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00:00:33,212\n謝謝主席我請農業部杜次長來我們經貿辦嚴首席代表次長我們民眾館都要關市地市污都很多我們的養殖業也發達\n\n2\n00:00:50,990 --> 00:01:20,009\n那我們台灣現在的漁業差不多近海捕魚近海魚撈跟遠洋魚撈差不多占45%差不多嘛那鄉網養殖跟岸上養殖差不多占55%那這件呢美國這樣搞下去我們才發現說這個農業是要好好的保護啦我跟你講一個data\n\n3\n00:01:21,274 --> 00:01:47,467\n加薩走廊加薩走廊現在的難民差不多兩百萬人差不多190到210以色列是要炸哪裡就炸哪裡要殺誰就殺誰小孩子嬰兒都不放過這就是戰爭已經死了十萬人左右啦那加薩走廊什麼都沒有那每天需要的水\n\n4\n00:01:49,090 --> 00:02:08,064\n每天需要的糧食差不多沒辦法供應30%所以我們的農業台灣的農業重不重要當然重要我去日本我看到日本的米啊它的價格差不多泰國的五倍\n\n5\n00:02:09,431 --> 00:02:29,079\n我去看日本人離開泰國,卡榜裡面都排什麼呢?排米!因為日本的米太貴,又太好吃了所以要拿泰國米來討所以農業一定要保護這一次我們屏東的毛豆,差不多佔了51%差不多一年的6000公噸\n\n6\n00:02:34,541 --> 00:02:40,427\n蘿蔔魚整套桌子還有台灣雕我們平常也有一些在那裡妳怎麼會這麼豐富呢一定的妳也幫得上忙你們編了180億夠嗎\n\n7\n00:02:50,896 --> 00:03:03,164\n謝謝委員支持臺灣農業這是一定要做因為農業真的不是說是吃飽吃好其實是一個糧食安全和國家安全的基礎那當然也是一個文化傳承那181到底夠不夠我相信這樣說現時我們是先變這件事希望是渡費這個困難\n\n8\n00:03:07,927 --> 00:03:23,157\n都怪這個困難這個是短時間之內那以這個美國現在10%的關稅來看先這樣做長期來看支持農業一直要往前走這絕對不是只有180億現在要做的事情農業部肯定要一直跟我們台灣農業站在一起\n\n9\n00:03:23,937 --> 00:03:37,935\n對啦,所以我們經貿辦這邊談判,我們台灣的農業,剛才很多委員講已經是對美國是入操了嘛,所以我們才有底氣嘛,美國是前九十萬的低價估估,\n\n10\n00:03:41,920 --> 00:03:52,833\n我記得在第八屆立委的時候,我非常欽佩田秋晴委員、陳潔如委員我在當召委,他們堅持就是要零檢出邱部長你也是說要零檢出嘛但是2021年開放,什麼40個PPB、10個PPB\n\n11\n00:04:04,353 --> 00:04:32,777\n現在進來的,剛剛你講的大部分也都是沒有用萊克多巴胺嘛,對不對只有美國進來的有,是這樣酒都要保留在裡面,我只推廣我也贊成我也來Promote只有台灣豬啦我都要保留在裡面,我不會替美國人說話啦我在舊金山Fremont那邊看那個超市我去看他們,真的跑去看他們的超市的豬肉跟牛肉\n\n12\n00:04:33,649 --> 00:04:52,337\n他標示得很清楚,這個有用瘦肉精的,這個沒有瘦肉精的,分開然後你要買,實在是另一回事,你要吃瘦肉精的,吃瘦肉精的這個我跟大家報告,那個有加瘦肉精的,那個價格是比沒有加瘦肉精的還貴一點\n\n13\n00:04:54,810 --> 00:05:08,545\n真的是瘦肉,油花比較少,因為有代謝所以要標示最重要,我們自己的所有商業都要保護你進口的美國豬肉\n\n14\n00:05:15,851 --> 00:05:30,235\n八千多噸嘛,每一年進來,剛才王毅民一直在追,一直在追說都遭遇到,都遭遇到營養午餐啦,遭遇到7-11,燉完啦營養午餐不能用進口,營養午餐臟Q一定是我們台灣國產的,農業副理事也只推廣台灣豬\n\n15\n00:05:40,509 --> 00:06:00,649\n好希望是這樣啦那我們現在養豬的頭數你說6000多個養豬場屏東都佔了20幾%左右屏東的場數最多最多嘛那我們一直在關心現在我們的豬肉也可以銷日本冷藏的就可以銷日本啦要不然加工的啦不不不重點是價位\n\n16\n00:06:05,303 --> 00:06:23,094\n這裡一廂,這裡一廂有出去,還有新加坡,去新加坡新加坡跟菲律賓我有去參加,台灣的豬肉本身品質也非常好那外務部的標示跟農委會的標示,欸你標示這是什麼意思啦是農委會比較厲害,還是外務部比較厲害為什麼標示都不一樣\n\n17\n00:06:28,370 --> 00:06:36,374\n這樣就能夠證明是我們台灣豬啊不然那...北省不那麼聰明啦北省就簡單就好看得到就好大大隻台灣豬很清楚那我們經貿辦談判一定要捍衛這個我們的糧食一定要保護我剛剛講那個家造走廊那個就是完全沒有生產力\n\n18\n00:06:57,076 --> 00:07:24,649\n它是200多平方公里上面住了200多萬人然後所有的一點一滴都是從外面輸進來你知道一天只有貨櫃車幾千台貨櫃車從西奈半島這邊上去然後以色列要過不過的要進不進的每一個人的飲用水都不到20公升然後他的糧食能夠拿到的人不到30%\n\n19\n00:07:26,547 --> 00:07:52,739\n要就是要讓那些人都死死的讓那些人都遷就讓那些人移民、駐紮走廊、以色列永久佔領是不是這樣我不知道但是看那個樣子是這樣就硬幹所以打仗封鎖是非常非常的殘酷我們如果現在都零關稅全部的米美國的米都一百美國的什麼東西都一百台灣整個農業都崩盤\n\n20\n00:07:54,758 --> 00:08:14,459\n我們真的被封鎖的時候,真的打仗的時候,我們是死的,我們的人口數是袈裟走廊的十二倍,所以這個經貿辦你們要以國家的,日本有些人很硬啊,日本講到農業,他們聽就不要聽啦,他就跟他拚,所以你看你們的立場,這個很重要。