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0.914}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 459.162, \"end\": 459.382, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"存\", \"start\": 459.382, \"end\": 459.502, \"score\": 0.893}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 459.502, \"end\": 459.643, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"心\", \"start\": 459.643, \"end\": 460.764, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 460.764, \"end\": 461.285, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 461.285, \"end\": 461.305, \"score\": 0.265}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:01,504 --> 00:00:02,246\n請外交部長請李佳龍部長\n\n2\n00:00:11,294 --> 00:00:37,999\n部長好,你那外交部有在推那個全民外交嗎?總和外交現在叫總和外交那要也是要公司協力嘛結合我們台灣最大的力量去推展外交特別是政府部門大家都要做外交的幫手不是當豬隊友但最近我們在別的地方就看到我們有一個公家機關相關的部門都一直在當豬隊友就是所謂的台灣plus我不知道這個計畫你知道嗎?\n\n3\n00:00:41,780 --> 00:00:52,286\n幾年前當時蔡英文總統講說要打造像NHK跟BBC一樣的公共平台要讓全世界聽到台灣的故事聽到台灣的聲音花了58億4年的計畫\n\n4\n00:00:55,044 --> 00:01:17,912\n結果最近在川普總統當選的時候他們的記者講說看來美國人選擇了一個重刑犯那這個事情那時候引起軒然大波所以後來文化部長覺得不妥要求台灣Plus把這個新聞下架但是我在台灣Plus的很多新聞裡面我持續看到他們用\n\n5\n00:01:18,832 --> 00:01:20,234\n他也是一個企業家他還是一個曾經是一個脫口秀的主持人他是一個\n\n6\n00:01:39,913 --> 00:01:52,274\n重返白宮的一個總統候選的成功的當選他這麼多的形容詞但是非要講他是一個重刑犯你認為湯恩普拉斯這樣不斷的強調川普是一個重刑犯這件事情你覺得妥當嗎?\n\n7\n00:01:54,270 --> 00:02:15,688\n就從委員講的去報導的時候他在什麼脈絡下用什麼樣的一個形容方式本來就是有他的主觀心可是客觀上面當然因為他當選了就是民意的支持所以這個時候如果個人的立場跟這個機構他的角色這怎麼去一個能夠有一個權衡\n\n8\n00:02:20,865 --> 00:02:23,746\n臺灣Plus不是一般的民營媒體它是政府出資\n\n9\n00:02:48,911 --> 00:03:06,569\n做的媒體用意是要讓全世界聽到台灣的聲音結果他們現在聽到台灣的聲音是說台灣人就一直不斷地強調川普是重刑犯這個特質那你覺得適合嗎然後我舉個比較明確的例子在他們發生爭議之後我去他們的網站去看\n\n10\n00:03:07,290 --> 00:03:36,730\n他們是怎麼形容說川普的支持者在海湖山莊去慶祝川普的當選一樣喔描述川普的時候說川普就是一個被定罪的重刑犯人家已經當選了人家的支持者在慶祝結果你用一個這麼負面的標籤在形容川普那你現在是怎樣你在酸那些支持者喔好像意思是說你們這個支持者有問題啊人家是一個重刑犯的當選了你還在那邊慶祝你慶祝重刑犯嗎我個人站在外交的角度我覺得非常不妥當\n\n11\n00:03:37,490 --> 00:03:59,870\n我是覺得非常不妥當那文化部當然可以拗啊文化部他可以講說那個就客觀描述但我要強調客觀描述有非常多種部長你本人也做過很多職務嘛你做過外交部長你也做過交通部長你也選過新北市長你還做過總統府秘書長那我們特別去挑你失敗的經驗不斷的加注在你的身上你會舒服嗎你會不會覺得是偏見你會不會覺得很刻意\n\n12\n00:04:01,563 --> 00:04:26,274\n我還做過行政院新聞記者對對嘛對嘛然後那我就一直負面標籤嘛比如說這個參選新北市長失利的林佳我沒有必要這樣嘛因為你現在是外交部長我們希望你外交就好嘛就像川普當選了我們希望他領導美國然後對跟台灣關係好我們要正面那不斷的去描述他的負面標籤然後強調說這個是客觀的描述我在希望你從外交的角度來評論這個事情你覺得適當嗎\n\n13\n00:04:28,815 --> 00:04:29,035\n他是媒體啊?