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544.214, \"end\": 544.834, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 544.834, \"end\": 545.094, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"灣\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 545.094, \"end\": 545.234, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 545.234, \"end\": 545.415, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 545.415, \"end\": 545.615, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"公\", \"start\": 545.615, \"end\": 545.855, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"司\", \"start\": 545.855, \"end\": 546.055, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 546.055, \"end\": 546.556, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"矽\"}, {\"word\": \"谷\", \"start\": 546.556, \"end\": 546.756, \"score\": 0.959}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 546.756, \"end\": 546.896, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 546.896, \"end\": 547.016, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 547.016, \"end\": 547.136, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"研\", \"start\": 547.136, \"end\": 547.456, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"發\"}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 547.456, \"end\": 547.677, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"心\", \"start\": 547.677, \"end\": 548.037, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 548.037, \"end\": 548.257, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"瞞\"}, {\"word\": \"您\", \"start\": 548.257, \"end\": 548.597, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"包\", \"start\": 548.597, \"end\": 548.757, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"括\", \"start\": 548.757, \"end\": 548.918, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 548.918, \"end\": 549.298, \"score\": 0.83}, {\"word\": \"積\"}, {\"word\": \"電\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 549.298, \"end\": 549.438, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 549.438, \"end\": 550.579, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 550.579, \"end\": 550.779, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"美\", \"start\": 550.779, \"end\": 551.139, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 551.139, \"end\": 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{\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 605.373, \"end\": 605.493, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 605.493, \"end\": 605.633, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 605.633, \"end\": 605.713, \"score\": 0.676}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 605.713, \"end\": 605.793, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 605.793, \"end\": 605.813, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,449 --> 00:00:11,559\n請呂玉玲委員做詢答謝謝主席請劉主委劉主委\n\n2\n00:00:20,785 --> 