\n\n21\n00:08:15,470 --> 00:08:33,616\n跟委員報告我想不論是我們現在跟美國之間是出超關係或入超關係我們一定都是據理理真更何況我們現在農產品對美國來說完全是對他來說是一個順差的這個情況之下所以我覺得這個是第一個我們會跟美國去訴求我們跟他\n\n22\n00:08:34,116 --> 00:09:03,599\n在很多的領域上面都是戰略夥伴的關係所以這是第一個我們一定會努力的去爭取第二個我想對於農產或農業它絕對不是一個單純的市場開放的問題所以我們還會兼顧到產業發展以及您剛才提到的這些糧食安全國人的健康這個絕對會是我們在通盤考量而且特別是我們會跟我們的農業主管機關討論之後才來決定我們的接下來要跟美國去進行談判的策略\n\n23\n00:09:04,963 --> 00:09:17,403\n我們稻米的收購價格是26塊每公斤我們在立法院給他搞到要31塊結果法案通過還沒有實施所以要調2塊錢\n\n24\n00:09:20,150 --> 00:09:47,690\n這是一樣的意思我們的黃豆我們生產成本一公斤可能要60-70美國的黃豆可能要10公斤大規模的所以如果我們都沒有保護的話我們一定是崩盤好我再問農業部你的牛肉台灣的牛肉自產的\n\n25\n00:09:48,570 --> 00:10:04,694\n差不多幾%整年多少萬噸我們自己對消費市場佔有率差不多5%到6%牛肉嘛國產牛肉那這些牛肉都是市的還是外土牛打起來的都有\n\n26\n00:10:05,373 --> 00:10:14,597\n都有啦,我那麼深入的,我幾乎每個禮拜都在跟那些乳牛業者為了那個紐西蘭的FTA簽完,他們的一公升才40塊的成本我們這邊要7、80、80、90,這個市府都趕快叫\n\n27\n00:10:27,023 --> 00:10:40,692\n那我們的牛肉我們自己才供應5、6%所以從國外進口的我們是沒有話講那我們的豬肉我們養了700一年才要產750萬頭豬肉差不多180天就一起那應該是要產到八九百萬頭才對啊怎麼會只有750萬頭\n\n28\n00:10:51,564 --> 00:11:05,992\n沒有啦,一方面就是因為我們的整個飼養環境當然也是有成本的可能,第二就是因為我們現在其實山龍提供我們國內的90%都是我們自己的國產豬肉,國人對那個風味其實也是非常敏感,所以\n\n29\n00:11:07,232 --> 00:11:26,240\n臺灣的豬肉在我們的市場其實選擇性我們的消費者比較喜歡所以臺灣的豬肉是有競爭性國人還是喜歡吃目前看起來是這樣進口的就是11萬噸美國差不多占8%大概一成左右總共一成左右\n\n30\n00:11:27,020 --> 00:11:41,147\n好,我是希望一定要堅持啦,今天排這個題目就是一定要捍衛住,尤其是談判的人齁,這個不要穿著西裝,帽子沒穿出來跟人家談判,談到買回來再扛扛\n\n31\n00:11:44,028 --> 00:11:56,370\n再說下去就難聽了,所以這個我是非常concern這一塊,每天會頂,因為我們家就做實的,我們家就在做虛擬的,我們的錢都在抓虛的,我們有可能說沒資格就用這個,而且是以農立國,農業為本,民意實為天,你這個農業要崩盤,你這個國家就\n\n32\n00:12:10,881 --> 00:12:12,689\n結束謝謝委員支持好謝謝好謝謝蘇清泉委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n21623\t33212\t謝謝主席我請農業部杜次長來我們經貿辦嚴首席代表次長我們民眾館都要關市地市污都很多我們的養殖業也發達\n50990\t80009\t那我們台灣現在的漁業差不多近海捕魚近海魚撈跟遠洋魚撈差不多占45%差不多嘛那鄉網養殖跟岸上養殖差不多占55%那這件呢美國這樣搞下去我們才發現說這個農業是要好好的保護啦我跟你講一個data\n81274\t107467\t加薩走廊加薩走廊現在的難民差不多兩百萬人差不多190到210以色列是要炸哪裡就炸哪裡要殺誰就殺誰小孩子嬰兒都不放過這就是戰爭已經死了十萬人左右啦那加薩走廊什麼都沒有那每天需要的水\n109090\t128064\t每天需要的糧食差不多沒辦法供應30%所以我們的農業台灣的農業重不重要當然重要我去日本我看到日本的米啊它的價格差不多泰國的五倍\n129431\t149079\t我去看日本人離開泰國,卡榜裡面都排什麼呢?排米!因為日本的米太貴,又太好吃了所以要拿泰國米來討所以農業一定要保護這一次我們屏東的毛豆,差不多佔了51%差不多一年的6000公噸\n154541\t160427\t蘿蔔魚 整套桌子 還有台灣雕我們平常也有一些在那裡妳怎麼會這麼豐富呢一定的妳也幫得上忙你們編了180億 夠嗎\n170896\t183164\t謝謝委員支持臺灣農業這是一定要做因為農業真的不是說是吃飽吃好其實是一個糧食安全和國家安全的基礎那當然也是一個文化傳承那181 到底夠不夠我相信這樣說現時我們是先變這件事希望是渡費這個困難\n187927\t203157\t都怪這個困難這個是短時間之內那以這個美國現在10%的關稅來看先這樣做長期來看支持農業一直要往前走這絕對不是只有180億現在要做的事情農業部肯定要一直跟我們台灣農業站在一起\n203937\t217935\t對啦,所以我們經貿辦這邊談判,我們台灣的農業,剛才很多委員講已經是對美國是入操了嘛,所以我們才有底氣嘛,美國是前九十萬的低價估估,\n221920\t232833\t我記得在第八屆立委的時候,我非常欽佩田秋晴委員、陳潔如委員我在當召委,他們堅持就是要零檢出邱部長你也是說要零檢出嘛但是2021年開放,什麼40個PPB、10個PPB\n244353\t272777\t現在進來的,剛剛你講的大部分也都是沒有用萊克多巴胺嘛,對不對只有美國進來的有,是這樣酒都要保留在裡面,我只推廣我也贊成我也來Promote只有台灣豬啦我都要保留在裡面,我不會替美國人說話啦我在舊金山Fremont那邊看那個超市我去看他們,真的跑去看他們的超市的豬肉跟牛肉\n273649\t292337\t他標示得很清楚,這個有用瘦肉精的,這個沒有瘦肉精的,分開然後你要買,實在是另一回事,你要吃瘦肉精的,吃瘦肉精的這個我跟大家報告,那個有加瘦肉精的,那個價格是比沒有加瘦肉精的還貴一點\n294810\t308545\t真的是瘦肉,油花比較少,因為有代謝所以要標示最重要,我們自己的所有商業都要保護你進口的美國豬肉\n315851\t330235\t八千多噸嘛,每一年進來,剛才王毅民一直在追,一直在追說都遭遇到,都遭遇到營養午餐啦,遭遇到7-11,燉完啦營養午餐不能用進口,營養午餐臟Q一定是我們台灣國產的,農業副理事也只推廣台灣豬\n340509\t360649\t好 希望是這樣啦那我們現在養豬的頭數你說6000多個養豬場屏東都佔了20幾%左右屏東的場數最多最多嘛那我們一直在關心現在我們的豬肉也可以銷日本冷藏的就可以銷日本啦要不然加工的啦不不不 重點是價位\n365303\t383094\t這裡一廂,這裡一廂有出去,還有新加坡,去新加坡新加坡跟菲律賓我有去參加,台灣的豬肉本身品質也非常好那外務部的標示跟農委會的標示,欸你標示這是什麼意思啦是農委會比較厲害,還是外務部比較厲害為什麼標示都不一樣\n388370\t396374\t這樣就能夠證明是我們台灣豬啊不然那...