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\"我\", \"start\": 321.192, \"end\": 321.292, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"綠\"}, {\"word\": \"電\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 321.292, \"end\": 321.372, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"增\", \"start\": 321.372, \"end\": 321.392, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"設\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 321.392, \"end\": 321.412, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 321.412, \"end\": 321.432, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"遺\"}, {\"word\": \"餘\"}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 321.432, \"end\": 321.452, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 321.452, \"end\": 321.472, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 326.016, \"end\": 347.372, \"text\": \"因為我們增設綠電的這個部分主要還是要滿足台灣半導體業它的需求那針對這個部分的時候我想另外再衍生一個問題其實就是之前很多委員也都很關心就是呂宋經濟走廊這個計畫那因為之前是拜登的一個計畫現在川普上來之後這個計畫還繼續執行嗎\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 326.016, \"end\": 326.857, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 326.857, \"end\": 327.097, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, 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\"所以我們是協助他們能夠將他在台灣製造特別是這個台灣製造的光電是飛鴻供應鏈裡面非常重要的一部分理解所以我想在這個民主同盟的這個光電的需求台灣的業者可以扮演非常強大的這個貢獻所以我們幫助他能夠到菲律賓去種電所以我們會去幫他談到一些可以當地快速落地快速賺錢的這個方法\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 414.81, \"end\": 414.93, \"score\": 0.835}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 414.93, \"end\": 415.07, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 415.07, \"end\": 415.31, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 415.31, \"end\": 415.791, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"助\", \"start\": 415.791, \"end\": 415.991, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 415.991, \"end\": 416.911, \"score\": 0.971}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 416.911, \"end\": 417.992, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"將\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 417.992, \"end\": 418.172, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 418.172, \"end\": 418.352, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 418.352, \"end\": 419.532, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": 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{\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 437.901, \"end\": 438.501, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"幫\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 438.501, \"end\": 439.662, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"談\"}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 439.662, \"end\": 440.022, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 440.022, \"end\": 440.222, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 440.222, \"end\": 440.602, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 440.602, \"end\": 440.742, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 440.742, \"end\": 441.183, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"當\"}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 441.183, \"end\": 441.463, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"快\", \"start\": 441.463, \"end\": 441.743, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"速\", \"start\": 441.743, \"end\": 441.963, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"落\", \"start\": 441.963, \"end\": 442.163, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 442.163, \"end\": 442.403, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"快\", \"start\": 442.403, \"end\": 442.583, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"速\", \"start\": 442.583, \"end\": 