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{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 627.406, \"end\": 627.626, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 627.626, \"end\": 628.066, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 628.066, \"end\": 628.246, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"家\", \"start\": 628.246, \"end\": 628.386, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 628.386, \"end\": 628.486, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"病\", \"start\": 628.486, \"end\": 628.606, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"房\", \"start\": 628.606, \"end\": 628.806, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 628.806, \"end\": 629.066, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"類\"}, {\"word\": \"假\", \"start\": 629.066, \"end\": 629.607, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"設\"}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 629.607, \"end\": 629.767, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 629.767, \"end\": 629.927, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 629.927, \"end\": 630.347, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 630.347, \"end\": 630.487, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"願\"}, {\"word\": \"意\", \"start\": 630.487, \"end\": 630.687, \"score\": 0.863}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 630.687, \"end\": 630.967, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"協\"}, {\"word\": \"助\", \"start\": 630.967, \"end\": 631.127, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 631.127, \"end\": 631.147, \"score\": 0.798}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 631.527, \"end\": 631.667, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 631.667, \"end\": 632.107, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 632.107, \"end\": 632.288, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 632.288, \"end\": 633.128, \"score\": 0.881}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"結\"}, {\"word\": \"束\", \"start\": 633.128, \"end\": 633.329, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"希\", \"start\": 633.329, \"end\": 633.429, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"望\", \"start\": 633.429, \"end\": 633.569, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 633.569, \"end\": 633.769, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 633.769, \"end\": 633.869, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 633.869, \"end\": 633.989, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 633.989, \"end\": 634.289, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 634.289, \"end\": 634.489, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 634.489, \"end\": 634.57, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 634.57, \"end\": 634.81, \"score\": 0.849}, {\"word\": \"醫\"}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 634.81, \"end\": 635.17, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"聯\"}, {\"word\": \"絡\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 635.17, \"end\": 635.751, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 635.751, \"end\": 636.171, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"發\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 636.171, \"end\": 636.291, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"新\", \"start\": 636.291, \"end\": 636.591, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"聞\"}, {\"word\": \"稿\", \"start\": 636.591, \"end\": 636.771, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 636.771, \"end\": 636.831, \"score\": 