北省不那麼聰明啦北省就簡單就好 看得到就好大大隻 台灣豬很清楚那我們經貿辦談判一定要捍衛這個我們的糧食一定要保護我剛剛講那個家造走廊那個就是完全沒有生產力\n417076\t444649\t它是200多平方公里上面住了200多萬人然後所有的一點一滴都是從外面輸進來你知道一天只有貨櫃車幾千台貨櫃車從西奈半島這邊上去然後以色列要過不過的要進不進的每一個人的飲用水都不到20公升然後他的糧食能夠拿到的人不到30%\n446547\t472739\t要就是要讓那些人都死死的讓那些人都遷就讓那些人移民、駐紮走廊、以色列永久佔領是不是這樣 我不知道但是看那個樣子是這樣就硬幹所以 打仗封鎖是非常非常的殘酷我們如果現在都零關稅全部的米 美國的米都一百美國的什麼東西都一百台灣整個農業都崩盤\n474758\t494459\t我們真的被封鎖的時候,真的打仗的時候,我們是死的,我們的人口數是袈裟走廊的十二倍,所以這個經貿辦你們要以國家的,日本有些人很硬啊,日本講到農業,他們聽就不要聽啦,他就跟他拚,所以你看你們的立場,這個很重要。\n495470\t513616\t跟委員報告我想不論是我們現在跟美國之間是出超關係或入超關係我們一定都是據理理真更何況我們現在農產品對美國來說完全是對他來說是一個順差的這個情況之下所以我覺得這個是第一個我們會跟美國去訴求我們跟他\n514116\t543599\t在很多的領域上面都是戰略夥伴的關係所以這是第一個我們一定會努力的去爭取第二個我想對於農產或農業它絕對不是一個單純的市場開放的問題所以我們還會兼顧到產業發展以及您剛才提到的這些糧食安全國人的健康這個絕對會是我們在通盤考量而且特別是我們會跟我們的農業主管機關討論之後才來決定我們的接下來要跟美國去進行談判的策略\n544963\t557403\t我們稻米的收購價格是26塊每公斤我們在立法院給他搞到要31塊結果法案通過還沒有實施所以要調2塊錢\n560150\t587690\t這是一樣的意思 我們的黃豆我們生產成本一公斤可能要60-70美國的黃豆可能要10公斤大規模的所以如果我們都沒有保護的話我們一定是崩盤好 我再問農業部你的牛肉 台灣的牛肉 自產的\n588570\t604694\t差不多幾% 整年多少萬噸我們自己對消費市場佔有率差不多5%到6%牛肉嘛 國產牛肉那這些牛肉都是市的還是外土牛打起來的都有\n605373\t614597\t都有啦,我那麼深入的,我幾乎每個禮拜都在跟那些乳牛業者為了那個紐西蘭的FTA簽完,他們的一公升才40塊的成本我們這邊要7、80、80、90,這個市府都趕快叫\n627023\t640692\t那我們的牛肉我們自己才供應5、6%所以從國外進口的我們是沒有話講那我們的豬肉我們養了700一年才要產750萬頭豬肉差不多180天就一起那應該是要產到八九百萬頭才對啊怎麼會只有750萬頭\n651564\t665992\t沒有啦,一方面就是因為我們的整個飼養環境當然也是有成本的可能,第二就是因為我們現在其實山龍提供我們國內的90%都是我們自己的國產豬肉,國人對那個風味其實也是非常敏感,所以\n667232\t686240\t臺灣的豬肉在我們的市場其實選擇性我們的消費者比較喜歡所以臺灣的豬肉是有競爭性國人還是喜歡吃目前看起來是這樣進口的就是11萬噸美國差不多占8%大概一成左右總共一成左右\n687020\t701147\t好,我是希望一定要堅持啦,今天排這個題目就是一定要捍衛住,尤其是談判的人齁,這個不要穿著西裝,帽子沒穿出來跟人家談判,談到買回來再扛扛\n704028\t716370\t再說下去就難聽了,所以這個我是非常concern這一塊,每天會頂,因為我們家就做實的,我們家就在做虛擬的,我們的錢都在抓虛的,我們有可能說沒資格就用這個,而且是以農立國,農業為本,民意實為天,你這個農業要崩盤,你這個國家就\n730881\t732689\t結束謝謝委員支持好謝謝好謝謝蘇清泉委員\n","txt":"謝謝主席我請農業部杜次長來我們經貿辦嚴首席代表次長我們民眾館都要關市地市污都很多我們的養殖業也發達\n那我們台灣現在的漁業差不多近海捕魚近海魚撈跟遠洋魚撈差不多占45%差不多嘛那鄉網養殖跟岸上養殖差不多占55%那這件呢美國這樣搞下去我們才發現說這個農業是要好好的保護啦我跟你講一個data\n加薩走廊加薩走廊現在的難民差不多兩百萬人差不多190到210以色列是要炸哪裡就炸哪裡要殺誰就殺誰小孩子嬰兒都不放過這就是戰爭已經死了十萬人左右啦那加薩走廊什麼都沒有那每天需要的水\n每天需要的糧食差不多沒辦法供應30%所以我們的農業台灣的農業重不重要當然重要我去日本我看到日本的米啊它的價格差不多泰國的五倍\n我去看日本人離開泰國,卡榜裡面都排什麼呢?排米!因為日本的米太貴,又太好吃了所以要拿泰國米來討所以農業一定要保護這一次我們屏東的毛豆,差不多佔了51%差不多一年的6000公噸\n蘿蔔魚 整套桌子 還有台灣雕我們平常也有一些在那裡妳怎麼會這麼豐富呢一定的妳也幫得上忙你們編了180億 夠嗎\n謝謝委員支持臺灣農業這是一定要做因為農業真的不是說是吃飽吃好其實是一個糧食安全和國家安全的基礎那當然也是一個文化傳承那181 到底夠不夠我相信這樣說現時我們是先變這件事希望是渡費這個困難\n都怪這個困難這個是短時間之內那以這個美國現在10%的關稅來看先這樣做長期來看支持農業一直要往前走這絕對不是只有180億現在要做的事情農業部肯定要一直跟我們台灣農業站在一起\n對啦,所以我們經貿辦這邊談判,我們台灣的農業,剛才很多委員講已經是對美國是入操了嘛,所以我們才有底氣嘛,美國是前九十萬的低價估估,\n我記得在第八屆立委的時候,我非常欽佩田秋晴委員、陳潔如委員我在當召委,他們堅持就是要零檢出邱部長你也是說要零檢出嘛但是2021年開放,什麼40個PPB、10個PPB\n現在進來的,剛剛你講的大部分也都是沒有用萊克多巴胺嘛,對不對只有美國進來的有,是這樣酒都要保留在裡面,我只推廣我也贊成我也來Promote只有台灣豬啦我都要保留在裡面,我不會替美國人說話啦我在舊金山Fremont那邊看那個超市我去看他們,真的跑去看他們的超市的豬肉跟牛肉\n他標示得很清楚,這個有用瘦肉精的,這個沒有瘦肉精的,分開然後你要買,實在是另一回事,你要吃瘦肉精的,吃瘦肉精的這個我跟大家報告,那個有加瘦肉精的,那個價格是比沒有加瘦肉精的還貴一點\n真的是瘦肉,油花比較少,因為有代謝所以要標示最重要,我們自己的所有商業都要保護你進口的美國豬肉\n八千多噸嘛,每一年進來,剛才王毅民一直在追,一直在追說都遭遇到,都遭遇到營養午餐啦,遭遇到7-11,燉完啦營養午餐不能用進口,營養午餐臟Q一定是我們台灣國產的,農業副理事也只推廣台灣豬\n好 希望是這樣啦那我們現在養豬的頭數你說6000多個養豬場屏東都佔了20幾%左右屏東的場數最多最多嘛那我們一直在關心現在我們的豬肉也可以銷日本冷藏的就可以銷日本啦要不然加工的啦不不不 重點是價位\n這裡一廂,這裡一廂有出去,還有新加坡,去新加坡新加坡跟菲律賓我有去參加,台灣的豬肉本身品質也非常好那外務部的標示跟農委會的標示,欸你標示這是什麼意思啦是農委會比較厲害,還是外務部比較厲害為什麼標示都不一樣\n這樣就能夠證明是我們台灣豬啊不然那...