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審查委員劉建國等17人擬具「學校飲食教育法草案」案。(二十) 審查委員徐巧芯等19人擬具「學校營養飲食供餐法草案」案。(二十一) \t審查委員邱鎮軍等25人擬具「高級中等以下學校供餐及飲食教育條例草案」案。(二十二) 審查委員羅廷瑋等20人擬具「高級中等以下學校午餐及飲食教育條例草案」案。(二十三) 審查委員萬美玲等19人擬具「學校營養午餐法草案」案。\n二、審查「運動產業發展條例」：\n(一) 審查委員柯志恩等22人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二十四條及第二十六條條文修正草案」案。(二) 審查委員張智倫等 18 人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二十四條及第二十六條條文修正草案」案。(三) 審查委員洪孟楷等17人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二十四條及第二十六條條文修正草案」案。(四) 審查委員王鴻薇等 19 人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二十四條及第二十六條條文修正草案」案。(五) 審查委員林倩綺等22人擬具「運動產業發展條例第四條條文修正草案」案。(六) 審查委員沈發惠等19人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二條條文修正草案」案。(七) 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\"start\": 646.517, \"end\": 647.518, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"武\", \"start\": 647.518, \"end\": 647.619, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"林\", \"start\": 647.619, \"end\": 647.759, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 647.759, \"end\": 647.919, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 647.919, \"end\": 647.939, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,109 --> 00:00:10,045\n謝謝主席有請次長請次長備質詢謝謝\n\n2\n00:00:16,367 --> 00:00:37,423\n市長今天如果說我們要為我們的營養午餐來立一步法我想很多與時俱進的觀念很未來性的觀念應該都要放進去好比氣候變遷影響下我們對糧食的看法\n\n3\n00:00:38,143 --> 00:00:51,695\n那這種低碳啊抗旱啊在地產銷循環經濟保種的觀念民族的味覺解殖民的概念等等我想如果都能夠含瓜進去這是非常前進的一步法那為什麼我這樣談我舉我的版本來講我的版本的名稱叫做學校共餐及飲食教育法那我看到很多的版本都會提到\n\n4\n00:01:03,925 --> 00:01:15,137\n就是採用當地食材然後發展地方飲食特色但是談何容易我舉個例子我的部落旁邊種滿了山蘇誰來買從產地到餐桌我們講探足機\n\n5\n00:01:21,204 --> 00:01:44,469\n有那麼容易嗎這二三十年來我們做營養午餐很不容易達到但是我更希望談的就是說民族味覺的記憶跟文化附贈的途徑其實如果能夠從這一步伐來做其實可以成為一個很好的途徑我舉一個例子來講齁在花東地區有一個基金會叫慈欣基金會次長您聽過嗎\n\n6\n00:01:46,650 --> 00:02:00,299\n這個慈欣經濟會他是用募款的方式他目前有幫助12間的小學他做什麼呢每週幫助他們提供一次的小米加布農豆就是畫面圖片上看到的\n\n7\n00:02:01,399 --> 00:02:05,723\n那這個部分小米很營養為什麼因為農糧屬農業不說的啊小米是鹼性的它是所有穀類當中唯一就是不含麩質的那些胃腸過敏的小朋友呢其實很適合吃這個\n\n8\n00:02:17,913 --> 00:02:41,765\n容易吸收而且它可以做酸鹼中和對現在的孩子很愛吃肉來講是一個很好的一個食物那另外呢也提到說如果做成小米粥它的營養成分就好比人生湯哇這麼好我們國家未來的主人翁如果能夠吃小米飯小米粥該有多好但是次長你看一下\n\n9\n00:02:42,725 --> 00:02:56,218\n我們小米種植的面積日本人來的時候我不計算就已經開始輔導原住民轉作但是國民政府當時轉作稻米那個時候我們看到數據是在6736公頃\n\n10\n00:03:00,222 --> 00:03:15,579\n時至今日小米的面積只剩下91公頃1%不到真的很令人難過那我們其實原住民也經歷山地平地化的一個過程像我們的高山上以前哪有高麗菜\n\n11\n00:03:16,780 --> 00:03:34,967\n種滿了高麗菜以前哪有茶葉以前哪有水梨以前哪有蘋果所以呢山上種的植物已經不再是我們過去的作物或植物所以小米它面臨的問題很多像是種植的人口少而且那些人都高齡化\n\n12\n00:03:36,067 --> 00:03:54,894\n更可怕的是我們的小米品系在台灣原本是全世界最多的可是時至今日因為沒有人吃沒有人種所以保種困難快速流失甚至現在中國已經把小米變作是第二公糧因為它為了要抗旱當作是一個未來的植物\n\n13\n00:04:00,916 --> 00:04:29,169\n所以在這個地方生產端他說他不容易賣所以不種那市場端他說因為買不到所以不方便好那我現在說小米他不是只有想要保種我們更希望的是把它昇華成飲食的行動保存我們民族的味覺記憶我們的孩子很需要小米但是我想說以慈欣為例她輔導那12間學校第一個每週給他們吃一次小米飯\n\n14\n00:04:30,370 --> 00:04:42,670\n然後呢給他們種小米跟部落的農友合作做一些小米的變化料理做小米的宣講然後呢進入到部落的文件站好我想先問一下農糧署\n\n15\n00:04:50,182 --> 00:05:16,392\n委員好好請教一下我們農糧署是副署長副署長我剛剛講了這麼多你支不支持我們的部落在地食材像小米啊樹豆等等進入校園做營養午餐農糧署的部分原則上應該會支持啦那這一部分目前農糧署對於原鄉的這個作物我們也有在支持輔導好\n\n16\n00:05:17,412 --> 00:05:33,322\n那其實我在農糧署碰到一個障礙齁我過去也開過中庭會你們有一個非傳統性食品原料申請是很麻煩耶我們好多的月桃入菜老葉入菜很多都要被罰耶\n\n17\n00:05:34,503 --> 