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\"start\": 444.709, \"end\": 444.809, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"度\", \"start\": 444.809, \"end\": 444.869, \"score\": 0.663}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 444.869, \"end\": 445.049, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"央\", \"start\": 445.049, \"end\": 445.249, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 445.249, \"end\": 445.369, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"府\", \"start\": 445.369, \"end\": 445.449, \"score\": 0.717}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"預\"}, {\"word\": \"算\", \"start\": 445.449, \"end\": 445.55, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 445.55, \"end\": 445.57, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"附\", \"start\": 445.57, \"end\": 445.59, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"屬\"}, {\"word\": \"單\"}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 445.59, \"end\": 445.63, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"預\"}, {\"word\": \"算\", \"start\": 445.63, \"end\": 445.65, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"。\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:03,508 --> 00:00:05,990\n主席台鐵董事長\n\n2\n00:00:16,264 --> 00:00:34,777\n董事長我每次看到你都想要跟你討論臺鐵的文資保存我們來看頭影片上個月11月9號臺鐵發了一個新聞稿說臺鐵為了文資編了非常多的預算還成立了鐵路文化保存及活用小組還說已經開了11次的會議所以看起來如果從會議上來看跟相關預算\n\n3\n00:00:35,638 --> 00:00:41,241\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n4\n00:00:56,670 --> 00:00:57,450\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n5\n00:01:15,356 --> 00:01:15,956\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n6\n00:01:36,628 --> 00:01:38,770\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n7\n00:01:54,142 --> 00:01:56,263\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n8\n00:02:11,332 --> 00:02:37,444\n前一頁前一頁前一頁有一頁不見了有一張投影片我先說你們台鐵我們後來跟你們索資有一台車叫S201那這是在你們清單上可是在201呢看起來現在是被放在好像是基隆吧那個風吹日曬他就放在外面那我們之前還去復剛我們辦了一個自己的考察那感謝台鐵當時有接待我們看了這個機車我們來看一下這個機車現在的狀況我們也很擔心\n\n9\n00:02:40,606 --> 00:02:42,948\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n10\n00:03:07,984 --> 00:03:17,227\n非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務\n\n11\n00:03:36,733 --> 00:03:38,394\n臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?\n\n12\n00:03:58,643 --> 00:04:00,925\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n13\n00:04:19,045 --> 00:04:23,108\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n14\n00:04:44,821 --> 00:04:49,525\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n15\n00:05:11,883 --> 00:05:22,116\n你預計多久提出?