0.685}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 636.831, \"end\": 636.932, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 636.932, \"end\": 637.032, \"score\": 0.816}, {\"word\": \"才\", \"start\": 637.032, \"end\": 638.133, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"發\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 638.133, \"end\": 638.373, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 638.373, \"end\": 638.593, \"score\": 0.906}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 638.593, \"end\": 638.693, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 638.693, \"end\": 638.793, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 638.793, \"end\": 639.053, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"懂\", \"start\": 639.053, \"end\": 639.474, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"並\"}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 639.474, \"end\": 639.674, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"防\", \"start\": 639.674, \"end\": 639.934, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"止\", \"start\": 639.934, \"end\": 640.294, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 640.294, \"end\": 640.475, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 640.475, \"end\": 640.615, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 640.615, \"end\": 641.335, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 641.335, \"end\": 641.495, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 641.495, \"end\": 641.515, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"長\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:07,636 --> 00:00:10,399\n主席委員還有各位官員好我請彭部長\n\n2\n00:00:15,468 --> 00:00:39,238\n部長好部長你還記得去年7月剛上任的時候洪森漢委員有找你去體驗一日拾荒原嗎那我給你報告一個數據我覺得有可能會被低估不知道您是不是這樣認同這個列冊的拾荒者回收量佔全台總量的9%而清潔隊是10%你有覺得有可能被低估了嗎\n\n3\n00:00:40,178 --> 00:01:06,824\n的確是低估啦因為報告委員他最主要是說有些有些縣市的福利比較好所以他們不願意去申報這個我們有去調查過是那當時您在跟紅山委員體驗的時候就說過阿姨很辛苦所以你希望回到這個部裡要跟紅山委員一起討論要怎麼提升石荒原的勞工條件現在播放一下請助理播放一下\n\n4\n00:01:07,930 --> 00:01:32,405\n我們應該正視這一群底層的人的存在而一定的形狀的存在讓這群底層的人能夠為我們做到什麼樣的處理也很謝謝五角班想要辦法更進一步的進行這個資源回收的提議很希望網絡上面的朋友可以跟我們一起關心這個議題讓這些底層的工作者有更尊嚴的合同條件我們才會有更好的資源回收跟更環保的城市\n\n5\n00:01:34,126 --> 00:01:55,582\n好那現在洪山委員已經不是委員了他已經是部長了嘛不過許多網友還持續關心這樣子的議題所以我去翻了一下環境部最近有沒有就實荒者的勞動條件這件事情跟勞動部來進行討論或是開會但是沒有耶這個議題還沒有跟洪部長對還沒有討論那你會考慮\n\n6\n00:01:59,116 --> 00:02:21,346\n報告委員因為第一個是我們有去協調過這些事情然後有發現就是說有些死荒者因為有些地方的福利他的待遇比較好他就沒有來報我們這個東西因為我們有一些補助的方案所以這個是一個大的問題我們跟地方政府在協調當中那第二個呢在我們的這個回收基金的委員上面其實我們最近我有在最近你有承諾說要再加一個第一線的\n\n7\n00:02:22,606 --> 00:02:46,373\n對目前正在進行當中那下一任的委員應該就有這種所謂的代表會再進來你會找NGO應該是支持就是所謂的這種死荒者的NGO相關的NGO請他們來進來反映真實的情況好那這邊我們稍微看一下因為從110年開始有看到資收關懷計畫的預算是逐年的下降那\n\n8\n00:02:47,173 --> 00:03:07,185\n怕你對於死亡者的保障還有福利是越來越少而且補助的人次保駕的收購經費也都呈現下降的趨勢那依據您剛剛講的說法是說你現在遇到了一個瓶頸就是有一些縣市條件比較好有一些比較不好所以你這個經費呈現下降的趨勢是這個意思嗎\n\n9\n00:03:09,046 --> 00:03:34,915\n這個請我們署長來回答跟委員報告那這些人數我們是請地方他們去做一些調查然後讓他們把這個死亡者願意的就把他納為我們服務的對象因為現在你的列冊全台死亡人數是7283人但是真正有參與你的資收關懷計畫大概只有2370人所以如何你要讓這兩個可以\n\n10\n00:03:37,395 --> 00:04:06,322\n人數可以比較match這個可能是你要努力的任務啦是不是你有沒有什麼想法應該要怎麼做各位委員報告我們現在有一個計畫是進行比較普遍全面的調查那瞭解說他們為什麼沒有來的原因那這個調查是去應該是去年年底開始進行的那我想結果出來之後我們比較能夠瞭解好那初步的方向你覺得是是不是因為他們要兼顧他們的社福的身份是\n\n11\n00:04:07,302 --> 00:04:27,881\n那因為那個社福這邊的規定就是如果你超過的話就是沒有辦法領到這個社福的這個錢那我們有跟他說我們有跟那個衛福協調過說有沒有辦法我們這個是低收入的我們是持荒者可是他說因為如果你要去例外的話就要在自己的法令裡面去做排除的條款\n\n12\n00:04:28,962 --> 00:04:48,989\n對所以我想銜接一下剛剛那個短影片嘛因為您在洪森漢委員擔任委員的時候而且他現在已經是部長就發現原來這件事如果要落實你可能需要跟勞動部還有剛剛署長提到的衛福部等於是三個地方要做橫向溝通才有辦法所以也希望很快可以看到你們三個部的會議記錄好嗎\n\n13\n00:04:50,029 --> 00:05:17,999\n好謝謝委員這個因為這個這件事情最主要是第一個是費率要往上拉啦他們死荒者的費率那這個我們會就等於是這一期的委員那我們就是我有特別指示要加入他們的代表進來就有機會充分的反映因為這也是當時他們的訴求之一啦是就給你看一下這是今年6月即將卸任的審議會委員嘛裡面有21個成員但對大家比較不能接受可能裡面才太多\n\n14\n00:05:19,019 --> 