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\"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:03,302 --> 00:00:11,426\n謝謝主席先請交通部陳部長陳部長林所長好林居國所長部長早所長早這個今天本席就教幾個問題第一個就是我們那個ADS先進駕駛輔助系統\n\n2\n00:00:31,096 --> 00:00:58,646\n所長執行的成果怎麼樣過去在國道上面執行嗎是跟委員報告一下我們前兩年在國道執行當然就是幫業者去開發出來一個所謂的一個分析的一個平台工具也就是說後續他們業者可以直接就是利用ADAS還有這個一些行車影像的資料直接就可以去找出到底他所寫的哪些駕駛員他在什麼樣的一些\n\n3\n00:00:59,426 --> 00:01:15,773\n道路的一個情況之下比較會有一些不適當的駕駛行為那可以作為教育訓練的一個工具那進度上面我們實際在運用了嗎?國道的客運業國道客運我們那個114年度我們準備就是要實際找一家業者來輔導他們來移轉給他們做使用\n\n4\n00:01:18,274 --> 00:01:39,280\n好,所以國道,你要從國道跟市區道路是同時做還是分開做?前兩年是先開發國道的這個分區平台。對,明年開始做市區。然後明年同時做市區跟福島。那這個福島的計畫好了之後,對於這個ADAS系統在行車安全上面,\n\n5\n00:01:41,845 --> 00:02:03,597\n你先會讓他們熟悉嘛然後也讓AI辨識度data多了他的辨識精準度就高嘛那實際在運用上面你覺得時間時程會落在什麼時候我想明年我們實際就是會找業者來做這一個示範嘛到時候就可以從這個過程當中我知道示範我知道但你覺得這個\n\n6\n00:02:05,058 --> 00:02:12,498\n這樣的系統普遍的運用在國道的客運跟市區的公車上面時間大概還要多久?\n\n7\n00:02:13,592 --> 00:02:37,801\n我預估大概三到五年十成盡量掌握啦如果這是一個有用的技術因為我們都知道這個系統裝上去如果成效好的話事實上對於國道客運特別在市區啦你看市區很多的這種車禍對行人公車去撞到行人等等\n\n8\n00:02:38,681 --> 00:02:59,460\n如果這個系統你們經過測試、教育訓練都可以成功,那未來勢必對於行人受到公車、大型巴士傷害的機率就下降。人民關天啦,這有好的事情,要早一點做、快一點做。我們加速。對,這都講實際的啦,除了有的,我聽都覺得那個就...\n\n9\n00:03:02,502 --> 00:03:20,257\n但是這次馬上可以立即改善我們很多你看這種死角啦公車在開在過程裡面司機沒有去注意到科技的發展協助這個公車的駕駛讓保障行人的安全這個很重要好不好首長114年度這預算要趕快去執行怎麼去縮短\n\n10\n00:03:24,740 --> 00:03:24,920\n總議長請回,請我們主委。\n\n11\n00:03:44,602 --> 00:04:00,839\n各位有關那個運安會我想多次我們在我辦公室我們有協調過有瞭解過那我其實有些數據趁著今天部長也在這個運安會第一個在事故調查暫期暫期率高達\n\n12\n00:04:02,216 --> 00:04:15,590\n高達65%這個很多的研究都顯示這個時間過長這個我也曾經跟你就教過那你也跟我提出包括這個運安會人力不足啦等等的問題你們要\n\n13\n00:04:17,574 --> 00:04:42,601\n不是像其他單位不是說其他單位隨便調查意思是說運安會非常認真調查所以你覺得時程都會久但是這個數字看起來並不好看你看這個運安會運輸事故調查的暫期情形你看這個暫期的比率從航空的23水路的76道路的63公路的13然後合計平均大概65這時間大家感覺很長所以那個\n\n14\n00:04:48,015 --> 00:05:12,343\n主委,這個有沒有可能可以縮短的這種可能性存在嗎?各位報告齁,這個展期率的統計它是從一開始成立的時候,它就算一直算到去年底。對,沒錯。那,因為我們這個院會成立的時候有三個主要因素是這樣子。我們成立的時候是要用人嘛,招考人來。\n\n15\n00:05:13,243 --> 00:05:17,205\n五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算\n\n16\n00:05:30,592 --> 00:05:33,934\n三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度\n\n17\n00:05:59,531 --> 00:06:00,572\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於\n\n18\n00:06:23,229 --> 00:06:23,589\n第三個問題呢這個齁\n\n19\n00:06:50,560 --> 00:07:01,824\n我們提的因為運安會的調查報告結果就是要求行政單位來改善那我看一下這個要求要改善建立的事項在所謂分項執行計畫列管情形這個列管比例\n\n20\n00:07:09,679 --> 00:07:29,591\n這個列管比例都還有20幾%、10幾%甚至列管年限還有三年以上的一個事情要列管三年像我不知道三年以上哪一個案子像航空三年以上的就有五件嘛鐵道就有九件都是列管三年以上\n\n21\n00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:32,082\n為什麼會列管這麼久?是你列管的有問題還是交通部執行的有問題?\n\n22\n00:07:45,640 --> 00:08:09,969\n那個完成率的這個數字的顯示,最主要被幾個大數字拉下,譬如說,譬如說高雄機場他的那個跑法道的安全區他要改善,他要編列預算要編好幾年。譬如說台中機場那個區前干擾,也是一樣他跑法道需要檢查,要改善的話國防部編預算也是編了很多年,他就掛在那邊。