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65.342, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 65.342, \"end\": 65.522, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"犯\", \"start\": 65.522, \"end\": 65.723, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 65.723, \"end\": 66.003, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"者\", \"start\": 66.003, \"end\": 66.243, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 66.243, \"end\": 66.463, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 66.463, \"end\": 66.704, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"序\", \"start\": 66.704, \"end\": 66.924, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"进\", \"start\": 66.924, \"end\": 67.124, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 67.124, \"end\": 67.364, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"期\", \"start\": 67.364, \"end\": 67.525, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"间\", \"start\": 67.525, \"end\": 67.785, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 67.785, \"end\": 68.105, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"犯\", \"start\": 68.105, \"end\": 68.646, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"。\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 68.646, \"end\": 68.766, \"score\": 0.832}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 68.766, \"end\": 68.986, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"个\", \"start\": 68.986, \"end\": 69.146, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 69.146, \"end\": 69.487, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 69.487, \"end\": 69.687, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"倾\", \"start\": 69.687, \"end\": 69.827, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"向\", \"start\": 69.827, \"end\": 70.047, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"支\", \"start\": 70.047, \"end\": 70.288, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"持\", \"start\": 70.288, \"end\": 71.188, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"。\"}, {\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 71.188, \"end\": 71.429, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 71.429, \"end\": 71.649, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"三\", \"start\": 71.649, \"end\": 71.889, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 71.889, \"end\": 72.15, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 72.15, \"end\": 72.41, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"四\", \"start\": 72.41, \"end\": 72.63, \"score\": 0.871}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 72.63, \"end\": 72.79, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 72.79, \"end\": 72.93, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"认\", \"start\": 72.93, \"end\": 73.111, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"为\", \"start\": 73.111, \"end\": 73.291, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 73.291, \"end\": 73.431, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"还\", \"start\": 73.431, \"end\": 73.611, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"需\", \"start\": 73.611, \"end\": 73.751, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 73.751, \"end\": 73.871, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 73.871, \"end\": 74.092, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"讨\", \"start\": 74.092, \"end\": 74.452, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"论\", \"start\": 74.452, \"end\": 74.472, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"。\"}]}, {\"start\": 75.453, \"end\": 101.944, \"text\": \"第449跟451條之一呢就是修正檢疫判決處刑的程序的這個部分基本上因為我不是律師我不是檢察官法官出身我基本上會尊重法律十五屆的意見那我同時也看到法務部跟司法院針對如果涉及這樣子的修法那後續也免不了要去增加很多法院相關的一些負擔\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 75.453, \"end\": 76.694, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"9\"}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 76.694, \"end\": 77.854, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"5\"}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 77.854, \"end\": 78.174, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 78.174, \"end\": 78.414, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 78.414, \"end\": 78.654, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 78.654, \"end\": 78.774, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 78.774, \"end\": 78.954, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"修\", \"start\": 78.954, \"end\": 79.215, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"正\", \"start\": 79.215, \"end\": 79.595, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"檢\"}, {\"word\": \"疫\", \"start\": 79.595, \"end\": 79.775, \"score\": 0.779}, {\"word\": \"判\", \"start\": 79.775, \"end\": 80.375, \"score\": 