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00:00:35,435\n謝謝主席,有請施部長。部長,我想年金改革是一個我們必須進行而且無可迴避的國家政策。所以民進黨政府很負責任我們提出的年金改革的一個版本。我相信我們政府面也很多,我們從事軍公教退休的很多長輩,他們都會一直覺得說,過去因為我們這個制度設計的問題,\n\n2\n00:00:36,656 --> 00:01:05,323\n撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案案案件,則稱併休醫療捏料比上班更多的畸形現象。所以他們這一次聽到國民黨的立委提出這樣的一個版本,也感覺不可思議,因為他們覺得說我們現在現行的年金改革制度不只是保障他們一個替代率的一個很好的一個政策,而且是確保未來我們這個年金改革這個制度實行之後我們的退伏基金不會因為這個停滯改革而破綻,所以\n\n3\n00:01:06,323 --> 00:01:07,205\n三）委員張智倫等16人擬具\n\n4\n00:01:22,467 --> 00:01:50,375\n財務很大一個問題所以在推動年金改革然後至少讓他可以延後一個世代才會用盡那在這個過程裡面大家一起來做努力我覺得這樣已經有了成果就應該繼續來把它執行我想我們過去很負責任我們經過很嚴謹的一個數據分析跟充分的一個政策討論所以我們提出了這樣一個改革的方案那有效的延長我們公務人員退休撫卹基金的一個運作一個年限\n\n5\n00:01:51,135 --> 00:01:54,237\n三）委員張智倫等19人擬具«公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案》案。\n\n6\n00:02:12,529 --> 00:02:12,849\n三）委員張智倫等19人擬具\n\n7\n00:02:28,143 --> 00:02:28,943\n撫卹法第16條條文修正草案．一．一）委員\n\n8\n00:02:52,590 --> 00:03:19,173\n我想這也是我們為什麼還是從部裡面的專業分析的報告認為說年金改革的步調應該按照現在的法律制度持續來做進行是所以我們期待年金改革是一個持續的一個過程不是只有解決現在的財政問題更應該建立一個長期穩定的一個機制那未來我們應該是要定期評估這樣一個改革的效益而且根據這個數據進行政策微調\n\n9\n00:03:20,794 --> 00:03:21,415\n三）委員張智倫等16人擬具\n\n10\n00:03:38,138 --> 00:03:54,114\n對所以本席還是要強烈呼籲我們年金改革是保障國家財政穩健跟世代公平的一個基石我們必須堅持推進拒絕倒退第二個國民黨應該提出這樣一個不負責任的反政治的一個操作\n\n11\n00:03:54,795 --> 00:04:18,775\n第三、針對未來的一個年改的修法跟政策的調整我們必須要有專業的數據跟依據來做一個基礎確保我們改革的公平跟永續性我想這也是關鍵在我們全國國民福祉的一個重要的國家的一個行動那我想這部分我們應該是要請這個我們不管是行政院、立法院我們要好好的來處理這件事情好,部長謝謝好,謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n7112\t35435\t謝謝主席,有請施部長。部長,我想年金改革是一個我們必須進行而且無可迴避的國家政策。所以民進黨政府很負責任我們提出的年金改革的一個版本。我相信我們政府面也很多,我們從事軍公教退休的很多長輩,他們都會一直覺得說,過去因為我們這個制度設計的問題,\n36656\t65323\t撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案案 案件,則稱併休醫療捏料比上班更多的畸形現象。所以他們這一次聽到國民黨的立委提出這樣的一個版本,也感覺不可思議,因為他們覺得說我們現在現行的年金改革制度不只是保障他們一個替代率的一個很好的一個政策,而且是確保未來我們這個年金改革這個制度實行之後我們的退伏基金不會因為這個停滯改革而破綻,所以\n66323\t67205\t三）委員張智倫等16人擬具\n82467\t110375\t財務很大一個問題所以在推動年金改革然後至少讓他可以延後一個世代才會用盡那在這個過程裡面大家一起來做努力我覺得這樣已經有了成果就應該繼續來把它執行我想我們過去很負責任我們經過很嚴謹的一個數據分析跟充分的一個政策討論所以我們提出了這樣一個改革的方案那有效的延長我們公務人員退休撫卹基金的一個運作一個年限\n111135\t114237\t三）委員張智倫等19人擬具 «公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案》案。