00:00:40,015\n六點早安各位在二月份國發會有公布了一月份的景氣的燈號中和整個判斷的話是34分比去年的12月份的38分是掉了4分但是我們從去年看到的整個台灣經濟的狀況是有逐步復甦的情形那這個也擺脫了前幾年藍燈低迷\n\n3\n00:00:47,659 --> 00:01:09,411\n據我們國發會的說法是因為整個經濟的動能就是受到AIAI這個產業新興科技整個的發展所帶動起來讓我們出口有更進一步的增加讓國外的很多大廠都到台灣來投資也讓我們的民眾可以支配整個我們國內內需的整個市場的活絡對不對是的\n\n4\n00:01:12,293 --> 00:01:20,799\n那本席也特別跟我們的國貿署有調了一份資料我們看到了就是2023年我們整個對於出口總值是4324億2905萬元那2024年的話是4750億284億元整個產值也多了這個將近有426億的美元那看到的話這就是\n\n5\n00:01:40,112 --> 00:01:44,719\n目前來講的話就是川普他上任之後的話他說要重回這個貿易這個\n\n6\n00:01:48,653 --> 00:02:03,743\n這樣保護的這個措施所以要對各國課以這個關稅那我們也看到了他對於這個大陸的關稅要全面的話要增加了20%而對鋼鐵還有就是鋁的部分的話要25%那我們看到他有預告了4月份都對所有的國家都會這個這個對等的這個關稅都會來增加在這個部分來\n\n7\n00:02:17,071 --> 00:02:45,043\n各國也對這個這個美國會有一些的比例的這個課稅的方面都會相對的因應那我請問諸位那目前來講的話我們的關稅施行細則還沒有公布那對於美國對我們的這個出口也是第二大這個市場那請問這個諸位那會不會影響我們下半年裡的出口率出口會下降出口總值會下降情形\n\n8\n00:02:47,797 --> 00:03:05,789\n這個部分其實我們是兩件事在做一個是持續溝通第二個我們做一些因應那我舉個例子其實美國整個策略他還是希望在美國製造所以川普講了很多次了就是在美國製造會比較便宜如果課稅的話\n\n9\n00:03:07,190 --> 00:03:34,656\n那所以呢我們現在因應比較比較目前機會比較大的像以譬如說半導體好了我大概跟業者我們談了三次那業者是認為呢有些業者他在美國有工廠他會從美國出貨那有些業者呢他認為呢只要是全球一起科稅那他們的競爭條件是一致的所以主委那這樣子的話美國可不可能對我們國內的有哪些產業他會加徵這個關稅\n\n10\n00:03:39,385 --> 00:03:59,339\n目前我們看到機會最大的是半導體它會逐步因為它是從稅務平等來看只要我們的平均稅率高於它的那個產業就會有可能要嘛我們降稅要嘛就增稅所以國發會那你對這些產業你要如何協助跟各部會的話怎麼嚴厲因應的方案呢\n\n11\n00:03:59,919 --> 00:04:10,902\n對我們現在是這樣子因為它產業別的狀態是不一樣的我想委員應該前面有提到我們美國對於這個鋼鐵鋁去課徵25%的關稅那譬如說它全球課25%關稅的時候對台灣是沒有影響的因為台灣本來就課25%\n\n12\n00:04:18,824 --> 00:04:36,984\n反而對韓國中國這些稅負比較低的受到影響所以他不同的產業會有不同的因應的策略所以你要跟各部會做好嚴寧的方案嗎現在是我們副院長在領導大家在做這樣的一個規劃坦白講我們最近也會在\n\n13\n00:04:37,985 --> 00:04:48,131\n我們幾乎每個禮拜都有開會可是主委你要知道如果整個出口的產值都萎縮的話也會影響國內整個產業搞不好我們的燈號又回到藍燈了是不是我們其實這個部分我們是一直在觀測美國內部的銷售數據跟就業的狀態還有它的CPI跟PPI\n\n14\n00:04:59,677 --> 00:05:23,257\n國防會你有沒有做這個先前的評估嗎有我們現在是很頻繁的在看它只要數字出來我們就有在看它的數字的變動我們希望整個景氣能夠維持現在的狀況然後讓產業變得比較穩定但是如果我們從AI的角度來看它可能整體的需求我們目前評估AI的需求是比較不容易下降的\n\n15\n00:05:23,877 --> 00:05:32,779\n可是你現在看到加拿大或者是歐盟國家他對於他這個課稅這關稅的部分的話他們有採取這個相對應的方式就是報復性的課稅對那你對這個看法呢我們台灣的話有沒有那個底氣有沒有那個魄力或者是我們能夠也有相對應的這個方案出來\n\n16\n00:05:46,233 --> 00:05:55,160\n因為我們是高貿易依存度的國家所以我們還是會主張要跟世界各國維持友好的關係人家看我們課稅\n\n17\n00:05:57,025 --> 00:06:03,412\n科稅這個也不是第一次在2017、2018都有所以我們一直在溝通我們看看4月2號溝通的結果那個時候再來去我們的因應措施目前有一些包括我們怎麼去協助因為我們國發會都很樂觀外銷成本\n\n18\n00:06:19,289 --> 00:06:24,551\n你們很樂觀說現在我們整個經濟的成長你們也定到3%如果這種情形一再發生下去的話這經濟成長你就要下修了嗎不一定喔因為這還是一個全球競爭的企業是一個競爭的狀態我舉個例子喔全球經濟如果0成長他去年呢跟我們買100億的東西今年還是會買100億那如果我們從別人別的國家手上拿回一些市場市佔率我們還有可能從100億拉到110億\n\n19\n00:06:48,641 --> 00:06:59,958\n可是你這個關稅會影響讓所有的產品的成本都會提高提高之後的話我們整個全球的話就會有通膨的情形發生如果大家都一起漲價本身就是大家會在同一個競爭基礎上\n\n20\n00:07:01,502 --> 00:07:09,387\n那現在是怎麼樣去驅動消費端主委是很樂觀但是你不要忽略了這整個對產業國內國外的產業都有很大的衝擊我們為了保護自己的話我們應該跟各部會趕快嚴寧方案出來所以我們每週都有一個會議在討論再來問我們主委一個狀況那因為台積電先問主委好了台積電的股票你有買嗎\n\n21\n00:07:29,895 --> 00:07:37,780\n我沒有買你沒有買那你有沒有關心台積電的股票現在的情形因為我是問我們當然關心因為我們是他的大股東對就是因為國發會我們我們是大股東所以目前的股價一直下跌而在這種情形之下又美國這邊有預告說未來我們半導體可能課稅要到百分之八百分之二十五那在這種情況之下的話我們國人對於整個台積電\n\n22\n00:07:59,553 --> 00:08:09,520\n這個未來的發展是不太樂觀也存在很大的疑慮尤其是說現在我們整個台積電到美國是來投資了將近1650億的這個美元那未來會再增加投資也是未來確定性的事情\n\n23\n00:08:17,606 --> 00:08:37,502\n但是我們擔心的就是說我們的整個研發會不會移到美國去美國也說他們在那邊台積電會做研發中心會在那裡設置在那裡設置之後的話我們人才剛剛主委特別提到說還是台灣的人才最重要整個先進的研發製程的話都會在台灣研發半年到兩年的時間研發成了會\n\n24\n00:08:41,765 --> 