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00:00:35,883\n委員長部長因為您擔任非常久的教授所以我也想問一個很生活化的問題啊教授平常看過很多學生的報告如果今天我被指派一個題目是說我要寫我的家庭結果呢這份報告寫了我的外公外婆寫了爺爺奶奶連鄰居都寫了可是沒有寫到爸爸媽媽跟兄弟姊妹你覺得這個報告幾分\n\n3\n00:00:40,795 --> 00:01:03,157\n那要看他寫的可能他以他以外公為榮所以花費了30分鐘都在寫他外公外婆的所謂成績部長我今天要幫您講幾句話今天我們收到了負責去談判的經貿談判辦公室的報告我們來看一下幫我按下一張\n\n4\n00:01:04,755 --> 00:01:24,055\n他就只有封面提到美豬美牛今天給的議程題目叫做美豬美牛進口如何保障國人食品安全及農民權益書面報告上有這兩個字再來就是主席各位委員承蒙本辦公室對美豬美牛提出報告再來全部都沒有了\n\n5\n00:01:27,608 --> 00:01:52,703\n全部都沒有了我可以幫你改題目教授教授如果我可以我是您的助教的話啦我會幫這份報告改一個題目叫做川普的貿易哲學與全球關稅分佈圖因為他裡面全部都在講全球關稅分佈圖最後一句話只有以上敬請主席以及各位委員指教謝謝\n\n6\n00:01:55,526 --> 00:02:14,493\n部長我今天對你非常好因為我想幫你講話來監督食安的人是你負責把關全民健康的是你可是談判的是他們您不會覺得自己很委屈嗎我想政府是一體的守護國家也是前提\n\n7\n00:02:15,694 --> 00:02:33,465\n那個政府跟人民共同的權益我們就是這個台灣我們台灣人民要活得快樂時的安心好那我希望其實今天我們也是藉由這個機會這個場合可以做溝通因為您是衛生主管機關的最高指導人嘛\n\n8\n00:02:34,085 --> 00:02:50,916\n那今天您對於未來談判的結果可能影響到國人有哪些問題這個是您需要先跟談判辦公室溝通好談判辦公室在代表您去跟美方做溝通所以我們等一下會就可能美方在意的幾個點我們也一起來討論我們也可以藉這個機會可以讓未來代表我們出去溝通的長官們可以把我們台灣人的聲音也納進去謝謝\n\n9\n00:02:59,178 --> 00:03:13,757\n好這邊可能要問一下因為這個新聞在非常多台灣的媒體也都有曝光嘛大家知道說自從2024年年初一直到2024年年底美國的牛群就有\n\n10\n00:03:14,518 --> 00:03:38,113\n規模的這個H5N1禽流感病毒的感染那一直到2024年年底已經有15個州689個牧場其中加州又最為嚴重因此他們也撲殺了很多可憐的牛隻後來又發現說這個牛還會傳染給工人所以又發現了36名跟牛隻接觸的工人感染了H5N1病毒\n\n11\n00:03:39,181 --> 00:03:59,262\n那這個引起國際的關注所以我想問呢您對於美牛的茶廠以及美豬的茶廠現在的態度是如何還有您最近查了幾次以及未來經過這樣子的談判您有可能會修改您的頻率嗎您會根據什麼方式來修改\n\n12\n00:03:59,942 --> 00:04:15,736\n報告委員,我想我們一定遵守法規,遵守法規的一個規定去執行那我想委員一定很願意聽我們國際死案專家我們江署長來跟你做一個說明\n\n13\n00:04:17,368 --> 00:04:35,914\n江署長最近好像有過去查場嗎這個我大概知道我跟委員做進一步的報告因為我們看到委員非常專業的提到乳牛等等的有相關Birdflu就是所謂的禽流感的疫情那其實我們因為\n\n14\n00:04:37,254 --> 00:04:47,231\n擔任我們邊境所有進口來台灣的食品安全任何的農產品或者畜產品進來我們把關的機制所以我們要去更加買\n\n15\n00:04:48,905 --> 00:05:17,594\n至少他的廠在國內特別是美國的國內有一項叫做QualitySystem就是品質系統的Assessment叫QSA之後已經認證之後進一步做所謂Export出口的Verification認證之後他們國內會先做完是確定是安全的然後讓我們選擇任何進來台灣的都有機會去看我們要去\n\n16\n00:05:18,394 --> 00:05:34,681\n看到的廠廠廠款那就是系統性的廠廠好我懂那等一下其實美國也有一些聲音我們可以一起討論再來部長這個是您擔任立委的時候我昨天也有把您擔任立委時對於這些台美21世紀貿易倡議的\n\n17\n00:05:37,262 --> 00:06:02,524\n這些質詢的發言等等都有看完我也很敬佩你因為部長有堅持住您剛剛的發言跟您以前的發言都非常的類似您還是為全國人民把關那最近就您的掌握呢美國還有沒有再類似講這些我們會再去管制進口它的原產地標籤啊檢驗等等的障礙與關切呢因為這是農民也蠻在意的\n\n18\n00:06:07,133 --> 00:06:22,923\n好,我想我們站在衛福部的立場,不管怎麼樣就是把相關有關的一些食品按照法規來執行以外就是不斷的進行科學的分析,提供給我們整體的政府\n\n19\n00:06:24,135 --> 00:06:41,769\n來做但是原則上所有的一切都是一體適用所以我們會用這樣子這樣的原則跟各個國家去談論相關的一些事情那在這邊有提到賴總統有對彭博社做了一個投書所以他說他會擴大對美國能源農業\n\n20\n00:06:45,291 --> 00:06:49,034\n工業還有軍售方面的採購來增加雙方的投資量能在他投書之前因為農業有被拉進去嘛農業上其實我們已經對美國是逆差了那可能還會再增加或者是降低這些貿易壁壘等等這個在他投書之前您有知道嗎\n\n21\n00:07:07,455 --> 00:07:23,409\n我想總統提的這些都是得到國際間以及我們國內的最大的肯定我想這個方向是我們應該要去做的所以我們就要因應嘛因為可能進口的農產品會變多再來呢這個談判內容在場\n\n22\n00:07:26,832 --> 00:07:52,291\n其實這個報告有寫到真的有寫到真心提到美豬美牛大概只有衛福部跟農業部這個本席予以肯定但農業部的結語是說4月11號的首次視訊會議交換意見過程很順利但這邊我們當然也會想知道說過程順利OK有沒有初步談到可能的方向就是跟彭博的投書是不是一致\n\n23\n00:07:54,483 --> 00:08:18,770\n是不是農業部是報告委員謝謝委員關心並支持台灣農業那開啟談判只是第一步那實質內容其實雙方都還在溝通當中是所以還沒有辦法跟我們講到方向已經開啟了談判是謝謝委員支持那這邊也要請教邱部長這個文件不知道你有沒有看到過因為在關稅之後呢\n\n24\n00:08:19,949 --> 00:08:33,720\n川普宣布對世界全球的關稅之後很快他就發布了ForeignTradeBarriers對每一國的貿易壁壘他一國一國的列出來那這也是公開文件所以我們也一點一點來看跟我們衛福部比較相關的\n\n25\n00:08:36,502 --> 00:09:00,230\n他提到說台灣在沒有正當理由下對台灣處理美國豬隻的業者包括進口商批發商餐飲業者進行稽查頻繁回訪這些業者干擾正常營運是不是在亂干擾我想要問衛福部的立場是不是是的謝委員我們的立場非常簡單我們都是科學分析然後一體試用\n\n26\n00:09:01,970 --> 00:09:11,053\n所以我們必須會向各國講說我們是為了守護國人的健康我們是一體適用並沒有針對哪個國家有任何的所以聽起來我們並不是在亂干擾也很希望我們的官員在談判的時候可以表達我們衛福部的立場那第二個這個陳昭志委員問過了台灣對於訂定最大殘留容許量這個做法錯誤的暗示美國豬肉產品存在食品安全的疑慮\n\n27\n00:09:31,527 --> 00:09:32,488\n您覺得呢我想我們要這個部分從我們專業以及說在維護食安的當中我們這個是應該是說剛剛已經跟委員報告過這是我們國人飲食的習慣\n\n28\n00:09:50,281 --> 00:10:16,276\n陳昭智委員也有說可能沒有辦法就習慣來說服美方我們還是必須要就我們台灣的法規就剛剛史耀署署長講得很清楚我們為什麼這樣子做那為什麼我們的標準定的比別人高這個是必須我們要透明的跟對方解釋的下一個這也列在他對台灣有所意見可是其實很多美國的媽媽也有意見\n\n29\n00:10:17,657 --> 00:10:45,034\n台灣禁止學校公餐使用含有生物科技成分意思就是基改啦加工食品美國持續對這項禁令的科學依據表示疑慮並且不斷的敦促台灣來撤銷該措施這個是所有父母都最關心的問題因為現在大家都必須要吃營養午餐嘛我也想請問小鼠署長的意見我們有可能去撤銷這樣子的禁令嗎\n\n30\n00:10:47,758 --> 00:11:01,392\n就我的了解剛才提到的是校園裡面特定的食品的部分因為這個特定的食品部分當初的立法的背景裡面應該是全國國民很關心食安這個議題\n\n31\n00:11:02,433 --> 00:11:27,157\n那也關心特定的議題之下呢進行的風險溝通最後形成評估出來的結果評估出來的結果呢就變成了一個規定跟法律上面的協助他做法官所以在這個規定底下我們就有機會可以協助做整個市場的稽查才能確立他的風險所以這些是我們持續在因應跟\n\n32\n00:11:27,797 --> 00:11:51,748\n持續精進的一個部分那目前我們持續在往這方面來持續的來對相關的食安的議題能夠把關我覺得署長講得非常清楚這個是在您跟校園跟家長以及台灣的食品提供者作為溝通所訂定出來的這個也希望在談判的過程可以表達清楚因為從第一頁我就說出去的是別人\n\n33\n00:11:52,368 --> 00:12:18,388\n可是近來被罵的是你們這不公平所以現在我們剛好藉由這個場合表達清楚你們為什麼這樣做你們的立場是什麼台灣人民的想法是什麼家長的想法是什麼那在談判的時候希望可以也顧及台灣人民的這麼一塊那最後就是台灣曾經以狂牛病為疑慮所以禁止某些美國牛肉的產品如絞肉等等的所以之後\n\n34\n00:12:19,970 --> 00:12:23,033\n這個方向是不是有可能會談到美國的牛絞肉?