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00:00:54,062\n你這應該回答很清楚才對啊這是第一點第二點呢這個3753億撥給地方之後地方的財源就相當充裕了對不對但是呢它唯一可以調整的就是計劃型補助反倒是計劃型補助以外計劃型補助的縣市發展會延宕很多這裡頭的資金的部分要怎麼處理就變成是之前我們所謂的保險基金保險的那個資金要如何來運用在整個\n\n3\n00:00:54,722 --> 00:01:18,773\n更重大的公共建設,這顯得更加急迫了。部長,你有沒有認為如此?您說的是,確實是,因為三兆億裡面有一些是法定義務支出的,所以這個部分是不能動的。那另外的部分是不是屬於法定義務支出的部分?不是那麼容易嘛,對不對?是,本來就是不容易的事情。對,但它影響的衝擊是主要是資本門的部分。當然會衝擊到中央的施政。\n\n4\n00:01:19,313 --> 00:01:34,921\n中央跟地方的部分特別是資本門的部分資本門的部分特別需要重大民間資金的引入所以財政部的責任就更加重大不是嗎這部分要特別加強速度要快一點不然會耽誤到地方的一些重大的建設的一個進度\n\n5\n00:01:36,402 --> 00:02:02,529\n另外一個部分部長另外一個部分之前在財委會的時候一直討論到兩個稅一個是印花稅一個是娛樂稅你每次都講說印花稅基於替代財源籌措有所困難因為影響到地方的建設發展所以不予匯除第二個娛樂稅的部分說地方政府重要的財源我查一查印花稅今年1月到11月總共是180億娛樂稅大概是17億兩個夯不啷噹加起來大概200億\n\n6\n00:02:06,291 --> 00:02:17,739\n這210現在對地方來說是小條了他已經有3753頁你現在要不要評估一下這兩個長久以來備受爭議的這個地方稅把它廢除掉有沒有可能部長\n\n7\n00:02:21,616 --> 00:02:40,690\n瞭解還是同意你去看一看我就給你看一下在當時討論的時候確實是各地方政府都反對對那現在他有錢啊中央窮啊對不對當初你考慮地方是不是可以重新調整一下有沒有思考的空間我舉一個例子就好了你去看看\n\n8\n00:02:41,711 --> 00:03:05,456\n連金融業的部分你不要說一般的連統一發票你拿到錢都要去付都要付印發稅金融業的部分只要是本業的部分都要繳印發稅除了營業稅之外你還要繳印發稅然後其他的金融業都是如此銀行保險更是如此而且他還要設計還要在地方上設立一個會計人員對不對部長你知道嗎這影響非常的大生意非常的多\n\n9\n00:03:10,208 --> 00:03:26,198\n是不是要考慮一下?要不要檢討一下?我想這個整個財劃法如果這樣子修正過了以後整個地方的稅制要不要做調整當然我覺得這是一個思考的一個方向所以說包括這兩個廢除了是思考方向對不對?\n\n10\n00:03:26,758 --> 00:03:53,221\n是可以思考的方向所以思考嘛我看署長也在點頭嘛對不對如果這樣子的話你一直顧慮他他也沒有在顧慮你嘛而且是爭議的稅都是你們在當門神幫他守住嘛兩百億算什麼他現在有三千七百五十三億了好耶啦有錢了啦好接下來我先問你一個問題有關於公股這一個整併的問題公股銀行底下的子宮心子盼我列一個表給你看你看右邊的\n\n11\n00:03:54,122 --> 00:04:11,417\n政卷、投信、創投、資產都有這一個這四家趙鋒、西醫、核庫、華南都有還有包括剛剛那個我們聽到那個誰啊那個台銀也有還有包括什麼那個張銀跟台企銀也有創投\n\n12\n00:04:12,778 --> 00:04:39,020\n這個其實是有合併的空間我講給你聽第一個保險的部分我們的保險都賺那個個位數億的啦那你去看民間的保險都賺3位數甚至4位數啦700多億跟900多億啦差那麼多啦第二個呢AMC的部分合庫的部分賺最多的3.4億賺最少呢華南銀行0.27兩千多萬而已投薪的部分呢賺最多的是哪一個單位\n\n13\n00:04:41,209 --> 00:04:59,241\n我看一看真的很可憐欸賺最多是第一銀行欸1.11欸那華南銀行還麻辣死欸這些公司真的老實講齁非常急塞啊有沒有可能把所有同類型的部分來進行一個合併的可能要考慮到那個工會意見的情況底下來做一個推動啊那個部長\n\n14\n00:05:00,287 --> 00:05:24,174\n我都幫你列好啦瞭解我知道委員的意思齁我都幫你排列組合好了您的意思是希望把相同類的把它整併然後讓它更有忠孝然後更有競爭力那當然這個部分呢必須要進行相關的一個要做合一的整併合一的整併而且要遵循相關的法規對遵循相關的法規講了我都同意啦你講了都重複啦也同意啦\n\n15\n00:05:24,834 --> 00:05:53,387\n問題是你什麼時候有一個政策評估出來啦這個部分必須要有一個詳細的一個評估你就是大老闆嘛你財政部大老闆底下都歸你管嘛啊你的態度最關鍵嘛當然這還有其他的相關的股東以及員工跟客戶都要考量而且我跟你講最誇張的是什麼你知道嗎最誇張的是什麼我跟你講最誇張的是台灣金融啊台灣金融是銀行公會號召成立的台灣金融就銀行公會成立金融台灣金融是要處理那個金融風暴的這個不良資產\n\n16\n00:05:54,307 --> 00:06:20,118\n結果成立4家金控公司以後各個金控公司底下又成立了所謂的AMC那個很奇怪嘛業務重疊不是嗎而且你看看喔臺灣今年的爭議性多大不論是兩次的人事爭議還有之前的被炒房還有甚至拿去炒股馬英九時代拿去炒股還自己瓜分了7000萬還被告你知道臺聯金控的董事長臺銀的董事長林董事長請上來一下\n\n17\n00:06:23,786 --> 00:06:24,469\n時間暫停林董事長\n\n18\n00:06:31,456 --> 00:06:53,902\n林董事長我就問你好了報告委員我不是台灣今年的董事長我當然不知道你不是台灣今年的董事長我不是是你董事長你是台銀金控的董事長吧林董你一年的薪水多少錢不好意思啦在這裡不好講不好意思講240、250嘛對不對我應該沒有猜錯嘛差不多差不多嘛240、250你的營業額多少營業額3000億有沒有\n\n19\n00:06:57,932 --> 00:07:14,810\n超過阿3000億請坐啦3000億好我跟你講台灣金融的營業營收多少不到20億阿你知道嗎他的薪水有多少嗎他的薪水根據報宅月薪31萬年薪400外加假金800有卸幕沒有\n\n20\n00:07:16,291 --> 00:07:40,930\n老實說你如果不說羨慕的話你後面的待遇我都不處理了很羨慕很羨慕超級羨慕我看你的表情超級羨慕你的倍數是他的15倍營業是15倍他的薪水是你的將近3倍多4倍拜託這個台灣今年還有存在空間現在沒有什麼不良資產可以處理了不是嗎部長回復一下態度怎麼樣\n\n21\n00:07:46,274 --> 00:07:52,038\n他們是公股民營的一個公司他們的薪資有他們現在有一個標準規範官方在主導啦這個都有合併的可能有沒有\n\n22\n00:07:59,855 --> 00:08:23,648\n這個要詳細的再來評估你每次都講這種模糊兩可的話讓其他的公股董事長那麼費心力你看一個拿了800萬一個拿200多萬一個營業3000然後一個營業不到20差那麼多我就舉這個例子就好了啦所以這些啊底下這些子公司啊老實講很多啊都有一些合併的這個可能性\n\n23\n00:08:25,589 --> 00:08:34,939\n那我不能說只叫苔穎了還有我請那個戴瑞理事主席也上來一下時間暫停一下你看看喔這數字都有\n\n24\n00:08:36,756 --> 00:08:59,827\n部長,我再問一下部長,代理事主席部長,你這個能不能給本席一個月裡頭做一個評估你yesorno要不要進行合併的方案我們可以寫一個書面報告給委員書面報告?