0.879}, {\"word\": \"決\"}, {\"word\": \"處\"}, {\"word\": \"刑\", \"start\": 80.375, \"end\": 80.575, \"score\": 0.896}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 80.575, \"end\": 80.755, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 80.755, \"end\": 81.095, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"序\", \"start\": 81.095, \"end\": 81.275, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 81.275, \"end\": 81.776, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 81.776, \"end\": 82.096, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 82.096, \"end\": 82.856, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"基\", \"start\": 82.856, \"end\": 82.976, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 82.976, \"end\": 83.136, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 83.136, \"end\": 83.336, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 83.336, \"end\": 83.576, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 83.576, \"end\": 83.776, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 83.776, \"end\": 83.916, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 83.916, \"end\": 84.096, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"律\", \"start\": 84.096, \"end\": 84.477, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"師\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 84.477, \"end\": 84.637, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 84.637, \"end\": 84.757, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 84.757, \"end\": 85.057, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"檢\"}, {\"word\": \"察\", \"start\": 85.057, \"end\": 85.217, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"官\", \"start\": 85.217, \"end\": 85.417, \"score\": 0.815}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 85.417, \"end\": 85.537, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"官\", \"start\": 85.537, \"end\": 85.777, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 85.777, \"end\": 85.997, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"身\", \"start\": 85.997, \"end\": 86.617, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"我\", 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\"我\", \"start\": 90.939, \"end\": 91.099, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 91.099, \"end\": 91.419, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 91.419, \"end\": 91.599, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"看\", \"start\": 91.599, \"end\": 91.76, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 91.76, \"end\": 91.96, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 91.96, \"end\": 92.24, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"務\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 92.24, \"end\": 92.36, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 92.36, \"end\": 92.56, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"司\", \"start\": 92.56, \"end\": 92.7, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 92.7, \"end\": 92.9, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 92.9, \"end\": 94.301, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"針\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 94.301, \"end\": 94.461, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 94.461, \"end\": 94.661, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"涉\", \"start\": 94.661, \"end\": 94.861, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"及\", \"start\": 94.861, \"end\": 95.001, \"score\": 0.707}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"子\", \"start\": 95.001, \"end\": 95.221, \"score\": 0.896}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 95.221, \"end\": 95.461, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"修\", \"start\": 95.461, \"end\": 95.821, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 95.821, \"end\": 96.281, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 96.281, \"end\": 96.842, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 96.842, \"end\": 97.362, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"續\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 97.362, \"end\": 97.382, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"免\", \"start\": 97.382, \"end\": 97.742, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 97.742, \"end\": 98.182, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 98.182, \"end\": 98.582, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 98.582, \"end\": 98.822, \"score\": 0.826}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 98.822, \"end\": 99.042, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"增\", \"start\": 99.042, \"end\": 99.263, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"加\", \"start\": 99.263, \"end\": 99.523, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 99.523, \"end\": 99.763, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 