣境內不能搜尋到？因為它在臺灣就是不合法，有些國家也許合法，但是在臺灣不合法，你不能用一個不合法的東西，讓我們在臺灣可以搜尋得到，就這麼簡單，結果三個禮拜過去了，沒有！然後現在跟我們糊弄，表示有開罰，海外有開罰，你罰單寄給誰？"],["吳署長昭軍：我剛剛提到了，我們是對這些平臺開罰。剛剛提到遮蔽的部分，我們也跟數發部跟NCC一起討論……"],["洪委員孟楷：對，就是現在還沒有遮蔽……"],["吳署長昭軍：剛剛也跟委員報告，禮拜二在行政院還有這樣的一個會議，各部會必須要強力一起來合作。"],["洪委員孟楷：部長，為什麼會那麼語重心長，就是因為……"],["邱部長泰源：瞭解。"],["洪委員孟楷：我知道這個世界不完美，但我們能夠做到除了法令的完整以外，我們讓犯罪成本提高，讓一般的民眾不會那麼容易取得違禁品，因為現在的狀況是如果連一個12歲、15歲的小朋友，只要會搜尋，Google一打，三天下訂，便利商店就買得到了。我們怎麼樣防止電子煙進校園，我們怎樣防止青少年不去接觸，這才是最大的問題。"],["邱部長泰源：了解，我們會加強這一方面。"],["洪委員孟楷：部長，不要讓我在下一次您來這邊的時候……"],["邱部長泰源：好，我再跟委員……"],["洪委員孟楷：不然你的55億，說實在我支持不下去，我完全沒有辦法認同你們國健署要增加55億，要增加一倍的預算，衛福部要增加300億的預算，然後一個違禁品，你都還可以讓它大剌剌持續在那邊，這個我沒有辦法接受，好不好？"],["邱部長泰源：好，謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝洪孟楷委員，謝謝部長。","接續我們請伍麗華委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":140,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-26-10","speakers":["蘇清泉","陳昭姿","林月琴","盧縣一","陳菁徽","王育敏","邱鎮軍","林淑芬","黃秀芳","廖偉翔","黃國昌","賴士葆","邱議瑩","洪孟楷","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","涂權吉","吳春城","羅智強","張雅琳","羅廷瑋","楊瓊瓔","楊曜","王正旭","陳培瑜","劉建國","陳瑩"],"page_start":55,"meetingDate":["2024-11-21"],"gazette_id":"11310501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11310501_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第10次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"審查中華民國 114 年度中央政府總預算案關於衛生福利部主管預算（公務預算及基金）（僅詢\n答）","agenda_id":"11310501_00008"}}}