因為剛剛前面一個問題,我還是跟委員回復一下我想我們衛福部就站在我們的一個食品\n\n35\n00:12:39,266 --> 00:13:08,695\n的一個維護安全的一些專業的建議我們是跟談判的這種團這是政府是一個一體的所以是充分的一個溝通所以沒有說誰來談誰來承擔的事情我們共同一起來承擔然後共同維護食安跟我們國家最大的一個利益所以我想那個我們都會根據國際的標準來繼續往最後方面來努力\n\n36\n00:13:09,275 --> 00:13:32,128\n主席兩分鐘對我們今天其實只是希望你們談判的方向大家可以明確知道而且未來可以做社會溝通因為之前兩位還沒上任的時候曾經發生食藥署就默默地更改了日本進口草莓的農藥殘餘量把它提高了那預告的時候也是一聲不響\n\n37\n00:13:32,828 --> 00:13:55,564\n後來真的開始實施開始進口的時候接到了非常大量的陳情那當然你們現在可能說你們細節不能透露但是我們希望方向我們是知道的那之後你們用科學的證據來說服我們好不好那最後在這邊提醒大家一下這句話我先念過去不過呢剛剛聽了半天好像都問不到什麼\n\n38\n00:13:56,525 --> 00:14:20,802\n明確的這個談判內容等等等一下我們蘇昭瑋可以接著問有一個人曾經說過啊正常的貿易協定跟任何一個政治實體且貿易協定正常需要需要昭告社會大眾召開空丁會各行各業的工會加入討論讓行政機關充分獲得資訊了解各行各業的利弊得失我們才能知道談判的重點與籌碼\n\n39\n00:14:22,483 --> 00:14:23,464\n這句話聽起來很有道理吧很有道理嗎\n\n40\n00:14:46,787 --> 00:15:07,513\n包委員我想我們政府在做任何事情一定是廣徵大家的意見不管是產業特別是立法院的一個意見我相信政府這是我們立法院黨團的愛台第一品牌沈伯陽大立委曾經做過的發言所以我們希望我們可以堅守同樣的標準\n\n41\n00:15:09,213 --> 00:15:34,622\n沈伯陽大立委在監督其他政黨的時候講過這些話我們希望這些事也可以同樣再落實下去因為像現在日本的國會他們在跟立法他們的國會議員討論的時候也許不能給細節但是他們給予大概的方向並且逐步的讓人民去了解為何我們可能需要修改標準等等的這些我希望未來大家可以共同做到各部會可以一起合作好嗎\n\n42\n00:15:35,202 --> 00:15:36,126\n好謝謝主席謝謝我們一起合作謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1985\t5736\t謝謝主席 謝謝委員 謝謝各位官員那我想請邱部長\n11792\t35883\t委員長部長因為您擔任非常久的教授所以我也想問一個很生活化的問題啊教授平常看過很多學生的報告如果今天我被指派一個題目是說我要寫我的家庭結果呢這份報告寫了我的外公外婆寫了爺爺奶奶連鄰居都寫了可是沒有寫到爸爸媽媽跟兄弟姊妹你覺得這個報告幾分\n40795\t63157\t那要看他寫的可能他以他以外公為榮所以花費了30分鐘都在寫他外公外婆的所謂成績部長我今天要幫您講幾句話今天我們收到了負責去談判的經貿談判辦公室的報告我們來看一下 幫我按下一張\n64755\t84055\t他就只有封面提到美豬美牛今天給的議程題目叫做美豬美牛進口如何保障國人食品安全及農民權益書面報告上有這兩個字再來就是主席各位委員承蒙本辦公室對美豬美牛提出報告再來全部都沒有了\n87608\t112703\t全部都沒有了我可以幫你改題目教授教授如果我可以我是您的助教的話啦我會幫這份報告改一個題目叫做川普的貿易哲學與全球關稅分佈圖因為他裡面全部都在講全球關稅分佈圖最後一句話只有以上敬請主席以及各位委員指教謝謝\n115526\t134493\t部長我今天對你非常好因為我想幫你講話來監督食安的人是你負責把關全民健康的是你可是談判的是他們您不會覺得自己很委屈嗎我想政府是一體的守護國家也是前提\n135694\t153465\t那個政府跟人民共同的權益我們就是這個台灣我們台灣人民要活得快樂 時的安心好 那我希望其實今天我們也是藉由這個機會這個場合可以做溝通因為您是衛生主管機關的最高指導人嘛\n154085\t170916\t那今天您對於未來談判的結果可能影響到國人有哪些問題這個是您需要先跟談判辦公室溝通好談判辦公室在代表您去跟美方做溝通所以我們等一下會就可能美方在意的幾個點我們也一起來討論我們也可以藉這個機會可以讓未來代表我們出去溝通的長官們可以把我們台灣人的聲音也納進去謝謝\n179178\t193757\t好 這邊可能要問一下因為這個新聞在非常多台灣的媒體也都有曝光嘛大家知道說自從2024年年初一直到2024年年底美國的牛群就有\n194518\t218113\t規模的這個H5N1禽流感病毒的感染那一直到2024年年底已經有15個州689個牧場其中加州又最為嚴重因此他們也撲殺了很多可憐的牛隻後來又發現說這個牛還會傳染給工人所以又發現了36名跟牛隻接觸的工人感染了H5N1病毒\n219181\t239262\t那這個引起國際的關注所以我想問呢您對於美牛的茶廠以及美豬的茶廠現在的態度是如何還有您最近查了幾次以及未來經過這樣子的談判您有可能會修改您的頻率嗎您會根據什麼方式來修改\n239942\t255736\t報告委員,我想我們一定遵守法規,遵守法規的一個規定去執行那我想委員一定很願意聽我們國際死案專家我們江署長來跟你做一個說明\n257368\t275914\t江署長最近好像有過去查場嗎這個我大概知道我跟委員做進一步的報告因為我們看到委員非常專業的提到乳牛等等的有相關Bird flu就是所謂的禽流感的疫情那其實我們因為\n277254\t287231\t擔任我們邊境所有進口來台灣的食品安全任何的農產品或者畜產品進來我們把關的機制所以我們要去更加買\n288905\t317594\t至少他的廠在國內特別是美國的國內有一項叫做Quality System就是品質系統的Assessment叫QSA之後已經認證之後進一步做所謂Export出口的Verification認證之後他們國內會先做完是確定是安全的然後讓我們選擇任何進來台灣的都有機會去看我們要去\n318394\t334681\t看到的廠廠 廠款 那就是系統性的廠廠好 我懂 那等一下其實美國也有一些聲音我們可以一起討論再來 部長這個是您擔任立委的時候我昨天也有把您擔任立委時對於這些台美21世紀貿易倡議的\n337262\t362524\t這些質詢的發言等等都有看完我也很敬佩你因為部長有堅持住您剛剛的發言跟您以前的發言都非常的類似您還是為全國人民把關那最近就您的掌握呢美國還有沒有再類似講這些我們會再去管制進口它的原產地標籤啊檢驗等等的障礙與關切呢因為這是農民也蠻在意的\n367133\t382923\t好,我想我們站在衛福部的立場,不管怎麼樣就是把相關有關的一些食品按照法規來執行以外就是不斷的進行科學的分析,提供給我們整體的政府\n384135\t401769\t來做 但是原則上所有的一切都是一體適用所以我們會用這樣子這樣的原則跟各個國家去談論相關的一些事情 那在這邊有提到賴總統有對彭博社做了一個投書 所以他說他會擴大對美國能源 