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\"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 464.488, \"end\": 464.568, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 464.568, \"end\": 464.688, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 464.688, \"end\": 464.828, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 464.828, \"end\": 464.848, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:09,468 --> 00:00:10,652\n謝謝主席我們請郭部長\n\n2\n00:00:19,321 --> 00:00:44,982\n委員好部長美國的川普總統他在競選的時候他就已經主張要加重關稅來消除美國對各個國家的貿易的這個逆差他在上任之後的話他也馬上兌現了他的政見加徵了出口到美國的鋼鋁製品關稅到25%他也預告了4月份要來實施對等的關稅\n\n3\n00:00:46,303 --> 00:00:48,065\n增加這個關稅這個動作本席是非常的擔心那我們看到我們台灣2024年對美國出口將近1163億美元那美國進口到我們台灣的是424億美元那我們國家是在\n\n4\n00:01:04,879 --> 00:01:33,664\n这个美国第六大的这个贸易这个逆差的国家那我们出口到美国的大部分也都是这个机械的用具跟电子的零件那经济部应该对我们国内的相关的产业对这个被征收关税的问题你有没有相对应的这个应对的方式是报告委员我们都有各种不同的这个情境的模拟然后提出因应的对策那刚才你所这个垂询的这部分呢\n\n5\n00:01:34,204 --> 00:01:56,907\n大概740億左右的這個出鈔呢大部分其中有七成是屬於伺服器是屬於伺服器的部分那我們會針對我們出鈔的部分然後來訪談所有的這個業者那我們跟業者共同討論如何來因應這樣子如果萬一關稅被調整的話\n\n6\n00:01:57,745 --> 00:02:13,926\n我們能會得到多少的這個衝擊跟傷害那報告委員我想所有的剛才你在上面所列舉的這些業者我們都談過我們都有談過那建立各種不同的情境因為美國會跟我們談什麼樣的內容\n\n7\n00:02:16,414 --> 00:02:23,236\n我們沒有辦法了解但是我們可以去推論我們還沒有談我們會去推論那我們主談不是經濟部談我們談的是我們的這個談判辦公室在談是因為部長你特別說你會協助廠商以往這個美國那我們是擔心\n\n8\n00:02:36,479 --> 00:03:05,899\n這些產業包括像台積電他到美國去投資上下游的整個產業也都會為了成本問題而到美國去那你要協助這些產業到美國那整個我們台灣的就業市場不就會下降了嗎不會報告委員我想這個地方大家應該是可以用比較科學的來討論這個數大就分支數大就分支他今天到美國去特別像你剛才所指導的這個台積電這件事情\n\n9\n00:03:06,899 --> 00:03:32,975\n台積電是非常大它是一個世界市場的公司而且它是一個所以大家可能比較了解就是因為大所以上下游的產業才會跟著它走上下游的產業它也要看它的成本能不能夠符合那成本不能夠符合幾乎很難移動我要跟委員報告就我專業的角度跟我的經驗來跟您報告的話我可以分享給你就是說\n\n10\n00:03:34,232 --> 00:03:54,772\n供應鏈的部分大概是10倍的量對於這個台積電使用量的10倍所以我今天賣給台積電譬如說假設矽晶圓矽晶圓台積電大概一個月用兩萬片一條線如果說部長你講到這個問題的話本席要提醒你\n\n11\n00:03:55,353 --> 00:03:57,394\n剛剛有講到說我們出口到美國是1163億的美元嘛那但是我們看到我們在這個所有我們晶片或者半導體的設備出口到美國大概佔有83.51億的美元在我們出口值上只是不到5%\n\n12\n00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:32,728\n不到我怕我們被美國要增加這個關稅我們就被嚇到了馬上就跑到美國去設廠在這種情形之下想請教部長就是說那是不是說我們台積電到美國之後的話我們就有這個當籌碼來幫忙所有我們其他產業到出口到美國可以免備加徵關稅的這個籌碼是不是這樣子\n\n13\n00:04:35,420 --> 00:05:02,656\n這個部分我想報告委員這個是綜合的考量我相信台積電會幫助它的供應鏈來談出一個比較好的條件畢竟打它關稅那對台積電的成本就增加了那就更沒有競爭力了所以這個不符合企業國際化的這樣的一個要求我要跟委員報告的就是說台積電到美國去\n\n14\n00:05:03,955 --> 00:05:28,215\n絕對不是受到美國他一定是受到美國客戶的需求客到美國客戶的需求因為他是有客戶的需求可是部長你不要忘了國際企業的創造只有兩個我們知道都要創造走入國際化但是人才外流是我們擔心的因為他現在宣布了說要到美國研發中心當然跟我們台灣的研發中心是有區隔的\n\n15\n00:05:28,755 --> 00:05:45,801\n一個是那個先進的製程一個是屬於整個產能產量的製造但是兩個研發中心的人才在那邊一起的時候你要知道說他會不會超前了我們的技術或者我們技術會流到美國去這個都是我們關係的問題你是不是給我一點時間跟你說明\n\n16\n00:05:48,542 --> 00:06:04,438\n美國的研究大概是做這個基本的研究包括材料包括用什麼樣的設備來生產這個是美國的同仁他們比較喜歡做的事情所以美國的大學美國的研究所都是在做這個所謂Research\n\n17\n00:06:06,131 --> 00:06:32,772\n對這個工作但是台積電最厲害在台灣的有9000人的那個是做develop可是他也說他要肩負著開創新的技術啊對但是那個技術啊要能夠成為生產他要能夠發展出來這要量產就好像我今天在家裡我只能做一點的這個這個譬如說10件但是我在工廠生產的就是1萬件\n\n18\n00:06:34,093 --> 00:07:00,646\n有這個技術要發展成能夠製造部長你要了解這些都是我們擔心的你要如何讓國人能夠增強信心不會因為台積電到美國去投資之後我們大家信心會大減要繼續壯大我們的護國神山台積電台積電是它的技術就是到哪裡大概別人很難接受的很難接收的\n\n19\n00:07:01,584 --> 00:07:28,352\n可是研發中心在美國設之後這是我們擔心的它那個是在線上我這個線上已經成熟了我要讓它良率因為半導體注重的是良率可是我們就怕超前了啦這個在研發中心在美國之後他們的各項技術就會超前我們台灣的研發中心報告委員台積電在座剛剛跟我講研究跟發展的工程師有一萬多位\n\n20\n00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:44,848\n所以這個是不可能他去的是一千位是這個所謂製程商我在生產上面的工程師如何生產的成本更低如何的效益更好部長你要有信心那也希望能夠讓我們的護國神山繼續壯大好不好是好謝謝好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n9468\t10652\t謝謝主席 我們請郭部長\n19321\t44982\t委員好 部長美國的川普總統他在競選的時候他就已經主張要加重關稅來消除美國對各個國家的貿易的這個逆差他在上任之後的話他也馬上兌現了他的政見加徵了出口到美國的鋼鋁製品關稅到25%他也預告了4月份要來實施對等的關稅\n46303\t48065\t增加這個關稅這個動作本席是非常的擔心那我們看到我們台灣2024年對美國出口將近1163億美元那美國進口到我們台灣的是424億美元那我們國家是在\n64879\t93664\t这个美国第六大的这个贸易这个逆差的国家那我们出口到美国的大部分也都是这个机械的用具跟电子的零件那经济部应该对我们国内的相关的产业对这个被征收关税的问题你有没有相对应的这个应对的方式是报告委员我们都有各种不同的这个情境的模拟然后提出因应的对策那刚才你所这个垂询的这部分呢\n94204\t116907\t大概740億左右的這個出鈔呢大部分其中有七成是屬於伺服器是屬於伺服器的部分那我們會針對我們出鈔的部分然後來訪談所有的這個業者那我們跟業者共同討論如何來因應這樣子如果萬一關稅被調整的話\n117745\t133926\t我們能會得到多少的這個衝擊跟傷害那報告委員我想所有的剛才你在上面所列舉的這些業者我們都談過我們都有談過那建立各種不同的情境因為美國會跟我們談什麼樣的內容\n136414\t143236\t我們沒有辦法了解但是我們可以去推論我們還沒有談我們會去推論那我們主談不是經濟部談我們談的是我們的這個談判辦公室在談是因為部長你特別說你會協助廠商以往這個美國那我們是擔心\n156479\t185899\t這些產業包括像台積電他到美國去投資上下游的整個產業也都會為了成本問題而到美國去那你要協助這些