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61.292, \"end\": 79.364, \"text\": \"昨天的畫面我都直接調出來了那我也覺得很疑惑啦因為我在想說我不只是從媒體看到而且重要的其實是在我在4月9號的時候就在我們紅樓101經濟委員會的時候你在回答\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"昨\", \"start\": 61.292, \"end\": 61.432, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 61.432, \"end\": 61.552, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 61.552, \"end\": 61.913, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"畫\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 61.913, \"end\": 62.233, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 62.233, \"end\": 62.353, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 62.353, \"end\": 62.493, \"score\": 0.864}, {\"word\": \"直\", \"start\": 62.493, \"end\": 62.653, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 62.653, \"end\": 63.414, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 63.414, \"end\": 63.754, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 63.754, \"end\": 64.434, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 64.434, \"end\": 64.634, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": 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\"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 548.602, \"end\": 549.062, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 549.062, \"end\": 549.442, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 549.442, \"end\": 549.702, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 549.702, \"end\": 549.982, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 549.982, \"end\": 550.122, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 550.122, \"end\": 550.282, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 550.282, \"end\": 550.722, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"凍\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 550.722, \"end\": 551.223, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"共\", \"start\": 551.223, \"end\": 551.743, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"濟\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 551.743, \"end\": 552.283, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"共\", \"start\": 552.283, \"end\": 552.543, 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557.426, \"end\": 557.626, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 557.626, \"end\": 558.387, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"專\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 558.387, \"end\": 558.888, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 558.888, \"end\": 559.108, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 559.108, \"end\": 559.348, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"使\", \"start\": 559.348, \"end\": 559.488, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 559.488, \"end\": 559.828, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 559.828, \"end\": 559.948, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 559.948, \"end\": 560.469, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 560.469, \"end\": 561.229, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"書\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 561.229, \"end\": 561.65, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 561.65, \"end\": 562.39, \"score\": 1.0}, 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\"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 575.181, \"end\": 575.621, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 575.621, \"end\": 575.742, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 575.742, \"end\": 575.842, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 575.842, \"end\": 576.082, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"7\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 576.082, \"end\": 576.102, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 577.603, \"end\": 586.273, \"text\": \"那到目前為止的時候我想請一下劉主委跟郭部長我們國發會跟經濟部有送了多少解凍案進經濟委員會來\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 577.603, \"end\": 577.823, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 