\n\n14\n00:04:54,687 --> 00:05:04,866\n當時就說打造跟BBC跟NHK,那BBC是不是媒體?那個就是值得討論,因為...那個是蔡英文總統宣誓要成立的啊因為其實文化部也不一定給公視,以前也沒有\n\n15\n00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:10,022\n所以這個是制度面的問題我認為要去理解因為媒體你做平台的話讓各種內容匯流去促進那你可以專案的跟很多的媒體合作人家媒體合作有他的立場可是這個角色的問題因為你問我做過很多工作所以我也常常換工作他是媒體啦他是類似BGNHK對媒體的定義\n\n16\n00:05:27,691 --> 00:05:30,432\n有限、無限跟外星媒體匯流中的網路。\n\n17\n00:05:45,938 --> 00:06:06,995\n在外交角度個人的立場、機構的立場、國家的立場現在沒有個人立場現在你們有很多外交人員在做對美關係大家都希望台美關係更進一步特別是川普上任之後他很強勢我們當然可能需要花更多心力在對美關係上面那如果我們跟他保持好關係的同時台灣的公營媒體\n\n18\n00:06:08,256 --> 00:06:35,658\n臺灣人出的錢的媒體是這樣子不斷去描述川普的負面標籤我覺得很不作當我希望布朗你站在外交角度你去跟王岸部長講一下好不好現在大家都講全民外交啊你現在你難道希望總和外交總和外交全民一樣啦一樣的意思人人都是外交官人人都是外交官嘛人人都是外交官嘛然後現在我們動不動假設國人去美國就一直講說哎呀這川普就是一個被定刑的重刑犯啊\n\n19\n00:06:36,198 --> 00:06:59,033\n一講這種東西有辦法做到嗎個人的言論是一個層次但是代表你的組織、機構尤其是媒體那是另外一回事對啦對但我們不希望大家這樣嘛你做總和外交你難道希望我們的國人出去都講川普壞話嗎你當然希望說大家維持好關係這是你一個期許他怎麼講你不要控制他因為他是個人可是你總不希望他這樣做吧還是你希望\n\n20\n00:06:59,929 --> 00:07:06,725\n你不會希望嘛所以是不是可以跟外交部講一下因為他們現在民玩我覺得是民玩不靈啊他們不斷的強調自己是對的啦\n\n21\n00:07:09,873 --> 00:07:30,952\n我覺得這是最可怕的就是說你不小心失誤怎麼樣怎麼樣你改就好了嘛你一直強調你是對的開玩笑那以後你是要不斷的強調川普是重刑犯這件事情有必要嗎有必要嗎我來瞭解一下文化部長他的心聲我們是站在外交不是說完全沒有說你做不好的地方就是希望你跟他說一下因為這是統合外交的一環\n\n22\n00:07:34,455 --> 00:07:41,305\n要配合外交部做一些良善正善良善好運動說好話做好事存好心謝謝好謝謝委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1504\t2246\t請外交部長請李佳龍部長\n11294\t37999\t部長好,你那外交部有在推那個全民外交嗎?總和外交現在叫總和外交那要也是要公司協力嘛結合我們台灣最大的力量去推展外交特別是政府部門大家都要做外交的幫手不是當豬隊友但最近我們在別的地方就看到我們有一個公家機關相關的部門都一直在當豬隊友就是所謂的台灣plus我不知道這個計畫你知道嗎?\n41780\t52286\t幾年前當時蔡英文總統講說要打造像NHK跟BBC一樣的公共平台要讓全世界聽到台灣的故事聽到台灣的聲音花了58億4年的計畫\n55044\t77912\t結果最近在川普總統當選的時候他們的記者講說看來美國人選擇了一個重刑犯那這個事情那時候引起軒然大波所以後來文化部長覺得不妥要求台灣Plus把這個新聞下架但是我在台灣Plus的很多新聞裡面我持續看到他們用\n78832\t80234\t他也是一個企業家他還是一個曾經是一個脫口秀的主持人他是一個\n99913\t112274\t重返白宮的一個總統候選的成功的當選他這麼多的形容詞但是非要講他是一個重刑犯你認為湯恩普拉斯這樣不斷的強調川普是一個重刑犯這件事情你覺得妥當嗎?