00:08:56,887\n之後才拿到美國去就做個製程出來但是我們擔心的是研發中心如果美國設置下去的話他們研發的速度如果比我們快更先進的話那是不是整個技術都會整個被美國控制過去了\n\n25\n00:08:58,889 --> 00:09:14,662\n這個所有的技術一定產權屬於台積電所有所以其實台灣有很多公司在矽谷都是有研發中心不瞞您說包括台積電也有因為美國在某些領域還是有頂尖的領先技術整個半導體是從美國發過來的\n\n26\n00:09:16,684 --> 00:09:43,221\n所以每一個公司在海外設的研發中心所取得的研究成果還是屬於這家公司的知識產權所以它還是會有營業秘密的保障所以技術還是有一定的保障但是主委你要知道台積電過去之後它底下上下游的產業鏈因為成本因為關稅的問題他們也都會外移到美國在外移的情況之下我們要如何鞏固在我們台灣整個產業的發展這個不是外移是擴大台灣的市場\n\n27\n00:09:44,702 --> 00:10:05,813\n因為我們臺灣本土的市場並不夠大那如果我們能走到世界的市場會讓臺灣的產業更加著重所以國發會更要具體的整個政策的一個作為才能讓我們國人對台積電這個護國神山更加有信心是不是你們拿出你們的政策出來好不好我們是有的謝謝委員好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n449\t11559\t請呂玉玲委員做詢答謝謝主席 請劉主委劉主委\n20785\t40015\t六點早安 各位在二月份國發會有公布了一月份的景氣的燈號中和整個判斷的話是34分比去年的12月份的38分是掉了4分但是我們從去年看到的整個台灣經濟的狀況是有逐步復甦的情形那這個也擺脫了前幾年藍燈低迷\n47659\t69411\t據我們國發會的說法是因為整個經濟的動能就是受到AIAI這個產業新興科技整個的發展所帶動起來讓我們出口有更進一步的增加讓國外的很多大廠都到台灣來投資也讓我們的民眾可以支配整個我們國內內需的整個市場的活絡對不對是的\n72293\t80799\t那本席也特別跟我們的國貿署有調了一份資料我們看到了就是2023年我們整個對於出口總值是4324億2905萬元那2024年的話是4750億284億元整個產值也多了這個將近有426億的美元那看到的話這就是\n100112\t104719\t目前來講的話就是川普他上任之後的話他說要重回這個貿易這個\n108653\t123743\t這樣保護的這個措施所以要對各國課以這個關稅那我們也看到了他對於這個大陸的關稅要全面的話要增加了20%而對鋼鐵還有就是鋁的部分的話要25%那我們看到他有預告了4月份都對所有的國家都會這個這個對等的這個關稅都會來增加在這個部分來\n137071\t165043\t各國也對這個這個美國會有一些的比例的這個課稅的方面都會相對的因應那我請問諸位那目前來講的話我們的關稅施行細則還沒有公布那對於美國對我們的這個出口也是第二大這個市場那請問這個諸位那會不會影響我們下半年裡的出口率出口會下降出口總值會下降情形\n167797\t185789\t這個部分其實我們是兩件事在做一個是持續溝通第二個我們做一些因應那我舉個例子其實美國整個策略他還是希望在美國製造所以川普講了很多次了就是在美國製造會比較便宜如果課稅的話\n187190\t214656\t那所以呢我們現在因應比較比較目前機會比較大的像以譬如說半導體好了我大概跟業者我們談了三次那業者是認為呢有些業者他在美國有工廠他會從美國出貨那有些業者呢他認為呢只要是全球一起科稅那他們的競爭條件是一致的所以主委那這樣子的話美國可不可能對我們國內的有哪些產業他會加徵這個關稅\n219385\t239339\t目前我們看到機會最大的是半導體它會逐步因為它是從稅務平等來看只要我們的平均稅率高於它的那個產業就會有可能要嘛我們降稅要嘛就增稅所以國發會那你對這些產業你要如何協助跟各部會的話怎麼嚴厲因應的方案呢\n239919\t250902\t對 我們現在是這樣子因為它產業別的狀態是不一樣的我想委員應該前面有提到我們美國對於這個鋼鐵鋁去課徵25%的關稅那譬如說它全球課25%關稅的時候對台灣是沒有影響的因為台灣本來就課25%\n258824\t276984\t反而對韓國中國這些稅負比較低的受到影響所以他不同的產業會有不同的因應的策略所以你要跟各部會做好嚴寧的方案嗎現在是我們副院長在領導大家在做這樣的一個規劃坦白講我們最近也會在\n277985\t288131\t我們幾乎每個禮拜都有開會可是主委你要知道如果整個出口的產值都萎縮的話也會影響國內整個產業搞不好我們的燈號又回到藍燈了是不是我們其實這個部分我們是一直在觀測美國內部的銷售數據跟就業的狀態還有它的CPI跟PPI\n299677\t323257\t國防會你有沒有做這個先前的評估嗎有 我們現在是很頻繁的在看它只要數字出來我們就有在看它的數字的變動我們希望整個景氣能夠維持現在的狀況然後讓產業變得比較穩定但是如果我們從AI的角度來看它可能整體的需求我們目前評估AI的需求是比較不容易下降的\n323877\t332779\t可是你現在看到加拿大或者是歐盟國家他對於他這個課稅這關稅的部分的話他們有採取這個相對應的方式就是報復性的課稅對那你對這個看法呢我們台灣的話有沒有那個底氣有沒有那個魄力或者是我們能夠也有相對應的這個方案出來\n346233\t355160\t因為我們是高貿易依存度的國家所以我們還是會主張要跟世界各國維持友好的關係人家看我們課稅\n357025\t363412\t科稅這個也不是第一次在2017、2018都有所以我們一直在溝通我們看看4月2號溝通的結果那個時候再來去我們的因應措施目前有一些包括我們怎麼去協助因為我們國發會都很樂觀外銷成本\n379289\t384551\t你們很樂觀說現在我們整個經濟的成長你們也定到3%如果這種情形一再發生下去的話這經濟成長你就要下修了嗎不一定喔因為這還是一個全球競爭的企業是一個競爭的狀態我舉個例子喔全球經濟如果0成長他去年呢跟我們買100億的東西今年還是會買100億那如果我們從別人別的國家手上拿回一些市場市佔率我們還有可能從100億拉到110億\n408641\t419958\t可是你這個關稅會影響讓所有的產品的成本都會提高提高之後的話我們整個全球的話就會有通膨的情形發生如果大家都一起漲價本身就是大家會在同一個競爭基礎上\n421502\t429387\t那現在是怎麼樣去驅動消費端主委是很樂觀但是你不要忽略了這整個對產業國內國外的產業都有很大的衝擊我們為了保護自己的話我們應該跟各部會趕快嚴寧方案出來所以我們每週都有一個會議在討論再來問我們主委一個狀況那因為台積電先問主委好了台積電的股票你有買嗎\n449895\t457780\t我沒有買你沒有買那你有沒有關心台積電的股票現在的情形因為我是問我們當然關心因為我們是他的大股東對就是因為國發會我們我們是大股東所以目前的股價一直下跌而在這種情形之下又美國這邊有預告說未來我們半導體可能課稅要到百分之八百分之二十五那在這種情況之下的話我們國人對於整個台積電\n479553\t489520\t這個未來的發展是不太樂觀也存在很大的疑慮尤其是說現在我們整個台積電到美國是來投資了將近1650億的這個美元那未來會再增加投資也是未來確定性的事情