442.723, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"賺\"}, {\"word\": \"錢\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 442.723, \"end\": 442.823, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 442.823, \"end\": 442.983, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 442.983, \"end\": 443.003, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 444.264, \"end\": 464.317, \"text\": \"OK 兩個部分所以呂宋經濟走廊這個部分不影響到你提的一個呂宋重電的這個計畫對不對那呂宋重電計畫我上一次在質詢的時候我也曾經問過你一個狀態是在呂宋這邊發電的狀態它的碳權有沒有辦法為台灣企業所使用你那時候提到說因為必須要有電纜\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"O\", \"start\": 444.264, \"end\": 444.744, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"K\", \"start\": 444.744, \"end\": 445.025, \"score\": 0.838}, {\"word\": \"兩\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 445.025, \"end\": 445.245, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 445.245, \"end\": 445.725, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 445.725, \"end\": 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\"end\": 461.735, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"灣\"}, {\"word\": \"企\", \"start\": 461.735, \"end\": 462.075, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 462.075, \"end\": 462.395, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"使\", \"start\": 462.395, \"end\": 462.595, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 462.595, \"end\": 463.116, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 463.116, \"end\": 463.216, \"score\": 0.767}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 463.216, \"end\": 463.336, \"score\": 0.821}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 463.336, \"end\": 463.476, \"score\": 0.827}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 463.476, \"end\": 463.616, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 463.616, \"end\": 463.876, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 463.876, \"end\": 463.996, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"必\", \"start\": 463.996, \"end\": 464.136, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"須\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 464.136, \"end\": 464.297, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 464.297, \"end\": 464.317, \"score\": 0.025}, {\"word\": \"電\"}, {\"word\": \"纜\"}]}, {\"start\": 465.257, \"end\": 487.738, \"text\": \"才能夠滿足R100的需求那因為現在還有R130的問題然後我看到你們提到報告當中提到一個運電船的這個問題我先不考慮它的成本我想先知道運電船假設運到台灣因為你剛剛有提到說年底日本這邊有就是成本會降低到一度一塊多那這個狀態的時候用運電船運到台灣的電\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"才\", \"start\": 465.257, \"end\": 465.377, \"score\": 0.641}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 465.377, \"end\": 466.658, \"score\": 0.865}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"滿\"}, {\"word\": \"足\", \"start\": 466.658, \"end\": 466.779, \"score\": 0.742}, {\"word\": \"R\", \"start\": 466.779, \"end\": 467.239, \"score\": 0.778}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 467.239, \"end\": 467.359, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"需\", \"start\": 467.359, \"end\": 467.579, \"score\": 0.842}, {\"word\": \"求\", \"start\": 467.579, \"end\": 468.24, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"那\", 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0.805}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 668.579, \"end\": 668.599, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:08,581 --> 00:00:11,196\n謝主席我想請一下郭智慧郭部長郭部長\n\n2\n00:00:22,288 --> 00:00:44,596\n部長好我發現昭緯其實對你特別友善因為我們今天的質詢時間少了兩分鐘所以可以感覺到我們昭緯是對你是友善的一個狀態我想說大家都很關心台灣的能源政策感覺像電價上漲似乎已經在箭在弦上可是我覺得台灣對於整個用電用到哪裡去我們也非常非常的關心\n\n3\n00:00:46,077 --> 00:01:01,219\n可是我發現說我們在找一些資料的時候我想問一下部長這邊因為我們想要知道說台灣前30大的用電大戶的相關的資料這個部分可不可以提供\n\n4\n00:01:04,436 --> 00:01:21,982\n報告委員限於個資法的部分我們有困難個資法的部分不能夠提供用電大戶的名單是這樣子嗎確定嗎連我們如果要質詢也都不能夠有這樣子的一個狀態嗎\n\n5\n00:01:25,454 --> 00:01:40,864\n對於這個產業競爭的部分他用的度數多少這個我們很難提供Ranking的部分我想沒有問題Ranking的部分沒有問題嘛前30大用電的部分沒有問題可是如果要知道說他們用電的種類數量\n\n6\n00:01:42,705 --> 00:02:11,277\n可能就會有一些問題對不對OK那我們之後我們辦公室會直接會跟能源署這邊要求資料因為按照能源管理法的時候我們應該要有最真實相關的一個掌握OK好那我們接下來因為為什麼會提到這個部分因為當大家都在關心台積電到美國去投資1000億這件事情的時候很多人講到國安的問題或等等可是我從產業上面直接得到一些訊息的時候他們很多很直覺的反應跟我講說是因為台灣的電他們怕不夠\n\n7\n00:02:12,057 --> 00:02:34,394\n所以到國外去設廠那這當然都有很多不同的理由那我只想要請教一下部長這邊就是去年2024年的時候台積電的用電量佔台灣整體發電量的百分之多少大概是8%左右\n\n8\n00:02:36,745 --> 00:02:52,056\n8%嗎因為我看媒體有些是寫9%那我按照那個標準普爾他的一個國際報告的時候他認為說電力供應逐漸成為台積電的信用風險那他提到的數字是在\n\n9\n00:02:53,817 --> 00:03:20,312\n2023年的時候大概是8.4%啦那預計到2030年的時候就是會佔到台灣總體發電量的15.6%比重不斷的升高所以這也是為什麼其實我在第一線的時候很多台積電裡面的人他們第一個直接反應就是說因為電量不夠所以他們要到國外去投資那我這邊我也想請教因為我這邊也有一些不同的訊息\n\n10\n00:03:21,653 --> 00:03:47,515\n就是他提到一個點就是說台積電現在每天到夏季的時候下午用電尖峰的時候如果台電的備載容量有點不夠的時候呢台積電馬上就會被要求降載然後台積電的沒關係等一下你再回應一下然後他們就直接講說台積電他們自己的一個柴油發電機幾乎天天是火力全開長達半年的時間有沒有這樣的一個狀態\n\n11\n00:03:49,073 --> 00:04:09,055\n報告委員,你是新竹市的委員,你應該非常清楚台積電的訊息,台積電半導體廠是不能夠降載的。所以這個就是我要特別提的問題,是因為地方一直在傳這件事情。我覺得可能是有人提供錯誤的訊息給你。\n\n12\n00:04:10,416 --> 00:04:39,583\n理解所以說我這邊我要特別提到就是說我們這邊對於電的部分是怎麼樣子我覺得我們這邊很關切所以從你上來的時候我們就不斷在講到怎麼樣在優化台灣綠電的一個產出所以當我們之前特別問到一個台澎電纜的部分因為它現在有200MHz的一個電纜線可是它實際能夠用的部分非常非常的低只有80MHz那我們在想這個部分有沒有辦法把它提高\n\n13\n00:04:41,464 --> 00:05:01,275\n報導委員我們現在當然有一個新的計畫我們大概澎湖有一些地區他們可以設置太陽能光電也可以設置陸域的風電那這個全部是綠電我們可以利用現有的海纜把它送回來\n\n14\n00:05:02,456 --> 00:05:21,472\n這個大概會有將近100多MW這個對我們來講因為澎湖來到新竹其實也蠻近的所以我想這是一個我們在啟動新的計畫的一部分當然現在我們還在抱怨許可我相信我們對綠電的增設是不遺餘力的\n\n15\n00:05:26,016 --> 00:05:47,372\n因為我們增設綠電的這個部分主要還是要滿足台灣半導體業它的需求那針對這個部分的時候我想另外再衍生一個問題其實就是之前很多委員也都很關心就是呂宋經濟走廊這個計畫那因為之前是拜登的一個計畫現在川普上來之後這個計畫還繼續執行嗎\n\n16\n00:05:51,039 --> 00:05:52,300\n報告委員這個計畫因為這個美國政府的這個改變那這個計畫我們必須要得到這個\n\n17\n00:06:01,325 --> 00:06:26,144\nAIT然後這個菲律賓的這個美國駐菲律賓他們的這些關鍵人物的這個支持所以我們不是在旅送經濟走廊上面的份子我們只是想要參與那因為我知道去年的時候包括國發會主委其實也都直接表示台灣是要參與在旅送經濟走廊這個計畫當中很具體的表示出來\n\n18\n00:06:26,724 --> 00:06:54,250\n那你這邊也某一個部分參與那我想知道一個狀態是這個計畫影不影響到我們在呂宋重電它可不可以分開來獨立處理基本上這是兩個不同的計畫我們希望讓台灣的廠商可以到菲律賓去重電主要是我們希望光電業者因為台灣這個市場太小了它必須要走到世界但是最近的世界就是在菲律賓跟日本\n\n19\n00:06:54,810 --> 00:07:23,003\n所以我們是協助他們能夠將他在台灣製造特別是這個台灣製造的光電是飛鴻供應鏈裡面非常重要的一部分理解所以我想在這個民主同盟的這個光電的需求台灣的業者可以扮演非常強大的這個貢獻所以我們幫助他能夠到菲律賓去種電所以我們會去幫他談到一些可以當地快速落地快速賺錢的這個方法\n\n20\n00:07:24,264 --> 00:07:44,317\nOK兩個部分所以呂宋經濟走廊這個部分不影響到你提的一個呂宋重電的這個計畫對不對那呂宋重電計畫我上一次在質詢的時候我也曾經問過你一個狀態是在呂宋這邊發電的狀態它的碳權有沒有辦法為台灣企業所使用你那時候提到說因為必須要有電纜\n\n21\n00:07:45,257 --> 00:08:07,738\n才能夠滿足R100的需求那因為現在還有R130的問題然後我看到你們提到報告當中提到一個運電船的這個問題我先不考慮它的成本我想先知道運電船假設運到台灣因為你剛剛有提到說年底日本這邊有就是成本會降低到一度一塊多那這個狀態的時候用運電船運到台灣的電\n\n22\n00:08:11,161 --> 00:08:26,428\n碳泉能不能使用可以可以使用那這個部分那個船本身也是綠電的電池的話電動船就可以如果是燒油的那就變成灰電所以說如果是\n\n23\n00:08:29,438 --> 00:08:42,313\n運電船運到台灣來的電這探權還是可以由台灣的企業這邊來直接使用他這個部分之後有再更細的資料再給本席一下我這邊另外要問一下我們大阪市博會這邊的進度\n\n24\n00:08:44,471 --> 00:09:06,082\n有沒有落後報告委員沒有落後因為那個我看整個新聞出來說目前整個國外的一個國際場館只有完成不到20%剩下不到一個月要開展那我在想說關心台灣這邊因為我們花了20億在大阪市博會這邊那進度是不是能夠如期開張\n\n25\n00:09:07,843 --> 00:09:25,258\n我們現在是按照進度在進行啦這部分詳細的話我是不是請我們署長跟你報告因為時間的關係請事後再跟本辦公室做一個清楚的報告好不好那我最後想問一個因為你在那個你的口頭報告當中的時候有特別提到了一個軍工的一個產業\n\n26\n00:09:26,519 --> 00:09:42,875\n在國家防衛任性扮演的角色當中你特別提到了一個就是無人機的一個費用供應鏈就無人機國家隊的問題那我想問一下目前這個無人機國家隊他是用商規軍用還是直接變成軍規軍用\n\n27\n00:09:44,733 --> 00:10:03,623\n我們目前所啟動的是軍規商用所以目前是用了軍規商用的部分可是商用跟軍用是他就在一線之隔只是用法上面的部分200公里為界限200公里可以飛200公里以上的叫軍規軍用\n\n28\n00:10:06,085 --> 00:10:26,243\n軍規但是商用的是可以飛200公里以內的是叫軍規商用所以基本上目前你會把這個無人機這個部分放在軍工產業這邊就是因為它是軍規商用所以對台灣來講的時候如果說我們無人機要用變成軍規軍用其實也是很容易的對不對防禦上面沒有問題\n\n29\n00:10:26,883 --> 00:10:50,633\nOK理解那針對無人艇的部分因為你在這邊的時候針對無人艇的部分目前我們還沒有完成一個國家隊的一個建立可是無人艇的部分在整個軍規軍用的部分某個部分也很近那針對這個部分我想說之後再給本辦公室一個清楚的一個資料好不好因為時間的關係是的好謝謝\n\n30\n00:10:52,215 --> 00:11:08,599\n政委員我主席做一項宣告因為今天登記發言的委員非常多那為了在郭部長離開前讓所有委員都可以質詢到他所以我們就是減少發言的時間不是對郭部長特別好而是對本會以及所有委員好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n8581\t11196\t謝主席我想請一下郭智慧郭部長郭部長\n22288\t44596\t部長好 我發現昭緯其實對你特別友善因為我們今天的質詢時間少了兩分鐘所以可以感覺到我們昭緯是對你是友善的一個狀態我想說大家都很關心台灣的能源政策感覺像電價上漲似乎已經在箭在弦上可是我覺得台灣對於整個用電用到哪裡去我們也非常非常的關心\n46077\t61219\t可是我發現說我們在找一些資料的時候我想問一下部長這邊因為我們想要知道說台灣前30大的用電大戶的相關的資料這個部分可不可以提供\n64436\t81982\t報告委員 