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\"裡\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 375.525, \"end\": 376.125, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 376.125, \"end\": 376.226, \"score\": 0.81}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 376.226, \"end\": 376.426, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 376.426, \"end\": 376.546, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 376.546, \"end\": 376.646, \"score\": 0.812}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 376.646, \"end\": 376.746, \"score\": 0.77}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"修\", \"start\": 376.746, \"end\": 376.986, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"正\", \"start\": 376.986, \"end\": 377.146, \"score\": 0.863}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 377.146, \"end\": 377.286, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 377.286, \"end\": 377.387, \"score\": 0.785}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 377.387, \"end\": 377.487, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 377.487, \"end\": 377.507, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"說\"}]}, {\"start\": 378.027, \"end\": 406.064, \"text\": \"第33條第13款希望在補助及獎勵事業與原住民地區推動自然資源與生態多樣性的維護教育及宣導事項這些辦法是由中央跟原民會去訂定的這是之前是沒有的所以希望主委能夠先了解這方面的一個情境跟我們立法的一個想法好不好好然後最後就是說我希望請教卓仁泰院長說原住民地區的自然攤會\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 378.027, \"end\": 379.228, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"3\"}, {\"word\": \"3\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 379.228, \"end\": 379.768, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"3\"}, {\"word\": \"款\", \"start\": 379.768, \"end\": 379.968, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"希\", \"start\": 379.968, \"end\": 380.088, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"望\", \"start\": 380.088, \"end\": 380.228, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 380.228, \"end\": 380.649, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"補\"}, {\"word\": \"助\", \"start\": 380.649, \"end\": 380.789, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"及\", \"start\": 380.789, \"end\": 381.269, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"獎\"}, {\"word\": \"勵\"}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 381.269, \"end\": 382.089, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"與\"}, {\"word\": \"原\", \"start\": 382.089, \"end\": 382.29, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"住\", \"start\": 382.29, \"end\": 382.41, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 382.41, \"end\": 382.59, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 382.59, \"end\": 383.37, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"區\"}, {\"word\": \"推\", \"start\": 383.37, \"end\": 383.851, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"自\", \"start\": 383.851, \"end\": 383.931, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"然\", \"start\": 383.931, \"end\": 384.311, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"資\"}, {\"word\": \"源\", \"start\": 384.311, \"end\": 384.611, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"與\"}, {\"word\": \"生\", \"start\": 384.611, \"end\": 385.972, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"態\"}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 385.972, \"end\": 386.312, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"性\", \"start\": 386.312, \"end\": 386.452, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 386.452, \"end\": 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[{\"word\": \"又\", \"start\": 407.028, \"end\": 407.228, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"或\", \"start\": 407.228, \"end\": 407.409, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 407.409, \"end\": 407.689, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"與\"}, {\"word\": \"企\", \"start\": 407.689, \"end\": 408.39, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"合\", \"start\": 408.39, \"end\": 408.67, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"作\", \"start\": 408.67, \"end\": 409.151, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 409.151, \"end\": 409.211, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 409.211, \"end\": 409.391, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"推\", \"start\": 409.391, \"end\": 409.751, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"E\", \"start\": 409.751, \"end\": 409.932, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"S\", \"start\": 409.932, \"end\": 410.072, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"G\", \"start\": 410.072, \"end\": 410.232, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 410.232, \"end\": 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\"剛剛主委有說明過他們辦了10場的說明會有300多人來參加我發現陸續還會再舉辦而且剛剛所提到成立一個淨零永續的發展推動小組在這個小組裡面會擬定各項的一個工作的要項同時原住民經濟永續發展的發展計畫115年到118年他們也會陸續的提出我想針對原住民族\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 414.997, \"end\": 415.117, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 415.117, \"end\": 415.197, \"score\": 0.714}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 415.197, \"end\": 415.537, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 415.537, \"end\": 415.817, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 415.817, \"end\": 