99.763, \"end\": 100.003, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 100.003, \"end\": 100.203, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 100.203, \"end\": 100.503, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 100.503, \"end\": 101.183, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 101.183, \"end\": 101.363, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 101.363, \"end\": 101.563, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 101.563, \"end\": 101.924, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"負\", \"start\": 101.924, \"end\": 101.944, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"擔\"}]}, {\"start\": 103.304, \"end\": 129.853, \"text\": \"那這些我覺得都可以再商量那第四個441條的非常上訴的這個他變動了檢查總長的裁量權限而且呢可能會混淆了非常上訴制度的功能所以用具體的個案的救濟有利與否來作為提醒非常上訴的要件我認為這真的是要挺看挺我大概把今天四個修法我兩個是100%支持\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 103.304, \"end\": 103.564, \"score\": 0.567}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 103.564, \"end\": 103.844, \"score\": 0.818}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 103.844, \"end\": 104.104, \"score\": 0.664}, {\"word\": \"覺\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 104.104, \"end\": 104.364, \"score\": 0.864}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 104.364, \"end\": 104.505, \"score\": 0.742}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 104.505, \"end\": 104.625, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 104.625, \"end\": 104.705, \"score\": 0.703}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 104.705, \"end\": 105.745, \"score\": 0.865}, {\"word\": \"商\", \"start\": 105.745, \"end\": 106.005, \"score\": 0.635}, {\"word\": \"量\", \"start\": 106.005, \"end\": 106.865, \"score\": 0.638}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 106.865, \"end\": 107.185, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 107.185, \"end\": 107.506, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"四\", \"start\": 107.506, \"end\": 109.506, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 109.506, \"end\": 109.686, \"score\": 0.83}, {\"word\": \"非\", \"start\": 109.686, \"end\": 109.806, \"score\": 0.705}, {\"word\": \"常\", \"start\": 109.806, \"end\": 110.026, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 110.026, \"end\": 110.627, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"訴\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 110.627, \"end\": 111.107, \"score\": 0.827}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 111.107, \"end\": 111.947, \"score\": 0.906}, {\"word\": \"變\"}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 111.947, \"end\": 112.207, \"score\": 0.796}, {\"word\": \"檢\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 112.207, \"end\": 112.727, \"score\": 0.784}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, 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\"加\", \"start\": 824.326, \"end\": 824.486, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"油\", \"start\": 824.486, \"end\": 824.666, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"辛\", \"start\": 824.666, \"end\": 824.826, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"苦\", \"start\": 824.826, \"end\": 824.966, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 824.966, \"end\": 825.727, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 825.727, \"end\": 825.887, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"席\", \"start\": 825.887, \"end\": 826.007, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 826.007, \"end\": 826.027, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:10,066 --> 00:00:36,900\n好謝謝主席有請王複密然後請黃長賜複密張賜張賜不好意思委員早安委員早大家早安今天扣合著三個主題刑事訴訟法的修法然後立法委員成了違法委員嗎還有法庭的直播到底能不能上路三個議題來進一提出我的質詢下一頁有關今天有四個\n\n2\n00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:55,178\n刑事訴訟法的修法的議案那我自己初步認為在116條之二羈押替代處分增訂的廢紙並註銷護照旅行文件希望能夠藉由修法來防止被告逃逸到境外這個我支持\n\n3\n00:00:56,072 --> 00:01:14,472\n第二个呢,刑诉法101条之一,预防性羁押案件要增列儿少性剥削案件,避免相关的犯行者在程序进行期间再犯。那我个人也倾向支持。但第三跟第四呢,我认为就还需要再讨论。\n\n4\n00:01:15,453 --> 00:01:41,944\n第449跟451條之一呢就是修正檢疫判決處刑的程序的這個部分基本上因為我不是律師我不是檢察官法官出身我基本上會尊重法律十五屆的意見那我同時也看到法務部跟司法院針對如果涉及這樣子的修法那後續也免不了要去增加很多法院相關的一些負擔\n\n5\n00:01:43,304 --> 00:02:09,853\n那這些我覺得都可以再商量那第四個441條的非常上訴的這個他變動了檢查總長的裁量權限而且呢可能會混淆了非常上訴制度的功能所以用具體的個案的救濟有利與否來作為提醒非常上訴的要件我認為這真的是要挺看挺我大概把今天四個修法我兩個是100%支持\n\n6\n00:02:12,774 --> 00:02:35,839\n後兩項我認為都需要再討論我表達我的立場我也看到你們的完整報告好謝謝下一頁那現在就交於兩位的事喔我們在宣誓就職的時候都要克尊憲法克尊國家法規這是我的宣誓每一個立法委員都是要這樣宣誓請問在台灣我們要克尊哪一國的法律\n\n7\n00:02:37,827 --> 00:03:01,202\n這簡單的ABC嘛當然是克尊中華民國的法律我真的不知道這個問題要成為今天立法院被討論的問題有民眾黨的委員呢引用中國的反分裂國家法要求行政院要遵從要克尊中國反分裂法的規定\n\n8\n00:03:02,663 --> 00:03:17,695\n然後來批判說,你如果沒有去參照中國的反分裂國家法,禁制的把中國定為境外敵對勢力,這樣對台灣很不好喔,會招致一些風險喔兩位怎麼看?