\n132529\t132849\t三）委員張智倫等19人擬具\n148143\t148943\t撫卹法第16條條文修正草案．一．一）委員\n172590\t199173\t我想這也是我們為什麼還是從部裡面的專業分析的報告認為說年金改革的步調應該按照現在的法律制度持續來做進行是所以我們期待年金改革是一個持續的一個過程不是只有解決現在的財政問題更應該建立一個長期穩定的一個機制那未來我們應該是要定期評估這樣一個改革的效益而且根據這個數據進行政策微調\n200794\t201415\t三）委員張智倫等16人擬具\n218138\t234114\t對所以本席還是要強烈呼籲我們年金改革是保障國家財政穩健跟世代公平的一個基石我們必須堅持推進拒絕倒退第二個國民黨應該提出這樣一個不負責任的反政治的一個操作\n234795\t258775\t第三、針對未來的一個年改的修法跟政策的調整我們必須要有專業的數據跟依據來做一個基礎確保我們改革的公平跟永續性我想這也是關鍵在我們全國國民福祉的一個重要的國家的一個行動那我想這部分我們應該是要請這個我們不管是行政院、立法院我們要好好的來處理這件事情好,部長謝謝好,謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席,有請施部長。部長,我想年金改革是一個我們必須進行而且無可迴避的國家政策。所以民進黨政府很負責任我們提出的年金改革的一個版本。我相信我們政府面也很多,我們從事軍公教退休的很多長輩,他們都會一直覺得說,過去因為我們這個制度設計的問題,\n撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案案 案件,則稱併休醫療捏料比上班更多的畸形現象。所以他們這一次聽到國民黨的立委提出這樣的一個版本,也感覺不可思議,因為他們覺得說我們現在現行的年金改革制度不只是保障他們一個替代率的一個很好的一個政策,而且是確保未來我們這個年金改革這個制度實行之後我們的退伏基金不會因為這個停滯改革而破綻,所以\n三）委員張智倫等16人擬具\n財務很大一個問題所以在推動年金改革然後至少讓他可以延後一個世代才會用盡那在這個過程裡面大家一起來做努力我覺得這樣已經有了成果就應該繼續來把它執行我想我們過去很負責任我們經過很嚴謹的一個數據分析跟充分的一個政策討論所以我們提出了這樣一個改革的方案那有效的延長我們公務人員退休撫卹基金的一個運作一個年限\n三）委員張智倫等19人擬具 «公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案》案。\n三）委員張智倫等19人擬具\n撫卹法第16條條文修正草案．一．一）委員\n我想這也是我們為什麼還是從部裡面的專業分析的報告認為說年金改革的步調應該按照現在的法律制度持續來做進行是所以我們期待年金改革是一個持續的一個過程不是只有解決現在的財政問題更應該建立一個長期穩定的一個機制那未來我們應該是要定期評估這樣一個改革的效益而且根據這個數據進行政策微調\n三）委員張智倫等16人擬具\n對所以本席還是要強烈呼籲我們年金改革是保障國家財政穩健跟世代公平的一個基石我們必須堅持推進拒絕倒退第二個國民黨應該提出這樣一個不負責任的反政治的一個操作\n第三、針對未來的一個年改的修法跟政策的調整我們必須要有專業的數據跟依據來做一個基礎確保我們改革的公平跟永續性我想這也是關鍵在我們全國國民福祉的一個重要的國家的一個行動那我想這部分我們應該是要請這個我們不管是行政院、立法院我們要好好的來處理這件事情好,部長謝謝好,謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:07.112 --> 00:35.435\n謝謝主席,有請施部長。部長,我想年金改革是一個我們必須進行而且無可迴避的國家政策。所以民進黨政府很負責任我們提出的年金改革的一個版本。我相信我們政府面也很多,我們從事軍公教退休的很多長輩,他們都會一直覺得說,過去因為我們這個制度設計的問題,\n\n00:36.656 --> 01:05.323\n撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案案案件,則稱併休醫療捏料比上班更多的畸形現象。