一個月?態度是如何?方向是怎麼樣?哪些比較有可能性?委員是不是可以給我們三個月啊?三個月啊?\n\n25\n00:09:01,532 --> 00:09:18,928\n那這樣兩個月好了啦好謝謝委員職場管理公司的部分特別是職場管理公司特別是臺灣經聯啦我給你點名啦好不好你覺得我剛剛講有沒有道理我再最後一次問你我想委員的意見我們都會納入考量你實在太客氣了也是太模糊了來主席來\n\n26\n00:09:20,216 --> 00:09:35,441\n代理處主席整個輸出銀行的政策很多新南向的部分很重要我就問你一件事情總統最近有出訪太平洋三小國這三小國你有沒有幫忙到輸出銀行\n\n27\n00:09:37,881 --> 00:09:51,912\n報告委員我們這三部分都沒有因為我們做的是一般的商業性的貸款即使跟國家之間的貸款也用商業貸款的模式來處理你有國家融資保證的機構還有新南向政策這是南向的範圍\n\n28\n00:09:53,553 --> 00:10:21,238\n而且這三小國在整個區域安全上是佔有很大的關鍵性再加上外交部現在有所謂的榮邦計畫你是不是要跟外交部稍微主動跟他討論看看是不是對這個戰略性的這個國家友好的這個對象有一些加強的可能性不要做繼承的業務而已還有包括最近我們整個外交情勢的發展非常的重要如果扮演一個金融外交的角色非常的關鍵再加上立陶宛\n\n29\n00:10:21,758 --> 00:10:46,372\n歐洲的這些破了地海三小國跟我們之間的關係也非常非常的友好這個部分你能不能作為做一個瞭解通盤檢討然後跟外交部做一個討論是不是有增加的可能增加對象的可能是這個我們會努力來辦理那個中東歐中歐跟東歐的部分我們一個中東歐融資基金現在有在辦理的大概有15個案子有15個案子這是新增的嗎\n\n30\n00:10:47,172 --> 00:11:10,764\n對,這是新增的那這15個你再給本席一下那其他的有一些要搭配整個外交布局的你這個本來就負有政策責任的嘛對不對這是國力的一種延伸的展現啊更何況我們之前也給你多了150億不是嗎我現在不是跟你要人情啦是希望你發揮績效好不好我們會來努力好,謝謝理事主席、謝謝部長、謝謝林董、謝謝好,謝謝郭國文委員的話言\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n990\t20761\t謝謝主席 有請莊部長請莊部長委員好部長好 部長剛剛的賴委員在質詢的時候他說只有一層其實不是啊法定支出3.1兆的部分法定支出佔1.8兆剩下可以活用是1.3兆1.3兆3723億是28.47%啊部長\n26764\t54062\t你這應該回答很清楚才對啊這是第一點第二點呢這個3753億撥給地方之後地方的財源就相當充裕了對不對但是呢它唯一可以調整的就是計劃型補助反倒是計劃型補助以外計劃型補助的縣市發展會延宕很多這裡頭的資金的部分要怎麼處理就變成是之前我們所謂的保險基金保險的那個資金要如何來運用在整個\n54722\t78773\t更重大的公共建設,這顯得更加急迫了。部長,你有沒有認為如此?您說的是,確實是,因為三兆億裡面有一些是法定義務支出的,所以這個部分是不能動的。那另外的部分是不是屬於法定義務支出的部分?不是那麼容易嘛,對不對?是,本來就是不容易的事情。對,但它影響的衝擊是主要是資本門的部分。當然會衝擊到中央的施政。\n79313\t94921\t中央跟地方的部分特別是資本門的部分資本門的部分特別需要重大民間資金的引入所以財政部的責任就更加重大不是嗎這部分要特別加強速度要快一點不然會耽誤到地方的一些重大的建設的一個進度\n96402\t122529\t另外一個部分部長另外一個部分之前在財委會的時候一直討論到兩個稅一個是印花稅一個是娛樂稅你每次都講說印花稅基於替代財源籌措有所困難因為影響到地方的建設發展所以不予匯除第二個娛樂稅的部分說地方政府重要的財源我查一查印花稅今年1月到11月總共是180億娛樂稅大概是17億兩個夯不啷噹加起來大概200億\n126291\t137739\t這210現在對地方來說是小條了他已經有3753頁你現在要不要評估一下這兩個長久以來備受爭議的這個地方稅把它廢除掉有沒有可能 部長\n141616\t160690\t瞭解還是同意你去看一看我就給你看一下在當時討論的時候確實是各地方政府都反對對那現在他有錢啊中央窮啊對不對當初你考慮地方是不是可以重新調整一下有沒有思考的空間我舉一個例子就好了你去看看\n161711\t185456\t連金融業的部分你不要說一般的連統一發票你拿到錢都要去付都要付印發稅金融業的部分只要是本業的部分都要繳印發稅除了營業稅之外你還要繳印發稅然後其他的金融業都是如此銀行保險更是如此而且他還要設計還要在地方上設立一個會計人員對不對部長你知道嗎這影響非常的大生意非常的多\n190208\t206198\t是不是要考慮一下?要不要檢討一下?我想這個整個財劃法如果這樣子修正過了以後整個地方的稅制要不要做調整當然我覺得這是一個思考的一個方向所以說包括這兩個廢除了是思考方向對不對?\n206758\t233221\t是可以思考的方向所以思考嘛我看署長也在點頭嘛對不對如果這樣子的話你一直顧慮他他也沒有在顧慮你嘛而且是爭議的稅都是你們在當門神幫他守住嘛兩百億算什麼他現在有三千七百五十三億了好耶啦有錢了啦好接下來我先問你一個問題有關於公股這一個整併的問題公股銀行底下的子宮心子盼我列一個表給你看你看右邊的\n234122\t251417\t政卷、投信、創投、資產都有這一個這四家趙鋒、西醫、核庫、華南都有還有包括剛剛那個我們聽到那個誰啊那個台銀也有還有包括什麼那個張銀跟台企銀也有創投\n252778\t279020\t這個其實是有合併的空間我講給你聽第一個保險的部分我們的保險都賺那個個位數億的啦那你去看民間的保險都賺3位數甚至4位數啦700多億跟900多億啦差那麼多啦第二個呢AMC的部分合庫的部分賺最多的3.4億賺最少呢華南銀行0.27兩千多萬而已投薪的部分呢賺最多的是哪一個單位\n281209\t299241\t我看一看真的很可憐欸賺最多是第一銀行欸 1.11欸那華南銀行還麻辣死欸這些公司真的老實講齁 