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416.408, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 416.408, \"end\": 417.749, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"針\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"媒\", \"start\": 417.749, \"end\": 418.209, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"體\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 418.209, \"end\": 418.429, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"嗜\", \"start\": 418.429, \"end\": 419.61, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"讀\"}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 419.61, \"end\": 419.87, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"何\", \"start\": 419.87, \"end\": 420.41, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 420.41, \"end\": 420.95, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"應\"}, {\"word\": \"防\", \"start\": 420.95, \"end\": 421.631, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"範\"}, {\"word\": \"認\"}, {\"word\": \"知\", \"start\": 421.631, \"end\": 421.831, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"作\", \"start\": 421.831, \"end\": 422.671, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"戰\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 422.671, 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00:00:16,830\n在乎的文化政策那当然我会聚焦在这一次的预算被二砍二扇二动文化成了重灾户当然我也期待您说的文化人不是要饭的我们要一起来做打造台湾的文化聚宝盆\n\n2\n00:00:17,651 --> 00:00:41,601\n但是預算就是受害了我們怎麼辦呢我這邊要先跟您談喔最近大家都在講言論自由我放的是我立志從政就是1989年我受到鄭南榮先生他為了爭取台灣百分之百的言論自由他自焚了那時候我十多歲我因此立志我要從政\n\n3\n00:00:42,521 --> 00:01:07,159\n小葉老師您也是在美麗島事件前後您原本在美國就回來台灣您投入台灣的電影新浪潮的運動甚至你投入電視界以後你也推動台灣電視界的文化復興我想您的DNA裡頭是絕對追求百分之百的創作自由的但是呢言論自由有兩種一種是真正的言論自由\n\n4\n00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:31,768\n是宪法层级也是国际的公民与政治国际公约所保护的言论自由但是有一种言论自由是坏的是错的是假的就是假借言论自由来进行仇恨的暴力的战争的鼓吹我想您都非常认同言论自由有两种台湾要捍卫哪一种中配也有两种\n\n5\n00:01:32,779 --> 00:01:53,248\n一種是在台灣但是卻鼓張鼓吹武統濫用台灣的言論自由的呀呀另外一種讓我們可敬的中配就是八旗出版社的復查他在台灣因為出版了一些中國不喜歡的書\n\n6\n00:01:54,932 --> 00:02:04,617\n他剛被判刑你知道嗎在中國毫無正當法律程序毫無公開審判的司法下他被求重刑\n\n7\n00:02:05,939 --> 00:02:26,184\n中配有兩種我們要捍衛跟支持的是複查這一種但是複查的事件當然我知道文化部第一時間想救援但是也尊重家屬的意願但是無論如何作為台灣文化出版文學創作的大家長複查被重判\n\n8\n00:02:27,404 --> 00:02:39,911\n文化部有沒有任何聲援部長有沒有利用您的臉書您也是個文學人文化人我們給予捍衛台灣的自由創作出版自由我們應當發聲我們應當發聲有沒有\n\n9\n00:02:47,004 --> 00:03:03,235\n我在民間的時候我有參與這個聲援但是作為文化部長的時候我覺得我們的官方的聲明不曉得會不會危害到複雜更嚴重的被中共對待所以我理解在當時不明的狀況之下我們是要拿捏\n\n10\n00:03:08,419 --> 00:03:27,049\n但现在因为中共要的就是造成寒蝉效应让台湾的出版自由受到强害这个时候我认为文化部应当有所声援的动作同样的我们有这么多的文化界的人士站出来因为我们的文化预算被恶砍\n\n11\n00:03:28,248 --> 00:03:56,306\n所以文化人的集结发生今天有第三片的这个反罢免对不起这个投入这个我们大罢免的这个我在这里不讲政治我讲文化因为每一天文化人在做的就是批判社会就是关怀政治那同样的杨丽洲导演也受到了暴力的威胁某种程度他的文化表意的自由也受到强害我认为文化部也要声援他力挺他\n\n12\n00:03:57,592 --> 00:03:57,735\n你認為呢\n\n13\n00:03:59,537 --> 00:04:27,910\n委員講到這裡我跟委員講當揚立州出現有人威脅的時候其實我就找內政部長我說他這樣子發生我們得抓到那個威脅他的人然後我們要給他加強維安那內政部長跟我講說他第一次被威脅他就有加強維安那最近公布出來已經抓到那個當初威脅他的人是一個計程車司機所以這一切我想我們國家能做的就是我們也不能干預\n\n14\n00:04:28,410 --> 00:04:50,256\n第一线保护维安就如同刚刚我们要保护复查在中国的时候下落不明他的安全我同意但是必要的时候我认为当台湾的创作自由受到强害的时候作为文化的大家长我们必须捍卫我们的自由在文化人来讲这非常重要下一页为什么要锁定文化预算来恶砍重砍下一页\n\n15\n00:04:51,368 --> 00:05:13,763\n就是如果台灣的文化被噤聲了這個世界上只剩下中國的文化霸權只剩下中國的聲音前夜所以這一次文化預算遭刪除11億遭凍結34億樣樣相向都對準了讓我們的文化被勒住了脖子我要說這是中國的文化霸權\n\n16\n00:05:14,684 --> 00:05:29,411\n他鎖定了文化部門下一頁而除了鎖定文化部門他更鎖定文化部門當中的第一線的發聲的管道例如特定經費從我們的國際交流國際旅費媒體宣傳來下手然後針對機構的部分鎖定了公視還好被民意擋下來\n\n17\n00:05:40,580 --> 00:06:06,288\n沒了公視當初要砍23億沒了公視台灣要看央視嗎台灣plus也被下重手當然我對台灣plus很多的營運還要再努力我也有意見我也要監督但是這都是他們重中之重的鎖定包括中央通訊社也是為台灣文化發生重要的平台還有剛剛一直在被在野黨委員為難的央廣\n\n18\n00:06:09,391 --> 00:06:15,677\n楊廣如果有弊案當然要查我也不容不查跟怠惰但是弊案調查中\n\n19\n00:06:17,348 --> 00:06:44,307\n調查中的案子不要再來政治干預調查了所以這些都是台灣被消音了世界只剩下中國的聲音我認為這一切的作為包括鎖定文化預算還有文化預算當中的特定機構還有央廣不斷的被為難央廣這幾年做了很多過去的央廣做不到的事譬如說強化國際的鏈接譬如說央廣\n\n20\n00:06:46,644 --> 00:07:06,032\n去成立了我們新聞部的這個中國小組我們要向社會傳達正確的華人的聲音還有我們全面針對媒體的嗜讀如何來因應防範認知作戰這都是這幾年央廣的成就不要因為\n\n21\n00:07:07,633 --> 00:07:29,773\n單一弊案打趴央廣這事背後的政治意圖是什麼要給予央廣努力的同仁合理的評價所以從公共電視、台灣Plus中央通訊社乃至於央廣你也認為是不是有被集中鎖定這背後有一個不知名的力量讓我們必須要慎防\n\n22\n00:07:32,301 --> 00:07:47,128\n我覺得獨裁政權最怕就是這種文化跟言論自由跟媒體一個獨裁政權它最需要封鎖的就是這個那我覺得像我們這次被審預算的時候我也發現到為什麼全部是針對這個公共媒體\n\n23\n00:07:48,228 --> 00:08:14,970\n我感謝那個委員剛才講到那個中央央廣其實這幾年央廣也好中央通訊社也好公視基金會也好他們扮演的角色不如不如外面所說的只有那些缺點他們的確也扮演了一個公共媒體的重要性那這次被刪的結果台灣plus他有很多做不對的地方但是他這次的刪是刪掉刪跟動大概有\n\n24\n00:08:15,959 --> 00:08:41,510\n去掉一半他幾乎要關台那他我承認他有很多問題我也還不滿意他在做了五年之後他累積了一些那個成果跟能量也是很難得的但你把他一口氣關掉那等於前面的努力全部白費所以我我認為這次的刪減是非常有針對性是謝謝主席我最後收尾我想\n\n25\n00:08:43,151 --> 00:08:59,268\n文化部門受重傷我長期爭取文化建設從前瞻從無色要催生的文化發展基金我後面沒有時間講了下一頁但是我們如何讓台灣文化的聚寶盆讓文化免於這一次的全面性的災難\n\n26\n00:09:00,689 --> 00:09:19,360\n我們還要有更多想方設法我非常謝謝大家我這幾天陸續找各個私處同仁大家來商量那因為剛剛講到國際傳媒馬上就上路的大阪勢博文化勢博的部分我們因此也受了影響它馬上就到了我們要善用MegaEvent\n\n27\n00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:40,217\n讓台灣的文化成為台灣的NationBrand國家的品牌有沒有可能用各種方式在經費被刪百分之百的每天預算被刪但是文化勢博在大阪又是這麼台日友好的大阪有沒有任何方式強化我們在文化勢博這一次的推廣就在今年\n\n28\n00:09:41,551 --> 00:10:10,400\n就是说预算被大概两千万的所有宣传那个费用在这边全部被删掉那我们现在就想办法透过跟民间组织合作然后透过跟外交部的合作我们一定不会因为预算被删减之后让这个活动我给期许我也持续给监督但我也持续送暖谢谢主席给我时间后面的题目都没办法讲我希望还有文化部门的机会我可以跟大家来讨论谢谢谢谢谢谢委员好谢谢吴思瑶委员\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n289\t16830\t在乎的文化政策那当然我会聚焦在这一次的预算被二砍二扇二动文化成了重灾户当然我也期待您说的文化人不是要饭的我们要一起来做打造台湾的文化聚宝盆\n17651\t41601\t但是預算就是受害了 我們怎麼辦呢我這邊要先跟您談喔最近大家都在講言論自由我放的是我立志從政就是1989年我受到鄭南榮先生他為了爭取台灣百分之百的言論自由 