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口頭報告大概要經過三個月的時間 對嗎\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 133.897, \"end\": 134.117, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"整\", \"start\": 134.117, \"end\": 134.798, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"凍\"}, {\"word\": \"結\"}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 134.798, \"end\": 135.939, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"凍\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 135.939, \"end\": 136.599, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 136.599, \"end\": 137.52, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 137.52, \"end\": 137.68, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 137.68, \"end\": 138.321, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"從\"}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 138.321, \"end\": 139.201, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"凍\"}, {\"word\": \"送\", \"start\": 139.201, \"end\": 139.882, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 139.882, \"end\": 140.182, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"口\", \"start\": 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\"然後再來三月中我們覺得自愛難行我們提出了所謂的復議但是他們也否決了這個復議那現在其實在四月初的時候我們就不斷的聽到藍白的委員一直在講說你們送進報告我們馬上就可以讓你可以動用這個金額了\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"然\", \"start\": 173.666, \"end\": 173.766, \"score\": 0.677}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 173.766, \"end\": 173.886, \"score\": 0.709}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 173.886, \"end\": 174.346, \"score\": 0.818}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"三\", \"start\": 174.346, \"end\": 174.486, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"月\", \"start\": 174.486, \"end\": 174.646, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 174.646, \"end\": 174.986, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 174.986, \"end\": 175.587, \"score\": 0.846}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"覺\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 175.587, \"end\": 175.747, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"自\", \"start\": 175.747, \"end\": 176.207, \"score\": 0.848}, {\"word\": \"愛\"}, {\"word\": \"難\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 176.207, \"end\": 176.387, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 176.387, \"end\": 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\"text\": \"我們來看一下他們是怎麼操作的我不知道這樣解釋對不對但我看起來其實我就幫大家整理一下先大規模的一個凍結其實刻意讓各個單位認為說這個很多的東西是無法正常的運行再來再否決你的復議案\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 189.592, \"end\": 189.973, \"score\": 0.806}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"看\", \"start\": 189.973, \"end\": 190.113, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 190.113, \"end\": 190.193, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 190.193, \"end\": 190.473, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 190.473, \"end\": 190.674, \"score\": 0.893}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 190.674, \"end\": 190.814, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"怎\", \"start\": 190.814, \"end\": 191.034, \"score\": 0.879}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"操\", \"start\": 191.034, \"end\": 191.234, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"作\", \"start\": 191.234, \"end\": 191.415, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 191.415, \"end\": 192.055, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 192.055, \"end\": 192.216, 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\"營造這個政府失能的一個形象然後第三個呢就是限三個禮拜之內要行政單位來交出所謂的解凍的報告那我上次其實在委員會當中其實我有特別提到這個有研究員他們也講\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"營\"}, {\"word\": \"造\", \"start\": 206.054, \"end\": 206.435, \"score\": 0.757}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 206.435, \"end\": 206.615, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"府\", \"start\": 206.615, \"end\": 206.795, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"失\", \"start\": 206.795, \"end\": 206.996, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 206.996, \"end\": 207.136, \"score\": 0.816}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 207.136, \"end\": 207.196, \"score\": 0.64}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 207.196, \"end\": 207.356, \"score\": 0.552}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"形\", \"start\": 207.356, \"end\": 207.556, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"象\", \"start\": 207.556, \"end\": 208.057, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"然\", \"start\": 208.057, \"end\": 208.077, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 208.077, \"end\": 208.297, \"score\": 0.854}, {\"word\": 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\"end\": 