非常急塞啊有沒有可能把所有同類型的部分來進行一個合併的可能要考慮到那個工會意見的情況底下來做一個推動啊那個部長\n300287\t324174\t我都幫你列好啦瞭解我知道委員的意思齁我都幫你排列組合好了您的意思是希望把相同類的把它整併然後讓它更有忠孝然後更有競爭力那當然這個部分呢必須要進行相關的一個要做合一的整併合一的整併而且要遵循相關的法規對遵循相關的法規講了我都同意啦你講了都重複啦也同意啦\n324834\t353387\t問題是你什麼時候有一個政策評估出來啦這個部分必須要有一個詳細的一個評估你就是大老闆嘛你財政部大老闆底下都歸你管嘛啊你的態度最關鍵嘛當然這還有其他的相關的股東以及員工跟客戶都要考量而且我跟你講最誇張的是什麼你知道嗎最誇張的是什麼我跟你講最誇張的是台灣金融啊台灣金融是銀行公會號召成立的台灣金融就銀行公會成立金融台灣金融是要處理那個金融風暴的這個不良資產\n354307\t380118\t結果成立4家金控公司以後各個金控公司底下又成立了所謂的AMC那個很奇怪嘛業務重疊不是嗎而且你看看喔臺灣今年的爭議性多大不論是兩次的人事爭議還有之前的被炒房還有甚至拿去炒股馬英九時代拿去炒股還自己瓜分了7000萬還被告你知道臺聯金控的董事長臺銀的董事長林董事長請上來一下\n383786\t384469\t時間暫停林董事長\n391456\t413902\t林董事長我就問你好了報告委員我不是台灣今年的董事長我當然不知道你不是台灣今年的董事長我不是是你董事長你是台銀金控的董事長吧林董你一年的薪水多少錢不好意思啦在這裡不好講不好意思講240、250嘛對不對我應該沒有猜錯嘛差不多差不多嘛240、250你的營業額多少營業額3000億有沒有\n417932\t434810\t超過阿3000億請坐啦3000億好我跟你講台灣金融的營業營收多少不到20億阿你知道嗎他的薪水有多少嗎他的薪水根據報宅月薪31萬年薪400外加假金800有卸幕沒有\n436291\t460930\t老實說你如果不說羨慕的話你後面的待遇我都不處理了很羨慕很羨慕超級羨慕我看你的表情超級羨慕你的倍數是他的15倍營業是15倍他的薪水是你的將近3倍多4倍拜託這個台灣今年還有存在空間現在沒有什麼不良資產可以處理了不是嗎部長回復一下態度怎麼樣\n466274\t472038\t他們是公股民營的一個公司他們的薪資有他們現在有一個標準規範官方在主導啦這個都有合併的可能有沒有\n479855\t503648\t這個要詳細的再來評估你每次都講這種模糊兩可的話讓其他的公股董事長那麼費心力你看一個拿了800萬一個拿200多萬一個營業3000然後一個營業不到20差那麼多我就舉這個例子就好了啦所以這些啊底下這些子公司啊老實講很多啊都有一些合併的這個可能性\n505589\t514939\t那我不能說只叫苔穎了還有我請那個戴瑞理事主席也上來一下時間暫停一下你看看喔 這數字都有\n516756\t539827\t部長,我再問一下部長,代理事主席部長,你這個能不能給本席一個月裡頭做一個評估你yes or no要不要進行合併的方案我們可以寫一個書面報告給委員書面報告?一個月?態度是如何?方向是怎麼樣?哪些比較有可能性?委員是不是可以給我們三個月啊?三個月啊?\n541532\t558928\t那這樣兩個月好了啦好 謝謝委員職場管理公司的部分特別是職場管理公司特別是臺灣經聯啦我給你點名啦好不好你覺得我剛剛講有沒有道理我再最後一次問你我想委員的意見我們都會納入考量你實在太客氣了也是太模糊了 來主席來\n560216\t575441\t代理處主席整個輸出銀行的政策很多新南向的部分很重要我就問你一件事情總統最近有出訪太平洋三小國這三小國你有沒有幫忙到輸出銀行\n577881\t591912\t報告委員我們這三部分都沒有因為我們做的是一般的商業性的貸款即使跟國家之間的貸款也用商業貸款的模式來處理你有國家融資保證的機構還有新南向政策這是南向的範圍\n593553\t621238\t而且這三小國在整個區域安全上是佔有很大的關鍵性再加上外交部現在有所謂的榮邦計畫你是不是要跟外交部稍微主動跟他討論看看是不是對這個戰略性的這個國家友好的這個對象有一些加強的可能性不要做繼承的業務而已還有包括最近我們整個外交情勢的發展非常的重要如果扮演一個金融外交的角色非常的關鍵再加上立陶宛\n621758\t646372\t歐洲的這些破了地海三小國跟我們之間的關係也非常非常的友好這個部分你能不能作為做一個瞭解通盤檢討然後跟外交部做一個討論是不是有增加的可能增加對象的可能是 這個我們會努力來辦理那個中東歐中歐跟東歐的部分我們一個中東歐融資基金現在有在辦理的大概有15個案子有15個案子這是新增的嗎\n647172\t670764\t對,這是新增的那這15個你再給本席一下那其他的有一些要搭配整個外交布局的你這個本來就負有政策責任的嘛對不對這是國力的一種延伸的展現啊更何況我們之前也給你多了150億不是嗎我現在不是跟你要人情啦是希望你發揮績效好不好我們會來努力好,謝謝理事主席、謝謝部長、謝謝林董、謝謝好,謝謝郭國文委員的話言\n","txt":"謝謝主席 有請莊部長請莊部長委員好部長好 部長剛剛的賴委員在質詢的時候他說只有一層其實不是啊法定支出3.1兆的部分法定支出佔1.8兆剩下可以活用是1.3兆1.3兆3723億是28.47%啊部長\n你這應該回答很清楚才對啊這是第一點第二點呢這個3753億撥給地方之後地方的財源就相當充裕了對不對但是呢它唯一可以調整的就是計劃型補助反倒是計劃型補助以外計劃型補助的縣市發展會延宕很多這裡頭的資金的部分要怎麼處理就變成是之前我們所謂的保險基金保險的那個資金要如何來運用在整個\n更重大的公共建設,這顯得更加急迫了。部長,你有沒有認為如此?您說的是,確實是,因為三兆億裡面有一些是法定義務支出的,所以這個部分是不能動的。那另外的部分是不是屬於法定義務支出的部分?不是那麼容易嘛,對不對?是,本來就是不容易的事情。對,但它影響的衝擊是主要是資本門的部分。當然會衝擊到中央的施政。\n中央跟地方的部分特別是資本門的部分資本門的部分特別需要重大民間資金的引入所以財政部的責任就更加重大不是嗎這部分要特別加強速度要快一點不然會耽誤到地方的一些重大的建設的一個進度\n另外一個部分部長另外一個部分之前在財委會的時候一直討論到兩個稅一個是印花稅一個是娛樂稅你每次都講說印花稅基於替代財源籌措有所困難因為影響到地方的建設發展所以不予匯除第二個娛樂稅的部分說地方政府重要的財源我查一查印花稅今年1月到11月總共是180億娛樂稅大概是17億兩個夯不啷噹加起來大概200億\n這210現在對地方來說是小條了他已經有3753頁你現在要不要評估一下這兩個長久以來備受爭議的這個地方稅把它廢除掉有沒有可能 部長\n瞭解還是同意你去看一看我就給你看一下在當時討論的時候確實是各地方政府都反對對那現在他有錢啊中央窮啊對不對當初你考慮地方是不是可以重新調整一下有沒有思考的空間我舉一個例子就好了你去看看\n連金融業的部分你不要說一般的連統一發票你拿到錢都要去付都要付印發稅金融業的部分只要是本業的部分都要繳印發稅除了營業稅之外你還要繳印發稅然後其他的金融業都是如此銀行保險更是如此而且他還要設計還要在地方上設立一個會計人員對不對部長你知道嗎這影響非常的大生意非常的多\n是不是要考慮一下?要不要檢討一下?我想這個整個財劃法如果這樣子修正過了以後整個地方的稅制要不要做調整當然我覺得這是一個思考的一個方向所以說包括這兩個廢除了是思考方向對不對?\n是可以思考的方向所以思考嘛我看署長也在點頭嘛對不對如果這樣子的話你一直顧慮他他也沒有在顧慮你嘛而且是爭議的稅都是你們在當門神幫他守住嘛兩百億算什麼他現在有三千七百五十三億了好耶啦有錢了啦好接下來我先問你一個問題有關於公股這一個整併的問題公股銀行底下的子宮心子盼我列一個表給你看你看右邊的\n政卷、投信、創投、資產都有這一個這四家趙鋒、西醫、核庫、華南都有還有包括剛剛那個我們聽到那個誰啊那個台銀也有還有包括什麼那個張銀跟台企銀也有創投\n這個其實是有合併的空間我講給你聽第一個保險的部分我們的保險都賺那個個位數億的啦那你去看民間的保險都賺3位數甚至4位數啦700多億跟900多億啦差那麼多啦第二個呢AMC的部分合庫的部分賺最多的3.4億賺最少呢華南銀行0.27兩千多萬而已投薪的部分呢賺最多的是哪一個單位\n我看一看真的很可憐欸賺最多是第一銀行欸 1.11欸那華南銀行還麻辣死欸這些公司真的老實講齁 