他自焚了那時候我十多歲我因此立志我要從政\n42521\t67159\t小葉老師您也是在美麗島事件前後您原本在美國就回來台灣您投入台灣的電影新浪潮的運動甚至你投入電視界以後你也推動台灣電視界的文化復興我想您的DNA裡頭是絕對追求百分之百的創作自由的但是呢言論自由有兩種一種是真正的言論自由\n68240\t91768\t是宪法层级也是国际的公民与政治国际公约所保护的言论自由但是有一种言论自由是坏的是错的是假的就是假借言论自由来进行仇恨的暴力的战争的鼓吹我想您都非常认同言论自由有两种台湾要捍卫哪一种中配也有两种\n92779\t113248\t一種是在台灣但是卻鼓張鼓吹武統濫用台灣的言論自由的呀呀另外一種讓我們可敬的中配就是八旗出版社的復查他在台灣因為出版了一些中國不喜歡的書\n114932\t124617\t他剛被判刑你知道嗎在中國毫無正當法律程序毫無公開審判的司法下他被求重刑\n125939\t146184\t中配有兩種我們要捍衛跟支持的是複查這一種但是複查的事件當然我知道文化部第一時間想救援但是也尊重家屬的意願但是無論如何作為台灣文化出版文學創作的大家長複查被重判\n147404\t159911\t文化部有沒有任何聲援部長有沒有利用您的臉書您也是個文學人文化人我們給予捍衛台灣的自由創作出版自由我們應當發聲我們應當發聲有沒有\n167004\t183235\t我在民間的時候我有參與這個聲援但是作為文化部長的時候 我覺得我們的官方的聲明不曉得會不會危害到複雜 更嚴重的被中共對待所以我理解在當時不明的狀況之下 我們是要拿捏\n188419\t207049\t但现在因为中共要的就是造成寒蝉效应让台湾的出版自由受到强害这个时候我认为文化部应当有所声援的动作同样的我们有这么多的文化界的人士站出来因为我们的文化预算被恶砍\n208248\t236306\t所以文化人的集结发生今天有第三片的这个反罢免对不起这个投入这个我们大罢免的这个我在这里不讲政治我讲文化因为每一天文化人在做的就是批判社会就是关怀政治那同样的杨丽洲导演也受到了暴力的威胁某种程度他的文化表意的自由也受到强害我认为文化部也要声援他力挺他\n237592\t237735\t你認為呢\n239537\t267910\t委員講到這裡我跟委員講當揚立州出現有人威脅的時候其實我就找內政部長我說他這樣子發生我們得抓到那個威脅他的人然後我們要給他加強維安那內政部長跟我講說他第一次被威脅他就有加強維安那最近公布出來已經抓到那個當初威脅他的人是一個計程車司機所以這一切我想我們國家能做的就是我們也不能干預\n268410\t290256\t第一线保护维安就如同刚刚我们要保护复查在中国的时候下落不明他的安全我同意但是必要的时候我认为当台湾的创作自由受到强害的时候作为文化的大家长我们必须捍卫我们的自由在文化人来讲这非常重要下一页为什么要锁定文化预算来恶砍重砍下一页\n291368\t313763\t就是如果台灣的文化被噤聲了這個世界上只剩下中國的文化霸權只剩下中國的聲音前夜所以這一次文化預算遭刪除11億遭凍結34億樣樣相向都對準了讓我們的文化被勒住了脖子我要說這是中國的文化霸權\n314684\t329411\t他鎖定了文化部門下一頁而除了鎖定文化部門他更鎖定文化部門當中的第一線的發聲的管道例如特定經費從我們的國際交流國際旅費媒體宣傳來下手然後針對機構的部分鎖定了公視還好被民意擋下來\n340580\t366288\t沒了公視 當初要砍23億沒了公視 台灣要看央視嗎台灣plus也被下重手當然我對台灣plus很多的營運還要再努力我也有意見 我也要監督但是這都是他們重中之重的鎖定包括中央通訊社也是為台灣文化發生重要的平台還有剛剛一直在被在野黨委員為難的央廣\n369391\t375677\t楊廣如果有弊案當然要查我也不容不查跟怠惰但是弊案調查中\n377348\t404307\t調查中的案子不要再來政治干預調查了所以這些都是台灣被消音了世界只剩下中國的聲音我認為這一切的作為包括鎖定文化預算還有文化預算當中的特定機構還有央廣不斷的被為難央廣這幾年做了很多過去的央廣做不到的事譬如說強化國際的鏈接譬如說央廣\n406644\t426032\t去成立了我們新聞部的這個中國小組我們要向社會傳達正確的華人的聲音還有我們全面針對媒體的嗜讀如何來因應防範認知作戰這都是這幾年央廣的成就不要因為\n427633\t449773\t單一弊案打趴央廣這事背後的政治意圖是什麼要給予央廣努力的同仁合理的評價所以從公共電視、台灣Plus中央通訊社乃至於央廣你也認為是不是有被集中鎖定這背後有一個不知名的力量讓我們必須要慎防\n452301\t467128\t我覺得獨裁政權最怕就是這種文化跟言論自由跟媒體一個獨裁政權它最需要封鎖的就是這個那我覺得像我們這次被審預算的時候我也發現到為什麼全部是針對這個公共媒體\n468228\t494970\t我感謝那個委員剛才講到那個中央央廣其實這幾年央廣也好中央通訊社也好公視基金會也好他們扮演的角色不如不如外面所說的只有那些缺點他們的確也扮演了一個公共媒體的重要性那這次被刪的結果台灣plus他有很多做不對的地方但是他這次的刪是刪掉刪跟動大概有\n495959\t521510\t去掉一半他幾乎要關台那他我承認他有很多問題我也還不滿意他在做了五年之後他累積了一些那個成果跟能量也是很難得的但你把他一口氣關掉那等於前面的努力全部白費所以我我認為這次的刪減是非常有針對性是謝謝主席我最後收尾我想\n523151\t539268\t文化部門受重傷 我長期爭取文化建設從前瞻 從無色要催生的文化發展基金我後面沒有時間講了 下一頁但是我們如何讓台灣文化的聚寶盆讓文化免於這一次的全面性的災難\n540689\t559360\t我們還要有更多想方設法我非常謝謝大家我這幾天陸續找各個私處同仁大家來商量那因為剛剛講到國際傳媒馬上就上路的大阪勢博文化勢博的部分我們因此也受了影響它馬上就到了我們要善用Mega Event\n560240\t580217\t讓台灣的文化成為台灣的Nation Brand國家的品牌有沒有可能用各種方式在經費被刪百分之百的每天預算被刪但是文化勢博在大阪又是這麼台日友好的大阪有沒有任何方式強化我們在文化勢博這一次的推廣就在今年\n581551\t610400\t就是说预算被大概两千万的所有宣传那个费用在这边全部被删掉那我们现在就想办法透过跟民间组织合作然后透过跟外交部的合作我们一定不会因为预算被删减之后让这个活动我给期许我也持续给监督但我也持续送暖谢谢主席给我时间后面的题目都没办法讲我希望还有文化部门的机会我可以跟大家来讨论谢谢谢谢 