00:05:51,310\n那個動作加速了沒有這個還要跟衛福部這邊因為那個可不可以當作食材這個部分要對我的意思說要加速要加速我們很需要農糧署的幫忙好不好好謝謝副署長那再請教一下我們的署長國教署署長\n\n18\n00:05:53,564 --> 00:06:08,758\n那個署長因為這個專法是在我們國教署請教依您的經驗這些部落在地的食材要進入到我們學校的營養午餐廚房會面臨哪些困難跟限制\n\n19\n00:06:10,479 --> 00:06:29,170\n第一個他可能如果在張Q的認定上這可能要鏈接起來這個我們會跟農糧署做了解農糧署據我了解最近在這個整體的認定上為什麼我們現在會98.41這麼高的比率也是農糧署做了很多的跟地方的合作第二點\n\n20\n00:06:29,670 --> 00:06:56,783\n可能在經費上經費上這一點剛好在前面109到111年我們給餐費我們直接給餐費到62元這樣的一個情況下對於量少它的經費可能要多一點的這樣也可以做一點支持那署長我的意思是說既然我們現在要立這部專訪那您也很知道過去推動在地食材的一個困難那我很希望說這個部分我們要盡量的去協助輔導好謝謝署長\n\n21\n00:06:59,904 --> 00:07:22,815\n對剛才講的就是說門檻太高那部落的食材進不去學校的高牆那我們講的什麼碳足跡部落經濟部落足體農業在地產銷其實在這個地方都遇到了障礙所以我也請次長你能夠去關心這個問題那我關心的是說你的公糧不是我的公糧你的營養午餐不見得是我想要的營養午餐所以\n\n22\n00:07:24,376 --> 00:07:49,026\n這個部分其實我們有很多的在地食材我們都很希望能夠輕鬆的進入政府所講的這件事情怎麼樣從產地到餐桌讓它更順暢那我更希望的是說要有人吃啊有人利用啊才會有人種啊那這樣子才是保種的真思維因為沒有人吃沒有人利用沒有人補助\n\n23\n00:07:50,066 --> 00:08:06,134\n我們要談保種何其困難都要送到北極的總園庫這是很悲哀的一件事情所以我是希望說這件事情我們的政府能夠去介入能夠關心連民間的慈欣基金會這樣的團體它都基於它對土地的使命感\n\n24\n00:08:10,676 --> 00:08:31,516\n對地球的愛護他都願意去募款但是他能力有限但是我是希望說我們的農業部我們的教育部國教署大家一起共同的來推動協助我們這些的在地食材可以進入到我們學校的營養午餐那也希望呢至少有沒有可能從原住民重點學校來示範次長\n\n25\n00:08:32,814 --> 00:08:59,983\n我想委員的建議非常好,很前進這部分我們一定是願意來做相關的計畫因為涉及到地方的部分我們會跟他寫請他們來提計畫那我們如果可以的話我們當然會來讓部落的學校優先來示範這個如果能夠用這樣的方式來做飲食我想是部落孩童的福氣而且可以發展在地的食材在觀光、文化、旅遊上面都會有幫忙\n\n26\n00:09:01,023 --> 00:09:23,856\n對它就是一個良性循環其實我們談到的很多東西它都可以在這件事情裡面能夠完全所以為什麼說專法有時候就是一個宣示性規範性很多特色包括食農教育在講很多特色在地食材是有地方的特色其實我們都很希望地方能夠發展出特色那如果在法規層面上譬如三張EQ的認證困難上面我們會跟衛福部還有農業部來協調\n\n27\n00:09:28,999 --> 00:09:54,004\n其實我要談的就是幾乎大家的版本都提到這幾個字鼓勵學校採用在地食材發展地方飲食特色但是要落實很難所以我希望說這個部分就是提醒我們教育部還有農業部能夠好好的去思考教育部的母法就是做一個規範那真的要做到有特色一定是地方的規劃計畫提出來我們一定會全力支持\n\n28\n00:09:54,624 --> 00:10:14,881\n那我們很難去為每一個縣市每一個學校由中央直接來規劃這不太可能的也是不切實際但是我還是要講但是在規範上是有的我們在布的這個布板的條例裡面像第四條第十五條的樣子十三條都有提到就是說尊重在地文化在地食材\n\n29\n00:10:15,501 --> 00:10:33,928\n然後尊重這個認識跟尊重傳統及多元飲食文化尊重生命及自然環境我希望那個強度我們法的強度還是指導性再多一點因為到地方政府說一句實在話我們很辛苦就是說有政策然後再用政策工具在編預算來推動那這一部分\n\n30\n00:10:34,761 --> 00:10:47,939\n在經費的准許下我們會努力來做好不好如果將來想辦法大家一起努力地方政委也一起來分擔這個責任好謝謝教育部謝謝農業部好謝謝主席謝謝武林法委員質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n109\t10045\t謝謝主席 有請次長請次長備質詢 謝謝\n16367\t37423\t市長今天如果說我們要為我們的營養午餐來立一步法我想很多與時俱進的觀念很未來性的觀念應該都要放進去好比氣候變遷影響下我們對糧食的看法\n38143\t51695\t那這種低碳啊 抗旱啊 在地產銷 循環經濟保種的觀念 民族的味覺 解殖民的概念等等我想如果都能夠含瓜進去 這是非常前進的一步法那為什麼我這樣談 我舉我的版本來講我的版本的名稱叫做學校共餐及飲食教育法那我看到很多的版本都會提到\n63925\t75137\t就是採用當地食材然後發展地方飲食特色但是談何容易我舉個例子我的部落旁邊種滿了山蘇誰來買從產地到餐桌我們講探足機\n81204\t104469\t有那麼容易嗎這二三十年來我們做營養午餐很不容易達到但是我更希望談的就是說民族味覺的記憶跟文化附贈的途徑其實如果能夠從這一步伐來做其實可以成為一個很好的途徑我舉一個例子來講齁在花東地區有一個基金會叫慈欣基金會次長您聽過嗎\n106650\t120299\t這個慈欣經濟會他是用募款的方式他目前有幫助12間的小學他做什麼呢每週幫助他們提供一次的小米加布農豆就是畫面圖片上看到的\n121399\t125723\t那這個部分小米很營養為什麼因為農糧屬農業不說的啊小米是鹼性的它是所有穀類當中唯一就是不含麩質的那些胃腸過敏的小朋友呢其實很適合吃這個\n137913\t161765\t容易吸收而且它可以做酸鹼中和對現在的孩子很愛吃肉來講是一個很好的一個食物那另外呢也提到說如果做成小米粥它的營養成分就好比人生湯哇 這麼好我們國家未來的主人翁如果能夠吃小米飯小米粥該有多好但是 次長你看一下\n162725\t176218\t我們小米種植的面積日本人來的時候我不計算就已經開始輔導原住民轉作但是國民政府當時轉作稻米那個時候我們看到數據是在6736公頃\n180222\t195579\t時至今日小米的面積只剩下91公頃1%不到真的很令人難過那我們其實原住民也經歷山地平地化的一個過程像我們的高山上以前哪有高麗菜\n196780\t214967\t種滿了高麗菜以前哪有茶葉以前哪有水梨以前哪有蘋果所以呢山上種的植物已經不再是我們過去的作物或植物所以小米它面臨的問題很多像是種植的人口少而且那些人都高齡化\n216067\t234894\t更可怕的是我們的小米品系在台灣原本是全世界最多的可是時至今日因為沒有人吃 沒有人種所以保種困難 快速流失甚至現在中國已經把小米變作是第二公糧因為它為了要抗旱當作是一個未來的植物\n240916\t269169\t所以在這個地方生產端他說他不容易賣所以不種那市場端他說因為買不到所以不方便好 