\n114270\t135688\t就從委員講的去報導的時候他在什麼脈絡下用什麼樣的一個形容方式本來就是有他的主觀心可是客觀上面當然因為他當選了就是民意的支持所以這個時候如果個人的立場跟這個機構他的角色這怎麼去一個能夠有一個權衡\n140865\t143746\t臺灣Plus不是一般的民營媒體它是政府出資\n168911\t186569\t做的媒體用意是要讓全世界聽到台灣的聲音結果他們現在聽到台灣的聲音是說台灣人就一直不斷地強調川普是重刑犯這個特質那你覺得適合嗎然後我舉個比較明確的例子在他們發生爭議之後我去他們的網站去看\n187290\t216730\t他們是怎麼形容說川普的支持者在海湖山莊去慶祝川普的當選一樣喔描述川普的時候說川普就是一個被定罪的重刑犯人家已經當選了人家的支持者在慶祝結果你用一個這麼負面的標籤在形容川普那你現在是怎樣你在酸那些支持者喔好像意思是說你們這個支持者有問題啊人家是一個重刑犯的當選了你還在那邊慶祝你慶祝重刑犯嗎我個人站在外交的角度我覺得非常不妥當\n217490\t239870\t我是覺得非常不妥當那文化部當然可以拗啊文化部他可以講說那個就客觀描述但我要強調客觀描述有非常多種部長你本人也做過很多職務嘛你做過外交部長你也做過交通部長你也選過新北市長你還做過總統府秘書長那我們特別去挑你失敗的經驗不斷的加注在你的身上你會舒服嗎你會不會覺得是偏見你會不會覺得很刻意\n241563\t266274\t我還做過行政院新聞記者對對嘛對嘛然後那我就一直負面標籤嘛比如說這個參選新北市長失利的林佳我沒有必要這樣嘛因為你現在是外交部長我們希望你外交就好嘛就像川普當選了我們希望他領導美國然後對跟台灣關係好我們要正面那不斷的去描述他的負面標籤然後強調說這個是客觀的描述我在希望你從外交的角度來評論這個事情你覺得適當嗎\n268815\t269035\t他是媒體啊?\n294687\t304866\t當時就說打造跟BBC跟NHK,那BBC是不是媒體?那個就是值得討論,因為...那個是蔡英文總統宣誓要成立的啊因為其實文化部也不一定給公視,以前也沒有\n305560\t310022\t所以這個是制度面的問題我認為要去理解因為媒體你做平台的話讓各種內容匯流去促進那你可以專案的跟很多的媒體合作人家媒體合作有他的立場可是這個角色的問題因為你問我做過很多工作所以我也常常換工作他是媒體啦他是類似BGNHK對媒體的定義\n327691\t330432\t有限、無限跟外星媒體匯流中的網路。\n345938\t366995\t在外交角度個人的立場、機構的立場、國家的立場現在沒有個人立場現在你們有很多外交人員在做對美關係大家都希望台美關係更進一步特別是川普上任之後他很強勢我們當然可能需要花更多心力在對美關係上面那如果我們跟他保持好關係的同時台灣的公營媒體\n368256\t395658\t臺灣人出的錢的媒體是這樣子不斷去描述川普的負面標籤我覺得很不作當我希望布朗你站在外交角度你去跟王岸部長講一下好不好現在大家都講全民外交啊你現在你難道希望總和外交總和外交全民一樣啦一樣的意思人人都是外交官人人都是外交官嘛人人都是外交官嘛然後現在我們動不動假設國人去美國就一直講說哎呀這川普就是一個被定刑的重刑犯啊\n396198\t419033\t一講這種東西有辦法做到嗎個人的言論是一個層次但是代表你的組織、機構尤其是媒體那是另外一回事對啦對但我們不希望大家這樣嘛你做總和外交你難道希望我們的國人出去都講川普壞話嗎你當然希望說大家維持好關係這是你一個期許他怎麼講你不要控制他因為他是個人可是你總不希望他這樣做吧還是你希望\n419929\t426725\t你不會希望嘛所以是不是可以跟外交部講一下因為他們現在民玩我覺得是民玩不靈啊他們不斷的強調自己是對的啦\n429873\t450952\t我覺得這是最可怕的就是說你不小心失誤怎麼樣怎麼樣你改就好了嘛你一直強調你是對的開玩笑那以後你是要不斷的強調川普是重刑犯這件事情有必要嗎有必要嗎我來瞭解一下文化部長他的心聲我們是站在外交不是說完全沒有說你做不好的地方就是希望你跟他說一下因為這是統合外交的一環\n454455\t461305\t要配合外交部做一些良善正善良善好運動說好話做好事存好心謝謝好謝謝委員\n","txt":"請外交部長請李佳龍部長\n部長好,你那外交部有在推那個全民外交嗎?總和外交現在叫總和外交那要也是要公司協力嘛結合我們台灣最大的力量去推展外交特別是政府部門大家都要做外交的幫手不是當豬隊友但最近我們在別的地方就看到我們有一個公家機關相關的部門都一直在當豬隊友就是所謂的台灣plus我不知道這個計畫你知道嗎?\n幾年前當時蔡英文總統講說要打造像NHK跟BBC一樣的公共平台要讓全世界聽到台灣的故事聽到台灣的聲音花了58億4年的計畫\n結果最近在川普總統當選的時候他們的記者講說看來美國人選擇了一個重刑犯那這個事情那時候引起軒然大波所以後來文化部長覺得不妥要求台灣Plus把這個新聞下架但是我在台灣Plus的很多新聞裡面我持續看到他們用\n他也是一個企業家他還是一個曾經是一個脫口秀的主持人他是一個\n重返白宮的一個總統候選的成功的當選他這麼多的形容詞但是非要講他是一個重刑犯你認為湯恩普拉斯這樣不斷的強調川普是一個重刑犯這件事情你覺得妥當嗎?