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{\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 205.851, \"end\": 205.991, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"頭\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 205.991, \"end\": 206.331, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 206.331, \"end\": 206.852, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"試\"}, {\"word\": \"圖\"}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 206.852, \"end\": 207.312, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"繩\"}, {\"word\": \"子\", \"start\": 207.312, \"end\": 207.532, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 207.532, \"end\": 207.852, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"突\", \"start\": 207.852, \"end\": 208.053, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"破\", \"start\": 208.053, \"end\": 208.073, \"score\": 0.003}]}, {\"start\": 209.38, \"end\": 237.695, \"text\": \"好我們現在看到這段影片很多的民進黨的委員都在叫說協助青鳥衝進立法院現場還有出現青鳥勒住遠景還有破壞柵欄衝撞遠景的狀況這樣有沒有違法那我想這個是構成要件跟程度的問題就是說這樣子還沒有構成要件整個的一個狀況是不是跟這個有沒有達到已經就是這個整個構成要件那我們想會跟事實的狀況來做一個認定\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 209.38, \"end\": 210.02, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 210.02, 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{\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 375.992, \"end\": 376.012, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 398.686, \"end\": 398.708, \"score\": 0.002}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,089 --> 00:00:26,502\n主席我們請劉部長張署長劉部長張署長有請薛文豪部長好還有署長好部長我星期一詢問您去年的12月20號青鳥在立法院外集結那一些民進黨的立委毀損公務叫說青鳥衝進立法院我當時問你的是請問你有沒有把他們移送\n\n2\n00:00:27,242 --> 00:00:47,705\n你回答我說因為立法院不是禁制區我當然知道立法院不是禁制區我問你的是有沒有把他們移送可是你回答我立法院是不是禁制區如果不是狀況外就是你在包庇誰我想請教署長12月20號衝突後你們有沒有把誰移送法辦除了宗家兵委員\n\n3\n00:00:48,226 --> 00:01:15,124\n好10月20號那個這一場是由台北市政府警察局來做一個執行那因為這個每一場的這個群眾活動都會跟現場的這個這個市政來做處理那這裡面看起來就是他們處理這個中加兵委員的這個他們檢視的這一些的一個相關的一個市政是沒有在做其他繁重其他的這個人員所以只移送中加兵委員\n\n4\n00:01:19,487 --> 