那我現在說小米他不是只有想要保種我們更希望的是把它昇華成飲食的行動保存我們民族的味覺記憶我們的孩子很需要小米但是我想說以慈欣為例她輔導那12間學校第一個每週給他們吃一次小米飯\n270370\t282670\t然後呢 給他們種小米跟部落的農友合作做一些小米的變化料理做小米的宣講然後呢 進入到部落的文件站好 我想先問一下農糧署\n290182\t316392\t委員好好 請教一下我們農糧署是副署長副署長我剛剛講了這麼多你支不支持我們的部落在地食材像小米啊 樹豆等等進入校園做營養午餐農糧署的部分原則上應該會支持啦那這一部分目前農糧署對於原鄉的這個作物我們也有在支持輔導好\n317412\t333322\t那其實我在農糧署碰到一個障礙齁我過去也開過中庭會你們有一個非傳統性食品原料申請是很麻煩耶我們好多的月桃入菜老葉入菜很多都要被罰耶\n334503\t351310\t那個動作加速了沒有這個還要跟衛福部這邊因為那個可不可以當作食材這個部分要對我的意思說要加速要加速我們很需要農糧署的幫忙好不好好謝謝副署長那再請教一下我們的署長國教署署長\n353564\t368758\t那個署長因為這個專法是在我們國教署請教依您的經驗這些部落在地的食材要進入到我們學校的營養午餐廚房會面臨哪些困難跟限制\n370479\t389170\t第一個他可能如果在張Q的認定上這可能要鏈接起來這個我們會跟農糧署做了解農糧署據我了解最近在這個整體的認定上為什麼我們現在會98.41這麼高的比率也是農糧署做了很多的跟地方的合作第二點\n389670\t416783\t可能在經費上經費上這一點剛好在前面109到111年我們給餐費我們直接給餐費到62元這樣的一個情況下對於量少它的經費可能要多一點的這樣也可以做一點支持那署長我的意思是說既然我們現在要立這部專訪那您也很知道過去推動在地食材的一個困難那我很希望說這個部分我們要盡量的去協助輔導好 謝謝署長\n419904\t442815\t對 剛才講的就是說門檻太高那部落的食材進不去學校的高牆那我們講的什麼碳足跡部落經濟部落足體農業在地產銷其實在這個地方都遇到了障礙所以我也請次長你能夠去關心這個問題那我關心的是說你的公糧不是我的公糧你的營養午餐不見得是我想要的營養午餐所以\n444376\t469026\t這個部分其實我們有很多的在地食材我們都很希望能夠輕鬆的進入政府所講的這件事情怎麼樣從產地到餐桌讓它更順暢那我更希望的是說要有人吃啊 有人利用啊才會有人種啊那這樣子才是保種的真思維因為沒有人吃 沒有人利用 沒有人補助\n470066\t486134\t我們要談保種何其困難都要送到北極的總園庫這是很悲哀的一件事情所以我是希望說這件事情我們的政府能夠去介入能夠關心連民間的慈欣基金會這樣的團體它都基於它對土地的使命感\n490676\t511516\t對地球的愛護他都願意去募款但是他能力有限但是我是希望說我們的農業部我們的教育部 國教署大家一起共同的來推動協助我們這些的在地食材可以進入到我們學校的營養午餐那也希望呢 至少有沒有可能從原住民重點學校來示範 次長\n512814\t539983\t我想委員的建議非常好,很前進這部分我們一定是願意來做相關的計畫因為涉及到地方的部分我們會跟他寫請他們來提計畫那我們如果可以的話我們當然會來讓部落的學校優先來示範這個如果能夠用這樣的方式來做飲食我想是部落孩童的福氣而且可以發展在地的食材在觀光、文化、旅遊上面都會有幫忙\n541023\t563856\t對 它就是一個良性循環其實我們談到的很多東西它都可以在這件事情裡面能夠完全所以為什麼說專法有時候就是一個宣示性規範性很多特色包括食農教育在講很多特色在地食材是有地方的特色其實我們都很希望地方能夠發展出特色那如果在法規層面上譬如三張EQ的認證困難上面我們會跟衛福部還有農業部來協調\n568999\t594004\t其實我要談的就是幾乎大家的版本都提到這幾個字鼓勵學校採用在地食材發展地方飲食特色但是要落實很難所以我希望說這個部分就是提醒我們教育部還有農業部能夠好好的去思考教育部的母法就是做一個規範那真的要做到有特色一定是地方的規劃計畫提出來我們一定會全力支持\n594624\t614881\t那我們很難去為每一個縣市每一個學校由中央直接來規劃這不太可能的 也是不切實際但是我還是要講但是在規範上是有的我們在布的這個布板的條例裡面像第四條第十五條的樣子十三條都有提到就是說尊重在地文化在地食材\n615501\t633928\t然後尊重這個認識跟尊重傳統及多元飲食文化尊重生命及自然環境我希望那個強度我們法的強度還是指導性再多一點因為到地方政府說一句實在話我們很辛苦就是說有政策然後再用政策工具在編預算來推動那這一部分\n634761\t647939\t在經費的准許下我們會努力來做 好不好如果將來想辦法 大家一起努力地方政委也一起來分擔這個責任好 謝謝教育部 謝謝農業部好 謝謝主席謝謝武林法委員質詢\n","txt":"謝謝主席 有請次長請次長備質詢 謝謝\n市長今天如果說我們要為我們的營養午餐來立一步法我想很多與時俱進的觀念很未來性的觀念應該都要放進去好比氣候變遷影響下我們對糧食的看法\n那這種低碳啊 抗旱啊 在地產銷 循環經濟保種的觀念 民族的味覺 解殖民的概念等等我想如果都能夠含瓜進去 這是非常前進的一步法那為什麼我這樣談 我舉我的版本來講我的版本的名稱叫做學校共餐及飲食教育法那我看到很多的版本都會提到\n就是採用當地食材然後發展地方飲食特色但是談何容易我舉個例子我的部落旁邊種滿了山蘇誰來買從產地到餐桌我們講探足機\n有那麼容易嗎這二三十年來我們做營養午餐很不容易達到但是我更希望談的就是說民族味覺的記憶跟文化附贈的途徑其實如果能夠從這一步伐來做其實可以成為一個很好的途徑我舉一個例子來講齁在花東地區有一個基金會叫慈欣基金會次長您聽過嗎\n這個慈欣經濟會他是用募款的方式他目前有幫助12間的小學他做什麼呢每週幫助他們提供一次的小米加布農豆就是畫面圖片上看到的\n那這個部分小米很營養為什麼因為農糧屬農業不說的啊小米是鹼性的它是所有穀類當中唯一就是不含麩質的那些胃腸過敏的小朋友呢其實很適合吃這個\n容易吸收而且它可以做酸鹼中和對現在的孩子很愛吃肉來講是一個很好的一個食物那另外呢也提到說如果做成小米粥它的營養成分就好比人生湯哇 這麼好我們國家未來的主人翁如果能夠吃小米飯小米粥該有多好但是 次長你看一下\n我們小米種植的面積日本人來的時候我不計算就已經開始輔導原住民轉作但是國民政府當時轉作稻米那個時候我們看到數據是在6736公頃\n時至今日小米的面積只剩下91公頃1%不到真的很令人難過那我們其實原住民也經歷山地平地化的一個過程像我們的高山上以前哪有高麗菜\n種滿了高麗菜以前哪有茶葉以前哪有水梨以前哪有蘋果所以呢山上種的植物已經不再是我們過去的作物或植物所以小米它面臨的問題很多像是種植的人口少而且那些人都高齡化\n更可怕的是我們的小米品系在台灣原本是全世界最多的可是時至今日因為沒有人吃 沒有人種所以保種困難 快速流失甚至現在中國已經把小米變作是第二公糧因為它為了要抗旱當作是一個未來的植物\n所以在這個地方生產端他說他不容易賣所以不種那市場端他說因為買不到所以不方便好 