所以他們這一次聽到國民黨的立委提出這樣的一個版本,也感覺不可思議,因為他們覺得說我們現在現行的年金改革制度不只是保障他們一個替代率的一個很好的一個政策,而且是確保未來我們這個年金改革這個制度實行之後我們的退伏基金不會因為這個停滯改革而破綻,所以\n\n01:06.323 --> 01:07.205\n三）委員張智倫等16人擬具\n\n01:22.467 --> 01:50.375\n財務很大一個問題所以在推動年金改革然後至少讓他可以延後一個世代才會用盡那在這個過程裡面大家一起來做努力我覺得這樣已經有了成果就應該繼續來把它執行我想我們過去很負責任我們經過很嚴謹的一個數據分析跟充分的一個政策討論所以我們提出了這樣一個改革的方案那有效的延長我們公務人員退休撫卹基金的一個運作一個年限\n\n01:51.135 --> 01:54.237\n三）委員張智倫等19人擬具«公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案》案。\n\n02:12.529 --> 02:12.849\n三）委員張智倫等19人擬具\n\n02:28.143 --> 02:28.943\n撫卹法第16條條文修正草案．一．一）委員\n\n02:52.590 --> 03:19.173\n我想這也是我們為什麼還是從部裡面的專業分析的報告認為說年金改革的步調應該按照現在的法律制度持續來做進行是所以我們期待年金改革是一個持續的一個過程不是只有解決現在的財政問題更應該建立一個長期穩定的一個機制那未來我們應該是要定期評估這樣一個改革的效益而且根據這個數據進行政策微調\n\n03:20.794 --> 03:21.415\n三）委員張智倫等16人擬具\n\n03:38.138 --> 03:54.114\n對所以本席還是要強烈呼籲我們年金改革是保障國家財政穩健跟世代公平的一個基石我們必須堅持推進拒絕倒退第二個國民黨應該提出這樣一個不負責任的反政治的一個操作\n\n03:54.795 --> 04:18.775\n第三、針對未來的一個年改的修法跟政策的調整我們必須要有專業的數據跟依據來做一個基礎確保我們改革的公平跟永續性我想這也是關鍵在我們全國國民福祉的一個重要的國家的一個行動那我想這部分我們應該是要請這個我們不管是行政院、立法院我們要好好的來處理這件事情好,部長謝謝好,謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":7.112,"end":35.435,"text":"謝謝主席,有請施部長。部長,我想年金改革是一個我們必須進行而且無可迴避的國家政策。所以民進黨政府很負責任我們提出的年金改革的一個版本。我相信我們政府面也很多,我們從事軍公教退休的很多長輩,他們都會一直覺得說,過去因為我們這個制度設計的問題,"},{"start":36.656,"end":65.323,"text":"撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案案 案件,則稱併休醫療捏料比上班更多的畸形現象。所以他們這一次聽到國民黨的立委提出這樣的一個版本,也感覺不可思議,因為他們覺得說我們現在現行的年金改革制度不只是保障他們一個替代率的一個很好的一個政策,而且是確保未來我們這個年金改革這個制度實行之後我們的退伏基金不會因為這個停滯改革而破綻,所以"},{"start":66.323,"end":67.205,"text":"三）委員張智倫等16人擬具"},{"start":82.467,"end":110.375,"text":"財務很大一個問題所以在推動年金改革然後至少讓他可以延後一個世代才會用盡那在這個過程裡面大家一起來做努力我覺得這樣已經有了成果就應該繼續來把它執行我想我們過去很負責任我們經過很嚴謹的一個數據分析跟充分的一個政策討論所以我們提出了這樣一個改革的方案那有效的延長我們公務人員退休撫卹基金的一個運作一個年限"},{"start":111.135,"end":114.237,"text":"三）委員張智倫等19人擬具 «公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案》案。"},{"start":132.529,"end":132.849,"text":"三）委員張智倫等19人擬具"},{"start":148.143,"end":148.943,"text":"撫卹法第16條條文修正草案．一．