北省不那麼聰明啦北省就簡單就好 看得到就好大大隻 台灣豬很清楚那我們經貿辦談判一定要捍衛這個我們的糧食一定要保護我剛剛講那個家造走廊那個就是完全沒有生產力\n它是200多平方公里上面住了200多萬人然後所有的一點一滴都是從外面輸進來你知道一天只有貨櫃車幾千台貨櫃車從西奈半島這邊上去然後以色列要過不過的要進不進的每一個人的飲用水都不到20公升然後他的糧食能夠拿到的人不到30%\n要就是要讓那些人都死死的讓那些人都遷就讓那些人移民、駐紮走廊、以色列永久佔領是不是這樣 我不知道但是看那個樣子是這樣就硬幹所以 打仗封鎖是非常非常的殘酷我們如果現在都零關稅全部的米 美國的米都一百美國的什麼東西都一百台灣整個農業都崩盤\n我們真的被封鎖的時候,真的打仗的時候,我們是死的,我們的人口數是袈裟走廊的十二倍,所以這個經貿辦你們要以國家的,日本有些人很硬啊,日本講到農業,他們聽就不要聽啦,他就跟他拚,所以你看你們的立場,這個很重要。\n跟委員報告我想不論是我們現在跟美國之間是出超關係或入超關係我們一定都是據理理真更何況我們現在農產品對美國來說完全是對他來說是一個順差的這個情況之下所以我覺得這個是第一個我們會跟美國去訴求我們跟他\n在很多的領域上面都是戰略夥伴的關係所以這是第一個我們一定會努力的去爭取第二個我想對於農產或農業它絕對不是一個單純的市場開放的問題所以我們還會兼顧到產業發展以及您剛才提到的這些糧食安全國人的健康這個絕對會是我們在通盤考量而且特別是我們會跟我們的農業主管機關討論之後才來決定我們的接下來要跟美國去進行談判的策略\n我們稻米的收購價格是26塊每公斤我們在立法院給他搞到要31塊結果法案通過還沒有實施所以要調2塊錢\n這是一樣的意思 我們的黃豆我們生產成本一公斤可能要60-70美國的黃豆可能要10公斤大規模的所以如果我們都沒有保護的話我們一定是崩盤好 我再問農業部你的牛肉 台灣的牛肉 自產的\n差不多幾% 整年多少萬噸我們自己對消費市場佔有率差不多5%到6%牛肉嘛 國產牛肉那這些牛肉都是市的還是外土牛打起來的都有\n都有啦,我那麼深入的,我幾乎每個禮拜都在跟那些乳牛業者為了那個紐西蘭的FTA簽完,他們的一公升才40塊的成本我們這邊要7、80、80、90,這個市府都趕快叫\n那我們的牛肉我們自己才供應5、6%所以從國外進口的我們是沒有話講那我們的豬肉我們養了700一年才要產750萬頭豬肉差不多180天就一起那應該是要產到八九百萬頭才對啊怎麼會只有750萬頭\n沒有啦,一方面就是因為我們的整個飼養環境當然也是有成本的可能,第二就是因為我們現在其實山龍提供我們國內的90%都是我們自己的國產豬肉,國人對那個風味其實也是非常敏感,所以\n臺灣的豬肉在我們的市場其實選擇性我們的消費者比較喜歡所以臺灣的豬肉是有競爭性國人還是喜歡吃目前看起來是這樣進口的就是11萬噸美國差不多占8%大概一成左右總共一成左右\n好,我是希望一定要堅持啦,今天排這個題目就是一定要捍衛住,尤其是談判的人齁,這個不要穿著西裝,帽子沒穿出來跟人家談判,談到買回來再扛扛\n再說下去就難聽了,所以這個我是非常concern這一塊,每天會頂,因為我們家就做實的,我們家就在做虛擬的,我們的錢都在抓虛的,我們有可能說沒資格就用這個,而且是以農立國,農業為本,民意實為天,你這個農業要崩盤,你這個國家就\n結束謝謝委員支持好謝謝好謝謝蘇清泉委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:21.623 --> 00:33.212\n謝謝主席我請農業部杜次長來我們經貿辦嚴首席代表次長我們民眾館都要關市地市污都很多我們的養殖業也發達\n\n00:50.990 --> 01:20.009\n那我們台灣現在的漁業差不多近海捕魚近海魚撈跟遠洋魚撈差不多占45%差不多嘛那鄉網養殖跟岸上養殖差不多占55%那這件呢美國這樣搞下去我們才發現說這個農業是要好好的保護啦我跟你講一個data\n\n01:21.274 --> 01:47.467\n加薩走廊加薩走廊現在的難民差不多兩百萬人差不多190到210以色列是要炸哪裡就炸哪裡要殺誰就殺誰小孩子嬰兒都不放過這就是戰爭已經死了十萬人左右啦那加薩走廊什麼都沒有那每天需要的水\n\n01:49.090 --> 02:08.064\n每天需要的糧食差不多沒辦法供應30%所以我們的農業台灣的農業重不重要當然重要我去日本我看到日本的米啊它的價格差不多泰國的五倍\n\n02:09.431 --> 02:29.079\n我去看日本人離開泰國,卡榜裡面都排什麼呢?排米!因為日本的米太貴,又太好吃了所以要拿泰國米來討所以農業一定要保護這一次我們屏東的毛豆,差不多佔了51%差不多一年的6000公噸\n\n02:34.541 --> 02:40.427\n蘿蔔魚整套桌子還有台灣雕我們平常也有一些在那裡妳怎麼會這麼豐富呢一定的妳也幫得上忙你們編了180億夠嗎\n\n02:50.896 --> 03:03.164\n謝謝委員支持臺灣農業這是一定要做因為農業真的不是說是吃飽吃好其實是一個糧食安全和國家安全的基礎那當然也是一個文化傳承那181到底夠不夠我相信這樣說現時我們是先變這件事希望是渡費這個困難\n\n03:07.927 --> 03:23.157\n都怪這個困難這個是短時間之內那以這個美國現在10%的關稅來看先這樣做長期來看支持農業一直要往前走這絕對不是只有180億現在要做的事情農業部肯定要一直跟我們台灣農業站在一起\n\n03:23.937 --> 03:37.935\n對啦,所以我們經貿辦這邊談判,我們台灣的農業,剛才很多委員講已經是對美國是入操了嘛,所以我們才有底氣嘛,美國是前九十萬的低價估估,\n\n03:41.920 --> 