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\"這個我們一定會來努力啦只是說現在的時候有一些法規法律上面的限制我們要來突破我知道經管會一直想突破很多法規我覺得您上來以後很多相關的法律都一直有在突破嘛但是我覺得你下面的單位好像對這些事情都有點不大認真啦\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 157.046, \"end\": 157.386, \"score\": 0.74}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 157.386, \"end\": 157.526, \"score\": 0.846}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 157.526, \"end\": 157.946, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"努\", \"start\": 157.946, \"end\": 158.147, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 158.147, \"end\": 158.307, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"啦\", \"start\": 158.307, \"end\": 158.507, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"只\", \"start\": 158.507, \"end\": 159.347, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 159.347, \"end\": 159.567, \"score\": 0.821}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 159.567, \"end\": 159.767, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 159.767, \"end\": 160.067, \"score\": 0.868}, 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0.812}, {\"word\": \"覺\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 172.072, \"end\": 172.352, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 172.352, \"end\": 172.592, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 172.592, \"end\": 172.753, \"score\": 0.841}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 172.753, \"end\": 172.833, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 172.833, \"end\": 173.113, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"單\"}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 173.113, \"end\": 173.253, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 173.253, \"end\": 173.393, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"像\", \"start\": 173.393, \"end\": 174.173, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 174.173, \"end\": 174.313, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 174.313, \"end\": 174.413, \"score\": 0.801}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 174.413, \"end\": 174.553, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 174.553, \"end\": 174.733, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 174.733, \"end\": 175.294, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"點\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 175.294, \"end\": 175.414, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 175.414, \"end\": 175.794, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"認\"}, {\"word\": \"真\", \"start\": 175.794, \"end\": 175.954, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"啦\", \"start\": 175.954, \"end\": 175.974, \"score\": 0.001}]}, {\"start\": 176.594, \"end\": 196.29, \"text\": \"這也不能這麼說啦因為主要是說我們看結果嘛1700萬這樣算金額嗎從上個會議到現在那我現在跟你請求啦就是說這個我一直在講說這個中小企業這個因為還經濟部在管嘛那也有相關的公司有這些有新創企業嘛他們也有新創署嘛我們這邊也有這個創新處嘛這相關單位是不是一起來開個會啊\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 176.594, \"end\": 176.794, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 176.794, \"end\": 176.874, \"score\": 0.764}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 176.874, \"end\": 177.515, \"score\": 0.819}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"啦\", \"start\": 177.515, \"end\": 177.715, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 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\"start\": 652.874, \"end\": 652.994, \"score\": 0.748}, {\"word\": \"別\", \"start\": 652.994, \"end\": 653.154, \"score\": 0.829}, {\"word\": \"注\", \"start\": 653.154, \"end\": 653.274, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"意\", \"start\": 653.274, \"end\": 653.294, \"score\": 0.047}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:05,839 --> 00:00:15,241\n謝謝主席我們請這個彭主委好請彭主委主席在這邊宣布我們現在開放在現場用餐\n\n2\n00:00:18,144 --> 00:00:43,266\n主委本期在前兩次會期都有跟您詢問過就是研議民間版的創櫃機制那您也有回覆說金管會金管會也有回覆說104年起已經開放證券商得經營股權性質群眾募資業成效有三家新創公司那時候的回覆是募資的金額現在有新台幣1700萬元這是上次回的\n\n3\n00:00:43,766 --> 00:00:57,366\n那專間又一個會期啦半年又過去請問現在的募資成效有績效有沒有增加這個我請說我們了解一下再跟委員報告你現在告訴我證據局成效咧1700萬\n\n4\n00:01:00,205 --> 00:01:15,036\n又過了半年有沒有再增加?