577.823, \"end\": 578.044, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"目\", \"start\": 578.044, \"end\": 578.304, \"score\": 0.959}, {\"word\": \"前\", \"start\": 578.304, \"end\": 578.785, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"止\", \"start\": 578.785, \"end\": 578.885, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"的\", 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\"text\": \"跟委員報告我們現在大部分的報告都準備好了但是有些數字因為還在釐清中所以我們還在等那個這個確定的數字大概什麼時候可以送進來下個禮拜嗎因為有些數字因為他給的當時在統三那部分有些數字不夠還要等分配所以我們因為有一點\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 590.614, \"end\": 590.774, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 590.774, \"end\": 591.134, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 591.134, \"end\": 591.495, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 591.495, \"end\": 591.855, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 591.855, \"end\": 592.876, \"score\": 0.98}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 592.876, \"end\": 593.016, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 593.016, \"end\": 593.036, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 593.036, \"end\": 593.156, \"score\": 0.826}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 593.156, \"end\": 593.437, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 593.437, \"end\": 593.557, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"都\", 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顧部長這邊呢我們也是一樣因為那個統三的部分我們到底要怎麼樣調這個是一個問題\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 613.317, \"end\": 613.457, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 613.457, \"end\": 613.617, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"等\", \"start\": 613.617, \"end\": 613.738, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 613.738, \"end\": 615.359, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"足\", \"start\": 615.359, \"end\": 615.739, \"score\": 0.845}, {\"word\": \"跡\"}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"署\", \"start\": 615.739, \"end\": 615.88, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 615.88, \"end\": 615.98, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 615.98, \"end\": 616.16, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"配\", \"start\": 616.16, \"end\": 616.3, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 616.3, \"end\": 616.42, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 616.42, \"end\": 616.961, 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能源署也沒有送進來那麼國發會這邊的一個檔案局也都沒有送進來這都是一個很簡單可以就解凍的案子那我不知道是現在是因為更高層的一個政治決策還是我們各部會\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"制\", \"start\": 653.09, \"end\": 653.25, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"裁\", \"start\": 653.25, \"end\": 653.47, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"局\", \"start\": 653.47, \"end\": 653.57, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 653.57, \"end\": 653.71, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 653.71, \"end\": 653.83, \"score\": 0.801}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 653.83, \"end\": 653.95, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"送\", \"start\": 653.95, \"end\": 654.451, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"水\", \"start\": 654.451, \"end\": 654.571, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"利\", \"start\": 654.571, \"end\": 654.751, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"署\", \"start\": 654.751, \"end\": 654.891, \"score\": 0.797}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 654.891, \"end\": 654.991, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 654.991, \"end\": 655.111, 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00:00:41,023\n兩位好首先我想請一下郭部長因為昨天我在質詢總質詢的時候針對那個卓院長的部分我特別問到了一個因為我們在做那個國際採購當中要平衡那個台美貿易逆差的部分問到了一個\n\n3\n00:00:41,603 --> 00:00:59,591\n天然氣的部分那針對這個部分的時候我那時候有提到說當時說要跟美國買天然氣要從10%提高到30%嘛那郭部長你當時你直接講到的狀態是說你要鄭重跟委員報告你從來不會提到有多少的比例然後而且你提到說這個資料可能有錯\n\n4\n00:01:01,292 --> 00:01:19,364\n昨天的畫面我都直接調出來了那我也覺得很疑惑啦因為我在想說我不只是從媒體看到而且重要的其實是在我在4月9號的時候就在我們紅樓101經濟委員會的時候你在回答\n\n5\n00:01:20,245 --> 00:01:46,163\n你在回答就是張其凱委員的時候你就直接講到了就是將來就是20%到30%你具體講這個部分所以我覺得我也很疑惑我在想說不就是只差幾天的時間一下怎麼會變成說我得到的資訊可能是錯誤的可不可以請部長這邊做一個簡單的回應報告委員我想這個是天然氣的部分\n\n6\n00:01:47,386 --> 00:02:00,731\n那天然氣的部分是不是會買到30%這個我想我們會根據談判的這個內容我不應該這個很貿然的講說我們會一定肯定會到30%\n\n7\n00:02:03,252 --> 00:02:22,708\n所以基本上我的依據是有來源的嘛對不對因為你很具體在經紀委員會講到了這樣的一個數字那我用這樣的方式來質詢我們的院長的時候你跳出來說我的資訊可能是錯誤的不會有這樣子的一個事情我就覺得這是什麼狀態\n\n8\n00:02:24,930 --> 00:02:44,867\n才四月九號到四月十五號隔六天等一下你講的話就要收回去了但我們這樣怎麼去做我們接下來的整個報告委員這一點我想是這個樣子因為我們的變化蠻大的這裡面牽扯到現在在談判的內容所以六天你的話變化就不算了不是不算\n\n9\n00:02:47,072 --> 00:03:06,060\n所以媒體有嘛我用媒體你背詢的資料回來出來用的時候你告訴我說我的資訊是錯誤的那我這樣我怎麼能夠接受部長你理解我的意思嗎那針對這個部分我想說我們接下來要怎麼樣去談判這件事情其實我完全尊重\n\n10\n00:03:06,400 --> 00:03:28,870\n而且我也理解談判當中有很多東西可以揭露有很多東西不能揭露只是針對我昨天在總質詢的時候問到這個數字的時候你說我應用的那個數字是錯誤的我就很難接受因為你當時4月9號在我們經紀委員會回答的這件事情那這部分我想說在這邊我就很清楚地跟\n\n11\n00:03:29,770 --> 00:03:50,504\n就是部長報告我在質詢運用的所引用的數據都是有來源的而且有清楚的來源而且是從你這邊講出來的東西如果說隔了六天你覺得就不算數然後理由是因為我們現在在台美談判當中的時候那很多東西都不算數那我們這樣政策很難推動啊\n\n12\n00:03:51,004 --> 00:04:16,562\n好不好這邊特別跟部長這邊做一個清楚的一個說明那我想說接下來的時候我想請教一下劉主委因為你在簡報當中你特別提到了一個台灣加一這個部分那台灣加一的部分其實我們賴總統他特別提到的一個情況就是說台灣加一就是台灣加美國的一個新布局對不對我這樣理解有沒有錯\n\n13\n00:04:18,134 --> 00:04:32,543\n按照這是總統的的意見對那總統意見對嘛台灣加一日臺灣加美國就是一個全球的一個新佈局嗎OK那因為你剛的報告當中你也特別提到了這個部分\n\n14\n00:04:33,283 --> 00:04:45,909\n那我想說台灣要加一這一是什麼東西我在想說也許我們本來在想他可能有一些更彈性的一個調整而不是只是設定在美國那總統既然定調說他是美國的狀態的時候我們對台灣加一就是我們希望還是實現這個經濟日不落帝國\n\n15\n00:04:53,693 --> 00:05:19,630\n只是因為你剛剛也特別提到了因為總統特別提到說台灣加1加1就是美國那我其實是有點擔心因為台灣其實它本來就是貿易導向的國家它其實應該是要更多元化跟國際接軌這很重要所以跟台灣加1這部分還牽涉到了一個脫中入北我這邊我也請教一下那個主委我們脫中入北這個概念是怎麼樣子\n\n16\n00:05:21,243 --> 00:05:26,001\n郭忠祿北不好意思我不太清楚您這個意思是北是什麼\n\n17\n00:05:27,505 --> 00:05:51,416\n如果連國發會主委都不知道賴總統講脫中入北是什麼意思的時候那我們的廠商我們的企業我們其他的經濟部其他各部會要怎麼去講脫中入北脫中入北這個部分也是賴總統直接講的我說明一下我們的簡報上面我們今天講的兩件事如果你早上有聽我講美國佔全球進口市場13.4%\n\n18\n00:05:54,197 --> 00:06:09,103\n全球美國之外的市場還有86.6%我們希望引導我們希望引導廠商能夠分散市場進入全球那美國是因為深化我們跟美國的合作這個沒問題我只是針對因為脫中入北這個部分\n\n19\n00:06:12,825 --> 00:06:36,233\n我不太理解就像你的反應跟我的反應是一樣的因為所謂北是什麼意思因為台灣其實在20世紀下半的部分的時候當時華沙公約組織解散的時候很多人就講說北方國家的時候就是一個先進的國家概念所以台灣原本就在北方國家之列所以脫中入北這邊的時候我覺得在目前整個\n\n20\n00:06:37,873 --> 00:06:57,086\n美國重新要調整國際經濟格局的時候我覺得特別的一個重要所以我為什麼會把台灣加一跟拖中入北這兩件事情拿起來討論就是因為台灣目前為止第一個最大的貿易對象其實還是在中國大陸去年佔了20%那麼美國這邊佔18%點多那美國也成長得很快這都沒有問題那台灣要擁抱美國\n\n21\n00:07:08,173 --> 00:07:32,853\n但是說實話我覺得台灣原本跟美國關係就非常的緊密而且台灣的朝野基本上都是親美的我的認為是這樣子所以我們跟美國這邊有更好的連結度我覺得也沒有問題只是在目前因為美國的對等關稅的時候全世界都在重新考量跟美國的一個距離當中而且我覺得可能會產生兩個世界格局的一個不同的\n\n22\n00:07:33,633 --> 00:07:49,143\n貿易陣營的時候台灣要怎麼去做很重要是不是完全壓在美國的身上台灣加一完全壓在美國的身上還是我們同時重新要去讓台灣更多元化去進行\n\n23\n00:07:50,183 --> 00:08:11,785\n美國以外的一個貿易的一個互動跟格局這也是我特別關心的一點所以今天針對就是主委跟部長在的一個今天的一個委員會當中的時候我特別提到這個點就台灣這邊加一我希望這個一委員我的報告第二第二頁寫得很清楚台灣加一佈局全球\n\n24\n00:08:12,025 --> 00:08:26,177\n理解理解只是因為我們總統不是這樣講我們總統講台灣家又台灣家美國總統的政策很清楚就是要做經濟日不落國也就是希望我們協助台商能夠佈局全球理解這個也是我的目標\n\n25\n00:08:28,559 --> 00:08:53,612\n那我只是希望說因為針對這個部分的時候呢我希望我們有更好的一個戰略讓台灣能夠更面向就是世界不同的一個經濟體都能夠有好的一個互動那這個部分我在這邊先打住我最後一個部分因為您跟郭部長都在那我想特別提到的一個情況其實是因為\n\n26\n00:08:56,677 --> 00:09:13,143\n總預算的複議已經過了35天了總統公告也已經公告到今天是第36天我看到的一個狀態國發會這邊的時候我們有很多的解凍案總共經濟委員會總共有98個解凍案\n\n27\n00:09:15,184 --> 00:09:36,102\n那其中在國發會這邊的時候呢專案報告就使得動之有4個案書面報告就可以動之的有15案那書面報告之後要同意使得動之有2個案經濟部這邊的時候呢專案報告使得動之有21個案書面報告就可以動之的有17個案\n\n28\n00:09:37,603 --> 00:09:46,273\n那到目前為止的時候我想請一下劉主委跟郭部長我們國發會跟經濟部有送了多少解凍案進經濟委員會來\n\n29\n00:09:50,614 --> 00:10:12,556\n跟委員報告我們現在大部分的報告都準備好了但是有些數字因為還在釐清中所以我們還在等那個這個確定的數字大概什麼時候可以送進來下個禮拜嗎因為有些數字因為他給的當時在統三那部分有些數字不夠還要等分配所以我們因為有一點\n\n30\n00:10:13,317 --> 00:10:27,411\n我們在等那個這個足跡總署的分配什麼時候會送進來什麼時候送進來他們確定之後我們就會送過來我們基本上報告都寫好了OK顧部長這邊呢我們也是一樣因為那個統三的部分我們到底要怎麼樣調這個是一個問題\n\n31\n00:10:30,804 --> 00:10:51,890\n這個部分因為我覺得書面報告送進來的時候就可以直接動用的時候可是到目前為止其實是零我們整個經紀人會動了98個案子一個案子都沒有送進來這其中包括了我們產發署也有一個直接書面報告就可以解凍的案子也沒有送進來標準局也沒有送進來\n\n32\n00:10:53,090 --> 00:11:13,718\n制裁局也沒有送進來水利署沒有送進來商業發展署沒有送進來能源署也沒有送進來那麼國發會這邊的一個檔案局也都沒有送進來這都是一個很簡單可以就解凍的案子那我不知道是現在是因為更高層的一個政治決策還是我們各部會\n\n33\n00:11:15,205 --> 00:11:36,341\n或者是各署各局偷懶了所以我們沒有送進來那這個部分我希望因為主委剛剛提到的一個數字這個問題我相信它正常應該可以很快有那我希望就是劉主委跟郭部長能夠用最快的速度把可以直接用書面報告解凍的案子就直接送進委員會可不可以這個我們回去會來努力\n\n34\n00:11:41,664 --> 00:12:07,008\n好那這個部分我希望用最快的速度因為我覺得能夠做行政部門能夠做我們就盡力的去做那麼盡力的去做尤其兩位都是攸關整個台灣整個經貿發展很重要的一個部門那我們希望對於這樣的行政效率的時候能夠加速的提升能夠解凍就盡力速的解凍不要拖謝謝好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n11374\t16378\t謝謝主席我想請一下郭志威部長還有我們劉繼欽主委郭部長 