03:52.833\n我記得在第八屆立委的時候,我非常欽佩田秋晴委員、陳潔如委員我在當召委,他們堅持就是要零檢出邱部長你也是說要零檢出嘛但是2021年開放,什麼40個PPB、10個PPB\n\n04:04.353 --> 04:32.777\n現在進來的,剛剛你講的大部分也都是沒有用萊克多巴胺嘛,對不對只有美國進來的有,是這樣酒都要保留在裡面,我只推廣我也贊成我也來Promote只有台灣豬啦我都要保留在裡面,我不會替美國人說話啦我在舊金山Fremont那邊看那個超市我去看他們,真的跑去看他們的超市的豬肉跟牛肉\n\n04:33.649 --> 04:52.337\n他標示得很清楚,這個有用瘦肉精的,這個沒有瘦肉精的,分開然後你要買,實在是另一回事,你要吃瘦肉精的,吃瘦肉精的這個我跟大家報告,那個有加瘦肉精的,那個價格是比沒有加瘦肉精的還貴一點\n\n04:54.810 --> 05:08.545\n真的是瘦肉,油花比較少,因為有代謝所以要標示最重要,我們自己的所有商業都要保護你進口的美國豬肉\n\n05:15.851 --> 05:30.235\n八千多噸嘛,每一年進來,剛才王毅民一直在追,一直在追說都遭遇到,都遭遇到營養午餐啦,遭遇到7-11,燉完啦營養午餐不能用進口,營養午餐臟Q一定是我們台灣國產的,農業副理事也只推廣台灣豬\n\n05:40.509 --> 06:00.649\n好希望是這樣啦那我們現在養豬的頭數你說6000多個養豬場屏東都佔了20幾%左右屏東的場數最多最多嘛那我們一直在關心現在我們的豬肉也可以銷日本冷藏的就可以銷日本啦要不然加工的啦不不不重點是價位\n\n06:05.303 --> 06:23.094\n這裡一廂,這裡一廂有出去,還有新加坡,去新加坡新加坡跟菲律賓我有去參加,台灣的豬肉本身品質也非常好那外務部的標示跟農委會的標示,欸你標示這是什麼意思啦是農委會比較厲害,還是外務部比較厲害為什麼標示都不一樣\n\n06:28.370 --> 06:36.374\n這樣就能夠證明是我們台灣豬啊不然那...北省不那麼聰明啦北省就簡單就好看得到就好大大隻台灣豬很清楚那我們經貿辦談判一定要捍衛這個我們的糧食一定要保護我剛剛講那個家造走廊那個就是完全沒有生產力\n\n06:57.076 --> 07:24.649\n它是200多平方公里上面住了200多萬人然後所有的一點一滴都是從外面輸進來你知道一天只有貨櫃車幾千台貨櫃車從西奈半島這邊上去然後以色列要過不過的要進不進的每一個人的飲用水都不到20公升然後他的糧食能夠拿到的人不到30%\n\n07:26.547 --> 07:52.739\n要就是要讓那些人都死死的讓那些人都遷就讓那些人移民、駐紮走廊、以色列永久佔領是不是這樣我不知道但是看那個樣子是這樣就硬幹所以打仗封鎖是非常非常的殘酷我們如果現在都零關稅全部的米美國的米都一百美國的什麼東西都一百台灣整個農業都崩盤\n\n07:54.758 --> 08:14.459\n我們真的被封鎖的時候,真的打仗的時候,我們是死的,我們的人口數是袈裟走廊的十二倍,所以這個經貿辦你們要以國家的,日本有些人很硬啊,日本講到農業,他們聽就不要聽啦,他就跟他拚,所以你看你們的立場,這個很重要。\n\n08:15.470 --> 08:33.616\n跟委員報告我想不論是我們現在跟美國之間是出超關係或入超關係我們一定都是據理理真更何況我們現在農產品對美國來說完全是對他來說是一個順差的這個情況之下所以我覺得這個是第一個我們會跟美國去訴求我們跟他\n\n08:34.116 --> 09:03.599\n在很多的領域上面都是戰略夥伴的關係所以這是第一個我們一定會努力的去爭取第二個我想對於農產或農業它絕對不是一個單純的市場開放的問題所以我們還會兼顧到產業發展以及您剛才提到的這些糧食安全國人的健康這個絕對會是我們在通盤考量而且特別是我們會跟我們的農業主管機關討論之後才來決定我們的接下來要跟美國去進行談判的策略\n\n09:04.963 --> 09:17.403\n我們稻米的收購價格是26塊每公斤我們在立法院給他搞到要31塊結果法案通過還沒有實施所以要調2塊錢\n\n09:20.150 --> 09:47.690\n這是一樣的意思我們的黃豆我們生產成本一公斤可能要60-70美國的黃豆可能要10公斤大規模的所以如果我們都沒有保護的話我們一定是崩盤好我再問農業部你的牛肉台灣的牛肉自產的\n\n09:48.570 --> 10:04.694\n差不多幾%整年多少萬噸我們自己對消費市場佔有率差不多5%到6%牛肉嘛國產牛肉那這些牛肉都是市的還是外土牛打起來的都有\n\n10:05.373 --> 10:14.597\n都有啦,我那麼深入的,我幾乎每個禮拜都在跟那些乳牛業者為了那個紐西蘭的FTA簽完,他們的一公升才40塊的成本我們這邊要7、80、80、90,這個市府都趕快叫\n\n10:27.023 --> 10:40.692\n那我們的牛肉我們自己才供應5、6%所以從國外進口的我們是沒有話講那我們的豬肉我們養了700一年才要產750萬頭豬肉差不多180天就一起那應該是要產到八九百萬頭才對啊怎麼會只有750萬頭\n\n10:51.564 --> 11:05.992\n沒有啦,一方面就是因為我們的整個飼養環境當然也是有成本的可能,第二就是因為我們現在其實山龍提供我們國內的90%都是我們自己的國產豬肉,國人對那個風味其實也是非常敏感,所以\n\n11:07.232 --> 11:26.240\n臺灣的豬肉在我們的市場其實選擇性我們的消費者比較喜歡所以臺灣的豬肉是有競爭性國人還是喜歡吃目前看起來是這樣進口的就是11萬噸美國差不多占8%大概一成左右總共一成左右\n\n11:27.020 --> 11:41.147\n好,我是希望一定要堅持啦,今天排這個題目就是一定要捍衛住,尤其是談判的人齁,這個不要穿著西裝,帽子沒穿出來跟人家談判,談到買回來再扛扛\n\n11:44.028 --> 11:56.370\n再說下去就難聽了,所以這個我是非常concern這一塊,每天會頂,因為我們家就做實的,我們家就在做虛擬的,我們的錢都在抓虛的,我們有可能說沒資格就用這個,而且是以農立國,農業為本,民意實為天,你這個農業要崩盤,你這個國家就\n\n12:10.881 --> 