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00:00:50,046\n經濟部公布了《台太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統的競標公告》在11月6日不久前公告說實在是也沒寫說你禁用中國製的電磁性或相關的模組\n\n3\n00:00:51,187 --> 00:00:51,708\n陳蘭桑得選用中國字的電池芯\n\n4\n00:01:08,001 --> 00:01:10,182\n中國的電磁星有沒有替代?傳統的電磁星我們就叫做液態電磁星在2022年前年前\n\n5\n00:01:31,528 --> 00:01:44,777\n統計中國、日本、韓國南掛了全球液態離電池的產量近三分之二這右上角這一張的方塊圖呈現出來那全球近六成的液態離電池芯\n\n6\n00:01:47,058 --> 00:02:03,327\n電池組三分之二中日韓南瓜去了但是在電池芯的部分義大利電池芯六成是來自中國我國國內的電池現在的總產量整個電池組的總產量占全國義大利電池不到2%\n\n7\n00:02:04,824 --> 00:02:25,119\n那我們國內的這個電池的發展有沒有利基呢那當然有我們是應該鎖定高功率及創新應用的固態離電池而不是液態搶下來高單價的利基市場這所謂高單價利基市場後面我也講我們的市場在哪裡在無人機在電動車\n\n8\n00:02:30,443 --> 00:02:51,499\n部長我們來看一下國際的戰爭二屋戰爭之後讓整個國防系統有了一個省思我們無人機如何輕量化包括我民用的貨車你希望有電動卡車電動卡車是要載貨的所以當你的電池越大的時候當然它載貨量就少所以電池的輕量化機載的輕量化電池的輕量化這個是一個趨勢市場的量體在哪裡\n\n9\n00:02:59,454 --> 00:02:59,574\n財政部長\n\n10\n00:03:19,565 --> 00:03:29,810\n的這樣的一個無人機市場這是臺灣有機會的所以他的電池的這個固態電池是我們的利基那我為什麼說他有利基呢這個來臺灣固態電池啊切入高單價這邊啊這個我要這個爬梳出來這前三家都是美國的企業第四家呢叫輝能他是臺灣的廠商中國的資金但是工廠在法國\n\n11\n00:03:48,138 --> 00:04:05,171\n後面這一家是用臺灣的資源去給工研院研發出來育成的這個廠商愛國者能源但是他的產能我這邊列出來的是國際固態電池的優秀的廠商我們可以排名進去耶\n\n12\n00:04:09,689 --> 00:04:11,950\n中央政府總預算案關於經濟部及所屬單位預算部分。：林岱樺\n\n13\n00:04:38,231 --> 00:04:54,660\n他有更輕的重量第三他有更長的續航力這張表在我的這個電子的模組的能量他可以呢這個可以固態的優於液態的將近三倍他的行駛的車輛固態電池可以應液態電池達到35%到70那他的成本每一次充電的成本他可以降低30%到70\n\n14\n00:05:04,165 --> 00:05:31,518\n好再來從國安的角度黎巴嫩的爆炸事件美聯社多名的專家認為很可能是呼叫器的供應鏈被入侵在製作過程當中已會已經填入炸藥電池只有過充過熱才會爆炸他現在是數千具的bb扣同時爆炸所以這個只有可能很大的可能是供應鏈深入高爆性的炸藥才有可能好\n\n15\n00:05:32,438 --> 00:05:44,324\n那我們的族人裡面的電子星BBCODE都可以用電子星當中導入爆藥而讓它集體爆炸你說這個電子星這個電子模組我要不要去紅化\n\n16\n00:05:45,630 --> 00:06:01,621\n政府基於國安的理由,接近黎巴嫩的爆炸,面臨特殊區域政治形勢,政府及國營事業的光儲能設備是否列為關鍵基礎設施?中油已經將儲油設施列為關鍵基礎設備,那台電是不是要重新檢討你的光儲能廠是否要列為關鍵基礎設施?\n\n17\n00:06:15,650 --> 00:06:18,453\n國際市場推廣過程中,臺灣是優勢而且是用政府資源去支持出來的。經濟部當然要支持\n\n18\n00:06:30,963 --> 00:06:49,736\n國內的固態離電池的製造產業,切入國際的固態離電池的南海市場,擺脫中國製的電池業者。好,本席的具體要求也請部長能夠具體回應。據區域政治的情勢,國安考量政府經國一企業的關鍵基礎設施,嚴禁中國製設備進入國家標案,檢視線有了太陽光電\n\n19\n00:06:57,460 --> 00:07:17,584\n發電設備結合儲能系統的設備你這個蓄能系統也就是跟電子型電子模組電子型有關我們有國內的你可以國內也有液態日韓也有液態我們都有替代產品固態的是我們自己現在正在研發的好那我覺得這是中油都可以把它的儲能潮當作關鍵基礎聲勢台電的你的儲能系統\n\n20\n00:07:23,385 --> 00:07:40,300\n要不然你的綠能發電你一定要有完備的儲能系統才能穩定電力阿第二個因應川普當選去紅化可能是國際市場的主要影響重點輔導國產的固態電池產業協助推廣到國內外的電動載具及無人載具部長怎麼針對這兩個訴求您回應一下\n\n21\n00:07:47,426 --> 00:08:03,370\n是,我們謝謝這個委員的隨詢。