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00:01:10,749\n又漲價又補貼那他們的補貼竟然聽起來其實比台灣高很多是的那聽起來呢那我問一下這些補貼電價或者是漲電價的國家是不是也都使用核電核電的占比比我們還高嗎日本跟法國確實都使用核電那法國的核電比例非常高\n\n5\n00:01:12,061 --> 00:01:26,948\n所以看起來這跟很多人在那邊喊說是錯誤的能源政策有關我認為聽起來沒有關係而是這整個能源價格上漲的問題看起來是全世界的所有國家在追求經濟發展兼顧民生福利的時候大家共同的難題我可以下這個結論嗎\n\n6\n00:01:28,615 --> 00:01:43,949\n那個能源價格上漲會造成通膨通膨以後國家的公共支出會更大那其實他們是先漲價通膨以後政府才補貼這個其實造成的惡性循環其實後果是更嚴重跟台灣台灣狀況是台電\n\n7\n00:01:47,056 --> 00:01:47,096\n好聽到\n\n8\n00:02:02,537 --> 00:02:20,057\n剛剛說承擔政策台電我來跟董事長分享一個我目前在服務金門跟連江線那這兩個線我想長期董事長一定清楚他們的發電成本都比較高那也因為發電成本高所以長期以來台電都給予非常大的優惠價格給予相關的撥補跟補助可不可以說一下這個現況\n\n9\n00:02:21,633 --> 00:02:45,563\n跟委員報告啊就因為機組的關係所以他們每一度電帶平均成本都超過10塊錢那委員這個簡報上面已經清楚的呈現就是這兩個離島大概一年一年要補貼30幾億但是我現在身為要服務離島的委員我很擔心不管是陳雪生委員或是陳玉珍委員他們藍白一起砍掉這個相關的預算然後目前又拒絕任何的可能性我想問一下我們離島居民怎麼辦\n\n10\n00:02:48,393 --> 00:03:06,458\n你也沒辦法報告委員我們這樣講台電還有一個很基本的任務就是即使財務困難我們也要充分供電這個充分供電並且確保合理的電價讓離島的居民在享受這個便利發電同時跟台灣本島的使用電價是一樣的不然說白了對不對是的\n\n11\n00:03:08,939 --> 00:03:19,431\n好所以相關政策困難我想後續我們再來討論也希望大院支持我們的補貼預算我希望我的藍白同事們支持啦好謝謝董事長謝謝主席謝謝好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n4706\t6830\t好 謝謝主席 那有請台電董事長 謝謝\n15558\t32548\t是委員長我想問一下二屋戰爭造成能源價格上漲世界其他國家到底都如何應對是不是跟台灣一樣也有政府補貼的部分可不可以請您回答告訴我目前世界各國的趨勢謝謝我據我所了解德國日本法國\n33468\t47160\t的補助金額都超過台幣五千億是那這個數字是去年跟前年也就是說它是近幾年可參考很重要的數字嗎是好那如果是這樣聽起來補充報告就是不只補貼其實他們也漲價\n49802\t70749\t又漲價又補貼那他們的補貼竟然聽起來其實比台灣高很多是的那聽起來呢那我問一下這些補貼電價或者是漲電價的國家是不是也都使用核電核電的占比比我們還高嗎日本跟法國確實都使用核電那法國的核電比例非常高\n72061\t86948\t所以看起來這跟很多人在那邊喊說是錯誤的能源政策有關我認為聽起來沒有關係而是這整個能源價格上漲的問題看起來是全世界的所有國家在追求經濟發展兼顧民生福利的時候大家共同的難題我可以下這個結論嗎\n88615\t103949\t那個能源價格上漲會造成通膨通膨以後國家的公共支出會更大那其實他們是先漲價通膨以後政府才補貼這個其實造成的惡性循環其實後果是更嚴重跟台灣台灣狀況是台電\n107056\t107096\t好 聽到\n122537\t140057\t剛剛說承擔政策台電我來跟董事長分享一個我目前在服務金門跟連江線那這兩個線我想長期董事長一定清楚他們的發電成本都比較高那也因為發電成本高所以長期以來台電都給予非常大的優惠價格給予相關的撥補跟補助可不可以說一下這個現況\n141633\t165563\t跟委員報告啊就因為機組的關係所以他們每一度電帶平均成本都超過10塊錢那委員這個簡報上面已經清楚的呈現就是這兩個離島大概一年一年要補貼30幾億但是我現在身為要服務離島的委員我很擔心不管是陳雪生委員或是陳玉珍委員他們藍白一起砍掉這個相關的預算然後目前又拒絕任何的可能性我想問一下我們離島居民怎麼辦\n168393\t186458\t你也沒辦法報告委員我們這樣講台電還有一個很基本的任務就是即使財務困難我們也要充分供電這個充分供電並且確保合理的電價讓離島的居民在享受這個便利發電同時跟台灣本島的使用電價是一樣的不然說白了對不對是的\n188939\t199431\t好 