\n就從委員講的去報導的時候他在什麼脈絡下用什麼樣的一個形容方式本來就是有他的主觀心可是客觀上面當然因為他當選了就是民意的支持所以這個時候如果個人的立場跟這個機構他的角色這怎麼去一個能夠有一個權衡\n臺灣Plus不是一般的民營媒體它是政府出資\n做的媒體用意是要讓全世界聽到台灣的聲音結果他們現在聽到台灣的聲音是說台灣人就一直不斷地強調川普是重刑犯這個特質那你覺得適合嗎然後我舉個比較明確的例子在他們發生爭議之後我去他們的網站去看\n他們是怎麼形容說川普的支持者在海湖山莊去慶祝川普的當選一樣喔描述川普的時候說川普就是一個被定罪的重刑犯人家已經當選了人家的支持者在慶祝結果你用一個這麼負面的標籤在形容川普那你現在是怎樣你在酸那些支持者喔好像意思是說你們這個支持者有問題啊人家是一個重刑犯的當選了你還在那邊慶祝你慶祝重刑犯嗎我個人站在外交的角度我覺得非常不妥當\n我是覺得非常不妥當那文化部當然可以拗啊文化部他可以講說那個就客觀描述但我要強調客觀描述有非常多種部長你本人也做過很多職務嘛你做過外交部長你也做過交通部長你也選過新北市長你還做過總統府秘書長那我們特別去挑你失敗的經驗不斷的加注在你的身上你會舒服嗎你會不會覺得是偏見你會不會覺得很刻意\n我還做過行政院新聞記者對對嘛對嘛然後那我就一直負面標籤嘛比如說這個參選新北市長失利的林佳我沒有必要這樣嘛因為你現在是外交部長我們希望你外交就好嘛就像川普當選了我們希望他領導美國然後對跟台灣關係好我們要正面那不斷的去描述他的負面標籤然後強調說這個是客觀的描述我在希望你從外交的角度來評論這個事情你覺得適當嗎\n他是媒體啊?\n當時就說打造跟BBC跟NHK,那BBC是不是媒體?那個就是值得討論,因為...那個是蔡英文總統宣誓要成立的啊因為其實文化部也不一定給公視,以前也沒有\n所以這個是制度面的問題我認為要去理解因為媒體你做平台的話讓各種內容匯流去促進那你可以專案的跟很多的媒體合作人家媒體合作有他的立場可是這個角色的問題因為你問我做過很多工作所以我也常常換工作他是媒體啦他是類似BGNHK對媒體的定義\n有限、無限跟外星媒體匯流中的網路。\n在外交角度個人的立場、機構的立場、國家的立場現在沒有個人立場現在你們有很多外交人員在做對美關係大家都希望台美關係更進一步特別是川普上任之後他很強勢我們當然可能需要花更多心力在對美關係上面那如果我們跟他保持好關係的同時台灣的公營媒體\n臺灣人出的錢的媒體是這樣子不斷去描述川普的負面標籤我覺得很不作當我希望布朗你站在外交角度你去跟王岸部長講一下好不好現在大家都講全民外交啊你現在你難道希望總和外交總和外交全民一樣啦一樣的意思人人都是外交官人人都是外交官嘛人人都是外交官嘛然後現在我們動不動假設國人去美國就一直講說哎呀這川普就是一個被定刑的重刑犯啊\n一講這種東西有辦法做到嗎個人的言論是一個層次但是代表你的組織、機構尤其是媒體那是另外一回事對啦對但我們不希望大家這樣嘛你做總和外交你難道希望我們的國人出去都講川普壞話嗎你當然希望說大家維持好關係這是你一個期許他怎麼講你不要控制他因為他是個人可是你總不希望他這樣做吧還是你希望\n你不會希望嘛所以是不是可以跟外交部講一下因為他們現在民玩我覺得是民玩不靈啊他們不斷的強調自己是對的啦\n我覺得這是最可怕的就是說你不小心失誤怎麼樣怎麼樣你改就好了嘛你一直強調你是對的開玩笑那以後你是要不斷的強調川普是重刑犯這件事情有必要嗎有必要嗎我來瞭解一下文化部長他的心聲我們是站在外交不是說完全沒有說你做不好的地方就是希望你跟他說一下因為這是統合外交的一環\n要配合外交部做一些良善正善良善好運動說好話做好事存好心謝謝好謝謝委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.504 --> 00:02.246\n請外交部長請李佳龍部長\n\n00:11.294 --> 00:37.999\n部長好,你那外交部有在推那個全民外交嗎?總和外交現在叫總和外交那要也是要公司協力嘛結合我們台灣最大的力量去推展外交特別是政府部門大家都要做外交的幫手不是當豬隊友但最近我們在別的地方就看到我們有一個公家機關相關的部門都一直在當豬隊友就是所謂的台灣plus我不知道這個計畫你知道嗎?\n\n00:41.780 --> 00:52.286\n幾年前當時蔡英文總統講說要打造像NHK跟BBC一樣的公共平台要讓全世界聽到台灣的故事聽到台灣的聲音花了58億4年的計畫\n\n00:55.044 --> 01:17.912\n結果最近在川普總統當選的時候他們的記者講說看來美國人選擇了一個重刑犯那這個事情那時候引起軒然大波所以後來文化部長覺得不妥要求台灣Plus把這個新聞下架但是我在台灣Plus的很多新聞裡面我持續看到他們用\n\n01:18.832 --> 01:20.234\n他也是一個企業家他還是一個曾經是一個脫口秀的主持人他是一個\n\n01:39.913 --> 01:52.274\n重返白宮的一個總統候選的成功的當選他這麼多的形容詞但是非要講他是一個重刑犯你認為湯恩普拉斯這樣不斷的強調川普是一個重刑犯這件事情你覺得妥當嗎?