416.258, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"辦\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 416.258, \"end\": 417.079, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"場\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 417.079, \"end\": 417.539, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 417.539, \"end\": 418.219, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 418.219, \"end\": 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\"題\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 510.802, \"end\": 511.242, \"score\": 0.858}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 511.242, \"end\": 511.462, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"延\", \"start\": 511.462, \"end\": 511.783, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"宕\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 511.783, \"end\": 511.903, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 511.903, \"end\": 512.163, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"久\", \"start\": 512.163, \"end\": 512.663, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 512.663, \"end\": 512.824, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 512.824, \"end\": 512.944, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 512.944, \"end\": 513.344, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 513.344, \"end\": 513.544, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"需\", \"start\": 513.544, \"end\": 513.724, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 513.724, \"end\": 514.105, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 514.105, \"end\": 514.405, 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\"定\", \"start\": 781.133, \"end\": 781.273, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 781.273, \"end\": 781.533, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 781.533, \"end\": 781.854, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 781.854, \"end\": 781.954, \"score\": 0.971}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 781.954, \"end\": 782.274, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 782.274, \"end\": 782.595, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"書\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 782.595, \"end\": 782.695, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 782.695, \"end\": 782.795, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 782.795, \"end\": 782.895, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 782.895, \"end\": 782.915, \"score\": 0.001}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}]}, {\"start\": 784.002, \"end\": 812.948, \"text\": \"我跟委員報告所以我們為什麼要提出原住民保留地就是說它的條例的一個修正因為我們不希望這樣的事情一直在發生可是你要掌握然後掌握以後要如何去解決然後如何去預防現在我們要發展原住民的經濟可是我們的土地常常是林業用地 農牧用地國土保安用地可是我們要去如何提高我們或者是說讓我們供股銀行去成\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 784.002, \"end\": 784.102, \"score\": 0.797}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 784.102, \"end\": 784.262, \"score\": 0.752}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 784.262, \"end\": 784.642, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 784.642, \"end\": 785.562, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 785.562, \"end\": 785.742, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 785.742, \"end\": 785.862, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 785.862, \"end\": 786.342, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 786.342, \"end\": 786.603, \"score\": 0.854}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 786.603, \"end\": 787.163, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 787.163, \"end\": 787.363, \"score\": 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\"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"護\"}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 938.024, \"end\": 938.084, \"score\": 0.667}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"盧\"}, {\"word\": \"縣\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 938.084, \"end\": 938.104, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 938.104, \"end\": 938.124, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"資\"}, {\"word\": \"訊\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 938.124, \"end\": 938.164, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 938.164, \"end\": 938.244, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"原\", \"start\": 938.244, \"end\": 938.264, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 938.264, \"end\": 938.304, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 938.304, \"end\": 938.324, \"score\": 0.001}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:15,236 --> 00:00:19,158\n主席有請院長跟園民會主委麻煩請卓院長園民會請備選卓院長好主委好\n\n2\n00:00:36,532 --> 00:01:03,688\n气候变迁因应法已经迈入即将迈入十年它之前是温室气体减量及管理办法针对原住民的部分在第五条他有说就是为推动自然碳会政府应与原住民族共同推动及管理原住民族地区的自然碳会该区域内所增碳会之相关权益应与原住民族共享\n\n3\n00:01:04,321 --> 00:01:25,435\n涉及原住民族土地開發利用限制英語原住民族諮商並取得同意那我們現在看到川普政府已經退出巴黎協定也就是說他原本的國家對美國政府對國家的一個所謂的可能是從30億美金的一個\n\n4\n00:01:27,216 --> 00:01:51,067\n支出呢他直接Cutdown也就是說我們政府會不會因為這樣也對我們未來的這個發展呢做一些減緩或者說有一些其他的想法院長你可以回答嗎其他的想法也就是說美國他Cutdown了他對這個方面的一個支出跟支持那我們政府是不是也會受到影響\n\n5\n00:01:52,153 --> 00:02:04,867\n我覺得共同維護一個乾淨可以永續的地球到底是這一代人類共同的可是當你付出很多沒有實際的實質回報的時候你會不會想要減緩這方面的支出\n\n6\n00:02:05,595 --> 00:02:33,278\n我們照原有的步驟繼續向前進OK那我想先知道原民會主委的想法就是說我們針對創造就業機會我知道在環境部這邊他有想要培育人才綠領人才那他說他要預計在北中南一年要大概今年要訓練3500人那3500人裡面我不知道環境部有沒有跟會會去討論說如果按照人口比例我們原住民\n\n7\n00:02:33,758 --> 