我的記憶是應該是在後年可以提出後年?2026年?15年對現在已經在進行\n\n16\n00:05:27,863 --> 00:05:44,899\n我們辦公室會在持續追蹤臺鐵關於這些文資文物的保存我認為現在沒有開放多元透明的狀況還有我也認為臺鐵應該要積極的定期對外報告這件事情我認為更多的公民參與這件事情其實絕對是有助於臺鐵把相關文資做好\n\n17\n00:05:45,519 --> 00:06:02,119\n請不要把這些民間專業的聲音排斥在外我覺得這個非常非常可惜不要等到每次新聞事件爆發出來之後我們才會回頭去想要去協助那個個案好謝謝董事長最後一題主席不好意思我想要講一下我上次問了關於這個台鐵安全的事情那聽說你們就召開了相關的會議\n\n18\n00:06:04,882 --> 00:06:26,710\n聽說在相關會議上大家沒有共識所以說這件事情就不要做就繼續放著我不知道部長知不知道這件事情但是我想董事長你應該要知道這件事情我想要知道到底你們目前對於這個部分你們的想法跟規劃到底是什麼這件事指那個我們在駕駛台上的這個我們現在還在跟我們工會還有我們同仁溝通\n\n19\n00:06:32,932 --> 00:06:48,647\n那民眾乘坐車子的安全你們怎麼看這件事情?如果最後只是因為工會內部沒有共識可是我們沒有辦法導入更好的更安全的機制來保障民眾的安全我會認為這件事情不能用工會沒有共識來對人民做交代\n\n20\n00:06:49,628 --> 00:06:50,409\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n21\n00:07:19,828 --> 00:07:25,650\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n3508\t5990\t主席台鐵董事長\n16264\t34777\t董事長我每次看到你都想要跟你討論臺鐵的文資保存我們來看頭影片上個月11月9號臺鐵發了一個新聞稿說臺鐵為了文資編了非常多的預算還成立了鐵路文化保存及活用小組還說已經開了11次的會議所以看起來如果從會議上來看跟相關預算\n35638\t41241\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n56670\t57450\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n75356\t75956\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n96628\t98770\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n114142\t116263\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n131332\t157444\t前一頁前一頁前一頁有一頁不見了有一張投影片我先說你們台鐵我們後來跟你們索資有一台車叫S201那這是在你們清單上可是在201呢看起來現在是被放在好像是基隆吧那個風吹日曬他就放在外面那我們之前還去復剛我們辦了一個自己的考察那感謝台鐵當時有接待我們看了這個機車我們來看一下這個機車現在的狀況我們也很擔心\n160606\t162948\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n187984\t197227\t非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務\n216733\t218394\t臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?\n238643\t240925\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n259045\t263108\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n284821\t289525\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n311883\t322116\t你預計多久提出?我的記憶是應該是在後年可以提出後年?2026年?15年對現在已經在進行\n327863\t344899\t我們辦公室會在持續追蹤臺鐵關於這些文資文物的保存我認為現在沒有開放多元透明的狀況還有我也認為臺鐵應該要積極的定期對外報告這件事情我認為更多的公民參與這件事情其實絕對是有助於臺鐵把相關文資做好\n345519\t362119\t請不要把這些民間專業的聲音排斥在外我覺得這個非常非常可惜不要等到每次新聞事件爆發出來之後我們才會回頭去想要去協助那個個案好謝謝董事長最後一題主席不好意思我想要講一下我上次問了關於這個台鐵安全的事情那聽說你們就召開了相關的會議\n364882\t386710\t聽說在相關會議上大家沒有共識所以說這件事情就不要做就繼續放著我不知道部長知不知道這件事情但是我想董事長你應該要知道這件事情我想要知道到底你們目前對於這個部分你們的想法跟規劃到底是什麼這件事指那個我們在駕駛台上的這個我們現在還在跟我們工會還有我們同仁溝通\n392932\t408647\t那民眾乘坐車子的安全你們怎麼看這件事情?如果最後只是因為工會內部沒有共識可是我們沒有辦法導入更好的更安全的機制來保障民眾的安全我會認為這件事情不能用工會沒有共識來對人民做交代\n409628\t410409\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n439828\t445650\t三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。\n","txt":"主席台鐵董事長\n董事長我每次看到你都想要跟你討論臺鐵的文資保存我們來看頭影片上個月11月9號臺鐵發了一個新聞稿說臺鐵為了文資編了非常多的預算還成立了鐵路文化保存及活用小組還說已經開了11次的會議所以看起來如果從會議上來看跟相關預算\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n前一頁前一頁前一頁有一頁不見了有一張投影片我先說你們台鐵我們後來跟你們索資有一台車叫S201那這是在你們清單上可是在201呢看起來現在是被放在好像是基隆吧那個風吹日曬他就放在外面那我們之前還去復剛我們辦了一個自己的考察那感謝台鐵當時有接待我們看了這個機車我們來看一下這個機車現在的狀況我們也很擔心\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務\n臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n你預計多久提出?