\n497606\t517502\t但是我們擔心的就是說我們的整個研發會不會移到美國去美國也說他們在那邊台積電會做研發中心會在那裡設置在那裡設置之後的話我們人才剛剛主委特別提到說還是台灣的人才最重要整個先進的研發製程的話都會在台灣研發半年到兩年的時間研發成了會\n521765\t536887\t之後才拿到美國去就做個製程出來但是我們擔心的是研發中心如果美國設置下去的話他們研發的速度如果比我們快更先進的話那是不是整個技術都會整個被美國控制過去了\n538889\t554662\t這個所有的技術一定產權屬於台積電所有所以其實台灣有很多公司在矽谷都是有研發中心不瞞您說包括台積電也有因為美國在某些領域還是有頂尖的領先技術整個半導體是從美國發過來的\n556684\t583221\t所以每一個公司在海外設的研發中心所取得的研究成果還是屬於這家公司的知識產權所以它還是會有營業秘密的保障所以技術還是有一定的保障但是主委你要知道台積電過去之後它底下上下游的產業鏈因為成本因為關稅的問題他們也都會外移到美國在外移的情況之下我們要如何鞏固在我們台灣整個產業的發展這個不是外移是擴大台灣的市場\n584702\t605813\t因為我們臺灣本土的市場並不夠大那如果我們能走到世界的市場會讓臺灣的產業更加著重所以國發會更要具體的整個政策的一個作為才能讓我們國人對台積電這個護國神山更加有信心是不是你們拿出你們的政策出來好不好我們是有的 謝謝委員好 謝謝\n","txt":"請呂玉玲委員做詢答謝謝主席 請劉主委劉主委\n六點早安 各位在二月份國發會有公布了一月份的景氣的燈號中和整個判斷的話是34分比去年的12月份的38分是掉了4分但是我們從去年看到的整個台灣經濟的狀況是有逐步復甦的情形那這個也擺脫了前幾年藍燈低迷\n據我們國發會的說法是因為整個經濟的動能就是受到AIAI這個產業新興科技整個的發展所帶動起來讓我們出口有更進一步的增加讓國外的很多大廠都到台灣來投資也讓我們的民眾可以支配整個我們國內內需的整個市場的活絡對不對是的\n那本席也特別跟我們的國貿署有調了一份資料我們看到了就是2023年我們整個對於出口總值是4324億2905萬元那2024年的話是4750億284億元整個產值也多了這個將近有426億的美元那看到的話這就是\n目前來講的話就是川普他上任之後的話他說要重回這個貿易這個\n這樣保護的這個措施所以要對各國課以這個關稅那我們也看到了他對於這個大陸的關稅要全面的話要增加了20%而對鋼鐵還有就是鋁的部分的話要25%那我們看到他有預告了4月份都對所有的國家都會這個這個對等的這個關稅都會來增加在這個部分來\n各國也對這個這個美國會有一些的比例的這個課稅的方面都會相對的因應那我請問諸位那目前來講的話我們的關稅施行細則還沒有公布那對於美國對我們的這個出口也是第二大這個市場那請問這個諸位那會不會影響我們下半年裡的出口率出口會下降出口總值會下降情形\n這個部分其實我們是兩件事在做一個是持續溝通第二個我們做一些因應那我舉個例子其實美國整個策略他還是希望在美國製造所以川普講了很多次了就是在美國製造會比較便宜如果課稅的話\n那所以呢我們現在因應比較比較目前機會比較大的像以譬如說半導體好了我大概跟業者我們談了三次那業者是認為呢有些業者他在美國有工廠他會從美國出貨那有些業者呢他認為呢只要是全球一起科稅那他們的競爭條件是一致的所以主委那這樣子的話美國可不可能對我們國內的有哪些產業他會加徵這個關稅\n目前我們看到機會最大的是半導體它會逐步因為它是從稅務平等來看只要我們的平均稅率高於它的那個產業就會有可能要嘛我們降稅要嘛就增稅所以國發會那你對這些產業你要如何協助跟各部會的話怎麼嚴厲因應的方案呢\n對 我們現在是這樣子因為它產業別的狀態是不一樣的我想委員應該前面有提到我們美國對於這個鋼鐵鋁去課徵25%的關稅那譬如說它全球課25%關稅的時候對台灣是沒有影響的因為台灣本來就課25%\n反而對韓國中國這些稅負比較低的受到影響所以他不同的產業會有不同的因應的策略所以你要跟各部會做好嚴寧的方案嗎現在是我們副院長在領導大家在做這樣的一個規劃坦白講我們最近也會在\n我們幾乎每個禮拜都有開會可是主委你要知道如果整個出口的產值都萎縮的話也會影響國內整個產業搞不好我們的燈號又回到藍燈了是不是我們其實這個部分我們是一直在觀測美國內部的銷售數據跟就業的狀態還有它的CPI跟PPI\n國防會你有沒有做這個先前的評估嗎有 我們現在是很頻繁的在看它只要數字出來我們就有在看它的數字的變動我們希望整個景氣能夠維持現在的狀況然後讓產業變得比較穩定但是如果我們從AI的角度來看它可能整體的需求我們目前評估AI的需求是比較不容易下降的\n可是你現在看到加拿大或者是歐盟國家他對於他這個課稅這關稅的部分的話他們有採取這個相對應的方式就是報復性的課稅對那你對這個看法呢我們台灣的話有沒有那個底氣有沒有那個魄力或者是我們能夠也有相對應的這個方案出來\n因為我們是高貿易依存度的國家所以我們還是會主張要跟世界各國維持友好的關係人家看我們課稅\n科稅這個也不是第一次在2017、2018都有所以我們一直在溝通我們看看4月2號溝通的結果那個時候再來去我們的因應措施目前有一些包括我們怎麼去協助因為我們國發會都很樂觀外銷成本\n你們很樂觀說現在我們整個經濟的成長你們也定到3%如果這種情形一再發生下去的話這經濟成長你就要下修了嗎不一定喔因為這還是一個全球競爭的企業是一個競爭的狀態我舉個例子喔全球經濟如果0成長他去年呢跟我們買100億的東西今年還是會買100億那如果我們從別人別的國家手上拿回一些市場市佔率我們還有可能從100億拉到110億\n可是你這個關稅會影響讓所有的產品的成本都會提高提高之後的話我們整個全球的話就會有通膨的情形發生如果大家都一起漲價本身就是大家會在同一個競爭基礎上\n那現在是怎麼樣去驅動消費端主委是很樂觀但是你不要忽略了這整個對產業國內國外的產業都有很大的衝擊我們為了保護自己的話我們應該跟各部會趕快嚴寧方案出來所以我們每週都有一個會議在討論再來問我們主委一個狀況那因為台積電先問主委好了台積電的股票你有買嗎\n我沒有買你沒有買那你有沒有關心台積電的股票現在的情形因為我是問我們當然關心因為我們是他的大股東對就是因為國發會我們我們是大股東所以目前的股價一直下跌而在這種情形之下又美國這邊有預告說未來我們半導體可能課稅要到百分之八百分之二十五那在這種情況之下的話我們國人對於整個台積電\n這個未來的發展是不太樂觀也存在很大的疑慮尤其是說現在我們整個台積電到美國是來投資了將近1650億的這個美元那未來會再增加投資也是未來確定性的事情\n但是我們擔心的就是說我們的整個研發會不會移到美國去美國也說他們在那邊台積電會做研發中心會在那裡設置在那裡設置之後的話我們人才剛剛主委特別提到說還是台灣的人才最重要整個先進的研發製程的話都會在台灣研發半年到兩年的時間研發成了會\n之後才拿到美國去就做個製程出來但是我們擔心的是研發中心如果美國設置下去的話他們研發的速度如果比我們快更先進的話那是不是整個技術都會整個被美國控制過去了\n這個所有的技術一定產權屬於台積電所有所以其實台灣有很多公司在矽谷都是有研發中心不瞞您說包括台積電也有因為美國在某些領域還是有頂尖的領先技術整個半導體是從美國發過來的\n所以每一個公司在海外設的研發中心所取得的研究成果還是屬於這家公司的知識產權所以它還是會有營業秘密的保障所以技術還是有一定的保障但是主委你要知道台積電過去之後它底下上下游的產業鏈因為成本因為關稅的問題他們也都會外移到美國在外移的情況之下我們要如何鞏固在我們台灣整個產業的發展這個不是外移是擴大台灣的市場\n因為我們臺灣本土的市場並不夠大那如果我們能走到世界的市場會讓臺灣的產業更加著重所以國發會更要具體的整個政策的一個作為才能讓我們國人對台積電這個護國神山更加有信心是不是你們拿出你們的政策出來好不好我們是有的 