928.039, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 928.039, \"end\": 928.059, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 947.705, \"end\": 947.968, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"各\", \"start\": 947.968, \"end\": 948.11, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 948.11, \"end\": 948.434, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"節\"}, {\"word\": \"目\", \"start\": 948.434, \"end\": 948.454, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:10,033 --> 00:00:13,477\n謝謝主席有請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備詢國務院好院長好我想川普的關稅大刀是砍向全世界但是我們台灣是第一批能夠進入到跟川普跟美國政府\n\n2\n00:00:33,683 --> 00:01:02,095\n第一批的一個國家可以來做對談我想這是很好的一個機會喔那麼也希望陸續能夠聽到一些好消息一定努力好院長我想請教您一個比較簡單的一個問題喔如果這個預算呢可以隨便的凍結然後隨便再靠一個所謂的這個倒數計時器來逼行政單位來做解凍那請問這個凍結預算的意義到底是什麼那到底是為了要追蹤改善呢還是為了要政治表演所以現在有這樣子的一個狀況喔\n\n3\n00:01:03,482 --> 00:01:33,125\n您覺得呢應該大家都很清楚在整個預算法裡面對於審查預算是沒有所謂凍結的這個項目的啦刪減就可以刪減通過就通過所以沒有凍結凍結是因為委員們對於行政院所做的一些事情希望再提出一些說明所以把它凍結了但是如果凍結的過程它附帶了一些條件目前我們連這個條件都還沒有達到也很難在這個時候就提出要去解凍的任何程序\n\n4\n00:01:34,188 --> 00:01:47,237\n我想這個凍結的部分我們就以中研院為例上個禮拜其實因為我們也才跟中研院來做委員會上面的一個質詢以中研院的這個部分在教文會當中其實我們凍結的金額是1250萬\n\n5\n00:01:49,819 --> 00:02:13,537\n那看似好像沒有什麼不多啦齁但是別忘了其實還有所謂的這個全院凍結的部分是高達了有這個11億喔那我想呢現在呢有委員這個設計了所謂的這個解凍計時器那他們可能真的是誤以為喔這個解凍預算喔好像是把那個一塊肌肉啊從冷凍庫拿下來然後放進這個微波爐逼一下可能之後就可以馬上就可以吃了喔\n\n6\n00:02:13,897 --> 00:02:22,904\n其實整個凍結解凍的過程如果從解凍送進報告口頭報告大概要經過三個月的時間對嗎\n\n7\n00:02:24,572 --> 00:02:53,241\n過去解凍的例子雖然也是有但比較少要到院會裡面來通過通常在委員會裡面或者是書面報告或者是口頭的說明委員會裡面就會通過現在是很多數的凍結案都要到院會裡面來院會的時間是非常有限而且非常寶貴的我也不曉得將來立法院大院怎麼來解決這些凍結案的問題所以我們還記得這個1月底他們開始這個凍結預算刪除預算這個是1月底的事情\n\n8\n00:02:53,666 --> 00:03:07,871\n然後再來三月中我們覺得自愛難行我們提出了所謂的復議但是他們也否決了這個復議那現在其實在四月初的時候我們就不斷的聽到藍白的委員一直在講說你們送進報告我們馬上就可以讓你可以動用這個金額了\n\n9\n00:03:09,592 --> 00:03:25,213\n我們來看一下他們是怎麼操作的我不知道這樣解釋對不對但我看起來其實我就幫大家整理一下先大規模的一個凍結其實刻意讓各個單位認為說這個很多的東西是無法正常的運行再來再否決你的復議案\n\n10\n00:03:26,054 --> 00:03:41,252\n營造這個政府失能的一個形象然後第三個呢就是限三個禮拜之內要行政單位來交出所謂的解凍的報告那我上次其實在委員會當中其實我有特別提到這個有研究員他們也講\n\n11\n00:03:42,393 --> 00:04:07,483\n雖然看似好像中研院的預算被凍結的金額不高但是也已經確定有一些項目在跟比方說在日本進行20年的這個長期的研究也被迫要被終止了那我想這樣子的監督改善放一個計時倒數計時期放在這個地方到底是為了什麼那我們還記得其實今年這個228事件其實我們邁入的第78年\n\n12\n00:04:08,763 --> 00:04:31,620\n那藍白聯手煽動了大概內政部的預算也直接衝擊了228事件紀念基金會的一個運作其實已經模糊了228事件其實是台灣人的傷痕跟歷史他不斷的是用所謂的預算的權力來壓制了這個歷史跟真相而且也影響到基金會要照顧這些受難者的\n\n13\n00:04:32,288 --> 00:04:58,874\n受難者本身跟受難家屬的一個計畫我想問一下行政院長我們的行政機關是不是有信心可以堅守所謂的解凍報告堅守這個所謂的解凍的報告而不做所謂的交差形式來呼應他們這些所謂的政治上的動作因為我們也擔心我們的報告寫得太長他說你動作太慢寫得太\n\n14\n00:04:59,954 --> 00:05:13,883\n寫的不夠多他說啊你忽略我你真的也不重視我的這個委員會也不尊重我這個委員會目前我們應該要怎麼樣來保護這個行政單位跟公務人員不要被這樣子的政治動作給綁架院長\n\n15\n00:05:14,582 --> 00:05:33,918\n是如委員所說的二八基金會如果我沒有記錯他大概三千六百多萬的預算被三減兩千五百多萬凍結了六百多萬幾乎是三千六百多萬當中的兩三千兩百萬不是被刪就是被凍他把媒體的政策所有的業務的費用是全數刪除更難為的是他把他\n\n16\n00:05:34,719 --> 00:05:48,976\n集中在某一個單一的項目、科目裡面單一的項目裡面把它刪減了或凍除了所以它的業務費用是沒有辦法執行的這個是普遍發生在現在所有部會當中的所以我認為解鈴要須繫鈴人解凍也要凍結人\n\n17\n00:05:53,635 --> 00:06:17,519\n自己要知道過去做了這個事情之後又設了很多的門檻跟條件當我們還沒有達到的時候如果貿然提出可能又引起另外一次的批評所以這整個預算我們現在一方面在研議是否再度尋求憲政的救濟同時我們也希望是否能夠啟動過去兩院協商的機制再就目前的預算如何有效的實施對全民最有利\n\n18\n00:06:18,052 --> 00:06:25,458\n我們兩個在進行有可不可能再進行一次的協商好我們只能就是繼續努力了好那接下來我想請教一下這個請農業部麻煩請農業部長備詢\n\n19\n00:06:41,226 --> 00:06:54,551\n我也好部長好這根據農業部的統計因為我們是五年做一次的調查關於所謂的全國的犬貓的一些數量在2023年全國的家犬跟家貓估計是比2021年要增加了19%跟50%目前已經來到了所謂的150萬隻的家犬跟135萬隻的家貓這個還是2023年的資料279萬對\n\n20\n00:07:10,256 --> 00:07:31,528\n好那接著下來其實我相信很多人關心的就是每一個四組他們對於這個毛小孩的照顧那我們也經過這個統計就是包含每年在支出的項目的前三名對於毛小孩的一個照顧的部分第一名當然就是醫療跟照護那第二個就是我們的飼料跟零食再來第三個是美容服務跟這個住宿\n\n21\n00:07:32,108 --> 00:07:56,485\n那是最為所謂的這個市主他們所關心的一個部分那今天其實我想要就兩個問題來請教一下這個我們的這個部長就是市主其實是非常關心所謂的這個飼料跟零食還有美容服務跟這個住宿的部分那我們就先就這個美容住宿的部分來向這個部長請教一下因為目前我們知道可以合法寄養的寵物店大概將近有3000家大概2841家\n\n22\n00:08:03,388 --> 00:08:20,973\n相較於前五年來講是2184家其實已經增加了大概百分之三十這兩年特別的快速每一個月當中其實我們就增加了大概將近有11家之多每一個月都在增加所謂的寵物寄養的數量\n\n23\n00:08:23,334 --> 00:08:45,408\n那我想呢以前我們可能都會碰到說比方說我可能要出遊啦我要出差啦我要出國啦在短期的當中我可能就是叫把寵貓犬貓我可能是寄養要不就是寵物旅館那要不就是請朋友來幫我照顧或帶到朋友的家但是呢現在其實還有另外一種對不起另外還有一種選擇就是呢他們是\n\n24\n00:08:46,048 --> 00:09:05,919\n放在所謂的平台當中他們所媒合的一些寵物保母之類的問題是現行我們的法規當中這個寄宿跟安親寵物的寄養行為其實它是必須要符合所謂的特定寵物管理辦法當中的規定要有特寵證\n\n25\n00:09:07,841 --> 00:09:35,784\n這個特種證其實是向我們的經濟部來申請營業登記的一個項目除了是保障所謂的消費者當然也要保障業者當然提供相對的一個保障能夠來增加所謂的動物的一個福祉但是為什麼我說這個制度跟所謂的證照的部分其實真的會需要所謂的通盤的考量最主要的原因是因為我們剛剛有提到就是\n\n26\n00:09:36,304 --> 00:10:00,212\n有一些平台類似像寵物的Airbnb但是這個是平台上面它有一些些說我可以來登記我可以來照顧貓犬但是這些所謂的被寄養的這個寄養的不管是家庭也好或者是個人的這個短期的這個照護也好其實第一考量到它是沒有所謂的證照的它是沒有證照的\n\n27\n00:10:00,592 --> 00:10:16,572\n那在管理的部分其實可能就會有所謂的灰色地帶那這個灰色地帶我們應該要怎麼樣萬一發生問題由誰來負責因為我們曾經也聽到就是有一些就是毛小孩的爸爸媽媽他們把自己的毛小孩送去之後可能第一天他就骨折了\n\n28\n00:10:16,912 --> 00:10:40,951\n那到底這個責任要歸咎這個平台呢還是要歸咎這個所謂的寄養的這個家庭那在專業的照護的寄養跟這個商業的寄養當中有沒有符合所謂的專業技術的一個門檻到目前為止其實我們還沒有所謂的官方的一個管理的機制或者是考核的一個機制那就這個部分農業部這邊我們可以扮演什麼樣的角色怎麼樣來輔導他們呢\n\n29\n00:10:43,417 --> 00:11:11,520\n我跟委員報告就是我們現在在做的大概分為兩個面向一個面向是制度面的部分就是剛才特別提到的我們如果是專業的寄養我們有相關的要向中央主管機構向各地方去登記但是你剛才講像BMB的部分這種類似寵物保母的這個部分那我覺得人的能力一定要先被建立所以我們現在正在規劃類似我們寵物美容的技術是一樣\n\n30\n00:11:12,060 --> 00:11:33,970\n我們會變成一個動物照護的一個技術是讓他領有丙級的這個證照先把人處理了以後然後第二個部分就是我們希望說建立一個所謂的寄養或是相關的這個所謂的定型化契約那定型化契約就可以釐清相關的責任因為現在目前並沒有所謂定型化契約的責任所以先就這兩點我們先\n\n31\n00:11:35,431 --> 00:11:58,272\n現在目前我們是有所謂的寵物的美容定型化的契約啦但是沒有寄養但是寄養的部分其實是還沒有的我們現在就要做這個寄養的部分好那大概什麼時候因為我剛剛有聽到部長您說現在目前已經在規劃了大概最快什麼時候可以上路我是跟我們的動保師講說在五月底之前要把所有的這個包括我們的定型化契約先做出來那有關於寵物\n\n32\n00:11:59,233 --> 00:12:20,476\n照護的這個技術是拿丙級證照的我希望他六月底的時候能夠把相關的規範因為他比較嚴謹必須要有一些規範所以我們聽到兩個比較肯定跟正面的一個答覆了就是說關於寵物定型化的契約我們是在五月底那另外就是關於所謂的照護者他們自己本身的證照的一個認可我們可能希望能夠在六月底的部分\n\n33\n00:12:20,896 --> 00:12:35,385\n好那第二個問題我想要關心的就是寵物食品安全的問題了我想這個寵物食品安全問題也是很多的這個事主他們其實也都有相對的一些澄清案件跟提出那首先我先要謝謝就是我們的基層的行政人員對於所謂的這個\n\n34\n00:12:37,606 --> 00:13:02,615\n農業部我們在這個食安就是寵物的食安的部分其實我們也有相對來講其實比過去更加嚴謹的一個把關但是現在凸顯的一個問題我們看到光是寵物食品登記業者從2018年的642家到2022年增加到所謂的3286家其實累計已經增加了將近4倍這個還是只有在2022年之前的一個資料但現在可能又不止了\n\n35\n00:13:03,115 --> 00:13:27,157\n那我想這個寵物食品目前申報的部分其實我們是鼓勵他們能夠主動申報自主申報但問題是在自主申報的這樣子的一個狀況之下其實就有很多很多的漏洞會跑出來了我們舉例來講像之前我們看到這個主動申報的一個方式我個人認為其實是比較難以確保寵物食品安全\n\n36\n00:13:27,677 --> 00:13:44,658\n因為在這個這個應該算是在去年為例有381件的違規當中其實有335件大概88%將近快要90%其實就是沒有按照申報而違規的這個案例其實這個比例上是高的我們怎麼樣來\n\n37\n00:13:45,599 --> 00:14:00,724\n改變這個制度就是從主動申報還是我們要主動去稽查因為市面當中有太多其實跟源頭也相關包含寵物食品的源頭代工廠其實他們都有可能會是問題最重要的一個源頭這個部分我們怎麼樣來加強\n\n38\n00:14:02,250 --> 00:14:28,990\n我想同樣也是分兩個部分就像委員一直要期待我們的那個寵物專法但是寵物專法現在目前已經經過預告而且重新收斂了以後正在我們的法規會去做審議諸刀確認然後就會送行政院但是在這個法完全通過之前我們也是要協助就是用過往的這種自主申報它有很多灰色地帶跟漏洞的部分如果我們從\n\n39\n00:14:30,271 --> 00:14:49,287\n去年度的違規的樣態來講21.6%左右是屬於申報樣態不符合的那申報樣態不符合表示說有一些寵物食品它的規列可能業者不是非常清楚那這個部分我想我們會更積極的把它的正面表列的部分去處理讓業者能夠針對它的樣態能夠處理\n\n40\n00:14:52,350 --> 00:15:13,371\n第二個部分是標示不實的部分大概佔了百分之16.5的左右大概16.5那這個標示不實的部分就牽扯到裡面的內容物就是寵物食品的有害物質跟它的這些不該有的這些物質本身它的規範不明確那這個部分我們今年特別的增加了五種\n\n41\n00:15:14,432 --> 00:15:28,059\n相關的這些有害物質的這些公告包括含有汞的部分然後希望說能夠讓毛小孩更健康的用他的飲食好因為最後其實我們在輸往歐盟的這個所謂的外銷的部分\n\n42\n00:15:47,705 --> 00:15:48,454\n好謝謝各位節目\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n10033\t13477\t謝謝主席有請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備詢國務院好院長好我想川普的關稅大刀是砍向全世界但是我們台灣是第一批能夠進入到跟川普跟美國政府\n33683\t62095\t第一批的一個國家可以來做對談我想這是很好的一個機會喔那麼也希望陸續能夠聽到一些好消息一定努力好 院長我想請教您一個比較簡單的一個問題喔如果這個預算呢可以隨便的凍結然後隨便再靠一個所謂的這個倒數計時器來逼行政單位來做解凍那請問這個凍結預算的意義到底是什麼那到底是為了要追蹤改善呢還是為了要政治表演所以現在有這樣子的一個狀況喔\n63482\t93125\t您覺得呢應該大家都很清楚在整個預算法裡面對於審查預算是沒有所謂凍結的這個項目的啦刪減就可以刪減通過就通過 所以沒有凍結凍結是因為委員們對於行政院所做的一些事情希望再提出一些說明所以把它凍結了但是如果凍結的過程它附帶了一些條件目前我們連這個條件都還沒有達到也很難在這個時候就提出要去解凍的任何程序\n94188\t107237\t我想這個凍結的部分我們就以中研院為例上個禮拜其實因為我們也才跟中研院來做委員會上面的一個質詢以中研院的這個部分在教文會當中其實我們凍結的金額是1250萬\n109819\t133537\t那看似好像沒有什麼不多啦齁但是別忘了其實還有所謂的這個全院凍結的部分是高達了有這個11億喔那我想呢現在呢有委員這個設計了所謂的這個解凍計時器那他們可能真的是誤以為喔這個解凍預算喔好像是把那個一塊肌肉啊從冷凍庫拿下來然後放進這個微波爐逼一下可能之後就可以馬上就可以吃了喔\n133897\t142904\t其實整個凍結解凍的過程如果從解凍送進報告 口頭報告大概要經過三個月的時間 對嗎\n144572\t173241\t過去解凍的例子雖然也是有但比較少要到院會裡面來通過通常在委員會裡面或者是書面報告或者是口頭的說明委員會裡面就會通過現在是很多數的凍結案都要到院會裡面來院會的時間是非常有限而且非常寶貴的我也不曉得將來立法院大院怎麼來解決這些凍結案的問題所以我們還記得這個1月底他們開始這個凍結預算刪除預算這個是1月底的事情\n173666\t187871\t然後再來三月中我們覺得自愛難行我們提出了所謂的復議但是他們也否決了這個復議那現在其實在四月初的時候我們就不斷的聽到藍白的委員一直在講說你們送進報告我們馬上就可以讓你可以動用這個金額了\n189592\t205213\t我們來看一下他們是怎麼操作的我不知道這樣解釋對不對但我看起來其實我就幫大家整理一下先大規模的一個凍結其實刻意讓各個單位認為說這個很多的東西是無法正常的運行再來再否決你的復議案\n206054\t221252\t營造這個政府失能的一個形象然後第三個呢就是限三個禮拜之內要行政單位來交出所謂的解凍的報告那我上次其實在委員會當中其實我有特別提到這個有研究員他們也講\n222393\t247483\t雖然看似好像中研院的預算被凍結的金額不高但是也已經確定有一些項目在跟比方說在日本進行20年的這個長期的研究也被迫要被終止了那我想這樣子的監督改善放一個計時倒數計時期放在這個地方到底是為了什麼那我們還記得其實今年這個228事件其實我們邁入的第78年\n248763\t271620\t那藍白聯手煽動了大概內政部的預算也直接衝擊了228事件紀念基金會的一個運作其實已經模糊了228事件其實是台灣人的傷痕跟歷史他不斷的是用所謂的預算的權力來壓制了這個歷史跟真相而且也影響到基金會要照顧這些受難者的\n272288\t298874\t受難者本身跟受難家屬的一個計畫我想問一下行政院長我們的行政機關是不是有信心可以堅守所謂的解凍報告堅守這個所謂的解凍的報告而不做所謂的交差形式來呼應他們這些所謂的政治上的動作因為我們也擔心我們的報告寫得太長他說你動作太慢寫得太\n299954\t313883\t寫的不夠多他說啊你忽略我你真的也不重視我的這個委員會也不尊重我這個委員會目前我們應該要怎麼樣來保護這個行政單位跟公務人員不要被這樣子的政治動作給綁架院長\n314582\t333918\t是如委員所說的二八基金會如果我沒有記錯他大概三千六百多萬的預算被三減兩千五百多萬凍結了六百多萬幾乎是三千六百多萬當中的兩三千兩百萬不是被刪就是被凍他把媒體的政策所有的業務的費用是全數刪除更難為的是他把他\n334719\t348976\t集中在某一個單一的項目、科目裡面單一的項目裡面把它刪減了或凍除了所以它的業務費用是沒有辦法執行的這個是普遍發生在現在所有部會當中的所以我認為解鈴要須繫鈴人解凍也要凍結人\n353635\t377519\t自己要知道過去做了這個事情之後又設了很多的門檻跟條件當我們還沒有達到的時候如果貿然提出可能又引起另外一次的批評所以這整個預算我們現在一方面在研議是否再度尋求憲政的救濟同時我們也希望是否能夠啟動過去兩院協商的機制再就目前的預算如何有效的實施對全民最有利\n378052\t385458\t我們兩個在進行有可不可能再進行一次的協商好我們只能就是繼續努力了好那接下來我想請教一下這個請農業部麻煩請農業部長備詢\n401226\t414551\t我也好部長好這根據農業部的統計因為我們是五年做一次的調查關於所謂的全國的犬貓的一些數量在2023年全國的家犬跟家貓估計是比2021年要增加了19%跟50%目前已經來到了所謂的150萬隻的家犬跟135萬隻的家貓這個還是2023年的資料279萬對\n430256\t451528\t好 那接著下來其實我相信很多人關心的就是每一個四組他們對於這個毛小孩的照顧那我們也經過這個統計就是包含每年在支出的項目的前三名對於毛小孩的一個照顧的部分第一名當然就是醫療跟照護那第二個就是我們的飼料跟零食再來第三個是美容服務跟這個住宿\n452108\t476485\t那是最為所謂的這個市主他們所關心的一個部分那今天其實我想要就兩個問題來請教一下這個我們的這個部長就是市主其實是非常關心所謂的這個飼料跟零食還有美容服務跟這個住宿的部分那我們就先就這個美容住宿的部分來向這個部長請教一下因為目前我們知道可以合法寄養的寵物店大概將近有3000家大概2841家\n483388\t500973\t相較於前五年來講是2184家其實已經增加了大概百分之三十這兩年特別的快速每一個月當中其實我們就增加了大概將近有11家之多每一個月都在增加所謂的寵物寄養的數量\n503334\t525408\t那我想呢以前我們可能都會碰到說比方說我可能要出遊啦我要出差啦我要出國啦在短期的當中我可能就是叫把寵貓犬貓我可能是寄養要不就是寵物旅館那要不就是請朋友來幫我照顧或帶到朋友的家但是呢現在其實還有另外一種對不起另外還有一種選擇就是呢他們是\n526048\t545919\t放在所謂的平台當中他們所媒合的一些寵物保母之類的問題是現行我們的法規當中這個寄宿跟安親寵物的寄養行為其實它是必須要符合所謂的特定寵物管理辦法當中的規定要有特寵證\n547841\t575784\t這個特種證其實是向我們的經濟部來申請營業登記的一個項目除了是保障所謂的消費者當然也要保障業者當然提供相對的一個保障能夠來增加所謂的動物的一個福祉但是為什麼我說這個制度跟所謂的證照的部分其實真的會需要所謂的通盤的考量最主要的原因是因為我們剛剛有提到就是\n576304\t600212\t有一些平台類似像寵物的Airbnb但是這個是平台上面它有一些些說我可以來登記我可以來照顧貓犬但是這些所謂的被寄養的這個寄養的不管是