農業\n405291\t409034\t工業還有軍售方面的採購來增加雙方的投資量能在他投書之前因為農業有被拉進去嘛農業上其實我們已經對美國是逆差了那可能還會再增加或者是降低這些貿易壁壘等等這個在他投書之前您有知道嗎\n427455\t443409\t我想總統提的這些都是得到國際間以及我們國內的最大的肯定我想這個方向是我們應該要去做的所以我們就要因應嘛因為可能進口的農產品會變多再來呢這個談判內容在場\n446832\t472291\t其實這個報告有寫到真的有寫到真心提到美豬美牛大概只有衛福部跟農業部這個本席予以肯定但農業部的結語是說4月11號的首次視訊會議交換意見過程很順利但這邊我們當然也會想知道說過程順利OK有沒有初步談到可能的方向就是跟彭博的投書是不是一致\n474483\t498770\t是不是農業部是報告委員謝謝委員關心並支持台灣農業那開啟談判只是第一步那實質內容其實雙方都還在溝通當中是所以還沒有辦法跟我們講到方向已經開啟了談判是謝謝委員支持那這邊也要請教邱部長這個文件不知道你有沒有看到過因為在關稅之後呢\n499949\t513720\t川普宣布對世界全球的關稅之後很快他就發布了Foreign Trade Barriers對每一國的貿易壁壘他一國一國的列出來那這也是公開文件所以我們也一點一點來看跟我們衛福部比較相關的\n516502\t540230\t他提到說 台灣在沒有正當理由下對台灣處理美國豬隻的業者包括進口商 批發商 餐飲業者進行稽查頻繁回訪這些業者 干擾正常營運是不是在亂干擾 我想要問衛福部的立場 是不是是的 謝委員我們的立場非常簡單我們都是科學分析 然後一體試用\n541970\t551053\t所以我們必須會向各國講說我們是為了守護國人的健康我們是一體適用並沒有針對哪個國家有任何的所以聽起來我們並不是在亂干擾也很希望我們的官員在談判的時候可以表達我們衛福部的立場那第二個這個陳昭志委員問過了台灣對於訂定最大殘留容許量這個做法錯誤的暗示美國豬肉產品存在食品安全的疑慮\n571527\t572488\t您覺得呢我想我們要這個部分從我們專業以及說在維護食安的當中我們這個是應該是說剛剛已經跟委員報告過這是我們國人飲食的習慣\n590281\t616276\t陳昭智委員也有說可能沒有辦法就習慣來說服美方我們還是必須要就我們台灣的法規就剛剛史耀署署長講得很清楚我們為什麼這樣子做那為什麼我們的標準定的比別人高這個是必須我們要透明的跟對方解釋的下一個這也列在他對台灣有所意見可是其實很多美國的媽媽也有意見\n617657\t645034\t台灣禁止學校公餐使用含有生物科技成分意思就是基改啦加工食品美國持續對這項禁令的科學依據表示疑慮並且不斷的敦促台灣來撤銷該措施這個是所有父母都最關心的問題因為現在大家都必須要吃營養午餐嘛我也想請問小鼠署長的意見我們有可能去撤銷這樣子的禁令嗎\n647758\t661392\t就我的了解剛才提到的是校園裡面特定的食品的部分因為這個特定的食品部分當初的立法的背景裡面應該是全國國民很關心食安這個議題\n662433\t687157\t那也關心特定的議題之下呢進行的風險溝通最後形成評估出來的結果評估出來的結果呢就變成了一個規定跟法律上面的協助他做法官所以在這個規定底下我們就有機會可以協助做整個市場的稽查才能確立他的風險所以這些是我們持續在因應跟\n687797\t711748\t持續精進的一個部分那目前我們持續在往這方面來持續的來對相關的食安的議題能夠把關我覺得署長講得非常清楚這個是在您跟校園跟家長以及台灣的食品提供者作為溝通所訂定出來的這個也希望在談判的過程可以表達清楚因為從第一頁我就說出去的是別人\n712368\t738388\t可是近來被罵的是你們 這不公平所以現在我們剛好藉由這個場合表達清楚你們為什麼這樣做你們的立場是什麼台灣人民的想法是什麼家長的想法是什麼那在談判的時候希望可以也顧及台灣人民的這麼一塊那最後就是台灣曾經以狂牛病為疑慮所以禁止某些美國牛肉的產品如絞肉等等的所以之後\n739970\t743033\t這個方向是不是有可能會談到美國的牛絞肉?因為剛剛前面一個問題,我還是跟委員回復一下我想我們衛福部就站在我們的一個食品\n759266\t788695\t的一個維護安全的一些專業的建議我們是跟談判的這種團這是政府是一個一體的所以是充分的一個溝通所以沒有說誰來談誰來承擔的事情我們共同一起來承擔然後共同維護食安跟我們國家最大的一個利益所以我想那個我們都會根據國際的標準來繼續往最後方面來努力\n789275\t812128\t主席兩分鐘 對我們今天其實只是希望你們談判的方向大家可以明確知道而且未來可以做社會溝通因為之前兩位還沒上任的時候曾經發生食藥署就默默地更改了日本進口草莓的農藥殘餘量把它提高了那預告的時候也是一聲不響\n812828\t835564\t後來真的開始實施開始進口的時候接到了非常大量的陳情那當然你們現在可能說你們細節不能透露但是我們希望方向我們是知道的那之後你們用科學的證據來說服我們好不好那最後在這邊提醒大家一下這句話我先念過去不過呢剛剛聽了半天好像都問不到什麼\n836525\t860802\t明確的這個談判內容等等等一下我們蘇昭瑋可以接著問有一個人曾經說過啊正常的貿易協定跟任何一個政治實體且貿易協定正常需要 需要昭告社會大眾 召開空丁會各行各業的工會加入討論讓行政機關充分獲得資訊了解各行各業的利弊得失我們才能知道談判的重點與籌碼\n862483\t863464\t這句話聽起來很有道理吧很有道理嗎\n886787\t907513\t包委員我想我們政府在做任何事情一定是廣徵大家的意見不管是產業特別是立法院的一個意見我相信政府這是我們立法院黨團的愛台第一品牌沈伯陽大立委曾經做過的發言所以我們希望我們可以堅守同樣的標準\n909213\t934622\t沈伯陽大立委在監督其他政黨的時候講過這些話我們希望這些事也可以同樣再落實下去因為像現在日本的國會他們在跟立法他們的國會議員討論的時候也許不能給細節但是他們給予大概的方向並且逐步的讓人民去了解為何我們可能需要修改標準等等的這些我希望未來大家可以共同做到各部會可以一起合作好嗎\n935202\t936126\t好 謝謝主席 謝謝我們一起合作 謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席 謝謝委員 謝謝各位官員那我想請邱部長\n委員長部長因為您擔任非常久的教授所以我也想問一個很生活化的問題啊教授平常看過很多學生的報告如果今天我被指派一個題目是說我要寫我的家庭結果呢這份報告寫了我的外公外婆寫了爺爺奶奶連鄰居都寫了可是沒有寫到爸爸媽媽跟兄弟姊妹你覺得這個報告幾分\n那要看他寫的可能他以他以外公為榮所以花費了30分鐘都在寫他外公外婆的所謂成績部長我今天要幫您講幾句話今天我們收到了負責去談判的經貿談判辦公室的報告我們來看一下 幫我按下一張\n他就只有封面提到美豬美牛今天給的議程題目叫做美豬美牛進口如何保障國人食品安全及農民權益書面報告上有這兩個字再來就是主席各位委員承蒙本辦公室對美豬美牛提出報告再來全部都沒有了\n全部都沒有了我可以幫你改題目教授教授如果我可以我是您的助教的話啦我會幫這份報告改一個題目叫做川普的貿易哲學與全球關稅分佈圖因為他裡面全部都在講全球關稅分佈圖最後一句話只有以上敬請主席以及各位委員指教謝謝\n部長我今天對你非常好因為我想幫你講話來監督食安的人是你負責把關全民健康的是你可是談判的是他們您不會覺得自己很委屈嗎我想政府是一體的守護國家也是前提\n那個政府跟人民共同的權益我們就是這個台灣我們台灣人民要活得快樂 時的安心好 那我希望其實今天我們也是藉由這個機會這個場合可以做溝通因為您是衛生主管機關的最高指導人嘛\n那今天您對於未來談判的結果可能影響到國人有哪些問題這個是您需要先跟談判辦公室溝通好談判辦公室在代表您去跟美方做溝通所以我們等一下會就可能美方在意的幾個點我們也一起來討論我們也可以藉這個機會可以讓未來代表我們出去溝通的長官們可以把我們台灣人的聲音也納進去謝謝\n好 這邊可能要問一下因為這個新聞在非常多台灣的媒體也都有曝光嘛大家知道說自從2024年年初一直到2024年年底美國的牛群就有\n規模的這個H5N1禽流感病毒的感染那一直到2024年年底已經有15個州689個牧場其中加州又最為嚴重因此他們也撲殺了很多可憐的牛隻後來又發現說這個牛還會傳染給工人所以又發現了36名跟牛隻接觸的工人感染了H5N1病毒\n那這個引起國際的關注所以我想問呢您對於美牛的茶廠以及美豬的茶廠現在的態度是如何還有您最近查了幾次以及未來經過這樣子的談判您有可能會修改您的頻率嗎您會根據什麼方式來修改\n報告委員,我想我們一定遵守法規,遵守法規的一個規定去執行那我想委員一定很願意聽我們國際死案專家我們江署長來跟你做一個說明\n江署長最近好像有過去查場嗎這個我大概知道我跟委員做進一步的報告因為我們看到委員非常專業的提到乳牛等等的有相關Bird flu就是所謂的禽流感的疫情那其實我們因為\n擔任我們邊境所有進口來台灣的食品安全任何的農產品或者畜產品進來我們把關的機制所以我們要去更加買\n至少他的廠在國內特別是美國的國內有一項叫做Quality System就是品質系統的Assessment叫QSA之後已經認證之後進一步做所謂Export出口的Verification認證之後他們國內會先做完是確定是安全的然後讓我們選擇任何進來台灣的都有機會去看我們要去\n看到的廠廠 