00:02:53,316\n裡面受教受訓練的一些專業人才是不是應該至少要70名到105名之間那你這個人才的這個培訓計畫裡面你有沒有被知會好謝謝委員我想這個人才的培育有關這個岩箱這個碳會的問題我們這邊有已經也跟我們自己的族人\n\n8\n00:02:53,837 --> 00:03:17,667\n做超過10場以上的說明會我們也會繼續來辦那比如說我是一個鄉長我要到園民會去拜託是到縣政府去說我以後要做這方面的產業那我是要跟哪一個單位來說明因為我沒有看到專責單位園民會的專責單位在哪裡我們在經建處那我知道我們現在原住民的一個Town會的規模大概是多少嗎\n\n9\n00:03:18,837 --> 00:03:24,204\n我們現在就是希望說趕快因為部落都還不清楚這個事情我知道所以因為已經10年要即將\n\n10\n00:03:25,810 --> 00:03:50,477\n這個頒布法令要十年了可是我每次一問就是說還沒有一個一致性還不知道該怎麼弄那我剛剛又查了一些資料其實至於碳盤炒到現在還沒有一致的規定所以環境部長你這邊也在三腦筋他希望至少在今年可以成立新的一個所謂碳盤炒基準然後每三年更新一次那這個部分你聯名會這邊有備資會嗎\n\n11\n00:03:52,017 --> 00:03:59,838\n有我們在一夜我們已經成立淨碳的這個永續發展這個小組那我們也送出這個原住民\n\n12\n00:04:00,492 --> 00:04:22,146\n足經濟永續發展計畫的草案我們希望這個推出去之後我們研擬之後這個草案我們會繼續來做之前在屏東縣當過處長是也長期在屏東縣那我想知道說如果就屏東縣那個碳的規模我們原鄉的大概可以在利益上面你覺得可以分配到多少資源\n\n13\n00:04:23,141 --> 00:04:43,816\n現在要精算還不曉得但是這個有一個重點這個不影響到我們的淨化補償就是你在淨化補償一樣可以做這樣的東西我是想幫園民會爭取資源所以我才會這樣算那你這樣算的話是不是因為有一個叫做管理基金就是衛生氣體管理基金那以後這個部分\n\n14\n00:04:44,807 --> 00:05:13,735\n你在盤查盤算的時候在整個碳會的一個機制裡面你至少要知道說有多少基金會到中央這邊來啊你以後要去你要去分配的這些資源要到哪裡去啊所以這個部分你是不是應該先先去了解我現在大概有看到農業部財政部所俠所俠台灣吉寶結算所針對原香碳會或是企業投入ESG已經有建立了相關的平台建制了那其實ESG最被人過病的是什麼你知道嗎\n\n15\n00:05:15,903 --> 00:05:32,732\n大部分就是他的透明度還有他的票率也就是說其實他並沒有做出相當的投資可是他卻寫了這樣子的一個計畫出來還有他的透明度他認為他應該是多少可是我們一般的人無從得知他的計算結果\n\n16\n00:05:33,732 --> 00:05:51,144\n所以就簡單來講我希望主委你自己應該要很清楚去了解他們在做這些所謂的試算跟原先的這些ESG的計畫裡面我覺得你應該要主導來掌握可以嗎可以我非常感謝委員這樣重要的提醒透明度\n\n17\n00:05:51,724 --> 00:06:17,507\n以及他整個是算的方式我想園民會一定是跟大家關係最密切的園民會也可以同時請環境部來支援他做很多這樣的工作對我剛才講的溫室氣體的管理基金所以我希望他的用途上面能夠明定一些方向因為之前的法律裡面並沒有針對這個法案做修正或者是增加所以我在第33條裡面今年提了一個修正案也就是說\n\n18\n00:06:18,027 --> 00:06:46,064\n第33條第13款希望在補助及獎勵事業與原住民地區推動自然資源與生態多樣性的維護教育及宣導事項這些辦法是由中央跟原民會去訂定的這是之前是沒有的所以希望主委能夠先了解這方面的一個情境跟我們立法的一個想法好不好好然後最後就是說我希望請教卓仁泰院長說原住民地區的自然攤會\n\n19\n00:06:47,028 --> 00:06:52,675\n又或是與企業合作一同推動ESG方面我們原住民委員會做了哪些建設\n\n20\n00:06:54,997 --> 00:07:19,217\n剛剛主委有說明過他們辦了10場的說明會有300多人來參加我發現陸續還會再舉辦而且剛剛所提到成立一個淨零永續的發展推動小組在這個小組裡面會擬定各項的一個工作的要項同時原住民經濟永續發展的發展計畫115年到118年他們也會陸續的提出我想針對原住民族\n\n21\n00:07:19,797 --> 00:07:27,203\n在台灣很多好山還是好水的地方我們既然希望他維持就應該有能力讓他自己能夠維持所以提供給他更多的這樣的資源\n\n22\n00:07:28,203 --> 00:07:50,504\n我希望有一個APP,比如說我是一個一般民眾,我想知道說我對自然攤位的貢獻,比如說我身處在屏東縣,我就會知道說屏東縣的自然攤位的資源是多少,那如果我是一個鄉長,我要知道說我這個鄉可以掌握的資源是多少,我覺得至少在以後在這個資訊的一個透明度要讓大家知道,才會知道說我作為一個個人,作為一個\n\n23\n00:07:51,505 --> 00:08:00,633\n一廂之長我能夠做的努力在哪裡可以嗎謝謝再次謝謝委員的提醒這個非常重要第二個議題就是說針對我在114年4月10號收到園民會的公文首先先謝謝園民會願意補助70萬可是他們實際的需求是92萬1600元那我想知道說你們的難處在哪裡\n\n24\n00:08:16,088 --> 00:08:36,367\n納瑪下區公所要協助區公所的蒸化編的工作我跟委員報告這個機會不多啦是不多但是就是說不管是哪一個不是多不多的問題因為他延宕了很久他如果有需要我們都會核實來協助就是說這個\n\n25\n00:08:38,869 --> 00:08:53,817\n那麼下這個部分這個早在去年應該是吳立豪委他就有提出來那我們每一年光是平均補助就超過了525萬都有協助各鄉的困境\n\n26\n00:08:54,537 --> 00:09:21,549\n那當然就是那個時候孔賢傑七長他來他也要我們來協助那我們想說我們也很快的就是說他要的經費很快就給他補充短缺的22萬要公務員去承擔嗎不是不是不是我想我有跟他講好但如果說還是不夠我們還是願意來協助啊所以就針對這個問題原鄉公所所謂的原住民鄉公所在振化邊的保留地所謂的私有的負帳啊分割經費啊\n\n27\n00:09:22,689 --> 00:09:41,695\n這些部分你們有沒有做每年的一個說經費預算的一些編列不然每年如果遇到這些問題你們要怎麼去哪裡找錢我每一年有編這樣的在圖管處都有編這樣的經費類似有公所提出來可是你還是沒有達到他們要的九十二萬一千你說你只核定了七十萬給他\n\n28\n00:09:42,728 --> 00:10:07,603\n其實我跟委員講,他講92萬,可是我願意協助他這樣,他已經應該是,他跟我講說可以,如果真的不夠,有什麼關係,我還是會再協助他,因為各鄉都會遇到這個問題,這是剛好是納馬下來文,我們來幫忙這樣,好,第二個就是,第三個就是我們國立原住民博物館這個進度啊,我再追蹤一下,我想知道他現在的用地取得有沒有問題,\n\n29\n00:10:08,444 --> 00:10:24,246\n郵遞期的沒有問題了我跟委員報告現在我們的籌備處也已經成立了那現在籌備處未來會在高雄市政府的隔壁那現在正在做裝潢現在也正在做一些這個內部設施的一個整理那目前人\n\n30\n00:10:25,054 --> 00:10:42,120\n人是在暫屆文化延期的辦公處所那很快我們的土地都已經起的我們很快現在在下半年度我們就會先推出一個驗景館驗景館就會推出來以後他們裡面的工作人員是不是已經在原住民特考裡面的\n\n31\n00:10:43,300 --> 00:10:58,049\n名額裡面在招生或者說也在訓練了沒有辦法一下子就補齊啦至少目前的人力已經有到二分之一了那興建進度呢什麼時候可以動圖啊籌備處沒有想說要怎麼樣的大興頭目因為畢竟它是一個籌備處而已\n\n32\n00:11:07,393 --> 00:11:31,241\n那等到就是說縣警管如果到一個就是說要動工那個時候我們再來跟外界來做說明籌備書我想其實是主要是行政工作啦還有一些作業的一個沒有必要去做完工的時間大概是什麼時候大概一年半之內那個縣警管就會是啦我說整個國立原住民博物館大概什麼時候可以蓋好\n\n33\n00:11:32,236 --> 00:11:49,345\n全部喔全部沒有那麼快全部至少你至少因為這個是14公頃的土地很多人想要去那邊工作可是他不知道說到底是什麼時候會遙遙無期啊萬一他想應徵可是他覺得說這個可能我到老都還沒有看到我想知道到底什麼時候可以往工啟用啊\n\n34\n00:11:49,625 --> 00:12:05,815\n我們當然越想越快越好但是這個啟程從一百一十三年到一百二十年那當然這個我們希望能夠加速蓋一個博物館面積又那麼大而且這個計畫是逐年來編列不是說一次就到位\n\n35\n00:12:06,055 --> 00:12:23,607\n沒有辦法確定一個時間表如果今年已經40歲了我想好好發揮我的對原住民文化的一個專才結果我60歲了要退休了這個博物館還沒有蓋好有些人有生涯規劃嘛所以你至少要讓我們原住民一些專業人才知道說我有沒有機會去那裡上班\n\n36\n00:12:24,227 --> 00:12:46,373\n六年到七年我想我們想就讓他營運就能夠也就是說三十歲的人左右可以去想這些事情是吧本來這個很多的這個工程的施作是一定要時間的嘛我們進入下一個主題就是說其實常常看到原住民保留地長期受到一些擔保啊或者是設定啊借名登記這個部分\n\n37\n00:12:47,313 --> 00:13:02,915\n我知道之前的我們的圖管處的處長也是現在副主委在這部分他有一些了解那他說他會去盤查去盤點我們全國原住民保留地到底有多少比例是被屆民登記被設定的你們現在有報告書可以出來了嗎\n\n38\n00:13:04,002 --> 00:13:32,948\n我跟委員報告所以我們為什麼要提出原住民保留地就是說它的條例的一個修正因為我們不希望這樣的事情一直在發生可是你要掌握然後掌握以後要如何去解決然後如何去預防現在我們要發展原住民的經濟可是我們的土地常常是林業用地農牧用地國土保安用地可是我們要去如何提高我們或者是說讓我們供股銀行去成\n\n39\n00:13:33,528 --> 00:13:47,775\n去承作他的貸款這個部分你們做了哪些努力目前就是說我們公股八大銀行他們也有提出來他們更希望就是說是不是有這個\n\n40\n00:13:48,915 --> 00:14:09,973\n有這個辦理這個個人保證業務的一些這個這個那個從小企業是不是也來協助但是我們現在一直在想這個八大公股銀行如果可以幫我們做那是最好那我們目前也在研擬這個原住民保留地貸款信用的保證草案那我們希望今年會完成嗎今年會完成嗎\n\n41\n00:14:10,836 --> 00:14:36,289\n我們一直在跟這個八大公股這個銀行希望要嘛就大家看是哪幾家可以先做但是他們也提出一些修正計畫我們願意再補一直在我們現在還在很快已經在後期的討論了我知道現在內政部有委託不動產估價施工會進行原住民保留地的估價方式的探討那報告書出來了嗎\n\n42\n00:14:37,731 --> 00:15:01,370\n目前還沒有我們尊重還是希望我們動作還是能夠快一點因為很多人都是嗷嗷待哺希望他的土地有價值而不是永遠都在政府在想在想辦法可是辦法一籌莫展最後就是說關於我們巡山園也就是說我們的高山巷島協作園這個部分其實每次天災的時候或者是需要\n\n43\n00:15:02,470 --> 00:15:23,979\n像玉山這個步道需要有人去管理的時候或者是說有些人發生山難需要去救助的時候其實都是這些人在工作那我想知道說到底有沒有對他們一些待遇的一些保障或者說至少讓他們在投保的時候商業保險能夠不要因為他的工作性質是危險的而不拒保\n\n44\n00:15:24,719 --> 00:15:38,324\n所以希望主委這邊把高山協作園祥島這邊納入一個高危險也就是說雖然是高風險可是是政府協助的一個工作項目好我們會特別要求我們的這個救護員好謝謝盧縣議委的資訊謝謝主委長原民會的\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n15236\t19158\t主席有請院長跟園民會主委麻煩請卓院長園民會請備選卓院長好 主委好\n36532\t63688\t气候变迁因应法已经迈入即将迈入十年它之前是温室气体减量及管理办法针对原住民的部分在第五条他有说就是为推动自然碳会政府应与原住民族共同推动及管理原住民族地区的自然碳会该区域内所增碳会之相关权益应与原住民族共享\n64321\t85435\t涉及原住民族土地開發利用限制英語原住民族諮商並取得同意那我們現在看到川普政府已經退出巴黎協定也就是說他原本的國家對美國政府對國家的一個所謂的可能是從30億美金的一個\n87216\t111067\t支出呢他直接Cut