產業到美國那整個我們台灣的就業市場不就會下降了嗎不會報告委員我想這個地方大家應該是可以用比較科學的來討論這個數大就分支數大就分支他今天到美國去特別像你剛才所指導的這個台積電這件事情\n186899\t212975\t台積電是非常大它是一個世界市場的公司而且它是一個所以大家可能比較了解就是因為大所以上下游的產業才會跟著它走上下游的產業它也要看它的成本能不能夠符合那成本不能夠符合幾乎很難移動我要跟委員報告就我專業的角度跟我的經驗來跟您報告的話我可以分享給你就是說\n214232\t234772\t供應鏈的部分大概是10倍的量對於這個台積電使用量的10倍所以我今天賣給台積電譬如說假設矽晶圓矽晶圓台積電大概一個月用兩萬片一條線如果說部長你講到這個問題的話本席要提醒你\n235353\t237394\t剛剛有講到說我們出口到美國是1163億的美元嘛那但是我們看到我們在這個所有我們晶片或者半導體的設備出口到美國大概佔有83.51億的美元在我們出口值上只是不到5%\n252680\t272728\t不到我怕我們被美國要增加這個關稅我們就被嚇到了馬上就跑到美國去設廠在這種情形之下想請教部長就是說那是不是說我們台積電到美國之後的話我們就有這個當籌碼來幫忙所有我們其他產業到出口到美國可以免備加徵關稅的這個籌碼是不是這樣子\n275420\t302656\t這個部分我想報告委員這個是綜合的考量我相信台積電會幫助它的供應鏈來談出一個比較好的條件畢竟打它關稅那對台積電的成本就增加了那就更沒有競爭力了所以這個不符合企業國際化的這樣的一個要求我要跟委員報告的就是說台積電到美國去\n303955\t328215\t絕對不是受到美國 他一定是受到美國客戶的需求客到美國客戶的需求因為他是有客戶的需求 可是部長你不要忘了國際企業的創造只有兩個我們知道都要創造走入國際化但是人才外流是我們擔心的因為他現在宣布了說要到美國研發中心當然跟我們台灣的研發中心是有區隔的\n328755\t345801\t一個是那個先進的製程一個是屬於整個產能產量的製造但是兩個研發中心的人才在那邊一起的時候你要知道說他會不會超前了我們的技術或者我們技術會流到美國去這個都是我們關係的問題你是不是給我一點時間跟你說明\n348542\t364438\t美國的研究大概是做這個基本的研究包括材料 包括用什麼樣的設備來生產這個是美國的同仁他們比較喜歡做的事情所以美國的大學 美國的研究所都是在做這個所謂Research\n366131\t392772\t對這個工作但是台積電最厲害在台灣的有9000人的那個是做develop可是他也說他要肩負著開創新的技術啊對但是那個技術啊要能夠成為生產他要能夠發展出來這要量產就好像我今天在家裡我只能做一點的這個這個譬如說10件但是我在工廠生產的就是1萬件\n394093\t420646\t有這個技術要發展成能夠製造部長你要了解這些都是我們擔心的你要如何讓國人能夠增強信心不會因為台積電到美國去投資之後我們大家信心會大減要繼續壯大我們的護國神山台積電台積電是它的技術就是到哪裡大概別人很難接受的很難接收的\n421584\t448352\t可是研發中心在美國設之後這是我們擔心的它那個是在線上我這個線上已經成熟了我要讓它良率因為半導體注重的是良率可是我們就怕超前了啦這個在研發中心在美國之後他們的各項技術就會超前我們台灣的研發中心報告委員台積電在座剛剛跟我講研究跟發展的工程師有一萬多位\n450120\t464848\t所以這個是不可能他去的是一千位是這個所謂製程商我在生產上面的工程師如何生產的成本更低如何的效益更好部長你要有信心那也希望能夠讓我們的護國神山繼續壯大好不好是好謝謝好謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席 我們請郭部長\n委員好 部長美國的川普總統他在競選的時候他就已經主張要加重關稅來消除美國對各個國家的貿易的這個逆差他在上任之後的話他也馬上兌現了他的政見加徵了出口到美國的鋼鋁製品關稅到25%他也預告了4月份要來實施對等的關稅\n增加這個關稅這個動作本席是非常的擔心那我們看到我們台灣2024年對美國出口將近1163億美元那美國進口到我們台灣的是424億美元那我們國家是在\n这个美国第六大的这个贸易这个逆差的国家那我们出口到美国的大部分也都是这个机械的用具跟电子的零件那经济部应该对我们国内的相关的产业对这个被征收关税的问题你有没有相对应的这个应对的方式是报告委员我们都有各种不同的这个情境的模拟然后提出因应的对策那刚才你所这个垂询的这部分呢\n大概740億左右的這個出鈔呢大部分其中有七成是屬於伺服器是屬於伺服器的部分那我們會針對我們出鈔的部分然後來訪談所有的這個業者那我們跟業者共同討論如何來因應