廠款 那就是系統性的廠廠好 我懂 那等一下其實美國也有一些聲音我們可以一起討論再來 部長這個是您擔任立委的時候我昨天也有把您擔任立委時對於這些台美21世紀貿易倡議的\n這些質詢的發言等等都有看完我也很敬佩你因為部長有堅持住您剛剛的發言跟您以前的發言都非常的類似您還是為全國人民把關那最近就您的掌握呢美國還有沒有再類似講這些我們會再去管制進口它的原產地標籤啊檢驗等等的障礙與關切呢因為這是農民也蠻在意的\n好,我想我們站在衛福部的立場,不管怎麼樣就是把相關有關的一些食品按照法規來執行以外就是不斷的進行科學的分析,提供給我們整體的政府\n來做 但是原則上所有的一切都是一體適用所以我們會用這樣子這樣的原則跟各個國家去談論相關的一些事情 那在這邊有提到賴總統有對彭博社做了一個投書 所以他說他會擴大對美國能源 農業\n工業還有軍售方面的採購來增加雙方的投資量能在他投書之前因為農業有被拉進去嘛農業上其實我們已經對美國是逆差了那可能還會再增加或者是降低這些貿易壁壘等等這個在他投書之前您有知道嗎\n我想總統提的這些都是得到國際間以及我們國內的最大的肯定我想這個方向是我們應該要去做的所以我們就要因應嘛因為可能進口的農產品會變多再來呢這個談判內容在場\n其實這個報告有寫到真的有寫到真心提到美豬美牛大概只有衛福部跟農業部這個本席予以肯定但農業部的結語是說4月11號的首次視訊會議交換意見過程很順利但這邊我們當然也會想知道說過程順利OK有沒有初步談到可能的方向就是跟彭博的投書是不是一致\n是不是農業部是報告委員謝謝委員關心並支持台灣農業那開啟談判只是第一步那實質內容其實雙方都還在溝通當中是所以還沒有辦法跟我們講到方向已經開啟了談判是謝謝委員支持那這邊也要請教邱部長這個文件不知道你有沒有看到過因為在關稅之後呢\n川普宣布對世界全球的關稅之後很快他就發布了Foreign Trade Barriers對每一國的貿易壁壘他一國一國的列出來那這也是公開文件所以我們也一點一點來看跟我們衛福部比較相關的\n他提到說 台灣在沒有正當理由下對台灣處理美國豬隻的業者包括進口商 批發商 餐飲業者進行稽查頻繁回訪這些業者 干擾正常營運是不是在亂干擾 我想要問衛福部的立場 是不是是的 謝委員我們的立場非常簡單我們都是科學分析 然後一體試用\n所以我們必須會向各國講說我們是為了守護國人的健康我們是一體適用並沒有針對哪個國家有任何的所以聽起來我們並不是在亂干擾也很希望我們的官員在談判的時候可以表達我們衛福部的立場那第二個這個陳昭志委員問過了台灣對於訂定最大殘留容許量這個做法錯誤的暗示美國豬肉產品存在食品安全的疑慮\n您覺得呢我想我們要這個部分從我們專業以及說在維護食安的當中我們這個是應該是說剛剛已經跟委員報告過這是我們國人飲食的習慣\n陳昭智委員也有說可能沒有辦法就習慣來說服美方我們還是必須要就我們台灣的法規就剛剛史耀署署長講得很清楚我們為什麼這樣子做那為什麼我們的標準定的比別人高這個是必須我們要透明的跟對方解釋的下一個這也列在他對台灣有所意見可是其實很多美國的媽媽也有意見\n台灣禁止學校公餐使用含有生物科技成分意思就是基改啦加工食品美國持續對這項禁令的科學依據表示疑慮並且不斷的敦促台灣來撤銷該措施這個是所有父母都最關心的問題因為現在大家都必須要吃營養午餐嘛我也想請問小鼠署長的意見我們有可能去撤銷這樣子的禁令嗎\n就我的了解剛才提到的是校園裡面特定的食品的部分因為這個特定的食品部分當初的立法的背景裡面應該是全國國民很關心食安這個議題\n那也關心特定的議題之下呢進行的風險溝通最後形成評估出來的結果評估出來的結果呢就變成了一個規定跟法律上面的協助他做法官所以在這個規定底下我們就有機會可以協助做整個市場的稽查才能確立他的風險所以這些是我們持續在因應跟\n持續精進的一個部分那目前我們持續在往這方面來持續的來對相關的食安的議題能夠把關我覺得署長講得非常清楚這個是在您跟校園跟家長以及台灣的食品提供者作為溝通所訂定出來的這個也希望在談判的過程可以表達清楚因為從第一頁我就說出去的是別人\n可是近來被罵的是你們 這不公平所以現在我們剛好藉由這個場合表達清楚你們為什麼這樣做你們的立場是什麼台灣人民的想法是什麼家長的想法是什麼那在談判的時候希望可以也顧及台灣人民的這麼一塊那最後就是台灣曾經以狂牛病為疑慮所以禁止某些美國牛肉的產品如絞肉等等的所以之後\n這個方向是不是有可能會談到美國的牛絞肉?因為剛剛前面一個問題,我還是跟委員回復一下我想我們衛福部就站在我們的一個食品\n的一個維護安全的一些專業的建議我們是跟談判的這種團這是政府是一個一體的所以是充分的一個溝通所以沒有說誰來談誰來承擔的事情我們共同一起來承擔然後共同維護食安跟我們國家最大的一個利益所以我想那個我們都會根據國際的標準來繼續往最後方面來努力\n主席兩分鐘 對我們今天其實只是希望你們談判的方向大家可以明確知道而且未來可以做社會溝通因為之前兩位還沒上任的時候曾經發生食藥署就默默地更改了日本進口草莓的農藥殘餘量把它提高了那預告的時候也是一聲不響\n後來真的開始實施開始進口的時候接到了非常大量的陳情那當然你們現在可能說你們細節不能透露但是我們希望方向我們是知道的那之後你們用科學的證據來說服我們好不好那最後在這邊提醒大家一下這句話我先念過去不過呢剛剛聽了半天好像都問不到什麼\n明確的這個談判內容等等等一下我們蘇昭瑋可以接著問有一個人曾經說過啊正常的貿易協定跟任何一個政治實體且貿易協定正常需要 需要昭告社會大眾 召開空丁會各行各業的工會加入討論讓行政機關充分獲得資訊了解各行各業的利弊得失我們才能知道談判的重點與籌碼\n這句話聽起來很有道理吧很有道理嗎\n包委員我想我們政府在做任何事情一定是廣徵大家的意見不管是產業特別是立法院的一個意見我相信政府這是我們立法院黨團的愛台第一品牌沈伯陽大立委曾經做過的發言所以我們希望我們可以堅守同樣的標準\n沈伯陽大立委在監督其他政黨的時候講過這些話我們希望這些事也可以同樣再落實下去因為像現在日本的國會他們在跟立法他們的國會議員討論的時候也許不能給細節但是他們給予大概的方向並且逐步的讓人民去了解為何我們可能需要修改標準等等的這些我希望未來大家可以共同做到各部會可以一起合作好嗎\n好 謝謝主席 謝謝我們一起合作 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.985 --> 00:05.736\n謝謝主席謝謝委員謝謝各位官員那我想請邱部長\n\n00:11.792 --> 00:35.883\n委員長部長因為您擔任非常久的教授所以我也想問一個很生活化的問題啊教授平常看過很多學生的報告如果今天我被指派一個題目是說我要寫我的家庭結果呢這份報告寫了我的外公外婆寫了爺爺奶奶連鄰居都寫了可是沒有寫到爸爸媽媽跟兄弟姊妹你覺得這個報告幾分\n\n00:40.795 --> 01:03.157\n那要看他寫的可能他以他以外公為榮所以花費了30分鐘都在寫他外公外婆的所謂成績部長我今天要幫您講幾句話今天我們收到了負責去談判的經貿談判辦公室的報告我們來看一下幫我按下一張\n\n01:04.755 --> 01:24.055\n他就只有封面提到美豬美牛今天給的議程題目叫做美豬美牛進口如何保障國人食品安全及農民權益書面報告上有這兩個字再來就是主席各位委員承蒙本辦公室對美豬美牛提出報告再來全部都沒有了\n\n01:27.608 --> 01:52.703\n全部都沒有了我可以幫你改題目教授教授如果我可以我是您的助教的話啦我會幫這份報告改一個題目叫做川普的貿易哲學與全球關稅分佈圖因為他裡面全部都在講全球關稅分佈圖最後一句話只有以上敬請主席以及各位委員指教謝謝\n\n01:55.526 --> 02:14.493\n部長我今天對你非常好因為我想幫你講話來監督食安的人是你負責把關全民健康的是你可是談判的是他們您不會覺得自己很委屈嗎我想政府是一體的守護國家也是前提\n\n02:15.694 --> 02:33.465\n那個政府跟人民共同的權益我們就是這個台灣我們台灣人民要活得快樂時的安心好那我希望其實今天我們也是藉由這個機會這個場合可以做溝通因為您是衛生主管機關的最高指導人嘛\n\n02:34.085 --> 02:50.916\n那今天您對於未來談判的結果可能影響到國人有哪些問題這個是您需要先跟談判辦公室溝通好談判辦公室在代表您去跟美方做溝通所以我們等一下會就可能美方在意的幾個點我們也一起來討論我們也可以藉這個機會可以讓未來代表我們出去溝通的長官們可以把我們台灣人的聲音也納進去謝謝\n\n02:59.178 --> 03:13.757\n好這邊可能要問一下因為這個新聞在非常多台灣的媒體也都有曝光嘛大家知道說自從2024年年初一直到2024年年底美國的牛群就有\n\n03:14.518 --> 