好OK,你如果說他就在做了,\n\n23\n00:08:10,689 --> 00:08:34,247\n它已經在執行了預算也照年度編列了你們這個列管的方法要不要調整一下這很難看嘛這個事情一直在列管三年以上還在列管三年以上列管如果你沒有告訴我我認為他就是不做三年都不做那第二種解釋方式是不對他已經在做了他已經做三年了但還沒有做完所以我還在列管\n\n24\n00:08:35,764 --> 00:08:53,776\n對,委員你講的是重點,確實沒有錯。我們在行政院開會的時候,我們也跟政委報告說,譬如說台鐵,他已經有編了預算,那我們也看得到他的進入往前在走,那我們就會建議說這個就不要列關了。可是,像剛剛講的,台中青年康國防部編預算、明昌市高雄機場編預算、買土地\n\n25\n00:08:55,077 --> 00:08:55,938\n單位預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算\n\n26\n00:09:18,123 --> 00:09:42,680\n我持續關注你的進度你沒有我就把你放到列管你沒有按照你的進度走我就回到列管但你只要按照進度走我應該是另外一種列管方式這樣我們立委在監督齁才不會每天看到這種看到這種三年以上我都會覺得懷疑是現在是怎樣交通部沒要理他就對了完全不鳥你運安會嗎不是嘛所以你要讓我們知道什麼事情他不鳥你的\n\n27\n00:09:43,160 --> 00:10:08,785\n那我們該冤有頭再有主就要該怎麼監督那有一些是人家已經只著手在進行案子他就一定要做5年那你簡單講明年還有那個列管4年的因為他要做5年嘛我的意思是這樣你懂我意思嗎我們來檢討一個其實如果他進行中看得見了你應該有另外一種追蹤列管的方法而不是通通統合在一個好像都沒有做的那種列管裡面\n\n28\n00:10:09,685 --> 00:10:34,962\n這樣好不好?這樣我們才有辦法監督嘛,不然這個數字看了我都覺得很離譜的,三年以上還有五件,還有鐵道還有九件,要怕死人啊,現在是怎樣?運安會說的話都沒人要聽就對了。這個不行啊,這個運安會的報告要改善的就是要確保我們交通載具的安全,這是維護人民生命財產的重大事情。是這樣好不好?這樣我們才有能力去監督嘛。好,謝謝,謝謝委員。\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n3302\t11426\t謝謝主席先請交通部陳部長陳部長林所長好林居國所長部長早所長早這個今天本席就教幾個問題第一個就是我們那個ADS先進駕駛輔助系統\n31096\t58646\t所長執行的成果怎麼樣過去在國道上面執行嗎是跟委員報告一下我們前兩年在國道執行當然就是幫業者去開發出來一個所謂的一個分析的一個平台工具也就是說後續他們業者可以直接就是利用ADAS還有這個一些行車影像的資料直接就可以去找出到底他所寫的哪些駕駛員他在什麼樣的一些\n59426\t75773\t道路的一個情況之下比較會有一些不適當的駕駛行為那可以作為教育訓練的一個工具那進度上面我們實際在運用了嗎?國道的客運業國道客運我們那個114年度我們準備就是要實際找一家業者來輔導他們來移轉給他們做使用\n78274\t99280\t好,所以國道,你要從國道跟市區道路是同時做還是分開做?前兩年是先開發國道的這個分區平台。對,明年開始做市區。然後明年同時做市區跟福島。那這個福島的計畫好了之後,對於這個ADAS系統在行車安全上面,\n101845\t123597\t你先會讓他們熟悉嘛然後也讓AI辨識度data多了他的辨識精準度就高嘛那實際在運用上面你覺得時間時程會落在什麼時候我想明年我們實際就是會找業者來做這一個示範嘛到時候就可以從這個過程當中我知道示範我知道但你覺得這個\n125058\t132498\t這樣的系統普遍的運用在國道的客運跟市區的公車上面時間大概還要多久?\n133592\t157801\t我預估大概三到五年十成盡量掌握啦如果這是一個有用的技術因為我們都知道這個系統裝上去如果成效好的話事實上對於國道客運特別在市區啦你看市區很多的這種車禍對行人公車去撞到行人等等\n158681\t179460\t如果這個系統你們經過測試、教育訓練都可以成功,那未來勢必對於行人受到公車、大型巴士傷害的機率就下降。人民關天啦,這有好的事情,要早一點做、快一點做。我們加速。對,這都講實際的啦,除了有的,我聽都覺得那個就...\n182502\t200257\t但是這次馬上可以立即改善我們很多你看這種死角啦公車在開在過程裡面司機沒有去注意到科技的發展協助這個公車的駕駛讓保障行人的安全這個很重要好不好首長114年度這預算要趕快去執行怎麼去縮短\n204740\t204920\t總議長請回,請我們主委。\n224602\t240839\t各位有關那個運安會我想多次我們在我辦公室我們有協調過有瞭解過那我其實有些數據趁著今天部長也在這個運安會第一個在事故調查暫期暫期率高達\n242216\t255590\t高達65%這個很多的研究都顯示這個時間過長這個我也曾經跟你就教過那你也跟我提出包括這個運安會人力不足啦等等的問題你們要\n257574\t282601\t不是像其他單位不是說其他單位隨便調查意思是說運安會非常認真調查所以你覺得時程都會久但是這個數字看起來並不好看你看這個運安會運輸事故調查的暫期情形你看這個暫期的比率從航空的23水路的76道路的63公路的13然後合計平均大概65這時間大家感覺很長所以那個\n288015\t312343\t主委,這個有沒有可能可以縮短的這種可能性存在嗎?各位報告齁,這個展期率的統計它是從一開始成立的時候,它就算一直算到去年底。對,沒錯。那,因為我們這個院會成立的時候有三個主要因素是這樣子。我們成立的時候是要用人嘛,招考人來。