12:12.689\n結束謝謝委員支持好謝謝好謝謝蘇清泉委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":21.623,"end":33.212,"text":"謝謝主席我請農業部杜次長來我們經貿辦嚴首席代表次長我們民眾館都要關市地市污都很多我們的養殖業也發達"},{"start":50.99,"end":80.009,"text":"那我們台灣現在的漁業差不多近海捕魚近海魚撈跟遠洋魚撈差不多占45%差不多嘛那鄉網養殖跟岸上養殖差不多占55%那這件呢美國這樣搞下去我們才發現說這個農業是要好好的保護啦我跟你講一個data"},{"start":81.274,"end":107.467,"text":"加薩走廊加薩走廊現在的難民差不多兩百萬人差不多190到210以色列是要炸哪裡就炸哪裡要殺誰就殺誰小孩子嬰兒都不放過這就是戰爭已經死了十萬人左右啦那加薩走廊什麼都沒有那每天需要的水"},{"start":109.09,"end":128.064,"text":"每天需要的糧食差不多沒辦法供應30%所以我們的農業台灣的農業重不重要當然重要我去日本我看到日本的米啊它的價格差不多泰國的五倍"},{"start":129.431,"end":149.079,"text":"我去看日本人離開泰國,卡榜裡面都排什麼呢?排米!因為日本的米太貴,又太好吃了所以要拿泰國米來討所以農業一定要保護這一次我們屏東的毛豆,差不多佔了51%差不多一年的6000公噸"},{"start":154.541,"end":160.427,"text":"蘿蔔魚 整套桌子 還有台灣雕我們平常也有一些在那裡妳怎麼會這麼豐富呢一定的妳也幫得上忙你們編了180億 夠嗎"},{"start":170.896,"end":183.164,"text":"謝謝委員支持臺灣農業這是一定要做因為農業真的不是說是吃飽吃好其實是一個糧食安全和國家安全的基礎那當然也是一個文化傳承那181 到底夠不夠我相信這樣說現時我們是先變這件事希望是渡費這個困難"},{"start":187.927,"end":203.157,"text":"都怪這個困難這個是短時間之內那以這個美國現在10%的關稅來看先這樣做長期來看支持農業一直要往前走這絕對不是只有180億現在要做的事情農業部肯定要一直跟我們台灣農業站在一起"},{"start":203.937,"end":217.935,"text":"對啦,所以我們經貿辦這邊談判,我們台灣的農業,剛才很多委員講已經是對美國是入操了嘛,所以我們才有底氣嘛,美國是前九十萬的低價估估,"},{"start":221.92,"end":232.833,"text":"我記得在第八屆立委的時候,我非常欽佩田秋晴委員、陳潔如委員我在當召委,他們堅持就是要零檢出邱部長你也是說要零檢出嘛但是2021年開放,什麼40個PPB、10個PPB"},{"start":244.353,"end":272.777,"text":"現在進來的,剛剛你講的大部分也都是沒有用萊克多巴胺嘛,對不對只有美國進來的有,是這樣酒都要保留在裡面,我只推廣我也贊成我也來Promote只有台灣豬啦我都要保留在裡面,我不會替美國人說話啦我在舊金山Fremont那邊看那個超市我去看他們,真的跑去看他們的超市的豬肉跟牛肉"},{"start":273.649,"end":292.337,"text":"他標示得很清楚,這個有用瘦肉精的,這個沒有瘦肉精的,分開然後你要買,實在是另一回事,你要吃瘦肉精的,吃瘦肉精的這個我跟大家報告,那個有加瘦肉精的,那個價格是比沒有加瘦肉精的還貴一點"},{"start":294.81,"end":308.545,"text":"真的是瘦肉,油花比較少,因為有代謝所以要標示最重要,我們自己的所有商業都要保護你進口的美國豬肉"},{"start":315.851,"end":330.235,"text":"八千多噸嘛,每一年進來,剛才王毅民一直在追,一直在追說都遭遇到,都遭遇到營養午餐啦,遭遇到7-11,燉完啦營養午餐不能用進口,營養午餐臟Q一定是我們台灣國產的,農業副理事也只推廣台灣豬"},{"start":340.509,"end":360.649,"text":"好 希望是這樣啦那我們現在養豬的頭數你說6000多個養豬場屏東都佔了20幾%左右屏東的場數最多最多嘛那我們一直在關心現在我們的豬肉也可以銷日本冷藏的就可以銷日本啦要不然加工的啦不不不 重點是價位"},{"start":365.303,"end":383.094,"text":"這裡一廂,這裡一廂有出去,還有新加坡,去新加坡新加坡跟菲律賓我有去參加,台灣的豬肉本身品質也非常好那外務部的標示跟農委會的標示,欸你標示這是什麼意思啦是農委會比較厲害,還是外務部比較厲害為什麼標示都不一樣"},{"start":388.37,"end":396.374,"text":"這樣就能夠證明是我們台灣豬啊不然那...北省不那麼聰明啦北省就簡單就好 看得到就好大大隻 台灣豬很清楚那我們經貿辦談判一定要捍衛這個我們的糧食一定要保護我剛剛講那個家造走廊那個就是完全沒有生產力"},{"start":417.076,"end":444.649,"text":"它是200多平方公里上面住了200多萬人然後所有的一點一滴都是從外面輸進來你知道一天只有貨櫃車幾千台貨櫃車從西奈半島這邊上去然後以色列要過不過的要進不進的每一個人的飲用水都不到20公升然後他的糧食能夠拿到的人不到30%"},{"start":446.547,"end":472.739,"text":"要就是要讓那些人都死死的讓那些人都遷就讓那些人移民、駐紮走廊、以色列永久佔領是不是這樣 我不知道但是看那個樣子是這樣就硬幹所以 打仗封鎖是非常非常的殘酷我們如果現在都零關稅全部的米 美國的米都一百美國的什麼東西都一百台灣整個農業都崩盤"},{"start":474.758,"end":494.459,"text":"我們真的被封鎖的時候,真的打仗的時候,我們是死的,我們的人口數是袈裟走廊的十二倍,所以這個經貿辦你們要以國家的,日本有些人很硬啊,日本講到農業,他們聽就不要聽啦,他就跟他拚,所以你看你們的立場,這個很重要。"