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{\"word\": \"照\", \"start\": 228.898, \"end\": 229.078, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"整\", \"start\": 229.078, \"end\": 229.338, \"score\": 0.838}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 229.338, \"end\": 229.498, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"府\", \"start\": 229.498, \"end\": 229.779, \"score\": 0.777}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"邊\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 229.779, \"end\": 229.859, \"score\": 0.758}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 229.859, \"end\": 229.879, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"計\"}, {\"word\": \"數\"}, {\"word\": \"字\", \"start\": 229.879, \"end\": 229.899, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 231.36, \"end\": 246.058, \"text\": \"那我想特別問到一個狀態因為在整個國發會這邊有特別提到說我們在整個非紅供應鏈這邊的時候逐漸形成新的商機嘛那政府也想要大力推動國內傳產中小企業進購相關能力拓展還會通路\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 231.36, \"end\": 231.5, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 231.5, \"end\": 231.641, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 231.641, \"end\": 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834.551, \"score\": 0.841}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 834.551, \"end\": 834.571, \"score\": 0.293}, {\"word\": \"O\", \"start\": 835.091, \"end\": 835.192, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"K\", \"start\": 835.192, \"end\": 835.312, \"score\": 0.821}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 835.312, \"end\": 835.513, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"谢\", \"start\": 835.513, \"end\": 835.633, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"谢\", \"start\": 835.633, \"end\": 835.653, \"score\": 0.391}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:08,435 --> 00:00:11,513\n謝謝主席我想請一下郭智慧部長還有劉靜清主委\n\n2\n00:00:22,841 --> 00:00:48,059\n首先先請一下郭部長就是剛剛你有特別回憶一個狀態就是說因為在面對這個美國科30%關稅之後的時候我們有一個880億的一個因應計畫對不對你有特別提到說這880億是特別預算對不對是特別預算可是因為之前柯總早講說這880億是舊有預算所以它到底是特別預算還是舊有預算\n\n3\n00:00:54,985 --> 00:01:00,817\n我們所了解的是特別預算是特別預算嘛所以基本上柯總召之前講的是不對的\n\n4\n00:01:04,035 --> 00:01:26,136\n我們所了解的是我想這個時間差啦這個預算跟特別預算是完全不一樣之後要動用也完全不一樣的程序阿在講的那個部分是不是時間上面的差異啦但是就這個預算來講就是特別預算ok沒問題喔特別預算那我們就知道說後續我們立法院這邊要怎麼去配合這件事情\n\n5\n00:01:26,957 --> 00:01:51,587\n那我想另外再特別問一段話因為之前有商種有些企業界朋友他們回應說因為有些貨品現在在海運當中的時候那他們現在碰到4月9號之後課徵32%的關稅的時候可是有新的訊息出來就說如果4月9號之前已經裝船在5月27號之前抵達美國的部分的時候就不會課徵這32%具體的狀態是不是這樣經濟部這邊有沒有掌握\n\n6\n00:01:54,668 --> 00:02:14,647\n報告委員是沒有錯啦就是說你4月9號onboard的產品才會課徵這個32%的稅啦4月9號以前出貨從台灣出口的應該是這個具體是這樣的4月5號以前那適用的稅率就是原稅率4月5號到4月9號是加徵10%4月9號以後出貨的\n\n7\n00:02:20,752 --> 00:02:37,443\n加32%所以是以出貨的時間為標準對不對所以4月9號之前裝船的話基本上就不苛徵這32%裝船的時間適用的稅率是嘛OK所以只要在4月9號搬船4月9號裝船5月27號之前到達美國就不苛徵對不對在報關才能適用我看那個劉主委\n\n8\n00:02:46,276 --> 00:03:10,615\n點頭點得很用力就確定是這樣的狀態嗎?確定那我想說接下來我想來針對這個部分因為我看到那個2017年我們整個出口的統計跟2024年出口的統計因為當中有一個很大的一個部分就是我們政府不斷推新南向這個政策可是我們看到2017年的時候呢\n\n9\n00:03:11,635 --> 00:03:27,800\n對中國大陸跟港澳的一個貿易統計占台灣出口的31.68%出口到美國只占11.37%到去年的狀態的時候對大陸跟港澳的狀態出口是20.27%可是對美國這邊大幅的提高到18.15%\n\n10\n00:03:29,860 --> 00:03:49,899\n所以我們看到一個狀態就是在這段期間當中的時候呢在新南向在東南亞國家這邊其實比重沒有差距很大那對大陸這邊金額沒有差距很大可是比重大幅的下降表示我們對美國這邊的成長非常的多這個數字應該沒有錯吧我看都是按照整個政府這邊的一個統計數字\n\n11\n00:03:51,360 --> 00:04:06,058\n那我想特別問到一個狀態因為在整個國發會這邊有特別提到說我們在整個非紅供應鏈這邊的時候逐漸形成新的商機嘛那政府也想要大力推動國內傳產中小企業進購相關能力拓展還會通路\n\n12\n00:04:07,519 --> 00:04:30,970\n打造一個民主供應鏈我想特別講一個狀態就是說我們看到這個數字當中的時候呢就發現非紅供應鏈我們現在政府努力在做的狀態可是在這一次的關稅的一個大地震當中的時候其實並沒有倖免針對這個部分的時候我想請教一下國發會主委的時候你怎麼樣去看待我們接下來對於整個非紅供應鏈的一個建制\n\n13\n00:04:34,122 --> 00:04:54,389\n陳如我剛才講的,其實美國佔全球進口大概是3.34%,大概全球的進口貿易還有86.66%在其他的國家。所以對我們而言,以台灣的經濟產業能量而言,其實我們還有很多其他的市場可以去發展。