\n313243\t317205\t五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算\n330592\t333934\t三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度\n359531\t360572\t二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於\n383229\t383589\t第三個問題呢這個齁\n410560\t421824\t我們提的因為運安會的調查報告結果就是要求行政單位來改善那我看一下這個要求要改善建立的事項在所謂分項執行計畫列管情形這個列管比例\n429679\t449591\t這個列管比例都還有20幾%、10幾%甚至列管年限還有三年以上的一個事情要列管三年像我不知道三年以上哪一個案子像航空三年以上的就有五件嘛鐵道就有九件都是列管三年以上\n450520\t452082\t為什麼會列管這麼久?是你列管的有問題還是交通部執行的有問題?\n465640\t489969\t那個完成率的這個數字的顯示,最主要被幾個大數字拉下,譬如說,譬如說高雄機場他的那個跑法道的安全區他要改善,他要編列預算要編好幾年。譬如說台中機場那個區前干擾,也是一樣他跑法道需要檢查,要改善的話國防部編預算也是編了很多年,他就掛在那邊。好OK,你如果說他就在做了,\n490689\t514247\t它已經在執行了預算也照年度編列了你們這個列管的方法要不要調整一下這很難看嘛這個事情一直在列管三年以上還在列管三年以上列管如果你沒有告訴我我認為他就是不做三年都不做那第二種解釋方式是不對他已經在做了他已經做三年了但還沒有做完所以我還在列管\n515764\t533776\t對,委員你講的是重點,確實沒有錯。我們在行政院開會的時候,我們也跟政委報告說,譬如說台鐵,他已經有編了預算,那我們也看得到他的進入往前在走,那我們就會建議說這個就不要列關了。可是,像剛剛講的,台中青年康國防部編預算、明昌市高雄機場編預算、買土地\n535077\t535938\t單位預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算\n558123\t582680\t我持續關注你的進度你沒有我就把你放到列管你沒有按照你的進度走我就回到列管但你只要按照進度走我應該是另外一種列管方式這樣我們立委在監督齁才不會每天看到這種看到這種三年以上我都會覺得懷疑是現在是怎樣交通部沒要理他就對了完全不鳥你運安會嗎不是嘛所以你要讓我們知道什麼事情他不鳥你的\n583160\t608785\t那我們該冤有頭再有主就要該怎麼監督那有一些是人家已經只著手在進行案子他就一定要做5年那你簡單講明年還有那個列管4年的因為他要做5年嘛我的意思是這樣你懂我意思嗎我們來檢討一個其實如果他進行中看得見了你應該有另外一種追蹤列管的方法而不是通通統合在一個好像都沒有做的那種列管裡面\n609685\t634962\t這樣好不好?這樣我們才有辦法監督嘛,不然這個數字看了我都覺得很離譜的,三年以上還有五件,還有鐵道還有九件,要怕死人啊,現在是怎樣?運安會說的話都沒人要聽就對了。這個不行啊,這個運安會的報告要改善的就是要確保我們交通載具的安全,這是維護人民生命財產的重大事情。是這樣好不好?這樣我們才有能力去監督嘛。好,謝謝,謝謝委員。\n","txt":"謝謝主席先請交通部陳部長陳部長林所長好林居國所長部長早所長早這個今天本席就教幾個問題第一個就是我們那個ADS先進駕駛輔助系統\n所長執行的成果怎麼樣過去在國道上面執行嗎是跟委員報告一下我們前兩年在國道執行當然就是幫業者去開發出來一個所謂的一個分析的一個平台工具也就是說後續他們業者可以直接就是利用ADAS還有這個一些行車影像的資料直接就可以去找出到底他所寫的哪些駕駛員他在什麼樣的一些\n道路的一個情況之下比較會有一些不適當的駕駛行為那可以作為教育訓練的一個工具那進度上面我們實際在運用了嗎?國道的客運業國道客運我們那個114年度我們準備就是要實際找一家業者來輔導他們來移轉給他們做使用\n好,所以國道,你要從國道跟市區道路是同時做還是分開做?前兩年是先開發國道的這個分區平台。對,明年開始做市區。然後明年同時做市區跟福島。那這個福島的計畫好了之後,對於這個ADAS系統在行車安全上面,\n你先會讓他們熟悉嘛然後也讓AI辨識度data多了他的辨識精準度就高嘛那實際在運用上面你覺得時間時程會落在什麼時候我想明年我們實際就是會找業者來做這一個示範嘛到時候就可以從這個過程當中我知道示範我知道但你覺得這個\n這樣的系統普遍的運用在國道的客運跟市區的公車上面時間大概還要多久?\n我預估大概三到五年十成盡量掌握啦如果這是一個有用的技術因為我們都知道這個系統裝上去如果成效好的話事實上對於國道客運特別在市區啦你看市區很多的這種車禍對行人公車去撞到行人等等\n如果這個系統你們經過測試、教育訓練都可以成功,那未來勢必對於行人受到公車、大型巴士傷害的機率就下降。人民關天啦,這有好的事情,要早一點做、快一點做。我們加速。對,這都講實際的啦,除了有的,我聽都覺得那個就...\n但是這次馬上可以立即改善我們很多你看這種死角啦公車在開在過程裡面司機沒有去注意到科技的發展協助這個公車的駕駛讓保障行人的安全這個很重要好不好首長114年度這預算要趕快去執行怎麼去縮短\n總議長請回,請我們主委。\n各位有關那個運安會我想多次我們在我辦公室我們有協調過有瞭解過那我其實有些數據趁著今天部長也在這個運安會第一個在事故調查暫期暫期率高達\n高達65%這個很多的研究都顯示這個時間過長這個我也曾經跟你就教過那你也跟我提出包括這個運安會人力不足啦等等的問題你們要\n不是像其他單位不是說其他單位隨便調查意思是說運安會非常認真調查所以你覺得時程都會久但是這個數字看起來並不好看你看這個運安會運輸事故調查的暫期情形你看這個暫期的比率從航空的23水路的76道路的63公路的13然後合計平均大概65這時間大家感覺很長所以那個\n主委,這個有沒有可能可以縮短的這種可能性存在嗎?各位報告齁,這個展期率的統計它是從一開始成立的時候,它就算一直算到去年底。對,沒錯。那,因為我們這個院會成立的時候有三個主要因素是這樣子。我們成立的時候是要用人嘛,招考人來。