down也就是說我們政府會不會因為這樣也對我們未來的這個發展呢做一些減緩或者說有一些其他的想法院長你可以回答嗎其他的想法也就是說美國他Cut down了他對這個方面的一個支出跟支持那我們政府是不是也會受到影響\n112153\t124867\t我覺得共同維護一個乾淨可以永續的地球到底是這一代人類共同的可是當你付出很多沒有實際的實質回報的時候你會不會想要減緩這方面的支出\n125595\t153278\t我們照原有的步驟繼續向前進OK那我想先知道原民會主委的想法就是說我們針對創造就業機會我知道在環境部這邊他有想要培育人才綠領人才那他說他要預計在北中南一年要大概今年要訓練3500人那3500人裡面我不知道環境部有沒有跟會會去討論說如果按照人口比例我們原住民\n153758\t173316\t裡面受教受訓練的一些專業人才是不是應該至少要70名到105名之間那你這個人才的這個培訓計畫裡面你有沒有被知會好謝謝委員我想這個人才的培育有關這個岩箱這個碳會的問題我們這邊有已經也跟我們自己的族人\n173837\t197667\t做超過10場以上的說明會我們也會繼續來辦那比如說我是一個鄉長我要到園民會去拜託是到縣政府去說我以後要做這方面的產業那我是要跟哪一個單位來說明因為我沒有看到專責單位園民會的專責單位在哪裡我們在經建處那我知道我們現在原住民的一個Town會的規模大概是多少嗎\n198837\t204204\t我們現在就是希望說趕快因為部落都還不清楚這個事情我知道 所以因為已經10年要即將\n205810\t230477\t這個頒布法令要十年了可是我每次一問就是說還沒有一個一致性還不知道該怎麼弄那我剛剛又查了一些資料其實至於碳盤炒到現在還沒有一致的規定所以環境部長你這邊也在三腦筋他希望至少在今年可以成立新的一個所謂碳盤炒基準然後每三年更新一次那這個部分你聯名會這邊有備資會嗎\n232017\t239838\t有 我們在一夜我們已經成立淨碳的這個永續發展這個小組那我們也送出這個原住民\n240492\t262146\t足經濟永續發展計畫的草案我們希望這個推出去之後我們研擬之後這個草案我們會繼續來做之前在屏東縣當過處長是也長期在屏東縣那我想知道說如果就屏東縣那個碳的規模我們原鄉的大概可以在利益上面你覺得可以分配到多少資源\n263141\t283816\t現在要精算還不曉得但是這個有一個重點這個不影響到我們的淨化補償就是你在淨化補償一樣可以做這樣的東西我是想幫園民會爭取資源所以我才會這樣算那你這樣算的話是不是因為有一個叫做管理基金就是衛生氣體管理基金那以後這個部分\n284807\t313735\t你在盤查盤算的時候在整個碳會的一個機制裡面你至少要知道說有多少基金會到中央這邊來啊你以後要去你要去分配的這些資源要到哪裡去啊所以這個部分你是不是應該先先去了解我現在大概有看到農業部財政部所俠所俠台灣吉寶結算所針對原香碳會或是企業投入ESG已經有建立了相關的平台建制了那其實ESG最被人過病的是什麼你知道嗎\n315903\t332732\t大部分就是他的透明度還有他的票率也就是說其實他並沒有做出相當的投資可是他卻寫了這樣子的一個計畫出來還有他的透明度他認為他應該是多少可是我們一般的人無從得知他的計算結果\n333732\t351144\t所以就簡單來講我希望主委你自己應該要很清楚去了解他們在做這些所謂的試算跟原先的這些ESG的計畫裡面我覺得你應該要主導來掌握 可以嗎可以 我非常感謝委員這樣重要的提醒 透明度\n351724\t377507\t以及他整個是算的方式我想園民會一定是跟大家關係最密切的園民會也可以同時請環境部來支援他做很多這樣的工作對我剛才講的溫室氣體的管理基金所以我希望他的用途上面能夠明定一些方向因為之前的法律裡面並沒有針對這個法案做修正或者是增加所以我在第33條裡面今年提了一個修正案也就是說\n378027\t406064\t第33條第13款希望在補助及獎勵事業與原住民地區推動自然資源與生態多樣性的維護教育及宣導事項這些辦法是由中央跟原民會去訂定的這是之前是沒有的所以希望主委能夠先了解這方面的一個情境跟我們立法的一個想法好不好好然後最後就是說我希望請教卓仁泰院長說原住民地區的自然攤會\n407028\t412675\t又或是與企業合作一同推動ESG方面我們原住民委員會做了哪些建設\n414997\t439217\t剛剛主委有說明過他們辦了10場的說明會有300多人來參加我發現陸續還會再舉辦而且剛剛所提到成立一個淨零永續的發展推動小組在這個小組裡面會擬定各項的一個工作的要項同時原住民經濟永續發展的發展計畫115年到118年他們也會陸續的提出我想針對原住民族\n439797\t447203\t在台灣很多好山還是好水的地方我們既然希望他維持就應該有能力讓他自己能夠維持所以提供給他更多的這樣的資源\n448203\t470504\t我希望有一個APP,比如說我是一個一般民眾,我想知道說我對自然攤位的貢獻,比如說我身處在屏東縣,我就會知道說屏東縣的自然攤位的資源是多少,那如果我是一個鄉長,我要知道說我這個鄉可以掌握的資源是多少,我覺得至少在以後在這個資訊的一個透明度要讓大家知道,才會知道說我作為一個個人,作為一個\n471505\t480633\t一廂之長我能夠做的努力在哪裡可以嗎謝謝 再次謝謝委員的提醒這個非常重要第二個議題就是說針對我在114年4月10號收到園民會的公文首先先謝謝園民會願意補助70萬可是他們實際的需求是92萬1600元那我想知道說你們的難處在哪裡\n496088\t516367\t納瑪下區公所要協助區公所的蒸化編的工作我跟委員報告這個機會不多啦是不多但是就是說不管是哪一個不是多不多的問題因為他延宕了很久他如果有需要我們都會核實來協助就是說這個\n518869\t533817\t那麼下這個部分這個早在去年應該是吳立豪委他就有提出來那我們每一年光是平均補助就超過了525萬都有協助各鄉的困境\n534537\t561549\t那當然就是那個時候孔賢傑七長他來他也要我們來協助那我們想說我們也很快的就是說他要的經費很快就給他補充短缺的22萬要公務員去承擔嗎不是不是不是我想我有跟他講好但如果說還是不夠我們還是願意來協助啊所以就針對這個問題原鄉公所所謂的原住民鄉公所在振化邊的保留地所謂的私有的負帳啊分割經費啊\n562689\t581695\t這些部分你們有沒有做每年的一個說經費預算的一些編列不然每年如果遇到這些問題你們要怎麼去哪裡找錢我每一年有編這樣的在圖管處都有編這樣的經費類似有公所提出來可是你還是沒有達到他們要的九十二萬一千你說你只核定了七十萬給他\n582728\t607603\t其實我跟委員講,他講92萬,可是我願意協助他這樣,他已經應該是,他跟我講說可以,如果真的不夠,有什麼關係,我還是會再協助他,因為各鄉都會遇到這個問題,這是剛好是納馬下來文,我們來幫忙這樣,好,第二個就是,第三個就是我們國立原住民博物館這個進度啊,我再追蹤一下,我想知道他現在的用地取得有沒有問題,\n608444\t624246\t郵遞期的沒有問題了我跟委員報告現在我們的籌備處也已經成立了那現在籌備處未來會在高雄市政府的隔壁那現在正在做裝潢現在也正在做一些這個內部設施的一個整理那目前人\n625054\t642120\t人是在暫屆文化延期的辦公處所那很快我們的土地都已經起的我們很快現在在下半年度我們就會先推出一個驗景館驗景館就會推出來以後他們裡面的工作人員是不是已經在原住民特考裡面的\n643300\t658049\t名額裡面在招生或者說也在訓練了沒有辦法一下子就補齊啦至少目前的人力已經有到二分之一了那興建進度呢 什麼時候可以動圖啊籌備處沒有想說要怎麼樣的大興頭目因為畢竟它是一個籌備處而已\n667393\t691241\t那等到就是說縣警管如果到一個就是說要動工那個時候我們再來跟外界來做說明籌備書我想其實是主要是行政工作啦還有一些作業的一個沒有必要去做完工的時間大概是什麼時候大概一年半之內那個縣警管就會是啦我說整個國立原住民博物館大概什麼時候可以蓋好\n692236\t709345\t全部喔 全部沒有那麼快 全部至少你至少因為這個是14公頃的土地很多人想要去那邊工作可是他不知道說到底是什麼時候會遙遙無期啊萬一他想應徵可是他覺得說這個可能我到老都還沒有看到我想知道到底什麼時候可以往工啟用啊\n709625\t725815\t我們當然越想越快越好但是這個啟程從一百一十三年到一百二十年那當然這個我們希望能夠加速蓋一個博物館面積又那麼大而且這個計畫是逐年來編列不是說一次就到位\n726055\t743607\t沒有辦法確定一個時間表如果今年已經40歲了我想好好發揮我的對原住民文化的一個專才結果我60歲了要退休了這個博物館還沒有蓋好有些人有生涯規劃嘛所以你至少要讓我們原住民一些專業人才知道說我有沒有機會去那裡上班\n744227\t766373\t六年到七年我想我們想就讓他營運就能夠也就是說三十歲的人左右可以去想這些事情是吧本來這個很多的這個工程的施作是一定要時間的嘛我們進入下一個主題就是說其實常常看到原住民保留地長期受到一些擔保啊或者是設定啊 借名登記這個部分\n767313\t782915\t我知道之前的我們的圖管處的處長也是現在副主委在這部分他有一些了解那他說他會去盤查去盤點我們全國原住民保留地到底有多少比例是被屆民登記被設定的你們現在有報告書可以出來了嗎\n784002\t812948\t我跟委員報告所以我們為什麼要提出原住民保留地就是說它的條例的一個修正因為我們不希望這樣的事情一直在發生可是你要掌握然後掌握以後要如何去解決然後如何去預防現在我們要發展原住民的經濟可是我們的土地常常是林業用地 農牧用地國土保安用地可是我們要去如何提高我們或者是說讓我們供股銀行去成\n813528\t827775\t去承作他的貸款這個部分你們做了哪些努力目前就是說我們公股八大銀行他們也有提出來他們更希望就是說是不是有這個\n828915\t849973\t有這個辦理這個個人保證業務的一些這個這個那個從小企業是不是也來協助但是我們現在一直在想這個八大公股銀行如果可以幫我們做那是最好那我們目前也在研擬這個原住民保留地貸款信用的保證草案那我們希望今年會完成嗎今年會完成嗎\n850836\t876289\t我們一直在跟這個八大公股這個銀行希望要嘛就大家看是哪幾家可以先做但是他們也提出一些修正計畫我們願意再補一直在 我們現在還在很快 已經在後期的討論了我知道現在內政部有委託不動產估價施工會進行原住民保留地的估價方式的探討那報告書出來了嗎\n877731\t901370\t目前還沒有我們尊重還是希望我們動作還是能夠快一點因為很多人都是嗷嗷待哺希望他的土地有價值而不是永遠都在政府在想在想辦法可是辦法一籌莫展最後就是說關於我們巡山園也就是說我們的高山巷島協作園這個部分其實每次天災的時候或者是需要\n902470\t923979\t像玉山這個步道需要有人去管理的時候或者是說有些人發生山難需要去救助的時候其實都是這些人在工作那我想知道說到底有沒有對他們一些待遇的一些保障或者說至少讓他們在投保的時候商業保險能夠不要因為他的工作性質是危險的而不拒保\n924719\t938324\t所以希望主委這邊把高山協作園祥島這邊納入一個高危險也就是說雖然是高風險可是是政府協助的一個工作項目好我們會特別要求我們的這個救護員好謝謝盧縣議委的資訊謝謝主委長原民會的\n","txt":"主席有請院長跟園民會主委麻煩請卓院長園民會請備選卓院長好 主委好\n气候变迁因应法已经迈入即将迈入十年它之前是温室气体减量及管理办法针对原住民的部分在第五条他有说就是为推动自然碳会政府应与原住民族共同推动及管理原住民族地区的自然碳会该区域内所增碳会之相关权益应与原住民族共享\n涉及原住民族土地開發利用限制英語原住民族諮商並取得同意那我們現在看到川普政府已經退出巴黎協定也就是說他原本的國家對美國政府對國家的一個所謂的可能是從30億美金的一個\n支出呢他直接Cut down也就是說我們政府會不會因為這樣也對我們未來的這個發展呢做一些減緩或者說有一些其他的想法院長你可以回答嗎其他的想法也就是說美國他Cut down了他對這個方面的一個支出跟支持那我們政府是不是也會受到影響\n我覺得共同維護一個乾淨可以永續的地球到底是這一代人類共同的可是當你付出很多沒有實際的實質回報的時候你會不會想要減緩這方面的支出\n我們照原有的步驟繼續向前進OK那我想先知道原民會主委的想法就是說我們針對創造就業機會我知道在環境部這邊他有想要培育人才綠領人才那他說他要預計在北中南一年要大概今年要訓練3500人那3500人裡面我不知道環境部有沒有跟會會去討論說如果按照人口比例我們原住民\n裡面受教受訓練的一些專業人才是不是應該至少要70名到105名之間那你這個人才的這個培訓計畫裡面你有沒有被知會好謝謝委員我想這個人才的培育有關這個岩箱這個碳會的問題我們這邊有已經也跟我們自己的族人\n做超過10場以上的說明會我們也會繼續來辦那比如說我是一個鄉長我要到園民會去拜託是到縣政府去說我以後要做這方面的產業那我是要跟哪一個單位來說明因為我沒有看到專責單位園民會的專責單位在哪裡我們在經建處那我知道我們現在原住民的一個Town會的規模大概是多少嗎\n我們現在就是希望說趕快因為部落都還不清楚這個事情我知道 