00:01:40,701\n請這部長看一下影片我們是講道理的人但是當有人不講道理的時候當有人不講道理的時候我們也不要沉默然後再來請各位保持體力今天今天的時間還很漫長我們甚至很不容易感受到\n\n5\n00:01:43,363 --> 00:01:47,766\n我們沒有要來這裡跟任何人起肢體衝突今天最高的和平原則最高的和平目標署長\n\n6\n00:02:06,939 --> 00:02:15,836\n剛剛影片中你看到破壞貨欄有好幾位喔那為什麼只移送宗嘉賓委員一人其他人呢那依照劉部長的標準的話應該是全部都要移送啊\n\n7\n00:02:16,414 --> 00:02:24,779\n沒有這個部分我們會依照市政再來做滾動式的一個檢討從去年12月20到現在從去年12月20到現在莊家兵委員都已經出庭過一次了你們到現在還要滾動式的檢討了解現場的狀況這影片網路上到處都是好您再看一下這個照片就是\n\n8\n00:02:41,030 --> 00:03:04,077\n除了宗家立委員破壞柵欄之外還有不少的民進黨的立委也協助青鳥推倒護欄要衝進立法院那請問一下署長這樣有沒有違法那這個部分因為要衡量現場的這個狀況那我給你看一段影片你衡量一下民進黨立委到立院外不斷教授要青鳥進入院內場面一度混亂\n\n9\n00:03:09,657 --> 00:03:28,073\n跨上柵欄一個右勾拳青鳥把員警架住突破第一道防線青鳥跟警方拉扯柵欄用跨的抽不了後方有人踩在椅上像直接一個馬步跨過去甚至另一頭有人試圖用繩子想突破\n\n10\n00:03:29,380 --> 00:03:57,695\n好我們現在看到這段影片很多的民進黨的委員都在叫說協助青鳥衝進立法院現場還有出現青鳥勒住遠景還有破壞柵欄衝撞遠景的狀況這樣有沒有違法那我想這個是構成要件跟程度的問題就是說這樣子還沒有構成要件整個的一個狀況是不是跟這個有沒有達到已經就是這個整個構成要件那我們想會跟事實的狀況來做一個認定\n\n11\n00:03:58,575 --> 00:04:00,987\n那請問一下當天警政署有沒有移送守謀\n\n12\n00:04:03,058 --> 00:04:32,318\n那天沒有沒有沒有為什麼如果依照部長的要求沒有那些召集的人的一個受政的這個狀況沒有單獨的一個首謀一個情形單獨的那一天的那一天的申請那一天申請是有有申請核准的一個主要的主辦人但是可以衝撞嗎可以破壞公務嗎可以叫說大家衝進立法院嗎那我想這個因為群眾活動的樣態非常多這是會衡量現場的這個狀況來做一個處置那所以署長你現在準備怎麼處理\n\n13\n00:04:33,458 --> 00:05:01,738\n已經從去年12月20到現在那我想就是還是我們還是尊重台北市政府檢察局的這個根據這個現場的狀況來做一個處置因為部長我想在受訪的時候有提到說在我們4月17號當天在場的全部應該都要移送甚至部長也受訪的時候也提到說他會請警方將首謀朱立倫主席跟教育界委員這個移送那請問一下\n\n14\n00:05:02,950 --> 00:05:04,602\n部長您有沒有對媒體說這些話\n\n15\n00:05:07,058 --> 00:05:34,664\n謝謝委員的關心我想委員可能沒有了解我在對媒體受訪時候的全文的部分我在開始講的時候就有提到說我們按照集會遊行法裡面的相關規範那如果你有觸犯到集會遊行法的相關規範的話我們按照規範來處理那你有沒有說我會請警方移送首謀朱立倫主席跟謝榮介委員這個是在部長您知道嗎您已經是有史以來第一個內政部長指揮員警辦案的錯\n\n16\n00:05:36,664 --> 00:05:39,906\n您是第一個報告委員我剛有提到我們是根據集會遊行法那集會遊行法的主管機關是內政部但是檢察官沒有這個職權\n\n17\n00:05:51,874 --> 00:05:59,480\n妳內政部長不該下這種指導棋我沒有下指導棋我是根據對不起我是根據原先他們所提供的事項來對媒體所回應的你怎麼可以說要要求警方這個將守謀這個是斷章取義\n\n18\n00:06:07,546 --> 00:06:16,012\n這沒有斷章區域這是你自己受訪的那所以你就做出這個斷章區域嘛所以在這個部分我希望署長你要積極偵辦去年12月20號的這個青鳥衝撞立法院還有一些民進黨委員教唆他們衝進立法院不要只有辦藍不辦綠因為現在的標準大家看起來都是辦藍不辦綠請問署長可以嗎這個部分我們交給他被施政務局來處理好謝謝\n\n19\n00:06:38,686 --> 00:06:38,708\n好\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n89\t26502\t主席 我們請劉部長 張署長劉部長 