\n五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算\n三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於\n第三個問題呢這個齁\n我們提的因為運安會的調查報告結果就是要求行政單位來改善那我看一下這個要求要改善建立的事項在所謂分項執行計畫列管情形這個列管比例\n這個列管比例都還有20幾%、10幾%甚至列管年限還有三年以上的一個事情要列管三年像我不知道三年以上哪一個案子像航空三年以上的就有五件嘛鐵道就有九件都是列管三年以上\n為什麼會列管這麼久?是你列管的有問題還是交通部執行的有問題?\n那個完成率的這個數字的顯示,最主要被幾個大數字拉下,譬如說,譬如說高雄機場他的那個跑法道的安全區他要改善,他要編列預算要編好幾年。譬如說台中機場那個區前干擾,也是一樣他跑法道需要檢查,要改善的話國防部編預算也是編了很多年,他就掛在那邊。好OK,你如果說他就在做了,\n它已經在執行了預算也照年度編列了你們這個列管的方法要不要調整一下這很難看嘛這個事情一直在列管三年以上還在列管三年以上列管如果你沒有告訴我我認為他就是不做三年都不做那第二種解釋方式是不對他已經在做了他已經做三年了但還沒有做完所以我還在列管\n對,委員你講的是重點,確實沒有錯。我們在行政院開會的時候,我們也跟政委報告說,譬如說台鐵,他已經有編了預算,那我們也看得到他的進入往前在走,那我們就會建議說這個就不要列關了。可是,像剛剛講的,台中青年康國防部編預算、明昌市高雄機場編預算、買土地\n單位預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算\n我持續關注你的進度你沒有我就把你放到列管你沒有按照你的進度走我就回到列管但你只要按照進度走我應該是另外一種列管方式這樣我們立委在監督齁才不會每天看到這種看到這種三年以上我都會覺得懷疑是現在是怎樣交通部沒要理他就對了完全不鳥你運安會嗎不是嘛所以你要讓我們知道什麼事情他不鳥你的\n那我們該冤有頭再有主就要該怎麼監督那有一些是人家已經只著手在進行案子他就一定要做5年那你簡單講明年還有那個列管4年的因為他要做5年嘛我的意思是這樣你懂我意思嗎我們來檢討一個其實如果他進行中看得見了你應該有另外一種追蹤列管的方法而不是通通統合在一個好像都沒有做的那種列管裡面\n這樣好不好?這樣我們才有辦法監督嘛,不然這個數字看了我都覺得很離譜的,三年以上還有五件,還有鐵道還有九件,要怕死人啊,現在是怎樣?運安會說的話都沒人要聽就對了。這個不行啊,這個運安會的報告要改善的就是要確保我們交通載具的安全,這是維護人民生命財產的重大事情。是這樣好不好?這樣我們才有能力去監督嘛。好,謝謝,謝謝委員。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:03.302 --> 00:11.426\n謝謝主席先請交通部陳部長陳部長林所長好林居國所長部長早所長早這個今天本席就教幾個問題第一個就是我們那個ADS先進駕駛輔助系統\n\n00:31.096 --> 00:58.646\n所長執行的成果怎麼樣過去在國道上面執行嗎是跟委員報告一下我們前兩年在國道執行當然就是幫業者去開發出來一個所謂的一個分析的一個平台工具也就是說後續他們業者可以直接就是利用ADAS還有這個一些行車影像的資料直接就可以去找出到底他所寫的哪些駕駛員他在什麼樣的一些\n\n00:59.426 --> 01:15.773\n道路的一個情況之下比較會有一些不適當的駕駛行為那可以作為教育訓練的一個工具那進度上面我們實際在運用了嗎?國道的客運業國道客運我們那個114年度我們準備就是要實際找一家業者來輔導他們來移轉給他們做使用\n\n01:18.274 --> 01:39.280\n好,所以國道,你要從國道跟市區道路是同時做還是分開做?前兩年是先開發國道的這個分區平台。對,明年開始做市區。然後明年同時做市區跟福島。那這個福島的計畫好了之後,對於這個ADAS系統在行車安全上面,\n\n01:41.845 --> 02:03.597\n你先會讓他們熟悉嘛然後也讓AI辨識度data多了他的辨識精準度就高嘛那實際在運用上面你覺得時間時程會落在什麼時候我想明年我們實際就是會找業者來做這一個示範嘛到時候就可以從這個過程當中我知道示範我知道但你覺得這個\n\n02:05.058 --> 02:12.498\n這樣的系統普遍的運用在國道的客運跟市區的公車上面時間大概還要多久?\n\n02:13.592 --> 02:37.801\n我預估大概三到五年十成盡量掌握啦如果這是一個有用的技術因為我們都知道這個系統裝上去如果成效好的話事實上對於國道客運特別在市區啦你看市區很多的這種車禍對行人公車去撞到行人等等\n\n02:38.681 --> 02:59.460\n如果這個系統你們經過測試、教育訓練都可以成功,那未來勢必對於行人受到公車、大型巴士傷害的機率就下降。人民關天啦,這有好的事情,要早一點做、快一點做。我們加速。對,這都講實際的啦,除了有的,我聽都覺得那個就...\n\n03:02.502 --> 03:20.257\n但是這次馬上可以立即改善我們很多你看這種死角啦公車在開在過程裡面司機沒有去注意到科技的發展協助這個公車的駕駛讓保障行人的安全這個很重要好不好首長114年度這預算要趕快去執行怎麼去縮短\n\n03:24.740 --> 03:24.920\n總議長請回,請我們主委。\n\n03:44.602 --> 04:00.839\n各位有關那個運安會我想多次我們在我辦公室我們有協調過有瞭解過那我其實有些數據趁著今天部長也在這個運安會第一個在事故調查暫期暫期率高達\n\n04:02.216 --> 04:15.590\n高達65%這個很多的研究都顯示這個時間過長這個我也曾經跟你就教過那你也跟我提出包括這個運安會人力不足啦等等的問題你們要\n\n04:17.574 --> 04:42.601\n不是像其他單位不是說其他單位隨便調查意思是說運安會非常認真調查所以你覺得時程都會久但是這個數字看起來並不好看你看這個運安會運輸事故調查的暫期情形你看這個暫期的比率從航空的23水路的76道路的63公路的13然後合計平均大概65這時間大家感覺很長所以那個\n\n04:48.015 --> 05:12.343\n主委,這個有沒有可能可以縮短的這種可能性存在嗎?各位報告齁,這個展期率的統計它是從一開始成立的時候,它就算一直算到去年底。