一）委員"},{"start":172.59,"end":199.173,"text":"我想這也是我們為什麼還是從部裡面的專業分析的報告認為說年金改革的步調應該按照現在的法律制度持續來做進行是所以我們期待年金改革是一個持續的一個過程不是只有解決現在的財政問題更應該建立一個長期穩定的一個機制那未來我們應該是要定期評估這樣一個改革的效益而且根據這個數據進行政策微調"},{"start":200.794,"end":201.415,"text":"三）委員張智倫等16人擬具"},{"start":218.138,"end":234.114,"text":"對所以本席還是要強烈呼籲我們年金改革是保障國家財政穩健跟世代公平的一個基石我們必須堅持推進拒絕倒退第二個國民黨應該提出這樣一個不負責任的反政治的一個操作"},{"start":234.795,"end":258.775,"text":"第三、針對未來的一個年改的修法跟政策的調整我們必須要有專業的數據跟依據來做一個基礎確保我們改革的公平跟永續性我想這也是關鍵在我們全國國民福祉的一個重要的國家的一個行動那我想這部分我們應該是要請這個我們不管是行政院、立法院我們要好好的來處理這件事情好,部長謝謝好,謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":1326,"blocks":[["徐委員富癸：（16時1分）謝謝主席，有請施部長。"],["主席：麻煩部長。"],["施部長能傑：委員好。"],["徐委員富癸：部長，辛苦了。"],["施部長能傑：你好。"],["徐委員富癸：部長，我想年金改革是我們必須進行、而且無可迴避的國家政策，所以民進黨政府很負責任，我們提出了年金改革的版本。我們身邊也有很多軍公教退休長輩，他們一直覺得過去因為制度設計的問題，造成退休以後領得比上班還多這個畸形現象，所以他們這一次聽到國民黨立委提出這樣的版本，也覺得不可思議，因為他們覺得現行年金改革制度不只是能保障他們所得替代率很好的政策，而且是為了確保年金改革這個制度實行之後，退撫基金不會因為停止改革而破產，所以他們都希望民進黨所有立委一定要站在這個立場，堅持世代正義。不知道部長對此看法如何？"],["施部長能傑：我也贊成這種看法，因為我們好不容易做到。當初基金的財務面臨很大的問題，所以推動年金改革，至少讓它可以延後一個世代才會用罄。在這個過程裡，大家一起努力，我覺得既然已經有了成果，就應該繼續執行。"],["徐委員富癸：我想我們過去很負責任，經過很嚴謹的數據分析跟充分的政策討論，提出這樣的改革方案，有效地延長公務人員退休撫卹基金的運作年限，也因為有樓地板的設計、建立給付的調整機制，確保了公務退休給付的適足性，但很遺憾，國民黨的委員提出這樣的版本。我想，任何試圖逆轉年金改革的行為都是不負責任的政治操作啦！對於這樣的行為，國民黨應該正視一下他們如何逼迫下一代。如果停止這樣的年金改革政策、一旦又走回頭路的話，未來我們的下一代就必須面臨龐大的財政壓力，而且也會讓社會每一個世代都承受不一樣、不公平的對待啦！尤其年金改革不是一個討好少數人的政策，國民黨這種做法是將軍公教跟非軍公教做出很明顯的對比，我想這樣不甚公平啦！部長有什麼看法？"],["施部長能傑：這也是為什麼我們根據部裡面的專業分析報告，還是認為年金改革的步調應該按照現在的法律制度持續進行。"],["徐委員富癸：是，所以我們期待年金改革是持續的過程，不是只解決現在的財政問題，更應該建立一個長期穩定的機制，未來應該定期評估這樣改革的效益，而且根據數據進行政策微調。部長是否贊成這樣的做法？"],["施部長能傑：我也很關心每年的變化，所以這次我們部裡面第一次把相關數據非常負責任地給國人知道，我想這是提供公共討論的一個很好的基礎。"],["徐委員富癸：對。所以本席還是要強烈呼籲，年金改革是保障國家財政穩健跟世代公平的基石，我們必須堅持推進、拒絕倒退。第二，國民黨應該停止這樣不負責任、反政治的操作。第三，針對未來的年改修法跟政策調整，必須有專業的數據跟依據作為基礎，確保改革的公平跟永續性。我想這也是關係到全國國民福祉、重要的國家行動，對於這部分，不管是行政院或立法院，都要好好處理這件事情啦！好，部長，謝謝。"],["施部長能傑：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝。","下一位請蔡其昌委員發言。