限於個資法的部分我們有困難個資法的部分不能夠提供用電大戶的名單是這樣子嗎 確定嗎連我們如果要質詢也都不能夠有這樣子的一個狀態嗎\n85454\t100864\t對於這個產業競爭的部分他用的度數多少這個我們很難提供Ranking的部分我想沒有問題Ranking的部分沒有問題嘛前30大用電的部分沒有問題可是如果要知道說他們用電的種類數量\n102705\t131277\t可能就會有一些問題對不對OK那我們之後我們辦公室會直接會跟能源署這邊要求資料因為按照能源管理法的時候我們應該要有最真實相關的一個掌握OK好那我們接下來因為為什麼會提到這個部分因為當大家都在關心台積電到美國去投資1000億這件事情的時候很多人講到國安的問題或等等可是我從產業上面直接得到一些訊息的時候他們很多很直覺的反應跟我講說是因為台灣的電他們怕不夠\n132057\t154394\t所以到國外去設廠那這當然都有很多不同的理由那我只想要請教一下部長這邊就是去年2024年的時候台積電的用電量佔台灣整體發電量的百分之多少大概是8%左右\n156745\t172056\t8%嗎因為我看媒體有些是寫9%那我按照那個標準普爾他的一個國際報告的時候他認為說電力供應逐漸成為台積電的信用風險那他提到的數字是在\n173817\t200312\t2023年的時候大概是8.4%啦那預計到2030年的時候就是會佔到台灣總體發電量的15.6%比重不斷的升高所以這也是為什麼其實我在第一線的時候很多台積電裡面的人他們第一個直接反應就是說因為電量不夠所以他們要到國外去投資那我這邊我也想請教因為我這邊也有一些不同的訊息\n201653\t227515\t就是他提到一個點就是說台積電現在每天到夏季的時候下午用電尖峰的時候如果台電的備載容量有點不夠的時候呢台積電馬上就會被要求降載然後台積電的沒關係等一下你再回應一下然後他們就直接講說台積電他們自己的一個柴油發電機幾乎天天是火力全開長達半年的時間有沒有這樣的一個狀態\n229073\t249055\t報告委員,你是新竹市的委員,你應該非常清楚台積電的訊息,台積電半導體廠是不能夠降載的。所以這個就是我要特別提的問題,是因為地方一直在傳這件事情。我覺得可能是有人提供錯誤的訊息給你。\n250416\t279583\t理解所以說我這邊我要特別提到就是說我們這邊對於電的部分是怎麼樣子我覺得我們這邊很關切所以從你上來的時候我們就不斷在講到怎麼樣在優化台灣綠電的一個產出所以當我們之前特別問到一個台澎電纜的部分因為它現在有200MHz的一個電纜線可是它實際能夠用的部分非常非常的低只有80MHz那我們在想這個部分有沒有辦法把它提高\n281464\t301275\t報導委員我們現在當然有一個新的計畫我們大概澎湖有一些地區他們可以設置太陽能光電也可以設置陸域的風電那這個全部是綠電我們可以利用現有的海纜把它送回來\n302456\t321472\t這個大概會有將近100多MW這個對我們來講 因為澎湖來到新竹其實也蠻近的所以我想這是一個我們在啟動新的計畫的一部分當然現在我們還在抱怨許可我相信我們對綠電的增設是不遺餘力的\n326016\t347372\t因為我們增設綠電的這個部分主要還是要滿足台灣半導體業它的需求那針對這個部分的時候我想另外再衍生一個問題其實就是之前很多委員也都很關心就是呂宋經濟走廊這個計畫那因為之前是拜登的一個計畫現在川普上來之後這個計畫還繼續執行嗎\n351039\t352300\t報告委員這個計畫因為這個美國政府的這個改變那這個計畫我們必須要得到這個\n361325\t386144\tAIT然後這個菲律賓的這個美國駐菲律賓他們的這些關鍵人物的這個支持所以我們不是在旅送經濟走廊上面的份子我們只是想要參與那因為我知道去年的時候包括國發會主委其實也都直接表示台灣是要參與在旅送經濟走廊這個計畫當中很具體的表示出來\n386724\t414250\t那你這邊也某一個部分參與那我想知道一個狀態是這個計畫影不影響到我們在呂宋重電它可不可以分開來獨立處理基本上這是兩個不同的計畫我們希望讓台灣的廠商可以到菲律賓去重電主要是我們希望光電業者因為台灣這個市場太小了它必須要走到世界但是最近的世界就是在菲律賓跟日本\n414810\t443003\t所以我們是協助他們能夠將他在台灣製造特別是這個台灣製造的光電是飛鴻供應鏈裡面非常重要的一部分理解所以我想在這個民主同盟的這個光電的需求台灣的業者可以扮演非常強大的這個貢獻所以我們幫助他能夠到菲律賓去種電所以我們會去幫他談到一些可以當地快速落地快速賺錢的這個方法\n444264\t464317\tOK 兩個部分所以呂宋經濟走廊這個部分不影響到你提的一個呂宋重電的這個計畫對不對那呂宋重電計畫我上一次在質詢的時候我也曾經問過你一個狀態是在呂宋這邊發電的狀態它的碳權有沒有辦法為台灣企業所使用你那時候提到說因為必須要有電纜\n465257\t487738\t才能夠滿足R100的需求那因為現在還有R130的問題然後我看到你們提到報告當中提到一個運電船的這個問題我先不考慮它的成本我想先知道運電船假設運到台灣因為你剛剛有提到說年底日本這邊有就是成本會降低到一度一塊多那這個狀態的時候用運電船運到台灣的電\n491161\t506428\t碳泉能不能使用可以可以使用那這個部分那個船本身也是綠電的電池的話電動船就可以如果是燒油的那就變成灰電所以說如果是\n509438\t522313\t運電船運到台灣來的電這探權還是可以由台灣的企業這邊來直接使用他這個部分之後有再更細的資料再給本席一下我這邊另外要問一下我們大阪市博會這邊的進度\n524471\t546082\t有沒有落後報告委員沒有落後因為那個我看整個新聞出來說目前整個國外的一個國際場館只有完成不到20%剩下不到一個月要開展那我在想說關心台灣這邊因為我們花了20億在大阪市博會這邊那進度是不是能夠如期開張\n547843\t565258\t我們現在是按照進度在進行啦這部分詳細的話我是不是請我們署長跟你報告因為時間的關係請事後再跟本辦公室做一個清楚的報告好不好那我最後想問一個因為你在那個你的口頭報告當中的時候有特別提到了一個軍工的一個產業\n566519\t582875\t在國家防衛任性扮演的角色當中你特別提到了一個就是無人機的一個費用供應鏈就無人機國家隊的問題那我想問一下目前這個無人機國家隊他是用商規軍用還是直接變成軍規軍用\n584733\t603623\t我們目前所啟動的是軍規商用所以目前是用了軍規商用的部分可是商用跟軍用是他就在一線之隔 只是用法上面的部分200公里為界限 200公里可以飛200公里以上的叫軍規軍用\n606085\t626243\t軍規但是商用的是可以飛200公里以內的是叫軍規商用所以基本上目前你會把這個無人機這個部分放在軍工產業這邊就是因為它是軍規商用所以對台灣來講的時候如果說我們無人機要用變成軍規軍用其實也是很容易的對不對防禦上面沒有問題\n626883\t650633\tOK理解那針對無人艇的部分因為你在這邊的時候針對無人艇的部分目前我們還沒有完成一個國家隊的一個建立可是無人艇的部分在整個軍規軍用的部分某個部分也很近那針對這個部分我想說之後再給本辦公室一個清楚的一個資料好不好因為時間的關係是的好謝謝\n652215\t668599\t政委員我主席做一項宣告因為今天登記發言的委員非常多那為了在郭部長離開前讓所有委員都可以質詢到他所以我們就是減少發言的時間不是對郭部長特別好而是對本會以及所有委員好謝謝\n","txt":"謝主席我想請一下郭智慧郭部長郭部長\n部長好 我發現昭緯其實對你特別友善因為我們今天的質詢時間少了兩分鐘所以可以感覺到我們昭緯是對你是友善的一個狀態我想說大家都很關心台灣的能源政策感覺像電價上漲似乎已經在箭在弦上可是我覺得台灣對於整個用電用到哪裡去我們也非常非常的關心\n可是我發現說我們在找一些資料的時候我想問一下部長這邊因為我們想要知道說台灣前30大的用電大戶的相關的資料這個部分可不可以提供\n報告委員 限於個資法的部分我們有困難個資法的部分不能夠提供用電大戶的名單是這樣子嗎 確定嗎連我們如果要質詢也都不能夠有這樣子的一個狀態嗎\n對於這個產業競爭的部分他用的度數多少這個我們很難提供Ranking的部分我想沒有問題Ranking的部分沒有問題嘛前30大用電的部分沒有問題可是如果要知道說他們用電的種類數量\n可能就會有一些問題對不對OK那我們之後我們辦公室會直接會跟能源署這邊要求資料因為按照能源管理法的時候我們應該要有最真實相關的一個掌握OK好那我們接下來因為為什麼會提到這個部分因為當大家都在關心台積電到美國去投資1000億這件事情的時候很多人講到國安的問題或等等可是我從產業上面直接得到一些訊息的時候他們很多很直覺的反應跟我講說是因為台灣的電他們怕不夠\n所以到國外去設廠那這當然都有很多不同的理由那我只想要請教一下部長這邊就是去年2024年的時候台積電的用電量佔台灣整體發電量的百分之多少大概是8%左右\n8%嗎因為我看媒體有些是寫9%那我按照那個標準普爾他的一個國際報告的時候他認為說電力供應逐漸成為台積電的信用風險那他提到的數字是在\n2023年的時候大概是8.4%啦那預計到2030年的時候就是會佔到台灣總體發電量的15.6%比重不斷的升高所以這也是為什麼其實我在第一線的時候很多台積電裡面的人他們第一個直接反應就是說因為電量不夠所以他們要到國外去投資那我這邊我也想請教因為我這邊也有一些不同的訊息\n就是他提到一個點就是說台積電現在每天到夏季的時候下午用電尖峰的時候如果台電的備載容量有點不夠的時候呢台積電馬上就會被要求降載然後台積電的沒關係等一下你再回應一下然後他們就直接講說台積電他們自己的一個柴油發電機幾乎天天是火力全開長達半年的時間有沒有這樣的一個狀態\n報告委員,你是新竹市的委員,你應該非常清楚台積電的訊息,台積電半導體廠是不能夠降載的。