對,沒錯。那,因為我們這個院會成立的時候有三個主要因素是這樣子。我們成立的時候是要用人嘛,招考人來。\n\n05:13.243 --> 05:17.205\n五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算\n\n05:30.592 --> 05:33.934\n三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度\n\n05:59.531 --> 06:00.572\n二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於\n\n06:23.229 --> 06:23.589\n第三個問題呢這個齁\n\n06:50.560 --> 07:01.824\n我們提的因為運安會的調查報告結果就是要求行政單位來改善那我看一下這個要求要改善建立的事項在所謂分項執行計畫列管情形這個列管比例\n\n07:09.679 --> 07:29.591\n這個列管比例都還有20幾%、10幾%甚至列管年限還有三年以上的一個事情要列管三年像我不知道三年以上哪一個案子像航空三年以上的就有五件嘛鐵道就有九件都是列管三年以上\n\n07:30.520 --> 07:32.082\n為什麼會列管這麼久?是你列管的有問題還是交通部執行的有問題?\n\n07:45.640 --> 08:09.969\n那個完成率的這個數字的顯示,最主要被幾個大數字拉下,譬如說,譬如說高雄機場他的那個跑法道的安全區他要改善,他要編列預算要編好幾年。譬如說台中機場那個區前干擾,也是一樣他跑法道需要檢查,要改善的話國防部編預算也是編了很多年,他就掛在那邊。好OK,你如果說他就在做了,\n\n08:10.689 --> 08:34.247\n它已經在執行了預算也照年度編列了你們這個列管的方法要不要調整一下這很難看嘛這個事情一直在列管三年以上還在列管三年以上列管如果你沒有告訴我我認為他就是不做三年都不做那第二種解釋方式是不對他已經在做了他已經做三年了但還沒有做完所以我還在列管\n\n08:35.764 --> 08:53.776\n對,委員你講的是重點,確實沒有錯。我們在行政院開會的時候,我們也跟政委報告說,譬如說台鐵,他已經有編了預算,那我們也看得到他的進入往前在走,那我們就會建議說這個就不要列關了。可是,像剛剛講的,台中青年康國防部編預算、明昌市高雄機場編預算、買土地\n\n08:55.077 --> 08:55.938\n單位預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算\n\n09:18.123 --> 09:42.680\n我持續關注你的進度你沒有我就把你放到列管你沒有按照你的進度走我就回到列管但你只要按照進度走我應該是另外一種列管方式這樣我們立委在監督齁才不會每天看到這種看到這種三年以上我都會覺得懷疑是現在是怎樣交通部沒要理他就對了完全不鳥你運安會嗎不是嘛所以你要讓我們知道什麼事情他不鳥你的\n\n09:43.160 --> 10:08.785\n那我們該冤有頭再有主就要該怎麼監督那有一些是人家已經只著手在進行案子他就一定要做5年那你簡單講明年還有那個列管4年的因為他要做5年嘛我的意思是這樣你懂我意思嗎我們來檢討一個其實如果他進行中看得見了你應該有另外一種追蹤列管的方法而不是通通統合在一個好像都沒有做的那種列管裡面\n\n10:09.685 --> 10:34.962\n這樣好不好?這樣我們才有辦法監督嘛,不然這個數字看了我都覺得很離譜的,三年以上還有五件,還有鐵道還有九件,要怕死人啊,現在是怎樣?運安會說的話都沒人要聽就對了。這個不行啊,這個運安會的報告要改善的就是要確保我們交通載具的安全,這是維護人民生命財產的重大事情。是這樣好不好?這樣我們才有能力去監督嘛。好,謝謝,謝謝委員。\n\n","segments":[{"start":3.302,"end":11.426,"text":"謝謝主席先請交通部陳部長陳部長林所長好林居國所長部長早所長早這個今天本席就教幾個問題第一個就是我們那個ADS先進駕駛輔助系統"},{"start":31.096,"end":58.646,"text":"所長執行的成果怎麼樣過去在國道上面執行嗎是跟委員報告一下我們前兩年在國道執行當然就是幫業者去開發出來一個所謂的一個分析的一個平台工具也就是說後續他們業者可以直接就是利用ADAS還有這個一些行車影像的資料直接就可以去找出到底他所寫的哪些駕駛員他在什麼樣的一些"},{"start":59.426,"end":75.773,"text":"道路的一個情況之下比較會有一些不適當的駕駛行為那可以作為教育訓練的一個工具那進度上面我們實際在運用了嗎?國道的客運業國道客運我們那個114年度我們準備就是要實際找一家業者來輔導他們來移轉給他們做使用"},{"start":78.274,"end":99.28,"text":"好,所以國道,你要從國道跟市區道路是同時做還是分開做?前兩年是先開發國道的這個分區平台。對,明年開始做市區。然後明年同時做市區跟福島。那這個福島的計畫好了之後,對於這個ADAS系統在行車安全上面,"},{"start":101.845,"end":123.597,"text":"你先會讓他們熟悉嘛然後也讓AI辨識度data多了他的辨識精準度就高嘛那實際在運用上面你覺得時間時程會落在什麼時候我想明年我們實際就是會找業者來做這一個示範嘛到時候就可以從這個過程當中我知道示範我知道但你覺得這個"},{"start":125.058,"end":132.498,"text":"這樣的系統普遍的運用在國道的客運跟市區的公車上面時間大概還要多久?"},{"start":133.592,"end":157.801,"text":"我預估大概三到五年十成盡量掌握啦如果這是一個有用的技術因為我們都知道這個系統裝上去如果成效好的話事實上對於國道客運特別在市區啦你看市區很多的這種車禍對行人公車去撞到行人等等"},{"start":158.681,"end":179.46,"text":"如果這個系統你們經過測試、教育訓練都可以成功,那未來勢必對於行人受到公車、大型巴士傷害的機率就下降。