目前是沒有增加的沒有增加為什麼?你們不認真做這個嗎?沒有,廢買壯心其實他們有在做這個業務那他們有去鼓勵或者法華可以做什麼所以你們不重視這種這個創櫃這個民間版的創櫃機制的這種募資的這個業務喔?還是你們的做法是錯誤的?\n\n5\n00:01:23,018 --> 00:01:49,329\n我們當然是重視這個機制重視怎麼會沒有成效呢我們現在所謂的創櫃板我們有做一個整合你看喔為了扶植中小微型企業你們政局有最新的函令解釋就是說通過限定綜合證券商可以投資創櫃板登錄期間發行的新股投資總計不得超過券商競爭5%也不受標準公司單次發行的限制所以這個是比較新的新聞了\n\n6\n00:01:50,049 --> 00:02:07,420\n那可見我覺得金管會在這個彭主委過來後包括很多的金融的這個措施我都感覺上有要創新有要前進有要這個但是這個雖然你們修了這些修了那些你們好像整個成效都很差我們從這個以這個募資來講來我們講了兩個會期啦上個會期1700到現在還是沒有啊那你也知道我很關心這個議題啊\n\n7\n00:02:14,565 --> 00:02:36,225\n不過成效差我們會來虛心檢討啦所以我們一直跟你們提出說你們是不是這個股權群募平台是不是要有新的做法嘛我一直在講說比如說中小企業主管的這個中小企業開發公司跟新創企業這些來做募資平台你們是不是你們有創新處嘛對不對那找這個中小企業開發公司櫃買找來是不是一起來想看怎麼來做啊\n\n8\n00:02:37,046 --> 00:02:55,974\n這個我們一定會來努力啦只是說現在的時候有一些法規法律上面的限制我們要來突破我知道經管會一直想突破很多法規我覺得您上來以後很多相關的法律都一直有在突破嘛但是我覺得你下面的單位好像對這些事情都有點不大認真啦\n\n9\n00:02:56,594 --> 00:03:16,290\n這也不能這麼說啦因為主要是說我們看結果嘛1700萬這樣算金額嗎從上個會議到現在那我現在跟你請求啦就是說這個我一直在講說這個中小企業這個因為還經濟部在管嘛那也有相關的公司有這些有新創企業嘛他們也有新創署嘛我們這邊也有這個創新處嘛這相關單位是不是一起來開個會啊\n\n10\n00:03:21,674 --> 00:03:37,792\n是不是來集思廣益到底是怎麼來做啊我們已經建議很多回啦因為你們都被動不前進啊也不是啦如果說啊這個問題能夠解決好解決早解決啦那就是沒有努力在那個吧這問題一定是有它的複雜度所以我覺得我們可以再來\n\n11\n00:03:38,513 --> 00:03:57,693\n早時間大家來開會吧我們這一點我們是已經問了一年多啦我想說那個彭主委上來以後很多觀念都比較新嘛包括等一下我們要講比如說高齡的這個保單的這個部分也開放了啦當然我們的想法是說真的是正確的事情又能夠做我們當然就盡量來完成這個我們還會繼續聽啦那接著我們講另外幾點啦政局局聽到沒\n\n12\n00:04:01,998 --> 00:04:21,018\n這個績效真的很差一年以來半年來都沒有任何的成長表示你們根本不用1700萬根本就等於是沒有一樣等於是沒有任何的進步還應該說不進則退還算是退步來討論一下今天這個保險法你們是有研究說是要放寬放行這個保單職介對吧\n\n13\n00:04:22,840 --> 00:04:38,543\n銀行的部分就是對對就是說放行給銀行做這個可以做直接的業務吧現在保險公司本來就依法就可以做我知道我知道我說但是現在是放行就是病人多銀行可以可以向銀行直接啦他可以做一個受信的標的只要銀行可以接受的情況\n\n14\n00:04:38,763 --> 00:04:59,341\n那這個跟現行的這個保險法是不是有相關的這個抵觸這個沒有就是說今天就好像比如說今天銀行在做融資的時候他會有他自己的考量比如說我們最極端可以做信用融資不用任何的保險我不是不支持我是支持我的意思是說那這個東西是不是要再修法不用保險法120條這個規定不需要對\n\n15\n00:05:03,272 --> 00:05:29,763\n原來的規定是向保險人借款原來就向受險借款那你現在說不只銀行也可以比如說可能是A公司藍山的保單可以去向比如說富邦銀行舉例五大國泰、富邦、星光、藍山、凱基五大受險就是有做財管的我知道你現在一直力推財富管理的部分我看得出金管會的彭主委的想法這個我們也是很支持只是說你這個東西不用修法是吧\n\n16\n00:05:30,203 --> 00:05:44,789\n不用這個是跟委員打個比方比如說今天銀行要借你錢他如果你個人信用很好的話其實什麼抵押品都不需要假設你今天比如說你今天想去什麼抵押品都不需要很少\n\n17\n00:05:45,489 --> 00:06:09,417\n就是信用放款比如說你今天來講的話我想去這個拿一個比如說我的有價證券來做擔保只要銀行接受我覺得我就可以所以你認為這個不用修法就銀行的因為現在的現在來講保單要直接的話必須當然是像原來的這個保險公司保險人這一方面沒關係你們要這樣解釋我也不要就是說你在法律的部分要注意這個\n\n18\n00:06:10,537 --> 00:06:32,607\n跟現行的法規有沒有符合如果要的話也必須要依法來辦那另外一個是說你們現在的開放方向是高資產階層嘛目的是為什麼只有開放高資產因為一般百姓呢就叫事辦的意思事辦就是說我們希望現在我們先了解一下這個業務所產生的一些的效益跟風險會是什麼因為我們不想\n\n19\n00:06:33,487 --> 00:07:00,202\n因為高資產的客戶他風險承受率比較高承擔人力比較高啦對一定是先從這個開始如果我們事辦的結果良好沒有其他的問題的話我們再會擴展到其他就是普遍的大眾就對了這個是我們也是在做一種如果他是符合法令的就沒有所謂事辦啊就任何人都可以做啊你了解我意思嗎如果法令沒有不許的話那我不管是你是高資產還是我是一般資產的就誰都可以做啊\n\n20\n00:07:01,082 --> 00:07:26,677\n這我已經講的沒錯但是法令這兩個字有兩個層次一個叫做法律一個叫做令是這樣嗎法令一個另外一個就是很多我們的行政規則很多的其他的監管的層次這個東西呢我們在事辦的時候所以現在也是不允許的嘛是因為你們可能打算用一個函令來解釋這個東西對因為這個部分我就以法規而言你這個順序也要有行政規則上面或是治理規範很多是可能暫時沒辦法做的但是我們用一個有限範圍的開放\n\n21\n00:07:27,958 --> 00:07:32,118\n然後再一個能夠承擔高風險如果是有先放開放表示現在是不允許的嗎\n\n22\n00:07:33,125 --> 00:07:59,689\n對現在就是它只是不是法律層次的問題只是說你覺得不要用修法的方式只能用行政函式啊或一個事辦規則啊什麼這一類的位階比較低的方式來做一些好好的因為我是支持彭主委一向往開放的方向走啦不管是我們說這個中小企啊募資啊或者是新創啊這些我們都非常支持啊這個我也我也是支持只是說你這個開辦的期間大概你預計事辦多久我們現在的所有的事辦大概我們都以六到一年為原則啦六到一\n\n23\n00:08:00,089 --> 00:08:25,186\n六個月到一年六個月是個觀察期我們就看他情況如果說事辦成效良好就是說比如說那可能就會開放到一般的客戶就逐步開放到按照風險承受跟他那這個下去可能會有產生一些問題就是說那到時候發生如果沒有辦法融資他直接沒有辦法償還的時候那那個債權優先順序是銀行比如說我拿我的保單去跟銀行借那這個到時候債權的順序問題還有我的保單的效率會變成是什麼樣\n\n24\n00:08:30,450 --> 00:08:47,391\n就是說到時候會有相關的這個議題可能你們就必須要重視你知道我的意思嗎我的保單拿去直接的吧那我現在我後來又還不起那還不起的話那這個保單的這個就會被押走就會被這個我的就是融資方拿走\n\n25\n00:08:48,612 --> 00:09:07,643\n那這樣子的話你現在開放就只有銀行嘛對不對對做一個這個好那接著還有保險的效率問題喔這個可能有很多高資產的客戶我知道我知道那高資產的客戶定義是用銀行來定義的是嗎就是說哪一些銀行銀行這五家嘛財管這五家他們定義的高資產客戶嗎所以是由他們來決定哪些人是嗎\n\n26\n00:09:08,823 --> 00:09:30,270\n或者說你有一個標準我們高資產客戶有一個標準三千萬以上高資產客戶的標準是什麼呢一億以上一億是指保單一億以上嗎不含不動產就是說你是指保單嗎一張保單一億以上嗎不是就是這個人的資產他的資產當然有些銀行會更高有他的資產除了不動產以外你明確定義了嗎就這個個人個人資產在\n\n27\n00:09:34,331 --> 00:09:56,131\n1億元以上不管它是現金存款金融資產股票不含不動產不含不動產不動產也有借也有也有借的啊也有跟銀行融資出來不含不動產銀行不動產的借跟不管是融資什麼這些都不算那要不要扣掉不動產借貸的金額啊還是是淨資產啊\n\n28\n00:09:58,913 --> 00:10:13,063\n這個銀行都知道我們在財富管理2.0的規範都清楚沒有我只是想知道說這個規定是由銀行來決定還是說就是我們金融會有同一個標準那接下來銀行自己會決定OK怎麼樣銀行決定我們有第一個最低的標準往上你可以自己決定比如說你要服務什麼樣的客戶\n\n29\n00:10:13,863 --> 00:10:36,228\n有一個最低標準但這標準是由你們決定因為每家銀行可能對高資產客戶的定義不一樣我是鼓勵當然對金融我看黃志偉上任以來對很多包括像我剛剛高齡的這個也是有開放跟以前黃志偉時代也是有不一樣那我們對於我對於我們的這個我們國內這些金融的產品或各方面我覺得的確是有些東西是比較\n\n30\n00:10:37,335 --> 00:10:53,294\n不那麼開放不那麼進步我也是鼓勵很多東西是創新進步我們都支持那下去如果說但是如果有依法要注意的部分也是要注意尤其後面有權利判格的部分的時候包括融資銀行跟這個保單效益這個可能也要特別注意\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5839\t15241\t謝謝主席 我們請這個彭主委好 請彭主委主席在這邊宣布我們現在開放在現場用餐\n18144\t43266\t主委 本期在前兩次會期都有跟您詢問過就是研議民間版的創櫃機制那您也有回覆說 金管會金管會也有回覆說 104年起已經開放證券商得經營股權性質群眾募資業成效有三家新創公司那時候的回覆是募資的金額現在有新台幣1700萬元這是上次回的\n43766\t57366\t那專間又一個會期啦 半年又過去請問現在的募資成效有 績效有沒有增加這個我 請說我們了解一下再跟委員報告你現在告訴我 證據局成效咧 1700萬\n60205\t75036\t又過了半年有沒有再增加?目前是沒有增加的沒有增加為什麼?你們不認真做這個嗎?沒有,廢買壯心其實他們有在做這個業務那他們有去鼓勵或者法華可以做什麼所以你們不重視這種這個創櫃這個民間版的創櫃機制的這種募資的這個業務喔?還是你們的做法是錯誤的?\n83018\t109329\t我們當然是重視這個機制重視怎麼會沒有成效呢我們現在所謂的創櫃板我們有做一個整合你看喔為了扶植中小微型企業你們政局有最新的函令解釋就是說通過限定綜合證券商可以投資創櫃板登錄期間發行的新股投資總計不得超過券商競爭5%也不受標準公司單次發行的限制所以這個是比較新的新聞了\n110049\t127420\t那可見我覺得金管會在這個彭主委過來後包括很多的金融的這個措施我都感覺上有要創新有要前進有要這個但是這個雖然你們修了這些修了那些你們好像整個成效都很差我們從這個以這個募資來講來我們講了兩個會期啦上個會期1700到現在還是沒有啊那你也知道我很關心這個議題啊\n134565\t156225\t不過成效差我們會來虛心檢討啦所以我們一直跟你們提出說你們是不是這個股權群募平台是不是要有新的做法嘛我一直在講說比如說中小企業主管的這個中小企業開發公司跟新創企業這些來做募資平台你們是不是你們有創新處嘛 對不對那找這個中小企業開發公司櫃買找來是不是一起來想看怎麼來做啊\n157046\t175974\t這個我們一定會來努力啦只是說現在的時候有一些法規法律上面的限制我們要來突破我知道經管會一直想突破很多法規我覺得您上來以後很多相關的法律都一直有在突破嘛但是我覺得你下面的單位好像對這些事情都有點不大認真啦\n176594\t196290\t這也不能這麼說啦因為主要是說我們看結果嘛1700萬這樣算金額嗎從上個會議到現在那我現在跟你請求啦就是說這個我一直在講說這個中小企業這個因為還經濟部在管嘛那也有相關的公司有這些有新創企業嘛他們也有新創署嘛我們這邊也有這個創新處嘛這相關單位是不是一起來開個會啊\n201674\t217792\t是不是來集思廣益到底是怎麼來做啊我們已經建議很多回啦因為你們都被動不前進啊也不是啦如果說啊這個問題能夠解決好解決早解決啦那就是沒有努力在那個吧這問題一定是有它的複雜度所以我覺得我們可以再來\n218513\t237693\t早時間大家來開會吧我們這一點我們是已經問了一年多啦我想說那個彭主委上來以後很多觀念都比較新嘛包括等一下我們要講比如說高齡的這個保單的這個部分也開放了啦當然我們的想法是說真的是正確的事情又能夠做我們當然就盡量來完成這個我們還會繼續聽啦那接著我們講另外幾點啦政局局聽到沒\n241998\t261018\t這個績效真的很差一年以來半年來都沒有任何的成長表示你們根本不用1700萬根本就等於是沒有一樣等於是沒有任何的進步還應該說不進則退還算是退步來討論一下今天這個保險法你們是有研究說是要放寬放行這個保單職介對吧\n262840\t278543\t銀行的部分就是對對就是說放行給銀行做這個可以做直接的業務吧現在保險公司本來就依法就可以做我知道我知道我說但是現在是放行就是病人多銀行可以可以向銀行直接啦他可以做一個受信的標的只要銀行可以接受的情況\n278763\t299341\t那這個跟現行的這個保險法是不是有相關的這個抵觸這個沒有就是說今天就好像比如說今天銀行在做融資的時候他會有他自己的考量比如說我們最極端可以做信用融資不用任何的保險我不是不支持我是支持我的意思是說那這個東西是不是要再修法不用保險法120條這個規定不需要對\n303272\t329763\t原來的規定是向保險人借款原來就向受險借款那你現在說不只銀行也可以比如說可能是A公司藍山的保單可以去向比如說富邦銀行舉例五大國泰、富邦、星光、藍山、凱基五大受險就是有做財管的我知道你現在一直力推財富管理的部分我看得出金管會的彭主委的想法這個我們也是很支持只是說你這個東西不用修法是吧\n330203\t344789\t不用 這個是跟委員打個比方比如說今天銀行要借你錢他如果你個人信用很好的話其實什麼抵押品都不需要假設你今天比如說你今天想去什麼抵押品都不需要很少\n345489\t369417\t就是信用放款比如說你今天來講的話我想去這個拿一個比如說我的有價證券來做擔保只要銀行接受我覺得我就可以所以你認為這個不用修法就銀行的因為現在的現在來講保單要直接的話必須當然是像原來的這個保險公司保險人這一方面沒關係你們要這樣解釋我也不要就是說你在法律的部分要注意這個\n370537\t392607\t跟現行的法規有沒有符合如果要的話也必須要依法來辦那另外一個是說你們現在的開放方向是高資產階層嘛目的是為什麼只有開放高資產因為一般百姓呢就叫事辦的意思事辦就是說我們希望現在我們先了解一下這個業務所產生的一些的效益跟風險會是什麼因為我們不想\n393487\t420202\t因為高資產的客戶他風險承受率比較高承擔人力比較高啦對一定是先從這個開始如果我們事辦的結果良好沒有其他的問題的話我們再會擴展到其他就是普遍的大眾就對了這個是我們也是在做一種如果他是符合法令的就沒有所謂事辦啊就任何人都可以做啊你了解我意思嗎如果法令沒有不許的話那我不管是你是高資產還是我是一般資產的就誰都可以做啊\n421082\t446677\t這我已經講的沒錯但是法令這兩個字有兩個層次一個叫做法律一個叫做令是這樣嗎法令一個另外一個就是很多我們的行政規則很多的其他的監管的層次這個東西呢我們在事辦的時候所以現在也是不允許的嘛是因為你們可能打算用一個函令來解釋這個東西對因為這個部分我就以法規而言你這個順序也要有行政規則上面或是治理規範很多是可能暫時沒辦法做的但是我們用一個有限範圍的開放\n447958\t452118\t然後再一個能夠承擔高風險如果是有先放開放表示現在是不允許的嗎\n453125\t479689\t對 現在就是 它只是不是法律層次的問題只是說你覺得不要用修法的方式只能用行政函式啊 或一個事辦規則啊 什麼這一類的位階比較低的方式來做一些好好的因為我是支持彭主委一向往開放的方向走啦不管是我們說這個中小企啊 募資啊 或者是新創啊這些我們都非常支持啊這個我也 我也是支持只是說你這個開辦的期間大概你預計事辦多久我們現在的所有的事辦大概我們都以六到一年為原則啦六到一\n480089\t505186\t六個月到一年六個月是個觀察期我們就看他情況如果說事辦成效良好就是說比如說那可能就會開放到一般的客戶就逐步開放到按照風險承受跟他那這個下去可能會有產生一些問題就是說那到時候發生如果沒有辦法融資他直接沒有辦法償還的時候那那個債權優先順序是銀行比如說我拿我的保單去跟銀行借那這個到時候債權的順序問題還有我的保單的效率會變成是什麼樣\n510450\t527391\t就是說到時候會有相關的這個議題可能你們就必須要重視你知道我的意思嗎我的保單拿去直接的吧那我現在我後來又還不起那還不起的話那這個保單的這個就會被押走就會被這個我的就是融資方拿走\n528612\t547643\t那這樣子的話你現在開放就只有銀行嘛對不對對做一個這個好那接著還有保險的效率問題喔這個可能有很多高資產的客戶我知道我知道那高資產的客戶定義是用銀行來定義的是嗎就是說哪一些銀行銀行這五家嘛財管這五家他們定義的高資產客戶嗎所以是由他們來決定哪些人是嗎\n548823\t570270\t或者說你有一個標準我們高資產客戶有一個標準三千萬以上高資產客戶的標準是什麼呢一億以上一億是指保單一億以上嗎不含不動產就是說你是指保單嗎一張保單一億以上嗎不是就是這個人的資產他的資產當然有些銀行會更高有他的資產除了不動產以外你明確定義了嗎就這個個人個人資產在\n574331\t596131\t1億元以上 