谢谢委员好 谢谢吴思瑶委员\n","txt":"在乎的文化政策那当然我会聚焦在这一次的预算被二砍二扇二动文化成了重灾户当然我也期待您说的文化人不是要饭的我们要一起来做打造台湾的文化聚宝盆\n但是預算就是受害了 我們怎麼辦呢我這邊要先跟您談喔最近大家都在講言論自由我放的是我立志從政就是1989年我受到鄭南榮先生他為了爭取台灣百分之百的言論自由 他自焚了那時候我十多歲我因此立志我要從政\n小葉老師您也是在美麗島事件前後您原本在美國就回來台灣您投入台灣的電影新浪潮的運動甚至你投入電視界以後你也推動台灣電視界的文化復興我想您的DNA裡頭是絕對追求百分之百的創作自由的但是呢言論自由有兩種一種是真正的言論自由\n是宪法层级也是国际的公民与政治国际公约所保护的言论自由但是有一种言论自由是坏的是错的是假的就是假借言论自由来进行仇恨的暴力的战争的鼓吹我想您都非常认同言论自由有两种台湾要捍卫哪一种中配也有两种\n一種是在台灣但是卻鼓張鼓吹武統濫用台灣的言論自由的呀呀另外一種讓我們可敬的中配就是八旗出版社的復查他在台灣因為出版了一些中國不喜歡的書\n他剛被判刑你知道嗎在中國毫無正當法律程序毫無公開審判的司法下他被求重刑\n中配有兩種我們要捍衛跟支持的是複查這一種但是複查的事件當然我知道文化部第一時間想救援但是也尊重家屬的意願但是無論如何作為台灣文化出版文學創作的大家長複查被重判\n文化部有沒有任何聲援部長有沒有利用您的臉書您也是個文學人文化人我們給予捍衛台灣的自由創作出版自由我們應當發聲我們應當發聲有沒有\n我在民間的時候我有參與這個聲援但是作為文化部長的時候 我覺得我們的官方的聲明不曉得會不會危害到複雜 更嚴重的被中共對待所以我理解在當時不明的狀況之下 我們是要拿捏\n但现在因为中共要的就是造成寒蝉效应让台湾的出版自由受到强害这个时候我认为文化部应当有所声援的动作同样的我们有这么多的文化界的人士站出来因为我们的文化预算被恶砍\n所以文化人的集结发生今天有第三片的这个反罢免对不起这个投入这个我们大罢免的这个我在这里不讲政治我讲文化因为每一天文化人在做的就是批判社会就是关怀政治那同样的杨丽洲导演也受到了暴力的威胁某种程度他的文化表意的自由也受到强害我认为文化部也要声援他力挺他\n你認為呢\n委員講到這裡我跟委員講當揚立州出現有人威脅的時候其實我就找內政部長我說他這樣子發生我們得抓到那個威脅他的人然後我們要給他加強維安那內政部長跟我講說他第一次被威脅他就有加強維安那最近公布出來已經抓到那個當初威脅他的人是一個計程車司機所以這一切我想我們國家能做的就是我們也不能干預\n第一线保护维安就如同刚刚我们要保护复查在中国的时候下落不明他的安全我同意但是必要的时候我认为当台湾的创作自由受到强害的时候作为文化的大家长我们必须捍卫我们的自由在文化人来讲这非常重要下一页为什么要锁定文化预算来恶砍重砍下一页\n就是如果台灣的文化被噤聲了這個世界上只剩下中國的文化霸權只剩下中國的聲音前夜所以這一次文化預算遭刪除11億遭凍結34億樣樣相向都對準了讓我們的文化被勒住了脖子我要說這是中國的文化霸權\n他鎖定了文化部門下一頁而除了鎖定文化部門他更鎖定文化部門當中的第一線的發聲的管道例如特定經費從我們的國際交流國際旅費媒體宣傳來下手然後針對機構的部分鎖定了公視還好被民意擋下來\n沒了公視 當初要砍23億沒了公視 台灣要看央視嗎台灣plus也被下重手當然我對台灣plus很多的營運還要再努力我也有意見 我也要監督但是這都是他們重中之重的鎖定包括中央通訊社也是為台灣文化發生重要的平台還有剛剛一直在被在野黨委員為難的央廣\n楊廣如果有弊案當然要查我也不容不查跟怠惰但是弊案調查中\n調查中的案子不要再來政治干預調查了所以這些都是台灣被消音了世界只剩下中國的聲音我認為這一切的作為包括鎖定文化預算還有文化預算當中的特定機構還有央廣不斷的被為難央廣這幾年做了很多過去的央廣做不到的事譬如說強化國際的鏈接譬如說央廣\n去成立了我們新聞部的這個中國小組我們要向社會傳達正確的華人的聲音還有我們全面針對媒體的嗜讀如何來因應防範認知作戰這都是這幾年央廣的成就不要因為\n單一弊案打趴央廣這事背後的政治意圖是什麼要給予央廣努力的同仁合理的評價所以從公共電視、台灣Plus中央通訊社乃至於央廣你也認為是不是有被集中鎖定這背後有一個不知名的力量讓我們必須要慎防\n我覺得獨裁政權最怕就是這種文化跟言論自由跟媒體一個獨裁政權它最需要封鎖的就是這個那我覺得像我們這次被審預算的時候我也發現到為什麼全部是針對這個公共媒體\n我感謝那個委員剛才講到那個中央央廣其實這幾年央廣也好中央通訊社也好公視基金會也好他們扮演的角色不如不如外面所說的只有那些缺點他們的確也扮演了一個公共媒體的重要性那這次被刪的結果台灣plus他有很多做不對的地方但是他這次的刪是刪掉刪跟動大概有\n去掉一半他幾乎要關台那他我承認他有很多問題我也還不滿意他在做了五年之後他累積了一些那個成果跟能量也是很難得的但你把他一口氣關掉那等於前面的努力全部白費所以我我認為這次的刪減是非常有針對性是謝謝主席我最後收尾我想\n文化部門受重傷 我長期爭取文化建設從前瞻 從無色要催生的文化發展基金我後面沒有時間講了 下一頁但是我們如何讓台灣文化的聚寶盆讓文化免於這一次的全面性的災難\n我們還要有更多想方設法我非常謝謝大家我這幾天陸續找各個私處同仁大家來商量那因為剛剛講到國際傳媒馬上就上路的大阪勢博文化勢博的部分我們因此也受了影響它馬上就到了我們要善用Mega Event\n讓台灣的文化成為台灣的Nation Brand國家的品牌有沒有可能用各種方式在經費被刪百分之百的每天預算被刪但是文化勢博在大阪又是這麼台日友好的大阪有沒有任何方式強化我們在文化勢博這一次的推廣就在今年\n就是说预算被大概两千万的所有宣传那个费用在这边全部被删掉那我们现在就想办法透过跟民间组织合作然后透过跟外交部的合作我们一定不会因为预算被删减之后让这个活动我给期许我也持续给监督但我也持续送暖谢谢主席给我时间后面的题目都没办法讲我希望还有文化部门的机会我可以跟大家来讨论谢谢谢谢 谢谢委员好 谢谢吴思瑶委员\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.289 --> 00:16.830\n在乎的文化政策那当然我会聚焦在这一次的预算被二砍二扇二动文化成了重灾户当然我也期待您说的文化人不是要饭的我们要一起来做打造台湾的文化聚宝盆\n\n00:17.651 --> 00:41.601\n但是預算就是受害了我們怎麼辦呢我這邊要先跟您談喔最近大家都在講言論自由我放的是我立志從政就是1989年我受到鄭南榮先生他為了爭取台灣百分之百的言論自由他自焚了那時候我十多歲我因此立志我要從政\n\n00:42.521 --> 01:07.159\n小葉老師您也是在美麗島事件前後您原本在美國就回來台灣您投入台灣的電影新浪潮的運動甚至你投入電視界以後你也推動台灣電視界的文化復興我想您的DNA裡頭是絕對追求百分之百的創作自由的但是呢言論自由有兩種一種是真正的言論自由\n\n01:08.240 --> 01:31.768\n是宪法层级也是国际的公民与政治国际公约所保护的言论自由但是有一种言论自由是坏的是错的是假的就是假借言论自由来进行仇恨的暴力的战争的鼓吹我想您都非常认同言论自由有两种台湾要捍卫哪一种中配也有两种\n\n01:32.779 --> 01:53.248\n一種是在台灣但是卻鼓張鼓吹武統濫用台灣的言論自由的呀呀另外一種讓我們可敬的中配就是八旗出版社的復查他在台灣因為出版了一些中國不喜歡的書\n\n01:54.932 --> 02:04.617\n他剛被判刑你知道嗎在中國毫無正當法律程序毫無公開審判的司法下他被求重刑\n\n02:05.939 --> 02:26.184\n中配有兩種我們要捍衛跟支持的是複查這一種但是複查的事件當然我知道文化部第一時間想救援但是也尊重家屬的意願但是無論如何作為台灣文化出版文學創作的大家長複查被重判\n\n02:27.404 --> 02:39.911\n文化部有沒有任何聲援部長有沒有利用您的臉書您也是個文學人文化人我們給予捍衛台灣的自由創作出版自由我們應當發聲我們應當發聲有沒有\n\n02:47.004 --> 03:03.235\n我在民間的時候我有參與這個聲援但是作為文化部長的時候我覺得我們的官方的聲明不曉得會不會危害到複雜更嚴重的被中共對待所以我理解在當時不明的狀況之下我們是要拿捏\n\n03:08.419 --> 03:27.049\n但现在因为中共要的就是造成寒蝉效应让台湾的出版自由受到强害这个时候我认为文化部应当有所声援的动作同样的我们有这么多的文化界的人士站出来因为我们的文化预算被恶砍\n\n03:28.248 --> 03:56.306\n所以文化人的集结发生今天有第三片的这个反罢免对不起这个投入这个我们大罢免的这个我在这里不讲政治我讲文化因为每一天文化人在做的就是批判社会就是关怀政治那同样的杨丽洲导演也受到了暴力的威胁某种程度他的文化表意的自由也受到强害我认为文化部也要声援他力挺他\n\n03:57.592 --> 03:57.735\n你認為呢\n\n03:59.537 --> 04:27.910\n委員講到這裡我跟委員講當揚立州出現有人威脅的時候其實我就找內政部長我說他這樣子發生我們得抓到那個威脅他的人然後我們要給他加強維安那內政部長跟我講說他第一次被威脅他就有加強維安那最近公布出來已經抓到那個當初威脅他的人是一個計程車司機所以這一切我想我們國家能做的就是我們也不能干預\n\n04:28.410 --> 04:50.256\n第一线保护维安就如同刚刚我们要保护复查在中国的时候下落不明他的安全我同意但是必要的时候我认为当台湾的创作自由受到强害的时候作为文化的大家长我们必须捍卫我们的自由在文化人来讲这非常重要下一页为什么要锁定文化预算来恶砍重砍下一页\n\n04:51.368 --> 05:13.763\n就是如果台灣的文化被噤聲了這個世界上只剩下中國的文化霸權只剩下中國的聲音前夜所以這一次文化預算遭刪除11億遭凍結34億樣樣相向都對準了讓我們的文化被勒住了脖子我要說這是中國的文化霸權\n\n05:14.684 --> 05:29.411\n他鎖定了文化部門下一頁而除了鎖定文化部門他更鎖定文化部門當中的第一線的發聲的管道例如特定經費從我們的國際交流國際旅費媒體宣傳來下手然後針對機構的部分鎖定了公視還好被民意擋下來\n\n05:40.580 --> 06:06.288\n沒了公視當初要砍23億沒了公視台灣要看央視嗎台灣plus也被下重手當然我對台灣plus很多的營運還要再努力我也有意見我也要監督但是這都是他們重中之重的鎖定包括中央通訊社也是為台灣文化發生重要的平台還有剛剛一直在被在野黨委員為難的央廣\n\n06:09.391 --> 06:15.677\n楊廣如果有弊案當然要查我也不容不查跟怠惰但是弊案調查中\n\n06:17.348 --> 06:44.307\n調查中的案子不要再來政治干預調查了所以這些都是台灣被消音了世界只剩下中國的聲音我認為這一切的作為包括鎖定文化預算還有文化預算當中的特定機構還有央廣不斷的被為難央廣這幾年做了很多過去的央廣做不到的事譬如說強化國際的鏈接譬如說央廣\n\n06:46.644 --> 07:06.032\n去成立了我們新聞部的這個中國小組我們要向社會傳達正確的華人的聲音還有我們全面針對媒體的嗜讀如何來因應防範認知作戰這都是這幾年央廣的成就不要因為\n\n07:07.633 --> 07:29.773\n單一弊案打趴央廣這事背後的政治意圖是什麼要給予央廣努力的同仁合理的評價所以從公共電視、台灣Plus中央通訊社乃至於央廣你也認為是不是有被集中鎖定這背後有一個不知名的力量讓我們必須要慎防\n\n07:32.301 --> 07:47.128\n我覺得獨裁政權最怕就是這種文化跟言論自由跟媒體一個獨裁政權它最需要封鎖的就是這個那我覺得像我們這次被審預算的時候我也發現到為什麼全部是針對這個公共媒體\n\n07:48.228 --> 08:14.970\n我感謝那個委員剛才講到那個中央央廣其實這幾年央廣也好中央通訊社也好公視基金會也好他們扮演的角色不如不如外面所說的只有那些缺點他們的確也扮演了一個公共媒體的重要性那這次被刪的結果台灣plus他有很多做不對的地方但是他這次的刪是刪掉刪跟動大概有\n\n08:15.959 --> 