謝謝委員好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.449 --> 00:11.559\n請呂玉玲委員做詢答謝謝主席請劉主委劉主委\n\n00:20.785 --> 00:40.015\n六點早安各位在二月份國發會有公布了一月份的景氣的燈號中和整個判斷的話是34分比去年的12月份的38分是掉了4分但是我們從去年看到的整個台灣經濟的狀況是有逐步復甦的情形那這個也擺脫了前幾年藍燈低迷\n\n00:47.659 --> 01:09.411\n據我們國發會的說法是因為整個經濟的動能就是受到AIAI這個產業新興科技整個的發展所帶動起來讓我們出口有更進一步的增加讓國外的很多大廠都到台灣來投資也讓我們的民眾可以支配整個我們國內內需的整個市場的活絡對不對是的\n\n01:12.293 --> 01:20.799\n那本席也特別跟我們的國貿署有調了一份資料我們看到了就是2023年我們整個對於出口總值是4324億2905萬元那2024年的話是4750億284億元整個產值也多了這個將近有426億的美元那看到的話這就是\n\n01:40.112 --> 01:44.719\n目前來講的話就是川普他上任之後的話他說要重回這個貿易這個\n\n01:48.653 --> 02:03.743\n這樣保護的這個措施所以要對各國課以這個關稅那我們也看到了他對於這個大陸的關稅要全面的話要增加了20%而對鋼鐵還有就是鋁的部分的話要25%那我們看到他有預告了4月份都對所有的國家都會這個這個對等的這個關稅都會來增加在這個部分來\n\n02:17.071 --> 02:45.043\n各國也對這個這個美國會有一些的比例的這個課稅的方面都會相對的因應那我請問諸位那目前來講的話我們的關稅施行細則還沒有公布那對於美國對我們的這個出口也是第二大這個市場那請問這個諸位那會不會影響我們下半年裡的出口率出口會下降出口總值會下降情形\n\n02:47.797 --> 03:05.789\n這個部分其實我們是兩件事在做一個是持續溝通第二個我們做一些因應那我舉個例子其實美國整個策略他還是希望在美國製造所以川普講了很多次了就是在美國製造會比較便宜如果課稅的話\n\n03:07.190 --> 03:34.656\n那所以呢我們現在因應比較比較目前機會比較大的像以譬如說半導體好了我大概跟業者我們談了三次那業者是認為呢有些業者他在美國有工廠他會從美國出貨那有些業者呢他認為呢只要是全球一起科稅那他們的競爭條件是一致的所以主委那這樣子的話美國可不可能對我們國內的有哪些產業他會加徵這個關稅\n\n03:39.385 --> 03:59.339\n目前我們看到機會最大的是半導體它會逐步因為它是從稅務平等來看只要我們的平均稅率高於它的那個產業就會有可能要嘛我們降稅要嘛就增稅所以國發會那你對這些產業你要如何協助跟各部會的話怎麼嚴厲因應的方案呢\n\n03:59.919 --> 04:10.902\n對我們現在是這樣子因為它產業別的狀態是不一樣的我想委員應該前面有提到我們美國對於這個鋼鐵鋁去課徵25%的關稅那譬如說它全球課25%關稅的時候對台灣是沒有影響的因為台灣本來就課25%\n\n04:18.824 --> 04:36.984\n反而對韓國中國這些稅負比較低的受到影響所以他不同的產業會有不同的因應的策略所以你要跟各部會做好嚴寧的方案嗎現在是我們副院長在領導大家在做這樣的一個規劃坦白講我們最近也會在\n\n04:37.985 --> 04:48.131\n我們幾乎每個禮拜都有開會可是主委你要知道如果整個出口的產值都萎縮的話也會影響國內整個產業搞不好我們的燈號又回到藍燈了是不是我們其實這個部分我們是一直在觀測美國內部的銷售數據跟就業的狀態還有它的CPI跟PPI\n\n04:59.677 --> 05:23.257\n國防會你有沒有做這個先前的評估嗎有我們現在是很頻繁的在看它只要數字出來我們就有在看它的數字的變動我們希望整個景氣能夠維持現在的狀況然後讓產業變得比較穩定但是如果我們從AI的角度來看它可能整體的需求我們目前評估AI的需求是比較不容易下降的\n\n05:23.877 --> 05:32.779\n可是你現在看到加拿大或者是歐盟國家他對於他這個課稅這關稅的部分的話他們有採取這個相對應的方式就是報復性的課稅對那你對這個看法呢我們台灣的話有沒有那個底氣有沒有那個魄力或者是我們能夠也有相對應的這個方案出來\n\n05:46.233 --> 05:55.160\n因為我們是高貿易依存度的國家所以我們還是會主張要跟世界各國維持友好的關係人家看我們課稅\n\n05:57.025 --> 06:03.412\n科稅這個也不是第一次在2017、2018都有所以我們一直在溝通我們看看4月2號溝通的結果那個時候再來去我們的因應措施目前有一些包括我們怎麼去協助因為我們國發會都很樂觀外銷成本\n\n06:19.289 --> 06:24.551\n你們很樂觀說現在我們整個經濟的成長你們也定到3%如果這種情形一再發生下去的話這經濟成長你就要下修了嗎不一定喔因為這還是一個全球競爭的企業是一個競爭的狀態我舉個例子喔全球經濟如果0成長他去年呢跟我們買100億的東西今年還是會買100億那如果我們從別人別的國家手上拿回一些市場市佔率我們還有可能從100億拉到110億\n\n06:48.641 --> 06:59.958\n可是你這個關稅會影響讓所有的產品的成本都會提高提高之後的話我們整個全球的話就會有通膨的情形發生如果大家都一起漲價本身就是大家會在同一個競爭基礎上\n\n07:01.502 --> 07:09.387\n那現在是怎麼樣去驅動消費端主委是很樂觀但是你不要忽略了這整個對產業國內國外的產業都有很大的衝擊我們為了保護自己的話我們應該跟各部會趕快嚴寧方案出來所以我們每週都有一個會議在討論再來問我們主委一個狀況那因為台積電先問主委好了台積電的股票你有買嗎\n\n07:29.895 --> 07:37.780\n我沒有買你沒有買那你有沒有關心台積電的股票現在的情形因為我是問我們當然關心因為我們是他的大股東對就是因為國發會我們我們是大股東所以目前的股價一直下跌而在這種情形之下又美國這邊有預告說未來我們半導體可能課稅要到百分之八百分之二十五那在這種情況之下的話我們國人對於整個台積電\n\n07:59.553 --> 08:09.520\n這個未來的發展是不太樂觀也存在很大的疑慮尤其是說現在我們整個台積電到美國是來投資了將近1650億的這個美元那未來會再增加投資也是未來確定性的事情\n\n08:17.606 --> 08:37.502\n但是我們擔心的就是說我們的整個研發會不會移到美國去美國也說他們在那邊台積電會做研發中心會在那裡設置在那裡設置之後的話我們人才剛剛主委特別提到說還是台灣的人才最重要整個先進的研發製程的話都會在台灣研發半年到兩年的時間研發成了會\n\n08:41.765 --> 08:56.887\n之後才拿到美國去就做個製程出來但是我們擔心的是研發中心如果美國設置下去的話他們研發的速度如果比我們快更先進的話那是不是整個技術都會整個被美國控制過去了\n\n08:58.889 --> 09:14.662\n這個所有的技術一定產權屬於台積電所有所以其實台灣有很多公司在矽谷都是有研發中心不瞞您說包括台積電也有因為美國在某些領域還是有頂尖的領先技術整個半導體是從美國發過來的\n\n09:16.684 --> 09:43.221\n所以每一個公司在海外設的研發中心所取得的研究成果還是屬於這家公司的知識產權所以它還是會有營業秘密的保障所以技術還是有一定的保障但是主委你要知道台積電過去之後它底下上下游的產業鏈因為成本因為關稅的問題他們也都會外移到美國在外移的情況之下我們要如何鞏固在我們台灣整個產業的發展這個不是外移是擴大台灣的市場\n\n09:44.702 --> 10:05.813\n因為我們臺灣本土的市場並不夠大那如果我們能走到世界的市場會讓臺灣的產業更加著重所以國發會更要具體的整個政策的一個作為才能讓我們國人對台積電這個護國神山更加有信心是不是你們拿出你們的政策出來好不好我們是有的謝謝委員好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.449,"end":11.559,"text":"請呂玉玲委員做詢答謝謝主席 請劉主委劉主委"},{"start":20.785,"end":40.015,"text":"六點早安 各位在二月份國發會有公布了一月份的景氣的燈號中和整個判斷的話是34分比去年的12月份的38分是掉了4分但是我們從去年看到的整個台灣經濟的狀況是有逐步復甦的情形那這個也擺脫了前幾年藍燈低迷"},{"start":47.659,"end":69.411,"text":"據我們國發會的說法是因為整個經濟的動能就是受到AIAI這個產業新興科技整個的發展所帶動起來讓我們出口有更進一步的增加讓國外的很多大廠都到台灣來投資也讓我們的民眾可以支配整個我們國內內需的整個市場的活絡對不對是的"},{"start":72.293,"end":80.799,"text":"那本席也特別跟我們的國貿署有調了一份資料我們看到了就是2023年我們整個對於出口總值是4324億2905萬元那2024年的話是4750億284億元整個產值也多了這個將近有426億的美元那看到的話這就是"},{"start":100.112,"end":104.719,"text":"目前來講的話就是川普他上任之後的話他說要重回這個貿易這個"},{"start":108.653,"end":123.743,"text":"這樣保護的這個措施所以要對各國課以這個關稅那我們也看到了他對於這個大陸的關稅要全面的話要增加了20%而對鋼鐵還有就是鋁的部分的話要25%那我們看到他有預告了4月份都對所有的國家都會這個這個對等的這個關稅都會來增加在這個部分來"},{"start":137.071,"end":165.043,"text":"各國也對這個這個美國會有一些的比例的這個課稅的方面都會相對的因應那我請問諸位那目前來講的話我們的關稅施行細則還沒有公布那對於美國對我們的這個出口也是第二大這個市場那請問這個諸位那會不會影響我們下半年裡的出口率出口會下降出口總值會下降情形"},{"start":167.797,"end":185.789,"text":"這個部分其實我們是兩件事在做一個是持續溝通第二個我們做一些因應那我舉個例子其實美國整個策略他還是希望在美國製造所以川普講了很多次了就是在美國製造會比較便宜如果課稅的話"},{"start":187.19,"end":214.656,"text":"那所以呢我們現在因應比較比較目前機會比較大的像以譬如說半導體好了我大概跟業者我們談了三次那業者是認為呢有些業者他在美國有工廠他會從美國出貨那有些業者呢他認為呢只要是全球一起科稅那他們的競爭條件是一致的所以主委那這樣子的話美國可不可能對我們國內的有哪些產業他會加徵這個關稅"},{"start":219.385,"end":239.339,"text":"目前我們看到機會最大的是半導體它會逐步因為它是從稅務平等來看只要我們的平均稅率高於它的那個產業就會有可能要嘛我們降稅要嘛就增稅所以國發會那你對這些產業你要如何協助跟各部會的話怎麼嚴厲因應的方案呢"},{"start":239.919,"end":250.902,"text":"對 我們現在是這樣子因為它產業別的狀態是不一樣的我想委員應該前面有提到我們美國對於這個鋼鐵鋁去課徵25%的關稅那譬如說它全球課25%關稅的時候對台灣是沒有影響的因為台灣本來就課25%"},{"start":258.824,"end":276.984,"text":"反而對韓國中國這些稅負比較低的受到影響所以他不同的產業會有不同的因應的策略所以你要跟各部會做好嚴寧的方案嗎現在是我們副院長在領導大家在做這樣的一個規劃坦白講我們最近也會在"},{"start":277.985,"end":288.131,"text":"我們幾乎每個禮拜都有開會可是主委你要知道如果整個出口的產值都萎縮的話也會影響國內整個產業搞不好我們的燈號又回到藍燈了是不是我們其實這個部分我們是一直在觀測美國內部的銷售數據跟就業的狀態還有它的CPI跟PPI"},{"start":299.677,"end":323.257,"text":"國防會你有沒有做這個先前的評估嗎有 我們現在是很頻繁的在看它只要數字出來我們就有在看它的數字的變動我們希望整個景氣能夠維持現在的狀況然後讓產業變得比較穩定但是如果我們從AI的角度來看它可能整體的需求我們目前評估AI的需求是比較不容易下降的"},{"start":323.877,"end":332.779,"text":"可是你現在看到加拿大或者是歐盟國家他對於他這個課稅這關稅的部分的話他們有採取這個相對應的方式就是報復性的課稅對那你對這個看法呢我們台灣的話有沒有那個底氣有沒有那個魄力或者是我們能夠也有相對應的這個方案出來"},{"start":346.233,"end":355.16,"text":"因為我們是高貿易依存度的國家所以我們還是會主張要跟世界各國維持友好的關係人家看我們課稅"},{"start":357.025,"end":363.412,"text":"科稅這個也不是第一次在2017、2018都有所以我們一直在溝通我們看看4月2號溝通的結果那個時候再來去我們的因應措施目前有一些包括我們怎麼去協助因為我們國發會都很樂觀外銷成本"},{"start":379.289,"end":384.551,"text":"你們很