不管它是現金存款 金融資產 股票 不含不動產不含不動產 不動產也有 借也有也有借的啊 也有跟銀行融資出來 不含不動產銀行不動產的借跟不管是融資什麼這些都不算那要不要扣掉不動產借貸的金額啊 還是是淨資產啊\n598913\t613063\t這個銀行都知道我們在財富管理2.0的規範都清楚沒有 我只是想知道說這個規定是由銀行來決定還是說就是我們金融會有同一個標準那接下來銀行自己會決定OK 怎麼樣 銀行決定我們有第一個最低的標準往上你可以自己決定比如說你要服務什麼樣的客戶\n613863\t636228\t有一個最低標準但這標準是由你們決定因為每家銀行可能對高資產客戶的定義不一樣我是鼓勵當然對金融我看黃志偉上任以來對很多包括像我剛剛高齡的這個也是有開放跟以前黃志偉時代也是有不一樣那我們對於我對於我們的這個我們國內這些金融的產品或各方面我覺得的確是有些東西是比較\n637335\t653294\t不那麼開放不那麼進步我也是鼓勵很多東西是創新進步我們都支持那下去如果說但是如果有依法要注意的部分也是要注意尤其後面有權利判格的部分的時候包括融資銀行跟這個保單效益這個可能也要特別注意\n","txt":"謝謝主席 我們請這個彭主委好 請彭主委主席在這邊宣布我們現在開放在現場用餐\n主委 本期在前兩次會期都有跟您詢問過就是研議民間版的創櫃機制那您也有回覆說 金管會金管會也有回覆說 104年起已經開放證券商得經營股權性質群眾募資業成效有三家新創公司那時候的回覆是募資的金額現在有新台幣1700萬元這是上次回的\n那專間又一個會期啦 半年又過去請問現在的募資成效有 績效有沒有增加這個我 請說我們了解一下再跟委員報告你現在告訴我 證據局成效咧 1700萬\n又過了半年有沒有再增加?目前是沒有增加的沒有增加為什麼?你們不認真做這個嗎?沒有,廢買壯心其實他們有在做這個業務那他們有去鼓勵或者法華可以做什麼所以你們不重視這種這個創櫃這個民間版的創櫃機制的這種募資的這個業務喔?還是你們的做法是錯誤的?\n我們當然是重視這個機制重視怎麼會沒有成效呢我們現在所謂的創櫃板我們有做一個整合你看喔為了扶植中小微型企業你們政局有最新的函令解釋就是說通過限定綜合證券商可以投資創櫃板登錄期間發行的新股投資總計不得超過券商競爭5%也不受標準公司單次發行的限制所以這個是比較新的新聞了\n那可見我覺得金管會在這個彭主委過來後包括很多的金融的這個措施我都感覺上有要創新有要前進有要這個但是這個雖然你們修了這些修了那些你們好像整個成效都很差我們從這個以這個募資來講來我們講了兩個會期啦上個會期1700到現在還是沒有啊那你也知道我很關心這個議題啊\n不過成效差我們會來虛心檢討啦所以我們一直跟你們提出說你們是不是這個股權群募平台是不是要有新的做法嘛我一直在講說比如說中小企業主管的這個中小企業開發公司跟新創企業這些來做募資平台你們是不是你們有創新處嘛 對不對那找這個中小企業開發公司櫃買找來是不是一起來想看怎麼來做啊\n這個我們一定會來努力啦只是說現在的時候有一些法規法律上面的限制我們要來突破我知道經管會一直想突破很多法規我覺得您上來以後很多相關的法律都一直有在突破嘛但是我覺得你下面的單位好像對這些事情都有點不大認真啦\n這也不能這麼說啦因為主要是說我們看結果嘛1700萬這樣算金額嗎從上個會議到現在那我現在跟你請求啦就是說這個我一直在講說這個中小企業這個因為還經濟部在管嘛那也有相關的公司有這些有新創企業嘛他們也有新創署嘛我們這邊也有這個創新處嘛這相關單位是不是一起來開個會啊\n是不是來集思廣益到底是怎麼來做啊我們已經建議很多回啦因為你們都被動不前進啊也不是啦如果說啊這個問題能夠解決好解決早解決啦那就是沒有努力在那個吧這問題一定是有它的複雜度所以我覺得我們可以再來\n早時間大家來開會吧我們這一點我們是已經問了一年多啦我想說那個彭主委上來以後很多觀念都比較新嘛包括等一下我們要講比如說高齡的這個保單的這個部分也開放了啦當然我們的想法是說真的是正確的事情又能夠做我們當然就盡量來完成這個我們還會繼續聽啦那接著我們講另外幾點啦政局局聽到沒\n這個績效真的很差一年以來半年來都沒有任何的成長表示你們根本不用1700萬根本就等於是沒有一樣等於是沒有任何的進步還應該說不進則退還算是退步來討論一下今天這個保險法你們是有研究說是要放寬放行這個保單職介對吧\n銀行的部分就是對對就是說放行給銀行做這個可以做直接的業務吧現在保險公司本來就依法就可以做我知道我知道我說但是現在是放行就是病人多銀行可以可以向銀行直接啦他可以做一個受信的標的只要銀行可以接受的情況\n那這個跟現行的這個保險法是不是有相關的這個抵觸這個沒有就是說今天就好像比如說今天銀行在做融資的時候他會有他自己的考量比如說我們最極端可以做信用融資不用任何的保險我不是不支持我是支持我的意思是說那這個東西是不是要再修法不用保險法120條這個規定不需要對\n原來的規定是向保險人借款原來就向受險借款那你現在說不只銀行也可以比如說可能是A公司藍山的保單可以去向比如說富邦銀行舉例五大國泰、富邦、星光、藍山、凱基五大受險就是有做財管的我知道你現在一直力推財富管理的部分我看得出金管會的彭主委的想法這個我們也是很支持只是說你這個東西不用修法是吧\n不用 這個是跟委員打個比方比如說今天銀行要借你錢他如果你個人信用很好的話其實什麼抵押品都不需要假設你今天比如說你今天想去什麼抵押品都不需要很少\n就是信用放款比如說你今天來講的話我想去這個拿一個比如說我的有價證券來做擔保只要銀行接受我覺得我就可以所以你認為這個不用修法就銀行的因為現在的現在來講保單要直接的話必須當然是像原來的這個保險公司保險人這一方面沒關係你們要這樣解釋我也不要就是說你在法律的部分要注意這個\n跟現行的法規有沒有符合如果要的話也必須要依法來辦那另外一個是說你們現在的開放方向是高資產階層嘛目的是為什麼只有開放高資產因為一般百姓呢就叫事辦的意思事辦就是說我們希望現在我們先了解一下這個業務所產生的一些的效益跟風險會是什麼因為我們不想\n因為高資產的客戶他風險承受率比較高承擔人力比較高啦對一定是先從這個開始如果我們事辦的結果良好沒有其他的問題的話我們再會擴展到其他就是普遍的大眾就對了這個是我們也是在做一種如果他是符合法令的就沒有所謂事辦啊就任何人都可以做啊你了解我意思嗎如果法令沒有不許的話那我不管是你是高資產還是我是一般資產的就誰都可以做啊\n這我已經講的沒錯但是法令這兩個字有兩個層次一個叫做法律一個叫做令是這樣嗎法令一個另外一個就是很多我們的行政規則很多的其他的監管的層次這個東西呢我們在事辦的時候所以現在也是不允許的嘛是因為你們可能打算用一個函令來解釋這個東西對因為這個部分我就以法規而言你這個順序也要有行政規則上面或是治理規範很多是可能暫時沒辦法做的但是我們用一個有限範圍的開放\n然後再一個能夠承擔高風險如果是有先放開放表示現在是不允許的嗎\n對 現在就是 它只是不是法律層次的問題只是說你覺得不要用修法的方式只能用行政函式啊 或一個事辦規則啊 什麼這一類的位階比較低的方式來做一些好好的因為我是支持彭主委一向往開放的方向走啦不管是我們說這個中小企啊 募資啊 或者是新創啊這些我們都非常支持啊這個我也 我也是支持只是說你這個開辦的期間大概你預計事辦多久我們現在的所有的事辦大概我們都以六到一年為原則啦六到一\n六個月到一年六個月是個觀察期我們就看他情況如果說事辦成效良好就是說比如說那可能就會開放到一般的客戶就逐步開放到按照風險承受跟他那這個下去可能會有產生一些問題就是說那到時候發生如果沒有辦法融資他直接沒有辦法償還的時候那那個債權優先順序是銀行比如說我拿我的保單去跟銀行借那這個到時候債權的順序問題還有我的保單的效率會變成是什麼樣\n就是說到時候會有相關的這個議題可能你們就必須要重視你知道我的意思嗎我的保單拿去直接的吧那我現在我後來又還不起那還不起的話那這個保單的這個就會被押走就會被這個我的就是融資方拿走\n那這樣子的話你現在開放就只有銀行嘛對不對對做一個這個好那接著還有保險的效率問題喔這個可能有很多高資產的客戶我知道我知道那高資產的客戶定義是用銀行來定義的是嗎就是說哪一些銀行銀行這五家嘛財管這五家他們定義的高資產客戶嗎所以是由他們來決定哪些人是嗎\n或者說你有一個標準我們高資產客戶有一個標準三千萬以上高資產客戶的標準是什麼呢一億以上一億是指保單一億以上嗎不含不動產就是說你是指保單嗎一張保單一億以上嗎不是就是這個人的資產他的資產當然有些銀行會更高有他的資產除了不動產以外你明確定義了嗎就這個個人個人資產在\n1億元以上 不管它是現金存款 金融資產 股票 不含不動產不含不動產 不動產也有 借也有也有借的啊 也有跟銀行融資出來 不含不動產銀行不動產的借跟不管是融資什麼這些都不算那要不要扣掉不動產借貸的金額啊 還是是淨資產啊\n這個銀行都知道我們在財富管理2.0的規範都清楚沒有 我只是想知道說這個規定是由銀行來決定還是說就是我們金融會有同一個標準那接下來銀行自己會決定OK 怎麼樣 銀行決定我們有第一個最低的標準往上你可以自己決定比如說你要服務什麼樣的客戶\n有一個最低標準但這標準是由你們決定因為每家銀行可能對高資產客戶的定義不一樣我是鼓勵當然對金融我看黃志偉上任以來對很多包括像我剛剛高齡的這個也是有開放跟以前黃志偉時代也是有不一樣那我們對於我對於我們的這個我們國內這些金融的產品或各方面我覺得的確是有些東西是比較\n不那麼開放不那麼進步我也是鼓勵很多東西是創新進步我們都支持那下去如果說但是如果有依法要注意的部分也是要注意尤其後面有權利判格的部分的時候包括融資銀行跟這個保單效益這個可能也要特別注意\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.839 --> 00:15.241\n謝謝主席我們請這個彭主委好請彭主委主席在這邊宣布我們現在開放在現場用餐\n\n00:18.144 --> 00:43.266\n主委本期在前兩次會期都有跟您詢問過就是研議民間版的創櫃機制那您也有回覆說金管會金管會也有回覆說104年起已經開放證券商得經營股權性質群眾募資業成效有三家新創公司那時候的回覆是募資的金額現在有新台幣1700萬元這是上次回的\n\n00:43.766 --> 00:57.366\n那專間又一個會期啦半年又過去請問現在的募資成效有績效有沒有增加這個我請說我們了解一下再跟委員報告你現在告訴我證據局成效咧1700萬\n\n01:00.205 --> 01:15.036\n又過了半年有沒有再增加?