張署長有請薛文豪部長好 還有署長好部長 我星期一詢問您去年的12月20號青鳥在立法院外集結那一些民進黨的立委毀損公務叫說青鳥衝進立法院我當時問你的是請問你有沒有把他們移送\n27242\t47705\t你回答我說因為立法院不是禁制區我當然知道立法院不是禁制區我問你的是有沒有把他們移送可是你回答我立法院是不是禁制區如果不是狀況外就是你在包庇誰我想請教署長12月20號衝突後你們有沒有把誰移送法辦除了宗家兵委員\n48226\t75124\t好 10月20號那個這一場是由台北市政府警察局來做一個執行那因為這個每一場的這個群眾活動都會跟現場的這個這個市政來做處理那這裡面看起來就是他們處理這個中加兵委員的這個他們檢視的這一些的一個相關的一個市政是沒有在做其他繁重其他的這個人員所以只移送中加兵委員\n79487\t100701\t請這部長看一下影片我們是講道理的人但是當有人不講道理的時候當有人不講道理的時候我們也不要沉默然後再來 請各位保持體力今天 今天的時間還很漫長我們甚至很不容易感受到\n103363\t107766\t我們沒有要來這裡跟任何人起肢體衝突今天最高的和平原則最高的和平目標署長\n126939\t135836\t剛剛影片中你看到破壞貨欄有好幾位喔那為什麼只移送宗嘉賓委員一人其他人呢那依照劉部長的標準的話應該是全部都要移送啊\n136414\t144779\t沒有 這個部分我們會依照市政再來做滾動式的一個檢討從去年12月20到現在從去年12月20到現在 莊家兵委員都已經出庭過一次了你們到現在還要滾動式的檢討 了解現場的狀況這影片網路上到處都是好 您再看一下這個照片 就是\n161030\t184077\t除了宗家立委員破壞柵欄之外還有不少的民進黨的立委也協助青鳥推倒護欄要衝進立法院那請問一下署長這樣有沒有違法那這個部分因為要衡量現場的這個狀況那我給你看一段影片你衡量一下民進黨立委到立院外不斷教授要青鳥進入院內場面一度混亂\n189657\t208073\t跨上柵欄 一個右勾拳青鳥把員警架住突破第一道防線青鳥跟警方拉扯柵欄用跨的抽不了後方有人踩在椅上像直接一個馬步跨過去甚至另一頭有人試圖用繩子想突破\n209380\t237695\t好我們現在看到這段影片很多的民進黨的委員都在叫說協助青鳥衝進立法院現場還有出現青鳥勒住遠景還有破壞柵欄衝撞遠景的狀況這樣有沒有違法那我想這個是構成要件跟程度的問題就是說這樣子還沒有構成要件整個的一個狀況是不是跟這個有沒有達到已經就是這個整個構成要件那我們想會跟事實的狀況來做一個認定\n238575\t240987\t那請問一下當天警政署有沒有移送守謀\n243058\t272318\t那天沒有沒有沒有為什麼如果依照部長的要求沒有那些召集的人的一個受政的這個狀況沒有單獨的一個首謀一個情形單獨的那一天的那一天的申請那一天申請是有有申請核准的一個主要的主辦人但是可以衝撞嗎可以破壞公務嗎可以叫說大家衝進立法院嗎那我想這個因為群眾活動的樣態非常多這是會衡量現場的這個狀況來做一個處置那所以署長你現在準備怎麼處理\n273458\t301738\t已經從去年12月20到現在那我想就是還是我們還是尊重台北市政府檢察局的這個根據這個現場的狀況來做一個處置因為部長我想在受訪的時候有提到說在我們4月17號當天在場的全部應該都要移送甚至部長也受訪的時候也提到說他會請警方將首謀朱立倫主席跟教育界委員這個移送那請問一下\n302950\t304602\t部長 您有沒有對媒體說這些話\n307058\t334664\t謝謝委員的關心我想委員可能沒有了解我在對媒體受訪時候的全文的部分我在開始講的時候就有提到說我們按照集會遊行法裡面的相關規範那如果你有觸犯到集會遊行法的相關規範的話我們按照規範來處理那你有沒有說我會請警方移送首謀朱立倫主席跟謝榮介委員這個是在部長您知道嗎您已經是有史以來第一個內政部長指揮員警辦案的錯\n336664\t339906\t您是第一個報告委員我剛有提到我們是根據集會遊行法那集會遊行法的主管機關是內政部但是檢察官沒有這個職權\n351874\t359480\t妳內政部長不該下這種指導棋我沒有下指導棋我是根據 對不起我是根據原先他們所提供的事項來對媒體所回應的你怎麼可以說要要求警方這個將守謀這個是斷章取義\n367546\t376012\t這沒有斷章區域 這是你自己受訪的那所以你就做出這個斷章區域嘛所以在這個部分我希望署長你要積極偵辦去年12月20號的這個青鳥衝撞立法院還有一些民進黨委員教唆他們衝進立法院不要只有辦藍不辦綠因為現在的標準大家看起來都是辦藍不辦綠請問署長可以嗎這個部分我們交給他被施政務局來處理好 謝謝\n398686\t398708\t好\n","txt":"主席 我們請劉部長 張署長劉部長 