那我現在說小米他不是只有想要保種我們更希望的是把它昇華成飲食的行動保存我們民族的味覺記憶我們的孩子很需要小米但是我想說以慈欣為例她輔導那12間學校第一個每週給他們吃一次小米飯\n然後呢 給他們種小米跟部落的農友合作做一些小米的變化料理做小米的宣講然後呢 進入到部落的文件站好 我想先問一下農糧署\n委員好好 請教一下我們農糧署是副署長副署長我剛剛講了這麼多你支不支持我們的部落在地食材像小米啊 樹豆等等進入校園做營養午餐農糧署的部分原則上應該會支持啦那這一部分目前農糧署對於原鄉的這個作物我們也有在支持輔導好\n那其實我在農糧署碰到一個障礙齁我過去也開過中庭會你們有一個非傳統性食品原料申請是很麻煩耶我們好多的月桃入菜老葉入菜很多都要被罰耶\n那個動作加速了沒有這個還要跟衛福部這邊因為那個可不可以當作食材這個部分要對我的意思說要加速要加速我們很需要農糧署的幫忙好不好好謝謝副署長那再請教一下我們的署長國教署署長\n那個署長因為這個專法是在我們國教署請教依您的經驗這些部落在地的食材要進入到我們學校的營養午餐廚房會面臨哪些困難跟限制\n第一個他可能如果在張Q的認定上這可能要鏈接起來這個我們會跟農糧署做了解農糧署據我了解最近在這個整體的認定上為什麼我們現在會98.41這麼高的比率也是農糧署做了很多的跟地方的合作第二點\n可能在經費上經費上這一點剛好在前面109到111年我們給餐費我們直接給餐費到62元這樣的一個情況下對於量少它的經費可能要多一點的這樣也可以做一點支持那署長我的意思是說既然我們現在要立這部專訪那您也很知道過去推動在地食材的一個困難那我很希望說這個部分我們要盡量的去協助輔導好 謝謝署長\n對 剛才講的就是說門檻太高那部落的食材進不去學校的高牆那我們講的什麼碳足跡部落經濟部落足體農業在地產銷其實在這個地方都遇到了障礙所以我也請次長你能夠去關心這個問題那我關心的是說你的公糧不是我的公糧你的營養午餐不見得是我想要的營養午餐所以\n這個部分其實我們有很多的在地食材我們都很希望能夠輕鬆的進入政府所講的這件事情怎麼樣從產地到餐桌讓它更順暢那我更希望的是說要有人吃啊 有人利用啊才會有人種啊那這樣子才是保種的真思維因為沒有人吃 沒有人利用 沒有人補助\n我們要談保種何其困難都要送到北極的總園庫這是很悲哀的一件事情所以我是希望說這件事情我們的政府能夠去介入能夠關心連民間的慈欣基金會這樣的團體它都基於它對土地的使命感\n對地球的愛護他都願意去募款但是他能力有限但是我是希望說我們的農業部我們的教育部 國教署大家一起共同的來推動協助我們這些的在地食材可以進入到我們學校的營養午餐那也希望呢 至少有沒有可能從原住民重點學校來示範 次長\n我想委員的建議非常好,很前進這部分我們一定是願意來做相關的計畫因為涉及到地方的部分我們會跟他寫請他們來提計畫那我們如果可以的話我們當然會來讓部落的學校優先來示範這個如果能夠用這樣的方式來做飲食我想是部落孩童的福氣而且可以發展在地的食材在觀光、文化、旅遊上面都會有幫忙\n對 它就是一個良性循環其實我們談到的很多東西它都可以在這件事情裡面能夠完全所以為什麼說專法有時候就是一個宣示性規範性很多特色包括食農教育在講很多特色在地食材是有地方的特色其實我們都很希望地方能夠發展出特色那如果在法規層面上譬如三張EQ的認證困難上面我們會跟衛福部還有農業部來協調\n其實我要談的就是幾乎大家的版本都提到這幾個字鼓勵學校採用在地食材發展地方飲食特色但是要落實很難所以我希望說這個部分就是提醒我們教育部還有農業部能夠好好的去思考教育部的母法就是做一個規範那真的要做到有特色一定是地方的規劃計畫提出來我們一定會全力支持\n那我們很難去為每一個縣市每一個學校由中央直接來規劃這不太可能的 也是不切實際但是我還是要講但是在規範上是有的我們在布的這個布板的條例裡面像第四條第十五條的樣子十三條都有提到就是說尊重在地文化在地食材\n然後尊重這個認識跟尊重傳統及多元飲食文化尊重生命及自然環境我希望那個強度我們法的強度還是指導性再多一點因為到地方政府說一句實在話我們很辛苦就是說有政策然後再用政策工具在編預算來推動那這一部分\n在經費的准許下我們會努力來做 好不好如果將來想辦法 大家一起努力地方政委也一起來分擔這個責任好 謝謝教育部 謝謝農業部好 謝謝主席謝謝武林法委員質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.109 --> 00:10.045\n謝謝主席有請次長請次長備質詢謝謝\n\n00:16.367 --> 00:37.423\n市長今天如果說我們要為我們的營養午餐來立一步法我想很多與時俱進的觀念很未來性的觀念應該都要放進去好比氣候變遷影響下我們對糧食的看法\n\n00:38.143 --> 00:51.695\n那這種低碳啊抗旱啊在地產銷循環經濟保種的觀念民族的味覺解殖民的概念等等我想如果都能夠含瓜進去這是非常前進的一步法那為什麼我這樣談我舉我的版本來講我的版本的名稱叫做學校共餐及飲食教育法那我看到很多的版本都會提到\n\n01:03.925 --> 01:15.137\n就是採用當地食材然後發展地方飲食特色但是談何容易我舉個例子我的部落旁邊種滿了山蘇誰來買從產地到餐桌我們講探足機\n\n01:21.204 --> 01:44.469\n有那麼容易嗎這二三十年來我們做營養午餐很不容易達到但是我更希望談的就是說民族味覺的記憶跟文化附贈的途徑其實如果能夠從這一步伐來做其實可以成為一個很好的途徑我舉一個例子來講齁在花東地區有一個基金會叫慈欣基金會次長您聽過嗎\n\n01:46.650 --> 02:00.299\n這個慈欣經濟會他是用募款的方式他目前有幫助12間的小學他做什麼呢每週幫助他們提供一次的小米加布農豆就是畫面圖片上看到的\n\n02:01.399 --> 02:05.723\n那這個部分小米很營養為什麼因為農糧屬農業不說的啊小米是鹼性的它是所有穀類當中唯一就是不含麩質的那些胃腸過敏的小朋友呢其實很適合吃這個\n\n02:17.913 --> 02:41.765\n容易吸收而且它可以做酸鹼中和對現在的孩子很愛吃肉來講是一個很好的一個食物那另外呢也提到說如果做成小米粥它的營養成分就好比人生湯哇這麼好我們國家未來的主人翁如果能夠吃小米飯小米粥該有多好但是次長你看一下\n\n02:42.725 --> 02:56.218\n我們小米種植的面積日本人來的時候我不計算就已經開始輔導原住民轉作但是國民政府當時轉作稻米那個時候我們看到數據是在6736公頃\n\n03:00.222 --> 03:15.579\n時至今日小米的面積只剩下91公頃1%不到真的很令人難過那我們其實原住民也經歷山地平地化的一個過程像我們的高山上以前哪有高麗菜\n\n03:16.780 --> 03:34.967\n種滿了高麗菜以前哪有茶葉以前哪有水梨以前哪有蘋果所以呢山上種的植物已經不再是我們過去的作物或植物所以小米它面臨的問題很多像是種植的人口少而且那些人都高齡化\n\n03:36.067 --> 03:54.894\n更可怕的是我們的小米品系在台灣原本是全世界最多的可是時至今日因為沒有人吃沒有人種所以保種困難快速流失甚至現在中國已經把小米變作是第二公糧因為它為了要抗旱當作是一個未來的植物\n\n04:00.916 --> 