03:38.113\n規模的這個H5N1禽流感病毒的感染那一直到2024年年底已經有15個州689個牧場其中加州又最為嚴重因此他們也撲殺了很多可憐的牛隻後來又發現說這個牛還會傳染給工人所以又發現了36名跟牛隻接觸的工人感染了H5N1病毒\n\n03:39.181 --> 03:59.262\n那這個引起國際的關注所以我想問呢您對於美牛的茶廠以及美豬的茶廠現在的態度是如何還有您最近查了幾次以及未來經過這樣子的談判您有可能會修改您的頻率嗎您會根據什麼方式來修改\n\n03:59.942 --> 04:15.736\n報告委員,我想我們一定遵守法規,遵守法規的一個規定去執行那我想委員一定很願意聽我們國際死案專家我們江署長來跟你做一個說明\n\n04:17.368 --> 04:35.914\n江署長最近好像有過去查場嗎這個我大概知道我跟委員做進一步的報告因為我們看到委員非常專業的提到乳牛等等的有相關Birdflu就是所謂的禽流感的疫情那其實我們因為\n\n04:37.254 --> 04:47.231\n擔任我們邊境所有進口來台灣的食品安全任何的農產品或者畜產品進來我們把關的機制所以我們要去更加買\n\n04:48.905 --> 05:17.594\n至少他的廠在國內特別是美國的國內有一項叫做QualitySystem就是品質系統的Assessment叫QSA之後已經認證之後進一步做所謂Export出口的Verification認證之後他們國內會先做完是確定是安全的然後讓我們選擇任何進來台灣的都有機會去看我們要去\n\n05:18.394 --> 05:34.681\n看到的廠廠廠款那就是系統性的廠廠好我懂那等一下其實美國也有一些聲音我們可以一起討論再來部長這個是您擔任立委的時候我昨天也有把您擔任立委時對於這些台美21世紀貿易倡議的\n\n05:37.262 --> 06:02.524\n這些質詢的發言等等都有看完我也很敬佩你因為部長有堅持住您剛剛的發言跟您以前的發言都非常的類似您還是為全國人民把關那最近就您的掌握呢美國還有沒有再類似講這些我們會再去管制進口它的原產地標籤啊檢驗等等的障礙與關切呢因為這是農民也蠻在意的\n\n06:07.133 --> 06:22.923\n好,我想我們站在衛福部的立場,不管怎麼樣就是把相關有關的一些食品按照法規來執行以外就是不斷的進行科學的分析,提供給我們整體的政府\n\n06:24.135 --> 06:41.769\n來做但是原則上所有的一切都是一體適用所以我們會用這樣子這樣的原則跟各個國家去談論相關的一些事情那在這邊有提到賴總統有對彭博社做了一個投書所以他說他會擴大對美國能源農業\n\n06:45.291 --> 06:49.034\n工業還有軍售方面的採購來增加雙方的投資量能在他投書之前因為農業有被拉進去嘛農業上其實我們已經對美國是逆差了那可能還會再增加或者是降低這些貿易壁壘等等這個在他投書之前您有知道嗎\n\n07:07.455 --> 07:23.409\n我想總統提的這些都是得到國際間以及我們國內的最大的肯定我想這個方向是我們應該要去做的所以我們就要因應嘛因為可能進口的農產品會變多再來呢這個談判內容在場\n\n07:26.832 --> 07:52.291\n其實這個報告有寫到真的有寫到真心提到美豬美牛大概只有衛福部跟農業部這個本席予以肯定但農業部的結語是說4月11號的首次視訊會議交換意見過程很順利但這邊我們當然也會想知道說過程順利OK有沒有初步談到可能的方向就是跟彭博的投書是不是一致\n\n07:54.483 --> 08:18.770\n是不是農業部是報告委員謝謝委員關心並支持台灣農業那開啟談判只是第一步那實質內容其實雙方都還在溝通當中是所以還沒有辦法跟我們講到方向已經開啟了談判是謝謝委員支持那這邊也要請教邱部長這個文件不知道你有沒有看到過因為在關稅之後呢\n\n08:19.949 --> 08:33.720\n川普宣布對世界全球的關稅之後很快他就發布了ForeignTradeBarriers對每一國的貿易壁壘他一國一國的列出來那這也是公開文件所以我們也一點一點來看跟我們衛福部比較相關的\n\n08:36.502 --> 09:00.230\n他提到說台灣在沒有正當理由下對台灣處理美國豬隻的業者包括進口商批發商餐飲業者進行稽查頻繁回訪這些業者干擾正常營運是不是在亂干擾我想要問衛福部的立場是不是是的謝委員我們的立場非常簡單我們都是科學分析然後一體試用\n\n09:01.970 --> 09:11.053\n所以我們必須會向各國講說我們是為了守護國人的健康我們是一體適用並沒有針對哪個國家有任何的所以聽起來我們並不是在亂干擾也很希望我們的官員在談判的時候可以表達我們衛福部的立場那第二個這個陳昭志委員問過了台灣對於訂定最大殘留容許量這個做法錯誤的暗示美國豬肉產品存在食品安全的疑慮\n\n09:31.527 --> 09:32.488\n您覺得呢我想我們要這個部分從我們專業以及說在維護食安的當中我們這個是應該是說剛剛已經跟委員報告過這是我們國人飲食的習慣\n\n09:50.281 --> 10:16.276\n陳昭智委員也有說可能沒有辦法就習慣來說服美方我們還是必須要就我們台灣的法規就剛剛史耀署署長講得很清楚我們為什麼這樣子做那為什麼我們的標準定的比別人高這個是必須我們要透明的跟對方解釋的下一個這也列在他對台灣有所意見可是其實很多美國的媽媽也有意見\n\n10:17.657 --> 10:45.034\n台灣禁止學校公餐使用含有生物科技成分意思就是基改啦加工食品美國持續對這項禁令的科學依據表示疑慮並且不斷的敦促台灣來撤銷該措施這個是所有父母都最關心的問題因為現在大家都必須要吃營養午餐嘛我也想請問小鼠署長的意見我們有可能去撤銷這樣子的禁令嗎\n\n10:47.758 --> 11:01.392\n就我的了解剛才提到的是校園裡面特定的食品的部分因為這個特定的食品部分當初的立法的背景裡面應該是全國國民很關心食安這個議題\n\n11:02.433 --> 11:27.157\n那也關心特定的議題之下呢進行的風險溝通最後形成評估出來的結果評估出來的結果呢就變成了一個規定跟法律上面的協助他做法官所以在這個規定底下我們就有機會可以協助做整個市場的稽查才能確立他的風險所以這些是我們持續在因應跟\n\n11:27.797 --> 11:51.748\n持續精進的一個部分那目前我們持續在往這方面來持續的來對相關的食安的議題能夠把關我覺得署長講得非常清楚這個是在您跟校園跟家長以及台灣的食品提供者作為溝通所訂定出來的這個也希望在談判的過程可以表達清楚因為從第一頁我就說出去的是別人\n\n11:52.368 --> 12:18.388\n可是近來被罵的是你們這不公平所以現在我們剛好藉由這個場合表達清楚你們為什麼這樣做你們的立場是什麼台灣人民的想法是什麼家長的想法是什麼那在談判的時候希望可以也顧及台灣人民的這麼一塊那最後就是台灣曾經以狂牛病為疑慮所以禁止某些美國牛肉的產品如絞肉等等的所以之後\n\n12:19.970 --> 12:23.033\n這個方向是不是有可能會談到美國的牛絞肉?因為剛剛前面一個問題,我還是跟委員回復一下我想我們衛福部就站在我們的一個食品\n\n12:39.266 --> 13:08.695\n的一個維護安全的一些專業的建議我們是跟談判的這種團這是政府是一個一體的所以是充分的一個溝通所以沒有說誰來談誰來承擔的事情我們共同一起來承擔然後共同維護食安跟我們國家最大的一個利益所以我想那個我們都會根據國際的標準來繼續往最後方面來努力\n\n13:09.275 --> 13:32.128\n主席兩分鐘對我們今天其實只是希望你們談判的方向大家可以明確知道而且未來可以做社會溝通因為之前兩位還沒上任的時候曾經發生食藥署就默默地更改了日本進口草莓的農藥殘餘量把它提高了那預告的時候也是一聲不響\n\n13:32.828 --> 13:55.564\n後來真的開始實施開始進口的時候接到了非常大量的陳情那當然你們現在可能說你們細節不能透露但是我們希望方向我們是知道的那之後你們用科學的證據來說服我們好不好那最後在這邊提醒大家一下這句話我先念過去不過呢剛剛聽了半天好像都問不到什麼\n\n13:56.525 --> 14:20.802\n明確的這個談判內容等等等一下我們蘇昭瑋可以接著問有一個人曾經說過啊正常的貿易協定跟任何一個政治實體且貿易協定正常需要需要昭告社會大眾召開空丁會各行各業的工會加入討論讓行政機關充分獲得資訊了解各行各業的利弊得失我們才能知道談判的重點與籌碼\n\n14:22.483 --> 14:23.464\n這句話聽起來很有道理吧很有道理嗎\n\n14:46.787 --> 15:07.513\n包委員我想我們政府在做任何事情一定是廣徵大家的意見不管是產業特別是立法院的一個意見我相信政府這是我們立法院黨團的愛台第一品牌沈伯陽大立委曾經做過的發言所以我們希望我們可以堅守同樣的標準\n\n15:09.213 --> 