家庭也好或者是個人的這個短期的這個照護也好其實第一考量到它是沒有所謂的證照的它是沒有證照的\n600592\t616572\t那在管理的部分其實可能就會有所謂的灰色地帶那這個灰色地帶我們應該要怎麼樣萬一發生問題由誰來負責因為我們曾經也聽到就是有一些就是毛小孩的爸爸媽媽他們把自己的毛小孩送去之後可能第一天他就骨折了\n616912\t640951\t那到底這個責任要歸咎這個平台呢還是要歸咎這個所謂的寄養的這個家庭那在專業的照護的寄養跟這個商業的寄養當中有沒有符合所謂的專業技術的一個門檻到目前為止其實我們還沒有所謂的官方的一個管理的機制或者是考核的一個機制那就這個部分農業部這邊我們可以扮演什麼樣的角色怎麼樣來輔導他們呢\n643417\t671520\t我跟委員報告就是我們現在在做的大概分為兩個面向一個面向是制度面的部分就是剛才特別提到的我們如果是專業的寄養我們有相關的要向中央主管機構向各地方去登記但是你剛才講像BMB的部分這種類似寵物保母的這個部分那我覺得人的能力一定要先被建立所以我們現在正在規劃類似我們寵物美容的技術是一樣\n672060\t693970\t我們會變成一個動物照護的一個技術是讓他領有丙級的這個證照先把人處理了以後然後第二個部分就是我們希望說建立一個所謂的寄養或是相關的這個所謂的定型化契約那定型化契約就可以釐清相關的責任因為現在目前並沒有所謂定型化契約的責任所以先就這兩點我們先\n695431\t718272\t現在目前我們是有所謂的寵物的美容定型化的契約啦但是沒有寄養但是寄養的部分其實是還沒有的我們現在就要做這個寄養的部分好那大概什麼時候因為我剛剛有聽到部長您說現在目前已經在規劃了大概最快什麼時候可以上路我是跟我們的動保師講說在五月底之前要把所有的這個包括我們的定型化契約先做出來那有關於寵物\n719233\t740476\t照護的這個技術是拿丙級證照的我希望他六月底的時候能夠把相關的規範因為他比較嚴謹必須要有一些規範所以我們聽到兩個比較肯定跟正面的一個答覆了就是說關於寵物定型化的契約我們是在五月底那另外就是關於所謂的照護者他們自己本身的證照的一個認可我們可能希望能夠在六月底的部分\n740896\t755385\t好那第二個問題我想要關心的就是寵物食品安全的問題了我想這個寵物食品安全問題也是很多的這個事主他們其實也都有相對的一些澄清案件跟提出那首先我先要謝謝就是我們的基層的行政人員對於所謂的這個\n757606\t782615\t農業部我們在這個食安就是寵物的食安的部分其實我們也有相對來講其實比過去更加嚴謹的一個把關但是現在凸顯的一個問題我們看到光是寵物食品登記業者從2018年的642家到2022年增加到所謂的3286家其實累計已經增加了將近4倍這個還是只有在2022年之前的一個資料但現在可能又不止了\n783115\t807157\t那我想這個寵物食品目前申報的部分其實我們是鼓勵他們能夠主動申報自主申報但問題是在自主申報的這樣子的一個狀況之下其實就有很多很多的漏洞會跑出來了我們舉例來講像之前我們看到這個主動申報的一個方式我個人認為其實是比較難以確保寵物食品安全\n807677\t824658\t因為在這個這個應該算是在去年為例有381件的違規當中其實有335件大概88%將近快要90%其實就是沒有按照申報而違規的這個案例其實這個比例上是高的我們怎麼樣來\n825599\t840724\t改變這個制度就是從主動申報還是我們要主動去稽查因為市面當中有太多其實跟源頭也相關包含寵物食品的源頭代工廠其實他們都有可能會是問題最重要的一個源頭這個部分我們怎麼樣來加強\n842250\t868990\t我想同樣也是分兩個部分就像委員一直要期待我們的那個寵物專法但是寵物專法現在目前已經經過預告而且重新收斂了以後正在我們的法規會去做審議諸刀確認然後就會送行政院但是在這個法完全通過之前我們也是要協助就是用過往的這種自主申報它有很多灰色地帶跟漏洞的部分如果我們從\n870271\t889287\t去年度的違規的樣態來講21.6%左右是屬於申報樣態不符合的那申報樣態不符合表示說有一些寵物食品它的規列可能業者不是非常清楚那這個部分我想我們會更積極的把它的正面表列的部分去處理讓業者能夠針對它的樣態能夠處理\n892350\t913371\t第二個部分是標示不實的部分大概佔了百分之16.5的左右大概16.5那這個標示不實的部分就牽扯到裡面的內容物就是寵物食品的有害物質跟它的這些不該有的這些物質本身它的規範不明確那這個部分我們今年特別的增加了五種\n914432\t928059\t相關的這些有害物質的這些公告包括含有汞的部分然後希望說能夠讓毛小孩更健康的用他的飲食好 因為最後其實我們在輸往歐盟的這個所謂的外銷的部分\n947705\t948454\t好 謝謝各位節目\n","txt":"謝謝主席有請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備詢國務院好院長好我想川普的關稅大刀是砍向全世界但是我們台灣是第一批能夠進入到跟川普跟美國政府\n第一批的一個國家可以來做對談我想這是很好的一個機會喔那麼也希望陸續能夠聽到一些好消息一定努力好 院長我想請教您一個比較簡單的一個問題喔如果這個預算呢可以隨便的凍結然後隨便再靠一個所謂的這個倒數計時器來逼行政單位來做解凍那請問這個凍結預算的意義到底是什麼那到底是為了要追蹤改善呢還是為了要政治表演所以現在有這樣子的一個狀況喔\n您覺得呢應該大家都很清楚在整個預算法裡面對於審查預算是沒有所謂凍結的這個項目的啦刪減就可以刪減通過就通過 所以沒有凍結凍結是因為委員們對於行政院所做的一些事情希望再提出一些說明所以把它凍結了但是如果凍結的過程它附帶了一些條件目前我們連這個條件都還沒有達到也很難在這個時候就提出要去解凍的任何程序\n我想這個凍結的部分我們就以中研院為例上個禮拜其實因為我們也才跟中研院來做委員會上面的一個質詢以中研院的這個部分在教文會當中其實我們凍結的金額是1250萬\n那看似好像沒有什麼不多啦齁但是別忘了其實還有所謂的這個全院凍結的部分是高達了有這個11億喔那我想呢現在呢有委員這個設計了所謂的這個解凍計時器那他們可能真的是誤以為喔這個解凍預算喔好像是把那個一塊肌肉啊從冷凍庫拿下來然後放進這個微波爐逼一下可能之後就可以馬上就可以吃了喔\n其實整個凍結解凍的過程如果從解凍送進報告 口頭報告大概要經過三個月的時間 對嗎\n過去解凍的例子雖然也是有但比較少要到院會裡面來通過通常在委員會裡面或者是書面報告或者是口頭的說明委員會裡面就會通過現在是很多數的凍結案都要到院會裡面來院會的時間是非常有限而且非常寶貴的我也不曉得將來立法院大院怎麼來解決這些凍結案的問題所以我們還記得這個1月底他們開始這個凍結預算刪除預算這個是1月底的事情\n然後再來三月中我們覺得自愛難行我們提出了所謂的復議但是他們也否決了這個復議那現在其實在四月初的時候我們就不斷的聽到藍白的委員一直在講說你們送進報告我們馬上就可以讓你可以動用這個金額了\n我們來看一下他們是怎麼操作的我不知道這樣解釋對不對但我看起來其實我就幫大家整理一下先大規模的一個凍結其實刻意讓各個單位認為說這個很多的東西是無法正常的運行再來再否決你的復議案\n營造這個政府失能的一個形象然後第三個呢就是限三個禮拜之內要行政單位來交出所謂的解凍的報告那我上次其實在委員會當中其實我有特別提到這個有研究員他們也講\n雖然看似好像中研院的預算被凍結的金額不高但是也已經確定有一些項目在跟比方說在日本進行20年的這個長期的研究也被迫要被終止了那我想這樣子的監督改善放一個計時倒數計時期放在這個地方到底是為了什麼那我們還記得其實今年這個228事件其實我們邁入的第78年\n那藍白聯手煽動了大概內政部的預算也直接衝擊了228事件紀念基金會的一個運作其實已經模糊了228事件其實是台灣人的傷痕跟歷史他不斷的是用所謂的預算的權力來壓制了這個歷史跟真相而且也影響到基金會要照顧這些受難者的\n受難者本身跟受難家屬的一個計畫我想問一下行政院長我們的行政機關是不是有信心可以堅守所謂的解凍報告堅守這個所謂的解凍的報告而不做所謂的交差形式來呼應他們這些所謂的政治上的動作因為我們也擔心我們的報告寫得太長他說你動作太慢寫得太\n寫的不夠多他說啊你忽略我你真的也不重視我的這個委員會也不尊重我這個委員會目前我們應該要怎麼樣來保護這個行政單位跟公務人員不要被這樣子的政治動作給綁架院長\n是如委員所說的二八基金會如果我沒有記錯他大概三千六百多萬的預算被三減兩千五百多萬凍結了六百多萬幾乎是三千六百多萬當中的兩三千兩百萬不是被刪就是被凍他把媒體的政策所有的業務的費用是全數刪除更難為的是他把他\n集中在某一個單一的項目、科目裡面單一的項目裡面把它刪減了或凍除了所以它的業務費用是沒有辦法執行的這個是普遍發生在現在所有部會當中的所以我認為解鈴要須繫鈴人解凍也要凍結人\n自己要知道過去做了這個事情之後又設了很多的門檻跟條件當我們還沒有達到的時候如果貿然提出可能又引起另外一次的批評所以這整個預算我們現在一方面在研議是否再度尋求憲政的救濟同時我們也希望是否能夠啟動過去兩院協商的機制再就目前的預算如何有效的實施對全民最有利\n我們兩個在進行有可不可能再進行一次的協商好我們只能就是繼續努力了好那接下來我想請教一下這個請農業部麻煩請農業部長備詢\n我也好部長好這根據農業部的統計因為我們是五年做一次的調查關於所謂的全國的犬貓的一些數量在2023年全國的家犬跟家貓估計是比2021年要增加了19%跟50%目前已經來到了所謂的150萬隻的家犬跟135萬隻的家貓這個還是2023年的資料279萬對\n好 那接著下來其實我相信很多人關心的就是每一個四組他們對於這個毛小孩的照顧那我們也經過這個統計就是包含每年在支出的項目的前三名對於毛小孩的一個照顧的部分第一名當然就是醫療跟照護那第二個就是我們的飼料跟零食再來第三個是美容服務跟這個住宿\n那是最為所謂的這個市主他們所關心的一個部分那今天其實我想要就兩個問題來請教一下這個我們的這個部長就是市主其實是非常關心所謂的這個飼料跟零食還有美容服務跟這個住宿的部分那我們就先就這個美容住宿的部分來向這個部長請教一下因為目前我們知道可以合法寄養的寵物店大概將近有3000家大概2841家\n相較於前五年來講是2184家其實已經增加了大概百分之三十這兩年特別的快速每一個月當中其實我們就增加了大概將近有11家之多每一個月都在增加所謂的寵物寄養的數量\n那我想呢以前我們可能都會碰到說比方說我可能要出遊啦我要出差啦我要出國啦在短期的當中我可能就是叫把寵貓犬貓我可能是寄養要不就是寵物旅館那要不就是請朋友來幫我照顧或帶到朋友的家但是呢現在其實還有另外一種對不起另外還有一種選擇就是呢他們是\n放在所謂的平台當中他們所媒合的一些寵物保母之類的問題是現行我們的法規當中這個寄宿跟安親寵物的寄養行為其實它是必須要符合所謂的特定寵物管理辦法當中的規定要有特寵證\n這個特種證其實是向我們的經濟部來申請營業登記的一個項目除了是保障所謂的消費者當然也要保障業者當然提供相對的一個保障能夠來增加所謂的動物的一個福祉但是為什麼我說這個制度跟所謂的證照的部分其實真的會需要所謂的通盤的考量最主要的原因是因為我們剛剛有提到就是\n有一些平台類似像寵物的Airbnb但是這個是平台上面它有一些些說我可以來登記我可以來照顧貓犬但是這些所謂的被寄養的這個寄養的不管是家庭也好或者是個人的這個短期的這個照護也好其實第一考量到它是沒有所謂的證照的它是沒有證照的\n那在管理的部分其實可能就會有所謂的灰色地帶那這個灰色地帶我們應該要怎麼樣萬一發生問題由誰來負責因為我們曾經也聽到就是有一些就是