04:29.169\n所以在這個地方生產端他說他不容易賣所以不種那市場端他說因為買不到所以不方便好那我現在說小米他不是只有想要保種我們更希望的是把它昇華成飲食的行動保存我們民族的味覺記憶我們的孩子很需要小米但是我想說以慈欣為例她輔導那12間學校第一個每週給他們吃一次小米飯\n\n04:30.370 --> 04:42.670\n然後呢給他們種小米跟部落的農友合作做一些小米的變化料理做小米的宣講然後呢進入到部落的文件站好我想先問一下農糧署\n\n04:50.182 --> 05:16.392\n委員好好請教一下我們農糧署是副署長副署長我剛剛講了這麼多你支不支持我們的部落在地食材像小米啊樹豆等等進入校園做營養午餐農糧署的部分原則上應該會支持啦那這一部分目前農糧署對於原鄉的這個作物我們也有在支持輔導好\n\n05:17.412 --> 05:33.322\n那其實我在農糧署碰到一個障礙齁我過去也開過中庭會你們有一個非傳統性食品原料申請是很麻煩耶我們好多的月桃入菜老葉入菜很多都要被罰耶\n\n05:34.503 --> 05:51.310\n那個動作加速了沒有這個還要跟衛福部這邊因為那個可不可以當作食材這個部分要對我的意思說要加速要加速我們很需要農糧署的幫忙好不好好謝謝副署長那再請教一下我們的署長國教署署長\n\n05:53.564 --> 06:08.758\n那個署長因為這個專法是在我們國教署請教依您的經驗這些部落在地的食材要進入到我們學校的營養午餐廚房會面臨哪些困難跟限制\n\n06:10.479 --> 06:29.170\n第一個他可能如果在張Q的認定上這可能要鏈接起來這個我們會跟農糧署做了解農糧署據我了解最近在這個整體的認定上為什麼我們現在會98.41這麼高的比率也是農糧署做了很多的跟地方的合作第二點\n\n06:29.670 --> 06:56.783\n可能在經費上經費上這一點剛好在前面109到111年我們給餐費我們直接給餐費到62元這樣的一個情況下對於量少它的經費可能要多一點的這樣也可以做一點支持那署長我的意思是說既然我們現在要立這部專訪那您也很知道過去推動在地食材的一個困難那我很希望說這個部分我們要盡量的去協助輔導好謝謝署長\n\n06:59.904 --> 07:22.815\n對剛才講的就是說門檻太高那部落的食材進不去學校的高牆那我們講的什麼碳足跡部落經濟部落足體農業在地產銷其實在這個地方都遇到了障礙所以我也請次長你能夠去關心這個問題那我關心的是說你的公糧不是我的公糧你的營養午餐不見得是我想要的營養午餐所以\n\n07:24.376 --> 07:49.026\n這個部分其實我們有很多的在地食材我們都很希望能夠輕鬆的進入政府所講的這件事情怎麼樣從產地到餐桌讓它更順暢那我更希望的是說要有人吃啊有人利用啊才會有人種啊那這樣子才是保種的真思維因為沒有人吃沒有人利用沒有人補助\n\n07:50.066 --> 08:06.134\n我們要談保種何其困難都要送到北極的總園庫這是很悲哀的一件事情所以我是希望說這件事情我們的政府能夠去介入能夠關心連民間的慈欣基金會這樣的團體它都基於它對土地的使命感\n\n08:10.676 --> 08:31.516\n對地球的愛護他都願意去募款但是他能力有限但是我是希望說我們的農業部我們的教育部國教署大家一起共同的來推動協助我們這些的在地食材可以進入到我們學校的營養午餐那也希望呢至少有沒有可能從原住民重點學校來示範次長\n\n08:32.814 --> 08:59.983\n我想委員的建議非常好,很前進這部分我們一定是願意來做相關的計畫因為涉及到地方的部分我們會跟他寫請他們來提計畫那我們如果可以的話我們當然會來讓部落的學校優先來示範這個如果能夠用這樣的方式來做飲食我想是部落孩童的福氣而且可以發展在地的食材在觀光、文化、旅遊上面都會有幫忙\n\n09:01.023 --> 09:23.856\n對它就是一個良性循環其實我們談到的很多東西它都可以在這件事情裡面能夠完全所以為什麼說專法有時候就是一個宣示性規範性很多特色包括食農教育在講很多特色在地食材是有地方的特色其實我們都很希望地方能夠發展出特色那如果在法規層面上譬如三張EQ的認證困難上面我們會跟衛福部還有農業部來協調\n\n09:28.999 --> 09:54.004\n其實我要談的就是幾乎大家的版本都提到這幾個字鼓勵學校採用在地食材發展地方飲食特色但是要落實很難所以我希望說這個部分就是提醒我們教育部還有農業部能夠好好的去思考教育部的母法就是做一個規範那真的要做到有特色一定是地方的規劃計畫提出來我們一定會全力支持\n\n09:54.624 --> 10:14.881\n那我們很難去為每一個縣市每一個學校由中央直接來規劃這不太可能的也是不切實際但是我還是要講但是在規範上是有的我們在布的這個布板的條例裡面像第四條第十五條的樣子十三條都有提到就是說尊重在地文化在地食材\n\n10:15.501 --> 10:33.928\n然後尊重這個認識跟尊重傳統及多元飲食文化尊重生命及自然環境我希望那個強度我們法的強度還是指導性再多一點因為到地方政府說一句實在話我們很辛苦就是說有政策然後再用政策工具在編預算來推動那這一部分\n\n10:34.761 --> 10:47.939\n在經費的准許下我們會努力來做好不好如果將來想辦法大家一起努力地方政委也一起來分擔這個責任好謝謝教育部謝謝農業部好謝謝主席謝謝武林法委員質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.109,"end":10.045,"text":"謝謝主席 有請次長請次長備質詢 謝謝"},{"start":16.367,"end":37.423,"text":"市長今天如果說我們要為我們的營養午餐來立一步法我想很多與時俱進的觀念很未來性的觀念應該都要放進去好比氣候變遷影響下我們對糧食的看法"},{"start":38.143,"end":51.695,"text":"那這種低碳啊 抗旱啊 在地產銷 循環經濟保種的觀念 民族的味覺 解殖民的概念等等我想如果都能夠含瓜進去 這是非常前進的一步法那為什麼我這樣談 我舉我的版本來講我的版本的名稱叫做學校共餐及飲食教育法那我看到很多的版本都會提到"},{"start":63.925,"end":75.137,"text":"就是採用當地食材然後發展地方飲食特色但是談何容易我舉個例子我的部落旁邊種滿了山蘇誰來買從產地到餐桌我們講探足機"},{"start":81.204,"end":104.469,"text":"有那麼容易嗎這二三十年來我們做營養午餐很不容易達到但是我更希望談的就是說民族味覺的記憶跟文化附贈的途徑其實如果能夠從這一步伐來做其實可以成為一個很好的途徑我舉一個例子來講齁在花東地區有一個基金會叫慈欣基金會次長您聽過嗎"},{"start":106.65,"end":120.299,"text":"這個慈欣經濟會他是用募款的方式他目前有幫助12間的小學他做什麼呢每週幫助他們提供一次的小米加布農豆就是畫面圖片上看到的"},{"start":121.399,"end":125.723,"text":"那這個部分小米很營養為什麼因為農糧屬農業不說的啊小米是鹼性的它是所有穀類當中唯一就是不含麩質的那些胃腸過敏的小朋友呢其實很適合吃這個"},{"start":137.913,"end":161.765,"text":"容易吸收而且它可以做酸鹼中和對現在的孩子很愛吃肉來講是一個很好的一個食物那另外呢也提到說如果做成小米粥它的營養成分就好比人生湯哇 