\n\n14\n00:04:55,029 --> 00:05:09,081\n所以有這樣的機會我們希望利用這樣的機會協助廠商去發展讓他的整個風險管理跟這個市場更加的建立所以就是說飛鴻供應鏈這個部分我們還是持續在努力推動嘛原則上是這樣對不對對\n\n15\n00:05:10,382 --> 00:05:25,240\nOK好沒問題那我想說在接下來我想特別提到說因為您剛剛也特別提到說我們有一個那個對美的一個溝通的談判小組也成立了那我想說針對比方說以目前來說台積電已經承諾到美國去投資1000億沒有問題那麼\n\n16\n00:05:27,623 --> 00:05:44,462\n國防預算也承諾明年要提高到3%GDP是3%那麼經濟部這邊也表示我們要協助整個供應鏈赴美去投資然後總統也特別提到說零關稅那我們現在還有什麼樣的籌碼你覺得現在跟美國在談關稅的時候可以用得上的\n\n17\n00:05:48,198 --> 00:06:00,632\n這個兩邊在談判的過程中我想籌碼是不可能攤出來給對方知道那就我的瞭解他是在我們行政院副院長的領導之下然後也他準備了非常完整的\n\n18\n00:06:01,493 --> 00:06:27,019\n所以你說那個談判籌碼現在沒辦法講嘛我可以理解不過因為經濟部這邊有特別提到行政院已經完成了盤點對農工石油天然氣等產品大量採購計畫已經盤點完成那麼因為這一次的關稅很大一部分是因為貿易逆差的問題我想請教我們這樣一個大規模盤點之後的時候大概預計可以處理掉多少對美的貿易逆差順差的問題\n\n19\n00:06:28,764 --> 00:06:43,012\n這個還是要由談判的人來進行談判因為經濟部的報告裡面有直接提到所以我想知道說我們這個已經完成盤點的這部分的時候大概可以減少多少的一個貿易順差我們只能講說\n\n20\n00:06:44,353 --> 00:07:05,231\n這裡面經濟部是盤點了足夠的數字其實我們各個不同不只經濟部各個不同角度都有盤點那這個都是未來的籌碼這個看談判的代表所產生的談判結果所以這個數字已經盤點完成也沒有辦法揭露你的意思是這樣子嗎經濟部長因為這是你的報告當中你的意思也是這樣子嗎\n\n21\n00:07:07,438 --> 00:07:23,557\n我們現在經濟部所揭露的是我們經濟部所包括的範圍之內但是這個是經濟部的這個金額我想之後行政院他們談判他們還有其他的資源\n\n22\n00:07:24,418 --> 00:07:29,764\n因為你這邊講的行政院這邊已經談判好之後的時候我想之後到本辦公室我們來做這個細部的溝通我們內部這是可以調整的理解剛才像主委在講的就是說這個其實談判是在談判人員他們手上去溝通這個\n\n23\n00:07:41,235 --> 00:07:57,887\n那我想因為剛剛有地震可是我發現就是郭部長跟劉主委其實還是非常穩健我們也希望這一次關稅的一個大地震的時候我們台灣能夠順利的一起度過不過我這邊想要再問一個問題就是因為川普他又特別提到一個情況\n\n24\n00:07:58,667 --> 00:08:12,926\n就是說台積電如果沒有履行到美國去投資的一個承諾的時候他要對台積電課徵百分之百的關稅針對這個事情我想請教一下郭部長這邊有沒有掌握我們怎麼去因應這件事情\n\n25\n00:08:13,951 --> 00:08:33,342\n報告委員我想您的那個訊息從哪裡來我們是不清楚啦到目前為止我是沒有收到這樣的一個訊息OK媒體已經有報導這樣出來今天早上媒體出來的訊息已經是投資的公司嘛所以在講說不會投資這個也是很奇怪的一個論述啦\n\n26\n00:08:35,786 --> 00:09:03,948\n所以你剛剛講說你還不知道這個訊息因為這是今天早上一早的媒體的訊息所以我想說報告委員我想媒體的論述也有它的來源但是這個部分必須要由台積電他們自己來回答我的問題是川普因為他公開講如果沒有兌現的時候他就會課徵百分之百的關稅對啦我想這個就是看什麼時候嘛\n\n27\n00:09:05,430 --> 00:09:31,231\n什麼時候那另外我想特別針對目前其實台灣的對美出口當中的時候以伺服器跟整個零組件佔的比重非常的高那當然他們目前其實是一個零關稅的一個情況那之後碰到32%的關稅的時候我想特別又把那個所有以伺服器為例我找了一下\n\n28\n00:09:31,932 --> 00:09:46,668\n目前全球的十大伺服器的供應商台灣占四家啦那我一找他們的財報出來喔他們的一個淨利率淨利潤大概都低於5%基本上沒有辦法\n\n29\n00:09:47,569 --> 00:10:07,905\n去支撐這麼高的一個關稅所以我們對於這樣子的部分的時候我想請教一下部長這邊有沒有什麼回應報告委員那我想您的資料的取得這個當然是一種參考不過這幾家公司大概都是做這個代工的是所以那個稅是這個自己原廠要付\n\n30\n00:10:08,545 --> 00:10:20,642\n就是說今天可能是NVDA或者是這些公司包括COCOM這些公司他們或者是美插委這些公司他們要自己付是所以你說關稅他們這邊都不用沒有問題\n\n31\n00:10:22,313 --> 00:10:42,598\n這些我們都跟他們談過了伺服器所有的廠商我們都跟他們談過了他們認為32%對他們來講不是問題而且我們現在重點是我們自己的brand我們台灣的台廠那我也問過了你有多少的利潤大概對他們來講這個優勢商品利潤是高於32%\n\n32\n00:10:43,658 --> 00:11:04,343\n是高於32%優勢產品嘛因為我是看整個公司的財報啦那如果針對特定的優勢產品我當然相信他們毛利淨利率其實也是高於這個部分至於整個公司財報來說其實是不夠那你剛才有特別提到說針對這個部分的時候基本上買方的時候他會去把這個關稅的部分cover掉\n\n33\n00:11:05,236 --> 00:11:20,380\n而且坦白講這些這一個部分也是我們廠商他們自己我們都盤過他們了也跟他們討論過了他們認為對他們來講包括他們是生產的基地不一定只有在台灣理解\n\n34\n00:11:21,040 --> 00:11:47,396\n生產基地可能在墨西哥跟美國有一個美墨之間的稅條款所以你覺得因為台灣的出口當中很大一部分在針對伺服器跟ICT產品你覺得這個部分所以這關稅的部分對台灣的出口你覺得影響不會太大是這個意思嗎對就是對伺服器或者台灣的優勢商品譬如說台灣什麼叫優勢商品\n\n35\n00:11:49,177 --> 00:12:11,856\n舉個例像我們的汽車零組件Aftermarket大概就是獨佔所以這個Aftermarket你要買台灣的商品那對不起這個32%加上去你還是要準備OK理解那我想說因為我看經濟部的資料當中有提到說我們前30大產品的時候大概佔對於出口美國大概72%我想知道說我們這30\n\n36\n00:12:14,199 --> 00:12:31,177\n前30大的產品當中我們是不是有去針對它會受到這個關稅的一些影響像部長剛剛針對伺服器有一個很具體的說明就是不會受到影響我們前30大的產品是不是都有做這樣的一個分析跟評估不是不會受到影響而是這些影響\n\n37\n00:12:32,857 --> 00:12:59,345\n廠商可以解決理解這是這個不同的理解完全理解一定會受影響這麼高的這個關稅對我們台灣來講一定是影響只是我們對這個影響如何去解決如何把他這個影響轉到另外一個層級去然後大家來吸收或者是說他們可以承擔這些都是談判小組根據這個國內的能夠承受的程度\n\n38\n00:12:59,945 --> 00:13:26,698\n对于跟美国谈判的一个非常重要的关键所以经济部的立场就是不断地来访问国内的这些厂商可能会受影响的厂商他们影响的程度是多少提供给谈判小组做参考所以我想知道说我们经济部针对前30大产品这边是不是也都有做类似伺服器这样的一个评估如果有之后再给本席一个很清楚的一个资料好不好我们现在因为在谈判中对不起这个部分可能\n\n39\n00:13:27,796 --> 00:13:54,571\n可能要晚一點尊重那我最後這邊的時候想請國發會這邊因為有提到一個七大百億基金的部分在國發基金裡面那因為國發基金裡面本來就有針對這七大一個產業有一些相關的一些投資的一個計畫我想知道這七大百億基金當中的後續的一個操作會是怎麼樣子只有給本席一個書面的資料好不好好的\n\n40\n00:13:55,091 --> 00:13:55,653\nOK好谢谢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n8435\t11513\t謝謝主席 我想請一下郭智慧部長還有劉靜清主委\n22841\t48059\t首先先請一下郭部長就是剛剛你有特別回憶一個狀態就是說因為在面對這個美國科30%關稅之後的時候我們有一個880億的一個因應計畫對不對你有特別提到說這880億是特別預算對不對是特別預算可是因為之前柯總早講說這880億是舊有預算所以它到底是特別預算還是舊有預算\n54985\t60817\t我們所了解的是特別預算是特別預算嘛所以基本上柯總召之前講的是不對的\n64035\t86136\t我們所了解的是 我想這個時間差啦這個預算跟特別預算是完全不一樣 之後要動用也完全不一樣的程序阿在講的那個部分 是不是時間上面的差異啦但是就這個預算來講就是特別預算ok 沒問題喔 特別預算那我們就知道說後續我們立法院這邊要怎麼去配合這件事情\n86957\t111587\t那我想另外再特別問一段話因為之前有商種有些企業界朋友他們回應說因為有些貨品現在在海運當中的時候那他們現在碰到4月9號之後課徵32%的關稅的時候可是有新的訊息出來就說如果4月9號之前已經裝船在5月27號之前抵達美國的部分的時候就不會課徵這32%具體的狀態是不是這樣經濟部這邊有沒有掌握\n114668\t134647\t報告委員是沒有錯啦就是說你4月9號on board的產品才會課徵這個32%的稅啦4月9號以前出貨從台灣出口的應該是這個具體是這樣的4月5號以前那適用的稅率就是原稅率4月5號到4月9號是加徵10%4月9號以後出貨的\n140752\t157443\t加32%所以是以出貨的時間為標準對不對所以4月9號之前裝船的話基本上就不苛徵這32%裝船的時間適用的稅率是嘛 OK所以只要在4月9號搬船4月9號裝船5月27號之前到達美國就不苛徵對不對在報關才能適用我看那個劉主委\n166276\t190615\t點頭點得很用力就確定是這樣的狀態嗎?