},{"start":495.47,"end":513.616,"text":"跟委員報告我想不論是我們現在跟美國之間是出超關係或入超關係我們一定都是據理理真更何況我們現在農產品對美國來說完全是對他來說是一個順差的這個情況之下所以我覺得這個是第一個我們會跟美國去訴求我們跟他"},{"start":514.116,"end":543.599,"text":"在很多的領域上面都是戰略夥伴的關係所以這是第一個我們一定會努力的去爭取第二個我想對於農產或農業它絕對不是一個單純的市場開放的問題所以我們還會兼顧到產業發展以及您剛才提到的這些糧食安全國人的健康這個絕對會是我們在通盤考量而且特別是我們會跟我們的農業主管機關討論之後才來決定我們的接下來要跟美國去進行談判的策略"},{"start":544.963,"end":557.403,"text":"我們稻米的收購價格是26塊每公斤我們在立法院給他搞到要31塊結果法案通過還沒有實施所以要調2塊錢"},{"start":560.15,"end":587.69,"text":"這是一樣的意思 我們的黃豆我們生產成本一公斤可能要60-70美國的黃豆可能要10公斤大規模的所以如果我們都沒有保護的話我們一定是崩盤好 我再問農業部你的牛肉 台灣的牛肉 自產的"},{"start":588.57,"end":604.694,"text":"差不多幾% 整年多少萬噸我們自己對消費市場佔有率差不多5%到6%牛肉嘛 國產牛肉那這些牛肉都是市的還是外土牛打起來的都有"},{"start":605.373,"end":614.597,"text":"都有啦,我那麼深入的,我幾乎每個禮拜都在跟那些乳牛業者為了那個紐西蘭的FTA簽完,他們的一公升才40塊的成本我們這邊要7、80、80、90,這個市府都趕快叫"},{"start":627.023,"end":640.692,"text":"那我們的牛肉我們自己才供應5、6%所以從國外進口的我們是沒有話講那我們的豬肉我們養了700一年才要產750萬頭豬肉差不多180天就一起那應該是要產到八九百萬頭才對啊怎麼會只有750萬頭"},{"start":651.564,"end":665.992,"text":"沒有啦,一方面就是因為我們的整個飼養環境當然也是有成本的可能,第二就是因為我們現在其實山龍提供我們國內的90%都是我們自己的國產豬肉,國人對那個風味其實也是非常敏感,所以"},{"start":667.232,"end":686.24,"text":"臺灣的豬肉在我們的市場其實選擇性我們的消費者比較喜歡所以臺灣的豬肉是有競爭性國人還是喜歡吃目前看起來是這樣進口的就是11萬噸美國差不多占8%大概一成左右總共一成左右"},{"start":687.02,"end":701.147,"text":"好,我是希望一定要堅持啦,今天排這個題目就是一定要捍衛住,尤其是談判的人齁,這個不要穿著西裝,帽子沒穿出來跟人家談判,談到買回來再扛扛"},{"start":704.028,"end":716.37,"text":"再說下去就難聽了,所以這個我是非常concern這一塊,每天會頂,因為我們家就做實的,我們家就在做虛擬的,我們的錢都在抓虛的,我們有可能說沒資格就用這個,而且是以農立國,農業為本,民意實為天,你這個農業要崩盤,你這個國家就"},{"start":730.881,"end":732.689,"text":"結束謝謝委員支持好謝謝好謝謝蘇清泉委員"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":547,"blocks":[["蘇委員清泉：（11時11分）謝謝主席，我請農業部杜次長，還有我們經貿辦顏首席代表。"],["主席：請杜次長。"],["蘇委員清泉：次長，屏東縣是農業大縣，養豬、養牛的都很多，我們的養殖漁業也發達，臺灣現在的漁業差不多是近海漁撈跟遠洋漁撈，差不多占45%，差不多嘛！箱網養殖跟岸上養殖差不多占55%，因為這次美國這樣搞下去，我們才發現農業是要好好地保護。我跟你講一個data，加薩走廊現在的難民差不多兩百萬人，差不多190到210萬，以色列是要炸哪裡就炸哪裡，要殺誰就殺誰，小孩子、嬰兒都不放過，這就是戰爭，已經死了10萬人左右了，加薩走廊什麼都沒有，每天需要的水、每天需要的糧食差不多沒辦法供應30%。所以臺灣的農業重不重要？當然重要！我去日本看到日本的米，它的價錢差不多是泰國的5倍，如果你去泰國，看到日本人離開泰國時，背包裡面都裝什麼呢？裝米。因為日本的米太貴又太好吃了，所以要拿泰國米來混和，因此農業一定要保護啦！這一次我們屏東的毛豆差不多占了51%，一年差不多是6,000公噸；我們的鱸魚、鬼頭刀、臺灣鯛及吳郭魚……"],["杜次長文珍：蝴蝶蘭，也有一些在屏東那邊。"],["蘇委員清泉：你們要好好保護欸！"],["杜次長文珍：一定會、一定會。"],["蘇委員清泉：不要就放任由它去。你們編了180億，夠嗎？"],["杜次長文珍：謝謝委員支持臺灣農業，這是一定要夠，因為農業真的不僅是吃飽、吃好，其實是一個糧食安全跟國家安全的基礎，當然也是一個文化傳承，180億到底夠不夠？我相信是這樣說啦！現在我們是先編這些錢，希望能度過困難，這個是短時間之內，以美國現在10%的關稅來看，先這樣做；長期來看，支持農業一直要往前走，這絕對不是只有180億，現在要做的事情，農業部肯定要一直跟我們臺灣農業站在一起。"],["蘇委員清泉：對啦！我們經貿辦這邊的談判，剛才很多位委員說，臺灣的農業對美國已經是入超了，所以我們這樣才會有底氣嘛！我們從美國進口的是豬肉和牛肉，我記得在第8屆立委的時候，我非常欽佩田秋堇委員、陳節如委員，我在當召委，他們堅持就是要零檢出，邱部長你也是說要零檢出嘛！但是2021年我們就開放什麼40個ppb、10個ppb，現在進來的，剛剛你講的大部分也都是沒有用萊克多巴胺嘛！對不對？只有美國進來的有，是這樣？"],["杜次長文珍：像農業部的立場，我只推廣、我也贊成、我也來promote只有臺灣豬啦！嘿啦！我農業部的立場我不會替美國牛說話啦！"],["蘇委員清泉：我在舊金山Fremont那邊看超市，真的跑去看他們超市的豬肉跟牛肉，它標示得很清楚，這個有用瘦肉精的、這個沒有瘦肉精的，分開，然後你要買，隨便，你家的事情，你要吃瘦肉精就吃瘦肉精。我跟大家報告，有加瘦肉精的價格是比沒有加瘦肉精的還貴一點，真的是油花比較少，因為有把它代謝掉嘛！所以標示最重要啦！我們自己的所有產業都要保護啦！"],["杜次長文珍：是，謝謝委員。"],["蘇委員清泉：你進口的美國豬肉八千多噸，每一年進來。"],["杜次長文珍：是，大概……"],["蘇委員清泉：剛剛王育敏一直要追，一直在追說都跑去哪裡，都跑去營養午餐啦！跑去7-11的貢丸。"],["杜次長文珍：沒有啦，營養午餐不能用進口的，因為營養午餐……"],["蘇委員清泉：當然都這樣講啊！"],["杜次長文珍：沒有啦，營養午餐三章一Q一定是用我們臺灣國產的，農業部立場也只推廣臺灣豬。"],["蘇委員清泉：好，希望是這樣啦！我們現在養豬的頭數，你說六千多個養豬場，屏東差不多占了二十幾趴左右。"],["杜次長文珍：屏東的場數最多。"],["蘇委員清泉：最多嘛！