00:05:45,275\n太多跟第一線比較不相關可能沒有那麼了解實際工作或是基層的聲音的人所以你要加一位我們會有一個所謂的團體的代表那就是代表所謂的這個所謂這個資收戶的代表他們長期關心這個議題因為死亡阿嬤他們很辛苦所以我也不可能找一個阿嬤來所以基本上我們還會找一些關心這個族群的代表會幫他們爭取權益的來擔任委員\n\n15\n00:05:47,276 --> 00:06:12,356\n了解所以剛剛有講到說你造冊跟實際來做這個補助的人次差很多所以他們也有統計啦民團他們有統計說知道有這個資收關懷計畫的有八成八成的實況者根本就不知道這是一個蠻嚴重的警訊因此您要怎麼去提高他的能見度可以讓他們可以廣為知道是不是要多多跟這些民團來做\n\n16\n00:06:13,897 --> 00:06:35,556\n合作並且請他們加強幫忙宣導是嗎對對這個這個會加強那因為這裡面還有一個部分是因為這個執行都要靠地方縣市的環保局等於或是他們的社會局來來協助那這個部分我們會再跟地方在一起來溝通那不該委員特別指教的三個部會的協調我們會進行來進行好那我們也期待看到你們的合作好謝謝\n\n17\n00:06:36,597 --> 00:07:04,304\n接下來因為很多人有關心最近對於這個基金或是國發基金的議題當然是特別敏感啦甚至牽涉到有B案的可能那您之前曾經來這邊做業務報告的時候有提到說2050淨零排放的目標下由政府帶動綠色投資是國際趨勢嘛因此日本有做綠色創新基金還有美國做降低通膨法案等等的所以我們也會提出一個官方的基金叫做綠色成長基金\n\n18\n00:07:04,924 --> 00:07:23,181\n當然其中投資的對象有包括資源循環的永續的前瞻還有能源儲能以及效率碳捕捉負碳技術等等等等的那這個招標是2月7號公告3月11開標都有按照時程嗎對都有按照時程然後基金總規模是100億元嗎對100億分10年10年來完成這個事情\n\n19\n00:07:29,727 --> 00:07:56,230\n好因為之前我們獲得的消息是綠色成長基金專案的辦公室應該要在去年2024年11月就說要成立現在成立了嗎還沒有因為第一個是因為政府機關像這個基金我們弄了然後最後國發會申請到是年底然後年底他要撥預算給我們我也不是就是公務程序那你預計什麼時候要成立我們要預計在5月可以掛牌\n\n20\n00:07:57,110 --> 00:08:19,447\n掛牌然後辦公室應該在五月底可以成立然後運作的話可能是在五月底六月初就可以開始對外正式運作因此你大概預計五月底六月初你才要開放受理投資案件的申請嗎對對他會到時候委員關心的說會不會有什麼弊案基本上我們不會讓這個弊案發生一定有一個程序會來進行所以請委員放心\n\n21\n00:08:20,247 --> 00:08:44,354\n我跟你說因為這個月你也知道在這個國發基金不當投資暨管理失職調查委員會有許許多多的討論那當然後來書面報告他有提出九項改革包括強化投資審查機制加強投資後管理還有風險預警指標等等的但是你的這個實施方案作業要點已經列好了你已經做好了請問\n\n22\n00:08:47,513 --> 00:09:02,321\n經過這個檢討還有調查委員會之後你有沒有想要讓你的這個作業方案更為嚴格一點你有沒有要修改的地方包委員這個其實一定要嚴格的一定要符合法尊但是其實有時候基金投資不可能\n\n23\n00:09:03,482 --> 00:09:24,789\n任何的基金都是不可能全部都賺錢一定有賺有賺所以他才說增建風險預警的指標啊還有投資後的管理措施啊對這個我們一定會按照因為我們的上游是國發會的基金管理委員會所以我們會遵照他們的指示我們是他們下面的七大基金之一所以我們會完全會照他們的這個指示來進行\n\n24\n00:09:25,529 --> 00:09:44,340\n好我也希望未來不會衍生出什麼弊案歡迎我也來監督我是覺得大家可以來監督最後一個問題最後一個問題就是上週五一個比較大的議題是護理師在台大醫院的企業工會講說哇台大有了老鼠患之後居然是一位護理師發一塊黏鼠板來做處理但是面臨護理荒\n\n25\n00:09:48,723 --> 00:10:10,313\n他們還要再做這樣額外的工作真的不行結果台大醫院呢就跑出來說沒有請護理師放心他們跟簽約的清潔公司會來清除病媒但是您身為病媒的最高指導機關你是不是覺得你應該好好的幫他們把脈因為簽約的清潔公司跟病媒的防治根本就是兩個不同的專業對吧\n\n26\n00:10:12,082 --> 00:10:31,147\n對其實這個不會是一般人都有專業的人來處理像我這兩天聽到監察院聽說3月就有很多的老鼠在吃文件你有趕快跟他聯絡嗎那個室內的話不是我們的事我們是跑到馬路上來是環境部的事我們署長來回答是報告委員我們有1000多家的病房之類假設台大有問題我們願意去協助他們\n\n27\n00:10:31,527 --> 00:10:41,515\n好那今天這個會議結束希望你們可以主動跟台大醫院聯絡因為他們發了新聞稿以後我才發現其實他們沒有那麼懂並沒防止是沒問題好謝謝謝謝好謝謝謝謝請問謝謝部長\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n7636\t10399\t主席委員還有各位官員好我請彭部長\n15468\t39238\t部長好部長你還記得去年7月剛上任的時候洪森漢委員有找你去體驗一日拾荒原嗎那我給你報告一個數據我覺得有可能會被低估不知道您是不是這樣認同這個列冊的拾荒者回收量佔全台總量的9%而清潔隊是10%你有覺得有可能被低估了嗎\n40178\t66824\t的確是低估啦因為報告委員他最主要是說有些有些縣市的福利比較好所以他們不願意去申報這個我們有去調查過是那當時您在跟紅山委員體驗的時候就說過阿姨很辛苦所以你希望回到這個部裡要跟紅山委員一起討論要怎麼提升石荒原的勞工條件現在播放一下請助理播放一下\n67930\t92405\t我們應該正視這一群底層的人的存在而一定的形狀的存在讓這群底層的人能夠為我們做到什麼樣的處理也很謝謝五角班想要辦法更進一步的進行這個資源回收的提議很希望網絡上面的朋友可以跟我們一起關心這個議題讓這些底層的工作者有更尊嚴的合同條件我們才會有更好的資源回收跟更環保的城市\n94126\t115582\t好那現在洪山委員已經不是委員了他已經是部長了嘛不過許多網友還持續關心這樣子的議題所以我去翻了一下環境部最近有沒有就實荒者的勞動條件這件事情跟勞動部來進行討論或是開會但是沒有耶這個議題還沒有跟洪部長對還沒有討論那你會考慮\n119116\t141346\t報告委員因為第一個是我們有去協調過這些事情然後有發現就是說有些死荒者因為有些地方的福利他的待遇比較好他就沒有來報我們這個東西因為我們有一些補助的方案所以這個是一個大的問題我們跟地方政府在協調當中那第二個呢在我們的這個回收基金的委員上面其實我們最近我有在最近你有承諾說要再加一個第一線的\n142606\t166373\t對目前正在進行當中那下一任的委員應該就有這種所謂的代表會再進來你會找NGO應該是支持就是所謂的這種死荒者的NGO相關的NGO請他們來進來反映真實的情況好那這邊我們稍微看一下因為從110年開始有看到資收關懷計畫的預算是逐年的下降那\n167173\t187185\t怕你對於死亡者的保障還有福利是越來越少而且補助的人次保駕的收購經費也都呈現下降的趨勢那依據您剛剛講的說法是說你現在遇到了一個瓶頸就是有一些縣市條件比較好有一些比較不好所以你這個經費呈現下降的趨勢是這個意思嗎\n189046\t214915\t這個請我們署長來回答跟委員報告那這些人數我們是請地方他們去做一些調查然後讓他們把這個死亡者願意的就把他納為我們服務的對象因為現在你的列冊全台死亡人數是7283人但是真正有參與你的資收關懷計畫大概只有2370人所以如何你要讓這兩個可以\n217395\t246322\t人數可以比較match這個可能是你要努力的任務啦是不是你有沒有什麼想法應該要怎麼做各位委員報告我們現在有一個計畫是進行比較普遍全面的調查那瞭解說他們為什麼沒有來的原因那這個調查是去應該是去年年底開始進行的那我想結果出來之後我們比較能夠瞭解好那初步的方向你覺得是是不是因為他們要兼顧他們的社福的身份是\n247302\t267881\t那因為那個社福這邊的規定就是如果你超過的話就是沒有辦法領到這個社福的這個錢那我們有跟他說我們有跟那個衛福協調過說有沒有辦法我們這個是低收入的我們是持荒者可是他說因為如果你要去例外的話就要在自己的法令裡面去做排除的條款\n268962\t288989\t對 