我想對第一點,我們會馬上深入的這個檢討。那麼未來這個屬於這個國家的這個標案,那麼就是類似這個太陽能發電這些設備啊這些儲能的這個標準規範裡面,我們會訂出來這個\n\n22\n00:08:09,133 --> 00:08:30,095\n去紅化這是第一點第二點就是我們這個固態電池確實是如委員所垂詢的我們現在工研院正加速在跟這個產業在合作所以我相信在大家的祝福之下我們希望這個明後年就能夠開始量產大量量產\n\n23\n00:08:31,216 --> 00:08:37,178\n這個量產我真的需要你們這個經濟部你看這張圖這張圖你看因為我們的公司小所以你看當後你2027到2028也就三四年後今年2024你看這個全球的美國的部分他量產每年到91GWh\n\n24\n00:08:53,044 --> 00:09:20,760\n到這個他的前三家都到80到100這當中但是我們國內每年只能到20GWh我們有技術我們只是在資金人才這個部分要多一些助力所以在相關的這個輔導計畫我拜託這個部長您是不是要加碼一下我們這個都有一些鼓勵的政策來那技術師師長你有點頭來你要怎麼輔導我是不是部長讓技術師來講一下\n\n25\n00:09:25,626 --> 00:09:30,752\n技術上已經有進行一些開發,但是後續的話就是要去進行後續的量產的協助,那我們政府一定要大力的來與協助。\n\n26\n00:09:43,247 --> 00:10:00,085\n部長、市長這個在跟時間賽跑既然現在的無人機包括電動機的輕量化這就是在這次惡霧戰爭中很明顯的轉變市場的一個局勢如果國內有這樣的技術我還不加碼搶進這個市場在兩三年後我們就沒有這個\n\n27\n00:10:01,947 --> 00:10:13,876\n我們會跟國發會來討論國發基金可不可以來投還有台山基金可不可以投我想這個我們會有一些技術專家來做一些評斷市長一定有這個機會謝謝委員學訓\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n80\t24869\t委員諮詢好有請部長請郭部長還沒用好好部長今天針對人員政策應該要鏈結國安跟產業發展不是只有產業發展還要國安那聚焦在太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統去紅化\n32770\t50046\t經濟部公布了《台太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統的競標公告》在11月6日不久前公告說實在是也沒寫說你禁用中國製的電磁性或相關的模組\n51187\t51708\t陳蘭桑得選用中國字的電池芯\n68001\t70182\t中國的電磁星有沒有替代?傳統的電磁星我們就叫做液態電磁星在2022年前年前\n91528\t104777\t統計中國、日本、韓國南掛了全球液態離電池的產量近三分之二這右上角這一張的方塊圖呈現出來那全球近六成的液態離電池芯\n107058\t123327\t電池組三分之二中日韓南瓜去了但是在電池芯的部分義大利電池芯六成是來自中國我國國內的電池現在的總產量整個電池組的總產量占全國義大利電池不到2%\n124824\t145119\t那我們國內的這個電池的發展有沒有利基呢那當然有我們是應該鎖定高功率及創新應用的固態離電池而不是液態搶下來高單價的利基市場這所謂高單價利基市場後面我也講我們的市場在哪裡在無人機在電動車\n150443\t171499\t部長 我們來看一下國際的戰爭二屋戰爭之後讓整個國防系統有了一個省思我們無人機如何輕量化包括我民用的貨車你希望有電動卡車電動卡車是要載貨的所以當你的電池越大的時候當然它載貨量就少所以電池的輕量化機載的輕量化電池的輕量化這個是一個趨勢市場的量體在哪裡\n179454\t179574\t財政部長\n199565\t209810\t的這樣的一個無人機市場這是臺灣有機會的所以他的電池的這個固態電池是我們的利基那我為什麼說他有利基呢這個來臺灣固態電池啊切入高單價這邊啊這個我要這個爬梳出來這前三家都是美國的企業第四家呢叫輝能他是臺灣的廠商中國的資金但是工廠在法國\n228138\t245171\t後面這一家是用臺灣的資源去給工研院研發出來育成的這個廠商愛國者能源但是他的產能我這邊列出來的是國際固態電池的優秀的廠商我們可以排名進去耶\n249689\t251950\t中央政府總預算案關於經濟部及所屬單位預算部分。 ：林岱樺\n278231\t294660\t他有更輕的重量第三他有更長的續航力這張表在我的這個電子的模組的能量他可以呢這個可以固態的優於液態的將近三倍他的行駛的車輛固態電池可以應液態電池達到35%到70那他的成本每一次充電的成本他可以降低30%到70\n304165\t331518\t好再來從國安的角度黎巴嫩的爆炸事件美聯社多名的專家認為很可能是呼叫器的供應鏈被入侵在製作過程當中已會已經填入炸藥電池只有過充過熱才會爆炸他現在是數千具的bb扣同時爆炸所以這個只有可能很大的可能是供應鏈深入高爆性的炸藥才有可能好\n332438\t344324\t那我們的族人裡面的電子星BBCODE都可以用電子星當中導入爆藥而讓它集體爆炸你說這個電子星這個電子模組我要不要去紅化\n345630\t361621\t政府基於國安的理由,接近黎巴嫩的爆炸,面臨特殊區域政治形勢,政府及國營事業的光儲能設備是否列為關鍵基礎設施?