蜉蜜,我們來做法治教育王蜉蜜\n\n9\n00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:50,103\n在台灣的立法委員在台灣的任何一個公民我們要遵守的是台灣中華民國憲法所制定的反滲透法還是要遵守中國所制定的反分裂國家法就這麼簡單因為立法委員也是國家機關的一部分所以當然是要遵守中華民國的法律\n\n10\n00:03:50,643 --> 00:04:10,865\n所以我們要遵守的是中華民國立法院制定的反滲透法嘛反滲透法的第二條第一款具體的針對境外敵對勢力的要件有非常清楚的定義這是立法院自己通過的法律怎麼立法委員要成了違法委員呢來黃次長法治教育給您20秒\n\n11\n00:04:12,386 --> 00:04:32,131\n我們的確是在我們的反滲透法有對境外敵對勢力做一個立法性的定義什麼叫境外敵對勢力它包括交戰、對峙或者是主張以武力來非和平球段這個當然就會是我們反滲透法所定義的境外敵對勢力所以\n\n12\n00:04:33,971 --> 00:04:53,504\n不管政治立場是什麼不管你的政黨是什麼立法委員就要克尊中華民國的法律更何況這是立法委員自己立的法立委不要成為違法的委員立法委員成為違法委員了嗎去沖北檢沖北院請問極有法第六條規範的是什麼長次\n\n13\n00:05:05,262 --> 00:05:23,229\n它是有關於這個五院跟法院區區所在或周邊設置是禁止集會的除非有例外規定要不然是禁止集會的集合法第六條它規範了集會遊行的禁制區的四種樣態第一種就是重要的國家機關包括總統府\n\n14\n00:05:24,449 --> 00:05:51,256\n司法院考試院行政院但是立法院不算因為立法院秉持民意所以立法院我們是歡迎大家來表達不同的你的政治立場都可以所以說第一類是政府機關第二類是重要的交通設施嘛比如說機場港口是禁制區嘛第三類是軍事設施嘛重要的軍事設施不可以集會遊行嘛第四類就是駐外使館\n\n15\n00:05:52,276 --> 00:06:16,219\n對不對我們要保護駐外使館的權益包括國際組織的駐台機構也都是極有法第六條所規範的集會遊行禁制區好極有法是誰通過的立法院通過的立法院修法的請立法委員不要成為違法委員我今天還聽說在野黨的黨主席說他認為極有法是惡法要修\n\n16\n00:06:17,711 --> 00:06:35,026\n如果說是針對第六條要求大家真的可以討論但如果是為了方便個別的政黨為了鬥臭司法施壓司法消費司法要開放法院地檢署或是司法院能夠成為自由的\n\n17\n00:06:36,600 --> 00:06:52,835\n開放區我認為真的要深思兩位同意法院地檢署如果透過修法可以現在是禁制未來大家都可以要來抗議為了個案都可以來抗議你們的意見是什麼來我問秘書長覆名\n\n18\n00:06:55,055 --> 00:07:17,588\n司法院是反對的最主要是司法院是人民來禁用司法的一個場域這不適合開放法務部呢地檢署被包圍基本上也是不宜因為這涉及到地檢署跟法院的莊嚴性另外可能會對個案懲辦檢察官或法官造成心理上的強制所以都為了捍衛司法的獨立公正\n\n19\n00:07:18,328 --> 00:07:37,450\n我們都不以草率的去修集遊法有關於北檢北院或司法院可以成為集會遊行的場域我真的認為要慎重理由你們剛剛都說了但是立法院我們非常歡迎立法院從過去到現在甚至世界各國的立法院國會周遭都是\n\n20\n00:07:38,431 --> 00:08:07,113\n合法可以讓大家來表達不同意見的場域包括台灣也是好下一個立法委員不要成為違法委員喔這週末就要上凱道了我再次的呼籲我們國家有法規犯罪就是犯罪違法就是違法民主不容造假不管是會選不管是作票不管是罷免案的\n\n21\n00:08:08,021 --> 00:08:27,363\n未造联署都是违法行为如果立法委员上凯道是去挺作弊我想这真的是一笑大方也一笑国际今天花了一点时间我们来做法治教育接下来呢我们来进入另一个主题哦下一页\n\n22\n00:08:28,188 --> 00:08:47,717\n也就是藍白領袖的高峰會那會中有人提出要推司法改革就是要法庭直播法庭直播下一頁直播真的不是萬能喔直播也解決不了所有的問題\n\n23\n00:08:50,031 --> 00:09:14,733\n確實2017年司改國是會議有決議但他的決議是要先落實司法的透明跟友善再逐步來開放法庭直播這應當是當初司法國是會議一個完整的一個論述吧那但是我也找了資料當時的司改國是會議司法院有允諾要提出來研議開放法庭直播的草案你們有進行嗎\n\n24\n00:09:16,096 --> 00:09:42,965\n跟委員報告這個部分因為在思改國師會議期間它是一個議題所以司法院曾經做過非常周延的一個政策研討我們委託的那個學者專家就世界上就是重要這些法治國家就是進行了一個法庭直播的一個研究案然後之後我們也邀請了各方的能不能簡單分享一下幾個重要國際國家\n\n25\n00:09:44,945 --> 00:10:11,763\n就是目前來看跟我們相近的歐陸國家40省沒有人在開放的那就是即使是在美國他們有分聯邦跟邦就是聯邦的法制也都不開放原則上也都不開放那為什麼結論來講就是說特別是40省的法庭直播它對於法院的公正跟獨立性是很容易造成侵害是非常危險的\n\n26\n00:10:12,823 --> 00:10:38,980\n謝謝您的簡要報告所以您也說明了司法院試圖努力去提草案但是正因為我們做了這樣的研究做了這樣的評估包括去採酌世界各國的經驗也橫著台灣的司法現況所以你們才比較保留的態度我認為是可以持續研議既然有委員有倡議我們當然可以研議但是直播不是萬能我們還是有很多面向要考慮喔下一頁\n\n27\n00:10:40,001 --> 00:11:01,591\n那事實上也要替你們說一下啦在私改國是會議之後你們優先推動的司法資訊的透明公開其實已經做了相關的改革革新譬如說2021年已經修了法庭錄音錄影及其利用保存辦法那個時候也因為疫情推我們一把所以說相關的軟硬體的建制跟辦法已經有修好下一頁\n\n28\n00:11:02,751 --> 00:11:25,126\n那您剛講的世界各國的經驗跟保留的意見就看台灣法官協會是非常清楚的主張公開審判不等於法庭直播大家要三思各類訴訟參與者面對媒體傳播所承受的心理壓力是否影響到證人到庭作證的意願\n\n29\n00:11:26,147 --> 00:11:54,592\n被告是不是也會因此直播而面臨了全民公審導致司法的摯愛難行甚至影響判決的公正性所以說必須妥適去權衡公開直播的公益性與訴訟參與者的基本權一個是公益性大家想要直播想要透明想要公開但另外一邊訴訟當事者他才是這個案件的核心\n\n30\n00:11:55,669 --> 00:12:03,822\n他的權益基本權是不容去強害的所以法官協會的意見都告訴我們還要再三思喔下一頁\n\n31\n00:12:05,114 --> 00:12:28,868\n那事實上你們的預算現在也提出解凍案了史上被凍結最高的一次司法院的預算事實上這是2017年司改國是會議之後呢就已經有人替你們試算了如果說各級法院呢要事實審要法院法庭直播的話成本是非常高的你不管是自建直播系統或是採用租賃的系統那些東西一來一去\n\n32\n00:12:30,680 --> 00:12:41,308\n有一個數字是如果是租賃的方式像立法院我們的直播租賃的方式如果以你法院因為呢每年平均開庭57萬4千多次我們事實審法庭有598間可能要593億啊593億啊要推動的委員請三思國家的成本能夠來負擔嗎最後一頁也就是\n\n33\n00:12:55,612 --> 00:13:12,760\n有違各自法的保障將不利於事實的調查而且有違無罪推定的原則而且恐怕會影響法官的心證基於這些理由我今天再一次透過我的質詢我想我們可以持續演繹\n\n34\n00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:38,280\n可以持續研議但是直播不能解決所有的問題直播不是萬能立法委員也不要一直以直播來作為直播就萬歲直播就萬能在司法的領域上我認為這個是要深思熟慮的公開透明不等於全程直播能夠做到的司法的禁用友善\n\n35\n00:13:39,241 --> 00:13:46,027\n透明公開我們持續在其他的制度配套來推動好我們一起加油辛苦了謝謝謝主席好謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n10066\t36900\t好 謝謝主席 有請王複密然後請黃長賜 複密張賜 張賜不好意思委員早安 委員早大家早安 今天扣合著三個主題刑事訴訟法的修法然後立法委員成了違法委員嗎還有法庭的直播到底能不能上路 三個議題來進一提出我的質詢 下一頁有關今天有四個\n38280\t55178\t刑事訴訟法的修法的議案那我自己初步認為在116條之二羈押替代處分增訂的廢紙並註銷護照旅行文件希望能夠藉由修法來防止被告逃逸到境外這個我支持\n56072\t74472\t第二个呢,刑诉法101条之一,预防性羁押案件要增列儿少性剥削案件,避免相关的犯行者在程序进行期间再犯。那我个人也倾向支持。但第三跟第四呢,我认为就还需要再讨论。\n75453\t101944\t第449跟451條之一呢就是修正檢疫判決處刑的程序的這個部分基本上因為我不是律師我不是檢察官法官出身我基本上會尊重法律十五屆的意見那我同時也看到法務部跟司法院針對如果涉及這樣子的修法那後續也免不了要去增加很多法院相關的一些負擔\n103304\t129853\t那這些我覺得都可以再商量那第四個441條的非常上訴的這個他變動了檢查總長的裁量權限而且呢可能會混淆了非常上訴制度的功能所以用具體的個案的救濟有利與否來作為提醒非常上訴的要件我認為這真的是要挺看挺我大概把今天四個修法我兩個是100%支持\n132774\t155839\t後兩項我認為都需要再討論我表達我的立場我也看到你們的完整報告好 謝謝 下一頁那現在就交於兩位的事喔我們在宣誓就職的時候都要克尊憲法 克尊國家法規這是我的宣誓每一個立法委員都是要這樣宣誓請問在台灣我們要克尊哪一國的法律\n157827\t181202\t這簡單的ABC嘛當然是克尊中華民國的法律我真的不知道這個問題要成為今天立法院被討論的問題有民眾黨的委員呢引用中國的反分裂國家法要求行政院要遵從要克尊中國反分裂法的規定\n182663\t197695\t然後來批判說,你如果沒有去參照中國的反分裂國家法,禁制的把中國定為境外敵對勢力,這樣對台灣很不好喔,會招致一些風險喔兩位怎麼看?