劉主委\n25333\t41023\t兩位好首先我想請一下郭部長因為昨天我在質詢總質詢的時候針對那個卓院長的部分我特別問到了一個因為我們在做那個國際採購當中要平衡那個台美貿易逆差的部分問到了一個\n41603\t59591\t天然氣的部分那針對這個部分的時候我那時候有提到說當時說要跟美國買天然氣要從10%提高到30%嘛那郭部長你當時你直接講到的狀態是說你要鄭重跟委員報告你從來不會提到有多少的比例然後而且你提到說這個資料可能有錯\n61292\t79364\t昨天的畫面我都直接調出來了那我也覺得很疑惑啦因為我在想說我不只是從媒體看到而且重要的其實是在我在4月9號的時候就在我們紅樓101經濟委員會的時候你在回答\n80245\t106163\t你在回答就是張其凱委員的時候你就直接講到了就是將來就是20%到30%你具體講這個部分所以我覺得我也很疑惑我在想說不就是只差幾天的時間一下怎麼會變成說我得到的資訊可能是錯誤的可不可以請部長這邊做一個簡單的回應報告委員我想這個是天然氣的部分\n107386\t120731\t那天然氣的部分是不是會買到30%這個我想我們會根據談判的這個內容我不應該這個很貿然的講說我們會一定肯定會到30%\n123252\t142708\t所以基本上我的依據是有來源的嘛對不對因為你很具體在經紀委員會講到了這樣的一個數字那我用這樣的方式來質詢我們的院長的時候你跳出來說我的資訊可能是錯誤的不會有這樣子的一個事情我就覺得這是什麼狀態\n144930\t164867\t才四月九號到四月十五號 隔六天等一下你講的話就要收回去了但我們這樣怎麼去做我們接下來的整個報告委員這一點我想是這個樣子因為我們的變化蠻大的這裡面牽扯到現在在談判的內容所以六天你的話變化就不算了不是不算\n167072\t186060\t所以媒體有嘛我用媒體你背詢的資料回來出來用的時候你告訴我說我的資訊是錯誤的那我這樣我怎麼能夠接受部長你理解我的意思嗎那針對這個部分我想說我們接下來要怎麼樣去談判這件事情其實我完全尊重\n186400\t208870\t而且我也理解談判當中有很多東西可以揭露有很多東西不能揭露只是針對我昨天在總質詢的時候問到這個數字的時候你說我應用的那個數字是錯誤的我就很難接受因為你當時4月9號在我們經紀委員會回答的這件事情那這部分我想說在這邊我就很清楚地跟\n209770\t230504\t就是部長報告我在質詢運用的所引用的數據都是有來源的而且有清楚的來源而且是從你這邊講出來的東西如果說隔了六天你覺得就不算數然後理由是因為我們現在在台美談判當中的時候那很多東西都不算數那我們這樣政策很難推動啊\n231004\t256562\t好不好這邊特別跟部長這邊做一個清楚的一個說明那我想說接下來的時候我想請教一下劉主委因為你在簡報當中你特別提到了一個台灣加一這個部分那台灣加一的部分其實我們賴總統他特別提到的一個情況就是說台灣加一就是台灣加美國的一個新布局對不對我這樣理解有沒有錯\n258134\t272543\t按照這是總統的的意見對那總統意見對嘛台灣加一日臺灣加美國就是一個全球的一個新佈局嗎OK那因為你剛的報告當中你也特別提到了這個部分\n273283\t285909\t那我想說台灣要加一這一是什麼東西我在想說也許我們本來在想他可能有一些更彈性的一個調整而不是只是設定在美國那總統既然定調說他是美國的狀態的時候我們對台灣加一就是我們希望還是實現這個經濟日不落帝國\n293693\t319630\t只是因為你剛剛也特別提到了因為總統特別提到說台灣加1加1就是美國那我其實是有點擔心因為台灣其實它本來就是貿易導向的國家它其實應該是要更多元化跟國際接軌這很重要所以跟台灣加1這部分還牽涉到了一個脫中入北我這邊我也請教一下那個主委我們脫中入北這個概念是怎麼樣子\n321243\t326001\t郭忠祿北不好意思我不太清楚您這個意思是北是什麼\n327505\t351416\t如果連國發會主委都不知道賴總統講脫中入北是什麼意思的時候那我們的廠商我們的企業我們其他的經濟部其他各部會要怎麼去講脫中入北脫中入北這個部分也是賴總統直接講的我說明一下我們的簡報上面我們今天講的兩件事如果你早上有聽我講美國佔全球進口市場13.4%\n354197\t369103\t全球美國之外的市場還有86.6%我們希望引導我們希望引導廠商能夠分散市場進入全球那美國是因為深化我們跟美國的合作這個沒問題我只是針對因為脫中入北這個部分\n372825\t396233\t我不太理解就像你的反應跟我的反應是一樣的因為所謂北是什麼意思因為台灣其實在20世紀下半的部分的時候當時華沙公約組織解散的時候很多人就講說北方國家的時候就是一個先進的國家概念所以台灣原本就在北方國家之列所以脫中入北這邊的時候我覺得在目前整個\n397873\t417086\t美國重新要調整國際經濟格局的時候我覺得特別的一個重要所以我為什麼會把台灣加一跟拖中入北這兩件事情拿起來討論就是因為台灣目前為止第一個最大的貿易對象其實還是在中國大陸去年佔了20%那麼美國這邊佔18%點多那美國也成長得很快這都沒有問題那台灣要擁抱美國\n428173\t452853\t但是說實話 我覺得台灣原本跟美國關係就非常的緊密而且台灣的朝野基本上都是親美的我的認為是這樣子所以我們跟美國這邊有更好的連結度我覺得也沒有問題只是在目前因為美國的對等關稅的時候全世界都在重新考量跟美國的一個距離當中而且我覺得可能會產生兩個世界格局的一個不同的\n453633\t469143\t貿易陣營的時候台灣要怎麼去做很重要是不是完全壓在美國的身上台灣加一完全壓在美國的身上還是我們同時重新要去讓台灣更多元化去進行\n470183\t491785\t美國以外的一個貿易的一個互動跟格局這也是我特別關心的一點所以今天針對就是主委跟部長在的一個今天的一個委員會當中的時候我特別提到這個點就台灣這邊加一我希望這個一委員我的報告第二第二頁寫得很清楚台灣加一佈局全球\n492025\t506177\t理解 理解只是因為我們總統不是這樣講我們總統講台灣家又台灣家美國總統的政策很清楚就是要做經濟日不落國也就是希望我們協助台商能夠佈局全球理解 這個也是我的目標\n508559\t533612\t那我只是希望說因為針對這個部分的時候呢我希望我們有更好的一個戰略讓台灣能夠更面向就是世界不同的一個經濟體都能夠有好的一個互動那這個部分我在這邊先打住我最後一個部分因為您跟郭部長都在那我想特別提到的一個情況其實是因為\n536677\t553143\t總預算的複議已經過了35天了總統公告也已經公告到今天是第36天我看到的一個狀態國發會這邊的時候我們有很多的解凍案總共經濟委員會總共有98個解凍案\n555184\t576102\t那其中在國發會這邊的時候呢專案報告就使得動之有4個案書面報告就可以動之的有15案那書面報告之後要同意使得動之有2個案經濟部這邊的時候呢專案報告使得動之有21個案書面報告就可以動之的有17個案\n577603\t586273\t那到目前為止的時候我想請一下劉主委跟郭部長我們國發會跟經濟部有送了多少解凍案進經濟委員會來\n590614\t612556\t跟委員報告我們現在大部分的報告都準備好了但是有些數字因為還在釐清中所以我們還在等那個這個確定的數字大概什麼時候可以送進來下個禮拜嗎因為有些數字因為他給的當時在統三那部分有些數字不夠還要等分配所以我們因為有一點\n613317\t627411\t我們在等那個這個足跡總署的分配什麼時候會送進來什麼時候送進來他們確定之後我們就會送過來我們基本上報告都寫好了OK 顧部長這邊呢我們也是一樣因為那個統三的部分我們到底要怎麼樣調這個是一個問題\n630804\t651890\t這個部分因為我覺得書面報告送進來的時候就可以直接動用的時候可是到目前為止其實是零我們整個經紀人會動了98個案子一個案子都沒有送進來這其中包括了我們產發署也有一個直接書面報告就可以解凍的案子也沒有送進來標準局也沒有送進來\n653090\t673718\t制裁局也沒有送進來 水利署沒有送進來 商業發展署沒有送進來 能源署也沒有送進來那麼國發會這邊的一個檔案局也都沒有送進來這都是一個很簡單可以就解凍的案子那我不知道是現在是因為更高層的一個政治決策還是我們各部會\n675205\t696341\t或者是各署各局偷懶了所以我們沒有送進來那這個部分我希望因為主委剛剛提到的一個數字這個問題我相信它正常應該可以很快有那我希望就是劉主委跟郭部長能夠用最快的速度把可以直接用書面報告解凍的案子就直接送進委員會可不可以這個我們回去會來努力\n701664\t727008\t好那這個部分我希望用最快的速度因為我覺得能夠做行政部門能夠做我們就盡力的去做那麼盡力的去做尤其兩位都是攸關整個台灣整個經貿發展很重要的一個部門那我們希望對於這樣的行政效率的時候能夠加速的提升能夠解凍就盡力速的解凍不要拖謝謝好謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席我想請一下郭志威部長還有我們劉繼欽主委郭部長 劉主委\n兩位好首先我想請一下郭部長因為昨天我在質詢總質詢的時候針對那個卓院長的部分我特別問到了一個因為我們在做那個國際採購當中要平衡那個台美貿易逆差的部分問到了一個\n天然氣的部分那針對這個部分的時候我那時候有提到說當時說要跟美國買天然氣要從10%提高到30%嘛那郭部長你當時你直接講到的狀態是說你要鄭重跟委員報告你從來不會提到有多少的比例然後而且你提到說這個資料可能有錯\n昨天的畫面我都直接調出來了那我也覺得很疑惑啦因為我在想說我不只是從媒體看到而且重要的其實是在我在4月9號的時候就在我們紅樓101經濟委員會的時候你在回答\n你在回答就是張其凱委員的時候你就直接講到了就是將來就是20%到30%你具體講這個部分所以我覺得我也很疑惑我在想說不就是只差幾天的時間一下怎麼會變成說我得到的資訊可能是錯誤的可不可以請部長這邊做一個簡單的回應報告委員我想這個是天然氣的部分\n那天然氣的部分是不是會買到30%這個我想我們會根據談判的這個內容我不應該這個很貿然的講說我們會一定肯定會到30%\n所以基本上我的依據是有來源的嘛對不對因為你很具體在經紀委員會講到了這樣的一個數字那我用這樣的方式來質詢我們的院長的時候你跳出來說我的資訊可能是錯誤的不會有這樣子的一個事情我就覺得這是什麼狀態\n才四月九號到四月十五號 