確定那我想說接下來我想來針對這個部分因為我看到那個2017年我們整個出口的統計跟2024年出口的統計因為當中有一個很大的一個部分就是我們政府不斷推新南向這個政策可是我們看到2017年的時候呢\n191635\t207800\t對中國大陸跟港澳的一個貿易統計占台灣出口的31.68%出口到美國只占11.37%到去年的狀態的時候對大陸跟港澳的狀態出口是20.27%可是對美國這邊大幅的提高到18.15%\n209860\t229899\t所以我們看到一個狀態就是在這段期間當中的時候呢在新南向在東南亞國家這邊其實比重沒有差距很大那對大陸這邊金額沒有差距很大可是比重大幅的下降表示我們對美國這邊的成長非常的多這個數字應該沒有錯吧我看都是按照整個政府這邊的一個統計數字\n231360\t246058\t那我想特別問到一個狀態因為在整個國發會這邊有特別提到說我們在整個非紅供應鏈這邊的時候逐漸形成新的商機嘛那政府也想要大力推動國內傳產中小企業進購相關能力拓展還會通路\n247519\t270970\t打造一個民主供應鏈我想特別講一個狀態就是說我們看到這個數字當中的時候呢就發現非紅供應鏈我們現在政府努力在做的狀態可是在這一次的關稅的一個大地震當中的時候其實並沒有倖免針對這個部分的時候我想請教一下國發會主委的時候你怎麼樣去看待我們接下來對於整個非紅供應鏈的一個建制\n274122\t294389\t陳如我剛才講的,其實美國佔全球進口大概是3.34%,大概全球的進口貿易還有86.66%在其他的國家。所以對我們而言,以台灣的經濟產業能量而言,其實我們還有很多其他的市場可以去發展。\n295029\t309081\t所以有這樣的機會我們希望利用這樣的機會協助廠商去發展讓他的整個風險管理跟這個市場更加的建立所以就是說飛鴻供應鏈這個部分我們還是持續在努力推動嘛原則上是這樣對不對對\n310382\t325240\tOK好沒問題那我想說在接下來我想特別提到說因為您剛剛也特別提到說我們有一個那個對美的一個溝通的談判小組也成立了那我想說針對比方說以目前來說台積電已經承諾到美國去投資1000億沒有問題那麼\n327623\t344462\t國防預算也承諾明年要提高到3%GDP是3%那麼經濟部這邊也表示我們要協助整個供應鏈赴美去投資然後總統也特別提到說零關稅那我們現在還有什麼樣的籌碼你覺得現在跟美國在談關稅的時候可以用得上的\n348198\t360632\t這個兩邊在談判的過程中我想籌碼是不可能攤出來給對方知道那就我的瞭解他是在我們行政院副院長的領導之下然後也他準備了非常完整的\n361493\t387019\t所以你說那個談判籌碼現在沒辦法講嘛我可以理解不過因為經濟部這邊有特別提到行政院已經完成了盤點對農工石油天然氣等產品大量採購計畫已經盤點完成那麼因為這一次的關稅很大一部分是因為貿易逆差的問題我想請教我們這樣一個大規模盤點之後的時候大概預計可以處理掉多少對美的貿易逆差順差的問題\n388764\t403012\t這個還是要由談判的人來進行談判因為經濟部的報告裡面有直接提到所以我想知道說我們這個已經完成盤點的這部分的時候大概可以減少多少的一個貿易順差我們只能講說\n404353\t425231\t這裡面經濟部是盤點了足夠的數字 其實我們各個不同 不只經濟部各個不同角度都有盤點那這個都是未來的籌碼 這個看談判的代表所產生的談判結果所以這個數字已經盤點完成也沒有辦法揭露 你的意思是這樣子嗎經濟部長 因為這是你的報告當中 你的意思也是這樣子嗎\n427438\t443557\t我們現在經濟部所揭露的是我們經濟部所包括的範圍之內但是這個是經濟部的這個金額我想之後行政院他們談判他們還有其他的資源\n444418\t449764\t因為你這邊講的行政院這邊已經談判好之後的時候我想之後到本辦公室我們來做這個細部的溝通我們內部這是可以調整的理解剛才像主委在講的就是說這個其實談判是在談判人員他們手上去溝通這個\n461235\t477887\t那我想因為剛剛有地震可是我發現就是郭部長跟劉主委其實還是非常穩健我們也希望這一次關稅的一個大地震的時候我們台灣能夠順利的一起度過不過我這邊想要再問一個問題就是因為川普他又特別提到一個情況\n478667\t492926\t就是說台積電如果沒有履行到美國去投資的一個承諾的時候他要對台積電課徵百分之百的關稅針對這個事情我想請教一下郭部長這邊有沒有掌握我們怎麼去因應這件事情\n493951\t513342\t報告委員我想您的那個訊息從哪裡來我們是不清楚啦到目前為止我是沒有收到這樣的一個訊息OK媒體已經有報導這樣出來今天早上媒體出來的訊息已經是投資的公司嘛所以在講說不會投資這個也是很奇怪的一個論述啦\n515786\t543948\t所以你剛剛講說你還不知道這個訊息因為這是今天早上一早的媒體的訊息所以我想說報告委員我想媒體的論述也有它的來源但是這個部分必須要由台積電他們自己來回答我的問題是川普因為他公開講如果沒有兌現的時候他就會課徵百分之百的關稅對啦我想這個就是看什麼時候嘛\n545430\t571231\t什麼時候那另外我想特別針對目前其實台灣的對美出口當中的時候以伺服器跟整個零組件佔的比重非常的高那當然他們目前其實是一個零關稅的一個情況那之後碰到32%的關稅的時候我想特別又把那個所有以伺服器為例我找了一下\n571932\t586668\t目前全球的十大伺服器的供應商台灣占四家啦那我一找他們的財報出來喔他們的一個淨利率淨利潤大概都低於5%基本上沒有辦法\n587569\t607905\t去支撐這麼高的一個關稅所以我們對於這樣子的部分的時候我想請教一下部長這邊有沒有什麼回應報告委員那我想您的資料的取得這個當然是一種參考不過這幾家公司大概都是做這個代工的是所以那個稅是這個自己原廠要付\n608545\t620642\t就是說今天可能是NVDA或者是這些公司包括COCOM這些公司他們或者是美插委這些公司他們要自己付是 所以你說關稅他們這邊都不用沒有問題\n622313\t642598\t這些我們都跟他們談過了伺服器所有的廠商我們都跟他們談過了他們認為32%對他們來講不是問題而且我們現在重點是我們自己的brand我們台灣的台廠那我也問過了你有多少的利潤大概對他們來講這個優勢商品利潤是高於32%\n643658\t664343\t是高於32%優勢產品嘛因為我是看整個公司的財報啦那如果針對特定的優勢產品我當然相信他們毛利淨利率其實也是高於這個部分至於整個公司財報來說其實是不夠那你剛才有特別提到說針對這個部分的時候基本上買方的時候他會去把這個關稅的部分cover掉\n665236\t680380\t而且坦白講這些這一個部分也是我們廠商他們自己我們都盤過他們了也跟他們討論過了他們認為對他們來講包括他們是生產的基地不一定只有在台灣理解\n681040\t707396\t生產基地可能在墨西哥跟美國有一個美墨之間的稅條款所以你覺得因為台灣的出口當中很大一部分在針對伺服器跟ICT產品你覺得這個部分所以這關稅的部分對台灣的出口你覺得影響不會太大是這個意思嗎對 就是對伺服器或者台灣的優勢商品譬如說台灣什麼叫優勢商品\n709177\t731856\t舉個例像我們的汽車零組件Aftermarket大概就是獨佔所以這個Aftermarket你要買台灣的商品那對不起這個32%加上去你還是要準備OK 理解那我想說因為我看經濟部的資料當中有提到說我們前30大產品的時候大概佔對於出口美國大概72%我想知道說我們這30\n734199\t751177\t前30大的產品當中我們是不是有去針對它會受到這個關稅的一些影響像部長剛剛針對伺服器有一個很具體的說明就是不會受到影響我們前30大的產品是不是都有做這樣的一個分析跟評估不是不會受到影響而是這些影響\n752857\t779345\t廠商可以解決理解這是這個不同的理解 完全理解一定會受影響這麼高的這個關稅對我們台灣來講一定是影響只是我們對這個影響如何去解決如何把他這個影響轉到另外一個層級去然後大家來吸收或者是說他們可以承擔這些都是談判小組根據這個國內的能夠承受的程度\n779945\t806698\t对于跟美国谈判的一个非常重要的关键所以经济部的立场就是不断地来访问国内的这些厂商可能会受影响的厂商他们影响的程度是多少提供给谈判小组做参考所以我想知道说我们经济部针对前30大产品这边是不是也都有做类似伺服器这样的一个评估如果有之后再给本席一个很清楚的一个资料好不好我们现在因为在谈判中对不起这个部分可能\n807796\t834571\t可能要晚一點尊重那我最後這邊的時候想請國發會這邊因為有提到一個七大百億基金的部分在國發基金裡面那因為國發基金裡面本來就有針對這七大一個產業有一些相關的一些投資的一個計畫我想知道這七大百億基金當中的後續的一個操作會是怎麼樣子只有給本席一個書面的資料好不好好的\n835091\t835653\tOK好谢谢\n","txt":"謝謝主席 我想請一下郭智慧部長還有劉靜清主委\n首先先請一下郭部長就是剛剛你有特別回憶一個狀態就是說因為在面對這個美國科30%關稅之後的時候我們有一個880億的一個因應計畫對不對你有特別提到說這880億是特別預算對不對是特別預算可是因為之前柯總早講說這880億是舊有預算所以它到底是特別預算還是舊有預算\n我們所了解的是特別預算是特別預算嘛所以基本上柯總召之前講的是不對的\n我們所了解的是 我想這個時間差啦這個預算跟特別預算是完全不一樣 之後要動用也完全不一樣的程序阿在講的那個部分 是不是時間上面的差異啦但是就這個預算來講就是特別預算ok 沒問題喔 特別預算那我們就知道說後續我們立法院這邊要怎麼去配合這件事情\n那我想另外再特別問一段話因為之前有商種有些企業界朋友他們回應說因為有些貨品現在在海運當中的時候那他們現在碰到4月9號之後課徵32%的關稅的時候可是有新的訊息出來就說如果4月9號之前已經裝船在5月27號之前抵達美國的部分的時候就不會課徵這32%具體的狀態是不是這樣經濟部這邊有沒有掌握\n報告委員是沒有錯啦就是說你4月9號on board的產品才會課徵這個32%的稅啦4月9號以前出貨從台灣出口的應該是這個具體是這樣的4月5號以前那適用的稅率就是原稅率4月5號到4月9號是加徵10%4月9號以後出貨的\n加32%所以是以出貨的時間為標準對不對所以4月9號之前裝船的話基本上就不苛徵這32%裝船的時間適用的稅率是嘛 OK所以只要在4月9號搬船4月9號裝船5月27號之前到達美國就不苛徵對不對在報關才能適用我看那個劉主委\n點頭點得很用力就確定是這樣的狀態嗎?