我的記憶是應該是在後年可以提出後年?2026年?15年對現在已經在進行\n我們辦公室會在持續追蹤臺鐵關於這些文資文物的保存我認為現在沒有開放多元透明的狀況還有我也認為臺鐵應該要積極的定期對外報告這件事情我認為更多的公民參與這件事情其實絕對是有助於臺鐵把相關文資做好\n請不要把這些民間專業的聲音排斥在外我覺得這個非常非常可惜不要等到每次新聞事件爆發出來之後我們才會回頭去想要去協助那個個案好謝謝董事長最後一題主席不好意思我想要講一下我上次問了關於這個台鐵安全的事情那聽說你們就召開了相關的會議\n聽說在相關會議上大家沒有共識所以說這件事情就不要做就繼續放著我不知道部長知不知道這件事情但是我想董事長你應該要知道這件事情我想要知道到底你們目前對於這個部分你們的想法跟規劃到底是什麼這件事指那個我們在駕駛台上的這個我們現在還在跟我們工會還有我們同仁溝通\n那民眾乘坐車子的安全你們怎麼看這件事情?如果最後只是因為工會內部沒有共識可是我們沒有辦法導入更好的更安全的機制來保障民眾的安全我會認為這件事情不能用工會沒有共識來對人民做交代\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:03.508 --> 00:05.990\n主席台鐵董事長\n\n00:16.264 --> 00:34.777\n董事長我每次看到你都想要跟你討論臺鐵的文資保存我們來看頭影片上個月11月9號臺鐵發了一個新聞稿說臺鐵為了文資編了非常多的預算還成立了鐵路文化保存及活用小組還說已經開了11次的會議所以看起來如果從會議上來看跟相關預算\n\n00:35.638 --> 00:41.241\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n00:56.670 --> 00:57.450\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n01:15.356 --> 01:15.956\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n01:36.628 --> 01:38.770\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n01:54.142 --> 01:56.263\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n02:11.332 --> 02:37.444\n前一頁前一頁前一頁有一頁不見了有一張投影片我先說你們台鐵我們後來跟你們索資有一台車叫S201那這是在你們清單上可是在201呢看起來現在是被放在好像是基隆吧那個風吹日曬他就放在外面那我們之前還去復剛我們辦了一個自己的考察那感謝台鐵當時有接待我們看了這個機車我們來看一下這個機車現在的狀況我們也很擔心\n\n02:40.606 --> 02:42.948\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n03:07.984 --> 03:17.227\n非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務\n\n03:36.733 --> 03:38.394\n臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?\n\n03:58.643 --> 04:00.925\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n04:19.045 --> 04:23.108\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n04:44.821 --> 04:49.525\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n05:11.883 --> 05:22.116\n你預計多久提出?我的記憶是應該是在後年可以提出後年?2026年?15年對現在已經在進行\n\n05:27.863 --> 05:44.899\n我們辦公室會在持續追蹤臺鐵關於這些文資文物的保存我認為現在沒有開放多元透明的狀況還有我也認為臺鐵應該要積極的定期對外報告這件事情我認為更多的公民參與這件事情其實絕對是有助於臺鐵把相關文資做好\n\n05:45.519 --> 06:02.119\n請不要把這些民間專業的聲音排斥在外我覺得這個非常非常可惜不要等到每次新聞事件爆發出來之後我們才會回頭去想要去協助那個個案好謝謝董事長最後一題主席不好意思我想要講一下我上次問了關於這個台鐵安全的事情那聽說你們就召開了相關的會議\n\n06:04.882 --> 06:26.710\n聽說在相關會議上大家沒有共識所以說這件事情就不要做就繼續放著我不知道部長知不知道這件事情但是我想董事長你應該要知道這件事情我想要知道到底你們目前對於這個部分你們的想法跟規劃到底是什麼這件事指那個我們在駕駛台上的這個我們現在還在跟我們工會還有我們同仁溝通\n\n06:32.932 --> 06:48.647\n那民眾乘坐車子的安全你們怎麼看這件事情?如果最後只是因為工會內部沒有共識可是我們沒有辦法導入更好的更安全的機制來保障民眾的安全我會認為這件事情不能用工會沒有共識來對人民做交代\n\n06:49.628 --> 06:50.409\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算\n\n07:19.828 --> 07:25.650\n三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。