\n\n01:54.270 --> 02:15.688\n就從委員講的去報導的時候他在什麼脈絡下用什麼樣的一個形容方式本來就是有他的主觀心可是客觀上面當然因為他當選了就是民意的支持所以這個時候如果個人的立場跟這個機構他的角色這怎麼去一個能夠有一個權衡\n\n02:20.865 --> 02:23.746\n臺灣Plus不是一般的民營媒體它是政府出資\n\n02:48.911 --> 03:06.569\n做的媒體用意是要讓全世界聽到台灣的聲音結果他們現在聽到台灣的聲音是說台灣人就一直不斷地強調川普是重刑犯這個特質那你覺得適合嗎然後我舉個比較明確的例子在他們發生爭議之後我去他們的網站去看\n\n03:07.290 --> 03:36.730\n他們是怎麼形容說川普的支持者在海湖山莊去慶祝川普的當選一樣喔描述川普的時候說川普就是一個被定罪的重刑犯人家已經當選了人家的支持者在慶祝結果你用一個這麼負面的標籤在形容川普那你現在是怎樣你在酸那些支持者喔好像意思是說你們這個支持者有問題啊人家是一個重刑犯的當選了你還在那邊慶祝你慶祝重刑犯嗎我個人站在外交的角度我覺得非常不妥當\n\n03:37.490 --> 03:59.870\n我是覺得非常不妥當那文化部當然可以拗啊文化部他可以講說那個就客觀描述但我要強調客觀描述有非常多種部長你本人也做過很多職務嘛你做過外交部長你也做過交通部長你也選過新北市長你還做過總統府秘書長那我們特別去挑你失敗的經驗不斷的加注在你的身上你會舒服嗎你會不會覺得是偏見你會不會覺得很刻意\n\n04:01.563 --> 04:26.274\n我還做過行政院新聞記者對對嘛對嘛然後那我就一直負面標籤嘛比如說這個參選新北市長失利的林佳我沒有必要這樣嘛因為你現在是外交部長我們希望你外交就好嘛就像川普當選了我們希望他領導美國然後對跟台灣關係好我們要正面那不斷的去描述他的負面標籤然後強調說這個是客觀的描述我在希望你從外交的角度來評論這個事情你覺得適當嗎\n\n04:28.815 --> 04:29.035\n他是媒體啊?\n\n04:54.687 --> 05:04.866\n當時就說打造跟BBC跟NHK,那BBC是不是媒體?那個就是值得討論,因為...那個是蔡英文總統宣誓要成立的啊因為其實文化部也不一定給公視,以前也沒有\n\n05:05.560 --> 05:10.022\n所以這個是制度面的問題我認為要去理解因為媒體你做平台的話讓各種內容匯流去促進那你可以專案的跟很多的媒體合作人家媒體合作有他的立場可是這個角色的問題因為你問我做過很多工作所以我也常常換工作他是媒體啦他是類似BGNHK對媒體的定義\n\n05:27.691 --> 05:30.432\n有限、無限跟外星媒體匯流中的網路。\n\n05:45.938 --> 06:06.995\n在外交角度個人的立場、機構的立場、國家的立場現在沒有個人立場現在你們有很多外交人員在做對美關係大家都希望台美關係更進一步特別是川普上任之後他很強勢我們當然可能需要花更多心力在對美關係上面那如果我們跟他保持好關係的同時台灣的公營媒體\n\n06:08.256 --> 06:35.658\n臺灣人出的錢的媒體是這樣子不斷去描述川普的負面標籤我覺得很不作當我希望布朗你站在外交角度你去跟王岸部長講一下好不好現在大家都講全民外交啊你現在你難道希望總和外交總和外交全民一樣啦一樣的意思人人都是外交官人人都是外交官嘛人人都是外交官嘛然後現在我們動不動假設國人去美國就一直講說哎呀這川普就是一個被定刑的重刑犯啊\n\n06:36.198 --> 06:59.033\n一講這種東西有辦法做到嗎個人的言論是一個層次但是代表你的組織、機構尤其是媒體那是另外一回事對啦對但我們不希望大家這樣嘛你做總和外交你難道希望我們的國人出去都講川普壞話嗎你當然希望說大家維持好關係這是你一個期許他怎麼講你不要控制他因為他是個人可是你總不希望他這樣做吧還是你希望\n\n06:59.929 --> 07:06.725\n你不會希望嘛所以是不是可以跟外交部講一下因為他們現在民玩我覺得是民玩不靈啊他們不斷的強調自己是對的啦\n\n07:09.873 --> 07:30.952\n我覺得這是最可怕的就是說你不小心失誤怎麼樣怎麼樣你改就好了嘛你一直強調你是對的開玩笑那以後你是要不斷的強調川普是重刑犯這件事情有必要嗎有必要嗎我來瞭解一下文化部長他的心聲我們是站在外交不是說完全沒有說你做不好的地方就是希望你跟他說一下因為這是統合外交的一環\n\n07:34.455 --> 07:41.305\n要配合外交部做一些良善正善良善好運動說好話做好事存好心謝謝好謝謝委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.504,"end":2.246,"text":"請外交部長請李佳龍部長"},{"start":11.294,"end":37.999,"text":"部長好,你那外交部有在推那個全民外交嗎?總和外交現在叫總和外交那要也是要公司協力嘛結合我們台灣最大的力量去推展外交特別是政府部門大家都要做外交的幫手不是當豬隊友但最近我們在別的地方就看到我們有一個公家機關相關的部門都一直在當豬隊友就是所謂的台灣plus我不知道這個計畫你知道嗎?"