隔六天等一下你講的話就要收回去了但我們這樣怎麼去做我們接下來的整個報告委員這一點我想是這個樣子因為我們的變化蠻大的這裡面牽扯到現在在談判的內容所以六天你的話變化就不算了不是不算\n所以媒體有嘛我用媒體你背詢的資料回來出來用的時候你告訴我說我的資訊是錯誤的那我這樣我怎麼能夠接受部長你理解我的意思嗎那針對這個部分我想說我們接下來要怎麼樣去談判這件事情其實我完全尊重\n而且我也理解談判當中有很多東西可以揭露有很多東西不能揭露只是針對我昨天在總質詢的時候問到這個數字的時候你說我應用的那個數字是錯誤的我就很難接受因為你當時4月9號在我們經紀委員會回答的這件事情那這部分我想說在這邊我就很清楚地跟\n就是部長報告我在質詢運用的所引用的數據都是有來源的而且有清楚的來源而且是從你這邊講出來的東西如果說隔了六天你覺得就不算數然後理由是因為我們現在在台美談判當中的時候那很多東西都不算數那我們這樣政策很難推動啊\n好不好這邊特別跟部長這邊做一個清楚的一個說明那我想說接下來的時候我想請教一下劉主委因為你在簡報當中你特別提到了一個台灣加一這個部分那台灣加一的部分其實我們賴總統他特別提到的一個情況就是說台灣加一就是台灣加美國的一個新布局對不對我這樣理解有沒有錯\n按照這是總統的的意見對那總統意見對嘛台灣加一日臺灣加美國就是一個全球的一個新佈局嗎OK那因為你剛的報告當中你也特別提到了這個部分\n那我想說台灣要加一這一是什麼東西我在想說也許我們本來在想他可能有一些更彈性的一個調整而不是只是設定在美國那總統既然定調說他是美國的狀態的時候我們對台灣加一就是我們希望還是實現這個經濟日不落帝國\n只是因為你剛剛也特別提到了因為總統特別提到說台灣加1加1就是美國那我其實是有點擔心因為台灣其實它本來就是貿易導向的國家它其實應該是要更多元化跟國際接軌這很重要所以跟台灣加1這部分還牽涉到了一個脫中入北我這邊我也請教一下那個主委我們脫中入北這個概念是怎麼樣子\n郭忠祿北不好意思我不太清楚您這個意思是北是什麼\n如果連國發會主委都不知道賴總統講脫中入北是什麼意思的時候那我們的廠商我們的企業我們其他的經濟部其他各部會要怎麼去講脫中入北脫中入北這個部分也是賴總統直接講的我說明一下我們的簡報上面我們今天講的兩件事如果你早上有聽我講美國佔全球進口市場13.4%\n全球美國之外的市場還有86.6%我們希望引導我們希望引導廠商能夠分散市場進入全球那美國是因為深化我們跟美國的合作這個沒問題我只是針對因為脫中入北這個部分\n我不太理解就像你的反應跟我的反應是一樣的因為所謂北是什麼意思因為台灣其實在20世紀下半的部分的時候當時華沙公約組織解散的時候很多人就講說北方國家的時候就是一個先進的國家概念所以台灣原本就在北方國家之列所以脫中入北這邊的時候我覺得在目前整個\n美國重新要調整國際經濟格局的時候我覺得特別的一個重要所以我為什麼會把台灣加一跟拖中入北這兩件事情拿起來討論就是因為台灣目前為止第一個最大的貿易對象其實還是在中國大陸去年佔了20%那麼美國這邊佔18%點多那美國也成長得很快這都沒有問題那台灣要擁抱美國\n但是說實話 我覺得台灣原本跟美國關係就非常的緊密而且台灣的朝野基本上都是親美的我的認為是這樣子所以我們跟美國這邊有更好的連結度我覺得也沒有問題只是在目前因為美國的對等關稅的時候全世界都在重新考量跟美國的一個距離當中而且我覺得可能會產生兩個世界格局的一個不同的\n貿易陣營的時候台灣要怎麼去做很重要是不是完全壓在美國的身上台灣加一完全壓在美國的身上還是我們同時重新要去讓台灣更多元化去進行\n美國以外的一個貿易的一個互動跟格局這也是我特別關心的一點所以今天針對就是主委跟部長在的一個今天的一個委員會當中的時候我特別提到這個點就台灣這邊加一我希望這個一委員我的報告第二第二頁寫得很清楚台灣加一佈局全球\n理解 理解只是因為我們總統不是這樣講我們總統講台灣家又台灣家美國總統的政策很清楚就是要做經濟日不落國也就是希望我們協助台商能夠佈局全球理解 這個也是我的目標\n那我只是希望說因為針對這個部分的時候呢我希望我們有更好的一個戰略讓台灣能夠更面向就是世界不同的一個經濟體都能夠有好的一個互動那這個部分我在這邊先打住我最後一個部分因為您跟郭部長都在那我想特別提到的一個情況其實是因為\n總預算的複議已經過了35天了總統公告也已經公告到今天是第36天我看到的一個狀態國發會這邊的時候我們有很多的解凍案總共經濟委員會總共有98個解凍案\n那其中在國發會這邊的時候呢專案報告就使得動之有4個案書面報告就可以動之的有15案那書面報告之後要同意使得動之有2個案經濟部這邊的時候呢專案報告使得動之有21個案書面報告就可以動之的有17個案\n那到目前為止的時候我想請一下劉主委跟郭部長我們國發會跟經濟部有送了多少解凍案進經濟委員會來\n跟委員報告我們現在大部分的報告都準備好了但是有些數字因為還在釐清中所以我們還在等那個這個確定的數字大概什麼時候可以送進來下個禮拜嗎因為有些數字因為他給的當時在統三那部分有些數字不夠還要等分配所以我們因為有一點\n我們在等那個這個足跡總署的分配什麼時候會送進來什麼時候送進來他們確定之後我們就會送過來我們基本上報告都寫好了OK 顧部長這邊呢我們也是一樣因為那個統三的部分我們到底要怎麼樣調這個是一個問題\n這個部分因為我覺得書面報告送進來的時候就可以直接動用的時候可是到目前為止其實是零我們整個經紀人會動了98個案子一個案子都沒有送進來這其中包括了我們產發署也有一個直接書面報告就可以解凍的案子也沒有送進來標準局也沒有送進來\n制裁局也沒有送進來 水利署沒有送進來 商業發展署沒有送進來 能源署也沒有送進來那麼國發會這邊的一個檔案局也都沒有送進來這都是一個很簡單可以就解凍的案子那我不知道是現在是因為更高層的一個政治決策還是我們各部會\n或者是各署各局偷懶了所以我們沒有送進來那這個部分我希望因為主委剛剛提到的一個數字這個問題我相信它正常應該可以很快有那我希望就是劉主委跟郭部長能夠用最快的速度把可以直接用書面報告解凍的案子就直接送進委員會可不可以這個我們回去會來努力\n好那這個部分我希望用最快的速度因為我覺得能夠做行政部門能夠做我們就盡力的去做那麼盡力的去做尤其兩位都是攸關整個台灣整個經貿發展很重要的一個部門那我們希望對於這樣的行政效率的時候能夠加速的提升能夠解凍就盡力速的解凍不要拖謝謝好謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:11.374 --> 00:16.378\n謝謝主席我想請一下郭志威部長還有我們劉繼欽主委郭部長劉主委\n\n00:25.333 --> 00:41.023\n兩位好首先我想請一下郭部長因為昨天我在質詢總質詢的時候針對那個卓院長的部分我特別問到了一個因為我們在做那個國際採購當中要平衡那個台美貿易逆差的部分問到了一個\n\n00:41.603 --> 00:59.591\n天然氣的部分那針對這個部分的時候我那時候有提到說當時說要跟美國買天然氣要從10%提高到30%嘛那郭部長你當時你直接講到的狀態是說你要鄭重跟委員報告你從來不會提到有多少的比例然後而且你提到說這個資料可能有錯\n\n01:01.292 --> 01:19.364\n昨天的畫面我都直接調出來了那我也覺得很疑惑啦因為我在想說我不只是從媒體看到而且重要的其實是在我在4月9號的時候就在我們紅樓101經濟委員會的時候你在回答\n\n01:20.245 --> 01:46.163\n你在回答就是張其凱委員的時候你就直接講到了就是將來就是20%到30%你具體講這個部分所以我覺得我也很疑惑我在想說不就是只差幾天的時間一下怎麼會變成說我得到的資訊可能是錯誤的可不可以請部長這邊做一個簡單的回應報告委員我想這個是天然氣的部分\n\n01:47.386 --> 02:00.731\n那天然氣的部分是不是會買到30%這個我想我們會根據談判的這個內容我不應該這個很貿然的講說我們會一定肯定會到30%\n\n02:03.252 --> 02:22.708\n所以基本上我的依據是有來源的嘛對不對因為你很具體在經紀委員會講到了這樣的一個數字那我用這樣的方式來質詢我們的院長的時候你跳出來說我的資訊可能是錯誤的不會有這樣子的一個事情我就覺得這是什麼狀態\n\n02:24.930 --> 02:44.867\n才四月九號到四月十五號隔六天等一下你講的話就要收回去了但我們這樣怎麼去做我們接下來的整個報告委員這一點我想是這個樣子因為我們的變化蠻大的這裡面牽扯到現在在談判的內容所以六天你的話變化就不算了不是不算\n\n02:47.072 --> 03:06.060\n所以媒體有嘛我用媒體你背詢的資料回來出來用的時候你告訴我說我的資訊是錯誤的那我這樣我怎麼能夠接受部長你理解我的意思嗎那針對這個部分我想說我們接下來要怎麼樣去談判這件事情其實我完全尊重\n\n03:06.400 --> 03:28.870\n而且我也理解談判當中有很多東西可以揭露有很多東西不能揭露只是針對我昨天在總質詢的時候問到這個數字的時候你說我應用的那個數字是錯誤的我就很難接受因為你當時4月9號在我們經紀委員會回答的這件事情那這部分我想說在這邊我就很清楚地跟\n\n03:29.770 --> 