確定那我想說接下來我想來針對這個部分因為我看到那個2017年我們整個出口的統計跟2024年出口的統計因為當中有一個很大的一個部分就是我們政府不斷推新南向這個政策可是我們看到2017年的時候呢\n對中國大陸跟港澳的一個貿易統計占台灣出口的31.68%出口到美國只占11.37%到去年的狀態的時候對大陸跟港澳的狀態出口是20.27%可是對美國這邊大幅的提高到18.15%\n所以我們看到一個狀態就是在這段期間當中的時候呢在新南向在東南亞國家這邊其實比重沒有差距很大那對大陸這邊金額沒有差距很大可是比重大幅的下降表示我們對美國這邊的成長非常的多這個數字應該沒有錯吧我看都是按照整個政府這邊的一個統計數字\n那我想特別問到一個狀態因為在整個國發會這邊有特別提到說我們在整個非紅供應鏈這邊的時候逐漸形成新的商機嘛那政府也想要大力推動國內傳產中小企業進購相關能力拓展還會通路\n打造一個民主供應鏈我想特別講一個狀態就是說我們看到這個數字當中的時候呢就發現非紅供應鏈我們現在政府努力在做的狀態可是在這一次的關稅的一個大地震當中的時候其實並沒有倖免針對這個部分的時候我想請教一下國發會主委的時候你怎麼樣去看待我們接下來對於整個非紅供應鏈的一個建制\n陳如我剛才講的,其實美國佔全球進口大概是3.34%,大概全球的進口貿易還有86.66%在其他的國家。所以對我們而言,以台灣的經濟產業能量而言,其實我們還有很多其他的市場可以去發展。\n所以有這樣的機會我們希望利用這樣的機會協助廠商去發展讓他的整個風險管理跟這個市場更加的建立所以就是說飛鴻供應鏈這個部分我們還是持續在努力推動嘛原則上是這樣對不對對\nOK好沒問題那我想說在接下來我想特別提到說因為您剛剛也特別提到說我們有一個那個對美的一個溝通的談判小組也成立了那我想說針對比方說以目前來說台積電已經承諾到美國去投資1000億沒有問題那麼\n國防預算也承諾明年要提高到3%GDP是3%那麼經濟部這邊也表示我們要協助整個供應鏈赴美去投資然後總統也特別提到說零關稅那我們現在還有什麼樣的籌碼你覺得現在跟美國在談關稅的時候可以用得上的\n這個兩邊在談判的過程中我想籌碼是不可能攤出來給對方知道那就我的瞭解他是在我們行政院副院長的領導之下然後也他準備了非常完整的\n所以你說那個談判籌碼現在沒辦法講嘛我可以理解不過因為經濟部這邊有特別提到行政院已經完成了盤點對農工石油天然氣等產品大量採購計畫已經盤點完成那麼因為這一次的關稅很大一部分是因為貿易逆差的問題我想請教我們這樣一個大規模盤點之後的時候大概預計可以處理掉多少對美的貿易逆差順差的問題\n這個還是要由談判的人來進行談判因為經濟部的報告裡面有直接提到所以我想知道說我們這個已經完成盤點的這部分的時候大概可以減少多少的一個貿易順差我們只能講說\n這裡面經濟部是盤點了足夠的數字 其實我們各個不同 不只經濟部各個不同角度都有盤點那這個都是未來的籌碼 這個看談判的代表所產生的談判結果所以這個數字已經盤點完成也沒有辦法揭露 你的意思是這樣子嗎經濟部長 因為這是你的報告當中 你的意思也是這樣子嗎\n我們現在經濟部所揭露的是我們經濟部所包括的範圍之內但是這個是經濟部的這個金額我想之後行政院他們談判他們還有其他的資源\n因為你這邊講的行政院這邊已經談判好之後的時候我想之後到本辦公室我們來做這個細部的溝通我們內部這是可以調整的理解剛才像主委在講的就是說這個其實談判是在談判人員他們手上去溝通這個\n那我想因為剛剛有地震可是我發現就是郭部長跟劉主委其實還是非常穩健我們也希望這一次關稅的一個大地震的時候我們台灣能夠順利的一起度過不過我這邊想要再問一個問題就是因為川普他又特別提到一個情況\n就是說台積電如果沒有履行到美國去投資的一個承諾的時候他要對台積電課徵百分之百的關稅針對這個事情我想請教一下郭部長這邊有沒有掌握我們怎麼去因應這件事情\n報告委員我想您的那個訊息從哪裡來我們是不清楚啦到目前為止我是沒有收到這樣的一個訊息OK媒體已經有報導這樣出來今天早上媒體出來的訊息已經是投資的公司嘛所以在講說不會投資這個也是很奇怪的一個論述啦\n所以你剛剛講說你還不知道這個訊息因為這是今天早上一早的媒體的訊息所以我想說報告委員我想媒體的論述也有它的來源但是這個部分必須要由台積電他們自己來回答我的問題是川普因為他公開講如果沒有兌現的時候他就會課徵百分之百的關稅對啦我想這個就是看什麼時候嘛\n什麼時候那另外我想特別針對目前其實台灣的對美出口當中的時候以伺服器跟整個零組件佔的比重非常的高那當然他們目前其實是一個零關稅的一個情況那之後碰到32%的關稅的時候我想特別又把那個所有以伺服器為例我找了一下\n目前全球的十大伺服器的供應商台灣占四家啦那我一找他們的財報出來喔他們的一個淨利率淨利潤大概都低於5%基本上沒有辦法\n去支撐這麼高的一個關稅所以我們對於這樣子的部分的時候我想請教一下部長這邊有沒有什麼回應報告委員那我想您的資料的取得這個當然是一種參考不過這幾家公司大概都是做這個代工的是所以那個稅是這個自己原廠要付\n就是說今天可能是NVDA或者是這些公司包括COCOM這些公司他們或者是美插委這些公司他們要自己付是 所以你說關稅他們這邊都不用沒有問題\n這些我們都跟他們談過了伺服器所有的廠商我們都跟他們談過了他們認為32%對他們來講不是問題而且我們現在重點是我們自己的brand我們台灣的台廠那我也問過了你有多少的利潤大概對他們來講這個優勢商品利潤是高於32%\n是高於32%優勢產品嘛因為我是看整個公司的財報啦那如果針對特定的優勢產品我當然相信他們毛利淨利率其實也是高於這個部分至於整個公司財報來說其實是不夠那你剛才有特別提到說針對這個部分的時候基本上買方的時候他會去把這個關稅的部分cover掉\n而且坦白講這些這一個部分也是我們廠商他們自己我們都盤過他們了也跟他們討論過了他們認為對他們來講包括他們是生產的基地不一定只有在台灣理解\n生產基地可能在墨西哥跟美國有一個美墨之間的稅條款所以你覺得因為台灣的出口當中很大一部分在針對伺服器跟ICT產品你覺得這個部分所以這關稅的部分對台灣的出口你覺得影響不會太大是這個意思嗎對 就是對伺服器或者台灣的優勢商品譬如說台灣什麼叫優勢商品\n舉個例像我們的汽車零組件Aftermarket大概就是獨佔所以這個Aftermarket你要買台灣的商品那對不起這個32%加上去你還是要準備OK 理解那我想說因為我看經濟部的資料當中有提到說我們前30大產品的時候大概佔對於出口美國大概72%我想知道說我們這30\n前30大的產品當中我們是不是有去針對它會受到這個關稅的一些影響像部長剛剛針對伺服器有一個很具體的說明就是不會受到影響我們前30大的產品是不是都有做這樣的一個分析跟評估不是不會受到影響而是這些影響\n廠商可以解決理解這是這個不同的理解 完全理解一定會受影響這麼高的這個關稅對我們台灣來講一定是影響只是我們對這個影響如何去解決如何把他這個影響轉到另外一個層級去然後大家來吸收或者是說他們可以承擔這些都是談判小組根據這個國內的能夠承受的程度\n对于跟美国谈判的一个非常重要的关键所以经济部的立场就是不断地来访问国内的这些厂商可能会受影响的厂商他们影响的程度是多少提供给谈判小组做参考所以我想知道说我们经济部针对前30大产品这边是不是也都有做类似伺服器这样的一个评估如果有之后再给本席一个很清楚的一个资料好不好我们现在因为在谈判中对不起这个部分可能\n可能要晚一點尊重那我最後這邊的時候想請國發會這邊因為有提到一個七大百億基金的部分在國發基金裡面那因為國發基金裡面本來就有針對這七大一個產業有一些相關的一些投資的一個計畫我想知道這七大百億基金當中的後續的一個操作會是怎麼樣子只有給本席一個書面的資料好不好好的\nOK好谢谢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:08.435 --> 00:11.513\n謝謝主席我想請一下郭智慧部長還有劉靜清主委\n\n00:22.841 --> 00:48.059\n首先先請一下郭部長就是剛剛你有特別回憶一個狀態就是說因為在面對這個美國科30%關稅之後的時候我們有一個880億的一個因應計畫對不對你有特別提到說這880億是特別預算對不對是特別預算可是因為之前柯總早講說這880億是舊有預算所以它到底是特別預算還是舊有預算\n\n00:54.985 --> 01:00.817\n我們所了解的是特別預算是特別預算嘛所以基本上柯總召之前講的是不對的\n\n01:04.035 --> 01:26.136\n我們所了解的是我想這個時間差啦這個預算跟特別預算是完全不一樣之後要動用也完全不一樣的程序阿在講的那個部分是不是時間上面的差異啦但是就這個預算來講就是特別預算ok沒問題喔特別預算那我們就知道說後續我們立法院這邊要怎麼去配合這件事情\n\n01:26.957 --> 01:51.587\n那我想另外再特別問一段話因為之前有商種有些企業界朋友他們回應說因為有些貨品現在在海運當中的時候那他們現在碰到4月9號之後課徵32%的關稅的時候可是有新的訊息出來就說如果4月9號之前已經裝船在5月27號之前抵達美國的部分的時候就不會課徵這32%具體的狀態是不是這樣經濟部這邊有沒有掌握\n\n01:54.668 --> 02:14.647\n報告委員是沒有錯啦就是說你4月9號onboard的產品才會課徵這個32%的稅啦4月9號以前出貨從台灣出口的應該是這個具體是這樣的4月5號以前那適用的稅率就是原稅率4月5號到4月9號是加徵10%4月9號以後出貨的\n\n02:20.752 --> 02:37.443\n加32%所以是以出貨的時間為標準對不對所以4月9號之前裝船的話基本上就不苛徵這32%裝船的時間適用的稅率是嘛OK所以只要在4月9號搬船4月9號裝船5月27號之前到達美國就不苛徵對不對在報關才能適用我看那個劉主委\n\n02:46.276 --> 03:10.615\n點頭點得很用力就確定是這樣的狀態嗎?