所以這個就是我要特別提的問題,是因為地方一直在傳這件事情。我覺得可能是有人提供錯誤的訊息給你。\n理解所以說我這邊我要特別提到就是說我們這邊對於電的部分是怎麼樣子我覺得我們這邊很關切所以從你上來的時候我們就不斷在講到怎麼樣在優化台灣綠電的一個產出所以當我們之前特別問到一個台澎電纜的部分因為它現在有200MHz的一個電纜線可是它實際能夠用的部分非常非常的低只有80MHz那我們在想這個部分有沒有辦法把它提高\n報導委員我們現在當然有一個新的計畫我們大概澎湖有一些地區他們可以設置太陽能光電也可以設置陸域的風電那這個全部是綠電我們可以利用現有的海纜把它送回來\n這個大概會有將近100多MW這個對我們來講 因為澎湖來到新竹其實也蠻近的所以我想這是一個我們在啟動新的計畫的一部分當然現在我們還在抱怨許可我相信我們對綠電的增設是不遺餘力的\n因為我們增設綠電的這個部分主要還是要滿足台灣半導體業它的需求那針對這個部分的時候我想另外再衍生一個問題其實就是之前很多委員也都很關心就是呂宋經濟走廊這個計畫那因為之前是拜登的一個計畫現在川普上來之後這個計畫還繼續執行嗎\n報告委員這個計畫因為這個美國政府的這個改變那這個計畫我們必須要得到這個\nAIT然後這個菲律賓的這個美國駐菲律賓他們的這些關鍵人物的這個支持所以我們不是在旅送經濟走廊上面的份子我們只是想要參與那因為我知道去年的時候包括國發會主委其實也都直接表示台灣是要參與在旅送經濟走廊這個計畫當中很具體的表示出來\n那你這邊也某一個部分參與那我想知道一個狀態是這個計畫影不影響到我們在呂宋重電它可不可以分開來獨立處理基本上這是兩個不同的計畫我們希望讓台灣的廠商可以到菲律賓去重電主要是我們希望光電業者因為台灣這個市場太小了它必須要走到世界但是最近的世界就是在菲律賓跟日本\n所以我們是協助他們能夠將他在台灣製造特別是這個台灣製造的光電是飛鴻供應鏈裡面非常重要的一部分理解所以我想在這個民主同盟的這個光電的需求台灣的業者可以扮演非常強大的這個貢獻所以我們幫助他能夠到菲律賓去種電所以我們會去幫他談到一些可以當地快速落地快速賺錢的這個方法\nOK 兩個部分所以呂宋經濟走廊這個部分不影響到你提的一個呂宋重電的這個計畫對不對那呂宋重電計畫我上一次在質詢的時候我也曾經問過你一個狀態是在呂宋這邊發電的狀態它的碳權有沒有辦法為台灣企業所使用你那時候提到說因為必須要有電纜\n才能夠滿足R100的需求那因為現在還有R130的問題然後我看到你們提到報告當中提到一個運電船的這個問題我先不考慮它的成本我想先知道運電船假設運到台灣因為你剛剛有提到說年底日本這邊有就是成本會降低到一度一塊多那這個狀態的時候用運電船運到台灣的電\n碳泉能不能使用可以可以使用那這個部分那個船本身也是綠電的電池的話電動船就可以如果是燒油的那就變成灰電所以說如果是\n運電船運到台灣來的電這探權還是可以由台灣的企業這邊來直接使用他這個部分之後有再更細的資料再給本席一下我這邊另外要問一下我們大阪市博會這邊的進度\n有沒有落後報告委員沒有落後因為那個我看整個新聞出來說目前整個國外的一個國際場館只有完成不到20%剩下不到一個月要開展那我在想說關心台灣這邊因為我們花了20億在大阪市博會這邊那進度是不是能夠如期開張\n我們現在是按照進度在進行啦這部分詳細的話我是不是請我們署長跟你報告因為時間的關係請事後再跟本辦公室做一個清楚的報告好不好那我最後想問一個因為你在那個你的口頭報告當中的時候有特別提到了一個軍工的一個產業\n在國家防衛任性扮演的角色當中你特別提到了一個就是無人機的一個費用供應鏈就無人機國家隊的問題那我想問一下目前這個無人機國家隊他是用商規軍用還是直接變成軍規軍用\n我們目前所啟動的是軍規商用所以目前是用了軍規商用的部分可是商用跟軍用是他就在一線之隔 只是用法上面的部分200公里為界限 200公里可以飛200公里以上的叫軍規軍用\n軍規但是商用的是可以飛200公里以內的是叫軍規商用所以基本上目前你會把這個無人機這個部分放在軍工產業這邊就是因為它是軍規商用所以對台灣來講的時候如果說我們無人機要用變成軍規軍用其實也是很容易的對不對防禦上面沒有問題\nOK理解那針對無人艇的部分因為你在這邊的時候針對無人艇的部分目前我們還沒有完成一個國家隊的一個建立可是無人艇的部分在整個軍規軍用的部分某個部分也很近那針對這個部分我想說之後再給本辦公室一個清楚的一個資料好不好因為時間的關係是的好謝謝\n政委員我主席做一項宣告因為今天登記發言的委員非常多那為了在郭部長離開前讓所有委員都可以質詢到他所以我們就是減少發言的時間不是對郭部長特別好而是對本會以及所有委員好謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:08.581 --> 00:11.196\n謝主席我想請一下郭智慧郭部長郭部長\n\n00:22.288 --> 00:44.596\n部長好我發現昭緯其實對你特別友善因為我們今天的質詢時間少了兩分鐘所以可以感覺到我們昭緯是對你是友善的一個狀態我想說大家都很關心台灣的能源政策感覺像電價上漲似乎已經在箭在弦上可是我覺得台灣對於整個用電用到哪裡去我們也非常非常的關心\n\n00:46.077 --> 01:01.219\n可是我發現說我們在找一些資料的時候我想問一下部長這邊因為我們想要知道說台灣前30大的用電大戶的相關的資料這個部分可不可以提供\n\n01:04.436 --> 01:21.982\n報告委員限於個資法的部分我們有困難個資法的部分不能夠提供用電大戶的名單是這樣子嗎確定嗎連我們如果要質詢也都不能夠有這樣子的一個狀態嗎\n\n01:25.454 --> 01:40.864\n對於這個產業競爭的部分他用的度數多少這個我們很難提供Ranking的部分我想沒有問題Ranking的部分沒有問題嘛前30大用電的部分沒有問題可是如果要知道說他們用電的種類數量\n\n01:42.705 --> 02:11.277\n可能就會有一些問題對不對OK那我們之後我們辦公室會直接會跟能源署這邊要求資料因為按照能源管理法的時候我們應該要有最真實相關的一個掌握OK好那我們接下來因為為什麼會提到這個部分因為當大家都在關心台積電到美國去投資1000億這件事情的時候很多人講到國安的問題或等等可是我從產業上面直接得到一些訊息的時候他們很多很直覺的反應跟我講說是因為台灣的電他們怕不夠\n\n02:12.057 --> 02:34.394\n所以到國外去設廠那這當然都有很多不同的理由那我只想要請教一下部長這邊就是去年2024年的時候台積電的用電量佔台灣整體發電量的百分之多少大概是8%左右\n\n02:36.745 --> 02:52.056\n8%嗎因為我看媒體有些是寫9%那我按照那個標準普爾他的一個國際報告的時候他認為說電力供應逐漸成為台積電的信用風險那他提到的數字是在\n\n02:53.817 --> 03:20.312\n2023年的時候大概是8.4%啦那預計到2030年的時候就是會佔到台灣總體發電量的15.6%比重不斷的升高所以這也是為什麼其實我在第一線的時候很多台積電裡面的人他們第一個直接反應就是說因為電量不夠所以他們要到國外去投資那我這邊我也想請教因為我這邊也有一些不同的訊息\n\n03:21.653 --> 03:47.515\n就是他提到一個點就是說台積電現在每天到夏季的時候下午用電尖峰的時候如果台電的備載容量有點不夠的時候呢台積電馬上就會被要求降載然後台積電的沒關係等一下你再回應一下然後他們就直接講說台積電他們自己的一個柴油發電機幾乎天天是火力全開長達半年的時間有沒有這樣的一個狀態\n\n03:49.073 --> 04:09.055\n報告委員,你是新竹市的委員,你應該非常清楚台積電的訊息,台積電半導體廠是不能夠降載的。所以這個就是我要特別提的問題,是因為地方一直在傳這件事情。我覺得可能是有人提供錯誤的訊息給你。