中油已經將儲油設施列為關鍵基礎設備,那台電是不是要重新檢討你的光儲能廠是否要列為關鍵基礎設施?\n375650\t378453\t國際市場推廣過程中,臺灣是優勢而且是用政府資源去支持出來的。經濟部當然要支持\n390963\t409736\t國內的固態離電池的製造產業,切入國際的固態離電池的南海市場,擺脫中國製的電池業者。好,本席的具體要求也請部長能夠具體回應。據區域政治的情勢,國安考量政府經國一企業的關鍵基礎設施,嚴禁中國製設備進入國家標案,檢視線有了太陽光電\n417460\t437584\t發電設備結合儲能系統的設備你這個蓄能系統也就是跟電子型電子模組電子型有關我們有國內的你可以國內也有液態日韓也有液態我們都有替代產品固態的是我們自己現在正在研發的好那我覺得這是中油都可以把它的儲能潮當作關鍵基礎聲勢台電的你的儲能系統\n443385\t460300\t要不然你的綠能發電你一定要有完備的儲能系統才能穩定電力阿第二個因應川普當選去紅化可能是國際市場的主要影響重點輔導國產的固態電池產業協助推廣到國內外的電動載具及無人載具部長怎麼針對這兩個訴求您回應一下\n467426\t483370\t是,我們謝謝這個委員的隨詢。我想對第一點,我們會馬上深入的這個檢討。那麼未來這個屬於這個國家的這個標案,那麼就是類似這個太陽能發電這些設備啊這些儲能的這個標準規範裡面,我們會訂出來這個\n489133\t510095\t去紅化這是第一點第二點就是我們這個固態電池確實是如委員所垂詢的我們現在工研院正加速在跟這個產業在合作所以我相信在大家的祝福之下我們希望這個明後年就能夠開始量產大量量產\n511216\t517178\t這個量產我真的需要你們這個經濟部你看這張圖這張圖你看因為我們的公司小所以你看當後你2027到2028也就三四年後今年2024你看這個全球的美國的部分他量產每年到91GWh\n533044\t560760\t到這個他的前三家都到80到100這當中但是我們國內每年只能到20GWh我們有技術我們只是在資金人才這個部分要多一些助力所以在相關的這個輔導計畫我拜託這個部長您是不是要加碼一下我們這個都有一些鼓勵的政策來那技術師師長你有點頭來你要怎麼輔導我是不是部長讓技術師來講一下\n565626\t570752\t技術上已經有進行一些開發,但是後續的話就是要去進行後續的量產的協助,那我們政府一定要大力的來與協助。\n583247\t600085\t部長、市長這個在跟時間賽跑既然現在的無人機包括電動機的輕量化這就是在這次惡霧戰爭中很明顯的轉變市場的一個局勢如果國內有這樣的技術我還不加碼搶進這個市場在兩三年後我們就沒有這個\n601947\t613876\t我們會跟國發會來討論國發基金可不可以來投還有台山基金可不可以投我想這個我們會有一些技術專家來做一些評斷市長一定有這個機會謝謝委員學訓\n","txt":"委員諮詢好有請部長請郭部長還沒用好好部長今天針對人員政策應該要鏈結國安跟產業發展不是只有產業發展還要國安那聚焦在太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統去紅化\n經濟部公布了《台太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統的競標公告》在11月6日不久前公告說實在是也沒寫說你禁用中國製的電磁性或相關的模組\n陳蘭桑得選用中國字的電池芯\n中國的電磁星有沒有替代?傳統的電磁星我們就叫做液態電磁星在2022年前年前\n統計中國、日本、韓國南掛了全球液態離電池的產量近三分之二這右上角這一張的方塊圖呈現出來那全球近六成的液態離電池芯\n電池組三分之二中日韓南瓜去了但是在電池芯的部分義大利電池芯六成是來自中國我國國內的電池現在的總產量整個電池組的總產量占全國義大利電池不到2%\n那我們國內的這個電池的發展有沒有利基呢那當然有我們是應該鎖定高功率及創新應用的固態離電池而不是液態搶下來高單價的利基市場這所謂高單價利基市場後面我也講我們的市場在哪裡在無人機在電動車\n部長 我們來看一下國際的戰爭二屋戰爭之後讓整個國防系統有了一個省思我們無人機如何輕量化包括我民用的貨車你希望有電動卡車電動卡車是要載貨的所以當你的電池越大的時候當然它載貨量就少所以電池的輕量化機載的輕量化電池的輕量化這個是一個趨勢市場的量體在哪裡\n財政部長\n的這樣的一個無人機市場這是臺灣有機會的所以他的電池的這個固態電池是我們的利基那我為什麼說他有利基呢這個來臺灣固態電池啊切入高單價這邊啊這個我要這個爬梳出來這前三家都是美國的企業第四家呢叫輝能他是臺灣的廠商中國的資金但是工廠在法國\n後面這一家是用臺灣的資源去給工研院研發出來育成的這個廠商愛國者能源但是他的產能我這邊列出來的是國際固態電池的優秀的廠商我們可以排名進去耶\n中央政府總預算案關於經濟部及所屬單位預算部分。 ：林岱樺\n他有更輕的重量第三他有更長的續航力這張表在我的這個電子的模組的能量他可以呢這個可以固態的優於液態的將近三倍他的行駛的車輛固態電池可以應液態電池達到35%到70那他的成本每一次充電的成本他可以降低30%到70\n好再來從國安的角度黎巴嫩的爆炸事件美聯社多名的專家認為很可能是呼叫器的供應鏈被入侵在製作過程當中已會已經填入炸藥電池只有過充過熱才會爆炸他現在是數千具的bb扣同時爆炸所以這個只有可能很大的可能是供應鏈深入高爆性的炸藥才有可能好\n那我們的族人裡面的電子星BBCODE都可以用電子星當中導入爆藥而讓它集體爆炸你說這個電子星這個電子模組我要不要去紅化\n政府基於國安的理由,接近黎巴嫩的爆炸,面臨特殊區域政治形勢,政府及國營事業的光儲能設備是否列為關鍵基礎設施?中油已經將儲油設施列為關鍵基礎設備,那台電是不是要重新檢討你的光儲能廠是否要列為關鍵基礎設施?\n國際市場推廣過程中,臺灣是優勢而且是用政府資源去支持出來的。經濟部當然要支持\n國內的固態離電池的製造產業,切入國際的固態離電池的南海市場,擺脫中國製的電池業者。好,本席的具體要求也請部長能夠具體回應。據區域政治的情勢,國安考量政府經國一企業的關鍵基礎設施,嚴禁中國製設備進入國家標案,檢視線有了太陽光電\n發電設備結合儲能系統的設備你這個蓄能系統也就是跟電子型電子模組電子型有關我們有國內的你可以國內也有液態日韓也有液態我們都有替代產品固態的是我們自己現在正在研發的好那我覺得這是中油都可以把它的儲能潮當作關鍵基礎聲勢台電的你的儲能系統\n要不然你的綠能發電你一定要有完備的儲能系統才能穩定電力阿第二個因應川普當選去紅化可能是國際市場的主要影響重點輔導國產的固態電池產業協助推廣到國內外的電動載具及無人載具部長怎麼針對這兩個訴求您回應一下\n是,我們謝謝這個委員的隨詢。我想對第一點,我們會馬上深入的這個檢討。那麼未來這個屬於這個國家的這個標案,那麼就是類似這個太陽能發電這些設備啊這些儲能的這個標準規範裡面,我們會訂出來這個\n去紅化這是第一點第二點就是我們這個固態電池確實是如委員所垂詢的我們現在工研院正加速在跟這個產業在合作所以我相信在大家的祝福之下我們希望這個明後年就能夠開始量產大量量產\n這個量產我真的需要你們這個經濟部你看這張圖這張圖你看因為我們的公司小所以你看當後你2027到2028也就三四年後今年2024你看這個全球的美國的部分他量產每年到91GWh\n到這個他的前三家都到80到100這當中但是我們國內每年只能到20GWh我們有技術我們只是在資金人才這個部分要多一些助力所以在相關的這個輔導計畫我拜託這個部長您是不是要加碼一下我們這個都有一些鼓勵的政策來那技術師師長你有點頭來你要怎麼輔導我是不是部長讓技術師來講一下\n技術上已經有進行一些開發,但是後續的話就是要去進行後續的量產的協助,那我們政府一定要大力的來與協助。\n部長、市長這個在跟時間賽跑既然現在的無人機包括電動機的輕量化這就是在這次惡霧戰爭中很明顯的轉變市場的一個局勢如果國內有這樣的技術我還不加碼搶進這個市場在兩三年後我們就沒有這個\n我們會跟國發會來討論國發基金可不可以來投還有台山基金可不可以投我想這個我們會有一些技術專家來做一些評斷市長一定有這個機會謝謝委員學訓\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.080 --> 00:24.869\n委員諮詢好有請部長請郭部長還沒用好好部長今天針對人員政策應該要鏈結國安跟產業發展不是只有產業發展還要國安那聚焦在太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統去紅化\n\n00:32.770 --> 00:50.046\n經濟部公布了《台太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統的競標公告》在11月6日不久前公告說實在是也沒寫說你禁用中國製的電磁性或相關的模組\n\n00:51.187 --> 00:51.708\n陳蘭桑得選用中國字的電池芯\n\n01:08.001 --> 01:10.182\n中國的電磁星有沒有替代?傳統的電磁星我們就叫做液態電磁星在2022年前年前\n\n01:31.528 --> 01:44.777\n統計中國、日本、韓國南掛了全球液態離電池的產量近三分之二這右上角這一張的方塊圖呈現出來那全球近六成的液態離電池芯\n\n01:47.058 --> 02:03.327\n電池組三分之二中日韓南瓜去了但是在電池芯的部分義大利電池芯六成是來自中國我國國內的電池現在的總產量整個電池組的總產量占全國義大利電池不到2%\n\n02:04.824 --> 02:25.119\n那我們國內的這個電池的發展有沒有利基呢那當然有我們是應該鎖定高功率及創新應用的固態離電池而不是液態搶下來高單價的利基市場這所謂高單價利基市場後面我也講我們的市場在哪裡在無人機在電動車\n\n02:30.443 --> 02:51.499\n部長我們來看一下國際的戰爭二屋戰爭之後讓整個國防系統有了一個省思我們無人機如何輕量化包括我民用的貨車你希望有電動卡車電動卡車是要載貨的所以當你的電池越大的時候當然它載貨量就少所以電池的輕量化機載的輕量化電池的輕量化這個是一個趨勢市場的量體在哪裡\n\n02:59.454 --> 02:59.574\n財政部長\n\n03:19.565 --> 03:29.810\n的這樣的一個無人機市場這是臺灣有機會的所以他的電池的這個固態電池是我們的利基那我為什麼說他有利基呢這個來臺灣固態電池啊切入高單價這邊啊這個我要這個爬梳出來這前三家都是美國的企業第四家呢叫輝能他是臺灣的廠商中國的資金但是工廠在法國\n\n03:48.138 --> 04:05.171\n後面這一家是用臺灣的資源去給工研院研發出來育成的這個廠商愛國者能源但是他的產能我這邊列出來的是國際固態電池的優秀的廠商我們可以排名進去耶\n\n04:09.689 --> 04:11.950\n中央政府總預算案關於經濟部及所屬單位預算部分。：林岱樺\n\n04:38.231 --> 04:54.660\n他有更輕的重量第三他有更長的續航力這張表在我的這個電子的模組的能量他可以呢這個可以固態的優於液態的將近三倍他的行駛的車輛固態電池可以應液態電池達到35%到70那他的成本每一次充電的成本他可以降低30%到70\n\n05:04.165 --> 05:31.518\n好再來從國安的角度黎巴嫩的爆炸事件美聯社多名的專家認為很可能是呼叫器的供應鏈被入侵在製作過程當中已會已經填入炸藥電池只有過充過熱才會爆炸他現在是數千具的bb扣同時爆炸所以這個只有可能很大的可能是供應鏈深入高爆性的炸藥才有可能好\n\n05:32.438 --> 05:44.324\n那我們的族人裡面的電子星BBCODE都可以用電子星當中導入爆藥而讓它集體爆炸你說這個電子星這個電子模組我要不要去紅化\n\n05:45.630 --> 06:01.621\n政府基於國安的理由,接近黎巴嫩的爆炸,面臨特殊區域政治形勢,政府及國營事業的光儲能設備是否列為關鍵基礎設施?中油已經將儲油設施列為關鍵基礎設備,那台電是不是要重新檢討你的光儲能廠是否要列為關鍵基礎設施?\n\n06:15.650 --> 06:18.453\n國際市場推廣過程中,臺灣是優勢而且是用政府資源去支持出來的。經濟部當然要支持\n\n06:30.963 --> 06:49.736\n國內的固態離電池的製造產業,切入國際的固態離電池的南海市場,擺脫中國製的電池業者。好,本席的具體要求也請部長能夠具體回應。據區域政治的情勢,國安考量政府經國一企業的關鍵基礎設施,嚴禁中國製設備進入國家標案,檢視線有了太陽光電\n\n06:57.460 --> 07:17.584\n發電設備結合儲能系統的設備你這個蓄能系統也就是跟電子型電子模組電子型有關我們有國內的你可以國內也有液態日韓也有液態我們都有替代產品固態的是我們自己現在正在研發的好那我覺得這是中油都可以把它的儲能潮當作關鍵基礎聲勢台電的你的儲能系統\n\n07:23.385 --> 07:40.300\n要不然你的綠能發電你一定要有完備的儲能系統才能穩定電力阿第二個因應川普當選去紅化可能是國際市場的主要影響重點輔導國產的固態電池產業協助推廣到國內外的電動載具及無人載具部長怎麼針對這兩個訴求您回應一下\n\n07:47.426 --> 08:03.370\n是,我們謝謝這個委員的隨詢。我想對第一點,我們會馬上深入的這個檢討。那麼未來這個屬於這個國家的這個標案,那麼就是類似這個太陽能發電這些設備啊這些儲能的這個標準規範裡面,我們會訂出來這個\n\n08:09.133 --> 08:30.095\n去紅化這是第一點第二點就是我們這個固態電池確實是如委員所垂詢的我們現在工研院正加速在跟這個產業在合作所以我相信在大家的祝福之下我們希望這個明後年就能夠開始量產大量量產\n\n08:31.216 --> 08:37.178\n這個量產我真的需要你們這個經濟部你看這張圖這張圖你看因為我們的公司小所以你看當後你2027到2028也就三四年後今年2024你看這個全球的美國的部分他量產每年到91GWh\n\n08:53.044 --> 09:20.760\n到這個他的前三家都到80到100這當中但是我們國內每年只能到20GWh我們有技術我們只是在資金人才這個部分要多一些助力所以在相關的這個輔導計畫我拜託這個部長您是不是要加碼一下我們這個都有一些鼓勵的政策來那技術師師長你有點頭來你要怎麼輔導我是不是部長讓技術師來講一下\n\n09:25.626 --> 09:30.752\n技術上已經有進行一些開發,但是後續的話就是要去進行後續的量產的協助,那我們政府一定要大力的來與協助。