},{"start":41.78,"end":52.286,"text":"幾年前當時蔡英文總統講說要打造像NHK跟BBC一樣的公共平台要讓全世界聽到台灣的故事聽到台灣的聲音花了58億4年的計畫"},{"start":55.044,"end":77.912,"text":"結果最近在川普總統當選的時候他們的記者講說看來美國人選擇了一個重刑犯那這個事情那時候引起軒然大波所以後來文化部長覺得不妥要求台灣Plus把這個新聞下架但是我在台灣Plus的很多新聞裡面我持續看到他們用"},{"start":78.832,"end":80.234,"text":"他也是一個企業家他還是一個曾經是一個脫口秀的主持人他是一個"},{"start":99.913,"end":112.274,"text":"重返白宮的一個總統候選的成功的當選他這麼多的形容詞但是非要講他是一個重刑犯你認為湯恩普拉斯這樣不斷的強調川普是一個重刑犯這件事情你覺得妥當嗎?"},{"start":114.27,"end":135.688,"text":"就從委員講的去報導的時候他在什麼脈絡下用什麼樣的一個形容方式本來就是有他的主觀心可是客觀上面當然因為他當選了就是民意的支持所以這個時候如果個人的立場跟這個機構他的角色這怎麼去一個能夠有一個權衡"},{"start":140.865,"end":143.746,"text":"臺灣Plus不是一般的民營媒體它是政府出資"},{"start":168.911,"end":186.569,"text":"做的媒體用意是要讓全世界聽到台灣的聲音結果他們現在聽到台灣的聲音是說台灣人就一直不斷地強調川普是重刑犯這個特質那你覺得適合嗎然後我舉個比較明確的例子在他們發生爭議之後我去他們的網站去看"},{"start":187.29,"end":216.73,"text":"他們是怎麼形容說川普的支持者在海湖山莊去慶祝川普的當選一樣喔描述川普的時候說川普就是一個被定罪的重刑犯人家已經當選了人家的支持者在慶祝結果你用一個這麼負面的標籤在形容川普那你現在是怎樣你在酸那些支持者喔好像意思是說你們這個支持者有問題啊人家是一個重刑犯的當選了你還在那邊慶祝你慶祝重刑犯嗎我個人站在外交的角度我覺得非常不妥當"},{"start":217.49,"end":239.87,"text":"我是覺得非常不妥當那文化部當然可以拗啊文化部他可以講說那個就客觀描述但我要強調客觀描述有非常多種部長你本人也做過很多職務嘛你做過外交部長你也做過交通部長你也選過新北市長你還做過總統府秘書長那我們特別去挑你失敗的經驗不斷的加注在你的身上你會舒服嗎你會不會覺得是偏見你會不會覺得很刻意"},{"start":241.563,"end":266.274,"text":"我還做過行政院新聞記者對對嘛對嘛然後那我就一直負面標籤嘛比如說這個參選新北市長失利的林佳我沒有必要這樣嘛因為你現在是外交部長我們希望你外交就好嘛就像川普當選了我們希望他領導美國然後對跟台灣關係好我們要正面那不斷的去描述他的負面標籤然後強調說這個是客觀的描述我在希望你從外交的角度來評論這個事情你覺得適當嗎"},{"start":268.815,"end":269.035,"text":"他是媒體啊?"},{"start":294.687,"end":304.866,"text":"當時就說打造跟BBC跟NHK,那BBC是不是媒體?那個就是值得討論,因為...那個是蔡英文總統宣誓要成立的啊因為其實文化部也不一定給公視,以前也沒有"},{"start":305.56,"end":310.022,"text":"所以這個是制度面的問題我認為要去理解因為媒體你做平台的話讓各種內容匯流去促進那你可以專案的跟很多的媒體合作人家媒體合作有他的立場可是這個角色的問題因為你問我做過很多工作所以我也常常換工作他是媒體啦他是類似BGNHK對媒體的定義"},{"start":327.691,"end":330.432,"text":"有限、無限跟外星媒體匯流中的網路。"},{"start":345.938,"end":366.995,"text":"在外交角度個人的立場、機構的立場、國家的立場現在沒有個人立場現在你們有很多外交人員在做對美關係大家都希望台美關係更進一步特別是川普上任之後他很強勢我們當然可能需要花更多心力在對美關係上面那如果我們跟他保持好關係的同時台灣的公營媒體"},{"start":368.256,"end":395.658,"text":"臺灣人出的錢的媒體是這樣子不斷去描述川普的負面標籤我覺得很不作當我希望布朗你站在外交角度你去跟王岸部長講一下好不好現在大家都講全民外交啊你現在你難道希望總和外交總和外交全民一樣啦一樣的意思人人都是外交官人人都是外交官嘛人人都是外交官嘛然後現在我們動不動假設國人去美國就一直講說哎呀這川普就是一個被定刑的重刑犯啊"},{"start":396.198,"end":419.033,"text":"一講這種東西有辦法做到嗎個人的言論是一個層次但是代表你的組織、機構尤其是媒體那是另外一回事對啦對但我們不希望大家這樣嘛你做總和外交你難道希望我們的國人出去都講川普壞話嗎你當然希望說大家維持好關係這是你一個期許他怎麼講你不要控制他因為他是個人可是你總不希望他這樣做吧還是你希望"},{"start":419