毛小孩的爸爸媽媽他們把自己的毛小孩送去之後可能第一天他就骨折了\n那到底這個責任要歸咎這個平台呢還是要歸咎這個所謂的寄養的這個家庭那在專業的照護的寄養跟這個商業的寄養當中有沒有符合所謂的專業技術的一個門檻到目前為止其實我們還沒有所謂的官方的一個管理的機制或者是考核的一個機制那就這個部分農業部這邊我們可以扮演什麼樣的角色怎麼樣來輔導他們呢\n我跟委員報告就是我們現在在做的大概分為兩個面向一個面向是制度面的部分就是剛才特別提到的我們如果是專業的寄養我們有相關的要向中央主管機構向各地方去登記但是你剛才講像BMB的部分這種類似寵物保母的這個部分那我覺得人的能力一定要先被建立所以我們現在正在規劃類似我們寵物美容的技術是一樣\n我們會變成一個動物照護的一個技術是讓他領有丙級的這個證照先把人處理了以後然後第二個部分就是我們希望說建立一個所謂的寄養或是相關的這個所謂的定型化契約那定型化契約就可以釐清相關的責任因為現在目前並沒有所謂定型化契約的責任所以先就這兩點我們先\n現在目前我們是有所謂的寵物的美容定型化的契約啦但是沒有寄養但是寄養的部分其實是還沒有的我們現在就要做這個寄養的部分好那大概什麼時候因為我剛剛有聽到部長您說現在目前已經在規劃了大概最快什麼時候可以上路我是跟我們的動保師講說在五月底之前要把所有的這個包括我們的定型化契約先做出來那有關於寵物\n照護的這個技術是拿丙級證照的我希望他六月底的時候能夠把相關的規範因為他比較嚴謹必須要有一些規範所以我們聽到兩個比較肯定跟正面的一個答覆了就是說關於寵物定型化的契約我們是在五月底那另外就是關於所謂的照護者他們自己本身的證照的一個認可我們可能希望能夠在六月底的部分\n好那第二個問題我想要關心的就是寵物食品安全的問題了我想這個寵物食品安全問題也是很多的這個事主他們其實也都有相對的一些澄清案件跟提出那首先我先要謝謝就是我們的基層的行政人員對於所謂的這個\n農業部我們在這個食安就是寵物的食安的部分其實我們也有相對來講其實比過去更加嚴謹的一個把關但是現在凸顯的一個問題我們看到光是寵物食品登記業者從2018年的642家到2022年增加到所謂的3286家其實累計已經增加了將近4倍這個還是只有在2022年之前的一個資料但現在可能又不止了\n那我想這個寵物食品目前申報的部分其實我們是鼓勵他們能夠主動申報自主申報但問題是在自主申報的這樣子的一個狀況之下其實就有很多很多的漏洞會跑出來了我們舉例來講像之前我們看到這個主動申報的一個方式我個人認為其實是比較難以確保寵物食品安全\n因為在這個這個應該算是在去年為例有381件的違規當中其實有335件大概88%將近快要90%其實就是沒有按照申報而違規的這個案例其實這個比例上是高的我們怎麼樣來\n改變這個制度就是從主動申報還是我們要主動去稽查因為市面當中有太多其實跟源頭也相關包含寵物食品的源頭代工廠其實他們都有可能會是問題最重要的一個源頭這個部分我們怎麼樣來加強\n我想同樣也是分兩個部分就像委員一直要期待我們的那個寵物專法但是寵物專法現在目前已經經過預告而且重新收斂了以後正在我們的法規會去做審議諸刀確認然後就會送行政院但是在這個法完全通過之前我們也是要協助就是用過往的這種自主申報它有很多灰色地帶跟漏洞的部分如果我們從\n去年度的違規的樣態來講21.6%左右是屬於申報樣態不符合的那申報樣態不符合表示說有一些寵物食品它的規列可能業者不是非常清楚那這個部分我想我們會更積極的把它的正面表列的部分去處理讓業者能夠針對它的樣態能夠處理\n第二個部分是標示不實的部分大概佔了百分之16.5的左右大概16.5那這個標示不實的部分就牽扯到裡面的內容物就是寵物食品的有害物質跟它的這些不該有的這些物質本身它的規範不明確那這個部分我們今年特別的增加了五種\n相關的這些有害物質的這些公告包括含有汞的部分然後希望說能夠讓毛小孩更健康的用他的飲食好 因為最後其實我們在輸往歐盟的這個所謂的外銷的部分\n好 謝謝各位節目\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:10.033 --> 00:13.477\n謝謝主席有請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備詢國務院好院長好我想川普的關稅大刀是砍向全世界但是我們台灣是第一批能夠進入到跟川普跟美國政府\n\n00:33.683 --> 01:02.095\n第一批的一個國家可以來做對談我想這是很好的一個機會喔那麼也希望陸續能夠聽到一些好消息一定努力好院長我想請教您一個比較簡單的一個問題喔如果這個預算呢可以隨便的凍結然後隨便再靠一個所謂的這個倒數計時器來逼行政單位來做解凍那請問這個凍結預算的意義到底是什麼那到底是為了要追蹤改善呢還是為了要政治表演所以現在有這樣子的一個狀況喔\n\n01:03.482 --> 01:33.125\n您覺得呢應該大家都很清楚在整個預算法裡面對於審查預算是沒有所謂凍結的這個項目的啦刪減就可以刪減通過就通過所以沒有凍結凍結是因為委員們對於行政院所做的一些事情希望再提出一些說明所以把它凍結了但是如果凍結的過程它附帶了一些條件目前我們連這個條件都還沒有達到也很難在這個時候就提出要去解凍的任何程序\n\n01:34.188 --> 01:47.237\n我想這個凍結的部分我們就以中研院為例上個禮拜其實因為我們也才跟中研院來做委員會上面的一個質詢以中研院的這個部分在教文會當中其實我們凍結的金額是1250萬\n\n01:49.819 --> 02:13.537\n那看似好像沒有什麼不多啦齁但是別忘了其實還有所謂的這個全院凍結的部分是高達了有這個11億喔那我想呢現在呢有委員這個設計了所謂的這個解凍計時器那他們可能真的是誤以為喔這個解凍預算喔好像是把那個一塊肌肉啊從冷凍庫拿下來然後放進這個微波爐逼一下可能之後就可以馬上就可以吃了喔\n\n02:13.897 --> 02:22.904\n其實整個凍結解凍的過程如果從解凍送進報告口頭報告大概要經過三個月的時間對嗎\n\n02:24.572 --> 02:53.241\n過去解凍的例子雖然也是有但比較少要到院會裡面來通過通常在委員會裡面或者是書面報告或者是口頭的說明委員會裡面就會通過現在是很多數的凍結案都要到院會裡面來院會的時間是非常有限而且非常寶貴的我也不曉得將來立法院大院怎麼來解決這些凍結案的問題所以我們還記得這個1月底他們開始這個凍結預算刪除預算這個是1月底的事情\n\n02:53.666 --> 03:07.871\n然後再來三月中我們覺得自愛難行我們提出了所謂的復議但是他們也否決了這個復議那現在其實在四月初的時候我們就不斷的聽到藍白的委員一直在講說你們送進報告我們馬上就可以讓你可以動用這個金額了\n\n03:09.592 --> 03:25.213\n我們來看一下他們是怎麼操作的我不知道這樣解釋對不對但我看起來其實我就幫大家整理一下先大規模的一個凍結其實刻意讓各個單位認為說這個很多的東西是無法正常的運行再來再否決你的復議案\n\n03:26.054 --> 03:41.252\n營造這個政府失能的一個形象然後第三個呢就是限三個禮拜之內要行政單位來交出所謂的解凍的報告那我上次其實在委員會當中其實我有特別提到這個有研究員他們也講\n\n03:42.393 --> 04:07.483\n雖然看似好像中研院的預算被凍結的金額不高但是也已經確定有一些項目在跟比方說在日本進行20年的這個長期的研究也被迫要被終止了那我想這樣子的監督改善放一個計時倒數計時期放在這個地方到底是為了什麼那我們還記得其實今年這個228事件其實我們邁入的第78年\n\n04:08.763 --> 04:31.620\n那藍白聯手煽動了大概內政部的預算也直接衝擊了228事件紀念基金會的一個運作其實已經模糊了228事件其實是台灣人的傷痕跟歷史他不斷的是用所謂的預算的權力來壓制了這個歷史跟真相而且也影響到基金會要照顧這些受難者的\n\n04:32.288 --> 04:58.874\n受難者本身跟受難家屬的一個計畫我想問一下行政院長我們的行政機關是不是有信心可以堅守所謂的解凍報告堅守這個所謂的解凍的報告而不做所謂的交差形式來呼應他們這些所謂的政治上的動作因為我們也擔心我們的報告寫得太長他說你動作太慢寫得太\n\n04:59.954 --> 05:13.883\n寫的不夠多他說啊你忽略我你真的也不重視我的這個委員會也不尊重我這個委員會目前我們應該要怎麼樣來保護這個行政單位跟公務人員不要被這樣子的政治動作給綁架院長\n\n05:14.582 --> 05:33.918\n是如委員所說的二八基金會如果我沒有記錯他大概三千六百多萬的預算被三減兩千五百多萬凍結了六百多萬幾乎是三千六百多萬當中的兩三千兩百萬不是被刪就是被凍他把媒體的政策所有的業務的費用是全數刪除更難為的是他把他\n\n05:34.719 --> 05:48.976\n集中在某一個單一的項目、科目裡面單一的項目裡面把它刪減了或凍除了所以它的業務費用是沒有辦法執行的這個是普遍發生在現在所有部會當中的所以我認為解鈴要須繫鈴人解凍也要凍結人\n\n05:53.635 --> 06:17.519\n自己要知道過去做了這個事情之後又設了很多的門檻跟條件當我們還沒有達到的時候如果貿然提出可能又引起另外一次的批評所以這整個預算我們現在一方面在研議是否再度尋求憲政的救濟同時我們也希望是否能夠啟動過去兩院協商的機制再就目前的預算如何有效的實施對全民最有利\n\n06:18.052 --> 06:25.458\n我們兩個在進行有可不可能再進行一次的協商好我們只能就是繼續努力了好那接下來我想請教一下這個請農業部麻煩請農業部長備詢\n\n06:41.226 --> 06:54.551\n我也好部長好這根據農業部的統計因為我們是五年做一次的調查關於所謂的全國的犬貓的一些數量在2023年全國的家犬跟家貓估計是比2021年要增加了19%跟50%目前已經來到了所謂的150萬隻的家犬跟135萬隻的家貓這個還是2023年的資料279萬對\n\n07:10.256 --> 07:31.528\n好那接著下來其實我相信很多人關心的就是每一個四組他們對於這個毛小孩的照顧那我們也經過這個統計就是包含每年在支出的項目的前三名對於毛小孩的一個照顧的部分第一名當然就是醫療跟照護那第二個就是我們的飼料跟零食再來第三個是美容服務跟這個住宿\n\n07:32.108 --> 07:56.485\n那是最為所謂的這個市主他們所關心的一個部分那今天其實我想要就兩個問題來請教一下這個我們的這個部長就是市主其實是非常關心所謂的這個飼料跟零食還有美容服務跟這個住宿的部分那我們就先就這個美容住宿的部分來向這個部長請教一下因為目前我們知道可以合法寄養的寵物店大概將近有3000家大概2841家\n\n08:03.388 --> 08:20.973\n相較於前五年來講是2184家其實已經增加了大概百分之三十這兩年特別的快速每一個月當中其實我們就增加了大概將近有11家之多每一個月都在增加所謂的寵物寄養的數量\n\n08:23.334 --> 08:45.408\n那我想呢以前我們可能都會碰到說比方說我可能要出遊啦我要出差啦我要出國啦在短期的當中我可能就是叫把寵貓犬貓我可能是寄養要不就是寵物旅館那要不就是請朋友來幫我照顧或帶到朋友的家但是呢現在其實還有另外一種對不起另外還有一種選擇就是呢他們是\n\n08:46.048 --> 09:05.919\n放在所謂的平台當中他們所媒合的一些寵物保母之類的問題是現行我們的法規當中這個寄宿跟安親寵物的寄養行為其實它是必須要符合所謂的特定寵物管理辦法當中的規定要有特寵證\n\n09:07.841 --> 09:35.784\n這個特種證其實是向我們的經濟部來申請營業登記的一個項目除了是保障所謂的消費者當然也要保障業者當然提供相對的一個保障能夠來增加所謂的動物的一個福祉但是為什麼我說這個制度跟所謂的證照的部分其實真的會需要所謂的通盤的考量最主要的原因是因為我們剛剛有提到就是\n\n09:36.304 --> 10:00.212\n有一些平台類似像寵物的Airbnb但是這個是平台上面它有一些些說我可以來登記我可以來照顧貓犬但是這些所謂的被寄養的這個寄養的不管是家庭也好或者是個人的這個短期的這個照護也好其實第一考量到它是沒有所謂的證照的它是沒有證照的\n\n10:00.592 --> 10:16.572\n那在管理的部分其實可能就會有所謂的灰色地帶那這個灰色地帶我們應該要怎麼樣萬一發生問題由誰來負責因為我們曾經也聽到就是有一些就是毛小孩的爸爸媽媽他們把自己的毛小孩送去之後可能第一天他就骨折了\n\n10:16.912 --> 10:40.951\n那到底這個責任要歸咎這個平台呢還是要歸咎這個所謂的寄養的這個家庭那在專業的照護的寄養跟這個商業的寄養當中有沒有符合所謂的專業技術的一個門檻到目前為止其實我們還沒有所謂的官方的一個管理的機制或者是考核的一個機制那就這個部分農業部這邊我們可以扮演什麼樣的角色怎麼樣來輔導他們呢\n\n10:43.417 --> 11:11.520\n我跟委員報告就是我們現在在做的大概分為兩個面向一個面向是制度面的部分就是剛才特別提到的我們如果是專業的寄養我們有相關的要向中央主管機構向各地方去登記但是你剛才講像BMB的部分這種類似寵物保母的這個部分那我覺得人的能力一定要先被建立所以我們現在正在規劃類似我們寵物美容的技術是一樣\n\n11:12.060 --> 11:33.970\n我們會變成一個動物照護的一個技術是讓他領有丙級的這個證照先把人處理了以後然後第二個部分就是我們希望說建立一個所謂的寄養或是相關的這個所謂的定型化契約那定型化契約就可以釐清相關的責任因為現在目前並沒有所謂定型化契約的責任所以先就這兩點我們先\n\n11:35.431 --> 11:58.272\n現在目前我們是有所謂的寵物的美容定型化的契約啦但是沒有寄養但是寄養的部分其實是還沒有的我們現在就要做這個寄養的部分好那大概什麼時候因為我剛剛有聽到部長您說現在目前已經在規劃了大概最快什麼時候可以上路我是跟我們的動保師講說在五月底之前要把所有的這個包括我們的定型化契約先做出來那有關於寵物\n\n11:59.233 --> 12:20.476\n照護的這個技術是拿丙級證照的我希望他六月底的時候能夠把相關的規範因為他比較嚴謹必須要有一些規範所以我們聽到兩個比較肯定跟正面的一個答覆了就是說關於寵物定型化的契約我們是在五月底那另外就是關於所謂的照護者他們自己本身的證照的一個認可我們可能希望能夠在六月底的部分\n\n12:20.896 --> 12:35.385\n好那第二個問題我想要關心的就是寵物食品安全的問題了我想這個寵物食品安全問題也是很多的這個事主他們其實也都有相對的一些澄清案件跟提出那首先我先要謝謝就是我們的基層的行政人員對於所謂的這個\n\n12:37.606 --> 13:02.615\n農業部我們在這個食安就是寵物的食安的部分其實我們也有相對來講其實比過去更加嚴謹的一個把關但是現在凸顯的一個問題我們看到光是寵物食品登記業者從2018年的642家到2022年增加到所謂的3286家其實累計已經增加了將近4倍這個還是只有在2022年之前的一個資料但現在可能又不止了\n\n13:03.115 --> 13:27.157\n那我想這個寵物食品目前申報的部分其實我們是鼓勵他們能夠主動申報自主申報但問題是在自主申報的這樣子的一個狀況之下其實就有很多很多的漏洞會跑出來了我們舉例來講像之前我們看到這個主動申報的一個方式我個人認為其實是比較難以確保寵物食品安全\n\n13:27.677 --> 13:44.658\n因為在這個這個應該算是在去年為例有381件的違規當中其實有335件大概88%將近快要90%其實就是沒有按照申報而違規的這個案例其實這個比例上是高的我們怎麼樣來\n\n13:45.599 --> 14:00.724\n改變這個制度就是從主動申報還是我們要主動去稽查因為市面當中有太多其實跟源頭也相關包含寵物食品的源頭代工廠其實他們都有可能會是問題最重要的一個源頭這個部分我們怎麼樣來加強\n\n14:02.250 --> 14:28.990\n我想同樣也是分兩個部分就像委員一直要期待我們的那個寵物專法但是寵物專法現在目前已經經過預告而且重新收斂了以後正在我們的法規會去做審議諸刀確認然後就會送行政院但是在這個法完全通過之前我們也是要協助就是用過往的這種自主申報它有很多灰色地帶跟漏洞的部分如果我們從\n\n14:30.271 --> 14:49.287\n去年度的違規的樣態來講21.6%左右是屬於申報樣態不符合的那申報樣態不符合表示說有一些寵物食品它的規列可能業者不是非常清楚那這個部分我想我們會更積極的把它的正面表列的部分去處理讓業者能夠針對它的樣態能夠處理\n\n14:52.350 --> 15:13.371\n第二個部分是標示不實的部分大概佔了百分之16.5的左右大概16.5那這個標示不實的部分就牽扯到裡面的內容物就是寵物食品的有害物質跟它的這些不該有的這些物質本身它的規範不明確那這個部分我們今年特別的增加了五種\n\n15:14.432 --> 15:28.059\n相關的這些有害物質的這些公告包括含有汞的部分然後希望說能夠讓毛小孩更健康的用他的飲食好因為最後其實我們在輸往歐盟的這個所謂的外銷的部分\n\n15:47.705 --> 15:48.454\n好謝謝各位節目\n\n","segments":[{"start":10.033,"end":13.477,"text":"謝謝主席有請卓院長麻煩再請卓院長備詢國務院好院長好我想川普的關稅大刀是砍向全世界但是我們台灣是第一批能夠進入到跟川普跟美國政府"},{"start":33.683,"end":62.095,"text":"第一批的一個國家可以來做對談我想這是很好的一個機會喔那麼也希望陸續能夠聽到一些好消息一定努力好 院長我想請教您一個比較簡單的一個問題喔如果這個預算呢可以隨便的凍結然後隨便再靠一個所謂的這個倒數計時器來逼行政單位來做解凍那請問這個凍結預算的意義到底是什麼那到底是為了要追蹤改善呢還是為了要政治表演所以現在有這樣子的一個狀況喔"},{"start":63.482,"end":93.125,"text":"您覺得呢應該大家都很清楚在整個預算法裡面對於審查預算是沒有所謂凍結的這個項目的啦刪減就可以刪減通過就通過 所以沒有凍結凍結是因為委員們對於行政院所做的一些事情希望再提出一些說明所以把它凍結了但是如果凍結的過程它附帶了一些條件目前我們連這個條件都還沒有達到也很難在這個時候就提出要去解凍的任何程序"},{"start":94.188,"end":107.237,"text":"我想這個凍結的部分我們就以中研院為例上個禮拜其實因為我們也才跟中研院來做委員會上面的一個質詢以中研院的這個部分在教文會當中其實我們凍結的金額是1250萬"},{"start":109.819,"end":133.537,"text":"那看似好像沒有什麼不多啦齁但是別忘了其實還有所謂的這個全院凍結的部分是高達了有這個11億喔那我想呢現在呢有委員這個設計了所謂的這個解凍計時器那他們可能真的是誤以為喔這個解凍預算喔好像是把那個一塊肌肉啊從冷凍庫拿下來然後放進這個微波爐逼一下可能之後就可以馬上就可以吃了喔"},{"start":133.897,"end":142.904,"text":"其實整個凍結解凍的過程如果從解凍送進報告 口頭報告大概要經過三個月的時間 對嗎"},{"start":144.572,"end":173.241,"text":"過去解凍的例子雖然也是有但比較少要到院會裡面來通過通常在委員會裡面或者是書面報告或者是口頭的說明委員會裡面就會通過現在是很多數的凍結案都要到院會裡面來院會的時間是非常有限而且非常寶貴的我也不曉得將來立法院大院怎麼來解決這些凍結案的問題所以我們還記得這個1月底他們開始這個凍結預算刪除預算這個是1月底的事情"},{"start":173.666,"end":187.871,"text":"然後再來三月中我們覺得自愛難行我們提出了所謂的復議但是他們也否決了這個復議那現在其實在四月初的時候我們就不斷的聽到藍白的委員一直在講說你們送進報告我們馬上就可以讓你可以動用這個金額了"},{"start":189.592,"end":205.213,"text":"我們來看一下他們是怎麼操作的我不知道這樣解釋對不對但我看起來其實我就幫大家整理一下先大規模的一個凍結其實刻意讓各個單位認為說這個很多的東西是無法正常的運行再來再否決你的復議案"},{"start":206.054,"end":221.252,"text":"營造這個政府失能的一個形象然後第三個呢就是限三個禮拜之內要行政單位來交出所謂的解凍的報告那我上次其實在委員會當中其實我有特別提到這個有研究員他們也講"},{"start":222.393,"end":247.483,"text":"雖然看似好像中研院的預算被凍結的金額不高但是也已經確定有一些項目在跟比方說在日本進行20年的這個長期的研究也被迫要被終止了那我想這樣子的監督改善放一個計時倒數計時期放在這個地方到底是為了什麼那我們還記得其實今年這個228事件其實我們邁入的第78年"},{"start":248.763,"end":271.62,"text":"那藍白聯手煽動了大概內政部的預算也直接衝擊了228事件紀念基金會的一個運作其實已經模糊了228事件其實是台灣人的傷痕跟歷史他不斷的是用所謂的預算的權力來壓制了這個歷史跟真相而且也影響到基金會要照顧這些受難者的"},{"start":272.288,"end":298.874,"text":"受難者本身跟受難家屬的一個計畫我想問一下行政院長我們的行政機關是不是有信心可以堅守所謂的解凍報告堅守這個所謂的解凍的報告而不做所謂的交差形式來呼應他們這些所謂的政治上的動作因為我們也擔心我們的報告寫得太長他說你動作太慢寫得太"},{"start":299.954,"end":313.883,"text":"寫的不夠多他說啊你忽略我你真的也不重視我的這個委員會也不尊重我這個委員會目前我們應該要怎麼樣來保護這個行政單位跟公務人員不要被這樣子的政治動作給綁架院長"},{"start":314.582,"end":333.918,"text":"是如委員所說的二八基金會如果我沒有記錯他大概三千六百多萬的預算被三減兩千五百多萬凍結了六百多萬幾乎是三千六百多萬當中的兩三千兩百萬不是被刪就是被凍他把媒體的政策所有的業務的費用是全數刪除更難為的是他把他"},{"start":334.719,"end":348.976,"text":"集中在某一個單一的項目、科目裡面單一的項目裡面把它刪減了或凍除了所以它的業務費用是沒有辦法執行的這個是普遍發生在現在所有部會當中的所以我認為解鈴要須繫鈴人解凍也要凍結人"},{"start":353.635,"end":377.519,"text":"自己要知道過去做了這個事情之後又設了很多的門檻跟條件當我們還沒有達到的時候如果貿然提出可能又引起另外一次的批評所以這整個預算我們現在一方面在研議是否再度尋求憲政的救濟同時我們也希望是否能夠啟動過去兩院協商的機制再就目前的預算如何有效的實施對全民最有利"},{"start":378.052,"end":385.458,"text":"我們兩個在進行有可不可能再進行一次的協商好我們只能就是繼續努力了好那接下來我想請教一下這個請農業部麻煩請農業部長備詢"},{"start":401.226,"end":414.551,"text":"我也好部長好這根據農業部的統計因為我們是五年做一次的調查關於所謂的全國的犬貓的一些數量在2023年全國的家犬跟家貓估計是比2021年要增加了19%跟50%目前已經來到了所謂的150萬隻的家犬跟135萬隻的家貓這個還是2023年的資料279萬對"},{"start":430.256,"end":451.528,"text":"好 