我們一直在關心現在我們的豬肉也可以銷日本，冷藏的就可以銷日本。"],["杜次長文珍：還沒，是加工的。"],["蘇委員清泉：沒有，上次嘉一香有出去，去新加坡。"],["杜次長文珍：嘉一香去新加坡跟菲律賓。"],["蘇委員清泉：我有去參加，臺灣的豬肉本身品質也非常好，衛福部的標示跟農委會的標示，你們標示這是什麼意思啦？是農委會比較厲害還是衛福部比較厲害？為什麼標示都不一樣？"],["杜次長文珍：能夠證明是我們臺灣豬啊！嘿啊！"],["蘇委員清泉：沒有啦，百姓沒那麼聰明啦，百姓就簡單就好、看得懂就好。"],["杜次長文珍：有啊！大大的「臺灣豬」很清楚。"],["蘇委員清泉：好，我們經貿辦談判一定要捍衛這個，我們的糧食一定要保護，我剛剛講加薩走廊那個就是完全沒有生產力，它是兩百多平方公里，上面住了兩百多萬人，然後所有的一點一滴都是從外面輸進來，你知道一天只有貨櫃車，幾千台貨櫃車從西奈半島這邊上去，然後以色列要過不過的、要進不進的，每一個人的飲用水都不到20公升，然後糧食能夠拿到的人不到30%啊，就是要讓那些人都死一死，讓那些人都遷走、讓那些人都移民，以色列永久占領加薩走廊，是不是這樣我不知道，但是看那個樣子是這樣，是硬幹，所以打仗、封鎖是非常非常殘酷。如果現在你都零關稅，全部的米，美國米也進來、美國什麼東西都進來，臺灣整個農業都崩盤，我們真的被封鎖的時候、真的打仗的時候，我們穩死的，我們的人口數是加薩走廊的12倍，所以經貿辦你們要以國家的……日本也是很硬，日本講到農業，它連聽都不聽啦，它就跟它拼了，所以你看一下你們的立場，這個很重要。"],["顏副總談判代表慧欣：跟委員報告，我想不論是我們現在跟美國之間是出超關係或入超關係，我們一定都是據理力爭，更何況我們現在農產品對美國來說完全是一個順差的情況之下，所以我覺得這個是第一個，我們會去跟美國訴求我們跟它在很多的領域上面都是戰略夥伴的關係，所以這是第一個，我們一定會努力地去爭取。第二個，對於農產或農業，絕對不是一個單純的市場開放的問題，所以我們還會兼顧到產業發展，以及您剛才提到的這些糧食安全、國人健康，這個絕對會是我們在通盤考量，而且特別是我們會跟農業主管機關討論之後才來決定我們接下來要跟美國進行談判的策略。"],["蘇委員清泉：我們稻米的收購價格是26塊每公斤，我們在立法院給它搞到要31塊，結果法案通過，還沒有實施，所以要調2塊錢，這是一樣的意思，我們的毛豆，不要毛豆，我們的黃豆，你剛剛講的，我們的黃豆，我們生產成本1公斤可能要26、27，美國的黃豆可能就10塊而已，因為大規模，所以如果我們都沒有保護的話，我們一定是崩盤。","好，我再問農業部，臺灣牛肉自產的差不多幾%？一年差不多多少萬噸？"],["杜次長文珍：我們自己在消費市場占有率差不多5%到6%。"],["蘇委員清泉：就是牛肉。"],["杜次長文珍：國產牛肉。"],["蘇委員清泉：這些牛肉都是養的還是從乳牛打起來的？"],["杜次長文珍：都有。"],["蘇委員清泉：我那麼深入了，我幾乎每個禮拜都在跟那些乳牛業者在……為了紐西蘭的FTA簽完，他們的1公升才40塊的成本，我們這邊要七、八十或八、九十，這些養牛的人都哀哀叫。"],["杜次長文珍：我們飼養的成本確實比較高。"],["蘇委員清泉：對，我們的牛肉，我們自己才供應5、6%，所以從國外進口的，我們是沒有話講。我們的豬肉，我們一年差不多產750萬頭嘛！"],["杜次長文珍：在養五百多萬頭，送屠宰場差不多七百多萬頭。"],["蘇委員清泉：豬肉差不多180天就一期，應該是要產到八、九百萬頭才對啊，怎麼會只有750萬頭？"],["杜次長文珍：沒有啦！一方面就是因為我們整個飼養環境當然也是有成本的考量；第二個就是因為我們現在其實產量提供我們國內大概90%都是我們自己的國產豬肉，國人對那個風味其實也是非常敏感，所以臺灣的豬肉在我們的市場，其實選擇性上，我們的消費者比較喜歡。"],["蘇委員清泉：所以臺灣的豬肉是有競爭性。"],["杜次長文珍：在市場大概90%，品質……"],["蘇委員清泉：然後國人還是喜歡吃。"],["杜次長文珍：目前看起來是這樣。"],["蘇委員清泉：進口的就是11萬噸，美國差不多占8%。"],["杜次長文珍：大概一成左右，總共一成左右。"],["蘇委員清泉：好，我是希望一定要堅持啦！今天排這個題目就是一定要捍衛住，尤其是談判的人，不要穿著西裝、戴帽子出去跟人家談判，談到最後回來卻「空空」，再說下去就難聽了，所以我是非常concern這一塊……"],["杜次長文珍：謝謝召委支持臺灣農業，謝謝。"],["蘇委員清泉：一定會盯啦，因為我家就是做事的，我家就在做魚塭，我的親戚都在捕魚，我怎麼可能不注重這個，而且是以農立國、農業為本，民以食為天，農業如果崩盤，你這個國家就結束了。"],["杜次長文珍：謝謝委員支持，謝謝。"],["蘇委員清泉：好，謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝蘇清泉委員。接下來請涂權吉委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":452,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-26-7","speakers":["蘇清泉","陳昭姿","陳菁徽","楊曜","王正旭","王育敏","楊瓊瓔","林淑芬","涂權吉","邱鎮軍","黃秀芳","林月琴","劉建國","鍾佳濱","盧縣一","高金素梅","王鴻薇","許宇甄","葉元之","羅廷瑋","陳瑩","徐欣瑩","廖偉翔"],"page_start":371,"meetingDate":["2025-04-24"],"gazette_id":"1144101","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144101_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第7次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請衛生福利部部長、農業部次長、經濟部次長、外交部次長、行政院經貿談判辦公室副總談判\n代表、行政院食品安全辦公室主任針對「美豬、美牛進口零關稅且如何保障國人食品安全及農民\n權益」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1144101_00005"}}}