\n\n04:10.416 --> 04:39.583\n理解所以說我這邊我要特別提到就是說我們這邊對於電的部分是怎麼樣子我覺得我們這邊很關切所以從你上來的時候我們就不斷在講到怎麼樣在優化台灣綠電的一個產出所以當我們之前特別問到一個台澎電纜的部分因為它現在有200MHz的一個電纜線可是它實際能夠用的部分非常非常的低只有80MHz那我們在想這個部分有沒有辦法把它提高\n\n04:41.464 --> 05:01.275\n報導委員我們現在當然有一個新的計畫我們大概澎湖有一些地區他們可以設置太陽能光電也可以設置陸域的風電那這個全部是綠電我們可以利用現有的海纜把它送回來\n\n05:02.456 --> 05:21.472\n這個大概會有將近100多MW這個對我們來講因為澎湖來到新竹其實也蠻近的所以我想這是一個我們在啟動新的計畫的一部分當然現在我們還在抱怨許可我相信我們對綠電的增設是不遺餘力的\n\n05:26.016 --> 05:47.372\n因為我們增設綠電的這個部分主要還是要滿足台灣半導體業它的需求那針對這個部分的時候我想另外再衍生一個問題其實就是之前很多委員也都很關心就是呂宋經濟走廊這個計畫那因為之前是拜登的一個計畫現在川普上來之後這個計畫還繼續執行嗎\n\n05:51.039 --> 05:52.300\n報告委員這個計畫因為這個美國政府的這個改變那這個計畫我們必須要得到這個\n\n06:01.325 --> 06:26.144\nAIT然後這個菲律賓的這個美國駐菲律賓他們的這些關鍵人物的這個支持所以我們不是在旅送經濟走廊上面的份子我們只是想要參與那因為我知道去年的時候包括國發會主委其實也都直接表示台灣是要參與在旅送經濟走廊這個計畫當中很具體的表示出來\n\n06:26.724 --> 06:54.250\n那你這邊也某一個部分參與那我想知道一個狀態是這個計畫影不影響到我們在呂宋重電它可不可以分開來獨立處理基本上這是兩個不同的計畫我們希望讓台灣的廠商可以到菲律賓去重電主要是我們希望光電業者因為台灣這個市場太小了它必須要走到世界但是最近的世界就是在菲律賓跟日本\n\n06:54.810 --> 07:23.003\n所以我們是協助他們能夠將他在台灣製造特別是這個台灣製造的光電是飛鴻供應鏈裡面非常重要的一部分理解所以我想在這個民主同盟的這個光電的需求台灣的業者可以扮演非常強大的這個貢獻所以我們幫助他能夠到菲律賓去種電所以我們會去幫他談到一些可以當地快速落地快速賺錢的這個方法\n\n07:24.264 --> 07:44.317\nOK兩個部分所以呂宋經濟走廊這個部分不影響到你提的一個呂宋重電的這個計畫對不對那呂宋重電計畫我上一次在質詢的時候我也曾經問過你一個狀態是在呂宋這邊發電的狀態它的碳權有沒有辦法為台灣企業所使用你那時候提到說因為必須要有電纜\n\n07:45.257 --> 08:07.738\n才能夠滿足R100的需求那因為現在還有R130的問題然後我看到你們提到報告當中提到一個運電船的這個問題我先不考慮它的成本我想先知道運電船假設運到台灣因為你剛剛有提到說年底日本這邊有就是成本會降低到一度一塊多那這個狀態的時候用運電船運到台灣的電\n\n08:11.161 --> 08:26.428\n碳泉能不能使用可以可以使用那這個部分那個船本身也是綠電的電池的話電動船就可以如果是燒油的那就變成灰電所以說如果是\n\n08:29.438 --> 08:42.313\n運電船運到台灣來的電這探權還是可以由台灣的企業這邊來直接使用他這個部分之後有再更細的資料再給本席一下我這邊另外要問一下我們大阪市博會這邊的進度\n\n08:44.471 --> 09:06.082\n有沒有落後報告委員沒有落後因為那個我看整個新聞出來說目前整個國外的一個國際場館只有完成不到20%剩下不到一個月要開展那我在想說關心台灣這邊因為我們花了20億在大阪市博會這邊那進度是不是能夠如期開張\n\n09:07.843 --> 09:25.258\n我們現在是按照進度在進行啦這部分詳細的話我是不是請我們署長跟你報告因為時間的關係請事後再跟本辦公室做一個清楚的報告好不好那我最後想問一個因為你在那個你的口頭報告當中的時候有特別提到了一個軍工的一個產業\n\n09:26.519 --> 09:42.875\n在國家防衛任性扮演的角色當中你特別提到了一個就是無人機的一個費用供應鏈就無人機國家隊的問題那我想問一下目前這個無人機國家隊他是用商規軍用還是直接變成軍規軍用\n\n09:44.733 --> 10:03.623\n我們目前所啟動的是軍規商用所以目前是用了軍規商用的部分可是商用跟軍用是他就在一線之隔只是用法上面的部分200公里為界限200公里可以飛200公里以上的叫軍規軍用\n\n10:06.085 --> 10:26.243\n軍規但是商用的是可以飛200公里以內的是叫軍規商用所以基本上目前你會把這個無人機這個部分放在軍工產業這邊就是因為它是軍規商用所以對台灣來講的時候如果說我們無人機要用變成軍規軍用其實也是很容易的對不對防禦上面沒有問題\n\n10:26.883 --> 10:50.633\nOK理解那針對無人艇的部分因為你在這邊的時候針對無人艇的部分目前我們還沒有完成一個國家隊的一個建立可是無人艇的部分在整個軍規軍用的部分某個部分也很近那針對這個部分我想說之後再給本辦公室一個清楚的一個資料好不好因為時間的關係是的好謝謝\n\n10:52.215 --> 11:08.599\n政委員我主席做一項宣告因為今天登記發言的委員非常多那為了在郭部長離開前讓所有委員都可以質詢到他所以我們就是減少發言的時間不是對郭部長特別好而是對本會以及所有委員好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":8.581,"end":11.196,"text":"謝主席我想請一下郭智慧郭部長郭部長"},{"start":22.288,"end":44.596,"text":"部長好 我發現昭緯其實對你特別友善因為我們今天的質詢時間少了兩分鐘所以可以感覺到我們昭緯是對你是友善的一個狀態我想說大家都很關心台灣的能源政策感覺像電價上漲似乎已經在箭在弦上可是我覺得台灣對於整個用電用到哪裡去我們也非常非常的關心"},{"start":46.077,"end":61.219,"text":"可是我發現說我們在找一些資料的時候我想問一下部長這邊因為我們想要知道說台灣前30大的用電大戶的相關的資料這個部分可不可以提供"},{"start":64.436,"end":81.982,"text":"報告委員 限於個資法的部分我們有困難個資法的部分不能夠提供用電大戶的名單是這樣子嗎 確定嗎連我們如果要質詢也都不能夠有這樣子的一個狀態嗎"},{"start":85.454,"end":100.864,"text":"對於這個產業競爭的部分他用的度數多少這個我們很難提供Ranking的部分我想沒有問題Ranking的部分沒有問題嘛前30大用電的部分沒有問題可是如果要知道說他們用電的種類數量"},{"start":102.705,"end":131.277,"text":"可能就會有一些問題對不對OK那我們之後我們辦公室會直接會跟能源署這邊要求資料因為按照能源管理法的時候我們應該要有最真實相關的一個掌握OK好那我們接下來因為為什麼會提到這個部分因為當大家都在關心台積電到美國去投資1000億這件事情的時候很多人講到國安的問題或等等可是我從產業上面直接得到一些訊息的時候他們很多很直覺的反應跟我講說是因為台灣的電他們怕不夠"},{"start":132.057,"end":154.394,"text":"所以到國外去設廠那這當然都有很多不同的理由那我只想要請教一下部長這邊就是去年2024年的時候台積電的用電量佔台灣整體發電量的百分之多少大概是8%左右"},{"start":156.745,"end":172.056,"text":"8%嗎因為我看媒體有些是寫9%那我按照那個標準普爾他的一個國際報告的時候他認為說電力供應逐漸成為台積電的信用風險那他提到的數字是在"},{"start":173.817,"end":200.312,"text":"2023年的時候大概是8.4%啦那預計到2030年的時候就是會佔到台灣總體發電量的15.6%比重不斷的升高所以這也是為什麼其實我在第一線的時候很多台積電裡面的人他們第一個直接反應就是說因為電量不夠所以他們要到國外去投資那我這邊我也想請教因為我這邊也有一些不同的訊息"},{"start":201.653,"end":227.515,"text":"就是他提到一個點就是說台積電現在每天到夏季的時候下午用電尖峰的時候如果台電的備載容量有點不夠的時候呢台積電馬上就會被要求降載然後台積電的沒關係等一下你再回應一下然後他們就直接講說台積電他們自己的一個柴油發電機幾乎天天是火力全開長達半年的時間有沒有這樣的一個狀態"},{"start":229.073,"end":249.055,"text":"報告委員,你是新竹市的委員,你應該非常清楚台積電的訊息,台積電半導體廠是不能夠降載的。所以這個就是我要特別提的問題,是因為地方一直在傳這件事情。我覺得可能是有人提供錯誤的訊息給你。"