非常急塞啊有沒有可能把所有同類型的部分來進行一個合併的可能要考慮到那個工會意見的情況底下來做一個推動啊那個部長\n我都幫你列好啦瞭解我知道委員的意思齁我都幫你排列組合好了您的意思是希望把相同類的把它整併然後讓它更有忠孝然後更有競爭力那當然這個部分呢必須要進行相關的一個要做合一的整併合一的整併而且要遵循相關的法規對遵循相關的法規講了我都同意啦你講了都重複啦也同意啦\n問題是你什麼時候有一個政策評估出來啦這個部分必須要有一個詳細的一個評估你就是大老闆嘛你財政部大老闆底下都歸你管嘛啊你的態度最關鍵嘛當然這還有其他的相關的股東以及員工跟客戶都要考量而且我跟你講最誇張的是什麼你知道嗎最誇張的是什麼我跟你講最誇張的是台灣金融啊台灣金融是銀行公會號召成立的台灣金融就銀行公會成立金融台灣金融是要處理那個金融風暴的這個不良資產\n結果成立4家金控公司以後各個金控公司底下又成立了所謂的AMC那個很奇怪嘛業務重疊不是嗎而且你看看喔臺灣今年的爭議性多大不論是兩次的人事爭議還有之前的被炒房還有甚至拿去炒股馬英九時代拿去炒股還自己瓜分了7000萬還被告你知道臺聯金控的董事長臺銀的董事長林董事長請上來一下\n時間暫停林董事長\n林董事長我就問你好了報告委員我不是台灣今年的董事長我當然不知道你不是台灣今年的董事長我不是是你董事長你是台銀金控的董事長吧林董你一年的薪水多少錢不好意思啦在這裡不好講不好意思講240、250嘛對不對我應該沒有猜錯嘛差不多差不多嘛240、250你的營業額多少營業額3000億有沒有\n超過阿3000億請坐啦3000億好我跟你講台灣金融的營業營收多少不到20億阿你知道嗎他的薪水有多少嗎他的薪水根據報宅月薪31萬年薪400外加假金800有卸幕沒有\n老實說你如果不說羨慕的話你後面的待遇我都不處理了很羨慕很羨慕超級羨慕我看你的表情超級羨慕你的倍數是他的15倍營業是15倍他的薪水是你的將近3倍多4倍拜託這個台灣今年還有存在空間現在沒有什麼不良資產可以處理了不是嗎部長回復一下態度怎麼樣\n他們是公股民營的一個公司他們的薪資有他們現在有一個標準規範官方在主導啦這個都有合併的可能有沒有\n這個要詳細的再來評估你每次都講這種模糊兩可的話讓其他的公股董事長那麼費心力你看一個拿了800萬一個拿200多萬一個營業3000然後一個營業不到20差那麼多我就舉這個例子就好了啦所以這些啊底下這些子公司啊老實講很多啊都有一些合併的這個可能性\n那我不能說只叫苔穎了還有我請那個戴瑞理事主席也上來一下時間暫停一下你看看喔 這數字都有\n部長,我再問一下部長,代理事主席部長,你這個能不能給本席一個月裡頭做一個評估你yes or no要不要進行合併的方案我們可以寫一個書面報告給委員書面報告?一個月?態度是如何?方向是怎麼樣?哪些比較有可能性?委員是不是可以給我們三個月啊?三個月啊?\n那這樣兩個月好了啦好 謝謝委員職場管理公司的部分特別是職場管理公司特別是臺灣經聯啦我給你點名啦好不好你覺得我剛剛講有沒有道理我再最後一次問你我想委員的意見我們都會納入考量你實在太客氣了也是太模糊了 來主席來\n代理處主席整個輸出銀行的政策很多新南向的部分很重要我就問你一件事情總統最近有出訪太平洋三小國這三小國你有沒有幫忙到輸出銀行\n報告委員我們這三部分都沒有因為我們做的是一般的商業性的貸款即使跟國家之間的貸款也用商業貸款的模式來處理你有國家融資保證的機構還有新南向政策這是南向的範圍\n而且這三小國在整個區域安全上是佔有很大的關鍵性再加上外交部現在有所謂的榮邦計畫你是不是要跟外交部稍微主動跟他討論看看是不是對這個戰略性的這個國家友好的這個對象有一些加強的可能性不要做繼承的業務而已還有包括最近我們整個外交情勢的發展非常的重要如果扮演一個金融外交的角色非常的關鍵再加上立陶宛\n歐洲的這些破了地海三小國跟我們之間的關係也非常非常的友好這個部分你能不能作為做一個瞭解通盤檢討然後跟外交部做一個討論是不是有增加的可能增加對象的可能是 這個我們會努力來辦理那個中東歐中歐跟東歐的部分我們一個中東歐融資基金現在有在辦理的大概有15個案子有15個案子這是新增的嗎\n對,這是新增的那這15個你再給本席一下那其他的有一些要搭配整個外交布局的你這個本來就負有政策責任的嘛對不對這是國力的一種延伸的展現啊更何況我們之前也給你多了150億不是嗎我現在不是跟你要人情啦是希望你發揮績效好不好我們會來努力好,謝謝理事主席、謝謝部長、謝謝林董、謝謝好,謝謝郭國文委員的話言\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.990 --> 00:20.761\n謝謝主席有請莊部長請莊部長委員好部長好部長剛剛的賴委員在質詢的時候他說只有一層其實不是啊法定支出3.1兆的部分法定支出佔1.8兆剩下可以活用是1.3兆1.3兆3723億是28.47%啊部長\n\n00:26.764 --> 00:54.062\n你這應該回答很清楚才對啊這是第一點第二點呢這個3753億撥給地方之後地方的財源就相當充裕了對不對但是呢它唯一可以調整的就是計劃型補助反倒是計劃型補助以外計劃型補助的縣市發展會延宕很多這裡頭的資金的部分要怎麼處理就變成是之前我們所謂的保險基金保險的那個資金要如何來運用在整個\n\n00:54.722 --> 01:18.773\n更重大的公共建設,這顯得更加急迫了。部長,你有沒有認為如此?您說的是,確實是,因為三兆億裡面有一些是法定義務支出的,所以這個部分是不能動的。那另外的部分是不是屬於法定義務支出的部分?不是那麼容易嘛,對不對?是,本來就是不容易的事情。對,但它影響的衝擊是主要是資本門的部分。當然會衝擊到中央的施政。\n\n01:19.313 --> 01:34.921\n中央跟地方的部分特別是資本門的部分資本門的部分特別需要重大民間資金的引入所以財政部的責任就更加重大不是嗎這部分要特別加強速度要快一點不然會耽誤到地方的一些重大的建設的一個進度\n\n01:36.402 --> 02:02.529\n另外一個部分部長另外一個部分之前在財委會的時候一直討論到兩個稅一個是印花稅一個是娛樂稅你每次都講說印花稅基於替代財源籌措有所困難因為影響到地方的建設發展所以不予匯除第二個娛樂稅的部分說地方政府重要的財源我查一查印花稅今年1月到11月總共是180億娛樂稅大概是17億兩個夯不啷噹加起來大概200億\n\n02:06.291 --> 02:17.739\n這210現在對地方來說是小條了他已經有3753頁你現在要不要評估一下這兩個長久以來備受爭議的這個地方稅把它廢除掉有沒有可能部長\n\n02:21.616 --> 02:40.690\n瞭解還是同意你去看一看我就給你看一下在當時討論的時候確實是各地方政府都反對對那現在他有錢啊中央窮啊對不對當初你考慮地方是不是可以重新調整一下有沒有思考的空間我舉一個例子就好了你去看看\n\n02:41.711 --> 03:05.456\n連金融業的部分你不要說一般的連統一發票你拿到錢都要去付都要付印發稅金融業的部分只要是本業的部分都要繳印發稅除了營業稅之外你還要繳印發稅然後其他的金融業都是如此銀行保險更是如此而且他還要設計還要在地方上設立一個會計人員對不對部長你知道嗎這影響非常的大生意非常的多\n\n03:10.208 --> 03:26.198\n是不是要考慮一下?要不要檢討一下?我想這個整個財劃法如果這樣子修正過了以後整個地方的稅制要不要做調整當然我覺得這是一個思考的一個方向所以說包括這兩個廢除了是思考方向對不對?