人民關天啦,這有好的事情,要早一點做、快一點做。我們加速。對,這都講實際的啦,除了有的,我聽都覺得那個就..."},{"start":182.502,"end":200.257,"text":"但是這次馬上可以立即改善我們很多你看這種死角啦公車在開在過程裡面司機沒有去注意到科技的發展協助這個公車的駕駛讓保障行人的安全這個很重要好不好首長114年度這預算要趕快去執行怎麼去縮短"},{"start":204.74,"end":204.92,"text":"總議長請回,請我們主委。"},{"start":224.602,"end":240.839,"text":"各位有關那個運安會我想多次我們在我辦公室我們有協調過有瞭解過那我其實有些數據趁著今天部長也在這個運安會第一個在事故調查暫期暫期率高達"},{"start":242.216,"end":255.59,"text":"高達65%這個很多的研究都顯示這個時間過長這個我也曾經跟你就教過那你也跟我提出包括這個運安會人力不足啦等等的問題你們要"},{"start":257.574,"end":282.601,"text":"不是像其他單位不是說其他單位隨便調查意思是說運安會非常認真調查所以你覺得時程都會久但是這個數字看起來並不好看你看這個運安會運輸事故調查的暫期情形你看這個暫期的比率從航空的23水路的76道路的63公路的13然後合計平均大概65這時間大家感覺很長所以那個"},{"start":288.015,"end":312.343,"text":"主委,這個有沒有可能可以縮短的這種可能性存在嗎?各位報告齁,這個展期率的統計它是從一開始成立的時候,它就算一直算到去年底。對,沒錯。那,因為我們這個院會成立的時候有三個主要因素是這樣子。我們成立的時候是要用人嘛,招考人來。"},{"start":313.243,"end":317.205,"text":"五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算"},{"start":330.592,"end":333.934,"text":"三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度三、審查114年度"},{"start":359.531,"end":360.572,"text":"二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於"},{"start":383.229,"end":383.589,"text":"第三個問題呢這個齁"},{"start":410.56,"end":421.824,"text":"我們提的因為運安會的調查報告結果就是要求行政單位來改善那我看一下這個要求要改善建立的事項在所謂分項執行計畫列管情形這個列管比例"},{"start":429.679,"end":449.591,"text":"這個列管比例都還有20幾%、10幾%甚至列管年限還有三年以上的一個事情要列管三年像我不知道三年以上哪一個案子像航空三年以上的就有五件嘛鐵道就有九件都是列管三年以上"},{"start":450.52,"end":452.082,"text":"為什麼會列管這麼久?是你列管的有問題還是交通部執行的有問題?"},{"start":465.64,"end":489.969,"text":"那個完成率的這個數字的顯示,最主要被幾個大數字拉下,譬如說,譬如說高雄機場他的那個跑法道的安全區他要改善,他要編列預算要編好幾年。譬如說台中機場那個區前干擾,也是一樣他跑法道需要檢查,要改善的話國防部編預算也是編了很多年,他就掛在那邊。好OK,你如果說他就在做了,"},{"start":490.689,"end":514.247,"text":"它已經在執行了預算也照年度編列了你們這個列管的方法要不要調整一下這很難看嘛這個事情一直在列管三年以上還在列管三年以上列管如果你沒有告訴我我認為他就是不做三年都不做那第二種解釋方式是不對他已經在做了他已經做三年了但還沒有做完所以我還在列管"},{"start":515.764,"end":533.776,"text":"對,委員你講的是重點,確實沒有錯。我們在行政院開會的時候,我們也跟政委報告說,譬如說台鐵,他已經有編了預算,那我們也看得到他的進入往前在走,那我們就會建議說這個就不要列關了。可是,像剛剛講的,台中青年康國防部編預算、明昌市高雄機場編預算、買土地"},{"start":535.077,"end":535.938,"text":"單位預算案關於交通部運輸安全調查委員會單位預算"},{"start":558.123,"end":582.68,"text":"我持續關注你的進度你沒有我就把你放到列管你沒有按照你的進度走我就回到列管但你只要按照進度走我應該是另外一種列管方式這樣我們立委在監督齁才不會每天看到這種看到這種三年以上我都會覺得懷疑是現在是怎樣交通部沒要理他就對了完全不鳥你運安會嗎不是嘛所以你要讓我們知道什麼事情他不鳥你的"},{"start":583.16,"end":608.785,"text":"那我們該冤有頭再有主就要該怎麼監督那有一些是人家已經只著手在進行案子他就一定要做5年那你簡單講明年還有那個列管4年的因為他要做5年嘛我的意思是這樣你懂我意思嗎我們來檢討一個其實如果他進行中看得見了你應該有另外一種追蹤列管的方法而不是通通統合在一個好像都沒有做的那種列管裡面"},{"start":609.685,"end":634.962,"text":"這樣好不好?這樣我們才有辦法監督嘛,不然這個數字看了我都覺得很離譜的,三年以上還有五件,還有鐵道還有九件,要怕死人啊,現在是怎樣?運安會說的話都沒人要聽就對了。這個不行啊,這個運安會的報告要改善的就是要確保我們交通載具的安全,這是維護人民生命財產的重大事情。是這樣好不好?這樣我們才有能力去監督嘛。好,謝謝,謝謝委員。"