03:50.504\n就是部長報告我在質詢運用的所引用的數據都是有來源的而且有清楚的來源而且是從你這邊講出來的東西如果說隔了六天你覺得就不算數然後理由是因為我們現在在台美談判當中的時候那很多東西都不算數那我們這樣政策很難推動啊\n\n03:51.004 --> 04:16.562\n好不好這邊特別跟部長這邊做一個清楚的一個說明那我想說接下來的時候我想請教一下劉主委因為你在簡報當中你特別提到了一個台灣加一這個部分那台灣加一的部分其實我們賴總統他特別提到的一個情況就是說台灣加一就是台灣加美國的一個新布局對不對我這樣理解有沒有錯\n\n04:18.134 --> 04:32.543\n按照這是總統的的意見對那總統意見對嘛台灣加一日臺灣加美國就是一個全球的一個新佈局嗎OK那因為你剛的報告當中你也特別提到了這個部分\n\n04:33.283 --> 04:45.909\n那我想說台灣要加一這一是什麼東西我在想說也許我們本來在想他可能有一些更彈性的一個調整而不是只是設定在美國那總統既然定調說他是美國的狀態的時候我們對台灣加一就是我們希望還是實現這個經濟日不落帝國\n\n04:53.693 --> 05:19.630\n只是因為你剛剛也特別提到了因為總統特別提到說台灣加1加1就是美國那我其實是有點擔心因為台灣其實它本來就是貿易導向的國家它其實應該是要更多元化跟國際接軌這很重要所以跟台灣加1這部分還牽涉到了一個脫中入北我這邊我也請教一下那個主委我們脫中入北這個概念是怎麼樣子\n\n05:21.243 --> 05:26.001\n郭忠祿北不好意思我不太清楚您這個意思是北是什麼\n\n05:27.505 --> 05:51.416\n如果連國發會主委都不知道賴總統講脫中入北是什麼意思的時候那我們的廠商我們的企業我們其他的經濟部其他各部會要怎麼去講脫中入北脫中入北這個部分也是賴總統直接講的我說明一下我們的簡報上面我們今天講的兩件事如果你早上有聽我講美國佔全球進口市場13.4%\n\n05:54.197 --> 06:09.103\n全球美國之外的市場還有86.6%我們希望引導我們希望引導廠商能夠分散市場進入全球那美國是因為深化我們跟美國的合作這個沒問題我只是針對因為脫中入北這個部分\n\n06:12.825 --> 06:36.233\n我不太理解就像你的反應跟我的反應是一樣的因為所謂北是什麼意思因為台灣其實在20世紀下半的部分的時候當時華沙公約組織解散的時候很多人就講說北方國家的時候就是一個先進的國家概念所以台灣原本就在北方國家之列所以脫中入北這邊的時候我覺得在目前整個\n\n06:37.873 --> 06:57.086\n美國重新要調整國際經濟格局的時候我覺得特別的一個重要所以我為什麼會把台灣加一跟拖中入北這兩件事情拿起來討論就是因為台灣目前為止第一個最大的貿易對象其實還是在中國大陸去年佔了20%那麼美國這邊佔18%點多那美國也成長得很快這都沒有問題那台灣要擁抱美國\n\n07:08.173 --> 07:32.853\n但是說實話我覺得台灣原本跟美國關係就非常的緊密而且台灣的朝野基本上都是親美的我的認為是這樣子所以我們跟美國這邊有更好的連結度我覺得也沒有問題只是在目前因為美國的對等關稅的時候全世界都在重新考量跟美國的一個距離當中而且我覺得可能會產生兩個世界格局的一個不同的\n\n07:33.633 --> 07:49.143\n貿易陣營的時候台灣要怎麼去做很重要是不是完全壓在美國的身上台灣加一完全壓在美國的身上還是我們同時重新要去讓台灣更多元化去進行\n\n07:50.183 --> 08:11.785\n美國以外的一個貿易的一個互動跟格局這也是我特別關心的一點所以今天針對就是主委跟部長在的一個今天的一個委員會當中的時候我特別提到這個點就台灣這邊加一我希望這個一委員我的報告第二第二頁寫得很清楚台灣加一佈局全球\n\n08:12.025 --> 08:26.177\n理解理解只是因為我們總統不是這樣講我們總統講台灣家又台灣家美國總統的政策很清楚就是要做經濟日不落國也就是希望我們協助台商能夠佈局全球理解這個也是我的目標\n\n08:28.559 --> 08:53.612\n那我只是希望說因為針對這個部分的時候呢我希望我們有更好的一個戰略讓台灣能夠更面向就是世界不同的一個經濟體都能夠有好的一個互動那這個部分我在這邊先打住我最後一個部分因為您跟郭部長都在那我想特別提到的一個情況其實是因為\n\n08:56.677 --> 09:13.143\n總預算的複議已經過了35天了總統公告也已經公告到今天是第36天我看到的一個狀態國發會這邊的時候我們有很多的解凍案總共經濟委員會總共有98個解凍案\n\n09:15.184 --> 09:36.102\n那其中在國發會這邊的時候呢專案報告就使得動之有4個案書面報告就可以動之的有15案那書面報告之後要同意使得動之有2個案經濟部這邊的時候呢專案報告使得動之有21個案書面報告就可以動之的有17個案\n\n09:37.603 --> 09:46.273\n那到目前為止的時候我想請一下劉主委跟郭部長我們國發會跟經濟部有送了多少解凍案進經濟委員會來\n\n09:50.614 --> 10:12.556\n跟委員報告我們現在大部分的報告都準備好了但是有些數字因為還在釐清中所以我們還在等那個這個確定的數字大概什麼時候可以送進來下個禮拜嗎因為有些數字因為他給的當時在統三那部分有些數字不夠還要等分配所以我們因為有一點\n\n10:13.317 --> 10:27.411\n我們在等那個這個足跡總署的分配什麼時候會送進來什麼時候送進來他們確定之後我們就會送過來我們基本上報告都寫好了OK顧部長這邊呢我們也是一樣因為那個統三的部分我們到底要怎麼樣調這個是一個問題\n\n10:30.804 --> 10:51.890\n這個部分因為我覺得書面報告送進來的時候就可以直接動用的時候可是到目前為止其實是零我們整個經紀人會動了98個案子一個案子都沒有送進來這其中包括了我們產發署也有一個直接書面報告就可以解凍的案子也沒有送進來標準局也沒有送進來\n\n10:53.090 --> 11:13.718\n制裁局也沒有送進來水利署沒有送進來商業發展署沒有送進來能源署也沒有送進來那麼國發會這邊的一個檔案局也都沒有送進來這都是一個很簡單可以就解凍的案子那我不知道是現在是因為更高層的一個政治決策還是我們各部會\n\n11:15.205 --> 11:36.341\n或者是各署各局偷懶了所以我們沒有送進來那這個部分我希望因為主委剛剛提到的一個數字這個問題我相信它正常應該可以很快有那我希望就是劉主委跟郭部長能夠用最快的速度把可以直接用書面報告解凍的案子就直接送進委員會可不可以這個我們回去會來努力\n\n11:41.664 --> 12:07.008\n好那這個部分我希望用最快的速度因為我覺得能夠做行政部門能夠做我們就盡力的去做那麼盡力的去做尤其兩位都是攸關整個台灣整個經貿發展很重要的一個部門那我們希望對於這樣的行政效率的時候能夠加速的提升能夠解凍就盡力速的解凍不要拖謝謝好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":11.374,"end":16.378,"text":"謝謝主席我想請一下郭志威部長還有我們劉繼欽主委郭部長 劉主委"},{"start":25.333,"end":41.023,"text":"兩位好首先我想請一下郭部長因為昨天我在質詢總質詢的時候針對那個卓院長的部分我特別問到了一個因為我們在做那個國際採購當中要平衡那個台美貿易逆差的部分問到了一個"},{"start":41.603,"end":59.591,"text":"天然氣的部分那針對這個部分的時候我那時候有提到說當時說要跟美國買天然氣要從10%提高到30%嘛那郭部長你當時你直接講到的狀態是說你要鄭重跟委員報告你從來不會提到有多少的比例然後而且你提到說這個資料可能有錯"},{"start":61.292,"end":79.364,"text":"昨天的畫面我都直接調出來了那我也覺得很疑惑啦因為我在想說我不只是從媒體看到而且重要的其實是在我在4月9號的時候就在我們紅樓101經濟委員會的時候你在回答"},{"start":80.245,"end":106.163,"text":"你在回答就是張其凱委員的時候你就直接講到了就是將來就是20%到30%你具體講這個部分所以我覺得我也很疑惑我在想說不就是只差幾天的時間一下怎麼會變成說我得到的資訊可能是錯誤的可不可以請部長這邊做一個簡單的回應報告委員我想這個是天然氣的部分"},{"start":107.386,"end":120.731,"text":"那天然氣的部分是不是會買到30%這個我想我們會根據談判的這個內容我不應該這個很貿然的講說我們會一定肯定會到30%"},{"start":123.252,"end":142.708,"text":"所以基本上我的依據是有來源的嘛對不對因為你很具體在經紀委員會講到了這樣的一個數字那我用這樣的方式來質詢我們的院長的時候你跳出來說我的資訊可能是錯誤的不會有這樣子的一個事情我就覺得這是什麼狀態"},{"start":144.93,"end":164.867,"text":"才四月九號到四月十五號 