.929,"end":426.725,"text":"你不會希望嘛所以是不是可以跟外交部講一下因為他們現在民玩我覺得是民玩不靈啊他們不斷的強調自己是對的啦"},{"start":429.873,"end":450.952,"text":"我覺得這是最可怕的就是說你不小心失誤怎麼樣怎麼樣你改就好了嘛你一直強調你是對的開玩笑那以後你是要不斷的強調川普是重刑犯這件事情有必要嗎有必要嗎我來瞭解一下文化部長他的心聲我們是站在外交不是說完全沒有說你做不好的地方就是希望你跟他說一下因為這是統合外交的一環"},{"start":454.455,"end":461.305,"text":"要配合外交部做一些良善正善良善好運動說好話做好事存好心謝謝好謝謝委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":818,"blocks":[["葉委員元之：（13時10分）麻煩請外交部長。"],["主席：請林佳龍部長。"],["葉委員元之：部長好。"],["林部長佳龍：委員好。"],["葉委員元之：現在外交部有在推全民外交……"],["林部長佳龍：總合外交。"],["葉委員元之：現在叫總合外交喔？"],["林部長佳龍：對。"],["葉委員元之：也是要公私協力，結合我們臺灣最大的力量去推展外交，特別是政府部門，大家都要做外交的幫手，不是當豬隊友。但是最近我們在別的地方就看到有一個公家機關相關的部門都一直在當豬隊友，就是所謂的TaiwanPlus，我不知道這個計畫你知道嗎？"],["林部長佳龍：知道。"],["葉委員元之：幾年前蔡英文總統說要打造像NHK跟BBC一樣的公共平台，要讓全世界聽到臺灣的故事、聽到臺灣的聲音，花了58億、四年的計畫，結果最近在川普總統當選的時候，他們的記者說：看來美國人選擇了一個重刑犯。這個事情那時候引起軒然大波，所以後來文化部長覺得不妥，要求TaiwanPlus把這個新聞下架，但是我在TaiwanPlus的很多新聞裡面持續看到他們用「重刑犯」來形容川普，他們的解釋是：川普本來就是一個重刑犯，這樣講有錯嗎？國際上也都用「重刑犯」來形容川普啊！但問題是川普也有很多其他形容詞，他除了是重刑犯、他也是一個企業家，他還曾經是一個脫口秀主持人，他是一個重返白宮成功的總統當選人，他有這麼多的形容詞，但是非要講他是一個重刑犯，你認為TaiwanPlus這樣不斷的強調川普是一個重刑犯的這件事情妥當嗎？"],["林部長佳龍：除了委員講的，報導的時候他是在什麼脈絡下、用什麼樣的形容方式本來就是有他的主觀性；可是客觀上面因為他當選了，其實是民意的支持。"],["葉委員元之：對。"],["林部長佳龍：所以這個時候如果個人的立場跟這個機構的角色要怎麼能夠有一個權衡，比較客觀能夠……"],["葉委員元之：客觀有很多種描述嘛！"],["林部長佳龍：中性的、然後能呈現這些資訊，我們當然也要尊重TaiwanPlus也好、任何的媒體新聞自由的範圍，在這個之上能夠怎麼樣去做最妥適的報導。"],["葉委員元之：我是希望部長是以外交角度來談這個事情，因為第一個，TaiwanPlus不是一般的民營媒體，它是政府出資做的媒體，用意是要讓全世界聽到臺灣的聲音，結果他們現在聽到臺灣的聲音是臺灣人一直不斷的強調川普是重刑犯這個特質，你覺得適合嗎？我舉個比較明確的例子，在他們發生爭議之後我去他們的網站看，他們是怎麼形容川普的支持者在海湖山莊慶祝川普的當選？一樣喔，描述川普的時候說川普就是一個被定罪的重刑犯。人家已經當選了，人家的支持者在慶祝，結果你用一個這麼負面的標籤在形容川普，你現在是怎樣？你在酸那些支持者喔？好像意思是說你們這些支持者有問題啊，人家是一個重刑犯耶，當選了你還在那邊慶祝，你慶祝重刑犯嗎？我個人站在外交的角度覺得非常不妥當，我是覺得非常不妥當！文化部當然可以拗啊，文化部可以講那個就是客觀描述，但我要強調客觀描述有非常多種，部長您本人也做過很多職務，你做過外交部長、你也做過交通部長、你也選過新北市長、你還做過總統府秘書長，我們特別去挑你失敗的經驗不斷加注在你的身上，你會舒服嗎？你會不會覺得是偏見？你會不會覺得很刻意？"],["林部長佳龍：委員，我還做過行政院新聞局長。"],["葉委員元之：對嘛，然後我就一直負面標籤，比如說：參選新北市長失利的林佳龍。我沒有必要這樣嘛！因為你現在是外交部長，我們希望說你外交就好嘛！就像川普當選，我們希望他領導美國，然後跟臺灣關係好，我們要正面；而卻不斷的去描述他的負面標籤，然後強調說這個是客觀的描述。我就希望你從外交的角度來評論這個事情，你覺得適當嗎？"],["林部長佳龍：個人跟機構、跟國家是不一樣，它有那個角色，就是今天TaiwanPlus或任何媒體也好，關於這個新聞的報導，個人的政治立場是一回事，我覺得它這個角色大家都會有個期待嘛。另外就是比較根本的問題，我跟委員說，到底TaiwanPlus是不是媒體？它是平台還是內容？"],["葉委員元之：它是媒體啊！當時就說打造跟BBC跟NHK一樣，那BBC是不是媒體？"],["林部長佳龍：那個就是值得討論，因為如果用……"],["葉委員元之：BBC是不是媒體？