樂觀說現在我們整個經濟的成長你們也定到3%如果這種情形一再發生下去的話這經濟成長你就要下修了嗎不一定喔因為這還是一個全球競爭的企業是一個競爭的狀態我舉個例子喔全球經濟如果0成長他去年呢跟我們買100億的東西今年還是會買100億那如果我們從別人別的國家手上拿回一些市場市佔率我們還有可能從100億拉到110億"},{"start":408.641,"end":419.958,"text":"可是你這個關稅會影響讓所有的產品的成本都會提高提高之後的話我們整個全球的話就會有通膨的情形發生如果大家都一起漲價本身就是大家會在同一個競爭基礎上"},{"start":421.502,"end":429.387,"text":"那現在是怎麼樣去驅動消費端主委是很樂觀但是你不要忽略了這整個對產業國內國外的產業都有很大的衝擊我們為了保護自己的話我們應該跟各部會趕快嚴寧方案出來所以我們每週都有一個會議在討論再來問我們主委一個狀況那因為台積電先問主委好了台積電的股票你有買嗎"},{"start":449.895,"end":457.78,"text":"我沒有買你沒有買那你有沒有關心台積電的股票現在的情形因為我是問我們當然關心因為我們是他的大股東對就是因為國發會我們我們是大股東所以目前的股價一直下跌而在這種情形之下又美國這邊有預告說未來我們半導體可能課稅要到百分之八百分之二十五那在這種情況之下的話我們國人對於整個台積電"},{"start":479.553,"end":489.52,"text":"這個未來的發展是不太樂觀也存在很大的疑慮尤其是說現在我們整個台積電到美國是來投資了將近1650億的這個美元那未來會再增加投資也是未來確定性的事情"},{"start":497.606,"end":517.502,"text":"但是我們擔心的就是說我們的整個研發會不會移到美國去美國也說他們在那邊台積電會做研發中心會在那裡設置在那裡設置之後的話我們人才剛剛主委特別提到說還是台灣的人才最重要整個先進的研發製程的話都會在台灣研發半年到兩年的時間研發成了會"},{"start":521.765,"end":536.887,"text":"之後才拿到美國去就做個製程出來但是我們擔心的是研發中心如果美國設置下去的話他們研發的速度如果比我們快更先進的話那是不是整個技術都會整個被美國控制過去了"},{"start":538.889,"end":554.662,"text":"這個所有的技術一定產權屬於台積電所有所以其實台灣有很多公司在矽谷都是有研發中心不瞞您說包括台積電也有因為美國在某些領域還是有頂尖的領先技術整個半導體是從美國發過來的"},{"start":556.684,"end":583.221,"text":"所以每一個公司在海外設的研發中心所取得的研究成果還是屬於這家公司的知識產權所以它還是會有營業秘密的保障所以技術還是有一定的保障但是主委你要知道台積電過去之後它底下上下游的產業鏈因為成本因為關稅的問題他們也都會外移到美國在外移的情況之下我們要如何鞏固在我們台灣整個產業的發展這個不是外移是擴大台灣的市場"},{"start":584.702,"end":605.813,"text":"因為我們臺灣本土的市場並不夠大那如果我們能走到世界的市場會讓臺灣的產業更加著重所以國發會更要具體的整個政策的一個作為才能讓我們國人對台積電這個護國神山更加有信心是不是你們拿出你們的政策出來好不好我們是有的 謝謝委員好 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":510,"blocks":[["呂委員玉玲：（11時16分）謝謝主席，請劉主委。"],["主席：劉主委。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：呂委員早安。"],["呂委員玉玲：主委，在2月份國發會公布了1月份景氣的燈號，綜合整個判斷是34分，比去年12月份的38分掉了4分，但是我們從去年看到臺灣經濟的狀況是有逐步復甦的情形，也擺脫了前幾年藍燈的低迷。據國發會的說法，是因為整個經濟的動能受到AI產業、新興科技整個發展所帶動起來，讓我們出口有更進一步的增加，國外很多大廠都到臺灣來投資，也讓我們的民眾可以支配整個國內內需市場的活絡，對不對？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：是的。"],["呂委員玉玲：好，本席也特別跟國貿署調了一份資料，我們看到2023年出口總值是4,324億2,905萬元；2024年是4,750億0,284萬元，整個產值也多將近426億美元。以目前來講，川普上任之後，他說要重回貿易保護的措施，所以要對各國課以關稅，我們也看到他對大陸的關稅要全面增至20%；對於鋼鐵跟鋁要課徵25%，並且預告4月份對所有國家都會實施對等關稅，也就是都會增加，在這個部分，各國對於美國一些課稅比率也都會有相對的因應。目前來講，我們的關稅施行細則還沒有公布，而美國也是我們出口的第二大市場，請問主委，會不會影響我們下半年的出口率，即出口的總值會有下降的情形？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：這個部分其實我們是兩件事在做，一個是持續溝通；第二個，我們做一些因應。我舉個例子，其實美國整個策略還是希望在美國製造，如果課稅的話，川普講了很多次在美國製造會比較便宜。所以，因應目前機會比較大的，譬如說半導體好了，我大概跟業者談了3次，有些業者是認為他在美國有工廠，會從美國出貨；而有些業者認為只要是全球一起課稅，他們的競爭條件是一致的，他們覺得……"],["呂委員玉玲：主委，這樣子的話，美國對我們國內的哪些產業會加徵關稅？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：目前我們看到機會最大的是半導體，它會逐步，因為它是從稅務平等來看，只要我們平均利率高於他們的那個產業就有可能，要嘛我們降稅，要嘛就是增稅，那……"],["呂委員玉玲：所以國發會要如何協助這些產業？你們要怎麼跟各部會研擬因應方案呢？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我們現在是這樣子，因為產業別的狀態不一樣，委員前面也有提到美國對於鋼鐵、鋁課徵25%的關稅，譬如說在它對全球課徵25%關稅的時候，對臺灣是沒有影響的，因為臺灣本來就課25%，反而是韓國、中國這些稅率比較低的會受到影響，所以不同的產業會有不同的因應策略。"],["呂委員玉玲：所以你要跟各部會研擬好因應方案。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：有，現在是我們副院長在領導大家做這樣的規劃，坦白講，我們最近幾乎每個禮拜都開會。"],["呂委員玉玲：可是主委你要知道，如果整個出口產值萎縮的話，也會影響國內整個產業，搞不好我們的景氣燈號又會回到藍燈，是不是？