隔六天等一下你講的話就要收回去了但我們這樣怎麼去做我們接下來的整個報告委員這一點我想是這個樣子因為我們的變化蠻大的這裡面牽扯到現在在談判的內容所以六天你的話變化就不算了不是不算"},{"start":167.072,"end":186.06,"text":"所以媒體有嘛我用媒體你背詢的資料回來出來用的時候你告訴我說我的資訊是錯誤的那我這樣我怎麼能夠接受部長你理解我的意思嗎那針對這個部分我想說我們接下來要怎麼樣去談判這件事情其實我完全尊重"},{"start":186.4,"end":208.87,"text":"而且我也理解談判當中有很多東西可以揭露有很多東西不能揭露只是針對我昨天在總質詢的時候問到這個數字的時候你說我應用的那個數字是錯誤的我就很難接受因為你當時4月9號在我們經紀委員會回答的這件事情那這部分我想說在這邊我就很清楚地跟"},{"start":209.77,"end":230.504,"text":"就是部長報告我在質詢運用的所引用的數據都是有來源的而且有清楚的來源而且是從你這邊講出來的東西如果說隔了六天你覺得就不算數然後理由是因為我們現在在台美談判當中的時候那很多東西都不算數那我們這樣政策很難推動啊"},{"start":231.004,"end":256.562,"text":"好不好這邊特別跟部長這邊做一個清楚的一個說明那我想說接下來的時候我想請教一下劉主委因為你在簡報當中你特別提到了一個台灣加一這個部分那台灣加一的部分其實我們賴總統他特別提到的一個情況就是說台灣加一就是台灣加美國的一個新布局對不對我這樣理解有沒有錯"},{"start":258.134,"end":272.543,"text":"按照這是總統的的意見對那總統意見對嘛台灣加一日臺灣加美國就是一個全球的一個新佈局嗎OK那因為你剛的報告當中你也特別提到了這個部分"},{"start":273.283,"end":285.909,"text":"那我想說台灣要加一這一是什麼東西我在想說也許我們本來在想他可能有一些更彈性的一個調整而不是只是設定在美國那總統既然定調說他是美國的狀態的時候我們對台灣加一就是我們希望還是實現這個經濟日不落帝國"},{"start":293.693,"end":319.63,"text":"只是因為你剛剛也特別提到了因為總統特別提到說台灣加1加1就是美國那我其實是有點擔心因為台灣其實它本來就是貿易導向的國家它其實應該是要更多元化跟國際接軌這很重要所以跟台灣加1這部分還牽涉到了一個脫中入北我這邊我也請教一下那個主委我們脫中入北這個概念是怎麼樣子"},{"start":321.243,"end":326.001,"text":"郭忠祿北不好意思我不太清楚您這個意思是北是什麼"},{"start":327.505,"end":351.416,"text":"如果連國發會主委都不知道賴總統講脫中入北是什麼意思的時候那我們的廠商我們的企業我們其他的經濟部其他各部會要怎麼去講脫中入北脫中入北這個部分也是賴總統直接講的我說明一下我們的簡報上面我們今天講的兩件事如果你早上有聽我講美國佔全球進口市場13.4%"},{"start":354.197,"end":369.103,"text":"全球美國之外的市場還有86.6%我們希望引導我們希望引導廠商能夠分散市場進入全球那美國是因為深化我們跟美國的合作這個沒問題我只是針對因為脫中入北這個部分"},{"start":372.825,"end":396.233,"text":"我不太理解就像你的反應跟我的反應是一樣的因為所謂北是什麼意思因為台灣其實在20世紀下半的部分的時候當時華沙公約組織解散的時候很多人就講說北方國家的時候就是一個先進的國家概念所以台灣原本就在北方國家之列所以脫中入北這邊的時候我覺得在目前整個"},{"start":397.873,"end":417.086,"text":"美國重新要調整國際經濟格局的時候我覺得特別的一個重要所以我為什麼會把台灣加一跟拖中入北這兩件事情拿起來討論就是因為台灣目前為止第一個最大的貿易對象其實還是在中國大陸去年佔了20%那麼美國這邊佔18%點多那美國也成長得很快這都沒有問題那台灣要擁抱美國"},{"start":428.173,"end":452.853,"text":"但是說實話 我覺得台灣原本跟美國關係就非常的緊密而且台灣的朝野基本上都是親美的我的認為是這樣子所以我們跟美國這邊有更好的連結度我覺得也沒有問題只是在目前因為美國的對等關稅的時候全世界都在重新考量跟美國的一個距離當中而且我覺得可能會產生兩個世界格局的一個不同的"},{"start":453.633,"end":469.143,"text":"貿易陣營的時候台灣要怎麼去做很重要是不是完全壓在美國的身上台灣加一完全壓在美國的身上還是我們同時重新要去讓台灣更多元化去進行"},{"start":470.183,"end":491.785,"text":"美國以外的一個貿易的一個互動跟格局這也是我特別關心的一點所以今天針對就是主委跟部長在的一個今天的一個委員會當中的時候我特別提到這個點就台灣這邊加一我希望這個一委員我的報告第二第二頁寫得很清楚台灣加一佈局全球"},{"start":492.025,"end":506.177,"text":"理解 理解只是因為我們總統不是這樣講我們總統講台灣家又台灣家美國總統的政策很清楚就是要做經濟日不落國也就是希望我們協助台商能夠佈局全球理解 這個也是我的目標"},{"start":508.559,"end":533.612,"text":"那我只是希望說因為針對這個部分的時候呢我希望我們有更好的一個戰略讓台灣能夠更面向就是世界不同的一個經濟體都能夠有好的一個互動那這個部分我在這邊先打住我最後一個部分因為您跟郭部長都在那我想特別提到的一個情況其實是因為"},{"start":536.677,"end":553.143,"text":"總預算的複議已經過了35天了總統公告也已經公告到今天是第36天我看到的一個狀態國發會這邊的時候我們有很多的解凍案總共經濟委員會總共有98個解凍案"},{"start":555.184,"end":576.102,"text":"那其中在國發會這邊的時候呢專案報告就使得動之有4個案書面報告就可以動之的有15案那書面報告之後要同意使得動之有2個案經濟部這邊的時候呢專案報告使得動之有21個案書面報告就可以動之的有17個案"},{"start":577.603,"end":586.273,"text":"那到目前為止的時候我想請一下劉主委跟郭部長我們國發會跟經濟部有送了多少解凍案進經濟委員會來"},{"start":590.614,"end":612.556,"text":"跟委員報告我們現在大部分的報告都準備好了但是有些數字因為還在釐清中所以我們還在等那個這個確定的數字大概什麼時候可以送進來下個禮拜嗎因為有些數字因為他給的當時在統三那部分有些數字不夠還要等分配所以我們因為有一點"},{"start":613.317,"end":627.411,"text":"我們在等那個這個足跡總署的分配什麼時候會送進來什麼時候送進來他們確定之後我們就會送過來我們基本上報告都寫好了OK 顧部長這邊呢我們也是一樣因為那個統三的部分我們到底要怎麼樣調這個是一個問題"},{"start":630.804,"end":651.89,"text":"這個部分因為我覺得書面報告送進來的時候就可以直接動用的時候可是到目前為止其實是零我們整個經紀人會動了98個案子一個案子都沒有送進來這其中包括了我們產發署也有一個直接書面報告就可以解凍的案子也沒有送進來標準局也沒有送進來"},{"start":653.09,"end":673.718,"text":"制裁局也沒有送進來 水利署沒有送進來 商業發展署沒有送進來 能源署也沒有送進來那麼國發會這邊的一個檔案局也都沒有送進來這都是一個很簡單可以就解凍的案子那我不知道是現在是因為更高層的一個政治決策還是我們各部會"},{"start":675.205,"end":696.341,"text":"或者是各署各局偷懶了所以我們沒有送進來那這個部分我希望因為主委剛剛提到的一個數字這個問題我相信它正常應該可以很快有那我希望就是劉主委跟郭部長能夠用最快的速度把可以直接用書面報告解凍的案子就直接送進委員會可不可以這個我們回去會來努力"},{"start":701.664,"end":727.008,"text":"好那這個部分我希望用最快的速度因為我覺得能夠做行政部門能夠做我們就盡力的去做那麼盡力的去做尤其兩位都是攸關整個台灣整個經貿發展很重要的一個部門那我們希望對於這樣的行政效率的時候能夠加速的提升能夠解凍就盡力速的解凍不要拖謝謝好謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":333,"blocks":[["鄭委員正鈐：（10時29分）謝謝主席，我想請郭智輝部長，還有劉鏡清主委。"],["主席：郭部長、劉主委。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：委員好。"],["鄭委員正鈐：兩位好。首先我想先請教郭部長，因為昨天我在總質詢針對卓院長在國際採購要平衡臺美貿易逆差，問到天然氣的部分，我當時提到跟美國買天然氣從10%提高到30%，郭部長當下直接講要鄭重跟委員報告，從來不會提到有多少比例，你說資料可能有錯。這是我調出昨天的畫面截圖，我覺得很疑惑，因為我不只是從媒體看到，而且4月9號在我們紅樓101經濟委員會，你具體回答張啓楷委員也直接講將來就是20%到30%。我很疑惑不就是差幾天的時間，怎麼會變成我得到的資訊可能是錯誤的，可不可以請部長簡單地回應？"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，天然氣的部分是不是買到30%，我們會根據談判的內容。