所以相關政策困難 我想後續我們再來討論也希望大院支持我們的補貼預算我希望我的藍白同事們支持啦好 謝謝董事長 謝謝主席 謝謝好 謝謝\n","txt":"好 謝謝主席 那有請台電董事長 謝謝\n是委員長我想問一下二屋戰爭造成能源價格上漲世界其他國家到底都如何應對是不是跟台灣一樣也有政府補貼的部分可不可以請您回答告訴我目前世界各國的趨勢謝謝我據我所了解德國日本法國\n的補助金額都超過台幣五千億是那這個數字是去年跟前年也就是說它是近幾年可參考很重要的數字嗎是好那如果是這樣聽起來補充報告就是不只補貼其實他們也漲價\n又漲價又補貼那他們的補貼竟然聽起來其實比台灣高很多是的那聽起來呢那我問一下這些補貼電價或者是漲電價的國家是不是也都使用核電核電的占比比我們還高嗎日本跟法國確實都使用核電那法國的核電比例非常高\n所以看起來這跟很多人在那邊喊說是錯誤的能源政策有關我認為聽起來沒有關係而是這整個能源價格上漲的問題看起來是全世界的所有國家在追求經濟發展兼顧民生福利的時候大家共同的難題我可以下這個結論嗎\n那個能源價格上漲會造成通膨通膨以後國家的公共支出會更大那其實他們是先漲價通膨以後政府才補貼這個其實造成的惡性循環其實後果是更嚴重跟台灣台灣狀況是台電\n好 聽到\n剛剛說承擔政策台電我來跟董事長分享一個我目前在服務金門跟連江線那這兩個線我想長期董事長一定清楚他們的發電成本都比較高那也因為發電成本高所以長期以來台電都給予非常大的優惠價格給予相關的撥補跟補助可不可以說一下這個現況\n跟委員報告啊就因為機組的關係所以他們每一度電帶平均成本都超過10塊錢那委員這個簡報上面已經清楚的呈現就是這兩個離島大概一年一年要補貼30幾億但是我現在身為要服務離島的委員我很擔心不管是陳雪生委員或是陳玉珍委員他們藍白一起砍掉這個相關的預算然後目前又拒絕任何的可能性我想問一下我們離島居民怎麼辦\n你也沒辦法報告委員我們這樣講台電還有一個很基本的任務就是即使財務困難我們也要充分供電這個充分供電並且確保合理的電價讓離島的居民在享受這個便利發電同時跟台灣本島的使用電價是一樣的不然說白了對不對是的\n好 所以相關政策困難 我想後續我們再來討論也希望大院支持我們的補貼預算我希望我的藍白同事們支持啦好 謝謝董事長 謝謝主席 謝謝好 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:04.706 --> 00:06.830\n好謝謝主席那有請台電董事長謝謝\n\n00:15.558 --> 00:32.548\n是委員長我想問一下二屋戰爭造成能源價格上漲世界其他國家到底都如何應對是不是跟台灣一樣也有政府補貼的部分可不可以請您回答告訴我目前世界各國的趨勢謝謝我據我所了解德國日本法國\n\n00:33.468 --> 00:47.160\n的補助金額都超過台幣五千億是那這個數字是去年跟前年也就是說它是近幾年可參考很重要的數字嗎是好那如果是這樣聽起來補充報告就是不只補貼其實他們也漲價\n\n00:49.802 --> 01:10.749\n又漲價又補貼那他們的補貼竟然聽起來其實比台灣高很多是的那聽起來呢那我問一下這些補貼電價或者是漲電價的國家是不是也都使用核電核電的占比比我們還高嗎日本跟法國確實都使用核電那法國的核電比例非常高\n\n01:12.061 --> 01:26.948\n所以看起來這跟很多人在那邊喊說是錯誤的能源政策有關我認為聽起來沒有關係而是這整個能源價格上漲的問題看起來是全世界的所有國家在追求經濟發展兼顧民生福利的時候大家共同的難題我可以下這個結論嗎\n\n01:28.615 --> 01:43.949\n那個能源價格上漲會造成通膨通膨以後國家的公共支出會更大那其實他們是先漲價通膨以後政府才補貼這個其實造成的惡性循環其實後果是更嚴重跟台灣台灣狀況是台電\n\n01:47.056 --> 01:47.096\n好聽到\n\n02:02.537 --> 02:20.057\n剛剛說承擔政策台電我來跟董事長分享一個我目前在服務金門跟連江線那這兩個線我想長期董事長一定清楚他們的發電成本都比較高那也因為發電成本高所以長期以來台電都給予非常大的優惠價格給予相關的撥補跟補助可不可以說一下這個現況\n\n02:21.633 --> 02:45.563\n跟委員報告啊就因為機組的關係所以他們每一度電帶平均成本都超過10塊錢那委員這個簡報上面已經清楚的呈現就是這兩個離島大概一年一年要補貼30幾億但是我現在身為要服務離島的委員我很擔心不管是陳雪生委員或是陳玉珍委員他們藍白一起砍掉這個相關的預算然後目前又拒絕任何的可能性我想問一下我們離島居民怎麼辦\n\n02:48.393 --> 03:06.458\n你也沒辦法報告委員我們這樣講台電還有一個很基本的任務就是即使財務困難我們也要充分供電這個充分供電並且確保合理的電價讓離島的居民在享受這個便利發電同時跟台灣本島的使用電價是一樣的不然說白了對不對是的\n\n03:08.939 --> 03:19.431\n好所以相關政策困難我想後續我們再來討論也希望大院支持我們的補貼預算我希望我的藍白同事們支持啦好謝謝董事長謝謝主席謝謝好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":4.706,"end":6.83,"text":"好 謝謝主席 那有請台電董事長 謝謝"},{"start":15.558,"end":32.548,"text":"是委員長我想問一下二屋戰爭造成能源價格上漲世界其他國家到底都如何應對是不是跟台灣一樣也有政府補貼的部分可不可以請您回答告訴我目前世界各國的趨勢謝謝我據我所了解德國日本法國"},{"start":33.468,"end":47.16,"text":"的補助金額都超過台幣五千億是那這個數字是去年跟前年也就是說它是近幾年可參考很重要的數字嗎是好那如果是這樣聽起來補充報告就是不只補貼其實他們也漲價"},{"start":49.802,"end":70.749,"text":"又漲價又補貼那他們的補貼竟然聽起來其實比台灣高很多是的那聽起來呢那我問一下這些補貼電價或者是漲電價的國家是不是也都使用核電核電的占比比我們還高嗎日本跟法國確實都使用核電那法國的核電比例非常高"},{"start":72.061,"end":86.948,"text":"所以看起來這跟很多人在那邊喊說是錯誤的能源政策有關我認為聽起來沒有關係而是這整個能源價格上漲的問題看起來是全世界的所有國家在追求經濟發展兼顧民生福利的時候大家共同的難題我可以下這個結論嗎"},{"start":88.615,"end":103.949,"text":"那個能源價格上漲會造成通膨通膨以後國家的公共支出會更大那其實他們是先漲價通膨以後政府才補貼這個其實造成的惡性循環其實後果是更嚴重跟台灣台灣狀況是台電"},{"start":107.056,"end":107.096,"text":"好 聽到"},{"start":122.537,"end":140.057,"text":"剛剛說承擔政策台電我來跟董事長分享一個我目前在服務金門跟連江線那這兩個線我想長期董事長一定清楚他們的發電成本都比較高那也因為發電成本高所以長期以來台電都給予非常大的優惠價格給予相關的撥補跟補助可不可以說一下這個現況"},{"start":141.633,"end":165.563,"text":"跟委員報告啊就因為機組的關係所以他們每一度電帶平均成本都超過10塊錢那委員這個簡報上面已經清楚的呈現就是這兩個離島大概一年一年要補貼30幾億但是我現在身為要服務離島的委員我很擔心不管是陳雪生委員或是陳玉珍委員他們藍白一起砍掉這個相關的預算然後目前又拒絕任何的可能性我想問一下我們離島居民怎麼辦"},{"start":168.393,"end":186.458,"text":"你也沒辦法報告委員我們這樣講台電還有一個很基本的任務就是即使財務困難我們也要充分供電這個充分供電並且確保合理的電價讓離島的居民在享受這個便利發電同時跟台灣本島的使用電價是一樣的不然說白了對不對是的"},{"start":188.939,"end":199.431,"text":"好 所以相關政策困難 我想後續我們再來討論也希望大院支持我們的補貼預算我希望我的藍白同事們支持啦好 謝謝董事長 謝謝主席 謝謝好 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":699,"blocks":[["陳委員培瑜：（11時15分）謝謝主席，有請台電董事長，謝謝。"],["曾董事長文生：委員早！"],["陳委員培瑜：董事長早安！我想問一下，俄烏戰爭造成能源價格上漲，世界其他國家到底都如何應對，是不是跟臺灣一樣，也有政府補貼的部分？可不可以請您回答，告訴我目前世界各國的趨勢？謝謝。"],["曾董事長文生：據我所了解，德國、日本、法國的補助金額都超過臺幣5,000億。"],["陳委員培瑜：是，那這個數字是去年與前年，也就是它是近幾年可參考很重要的數字嗎？"],["曾董事長文生：是。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，如果是這樣，聽起來……"],["曾董事長文生：還要跟委員補充報告，就是不只補貼，其實他們也漲價……"],["陳委員培瑜：又漲價……"],["曾董事長文生：又漲價、又補貼。"],["陳委員培瑜：又補貼，他們的補貼金額聽起來其實比臺灣高很多。"],["曾董事長文生：是的。