這麼好我們國家未來的主人翁如果能夠吃小米飯小米粥該有多好但是 次長你看一下"},{"start":162.725,"end":176.218,"text":"我們小米種植的面積日本人來的時候我不計算就已經開始輔導原住民轉作但是國民政府當時轉作稻米那個時候我們看到數據是在6736公頃"},{"start":180.222,"end":195.579,"text":"時至今日小米的面積只剩下91公頃1%不到真的很令人難過那我們其實原住民也經歷山地平地化的一個過程像我們的高山上以前哪有高麗菜"},{"start":196.78,"end":214.967,"text":"種滿了高麗菜以前哪有茶葉以前哪有水梨以前哪有蘋果所以呢山上種的植物已經不再是我們過去的作物或植物所以小米它面臨的問題很多像是種植的人口少而且那些人都高齡化"},{"start":216.067,"end":234.894,"text":"更可怕的是我們的小米品系在台灣原本是全世界最多的可是時至今日因為沒有人吃 沒有人種所以保種困難 快速流失甚至現在中國已經把小米變作是第二公糧因為它為了要抗旱當作是一個未來的植物"},{"start":240.916,"end":269.169,"text":"所以在這個地方生產端他說他不容易賣所以不種那市場端他說因為買不到所以不方便好 那我現在說小米他不是只有想要保種我們更希望的是把它昇華成飲食的行動保存我們民族的味覺記憶我們的孩子很需要小米但是我想說以慈欣為例她輔導那12間學校第一個每週給他們吃一次小米飯"},{"start":270.37,"end":282.67,"text":"然後呢 給他們種小米跟部落的農友合作做一些小米的變化料理做小米的宣講然後呢 進入到部落的文件站好 我想先問一下農糧署"},{"start":290.182,"end":316.392,"text":"委員好好 請教一下我們農糧署是副署長副署長我剛剛講了這麼多你支不支持我們的部落在地食材像小米啊 樹豆等等進入校園做營養午餐農糧署的部分原則上應該會支持啦那這一部分目前農糧署對於原鄉的這個作物我們也有在支持輔導好"},{"start":317.412,"end":333.322,"text":"那其實我在農糧署碰到一個障礙齁我過去也開過中庭會你們有一個非傳統性食品原料申請是很麻煩耶我們好多的月桃入菜老葉入菜很多都要被罰耶"},{"start":334.503,"end":351.31,"text":"那個動作加速了沒有這個還要跟衛福部這邊因為那個可不可以當作食材這個部分要對我的意思說要加速要加速我們很需要農糧署的幫忙好不好好謝謝副署長那再請教一下我們的署長國教署署長"},{"start":353.564,"end":368.758,"text":"那個署長因為這個專法是在我們國教署請教依您的經驗這些部落在地的食材要進入到我們學校的營養午餐廚房會面臨哪些困難跟限制"},{"start":370.479,"end":389.17,"text":"第一個他可能如果在張Q的認定上這可能要鏈接起來這個我們會跟農糧署做了解農糧署據我了解最近在這個整體的認定上為什麼我們現在會98.41這麼高的比率也是農糧署做了很多的跟地方的合作第二點"},{"start":389.67,"end":416.783,"text":"可能在經費上經費上這一點剛好在前面109到111年我們給餐費我們直接給餐費到62元這樣的一個情況下對於量少它的經費可能要多一點的這樣也可以做一點支持那署長我的意思是說既然我們現在要立這部專訪那您也很知道過去推動在地食材的一個困難那我很希望說這個部分我們要盡量的去協助輔導好 謝謝署長"},{"start":419.904,"end":442.815,"text":"對 剛才講的就是說門檻太高那部落的食材進不去學校的高牆那我們講的什麼碳足跡部落經濟部落足體農業在地產銷其實在這個地方都遇到了障礙所以我也請次長你能夠去關心這個問題那我關心的是說你的公糧不是我的公糧你的營養午餐不見得是我想要的營養午餐所以"},{"start":444.376,"end":469.026,"text":"這個部分其實我們有很多的在地食材我們都很希望能夠輕鬆的進入政府所講的這件事情怎麼樣從產地到餐桌讓它更順暢那我更希望的是說要有人吃啊 有人利用啊才會有人種啊那這樣子才是保種的真思維因為沒有人吃 沒有人利用 沒有人補助"},{"start":470.066,"end":486.134,"text":"我們要談保種何其困難都要送到北極的總園庫這是很悲哀的一件事情所以我是希望說這件事情我們的政府能夠去介入能夠關心連民間的慈欣基金會這樣的團體它都基於它對土地的使命感"},{"start":490.676,"end":511.516,"text":"對地球的愛護他都願意去募款但是他能力有限但是我是希望說我們的農業部我們的教育部 國教署大家一起共同的來推動協助我們這些的在地食材可以進入到我們學校的營養午餐那也希望呢 至少有沒有可能從原住民重點學校來示範 次長"},{"start":512.814,"end":539.983,"text":"我想委員的建議非常好,很前進這部分我們一定是願意來做相關的計畫因為涉及到地方的部分我們會跟他寫請他們來提計畫那我們如果可以的話我們當然會來讓部落的學校優先來示範這個如果能夠用這樣的方式來做飲食我想是部落孩童的福氣而且可以發展在地的食材在觀光、文化、旅遊上面都會有幫忙"},{"start":541.023,"end":563.856,"text":"對 它就是一個良性循環其實我們談到的很多東西它都可以在這件事情裡面能夠完全所以為什麼說專法有時候就是一個宣示性規範性很多特色包括食農教育在講很多特色在地食材是有地方的特色其實我們都很希望地方能夠發展出特色那如果在法規層面上譬如三張EQ的認證困難上面我們會跟衛福部還有農業部來協調"},{"start":568.999,"end":594.004,"text":"其實我要談的就是幾乎大家的版本都提到這幾個字鼓勵學校採用在地食材發展地方飲食特色但是要落實很難所以我希望說這個部分就是提醒我們教育部還有農業部能夠好好的去思考教育部的母法就是做一個規範那真的要做到有特色一定是地方的規劃計畫提出來我們一定會全力支持"},{"start":594.624,"end":614.881,"text":"那我們很難去為每一個縣市每一個學校由中央直接來規劃這不太可能的 也是不切實際但是我還是要講但是在規範上是有的我們在布的這個布板的條例裡面像第四條第十五條的樣子十三條都有提到就是說尊重在地文化在地食材"},{"start":615.501,"end":633.928,"text":"然後尊重這個認識跟尊重傳統及多元飲食文化尊重生命及自然環境我希望那個強度我們法的強度還是指導性再多一點因為到地方政府說一句實在話我們很辛苦就是說有政策然後再用政策工具在編預算來推動那這一部分"},{"start":634.761,"end":647.939,"text":"在經費的准許下我們會努力來做 好不好如果將來想辦法 大家一起努力地方政委也一起來分擔這個責任好 謝謝教育部 謝謝農業部好 謝謝主席謝謝武林法委員質詢"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":897,"blocks":[["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：（12時24分）謝謝主席，有請次長。"],["主席：請次長備詢。"],["張廖次長萬堅：委員好。