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解。"],["郭部長智輝：我不應該很貿然地講我們肯定會到30%。"],["鄭委員正鈐：所以基本上，我的依據是有來源的，對不對？"],["郭部長智輝：是、是、是。"],["鄭委員正鈐：因為你很具體在經濟委員會講到的數字，我質詢院長的時候，你跳出來說我的資訊可能是錯誤的，不會有這樣子的事情，4月9號到4月15號，才隔6天你講的話就要收回去，這樣怎麼去做接下來整個……"],["郭部長智輝：報告委員，這一點因為變化滿大的，裡面牽扯到現在談判的內容。"],["鄭委員正鈐：所以6天後你的話就不算數？"],["郭部長智輝：不是不算。"],["鄭委員正鈐：媒體有嘛，我用媒體上你備詢的畫面，你說我的資訊是錯誤的，這樣我怎麼能夠接受？部長，你理解我的意思嗎？針對這個部分，我們接下來要怎麼樣去談判，其實我完全尊重，而且我也理解談判當中有些內容可以揭露，有些內容不能揭露，只是針對昨天在總質詢的時候，你說我應用的數字是錯誤的，我很難接受，因為是你4月9號在經濟委員會回答的，我就很清楚地跟部長報告，我質詢運用所引用的數據都有清楚來源，而且是你講出來的，如果因為我們現在還處在臺美談判中，隔6天你就覺得不算數，我們這樣政策很難推動啊，好不好？這邊特別跟部長清楚地說明。","接下來，我想請教劉主委，因為你在簡報當中特別提到臺灣加1，賴總統提到臺灣加1就是臺灣加美國的新布局，對不對？我這樣理解有沒有錯？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：這是總統的意見，對。"],["鄭委員正鈐：對嘛，臺灣加1就是臺灣加美國的一個全球新布局，OK。因為你剛剛的報告當中特別提到這個部分，我想說臺灣要加1的這個1是什麼東西？我在想也許我們可以有一些更彈性的調整，而不是只是設定在美國，但是總統既然定調是美國的部分……"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我們對臺灣加1還是希望實現經濟日不落帝國。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解，只是因為你剛剛提到，總統說臺灣加1的這個1就是美國，我有一點擔心，因為臺灣本來就是貿易導向國家，其實應該要更多元化跟國際接軌，這很重要，臺灣加1還牽涉到脫中入北，我請教主委，脫中入北這個概念是怎麼樣？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：脫中入北，不好意思，我不太清楚您的意思，北是什麼？"],["鄭委員正鈐：很好，如果連國發會主委都不知道賴總統講脫中入北是什麼意思，我們的廠商、我們的企業、我們經濟部、其他各部會要怎麼去講脫中入北？脫中入北是賴總統直接講的。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：委員，我說明一下，我們今天的簡報講的兩件事，如果你早上有聽我講，美國占全球進口市場13.4%，其實美國之外的市場還有86.6%。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解，這都沒有問題，主委你之前有提到……"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我們希望引導廠商能夠分散市場進入全球，美國是為了深化我們跟美國的合作跟往來，但美國以外也是我們的主張之一。"],["鄭委員正鈐：主委，這個部分沒問題，我只是針對脫中入北的部分不太理解，你跟我的反應是一樣的，所謂北是什麼意思？在二十世紀下半，當時華沙公約組織解散，很多人說北方國家是先進國家的概念，臺灣原本就在北方國家之列，所以脫中入北在目前美國要重新調整國際經濟格局，我覺得特別重要，所以我把臺灣加1跟脫中入北這兩件事情拿出來討論，就是因為臺灣目前為止最大的貿易對象，其實還是中國大陸，去年占20%，美國占百分之十八點多也成長得很快，這都沒有問題。臺灣要擁抱美國，說實話臺灣原本跟美國關係就非常地緊密，而且我認為臺灣朝野基本上都是親美的，所以跟美國有更好的連結度我覺得沒有問題。只是在目前，因為美國的對等關稅，全世界都在重新考量跟美國的距離，而且可能會產生兩個世界格局不同的貿易陣營，臺灣要怎麼去做是很重要，是不是要完全押在美國，臺灣加1？還是讓臺灣更多元化去進行美國以外的貿易互動跟格局？這也是我特別關心的點，所以今天針對主委跟部長在委員會，我特別提到臺灣加1，我希望這個1……"],["劉主任委員鏡清：委員，我的報告第2頁寫得很清楚，臺灣加1，布局全球。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解、理解。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我們還是布局全球。"],["鄭委員正鈐：只是因為我們總統不是這樣講，總統講臺灣加1就是臺灣加美國的新格局。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：總統的新政策很清楚，就是要做經濟日不落國，希望協助臺商能夠布局全球，發揮臺商對全球的影響力。"],["鄭委員正鈐：理解，這個也是我的目標，我希望我們有更好的戰略讓臺灣和世界不同的經濟體都能夠有好的互動，這個部分先打住。因為您跟郭部長都在，最後我想特別提到總預算的覆議已經過了35天，總統公告到今天已經第36天，我看到的一個狀態是，國發會這邊有很多的解凍案，經濟委員會總共有98個解凍案，其中在國發會這邊，專案報告之後始得動支的有4案，書面報告就可以動支的有15案，書面報告之後，要經同意始得動支有2案。經濟部這邊，專案報告始得動支的有21案，書面報告就可以動支的有17案。到目前為止，我想請一下劉主委跟郭部長，國發會跟經濟部有送了多少解凍案進經濟委員會來？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：跟委員報告，我們現在大部分的報告都準備好了，但是有些數字因為還待釐清中，所以我們還在等確定的數字？"],["鄭委員正鈐：大概什麼時候可以送進來，下個禮拜嗎？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：因為當時在統刪的那一部分，有些數字不夠……還要等分配，所以我們在等主計總處的分配。"],["鄭委員正鈐：什麼時候會送進來？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：他們確定之後，我們就會送過來，我們基本上報告都寫好了。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK。郭部長這邊？"],["郭部長智輝：我們也是一樣。"],["鄭委員正鈐：OK。"],["郭部長智輝：因為統刪的部分，我們到底要怎麼樣調，這也是一個問題。"],["鄭委員正鈐：有關這個部分，因為我覺得書面報告送進來就可以直接動用，可是到目前為止，其實是零，我們整個經濟委員會凍結了98個案子，一個案子都沒有送進來，這其中包括了產發署，也有一個書面報告直接就可以解凍的案子，也沒有送進來。標準局也沒有送進來，智財局也沒有送進來，水利署沒有送進來，商業發展署沒有送進來，能源署也沒有送進來。國發會這邊的檔案局也都沒有送進來，這都是很簡單就可以解凍的案子，我不知道現在是因為更高層的政治決策，還是我們各部會或者是各署、各局偷懶了，所以沒有送進來？這個部分，因為主委剛剛提到的數字這個問題，我相信它正常應該可以很快有，我希望劉主委跟郭部長能夠用最快的速度，把可以直接用書面報告解凍的案子直接送進委員會，可不可以？"],["劉主任委員鏡清：我們回去會努力。"],["鄭委員正鈐：好，這個部分我希望用最快的速度，因為我覺得行政部門能夠做的，你們就盡力的去做，尤其兩位都是攸關整個臺灣經貿發展很重要的部門，我們希望對於這樣的行政效率能夠加速提升，能夠解凍就儘速解凍，不要拖，謝謝。"],["劉主任委員鏡清：好，謝謝。"],["郭部長智輝：謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝。","現在請鄭天財委員做詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":116,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-19-9","speakers":["謝衣鳯","邱議瑩","楊瓊瓔","林岱樺","陳亭妃","張啓楷","鄭正鈐","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","呂玉玲","賴瑞隆","邱志偉","李坤城","鍾佳濱","蔡易餘","張嘉郡","賴士葆","黃國昌","陳冠廷","王鴻薇","廖先翔","黃健豪","陳超明","翁曉玲"],"page_start":51,"meetingDate":["2025-04-16"],"gazette_id":"1143801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143801_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期經濟委員會第9次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請國家發展委員會主任委員、經濟部部長及財政部首長就「因應國際貿易情勢變化，如何協助\n國內廠商擴大國際市場」進行報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1143801_00002"}}}