是啊，那個是蔡英文總統宣誓要成立的。"],["林部長佳龍：因為其實文化部也不一定給公視，以前也沒有，所以這個是制度面的問題，反而我認為要去理解。"],["葉委員元之：它是媒體啦，它也有拿我們的錢啦！"],["林部長佳龍：因為媒體方面，你做平台的話，讓各種內容匯流去促進，然後你可以專案跟很多的媒體合作，人家媒體合作有他的立場，可是這個角色的問題，因為你問我做過很多工作，所以我也常常換工作……"],["葉委員元之：它是媒體啦，它是類似BBC、NHK這樣的媒體。"],["林部長佳龍：現在對媒體的定義，有線、無線跟新媒體匯流之後的網路新媒體、社群媒體……"],["葉委員元之：部長，你希望當文化部長是不是？你是不是想當文化部長？在跟我討論這個事情！"],["林部長佳龍：沒有啦，我是說因為……"],["葉委員元之：你是外交部長，雖然你可能無法忘情過去的職務……"],["林部長佳龍：不是啦，是討論一下……"],["葉委員元之：現在我跟你講，因為我們是站在外交角度，我們認為他做了豬隊友，如果部長你……"],["林部長佳龍：我剛才講的是站在外交角度，個人的立場、機構的立場跟國家的立場，這不太一樣。"],["葉委員元之：沒有、沒有，現在沒有個人立場，現在你們有很多外交人員在做對美關係，大家都希望臺美關係更進一步，特別是川普上任之後他很強勢啊，我們當然可能需要花更多心力在對美關係上面，如果我們跟他保持好關係的同時，臺灣的公營媒體、臺灣人出的錢的媒體是這樣子不斷去描述川普的負面標籤，我覺得很不妥當。"],["林部長佳龍：其實……"],["葉委員元之：我希望部長你站在外交角度去跟文化部長講一下，現在大家都講全民外交啊，現在你難道希望……"],["林部長佳龍：總合外交。"],["葉委員元之：總合外交、全民外交一樣的意思啦！"],["林部長佳龍：人人都是外交官、部部都是外交部。"],["葉委員元之：人人都是外交官嘛，然後現在我們動不動、假設國人去美國就一直說川普就是一個被定刑的重刑犯，一直講這種東西有辦法做到嗎？"],["林部長佳龍：個人的言論是一個層次，但是代表你的組織、機構、尤其是媒體，那是另外一回事。"],["葉委員元之：對啦，但我們不希望大家這樣嘛，你說總合外交，你難道希望我們的國人出去都講川普壞話嗎？你當然希望大家維持好關係，這是你的期許，他怎麼講你不要控制他，因為他是個人，可是你總不希望他這樣做吧？還是你希望？你不會希望嘛！所以是不是可以跟文化部講一下，因為他們現在我覺得是冥頑不靈，他們不斷的強調自己是對的，我覺得這是最可怕的，你不小心失誤你改就好了嘛，但你一直強調你是對的。開玩笑！那以後你是要不斷的強調川普是重刑犯這件事情喔？有必要嗎？有必要嗎？"],["林部長佳龍：我再來了解一下文化部長他的心聲跟他的主導的狀況。"],["葉委員元之：你跟他講一下，好不好？我們是站在外交的角度，完全沒有說你做不好的地方，就是希望你跟他說一下。"],["林部長佳龍：好。"],["葉委員元之：因為這是總合外交的一環，要配合外交部做一些良善、正能量、三好運動，說好話、做好事、存好心。謝謝。"],["林部長佳龍：好，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝葉元之委員，部長請回。","洪孟楷委員、洪孟楷委員、洪孟楷委員不在場。","鍾佳濱委員、鍾佳濱委員、鍾佳濱委員不在場。","王鴻薇委員、王鴻薇委員、王鴻薇委員不在場。","接下來我們請沈伯洋委員上台質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":150,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-35-19","speakers":["林憶君","羅美玲","陳冠廷","王定宇","林楚茵","馬文君","徐巧芯","賴士葆","黃國昌","楊瓊瓔","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","羅廷瑋","羅智強","邱志偉","葉元之","沈伯洋","黃仁","王鴻薇"],"page_start":97,"meetingDate":["2024-11-28"],"gazette_id":"11310701","agenda_lcidc_ids":["11310701_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期外交及國防委員會第19次全體委員會議（含秘密會議）紀錄","content":"一、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於外交部主管收支公開及機密部分（僅詢答）；二、繼續\n處理院會交付外交部113年度中央政府總預算決議（十八）「對外之捐助」預算凍結100萬元案","agenda_id":"11310701_00002"}}}