所以因為已經10年要即將\n這個頒布法令要十年了可是我每次一問就是說還沒有一個一致性還不知道該怎麼弄那我剛剛又查了一些資料其實至於碳盤炒到現在還沒有一致的規定所以環境部長你這邊也在三腦筋他希望至少在今年可以成立新的一個所謂碳盤炒基準然後每三年更新一次那這個部分你聯名會這邊有備資會嗎\n有 我們在一夜我們已經成立淨碳的這個永續發展這個小組那我們也送出這個原住民\n足經濟永續發展計畫的草案我們希望這個推出去之後我們研擬之後這個草案我們會繼續來做之前在屏東縣當過處長是也長期在屏東縣那我想知道說如果就屏東縣那個碳的規模我們原鄉的大概可以在利益上面你覺得可以分配到多少資源\n現在要精算還不曉得但是這個有一個重點這個不影響到我們的淨化補償就是你在淨化補償一樣可以做這樣的東西我是想幫園民會爭取資源所以我才會這樣算那你這樣算的話是不是因為有一個叫做管理基金就是衛生氣體管理基金那以後這個部分\n你在盤查盤算的時候在整個碳會的一個機制裡面你至少要知道說有多少基金會到中央這邊來啊你以後要去你要去分配的這些資源要到哪裡去啊所以這個部分你是不是應該先先去了解我現在大概有看到農業部財政部所俠所俠台灣吉寶結算所針對原香碳會或是企業投入ESG已經有建立了相關的平台建制了那其實ESG最被人過病的是什麼你知道嗎\n大部分就是他的透明度還有他的票率也就是說其實他並沒有做出相當的投資可是他卻寫了這樣子的一個計畫出來還有他的透明度他認為他應該是多少可是我們一般的人無從得知他的計算結果\n所以就簡單來講我希望主委你自己應該要很清楚去了解他們在做這些所謂的試算跟原先的這些ESG的計畫裡面我覺得你應該要主導來掌握 可以嗎可以 我非常感謝委員這樣重要的提醒 透明度\n以及他整個是算的方式我想園民會一定是跟大家關係最密切的園民會也可以同時請環境部來支援他做很多這樣的工作對我剛才講的溫室氣體的管理基金所以我希望他的用途上面能夠明定一些方向因為之前的法律裡面並沒有針對這個法案做修正或者是增加所以我在第33條裡面今年提了一個修正案也就是說\n第33條第13款希望在補助及獎勵事業與原住民地區推動自然資源與生態多樣性的維護教育及宣導事項這些辦法是由中央跟原民會去訂定的這是之前是沒有的所以希望主委能夠先了解這方面的一個情境跟我們立法的一個想法好不好好然後最後就是說我希望請教卓仁泰院長說原住民地區的自然攤會\n又或是與企業合作一同推動ESG方面我們原住民委員會做了哪些建設\n剛剛主委有說明過他們辦了10場的說明會有300多人來參加我發現陸續還會再舉辦而且剛剛所提到成立一個淨零永續的發展推動小組在這個小組裡面會擬定各項的一個工作的要項同時原住民經濟永續發展的發展計畫115年到118年他們也會陸續的提出我想針對原住民族\n在台灣很多好山還是好水的地方我們既然希望他維持就應該有能力讓他自己能夠維持所以提供給他更多的這樣的資源\n我希望有一個APP,比如說我是一個一般民眾,我想知道說我對自然攤位的貢獻,比如說我身處在屏東縣,我就會知道說屏東縣的自然攤位的資源是多少,那如果我是一個鄉長,我要知道說我這個鄉可以掌握的資源是多少,我覺得至少在以後在這個資訊的一個透明度要讓大家知道,才會知道說我作為一個個人,作為一個\n一廂之長我能夠做的努力在哪裡可以嗎謝謝 再次謝謝委員的提醒這個非常重要第二個議題就是說針對我在114年4月10號收到園民會的公文首先先謝謝園民會願意補助70萬可是他們實際的需求是92萬1600元那我想知道說你們的難處在哪裡\n納瑪下區公所要協助區公所的蒸化編的工作我跟委員報告這個機會不多啦是不多但是就是說不管是哪一個不是多不多的問題因為他延宕了很久他如果有需要我們都會核實來協助就是說這個\n那麼下這個部分這個早在去年應該是吳立豪委他就有提出來那我們每一年光是平均補助就超過了525萬都有協助各鄉的困境\n那當然就是那個時候孔賢傑七長他來他也要我們來協助那我們想說我們也很快的就是說他要的經費很快就給他補充短缺的22萬要公務員去承擔嗎不是不是不是我想我有跟他講好但如果說還是不夠我們還是願意來協助啊所以就針對這個問題原鄉公所所謂的原住民鄉公所在振化邊的保留地所謂的私有的負帳啊分割經費啊\n這些部分你們有沒有做每年的一個說經費預算的一些編列不然每年如果遇到這些問題你們要怎麼去哪裡找錢我每一年有編這樣的在圖管處都有編這樣的經費類似有公所提出來可是你還是沒有達到他們要的九十二萬一千你說你只核定了七十萬給他\n其實我跟委員講,他講92萬,可是我願意協助他這樣,他已經應該是,他跟我講說可以,如果真的不夠,有什麼關係,我還是會再協助他,因為各鄉都會遇到這個問題,這是剛好是納馬下來文,我們來幫忙這樣,好,第二個就是,第三個就是我們國立原住民博物館這個進度啊,我再追蹤一下,我想知道他現在的用地取得有沒有問題,\n郵遞期的沒有問題了我跟委員報告現在我們的籌備處也已經成立了那現在籌備處未來會在高雄市政府的隔壁那現在正在做裝潢現在也正在做一些這個內部設施的一個整理那目前人\n人是在暫屆文化延期的辦公處所那很快我們的土地都已經起的我們很快現在在下半年度我們就會先推出一個驗景館驗景館就會推出來以後他們裡面的工作人員是不是已經在原住民特考裡面的\n名額裡面在招生或者說也在訓練了沒有辦法一下子就補齊啦至少目前的人力已經有到二分之一了那興建進度呢 什麼時候可以動圖啊籌備處沒有想說要怎麼樣的大興頭目因為畢竟它是一個籌備處而已\n那等到就是說縣警管如果到一個就是說要動工那個時候我們再來跟外界來做說明籌備書我想其實是主要是行政工作啦還有一些作業的一個沒有必要去做完工的時間大概是什麼時候大概一年半之內那個縣警管就會是啦我說整個國立原住民博物館大概什麼時候可以蓋好\n全部喔 全部沒有那麼快 全部至少你至少因為這個是14公頃的土地很多人想要去那邊工作可是他不知道說到底是什麼時候會遙遙無期啊萬一他想應徵可是他覺得說這個可能我到老都還沒有看到我想知道到底什麼時候可以往工啟用啊\n我們當然越想越快越好但是這個啟程從一百一十三年到一百二十年那當然這個我們希望能夠加速蓋一個博物館面積又那麼大而且這個計畫是逐年來編列不是說一次就到位\n沒有辦法確定一個時間表如果今年已經40歲了我想好好發揮我的對原住民文化的一個專才結果我60歲了要退休了這個博物館還沒有蓋好有些人有生涯規劃嘛所以你至少要讓我們原住民一些專業人才知道說我有沒有機會去那裡上班\n六年到七年我想我們想就讓他營運就能夠也就是說三十歲的人左右可以去想這些事情是吧本來這個很多的這個工程的施作是一定要時間的嘛我們進入下一個主題就是說其實常常看到原住民保留地長期受到一些擔保啊或者是設定啊 借名登記這個部分\n我知道之前的我們的圖管處的處長也是現在副主委在這部分他有一些了解那他說他會去盤查去盤點我們全國原住民保留地到底有多少比例是被屆民登記被設定的你們現在有報告書可以出來了嗎\n我跟委員報告所以我們為什麼要提出原住民保留地就是說它的條例的一個修正因為我們不希望這樣的事情一直在發生可是你要掌握然後掌握以後要如何去解決然後如何去預防現在我們要發展原住民的經濟可是我們的土地常常是林業用地 農牧用地國土保安用地可是我們要去如何提高我們或者是說讓我們供股銀行去成\n去承作他的貸款這個部分你們做了哪些努力目前就是說我們公股八大銀行他們也有提出來他們更希望就是說是不是有這個\n有這個辦理這個個人保證業務的一些這個這個那個從小企業是不是也來協助但是我們現在一直在想這個八大公股銀行如果可以幫我們做那是最好那我們目前也在研擬這個原住民保留地貸款信用的保證草案那我們希望今年會完成嗎今年會完成嗎\n我們一直在跟這個八大公股這個銀行希望要嘛就大家看是哪幾家可以先做但是他們也提出一些修正計畫我們願意再補一直在 我們現在還在很快 已經在後期的討論了我知道現在內政部有委託不動產估價施工會進行原住民保留地的估價方式的探討那報告書出來了嗎\n目前還沒有我們尊重還是希望我們動作還是能夠快一點因為很多人都是嗷嗷待哺希望他的土地有價值而不是永遠都在政府在想在想辦法可是辦法一籌莫展最後就是說關於我們巡山園也就是說我們的高山巷島協作園這個部分其實每次天災的時候或者是需要\n像玉山這個步道需要有人去管理的時候或者是說有些人發生山難需要去救助的時候其實都是這些人在工作那我想知道說到底有沒有對他們一些待遇的一些保障或者說至少讓他們在投保的時候商業保險能夠不要因為他的工作性質是危險的而不拒保\n所以希望主委這邊把高山協作園祥島這邊納入一個高危險也就是說雖然是高風險可是是政府協助的一個工作項目好我們會特別要求我們的這個救護員好謝謝盧縣議委的資訊謝謝主委長原民會的\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:15.236 --> 00:19.158\n主席有請院長跟園民會主委麻煩請卓院長園民會請備選卓院長好主委好\n\n00:36.532 --> 01:03.688\n气候变迁因应法已经迈入即将迈入十年它之前是温室气体减量及管理办法针对原住民的部分在第五条他有说就是为推动自然碳会政府应与原住民族共同推动及管理原住民族地区的自然碳会该区域内所增碳会之相关权益应与原住民族共享\n\n01:04.321 --> 01:25.435\n涉及原住民族土地開發利用限制英語原住民族諮商並取得同意那我們現在看到川普政府已經退出巴黎協定也就是說他原本的國家對美國政府對國家的一個所謂的可能是從30億美金的一個\n\n01:27.216 --> 01:51.067\n支出呢他直接Cutdown也就是說我們政府會不會因為這樣也對我們未來的這個發展呢做一些減緩或者說有一些其他的想法院長你可以回答嗎其他的想法也就是說美國他Cutdown了他對這個方面的一個支出跟支持那我們政府是不是也會受到影響\n\n01:52.153 --> 02:04.867\n我覺得共同維護一個乾淨可以永續的地球到底是這一代人類共同的可是當你付出很多沒有實際的實質回報的時候你會不會想要減緩這方面的支出\n\n02:05.595 --> 02:33.278\n我們照原有的步驟繼續向前進OK那我想先知道原民會主委的想法就是說我們針對創造就業機會我知道在環境部這邊他有想要培育人才綠領人才那他說他要預計在北中南一年要大概今年要訓練3500人那3500人裡面我不知道環境部有沒有跟會會去討論說如果按照人口比例我們原住民\n\n02:33.758 --> 02:53.316\n裡面受教受訓練的一些專業人才是不是應該至少要70名到105名之間那你這個人才的這個培訓計畫裡面你有沒有被知會好謝謝委員我想這個人才的培育有關這個岩箱這個碳會的問題我們這邊有已經也跟我們自己的族人\n\n02:53.837 --> 03:17.667\n做超過10場以上的說明會我們也會繼續來辦那比如說我是一個鄉長我要到園民會去拜託是到縣政府去說我以後要做這方面的產業那我是要跟哪一個單位來說明因為我沒有看到專責單位園民會的專責單位在哪裡我們在經建處那我知道我們現在原住民的一個Town會的規模大概是多少嗎\n\n03:18.837 --> 03:24.204\n我們現在就是希望說趕快因為部落都還不清楚這個事情我知道所以因為已經10年要即將\n\n03:25.810 --> 03:50.477\n這個頒布法令要十年了可是我每次一問就是說還沒有一個一致性還不知道該怎麼弄那我剛剛又查了一些資料其實至於碳盤炒到現在還沒有一致的規定所以環境部長你這邊也在三腦筋他希望至少在今年可以成立新的一個所謂碳盤炒基準然後每三年更新一次那這個部分你聯名會這邊有備資會嗎\n\n03:52.017 --> 03:59.838\n有我們在一夜我們已經成立淨碳的這個永續發展這個小組那我們也送出這個原住民\n\n04:00.492 --> 04:22.146\n足經濟永續發展計畫的草案我們希望這個推出去之後我們研擬之後這個草案我們會繼續來做之前在屏東縣當過處長是也長期在屏東縣那我想知道說如果就屏東縣那個碳的規模我們原鄉的大概可以在利益上面你覺得可以分配到多少資源\n\n04:23.141 --> 04:43.816\n現在要精算還不曉得但是這個有一個重點這個不影響到我們的淨化補償就是你在淨化補償一樣可以做這樣的東西我是想幫園民會爭取資源所以我才會這樣算那你這樣算的話是不是因為有一個叫做管理基金就是衛生氣體管理基金那以後這個部分\n\n04:44.807 --> 