張署長有請薛文豪部長好 還有署長好部長 我星期一詢問您去年的12月20號青鳥在立法院外集結那一些民進黨的立委毀損公務叫說青鳥衝進立法院我當時問你的是請問你有沒有把他們移送\n你回答我說因為立法院不是禁制區我當然知道立法院不是禁制區我問你的是有沒有把他們移送可是你回答我立法院是不是禁制區如果不是狀況外就是你在包庇誰我想請教署長12月20號衝突後你們有沒有把誰移送法辦除了宗家兵委員\n好 10月20號那個這一場是由台北市政府警察局來做一個執行那因為這個每一場的這個群眾活動都會跟現場的這個這個市政來做處理那這裡面看起來就是他們處理這個中加兵委員的這個他們檢視的這一些的一個相關的一個市政是沒有在做其他繁重其他的這個人員所以只移送中加兵委員\n請這部長看一下影片我們是講道理的人但是當有人不講道理的時候當有人不講道理的時候我們也不要沉默然後再來 請各位保持體力今天 今天的時間還很漫長我們甚至很不容易感受到\n我們沒有要來這裡跟任何人起肢體衝突今天最高的和平原則最高的和平目標署長\n剛剛影片中你看到破壞貨欄有好幾位喔那為什麼只移送宗嘉賓委員一人其他人呢那依照劉部長的標準的話應該是全部都要移送啊\n沒有 這個部分我們會依照市政再來做滾動式的一個檢討從去年12月20到現在從去年12月20到現在 莊家兵委員都已經出庭過一次了你們到現在還要滾動式的檢討 了解現場的狀況這影片網路上到處都是好 您再看一下這個照片 就是\n除了宗家立委員破壞柵欄之外還有不少的民進黨的立委也協助青鳥推倒護欄要衝進立法院那請問一下署長這樣有沒有違法那這個部分因為要衡量現場的這個狀況那我給你看一段影片你衡量一下民進黨立委到立院外不斷教授要青鳥進入院內場面一度混亂\n跨上柵欄 一個右勾拳青鳥把員警架住突破第一道防線青鳥跟警方拉扯柵欄用跨的抽不了後方有人踩在椅上像直接一個馬步跨過去甚至另一頭有人試圖用繩子想突破\n好我們現在看到這段影片很多的民進黨的委員都在叫說協助青鳥衝進立法院現場還有出現青鳥勒住遠景還有破壞柵欄衝撞遠景的狀況這樣有沒有違法那我想這個是構成要件跟程度的問題就是說這樣子還沒有構成要件整個的一個狀況是不是跟這個有沒有達到已經就是這個整個構成要件那我們想會跟事實的狀況來做一個認定\n那請問一下當天警政署有沒有移送守謀\n那天沒有沒有沒有為什麼如果依照部長的要求沒有那些召集的人的一個受政的這個狀況沒有單獨的一個首謀一個情形單獨的那一天的那一天的申請那一天申請是有有申請核准的一個主要的主辦人但是可以衝撞嗎可以破壞公務嗎可以叫說大家衝進立法院嗎那我想這個因為群眾活動的樣態非常多這是會衡量現場的這個狀況來做一個處置那所以署長你現在準備怎麼處理\n已經從去年12月20到現在那我想就是還是我們還是尊重台北市政府檢察局的這個根據這個現場的狀況來做一個處置因為部長我想在受訪的時候有提到說在我們4月17號當天在場的全部應該都要移送甚至部長也受訪的時候也提到說他會請警方將首謀朱立倫主席跟教育界委員這個移送那請問一下\n部長 您有沒有對媒體說這些話\n謝謝委員的關心我想委員可能沒有了解我在對媒體受訪時候的全文的部分我在開始講的時候就有提到說我們按照集會遊行法裡面的相關規範那如果你有觸犯到集會遊行法的相關規範的話我們按照規範來處理那你有沒有說我會請警方移送首謀朱立倫主席跟謝榮介委員這個是在部長您知道嗎您已經是有史以來第一個內政部長指揮員警辦案的錯\n您是第一個報告委員我剛有提到我們是根據集會遊行法那集會遊行法的主管機關是內政部但是檢察官沒有這個職權\n妳內政部長不該下這種指導棋我沒有下指導棋我是根據 對不起我是根據原先他們所提供的事項來對媒體所回應的你怎麼可以說要要求警方這個將守謀這個是斷章取義\n這沒有斷章區域 這是你自己受訪的那所以你就做出這個斷章區域嘛所以在這個部分我希望署長你要積極偵辦去年12月20號的這個青鳥衝撞立法院還有一些民進黨委員教唆他們衝進立法院不要只有辦藍不辦綠因為現在的標準大家看起來都是辦藍不辦綠請問署長可以嗎這個部分我們交給他被施政務局來處理好 謝謝\n好\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.089 --> 00:26.502\n主席我們請劉部長張署長劉部長張署長有請薛文豪部長好還有署長好部長我星期一詢問您去年的12月20號青鳥在立法院外集結那一些民進黨的立委毀損公務叫說青鳥衝進立法院我當時問你的是請問你有沒有把他們移送\n\n00:27.242 --> 00:47.705\n你回答我說因為立法院不是禁制區我當然知道立法院不是禁制區我問你的是有沒有把他們移送可是你回答我立法院是不是禁制區如果不是狀況外就是你在包庇誰我想請教署長12月20號衝突後你們有沒有把誰移送法辦除了宗家兵委員\n\n00:48.226 --> 01:15.124\n好10月20號那個這一場是由台北市政府警察局來做一個執行那因為這個每一場的這個群眾活動都會跟現場的這個這個市政來做處理那這裡面看起來就是他們處理這個中加兵委員的這個他們檢視的這一些的一個相關的一個市政是沒有在做其他繁重其他的這個人員所以只移送中加兵委員\n\n01:19.487 --> 01:40.701\n請這部長看一下影片我們是講道理的人但是當有人不講道理的時候當有人不講道理的時候我們也不要沉默然後再來請各位保持體力今天今天的時間還很漫長我們甚至很不容易感受到\n\n01:43.363 --> 01:47.766\n我們沒有要來這裡跟任何人起肢體衝突今天最高的和平原則最高的和平目標署長\n\n02:06.939 --> 02:15.836\n剛剛影片中你看到破壞貨欄有好幾位喔那為什麼只移送宗嘉賓委員一人其他人呢那依照劉部長的標準的話應該是全部都要移送啊\n\n02:16.414 --> 02:24.779\n沒有這個部分我們會依照市政再來做滾動式的一個檢討從去年12月20到現在從去年12月20到現在莊家兵委員都已經出庭過一次了你們到現在還要滾動式的檢討了解現場的狀況這影片網路上到處都是好您再看一下這個照片就是\n\n02:41.030 --> 03:04.077\n除了宗家立委員破壞柵欄之外還有不少的民進黨的立委也協助青鳥推倒護欄要衝進立法院那請問一下署長這樣有沒有違法那這個部分因為要衡量現場的這個狀況那我給你看一段影片你衡量一下民進黨立委到立院外不斷教授要青鳥進入院內場面一度混亂\n\n03:09.657 --> 03:28.073\n跨上柵欄一個右勾拳青鳥把員警架住突破第一道防線青鳥跟警方拉扯柵欄用跨的抽不了後方有人踩在椅上像直接一個馬步跨過去甚至另一頭有人試圖用繩子想突破\n\n03:29.380 --> 03:57.695\n好我們現在看到這段影片很多的民進黨的委員都在叫說協助青鳥衝進立法院現場還有出現青鳥勒住遠景還有破壞柵欄衝撞遠景的狀況這樣有沒有違法那我想這個是構成要件跟程度的問題就是說這樣子還沒有構成要件整個的一個狀況是不是跟這個有沒有達到已經就是這個整個構成要件那我們想會跟事實的狀況來做一個認定\n\n03:58.575 --> 04:00.987\n那請問一下當天警政署有沒有移送守謀\n\n04:03.058 --> 04:32.318\n那天沒有沒有沒有為什麼如果依照部長的要求沒有那些召集的人的一個受政的這個狀況沒有單獨的一個首謀一個情形單獨的那一天的那一天的申請那一天申請是有有申請核准的一個主要的主辦人但是可以衝撞嗎可以破壞公務嗎可以叫說大家衝進立法院嗎那我想這個因為群眾活動的樣態非常多這是會衡量現場的這個狀況來做一個處置那所以署長你現在準備怎麼處理\n\n04:33.458 --> 05:01.738\n已經從去年12月20到現在那我想就是還是我們還是尊重台北市政府檢察局的這個根據這個現場的狀況來做一個處置因為部長我想在受訪的時候有提到說在我們4月17號當天在場的全部應該都要移送甚至部長也受訪的時候也提到說他會請警方將首謀朱立倫主席跟教育界委員這個移送那請問一下\n\n05:02.950 --> 05:04.602\n部長您有沒有對媒體說這些話\n\n05:07.058 --> 05:34.664\n謝謝委員的關心我想委員可能沒有了解我在對媒體受訪時候的全文的部分我在開始講的時候就有提到說我們按照集會遊行法裡面的相關規範那如果你有觸犯到集會遊行法的相關規範的話我們按照規範來處理那你有沒有說我會請警方移送首謀朱立倫主席跟謝榮介委員這個是在部長您知道嗎您已經是有史以來第一個內政部長指揮員警辦案的錯\n\n05:36.664 --> 05:39.906\n您是第一個報告委員我剛有提到我們是根據集會遊行法那集會遊行法的主管機關是內政部但是檢察官沒有這個職權\n\n05:51.874 --> 05:59.480\n妳內政部長不該下這種指導棋我沒有下指導棋我是根據對不起我是根據原先他們所提供的事項來對媒體所回應的你怎麼可以說要要求警方這個將守謀這個是斷章取義\n\n06:07.546 --> 06:16.012\n這沒有斷章區域這是你自己受訪的那所以你就做出這個斷章區域嘛所以在這個部分我希望署長你要積極偵辦去年12月20號的這個青鳥衝撞立法院還有一些民進黨委員教唆他們衝進立法院不要只有辦藍不辦綠因為現在的標準大家看起來都是辦藍不辦綠請問署長可以嗎這個部分我們交給他被施政務局來處理好謝謝\n\n06:38.686 --> 06:38.708\n好\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.089,"end":26.502,"text":"主席 