08:41.510\n去掉一半他幾乎要關台那他我承認他有很多問題我也還不滿意他在做了五年之後他累積了一些那個成果跟能量也是很難得的但你把他一口氣關掉那等於前面的努力全部白費所以我我認為這次的刪減是非常有針對性是謝謝主席我最後收尾我想\n\n08:43.151 --> 08:59.268\n文化部門受重傷我長期爭取文化建設從前瞻從無色要催生的文化發展基金我後面沒有時間講了下一頁但是我們如何讓台灣文化的聚寶盆讓文化免於這一次的全面性的災難\n\n09:00.689 --> 09:19.360\n我們還要有更多想方設法我非常謝謝大家我這幾天陸續找各個私處同仁大家來商量那因為剛剛講到國際傳媒馬上就上路的大阪勢博文化勢博的部分我們因此也受了影響它馬上就到了我們要善用MegaEvent\n\n09:20.240 --> 09:40.217\n讓台灣的文化成為台灣的NationBrand國家的品牌有沒有可能用各種方式在經費被刪百分之百的每天預算被刪但是文化勢博在大阪又是這麼台日友好的大阪有沒有任何方式強化我們在文化勢博這一次的推廣就在今年\n\n09:41.551 --> 10:10.400\n就是说预算被大概两千万的所有宣传那个费用在这边全部被删掉那我们现在就想办法透过跟民间组织合作然后透过跟外交部的合作我们一定不会因为预算被删减之后让这个活动我给期许我也持续给监督但我也持续送暖谢谢主席给我时间后面的题目都没办法讲我希望还有文化部门的机会我可以跟大家来讨论谢谢谢谢谢谢委员好谢谢吴思瑶委员\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.289,"end":16.83,"text":"在乎的文化政策那当然我会聚焦在这一次的预算被二砍二扇二动文化成了重灾户当然我也期待您说的文化人不是要饭的我们要一起来做打造台湾的文化聚宝盆"},{"start":17.651,"end":41.601,"text":"但是預算就是受害了 我們怎麼辦呢我這邊要先跟您談喔最近大家都在講言論自由我放的是我立志從政就是1989年我受到鄭南榮先生他為了爭取台灣百分之百的言論自由 他自焚了那時候我十多歲我因此立志我要從政"},{"start":42.521,"end":67.159,"text":"小葉老師您也是在美麗島事件前後您原本在美國就回來台灣您投入台灣的電影新浪潮的運動甚至你投入電視界以後你也推動台灣電視界的文化復興我想您的DNA裡頭是絕對追求百分之百的創作自由的但是呢言論自由有兩種一種是真正的言論自由"},{"start":68.24,"end":91.768,"text":"是宪法层级也是国际的公民与政治国际公约所保护的言论自由但是有一种言论自由是坏的是错的是假的就是假借言论自由来进行仇恨的暴力的战争的鼓吹我想您都非常认同言论自由有两种台湾要捍卫哪一种中配也有两种"},{"start":92.779,"end":113.248,"text":"一種是在台灣但是卻鼓張鼓吹武統濫用台灣的言論自由的呀呀另外一種讓我們可敬的中配就是八旗出版社的復查他在台灣因為出版了一些中國不喜歡的書"},{"start":114.932,"end":124.617,"text":"他剛被判刑你知道嗎在中國毫無正當法律程序毫無公開審判的司法下他被求重刑"},{"start":125.939,"end":146.184,"text":"中配有兩種我們要捍衛跟支持的是複查這一種但是複查的事件當然我知道文化部第一時間想救援但是也尊重家屬的意願但是無論如何作為台灣文化出版文學創作的大家長複查被重判"},{"start":147.404,"end":159.911,"text":"文化部有沒有任何聲援部長有沒有利用您的臉書您也是個文學人文化人我們給予捍衛台灣的自由創作出版自由我們應當發聲我們應當發聲有沒有"},{"start":167.004,"end":183.235,"text":"我在民間的時候我有參與這個聲援但是作為文化部長的時候 我覺得我們的官方的聲明不曉得會不會危害到複雜 更嚴重的被中共對待所以我理解在當時不明的狀況之下 我們是要拿捏"},{"start":188.419,"end":207.049,"text":"但现在因为中共要的就是造成寒蝉效应让台湾的出版自由受到强害这个时候我认为文化部应当有所声援的动作同样的我们有这么多的文化界的人士站出来因为我们的文化预算被恶砍"},{"start":208.248,"end":236.306,"text":"所以文化人的集结发生今天有第三片的这个反罢免对不起这个投入这个我们大罢免的这个我在这里不讲政治我讲文化因为每一天文化人在做的就是批判社会就是关怀政治那同样的杨丽洲导演也受到了暴力的威胁某种程度他的文化表意的自由也受到强害我认为文化部也要声援他力挺他"},{"start":237.592,"end":237.735,"text":"你認為呢"},{"start":239.537,"end":267.91,"text":"委員講到這裡我跟委員講當揚立州出現有人威脅的時候其實我就找內政部長我說他這樣子發生我們得抓到那個威脅他的人然後我們要給他加強維安那內政部長跟我講說他第一次被威脅他就有加強維安那最近公布出來已經抓到那個當初威脅他的人是一個計程車司機所以這一切我想我們國家能做的就是我們也不能干預"},{"start":268.41,"end":290.256,"text":"第一线保护维安就如同刚刚我们要保护复查在中国的时候下落不明他的安全我同意但是必要的时候我认为当台湾的创作自由受到强害的时候作为文化的大家长我们必须捍卫我们的自由在文化人来讲这非常重要下一页为什么要锁定文化预算来恶砍重砍下一页"},{"start":291.368,"end":313.763,"text":"就是如果台灣的文化被噤聲了這個世界上只剩下中國的文化霸權只剩下中國的聲音前夜所以這一次文化預算遭刪除11億遭凍結34億樣樣相向都對準了讓我們的文化被勒住了脖子我要說這是中國的文化霸權"},{"start":314.684,"end":329.411,"text":"他鎖定了文化部門下一頁而除了鎖定文化部門他更鎖定文化部門當中的第一線的發聲的管道例如特定經費從我們的國際交流國際旅費媒體宣傳來下手然後針對機構的部分鎖定了公視還好被民意擋下來"},{"start":340.58,"end":366.288,"text":"沒了公視 