確定那我想說接下來我想來針對這個部分因為我看到那個2017年我們整個出口的統計跟2024年出口的統計因為當中有一個很大的一個部分就是我們政府不斷推新南向這個政策可是我們看到2017年的時候呢\n\n03:11.635 --> 03:27.800\n對中國大陸跟港澳的一個貿易統計占台灣出口的31.68%出口到美國只占11.37%到去年的狀態的時候對大陸跟港澳的狀態出口是20.27%可是對美國這邊大幅的提高到18.15%\n\n03:29.860 --> 03:49.899\n所以我們看到一個狀態就是在這段期間當中的時候呢在新南向在東南亞國家這邊其實比重沒有差距很大那對大陸這邊金額沒有差距很大可是比重大幅的下降表示我們對美國這邊的成長非常的多這個數字應該沒有錯吧我看都是按照整個政府這邊的一個統計數字\n\n03:51.360 --> 04:06.058\n那我想特別問到一個狀態因為在整個國發會這邊有特別提到說我們在整個非紅供應鏈這邊的時候逐漸形成新的商機嘛那政府也想要大力推動國內傳產中小企業進購相關能力拓展還會通路\n\n04:07.519 --> 04:30.970\n打造一個民主供應鏈我想特別講一個狀態就是說我們看到這個數字當中的時候呢就發現非紅供應鏈我們現在政府努力在做的狀態可是在這一次的關稅的一個大地震當中的時候其實並沒有倖免針對這個部分的時候我想請教一下國發會主委的時候你怎麼樣去看待我們接下來對於整個非紅供應鏈的一個建制\n\n04:34.122 --> 04:54.389\n陳如我剛才講的,其實美國佔全球進口大概是3.34%,大概全球的進口貿易還有86.66%在其他的國家。所以對我們而言,以台灣的經濟產業能量而言,其實我們還有很多其他的市場可以去發展。\n\n04:55.029 --> 05:09.081\n所以有這樣的機會我們希望利用這樣的機會協助廠商去發展讓他的整個風險管理跟這個市場更加的建立所以就是說飛鴻供應鏈這個部分我們還是持續在努力推動嘛原則上是這樣對不對對\n\n05:10.382 --> 05:25.240\nOK好沒問題那我想說在接下來我想特別提到說因為您剛剛也特別提到說我們有一個那個對美的一個溝通的談判小組也成立了那我想說針對比方說以目前來說台積電已經承諾到美國去投資1000億沒有問題那麼\n\n05:27.623 --> 05:44.462\n國防預算也承諾明年要提高到3%GDP是3%那麼經濟部這邊也表示我們要協助整個供應鏈赴美去投資然後總統也特別提到說零關稅那我們現在還有什麼樣的籌碼你覺得現在跟美國在談關稅的時候可以用得上的\n\n05:48.198 --> 06:00.632\n這個兩邊在談判的過程中我想籌碼是不可能攤出來給對方知道那就我的瞭解他是在我們行政院副院長的領導之下然後也他準備了非常完整的\n\n06:01.493 --> 06:27.019\n所以你說那個談判籌碼現在沒辦法講嘛我可以理解不過因為經濟部這邊有特別提到行政院已經完成了盤點對農工石油天然氣等產品大量採購計畫已經盤點完成那麼因為這一次的關稅很大一部分是因為貿易逆差的問題我想請教我們這樣一個大規模盤點之後的時候大概預計可以處理掉多少對美的貿易逆差順差的問題\n\n06:28.764 --> 06:43.012\n這個還是要由談判的人來進行談判因為經濟部的報告裡面有直接提到所以我想知道說我們這個已經完成盤點的這部分的時候大概可以減少多少的一個貿易順差我們只能講說\n\n06:44.353 --> 07:05.231\n這裡面經濟部是盤點了足夠的數字其實我們各個不同不只經濟部各個不同角度都有盤點那這個都是未來的籌碼這個看談判的代表所產生的談判結果所以這個數字已經盤點完成也沒有辦法揭露你的意思是這樣子嗎經濟部長因為這是你的報告當中你的意思也是這樣子嗎\n\n07:07.438 --> 07:23.557\n我們現在經濟部所揭露的是我們經濟部所包括的範圍之內但是這個是經濟部的這個金額我想之後行政院他們談判他們還有其他的資源\n\n07:24.418 --> 07:29.764\n因為你這邊講的行政院這邊已經談判好之後的時候我想之後到本辦公室我們來做這個細部的溝通我們內部這是可以調整的理解剛才像主委在講的就是說這個其實談判是在談判人員他們手上去溝通這個\n\n07:41.235 --> 07:57.887\n那我想因為剛剛有地震可是我發現就是郭部長跟劉主委其實還是非常穩健我們也希望這一次關稅的一個大地震的時候我們台灣能夠順利的一起度過不過我這邊想要再問一個問題就是因為川普他又特別提到一個情況\n\n07:58.667 --> 08:12.926\n就是說台積電如果沒有履行到美國去投資的一個承諾的時候他要對台積電課徵百分之百的關稅針對這個事情我想請教一下郭部長這邊有沒有掌握我們怎麼去因應這件事情\n\n08:13.951 --> 08:33.342\n報告委員我想您的那個訊息從哪裡來我們是不清楚啦到目前為止我是沒有收到這樣的一個訊息OK媒體已經有報導這樣出來今天早上媒體出來的訊息已經是投資的公司嘛所以在講說不會投資這個也是很奇怪的一個論述啦\n\n08:35.786 --> 09:03.948\n所以你剛剛講說你還不知道這個訊息因為這是今天早上一早的媒體的訊息所以我想說報告委員我想媒體的論述也有它的來源但是這個部分必須要由台積電他們自己來回答我的問題是川普因為他公開講如果沒有兌現的時候他就會課徵百分之百的關稅對啦我想這個就是看什麼時候嘛\n\n09:05.430 --> 09:31.231\n什麼時候那另外我想特別針對目前其實台灣的對美出口當中的時候以伺服器跟整個零組件佔的比重非常的高那當然他們目前其實是一個零關稅的一個情況那之後碰到32%的關稅的時候我想特別又把那個所有以伺服器為例我找了一下\n\n09:31.932 --> 09:46.668\n目前全球的十大伺服器的供應商台灣占四家啦那我一找他們的財報出來喔他們的一個淨利率淨利潤大概都低於5%基本上沒有辦法\n\n09:47.569 --> 10:07.905\n去支撐這麼高的一個關稅所以我們對於這樣子的部分的時候我想請教一下部長這邊有沒有什麼回應報告委員那我想您的資料的取得這個當然是一種參考不過這幾家公司大概都是做這個代工的是所以那個稅是這個自己原廠要付\n\n10:08.545 --> 10:20.642\n就是說今天可能是NVDA或者是這些公司包括COCOM這些公司他們或者是美插委這些公司他們要自己付是所以你說關稅他們這邊都不用沒有問題\n\n10:22.313 --> 10:42.598\n這些我們都跟他們談過了伺服器所有的廠商我們都跟他們談過了他們認為32%對他們來講不是問題而且我們現在重點是我們自己的brand我們台灣的台廠那我也問過了你有多少的利潤大概對他們來講這個優勢商品利潤是高於32%\n\n10:43.658 --> 11:04.343\n是高於32%優勢產品嘛因為我是看整個公司的財報啦那如果針對特定的優勢產品我當然相信他們毛利淨利率其實也是高於這個部分至於整個公司財報來說其實是不夠那你剛才有特別提到說針對這個部分的時候基本上買方的時候他會去把這個關稅的部分cover掉\n\n11:05.236 --> 11:20.380\n而且坦白講這些這一個部分也是我們廠商他們自己我們都盤過他們了也跟他們討論過了他們認為對他們來講包括他們是生產的基地不一定只有在台灣理解\n\n11:21.040 --> 11:47.396\n生產基地可能在墨西哥跟美國有一個美墨之間的稅條款所以你覺得因為台灣的出口當中很大一部分在針對伺服器跟ICT產品你覺得這個部分所以這關稅的部分對台灣的出口你覺得影響不會太大是這個意思嗎對就是對伺服器或者台灣的優勢商品譬如說台灣什麼叫優勢商品\n\n11:49.177 --> 12:11.856\n舉個例像我們的汽車零組件Aftermarket大概就是獨佔所以這個Aftermarket你要買台灣的商品那對不起這個32%加上去你還是要準備OK理解那我想說因為我看經濟部的資料當中有提到說我們前30大產品的時候大概佔對於出口美國大概72%我想知道說我們這30\n\n12:14.199 --> 12:31.177\n前30大的產品當中我們是不是有去針對它會受到這個關稅的一些影響像部長剛剛針對伺服器有一個很具體的說明就是不會受到影響我們前30大的產品是不是都有做這樣的一個分析跟評估不是不會受到影響而是這些影響\n\n12:32.857 --> 12:59.345\n廠商可以解決理解這是這個不同的理解完全理解一定會受影響這麼高的這個關稅對我們台灣來講一定是影響只是我們對這個影響如何去解決如何把他這個影響轉到另外一個層級去然後大家來吸收或者是說他們可以承擔這些都是談判小組根據這個國內的能夠承受的程度\n\n12:59.945 --> 13:26.698\n对于跟美国谈判的一个非常重要的关键所以经济部的立场就是不断地来访问国内的这些厂商可能会受影响的厂商他们影响的程度是多少提供给谈判小组做参考所以我想知道说我们经济部针对前30大产品这边是不是也都有做类似伺服器这样的一个评估如果有之后再给本席一个很清楚的一个资料好不好我们现在因为在谈判中对不起这个部分可能\n\n13:27.796 --> 13:54.571\n可能要晚一點尊重那我最後這邊的時候想請國發會這邊因為有提到一個七大百億基金的部分在國發基金裡面那因為國發基金裡面本來就有針對這七大一個產業有一些相關的一些投資的一個計畫我想知道這七大百億基金當中的後續的一個操作會是怎麼樣子只有給本席一個書面的資料好不好好的\n\n13:55.091 --> 13:55.653\nOK好谢谢\n\n","segments":[{"start":8.435,"end":11.513,"text":"謝謝主席 