所以我想銜接一下剛剛那個短影片嘛因為您在洪森漢委員擔任委員的時候而且他現在已經是部長就發現原來這件事如果要落實你可能需要跟勞動部還有剛剛署長提到的衛福部等於是三個地方要做橫向溝通才有辦法所以也希望很快可以看到你們三個部的會議記錄好嗎\n290029\t317999\t好謝謝委員這個因為這個這件事情最主要是第一個是費率要往上拉啦他們死荒者的費率那這個我們會就等於是這一期的委員那我們就是我有特別指示要加入他們的代表進來就有機會充分的反映因為這也是當時他們的訴求之一啦是就給你看一下這是今年6月即將卸任的審議會委員嘛裡面有21個成員但對大家比較不能接受可能裡面才太多\n319019\t345275\t太多跟第一線比較不相關可能沒有那麼了解實際工作或是基層的聲音的人所以你要加一位我們會有一個所謂的團體的代表那就是代表所謂的這個所謂這個資收戶的代表他們長期關心這個議題因為死亡阿嬤他們很辛苦所以我也不可能找一個阿嬤來所以基本上我們還會找一些關心這個族群的代表會幫他們爭取權益的來擔任委員\n347276\t372356\t了解所以剛剛有講到說你造冊跟實際來做這個補助的人次差很多所以他們也有統計啦民團他們有統計說知道有這個資收關懷計畫的有八成八成的實況者根本就不知道這是一個蠻嚴重的警訊因此您要怎麼去提高他的能見度可以讓他們可以廣為知道是不是要多多跟這些民團來做\n373897\t395556\t合作並且請他們加強幫忙宣導是嗎對對這個這個會加強那因為這裡面還有一個部分是因為這個執行都要靠地方縣市的環保局等於或是他們的社會局來來協助那這個部分我們會再跟地方在一起來溝通那不該委員特別指教的三個部會的協調我們會進行來進行好那我們也期待看到你們的合作好謝謝\n396597\t424304\t接下來因為很多人有關心最近對於這個基金或是國發基金的議題當然是特別敏感啦甚至牽涉到有B案的可能那您之前曾經來這邊做業務報告的時候有提到說2050淨零排放的目標下由政府帶動綠色投資是國際趨勢嘛因此日本有做綠色創新基金還有美國做降低通膨法案等等的所以我們也會提出一個官方的基金叫做綠色成長基金\n424924\t443181\t當然其中投資的對象有包括資源循環的永續的前瞻還有能源儲能以及效率碳捕捉負碳技術等等等等的那這個招標是2月7號公告3月11開標都有按照時程嗎對都有按照時程然後基金總規模是100億元嗎對100億分10年10年來完成這個事情\n449727\t476230\t好因為之前我們獲得的消息是綠色成長基金專案的辦公室應該要在去年2024年11月就說要成立現在成立了嗎還沒有因為第一個是因為政府機關像這個基金我們弄了然後最後國發會申請到是年底然後年底他要撥預算給我們我也不是就是公務程序那你預計什麼時候要成立我們要預計在5月可以掛牌\n477110\t499447\t掛牌然後辦公室應該在五月底可以成立然後運作的話可能是在五月底六月初就可以開始對外正式運作因此你大概預計五月底六月初你才要開放受理投資案件的申請嗎對對他會到時候委員關心的說會不會有什麼弊案基本上我們不會讓這個弊案發生一定有一個程序會來進行所以請委員放心\n500247\t524354\t我跟你說因為這個月你也知道在這個國發基金不當投資暨管理失職調查委員會有許許多多的討論那當然後來書面報告他有提出九項改革包括強化投資審查機制加強投資後管理還有風險預警指標等等的但是你的這個實施方案作業要點已經列好了你已經做好了請問\n527513\t542321\t經過這個檢討還有調查委員會之後你有沒有想要讓你的這個作業方案更為嚴格一點你有沒有要修改的地方包委員這個其實一定要嚴格的一定要符合法尊但是其實有時候基金投資不可能\n543482\t564789\t任何的基金都是不可能全部都賺錢一定有賺有賺所以他才說增建風險預警的指標啊還有投資後的管理措施啊對這個我們一定會按照因為我們的上游是國發會的基金管理委員會所以我們會遵照他們的指示我們是他們下面的七大基金之一所以我們會完全會照他們的這個指示來進行\n565529\t584340\t好 我也希望未來不會衍生出什麼弊案歡迎我也來監督我是覺得大家可以來監督最後一個問題最後一個問題就是上週五一個比較大的議題是護理師在台大醫院的企業工會講說哇 台大有了老鼠患之後居然是一位護理師發一塊黏鼠板來做處理但是面臨護理荒\n588723\t610313\t他們還要再做這樣額外的工作真的不行結果台大醫院呢就跑出來說沒有請護理師放心他們跟簽約的清潔公司會來清除病媒但是您身為病媒的最高指導機關你是不是覺得你應該好好的幫他們把脈因為簽約的清潔公司跟病媒的防治根本就是兩個不同的專業對吧\n612082\t631147\t對 其實這個不會是一般人都有專業的人來處理像我這兩天聽到監察院聽說3月就有很多的老鼠在吃文件你有趕快跟他聯絡嗎那個室內的話不是我們的事我們是跑到馬路上來是環境部的事我們署長來回答是 報告委員我們有1000多家的病房之類假設台大有問題我們願意去協助他們\n631527\t641515\t好那今天這個會議結束希望你們可以主動跟台大醫院聯絡因為他們發了新聞稿以後我才發現其實他們沒有那麼懂並沒防止是沒問題好謝謝謝謝好謝謝謝謝請問謝謝部長\n","txt":"主席委員還有各位官員好我請彭部長\n部長好部長你還記得去年7月剛上任的時候洪森漢委員有找你去體驗一日拾荒原嗎那我給你報告一個數據我覺得有可能會被低估不知道您是不是這樣認同這個列冊的拾荒者回收量佔全台總量的9%而清潔隊是10%你有覺得有可能被低估了嗎\n的確是低估啦因為報告委員他最主要是說有些有些縣市的福利比較好所以他們不願意去申報這個我們有去調查過是那當時您在跟紅山委員體驗的時候就說過阿姨很辛苦所以你希望回到這個部裡要跟紅山委員一起討論要怎麼提升石荒原的勞工條件現在播放一下請助理播放一下\n我們應該正視這一群底層的人的存在而一定的形狀的存在讓這群底層的人能夠為我們做到什麼樣的處理也很謝謝五角班想要辦法更進一步的進行這個資源回收的提議很希望網絡上面的朋友可以跟我們一起關心這個議題讓這些底層的工作者有更尊嚴的合同條件我們才會有更好的資源回收跟更環保的城市\n好那現在洪山委員已經不是委員了他已經是部長了嘛不過許多網友還持續關心這樣子的議題所以我去翻了一下環境部最近有沒有就實荒者的勞動條件這件事情跟勞動部來進行討論或是開會但是沒有耶這個議題還沒有跟洪部長對還沒有討論那你會考慮\n報告委員因為第一個是我們有去協調過這些事情然後有發現就是說有些死荒者因為有些地方的福利他的待遇比較好他就沒有來報我們這個東西因為我們有一些補助的方案所以這個是一個大的問題我們跟地方政府在協調當中那第二個呢在我們的這個回收基金的委員上面其實我們最近我有在最近你有承諾說要再加一個第一線的\n對目前正在進行當中那下一任的委員應該就有這種所謂的代表會再進來你會找NGO應該是支持就是所謂的這種死荒者的NGO相關的NGO請他們來進來反映真實的情況好那這邊我們稍微看一下因為從110年開始有看到資收關懷計畫的預算是逐年的下降那\n怕你對於死亡者的保障還有福利是越來越少而且補助的人次保駕的收購經費也都呈現下降的趨勢那依據您剛剛講的說法是說你現在遇到了一個瓶頸就是有一些縣市條件比較好有一些比較不好所以你這個經費呈現下降的趨勢是這個意思嗎\n這個請我們署長來回答跟委員報告那這些人數我們是請地方他們去做一些調查然後讓他們把這個死亡者願意的就把他納為我們服務的對象因為現在你的列冊全台死亡人數是7283人但是真正有參與你的資收關懷計畫大概只有2370人所以如何你要讓這兩個可以\n人數可以比較match這個可能是你要努力的任務啦是不是你有沒有什麼想法應該要怎麼做各位委員報告我們現在有一個計畫是進行比較普遍全面的調查那瞭解說他們為什麼沒有來的原因那這個調查是去應該是去年年底開始進行的那我想結果出來之後我們比較能夠瞭解好那初步的方向你覺得是是不是因為他們要兼顧他們的社福的身份是\n那因為那個社福這邊的規定就是如果你超過的話就是沒有辦法領到這個社福的這個錢那我們有跟他說我們有跟那個衛福協調過說有沒有辦法我們這個是低收入的我們是持荒者可是他說因為如果你要去例外的話就要在自己的法令裡面去做排除的條款\n對 