\n\n09:43.247 --> 10:00.085\n部長、市長這個在跟時間賽跑既然現在的無人機包括電動機的輕量化這就是在這次惡霧戰爭中很明顯的轉變市場的一個局勢如果國內有這樣的技術我還不加碼搶進這個市場在兩三年後我們就沒有這個\n\n10:01.947 --> 10:13.876\n我們會跟國發會來討論國發基金可不可以來投還有台山基金可不可以投我想這個我們會有一些技術專家來做一些評斷市長一定有這個機會謝謝委員學訓\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.08,"end":24.869,"text":"委員諮詢好有請部長請郭部長還沒用好好部長今天針對人員政策應該要鏈結國安跟產業發展不是只有產業發展還要國安那聚焦在太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統去紅化"},{"start":32.77,"end":50.046,"text":"經濟部公布了《台太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統的競標公告》在11月6日不久前公告說實在是也沒寫說你禁用中國製的電磁性或相關的模組"},{"start":51.187,"end":51.708,"text":"陳蘭桑得選用中國字的電池芯"},{"start":68.001,"end":70.182,"text":"中國的電磁星有沒有替代?傳統的電磁星我們就叫做液態電磁星在2022年前年前"},{"start":91.528,"end":104.777,"text":"統計中國、日本、韓國南掛了全球液態離電池的產量近三分之二這右上角這一張的方塊圖呈現出來那全球近六成的液態離電池芯"},{"start":107.058,"end":123.327,"text":"電池組三分之二中日韓南瓜去了但是在電池芯的部分義大利電池芯六成是來自中國我國國內的電池現在的總產量整個電池組的總產量占全國義大利電池不到2%"},{"start":124.824,"end":145.119,"text":"那我們國內的這個電池的發展有沒有利基呢那當然有我們是應該鎖定高功率及創新應用的固態離電池而不是液態搶下來高單價的利基市場這所謂高單價利基市場後面我也講我們的市場在哪裡在無人機在電動車"},{"start":150.443,"end":171.499,"text":"部長 我們來看一下國際的戰爭二屋戰爭之後讓整個國防系統有了一個省思我們無人機如何輕量化包括我民用的貨車你希望有電動卡車電動卡車是要載貨的所以當你的電池越大的時候當然它載貨量就少所以電池的輕量化機載的輕量化電池的輕量化這個是一個趨勢市場的量體在哪裡"},{"start":179.454,"end":179.574,"text":"財政部長"},{"start":199.565,"end":209.81,"text":"的這樣的一個無人機市場這是臺灣有機會的所以他的電池的這個固態電池是我們的利基那我為什麼說他有利基呢這個來臺灣固態電池啊切入高單價這邊啊這個我要這個爬梳出來這前三家都是美國的企業第四家呢叫輝能他是臺灣的廠商中國的資金但是工廠在法國"},{"start":228.138,"end":245.171,"text":"後面這一家是用臺灣的資源去給工研院研發出來育成的這個廠商愛國者能源但是他的產能我這邊列出來的是國際固態電池的優秀的廠商我們可以排名進去耶"},{"start":249.689,"end":251.95,"text":"中央政府總預算案關於經濟部及所屬單位預算部分。 ：林岱樺"},{"start":278.231,"end":294.66,"text":"他有更輕的重量第三他有更長的續航力這張表在我的這個電子的模組的能量他可以呢這個可以固態的優於液態的將近三倍他的行駛的車輛固態電池可以應液態電池達到35%到70那他的成本每一次充電的成本他可以降低30%到70"},{"start":304.165,"end":331.518,"text":"好再來從國安的角度黎巴嫩的爆炸事件美聯社多名的專家認為很可能是呼叫器的供應鏈被入侵在製作過程當中已會已經填入炸藥電池只有過充過熱才會爆炸他現在是數千具的bb扣同時爆炸所以這個只有可能很大的可能是供應鏈深入高爆性的炸藥才有可能好"},{"start":332.438,"end":344.324,"text":"那我們的族人裡面的電子星BBCODE都可以用電子星當中導入爆藥而讓它集體爆炸你說這個電子星這個電子模組我要不要去紅化"},{"start":345.63,"end":361.621,"text":"政府基於國安的理由,接近黎巴嫩的爆炸,面臨特殊區域政治形勢,政府及國營事業的光儲能設備是否列為關鍵基礎設施?中油已經將儲油設施列為關鍵基礎設備,那台電是不是要重新檢討你的光儲能廠是否要列為關鍵基礎設施?"},{"start":375.65,"end":378.453,"text":"國際市場推廣過程中,臺灣是優勢而且是用政府資源去支持出來的。經濟部當然要支持"},{"start":390.963,"end":409.736,"text":"國內的固態離電池的製造產業,切入國際的固態離電池的南海市場,擺脫中國製的電池業者。好,本席的具體要求也請部長能夠具體回應。