15:34.622\n沈伯陽大立委在監督其他政黨的時候講過這些話我們希望這些事也可以同樣再落實下去因為像現在日本的國會他們在跟立法他們的國會議員討論的時候也許不能給細節但是他們給予大概的方向並且逐步的讓人民去了解為何我們可能需要修改標準等等的這些我希望未來大家可以共同做到各部會可以一起合作好嗎\n\n15:35.202 --> 15:36.126\n好謝謝主席謝謝我們一起合作謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.985,"end":5.736,"text":"謝謝主席 謝謝委員 謝謝各位官員那我想請邱部長"},{"start":11.792,"end":35.883,"text":"委員長部長因為您擔任非常久的教授所以我也想問一個很生活化的問題啊教授平常看過很多學生的報告如果今天我被指派一個題目是說我要寫我的家庭結果呢這份報告寫了我的外公外婆寫了爺爺奶奶連鄰居都寫了可是沒有寫到爸爸媽媽跟兄弟姊妹你覺得這個報告幾分"},{"start":40.795,"end":63.157,"text":"那要看他寫的可能他以他以外公為榮所以花費了30分鐘都在寫他外公外婆的所謂成績部長我今天要幫您講幾句話今天我們收到了負責去談判的經貿談判辦公室的報告我們來看一下 幫我按下一張"},{"start":64.755,"end":84.055,"text":"他就只有封面提到美豬美牛今天給的議程題目叫做美豬美牛進口如何保障國人食品安全及農民權益書面報告上有這兩個字再來就是主席各位委員承蒙本辦公室對美豬美牛提出報告再來全部都沒有了"},{"start":87.608,"end":112.703,"text":"全部都沒有了我可以幫你改題目教授教授如果我可以我是您的助教的話啦我會幫這份報告改一個題目叫做川普的貿易哲學與全球關稅分佈圖因為他裡面全部都在講全球關稅分佈圖最後一句話只有以上敬請主席以及各位委員指教謝謝"},{"start":115.526,"end":134.493,"text":"部長我今天對你非常好因為我想幫你講話來監督食安的人是你負責把關全民健康的是你可是談判的是他們您不會覺得自己很委屈嗎我想政府是一體的守護國家也是前提"},{"start":135.694,"end":153.465,"text":"那個政府跟人民共同的權益我們就是這個台灣我們台灣人民要活得快樂 時的安心好 那我希望其實今天我們也是藉由這個機會這個場合可以做溝通因為您是衛生主管機關的最高指導人嘛"},{"start":154.085,"end":170.916,"text":"那今天您對於未來談判的結果可能影響到國人有哪些問題這個是您需要先跟談判辦公室溝通好談判辦公室在代表您去跟美方做溝通所以我們等一下會就可能美方在意的幾個點我們也一起來討論我們也可以藉這個機會可以讓未來代表我們出去溝通的長官們可以把我們台灣人的聲音也納進去謝謝"},{"start":179.178,"end":193.757,"text":"好 這邊可能要問一下因為這個新聞在非常多台灣的媒體也都有曝光嘛大家知道說自從2024年年初一直到2024年年底美國的牛群就有"},{"start":194.518,"end":218.113,"text":"規模的這個H5N1禽流感病毒的感染那一直到2024年年底已經有15個州689個牧場其中加州又最為嚴重因此他們也撲殺了很多可憐的牛隻後來又發現說這個牛還會傳染給工人所以又發現了36名跟牛隻接觸的工人感染了H5N1病毒"},{"start":219.181,"end":239.262,"text":"那這個引起國際的關注所以我想問呢您對於美牛的茶廠以及美豬的茶廠現在的態度是如何還有您最近查了幾次以及未來經過這樣子的談判您有可能會修改您的頻率嗎您會根據什麼方式來修改"},{"start":239.942,"end":255.736,"text":"報告委員,我想我們一定遵守法規,遵守法規的一個規定去執行那我想委員一定很願意聽我們國際死案專家我們江署長來跟你做一個說明"},{"start":257.368,"end":275.914,"text":"江署長最近好像有過去查場嗎這個我大概知道我跟委員做進一步的報告因為我們看到委員非常專業的提到乳牛等等的有相關Bird flu就是所謂的禽流感的疫情那其實我們因為"},{"start":277.254,"end":287.231,"text":"擔任我們邊境所有進口來台灣的食品安全任何的農產品或者畜產品進來我們把關的機制所以我們要去更加買"},{"start":288.905,"end":317.594,"text":"至少他的廠在國內特別是美國的國內有一項叫做Quality System就是品質系統的Assessment叫QSA之後已經認證之後進一步做所謂Export出口的Verification認證之後他們國內會先做完是確定是安全的然後讓我們選擇任何進來台灣的都有機會去看我們要去"},{"start":318.394,"end":334.681,"text":"看到的廠廠 廠款 那就是系統性的廠廠好 我懂 那等一下其實美國也有一些聲音我們可以一起討論再來 部長這個是您擔任立委的時候我昨天也有把您擔任立委時對於這些台美21世紀貿易倡議的"},{"start":337.262,"end":362.524,"text":"這些質詢的發言等等都有看完我也很敬佩你因為部長有堅持住您剛剛的發言跟您以前的發言都非常的類似您還是為全國人民把關那最近就您的掌握呢美國還有沒有再類似講這些我們會再去管制進口它的原產地標籤啊檢驗等等的障礙與關切呢因為這是農民也蠻在意的"},{"start":367.133,"end":382.923,"text":"好,我想我們站在衛福部的立場,不管怎麼樣就是把相關有關的一些食品按照法規來執行以外就是不斷的進行科學的分析,提供給我們整體的政府"},{"start":384.135,"end":401.769,"text":"來做 但是原則上所有的一切都是一體適用所以我們會用這樣子這樣的原則跟各個國家去談論相關的一些事情 那在這邊有提到賴總統有對彭博社做了一個投書 所以他說他會擴大對美國能源 農業"},{"start":405.291,"end":409.034,"text":"工業還有軍售方面的採購來增加雙方的投資量能在他投書之前因為農業有被拉進去嘛農業上其實我們已經對美國是逆差了那可能還會再增加或者是降低這些貿易壁壘等等這個在他投書之前您有知道嗎"},{"start":427.455,"end":443.409,"text":"我想總統提的這些都是得到國際間以及我們國內的最大的肯定我想這個方向是我們應該要去做的所以我們就要因應嘛因為可能進口的農產品會變多再來呢這個談判內容在場"},{"start":446.832,"end":472.291,"text":"其實這個報告有寫到真的有寫到真心提到美豬美牛大概只有衛福部跟農業部這個本席予以肯定但農業部的結語是說4月11號的首次視訊會議交換意見過程很順利但這邊我們當然也會想知道說過程順利OK有沒有初步談到可能的方向就是跟彭博的投書是不是一致"},{"start":474.483,"end":498.77,"text":"是不是農業部是報告委員謝謝委員關心並支持台灣農業那開啟談判只是第一步那實質內容其實雙方都還在溝通當中是所以還沒有辦法跟我們講到方向已經開啟了談判是謝謝委員支持那這邊也要請教邱部長這個文件不知道你有沒有看到過因為在關稅之後呢"},{"start":499.949,"end":513.72,"text":"川普宣布對世界全球的關稅之後很快他就發布了Foreign Trade Barriers對每一國的貿易壁壘他一國一國的列出來那這也是公開文件所以我們也一點一點來看跟我們衛福部比較相關的"},{"start":516.502,"end":540.23,"text":"他提到說 台灣在沒有正當理由下對台灣處理美國豬隻的業者包括進口商 批發商 餐飲業者進行稽查頻繁回訪這些業者 干擾正常營運是不是在亂干擾 我想要問衛福部的立場 是不是是的 謝委員我們的立場非常簡單我們都是科學分析 