所以我想銜接一下剛剛那個短影片嘛因為您在洪森漢委員擔任委員的時候而且他現在已經是部長就發現原來這件事如果要落實你可能需要跟勞動部還有剛剛署長提到的衛福部等於是三個地方要做橫向溝通才有辦法所以也希望很快可以看到你們三個部的會議記錄好嗎\n好謝謝委員這個因為這個這件事情最主要是第一個是費率要往上拉啦他們死荒者的費率那這個我們會就等於是這一期的委員那我們就是我有特別指示要加入他們的代表進來就有機會充分的反映因為這也是當時他們的訴求之一啦是就給你看一下這是今年6月即將卸任的審議會委員嘛裡面有21個成員但對大家比較不能接受可能裡面才太多\n太多跟第一線比較不相關可能沒有那麼了解實際工作或是基層的聲音的人所以你要加一位我們會有一個所謂的團體的代表那就是代表所謂的這個所謂這個資收戶的代表他們長期關心這個議題因為死亡阿嬤他們很辛苦所以我也不可能找一個阿嬤來所以基本上我們還會找一些關心這個族群的代表會幫他們爭取權益的來擔任委員\n了解所以剛剛有講到說你造冊跟實際來做這個補助的人次差很多所以他們也有統計啦民團他們有統計說知道有這個資收關懷計畫的有八成八成的實況者根本就不知道這是一個蠻嚴重的警訊因此您要怎麼去提高他的能見度可以讓他們可以廣為知道是不是要多多跟這些民團來做\n合作並且請他們加強幫忙宣導是嗎對對這個這個會加強那因為這裡面還有一個部分是因為這個執行都要靠地方縣市的環保局等於或是他們的社會局來來協助那這個部分我們會再跟地方在一起來溝通那不該委員特別指教的三個部會的協調我們會進行來進行好那我們也期待看到你們的合作好謝謝\n接下來因為很多人有關心最近對於這個基金或是國發基金的議題當然是特別敏感啦甚至牽涉到有B案的可能那您之前曾經來這邊做業務報告的時候有提到說2050淨零排放的目標下由政府帶動綠色投資是國際趨勢嘛因此日本有做綠色創新基金還有美國做降低通膨法案等等的所以我們也會提出一個官方的基金叫做綠色成長基金\n當然其中投資的對象有包括資源循環的永續的前瞻還有能源儲能以及效率碳捕捉負碳技術等等等等的那這個招標是2月7號公告3月11開標都有按照時程嗎對都有按照時程然後基金總規模是100億元嗎對100億分10年10年來完成這個事情\n好因為之前我們獲得的消息是綠色成長基金專案的辦公室應該要在去年2024年11月就說要成立現在成立了嗎還沒有因為第一個是因為政府機關像這個基金我們弄了然後最後國發會申請到是年底然後年底他要撥預算給我們我也不是就是公務程序那你預計什麼時候要成立我們要預計在5月可以掛牌\n掛牌然後辦公室應該在五月底可以成立然後運作的話可能是在五月底六月初就可以開始對外正式運作因此你大概預計五月底六月初你才要開放受理投資案件的申請嗎對對他會到時候委員關心的說會不會有什麼弊案基本上我們不會讓這個弊案發生一定有一個程序會來進行所以請委員放心\n我跟你說因為這個月你也知道在這個國發基金不當投資暨管理失職調查委員會有許許多多的討論那當然後來書面報告他有提出九項改革包括強化投資審查機制加強投資後管理還有風險預警指標等等的但是你的這個實施方案作業要點已經列好了你已經做好了請問\n經過這個檢討還有調查委員會之後你有沒有想要讓你的這個作業方案更為嚴格一點你有沒有要修改的地方包委員這個其實一定要嚴格的一定要符合法尊但是其實有時候基金投資不可能\n任何的基金都是不可能全部都賺錢一定有賺有賺所以他才說增建風險預警的指標啊還有投資後的管理措施啊對這個我們一定會按照因為我們的上游是國發會的基金管理委員會所以我們會遵照他們的指示我們是他們下面的七大基金之一所以我們會完全會照他們的這個指示來進行\n好 我也希望未來不會衍生出什麼弊案歡迎我也來監督我是覺得大家可以來監督最後一個問題最後一個問題就是上週五一個比較大的議題是護理師在台大醫院的企業工會講說哇 台大有了老鼠患之後居然是一位護理師發一塊黏鼠板來做處理但是面臨護理荒\n他們還要再做這樣額外的工作真的不行結果台大醫院呢就跑出來說沒有請護理師放心他們跟簽約的清潔公司會來清除病媒但是您身為病媒的最高指導機關你是不是覺得你應該好好的幫他們把脈因為簽約的清潔公司跟病媒的防治根本就是兩個不同的專業對吧\n對 其實這個不會是一般人都有專業的人來處理像我這兩天聽到監察院聽說3月就有很多的老鼠在吃文件你有趕快跟他聯絡嗎那個室內的話不是我們的事我們是跑到馬路上來是環境部的事我們署長來回答是 報告委員我們有1000多家的病房之類假設台大有問題我們願意去協助他們\n好那今天這個會議結束希望你們可以主動跟台大醫院聯絡因為他們發了新聞稿以後我才發現其實他們沒有那麼懂並沒防止是沒問題好謝謝謝謝好謝謝謝謝請問謝謝部長\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:07.636 --> 00:10.399\n主席委員還有各位官員好我請彭部長\n\n00:15.468 --> 00:39.238\n部長好部長你還記得去年7月剛上任的時候洪森漢委員有找你去體驗一日拾荒原嗎那我給你報告一個數據我覺得有可能會被低估不知道您是不是這樣認同這個列冊的拾荒者回收量佔全台總量的9%而清潔隊是10%你有覺得有可能被低估了嗎\n\n00:40.178 --> 01:06.824\n的確是低估啦因為報告委員他最主要是說有些有些縣市的福利比較好所以他們不願意去申報這個我們有去調查過是那當時您在跟紅山委員體驗的時候就說過阿姨很辛苦所以你希望回到這個部裡要跟紅山委員一起討論要怎麼提升石荒原的勞工條件現在播放一下請助理播放一下\n\n01:07.930 --> 01:32.405\n我們應該正視這一群底層的人的存在而一定的形狀的存在讓這群底層的人能夠為我們做到什麼樣的處理也很謝謝五角班想要辦法更進一步的進行這個資源回收的提議很希望網絡上面的朋友可以跟我們一起關心這個議題讓這些底層的工作者有更尊嚴的合同條件我們才會有更好的資源回收跟更環保的城市\n\n01:34.126 --> 01:55.582\n好那現在洪山委員已經不是委員了他已經是部長了嘛不過許多網友還持續關心這樣子的議題所以我去翻了一下環境部最近有沒有就實荒者的勞動條件這件事情跟勞動部來進行討論或是開會但是沒有耶這個議題還沒有跟洪部長對還沒有討論那你會考慮\n\n01:59.116 --> 02:21.346\n報告委員因為第一個是我們有去協調過這些事情然後有發現就是說有些死荒者因為有些地方的福利他的待遇比較好他就沒有來報我們這個東西因為我們有一些補助的方案所以這個是一個大的問題我們跟地方政府在協調當中那第二個呢在我們的這個回收基金的委員上面其實我們最近我有在最近你有承諾說要再加一個第一線的\n\n02:22.606 --> 02:46.373\n對目前正在進行當中那下一任的委員應該就有這種所謂的代表會再進來你會找NGO應該是支持就是所謂的這種死荒者的NGO相關的NGO請他們來進來反映真實的情況好那這邊我們稍微看一下因為從110年開始有看到資收關懷計畫的預算是逐年的下降那\n\n02:47.173 --> 03:07.185\n怕你對於死亡者的保障還有福利是越來越少而且補助的人次保駕的收購經費也都呈現下降的趨勢那依據您剛剛講的說法是說你現在遇到了一個瓶頸就是有一些縣市條件比較好有一些比較不好所以你這個經費呈現下降的趨勢是這個意思嗎\n\n03:09.046 --> 03:34.915\n這個請我們署長來回答跟委員報告那這些人數我們是請地方他們去做一些調查然後讓他們把這個死亡者願意的就把他納為我們服務的對象因為現在你的列冊全台死亡人數是7283人但是真正有參與你的資收關懷計畫大概只有2370人所以如何你要讓這兩個可以\n\n03:37.395 --> 04:06.322\n人數可以比較match這個可能是你要努力的任務啦是不是你有沒有什麼想法應該要怎麼做各位委員報告我們現在有一個計畫是進行比較普遍全面的調查那瞭解說他們為什麼沒有來的原因那這個調查是去應該是去年年底開始進行的那我想結果出來之後我們比較能夠瞭解好那初步的方向你覺得是是不是因為他們要兼顧他們的社福的身份是\n\n04:07.302 --> 04:27.881\n那因為那個社福這邊的規定就是如果你超過的話就是沒有辦法領到這個社福的這個錢那我們有跟他說我們有跟那個衛福協調過說有沒有辦法我們這個是低收入的我們是持荒者可是他說因為如果你要去例外的話就要在自己的法令裡面去做排除的條款\n\n04:28.962 --> 04:48.989\n對所以我想銜接一下剛剛那個短影片嘛因為您在洪森漢委員擔任委員的時候而且他現在已經是部長就發現原來這件事如果要落實你可能需要跟勞動部還有剛剛署長提到的衛福部等於是三個地方要做橫向溝通才有辦法所以也希望很快可以看到你們三個部的會議記錄好嗎\n\n04:50.029 --> 05:17.999\n好謝謝委員這個因為這個這件事情最主要是第一個是費率要往上拉啦他們死荒者的費率那這個我們會就等於是這一期的委員那我們就是我有特別指示要加入他們的代表進來就有機會充分的反映因為這也是當時他們的訴求之一啦是就給你看一下這是今年6月即將卸任的審議會委員嘛裡面有21個成員但對大家比較不能接受可能裡面才太多\n\n05:19.019 --> 