那接著下來其實我相信很多人關心的就是每一個四組他們對於這個毛小孩的照顧那我們也經過這個統計就是包含每年在支出的項目的前三名對於毛小孩的一個照顧的部分第一名當然就是醫療跟照護那第二個就是我們的飼料跟零食再來第三個是美容服務跟這個住宿"},{"start":452.108,"end":476.485,"text":"那是最為所謂的這個市主他們所關心的一個部分那今天其實我想要就兩個問題來請教一下這個我們的這個部長就是市主其實是非常關心所謂的這個飼料跟零食還有美容服務跟這個住宿的部分那我們就先就這個美容住宿的部分來向這個部長請教一下因為目前我們知道可以合法寄養的寵物店大概將近有3000家大概2841家"},{"start":483.388,"end":500.973,"text":"相較於前五年來講是2184家其實已經增加了大概百分之三十這兩年特別的快速每一個月當中其實我們就增加了大概將近有11家之多每一個月都在增加所謂的寵物寄養的數量"},{"start":503.334,"end":525.408,"text":"那我想呢以前我們可能都會碰到說比方說我可能要出遊啦我要出差啦我要出國啦在短期的當中我可能就是叫把寵貓犬貓我可能是寄養要不就是寵物旅館那要不就是請朋友來幫我照顧或帶到朋友的家但是呢現在其實還有另外一種對不起另外還有一種選擇就是呢他們是"},{"start":526.048,"end":545.919,"text":"放在所謂的平台當中他們所媒合的一些寵物保母之類的問題是現行我們的法規當中這個寄宿跟安親寵物的寄養行為其實它是必須要符合所謂的特定寵物管理辦法當中的規定要有特寵證"},{"start":547.841,"end":575.784,"text":"這個特種證其實是向我們的經濟部來申請營業登記的一個項目除了是保障所謂的消費者當然也要保障業者當然提供相對的一個保障能夠來增加所謂的動物的一個福祉但是為什麼我說這個制度跟所謂的證照的部分其實真的會需要所謂的通盤的考量最主要的原因是因為我們剛剛有提到就是"},{"start":576.304,"end":600.212,"text":"有一些平台類似像寵物的Airbnb但是這個是平台上面它有一些些說我可以來登記我可以來照顧貓犬但是這些所謂的被寄養的這個寄養的不管是家庭也好或者是個人的這個短期的這個照護也好其實第一考量到它是沒有所謂的證照的它是沒有證照的"},{"start":600.592,"end":616.572,"text":"那在管理的部分其實可能就會有所謂的灰色地帶那這個灰色地帶我們應該要怎麼樣萬一發生問題由誰來負責因為我們曾經也聽到就是有一些就是毛小孩的爸爸媽媽他們把自己的毛小孩送去之後可能第一天他就骨折了"},{"start":616.912,"end":640.951,"text":"那到底這個責任要歸咎這個平台呢還是要歸咎這個所謂的寄養的這個家庭那在專業的照護的寄養跟這個商業的寄養當中有沒有符合所謂的專業技術的一個門檻到目前為止其實我們還沒有所謂的官方的一個管理的機制或者是考核的一個機制那就這個部分農業部這邊我們可以扮演什麼樣的角色怎麼樣來輔導他們呢"},{"start":643.417,"end":671.52,"text":"我跟委員報告就是我們現在在做的大概分為兩個面向一個面向是制度面的部分就是剛才特別提到的我們如果是專業的寄養我們有相關的要向中央主管機構向各地方去登記但是你剛才講像BMB的部分這種類似寵物保母的這個部分那我覺得人的能力一定要先被建立所以我們現在正在規劃類似我們寵物美容的技術是一樣"},{"start":672.06,"end":693.97,"text":"我們會變成一個動物照護的一個技術是讓他領有丙級的這個證照先把人處理了以後然後第二個部分就是我們希望說建立一個所謂的寄養或是相關的這個所謂的定型化契約那定型化契約就可以釐清相關的責任因為現在目前並沒有所謂定型化契約的責任所以先就這兩點我們先"},{"start":695.431,"end":718.272,"text":"現在目前我們是有所謂的寵物的美容定型化的契約啦但是沒有寄養但是寄養的部分其實是還沒有的我們現在就要做這個寄養的部分好那大概什麼時候因為我剛剛有聽到部長您說現在目前已經在規劃了大概最快什麼時候可以上路我是跟我們的動保師講說在五月底之前要把所有的這個包括我們的定型化契約先做出來那有關於寵物"},{"start":719.233,"end":740.476,"text":"照護的這個技術是拿丙級證照的我希望他六月底的時候能夠把相關的規範因為他比較嚴謹必須要有一些規範所以我們聽到兩個比較肯定跟正面的一個答覆了就是說關於寵物定型化的契約我們是在五月底那另外就是關於所謂的照護者他們自己本身的證照的一個認可我們可能希望能夠在六月底的部分"},{"start":740.896,"end":755.385,"text":"好那第二個問題我想要關心的就是寵物食品安全的問題了我想這個寵物食品安全問題也是很多的這個事主他們其實也都有相對的一些澄清案件跟提出那首先我先要謝謝就是我們的基層的行政人員對於所謂的這個"},{"start":757.606,"end":782.615,"text":"農業部我們在這個食安就是寵物的食安的部分其實我們也有相對來講其實比過去更加嚴謹的一個把關但是現在凸顯的一個問題我們看到光是寵物食品登記業者從2018年的642家到2022年增加到所謂的3286家其實累計已經增加了將近4倍這個還是只有在2022年之前的一個資料但現在可能又不止了"},{"start":783.115,"end":807.157,"text":"那我想這個寵物食品目前申報的部分其實我們是鼓勵他們能夠主動申報自主申報但問題是在自主申報的這樣子的一個狀況之下其實就有很多很多的漏洞會跑出來了我們舉例來講像之前我們看到這個主動申報的一個方式我個人認為其實是比較難以確保寵物食品安全"},{"start":807.677,"end":824.658,"text":"因為在這個這個應該算是在去年為例有381件的違規當中其實有335件大概88%將近快要90%其實就是沒有按照申報而違規的這個案例其實這個比例上是高的我們怎麼樣來"},{"start":825.599,"end":840.724,"text":"改變這個制度就是從主動申報還是我們要主動去稽查因為市面當中有太多其實跟源頭也相關包含寵物食品的源頭代工廠其實他們都有可能會是問題最重要的一個源頭這個部分我們怎麼樣來加強"},{"start":842.25,"end":868.99,"text":"我想同樣也是分兩個部分就像委員一直要期待我們的那個寵物專法但是寵物專法現在目前已經經過預告而且重新收斂了以後正在我們的法規會去做審議諸刀確認然後就會送行政院但是在這個法完全通過之前我們也是要協助就是用過往的這種自主申報它有很多灰色地帶跟漏洞的部分如果我們從"},{"start":870.271,"end":889.287,"text":"去年度的違規的樣態來講21.6%左右是屬於申報樣態不符合的那申報樣態不符合表示說有一些寵物食品它的規列可能業者不是非常清楚那這個部分我想我們會更積極的把它的正面表列的部分去處理讓業者能夠針對它的樣態能夠處理"},{"start":892.35,"end":913.371,"text":"第二個部分是標示不實的部分大概佔了百分之16.5的左右大概16.5那這個標示不實的部分就牽扯到裡面的內容物就是寵物食品的有害物質跟它的這些不該有的這些物質本身它的規範不明確那這個部分我們今年特別的增加了五種"},{"start":914.432,"end":928.059,"text":"相關的這些有害物質的這些公告包括含有汞的部分然後希望說能夠讓毛小孩更健康的用他的飲食好 因為最後其實我們在輸往歐盟的這個所謂的外銷的部分"},{"start":947.705,"end":948.454,"text":"好 謝謝各位節目"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":77,"blocks":[["郭委員昱晴：（14時48分）謝謝主席。有請卓院長。"],["主席：麻煩再請卓院長備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：郭委員好。"],["郭委員昱晴：院長好。我想川普的關稅大刀是砍向全世界，但是我們臺灣是第一批能夠進入……第一批國家可以跟川普、跟美國政府對談，我想這是很好的一個機會，也希望陸續能夠聽到一些好消息。"],["卓院長榮泰：一定努力。"],["郭委員昱晴：好！院長，我想請教您一個比較簡單的問題，如果預算可以隨便的凍結，然後隨便再靠一個倒數計時器來逼行政單位解凍，請問這個凍結預算的意義到底是什麼？到底是為了要追蹤改善還是為了要政治表演？現在有這樣子的狀況，您覺得呢？"],["卓院長榮泰：大家應該都很清楚，在整個預算法裡面，對於審查預算是沒有所謂凍結項目的，可以刪減或通過，沒有凍結，凍結是因為委員們對於行政院所做的一些事情，希望再提出一些說明，所以把它凍結了，但是如果凍結的過程附帶一些條件，目前我們連這個條件都還沒有達到，也很難在這個時候就提出要去解凍的任何程序。"],["郭委員昱晴：我想凍結的部分，我們就以中研院為例，因為上個禮拜我們也才在委員會質詢中研院，以中研院這個部分，在教文會當中，我們凍結的金額是1,250萬，看似不多，但是別忘了其實還有所謂的全院凍結，這部分高達11億，現在有委員設計了所謂的解凍計時器，他們可能真的是誤以為解凍預算就好像是把一塊雞肉從冷凍庫拿下來，然後放進微波爐嗶一下可能之後就馬上可以吃了。其實整個解凍的過程，如果解凍從送進報告、口頭報告大概要經過三個月的時間，對嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：過去解凍的例子雖然也是有，但比較少要到院會裡面來通過的，通常在委員會裡面或者是書面報告或者是口頭說明，在委員會裡面就會通過。現在很多數的凍結案都要到院會裡面來，但院會的時間是非常有限的，而且非常寶貴，我也不曉得將來立法院要怎麼樣來解決這些凍結案的問題。"],["郭委員昱晴：我們還記得1月底他們開始凍結預算、刪除預算嘛！這個是1月底的事情；再來，3月中我們覺得窒礙難行而提出了覆議，但是他們也否決了覆議；而在4月初的時候，我們就不斷地聽到藍白的委員一直在講，你們送報告我們馬上就可以讓你們動用這個金額了啊！","我們來看一下他們是怎麼操作的，我不知道這樣解釋對不對，但我幫大家整理了一下。看起來是先大規模的凍結，刻意讓各個單位認為很多東西無法正常運行；再來是否決你的覆議案，營造政府失能的一個形象；第三個，限三個禮拜之內要行政單位交出所謂的解凍報告。