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：次長好。次長，今天如果要為我們的營養午餐來立一部法，我想很多與時俱進的觀念、很未來性的觀念，應該都要放進去，好比在氣候變遷影響下我們對糧食的看法，這種低碳、抗旱、在地產銷、循環經濟、保種的觀念、民族的味覺、解殖民的概念等等，我想如果都能夠含括進去……"],["張廖次長萬堅：這個非常前進。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：對，這是非常前進的一部法。為什麼我這樣談？舉我的版本來講，我的版本名稱叫做學校供餐及飲食教育法，我看到很多的版本都會提到採用當地食材、發展地方飲食特色，但是談何容易！我舉個例子，我的部落旁邊種滿了山蘇，誰來買？從產地到餐桌，我們講碳足跡，有那麼容易嗎？這二、三十年來，我們做營養午餐很不容易達到，但是我更希望談的就是民族味覺的記憶跟文化復振的途徑，如果能夠從這一步法來做，其實可以成為一個很好的途徑。","我舉一個例子來講，在花東地區有一個基金會叫慈心基金會，次長，您聽過嗎？"],["張廖次長萬堅：沒有。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：這個慈心基金會是用募款的方式，它目前有幫助12間小學，它做什麼呢？每週幫助他們提供一次的小米加布農豆，就是畫面圖片上看到的，這個部分小米很營養，為什麼？因為農糧署、農業部說小米是鹼性的，它是所有穀類當中唯一不含麩質的，那些胃腸過敏的小朋友其實很適合吃這個，容易吸收而且它可以做酸鹼中和，對現在的孩子很愛吃肉來講是一個很好的食物；另外也提到，如果做成小米粥，它的營養成分就好比人參湯。哇，這麼好，我們國家未來的主人翁如果能夠吃小米飯、小米粥該有多好！","但是次長你看一下，關於小米種植的面積，日本人來的時候我不計算，那時就已經開始輔導原住民轉作；但是國民政府當時轉作稻米，那個時候我們看到數據是6,736公頃；時至今日，小米的面積只剩下91公頃，1%不到，真的很令人難過！我們原住民也經歷山地平地化的過程，像我們高山上以前哪有高麗菜、種滿了高麗菜，以前哪有茶葉、以前哪有水梨、以前哪有蘋果！所以山上種的植物已經不再是我們過去的作物或植物，因此小米面臨的問題很多，像是種植的人口少，而且那些人都高齡化，更可怕的是，我們的小米品系在臺灣原本是全世界最多的，可是時至今日，因為沒有人吃、沒有人種，所以保種困難、快速流失，甚至現在中國已經把小米變做是第二公糧，因為他為了要抗旱，當作是一個未來的植物。所以在這方面，生產端因為不容易賣，所以不種；市場端因為買不到，所以不方便。","現在小米不是只有想要保種，我們更希望把它昇華成飲食的行動，保存我們民族的味覺記憶，我們的孩子很需要小米。我以慈心為例，它輔導那12間學校，第一個，每週給他們吃一次小米飯，然後給他們種小米，跟部落的農友合作，做一些小米的變化料理、做小米的宣講，然後進入到部落的文健站。","我想先問一下農糧署。"],["黃副署長昭興：委員好。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：好，請教一下農糧署副署長，副署長，我剛剛講了這麼多，你支不支持我們的部落在地食材，像小米、樹豆等等進入校園做營養午餐？"],["黃副署長昭興：農糧署原則上應該會支持，這一部分目前農糧署對於原鄉作物也有在支持、輔導。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：好。我在農糧署碰到一個障礙，我過去也開過公聽會，你們有一個非傳統性食品原料申請，很麻煩耶！例如我們好多的月桃入菜、荖葉入菜，很多都要被罰，那個動作加速了沒有？"],["黃副署長昭興：這個還要跟衛福部這邊……因為那個可不可以當作食材的部分要跟衛福部……"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：對，我的意思說要加速、要加速！我們很需要農糧署的幫忙，好不好？"],["黃副署長昭興：是！"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：謝謝副署長。","再請教一下國教署署長。"],["彭署長富源：委員好。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：署長，因為這個專法是在國教署，請教依您的經驗，這些部落在地的食材要進入到學校的營養午餐廚房會面臨哪些困難跟限制？"],["彭署長富源：第一個，在章Q的認定上可能要鏈結起來，這個我們會跟農糧署進行了解，據我了解，農糧署最近在整體的認定上，為什麼我們現在會是98.41%這麼高的比率？也是農糧署做了很多跟地方的合作；第二點，可能在經費上，這一點剛好在前面109到111年我們給餐費，我們直接給餐費到62元，在這樣的一個情況下，對於量少而經費可能要多一點的，這樣也可以做一點支持。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：署長，我的意思是，既然我們現在要立這部專法，您也很知道過去推動在地食材的困難，我很希望這個部分你們要儘量去協助輔導，謝謝署長。","對，剛才講的就是門檻太高，部落的食材進不去學校的高牆，我們講的什麼碳足跡、部落經濟、部落主體農業、在地產銷，其實在這個地方都遇到了障礙，所以我也請次長能夠關心這個問題。而我關心的部分是，你的公糧不是我的公糧，你的營養午餐不見得是我想要的營養午餐，所以這個部分其實我們有很多的在地食材，我們都很希望能夠輕鬆地進入政府所講的這件事情，怎麼讓產地到餐桌更順暢。","而我更希望的是，要有人吃、有人利用才會有人種，這樣子才是保種的真思維，因為沒有人吃、沒有人利用、沒有人補助，我們要談保種何其困難，都要送到北極的種原庫，這是很悲哀的一件事情，所以我希望這件事情政府能夠介入、能夠關心，連民間慈心基金會這樣的團體都基於它對土地的使命感、對地球的愛護而願意去募款，但是它能力有限，所以我希望農業部、教育部國教署大家一起共同來推動，協助我們這些在地食材可以進入到學校的營養午餐，有沒有可能至少從原住民重點學校來試辦，次長？"],["張廖次長萬堅：我想委員的建議非常好、很前進，這部分我們一定願意來做相關的計畫，涉及到地方的部分我們會請他們來提計畫，如果可以的話我們當然會讓部落的學校優先來試辦，如果能夠用這樣的方式來做飲食，我想是部落孩童的福氣，也非常幸運，而且可以發展在地的食材，在觀光、文化、旅遊上面都會有幫忙。