蜉蜜,我們來做法治教育王蜉蜜\n208840\t230103\t在台灣的立法委員在台灣的任何一個公民我們要遵守的是台灣中華民國憲法所制定的反滲透法還是要遵守中國所制定的反分裂國家法就這麼簡單因為立法委員也是國家機關的一部分所以當然是要遵守中華民國的法律\n230643\t250865\t所以我們要遵守的是中華民國立法院制定的反滲透法嘛反滲透法的第二條第一款具體的針對境外敵對勢力的要件有非常清楚的定義這是立法院自己通過的法律怎麼立法委員要成了違法委員呢來 黃次長法治教育給您20秒\n252386\t272131\t我們的確是在我們的反滲透法有對境外敵對勢力做一個立法性的定義什麼叫境外敵對勢力它包括交戰、對峙或者是主張以武力來非和平球段這個當然就會是我們反滲透法所定義的境外敵對勢力所以\n273971\t293504\t不管政治立場是什麼不管你的政黨是什麼立法委員就要克尊中華民國的法律更何況這是立法委員自己立的法立委不要成為違法的委員立法委員成為違法委員了嗎去沖北檢沖北院請問極有法第六條規範的是什麼長次\n305262\t323229\t它是有關於這個五院跟法院區區所在或周邊設置是禁止集會的除非有例外規定要不然是禁止集會的集合法第六條它規範了集會遊行的禁制區的四種樣態第一種就是重要的國家機關包括總統府\n324449\t351256\t司法院考試院行政院但是立法院不算因為立法院秉持民意所以立法院我們是歡迎大家來表達不同的你的政治立場都可以所以說第一類是政府機關第二類是重要的交通設施嘛比如說機場港口是禁制區嘛第三類是軍事設施嘛重要的軍事設施不可以集會遊行嘛第四類就是駐外使館\n352276\t376219\t對不對 我們要保護駐外使館的權益包括國際組織的駐台機構也都是極有法第六條所規範的集會遊行禁制區好 極有法是誰通過的立法院通過的立法院修法的請立法委員不要成為違法委員我今天還聽說在野黨的黨主席說他認為極有法是惡法要修\n377711\t395026\t如果說是針對第六條要求大家真的可以討論但如果是為了方便個別的政黨為了鬥臭司法施壓司法消費司法要開放法院地檢署或是司法院能夠成為自由的\n396600\t412835\t開放區我認為真的要深思兩位同意法院地檢署如果透過修法可以現在是禁制未來大家都可以要來抗議為了個案都可以來抗議你們的意見是什麼來我問秘書長覆名\n415055\t437588\t司法院是反對的 最主要是司法院是人民來禁用司法的一個場域這不適合開放法務部呢 地檢署被包圍基本上也是不宜因為這涉及到地檢署跟法院的莊嚴性另外可能會對個案懲辦檢察官或法官造成心理上的強制所以都為了捍衛司法的獨立公正\n438328\t457450\t我們都不以草率的去修集遊法有關於北檢北院或司法院可以成為集會遊行的場域我真的認為要慎重理由你們剛剛都說了但是立法院我們非常歡迎立法院從過去到現在甚至世界各國的立法院國會周遭都是\n458431\t487113\t合法可以讓大家來表達不同意見的場域包括台灣也是好下一個立法委員不要成為違法委員喔這週末就要上凱道了我再次的呼籲我們國家有法規犯罪就是犯罪違法就是違法民主不容造假不管是會選不管是作票不管是罷免案的\n488021\t507363\t未造联署都是违法行为如果立法委员上凯道是去挺作弊我想这真的是一笑大方也一笑国际今天花了一点时间我们来做法治教育接下来呢我们来进入另一个主题哦下一页\n508188\t527717\t也就是藍白領袖的高峰會那會中有人提出要推司法改革就是要法庭直播法庭直播下一頁直播真的不是萬能喔直播也解決不了所有的問題\n530031\t554733\t確實2017年司改國是會議有決議但他的決議是要先落實司法的透明跟友善再逐步來開放法庭直播這應當是當初司法國是會議一個完整的一個論述吧那但是我也找了資料當時的司改國是會議司法院有允諾要提出來研議開放法庭直播的草案你們有進行嗎\n556096\t582965\t跟委員報告這個部分因為在思改國師會議期間它是一個議題所以司法院曾經做過非常周延的一個政策研討我們委託的那個學者專家就世界上就是重要這些法治國家就是進行了一個法庭直播的一個研究案然後之後我們也邀請了各方的能不能簡單分享一下幾個重要國際國家\n584945\t611763\t就是目前來看跟我們相近的歐陸國家40省沒有人在開放的那就是即使是在美國他們有分聯邦跟邦就是聯邦的法制也都不開放原則上也都不開放那為什麼結論來講就是說特別是40省的法庭直播它對於法院的公正跟獨立性是很容易造成侵害是非常危險的\n612823\t638980\t謝謝您的簡要報告所以您也說明了司法院試圖努力去提草案但是正因為我們做了這樣的研究做了這樣的評估包括去採酌世界各國的經驗也橫著台灣的司法現況所以你們才比較保留的態度我認為是可以持續研議既然有委員有倡議我們當然可以研議但是直播不是萬能我們還是有很多面向要考慮喔下一頁\n640001\t661591\t那事實上也要替你們說一下啦在私改國是會議之後你們優先推動的司法資訊的透明公開其實已經做了相關的改革革新譬如說2021年已經修了法庭錄音錄影及其利用保存辦法那個時候也因為疫情推我們一把所以說相關的軟硬體的建制跟辦法已經有修好下一頁\n662751\t685126\t那您剛講的世界各國的經驗跟保留的意見就看台灣法官協會是非常清楚的主張公開審判不等於法庭直播大家要三思各類訴訟參與者面對媒體傳播所承受的心理壓力是否影響到證人到庭作證的意願\n686147\t714592\t被告是不是也會因此直播而面臨了全民公審導致司法的摯愛難行甚至影響判決的公正性所以說必須妥適去權衡公開直播的公益性與訴訟參與者的基本權一個是公益性大家想要直播想要透明想要公開但另外一邊訴訟當事者他才是這個案件的核心\n715669\t723822\t他的權益基本權是不容去強害的所以法官協會的意見都告訴我們還要再三思喔下一頁\n725114\t748868\t那事實上你們的預算現在也提出解凍案了史上被凍結最高的一次司法院的預算事實上這是2017年司改國是會議之後呢就已經有人替你們試算了如果說各級法院呢要事實審要法院法庭直播的話成本是非常高的你不管是自建直播系統或是採用租賃的系統那些東西一來一去\n750680\t761308\t有一個數字是如果是租賃的方式像立法院我們的直播租賃的方式如果以你法院因為呢每年平均開庭57萬4千多次我們事實審法庭有598間可能要593億啊593億啊要推動的委員請三思國家的成本能夠來負擔嗎最後一頁也就是\n775612\t792760\t有違各自法的保障將不利於事實的調查而且有違無罪推定的原則而且恐怕會影響法官的心證基於這些理由我今天再一次透過我的質詢我想我們可以持續演繹\n793840\t818280\t可以持續研議但是直播不能解決所有的問題直播不是萬能立法委員也不要一直以直播來作為直播就萬歲直播就萬能在司法的領域上我認為這個是要深思熟慮的公開透明不等於全程直播能夠做到的司法的禁用友善\n819241\t826027\t透明公開我們持續在其他的制度配套來推動好我們一起加油辛苦了謝謝謝主席好謝謝\n","txt":"好 謝謝主席 有請王複密然後請黃長賜 複密張賜 張賜不好意思委員早安 委員早大家早安 今天扣合著三個主題刑事訴訟法的修法然後立法委員成了違法委員嗎還有法庭的直播到底能不能上路 三個議題來進一提出我的質詢 下一頁有關今天有四個\n刑事訴訟法的修法的議案那我自己初步認為在116條之二羈押替代處分增訂的廢紙並註銷護照旅行文件希望能夠藉由修法來防止被告逃逸到境外這個我支持\n第二个呢,刑诉法101条之一,预防性羁押案件要增列儿少性剥削案件,避免相关的犯行者在程序进行期间再犯。那我个人也倾向支持。但第三跟第四呢,我认为就还需要再讨论。\n第449跟451條之一呢就是修正檢疫判決處刑的程序的這個部分基本上因為我不是律師我不是檢察官法官出身我基本上會尊重法律十五屆的意見那我同時也看到法務部跟司法院針對如果涉及這樣子的修法那後續也免不了要去增加很多法院相關的一些負擔\n那這些我覺得都可以再商量那第四個441條的非常上訴的這個他變動了檢查總長的裁量權限而且呢可能會混淆了非常上訴制度的功能所以用具體的個案的救濟有利與否來作為提醒非常上訴的要件我認為這真的是要挺看挺我大概把今天四個修法我兩個是100%支持\n後兩項我認為都需要再討論我表達我的立場我也看到你們的完整報告好 謝謝 下一頁那現在就交於兩位的事喔我們在宣誓就職的時候都要克尊憲法 克尊國家法規這是我的宣誓每一個立法委員都是要這樣宣誓請問在台灣我們要克尊哪一國的法律\n這簡單的ABC嘛當然是克尊中華民國的法律我真的不知道這個問題要成為今天立法院被討論的問題有民眾黨的委員呢引用中國的反分裂國家法要求行政院要遵從要克尊中國反分裂法的規定\n然後來批判說,你如果沒有去參照中國的反分裂國家法,禁制的把中國定為境外敵對勢力,這樣對台灣很不好喔,會招致一些風險喔兩位怎麼看?蜉蜜,我們來做法治教育王蜉蜜\n在台灣的立法委員在台灣的任何一個公民我們要遵守的是台灣中華民國憲法所制定的反滲透法還是要遵守中國所制定的反分裂國家法就這麼簡單因為立法委員也是國家機關的一部分所以當然是要遵守中華民國的法律\n所以我們要遵守的是中華民國立法院制定的反滲透法嘛反滲透法的第二條第一款具體的針對境外敵對勢力的要件有非常清楚的定義這是立法院自己通過的法律怎麼立法委員要成了違法委員呢來 黃次長法治教育給您20秒\n我們的確是在我們的反滲透法有對境外敵對勢力做一個立法性的定義什麼叫境外敵對勢力它包括交戰、對峙或者是主張以武力來非和平球段這個當然就會是我們反滲透法所定義的境外敵對勢力所以\n不管政治立場是什麼不管你的政黨是什麼立法委員就要克尊中華民國的法律更何況這是立法委員自己立的法立委不要成為違法的委員立法委員成為違法委員了嗎去沖北檢沖北院請問極有法第六條規範的是什麼長次\n它是有關於這個五院跟法院區區所在或周邊設置是禁止集會的除非有例外規定要不然是禁止集會的集合法第六條它規範了集會遊行的禁制區的四種樣態第一種就是重要的國家機關包括總統府\n司法院考試院行政院但是立法院不算因為立法院秉持民意所以立法院我們是歡迎大家來表達不同的你的政治立場都可以所以說第一類是政府機關第二類是重要的交通設施嘛比如說機場港口是禁制區嘛第三類是軍事設施嘛重要的軍事設施不可以集會遊行嘛第四類就是駐外使館\n對不對 我們要保護駐外使館的權益包括國際組織的駐台機構也都是極有法第六條所規範的集會遊行禁制區好 極有法是誰通過的立法院通過的立法院修法的請立法委員不要成為違法委員我今天還聽說在野黨的黨主席說他認為極有法是惡法要修\n如果說是針對第六條要求大家真的可以討論但如果是為了方便個別的政黨為了鬥臭司法施壓司法消費司法要開放法院地檢署或是司法院能夠成為自由的\n開放區我認為真的要深思兩位同意法院地檢署如果透過修法可以現在是禁制未來大家都可以要來抗議為了個案都可以來抗議你們的意見是什麼來我問秘書長覆名\n司法院是反對的 最主要是司法院是人民來禁用司法的一個場域這不適合開放法務部呢 地檢署被包圍基本上也是不宜因為這涉及到地檢署跟法院的莊嚴性另外可能會對個案懲辦檢察官或法官造成心理上的強制所以都為了捍衛司法的獨立公正\n我們都不以草率的去修集遊法有關於北檢北院或司法院可以成為集會遊行的場域我真的認為要慎重理由你們剛剛都說了但是立法院我們非常歡迎立法院從過去到現在甚至世界各國的立法院國會周遭都是\n合法可以讓大家來表達不同意見的場域包括台灣也是好下一個立法委員不要成為違法委員喔這週末就要上凱道了我再次的呼籲我們國家有法規犯罪就是犯罪違法就是違法民主不容造假不管是會選不管是作票不管是罷免案的\n未造联署都是违法行为如果立法委员上凯道是去挺作弊我想这真的是一笑大方也一笑国际今天花了一点时间我们来做法治教育接下来呢我们来进入另一个主题哦下一页\n也就是藍白領袖的高峰會那會中有人提出要推司法改革就是要法庭直播法庭直播下一頁直播真的不是萬能喔直播也解決不了所有的問題\n確實2017年司改國是會議有決議但他的決議是要先落實司法的透明跟友善再逐步來開放法庭直播這應當是當初司法國是會議一個完整的一個論述吧那但是我也找了資料當時的司改國是會議司法院有允諾要提出來研議開放法庭直播的草案你們有進行嗎\n跟委員報告這個部分因為在思改國師會議期間它是一個議題所以司法院曾經做過非常周延的一個政策研討我們委託的那個學者專家就世界上就是重要這些法治國家就是進行了一個法庭直播的一個研究案然後之後我們也邀請了各方的能不能簡單分享一下幾個重要國際國家\n就是目前來看跟我們相近的歐陸國家40省沒有人在開放的那就是即使是在美國他們有分聯邦跟邦就是聯邦的法制也都不開放原則上也都不開放那為什麼結論來講就是說特別是40省的法庭直播它對於法院的公正跟獨立性是很容易造成侵害是非常危險的\n謝謝您