目前是沒有增加的沒有增加為什麼?你們不認真做這個嗎?沒有,廢買壯心其實他們有在做這個業務那他們有去鼓勵或者法華可以做什麼所以你們不重視這種這個創櫃這個民間版的創櫃機制的這種募資的這個業務喔?還是你們的做法是錯誤的?\n\n01:23.018 --> 01:49.329\n我們當然是重視這個機制重視怎麼會沒有成效呢我們現在所謂的創櫃板我們有做一個整合你看喔為了扶植中小微型企業你們政局有最新的函令解釋就是說通過限定綜合證券商可以投資創櫃板登錄期間發行的新股投資總計不得超過券商競爭5%也不受標準公司單次發行的限制所以這個是比較新的新聞了\n\n01:50.049 --> 02:07.420\n那可見我覺得金管會在這個彭主委過來後包括很多的金融的這個措施我都感覺上有要創新有要前進有要這個但是這個雖然你們修了這些修了那些你們好像整個成效都很差我們從這個以這個募資來講來我們講了兩個會期啦上個會期1700到現在還是沒有啊那你也知道我很關心這個議題啊\n\n02:14.565 --> 02:36.225\n不過成效差我們會來虛心檢討啦所以我們一直跟你們提出說你們是不是這個股權群募平台是不是要有新的做法嘛我一直在講說比如說中小企業主管的這個中小企業開發公司跟新創企業這些來做募資平台你們是不是你們有創新處嘛對不對那找這個中小企業開發公司櫃買找來是不是一起來想看怎麼來做啊\n\n02:37.046 --> 02:55.974\n這個我們一定會來努力啦只是說現在的時候有一些法規法律上面的限制我們要來突破我知道經管會一直想突破很多法規我覺得您上來以後很多相關的法律都一直有在突破嘛但是我覺得你下面的單位好像對這些事情都有點不大認真啦\n\n02:56.594 --> 03:16.290\n這也不能這麼說啦因為主要是說我們看結果嘛1700萬這樣算金額嗎從上個會議到現在那我現在跟你請求啦就是說這個我一直在講說這個中小企業這個因為還經濟部在管嘛那也有相關的公司有這些有新創企業嘛他們也有新創署嘛我們這邊也有這個創新處嘛這相關單位是不是一起來開個會啊\n\n03:21.674 --> 03:37.792\n是不是來集思廣益到底是怎麼來做啊我們已經建議很多回啦因為你們都被動不前進啊也不是啦如果說啊這個問題能夠解決好解決早解決啦那就是沒有努力在那個吧這問題一定是有它的複雜度所以我覺得我們可以再來\n\n03:38.513 --> 03:57.693\n早時間大家來開會吧我們這一點我們是已經問了一年多啦我想說那個彭主委上來以後很多觀念都比較新嘛包括等一下我們要講比如說高齡的這個保單的這個部分也開放了啦當然我們的想法是說真的是正確的事情又能夠做我們當然就盡量來完成這個我們還會繼續聽啦那接著我們講另外幾點啦政局局聽到沒\n\n04:01.998 --> 04:21.018\n這個績效真的很差一年以來半年來都沒有任何的成長表示你們根本不用1700萬根本就等於是沒有一樣等於是沒有任何的進步還應該說不進則退還算是退步來討論一下今天這個保險法你們是有研究說是要放寬放行這個保單職介對吧\n\n04:22.840 --> 04:38.543\n銀行的部分就是對對就是說放行給銀行做這個可以做直接的業務吧現在保險公司本來就依法就可以做我知道我知道我說但是現在是放行就是病人多銀行可以可以向銀行直接啦他可以做一個受信的標的只要銀行可以接受的情況\n\n04:38.763 --> 04:59.341\n那這個跟現行的這個保險法是不是有相關的這個抵觸這個沒有就是說今天就好像比如說今天銀行在做融資的時候他會有他自己的考量比如說我們最極端可以做信用融資不用任何的保險我不是不支持我是支持我的意思是說那這個東西是不是要再修法不用保險法120條這個規定不需要對\n\n05:03.272 --> 05:29.763\n原來的規定是向保險人借款原來就向受險借款那你現在說不只銀行也可以比如說可能是A公司藍山的保單可以去向比如說富邦銀行舉例五大國泰、富邦、星光、藍山、凱基五大受險就是有做財管的我知道你現在一直力推財富管理的部分我看得出金管會的彭主委的想法這個我們也是很支持只是說你這個東西不用修法是吧\n\n05:30.203 --> 05:44.789\n不用這個是跟委員打個比方比如說今天銀行要借你錢他如果你個人信用很好的話其實什麼抵押品都不需要假設你今天比如說你今天想去什麼抵押品都不需要很少\n\n05:45.489 --> 06:09.417\n就是信用放款比如說你今天來講的話我想去這個拿一個比如說我的有價證券來做擔保只要銀行接受我覺得我就可以所以你認為這個不用修法就銀行的因為現在的現在來講保單要直接的話必須當然是像原來的這個保險公司保險人這一方面沒關係你們要這樣解釋我也不要就是說你在法律的部分要注意這個\n\n06:10.537 --> 06:32.607\n跟現行的法規有沒有符合如果要的話也必須要依法來辦那另外一個是說你們現在的開放方向是高資產階層嘛目的是為什麼只有開放高資產因為一般百姓呢就叫事辦的意思事辦就是說我們希望現在我們先了解一下這個業務所產生的一些的效益跟風險會是什麼因為我們不想\n\n06:33.487 --> 07:00.202\n因為高資產的客戶他風險承受率比較高承擔人力比較高啦對一定是先從這個開始如果我們事辦的結果良好沒有其他的問題的話我們再會擴展到其他就是普遍的大眾就對了這個是我們也是在做一種如果他是符合法令的就沒有所謂事辦啊就任何人都可以做啊你了解我意思嗎如果法令沒有不許的話那我不管是你是高資產還是我是一般資產的就誰都可以做啊\n\n07:01.082 --> 07:26.677\n這我已經講的沒錯但是法令這兩個字有兩個層次一個叫做法律一個叫做令是這樣嗎法令一個另外一個就是很多我們的行政規則很多的其他的監管的層次這個東西呢我們在事辦的時候所以現在也是不允許的嘛是因為你們可能打算用一個函令來解釋這個東西對因為這個部分我就以法規而言你這個順序也要有行政規則上面或是治理規範很多是可能暫時沒辦法做的但是我們用一個有限範圍的開放\n\n07:27.958 --> 07:32.118\n然後再一個能夠承擔高風險如果是有先放開放表示現在是不允許的嗎\n\n07:33.125 --> 07:59.689\n對現在就是它只是不是法律層次的問題只是說你覺得不要用修法的方式只能用行政函式啊或一個事辦規則啊什麼這一類的位階比較低的方式來做一些好好的因為我是支持彭主委一向往開放的方向走啦不管是我們說這個中小企啊募資啊或者是新創啊這些我們都非常支持啊這個我也我也是支持只是說你這個開辦的期間大概你預計事辦多久我們現在的所有的事辦大概我們都以六到一年為原則啦六到一\n\n08:00.089 --> 08:25.186\n六個月到一年六個月是個觀察期我們就看他情況如果說事辦成效良好就是說比如說那可能就會開放到一般的客戶就逐步開放到按照風險承受跟他那這個下去可能會有產生一些問題就是說那到時候發生如果沒有辦法融資他直接沒有辦法償還的時候那那個債權優先順序是銀行比如說我拿我的保單去跟銀行借那這個到時候債權的順序問題還有我的保單的效率會變成是什麼樣\n\n08:30.450 --> 08:47.391\n就是說到時候會有相關的這個議題可能你們就必須要重視你知道我的意思嗎我的保單拿去直接的吧那我現在我後來又還不起那還不起的話那這個保單的這個就會被押走就會被這個我的就是融資方拿走\n\n08:48.612 --> 09:07.643\n那這樣子的話你現在開放就只有銀行嘛對不對對做一個這個好那接著還有保險的效率問題喔這個可能有很多高資產的客戶我知道我知道那高資產的客戶定義是用銀行來定義的是嗎就是說哪一些銀行銀行這五家嘛財管這五家他們定義的高資產客戶嗎所以是由他們來決定哪些人是嗎\n\n09:08.823 --> 09:30.270\n或者說你有一個標準我們高資產客戶有一個標準三千萬以上高資產客戶的標準是什麼呢一億以上一億是指保單一億以上嗎不含不動產就是說你是指保單嗎一張保單一億以上嗎不是就是這個人的資產他的資產當然有些銀行會更高有他的資產除了不動產以外你明確定義了嗎就這個個人個人資產在\n\n09:34.331 --> 