05:45.275\n太多跟第一線比較不相關可能沒有那麼了解實際工作或是基層的聲音的人所以你要加一位我們會有一個所謂的團體的代表那就是代表所謂的這個所謂這個資收戶的代表他們長期關心這個議題因為死亡阿嬤他們很辛苦所以我也不可能找一個阿嬤來所以基本上我們還會找一些關心這個族群的代表會幫他們爭取權益的來擔任委員\n\n05:47.276 --> 06:12.356\n了解所以剛剛有講到說你造冊跟實際來做這個補助的人次差很多所以他們也有統計啦民團他們有統計說知道有這個資收關懷計畫的有八成八成的實況者根本就不知道這是一個蠻嚴重的警訊因此您要怎麼去提高他的能見度可以讓他們可以廣為知道是不是要多多跟這些民團來做\n\n06:13.897 --> 06:35.556\n合作並且請他們加強幫忙宣導是嗎對對這個這個會加強那因為這裡面還有一個部分是因為這個執行都要靠地方縣市的環保局等於或是他們的社會局來來協助那這個部分我們會再跟地方在一起來溝通那不該委員特別指教的三個部會的協調我們會進行來進行好那我們也期待看到你們的合作好謝謝\n\n06:36.597 --> 07:04.304\n接下來因為很多人有關心最近對於這個基金或是國發基金的議題當然是特別敏感啦甚至牽涉到有B案的可能那您之前曾經來這邊做業務報告的時候有提到說2050淨零排放的目標下由政府帶動綠色投資是國際趨勢嘛因此日本有做綠色創新基金還有美國做降低通膨法案等等的所以我們也會提出一個官方的基金叫做綠色成長基金\n\n07:04.924 --> 07:23.181\n當然其中投資的對象有包括資源循環的永續的前瞻還有能源儲能以及效率碳捕捉負碳技術等等等等的那這個招標是2月7號公告3月11開標都有按照時程嗎對都有按照時程然後基金總規模是100億元嗎對100億分10年10年來完成這個事情\n\n07:29.727 --> 07:56.230\n好因為之前我們獲得的消息是綠色成長基金專案的辦公室應該要在去年2024年11月就說要成立現在成立了嗎還沒有因為第一個是因為政府機關像這個基金我們弄了然後最後國發會申請到是年底然後年底他要撥預算給我們我也不是就是公務程序那你預計什麼時候要成立我們要預計在5月可以掛牌\n\n07:57.110 --> 08:19.447\n掛牌然後辦公室應該在五月底可以成立然後運作的話可能是在五月底六月初就可以開始對外正式運作因此你大概預計五月底六月初你才要開放受理投資案件的申請嗎對對他會到時候委員關心的說會不會有什麼弊案基本上我們不會讓這個弊案發生一定有一個程序會來進行所以請委員放心\n\n08:20.247 --> 08:44.354\n我跟你說因為這個月你也知道在這個國發基金不當投資暨管理失職調查委員會有許許多多的討論那當然後來書面報告他有提出九項改革包括強化投資審查機制加強投資後管理還有風險預警指標等等的但是你的這個實施方案作業要點已經列好了你已經做好了請問\n\n08:47.513 --> 09:02.321\n經過這個檢討還有調查委員會之後你有沒有想要讓你的這個作業方案更為嚴格一點你有沒有要修改的地方包委員這個其實一定要嚴格的一定要符合法尊但是其實有時候基金投資不可能\n\n09:03.482 --> 09:24.789\n任何的基金都是不可能全部都賺錢一定有賺有賺所以他才說增建風險預警的指標啊還有投資後的管理措施啊對這個我們一定會按照因為我們的上游是國發會的基金管理委員會所以我們會遵照他們的指示我們是他們下面的七大基金之一所以我們會完全會照他們的這個指示來進行\n\n09:25.529 --> 09:44.340\n好我也希望未來不會衍生出什麼弊案歡迎我也來監督我是覺得大家可以來監督最後一個問題最後一個問題就是上週五一個比較大的議題是護理師在台大醫院的企業工會講說哇台大有了老鼠患之後居然是一位護理師發一塊黏鼠板來做處理但是面臨護理荒\n\n09:48.723 --> 10:10.313\n他們還要再做這樣額外的工作真的不行結果台大醫院呢就跑出來說沒有請護理師放心他們跟簽約的清潔公司會來清除病媒但是您身為病媒的最高指導機關你是不是覺得你應該好好的幫他們把脈因為簽約的清潔公司跟病媒的防治根本就是兩個不同的專業對吧\n\n10:12.082 --> 10:31.147\n對其實這個不會是一般人都有專業的人來處理像我這兩天聽到監察院聽說3月就有很多的老鼠在吃文件你有趕快跟他聯絡嗎那個室內的話不是我們的事我們是跑到馬路上來是環境部的事我們署長來回答是報告委員我們有1000多家的病房之類假設台大有問題我們願意去協助他們\n\n10:31.527 --> 10:41.515\n好那今天這個會議結束希望你們可以主動跟台大醫院聯絡因為他們發了新聞稿以後我才發現其實他們沒有那麼懂並沒防止是沒問題好謝謝謝謝好謝謝謝謝請問謝謝部長\n\n","segments":[{"start":7.636,"end":10.399,"text":"主席委員還有各位官員好我請彭部長"},{"start":15.468,"end":39.238,"text":"部長好部長你還記得去年7月剛上任的時候洪森漢委員有找你去體驗一日拾荒原嗎那我給你報告一個數據我覺得有可能會被低估不知道您是不是這樣認同這個列冊的拾荒者回收量佔全台總量的9%而清潔隊是10%你有覺得有可能被低估了嗎"},{"start":40.178,"end":66.824,"text":"的確是低估啦因為報告委員他最主要是說有些有些縣市的福利比較好所以他們不願意去申報這個我們有去調查過是那當時您在跟紅山委員體驗的時候就說過阿姨很辛苦所以你希望回到這個部裡要跟紅山委員一起討論要怎麼提升石荒原的勞工條件現在播放一下請助理播放一下"},{"start":67.93,"end":92.405,"text":"我們應該正視這一群底層的人的存在而一定的形狀的存在讓這群底層的人能夠為我們做到什麼樣的處理也很謝謝五角班想要辦法更進一步的進行這個資源回收的提議很希望網絡上面的朋友可以跟我們一起關心這個議題讓這些底層的工作者有更尊嚴的合同條件我們才會有更好的資源回收跟更環保的城市"},{"start":94.126,"end":115.582,"text":"好那現在洪山委員已經不是委員了他已經是部長了嘛不過許多網友還持續關心這樣子的議題所以我去翻了一下環境部最近有沒有就實荒者的勞動條件這件事情跟勞動部來進行討論或是開會但是沒有耶這個議題還沒有跟洪部長對還沒有討論那你會考慮"},{"start":119.116,"end":141.346,"text":"報告委員因為第一個是我們有去協調過這些事情然後有發現就是說有些死荒者因為有些地方的福利他的待遇比較好他就沒有來報我們這個東西因為我們有一些補助的方案所以這個是一個大的問題我們跟地方政府在協調當中那第二個呢在我們的這個回收基金的委員上面其實我們最近我有在最近你有承諾說要再加一個第一線的"},{"start":142.606,"end":166.373,"text":"對目前正在進行當中那下一任的委員應該就有這種所謂的代表會再進來你會找NGO應該是支持就是所謂的這種死荒者的NGO相關的NGO請他們來進來反映真實的情況好那這邊我們稍微看一下因為從110年開始有看到資收關懷計畫的預算是逐年的下降那"},{"start":167.173,"end":187.185,"text":"怕你對於死亡者的保障還有福利是越來越少而且補助的人次保駕的收購經費也都呈現下降的趨勢那依據您剛剛講的說法是說你現在遇到了一個瓶頸就是有一些縣市條件比較好有一些比較不好所以你這個經費呈現下降的趨勢是這個意思嗎"},{"start":189.046,"end":214.915,"text":"這個請我們署長來回答跟委員報告那這些人數我們是請地方他們去做一些調查然後讓他們把這個死亡者願意的就把他納為我們服務的對象因為現在你的列冊全台死亡人數是7283人但是真正有參與你的資收關懷計畫大概只有2370人所以如何你要讓這兩個可以"},{"start":217.395,"end":246.322,"text":"人數可以比較match這個可能是你要努力的任務啦是不是你有沒有什麼想法應該要怎麼做各位委員報告我們現在有一個計畫是進行比較普遍全面的調查那瞭解說他們為什麼沒有來的原因那這個調查是去應該是去年年底開始進行的那我想結果出來之後我們比較能夠瞭解好那初步的方向你覺得是是不是因為他們要兼顧他們的社福的身份是"},{"start":247.302,"end":267.881,"text":"那因為那個社福這邊的規定就是如果你超過的話就是沒有辦法領到這個社福的這個錢那我們有跟他說我們有跟那個衛福協調過說有沒有辦法我們這個是低收入的我們是持荒者可是他說因為如果你要去例外的話就要在自己的法令裡面去做排除的條款"},{"start":268.962,"end":288.989,"text":"對 