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":474,"blocks":[["蔡委員其昌：（10時29分）謝謝主席，先請交通部陳部長跟林所長。"],["主席：請陳部長、林繼國所長。"],["蔡委員其昌：部長早、所長早。"],["陳部長世凱：委員好。"],["蔡委員其昌：今天本席要就教幾個問題，第一個就是ADAS先進駕駛輔助系統，所長，執行的成果怎麼樣？過去在國道上面執行嘛。"],["林所長繼國：是。跟委員報告一下，我們前兩年在國道執行當然就是幫業者開發出來一個分析的平臺工具，也就是說後續他們業者利用ADAS還有一些行車影像資料，直接就可以找出到底他所轄的哪些駕駛員在什麼樣的道路的情況之下比較會有一些不適當的駕駛行為，可以作為教育訓練的一個工具。"],["蔡委員其昌：對，所長，那進度上面，我們國道的客運業實際在運用了嗎？"],["林所長繼國：國道客運的部分，我們準備在114年度要實際找一家業者來輔導並移轉給他們使用。"],["蔡委員其昌：好。所以國道跟市區道路是要同時做還是分開做？"],["林所長繼國：前兩年是先開發國道的分析平臺……"],["蔡委員其昌：的ADAS，對。"],["林所長繼國：對，然後明年就……"],["蔡委員其昌：明年開始做市區？"],["林所長繼國：輔導，然後明年也同時做市區跟輔導。"],["蔡委員其昌：好。這個輔導計畫好了之後，對於ADAS系統在行車安全上面的，你先會讓他們……"],["林所長繼國：熟悉。"],["蔡委員其昌：熟悉嘛，然後也讓AI的辨識度，因為data多了，它的辨識精準度就高嘛……"],["林所長繼國：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：你覺得實際運用的時程會落在什麼時候？"],["林所長繼國：我想明年我們實際就會找業者來做試辦，到時候就可以從這個過程當中……"],["蔡委員其昌：對，試辦我知道，但你覺得這樣的系統普遍運用在國道客運跟市區的公車上面，時間大概還要多久？"],["林所長繼國：我預估大概3到5年。"],["蔡委員其昌：3到5年？"],["林所長繼國：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：時程要儘量掌握，如果這是一個有用的技術，因為我們都知道，這個系統裝上去，如果成效好的話，事實上對於國道客運，特別在市區，你看市區很多的車禍，對於公車去撞到行人等等，如果這個系統你們經過測試、教育訓練都可以成功，未來勢必對於行人受到公車、大型巴士傷害的機率就會下降……"],["林所長繼國：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：人命關天啦！"],["林所長繼國：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：這種有效的事情要早一點做，要快一點做。"],["林所長繼國：好，我們加速。"],["蔡委員其昌：對。這個講的都是實際的，有的議題我聽起來都覺得不一定能夠怎樣，但是這是馬上可以立即改善很多這種死角，公車在行駛的過程裡面司機沒有去注意到的，透過科技的發展協助公車的駕駛以保障行人的安全，這個很重要，好不好？所長。"],["林所長繼國：是，這個我知道。謝謝。"],["蔡委員其昌：114年度這筆預算要趕快下去執行，怎麼去縮短，同時來做，如果有效，怎麼去縮短時程可以快速落實在所有的大巴士上面。"],["林所長繼國：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：好。謝謝。"],["陳部長世凱：是，我們來加速。"],["蔡委員其昌：所長請回，我請主委。"],["主席：請林主委。"],["蔡委員其昌：主委，有關運安會，我想多次在我辦公室，我們有協調過，有了解過，其實我有一些數據，趁著今天部長也在，想跟您就教。第一個，運安會在事故調查的展期率高達65%，很多研究都顯示調查時間過長。這個我也曾經跟你就教過，你也跟我提出包括運安會人力不足等等的問題，你們要……是像其他單位，不是說其他單位隨便調查，意思是說運安會非常認真調查，所以你覺得時程都會久，但是這個數字看起來並不好看。你看運安會運輸事故調查的展期情形，你看這個展期的比率，從航空的23%，水路的76%，鐵道的63%，公路的13%，然後合計平均大概65%，這個時間大家覺得很長。所以，主委，這部分有可以縮短的可能性存在嗎？"],["林主任委員信得：跟委員報告，展期率的統計，它是從一開始成立的時候就一直算，一直算到去年底。"],["蔡委員其昌：對，沒錯。"],["林主任委員信得：因為這個運安會一成立的時候，有三個主要因素是這樣子，我們成立的時候要用人，招考人來，可是它並沒有籌備的階段……"],["蔡委員其昌：我知道，人不夠啦。"],["林主任委員信得：對，人不夠，它直接……"],["蔡委員其昌：我知道啦，直接就開始了啦！"],["林主任委員信得：對，然後又要招考人，又要訓練，又要調查。"],["蔡委員其昌：對，沒錯。"],["林主任委員信得：所以這個展期率那麼高，是古早譬如說……"],["蔡委員其昌：主委，我簡單講，應該就是說，讓你們在未來訓練人的時間會變少，所以再過一、兩年的時間，這個數字就會下來了，這樣對不對？"],["林主任委員信得：沒有錯，因為他還在算以前已經固定的東西，所以當然那個分子還是很大……"],["蔡委員其昌：我知道，我懂你的意思。"],["林主任委員信得：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：訓練成熟的人力到投入跟你要重新招募、訓練到投入相比，會讓這個數字顯得特別高。"],["林主任委員信得：對。"],["蔡委員其昌：這樣講對啦？"],["林主任委員信得：對，沒有錯。"],["蔡委員其昌：對這個數字我再給你一、兩年的時間，我會很注意，你不要在兩年後我來質詢你的時候你又跟我說還是65%這麼高，好不好？"],["林主任委員信得：這個是預算中心算的，如果是在110年以前的，因為都已經結案了，展期就展期了，以後如果有展期，這個數字就會很好看。"],["蔡委員其昌：所以第二個數字你可以幫我把它切開來給我嗎？"],["林主任委員信得：對。"],["蔡委員其昌：好，那你把那個數字稍微切開來給我一下，讓我知道運安會的展期真的在我們立法院的監督底下的確是有效改善、有把時間縮短，這樣好不好？"],["林主任委員信得：沒問題，謝謝委員。"],["蔡委員其昌：否則我們用這個標準，我們在議場上要來討論這個數字對你們也不公平，對社會也有誤導之嫌，變成好像我們也監督得不夠確實，所以請把數字給我，好不好？"],["林主任委員信得：是，謝謝。"],["蔡委員其昌：我們要提第三個問題，因為運安會調查報告的結果就是要求行政單位來改善，那我看了一下這個報告要求改善的建議事項，在所謂的分項執行計畫列管情形中，這個列管比率都還有百分之二十幾、百分之十幾，甚至列管年限還有3年以上的，一個事情要列管3年，我不知道3年以上的是哪一個案子，像航空3年以上的就有5件，鐵道就有9件，都是列管3年以上。