這樣子如果萬一關稅被調整的話\n我們能會得到多少的這個衝擊跟傷害那報告委員我想所有的剛才你在上面所列舉的這些業者我們都談過我們都有談過那建立各種不同的情境因為美國會跟我們談什麼樣的內容\n我們沒有辦法了解但是我們可以去推論我們還沒有談我們會去推論那我們主談不是經濟部談我們談的是我們的這個談判辦公室在談是因為部長你特別說你會協助廠商以往這個美國那我們是擔心\n這些產業包括像台積電他到美國去投資上下游的整個產業也都會為了成本問題而到美國去那你要協助這些產業到美國那整個我們台灣的就業市場不就會下降了嗎不會報告委員我想這個地方大家應該是可以用比較科學的來討論這個數大就分支數大就分支他今天到美國去特別像你剛才所指導的這個台積電這件事情\n台積電是非常大它是一個世界市場的公司而且它是一個所以大家可能比較了解就是因為大所以上下游的產業才會跟著它走上下游的產業它也要看它的成本能不能夠符合那成本不能夠符合幾乎很難移動我要跟委員報告就我專業的角度跟我的經驗來跟您報告的話我可以分享給你就是說\n供應鏈的部分大概是10倍的量對於這個台積電使用量的10倍所以我今天賣給台積電譬如說假設矽晶圓矽晶圓台積電大概一個月用兩萬片一條線如果說部長你講到這個問題的話本席要提醒你\n剛剛有講到說我們出口到美國是1163億的美元嘛那但是我們看到我們在這個所有我們晶片或者半導體的設備出口到美國大概佔有83.51億的美元在我們出口值上只是不到5%\n不到我怕我們被美國要增加這個關稅我們就被嚇到了馬上就跑到美國去設廠在這種情形之下想請教部長就是說那是不是說我們台積電到美國之後的話我們就有這個當籌碼來幫忙所有我們其他產業到出口到美國可以免備加徵關稅的這個籌碼是不是這樣子\n這個部分我想報告委員這個是綜合的考量我相信台積電會幫助它的供應鏈來談出一個比較好的條件畢竟打它關稅那對台積電的成本就增加了那就更沒有競爭力了所以這個不符合企業國際化的這樣的一個要求我要跟委員報告的就是說台積電到美國去\n絕對不是受到美國 他一定是受到美國客戶的需求客到美國客戶的需求因為他是有客戶的需求 可是部長你不要忘了國際企業的創造只有兩個我們知道都要創造走入國際化但是人才外流是我們擔心的因為他現在宣布了說要到美國研發中心當然跟我們台灣的研發中心是有區隔的\n一個是那個先進的製程一個是屬於整個產能產量的製造但是兩個研發中心的人才在那邊一起的時候你要知道說他會不會超前了我們的技術或者我們技術會流到美國去這個都是我們關係的問題你是不是給我一點時間跟你說明\n美國的研究大概是做這個基本的研究包括材料 包括用什麼樣的設備來生產這個是美國的同仁他們比較喜歡做的事情所以美國的大學 美國的研究所都是在做這個所謂Research\n對這個工作但是台積電最厲害在台灣的有9000人的那個是做develop可是他也說他要肩負著開創新的技術啊對但是那個技術啊要能夠成為生產他要能夠發展出來這要量產就好像我今天在家裡我只能做一點的這個這個譬如說10件但是我在工廠生產的就是1萬件\n有這個技術要發展成能夠製造部長你要了解這些都是我們擔心的你要如何讓國人能夠增強信心不會因為台積電到美國去投資之後我們大家信心會大減要繼續壯大我們的護國神山台積電台積電是它的技術就是到哪裡大概別人很難接受的很難接收的\n可是研發中心在美國設之後這是我們擔心的它那個是在線上我這個線上已經成熟了我要讓它良率因為半導體注重的是良率可是我們就怕超前了啦這個在研發中心在美國之後他們的各項技術就會超前我們台灣的研發中心報告委員台積電在座剛剛跟我講研究跟發展的工程師有一萬多位\n所以這個是不可能他去的是一千位是這個所謂製程商我在生產上面的工程師如何生產的成本更低如何的效益更好部長你要有信心那也希望能夠讓我們的護國神山繼續壯大好不好是好謝謝好謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:09.468 --> 00:10.652\n謝謝主席我們請郭部長\n\n00:19.321 --> 00:44.982\n委員好部長美國的川普總統他在競選的時候他就已經主張要加重關稅來消除美國對各個國家的貿易的這個逆差他在上任之後的話他也馬上兌現了他的政見加徵了出口到美國的鋼鋁製品關稅到25%他也預告了4月份要來實施對等的關稅\n\n00:46.303 --> 00:48.065\n增加這個關稅這個動作本席是非常的擔心那我們看到我們台灣2024年對美國出口將近1163億美元那美國進口到我們台灣的是424億美元那我們國家是在\n\n01:04.879 --> 01:33.664\n这个美国第六大的这个贸易这个逆差的国家那我们出口到美国的大部分也都是这个机械的用具跟电子的零件那经济部应该对我们国内的相关的产业对这个被征收关税的问题你有没有相对应的这个应对的方式是报告委员我们都有各种不同的这个情境的模拟然后提出因应的对策那刚才你所这个垂询的这部分呢\n\n01:34.204 --> 01:56.907\n大概740億左右的這個出鈔呢大部分其中有七成是屬於伺服器是屬於伺服器的部分那我們會針對我們出鈔的部分然後來訪談所有的這個業者那我們跟業者共同討論如何來因應這樣子如果萬一關稅被調整的話\n\n01:57.745 --> 02:13.926\n我們能會得到多少的這個衝擊跟傷害那報告委員我想所有的剛才你在上面所列舉的這些業者我們都談過我們都有談過那建立各種不同的情境因為美國會跟我們談什麼樣的內容\n\n02:16.414 --> 02:23.236\n我們沒有辦法了解但是我們可以去推論我們還沒有談我們會去推論那我們主談不是經濟部談我們談的是我們的這個談判辦公室在談是因為部長你特別說你會協助廠商以往這個美國那我們是擔心\n\n02:36.479 --> 03:05.899\n這些產業包括像台積電他到美國去投資上下游的整個產業也都會為了成本問題而到美國去那你要協助這些產業到美國那整個我們台灣的就業市場不就會下降了嗎不會報告委員我想這個地方大家應該是可以用比較科學的來討論這個數大就分支數大就分支他今天到美國去特別像你剛才所指導的這個台積電這件事情\n\n03:06.899 --> 03:32.975\n台積電是非常大它是一個世界市場的公司而且它是一個所以大家可能比較了解就是因為大所以上下游的產業才會跟著它走上下游的產業它也要看它的成本能不能夠符合那成本不能夠符合幾乎很難移動我要跟委員報告就我專業的角度跟我的經驗來跟您報告的話我可以分享給你就是說\n\n03:34.232 --> 03:54.772\n供應鏈的部分大概是10倍的量對於這個台積電使用量的10倍所以我今天賣給台積電譬如說假設矽晶圓矽晶圓台積電大概一個月用兩萬片一條線如果說部長你講到這個問題的話本席要提醒你\n\n03:55.353 --> 03:57.394\n剛剛有講到說我們出口到美國是1163億的美元嘛那但是我們看到我們在這個所有我們晶片或者半導體的設備出口到美國大概佔有83.51億的美元在我們出口值上只是不到5%\n\n04:12.680 --> 04:32.728\n不到我怕我們被美國要增加這個關稅我們就被嚇到了馬上就跑到美國去設廠在這種情形之下想請教部長就是說那是不是說我們台積電到美國之後的話我們就有這個當籌碼來幫忙所有我們其他產業到出口到美國可以免備加徵關稅的這個籌碼是不是這樣子\n\n04:35.420 --> 05:02.656\n這個部分我想報告委員這個是綜合的考量我相信台積電會幫助它的供應鏈來談出一個比較好的條件畢竟打它關稅那對台積電的成本就增加了那就更沒有競爭力了所以這個不符合企業國際化的這樣的一個要求我要跟委員報告的就是說台積電到美國去\n\n05:03.955 --> 05:28.215\n絕對不是受到美國他一定是受到美國客戶的需求客到美國客戶的需求因為他是有客戶的需求可是部長你不要忘了國際企業的創造只有兩個我們知道都要創造走入國際化但是人才外流是我們擔心的因為他現在宣布了說要到美國研發中心當然跟我們台灣的研發中心是有區隔的\n\n05:28.755 --> 05:45.801\n一個是那個先進的製程一個是屬於整個產能產量的製造但是兩個研發中心的人才在那邊一起的時候你要知道說他會不會超前了我們的技術或者我們技術會流到美國去這個都是我們關係的問題你是不是給我一點時間跟你說明\n\n05:48.542 --> 06:04.438\n美國的研究大概是做這個基本的研究包括材料包括用什麼樣的設備來生產這個是美國的同仁他們比較喜歡做的事情所以美國的大學美國的研究所都是在做這個所謂Research\n\n06:06.131 --> 06:32.772\n對這個工作但是台積電最厲害在台灣的有9000人的那個是做develop可是他也說他要肩負著開創新的技術啊對但是那個技術啊要能夠成為生產他要能夠發展出來這要量產就好像我今天在家裡我只能做一點的這個這個譬如說10件但是我在工廠生產的就是1萬件\n\n06:34.093 --> 07:00.646\n有這個技術要發展成能夠製造部長你要了解這些都是我們擔心的你要如何讓國人能夠增強信心不會因為台積電到美國去投資之後我們大家信心會大減要繼續壯大我們的護國神山台積電台積電是它的技術就是到哪裡大概別人很難接受的很難接收的\n\n07:01.584 --> 07:28.352\n可是研發中心在美國設之後這是我們擔心的它那個是在線上我這個線上已經成熟了我要讓它良率因為半導體注重的是良率可是我們就怕超前了啦這個在研發中心在美國之後他們的各項技術就會超前我們台灣的研發中心報告委員台積電在座剛剛跟我講研究跟發展的工程師有一萬多位\n\n07:30.120 --> 07:44.848\n所以這個是不可能他去的是一千位是這個所謂製程商我在生產上面的工程師如何生產的成本更低如何的效益更好部長你要有信心那也希望能夠讓我們的護國神山繼續壯大好不好是好謝謝好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":9.468,"end":10.652,"text":"謝謝主席 我們請郭部長"},{"start":19.321,"end":44.982,"text":"委員好 部長美國的川普總統他在競選的時候他就已經主張要加重關稅來消除美國對各個國家的貿易的這個逆差他在上任之後的話他也馬上兌現了他的政見加徵了出口到美國的鋼鋁製品關稅到25%他也預告了4月份要來實施對等的關稅"},{"start":46.303,"end":48.065,"text":"增加這個關稅這個動作本席是非常的擔心那我們看到我們台灣2024年對美國出口將近1163億美元那美國進口到我們台灣的是424億美元那我們國家是在"},{"start":64.879,"end":93.664,"text":"这个美国第六大的这个贸易这个逆差的国家那我们出口到美国的大部分也都是这个机械的用具跟电子的零件那经济部应该对我们国内的相关的产业对这个被征收关税的问题你有没有相对应的这个应对的方式是报告委员我们都有各种不同的这个情境的模拟然后提出因应的对策那刚才你所这个垂询的这部分呢"},{"start":94.204,"end":116.907,"text":"大概740億左右的這個出鈔呢大部分其中有七成是屬於伺服器是屬於伺服器的部分那我們會針對我們出鈔的部分然後來訪談所有的這個業者那我們跟業者共同討論如何來因應這樣子如果萬一關稅被調整的話"},{"start":117.745,"end":133.926,"text":"我們能會得到多少的這個衝擊跟傷害那報告委員我想所有的剛才你在上面所列舉的這些業者我們都談過我們都有談過那建立各種不同的情境因為美國會跟我們談什麼樣的內容"},{"start":136.414,"end":143.236,"text":"我們沒有辦法了解但是我們可以去推論我們還沒有談我們會去推論那我們主談不是經濟部談我們談的是我們的這個談判辦公室在談是因為部長你特別說你會協助廠商以往這個美國那我們是擔心"},{"start":156.479,"end":185.899,"text":"這些產業包括像台積電他到美國去投資上下游的整個產業也都會為了成本問題而到美國去那你要協助這些產業到美國那整個我們台灣的就業市場不就會下降了嗎不會報告委員我想這個地方大家應該是可以用比較科學的來討論這個數大就分支數大就分支他今天到美國去特別像你剛才所指導的這個台積電這件事情"},{"start":186.899,"end":212.975,"text":"台積電是非常大它是一個世界市場的公司而且它是一個所以大家可能比較了解就是因為大所以上下游的產業才會跟著它走上下游的產業它也要看它的成本能不能夠符合那成本不能夠符合幾乎很難移動我要跟委員報告就我專業的角度跟我的經驗來跟您報告的話我可以分享給你就是說"},{"start":214.232,"end":234.772,"text":"供應鏈的部分大概是10倍的量對於這個台積電使用量的10倍所以我今天賣給台積電譬如說假設矽晶圓矽晶圓台積電大概一個月用兩萬片一條線如果說部長你講到這個問題的話本席要提醒你"},{"start":235.353,"end":237.394,"text":"剛剛有講到說我們出口到美國是1163億的美元嘛那但是我們看到我們在這個所有我們晶片或者半導體的設備出口到美國大概佔有83.51億的美元在我們出口值上只是不到5%"},{"start":252.68,"end":272.728,"text":"不到我怕我們被美國要增加這個關稅我們就被嚇到了馬上就跑到美國去設廠在這種情形之下想請教部長就是說那是不是說我們台積電到美國之後的話我們就有這個當籌碼來幫忙所有我們其他產業到出口到美國可以免備加徵關稅的這個籌碼是不是這樣子"},{"start":275.42,"end":302.656,"text":"這個部分我想報告委員這個是綜合的考量我相信台積電會幫助它的供應鏈來談出一個比較好的條件畢竟打它關稅那對台積電的成本就增加了那就更沒有競爭力了所以這個不符合企業國際化的這樣的一個要求我要跟委員報告的就是說台積電到美國去"},{"start":303.955,"end":328.215,"text":"絕對不是受到美國 