09:56.131\n1億元以上不管它是現金存款金融資產股票不含不動產不含不動產不動產也有借也有也有借的啊也有跟銀行融資出來不含不動產銀行不動產的借跟不管是融資什麼這些都不算那要不要扣掉不動產借貸的金額啊還是是淨資產啊\n\n09:58.913 --> 10:13.063\n這個銀行都知道我們在財富管理2.0的規範都清楚沒有我只是想知道說這個規定是由銀行來決定還是說就是我們金融會有同一個標準那接下來銀行自己會決定OK怎麼樣銀行決定我們有第一個最低的標準往上你可以自己決定比如說你要服務什麼樣的客戶\n\n10:13.863 --> 10:36.228\n有一個最低標準但這標準是由你們決定因為每家銀行可能對高資產客戶的定義不一樣我是鼓勵當然對金融我看黃志偉上任以來對很多包括像我剛剛高齡的這個也是有開放跟以前黃志偉時代也是有不一樣那我們對於我對於我們的這個我們國內這些金融的產品或各方面我覺得的確是有些東西是比較\n\n10:37.335 --> 10:53.294\n不那麼開放不那麼進步我也是鼓勵很多東西是創新進步我們都支持那下去如果說但是如果有依法要注意的部分也是要注意尤其後面有權利判格的部分的時候包括融資銀行跟這個保單效益這個可能也要特別注意\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.839,"end":15.241,"text":"謝謝主席 我們請這個彭主委好 請彭主委主席在這邊宣布我們現在開放在現場用餐"},{"start":18.144,"end":43.266,"text":"主委 本期在前兩次會期都有跟您詢問過就是研議民間版的創櫃機制那您也有回覆說 金管會金管會也有回覆說 104年起已經開放證券商得經營股權性質群眾募資業成效有三家新創公司那時候的回覆是募資的金額現在有新台幣1700萬元這是上次回的"},{"start":43.766,"end":57.366,"text":"那專間又一個會期啦 半年又過去請問現在的募資成效有 績效有沒有增加這個我 請說我們了解一下再跟委員報告你現在告訴我 證據局成效咧 1700萬"},{"start":60.205,"end":75.036,"text":"又過了半年有沒有再增加?目前是沒有增加的沒有增加為什麼?你們不認真做這個嗎?沒有,廢買壯心其實他們有在做這個業務那他們有去鼓勵或者法華可以做什麼所以你們不重視這種這個創櫃這個民間版的創櫃機制的這種募資的這個業務喔?還是你們的做法是錯誤的?"},{"start":83.018,"end":109.329,"text":"我們當然是重視這個機制重視怎麼會沒有成效呢我們現在所謂的創櫃板我們有做一個整合你看喔為了扶植中小微型企業你們政局有最新的函令解釋就是說通過限定綜合證券商可以投資創櫃板登錄期間發行的新股投資總計不得超過券商競爭5%也不受標準公司單次發行的限制所以這個是比較新的新聞了"},{"start":110.049,"end":127.42,"text":"那可見我覺得金管會在這個彭主委過來後包括很多的金融的這個措施我都感覺上有要創新有要前進有要這個但是這個雖然你們修了這些修了那些你們好像整個成效都很差我們從這個以這個募資來講來我們講了兩個會期啦上個會期1700到現在還是沒有啊那你也知道我很關心這個議題啊"},{"start":134.565,"end":156.225,"text":"不過成效差我們會來虛心檢討啦所以我們一直跟你們提出說你們是不是這個股權群募平台是不是要有新的做法嘛我一直在講說比如說中小企業主管的這個中小企業開發公司跟新創企業這些來做募資平台你們是不是你們有創新處嘛 對不對那找這個中小企業開發公司櫃買找來是不是一起來想看怎麼來做啊"},{"start":157.046,"end":175.974,"text":"這個我們一定會來努力啦只是說現在的時候有一些法規法律上面的限制我們要來突破我知道經管會一直想突破很多法規我覺得您上來以後很多相關的法律都一直有在突破嘛但是我覺得你下面的單位好像對這些事情都有點不大認真啦"},{"start":176.594,"end":196.29,"text":"這也不能這麼說啦因為主要是說我們看結果嘛1700萬這樣算金額嗎從上個會議到現在那我現在跟你請求啦就是說這個我一直在講說這個中小企業這個因為還經濟部在管嘛那也有相關的公司有這些有新創企業嘛他們也有新創署嘛我們這邊也有這個創新處嘛這相關單位是不是一起來開個會啊"},{"start":201.674,"end":217.792,"text":"是不是來集思廣益到底是怎麼來做啊我們已經建議很多回啦因為你們都被動不前進啊也不是啦如果說啊這個問題能夠解決好解決早解決啦那就是沒有努力在那個吧這問題一定是有它的複雜度所以我覺得我們可以再來"},{"start":218.513,"end":237.693,"text":"早時間大家來開會吧我們這一點我們是已經問了一年多啦我想說那個彭主委上來以後很多觀念都比較新嘛包括等一下我們要講比如說高齡的這個保單的這個部分也開放了啦當然我們的想法是說真的是正確的事情又能夠做我們當然就盡量來完成這個我們還會繼續聽啦那接著我們講另外幾點啦政局局聽到沒"},{"start":241.998,"end":261.018,"text":"這個績效真的很差一年以來半年來都沒有任何的成長表示你們根本不用1700萬根本就等於是沒有一樣等於是沒有任何的進步還應該說不進則退還算是退步來討論一下今天這個保險法你們是有研究說是要放寬放行這個保單職介對吧"},{"start":262.84,"end":278.543,"text":"銀行的部分就是對對就是說放行給銀行做這個可以做直接的業務吧現在保險公司本來就依法就可以做我知道我知道我說但是現在是放行就是病人多銀行可以可以向銀行直接啦他可以做一個受信的標的只要銀行可以接受的情況"},{"start":278.763,"end":299.341,"text":"那這個跟現行的這個保險法是不是有相關的這個抵觸這個沒有就是說今天就好像比如說今天銀行在做融資的時候他會有他自己的考量比如說我們最極端可以做信用融資不用任何的保險我不是不支持我是支持我的意思是說那這個東西是不是要再修法不用保險法120條這個規定不需要對"},{"start":303.272,"end":329.763,"text":"原來的規定是向保險人借款原來就向受險借款那你現在說不只銀行也可以比如說可能是A公司藍山的保單可以去向比如說富邦銀行舉例五大國泰、富邦、星光、藍山、凱基五大受險就是有做財管的我知道你現在一直力推財富管理的部分我看得出金管會的彭主委的想法這個我們也是很支持只是說你這個東西不用修法是吧"},{"start":330.203,"end":344.789,"text":"不用 這個是跟委員打個比方比如說今天銀行要借你錢他如果你個人信用很好的話其實什麼抵押品都不需要假設你今天比如說你今天想去什麼抵押品都不需要很少"},{"start":345.489,"end":369.417,"text":"就是信用放款比如說你今天來講的話我想去這個拿一個比如說我的有價證券來做擔保只要銀行接受我覺得我就可以所以你認為這個不用修法就銀行的因為現在的現在來講保單要直接的話必須當然是像原來的這個保險公司保險人這一方面沒關係你們要這樣解釋我也不要就是說你在法律的部分要注意這個"},{"start":370.537,"end":392.607,"text":"跟現行的法規有沒有符合如果要的話也必須要依法來辦那另外一個是說你們現在的開放方向是高資產階層嘛目的是為什麼只有開放高資產因為一般百姓呢就叫事辦的意思事辦就是說我們希望現在我們先了解一下這個業務所產生的一些的效益跟風險會是什麼因為我們不想"},{"start":393.487,"end":420.202,"text":"因為高資產的客戶他風險承受率比較高承擔人力比較高啦對一定是先從這個開始如果我們事辦的結果良好沒有其他的問題的話我們再會擴展到其他就是普遍的大眾就對了這個是我們也是在做一種如果他是符合法令的就沒有所謂事辦啊就任何人都可以做啊你了解我意思嗎如果法令沒有不許的話那我不管是你是高資產還是我是一般資產的就誰都可以做啊"},{"start":421.082,"end":446.677,"text":"這我已經講的沒錯但是法令這兩個字有兩個層次一個叫做法律一個叫做令是這樣嗎法令一個另外一個就是很多我們的行政規則很多的其他的監管的層次這個東西呢我們在事辦的時候所以現在也是不允許的嘛是因為你們可能打算用一個函令來解釋這個東西對因為這個部分我就以法規而言你這個順序也要有行政規則上面或是治理規範很多是可能暫時沒辦法做的但是我們用一個有限範圍的開放"},{"start":447.958,"end":452.118,"text":"然後再一個能夠承擔高風險如果是有先放開放表示現在是不允許的嗎"},{"start":453.125,"end":479.689,"text":"對 現在就是 它只是不是法律層次的問題只是說你覺得不要用修法的方式只能用行政函式啊 或一個事辦規則啊 什麼這一類的位階比較低的方式來做一些好好的因為我是支持彭主委一向往開放的方向走啦不管是我們說這個中小企啊 募資啊 或者是新創啊這些我們都非常支持啊這個我也 