},{"start":250.416,"end":279.583,"text":"理解所以說我這邊我要特別提到就是說我們這邊對於電的部分是怎麼樣子我覺得我們這邊很關切所以從你上來的時候我們就不斷在講到怎麼樣在優化台灣綠電的一個產出所以當我們之前特別問到一個台澎電纜的部分因為它現在有200MHz的一個電纜線可是它實際能夠用的部分非常非常的低只有80MHz那我們在想這個部分有沒有辦法把它提高"},{"start":281.464,"end":301.275,"text":"報導委員我們現在當然有一個新的計畫我們大概澎湖有一些地區他們可以設置太陽能光電也可以設置陸域的風電那這個全部是綠電我們可以利用現有的海纜把它送回來"},{"start":302.456,"end":321.472,"text":"這個大概會有將近100多MW這個對我們來講 因為澎湖來到新竹其實也蠻近的所以我想這是一個我們在啟動新的計畫的一部分當然現在我們還在抱怨許可我相信我們對綠電的增設是不遺餘力的"},{"start":326.016,"end":347.372,"text":"因為我們增設綠電的這個部分主要還是要滿足台灣半導體業它的需求那針對這個部分的時候我想另外再衍生一個問題其實就是之前很多委員也都很關心就是呂宋經濟走廊這個計畫那因為之前是拜登的一個計畫現在川普上來之後這個計畫還繼續執行嗎"},{"start":351.039,"end":352.3,"text":"報告委員這個計畫因為這個美國政府的這個改變那這個計畫我們必須要得到這個"},{"start":361.325,"end":386.144,"text":"AIT然後這個菲律賓的這個美國駐菲律賓他們的這些關鍵人物的這個支持所以我們不是在旅送經濟走廊上面的份子我們只是想要參與那因為我知道去年的時候包括國發會主委其實也都直接表示台灣是要參與在旅送經濟走廊這個計畫當中很具體的表示出來"},{"start":386.724,"end":414.25,"text":"那你這邊也某一個部分參與那我想知道一個狀態是這個計畫影不影響到我們在呂宋重電它可不可以分開來獨立處理基本上這是兩個不同的計畫我們希望讓台灣的廠商可以到菲律賓去重電主要是我們希望光電業者因為台灣這個市場太小了它必須要走到世界但是最近的世界就是在菲律賓跟日本"},{"start":414.81,"end":443.003,"text":"所以我們是協助他們能夠將他在台灣製造特別是這個台灣製造的光電是飛鴻供應鏈裡面非常重要的一部分理解所以我想在這個民主同盟的這個光電的需求台灣的業者可以扮演非常強大的這個貢獻所以我們幫助他能夠到菲律賓去種電所以我們會去幫他談到一些可以當地快速落地快速賺錢的這個方法"},{"start":444.264,"end":464.317,"text":"OK 兩個部分所以呂宋經濟走廊這個部分不影響到你提的一個呂宋重電的這個計畫對不對那呂宋重電計畫我上一次在質詢的時候我也曾經問過你一個狀態是在呂宋這邊發電的狀態它的碳權有沒有辦法為台灣企業所使用你那時候提到說因為必須要有電纜"},{"start":465.257,"end":487.738,"text":"才能夠滿足R100的需求那因為現在還有R130的問題然後我看到你們提到報告當中提到一個運電船的這個問題我先不考慮它的成本我想先知道運電船假設運到台灣因為你剛剛有提到說年底日本這邊有就是成本會降低到一度一塊多那這個狀態的時候用運電船運到台灣的電"},{"start":491.161,"end":506.428,"text":"碳泉能不能使用可以可以使用那這個部分那個船本身也是綠電的電池的話電動船就可以如果是燒油的那就變成灰電所以說如果是"},{"start":509.438,"end":522.313,"text":"運電船運到台灣來的電這探權還是可以由台灣的企業這邊來直接使用他這個部分之後有再更細的資料再給本席一下我這邊另外要問一下我們大阪市博會這邊的進度"},{"start":524.471,"end":546.082,"text":"有沒有落後報告委員沒有落後因為那個我看整個新聞出來說目前整個國外的一個國際場館只有完成不到20%剩下不到一個月要開展那我在想說關心台灣這邊因為我們花了20億在大阪市博會這邊那進度是不是能夠如期開張"},{"start":547.843,"end":565.258,"text":"我們現在是按照進度在進行啦這部分詳細的話我是不是請我們署長跟你報告因為時間的關係請事後再跟本辦公室做一個清楚的報告好不好那我最後想問一個因為你在那個你的口頭報告當中的時候有特別提到了一個軍工的一個產業"},{"start":566.519,"end":582.875,"text":"在國家防衛任性扮演的角色當中你特別提到了一個就是無人機的一個費用供應鏈就無人機國家隊的問題那我想問一下目前這個無人機國家隊他是用商規軍用還是直接變成軍規軍用"},{"start":584.733,"end":603.623,"text":"我們目前所啟動的是軍規商用所以目前是用了軍規商用的部分可是商用跟軍用是他就在一線之隔 只是用法上面的部分200公里為界限 200公里可以飛200公里以上的叫軍規軍用"},{"start":606.085,"end":626.243,"text":"軍規但是商用的是可以飛200公里以內的是叫軍規商用所以基本上目前你會把這個無人機這個部分放在軍工產業這邊就是因為它是軍規商用所以對台灣來講的時候如果說我們無人機要用變成軍規軍用其實也是很容易的對不對防禦上面沒有問題"},{"start":626.883,"end":650.633,"text":"OK理解那針對無人艇的部分因為你在這邊的時候針對無人艇的部分目前我們還沒有完成一個國家隊的一個建立可是無人艇的部分在整個軍規軍用的部分某個部分也很近那針對這個部分我想說之後再給本辦公室一個清楚的一個資料好不好因為時間的關係是的好謝謝"},{"start":652.215,"end":668.599,"text":"政委員我主席做一項宣告因為今天登記發言的委員非常多那為了在郭部長離開前讓所有委員都可以質詢到他所以我們就是減少發言的時間不是對郭部長特別好而是對本會以及所有委員好謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":268,"blocks":[["鄭委員正鈐：（10時4分）謝謝主席，請郭智輝部長。"],["主席：請郭部長。"],["郭部長智輝：委員好。"],["鄭委員正鈐：部長好。我發現召委對你特別友善，因為今天的質詢時間少了2分鐘，所以可以感覺到召委對你是友善的狀態。我想大家都很關心臺灣的能源政策，感覺電價上漲似乎已經箭在弦上。我覺得臺灣對於整個用電用到哪裡去也非常、非常地關心，可是我發現我們在找一些資料的時候……我想問一下部長，因為我們想要知道臺灣前30大的用電大戶相關資料，這個部分可不可以提供？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，限於個資法，我們有困難。"],["鄭委員正鈐：因為個資法不能夠提供用電大戶的名單，是這樣子嗎？確定嗎？連我們要質詢，也都不能夠提供嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：對於產業競爭的部分，它用的度數多少，我們很難提供。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，這個部分……"],["郭部長智輝：但是ranking的部分我想沒有問題。"],["鄭委員正鈐：ranking的部分沒有問題嘛。"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["鄭委員正鈐：前30大用電的名單沒有問題，可是要知道他們用電的種類、數量可能就會有一些問題，對不對？"],["郭部長智輝：對。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，之後我們辦公室會直接跟能源署要求資料，因為按照能源管理法，你們應該要有相關的掌握。為什麼會提到這個部分？因為當大家都在關心台積電到美國去投資1,000億這件事情的時候，很多人講到國安的問題等等，可是我從產業上面直接得到一些訊息，他們很多很直覺的反應，跟我說是因為他們怕臺灣的電不夠，所以到國外去設廠，這當然有很多不同的理由。我只想要請教一下部長，去（2024）年台積電的用電量占臺灣整體發電量的百分之多少？"],["郭部長智輝：大概是8%左右。"],["鄭委員正鈐：8%嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["鄭委員正鈐：因為我看媒體有些是寫9%。按照標準普爾的國際報告，它認為電力供應逐漸成為台積電的信用風險，它提到的數字，2023年大概是8.4%，預計到2030年會占臺灣總體發電量的15.6%，比重不斷地升高，所以這也是為什麼我在第一線的時候，很多台積電裡面的人第一個直覺反應就是說因為電量不夠，所以他們要到國外去投資。