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，那我問一下，這些補貼電價或者是漲電價的國家是不是也都使用核電、核電的占比比我們還高嗎？"],["曾董事長文生：日本和法國確實都使用核電，且法國的核電比例非常高。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，所以很多人在那邊喊這跟錯誤的能源政策有關，我認為聽起來沒有關係，而是這整個能源價格上漲的問題看起來是全世界所有國家在追求經濟發展兼顧民生福利的時候共同的難題，我可以下這個結論嗎？"],["曾董事長文生：能源價格上漲會造成通膨，通膨以後，國家的公共支出會更大，其實他們是先漲價，通膨以後，政府才補貼，這個造成的惡性循環其實後果是更嚴重；臺灣的狀況是台電沒有漲價，通膨的問題相對和緩，國家的支出也比較少，我們有了歲計賸餘，拿這個歲計賸餘來補貼原來承擔政策的台電，我覺得這個是一個正向循環。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，聽到您剛剛說承擔政策的台電，我來跟董事長分享一個，我目前在服務金門及連江縣，董事長一定清楚，這兩個縣長期發電成本都比較高，也因為發電成本高，所以長期以來台電都給予非常大的優惠價格，給予相關的撥補及補助，可不可以說一下這個現況？"],["曾董事長文生：我跟委員報告，就因為機組的關係，所以他們每一度電大概平均成本都超過10塊錢，委員這個簡報上面已經清楚的呈現，這兩個離島大概一年要補貼三十幾億。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，但是我現在身為要服務離島的委員，我很擔心，不管是陳雪生委員或是陳玉珍委員，他們藍白一起砍掉這個相關的預算，目前又拒絕任何的可能性，我想問一下，我們離島的居民怎麼辦？你也沒辦法？"],["曾董事長文生：報告委員，我們這樣講，台電還有一個很基本的任務，就是即使財務困難，我們也要充分供電……"],["陳委員培瑜：好，充分供電，並且確保合理的電價，讓離島的居民在享受便利發電的同時，跟臺灣本島的使用電價是一樣的，不然不公平，對不對？"],["曾董事長文生：是的。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，所以相關的政策困難後續我們再來討論……"],["曾董事長文生：也希望大院支持我們的補貼預算。"],["陳委員培瑜：我希望我的藍白同事們支持啦！好，謝謝董事長，謝謝主席。"],["主席：謝謝陳培瑜委員。","下一位請林德福委員，林德福委員，林德福委員不在。","下一位請黃國昌委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":66,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-4","speakers":["蔡易餘","邱議瑩","楊瓊瓔","林岱樺","鄭正鈐","張啓楷","陳亭妃","張嘉郡","呂玉玲","賴瑞隆","邱志偉","陳超明","謝衣鳯","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","鍾佳濱","黃健豪","陳培瑜","黃國昌","葉元之","林德福","徐欣瑩"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-03-24"],"gazette_id":"1143101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143101_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"審查：一、行政院函請審議「電業法部分條文修正草案」案；二、本院委員賴士葆等 17 人擬具\n「電業法第七十四條條文修正草案」案；三、本院委員林岱樺等18人擬具「電業法第六條條文修\n正草案」案；四、本院委員楊瓊瓔等20人擬具「電業法第六條條文修正草案」案；五、本院委員\n邱議瑩等16人擬具「電業法第六條條文修正草案」案；六、本院委員邱志偉等20人擬具「電業法\n部分條文修正草案」案；七、本院委員鄭正鈐等19人擬具「電業法第七十四條條文修正草案」案","agenda_id":"1143101_00001"}}}