05:13.735\n你在盤查盤算的時候在整個碳會的一個機制裡面你至少要知道說有多少基金會到中央這邊來啊你以後要去你要去分配的這些資源要到哪裡去啊所以這個部分你是不是應該先先去了解我現在大概有看到農業部財政部所俠所俠台灣吉寶結算所針對原香碳會或是企業投入ESG已經有建立了相關的平台建制了那其實ESG最被人過病的是什麼你知道嗎\n\n05:15.903 --> 05:32.732\n大部分就是他的透明度還有他的票率也就是說其實他並沒有做出相當的投資可是他卻寫了這樣子的一個計畫出來還有他的透明度他認為他應該是多少可是我們一般的人無從得知他的計算結果\n\n05:33.732 --> 05:51.144\n所以就簡單來講我希望主委你自己應該要很清楚去了解他們在做這些所謂的試算跟原先的這些ESG的計畫裡面我覺得你應該要主導來掌握可以嗎可以我非常感謝委員這樣重要的提醒透明度\n\n05:51.724 --> 06:17.507\n以及他整個是算的方式我想園民會一定是跟大家關係最密切的園民會也可以同時請環境部來支援他做很多這樣的工作對我剛才講的溫室氣體的管理基金所以我希望他的用途上面能夠明定一些方向因為之前的法律裡面並沒有針對這個法案做修正或者是增加所以我在第33條裡面今年提了一個修正案也就是說\n\n06:18.027 --> 06:46.064\n第33條第13款希望在補助及獎勵事業與原住民地區推動自然資源與生態多樣性的維護教育及宣導事項這些辦法是由中央跟原民會去訂定的這是之前是沒有的所以希望主委能夠先了解這方面的一個情境跟我們立法的一個想法好不好好然後最後就是說我希望請教卓仁泰院長說原住民地區的自然攤會\n\n06:47.028 --> 06:52.675\n又或是與企業合作一同推動ESG方面我們原住民委員會做了哪些建設\n\n06:54.997 --> 07:19.217\n剛剛主委有說明過他們辦了10場的說明會有300多人來參加我發現陸續還會再舉辦而且剛剛所提到成立一個淨零永續的發展推動小組在這個小組裡面會擬定各項的一個工作的要項同時原住民經濟永續發展的發展計畫115年到118年他們也會陸續的提出我想針對原住民族\n\n07:19.797 --> 07:27.203\n在台灣很多好山還是好水的地方我們既然希望他維持就應該有能力讓他自己能夠維持所以提供給他更多的這樣的資源\n\n07:28.203 --> 07:50.504\n我希望有一個APP,比如說我是一個一般民眾,我想知道說我對自然攤位的貢獻,比如說我身處在屏東縣,我就會知道說屏東縣的自然攤位的資源是多少,那如果我是一個鄉長,我要知道說我這個鄉可以掌握的資源是多少,我覺得至少在以後在這個資訊的一個透明度要讓大家知道,才會知道說我作為一個個人,作為一個\n\n07:51.505 --> 08:00.633\n一廂之長我能夠做的努力在哪裡可以嗎謝謝再次謝謝委員的提醒這個非常重要第二個議題就是說針對我在114年4月10號收到園民會的公文首先先謝謝園民會願意補助70萬可是他們實際的需求是92萬1600元那我想知道說你們的難處在哪裡\n\n08:16.088 --> 08:36.367\n納瑪下區公所要協助區公所的蒸化編的工作我跟委員報告這個機會不多啦是不多但是就是說不管是哪一個不是多不多的問題因為他延宕了很久他如果有需要我們都會核實來協助就是說這個\n\n08:38.869 --> 08:53.817\n那麼下這個部分這個早在去年應該是吳立豪委他就有提出來那我們每一年光是平均補助就超過了525萬都有協助各鄉的困境\n\n08:54.537 --> 09:21.549\n那當然就是那個時候孔賢傑七長他來他也要我們來協助那我們想說我們也很快的就是說他要的經費很快就給他補充短缺的22萬要公務員去承擔嗎不是不是不是我想我有跟他講好但如果說還是不夠我們還是願意來協助啊所以就針對這個問題原鄉公所所謂的原住民鄉公所在振化邊的保留地所謂的私有的負帳啊分割經費啊\n\n09:22.689 --> 09:41.695\n這些部分你們有沒有做每年的一個說經費預算的一些編列不然每年如果遇到這些問題你們要怎麼去哪裡找錢我每一年有編這樣的在圖管處都有編這樣的經費類似有公所提出來可是你還是沒有達到他們要的九十二萬一千你說你只核定了七十萬給他\n\n09:42.728 --> 10:07.603\n其實我跟委員講,他講92萬,可是我願意協助他這樣,他已經應該是,他跟我講說可以,如果真的不夠,有什麼關係,我還是會再協助他,因為各鄉都會遇到這個問題,這是剛好是納馬下來文,我們來幫忙這樣,好,第二個就是,第三個就是我們國立原住民博物館這個進度啊,我再追蹤一下,我想知道他現在的用地取得有沒有問題,\n\n10:08.444 --> 10:24.246\n郵遞期的沒有問題了我跟委員報告現在我們的籌備處也已經成立了那現在籌備處未來會在高雄市政府的隔壁那現在正在做裝潢現在也正在做一些這個內部設施的一個整理那目前人\n\n10:25.054 --> 10:42.120\n人是在暫屆文化延期的辦公處所那很快我們的土地都已經起的我們很快現在在下半年度我們就會先推出一個驗景館驗景館就會推出來以後他們裡面的工作人員是不是已經在原住民特考裡面的\n\n10:43.300 --> 10:58.049\n名額裡面在招生或者說也在訓練了沒有辦法一下子就補齊啦至少目前的人力已經有到二分之一了那興建進度呢什麼時候可以動圖啊籌備處沒有想說要怎麼樣的大興頭目因為畢竟它是一個籌備處而已\n\n11:07.393 --> 11:31.241\n那等到就是說縣警管如果到一個就是說要動工那個時候我們再來跟外界來做說明籌備書我想其實是主要是行政工作啦還有一些作業的一個沒有必要去做完工的時間大概是什麼時候大概一年半之內那個縣警管就會是啦我說整個國立原住民博物館大概什麼時候可以蓋好\n\n11:32.236 --> 11:49.345\n全部喔全部沒有那麼快全部至少你至少因為這個是14公頃的土地很多人想要去那邊工作可是他不知道說到底是什麼時候會遙遙無期啊萬一他想應徵可是他覺得說這個可能我到老都還沒有看到我想知道到底什麼時候可以往工啟用啊\n\n11:49.625 --> 12:05.815\n我們當然越想越快越好但是這個啟程從一百一十三年到一百二十年那當然這個我們希望能夠加速蓋一個博物館面積又那麼大而且這個計畫是逐年來編列不是說一次就到位\n\n12:06.055 --> 12:23.607\n沒有辦法確定一個時間表如果今年已經40歲了我想好好發揮我的對原住民文化的一個專才結果我60歲了要退休了這個博物館還沒有蓋好有些人有生涯規劃嘛所以你至少要讓我們原住民一些專業人才知道說我有沒有機會去那裡上班\n\n12:24.227 --> 12:46.373\n六年到七年我想我們想就讓他營運就能夠也就是說三十歲的人左右可以去想這些事情是吧本來這個很多的這個工程的施作是一定要時間的嘛我們進入下一個主題就是說其實常常看到原住民保留地長期受到一些擔保啊或者是設定啊借名登記這個部分\n\n12:47.313 --> 13:02.915\n我知道之前的我們的圖管處的處長也是現在副主委在這部分他有一些了解那他說他會去盤查去盤點我們全國原住民保留地到底有多少比例是被屆民登記被設定的你們現在有報告書可以出來了嗎\n\n13:04.002 --> 13:32.948\n我跟委員報告所以我們為什麼要提出原住民保留地就是說它的條例的一個修正因為我們不希望這樣的事情一直在發生可是你要掌握然後掌握以後要如何去解決然後如何去預防現在我們要發展原住民的經濟可是我們的土地常常是林業用地農牧用地國土保安用地可是我們要去如何提高我們或者是說讓我們供股銀行去成\n\n13:33.528 --> 13:47.775\n去承作他的貸款這個部分你們做了哪些努力目前就是說我們公股八大銀行他們也有提出來他們更希望就是說是不是有這個\n\n13:48.915 --> 14:09.973\n有這個辦理這個個人保證業務的一些這個這個那個從小企業是不是也來協助但是我們現在一直在想這個八大公股銀行如果可以幫我們做那是最好那我們目前也在研擬這個原住民保留地貸款信用的保證草案那我們希望今年會完成嗎今年會完成嗎\n\n14:10.836 --> 14:36.289\n我們一直在跟這個八大公股這個銀行希望要嘛就大家看是哪幾家可以先做但是他們也提出一些修正計畫我們願意再補一直在我們現在還在很快已經在後期的討論了我知道現在內政部有委託不動產估價施工會進行原住民保留地的估價方式的探討那報告書出來了嗎\n\n14:37.731 --> 15:01.370\n目前還沒有我們尊重還是希望我們動作還是能夠快一點因為很多人都是嗷嗷待哺希望他的土地有價值而不是永遠都在政府在想在想辦法可是辦法一籌莫展最後就是說關於我們巡山園也就是說我們的高山巷島協作園這個部分其實每次天災的時候或者是需要\n\n15:02.470 --> 15:23.979\n像玉山這個步道需要有人去管理的時候或者是說有些人發生山難需要去救助的時候其實都是這些人在工作那我想知道說到底有沒有對他們一些待遇的一些保障或者說至少讓他們在投保的時候商業保險能夠不要因為他的工作性質是危險的而不拒保\n\n15:24.719 --> 15:38.324\n所以希望主委這邊把高山協作園祥島這邊納入一個高危險也就是說雖然是高風險可是是政府協助的一個工作項目好我們會特別要求我們的這個救護員好謝謝盧縣議委的資訊謝謝主委長原民會的\n\n","segments":[{"start":15.236,"end":19.158,"text":"主席有請院長跟園民會主委麻煩請卓院長園民會請備選卓院長好 主委好"},{"start":36.532,"end":63.688,"text":"气候变迁因应法已经迈入即将迈入十年它之前是温室气体减量及管理办法针对原住民的部分在第五条他有说就是为推动自然碳会政府应与原住民族共同推动及管理原住民族地区的自然碳会该区域内所增碳会之相关权益应与原住民族共享"},{"start":64.321,"end":85.435,"text":"涉及原住民族土地開發利用限制英語原住民族諮商並取得同意那我們現在看到川普政府已經退出巴黎協定也就是說他原本的國家對美國政府對國家的一個所謂的可能是從30億美金的一個"},{"start":87.216,"end":111.067,"text":"支出呢他直接Cut down也就是說我們政府會不會因為這樣也對我們未來的這個發展呢做一些減緩或者說有一些其他的想法院長你可以回答嗎其他的想法也就是說美國他Cut down了他對這個方面的一個支出跟支持那我們政府是不是也會受到影響"},{"start":112.153,"end":124.867,"text":"我覺得共同維護一個乾淨可以永續的地球到底是這一代人類共同的可是當你付出很多沒有實際的實質回報的時候你會不會想要減緩這方面的支出"},{"start":125.595,"end":153.278,"text":"我們照原有的步驟繼續向前進OK那我想先知道原民會主委的想法就是說我們針對創造就業機會我知道在環境部這邊他有想要培育人才綠領人才那他說他要預計在北中南一年要大概今年要訓練3500人那3500人裡面我不知道環境部有沒有跟會會去討論說如果按照人口比例我們原住民"},{"start":153.758,"end":173.316,"text":"裡面受教受訓練的一些專業人才是不是應該至少要70名到105名之間那你這個人才的這個培訓計畫裡面你有沒有被知會好謝謝委員我想這個人才的培育有關這個岩箱這個碳會的問題我們這邊有已經也跟我們自己的族人"},{"start":173.837,"end":197.667,"text":"做超過10場以上的說明會我們也會繼續來辦那比如說我是一個鄉長我要到園民會去拜託是到縣政府去說我以後要做這方面的產業那我是要跟哪一個單位來說明因為我沒有看到專責單位園民會的專責單位在哪裡我們在經建處那我知道我們現在原住民的一個Town會的規模大概是多少嗎"},{"start":198.837,"end":204.204,"text":"我們現在就是希望說趕快因為部落都還不清楚這個事情我知道 所以因為已經10年要即將"},{"start":205.81,"end":230.477,"text":"這個頒布法令要十年了可是我每次一問就是說還沒有一個一致性還不知道該怎麼弄那我剛剛又查了一些資料其實至於碳盤炒到現在還沒有一致的規定所以環境部長你這邊也在三腦筋他希望至少在今年可以成立新的一個所謂碳盤炒基準然後每三年更新一次那這個部分你聯名會這邊有備資會嗎"},{"start":232.017,"end":239.838,"text":"有 