我也想請教，因為我也有一些不同的訊息提到一個點，就是台積電現在每到夏季下午用電尖峰的時候，如果台電的備載容量有點不夠，台積電馬上就會被要求降載，然後他們說台積電自己的柴油發電機幾乎是天天火力全開，長達半年的時間，有沒有這樣的狀態？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，你是新竹市的委員，應該非常清楚台積電的這個訊息，台積電半導體廠是不能夠降載的。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解，所以這就是我要特別提的原因，因為地方一直在傳這件事情。"],["郭部長智輝：您剛才所提的這個指教，我覺得可能是有人提供錯誤的訊息給你。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解。我要特別提到，我們對於電的部分是很關切的，所以從你上來之後就不斷在講怎麼樣再優化臺灣綠電的產出，所以我們之前特別問到臺澎電纜，因為現在有200MW的電纜線，可是實際能夠用的部分非常、非常地低，只有80MW，這個部分有沒有辦法把它提高？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，我們現在當然有一個新的計畫，澎湖有一些地區可以設置太陽能光電，也可以設置陸域的風電，這些全部是綠電，我們可以利用現有的海纜把它送回來，大概會有將近一百多MW。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK。"],["郭部長智輝：對我們來講，因為澎湖到新竹其實也滿近的，這是我們在啟動新計畫的一部分，當然現在我們還在報院許可。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK。"],["郭部長智輝：我相信我們對綠電的增設是不遺餘力的，因為增設綠電主要還是要滿足臺灣半導體業的需求。"],["鄭委員正鈐：好，針對這個部分，我想再另外延伸一個問題，之前很多委員也都很關心呂宋經濟走廊這個計畫，因為這之前是拜登的一個計畫，現在這個計畫在川普上來之後還繼續執行嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，這個計畫因為美國政府的改變，我們必須要得到AIT、美國駐菲律賓的這些關鍵人物支持。我們不是在呂宋經濟走廊上的一分子……"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解。"],["郭部長智輝：我們只是在外部……"],["鄭委員正鈐：想要參與。因為我知道去年包括國發會主委也都直接表示，臺灣要參與呂宋經濟走廊這個計畫，很具體地表示出來，你在某一個部分也會參與。我想知道的是，這個計畫影不影響我們在呂宋種電？它可不可以分開來獨立處理？"],["郭部長智輝：基本上這是兩個不同的計畫。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK。"],["郭部長智輝：我們希望讓臺灣的廠商可以到菲律賓去種電，主要是我們希望光電業者……因為臺灣這個市場太小，它必須要走到世界，而最近的就是菲律賓跟日本，所以我們是協助他們能夠在臺灣製造，特別是臺灣製造的光電是非紅供應鏈裡面非常重要的一部分。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解。"],["郭部長智輝：我想在民主同盟的光電需求上，臺灣的業者可以有非常強大的貢獻，所以我們幫助它能夠到菲律賓去種電，也會去幫它談到一些可以在當地快速落地、快速賺錢的方法。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，兩個部分，所以呂宋經濟走廊這個部分不影響到你提的呂宋種電計畫，對不對？有關呂宋種電計畫，我上一次在質詢的時候也曾經問過你，在呂宋發電的狀態，它的碳權有沒有辦法為臺灣企業所使用？你那時候提到必須要有電纜，才能夠滿足RE100的需求，因為現在還有RE30的問題，然後我看到你們提出的報告當中有提到運電船的問題，我先不考慮它的成本，我想先知道假設運電船運到臺灣來，因為你剛剛有提到年底日本的成本會降低到一度一塊多，那在這個狀態的時候用運電船運到臺灣的電，碳權能不能使用？"],["郭部長智輝：可以。"],["鄭委員正鈐：可以使用喔？"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，這個部分……"],["郭部長智輝：那個船本身也是綠電的電池、是電動船就可以，如果是燒油的，那就變成廢電。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，如果是運電船運到臺灣的電，碳權還是可以由臺灣的企業直接使用。這個部分之後有更詳細的資料再給本席。","我另外要問一下大阪世博會的進度，有沒有落後？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，沒有落後。"],["鄭委員正鈐：沒有落後喔！因為我看新聞，目前整個國際場館只完成不到20%，剩下不到1個月就要開展，我想關心臺灣的進度，因為我們花了20億在大阪世博會，進度是不是能夠如期開展？"],["郭部長智輝：我們現在是按照進度在進行，詳細的部分我是不是請署長跟你報告？"],["鄭委員正鈐：因為時間的關係，請事後再跟本辦公室清楚的報告，好不好？"],["郭部長智輝：好的，沒問題。"],["鄭委員正鈐：我最後想問一個，因為你在口頭報告當中有特別提到了軍工產業，在國家防衛韌性扮演的角色當中，你特別提到了無人機的非紅供應鏈，就是無人機國家隊的問題。我想問一下，目前無人機國家隊是商規軍用，還是直接變成軍規軍用？"],["郭部長智輝：我們目前所啟動的是軍規商用。"],["鄭委員正鈐：軍規商用？"],["郭部長智輝：對。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，所以目前是軍規商用的部分，可是商用跟軍用就一線之隔，只是用法上面的部分……"],["郭部長智輝：以200公里為界線，可以飛200公里以上的叫軍規軍用；可以飛200公里以內的，叫軍規商用。"],["鄭委員正鈐：基本上，目前你會把無人機這個部分放在軍工產業，就是因為它是軍規商用，所以對臺灣來講，如果無人機要變成軍規軍用，其實也是很容易的，對不對？"],["郭部長智輝：防禦上面沒有問題。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK、理解。關於無人艇的部分，目前我們還沒有完成國家隊的建立，可是無人艇在軍規軍用，某個部分也很近，針對這個部分，我想之後再給本辦公室清楚的資料，好不好？因為時間的關係。"],["郭部長智輝：是的。"],["主席：謝謝。鄭委員，主席作以下宣告：因為今天登記發言的委員非常多，為了在郭部長離開前讓所有委員都可以質詢到，所以減少發言的時間，不是對郭部長特別好，而是對本會以及所有委員，謝謝。","現在請楊瓊瓔委員詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":266,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-3","speakers":["謝衣鳯","林岱樺","賴瑞隆","邱議瑩","張啓楷","鄭正鈐","楊瓊瓔","陳亭妃","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","邱志偉","張嘉郡","呂玉玲","賴士葆","洪孟楷","鍾佳濱","郭國文","陳昭姿","林月琴","李坤城","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","陳冠廷","徐富癸","羅智強","陳超明","林德福","牛煦庭","蔡易餘"],"page_start":193,"meetingDate":["2025-03-20"],"gazette_id":"1143002","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143002_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第3次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請經濟部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1143002_00004"}}}