所以我想銜接一下剛剛那個短影片嘛因為您在洪森漢委員擔任委員的時候而且他現在已經是部長就發現原來這件事如果要落實你可能需要跟勞動部還有剛剛署長提到的衛福部等於是三個地方要做橫向溝通才有辦法所以也希望很快可以看到你們三個部的會議記錄好嗎"},{"start":290.029,"end":317.999,"text":"好謝謝委員這個因為這個這件事情最主要是第一個是費率要往上拉啦他們死荒者的費率那這個我們會就等於是這一期的委員那我們就是我有特別指示要加入他們的代表進來就有機會充分的反映因為這也是當時他們的訴求之一啦是就給你看一下這是今年6月即將卸任的審議會委員嘛裡面有21個成員但對大家比較不能接受可能裡面才太多"},{"start":319.019,"end":345.275,"text":"太多跟第一線比較不相關可能沒有那麼了解實際工作或是基層的聲音的人所以你要加一位我們會有一個所謂的團體的代表那就是代表所謂的這個所謂這個資收戶的代表他們長期關心這個議題因為死亡阿嬤他們很辛苦所以我也不可能找一個阿嬤來所以基本上我們還會找一些關心這個族群的代表會幫他們爭取權益的來擔任委員"},{"start":347.276,"end":372.356,"text":"了解所以剛剛有講到說你造冊跟實際來做這個補助的人次差很多所以他們也有統計啦民團他們有統計說知道有這個資收關懷計畫的有八成八成的實況者根本就不知道這是一個蠻嚴重的警訊因此您要怎麼去提高他的能見度可以讓他們可以廣為知道是不是要多多跟這些民團來做"},{"start":373.897,"end":395.556,"text":"合作並且請他們加強幫忙宣導是嗎對對這個這個會加強那因為這裡面還有一個部分是因為這個執行都要靠地方縣市的環保局等於或是他們的社會局來來協助那這個部分我們會再跟地方在一起來溝通那不該委員特別指教的三個部會的協調我們會進行來進行好那我們也期待看到你們的合作好謝謝"},{"start":396.597,"end":424.304,"text":"接下來因為很多人有關心最近對於這個基金或是國發基金的議題當然是特別敏感啦甚至牽涉到有B案的可能那您之前曾經來這邊做業務報告的時候有提到說2050淨零排放的目標下由政府帶動綠色投資是國際趨勢嘛因此日本有做綠色創新基金還有美國做降低通膨法案等等的所以我們也會提出一個官方的基金叫做綠色成長基金"},{"start":424.924,"end":443.181,"text":"當然其中投資的對象有包括資源循環的永續的前瞻還有能源儲能以及效率碳捕捉負碳技術等等等等的那這個招標是2月7號公告3月11開標都有按照時程嗎對都有按照時程然後基金總規模是100億元嗎對100億分10年10年來完成這個事情"},{"start":449.727,"end":476.23,"text":"好因為之前我們獲得的消息是綠色成長基金專案的辦公室應該要在去年2024年11月就說要成立現在成立了嗎還沒有因為第一個是因為政府機關像這個基金我們弄了然後最後國發會申請到是年底然後年底他要撥預算給我們我也不是就是公務程序那你預計什麼時候要成立我們要預計在5月可以掛牌"},{"start":477.11,"end":499.447,"text":"掛牌然後辦公室應該在五月底可以成立然後運作的話可能是在五月底六月初就可以開始對外正式運作因此你大概預計五月底六月初你才要開放受理投資案件的申請嗎對對他會到時候委員關心的說會不會有什麼弊案基本上我們不會讓這個弊案發生一定有一個程序會來進行所以請委員放心"},{"start":500.247,"end":524.354,"text":"我跟你說因為這個月你也知道在這個國發基金不當投資暨管理失職調查委員會有許許多多的討論那當然後來書面報告他有提出九項改革包括強化投資審查機制加強投資後管理還有風險預警指標等等的但是你的這個實施方案作業要點已經列好了你已經做好了請問"},{"start":527.513,"end":542.321,"text":"經過這個檢討還有調查委員會之後你有沒有想要讓你的這個作業方案更為嚴格一點你有沒有要修改的地方包委員這個其實一定要嚴格的一定要符合法尊但是其實有時候基金投資不可能"},{"start":543.482,"end":564.789,"text":"任何的基金都是不可能全部都賺錢一定有賺有賺所以他才說增建風險預警的指標啊還有投資後的管理措施啊對這個我們一定會按照因為我們的上游是國發會的基金管理委員會所以我們會遵照他們的指示我們是他們下面的七大基金之一所以我們會完全會照他們的這個指示來進行"},{"start":565.529,"end":584.34,"text":"好 我也希望未來不會衍生出什麼弊案歡迎我也來監督我是覺得大家可以來監督最後一個問題最後一個問題就是上週五一個比較大的議題是護理師在台大醫院的企業工會講說哇 台大有了老鼠患之後居然是一位護理師發一塊黏鼠板來做處理但是面臨護理荒"},{"start":588.723,"end":610.313,"text":"他們還要再做這樣額外的工作真的不行結果台大醫院呢就跑出來說沒有請護理師放心他們跟簽約的清潔公司會來清除病媒但是您身為病媒的最高指導機關你是不是覺得你應該好好的幫他們把脈因為簽約的清潔公司跟病媒的防治根本就是兩個不同的專業對吧"},{"start":612.082,"end":631.147,"text":"對 其實這個不會是一般人都有專業的人來處理像我這兩天聽到監察院聽說3月就有很多的老鼠在吃文件你有趕快跟他聯絡嗎那個室內的話不是我們的事我們是跑到馬路上來是環境部的事我們署長來回答是 報告委員我們有1000多家的病房之類假設台大有問題我們願意去協助他們"},{"start":631.527,"end":641.515,"text":"好那今天這個會議結束希望你們可以主動跟台大醫院聯絡因為他們發了新聞稿以後我才發現其實他們沒有那麼懂並沒防止是沒問題好謝謝謝謝好謝謝謝謝請問謝謝部長"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":577,"blocks":[["陳委員菁徽：（9時27分）主席、委員，還有各位官員，好。我請彭部長。"],["彭部長啓明：陳委員好。"],["陳委員菁徽：部長好。部長，你還記得去年7月剛上任的時候，洪申翰委員有找你去體驗一日拾荒人，我跟你報告一個數據，我覺得有可能會被低估，不知道您是不是這樣認同？列冊的拾荒者回收量占全臺總量的9%，而清潔隊是10%，你覺得有可能被低估了嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：的確是低估，報告委員，最主要是因為有些縣市的福利比較好，所以他們不願意去申報，這個我們有去調查過。"],["陳委員菁徽：是。當時您跟洪申翰委員體驗的時候說過，阿姨很辛苦，所以你希望回到部裡要跟洪申翰委員一起討論怎麼提升拾荒人的勞工條件，請助理播放一下影片。","（播放影片）"],["陳委員菁徽：現在洪申翰委員已經不是委員了，他已經是部長了，不過許多網友還持續關心這樣子的議題，所以我去翻了一下環境部最近有沒有就拾荒者的勞動條件這件事情跟勞動部來進行討論或是開會，但是沒有耶！"],["彭部長啓明：對，這個議題還沒有跟洪部長討論。"],["陳委員菁徽：你會考慮……"],["彭部長啓明：報告委員，第一個是我們有去協調過這些事情，發現有些拾荒者因為地方的福利、待遇比較好，他就沒有來報我們這個東西，因為我們有一些補助的方案，所以這個是一個大的問題，我們跟地方政府在協調當中。","第二個，在我們這個回收基金的委員上面，最近我有……"],["陳委員菁徽：最近你有承諾說要再加一個第一線的……"],["彭部長啓明：對，目前正在進行當中，下一任的委員應該就有這種所謂的代表會加進來。"],["陳委員菁徽：你會找NGO？"],["彭部長啓明：應該是支持這種拾荒者相關的NGO，請他們進來反映真實的情況。"],["陳委員菁徽：我們稍微看一下，從110年開始，資收關懷計畫的預算是逐年下降，怕對於拾荒者的保障，還有福利越來越少，而且補助的人次、保價的收購補助經費也都呈現下降的趨勢。