\n\n","segments":[{"start":3.508,"end":5.99,"text":"主席台鐵董事長"},{"start":16.264,"end":34.777,"text":"董事長我每次看到你都想要跟你討論臺鐵的文資保存我們來看頭影片上個月11月9號臺鐵發了一個新聞稿說臺鐵為了文資編了非常多的預算還成立了鐵路文化保存及活用小組還說已經開了11次的會議所以看起來如果從會議上來看跟相關預算"},{"start":35.638,"end":41.241,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":56.67,"end":57.45,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":75.356,"end":75.956,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":96.628,"end":98.77,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":114.142,"end":116.263,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":131.332,"end":157.444,"text":"前一頁前一頁前一頁有一頁不見了有一張投影片我先說你們台鐵我們後來跟你們索資有一台車叫S201那這是在你們清單上可是在201呢看起來現在是被放在好像是基隆吧那個風吹日曬他就放在外面那我們之前還去復剛我們辦了一個自己的考察那感謝台鐵當時有接待我們看了這個機車我們來看一下這個機車現在的狀況我們也很擔心"},{"start":160.606,"end":162.948,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":187.984,"end":197.227,"text":"非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務非營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務"},{"start":216.733,"end":218.394,"text":"臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?臺鐵目前文資保存問題與困境?"},{"start":238.643,"end":240.925,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":259.045,"end":263.108,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":284.821,"end":289.525,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":311.883,"end":322.116,"text":"你預計多久提出?我的記憶是應該是在後年可以提出後年?2026年?15年對現在已經在進行"},{"start":327.863,"end":344.899,"text":"我們辦公室會在持續追蹤臺鐵關於這些文資文物的保存我認為現在沒有開放多元透明的狀況還有我也認為臺鐵應該要積極的定期對外報告這件事情我認為更多的公民參與這件事情其實絕對是有助於臺鐵把相關文資做好"},{"start":345.519,"end":362.119,"text":"請不要把這些民間專業的聲音排斥在外我覺得這個非常非常可惜不要等到每次新聞事件爆發出來之後我們才會回頭去想要去協助那個個案好謝謝董事長最後一題主席不好意思我想要講一下我上次問了關於這個台鐵安全的事情那聽說你們就召開了相關的會議"},{"start":364.882,"end":386.71,"text":"聽說在相關會議上大家沒有共識所以說這件事情就不要做就繼續放著我不知道部長知不知道這件事情但是我想董事長你應該要知道這件事情我想要知道到底你們目前對於這個部分你們的想法跟規劃到底是什麼這件事指那個我們在駕駛台上的這個我們現在還在跟我們工會還有我們同仁溝通"},{"start":392.932,"end":408.647,"text":"那民眾乘坐車子的安全你們怎麼看這件事情?如果最後只是因為工會內部沒有共識可是我們沒有辦法導入更好的更安全的機制來保障民眾的安全我會認為這件事情不能用工會沒有共識來對人民做交代"},{"start":409.628,"end":410.409,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算"},{"start":439.828,"end":445.65,"text":"三、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算。"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":1161,"blocks":[["陳委員培瑜：（12時12分）謝謝主席，有請臺鐵董事長，謝謝。"],["主席：請杜微董事長。"],["陳委員培瑜：部長不用緊張，請部長稍作休息。"],["杜董事長微：委員好。"],["陳委員培瑜：董事長，我每次看到你，都想要跟你討論臺鐵的文資保存。我們來看投影片，11月9日臺鐵發了一篇新聞稿，說臺鐵為了文資，編了非常多預算，還成立了鐵路文化保存及活用小組，還說已經開了11次會議，所以如果從會議跟相關預算來看，看起來臺鐵對於文資保存是有一些信心跟決心的，可是我想要問，臺鐵內部在開這些會議的時候，到底對於文資的認定標準是什麼？之前有員訓中心500箱資料遺失的事情，我知道你們後來有找了專家學者討論，還有之前基隆月台棚架的問題，也是因為有新聞出了，網友快速積極熱烈地討論，所以臺鐵做出了回應，可是我當時就提醒，不要因為發生新聞事件才來看臺鐵的文資。我們來看一下，在你們的新聞稿裡面說要保存文資，可是我們看到預算的困境，卻被你們自己做了調整，我會說，砍掉預算是因為你們營運的壓力很大嗎？董事長，你看一下，當你們在臉書發了這個文之後，底下的留言都在罵你們，大家擔心那些各式各樣的老火車到哪裡去了，隨便說一個，EU300到哪裡去了？大家都在問。我只是要說，看起來是個案，可是我認為是因為臺鐵公司對於整個文資保存通案的心情跟態度，才會讓這麼多在意臺鐵文史的網友們……董事長，你有看過這個追蹤臺鐵文物的臉書專頁嗎？有二十幾萬人在上面關心你們臺鐵，如果真的在專家委員會裡面找不到大家都在意的事情，或者是你們的眼睛看出去的文資跟網友們所在意的文資不一樣，是不是可以加入這個粉專來看一看？我們來看一下臺鐵給我們的資料，我先說，我們後來跟你們臺鐵索資，有一台車叫S201，這是在你們的清單上，可是看起來S201現在是被放在基隆，放在外面風吹日曬。我們之前還去富岡，我們辦了一個自己的考察，感謝臺鐵當時接待我們看了機車，我們來看一下這個機車現在的狀況，我們也很擔心它現在維修的狀況跟進度又是什麼，而在照片上的這一台，確實就是非常多人關注的火車頭，不管是不是鐵路發燒友，都會認為它是非常重要的火車頭，而現在這個機車維修的進度跟照片，還有放在隔壁空間的CK101，我當天沒有辦法看到，我也不知道它的維修狀況跟進度到底在哪裡。