然後一體試用"},{"start":541.97,"end":551.053,"text":"所以我們必須會向各國講說我們是為了守護國人的健康我們是一體適用並沒有針對哪個國家有任何的所以聽起來我們並不是在亂干擾也很希望我們的官員在談判的時候可以表達我們衛福部的立場那第二個這個陳昭志委員問過了台灣對於訂定最大殘留容許量這個做法錯誤的暗示美國豬肉產品存在食品安全的疑慮"},{"start":571.527,"end":572.488,"text":"您覺得呢我想我們要這個部分從我們專業以及說在維護食安的當中我們這個是應該是說剛剛已經跟委員報告過這是我們國人飲食的習慣"},{"start":590.281,"end":616.276,"text":"陳昭智委員也有說可能沒有辦法就習慣來說服美方我們還是必須要就我們台灣的法規就剛剛史耀署署長講得很清楚我們為什麼這樣子做那為什麼我們的標準定的比別人高這個是必須我們要透明的跟對方解釋的下一個這也列在他對台灣有所意見可是其實很多美國的媽媽也有意見"},{"start":617.657,"end":645.034,"text":"台灣禁止學校公餐使用含有生物科技成分意思就是基改啦加工食品美國持續對這項禁令的科學依據表示疑慮並且不斷的敦促台灣來撤銷該措施這個是所有父母都最關心的問題因為現在大家都必須要吃營養午餐嘛我也想請問小鼠署長的意見我們有可能去撤銷這樣子的禁令嗎"},{"start":647.758,"end":661.392,"text":"就我的了解剛才提到的是校園裡面特定的食品的部分因為這個特定的食品部分當初的立法的背景裡面應該是全國國民很關心食安這個議題"},{"start":662.433,"end":687.157,"text":"那也關心特定的議題之下呢進行的風險溝通最後形成評估出來的結果評估出來的結果呢就變成了一個規定跟法律上面的協助他做法官所以在這個規定底下我們就有機會可以協助做整個市場的稽查才能確立他的風險所以這些是我們持續在因應跟"},{"start":687.797,"end":711.748,"text":"持續精進的一個部分那目前我們持續在往這方面來持續的來對相關的食安的議題能夠把關我覺得署長講得非常清楚這個是在您跟校園跟家長以及台灣的食品提供者作為溝通所訂定出來的這個也希望在談判的過程可以表達清楚因為從第一頁我就說出去的是別人"},{"start":712.368,"end":738.388,"text":"可是近來被罵的是你們 這不公平所以現在我們剛好藉由這個場合表達清楚你們為什麼這樣做你們的立場是什麼台灣人民的想法是什麼家長的想法是什麼那在談判的時候希望可以也顧及台灣人民的這麼一塊那最後就是台灣曾經以狂牛病為疑慮所以禁止某些美國牛肉的產品如絞肉等等的所以之後"},{"start":739.97,"end":743.033,"text":"這個方向是不是有可能會談到美國的牛絞肉?因為剛剛前面一個問題,我還是跟委員回復一下我想我們衛福部就站在我們的一個食品"},{"start":759.266,"end":788.695,"text":"的一個維護安全的一些專業的建議我們是跟談判的這種團這是政府是一個一體的所以是充分的一個溝通所以沒有說誰來談誰來承擔的事情我們共同一起來承擔然後共同維護食安跟我們國家最大的一個利益所以我想那個我們都會根據國際的標準來繼續往最後方面來努力"},{"start":789.275,"end":812.128,"text":"主席兩分鐘 對我們今天其實只是希望你們談判的方向大家可以明確知道而且未來可以做社會溝通因為之前兩位還沒上任的時候曾經發生食藥署就默默地更改了日本進口草莓的農藥殘餘量把它提高了那預告的時候也是一聲不響"},{"start":812.828,"end":835.564,"text":"後來真的開始實施開始進口的時候接到了非常大量的陳情那當然你們現在可能說你們細節不能透露但是我們希望方向我們是知道的那之後你們用科學的證據來說服我們好不好那最後在這邊提醒大家一下這句話我先念過去不過呢剛剛聽了半天好像都問不到什麼"},{"start":836.525,"end":860.802,"text":"明確的這個談判內容等等等一下我們蘇昭瑋可以接著問有一個人曾經說過啊正常的貿易協定跟任何一個政治實體且貿易協定正常需要 需要昭告社會大眾 召開空丁會各行各業的工會加入討論讓行政機關充分獲得資訊了解各行各業的利弊得失我們才能知道談判的重點與籌碼"},{"start":862.483,"end":863.464,"text":"這句話聽起來很有道理吧很有道理嗎"},{"start":886.787,"end":907.513,"text":"包委員我想我們政府在做任何事情一定是廣徵大家的意見不管是產業特別是立法院的一個意見我相信政府這是我們立法院黨團的愛台第一品牌沈伯陽大立委曾經做過的發言所以我們希望我們可以堅守同樣的標準"},{"start":909.213,"end":934.622,"text":"沈伯陽大立委在監督其他政黨的時候講過這些話我們希望這些事也可以同樣再落實下去因為像現在日本的國會他們在跟立法他們的國會議員討論的時候也許不能給細節但是他們給予大概的方向並且逐步的讓人民去了解為何我們可能需要修改標準等等的這些我希望未來大家可以共同做到各部會可以一起合作好嗎"},{"start":935.202,"end":936.126,"text":"好 謝謝主席 謝謝我們一起合作 謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":283,"blocks":[["陳委員菁徽：（9時38分）謝謝主席，謝謝委員，謝謝各位官員，我想請邱部長。"],["邱部長泰源：委員早。"],["陳委員菁徽：部長，因為您擔任教授非常久，所以我也想問一個很生活化的問題，教授平常看很多學生的報告，如果今天我被指派一個題目是要寫我的家庭，結果這份報告寫了我的外公、外婆，寫了爺爺、奶奶，連鄰居都寫了，可是沒有寫到爸爸媽媽跟兄弟姐妹，你覺得這個報告可以得幾分？"],["邱部長泰源：那要看他寫的，可能他以外公為榮，所以花費了30分鐘都在寫他外公、外婆的卓越成績。"],["陳委員菁徽：部長，我今天要幫您講幾句話，我們收到負責談判的經貿談判辦公室的報告，我們來看一下，只有報告封面提到美豬、美牛，今天給的議程題目叫做「美豬、美牛進口零關稅且如何保障國人食品安全及農民權益」，書面報告上有這兩個字，再來就是「主席、各位委員……承蒙貴委員會邀請本辦公室就『美豬、美牛進口零關稅且如何保障國人食品安全及農民權益』提出報告」，再來全部都沒有了，全部都沒有了。"],["邱部長泰源：報告委員，這……"],["陳委員菁徽：我可以幫你改題目，教授，如果我是您的助教的話，我會幫這份報告改一個題目，叫做「川普的貿易哲學與全球關稅分布圖」，因為裡面全部都在講全球關稅分布圖，最後一句話只有「以上報告，敬請主席與各位委員指教。謝謝！」部長，我今天對你非常好，因為我想幫你講話。來監督食安的人是你，負責把關全民健康的是你，可是談判的是他們，您不會覺得自己很委屈嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：我想政府是一體的，守護國家也是全體政府跟人民共同的權力，我們就是這個臺灣，我們臺灣人民要活得快樂、食得安心，很健康。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，當然我希望今天我們也能藉由這個機會、這個場合可以做溝通，因為您是國家最高衛生主管機關的領導人，今天您對於未來談判的結果可能有哪些問題會影響到國人，這個是您需要先跟談判辦公室溝通好，談判辦公室再代表您去跟美方做溝通，所以我們等一下會就可能美方在意的幾個點，我們也一起來討論，我們也可藉此機會讓未來代表我們出去溝通的長官們，把我們臺灣人的聲音也納進去。"],["邱部長泰源：好，謝謝。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，這邊可能要問一下，因為這個新聞在非常多臺灣的媒體也都有曝光，大家知道自2024年年初一直到2024年年底，美國的牛群就大規模的感染H5N1禽流感病毒，一直到2024年年底已經有15個州689個牧場，其中又以加州最為嚴重，因此他們也撲殺了很多可憐的牛隻，後來又發現牛群感染後還會傳染給工人，所以又發現了36名跟牛隻接觸的工人感染了H5N1病毒。這件事引起國際關注，所以我想問，您對於美牛以及美豬的查廠，現在的態度是如何？還有您最近查了幾次，以及未來經過這一次的談判，您有可能會修改您的頻率嗎？你會根據什麼方式來修改？"],["邱部長泰源：報告委員，我們一定嚴格遵守法規的規定去執行，我想委員一定很願意聽我們國際食安專家姜署長來跟你做說明。"],["陳委員菁徽：姜署長最近好像有過去查廠嘛，對不對？這個我大概知道。"],["姜署長至剛：我跟委員做進一步的報告，委員非常非常專業的提到在美國有乳牛等等牛隻感染相關的bird flu，就是所謂的禽流感的疫情。我們因為擔任邊境所有進口來臺灣的食品安全，任何的農產品或者畜產品進來國內的把關機制，所以我們要去跟人家買，至少他的廠在國內，特別是美國的國內有一項叫做quality system，就是品質系統的assessment叫QSA，已經認證之後進一步做所謂export（出口）的verification（認證）之後，他們國內會先做完確定是安全的，然後讓我們選擇任何進來臺灣的都有機會去看我們想要看到的查廠的廠房，這就是系統性的查廠。