我想請一下郭智慧部長還有劉靜清主委"},{"start":22.841,"end":48.059,"text":"首先先請一下郭部長就是剛剛你有特別回憶一個狀態就是說因為在面對這個美國科30%關稅之後的時候我們有一個880億的一個因應計畫對不對你有特別提到說這880億是特別預算對不對是特別預算可是因為之前柯總早講說這880億是舊有預算所以它到底是特別預算還是舊有預算"},{"start":54.985,"end":60.817,"text":"我們所了解的是特別預算是特別預算嘛所以基本上柯總召之前講的是不對的"},{"start":64.035,"end":86.136,"text":"我們所了解的是 我想這個時間差啦這個預算跟特別預算是完全不一樣 之後要動用也完全不一樣的程序阿在講的那個部分 是不是時間上面的差異啦但是就這個預算來講就是特別預算ok 沒問題喔 特別預算那我們就知道說後續我們立法院這邊要怎麼去配合這件事情"},{"start":86.957,"end":111.587,"text":"那我想另外再特別問一段話因為之前有商種有些企業界朋友他們回應說因為有些貨品現在在海運當中的時候那他們現在碰到4月9號之後課徵32%的關稅的時候可是有新的訊息出來就說如果4月9號之前已經裝船在5月27號之前抵達美國的部分的時候就不會課徵這32%具體的狀態是不是這樣經濟部這邊有沒有掌握"},{"start":114.668,"end":134.647,"text":"報告委員是沒有錯啦就是說你4月9號on board的產品才會課徵這個32%的稅啦4月9號以前出貨從台灣出口的應該是這個具體是這樣的4月5號以前那適用的稅率就是原稅率4月5號到4月9號是加徵10%4月9號以後出貨的"},{"start":140.752,"end":157.443,"text":"加32%所以是以出貨的時間為標準對不對所以4月9號之前裝船的話基本上就不苛徵這32%裝船的時間適用的稅率是嘛 OK所以只要在4月9號搬船4月9號裝船5月27號之前到達美國就不苛徵對不對在報關才能適用我看那個劉主委"},{"start":166.276,"end":190.615,"text":"點頭點得很用力就確定是這樣的狀態嗎?確定那我想說接下來我想來針對這個部分因為我看到那個2017年我們整個出口的統計跟2024年出口的統計因為當中有一個很大的一個部分就是我們政府不斷推新南向這個政策可是我們看到2017年的時候呢"},{"start":191.635,"end":207.8,"text":"對中國大陸跟港澳的一個貿易統計占台灣出口的31.68%出口到美國只占11.37%到去年的狀態的時候對大陸跟港澳的狀態出口是20.27%可是對美國這邊大幅的提高到18.15%"},{"start":209.86,"end":229.899,"text":"所以我們看到一個狀態就是在這段期間當中的時候呢在新南向在東南亞國家這邊其實比重沒有差距很大那對大陸這邊金額沒有差距很大可是比重大幅的下降表示我們對美國這邊的成長非常的多這個數字應該沒有錯吧我看都是按照整個政府這邊的一個統計數字"},{"start":231.36,"end":246.058,"text":"那我想特別問到一個狀態因為在整個國發會這邊有特別提到說我們在整個非紅供應鏈這邊的時候逐漸形成新的商機嘛那政府也想要大力推動國內傳產中小企業進購相關能力拓展還會通路"},{"start":247.519,"end":270.97,"text":"打造一個民主供應鏈我想特別講一個狀態就是說我們看到這個數字當中的時候呢就發現非紅供應鏈我們現在政府努力在做的狀態可是在這一次的關稅的一個大地震當中的時候其實並沒有倖免針對這個部分的時候我想請教一下國發會主委的時候你怎麼樣去看待我們接下來對於整個非紅供應鏈的一個建制"},{"start":274.122,"end":294.389,"text":"陳如我剛才講的,其實美國佔全球進口大概是3.34%,大概全球的進口貿易還有86.66%在其他的國家。所以對我們而言,以台灣的經濟產業能量而言,其實我們還有很多其他的市場可以去發展。"},{"start":295.029,"end":309.081,"text":"所以有這樣的機會我們希望利用這樣的機會協助廠商去發展讓他的整個風險管理跟這個市場更加的建立所以就是說飛鴻供應鏈這個部分我們還是持續在努力推動嘛原則上是這樣對不對對"},{"start":310.382,"end":325.24,"text":"OK好沒問題那我想說在接下來我想特別提到說因為您剛剛也特別提到說我們有一個那個對美的一個溝通的談判小組也成立了那我想說針對比方說以目前來說台積電已經承諾到美國去投資1000億沒有問題那麼"},{"start":327.623,"end":344.462,"text":"國防預算也承諾明年要提高到3%GDP是3%那麼經濟部這邊也表示我們要協助整個供應鏈赴美去投資然後總統也特別提到說零關稅那我們現在還有什麼樣的籌碼你覺得現在跟美國在談關稅的時候可以用得上的"},{"start":348.198,"end":360.632,"text":"這個兩邊在談判的過程中我想籌碼是不可能攤出來給對方知道那就我的瞭解他是在我們行政院副院長的領導之下然後也他準備了非常完整的"},{"start":361.493,"end":387.019,"text":"所以你說那個談判籌碼現在沒辦法講嘛我可以理解不過因為經濟部這邊有特別提到行政院已經完成了盤點對農工石油天然氣等產品大量採購計畫已經盤點完成那麼因為這一次的關稅很大一部分是因為貿易逆差的問題我想請教我們這樣一個大規模盤點之後的時候大概預計可以處理掉多少對美的貿易逆差順差的問題"},{"start":388.764,"end":403.012,"text":"這個還是要由談判的人來進行談判因為經濟部的報告裡面有直接提到所以我想知道說我們這個已經完成盤點的這部分的時候大概可以減少多少的一個貿易順差我們只能講說"},{"start":404.353,"end":425.231,"text":"這裡面經濟部是盤點了足夠的數字 其實我們各個不同 不只經濟部各個不同角度都有盤點那這個都是未來的籌碼 這個看談判的代表所產生的談判結果所以這個數字已經盤點完成也沒有辦法揭露 你的意思是這樣子嗎經濟部長 因為這是你的報告當中 你的意思也是這樣子嗎"},{"start":427.438,"end":443.557,"text":"我們現在經濟部所揭露的是我們經濟部所包括的範圍之內但是這個是經濟部的這個金額我想之後行政院他們談判他們還有其他的資源"},{"start":444.418,"end":449.764,"text":"因為你這邊講的行政院這邊已經談判好之後的時候我想之後到本辦公室我們來做這個細部的溝通我們內部這是可以調整的理解剛才像主委在講的就是說這個其實談判是在談判人員他們手上去溝通這個"},{"start":461.235,"end":477.887,"text":"那我想因為剛剛有地震可是我發現就是郭部長跟劉主委其實還是非常穩健我們也希望這一次關稅的一個大地震的時候我們台灣能夠順利的一起度過不過我這邊想要再問一個問題就是因為川普他又特別提到一個情況"},{"start":478.667,"end":492.926,"text":"就是說台積電如果沒有履行到美國去投資的一個承諾的時候他要對台積電課徵百分之百的關稅針對這個事情我想請教一下郭部長這邊有沒有掌握我們怎麼去因應這件事情"},{"start":493.951,"end":513.342,"text":"報告委員我想您的那個訊息從哪裡來我們是不清楚啦到目前為止我是沒有收到這樣的一個訊息OK媒體已經有報導這樣出來今天早上媒體出來的訊息已經是投資的公司嘛所以在講說不會投資這個也是很奇怪的一個論述啦"},{"start":515.786,"end":543.948,"text":"所以你剛剛講說你還不知道這個訊息因為這是今天早上一早的媒體的訊息所以我想說報告委員我想媒體的論述也有它的來源但是這個部分必須要由台積電他們自己來回答我的問題是川普因為他公開講如果沒有兌現的時候他就會課徵百分之百的關稅對啦我想這個就是看什麼時候嘛"},{"start":545.43,"end":571.231,"text":"什麼時候那另外我想特別針對目前其實台灣的對美出口當中的時候以伺服器跟整個零組件佔的比重非常的高那當然他們目前其實是一個零關稅的一個情況那之後碰到32%的關稅的時候我想特別又把那個所有以伺服器為例我找了一下"},{"start":571.932,"end":586.668,"text":"目前全球的十大伺服器的供應商台灣占四家啦那我一找他們的財報出來喔他們的一個淨利率淨利潤大概都低於5%基本上沒有辦法"},{"start":587.569,"end":607.905,"text":"去支撐這麼高的一個關稅所以我們對於這樣子的部分的時候我想請教一下部長這邊有沒有什麼回應報告委員那我想您的資料的取得這個當然是一種參考不過這幾家公司大概都是做這個代工的是所以那個稅是這個自己原廠要付"},{"start":608.545,"end":620.642,"text":"就是說今天可能是NVDA或者是這些公司包括COCOM這些公司他們或者是美插委這些公司他們要自己付是 