我也是支持只是說你這個開辦的期間大概你預計事辦多久我們現在的所有的事辦大概我們都以六到一年為原則啦六到一"},{"start":480.089,"end":505.186,"text":"六個月到一年六個月是個觀察期我們就看他情況如果說事辦成效良好就是說比如說那可能就會開放到一般的客戶就逐步開放到按照風險承受跟他那這個下去可能會有產生一些問題就是說那到時候發生如果沒有辦法融資他直接沒有辦法償還的時候那那個債權優先順序是銀行比如說我拿我的保單去跟銀行借那這個到時候債權的順序問題還有我的保單的效率會變成是什麼樣"},{"start":510.45,"end":527.391,"text":"就是說到時候會有相關的這個議題可能你們就必須要重視你知道我的意思嗎我的保單拿去直接的吧那我現在我後來又還不起那還不起的話那這個保單的這個就會被押走就會被這個我的就是融資方拿走"},{"start":528.612,"end":547.643,"text":"那這樣子的話你現在開放就只有銀行嘛對不對對做一個這個好那接著還有保險的效率問題喔這個可能有很多高資產的客戶我知道我知道那高資產的客戶定義是用銀行來定義的是嗎就是說哪一些銀行銀行這五家嘛財管這五家他們定義的高資產客戶嗎所以是由他們來決定哪些人是嗎"},{"start":548.823,"end":570.27,"text":"或者說你有一個標準我們高資產客戶有一個標準三千萬以上高資產客戶的標準是什麼呢一億以上一億是指保單一億以上嗎不含不動產就是說你是指保單嗎一張保單一億以上嗎不是就是這個人的資產他的資產當然有些銀行會更高有他的資產除了不動產以外你明確定義了嗎就這個個人個人資產在"},{"start":574.331,"end":596.131,"text":"1億元以上 不管它是現金存款 金融資產 股票 不含不動產不含不動產 不動產也有 借也有也有借的啊 也有跟銀行融資出來 不含不動產銀行不動產的借跟不管是融資什麼這些都不算那要不要扣掉不動產借貸的金額啊 還是是淨資產啊"},{"start":598.913,"end":613.063,"text":"這個銀行都知道我們在財富管理2.0的規範都清楚沒有 我只是想知道說這個規定是由銀行來決定還是說就是我們金融會有同一個標準那接下來銀行自己會決定OK 怎麼樣 銀行決定我們有第一個最低的標準往上你可以自己決定比如說你要服務什麼樣的客戶"},{"start":613.863,"end":636.228,"text":"有一個最低標準但這標準是由你們決定因為每家銀行可能對高資產客戶的定義不一樣我是鼓勵當然對金融我看黃志偉上任以來對很多包括像我剛剛高齡的這個也是有開放跟以前黃志偉時代也是有不一樣那我們對於我對於我們的這個我們國內這些金融的產品或各方面我覺得的確是有些東西是比較"},{"start":637.335,"end":653.294,"text":"不那麼開放不那麼進步我也是鼓勵很多東西是創新進步我們都支持那下去如果說但是如果有依法要注意的部分也是要注意尤其後面有權利判格的部分的時候包括融資銀行跟這個保單效益這個可能也要特別注意"}]}}},"gazette":{"lineno":902,"blocks":[["陳委員玉珍：（12時1分）謝謝主席，請彭主委。"],["主席：好，請彭主委。","主席在這邊宣布，我們現在開放在現場用餐。"],["彭主任委員金隆：委員好。"],["陳委員玉珍：主委，本席在前兩次會期都有跟您詢問過，針對研議民間版的創櫃機制，金管會也回復在104年起已經開放證券商得經營股權性質群眾募資業，成效有三家新創公司，那時候回復的募資金額有新臺幣1,700萬元，這是上次回復的。"],["彭主任委員金隆：是。"],["陳委員玉珍：轉眼間又是一個會期了，半年又過去了，請問現在的募資績效有沒有增加？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這個我……"],["陳委員玉珍：證期局喔？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們了解一下再跟委員報告。"],["陳委員玉珍：你現在告訴我啊！證期局，成效呢？1,700萬，又過了半年，有沒有再增加？"],["張局長振山：目前是沒有增加的。"],["陳委員玉珍：沒有增加，為什麼？你們不認真做這個嗎？"],["張局長振山：沒有，櫃買中心其實有在做這個業務，他們有鼓勵或者把法規做出來……"],["陳委員玉珍：所以你們不重視這個民間版的創櫃機制募資業務喔？還是你們的做法是錯誤的？"],["張局長振山：我們當然重視這個機制……"],["陳委員玉珍：重視怎麼會沒有成效呢？"],["張局長振山：現在所謂的創櫃板，我們有做一個……"],["陳委員玉珍：你看，為了扶植中小微型企業，你們證期局有最新的函令解釋，通過限定綜合證券商可以投資創櫃板登板期間發行的新股，投資總金額不得超過券商淨值5%，且不受標的公司單次發行總額10%的限制。這個是比較新的新聞，可見金管會在彭主委過來以後，我都感覺很多金融的措施有要創新、有要前進，雖然你們修了這些、修了那些，好像整個成效都很差，以這個募資來講，我們講了兩個會期，上個會期1,700萬到現在還是沒有啊，你也知道我很關心這個議題啊！"],["彭主任委員金隆：成效差我們會虛心檢討。"],["陳委員玉珍：我們一直跟你們提，你們的股權群募平臺是不是也要有新的做法？我一直在講，比如說中小企業開發公司跟新創企業來做募資平臺，你們有創新處嘛，對不對？"],["彭主任委員金隆：對。"],["陳委員玉珍：把中小企業開發公司、櫃買找來，是不是一起來想看看要怎麼做啊？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這個我們一定會努力的，只是現在有一些法規、法律上面的限制，我們要來突破。"],["陳委員玉珍：我知道金管會一直想突破很多法，我覺得您上來後有很多相關法令都一直在突破……"],["彭主任委員金隆：對。"],["陳委員玉珍：但是我覺得你下面的單位好像對這些事情都不太認真。"],["彭主任委員金隆：這也不能這麼說，因為主要是……"],["陳委員玉珍：我們看結果嘛，上個會期的1,700萬，這樣算金金額嗎？從上個會期到現在，我現在跟你請求，我一直在講，因為中小企業是經濟部在管嘛……"],["彭主任委員金隆：對。"],["陳委員玉珍：也有相關的公司有新創企業，他們也有創新署，你們也有創新處嘛！"],["彭主任委員金隆：對。"],["陳委員玉珍：這些相關單位是不是一起來開個會啊？是不是可以集思廣益，看到底要怎麼做啊？"],["彭主任委員金隆：可以，這沒問題啊！"],["陳委員玉珍：我們已經建議很多回了，你們都被動不前進啊！"],["彭主任委員金隆：也不是啦！如果這個問題能夠解決、好解決的話，早解決了！"],["陳委員玉珍：所以就是沒有努力在……"],["彭主任委員金隆：沒有，這問題一定有其複雜度，所以我覺得可以再來討論……"],["陳委員玉珍：找時間大家來開會吧？這問題我們已經問了一年多，彭主委上來後，有很多觀念都比較新，包括等一下要講的高齡保單的部分也開放了……"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們的想法是，正確又能夠做的事我們當然會儘量來完成。"],["陳委員玉珍：這個我們會繼續盯。"],["彭主任委員金隆：好，謝謝。"],["陳委員玉珍：接著講另外幾點，證期局聽到沒？績效真的很差，這半年來都沒有任何成長，表示你們根本不用心，1,700萬等於跟沒有一樣，等於沒有任何進步，其實不進則退，所以應該算是退步！","我們來討論一下保險法。你們有研究要放寬、放行保單質借，對吧？"],["彭主任委員金隆：銀行的部分。"],["陳委員玉珍：對，就是放行給銀行可以做質借業務。"],["彭主任委員金隆：依法保險公司現在就可以做。"],["陳委員玉珍：我知道，但現在可以向銀行質借。"],["彭主任委員金隆：可以作為授信標的，只要銀行在風控可以接受的情況下。"],["陳委員玉珍：這跟現行保險法是否有牴觸？"],["彭主任委員金隆：沒有！這就好像銀行在做融資時會有自己的考量，比如最極端的可以做信用融資，不用任何擔保品……"],["陳委員玉珍：沒有牴觸是不是？我並非不支持，我是支持的。我的意思是，這需不需要再修法？"],["彭主任委員金隆：不用。"],["陳委員玉珍：修正保險法第一百二十條的規定？"],["彭主任委員金隆：不需要。"],["陳委員玉珍：原來規定是向保險人借款，也就是原來是向壽險借款，現在則不只，銀行也可以，比如說可能是A公司、南山的保單，可以向國泰、富邦、新光、南山、凱基五大壽險銀行，有做財管的銀行……我知道你一直在力推財富管理，我看得出金管會彭主委的想法，這點我們也很支持，只是這東西不用修法嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：不用。跟委員打個比方，比如銀行要借你錢，如果你個人信用很好的話，其實什麼抵押品都不需要。但假設你今天……"],["陳委員玉珍：什麼抵押品都不需要？