當初要砍23億沒了公視 台灣要看央視嗎台灣plus也被下重手當然我對台灣plus很多的營運還要再努力我也有意見 我也要監督但是這都是他們重中之重的鎖定包括中央通訊社也是為台灣文化發生重要的平台還有剛剛一直在被在野黨委員為難的央廣"},{"start":369.391,"end":375.677,"text":"楊廣如果有弊案當然要查我也不容不查跟怠惰但是弊案調查中"},{"start":377.348,"end":404.307,"text":"調查中的案子不要再來政治干預調查了所以這些都是台灣被消音了世界只剩下中國的聲音我認為這一切的作為包括鎖定文化預算還有文化預算當中的特定機構還有央廣不斷的被為難央廣這幾年做了很多過去的央廣做不到的事譬如說強化國際的鏈接譬如說央廣"},{"start":406.644,"end":426.032,"text":"去成立了我們新聞部的這個中國小組我們要向社會傳達正確的華人的聲音還有我們全面針對媒體的嗜讀如何來因應防範認知作戰這都是這幾年央廣的成就不要因為"},{"start":427.633,"end":449.773,"text":"單一弊案打趴央廣這事背後的政治意圖是什麼要給予央廣努力的同仁合理的評價所以從公共電視、台灣Plus中央通訊社乃至於央廣你也認為是不是有被集中鎖定這背後有一個不知名的力量讓我們必須要慎防"},{"start":452.301,"end":467.128,"text":"我覺得獨裁政權最怕就是這種文化跟言論自由跟媒體一個獨裁政權它最需要封鎖的就是這個那我覺得像我們這次被審預算的時候我也發現到為什麼全部是針對這個公共媒體"},{"start":468.228,"end":494.97,"text":"我感謝那個委員剛才講到那個中央央廣其實這幾年央廣也好中央通訊社也好公視基金會也好他們扮演的角色不如不如外面所說的只有那些缺點他們的確也扮演了一個公共媒體的重要性那這次被刪的結果台灣plus他有很多做不對的地方但是他這次的刪是刪掉刪跟動大概有"},{"start":495.959,"end":521.51,"text":"去掉一半他幾乎要關台那他我承認他有很多問題我也還不滿意他在做了五年之後他累積了一些那個成果跟能量也是很難得的但你把他一口氣關掉那等於前面的努力全部白費所以我我認為這次的刪減是非常有針對性是謝謝主席我最後收尾我想"},{"start":523.151,"end":539.268,"text":"文化部門受重傷 我長期爭取文化建設從前瞻 從無色要催生的文化發展基金我後面沒有時間講了 下一頁但是我們如何讓台灣文化的聚寶盆讓文化免於這一次的全面性的災難"},{"start":540.689,"end":559.36,"text":"我們還要有更多想方設法我非常謝謝大家我這幾天陸續找各個私處同仁大家來商量那因為剛剛講到國際傳媒馬上就上路的大阪勢博文化勢博的部分我們因此也受了影響它馬上就到了我們要善用Mega Event"},{"start":560.24,"end":580.217,"text":"讓台灣的文化成為台灣的Nation Brand國家的品牌有沒有可能用各種方式在經費被刪百分之百的每天預算被刪但是文化勢博在大阪又是這麼台日友好的大阪有沒有任何方式強化我們在文化勢博這一次的推廣就在今年"},{"start":581.551,"end":610.4,"text":"就是说预算被大概两千万的所有宣传那个费用在这边全部被删掉那我们现在就想办法透过跟民间组织合作然后透过跟外交部的合作我们一定不会因为预算被删减之后让这个活动我给期许我也持续给监督但我也持续送暖谢谢主席给我时间后面的题目都没办法讲我希望还有文化部门的机会我可以跟大家来讨论谢谢谢谢 谢谢委员好 谢谢吴思瑶委员"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":846,"blocks":[["吳委員思瑤：（12時44分）謝謝主席。請部長。"],["主席：有請部長。"],["李部長遠：吳委員好。"],["吳委員思瑤：部長好。很開心回到教文會來關心我最在乎的文化政策，我會聚焦在這次的預算被惡砍、惡刪、惡凍，讓文化成了重災戶，當然，我也期待您說的──文化人不是要飯的，我們要一起來打造臺灣的文化聚寶盆；但預算就是受害了，我們怎麼辦呢？","我在這邊要先跟您談，最近大家都在講言論自由，這張圖片是1989年鄭南榕先生為了爭取臺灣百分之百的言論自由，他自焚了，那時候我十多歲，從此立志要從政。小野老師原本在美國，您也是在美麗島事件前後回來臺灣，您投入臺灣電影新浪潮的運動，在投入電視界以後，您也推動臺灣電視界的文化復興，我想您的DNA裡頭是絕對追求百分之百的創作自由。但是言論自由有兩種，一種是真正的言論自由，是憲法層級，也是國際的公民與政治權利、國際公約所保護的言論自由；另有一種言論自由是壞的，是錯的、假的，就是假借言論自由來進行仇恨的、暴力的、戰爭的鼓吹。我想您非常認同言論自由有兩種，臺灣要捍衛哪一種？","中配也有兩種，一種是在臺灣卻鼓吹武統，濫用臺灣言論自由的亞亞；另外一種是讓我們敬佩的中配，就是八旗出版社的富察，他因為在臺灣出版了一些中國不喜歡的書籍，剛被判刑，在中國毫無正當法律程序，毫無公開審判的司法下，他被求重刑。中配有兩種，我們要捍衛跟支持的是富察這一種。對於富察事件，我知道文化部第一時間想救援，但也尊重家屬的意願。但是無論如何，作為臺灣文化出版、文學創作的大家長，對於富察被重判，文化部有沒有任何聲援？部長也是個文學人、文化人，有沒有利用您的臉書，我們來捍衛臺灣的自由創作、出版自由，我們應當發聲！部長，有沒有？"],["李部長遠：我在民間的時候有參與這個聲援……"],["吳委員思瑤：是。"],["李部長遠：但是作為文化部長的時候，我不曉得我們官方的聲明會不會危害到富察，讓他受到中共更嚴重的判刑……"],["吳委員思瑤：他現在已經被判，所以我理解，在他狀況不明的情況下，我們需要拿捏，但現在中共要的就是造成寒蟬效應，讓臺灣的出版自由受到戕害。