的簡要報告所以您也說明了司法院試圖努力去提草案但是正因為我們做了這樣的研究做了這樣的評估包括去採酌世界各國的經驗也橫著台灣的司法現況所以你們才比較保留的態度我認為是可以持續研議既然有委員有倡議我們當然可以研議但是直播不是萬能我們還是有很多面向要考慮喔下一頁\n那事實上也要替你們說一下啦在私改國是會議之後你們優先推動的司法資訊的透明公開其實已經做了相關的改革革新譬如說2021年已經修了法庭錄音錄影及其利用保存辦法那個時候也因為疫情推我們一把所以說相關的軟硬體的建制跟辦法已經有修好下一頁\n那您剛講的世界各國的經驗跟保留的意見就看台灣法官協會是非常清楚的主張公開審判不等於法庭直播大家要三思各類訴訟參與者面對媒體傳播所承受的心理壓力是否影響到證人到庭作證的意願\n被告是不是也會因此直播而面臨了全民公審導致司法的摯愛難行甚至影響判決的公正性所以說必須妥適去權衡公開直播的公益性與訴訟參與者的基本權一個是公益性大家想要直播想要透明想要公開但另外一邊訴訟當事者他才是這個案件的核心\n他的權益基本權是不容去強害的所以法官協會的意見都告訴我們還要再三思喔下一頁\n那事實上你們的預算現在也提出解凍案了史上被凍結最高的一次司法院的預算事實上這是2017年司改國是會議之後呢就已經有人替你們試算了如果說各級法院呢要事實審要法院法庭直播的話成本是非常高的你不管是自建直播系統或是採用租賃的系統那些東西一來一去\n有一個數字是如果是租賃的方式像立法院我們的直播租賃的方式如果以你法院因為呢每年平均開庭57萬4千多次我們事實審法庭有598間可能要593億啊593億啊要推動的委員請三思國家的成本能夠來負擔嗎最後一頁也就是\n有違各自法的保障將不利於事實的調查而且有違無罪推定的原則而且恐怕會影響法官的心證基於這些理由我今天再一次透過我的質詢我想我們可以持續演繹\n可以持續研議但是直播不能解決所有的問題直播不是萬能立法委員也不要一直以直播來作為直播就萬歲直播就萬能在司法的領域上我認為這個是要深思熟慮的公開透明不等於全程直播能夠做到的司法的禁用友善\n透明公開我們持續在其他的制度配套來推動好我們一起加油辛苦了謝謝謝主席好謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:10.066 --> 00:36.900\n好謝謝主席有請王複密然後請黃長賜複密張賜張賜不好意思委員早安委員早大家早安今天扣合著三個主題刑事訴訟法的修法然後立法委員成了違法委員嗎還有法庭的直播到底能不能上路三個議題來進一提出我的質詢下一頁有關今天有四個\n\n00:38.280 --> 00:55.178\n刑事訴訟法的修法的議案那我自己初步認為在116條之二羈押替代處分增訂的廢紙並註銷護照旅行文件希望能夠藉由修法來防止被告逃逸到境外這個我支持\n\n00:56.072 --> 01:14.472\n第二个呢,刑诉法101条之一,预防性羁押案件要增列儿少性剥削案件,避免相关的犯行者在程序进行期间再犯。那我个人也倾向支持。但第三跟第四呢,我认为就还需要再讨论。\n\n01:15.453 --> 01:41.944\n第449跟451條之一呢就是修正檢疫判決處刑的程序的這個部分基本上因為我不是律師我不是檢察官法官出身我基本上會尊重法律十五屆的意見那我同時也看到法務部跟司法院針對如果涉及這樣子的修法那後續也免不了要去增加很多法院相關的一些負擔\n\n01:43.304 --> 02:09.853\n那這些我覺得都可以再商量那第四個441條的非常上訴的這個他變動了檢查總長的裁量權限而且呢可能會混淆了非常上訴制度的功能所以用具體的個案的救濟有利與否來作為提醒非常上訴的要件我認為這真的是要挺看挺我大概把今天四個修法我兩個是100%支持\n\n02:12.774 --> 02:35.839\n後兩項我認為都需要再討論我表達我的立場我也看到你們的完整報告好謝謝下一頁那現在就交於兩位的事喔我們在宣誓就職的時候都要克尊憲法克尊國家法規這是我的宣誓每一個立法委員都是要這樣宣誓請問在台灣我們要克尊哪一國的法律\n\n02:37.827 --> 03:01.202\n這簡單的ABC嘛當然是克尊中華民國的法律我真的不知道這個問題要成為今天立法院被討論的問題有民眾黨的委員呢引用中國的反分裂國家法要求行政院要遵從要克尊中國反分裂法的規定\n\n03:02.663 --> 03:17.695\n然後來批判說,你如果沒有去參照中國的反分裂國家法,禁制的把中國定為境外敵對勢力,這樣對台灣很不好喔,會招致一些風險喔兩位怎麼看?蜉蜜,我們來做法治教育王蜉蜜\n\n03:28.840 --> 03:50.103\n在台灣的立法委員在台灣的任何一個公民我們要遵守的是台灣中華民國憲法所制定的反滲透法還是要遵守中國所制定的反分裂國家法就這麼簡單因為立法委員也是國家機關的一部分所以當然是要遵守中華民國的法律\n\n03:50.643 --> 04:10.865\n所以我們要遵守的是中華民國立法院制定的反滲透法嘛反滲透法的第二條第一款具體的針對境外敵對勢力的要件有非常清楚的定義這是立法院自己通過的法律怎麼立法委員要成了違法委員呢來黃次長法治教育給您20秒\n\n04:12.386 --> 04:32.131\n我們的確是在我們的反滲透法有對境外敵對勢力做一個立法性的定義什麼叫境外敵對勢力它包括交戰、對峙或者是主張以武力來非和平球段這個當然就會是我們反滲透法所定義的境外敵對勢力所以\n\n04:33.971 --> 04:53.504\n不管政治立場是什麼不管你的政黨是什麼立法委員就要克尊中華民國的法律更何況這是立法委員自己立的法立委不要成為違法的委員立法委員成為違法委員了嗎去沖北檢沖北院請問極有法第六條規範的是什麼長次\n\n05:05.262 --> 05:23.229\n它是有關於這個五院跟法院區區所在或周邊設置是禁止集會的除非有例外規定要不然是禁止集會的集合法第六條它規範了集會遊行的禁制區的四種樣態第一種就是重要的國家機關包括總統府\n\n05:24.449 --> 05:51.256\n司法院考試院行政院但是立法院不算因為立法院秉持民意所以立法院我們是歡迎大家來表達不同的你的政治立場都可以所以說第一類是政府機關第二類是重要的交通設施嘛比如說機場港口是禁制區嘛第三類是軍事設施嘛重要的軍事設施不可以集會遊行嘛第四類就是駐外使館\n\n05:52.276 --> 06:16.219\n對不對我們要保護駐外使館的權益包括國際組織的駐台機構也都是極有法第六條所規範的集會遊行禁制區好極有法是誰通過的立法院通過的立法院修法的請立法委員不要成為違法委員我今天還聽說在野黨的黨主席說他認為極有法是惡法要修\n\n06:17.711 --> 06:35.026\n如果說是針對第六條要求大家真的可以討論但如果是為了方便個別的政黨為了鬥臭司法施壓司法消費司法要開放法院地檢署或是司法院能夠成為自由的\n\n06:36.600 --> 06:52.835\n開放區我認為真的要深思兩位同意法院地檢署如果透過修法可以現在是禁制未來大家都可以要來抗議為了個案都可以來抗議你們的意見是什麼來我問秘書長覆名\n\n06:55.055 --> 07:17.588\n司法院是反對的最主要是司法院是人民來禁用司法的一個場域這不適合開放法務部呢地檢署被包圍基本上也是不宜因為這涉及到地檢署跟法院的莊嚴性另外可能會對個案懲辦檢察官或法官造成心理上的強制所以都為了捍衛司法的獨立公正\n\n07:18.328 --> 07:37.450\n我們都不以草率的去修集遊法有關於北檢北院或司法院可以成為集會遊行的場域我真的認為要慎重理由你們剛剛都說了但是立法院我們非常歡迎立法院從過去到現在甚至世界各國的立法院國會周遭都是\n\n07:38.431 --> 08:07.113\n合法可以讓大家來表達不同意見的場域包括台灣也是好下一個立法委員不要成為違法委員喔這週末就要上凱道了我再次的呼籲我們國家有法規犯罪就是犯罪違法就是違法民主不容造假不管是會選不管是作票不管是罷免案的\n\n08:08.021 --> 08:27.363\n未造联署都是违法行为如果立法委员上凯道是去挺作弊我想这真的是一笑大方也一笑国际今天花了一点时间我们来做法治教育接下来呢我们来进入另一个主题哦下一页\n\n08:28.188 --> 08:47.717\n也就是藍白領袖的高峰會那會中有人提出要推司法改革就是要法庭直播法庭直播下一頁直播真的不是萬能喔直播也解決不了所有的問題\n\n08:50.031 --> 09:14.733\n確實2017年司改國是會議有決議但他的決議是要先落實司法的透明跟友善再逐步來開放法庭直播這應當是當初司法國是會議一個完整的一個論述吧那但是我也找了資料當時的司改國是會議司法院有允諾要提出來研議開放法庭直播的草案你們有進行嗎\n\n09:16.096 --> 09:42.965\n跟委員報告這個部分因為在思改國師會議期間它是一個議題所以司法院曾經做過非常周延的一個政策研討我們委託的那個學者專家就世界上就是重要這些法治國家就是進行了一個法庭直播的一個研究案然後之後我們也邀請了各方的能不能簡單分享一下幾個重要國際國家\n\n09:44.945 --> 10:11.763\n就是目前來看跟我們相近的歐陸國家40省沒有人在開放的那就是即使是在美國他們有分聯邦跟邦就是聯邦的法制也都不開放原則上也都不開放那為什麼結論來講就是說特別是40省的法庭直播它對於法院的公正跟獨立性是很容易造成侵害是非常危險的\n\n10:12.823 --> 10:38.980\n謝謝您的簡要報告所以您也說明了司法院試圖努力去提草案但是正因為我們做了這樣的研究做了這樣的評估包括去採酌世界各國的經驗也橫著台灣的司法現況所以你們才比較保留的態度我認為是可以持續研議既然有委員有倡議我們當然可以研議但是直播不是萬能我們還是有很多面向要考慮喔下一頁\n\n10:40.001 --> 11:01.591\n那事實上也要替你們說一下啦在私改國是會議之後你們優先推動的司法資訊的透明公開其實已經做了相關的改革革新譬如說2021年已經修了法庭錄音錄影及其利用保存辦法那個時候也因為疫情推我們一把所以說相關的軟硬體的建制跟辦法已經有修好下一頁\n\n11:02.751 --> 11:25.126\n那您剛講的世界各國的經驗跟保留的意見就看台灣法官協會是非常清楚的主張公開審判不等於法庭直播大家要三思各類訴訟參與者面對媒體傳播所承受的心理壓力是否影響到證人到庭作證的意願\n\n11:26.147 --> 11:54.592\n被告是不是也會因此直播而面臨了全民公審導致司法的摯愛難行甚至影響判決的公正性所以說必須妥適去權衡公開直播的公益性與訴訟參與者的基本權一個是公益性大家想要直播想要透明想要公開但另外一邊訴訟當事者他才是這個案件的核心\n\n11:55.669 --> 12:03.822\n他的權益基本權是不容去強害的所以法官協會的意見都告訴我們還要再三思喔下一頁\n\n12:05.114 --> 12:28.868\n那事實上你們的預算現在也提出解凍案了史上被凍結最高的一次司法院的預算事實上這是2017年司改國是會議之後呢就已經有人替你們試算了如果說各級法院呢要事實審要法院法庭直播的話成本是非常高的你不管是自建直播系統或是採用租賃的系統那些東西一來一去\n\n12:30.680 --> 12:41.308\n有一個數字是如果是租賃的方式像立法院我們的直播租賃的方式如果以你法院因為呢每年平均開庭57萬4千多次我們事實審法庭有598間可能要593億啊593億啊要推動的委員請三思國家的成本能夠來負擔嗎最後一頁也就是\n\n12:55.612 --> 13:12.760\n有違各自法的保障將不利於事實的調查而且有違無罪推定的原則而且恐怕會影響法官的心證基於這些理由我今天再一次透過我的質詢我想我們可以持續演繹\n\n13:13.840 --> 13:38.280\n可以持續研議但是直播不能解決所有的問題直播不是萬能立法委員也不要一直以直播來作為直播就萬歲直播就萬能在司法的領域上我認為這個是要深思熟慮的公開透明不等於全程直播能夠做到的司法的禁用友善\n\n13:39.241 --> 13:46.027\n透明公開我們持續在其他的制度配套來推動好我們一起加油辛苦了謝謝謝主席好謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":10.066,"end":36.9,"text":"好 謝謝主席 有請王複密然後請黃長賜 複密張賜 張賜不好意思委員早安 委員早大家早安 今天扣合著三個主題刑事訴訟法的修法然後立法委員成了違法委員嗎還有法庭的直播到底能不能上路 三個議題來進一提出我的質詢 下一頁有關今天有四個"},{"start":38.28,"end":55.178,"text":"刑事訴訟法的修法的議案那我自己初步認為在116條之二羈押替代處分增訂的廢紙並註銷護照旅行文件希望能夠藉由修法來防止被告逃逸到境外這個我支持"},{"start":56.072,"end":74.472,"text":"第二个呢,刑诉法101条之一,预防性羁押案件要增列儿少性剥削案件,避免相关的犯行者在程序进行期间再犯。