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：對，這就是一個良性循環，其實我們談到的很多東西都可以在這件事情裡面能夠完全。"],["張廖次長萬堅：所以為什麼叫專法，有時候是一個宣示性、規範性，包括食農教育在講的，在地食材具有地方的特色，其實我們都很希望地方能夠發展出特色，如果在法規層面上，譬如三章一Q的認證困難，我們會跟衛福部還有農業部來協調。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：其實我要談的就是，幾乎大家的版本都提到這幾個字，鼓勵學校採用在地食材、發展地方飲食特色，但是要落實很難，所以這個部分就是提醒教育部還有農業部能夠好好的去思考。"],["張廖次長萬堅：委員也知道教育部的母法就是做一個規範，真的要做到有特色一定是地方的規劃、計畫提出來，我們一定會全力支持，很難每一個縣市、每一個學校由中央直接來規劃，這是不太可能的、也是不切實際。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：但我還是要講……"],["張廖次長萬堅：但在規範上是有的，我們在部版的條例裡面，像第四條、第十三條都有提到尊重在地文化、在地食材、認識跟尊重傳統及多元飲食文化、尊重生命及自然環境，都有這些。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：我希望我們法的強度還是指導性再多一點，因為到地方政府，說一句實在話，我們很辛苦。"],["張廖次長萬堅：過去我們有政策，然後再用政策工具、編預算來推動，這一部分在經費的准許下我們會努力來做，好不好？將來想辦法、大家一起努力，地方政府也一起來分擔這個責任。"],["伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe委員：好，謝謝教育部、謝謝農業部，謝謝主席。"],["主席：謝謝伍麗華委員質詢，官員請回座。剛剛聽到伍麗華委員講小米、樹豆，我肚子都餓了，我想在地的多元食材真的是可以來考慮一下。","我們待會在吳沛憶委員質詢之後會處理臨時提案。","我們接著繼續進行質詢，請張雅琳委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":198,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-22-3","speakers":["葛如鈞","洪孟楷","王育敏","徐巧芯","楊瓊瓔","王鴻薇","羅廷瑋","許宇甄","鍾佳濱","陳秀寳","葉元之","柯志恩","萬美玲","林沛祥","林宜瑾","劉書彬","郭昱晴","范雲","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","張雅琳","吳沛憶","林倩綺","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","李彥秀","吳思瑤","李坤城","陳培瑜"],"page_start":111,"meetingDate":["2025-03-20"],"gazette_id":"1142901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1142901_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期教育及文化委員會第3次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查「學校供餐法草案」：(一) 審查委員范雲等16人擬具「學校供餐法草案」案、(二) 審\n查委員馬文君等17人擬具「學校供餐法草案」案、 (三) 審查委員魯明哲等24人擬具「學校供餐\n法草案」案、(四) 審查委員王育敏等17人擬具「學校供餐法草案」案、(五) 審查委員洪孟楷等\n20 人擬具「學校供餐法草案」案、 ( 六 ) 審查委員黃健豪等 20 人擬具「學校供餐法草案」案、\n( 七) 審查委員楊瓊瓔等21 人擬具「學校供餐條例草案」案、 ( 八) 審查委員林倩綺等 21 人擬具\n「學校午餐及營養促進條例草案」案、 ( 九 ) 審查委員鍾佳濱等 17 人擬具「學校午餐法草案」\n案、(十) 審查委員郭昱晴等16人擬具「學校午餐及飲食教育法草案」案、(十一) 審查委員張雅\n琳等17人擬具「學校午餐及飲食教育法草案」案、(十二) 審查委員柯志恩等21人擬具「學校午\n餐及飲食教育條例草案」案、(十三) 審查委員陳培瑜等26人擬具「學校午餐及飲食教育條例草\n案」案、(十四) 審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「高級中等以下學校及幼兒園午餐供餐法草案」案、\n(十五) 審查委員王鴻薇等20人擬具「學校飲食健康促進法草案」案、(十六) 審查委員葉元之等\n20人擬具「學校飲食健康促進法草案」案、(十七) 審查委員陳秀寳等20人擬具「學校飲食法草\n案」案、(十八) 審查委員林宜瑾等33人擬具「學校飲食法草案」案、(十九) 審查委員劉建國等\n17人擬具「學校飲食教育法草案」案、(二十) 審查委員徐巧芯等19人擬具「學校營養飲食供餐\n法草案」案、(二十一) 審查委員邱鎮軍等25人擬具「高級中等以下學校供餐及飲食教育條例草\n案」案、(二十二) 審查委員羅廷瑋等20人擬具「高級中等以下學校午餐及飲食教育條例草案」\n案、(二十三) 審查委員萬美玲等19人擬具「學校營養午餐法草案」案（僅進行詢答）；二、審\n查「運動產業發展條例」：(一) 審查委員柯志恩等22人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二十四條及\n第二十六條條文修正草案」案、(二) 審查委員張智倫等 18 人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二十\n四條及第二十六條條文修正草案」案、(三) 審查委員洪孟楷等17人擬具「運動產業發展條例第\n二十四條及第二十六條條文修正草案」案、(四) 審查委員王鴻薇等 19 人擬具「運動產業發展\n條例第二十四條及第二十六條條文修正草案」案、(五) 審查委員林倩綺等22人擬具「運動產業\n發展條例第四條條文修正草案」案、(六) 審查委員沈發惠等19人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二\n條條文修正草案」案、(七) 審查委員許宇甄等17人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二十四條及第二\n十六條條文修正草案」案、(八)審查委員萬美玲等19人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二條、第二十\n四條及第二十六條條文修正草案」、(九)審查委員楊瓊瓔等27人擬具「運動產業發展條例第二十\n四條及第二十六條條文修正草案」（僅進行詢答）","agenda_id":"1142901_00003"}}}