我會說，臺灣有這麼多屬於臺鐵的非常珍貴的鐵路文物，其實它可以是很好的國內觀光旅遊素材，甚至也可以召喚起國人對於臺鐵的認同跟對於臺鐵的喜愛，我認為透過這樣子的事情，應該可以更加呼喚大家對於臺鐵的喜愛，而不是只是靠昂貴的旅遊列車，那個市場性是不一樣的，我並沒有說昂貴旅遊列車不好，可是我們這麼多文史的保存，如果沒有做好，真的很可惜。董事長，你怎麼看這件事情？最後，董事長，我想問一下，你怎麼看臺鐵目前文資保存的問題跟困境？還有，我也想要請你說明你們自己認為你們目前的困境到底是什麼。"],["杜董事長微：跟委員報告，其實包括我本人在內，我其實是滿注重我們臺鐵的文資，但是因為我們臺鐵的文資，包括我們的這些固定資產，還有我們的rolling stock，退役以後的確有很多，就是很廣泛，所以我們在界定文資的工作上面，必須要透過很多的調查還有認定，也就是說，剛剛委員有提到，我們有很多的會議，我們也都有在做相關的研究。我簡單講，目前如果我們有編列古蹟、歷史建物或文資保存的相關預算，當然這些就是在這個範疇之內，如果是在這個範疇之外的部分，我們現在也在做調查、研究，如果可以認列為珍貴的文化資產的話，我們未來會有一個中長期的大計畫，對這個計畫，我們的想法跟走法就是我們可能也要提報計畫出來，然後向文化部跟相關單位爭取一些經費，這樣才能可長可久。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，董事長，我聽到你剛剛說的這個大型計畫，你預計多久內提出？"],["杜董事長微：我的記憶是，應該是在後年可以。"],["陳委員培瑜：後年？是2026年？"],["杜董事長微：是民國115年。"],["陳委員培瑜：2026年嘛？"],["杜董事長微：對，現在已經在進行。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，那我們辦公室會再持續追蹤臺鐵這些文資文物的保存，我認為現在沒有開放多元透明的狀況，還有我也認為臺鐵應該要積極地定期對外報告這件事情，我認為更多的公民參與這件事情，絕對有助於臺鐵把相關文資做好，請不要把這些民間專業的聲音排斥在外，我覺得這個非常非常可惜，不要等到每次新聞事件爆發出來之後，我們才又回頭想要去協助那個個案。"],["杜董事長微：好。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，謝謝董事長。","最後一題，主席，不好意思，我想要講一下，我上次問了關於臺鐵安全的事情，聽說你們就召開了相關會議，在相關會議上大家沒有共識，所以這件事情就不要做，就繼續放著，我不知道部長知不知道這件事情，但是我想董事長你應該要知道這件事情，我想要知道，目前對於這個部分，你們的想法跟規劃到底是什麼？"],["杜董事長微：這一件事是指我們在駕駛台上的那個？"],["陳委員培瑜：是。"],["杜董事長微：這個事情，我們現在還在跟我們工會還有同仁溝通。"],["陳委員培瑜：民眾乘坐車子的安全，你們怎麼看這件事情？如果最後只是因為工會內部沒有共識，可是我們沒有辦法導入更好的、更安全的機制，來保障民眾的安全，我會認為這件事情不能用工會沒有共識來對人民交代。"],["杜董事長微：是。"],["陳委員培瑜：但我猜想部長可能還來不及知道這件事情，但我認為這件事情還有溝通的必要。時間有限，我想要拜託董事長把這樣的心情帶回去，真的不要等到出事了，我們才來看這件事情，好不好？我們都不希望再有相關的交通意外，不是嗎？"],["杜董事長微：是。還是要向委員報告，這麼做當然可以增進安全，但是我們既有的，包括駕駛艙裡面的各項設備，如果落實去做的話，其實安全還是可以確保的。"],["陳委員培瑜：好。本席希望董事長今天說的話真的可以做為民眾乘坐臺鐵提供重要的安全保障，但是如果國外都已經有相關做法，而臺灣卻遲遲不肯沿用，本席認為你們也要給一個說法和交代，為什麼工會做出這樣的決議，臺鐵就決定採用，甚至交通部也必須為這樣的建議買單，本席認為這件事情還有待商榷，我們也會持續追蹤，謝謝董事長、謝謝主席。"],["杜董事長微：這個部分我們再來溝通，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝陳培瑜委員。","接下來邀請張啓楷委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":334,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-23-14","speakers":["陳素月","林沛祥","李昆澤","林國成","何欣純","魯明哲","林俊憲","黃健豪","徐富癸","邱若華","蔡其昌","許智傑","羅廷瑋","王義川","洪孟楷","陳培瑜","張啓楷","游顥","廖先翔","蔡易餘","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","葉元之","鍾佳濱"],"page_start":257,"meetingDate":["2024-12-09"],"gazette_id":"1140402","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1140402_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期交通委員會第14次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部航港局單位預算；二、審查114年度中央政府總預\n算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管航港建設基金非營業預算；三、審查114年度中央\n政府總預算案附屬單位預算營業部分關於交通部主管臺灣港務股份有限公司營業預算；四、審查\n114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算營業部分關於交通部主管國營臺灣鐵路股份有限公司營\n業預算；五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管交通作業\n基金─臺鐵局撥入資產及債務管理基金分預算【僅進行詢答】","agenda_id":"1140402_00002"}}}