我們請劉部長 張署長劉部長 張署長有請薛文豪部長好 還有署長好部長 我星期一詢問您去年的12月20號青鳥在立法院外集結那一些民進黨的立委毀損公務叫說青鳥衝進立法院我當時問你的是請問你有沒有把他們移送"},{"start":27.242,"end":47.705,"text":"你回答我說因為立法院不是禁制區我當然知道立法院不是禁制區我問你的是有沒有把他們移送可是你回答我立法院是不是禁制區如果不是狀況外就是你在包庇誰我想請教署長12月20號衝突後你們有沒有把誰移送法辦除了宗家兵委員"},{"start":48.226,"end":75.124,"text":"好 10月20號那個這一場是由台北市政府警察局來做一個執行那因為這個每一場的這個群眾活動都會跟現場的這個這個市政來做處理那這裡面看起來就是他們處理這個中加兵委員的這個他們檢視的這一些的一個相關的一個市政是沒有在做其他繁重其他的這個人員所以只移送中加兵委員"},{"start":79.487,"end":100.701,"text":"請這部長看一下影片我們是講道理的人但是當有人不講道理的時候當有人不講道理的時候我們也不要沉默然後再來 請各位保持體力今天 今天的時間還很漫長我們甚至很不容易感受到"},{"start":103.363,"end":107.766,"text":"我們沒有要來這裡跟任何人起肢體衝突今天最高的和平原則最高的和平目標署長"},{"start":126.939,"end":135.836,"text":"剛剛影片中你看到破壞貨欄有好幾位喔那為什麼只移送宗嘉賓委員一人其他人呢那依照劉部長的標準的話應該是全部都要移送啊"},{"start":136.414,"end":144.779,"text":"沒有 這個部分我們會依照市政再來做滾動式的一個檢討從去年12月20到現在從去年12月20到現在 莊家兵委員都已經出庭過一次了你們到現在還要滾動式的檢討 了解現場的狀況這影片網路上到處都是好 您再看一下這個照片 就是"},{"start":161.03,"end":184.077,"text":"除了宗家立委員破壞柵欄之外還有不少的民進黨的立委也協助青鳥推倒護欄要衝進立法院那請問一下署長這樣有沒有違法那這個部分因為要衡量現場的這個狀況那我給你看一段影片你衡量一下民進黨立委到立院外不斷教授要青鳥進入院內場面一度混亂"},{"start":189.657,"end":208.073,"text":"跨上柵欄 一個右勾拳青鳥把員警架住突破第一道防線青鳥跟警方拉扯柵欄用跨的抽不了後方有人踩在椅上像直接一個馬步跨過去甚至另一頭有人試圖用繩子想突破"},{"start":209.38,"end":237.695,"text":"好我們現在看到這段影片很多的民進黨的委員都在叫說協助青鳥衝進立法院現場還有出現青鳥勒住遠景還有破壞柵欄衝撞遠景的狀況這樣有沒有違法那我想這個是構成要件跟程度的問題就是說這樣子還沒有構成要件整個的一個狀況是不是跟這個有沒有達到已經就是這個整個構成要件那我們想會跟事實的狀況來做一個認定"},{"start":238.575,"end":240.987,"text":"那請問一下當天警政署有沒有移送守謀"},{"start":243.058,"end":272.318,"text":"那天沒有沒有沒有為什麼如果依照部長的要求沒有那些召集的人的一個受政的這個狀況沒有單獨的一個首謀一個情形單獨的那一天的那一天的申請那一天申請是有有申請核准的一個主要的主辦人但是可以衝撞嗎可以破壞公務嗎可以叫說大家衝進立法院嗎那我想這個因為群眾活動的樣態非常多這是會衡量現場的這個狀況來做一個處置那所以署長你現在準備怎麼處理"},{"start":273.458,"end":301.738,"text":"已經從去年12月20到現在那我想就是還是我們還是尊重台北市政府檢察局的這個根據這個現場的狀況來做一個處置因為部長我想在受訪的時候有提到說在我們4月17號當天在場的全部應該都要移送甚至部長也受訪的時候也提到說他會請警方將首謀朱立倫主席跟教育界委員這個移送那請問一下"},{"start":302.95,"end":304.602,"text":"部長 您有沒有對媒體說這些話"},{"start":307.058,"end":334.664,"text":"謝謝委員的關心我想委員可能沒有了解我在對媒體受訪時候的全文的部分我在開始講的時候就有提到說我們按照集會遊行法裡面的相關規範那如果你有觸犯到集會遊行法的相關規範的話我們按照規範來處理那你有沒有說我會請警方移送首謀朱立倫主席跟謝榮介委員這個是在部長您知道嗎您已經是有史以來第一個內政部長指揮員警辦案的錯"},{"start":336.664,"end":339.906,"text":"您是第一個報告委員我剛有提到我們是根據集會遊行法那集會遊行法的主管機關是內政部但是檢察官沒有這個職權"},{"start":351.874,"end":359.48,"text":"妳內政部長不該下這種指導棋我沒有下指導棋我是根據 