那我个人也倾向支持。但第三跟第四呢,我认为就还需要再讨论。"},{"start":75.453,"end":101.944,"text":"第449跟451條之一呢就是修正檢疫判決處刑的程序的這個部分基本上因為我不是律師我不是檢察官法官出身我基本上會尊重法律十五屆的意見那我同時也看到法務部跟司法院針對如果涉及這樣子的修法那後續也免不了要去增加很多法院相關的一些負擔"},{"start":103.304,"end":129.853,"text":"那這些我覺得都可以再商量那第四個441條的非常上訴的這個他變動了檢查總長的裁量權限而且呢可能會混淆了非常上訴制度的功能所以用具體的個案的救濟有利與否來作為提醒非常上訴的要件我認為這真的是要挺看挺我大概把今天四個修法我兩個是100%支持"},{"start":132.774,"end":155.839,"text":"後兩項我認為都需要再討論我表達我的立場我也看到你們的完整報告好 謝謝 下一頁那現在就交於兩位的事喔我們在宣誓就職的時候都要克尊憲法 克尊國家法規這是我的宣誓每一個立法委員都是要這樣宣誓請問在台灣我們要克尊哪一國的法律"},{"start":157.827,"end":181.202,"text":"這簡單的ABC嘛當然是克尊中華民國的法律我真的不知道這個問題要成為今天立法院被討論的問題有民眾黨的委員呢引用中國的反分裂國家法要求行政院要遵從要克尊中國反分裂法的規定"},{"start":182.663,"end":197.695,"text":"然後來批判說,你如果沒有去參照中國的反分裂國家法,禁制的把中國定為境外敵對勢力,這樣對台灣很不好喔,會招致一些風險喔兩位怎麼看?蜉蜜,我們來做法治教育王蜉蜜"},{"start":208.84,"end":230.103,"text":"在台灣的立法委員在台灣的任何一個公民我們要遵守的是台灣中華民國憲法所制定的反滲透法還是要遵守中國所制定的反分裂國家法就這麼簡單因為立法委員也是國家機關的一部分所以當然是要遵守中華民國的法律"},{"start":230.643,"end":250.865,"text":"所以我們要遵守的是中華民國立法院制定的反滲透法嘛反滲透法的第二條第一款具體的針對境外敵對勢力的要件有非常清楚的定義這是立法院自己通過的法律怎麼立法委員要成了違法委員呢來 黃次長法治教育給您20秒"},{"start":252.386,"end":272.131,"text":"我們的確是在我們的反滲透法有對境外敵對勢力做一個立法性的定義什麼叫境外敵對勢力它包括交戰、對峙或者是主張以武力來非和平球段這個當然就會是我們反滲透法所定義的境外敵對勢力所以"},{"start":273.971,"end":293.504,"text":"不管政治立場是什麼不管你的政黨是什麼立法委員就要克尊中華民國的法律更何況這是立法委員自己立的法立委不要成為違法的委員立法委員成為違法委員了嗎去沖北檢沖北院請問極有法第六條規範的是什麼長次"},{"start":305.262,"end":323.229,"text":"它是有關於這個五院跟法院區區所在或周邊設置是禁止集會的除非有例外規定要不然是禁止集會的集合法第六條它規範了集會遊行的禁制區的四種樣態第一種就是重要的國家機關包括總統府"},{"start":324.449,"end":351.256,"text":"司法院考試院行政院但是立法院不算因為立法院秉持民意所以立法院我們是歡迎大家來表達不同的你的政治立場都可以所以說第一類是政府機關第二類是重要的交通設施嘛比如說機場港口是禁制區嘛第三類是軍事設施嘛重要的軍事設施不可以集會遊行嘛第四類就是駐外使館"},{"start":352.276,"end":376.219,"text":"對不對 我們要保護駐外使館的權益包括國際組織的駐台機構也都是極有法第六條所規範的集會遊行禁制區好 極有法是誰通過的立法院通過的立法院修法的請立法委員不要成為違法委員我今天還聽說在野黨的黨主席說他認為極有法是惡法要修"},{"start":377.711,"end":395.026,"text":"如果說是針對第六條要求大家真的可以討論但如果是為了方便個別的政黨為了鬥臭司法施壓司法消費司法要開放法院地檢署或是司法院能夠成為自由的"},{"start":396.6,"end":412.835,"text":"開放區我認為真的要深思兩位同意法院地檢署如果透過修法可以現在是禁制未來大家都可以要來抗議為了個案都可以來抗議你們的意見是什麼來我問秘書長覆名"},{"start":415.055,"end":437.588,"text":"司法院是反對的 最主要是司法院是人民來禁用司法的一個場域這不適合開放法務部呢 地檢署被包圍基本上也是不宜因為這涉及到地檢署跟法院的莊嚴性另外可能會對個案懲辦檢察官或法官造成心理上的強制所以都為了捍衛司法的獨立公正"},{"start":438.328,"end":457.45,"text":"我們都不以草率的去修集遊法有關於北檢北院或司法院可以成為集會遊行的場域我真的認為要慎重理由你們剛剛都說了但是立法院我們非常歡迎立法院從過去到現在甚至世界各國的立法院國會周遭都是"},{"start":458.431,"end":487.113,"text":"合法可以讓大家來表達不同意見的場域包括台灣也是好下一個立法委員不要成為違法委員喔這週末就要上凱道了我再次的呼籲我們國家有法規犯罪就是犯罪違法就是違法民主不容造假不管是會選不管是作票不管是罷免案的"},{"start":488.021,"end":507.363,"text":"未造联署都是违法行为如果立法委员上凯道是去挺作弊我想这真的是一笑大方也一笑国际今天花了一点时间我们来做法治教育接下来呢我们来进入另一个主题哦下一页"},{"start":508.188,"end":527.717,"text":"也就是藍白領袖的高峰會那會中有人提出要推司法改革就是要法庭直播法庭直播下一頁直播真的不是萬能喔直播也解決不了所有的問題"},{"start":530.031,"end":554.733,"text":"確實2017年司改國是會議有決議但他的決議是要先落實司法的透明跟友善再逐步來開放法庭直播這應當是當初司法國是會議一個完整的一個論述吧那但是我也找了資料當時的司改國是會議司法院有允諾要提出來研議開放法庭直播的草案你們有進行嗎"},{"start":556.096,"end":582.965,"text":"跟委員報告這個部分因為在思改國師會議期間它是一個議題所以司法院曾經做過非常周延的一個政策研討我們委託的那個學者專家就世界上就是重要這些法治國家就是進行了一個法庭直播的一個研究案然後之後我們也邀請了各方的能不能簡單分享一下幾個重要國際國家"},{"start":584.945,"end":611.763,"text":"就是目前來看跟我們相近的歐陸國家40省沒有人在開放的那就是即使是在美國他們有分聯邦跟邦就是聯邦的法制也都不開放原則上也都不開放那為什麼結論來講就是說特別是40省的法庭直播它對於法院的公正跟獨立性是很容易造成侵害是非常危險的"},{"start":612.823,"end":638.98,"text":"謝謝您的簡要報告所以您也說明了司法院試圖努力去提草案但是正因為我們做了這樣的研究做了這樣的評估包括去採酌世界各國的經驗也橫著台灣的司法現況所以你們才比較保留的態度我認為是可以持續研議既然有委員有倡議我們當然可以研議但是直播不是萬能我們還是有很多面向要考慮喔下一頁"},{"start":640.001,"end":661.591,"text":"那事實上也要替你們說一下啦在私改國是會議之後你們優先推動的司法資訊的透明公開其實已經做了相關的改革革新譬如說2021年已經修了法庭錄音錄影及其利用保存辦法那個時候也因為疫情推我們一把所以說相關的軟硬體的建制跟辦法已經有修好下一頁"},{"start":662.751,"end":685.126,"text":"那您剛講的世界各國的經驗跟保留的意見就看台灣法官協會是非常清楚的主張公開審判不等於法庭直播大家要三思各類訴訟參與者面對媒體傳播所承受的心理壓力是否影響到證人到庭作證的意願"},{"start":686.147,"end":714.592,"text":"被告是不是也會因此直播而面臨了全民公審導致司法的摯愛難行甚至影響判決的公正性所以說必須妥適去權衡公開直播的公益性與訴訟參與者的基本權一個是公益性大家想要直播想要透明想要公開但另外一邊訴訟當事者他才是這個案件的核心"},{"start":715.669,"end":723.822,"text":"他的權益基本權是不容去強害的所以法官協會的意見都告訴我們還要再三思喔下一頁"},{"start":725.114,"end":748.868,"text":"那事實上你們的預算現在也提出解凍案了史上被凍結最高的一次司法院的預算事實上這是2017年司改國是會議之後呢就已經有人替你們試算了如果說各級法院呢要事實審要法院法庭直播的話成本是非常高的你不管是自建直播系統或是採用租賃的系統那些東西一來一去"},{"start":750.68,"end":761.308,"text":"有一個數字是如果是租賃的方式像立法院我們的直播租賃的方式如果以你法院因為呢每年平均開庭57萬4千多次我們事實審法庭有598間可能要593億啊593億啊要推動的委員請三思國家的成本能夠來負擔嗎最後一頁也就是"},{"start":775.612,"end":792.76,"text":"有違各自法的保障將不利於事實的調查而且有違無罪推定的原則而且恐怕會影響法官的心證基於這些理由我今天再一次透過我的質詢我想我們可以持續演繹"},{"start":793.84,"end":818.28,"text":"可以持續研議但是直播不能解決所有的問題直播不是萬能立法委員也不要一直以直播來作為直播就萬歲直播就萬能在司法的領域上我認為這個是要深思熟慮的公開透明不等於全程直播能夠做到的司法的禁用友善"},{"start":819.241,"end":826.027,"text":"透明公開我們持續在其他的制度配套來推動好我們一起加油辛苦了謝謝謝主席好謝謝"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":614,"blocks":[["吳委員思瑤：（10時55分）謝謝主席，有請王副秘、請黃常次。"],["主席：請副秘、常次。"],["王副秘書長梅英：委員早安。"],["黃次長謀信：委員早。"],["吳委員思瑤：大家早安。