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，我懂，其實美國也有一些聲音，等一下我們可以一起討論。再來，部長，這是您擔任立委的時候，我昨天也把您擔任立委時，針對臺美21世紀貿易倡議的相關質詢跟發言等等都看完，我也很敬佩您，因為部長有堅持住，您剛剛的發言跟您以前的發言都非常的類似，您還是為全國人民把關。最近就您的掌握，美國還有沒有再講類似這些，我們會再去管制進口它的原產地標籤檢驗等等的障礙予以關切呢？因為這件事農民也蠻在意的。"],["邱部長泰源：我們站在衛福部的立場，不管怎麼樣就是把相關的食品按照法規來執行以外，就是不斷的進行科學的分析，提供給我們整體的政府來做，但是原則上所有的一切都是一體適用，所以我們會堅持這樣的原則跟各個國家去談論相關的一些事情。"],["陳委員菁徽：這邊有提到，賴總統投書彭博社，他說他會擴大對美國在能源、農業、工業還有軍售方面的採購，增加雙方的投資量能。在他投書之前，因為農業有被納進去，在農業上，其實我們對美國已經是逆差了，可能還會再增加，或者是降低這些貿易壁壘等等，這個在他投書之前，您有知道嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：我想總統提的這些都是得到國際間以及我們國內最大的肯定，我想這個方向是我們應該要去做的。"],["陳委員菁徽：對啊！所以我們就要因應嘛，因為可能進口的農產品會變多。再來，這個談判內容，其實這個報告有寫到、真的有寫到、真心提到美豬、美牛的大概只有衛福部跟農業部，這個本席予以肯定，但農業部的結語是，4月11號的首次視訊會議，交換意見過程很順利，過程順利，OK，但我們當然也想知道有沒有初步談到可能的方向？就是跟彭博社的投書是不是一致？"],["邱部長泰源：是不是由農業部……"],["杜次長文珍：報告委員，謝謝委員關心並支持臺灣農業。開啟談判只是第一步，實質內容其實雙方都還在溝通當中。"],["陳委員菁徽：所以還沒有辦法跟我們講到方向？"],["杜次長文珍：就是至少已經開啟了談判，謝謝委員支持。"],["陳委員菁徽：這邊也要請教邱部長，這個文件不知道你有沒有看過，因為在川普宣布對世界、全球的關稅之後，很快他就發布了Foreign Trade Barriers，對每一國的貿易壁壘是一國、一國的列出來，這也是公開文件，所以我們也一點、一點的來看跟我們衛福部比較相關的。他有提到，臺灣在沒有正當理由下，對臺灣處理美國豬隻的業者，包括進口商、批發商、餐飲業者進行稽查，頻繁回訪這些業者，干擾正常營運，是不是在亂干擾？我想要問衛福部的立場如何？"],["邱部長泰源：謝謝委員。我們的立場非常簡單，我們都是科學分析然後一體適用，所以我們會去向各國說為了守護國人的健康，我們是一體適用，並沒有針對哪一個國家有……"],["陳委員菁徽：所以聽起來我們並不是在亂干擾，也很希望我們的官員在談判的時候可以表達我們衛福部的立場。","第二個，這個陳昭姿委員問過了，對於臺灣訂定最大殘留容許量，這個作法錯誤的暗示美國豬肉產品存在食品安全的疑慮。您覺得呢？"],["邱部長泰源：我想這個部分從我們的專業以及在維護食安當中，這個應該是說，剛剛已經跟委員報告過，這是我們國人的飲食習慣，要尊重。"],["陳委員菁徽：陳昭姿委員也有說，可能沒有辦法就習慣來說服美方，我們還是必須要就我們臺灣的法規，剛剛食藥署署長講得很清楚，我們為什麼這樣子做？為什麼我們的標準訂得比別人高？這個是我們必須透明的跟對方解釋的。","下一個，這也列在他對臺灣有所意見的部分，可是其實很多美國的媽媽也有意見。臺灣禁止學校供餐中使用含有生物科技成分（即基改）食品及加工食品，美國持續對這項禁令的科學依據表示疑慮，並且不斷地敦促臺灣撤銷該措施。這是所有父母最關心的問題，因為現在大家都必須吃營養午餐，我也想請問食藥署署長的意見，我們有可能去撤銷這樣的禁令嗎？"],["姜署長至剛：就我的了解，剛才提到的是校園裡面特定的食品部分，因為特定的食品部分，當初的立法背景應該是全國國民很關心食安這個議題，也關心特定的議題之下，進行了風險溝通，最後形成、評估出後來的結果，評估出來的結果就變成一個規定跟法律上面的協助他做把關，所以在這個規定底下，我們就有機會可以協助做整個市場的稽查，才能確立它的風險，所以這些是我們持續在因應跟持續精進的一個部分，目前我們持續往這方面對相關的食安議題能夠把關。"],["陳委員菁徽：我覺得署長講得非常清楚，這個是在您跟校園、家長以及臺灣的食品提供者做溝通所訂定出來的，這個也希望在談判的過程可以表達清楚，因為從第1頁我就說了，出去的是別人，可是進來被罵的是你們，這不公平，所以現在我們剛好藉由這個場合表達清楚你們為什麼這樣做，然後你們的立場是什麼、臺灣人民的想法是什麼、家長的想法是什麼，在談判的時候希望可以顧及臺灣人民的這一塊。","最後，臺灣曾經以狂牛症為疑慮，所以禁止某些美國牛肉的產品如絞肉等等，所以之後這個方向是不是有可能會談到美國的牛絞肉？"],["邱部長泰源：剛剛前面一個問題，我還是跟委員回復一下。我想我們衛福部就是站在維護食品安全的一些專業建議，我們是跟談判的……政府是一體的，所以是充分的溝通，所以沒有說誰來談、誰來承擔的事情，我們共同一起來承擔，然後共同維護食安跟我們國家最大的利益，所以我想我們都會根據國際的標準，繼續往這方面來努力。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，主席，2分鐘，抱歉。我們今天其實只是希望對於你們談判的方向，大家可以明確知道，而且未來可以做社會溝通，因為之前兩位還沒上任的時候，曾經發生食藥署默默地更改了日本進口草莓的農藥殘餘量，把它提高了，預告的時候也是一聲不響，後來真的開始實施、開始進口的時候接到了非常大量的陳情，當然你們現在可能說不能透露細節，但是我們希望方向我們是知道的，之後你們用科學的證據來說服我們，好不好？最後在這邊提醒大家一下，這句話我先念過去，不過，剛剛聽了半天，好像都問不到什麼明確的談判內容等等，等一下我們蘇召委可以接著問。有一個人曾經說過，正常的貿易協定，跟任何一個政治實體簽貿易協定，正常之下需要：召告社會大眾，召開公聽會，各行各業的工會加入討論，讓行政機關充分獲得資訊，了解各行各業的利弊得失，我們才能知道談判的重點與籌碼；第二，行政機關出國談判；第三，談判結果由立法機關審議，由於事前授權不完全代表事後不用審議，立法機關必須確認行政機關談判並無違法，並且符合授權範圍，審議過後此貿易協定才能對國內產生法律的效力。這句話聽起來很有道理吧！很有道理？"],["邱部長泰源：報告委員，我想我們政府在做任何事情一定是廣徵大家的意見，不管是產業，特別是立法院的意見，我相信政府……"],["陳委員菁徽：這是我們立法院黨團的愛臺第一品牌沈伯洋大立委曾經做過的發言，所以希望我們也可以堅守同樣的標準。沈伯洋大立委在監督其他政黨的時候講過這些話，我們希望這些事也可以同樣再落實下去，因為像現在日本的國會，他們在跟他們的國會議員討論的時候，也許不能給細節，但是他們給予大概的方向，並且逐步地讓人民去了解，為何我們可能需要修改標準等等，這些我希望未來大家可以共同做到，各部會可以一起合作，好嗎？"],["邱部長泰源：好，謝謝委員。"],["陳委員菁徽：謝謝主席。"],["邱部長泰源：我們一起合作，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝部長。我們衛環委員會每一個委員都很認真，都是有備而來的。接續我們請楊曜委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":452,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-26-7","speakers":["蘇清泉","陳昭姿","陳菁徽","楊曜","王正旭","王育敏","楊瓊瓔","林淑芬","涂權吉","邱鎮軍","黃秀芳","林月琴","劉建國","鍾佳濱","盧縣一","高金素梅","王鴻薇","許宇甄","葉元之","羅廷瑋","陳瑩","徐欣瑩","廖偉翔"],"page_start":371,"meetingDate":["2025-04-24"],"gazette_id":"1144101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144101_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請衛生福利部部長、農業部次長、經濟部次長、外交部次長、行政院經貿談判辦公室副總談判\n代表、行政院食品安全辦公室主任針對「美豬、美牛進口零關稅且如何保障國人食品安全及農民\n權益」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1144101_00005"}}}