所以你說關稅他們這邊都不用沒有問題"},{"start":622.313,"end":642.598,"text":"這些我們都跟他們談過了伺服器所有的廠商我們都跟他們談過了他們認為32%對他們來講不是問題而且我們現在重點是我們自己的brand我們台灣的台廠那我也問過了你有多少的利潤大概對他們來講這個優勢商品利潤是高於32%"},{"start":643.658,"end":664.343,"text":"是高於32%優勢產品嘛因為我是看整個公司的財報啦那如果針對特定的優勢產品我當然相信他們毛利淨利率其實也是高於這個部分至於整個公司財報來說其實是不夠那你剛才有特別提到說針對這個部分的時候基本上買方的時候他會去把這個關稅的部分cover掉"},{"start":665.236,"end":680.38,"text":"而且坦白講這些這一個部分也是我們廠商他們自己我們都盤過他們了也跟他們討論過了他們認為對他們來講包括他們是生產的基地不一定只有在台灣理解"},{"start":681.04,"end":707.396,"text":"生產基地可能在墨西哥跟美國有一個美墨之間的稅條款所以你覺得因為台灣的出口當中很大一部分在針對伺服器跟ICT產品你覺得這個部分所以這關稅的部分對台灣的出口你覺得影響不會太大是這個意思嗎對 就是對伺服器或者台灣的優勢商品譬如說台灣什麼叫優勢商品"},{"start":709.177,"end":731.856,"text":"舉個例像我們的汽車零組件Aftermarket大概就是獨佔所以這個Aftermarket你要買台灣的商品那對不起這個32%加上去你還是要準備OK 理解那我想說因為我看經濟部的資料當中有提到說我們前30大產品的時候大概佔對於出口美國大概72%我想知道說我們這30"},{"start":734.199,"end":751.177,"text":"前30大的產品當中我們是不是有去針對它會受到這個關稅的一些影響像部長剛剛針對伺服器有一個很具體的說明就是不會受到影響我們前30大的產品是不是都有做這樣的一個分析跟評估不是不會受到影響而是這些影響"},{"start":752.857,"end":779.345,"text":"廠商可以解決理解這是這個不同的理解 完全理解一定會受影響這麼高的這個關稅對我們台灣來講一定是影響只是我們對這個影響如何去解決如何把他這個影響轉到另外一個層級去然後大家來吸收或者是說他們可以承擔這些都是談判小組根據這個國內的能夠承受的程度"},{"start":779.945,"end":806.698,"text":"对于跟美国谈判的一个非常重要的关键所以经济部的立场就是不断地来访问国内的这些厂商可能会受影响的厂商他们影响的程度是多少提供给谈判小组做参考所以我想知道说我们经济部针对前30大产品这边是不是也都有做类似伺服器这样的一个评估如果有之后再给本席一个很清楚的一个资料好不好我们现在因为在谈判中对不起这个部分可能"},{"start":807.796,"end":834.571,"text":"可能要晚一點尊重那我最後這邊的時候想請國發會這邊因為有提到一個七大百億基金的部分在國發基金裡面那因為國發基金裡面本來就有針對這七大一個產業有一些相關的一些投資的一個計畫我想知道這七大百億基金當中的後續的一個操作會是怎麼樣子只有給本席一個書面的資料好不好好的"},{"start":835.091,"end":835.653,"text":"OK好谢谢"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":273,"blocks":[["鄭委員正鈐：（10時5分）謝謝主席，我想請一下郭智輝部長還有劉鏡清主委。"],["郭部長智輝：委員早。"],["鄭委員正鈐：首先先請一下郭部長。剛剛你有特別回應，在美國課32%關稅之後，我們有一個880億的因應計畫，對不對？你有特別提到這880億是特別預算，對不對？"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["鄭委員正鈐：特別預算。可是之前柯總召說這880億是舊有預算，這到底是特別預算，還是舊有預算？"],["郭部長智輝：我們所了解的是特別預算。"],["鄭委員正鈐：是特別預算嘛。"],["郭部長智輝：是。"],["鄭委員正鈐：所以基本上，柯總召之前講的是不對的，OK，好。"],["郭部長智輝：我們所了解的是，我想這個是時間差啦，這個……"],["鄭委員正鈐：不一樣喔！舊有預算跟特別預算完全不一樣，之後要動用也是完全不一樣的程序啊！"],["郭部長智輝：我知道，但是委員剛剛在講的那個部分，是不是時間上面的差異？我就這個預算來講，就是特別預算。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，沒問題，只要是特別預算，我們就知道後續我們立法院這邊要怎麼去配合這件事情。","我想另外再特別問，因為之前有商總、企業界朋友反映有些貨品在海運當中，在4月9號之後，課徵32%的關稅，可是也有新的訊息說，如果4月9號之前已經裝船，在5月27號之前抵達美國的時候就不會課徵這32%，具體的狀態是不是這樣？經濟部這邊有沒有掌握？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，是沒有錯啦，就是說你4月9號on board的產品，才會課徵這個32%的稅。"],["鄭委員正鈐：是。"],["郭部長智輝：4月9號以前出貨，從臺灣出口的，應該具體是這樣，4月5號以前，適用的稅率就是原稅率。"],["鄭委員正鈐：是。"],["郭部長智輝：4月5號到4月9號是加徵10%；4月9號以後出貨的加32%。"],["鄭委員正鈐：是以出貨的時間為標準，對不對？所以4月9號之前裝船的話，基本上就不課徵這32%。"],["郭部長智輝：裝船的時間適用的稅率。"],["鄭委員正鈐：是嘛。所以只要在4月9號，包含4月9號裝船，5月27號之前到達美國，就不課徵，對不對？"],["郭部長智輝：對，5月27號再報關才能適用。"],["鄭委員正鈐：我看劉主委點頭點得很用力，就確定是這樣的狀態嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：確定。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，好。接下來我想針對的部份，因為我看到2017年我們出口的統計跟2024年出口統計，當中有一個很大的部分，是我們政府不斷推新南向這個政策。我們看到2017年的時候，對中國大陸跟港澳的貿易統計，占臺灣出口的31.68%，出口到美國只占11.37%；到去年的時候，對大陸跟港澳的出口是20.27%，可是對美國大幅地提高到18.15%。所以我們看到在這段期間當中，在新南向、東南亞國家其實比重沒有差距很大，對大陸金額沒有差距很大，可是比重大幅地下降，表示我們對美國的成長非常地多，這個數字應該沒有錯吧！我看都是按照政府的統計數字。","我想特別問到，因為國發會有特別提到，我們在非紅供應鏈逐漸形成新的商機，政府也想要大力推動國內傳產、中小企業建構相關能力、拓展海外通路，打造一個民主供應鏈。我想特別講，我們看到這個數字的時候，就發現非紅供應鏈是我們現在政府努力在做的，可是在這一次的關稅大地震當中幾乎並沒有倖免。針對這個部分，我想請教一下國發會主委，你怎麼樣去看待我們接下來對於整個非紅供應鏈的建置？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：誠如我剛才講的，其實美國占全球進口大概是13.34%，大概全球的進口貿易還有86.66%在其他的國家。"],["鄭委員正鈐：是。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：所以對我們而言，以臺灣的經濟產業能量而言，其實我們還有很多其他的市場可以去發展，所以有這樣的機會，我們希望利用這樣的機會協助廠商去發展，讓他整個風險管理跟這個市場更佳地健全。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK！理解，所以就是非紅供應鏈這個部分，我們還是持續努力推動，原則上是這樣，對不對？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：對。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK！好，沒問題。接下來，因為您剛剛也特別提到我們有一個對美溝通的談判小組也成立了，以目前來說，針對台積電已經承諾到美國去投資1,000億沒有問題，也承諾國防預算明年要提高到GDP的3%，經濟部這邊也表示要協助整個供應鏈赴美投資，總統也特別提到零關稅，我們還有什麼樣的籌碼是你覺得現在跟美國在談關稅時可以用得上的？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：兩邊在談判的過程中，籌碼不可能攤出來給對方知道，就我的了解，在我們行政院副院長的領導之下，他準備了非常完整的籌碼在手上。"],["鄭委員正鈐：所以你說談判籌碼現在沒辦法講嘛！我可以理解，不過因為經濟部有特別提到行政院針對農、工、石油、天然氣等產品大量採購計畫已經盤點完成，因為這一次的關稅很大一部分是因為貿易逆差的問題。我想請教，經過這樣一個大規模盤點之後，大概預計可以處理掉多少對美貿易順差的問題？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：這個還是要由談判的人來進行談判才……"],["鄭委員正鈐：因為經濟部的報告裡面有直接提到，所以我想知道已經完成盤點的部分，大概可以減少多少貿易順差？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我們只能說，這裡面經濟部盤點了足夠的數字，其實不只經濟部，各個不同角度都有盤點，這都是未來的籌碼，要看談判的代表所產生的談判結果。"],["鄭委員正鈐：所以這個數字已經盤點完成，也沒有辦法揭露，你的意思是這樣子嗎？