我們在一夜我們已經成立淨碳的這個永續發展這個小組那我們也送出這個原住民"},{"start":240.492,"end":262.146,"text":"足經濟永續發展計畫的草案我們希望這個推出去之後我們研擬之後這個草案我們會繼續來做之前在屏東縣當過處長是也長期在屏東縣那我想知道說如果就屏東縣那個碳的規模我們原鄉的大概可以在利益上面你覺得可以分配到多少資源"},{"start":263.141,"end":283.816,"text":"現在要精算還不曉得但是這個有一個重點這個不影響到我們的淨化補償就是你在淨化補償一樣可以做這樣的東西我是想幫園民會爭取資源所以我才會這樣算那你這樣算的話是不是因為有一個叫做管理基金就是衛生氣體管理基金那以後這個部分"},{"start":284.807,"end":313.735,"text":"你在盤查盤算的時候在整個碳會的一個機制裡面你至少要知道說有多少基金會到中央這邊來啊你以後要去你要去分配的這些資源要到哪裡去啊所以這個部分你是不是應該先先去了解我現在大概有看到農業部財政部所俠所俠台灣吉寶結算所針對原香碳會或是企業投入ESG已經有建立了相關的平台建制了那其實ESG最被人過病的是什麼你知道嗎"},{"start":315.903,"end":332.732,"text":"大部分就是他的透明度還有他的票率也就是說其實他並沒有做出相當的投資可是他卻寫了這樣子的一個計畫出來還有他的透明度他認為他應該是多少可是我們一般的人無從得知他的計算結果"},{"start":333.732,"end":351.144,"text":"所以就簡單來講我希望主委你自己應該要很清楚去了解他們在做這些所謂的試算跟原先的這些ESG的計畫裡面我覺得你應該要主導來掌握 可以嗎可以 我非常感謝委員這樣重要的提醒 透明度"},{"start":351.724,"end":377.507,"text":"以及他整個是算的方式我想園民會一定是跟大家關係最密切的園民會也可以同時請環境部來支援他做很多這樣的工作對我剛才講的溫室氣體的管理基金所以我希望他的用途上面能夠明定一些方向因為之前的法律裡面並沒有針對這個法案做修正或者是增加所以我在第33條裡面今年提了一個修正案也就是說"},{"start":378.027,"end":406.064,"text":"第33條第13款希望在補助及獎勵事業與原住民地區推動自然資源與生態多樣性的維護教育及宣導事項這些辦法是由中央跟原民會去訂定的這是之前是沒有的所以希望主委能夠先了解這方面的一個情境跟我們立法的一個想法好不好好然後最後就是說我希望請教卓仁泰院長說原住民地區的自然攤會"},{"start":407.028,"end":412.675,"text":"又或是與企業合作一同推動ESG方面我們原住民委員會做了哪些建設"},{"start":414.997,"end":439.217,"text":"剛剛主委有說明過他們辦了10場的說明會有300多人來參加我發現陸續還會再舉辦而且剛剛所提到成立一個淨零永續的發展推動小組在這個小組裡面會擬定各項的一個工作的要項同時原住民經濟永續發展的發展計畫115年到118年他們也會陸續的提出我想針對原住民族"},{"start":439.797,"end":447.203,"text":"在台灣很多好山還是好水的地方我們既然希望他維持就應該有能力讓他自己能夠維持所以提供給他更多的這樣的資源"},{"start":448.203,"end":470.504,"text":"我希望有一個APP,比如說我是一個一般民眾,我想知道說我對自然攤位的貢獻,比如說我身處在屏東縣,我就會知道說屏東縣的自然攤位的資源是多少,那如果我是一個鄉長,我要知道說我這個鄉可以掌握的資源是多少,我覺得至少在以後在這個資訊的一個透明度要讓大家知道,才會知道說我作為一個個人,作為一個"},{"start":471.505,"end":480.633,"text":"一廂之長我能夠做的努力在哪裡可以嗎謝謝 再次謝謝委員的提醒這個非常重要第二個議題就是說針對我在114年4月10號收到園民會的公文首先先謝謝園民會願意補助70萬可是他們實際的需求是92萬1600元那我想知道說你們的難處在哪裡"},{"start":496.088,"end":516.367,"text":"納瑪下區公所要協助區公所的蒸化編的工作我跟委員報告這個機會不多啦是不多但是就是說不管是哪一個不是多不多的問題因為他延宕了很久他如果有需要我們都會核實來協助就是說這個"},{"start":518.869,"end":533.817,"text":"那麼下這個部分這個早在去年應該是吳立豪委他就有提出來那我們每一年光是平均補助就超過了525萬都有協助各鄉的困境"},{"start":534.537,"end":561.549,"text":"那當然就是那個時候孔賢傑七長他來他也要我們來協助那我們想說我們也很快的就是說他要的經費很快就給他補充短缺的22萬要公務員去承擔嗎不是不是不是我想我有跟他講好但如果說還是不夠我們還是願意來協助啊所以就針對這個問題原鄉公所所謂的原住民鄉公所在振化邊的保留地所謂的私有的負帳啊分割經費啊"},{"start":562.689,"end":581.695,"text":"這些部分你們有沒有做每年的一個說經費預算的一些編列不然每年如果遇到這些問題你們要怎麼去哪裡找錢我每一年有編這樣的在圖管處都有編這樣的經費類似有公所提出來可是你還是沒有達到他們要的九十二萬一千你說你只核定了七十萬給他"},{"start":582.728,"end":607.603,"text":"其實我跟委員講,他講92萬,可是我願意協助他這樣,他已經應該是,他跟我講說可以,如果真的不夠,有什麼關係,我還是會再協助他,因為各鄉都會遇到這個問題,這是剛好是納馬下來文,我們來幫忙這樣,好,第二個就是,第三個就是我們國立原住民博物館這個進度啊,我再追蹤一下,我想知道他現在的用地取得有沒有問題,"},{"start":608.444,"end":624.246,"text":"郵遞期的沒有問題了我跟委員報告現在我們的籌備處也已經成立了那現在籌備處未來會在高雄市政府的隔壁那現在正在做裝潢現在也正在做一些這個內部設施的一個整理那目前人"},{"start":625.054,"end":642.12,"text":"人是在暫屆文化延期的辦公處所那很快我們的土地都已經起的我們很快現在在下半年度我們就會先推出一個驗景館驗景館就會推出來以後他們裡面的工作人員是不是已經在原住民特考裡面的"},{"start":643.3,"end":658.049,"text":"名額裡面在招生或者說也在訓練了沒有辦法一下子就補齊啦至少目前的人力已經有到二分之一了那興建進度呢 什麼時候可以動圖啊籌備處沒有想說要怎麼樣的大興頭目因為畢竟它是一個籌備處而已"},{"start":667.393,"end":691.241,"text":"那等到就是說縣警管如果到一個就是說要動工那個時候我們再來跟外界來做說明籌備書我想其實是主要是行政工作啦還有一些作業的一個沒有必要去做完工的時間大概是什麼時候大概一年半之內那個縣警管就會是啦我說整個國立原住民博物館大概什麼時候可以蓋好"},{"start":692.236,"end":709.345,"text":"全部喔 全部沒有那麼快 全部至少你至少因為這個是14公頃的土地很多人想要去那邊工作可是他不知道說到底是什麼時候會遙遙無期啊萬一他想應徵可是他覺得說這個可能我到老都還沒有看到我想知道到底什麼時候可以往工啟用啊"},{"start":709.625,"end":725.815,"text":"我們當然越想越快越好但是這個啟程從一百一十三年到一百二十年那當然這個我們希望能夠加速蓋一個博物館面積又那麼大而且這個計畫是逐年來編列不是說一次就到位"},{"start":726.055,"end":743.607,"text":"沒有辦法確定一個時間表如果今年已經40歲了我想好好發揮我的對原住民文化的一個專才結果我60歲了要退休了這個博物館還沒有蓋好有些人有生涯規劃嘛所以你至少要讓我們原住民一些專業人才知道說我有沒有機會去那裡上班"},{"start":744.227,"end":766.373,"text":"六年到七年我想我們想就讓他營運就能夠也就是說三十歲的人左右可以去想這些事情是吧本來這個很多的這個工程的施作是一定要時間的嘛我們進入下一個主題就是說其實常常看到原住民保留地長期受到一些擔保啊或者是設定啊 借名登記這個部分"},{"start":767.313,"end":782.915,"text":"我知道之前的我們的圖管處的處長也是現在副主委在這部分他有一些了解那他說他會去盤查去盤點我們全國原住民保留地到底有多少比例是被屆民登記被設定的你們現在有報告書可以出來了嗎"},{"start":784.002,"end":812.948,"text":"我跟委員報告所以我們為什麼要提出原住民保留地就是說它的條例的一個修正因為我們不希望這樣的事情一直在發生可是你要掌握然後掌握以後要如何去解決然後如何去預防現在我們要發展原住民的經濟可是我們的土地常常是林業用地 農牧用地國土保安用地可是我們要去如何提高我們或者是說讓我們供股銀行去成"},{"start":813.528,"end":827.775,"text":"去承作他的貸款這個部分你們做了哪些努力目前就是說我們公股八大銀行他們也有提出來他們更希望就是說是不是有這個"},{"start":828.915,"end":849.973,"text":"有這個辦理這個個人保證業務的一些這個這個那個從小企業是不是也來協助但是我們現在一直在想這個八大公股銀行如果可以幫我們做那是最好那我們目前也在研擬這個原住民保留地貸款信用的保證草案那我們希望今年會完成嗎今年會完成嗎"},{"start":850.836,"end":876.289,"text":"我們一直在跟這個八大公股這個銀行希望要嘛就大家看是哪幾家可以先做但是他們也提出一些修正計畫我們願意再補一直在 我們現在還在很快 已經在後期的討論了我知道現在內政部有委託不動產估價施工會進行原住民保留地的估價方式的探討那報告書出來了嗎"},{"start":877.731,"end":901.37,"text":"目前還沒有我們尊重還是希望我們動作還是能夠快一點因為很多人都是嗷嗷待哺希望他的土地有價值而不是永遠都在政府在想在想辦法可是辦法一籌莫展最後就是說關於我們巡山園也就是說我們的高山巷島協作園這個部分其實每次天災的時候或者是需要"},{"start":902.47,"end":923.979,"text":"像玉山這個步道需要有人去管理的時候或者是說有些人發生山難需要去救助的時候其實都是這些人在工作那我想知道說到底有沒有對他們一些待遇的一些保障或者說至少讓他們在投保的時候商業保險能夠不要因為他的工作性質是危險的而不拒保"},{"start":924.719,"end":938.324,"text":"所以希望主委這邊把高山協作園祥島這邊納入一個高危險也就是說雖然是高風險可是是政府協助的一個工作項目好我們會特別要求我們的這個救護員好謝謝盧縣議委的資訊謝謝主委長原民會的"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":395,"blocks":[["盧委員縣一：（10時6分）主席，有請院長跟原民會主委。"],["主席：麻煩請卓院長、原民會備詢。"],["卓院長榮泰：盧委員好。"],["盧委員縣一：院長好、主委好。氣候變遷因應法即將邁入10年，它之前是溫室氣體減量及管理法，針對原住民部分，在第五條是說「為推動自然碳匯，政府應與原住民族共同推動及管理原住民族地區內之自然碳匯，該區域內新增碳匯之相關權益應與原住民族共享，涉及原住民族土地開發、利用或限制，應與原住民族諮商，並取得其同意。」","我們現在看到川普政府已經退出巴黎協定，原本美國政府對國家可能是30億美金的支出，他直接cut down。我們政府會不會因為這樣，也對我們未來的發展做一些減緩或者有一些其他的想法，院長可以回答嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：其他的想法？"],["盧委員縣一：也就是美國cut down了他對這方面的支出跟支持，那我們政府是不是也會受到影響？"],["卓院長榮泰：我覺得共同維護一個乾淨跟永續的地球，到底是這一代人類共同的責任。"],["盧委員縣一：不是，當你付出很多，可是沒有實質回報的時候，你會不會想要減緩這方面的支出？"],["卓院長榮泰：我們照原有的步驟繼續向前進。"],["盧委員縣一：那我想先知道原民會主委的想法，這次針對創造就業機會，我知道在環境部這邊他有想要培育人才、綠領人才，他說預計在北、中、南大概今年要訓練3,500人。