這很少吧……"],["彭主任委員金隆：其實就是信用放款。"],["陳委員玉珍：一個額度？"],["彭主任委員金隆：比如我想用有價證券來做擔保，只要銀行接受，我覺得就可以……"],["陳委員玉珍：所以你認為不用修法？"],["彭主任委員金隆：以銀行的風險管理實務……"],["陳委員玉珍：現在保單要質借的話必須向原來的保險公司保險人……"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，現在是這樣。"],["陳委員玉珍：沒關係，你們要這樣解釋我也沒有……只是在法律上你們要注意這點。"],["彭主任委員金隆：是，謝謝。"],["陳委員玉珍：是不是跟現行法規符合，如果要的話，也必須依法辦理。"],["彭主任委員金隆：謝謝，確實不會有法律問題。"],["陳委員玉珍：另外，你們現在的開放方向是高資產階層？"],["彭主任委員金隆：對。"],["陳委員玉珍：為什麼只有開放高資產階層？一般百姓呢？"],["彭主任委員金隆：所謂的試辦意思就是，我們希望先了解一下這項業務所產生的一些效益跟風險會是什麼？因為高資產客戶風險承受力比較高……"],["陳委員玉珍：能力比較高……"],["彭主任委員金隆：所以一定先從這裡開始，如果試辦結果良好，沒有其他問題的話，我們會再擴展到其他人。"],["陳委員玉珍：就是普遍大眾？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們也是在做一種……"],["陳委員玉珍：如果符合法令的話，就沒有所謂的試辦，也就是任何人都可以……"],["彭主任委員金隆：法令有很多……"],["陳委員玉珍：你了解我意思嗎？如果法令沒有不許的話，那麼不管高資產或一般資產，誰都可以做！"],["彭主任委員金隆：委員講的沒錯，但「法令」這兩個字有兩個層次，一個叫做法律……"],["陳委員玉珍：一個叫做法，一個叫做令，是這樣嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這是一個，另外就是很多的行政規則及其他的監管層次，我們在試辦……"],["陳委員玉珍：現在也是不允許的？所以你們打算用函令來解釋？"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，因為這部分……"],["陳委員玉珍：用法規來看，順序也要有……"],["彭主任委員金隆：以行政規則或是自律規範來說，有很多可能暫時沒辦法做，但我們在有限範圍內開放，然後在能夠承擔高風險……"],["陳委員玉珍：如果是有限範圍內開放的話，表示現在是不允許的？"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，現在就是……不是法律層次的問題……"],["陳委員玉珍：你覺得不要用修法方式來處理，而是用行政函釋或試辦規則這類位階比較低的方式來做？"],["彭主任委員金隆：當然。"],["陳委員玉珍：我支持彭主委往開放的方向走……"],["彭主任委員金隆：會在風險可控的情況之下。"],["陳委員玉珍：不管是中小企業或募資或新創，這些我們都非常支持，今天講的我也支持，請問開辦時間與預計試辦時間是多久？"],["彭主任委員金隆：現在的所有試辦都以六個月到一年為原則……"],["陳委員玉珍：六個月到一年？"],["彭主任委員金隆：六個月是個觀察期，我們會看情況……"],["陳委員玉珍：如果試辦成效良好，可能就會開放到一般的客戶？"],["彭主任委員金隆：按照風險承受來逐步開放……"],["陳委員玉珍：但這樣下去可能會有產生一些問題，譬如沒有辦法融資，質借無法償還的話，屆時債權優先順序是銀行？比如我拿保單去跟銀行借錢，到時候會有債權的順序問題嗎？還有，保單的效力會變成怎麼樣？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這就要回到保險法……"],["陳委員玉珍：到時候相關的議題出現，你們必須重視。"],["彭主任委員金隆：當然……"],["陳委員玉珍：你知道我的意思嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我知道。"],["陳委員玉珍：我的保單拿去質借、質押了，結果我後來還不起；還不起的話，質借的保單就會被拿走，也就是融資方拿走，這樣子的話……你現在只開放銀行，對不對？"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，而且只對……"],["陳委員玉珍：接著，還有保險的效力問題……"],["彭主任委員金隆：高資產客戶。"],["陳委員玉珍：我知道。高資產客戶的定義是由銀行定義，是嗎？也就是這五家財管銀行所定義的高資產客戶，即由他們來決定哪些人，是嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：沒有……"],["陳委員玉珍：或者你有一個標準，譬如3,000萬以上……"],["彭主任委員金隆：高資產客戶有標準……"],["陳委員玉珍：高資產客戶的標準是什麼？"],["彭主任委員金隆：1億以上。"],["陳委員玉珍：1億以上？1億是指保單1億以上嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：不含不動產。"],["陳委員玉珍：你是指保單嗎？一張保單1億以上嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：個人的資產。"],["陳委員玉珍：他的資產？"],["彭主任委員金隆：當然，有些銀行會更高。"],["陳委員玉珍：資產是除了不動產以外？所以你明確定義個人資產在1億元以上，不管是現金或存款……"],["彭主任委員金隆：主要是金融資產。"],["陳委員玉珍：金融資產，如股票且不含不動產？不動產也有拿去借的啊，也有銀行融資……"],["彭主任委員金隆：不含不動產。"],["陳委員玉珍：這都不算？"],["彭主任委員金隆：對。"],["陳委員玉珍：不動產的借跟……跟銀行融資什麼的都不算？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這在我們那個……"],["陳委員玉珍：要不要扣掉不動產的借貸金額？還是淨資產？"],["彭主任委員金隆：財富管理2.0的規範相當清楚，銀行都知道……"],["陳委員玉珍：沒有，我只是想知道這規定是由銀行決定，還是金管會有統一的標準？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們有訂一個最低的標準，接下來銀行自己會決定。"],["陳委員玉珍：銀行決定？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們有訂定最低標準，往上可以自己決定，比如要服務什麼樣的客戶。"],["陳委員玉珍：有最低標準，但這標準是由你們決定？畢竟每家銀行可能對高資產客戶的定義不一樣。彭主委上任以來對很多業務，譬如開放高齡客戶，跟以前黃主委時代不一樣。對於國內這些金融產品或其他各方面，我覺得有些東西的確不是那麼開放，也不那麼進步。我鼓勵很多東西，譬如創新、進步，這些我們都支持。"],["彭主任委員金隆：謝謝委員的鼓勵跟支持。"],["陳委員玉珍：但依法要注意的部分也是要注意，尤其後面有權益扞格時，包括銀行融資跟保單效益都要特別注意。"],["彭主任委員金隆：當然，謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝陳玉珍委員。","接著請王世堅委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":314,"meet_id":"委員會-11-3-20-10","speakers":["賴惠員","黃珊珊","羅智強","林德福","吳秉叡","賴士葆","郭國文","李彥秀","鍾佳濱","顏寬恒","羅明才","李坤城","黃國昌","陳玉珍","王世堅","林思銘","羅廷瑋","陳培瑜","徐富癸","徐欣瑩"],"page_start":249,"meetingDate":["2025-04-30"],"gazette_id":"1144301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1144301_00007"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第3會期財政委員會第10次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"審查「保險法」15案：一、行政院函請審議、本院委員蔡其昌等19人、委員羅廷瑋等16人、委員\n王世堅等18人、委員徐富癸等16人、委員蔡其昌等19人、委員蔡易餘等18人、委員林思銘等18人\n分別擬具「保險法部分條文修正草案」等8案；二、本院委員鍾佳濱等21人擬具「保險法增訂第\n一百二十三條之一條文草案」案；三、本院台灣民眾黨黨團、委員陳超明等16人、委員羅智強等\n19人、委員李坤城等23人、委員賴瑞隆等17人、委員王美惠等17人分別擬具「保險法增訂第一百\n七十四條之二及第一百七十四條之三條文草案」等6案","agenda_id":"1144301_00006"}}}