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：這個部分其實我們一直在觀測美國內部的銷售數據跟就業狀態，還有它的CPI跟平均來做比較。"],["呂委員玉玲：所以國發會有做這個先前的評估嗎？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：有，我們現在就是很頻繁地在看，只要數字出來，我們就會看它的變動。我們希望整個景氣能夠維持現在的狀況，讓產業可以變得比較穩定，但是如果從AI的角度來看，我們目前評估它整體的需求是比較不容易下降的。"],["呂委員玉玲：主委，可是現在加拿大或歐盟國家對這個關稅的課徵有採取相對應的方式，就是報復性的課稅，你對這種方式有何看法？我們臺灣有沒有這樣的底氣和魄力，或者是我們也能提出相對應的方案？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：因為我們是高貿易依存度的國家，所以還是會主張要跟世界各國維持友好的關係，那……"],["呂委員玉玲：可是人家跟我們課稅了啊！"],["劉主任委員鏡清：有關課稅的部分，這也不是第一次了，在2017、2018都有，所以我們……"],["呂委員玉玲：可是現在是加重啊！美國優先、美國課稅啊！"],["劉主任委員鏡清：所以我們一直在溝通，看看4月2日溝通結果再提出相關措施，目前的因應措施包括怎麼去協助廠商降低外銷成本……"],["呂委員玉玲：因為國發會很樂觀啊！你們很樂觀，所以對於我們的經濟成長率，你們也把它訂在3%……"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我們非常審慎。"],["呂委員玉玲：如果這個情形一再發生，經濟成長率可能就要下修了嘛！"],["劉主任委員鏡清：不一定，因為企業是一個競爭的狀態，我舉個例子，全球經濟如果零成長，它去年跟我們買100億的東西，今年還是會買100億，如果我們從別的國家手上拿回一些市占率，我們還有可能從100億拉到110億。"],["呂委員玉玲：可是這樣的關稅會讓所有產品的成本都提高，之後全球就會有通膨的情形發生。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：如果大家都一起漲價，大家就會在同一個競爭基礎上，現在是怎麼樣去趨動消費端能夠達成……"],["呂委員玉玲：主委是很樂觀啦！但是你不要忽略這對國內外產業都會產生很大的衝擊，為了保護自己，我們應該趕快跟各部會研擬出方案，這才是最重要的，好不好？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：是的，所以我們現在每週都有一個會議在討論這個問題。"],["呂委員玉玲：本席想再請教主委一個狀況。首先請問主委，你有買台積電的股票嗎？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我沒有買。"],["呂委員玉玲：那你有沒有關心台積電現在的情形？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我們當然關心啊，因為我們是它的大股東。"],["呂委員玉玲：對，就是因為國發會是台積電的大股東，目前台積電股價一直下跌，而美國又預告可能要對半導體課到25%的稅，在這種情況之下，國人對於台積電未來的發展存有很大的疑慮，尤其現在台積電到美國投資了將近1,650億美元，雖然後續會不會再增加投資目前還不確定，但是我們擔心它整個研發會不會移到美國去。美國說台積電會在他們那裡設置研發中心，如果設在那裡的話，我們的人才呢？剛剛主委特別提到還是臺灣的人才最重要，整個先進研發製程都會在臺灣研發半年到兩年的時間，研發成功之後才會拿到美國去做為製程，但我們擔心的是，如果在美國設置研發中心，而且他們的研發速度比我們快、比我們更先進的話，會不會整個技術都被美國控制？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：所有技術的產權一定都屬於台積電所有，其實臺灣也有很多公司在矽谷都設有研發中心，不瞞您說，包括台積電也有。因為美國在某些領域還是有頂尖的領先技術，整個半導體就是從美國發展過來的，所以每家公司在其海外研發中心取得的研究成果還是屬於這家公司的知識產權，還是會受營業秘密的保障。"],["呂委員玉玲：雖然技術還是有一定的保障，但是主委你要知道，台積電過去之後，它上下游的產業鏈會因為成本和關稅的問題也外移到美國，在外移的情況之下，我們要如何鞏固臺灣整個產業的發展？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：這個不是外移，而是擴大臺灣的市場，因為我們臺灣本土的市場並不夠大，如果我們能走到世界的市場，會讓臺灣的產業更加茁壯，所以我們本來……"],["呂委員玉玲：所以國發會更要有具體的政策作為，才能讓國人對台積電這個護國神山更加有信心。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：是的。我們現在其實……"],["呂委員玉玲：你們要拿出你們的政策出來，好不好？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我們是有的。"],["呂委員玉玲：好。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝。現在請邱志偉委員詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":192,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-3","speakers":["謝衣鳯","林岱樺","邱議瑩","張啓楷","陳超明","楊瓊瓔","陳亭妃","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","鄭正鈐","呂玉玲","邱志偉","王鴻薇","賴瑞隆","蔡易餘","林倩綺","鍾佳濱","陳培瑜","張雅琳","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","黃建賓","徐欣瑩","陳冠廷","張嘉郡"],"page_start":133,"meetingDate":["2025-03-19"],"gazette_id":"1143002","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143002_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第3次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請國家發展委員會主任委員列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1143002_00003"}}}