對不起我是根據原先他們所提供的事項來對媒體所回應的你怎麼可以說要要求警方這個將守謀這個是斷章取義"},{"start":367.546,"end":376.012,"text":"這沒有斷章區域 這是你自己受訪的那所以你就做出這個斷章區域嘛所以在這個部分我希望署長你要積極偵辦去年12月20號的這個青鳥衝撞立法院還有一些民進黨委員教唆他們衝進立法院不要只有辦藍不辦綠因為現在的標準大家看起來都是辦藍不辦綠請問署長可以嗎這個部分我們交給他被施政務局來處理好 謝謝"},{"start":398.686,"end":398.708,"text":"好"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":534,"blocks":[["許委員宇甄：（10時22分）謝謝主席，我們請劉部長、張署長。"],["主席：劉部長、張署長，有請。"],["劉部長世芳：許委員好。"],["張署長榮興：委員好。"],["許委員宇甄：部長還有署長好。部長，我星期一時詢問您，去年的12月20號青鳥在立法院外集結，一些民進黨的立委毀損公物、教唆青鳥衝進立法院，我當時問請問你有沒有把他們移送？你回答我說因為立法院不是禁制區，我當然知道立法院不是禁制區，我問你的是有沒有把他們移送？可是你回答我立法院是不是禁制區，如果不是狀況外，就是你在包庇誰。我想請教署長，12月20號衝突後，你們有沒有把誰移送法辦？除了鍾佳濱委員。"],["張署長榮興：12月20號在場是由臺北市政府警察局來執行，因為每一場的群眾活動，都會跟現場的事證來做處理，這裡面看起來他們處理鍾佳濱委員……"],["許委員宇甄：好，請問除了鍾佳濱委員，你們還移送了誰？"],["張署長榮興：他們檢視這一些相關的事證後，沒有再做其他、函送其他的人員，因為……"],["許委員宇甄：所以只移送鍾佳濱委員一個人嗎？"],["張署長榮興：鍾佳濱委員，對。"],["許委員宇甄：好，請部長跟署長看一下影片。","（播放影片）"],["許委員宇甄：你看影片有幾個人在剪護欄？看到的至少就有3個，鍾佳濱委員旁邊戴綠帽子的跟一個戴助理證的，都是在剪護欄啊！署長，剛才影片中你看到破壞護欄有好幾位，那為什麼只移送鍾佳濱委員一人？其他人呢？依照劉部長的標準，應該是全部都要移送啊？"],["張署長榮興：沒有，這個部分，我們會依照事證，再來做滾動式的檢討……"],["許委員宇甄：從去年12月到20到現在……"],["張署長榮興：我們會來聯繫臺北市政府警察局了解現場的狀況，再來做滾動式的……"],["許委員宇甄：從去年12月到20到現在，鍾佳濱委員都已經出庭過一次，你們到現在還要滾動式的檢討、了解現場的狀況，這影片網路上到處都是。好，你再看一下這個照片，除了鍾佳濱委員破壞柵欄之外，還有不少民進黨的立委也協助青鳥推倒護欄，要衝進立法院。請問一下署長，這樣有沒有違法？"],["張署長榮興：這個部分因為要衡量現場的狀況……"],["許委員宇甄：好，我給你看一段影片，您衡量一下。","（播放影片）"],["許委員宇甄：我們現在看到這個影片，很多民進黨的委員都在教唆、協助青鳥衝進立法院，現場還有出現青鳥勒住員警，以及破壞柵欄、衝撞員警的狀況。署長，這樣有沒有違法？"],["張署長榮興：我想這是構成要件跟程度的問題，就是整個……"],["許委員宇甄：這樣子還沒有構成要件？"],["張署長榮興：整個的狀況有沒有達到整個構成要件，我想我們也會跟事實的狀況來做一個認定。"],["許委員宇甄：請問一下，當天警政署有沒有移送首謀？"],["張署長榮興：那天沒有，沒有形成那些……"],["許委員宇甄：為什麼？"],["張署長榮興：沒有形成……"],["許委員宇甄：如果依照部長的要求。"],["張署長榮興：沒有那些召集的人的蒐證狀況，沒有單獨首謀的情形……"],["許委員宇甄：沒有單獨首謀的情形，你剛剛看那個狀況……"],["張署長榮興：那天的申請是有……"],["許委員宇甄：我知道合法。"],["張署長榮興：有申請核准的主要主辦人。"],["許委員宇甄：但是可以衝撞嗎？可以破壞公物嗎？可以教唆大家衝進立法院嗎？"],["張署長榮興：我想因為群眾活動的樣態非常多，就是會衡量現場的狀況來做處置。"],["許委員宇甄：所以署長現在準備怎麼處理？