\n\n03:26.758 --> 03:53.221\n是可以思考的方向所以思考嘛我看署長也在點頭嘛對不對如果這樣子的話你一直顧慮他他也沒有在顧慮你嘛而且是爭議的稅都是你們在當門神幫他守住嘛兩百億算什麼他現在有三千七百五十三億了好耶啦有錢了啦好接下來我先問你一個問題有關於公股這一個整併的問題公股銀行底下的子宮心子盼我列一個表給你看你看右邊的\n\n03:54.122 --> 04:11.417\n政卷、投信、創投、資產都有這一個這四家趙鋒、西醫、核庫、華南都有還有包括剛剛那個我們聽到那個誰啊那個台銀也有還有包括什麼那個張銀跟台企銀也有創投\n\n04:12.778 --> 04:39.020\n這個其實是有合併的空間我講給你聽第一個保險的部分我們的保險都賺那個個位數億的啦那你去看民間的保險都賺3位數甚至4位數啦700多億跟900多億啦差那麼多啦第二個呢AMC的部分合庫的部分賺最多的3.4億賺最少呢華南銀行0.27兩千多萬而已投薪的部分呢賺最多的是哪一個單位\n\n04:41.209 --> 04:59.241\n我看一看真的很可憐欸賺最多是第一銀行欸1.11欸那華南銀行還麻辣死欸這些公司真的老實講齁非常急塞啊有沒有可能把所有同類型的部分來進行一個合併的可能要考慮到那個工會意見的情況底下來做一個推動啊那個部長\n\n05:00.287 --> 05:24.174\n我都幫你列好啦瞭解我知道委員的意思齁我都幫你排列組合好了您的意思是希望把相同類的把它整併然後讓它更有忠孝然後更有競爭力那當然這個部分呢必須要進行相關的一個要做合一的整併合一的整併而且要遵循相關的法規對遵循相關的法規講了我都同意啦你講了都重複啦也同意啦\n\n05:24.834 --> 05:53.387\n問題是你什麼時候有一個政策評估出來啦這個部分必須要有一個詳細的一個評估你就是大老闆嘛你財政部大老闆底下都歸你管嘛啊你的態度最關鍵嘛當然這還有其他的相關的股東以及員工跟客戶都要考量而且我跟你講最誇張的是什麼你知道嗎最誇張的是什麼我跟你講最誇張的是台灣金融啊台灣金融是銀行公會號召成立的台灣金融就銀行公會成立金融台灣金融是要處理那個金融風暴的這個不良資產\n\n05:54.307 --> 06:20.118\n結果成立4家金控公司以後各個金控公司底下又成立了所謂的AMC那個很奇怪嘛業務重疊不是嗎而且你看看喔臺灣今年的爭議性多大不論是兩次的人事爭議還有之前的被炒房還有甚至拿去炒股馬英九時代拿去炒股還自己瓜分了7000萬還被告你知道臺聯金控的董事長臺銀的董事長林董事長請上來一下\n\n06:23.786 --> 06:24.469\n時間暫停林董事長\n\n06:31.456 --> 06:53.902\n林董事長我就問你好了報告委員我不是台灣今年的董事長我當然不知道你不是台灣今年的董事長我不是是你董事長你是台銀金控的董事長吧林董你一年的薪水多少錢不好意思啦在這裡不好講不好意思講240、250嘛對不對我應該沒有猜錯嘛差不多差不多嘛240、250你的營業額多少營業額3000億有沒有\n\n06:57.932 --> 07:14.810\n超過阿3000億請坐啦3000億好我跟你講台灣金融的營業營收多少不到20億阿你知道嗎他的薪水有多少嗎他的薪水根據報宅月薪31萬年薪400外加假金800有卸幕沒有\n\n07:16.291 --> 07:40.930\n老實說你如果不說羨慕的話你後面的待遇我都不處理了很羨慕很羨慕超級羨慕我看你的表情超級羨慕你的倍數是他的15倍營業是15倍他的薪水是你的將近3倍多4倍拜託這個台灣今年還有存在空間現在沒有什麼不良資產可以處理了不是嗎部長回復一下態度怎麼樣\n\n07:46.274 --> 07:52.038\n他們是公股民營的一個公司他們的薪資有他們現在有一個標準規範官方在主導啦這個都有合併的可能有沒有\n\n07:59.855 --> 08:23.648\n這個要詳細的再來評估你每次都講這種模糊兩可的話讓其他的公股董事長那麼費心力你看一個拿了800萬一個拿200多萬一個營業3000然後一個營業不到20差那麼多我就舉這個例子就好了啦所以這些啊底下這些子公司啊老實講很多啊都有一些合併的這個可能性\n\n08:25.589 --> 08:34.939\n那我不能說只叫苔穎了還有我請那個戴瑞理事主席也上來一下時間暫停一下你看看喔這數字都有\n\n08:36.756 --> 08:59.827\n部長,我再問一下部長,代理事主席部長,你這個能不能給本席一個月裡頭做一個評估你yesorno要不要進行合併的方案我們可以寫一個書面報告給委員書面報告?一個月?態度是如何?方向是怎麼樣?哪些比較有可能性?委員是不是可以給我們三個月啊?三個月啊?\n\n09:01.532 --> 09:18.928\n那這樣兩個月好了啦好謝謝委員職場管理公司的部分特別是職場管理公司特別是臺灣經聯啦我給你點名啦好不好你覺得我剛剛講有沒有道理我再最後一次問你我想委員的意見我們都會納入考量你實在太客氣了也是太模糊了來主席來\n\n09:20.216 --> 09:35.441\n代理處主席整個輸出銀行的政策很多新南向的部分很重要我就問你一件事情總統最近有出訪太平洋三小國這三小國你有沒有幫忙到輸出銀行\n\n09:37.881 --> 09:51.912\n報告委員我們這三部分都沒有因為我們做的是一般的商業性的貸款即使跟國家之間的貸款也用商業貸款的模式來處理你有國家融資保證的機構還有新南向政策這是南向的範圍\n\n09:53.553 --> 10:21.238\n而且這三小國在整個區域安全上是佔有很大的關鍵性再加上外交部現在有所謂的榮邦計畫你是不是要跟外交部稍微主動跟他討論看看是不是對這個戰略性的這個國家友好的這個對象有一些加強的可能性不要做繼承的業務而已還有包括最近我們整個外交情勢的發展非常的重要如果扮演一個金融外交的角色非常的關鍵再加上立陶宛\n\n10:21.758 --> 10:46.372\n歐洲的這些破了地海三小國跟我們之間的關係也非常非常的友好這個部分你能不能作為做一個瞭解通盤檢討然後跟外交部做一個討論是不是有增加的可能增加對象的可能是這個我們會努力來辦理那個中東歐中歐跟東歐的部分我們一個中東歐融資基金現在有在辦理的大概有15個案子有15個案子這是新增的嗎\n\n10:47.172 --> 11:10.764\n對,這是新增的那這15個你再給本席一下那其他的有一些要搭配整個外交布局的你這個本來就負有政策責任的嘛對不對這是國力的一種延伸的展現啊更何況我們之前也給你多了150億不是嗎我現在不是跟你要人情啦是希望你發揮績效好不好我們會來努力好,謝謝理事主席、謝謝部長、謝謝林董、謝謝好,謝謝郭國文委員的話言\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.99,"end":20.761,"text":"謝謝主席 有請莊部長請莊部長委員好部長好 部長剛剛的賴委員在質詢的時候他說只有一層其實不是啊法定支出3.1兆的部分法定支出佔1.8兆剩下可以活用是1.3兆1.3兆3723億是28.47%啊部長"},{"start":26.764,"end":54.062,"text":"你這應該回答很清楚才對啊這是第一點第二點呢這個3753億撥給地方之後地方的財源就相當充裕了對不對但是呢它唯一可以調整的就是計劃型補助反倒是計劃型補助以外計劃型補助的縣市發展會延宕很多這裡頭的資金的部分要怎麼處理就變成是之前我們所謂的保險基金保險的那個資金要如何來運用在整個"},{"start":54.722,"end":78.773,"text":"更重大的公共建設,這顯得更加急迫了。部長,你有沒有認為如此?您說的是,確實是,因為三兆億裡面有一些是法定義務支出的,所以這個部分是不能動的。