我認為文化部這個時候應當有聲援的動作。"],["李部長遠：是。"],["吳委員思瑤：同樣的，我們有這麼多文化界的人士站出來，因為我們的文化預算被惡砍，所以文化人集結發聲，今天有第三片投入這個大罷免的這個……我在這裡不講政治，我講文化，因為文化人每一天在做的就是批判社會，關懷政治。同樣的，楊力州導演也受到暴力威脅，他的文化表意自由也受到某種程度的戕害，我認為文化部也要聲援他，力挺他。你認為呢？"],["李部長遠：我跟委員講，當楊力州出現被人威脅的時候，其實我就找內政部長，我說他有這樣的事情發生，我們得抓到那個威脅他的人，我們要給他加強維安……"],["吳委員思瑤：實質的幫助。"],["李部長遠：內政部長跟我說，他第一次被威脅，就有對他加強維安，最近公布出來已經抓到當初威脅他的人是一個計程車司機。所以我想我們國家能做的，就是我們也不能干預……"],["吳委員思瑤：當然第一線保護維安，就如同剛剛我們要保護富察在中國下落不明時他的安全，這個我同意；但我認為當臺灣的創作自由受到戕害的時候，作為文化的大家長，我們必須捍衛我們的自由，在文化人來講，這非常重要。","為什麼要鎖定文化預算來惡砍、重砍？就是如果臺灣的文化被噤聲了，這個世界上只剩下中國的文化霸權，只剩下中國的聲音，所以這一次文化預算遭刪除11億，遭凍結34億，樣樣項項都對準了讓我們的文化被勒住脖子，我要說這是中國的文化霸權，他們鎖定了文化部門！除了鎖定文化部門，他們更鎖定文化部門當中第一線的發聲管道，例如特定經費從我們的國際交流、國際旅費、媒體宣傳來下手；針對機構的部分，鎖定了公視，當初要砍23億，還好被民意擋下來。沒了公視，臺灣要看央視嗎？TaiwanPlus也被下重手，當然我對TaiwanPlus很多的營運還要再努力也有意見，也要監督；但這些都是他們重中之重的鎖定，包括中央通訊社也是為臺灣文化發聲重要的平台，還有剛剛一直被在野黨委員為難的央廣。央廣如果有弊案，當然要查，我也不容不查跟怠惰；但是弊案調查中的案子，不要讓政治干預調查，所以這些都是臺灣被消音了，那麼世界就只剩下中國的聲音。我認為這一切的作為，包括鎖定文化預算，還有文化預算中的特定機構以及央廣不斷地被為難。央廣這幾年做了很多過去做不到的事情，譬如強化國際的鏈結；在新聞部成立中國小組，向社會傳達正確的華人聲音；還有全面針對媒體的識讀，如何來因應防範認知作戰，這些都是央廣這幾年的成就，不要因為單一弊案打趴央廣。這背後的政治意圖是什麼？要給予央廣努力的同仁合理的評價！所以，從公共電視、TaiwanPlus、中央通訊社，乃至於央廣，你是不是也認為有被集中鎖定？這背後有一個不知名的力量，讓我們必須要慎防。"],["李部長遠：我覺得獨裁政權最怕的就是這種文化跟言論自由跟媒體，一個獨裁政權最需要封鎖的就是這個。像我們這次預算在審查的時候，我也發現到為什麼全部是針對這個公共媒體；感謝委員剛才提到了央廣，其實這幾年來，央廣也好，中央通訊社也好、公視基金會也好，他們扮演的角色不是如外面所說的只有那些缺點，他們的確也扮演了一個公共媒體的重要性。TaiwanPlus有很多做不對的地方，但是這次預算刪掉的跟凍結的，大概就去掉一半，它幾乎就要關台；我承認它有很多問題……"],["吳委員思瑤：對，44%。我也還不滿意……"],["李部長遠：它在做了五年之後，所累積的一些成果跟能量，也是很難得的，如果把它一口氣關掉，等於前面的努力全部白費。所以我認為這次的刪減是非常有針對性。"],["吳委員思瑤：謝謝主席，我最後收尾。我想文化部門受重傷，我長期爭取文化建設，從前瞻、從吳思瑤催生的文化發展基金，要如何讓臺灣文化的聚寶盆，讓文化免於這一次全面性的災難，我們還需要更多的想方設法。我非常謝謝大家，這幾天也陸續找各個司處同仁，大家來商量，因為剛剛講到國際傳媒，馬上就要上路的大阪文化世博，這個部分我們也受到影響，所以我們要善用Mega Event讓臺灣的文化成為臺灣的national brand，有沒有可能用各種方式，在經費被刪，百分之百的媒宣預算被刪，但是文化世博將在臺日這麼友好的大阪舉辦，有沒有任何方式，可以強化我們今年在文化世博的推廣？"],["李部長遠：所有的宣傳費用大概兩千萬在這邊全部被刪掉，我們現在也正想辦法透過跟民間組織合作，透過跟外交部的合作，一定不會因為預算被刪減之後，讓這個活動……"],["吳委員思瑤：好，我給期許，也持續給監督、持續送暖。謝謝主席給我時間，後面題目都沒辦法講，我希望還有機會可以跟文化部門來討論。謝謝。"],["李部長遠：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝吳思瑤委員，部長請回。","接下來請高金素梅委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":144,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-22-4","speakers":["林宜瑾","柯志恩","萬美玲","林沛祥","劉書彬","葛如鈞","林月琴","陳秀寳","張雅琳","郭昱晴","吳沛憶","羅廷瑋","范雲","王鴻薇","洪孟楷","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","吳思瑤","高金素梅","李坤城","蔡易餘","葉元之","林倩綺","徐欣瑩","陳培瑜"],"page_start":75,"meetingDate":["2025-03-27"],"gazette_id":"1143201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143201_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期教育及文化委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請文化部部長李遠列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1143201_00002"}}}