部長也在這裡，你要不要跟部長講一下為什麼會列管這麼久，是你列管的有問題還是交通部執行的有問題？就是死不改，所以你才一直列管嘛！到底是什麼問題？你們兩位都站在這裡，我就一次同時問你們，這樣會比較快。"],["林主任委員信得：因為完成率這個數字最主要是被幾個大數字拉下來，譬如說，高雄機場那個跑、滑道的安全性要改善，編列預算要編好幾年；譬如說臺中的清泉崗機場也是一樣，它跑、滑道的系統要檢查、要改善的話，國防部編預算也是編了很多年，就掛在那邊，這是最主要的因素。"],["蔡委員其昌：如果他就在做了，他已經在執行了，預算也照年度編列了，你們這個列管的方法要不要調整一下？因為這樣很難看，一個事情一直在列管，3年以上還在列管，到底是發生什麼事情？3年以上還在列管，如果你沒有告訴我原因，我會認為他就是不做，3年都不做。那第二種解釋方式是事實不是這樣，他已經在做了，他已經做3年了，但是還沒有做完，所以就還在列管。"],["林主任委員信得：對，委員講的是重點，確實沒有錯，我們在行政院開會的時候，我們也跟政委報告，譬如說，臺鐵已經有編了預算，我們也看得到進度有往前在走，那我們就會建議對這個就不要列管了。可是像剛剛講的臺中清泉崗機場是國防部編預算、民航局對高雄機場編預算買土地，把那個安全性擴大的這個部分，如果我們看不到他的預算，就還是會被列管，是這個意思啊！"],["蔡委員其昌：當然啊！你都沒有在做，我當然列管你啊！我的意思是說，他已經在進行當中，你應該是採另外一種列管方式。"],["林主任委員信得：對，沒錯。"],["蔡委員其昌：對，我認為要動態的列管，動態的列管就是我只是追蹤你有沒有進度，譬如說，你跟我講要做5年，那每一年的進度到多少，我持續關注你的進度，你沒有進度，我就把你放到列管，你沒有按照你的進度走，我就回到列管，但是你只要按照進度走，我應該是採另外一種列管方式，這樣我們立委在監督的時候，才不會在看到這種列管3年以上的都會懷疑現在是怎麼樣，是交通部都不理你就對了，是完全不鳥你運安會嗎？不是嘛！所以你要讓我們知道什麼事情是他不鳥你的，那冤有頭、債有主，就知道該怎麼監督。可是有一些是人家已經著手在進行，案子就是一定要做5年，簡單講，明年還有那個列管4年的，因為他要做5年嘛！我的意思是這樣，你懂我的意思嗎？"],["林主任委員信得：是，我們來檢討一個機制，如果他是在進行中、看得見的，那我們用另外一種列管方式……"],["蔡委員其昌：對，應該有另外一種追蹤、列管的方法，而不是通通統合在一個好像都沒有做的那種列管裡面，這樣好不好？"],["林主任委員信得：好，謝謝。"],["蔡委員其昌：這樣我們才有辦法監督，不然我看到這種數字都覺得很離譜，3年以上還有5件，鐵道還有9件，要嚇死人了，現在是怎麼樣？運安會說的話都沒人要聽就對了！這樣不行啊！"],["林主任委員信得：我們來研究另外一種方式。"],["蔡委員其昌：運安會的報告要求改善的就是為了確保我們交通載具的安全，這是維護人民生命財產的重大事情。"],["林主任委員信得：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：所以這樣好不好？這樣我們才有能力去監督嘛！"],["林主任委員信得：是。"],["蔡委員其昌：好，謝謝。"],["林主任委員信得：謝謝委員。"],["陳部長世凱：謝謝委員。"],["主席：好，謝謝蔡委員。","現在宣告，待會在何欣純委員發言完畢之後，休息10分鐘。","有請游顥委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":444,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-23-15","speakers":["魯明哲","李昆澤","林國成","林俊憲","陳素月","蔡其昌","游顥","何欣純","徐富癸","廖先翔","陳雪生","邱若華","楊瓊瓔","牛煦庭","許智傑","鍾佳濱","黃健豪"],"page_start":379,"meetingDate":["2024-12-16"],"gazette_id":"1140501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1140501_00009"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期交通委員會第15次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請國家運輸安全調查委員會主任委員林信得列席報告業務概況，並備質詢；二、審查114\n年度中央政府總預算案關於國家運輸安全調查委員會單位預算；三、審查114年度中央政府總預\n算案關於交通部運輸研究所單位預算；四、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於交通部鐵道局及\n所屬單位預算；五、審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算非營業部分關於交通部主管交\n通作業基金─鐵道發展基金分預算【僅進行詢答】","agenda_id":"1140501_00014"}}}