據區域政治的情勢,國安考量政府經國一企業的關鍵基礎設施,嚴禁中國製設備進入國家標案,檢視線有了太陽光電"},{"start":417.46,"end":437.584,"text":"發電設備結合儲能系統的設備你這個蓄能系統也就是跟電子型電子模組電子型有關我們有國內的你可以國內也有液態日韓也有液態我們都有替代產品固態的是我們自己現在正在研發的好那我覺得這是中油都可以把它的儲能潮當作關鍵基礎聲勢台電的你的儲能系統"},{"start":443.385,"end":460.3,"text":"要不然你的綠能發電你一定要有完備的儲能系統才能穩定電力阿第二個因應川普當選去紅化可能是國際市場的主要影響重點輔導國產的固態電池產業協助推廣到國內外的電動載具及無人載具部長怎麼針對這兩個訴求您回應一下"},{"start":467.426,"end":483.37,"text":"是,我們謝謝這個委員的隨詢。我想對第一點,我們會馬上深入的這個檢討。那麼未來這個屬於這個國家的這個標案,那麼就是類似這個太陽能發電這些設備啊這些儲能的這個標準規範裡面,我們會訂出來這個"},{"start":489.133,"end":510.095,"text":"去紅化這是第一點第二點就是我們這個固態電池確實是如委員所垂詢的我們現在工研院正加速在跟這個產業在合作所以我相信在大家的祝福之下我們希望這個明後年就能夠開始量產大量量產"},{"start":511.216,"end":517.178,"text":"這個量產我真的需要你們這個經濟部你看這張圖這張圖你看因為我們的公司小所以你看當後你2027到2028也就三四年後今年2024你看這個全球的美國的部分他量產每年到91GWh"},{"start":533.044,"end":560.76,"text":"到這個他的前三家都到80到100這當中但是我們國內每年只能到20GWh我們有技術我們只是在資金人才這個部分要多一些助力所以在相關的這個輔導計畫我拜託這個部長您是不是要加碼一下我們這個都有一些鼓勵的政策來那技術師師長你有點頭來你要怎麼輔導我是不是部長讓技術師來講一下"},{"start":565.626,"end":570.752,"text":"技術上已經有進行一些開發,但是後續的話就是要去進行後續的量產的協助,那我們政府一定要大力的來與協助。"},{"start":583.247,"end":600.085,"text":"部長、市長這個在跟時間賽跑既然現在的無人機包括電動機的輕量化這就是在這次惡霧戰爭中很明顯的轉變市場的一個局勢如果國內有這樣的技術我還不加碼搶進這個市場在兩三年後我們就沒有這個"},{"start":601.947,"end":613.876,"text":"我們會跟國發會來討論國發基金可不可以來投還有台山基金可不可以投我想這個我們會有一些技術專家來做一些評斷市長一定有這個機會謝謝委員學訓"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":176,"blocks":[["林委員岱樺：（9時23分）有請部長。"],["主席：請郭部長。"],["郭部長智輝：委員早。"],["林委員岱樺：好。部長，本席今天的質詢主題是能源政策應該鏈結國安跟產業發展，不是只有產業發展，還要國安，並聚焦在太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統的去紅化。好，我們來看經濟部公布了太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統的競標公告，公告日期是在11月6號，不久前，這個公告說實在的也沒有寫禁用中國製的電池芯或相關的模組，本席再繼續索資，你們出了這一張公文，這個公文最後這一頁就講到說「……承攬商得選用中國製電池（芯）」。","為什麼我要特別講這件事？中國的電池芯有沒有替代方案？當然有！國內也有，日本、韓國都有。它的嚴重性在哪裡？我們先看傳統的電池芯叫做液態電池芯，在2022年（前年）的統計，中國、日本、韓國囊括了全球液態鋰電池的產量近三分之二，如同右上角這一張方塊圖所呈現出來的，全球近六成的液態鋰電池芯電池組三分之二被中日韓囊括了，但是在電池芯的部分，液態鋰電池芯六成是來自中國，我們國內的電池現在的總產量，整個電池組的總產量占全國液態鋰電池不到百分之二。我們國內的電池發展有沒有利基呢？當然有！我們應該鎖定高功率及創新應用的固態鋰電池，而不是液態，搶下高單價的利基市場，所謂高單價的利基市場後面我會講，我們的市場在哪裡？在無人機、在電動車。部長，我們來看一下國際的戰爭，俄烏戰爭之後，讓整個國防系統有了一個省思，我們無人機如何輕量化？包括民用的貨車，你希望有電動卡車，電動卡車是要載貨的，當你的電池越大的時候，當然它的載貨量就少，所以機載的輕量化、電池的輕量化是一個趨勢，市場的量體在哪裡？第一個，在戰爭期間，我如果準備1萬台的無人機，我就必須準備十倍，甚至百倍的庫存量，因為它是消耗品，一打下來就沒有了，在整個俄烏戰爭當中，我要不要去搶那一倍、十倍、甚至百倍的無人機市場？這是臺灣有機會的，所以固態電池芯是我們的利基。","我為什麼說它有利基呢？臺灣固態鋰電池切入高單價市場，我爬梳出來，前三家都是美國企業，第四家叫輝能，它是臺灣的廠商，中國的資金，但是工廠在法國。後面這一家是用臺灣的資源去給工研院，由工研院研發出來育成的廠商──愛國者能源，但是它的產能，我這邊列出來的是國際固態電池的優秀廠商，我們可以排名進去耶！而且是用國家資源去支持出來的。固態鋰電池跟傳統電池相比到底有什麼優勢呢？