他一定是受到美國客戶的需求客到美國客戶的需求因為他是有客戶的需求 可是部長你不要忘了國際企業的創造只有兩個我們知道都要創造走入國際化但是人才外流是我們擔心的因為他現在宣布了說要到美國研發中心當然跟我們台灣的研發中心是有區隔的"},{"start":328.755,"end":345.801,"text":"一個是那個先進的製程一個是屬於整個產能產量的製造但是兩個研發中心的人才在那邊一起的時候你要知道說他會不會超前了我們的技術或者我們技術會流到美國去這個都是我們關係的問題你是不是給我一點時間跟你說明"},{"start":348.542,"end":364.438,"text":"美國的研究大概是做這個基本的研究包括材料 包括用什麼樣的設備來生產這個是美國的同仁他們比較喜歡做的事情所以美國的大學 美國的研究所都是在做這個所謂Research"},{"start":366.131,"end":392.772,"text":"對這個工作但是台積電最厲害在台灣的有9000人的那個是做develop可是他也說他要肩負著開創新的技術啊對但是那個技術啊要能夠成為生產他要能夠發展出來這要量產就好像我今天在家裡我只能做一點的這個這個譬如說10件但是我在工廠生產的就是1萬件"},{"start":394.093,"end":420.646,"text":"有這個技術要發展成能夠製造部長你要了解這些都是我們擔心的你要如何讓國人能夠增強信心不會因為台積電到美國去投資之後我們大家信心會大減要繼續壯大我們的護國神山台積電台積電是它的技術就是到哪裡大概別人很難接受的很難接收的"},{"start":421.584,"end":448.352,"text":"可是研發中心在美國設之後這是我們擔心的它那個是在線上我這個線上已經成熟了我要讓它良率因為半導體注重的是良率可是我們就怕超前了啦這個在研發中心在美國之後他們的各項技術就會超前我們台灣的研發中心報告委員台積電在座剛剛跟我講研究跟發展的工程師有一萬多位"},{"start":450.12,"end":464.848,"text":"所以這個是不可能他去的是一千位是這個所謂製程商我在生產上面的工程師如何生產的成本更低如何的效益更好部長你要有信心那也希望能夠讓我們的護國神山繼續壯大好不好是好謝謝好謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":676,"blocks":[["呂委員玉玲：（11時34分）謝謝主席，我們請郭部長。"],["主席：請郭部長。"],["郭部長智輝：委員好。"],["呂委員玉玲：部長，美國的川普總統在競選的時候，他就已經主張要加重關稅，來消除美國對各個國家的貿易逆差，他在上任之後也馬上兌現了他的政見，加徵了出口到美國的鋼鋁製品的關稅到25%，他也預告了4月份要來實施對等的關稅。對於美國增加關稅這個動作，本席是非常的擔心。我們看到2024年臺灣對美國的出口值將近1,163億美元，臺灣對美國的進口值則是424億美元，我們國家是美國第六大的貿易逆差國，我們出口到美國的產品大部分也都是機械用具跟電子零件，經濟部對於我們國內相關產業將被增加關稅的問題，你有沒有相對應的應對方案？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，我們都有各種不同情境的模擬，然後提出因應的對策。剛才你所垂詢的這個部分，大概740億左右的出超，其中有七成是屬於伺服器的部分，我們會針對我們出超的部分來訪談所有的業者，我們跟業者共同討論如何因應這樣的衝擊，如果關稅被調整的話，我們會受到多少的衝擊跟傷害。報告委員，剛才你在上面所列舉的這些業者，我們都有談過，並且也建立了各種不同的情境，因為美國會跟我們談什麼樣的內容，我們沒有辦法了解……"],["呂委員玉玲：沒有實質的進展？"],["郭部長智輝：但是我們可以去推論……"],["呂委員玉玲：都還沒有談？"],["郭部長智輝：我們還沒有談，但我們會去推論，而且我國的主談不是經濟部，是我們的談判辦公室負責在談的。"],["呂委員玉玲：因為部長特別有說到，你會協助廠商移往美國，我們是擔心，這些產業包括像台積電，它到美國去投資，上下游的整個產業也都會為了成本問題而到美國去，如果你要協助這些產業到美國，那整個臺灣的就業市場不就會下降了嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：不會，報告委員，我想這個地方大家應該是可以用比較科學的方式來討論，因為樹大就要分枝。它今天到美國去，特別像你剛才所指導的台積電這件事情，台積電是非常大的，它是一個世界市場的公司，而且它是一個，就是大家可能比較了解……"],["呂委員玉玲：就是因為大，所以上下游的產業才會跟著它走啊。"],["郭部長智輝：上下游的產業，也要看它的成本能不能夠符合，如果成本不能夠符合，幾乎很難移動。