那另外的部分是不是屬於法定義務支出的部分?不是那麼容易嘛,對不對?是,本來就是不容易的事情。對,但它影響的衝擊是主要是資本門的部分。當然會衝擊到中央的施政。"},{"start":79.313,"end":94.921,"text":"中央跟地方的部分特別是資本門的部分資本門的部分特別需要重大民間資金的引入所以財政部的責任就更加重大不是嗎這部分要特別加強速度要快一點不然會耽誤到地方的一些重大的建設的一個進度"},{"start":96.402,"end":122.529,"text":"另外一個部分部長另外一個部分之前在財委會的時候一直討論到兩個稅一個是印花稅一個是娛樂稅你每次都講說印花稅基於替代財源籌措有所困難因為影響到地方的建設發展所以不予匯除第二個娛樂稅的部分說地方政府重要的財源我查一查印花稅今年1月到11月總共是180億娛樂稅大概是17億兩個夯不啷噹加起來大概200億"},{"start":126.291,"end":137.739,"text":"這210現在對地方來說是小條了他已經有3753頁你現在要不要評估一下這兩個長久以來備受爭議的這個地方稅把它廢除掉有沒有可能 部長"},{"start":141.616,"end":160.69,"text":"瞭解還是同意你去看一看我就給你看一下在當時討論的時候確實是各地方政府都反對對那現在他有錢啊中央窮啊對不對當初你考慮地方是不是可以重新調整一下有沒有思考的空間我舉一個例子就好了你去看看"},{"start":161.711,"end":185.456,"text":"連金融業的部分你不要說一般的連統一發票你拿到錢都要去付都要付印發稅金融業的部分只要是本業的部分都要繳印發稅除了營業稅之外你還要繳印發稅然後其他的金融業都是如此銀行保險更是如此而且他還要設計還要在地方上設立一個會計人員對不對部長你知道嗎這影響非常的大生意非常的多"},{"start":190.208,"end":206.198,"text":"是不是要考慮一下?要不要檢討一下?我想這個整個財劃法如果這樣子修正過了以後整個地方的稅制要不要做調整當然我覺得這是一個思考的一個方向所以說包括這兩個廢除了是思考方向對不對?"},{"start":206.758,"end":233.221,"text":"是可以思考的方向所以思考嘛我看署長也在點頭嘛對不對如果這樣子的話你一直顧慮他他也沒有在顧慮你嘛而且是爭議的稅都是你們在當門神幫他守住嘛兩百億算什麼他現在有三千七百五十三億了好耶啦有錢了啦好接下來我先問你一個問題有關於公股這一個整併的問題公股銀行底下的子宮心子盼我列一個表給你看你看右邊的"},{"start":234.122,"end":251.417,"text":"政卷、投信、創投、資產都有這一個這四家趙鋒、西醫、核庫、華南都有還有包括剛剛那個我們聽到那個誰啊那個台銀也有還有包括什麼那個張銀跟台企銀也有創投"},{"start":252.778,"end":279.02,"text":"這個其實是有合併的空間我講給你聽第一個保險的部分我們的保險都賺那個個位數億的啦那你去看民間的保險都賺3位數甚至4位數啦700多億跟900多億啦差那麼多啦第二個呢AMC的部分合庫的部分賺最多的3.4億賺最少呢華南銀行0.27兩千多萬而已投薪的部分呢賺最多的是哪一個單位"},{"start":281.209,"end":299.241,"text":"我看一看真的很可憐欸賺最多是第一銀行欸 1.11欸那華南銀行還麻辣死欸這些公司真的老實講齁 非常急塞啊有沒有可能把所有同類型的部分來進行一個合併的可能要考慮到那個工會意見的情況底下來做一個推動啊那個部長"},{"start":300.287,"end":324.174,"text":"我都幫你列好啦瞭解我知道委員的意思齁我都幫你排列組合好了您的意思是希望把相同類的把它整併然後讓它更有忠孝然後更有競爭力那當然這個部分呢必須要進行相關的一個要做合一的整併合一的整併而且要遵循相關的法規對遵循相關的法規講了我都同意啦你講了都重複啦也同意啦"},{"start":324.834,"end":353.387,"text":"問題是你什麼時候有一個政策評估出來啦這個部分必須要有一個詳細的一個評估你就是大老闆嘛你財政部大老闆底下都歸你管嘛啊你的態度最關鍵嘛當然這還有其他的相關的股東以及員工跟客戶都要考量而且我跟你講最誇張的是什麼你知道嗎最誇張的是什麼我跟你講最誇張的是台灣金融啊台灣金融是銀行公會號召成立的台灣金融就銀行公會成立金融台灣金融是要處理那個金融風暴的這個不良資產"},{"start":354.307,"end":380.118,"text":"結果成立4家金控公司以後各個金控公司底下又成立了所謂的AMC那個很奇怪嘛業務重疊不是嗎而且你看看喔臺灣今年的爭議性多大不論是兩次的人事爭議還有之前的被炒房還有甚至拿去炒股馬英九時代拿去炒股還自己瓜分了7000萬還被告你知道臺聯金控的董事長臺銀的董事長林董事長請上來一下"},{"start":383.786,"end":384.469,"text":"時間暫停林董事長"},{"start":391.456,"end":413.902,"text":"林董事長我就問你好了報告委員我不是台灣今年的董事長我當然不知道你不是台灣今年的董事長我不是是你董事長你是台銀金控的董事長吧林董你一年的薪水多少錢不好意思啦在這裡不好講不好意思講240、250嘛對不對我應該沒有猜錯嘛差不多差不多嘛240、250你的營業額多少營業額3000億有沒有"},{"start":417.932,"end":434.81,"text":"超過阿3000億請坐啦3000億好我跟你講台灣金融的營業營收多少不到20億阿你知道嗎他的薪水有多少嗎他的薪水根據報宅月薪31萬年薪400外加假金800有卸幕沒有"},{"start":436.291,"end":460.93,"text":"老實說你如果不說羨慕的話你後面的待遇我都不處理了很羨慕很羨慕超級羨慕我看你的表情超級羨慕你的倍數是他的15倍營業是15倍他的薪水是你的將近3倍多4倍拜託這個台灣今年還有存在空間現在沒有什麼不良資產可以處理了不是嗎部長回復一下態度怎麼樣"},{"start":466.274,"end":472.038,"text":"他們是公股民營的一個公司他們的薪資有他們現在有一個標準規範官方在主導啦這個都有合併的可能有沒有"},{"start":479.855,"end":503.648,"text":"這個要詳細的再來評估你每次都講這種模糊兩可的話讓其他的公股董事長那麼費心力你看一個拿了800萬一個拿200多萬一個營業3000然後一個營業不到20差那麼多我就舉這個例子就好了啦所以這些啊底下這些子公司啊老實講很多啊都有一些合併的這個可能性"},{"start":505.589,"end":514.939,"text":"那我不能說只叫苔穎了還有我請那個戴瑞理事主席也上來一下時間暫停一下你看看喔 這數字都有"},{"start":516.756,"end":539.827,"text":"部長,我再問一下部長,代理事主席部長,你這個能不能給本席一個月裡頭做一個評估你yes or no要不要進行合併的方案我們可以寫一個書面報告給委員書面報告?一個月?態度是如何?方向是怎麼樣?哪些比較有可能性?委員是不是可以給我們三個月啊?三個月啊?"