蔡其昌委員、蔡其昌委員。","下一位請賴惠員委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":174,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-36-18","speakers":["吳宗憲","賴士葆","翁曉玲","張嘉郡","羅智強","黃建賓","林思銘","張智倫","黃健豪","許宇甄","鍾佳濱","吳思瑤","陳俊宇","莊瑞雄","王義川","李彥秀","吳沛憶","沈伯洋","林宜瑾","陳俊宇","黃國昌","楊瓊瓔","洪孟楷","林德福","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","張啓楷","李坤城","林楚茵","張雅琳","黃秀芳","林淑芬","陳秀寳","郭昱晴","陳素月","徐富癸","賴惠員","吳秉叡","許智傑","陳培瑜","郭國文"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-12-05"],"gazette_id":"1140301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1140301_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期司法及法制委員會第18次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、併案審查(一)委員賴士葆等31人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第三十七條條文修正草案」\n案、(二)委員賴士葆等19人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案」案、(三)\n委員張智倫等16人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第三十七條條文修正草案」案、(四)委員張嘉\n郡等23人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第三十七條條文修正草案」案、(五)委員賴士葆等26人\n擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第三十八條條文修正草案」案、(六)委員徐欣瑩等20人擬具「公\n務人員退休資遣撫卹法第三十七條、第三十八條及第六十七條條文修正草案」案、(七)委員邱鎮\n軍等25 人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第三十七條條文修正草案」案、( 八) 國民黨黨團擬具\n「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第三十七條條文修正草案」案、(九)委員林思銘等26人擬具「公務人\n員退休資遣撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案」案、(十)委員陳超明等19人擬具「公務人員退休資\n遣撫卹法第三十七條條文修正草案」案、(十一)委員許宇甄等20人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹\n法第三十七條及第六十七條條文修正草案」案、(十二)委員黃健豪等18人擬具「公務人員退休資\n遣撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案」案、(十三)委員張智倫等19人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹\n法第三條、第八條及第三十七條條文修正草案」案、(十四)委員馬文君等20人擬具「公務人員退\n休資遣撫卹法第三十七條條文修正草案」案、(十五)委員傅崐萁等21人擬具「公務人員退休資遣\n撫卹法第六十七條條文修正草案」案、(十六)委員王鴻薇等25人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法\n第三十七條及第六十七條條文修正草案」案、(十七)委員黃建賓等16人擬具「公務人員退休資遣\n撫卹法第三十七條條文修正草案」案、(十八)委員陳玉珍等16人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法\n第三十七條條文修正草案」案、(十九)委員王鴻薇等19人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第三十\n八條條文修正草案」案、(二十)委員羅智強等16人擬具「公務人員退休資遣撫卹法第三十七條條\n文修正草案」案；二、併案審查(一)委員李彥秀等18人擬具「公務人員任用法第三十六條之一條\n文修正草案」案、(二)委員翁曉玲等22人擬具「公務人員任用法第二十八條之一條文修正草案」\n案","agenda_id":"1140301_00001"}}}