我要跟委員報告，就我專業的角度跟我的經驗來跟您報告的話，我可以分享給你，就是供應鏈的部分大概是十倍的量，對於台積電使用量的十倍。"],["呂委員玉玲：是。"],["郭部長智輝：所以今天賣給台積電的，譬如說矽晶圓，台積電大概一個月用2萬片，它一個廠……"],["呂委員玉玲：如果部長你講到這個問題的話……"],["郭部長智輝：但是我的生產線是……"],["呂委員玉玲：本席也要提醒你，剛剛有講到我們到美國的出口值是1,163億美元，但是我們看到所有我們的晶片或者是半導體設備出口到美國的出口值大概83.51億美元，占我們出口值只有不到5%，當我們聽到要被美國增加關稅，我們就被嚇到了，馬上就跑到美國去設廠，在這種情形之下，我想請教部長，是不是我們的台積電加碼投資美國之後，我們就可以以此作為籌碼，幫忙我們所有其他產業出口到美國可以免被加徵關稅的籌碼，是不是這樣？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，我想這個部分是綜合的考量，我相信台積電會幫助它的供應鏈來談出一個比較好的條件，畢竟……"],["呂委員玉玲：就不會被加徵關稅？"],["郭部長智輝：畢竟如果增加關稅，台積電的成本就增加了，那就更沒有競爭力了，所以這個不符合企業國際化的一個要求。我要跟委員報告，台積電到美國去，絕對不是受到美國的這個……它一定是受到美國客戶的需求，因為大家都知道……"],["呂委員玉玲：當然是有客戶的需求，可是部長你不要忘了，它還是……"],["郭部長智輝：國際企業的創造只有兩個基本原則……"],["呂委員玉玲：我們知道都要創造，走入國際化，但是人才外流是我們擔心的，因為它現在宣布要到美國設研發中心，當然跟我們臺灣的研發中心是有區隔的，一個是先進製程，一個屬於整個產能、產量的製造，但是兩個研發中心的人才在那邊一起的時候，你要知道，它會不會超前了我們的技術，或者我們的技術會流到美國去，這個都是我們關心的問題。"],["郭部長智輝：跟委員報告，你能不能給我一點時間跟你說明？美國的研究大概是做基本研究，包括材料、包括用什麼樣的設備來生產，這是美國的同仁他們比較喜歡做的事情，所以美國的大學、美國的研究所都是在做所謂research的工作。但是台積電最厲害，在臺灣有9,000人的那是做develop、發展的工作。"],["呂委員玉玲：可是他也說它要肩負開創新的技術……"],["郭部長智輝：對，但是那個技術要能夠成為生產，它要能夠發展出來，就要量產。就好像我今天在家裡只能做一點，譬如10件，但我在工廠生產的就是1萬件，有這個技術要發展成能夠製造……"],["呂委員玉玲：是，但我們希望部長了解，這些都是我們擔心的，你要如何讓國人能夠增強信心，不會因為台積電到美國去投資之後大家的信心會大減，好不好？"],["郭部長智輝：這個我舉一個例子給你聽……"],["呂委員玉玲：要繼續壯大我們的護國神山台積電，可不可以？"],["郭部長智輝：台積電是它的技術，就是到哪裡大概別人都會很難接收的。"],["呂委員玉玲：可是到美國設研發中心是我們擔心的。"],["郭部長智輝：不是，它那個是在線上，線上已經成熟了，但它要讓它的良率，因為半導體注重的是良率，那它……"],["呂委員玉玲：可是我們就怕它超前了，研發中心在美國之後，他們的各項技術就會超前臺灣的研發中心。"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，剛剛我講，台積電在做研究和發展的工程師有一萬多位，所以這個是不可能，去的1,000位是所謂製程上、生產上有關的工程師，如何讓生產的成本更低、如何效益更好……"],["呂委員玉玲：好，部長，你要有信心，也希望能夠讓我們的護國神山繼續壯大，好不好？"],["郭部長智輝：是，一定。"],["呂委員玉玲：好，謝謝。"],["郭部長智輝：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝。我們現在請賴士葆委員做詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":266,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-3","speakers":["謝衣鳯","林岱樺","賴瑞隆","邱議瑩","張啓楷","鄭正鈐","楊瓊瓔","陳亭妃","鄭天財Sra 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