那3,500人裡面，我不知道環境部有沒有跟貴會討論過，如果按照人口比例，我們原住民裡面受訓練的一些專業人才是不是應該至少要70名到105名之間，這個人才培訓計畫裡面，你有沒有被知會？"],["曾主任委員智勇：謝謝委員，我想人才的培育，有關原鄉碳匯的問題，我們這邊也已經跟自己的族人做超過10場以上的說明會，我們也會繼續辦……"],["盧委員縣一：OK，比如我是一個鄉長，要到原民會拜託或到縣政府去說我以後要做這方面的產業，那我是要跟哪一個單位說明？因為我沒有看到專責單位，原民會的專責單位在哪裡？"],["曾主任委員智勇：我們在經濟處。"],["盧委員縣一：經濟處？"],["曾主任委員智勇：對。"],["盧委員縣一：你知道現在我們原住民碳匯的規模大概是多少嗎？"],["曾主任委員智勇：我們現在還沒有……我們現在就是希望趕快……因為部落都還不清楚這個事情嘛！"],["盧委員縣一：我知道，因為法令已經頒布10年了，可是我每次一問，就說還沒有一致性、不知道該怎麼弄。我剛剛又查了一些資料，其實碳盤查到現在還沒有一致的規定，所以環境部長也在傷腦筋，他希望至少在今年可以成立一個新的碳盤查基準，然後每3年更新一次。這個部分原民會這邊有被知會嗎？"],["曾主任委員智勇：有，我們在1月已經成立淨零永續發展小組，也送出原住民族經濟永續發展計畫的草案，希望推出去之後、我們研擬之後，這個草案能夠繼續來做。"],["盧委員縣一：主委，因為你之前在屏東縣當過處長……"],["曾主任委員智勇：是！"],["盧委員縣一：你也長期在屏東縣，我想知道如果就屏東縣的碳規模來講，你覺得我們原鄉在利益上面大概可以分配到多少資源？"],["曾主任委員智勇：現在要精算，還不曉得，但是這有一個重點，這不影響到我們的禁伐補償，就是禁伐補償一樣可以做這樣的東西。"],["盧委員縣一：我是想幫原民會爭取資源，所以才會這樣算。這樣算的話，因為有一個溫室氣體管理基金，以後這個部分在盤查、盤算的時候，在整個碳匯機制裡面，至少要知道有多少基金會到中央這邊來、以後分配的資源要到哪裡去啊！所以這個部分你是不是要先去瞭解？"],["曾主任委員智勇：會！"],["盧委員縣一：我現在大概有看到農業部、財政部所轄臺灣集保結算所，針對原鄉碳匯或是企業投入ESG，進行了相關平台的建置。其實ESG最被人詬病的是什麼？你知道嗎？"],["曾主任委員智勇：我不曉得。"],["盧委員縣一：大部分就是它的透明度和漂綠，比如說它其實並沒有做出相當的投資，可是卻寫了這樣的計畫出來；還有它的透明度，它認為它應該是多少，可是我們一般人無從得知它的計算方式。所以簡單來講，我希望主委自己應該要很清楚去瞭解，他們在做這些所謂的試算，還有和原鄉有關的ESG計畫裡面，我覺得你應該要主導和掌握，可以嗎？"],["曾主任委員智勇：可以。"],["卓院長榮泰：我非常感謝委員這樣重要的提醒：透明度以及它的試算方式。我想原民會一定是跟大家關係最密切的……"],["盧委員縣一：謝謝院長。"],["卓院長榮泰：原民會也可以同時請環境部來支援它，做很多這樣的工作。"],["盧委員縣一：針對我剛才講的溫室氣體管理基金，我希望它在用途上面能夠明定一些方向，因為之前修正氣候變遷因應法，並沒有針對這個部分進行修正或增訂，所以我今年提了一個修正案，就是針對第三十三條第一項第十三款，希望修正為「補助及獎勵事業於原住民族地區，推動自然資源與生態多樣性之維護、教育及宣導事項。」而且相關辦法是由中央跟原民會去訂定的。這些規定之前是沒有的，所以希望主委能夠先瞭解這方面的情境和我們立法的想法，好不好？"],["曾主任委員智勇：好。"],["盧委員縣一：最後，我希望請教卓榮泰院長的是，原住民族地區的自然碳匯，又或是與企業合作一同推動ESG方面，我們原住民族委員會做了哪些建樹？"],["卓院長榮泰：剛剛主委有說明過，他們辦了10場說明會，有三百多人來參加，陸續還會再舉辦，而且剛剛所提到的成立一個淨零永續發展推動小組，在這個小組裡面會擬定各個工作要項，同時，原住民族經濟永續發展計畫（115年-118年）他們也會陸續提出。我想，針對原住民族在臺灣很多好山好水的地方，我們既然希望它維持，就應該有能力讓它自己能夠維持，所以提供給它更多的資源。"],["盧委員縣一：OK。我希望有一個app，比如說我是一個一般民眾，我想知道我對自然碳匯的貢獻，譬如說我身處在屏東縣，我就會知道屏東縣自然碳匯的資源是多少，如果我是一個鄉長，我要知道我這個鄉可以掌握的資源是多少。我覺得以後至少資訊的透明度要讓大家知道，大家才會知道自己做為一個個人、做為一鄉之長，能夠做的努力在哪裡？可以嗎？"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝。再次謝謝委員的提醒，這個非常重要，我們會往這個方向走。"],["盧委員縣一：接下來的議題是針對我在114年4月10日收到的原民會公文。首先感謝原民會願意補助70萬元，可是他們實際的需求是92萬1,600元，我想知道你們的難處在哪裡？那瑪夏。"],["曾主任委員智勇：你講的是……"],["盧委員縣一：那瑪夏區公所。"],["曾主任委員智勇：要協助對區公所增劃編的那個工作？"],["盧委員縣一：保留地增劃編的部分。"],["曾主任委員智勇：我跟委員報告，這個經費不多啦！但是不管是哪一個……"],["盧委員縣一：不是多不多的問題，因為它延宕了很久。"],["曾主任委員智勇：如果它有需要，我們都會覈實來協助，那瑪夏這個部分早在去年，應該是伍麗華委員就有提出來，我們每一年光是平均補助就超過了525萬，都有協助各鄉的困境，當然那個時候孔賢傑區長來，他也要我們來協助，他要的這個經費，我們很快就給他補足了……"],["盧委員縣一：這短缺的22萬要公務員去承擔嗎？還是誰？"],["曾主任委員智勇：不是，我有跟他講好，當然如果還是不夠，我們還是願意來協助。"],["盧委員縣一：好，所以就針對這個問題，所有的原住民鄉公所增劃編的保留地，所謂私有的複丈、分割經費，這些部分你們有沒有做每一年經費預算的一些編列？不然每年如果遇到這些問題，你們要怎麼做？去哪裡找錢？"],["曾主任委員智勇：我每一年都有編這樣的經費，在土管處都有編這樣的經費，列示有公所提出來、有它的困難……"],["盧委員縣一：可是你還是沒有達到他們要的92萬1,000元，你只核定了70萬給他們。"],["曾主任委員智勇：其實我跟委員講，他講92萬，可是我願意協助他這樣，他跟我講是可以的，如果真的不夠，有什麼困難，我還是會再協助他們……"],["盧委員縣一：因為各鄉都會遇到這個問題，這次剛好是那瑪夏來文，我們來幫忙。"],["曾主任委員智勇：好。"],["盧委員縣一：第三個就是國立原住民博物館的進度，我再追蹤一下，我想知道它現在的用地取得有沒有問題。"],["曾主任委員智勇：用地取得沒有問題了。我跟委員報告，現在我們的籌備處也已經成立了，籌備處未來會在高雄市政府的隔壁，現在正在做裝潢，也正在做一些內部設施的整理，目前人是暫借文化園區的辦公處所，我們的土地都已經取得，我們很快會在下半年度，我們就會先推出一個願景館，願景館就會推出來，已經在規劃了。"],["盧委員縣一：我想知道以後裡面的工作人員是不是已經在原住民特考的名額裡面招生，或者有在訓練了？"],["曾主任委員智勇：有，我跟委員講，沒有辦法一下子就補齊啦，但是至少目前的人力已經有到二分之一了，至少有8個人。"],["盧委員縣一：興建進度呢？大概什麼時候可以動土？"],["曾主任委員智勇：籌備處沒有想要怎麼樣的大興土木，因為畢竟它是一個籌備處而已，等到願景館如果要動工了，那個時候我們再來跟外界做說明。我想籌備處其實主要是行政工作，還有一些作業的一個處所，沒有必要去做……"],["盧委員縣一：我想知道完工的時間大概是什麼時候？"],["曾主任委員智勇：大概一年半之內，願景館就會弄好。"],["盧委員縣一：不是，我說整個國立原住民博物館大概什麼時候可以蓋好？"],["曾主任委員智勇：全部？"],["盧委員縣一：對。"],["曾主任委員智勇：全部沒有那麼快，因為這個是14公頃的土地，全部至少……"],["盧委員縣一：很多人想要去那邊工作，可是他不知道到底是什麼時候？可能會遙遙無期，萬一他想應徵，可是他覺得這個可能他到老都還沒有看到。我想知道到底什麼時候可以完工啟用？"],["曾主任委員智勇：我們當然想越快越好，但是這個期程是從113年到120年，當然我們希望能夠加速，蓋一個博物館，面積又那麼大，而且這個計畫是逐年來編列，不是一次就到位。"],["盧委員縣一：沒有辦法確定一個時間表？如果我今年已經40歲了，我想好好發揮我對原住民文化的專才，結果到了我60歲了、要退休了，這個博物館還沒有蓋好？有些人有生涯規劃，所以你至少要讓我們原住民一些專業人才知道他有沒有機會去那裡上班啊？"],["曾主任委員智勇：6年到7年，我們想就能夠讓它營運。"],["盧委員縣一：也就是30歲左右的人可以去想這些事情，是吧？"],["曾主任委員智勇：本來工程的施作是一定要時間的，因為預算沒有辦法一次到位。"],["盧委員縣一：好，我們進入下一個主題，其實常常看到原住民保留地長期受到一些擔保，或者是設定、借名登記這個部分，我知道之前土管處的處長，也是現在的副主委，在這部分，他有一些了解，他說會去盤查、去盤點我們全國原住民保留地到底有多少比例是被借名登記、被設定的，你們現在有報告書出來了嗎？"],["曾主任委員智勇：我跟委員報告，所以我們為什麼要提出原住民保留地條例的修正，因為我們不希望這樣的事情一直在發生。"],["盧委員縣一：是啊！"],["曾主任委員智勇：我們有……"],["盧委員縣一：可是你要掌握，掌握以後，你們要如何去解決、如何去預防？現在我們要發展原住民經濟，可是我們的土地常常是林業用地、農牧用地、國土保安用地，要如何提高公股銀行承作土地貸款的意願，你們做了哪些努力？"],["曾主任委員智勇：這個部分，其實公股八大銀行有提出來希望辦理個人保證業務的一些中小企業是不是也可以來協助，但是我們也一直在思考，如果八大公股銀行可以幫我們做，那是最好，而我們目前也在研擬原住民保留地貸款信用的保證草案，希望很快的時間來……"],["盧委員縣一：今年會完成嗎？"],["曾主任委員智勇：我們一直在跟八大公股銀行討論，希望可以有幾家先做，但他們也提出一些修正計畫，我們願意再補，我想會很快，現在已經在後期的討論了。"],["盧委員縣一：我知道內政部有委託不動產估價師公會進行原住民保留地估價方式的探討，報告書出來了嗎？"],["曾主任委員智勇：目前還沒有，我們尊重內政部……"],["盧委員縣一：希望動作能夠快一點，因為很多人都是嗷嗷待哺，希望他的土地有價值，而不是永遠都是政府在想辦法，可是辦法卻一直一籌莫展。","最後是關於巡山員的問題，也就是高山嚮導、協作員的部分，其實每次有天災發生，像玉山的步道，都需要有人去管理；或者是發生山難時，需要有人去救助，都是這些人在工作，所以我想知道，到底有沒有對他們待遇的一些保障，或者至少讓他們在投保商業保險的時候，能夠不要因為工作性質是危險的而被拒保，希望主委能夠把高山協作員、嚮導納入，雖然是高風險工作，可是卻是協助政府的一個工作項目。"],["曾主任委員智勇：好，我們會特別要求就服員來協助有關勞工職災的保險及保護，我們會主動去協助他們。"],["盧委員縣一：好，謝謝，辛苦了！"],["曾主任委員智勇：謝謝。"],["卓院長榮泰：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝盧縣一委員的質詢，謝謝卓院長及原民會的備詢。","登記第6位陳瑩委員之質詢以書面提出，請行政院書面答復，並列入紀錄，刊登公報。","接下來請登記第7號林月琴委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":324,"meet_id":"院會-11-3-8","speakers":["韓國瑜","江啟臣","林國成","麥玉珍","翁曉玲","林宜瑾","盧縣一","林月琴","高金素梅","李坤城","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","劉書彬","陳永康","林俊憲","徐巧芯"],"page_start":267,"meetingDate":["2025-04-22"],"gazette_id":"1143701","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1143701_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期第8次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢─ 繼續質詢─","agenda_id":"1143701_00012"}}}