我其實上次在委員會當中有特別提到，有研究員也講到，雖然看似中研院的預算被凍結的金額不高，但是也已經確定有一些項目受影響，比方在日本進行20年的長期研究也被迫要終止。我想這樣子的監督改善，放一個倒數計時器在這個地方，到底是為了什麼？","我們還記得，二二八事件於今年邁入第78年，藍白聯手刪凍了內政部的預算，也直接衝擊二二八事件紀念基金會的運作，其實已經模糊了二二八事件是臺灣人的傷痕跟歷史。他們不斷地用預算權力來壓制歷史跟真相，而且也影響到基金會要照顧這些受難者跟受難者家屬的計畫。我想問一下行政院院長，我們的行政機關是不是有信心可以堅守解凍報告，而不用交差的形式，來呼應他們這些政治上的動作？因為我們也擔心，若你們的報告寫得太長，怕他們會說你們動作太慢；若寫得不夠多，他會說你們忽略我，你們不重視、不尊重我們這個委員會。目前我們應該要怎麼樣來保護行政單位跟公務人員不要被這樣子的政治動作給綁架？院長。"],["卓院長榮泰：是，委員所說的二二八基金會，如果我沒有記錯，它大概是三千六百多萬的預算，被刪減兩千五百多萬、凍結六百多萬，也就是三千六百多萬當中的3,200萬不是被刪就是被凍。"],["郭委員昱晴：他們把媒體政策所有的業務費用全數刪除。"],["卓院長榮泰：而且更難為的是，他們把它集中在某一個科目裡面，把單一的項目刪減或凍結了，所以他們的業務費用是沒有辦法執行的，這個是普遍發生在現在所有部會當中的。因此我認為解鈴還須繫鈴人，解凍也須凍結人，希望自己要知道，過去做了這個事情之後，又設了很多的門檻跟條件，當我們還沒有達到的時候，如果貿然提出可能又引起另外一次的批評。所以對於整個預算，我們現在一方面在研議是否再度尋求憲政的救濟，同時我們也希望是否能夠啟動過去兩院協商的機制，再就目前的預算如何有效的實施能對全民最有利，看我們兩院可不可能再進行一次的協商。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，我們只能繼續努力了。","接下來我想請教一下農業部。"],["主席：麻煩請農業部部長備詢。"],["陳部長駿季：委員好。"],["郭委員昱晴：部長好。根據農業部的統計……因為你們是5年做一次調查，關於全國犬貓的一些數量，2023年全國的家犬跟家貓數量估計是比2021年要增加19%及50%，目前已經來到150萬隻的家犬及135萬隻的家貓，這個還是2023年的資料。"],["陳部長駿季：2023年底，279萬隻。"],["郭委員昱晴：對。接下來，其實我相信很多人關心的就是每一個飼主對於毛小孩照顧的部分，經過統計，每年支出項目的前三名，第一名當然就是醫療照護，第二個就是飼料跟零食，再來第三個是美容服務跟住宿，是最為飼主所關心的部分。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["郭委員昱晴：今天我想要就兩個問題來請教一下部長，飼主其實非常關心飼料跟零食，還有美容服務跟住宿，我們先就美容住宿的部分向部長請教一下。目前我們知道可以合法寄養的寵物店大概3,000家，有2,841家。"],["陳部長駿季：2,846家。"],["郭委員昱晴：又多5家了，是不是？"],["陳部長駿季：對。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，相較於前5年來講是2,184家，其實已經增加了大概30%。"],["陳部長駿季：對，這兩年增加的特別快速。"],["郭委員昱晴：特別多？"],["陳部長駿季：對。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，其實等於每一個月我們就增加了將近11家之多，每一個月都在增加寵物寄養家數的數量。我想以前我們可能都會碰到，比方說我可能要出遊、出差、出國，在短期期間我可能就是把犬貓寄養，要不就是寵物旅館，要不就是請朋友來幫我照顧，帶到朋友家，但是現在其實還有另外一種選擇是放在平臺當中，他們所媒合的一些我們講類似寵物……"],["陳部長駿季：寵物保母之類的。"],["郭委員昱晴：對，但問題是我們現行的法規當中，這個寄宿跟安親寵物的寄養行為，其實是必須要符合特定寵物業管理辦法當中的規定，要有特寵證。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["郭委員昱晴：特寵證其實是向我們的經濟部來申請營業登記的項目，除了是保障消費者，當然也要保障業者，提供相對的保障，能夠增加動物的福祉。但是為什麼我說這個制度跟證照的部分，其實真的需要通盤的考量？最主要的原因我們剛剛有提到，就是有一些平臺類似寵物的Airbnb，這個是平臺上面有一些人說：我可以來登記，我可以來照顧貓犬，但是這些被寄養的，不管是家庭也好或者是個人短期的照護也好，其實，第一，考量到他是沒有證照的。"],["陳部長駿季：對，現在是沒有的。"],["郭委員昱晴：在管理的部分，其實可能就會有灰色地帶。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["郭委員昱晴：這個灰色地帶我們應該要怎麼樣避免？萬一發生問題由誰來負責？因為我們也曾經聽到，有一些毛小孩的爸爸媽媽把自己的毛小孩送去之後，可能第一天牠就骨折了，到底這個責任要歸咎平臺，還是要歸咎寄養的這個家庭？在專業照護的寄養跟商業的寄養當中，有沒有符合專業技術的門檻？到目前為止，其實我們還沒有官方的管理機制，或者是考核機制，就這個部分農業部可以扮演什麼樣的角色，怎麼樣來輔導他們呢？"],["陳部長駿季：我跟委員報告，我們現在在做的大概分為兩個面向，一個面向是制度面的部分，就是剛才特別提到的，如果是專業的寄養，要向各地方政府登記，但是你剛才講的像Airbnb，這種類似寵物保母的部分，我覺得人的能力一定要先被建立，所以我們現在正在規劃，類似寵物美容的技術士，我們會規劃動物照護的技術士，讓他領有丙級的證照，先把人處理了以後，第二個部分，我們希望建立一個所謂的寄養或是相關的定型化契約，有定型化契約就可以釐清相關的責任，因為目前並沒有所謂定型化契約的責任，所以就這兩點我們會先啟動。"],["郭委員昱晴：目前我們是有寵物美容定型化契約。"],["陳部長駿季：對。"],["郭委員昱晴：因為是在2月26日……"],["陳部長駿季：但是沒有寄養。"],["郭委員昱晴：但是寄養的部分其實是還沒有的。"],["陳部長駿季：我們現在就要做寄養的部分。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，大概什麼時候？我剛剛有聽到部長說目前已經在規劃了。"],["陳部長駿季：對。"],["郭委員昱晴：最快大概什麼時候可以上路？"],["陳部長駿季：我是跟我們的動保司說5月底之前要把所有的，包括我們的定型化契約先做出來，有關拿丙級證照的寵物照護技術士，我希望他們在6月底的時候能夠把相關的規範完成，因為它比較嚴謹，必須要有一些規範。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，所以我聽到兩個比較肯定跟正面的答復了，關於寵物定型化的契約是在5月底，另外關於照顧者本身證照的認可是在6月底。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["郭委員昱晴：第二個問題，我想要關心的是寵物食品安全的問題，針對寵物食品安全問題，其實也有很多飼主提出陳情。首先我先要謝謝基層的行政人員，農業部對於寵物食安的部分，相對來講，其實你們有比過去更加嚴謹的把關，但是現在凸顯了一個問題，我們看到寵物食品登記業者從2018年的642家到2022年增加至3,286家，累計已經增加了將近四倍，這個還是2022年之前的資料，現在可能又不只了。關於目前寵物食品申報的部分，其實我們是鼓勵他們能夠主動申報……"],["陳部長駿季：自主申報。"],["郭委員昱晴：但問題是在自主申報的狀況之下，其實就有很多的漏洞會跑出來。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["郭委員昱晴：舉例來講，之前我們看到主動申報的方式，我個人認為是比較難以確保寵物食品的安全，以去年為例，381件的違規當中，其實有335件，大概有88%，將近90%是沒有按照申報而違規的案例，這個比例是高的，我們怎麼樣來改變這個制度？是主動申報還是要主動稽查？因為市面當中有太多了，其實這跟源頭也有相關，包含寵物食品的源頭代工廠，他們都有可能會是問題最重要的源頭，這個部分要怎麼樣來加強？"],["陳部長駿季：我想同樣也是分兩個部分，就像委員一直期待的寵物專法，寵物專法目前已經經過預告，而且重新收斂了以後正在我們的法規會審議，逐條確認之後就會送行政院。但是在這個法完全通過之前，我們也是要協助……就是過往的這種自主申報有很多灰色地帶跟漏洞，如果從去年度的違規樣態來講，21.6%左右是屬於申報樣態不符合的……"],["郭委員昱晴：是。"],["陳部長駿季：申報樣態不符合表示有一些寵物食品的歸類，可能業者不是非常清楚，這個部分我想我們會更積極的把它正面表列，讓業者能夠針對其樣態處理。","第二個是標示不實的部分，大概占了16.5%左右，對於標示不實的部分，就是牽涉到裡面的內容物，寵物食品的有害物質跟一些不該有的物質，它本身的規範不明確，針對這個部分，我們今年特別增加了五種有害物質的公告，包括含有汞的部分，希望能夠讓毛小孩的飲食更健康。"],["郭委員昱晴：好，其實我們輸往歐盟外銷的部分是有嚴格的控制，可是我們在內銷的部分，可能還是要更加注意飲食的安全。"],["陳部長駿季：會，我們會更加強，用更積極的態度去處理。"],["郭委員昱晴：好。"],["卓院長榮泰：抽驗食品也抽查它的包裝標示，雙重加強管理。"],["郭委員昱晴：要大量的抽查，可能會比主動申報來得有效的多，謝謝。"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝郭昱晴委員質詢，謝謝卓院長及相關部會首長的備詢，謝謝。","報告院會，現在立法院又來了兩個團，一個是來自美國國會議員助理訪問團Welcome！Amigos, amigas, welcome.另外一個是來自於美國青年領袖訪問團，熱情歡迎，我們掌聲鼓勵。","接下來請李柏毅委員質詢，楊瓊瓔委員請準備。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":159,"meet_id":"院會-11-3-7","speakers":["韓國瑜","蘇清泉","范雲","涂權吉","王美惠","洪孟楷","劉建國","鄭正鈐","陳秀寳","郭昱晴","李柏毅","楊瓊瓔","葉元之"],"page_start":79,"meetingDate":["2025-04-15"],"gazette_id":"1143401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143401_00003","1143401_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期第7次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢─ 繼續質詢─","agenda_id":"1143401_00004"}}}