},{"start":541.532,"end":558.928,"text":"那這樣兩個月好了啦好 謝謝委員職場管理公司的部分特別是職場管理公司特別是臺灣經聯啦我給你點名啦好不好你覺得我剛剛講有沒有道理我再最後一次問你我想委員的意見我們都會納入考量你實在太客氣了也是太模糊了 來主席來"},{"start":560.216,"end":575.441,"text":"代理處主席整個輸出銀行的政策很多新南向的部分很重要我就問你一件事情總統最近有出訪太平洋三小國這三小國你有沒有幫忙到輸出銀行"},{"start":577.881,"end":591.912,"text":"報告委員我們這三部分都沒有因為我們做的是一般的商業性的貸款即使跟國家之間的貸款也用商業貸款的模式來處理你有國家融資保證的機構還有新南向政策這是南向的範圍"},{"start":593.553,"end":621.238,"text":"而且這三小國在整個區域安全上是佔有很大的關鍵性再加上外交部現在有所謂的榮邦計畫你是不是要跟外交部稍微主動跟他討論看看是不是對這個戰略性的這個國家友好的這個對象有一些加強的可能性不要做繼承的業務而已還有包括最近我們整個外交情勢的發展非常的重要如果扮演一個金融外交的角色非常的關鍵再加上立陶宛"},{"start":621.758,"end":646.372,"text":"歐洲的這些破了地海三小國跟我們之間的關係也非常非常的友好這個部分你能不能作為做一個瞭解通盤檢討然後跟外交部做一個討論是不是有增加的可能增加對象的可能是 這個我們會努力來辦理那個中東歐中歐跟東歐的部分我們一個中東歐融資基金現在有在辦理的大概有15個案子有15個案子這是新增的嗎"},{"start":647.172,"end":670.764,"text":"對,這是新增的那這15個你再給本席一下那其他的有一些要搭配整個外交布局的你這個本來就負有政策責任的嘛對不對這是國力的一種延伸的展現啊更何況我們之前也給你多了150億不是嗎我現在不是跟你要人情啦是希望你發揮績效好不好我們會來努力好,謝謝理事主席、謝謝部長、謝謝林董、謝謝好,謝謝郭國文委員的話言"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":344,"blocks":[["郭委員國文：（9時59分）謝謝主席，有請莊部長上台。"],["主席：請莊部長上台。"],["莊部長翠雲：委員好。"],["郭委員國文：部長好。剛剛賴委員在質詢的時候，他說只有一成，但其實不是，3.1兆的部分，法定支出占1.8兆，剩下可以活用的是不是1.3兆？3,753億是1.3兆的28.47%，部長，你這樣應該回答很清楚才對啊！這是第一點。","第二點，這個3,753億撥給地方之後，地方的財源就相當充裕了，對不對？但是它唯一可以調整的就是計畫型補助，反倒是倚賴計畫型補助的縣市發展會延宕很多，這裡頭資金的部分要怎麼處理？就變成我們之前所謂的保險基金，保險資金要如何運用在整個重大的公共建設？這顯得更加急迫了，部長你有沒有認為如此？"],["莊部長翠雲：委員說的是，確實是，因為三兆一裡面有一些是法定義務支出的，所以這個部分是不能動的，另外的部分不是屬於法定義務支出的部分。"],["郭委員國文：不是那麼容易嘛！對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：本來就是不容易的事情。"],["郭委員國文：但那影響的衝擊是主要資本門的部分。"],["莊部長翠雲：當然會衝擊到中央的施政。"],["郭委員國文：中央的施政跟地方的部分，特別是資本門的部分，而資本門的部分特別需要重大資金、民間資金的引入，所以財政部的責任就更加重大了，不是嗎？這個部分要特別加強，速度要快一點啦！不然會耽誤到地方重大建設的進度。"],["莊部長翠雲：是，這個部分主總也在請示中……"],["郭委員國文：另外一個部分，之前在財委會的時候一直討論到兩個稅，一個是印花稅、一個是娛樂稅，你每次都說印花稅是基於替代財源，籌措有所困難，因為會影響地方的建設發展，所以不宜廢除，第二個，娛樂稅的部分為地方政府的重要財源，我查一查，今年1月到11月印花稅總共是180億，娛樂稅大概17億，兩個稅「夯不啷噹」加起來大概200億，這200億對地方來說是「小條」的啊！他已經有3,753億，部長，你現在要不要評估一下把這兩個長久以來備受爭議的地方稅廢除掉？有沒有可能？"],["莊部長翠雲：當時印花稅……"],["郭委員國文：了解？還是同意？"],["莊部長翠雲：知道。"],["郭委員國文：你去看一看！我就給你看一下……"],["莊部長翠雲：當時討論的時候，確實是各地方政府都反對……"],["郭委員國文：對，現在地方政府有錢啊！中央窮啊！對不對？所以你是不是可以重新調整一下？有沒有思考的空間？我舉一個例子就好，你去看看金融業的部分，不要說一般的統一發票你拿到錢都要去付印花稅。金融業的部分只要是本業，除了營業稅之外，你還要繳印花稅，其他金融業都是如此，銀行保險更是如此，而且在地方上還要設立一個會計人員。部長你知道嗎？這個影響非常的大！爭議非常的多！是不是要考慮檢討一下？"],["莊部長翠雲：我想整個財劃法修正過了以後，地方的稅制要不要做調整？我覺得這是一個思考的方向。"],["郭委員國文：對，所以包含廢除這兩個稅也是一個思考的方向，對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：這是可以思考的方向，但是……"],["郭委員國文：可以思考嘛！我看署長也在點頭嘛！你一直顧慮他，他也沒有在顧慮你嘛！而且這些爭議的稅都是你們在當門神幫他守住，200億算什麼，他現在有3,753億，已經有錢了啦！","接著請問你有關公股銀行底下子公司整併的問題，我列一個表給你看，右邊的證券、投信、創投、資產這四項兆豐、第一、合庫、華南都有，包含剛剛提到的臺銀也有，還有彰銀、台企銀都有創投，這個其實是有合併的空間。第一個保險的部分，我們的保險都賺個位數億的，你去看民間的保險都是賺3位數甚至4位數，七百多億跟九百多億，差那麼多！第二個，合庫AMC的部分賺最多，3.4億，賺最少的是華南銀行，0.27億，才等於兩千多萬而已；投信的部分真的很可憐，賺最多的是第一銀行1.1億，華南銀行還minus，這些公司老實講非常小，部長，有沒有可能把所有同類型的部分來進行合併，考慮到公會意見的底下來做推動？我已經都幫你列好了，我都幫你排列組合好了。"],["莊部長翠雲：我了解委員的意思，您的意思是希望把同類的整併，讓它更有綜效、更有競爭力，這個部分一定要做合意的整併，而且要遵循相關法規，還有市場……"],["郭委員國文：合意的整併、遵循相關法規，你講的都重複，我也都同意啦！問題是你什麼時候要一個政策評估出來？"],["莊部長翠雲：這個部分必須要一個詳細的評估。"],["郭委員國文：你就是大老闆嘛！你是財政部大老闆，底下都歸你管，你的態度最關鍵。"],["莊部長翠雲：當然還有其他相關的股東、員工、客戶都要列入考量，不是只有單一考量。"],["郭委員國文：而且我跟你講最誇張的是台灣金聯，台灣金聯是銀行公會號召成立的，銀行公會成立台灣金聯是要處理金融風暴不良資產，結果成立4家金控公司之後，各個金控公司底下又成立了AMC，這樣子很奇怪！這樣不是業務重疊嗎？而且你看台灣金聯爭議性多大，不論是兩次的人事爭議、之前被炒房，甚至馬英九時代拿去炒股，還自己瓜分了7,000萬、還被告。","台銀的凌董事長請上來一下，我問一個問題，時間暫停一下。"],["主席：時間暫停。