已經從去年12月20日到現在。"],["張署長榮興：我想我們還是尊重臺北市政府警察局根據現場的狀況來做一個處置。"],["許委員宇甄：因為部長在受訪的時候，有提到4月17日當天在場的全部應該都要移送，甚至部長也在受訪的時候，也提到他會請警方將首謀朱立倫主席跟謝龍介委員移送，請問一下部長，您有沒有對媒體說這些話？"],["劉部長世芳：謝謝委員的關心，我想委員可能沒有了解我在對媒體受訪時的全文，我在該時講的時候，就有提到我們按照集會遊行法裡面的相關規範，如果有觸犯到集會遊行法的相關規範，我們按照規範來執行。"],["許委員宇甄：你有沒有說你會請警方移送首謀朱立倫主席跟謝龍介委員？"],["劉部長世芳：這個是在……"],["許委員宇甄：劉部長，你知道嗎？你已經是有史以來第一個內政部長指揮員警辦案的。"],["劉部長世芳：錯！不對！"],["許委員宇甄：你是第一個，你就是指揮員警辦案。"],["劉部長世芳：報告委員，我剛剛有提到，我們是根據集會遊行法，集會遊行法的主管機關是內政部，但是檢警調他們在執行的過程當中，我們都……"],["許委員宇甄：但是您沒有這個職權可以指揮員警辦案，檢察官才有這個職權。"],["劉部長世芳：沒有，您講的……"],["許委員宇甄：你內政部長不該下這種指導棋，你知道嗎？"],["劉部長世芳：我沒有下指導棋。"],["許委員宇甄：你就是下指導棋。"],["劉部長世芳：對不起，我是根據原先他們所提供的事證來對媒體作回應的。"],["許委員宇甄：怎麼可以說當天的全部都要移送法辦，你怎麼可以說要要求警方將首謀朱立倫主席跟……"],["劉部長世芳：這個是斷章取義。"],["許委員宇甄：這沒有斷章取義，這是你自己受訪的，所以你是說所有的媒體都斷章取義嗎？"],["劉部長世芳：對，但是受訪的內容，我希望它可以把全文發出來，我願意把全文的內容提供給許委員參考。"],["許委員宇甄：在這個部分，我希望署長要積極偵辦去年12月20日青鳥衝撞立法院，還有一些民進黨委員教唆他們衝進立法院，不要只有辦藍不辦綠，因為現在的標準大家看起來都是辦藍不辦綠，請問署長可以嗎？"],["張署長榮興：這個部分，我們交給臺北市政府警察局來處理。"],["許委員宇甄：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝許宇甄委員。","下一位，我們請黃建賓委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":180,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-15-13","speakers":["牛煦庭","高金素梅","王鴻薇","羅廷瑋","麥玉珍","蘇巧慧","張智倫","王美惠","張宏陸","黃捷","許宇甄","黃建賓","李柏毅","徐欣瑩","吳琪銘","楊瓊瓔","張啓楷","邱志偉","丁學忠"],"page_start":81,"meetingDate":["2025-04-23"],"gazette_id":"1144101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144101_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期內政委員會第13次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、審查委員羅廷瑋等16人擬具「社會秩序維護法第六十四條條文修正草案」案；二、審查委員\n高金素梅等21人擬具「社會秩序維護法第六十四條條文修正草案」案；三、審查委員王鴻薇等24\n人擬具「社會秩序維護法第六十四條條文修正草案」案；四、審查委員林思銘等22人擬具「社會\n秩序維護法第六十四條條文修正草案」案；五、審查委員魯明哲等17人擬具「社會秩序維護法第\n八十九條條文修正草案」案；六、審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「社會秩序維護法第六十四條及第七\n十二條條文修正草案」案；七、審查委員邱若華等19人擬具「社會秩序維護法第六十四條條文修\n正草案」案；八、審查委員邱若華等19人擬具「社會秩序維護法第七十二條條文修正草案」案；\n九、審查委員顏寬恒等16人擬具「社會秩序維護法第九條條文修正草案」案；十、審查委員顏寬\n恒等16人擬具「社會秩序維護法第八十九條條文修正草案」案；十一、審查委員魯明哲等18人擬\n具「社會秩序維護法第八十九條條文修正草案」案","agenda_id":"1144101_00002"}}}