今天扣合著三個主題──刑事訴訟法的修法；立法委員成了違法委員嗎？還有法庭的直播到底能不能上路？就這三個議題提出我的質詢。","今天有四個刑事訴訟法修法的議案，我自己初步認為，在第一百十六條之二，羈押替代處分增訂「得廢止並註銷護照、旅行文件」，希望能夠藉由修法來防止被告逃逸到境外。這個我支持。第二個，刑訴法第一百零一條之一，預防性羈押案件要增列「兒少性剝削案件」，避免相關的犯行者在程序進行期間再犯。我個人也傾向支持。","但第三跟第四我認為還需要再討論，第四百四十九條跟第四百五十一條之一就是修正簡易判決處刑的程序部分，因為我不是律師，不是檢察官、法官出身，我基本上會尊重法律實務界的意見，我同時也看到，法務部跟司法院針對如果涉及這樣子修法，後續也免不了要增加很多法院相關的負擔，這些我覺得都可以再商量。","第四個，第四百四十一條非常上訴的部分，它變動了檢察總長的裁量權限，而且可能會混淆非常上訴制度的功能，所以用具體個案的救濟有利與否來作為提起非常上訴的要件，我認為這真的是要停看聽。今天的四個修法，我對前兩個是100%支持，後兩項我認為都需要再討論，我表達我的立場，我也看到你們的完整報告，謝謝。","現在要就教於兩位的是，我們在宣誓就職的時候都說要恪遵憲法、恪遵國家法規，這是我的宣誓，每一個立法委員都要這樣宣誓。請問在臺灣我們要恪遵哪一國的法律？這是簡單的ABC嘛！當然是恪遵中華民國的法律，我真的不知道這個問題要成為今天立法院被討論的問題。有民眾黨的委員引用中國的反分裂國家法，要求行政院要遵從、要恪遵中國反分裂國家法的規定，然後來批判說，你如果沒有去參照中國反分裂國家法，逕自把中國定為境外敵對勢力，這樣對臺灣很不好，會招致一些風險。兩位怎麼看？王副秘，我們來做法治教育。在臺灣的立法委員、在臺灣的任何一個公民，我們要遵守的是臺灣中華民國憲法所制定的反滲透法，還是要遵守中國所制定的反分裂國家法？就這麼簡單。"],["王副秘書長梅英：因為立法委員也是國家機關的一部分，所以當然是要遵守中華民國的法律。"],["吳委員思瑤：所以我們要遵守的是中華民國立法院制定的反滲透法嘛！反滲透法的第二條第一款具體的針對境外敵對勢力的要件有非常清楚的定義，這是立法院自己通過的法律，怎麼立法委員成了違法委員呢？來，黃次長，法治教育，給您20秒。"],["黃次長謀信：我們的確是在反滲透法有對境外敵對勢力做一個立法性的定義，什麼叫境外敵對勢力？包括交戰、對峙，或者是主張以武力來……"],["吳委員思瑤：非和平手段。"],["黃次長謀信：對，這個當然就會是我們的反滲透法所定義的境外敵對勢力。"],["吳委員思瑤：所以不管政治立場是什麼，不管你的政黨是什麼，立法委員就要恪遵中華民國的法律，更何況這是立法委員自己立的法，立委不要成為違法的委員。請看下一頁，立法委員成為違法委員了嗎？去衝北檢、衝北院，請問集遊法第六條規範的是什麼？常次，是禁制區？"],["黃次長謀信：就是有關於五院跟法院所在地區或周邊設施是禁止集會的，除非有例外規定，要不然是禁止集會的。"],["吳委員思瑤：集遊法第六條規範了集會遊行禁制區的四種樣態，第一種就是重要的國家機關，包括總統府、司法院、考試院、行政院，但是立法院不算，因為立法院秉持民意，所以我們是歡迎大家來立法院表達你的政治立場，不同的意見都可以，所以第一類是政府機關；第二類是重要的交通設施，譬如說機場、港口是禁制區；第三類是軍事設施，在重要的軍事設施不可以集會遊行；第四類就是駐外使館，對不對？因為我們要保護駐外使館的權益，包括國際組織的駐臺機構，也都是集遊法第六條所規範的集會遊行禁制區。","好，集遊法是誰通過的？是立法院通過的，是立法院修法的，請立法委員不要成為違法委員。我今天還聽說在野黨的黨主席說他認為集遊法是惡法所以要修，如果針對第六條要修，大家真的可以討論，但如果是為了方便讓個別的政黨鬥臭司法、施壓司法、消費司法，要開放法院、地檢署或是司法院能夠成為集遊的開放區，我認為真的要深思，現在法院、地檢署是禁制區，兩位同意透過修法讓大家未來都可以為了個案來抗議嗎？你們的意見是什麼？來，我請問副秘書長。"],["王副秘書長梅英：司法院是反對的，最主要是因為司法院是人民來近用司法的場域，所以不適合開放。"],["吳委員思瑤：那法務部呢？地檢署被包圍。"],["黃次長謀信：基本上也是不宜，因為這涉及到地檢署跟法院的莊嚴性，另外也有可能對個案承辦檢察官或法官造成心理上的強制。"],["吳委員思瑤：會形成壓力，所以為了捍衛司法的獨立公正，我們都不宜草率地去修集遊法讓北檢、北院或司法院成為可以集會遊行的場域，我真的認為要慎重，理由你們剛剛都說了。但是如果是立法院，我們就非常歡迎，因為立法院從過去到現在，甚至世界各國的立法院、國會周遭都是合法可以讓大家來表達不同意見的場域，包括臺灣也是。","好，我再講下一個，立法委員不要成為違法委員，在這週末就要上凱道了，我要再次地呼籲，我們國家有法規，犯罪就是犯罪，違法就是違法，民主不容造假，不管是賄選，不管是作票，不管是罷免案的偽造連署，都是違法行為，如果立法委員上凱道是去挺作弊，我想這真的是貽笑大方，也貽笑國際。","今天我們花了一點時間來做法治教育，接下來我們進入另一個主題，請看下一頁，最近有一場藍白領袖的高峰會，在會中有人提出要推司法改革，就是要法庭直播。請看下一頁，直播真的不是萬能，直播也解決不了所有的問題，確實2017年司改國是會議有決議，但它的決議是要先落實司法的透明跟友善，再逐步來開放法庭直播，這應當是當初司法國是會議一個完整的論述吧？"],["王副秘書長梅英：是。"],["吳委員思瑤：但是我也找了資料，當時在司改國是會議中司法院有允諾要研議、提出開放法庭直播的草案，你們有進行嗎？"],["王副秘書長梅英：跟委員報告，因為在司改國是會議期間這個部分是一個議題，所以司法院曾經做過一個非常周延的政策研討，我們委託學者專家就世界上重要的法治國家進行了一個法庭直播的研究案，之後我們也邀請了各方的……"],["吳委員思瑤：你要不要簡單分享一下幾個國際上重要的國家？"],["王副秘書長梅英：好，就目前來看，在跟我們相近的歐陸國家中，事實審是沒有國家在開放的。"],["吳委員思瑤：是。"],["王副秘書長梅英：即使是在美國，他們有分聯邦跟邦，聯邦的法制原則上也都不開放。"],["吳委員思瑤：也沒有直播。"],["王副秘書長梅英：那是為什麼呢？以結論來講，特別是事實審的法庭直播，它對於法院的公正跟獨立性很容易造成侵害，是非常危險的。"],["吳委員思瑤：是，謝謝您的簡要報告，所以您也說明了，司法院試圖努力去提草案，但是正因為我們做了這樣的研究，做了這樣的評估，包括去採擢世界各國的經驗，也衡酌臺灣的司法現況，所以你們採比較保留的態度，我認為是可以持續研議，既然有委員倡議，我們當然可以研議，但是直播不是萬能，我們還是有很多面向要考慮。","事實上，我也要替你們說一下，在司改國是會議之後，你們優先推動的司法資訊透明公開其實已經做了相關的改革、革新，譬如說2021年已經修了「法庭錄音錄影及其利用保存辦法」，那個時候因為疫情推了我們一把，所以除了軟硬體的建置外，相關辦法也已經有修了。好，下一頁，那您剛剛講了世界各國的經驗跟保留的意見，我們就來看臺灣，法官協會非常清楚的主張公開審判不等於法庭直播，大家要三思，必須考慮各類訴訟參與者面對媒體傳播所承受的心理壓力，是否會影響證人到庭作證的意願，被告是不是也會因為直播而面臨全民公審，導致司法的窒礙難行，甚至影響判決的公正性，所以必須妥適去權衡公開直播的公益性與訴訟參與者的基本權。一個是公益性，就是大家想要直播、想要透明、想要公開，但另外一邊是訴訟當事者，他才是這個案件的核心，他的基本權益是不容去戕害的，所以法官協會的意見都告訴我們還要再三思。","事實上，你們的預算現在也提出解凍案了，這次司法院預算被凍結的金額是史上最高的一次，其實在2017年司改國是會議之後就已經有人替你們試算了，如果各級法院事實審要法庭直播的話，成本是非常高的，不管是自建直播系統或是採用租賃的系統，那都是「億來億去」，有一個數字可以參考，就是如果用租賃的方式，像我們立法院直播這種用租賃的方式，如果以你們法院每年平均開庭五十七萬四千多次，事實審法庭有598間，可能就要593億！所以請要推動的委員三思，國家能夠來負擔這樣的成本嗎？","請看最後一頁，有違個資法的保障，將不利於事實的調查，而且有違無罪推定的原則，恐怕會影響法官的心證，基於這些理由，我今天再一次透過我的質詢，我想我們可以持續研議，但是直播不能解決所有的問題，直播不是萬能，立法委員也不要一直以為直播就萬歲、直播就萬能，在司法的領域上，我認為這個是要深思熟慮的，公開透明不等於全程直播，要能夠做到司法的近用、友善、透明、公開，我們持續在其他的制度配套來推動。好，我們一起加油，辛苦了！謝謝。"],["王副秘書長梅英：謝謝委員。"],["吳委員思瑤：謝謝主席。"],["主席：好，謝謝。","接下來請羅智強委員代理主席，他來了嗎？他剛剛已經有跟我說好了，沒關係，那我們先休息5分鐘。","休息（11時9分）","繼續開會（11時14分）"],["主席（羅委員智強代）：有請吳宗憲委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":60,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-36-11","speakers":["吳宗憲","羅智強","王義川","陳培瑜","黃國昌","沈發惠","王鴻薇","翁曉玲","莊瑞雄","吳思瑤","傅崐萁","林淑芬"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2025-04-24"],"gazette_id":"1144301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144301_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期司法及法制委員會第11次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、併案審查( 一) 委員羅智強等25 人擬具「刑事訴訟法第一百十六條之二條文修正草案」案、\n(二)委員謝衣鳯等16人擬具「刑事訴訟法第一百十六條之二條文修正草案」案；二、審查委員陳\n培瑜等16人擬具「刑事訴訟法第一百零一條之一條文修正草案」案；三、審查委員陳亭妃等16人\n擬具「刑事訴訟法第四百四十九條及第四百五十一條之一條文修正草案」案；四、審查委員許智\n傑等22人擬具「刑事訴訟法第四百四十一條條文修正草案」案【僅進行詢答】","agenda_id":"1144301_00001"}}}