我用下面這一張表來說明，右邊是固態鋰電池，不管是樹脂、鋰或者是陶瓷，都有；左邊是液態電池。固態優於液態電池，我就以電動車為例，固態比液態有更高的能量密度、更輕的重量、更長的續航力，再看這張表，在電池模組能量方面，固態可以優於液態將近三倍；它行駛的里程，固態電池可以比液態電池提升35%到70%；它每一次充電的成本可以降低30%到70%。","再來，從國安的角度，黎巴嫩的爆炸事件，美聯社多名專家認為很可能是呼叫器供應鏈被入侵，在製作過程當中就已經填入炸藥。電池只有過充、過熱才會爆炸，但現在是數千具的BB Call同時爆炸，所以這有很大的可能是供應鏈滲入高爆性炸藥。而我們的儲能裡面的電子芯，BB Call都可以在電池芯當中滲入爆藥而讓它集體爆炸了，你說這個電池芯、這個電池模組要不要去紅化？政府基於國安的理由，借鏡黎巴嫩的爆炸事件，面臨特殊區域政治形勢，政府及國營事業的光儲能設備是否列為關鍵基礎設施？我這邊舉出中油跟台電，中油已經將儲油設施列為關鍵基礎設備囉！台電是不是要重新檢討你的光儲能廠是否要列為關鍵基礎設施？這你們要重新檢討。在產業面，剛才已經呈現得很清楚了，我們固態電池在國際市場推廣過程當中，臺灣是具有優勢，而且是用政府資源去支持出來的，經濟部當然要支持國內固態鋰電池的製造產業，協助切入國際固態鋰電池的藍海市場，擺脫中國製電子業者的市場掠奪。","本席的具體要求，也請部長能夠具體回應。基於區域政治情勢國安考量，政府及國營企業的關鍵基礎設施，嚴禁中國製設備進入國家標案，檢視現有「太陽光電發電設備結合儲能系統競標」規則。你這個儲能系統，也就是跟電子模組、電子芯有關，我們有國內的，國內也有液態，日韓也有液態，我們都有替代產品，固態的是我們自己現在正在研發的，中油都可以把它的儲能槽當作關鍵基礎設施，台電的儲能系統呢？你的綠能發電一定要有完備的儲能系統才能穩定電力啊！第二個，因應川普當選，去紅化可能是國際產業主流影響，重點輔導國產固態電池產業，協助推廣到國內外的電動載具及無人載具應用。部長，針對這兩個訴求，您回應一下。"],["郭部長智輝：是，謝謝委員的垂詢，對於第一點，我們會馬上深入地檢討，未來屬於國家的標案，就是類似太陽能發電的設備、儲能的標準規範裡面，我們會訂出來去紅化，這是第一點。第二點，關於固態電池，確實如委員所垂詢的，現在工研院正加速在跟產業合作，我相信在大家的祝福之下，我們希望明後年就能夠開始大量量產。"],["林委員岱樺：這個量產真的是需要你們經濟部的協助，你看這張圖，因為我們的公司小，所以2027年到2028年，也就三、四年後，今年是2024年，你看全球的數據，美國的部分，它量產每年到91 GWH，它的前三家都在80到100 GWH當中，但是我們國內每年只能到20 GWH，我們有技術，只是在資金、人才這個部分要多一些助力，所以在相關的輔導計畫，我拜託部長是不是要加碼一下？"],["郭部長智輝：我們這個都有一些鼓勵的政策。"],["林委員岱樺：技術司司長有點頭，來，您要怎麼輔導？部長，是不是讓技術司來講一下在技術面當中怎麼支持？"],["邱司長求慧：我們在科研的部分，其實事先都已經有先做一些布局了，現在技術上已經有進行一些開發，但是後續的話，就是要進行後續量產的協助，我們政府一定要大力地來予以協助。"],["林委員岱樺：部長、司長，這個在跟時間賽跑，既然現在的無人機，包括電動機的輕量化，這就是在這次俄烏戰爭中很明顯的一個市場局勢的轉變，如果國內有這樣的技術，我還不加碼搶進這個市場，再兩、三年後我們就沒有機會了，部長，你比我更清楚。"],["郭部長智輝：我們會跟國發會來討論，看國發基金可不可以來投，還有台杉基金可不可以投，我們會有一些技術專家來做一些評斷，市場一定有這個機會，謝謝委員垂詢。"],["林委員岱樺：好，謝謝。"],["主席：請邱議瑩委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":308,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-19-17","speakers":["呂玉玲","賴瑞隆","林岱樺","邱議瑩","張啓楷","鄭正鈐","楊瓊瓔","陳亭妃","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","賴士葆","邱志偉","謝衣鳯","林月琴","蔡易餘","黃國昌","牛煦庭","陳超明","鍾佳濱","何欣純","葉元之","林倩綺","洪孟楷","張嘉郡"],"page_start":245,"meetingDate":["2024-11-27"],"gazette_id":"11310501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11310501_00010"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第17次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於經濟部及所屬單位預算部分（詢答）","agenda_id":"11310501_00012"}}}