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：對，要不然的話……"],["鄭委員正鈐：經濟部長，這是在你的報告當中，你的意思也是這樣子嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：現在我們所揭露的是經濟部包括的範圍之內，但是這是經濟部的金額。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，我想之後……"],["郭部長智輝：行政院對於談判還有其他的資源。"],["鄭委員正鈐：因為你講行政院已經盤點好，所以之後請到本辦公室，我們來做細部的溝通。"],["郭部長智輝：一千八百多是我們內部，這是可以調整的。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解。"],["郭部長智輝：剛才像主委講的，其實談判是在談判人員的手上去溝通……"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，剛剛有地震，可是我發現郭部長跟劉主委其實還是非常穩健，我們也希望這一次關稅大地震，臺灣能夠順利地一起度過。不過我想要再問一個問題，因為川普又特別提到一個情況，台積電如果沒有履行到美國投資的承諾，他要對台積電課徵100%的關稅。針對這個事情，我想請教一下郭部長有沒有掌握？我們怎麼去因應這件事情？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，您的訊息從哪裡來，我們是不清楚啦，到目前為止，我沒有收到這樣一個訊息。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK！媒體已經有這樣的報導出來，是今天早上媒體出來的訊息。"],["郭部長智輝：台積電是已經在美國投資的公司，所以你講說不會投資，這個也是很奇怪的一個論述。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK，所以你剛剛說你還不知道這個訊息，因為這是今天一早媒體的訊息，所以我想說……"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，我想媒體的論述也有它的來源，但是這個部分必須要由台積電自己來回答，因為它要……"],["鄭委員正鈐：我問的問題是川普公開講，如果沒有兌現的時候，他就會課徵100%的關稅。"],["郭部長智輝：對啦，我想這個就是看什麼時候嘛！"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK！另外，針對目前臺灣對美出口當中，伺服器跟整個零組件占的比重非常高，當然他們目前其實是零關稅的情況，之後碰到32%關稅時，我特別以伺服器為例，我找了一下目前全球10大伺服器供應商，臺灣占4家，我也找了他們的財報出來，他們的淨利率、淨利潤大概都低於5%，基本上沒有辦法去支撐這麼高的關稅。我們對於這樣的狀況，我想請教一下部長，有沒有什麼回應？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，您的資料取得當然是一種參考，不過這幾家公司大概都是做代工的、OEM。"],["鄭委員正鈐：是。"],["郭部長智輝：所以稅是自己原廠要付，就是說今天可能是NVIDIA或者是包括Qualcomm、美超微這些公司他們要自己付。"],["鄭委員正鈐：是，所以你說關稅他們這邊都不用？"],["郭部長智輝：沒有問題啦！這些我們都跟他們談過了，我們都跟伺服器所有的廠商談過了。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK。"],["郭部長智輝：他們認為32%對他們來講不是問題。"],["鄭委員正鈐：不是問題。"],["郭部長智輝：而且現在重點是我們自己的branch，我們的臺廠，我也問過他們有多少利潤，大概對他們來講，優勢商品利潤是高於32%。"],["鄭委員正鈐：是高於32%？"],["郭部長智輝：優勢產品嘛！它當然就是……"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK！因為我是看整個公司的財報，如果針對特定的優勢產品，我當然相信他們的淨利率其實也是高於這個部分，但以整個公司財報來說其實是不夠的，你剛才有特別提到針對這個部分，基本上買方會去把關稅的部分cover掉。"],["郭部長智輝：對，而且坦白講這一個部分也是廠商他們自己，我們都盤過，也跟他們討論過了，他們認為對他們來講，包括生產的基地不一定只有在臺灣。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解。"],["郭部長智輝：生產基地可能在墨西哥，墨西哥跟美國有一個美墨之間的免稅條款，所以……"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解、理解。因為臺灣的出口當中很大一部分是針對伺服器跟ICT產品，所以你覺得關稅的部分對臺灣的出口影響不會太大，是這個意思嗎？"],["郭部長智輝：對，就是對伺服器或者臺灣的優勢商品，什麼叫優勢商品？舉個例，像我們的汽車零組件aftermarket大概就是獨占，所以像aftermarket，你要買臺灣的商品，對不起，32%加上去，你還是跟我買。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK！理解，經濟部的資料當中有提到，我們前30大產品出口美國大概占72%，我想知道這前30大的產品當中，我們是不是有評估它會受到關稅的影響程度？像部長剛剛針對伺服器有一個很具體的說明，覺得不會受到影響，而我們前30大產品是不是都有做這樣的分析跟評估？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，不是不會受到影響，而是這些影響廠商可以解決。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解、理解。"],["郭部長智輝：這是不同的，不是說不會受影響，一定會受影響。"],["鄭委員正鈐：完全理解。"],["郭部長智輝：這麼高的關稅對我們臺灣來講一定是影響，只是我們對這個影響如何去解決，如何把這個影響轉到另外一個層級去。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解。"],["郭部長智輝：然後大家來吸收或者是他們可以承擔，這些都是談判小組根據國內能夠承受的程度，去跟美國談判的一個非常重要的關鍵，所以經濟部的立場就是不斷訪問國內這些可能會受影響的廠商，看看他們受影響的程度是多少，提供談判小組參考。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解，我想知道經濟部針對前30大產品是不是也都有做類似伺服器這樣的評估？"],["郭部長智輝：是的。"],["鄭委員正鈐：如果有做，再給本席一個很清楚的資料，好不好？"],["郭部長智輝：我們現在因為在談判中，對不起，這個部分可能……"],["鄭委員正鈐：還不能夠給，是不是？"],["郭部長智輝：可能要晚一點，好不好？"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK！好，尊重。我最後想請問國發會，因為也有提到在國發基金裡面有一個七大百億基金的部分，因為國發基金本來就有針對七大產業有一些相關投資計畫，我想知道這七大百億基金當中後續的操作會是怎麼樣，之後給本席一個書面資料，好不好？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：好的。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK！好，謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝。在張啓楷委員詢答結束後我們休息2分鐘。","現在請張啓楷委員詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":116,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-7","speakers":["謝衣鳯","邱議瑩","邱志偉","楊瓊瓔","鄭正鈐","張啓楷","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","陳亭妃","呂玉玲","賴瑞隆","徐巧芯","張嘉郡","洪孟楷","劉書彬","李坤城","鍾佳濱","蔡易餘","黃國昌","牛煦庭","林倩綺","陳冠廷","黃建賓","徐富癸","葉元之","徐欣瑩","陳超明","劉建國"],"page_start":37,"meetingDate":["2025-04-09"],"gazette_id":"1143501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143501_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第7次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請經濟部部長及國家發展委員會主任委員就「國際經貿情勢變化，提出協助國內傳統產業及中\n小企業因應之對策」進行報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1143501_00002"}}}