請凌董事長上台。"],["郭委員國文：凌董事長，我請問你……"],["凌董事長忠嫄：報告委員，我不是台灣金聯的董事長。"],["郭委員國文：我當然知道你不是台灣金聯的董事長，我又不是不認識你，你是臺銀金控的董事長吧？"],["凌董事長忠嫄：是。"],["郭委員國文：凌董事長，您一年的薪水多少錢？"],["凌董事長忠嫄：抱歉，在這邊不好講。"],["郭委員國文：不好意思講，你應該年薪240萬至250萬，對不對？我應該沒有猜錯吧？"],["凌董事長忠嫄：差不多。"],["郭委員國文：你年薪240萬至250萬，那你的營業額多少？3,000億有沒有？"],["凌董事長忠嫄：超過。"],["郭委員國文：我跟你講，台灣金聯的營收不到20億，你知道他的薪水有多少嗎？根據報載，月薪31萬，等於年薪400萬，外加獎金共800萬，你有沒有羨慕？老實說，你如果不說羨慕的話，你後面的待遇我都不處理了。"],["凌董事長忠嫄：很羨慕。"],["郭委員國文：我看你的表情超級羨慕，你的營業額是他的15倍，但他的薪水是將近你的3到4倍！拜託，現在台灣金聯還有存在空間？現在沒有什麼不良資產可以處理，不是嗎？部長請回復一下，你的態度怎麼樣？"],["莊部長翠雲：他們是公股民營的公司，他們的薪資有個標準規範，讓他在這個標準規範裡面進行評估……"],["郭委員國文：這個是官方在主導啦！"],["莊部長翠雲：是。"],["郭委員國文：這個都有合併的可能，有沒有？"],["莊部長翠雲：這個要詳細的再來評估。"],["郭委員國文：你每次都講這個模稜兩可的話，你讓其他的公股董事長這麼費心力，你看一個拿了800萬、一個拿二百多萬；一個營業額3,000億、一個營業額不到20億，差那麼多，我就舉這個例子就好，所以這些底下的子公司老實說都有合併的可能性。","我不能只叫臺銀，請戴理事主席也上來一下，時間暫停。"],["主席：時間暫停。"],["郭委員國文：部長，你看一下，這些數字都有喔！","部長，你能不能1個月內給本席要不要進行合併方案的一個評估報告？Yes or No？"],["莊部長翠雲：我們可以寫一個書面報告給委員。"],["郭委員國文：1個月提供書面報告。"],["莊部長翠雲：1個月，太急了吧！"],["郭委員國文：態度是如何、方向是怎麼樣、哪些比較有可能性，特別是……"],["莊部長翠雲：委員可不可以給我們3個月？"],["郭委員國文：3個月喔？2個月好了。"],["莊部長翠雲：2個月喔……好，謝謝委員。"],["郭委員國文：資產管理公司的部分，特別是台灣金聯，我就給你點名了啦！你覺得我剛剛講的有沒有道理？我最後一次問你。"],["莊部長翠雲：委員的意見我們都會納入考量。"],["郭委員國文：你實在太客氣了，也太模糊了。","戴理事主席，輸出入銀行的政策很多，有關於新南向的部分很重要，請問總統最近有出訪太平洋三小國，對於這三小國，中國輸出入銀行有沒有幫忙到？"],["戴理事主席燈山：報告委員，這三小國都沒有，因為我們做的是一般商業性的貸款，即使跟國家之間的貸款，也是用商業貸款的模式來處理……"],["郭委員國文：你是有國家融資保證的機構，還有新南向政策，這是新南向的範圍喔！而且這三小國在整個區域安全上是占有很大的關鍵性，再加上外交部現在有所謂的榮邦計畫，你是不是要稍微主動跟外交部討論看看？對於戰略性的國家、友好的對象是不是有一些加強的可能性？不要只做既成的業務而已，還有包括最近我們整個外交情勢的發展也非常的重要，如何扮演一個金融外交的角色非常的關鍵，再加上立陶宛等歐洲這些波羅的海三小國跟我們之間的關係也非常非常友好，這個部分你能不能稍微做一個了解、通盤檢討，然後跟外交部做一個討論──是不是有增加對象的可能？"],["戴理事主席燈山：是的，這個我們會努力來辦理，中東歐、中歐跟東歐的部分，我們有一個中東歐融資基金，現在有在辦理了，大概有15個案子。"],["郭委員國文：有15個案子，這是新增的嗎？"],["戴理事主席燈山：對，這是新增的。"],["郭委員國文：好，這15個資料你再提供給本席。"],["戴理事主席燈山：是、是、是。"],["郭委員國文：其他有一些要搭配整個外交布局的，你們本來就負有政策責任嘛，對不對？這是一種國力延伸的展現，更何況我們之前也給你多了150億，不是嗎？我現在不是在跟你要人情啦，是希望你能夠發揮績效，好不好？"],["戴理事主席燈山：我們會來努力。"],["郭委員國文：好，謝謝理事主席、謝謝部長、謝謝凌董。"],["戴理事主席燈山：謝謝委員。"],["莊部長翠雲：謝謝委員。"],["郭委員國文：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝郭國文委員的發言。"],["主席（郭委員國文代）：接著我們請賴惠員委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":106,"meet_id":"委員會-11-2-20-13","speakers":["賴惠員","賴士葆","陳菁徽","林德福","吳秉叡","郭國文","顏寬恒","李坤城","李彥秀","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","王世堅","黃健豪","黃珊珊","羅明才","張啓楷","陳玉珍","王鴻薇"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-12-25"],"gazette_id":"1141203","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1141203_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第2會期財政委員會第13次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查「菸酒稅法」 10 案：( 一) 行政院函請審議、本院委員李柏毅等 16 人、委員賴惠員等16\n人、委員郭國文等 18 人、委員吳琪銘等 16 人分別擬具「菸酒稅法部分條文修正草案」等 5 案、\n(二)本院委員徐巧芯等29人擬具「菸酒稅法第十九條條文修正草案」案、(三)本院委員賴士葆等\n27人、委員伍麗華 Saidhai Tahovecahe 等20人、委員張智倫等18人分別擬具「菸酒稅法第十九\n條及第二十一條條文修正草案」等3案、(四)本院委員陳玉珍等19人擬具「菸酒稅法第十九條及\n第二十三條條文修正草案」案；二、審查「使用牌照稅法」8案：(一) 行政院函請審議、本院委\n員賴士葆等24人、委員陳菁徽等17人、委員張智倫等18人、委員陳素月等19人、委員賴惠員等17\n人、委員郭國文等16人分別擬具「使用牌照稅法第二十九條、第三十條及第三十一條條文修正草\n案」等7案、(二) 本院委員陳玉珍等19人擬具「使用牌照稅法第三十條及第三十一條條文修正草\n案」案；三、審查行政院函請審議、本院委員賴士葆等21人、委員林楚茵等18人、委員徐巧芯等\n27人、委員賴惠員等17人、委員郭國文等17人分別擬具「土地稅法第五十四條條文修正草案」等\n6案；四、審查中華民國114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算營業部分，關於財政部主管中國\n輸出入銀行、臺灣金融控股股份有限公司（含臺灣銀行股份有限公司、臺銀人壽保險股份有限公\n司、臺銀綜合證券股份有限公司）（僅詢答）","agenda_id":"1141203_00001"}}}