依據您剛剛的說法是，你現在遇到了一個瓶頸，就是有一些縣市條件比較好，有一些比較不好，所以這個經費呈現下降的趨勢，是這個意思嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：這個請我們署長來說明。"],["賴署長瑩瑩：跟委員報告，這些人數我們是請地方去做一些調查，讓他們把願意的拾荒者納為我們服務的對象。"],["陳委員菁徽：因為根據現在你的列冊，全臺拾荒人數是7,283人，但是真正有參與資收關懷計畫的大概只有2,370人，你如何讓這兩個人數可以比較match？這個可能是你要努力的任務，你有沒有什麼想法，應該要怎麼做？"],["賴署長瑩瑩：跟委員報告，我們現在有一個計畫是進行比較普遍、全面的調查，了解他們為什麼沒有來的原因，這個調查應該是去年年底開始進行的，我想結果出來之後我們比較能夠了解其中的原因。"],["陳委員菁徽：初步的方向你覺得是不是因為他們要兼顧社福的身分？"],["賴署長瑩瑩：是，因為社福的規定就是如果你超過的話就沒有辦法領到社福的這個錢，我們有跟衛福部協調過看有沒有辦法，因為他們是低收入的、是拾荒者，可是它說，如果要去例外的話，就要在自己的法令面去做排除的條款。"],["陳委員菁徽：對，所以我想銜接一下剛剛那個短影片，因為你在洪申翰委員擔任委員的時候就發現，他現在已經是部長，原來這件事要落實可能需要跟勞動部還有剛剛署長提到的衛福部，等於是三個地方要做橫向溝通才有辦法，所以也希望很快可以看到你們三個部的會議紀錄，好嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：好，謝謝委員，因為這件事情最主要第一個是拾荒者的費率要往上拉，這一期的委員我有特別指示要加入他們的代表進來，就有機會充分的反映，因為這也是當時他們的訴求之一。"],["陳委員菁徽：給你看一下，這是今年6月即將卸任的審議會委員，裡面有21個成員，但大家比較不能接受的可能是裡面有太多跟第一線比較不相關，可能沒有那麼了解實際工作或是基層的聲音的人，所以你要加1位？"],["彭部長啓明：對，我們會有一個所謂的團體的代表，就是資收戶的代表，他們長期關心這個議題，因為拾荒阿嬤他們很辛苦，所以我也不可能找一個阿嬤來，基本上我們會找一些關心這個族群、會幫他們爭取權益的代表來擔任委員。"],["陳委員菁徽：了解，剛剛有講到，你們造冊跟實際來做這個補助的人次差很多，民團也有統計知道這個資收關懷計畫有八成的拾荒者根本就不知道，這是一個蠻嚴重的警訊，因此您要怎麼去提高它的能見度，讓他們可以廣為知道這個計畫？是不是要多多跟這些民團合作，並且請他們加強幫忙宣導，是嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：對，這個會加強，但這裡面還有一個部分，因為執行都要靠地方縣市的環保局或社會局協助，這個部分我們會再跟地方一起溝通。至於剛才委員特別指教的三個部會的協調，我們會積極進行。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，那我們也期待看到你們的合作。"],["彭部長啓明：好，謝謝。"],["陳委員菁徽：接下來，很多人關心，最近對於基金或是國發基金的議題當然是特別敏感，甚至牽涉到有弊案的可能。您之前來做業務報告的時候曾經提到，2050淨零排放的目標下，由政府帶動綠色投資是國際趨勢，因此日本有做「綠色創新基金」，還有美國做「降低通膨法案」等等，所以我們也會提出一個官方的基金，叫做綠色成長基金，其中投資的對象包括資源循環、永續及前瞻能源或儲能、提升能源效率、碳捕捉再利用或負碳技術等等。這個招標是2月7號公告，3月11日開標，都有按照時程嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：對，都有按照時程。"],["陳委員菁徽：基金總規模是100億元嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：對，100億元，分10年來完成這個事情。"],["陳委員菁徽：之前我們獲得的消息是，綠色成長基金專案辦公室應該要在去（2024）年11月就要成立，現在成立了嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：還沒有，因為政府機關的程序，像這個基金我們弄了，最後國發會申請到是年底，年底它要撥預算給我們，就是公務程序比較漫長……"],["陳委員菁徽：那你預計什麼時候要成立？"],["彭部長啓明：我們預計在5月可以掛牌，辦公室應該在5月底可以成立，然後可能是在5月底、6月初就可以開始對外正式運作。"],["陳委員菁徽：因此你大概預計5月底、6月初才要開放受理投資案件的申請嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：對，委員關心會不會有什麼弊案，基本上，我們不會讓弊案發生，一定有一個程序會來進行，所以請委員放心。"],["陳委員菁徽：你也知道，這個月在國發基金不當投資暨管理失職調查委員會有許許多多的討論，後來書面報告有提出9項改革，包括強化投資審查機制、加強投資後管理，還有風險預警指標等等，但是你的實施方案作業要點已經列好了、你已經做好了，請問經過這個檢討，還有調查委員會之後，你有沒有想要讓你的作業方案更為嚴格一點？有沒有要修改的地方？"],["彭部長啓明：報告委員，這個一定要嚴格、一定要符合法遵，但是有時候基金投資不可能任何的基金全部都賺錢，一定有賺有賠。"],["陳委員菁徽：對，所以它才說增建風險預警的指標，還有投資後的管理措施。"],["彭部長啓明：對，因為我們的上游是國發會的基金管理委員會，所以我們一定會遵照他們的指示，我們是他們下面的七大基金之一，所以我們完全會照他們的指示進行。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，我也希望未來不會衍生出什麼弊案，這是很多人關心的。"],["彭部長啓明：不會，歡迎委員來監督，我是覺得大家可以來監督。"],["陳委員菁徽：最後一個問題，上週五有一個比較大的議題，護理師在臺大醫院的企業工會講，臺大有了老鼠患之後，處理方式居然是一位護理師發一塊黏鼠板，現在面臨護理荒，他們還要再做這樣額外的工作，真的不行。結果臺大醫院就跑出來說：沒有，請護理師放心，他們跟簽約的清潔公司會來清除病媒。您身為病媒防治的最高指導機關，你覺得是不是應該要好好的幫他們把脈？因為簽約的清潔公司跟病媒的防治根本就是兩個不同的專業，對吧？"],["彭部長啓明：對，其實這個不會是一般人，都會有專業的人來處理，像我這兩天聽說監察院3月就有很多老鼠在吃文件。"],["陳委員菁徽：你有趕快跟它聯絡嗎？"],["彭部長啓明：室內的話不是我們的事，如果跑到馬路上來是環境部的事，我們請署長來回答。"],["謝署長燕儒：是，報告委員，我們有一千多家的病媒防治業，假設臺大有問題，我們願意去協助它。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，今天這個會議結束後希望你們可以主動跟臺大醫院聯絡，因為他們發了新聞稿以後，我才發現其實他們沒有那麼懂病媒防治，好嗎？"],["謝署長燕儒：是，沒問題。"],["陳委員菁徽：好，謝謝。"],["彭部長啓明：謝謝。"],["主席：接下來請林月琴委員詢答。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":174,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-26-8","speakers":["劉建國","陳昭姿","陳菁徽","林月琴","邱鎮軍","蘇清泉","廖偉翔","王育敏","涂權吉","牛煦庭","林淑芬","葉元之","王正旭","劉書彬","盧縣一","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","黃秀芳","楊曜","陳瑩","徐欣瑩"],"page_start":69,"meetingDate":["2025-04-28"],"gazette_id":"1144301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144301_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第8次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請環境部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1144301_00003"}}}